Military Review

US media: Russian IRAs are able to restrain NATO and US forces

114
New Russian ship project "Karakurt" called "Typhoon" was launched in St. Petersburg 24 November. This is the latest example of the fact that the Russian Navy rely on small and heavily armed ships that can carry a lot of missiles, writes Business Insider.




“In total, Russia plans to build 18 ships of this type. They were originally intended to protect the coastal zone, so they are smaller than battleships and destroyers, which are assigned the main place in fleets other countries of the world. Moscow has always experienced difficulties in rivalry with its opponents in this regard and therefore decided to rely on small vessels, "- leads the article InoTV.

According to the author, "ships of the Karakurt project have a displacement of 800 tons, are able to work on the open sea for 15 days and cover the 2500 distance of nautical miles and have low-visibility technology that will make it difficult for potential opponents to detect them." The ships are also equipped with eight rocket launchers for launching either anti-ship supersonic P-800 “Onyx” missiles, or “Caliber-NK” cruise missiles.

In addition, the ships are equipped with the naval version of the Pantsir-S1 anti-aircraft missile system, which is called the Pantsir-M. The complex is capable of hitting targets at a distance of 20 km, the author adds.

Thus, the Russians created a small ship that is as fast and efficient as a destroyer, but smaller in size,
he writes.

As Michael Kofman, an expert on the Russian armed forces, noted, “Karakurts” have great potential, but they should not be overestimated.

Russia and NATO are in some sense the same when it comes to inflating Russian military potential and inflating threats. Small ships are capable of threatening most of Europe with cruise missiles, but ordinary cruise missiles are not too strong, and in order to match the firepower of a single American destroyer, several small ships will be required.
said Coffman edition.

According to him, despite the stealth technology and improved shipping characteristics, "Karakurt" is less stable compared to other ships, "which makes them ineffective for an attack by land."

Most likely, they are intended for "attacks and firing by volleys at combat groups of ships or enemy carrier strike groups if they approach the Russian shores." At the same time, the ships of the Karakurt project are “an effective platform for deploying anti-ship weapons and deterrence of NATO or US forces in the event of a conflict, ”the expert concluded.
Photos used:
Curious / forums.airbase.ru
114 comments
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  1. NEXUS
    NEXUS 4 December 2017 11: 18 New
    10
    For good, we need twice as many Karakurts as planned. Moreover, such ships, taking into account the displacement, shipbuilders must hand over 4-6 pieces per year. And we even plug in the construction of such MRCs.
    1. 1331M
      1331M 4 December 2017 11: 27 New
      +2
      And what to do, we live within our means ... There is no time for fat, as they say ... request
      1. NEXUS
        NEXUS 4 December 2017 11: 31 New
        10
        Quote: 1331M
        And what to do, we live within our means ..

        Given how many steal and take out over the hill, if we lived within our means, we would have had a carrier fleet for a long time.
        And about the Karakurt ... if they put universal launchers on them, then when adopting the Zircons, these little ones will really become dangerous for NATO ships, like the same spider in nature.
        1. Vlad.by
          Vlad.by 4 December 2017 12: 26 New
          +5
          They and Onyxes and Caliber are quite dangerous to themselves.
          Small bug, but smelly!
          1. hrych
            hrych 4 December 2017 16: 16 New
            +3
            Quote: Vlad.by
            They and Onyxes and Caliber are quite dangerous to themselves.

            I don’t know since EBN it seems to me to complain simply sin laughing
          2. hrych
            hrych 4 December 2017 16: 23 New
            +3
            And what about the system, the process and the project, especially the atomic one, is simply impressive.


            Prince Vladimir and Kazan from the bottom shemki already on the water good , like the four from the top, where 3 in the ranks, and Vdadimir again on the water laughing
    2. Finches
      Finches 4 December 2017 11: 37 New
      10
      So it’s not the USSR with a planned economy and a human face, "capitalism" ... laughing
      But even with our wild capitalism, what has been done since 2010, and moreover with the efforts of precisely the GDP, is impressive! Little has been done, but at the same time, taking into account the realities, it has been done decently to strengthen both the economy and the social component and defense capability!
      1. Tusv
        Tusv 4 December 2017 12: 24 New
        +3
        Quote: Finches
        Little done, but at the same time

        At the same time, we cannot make aircraft carriers, but for the horror of NATO improved. Strategic Missile Forces, air defense, electronic warfare and Armata showed. Parity restored. It is very much
        1. Finches
          Finches 4 December 2017 12: 27 New
          +8
          Why do we need aircraft carriers? We are not the United States which from its island exports democracy to all corners of the world - we are a peaceful country! Our strategy is defensive! Where it is necessary - and the "Caliber" will get, the submarine will swim ... hi
          1. Tusv
            Tusv 4 December 2017 12: 55 New
            +1
            Quote: Finches
            Why do we need aircraft carriers?

            And I'm talking about hi We do not have enough satellite killers, and so everything is there to protect our homeland. There will be anti-satellite weapons and parity, as has never happened, in favor of Mother Russia hi
            1. JIaIIoTb
              JIaIIoTb 5 December 2017 22: 13 New
              +1
              The foreign press has become aware of the continuation of tests of one of the newest Russian weapon systems. According to data obtained from sources in intelligence structures, a few days ago, Russian specialists carried out the second successful launch of a promising interceptor missile complex "Nudol". In the foreseeable future, this system should go on combat duty and replace the existing types of complexes.
              https://bulochnikov.livejournal.com/2473621.html
    3. Romario_Argo
      Romario_Argo 4 December 2017 11: 44 New
      +2
      nevertheless, a balance is needed, in the construction of only MRK, and an acute shortage in the IPC
      I wonder if there will be anti-submarine modification with a hull?
      or we will continue, "holes", corvettes, etc. 20380 - patching ....
      1. NEXUS
        NEXUS 4 December 2017 11: 51 New
        +4
        Quote: Romario_Argo
        or we will continue, "holes", corvettes, etc. 20380 - patching ....

        Project 22386 is already being finalized. And we need a dozen such corvettes.
      2. Tusv
        Tusv 4 December 2017 12: 28 New
        +2
        Quote: Romario_Argo
        I wonder if there will be anti-submarine modification with a hull

        Kamov aft is provided., The kit includes anti-submarine gauges. In general, yes
        1. Romario_Argo
          Romario_Argo 4 December 2017 13: 07 New
          0
          Kamov aft is provided., The kit includes anti-submarine gauges.

          you did not understand.
          anti-submarine project "Karakurt" with bow or sting or stern hull ???
          downhill hook is not an option
          PLURA Caliber 91P / 91PT - that’s understandable!
          1. Tusv
            Tusv 4 December 2017 13: 12 New
            0
            Quote: Romario_Argo
            PLURA Caliber 91P / 91PT - that’s understandable!
            And the Kamov stern? Not an option? Of course not BOD. But the treshka of these spiders should cope with enemy submarines
            1. Romario_Argo
              Romario_Argo 4 December 2017 13: 51 New
              0
              I repeat again lower hulls from both the ship and the helicopter is not an option
              I had a question on RTO Karakurt in the anti-submarine version
              with built-in HAC (sonar complex)
    4. siberalt
      siberalt 4 December 2017 12: 00 New
      0
      How many "Karakurt" do you need to sink one destroyer? winked
      1. NEXUS
        NEXUS 4 December 2017 12: 02 New
        +7
        Quote: siberalt
        How many "Karakurt" do you need to sink one destroyer? winked

        For an Arly Burke class destroyer, two Onyxes are enough ...
        1. Esoteric
          Esoteric 4 December 2017 12: 10 New
          0
          Quote: NEXUS
          For an Arly Burke class destroyer, two Onyxes are enough ...

          Simply put, when you hit a funnel over an area of ​​up to 60 square meters. meters ... And how many of the missiles launched will fly ... request
        2. Vlad.by
          Vlad.by 4 December 2017 12: 27 New
          +3
          As Argentinean practice shows, one may well be enough.
          1. Tusv
            Tusv 4 December 2017 12: 45 New
            0
            Quote: Vlad.by
            As Argentinean practice shows, one may well be enough

            Although the electronic warfare of the Yankees lags behind ours, it is still higher than the Argentinean hi
    5. hrych
      hrych 4 December 2017 12: 22 New
      +2
      Quote: NEXUS
      And we even plug in the construction of such MRCs.

      Perhaps this is not entirely fair, Ash trees are being built, Boreas are being built, icebreakers are being built, including nuclear ones, many ships are being modernized, including one rank. It seems like the slipways work, including the Crimean ones. 1 do, Buyan do, etc. Now the caliber was installed on patrol ships, etc., immediately transferring them to another category. We are building, in short, and so ...
      1. NEXUS
        NEXUS 4 December 2017 12: 30 New
        +6
        Quote: hrych
        Ash trees are being built

        Ash trees are not built, but give birth. I will not say anything about Severodvinsk, but the head Yasen-M Kazan, taking into account all the runs and tests, will be accepted 10 years after the bookmark. This is very slow, given that the US already has 13 Virgins.
        Quote: hrych
        Boreas are building

        They are building ... right. Have the Mace been modernized? Not yet ... and in fact, our Boreas are now toothless and the entire underwater component of the triad rests on the Dolphins and Sineva.
        Quote: hrych
        including 1 rank.

        If you are talking about Nakhimov ... so modernization began in the year 13 ... in the yard, almost the 18th year. This is already 5 years old. In the USSR, Orlan built this from scratch for 5! years old. But for now, we cannot see the end of this modernization ...
        Quote: hrych
        It seems like the slipways work, including the Crimean ones.

        We need more shipyards, and for large vessels of the 1st and 2nd rank ... but even if we build everything, the most important issue has long been standing is qualified personnel.
        1. hrych
          hrych 4 December 2017 12: 52 New
          +1
          Quote: NEXUS
          Have they upgraded the mace? Not yet ... and in fact, our Boreas are now toothless

          Let's not touch the Mace, everything is fine with her
          Quote: NEXUS
          We need more shipyards, and for large vessels of the 1st and 2nd rank ...

          Nobody argues, but the old and not very Pike-Bs, some titanium ones, Anthei, as well as Varshavyanka, got the Caliber in the arsenal. They have not gone anywhere, got new opportunities, like the coastal fleet. Which is decent with us. The task of ensuring the safety of the water area is being solved, we do not forget coastal aviation, including the new capabilities of the Tu22m3, Mig-31 and Tu-142 and coastal missile systems from Bal to Bastion, which, like Caliber, cover a 200-mile zone. Wave works, Container works, instructed Sunflowers. Our torpedoes are not inferior to the enemy, and the Waterfall, etc. are simply unique. Also, the entire nomenclature has a nuclear warhead, unlike the enemy, including the United States, we even have air defense of a kind, bang and everything fell laughing
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 4 December 2017 12: 56 New
            +3
            Quote: hrych
            Let's not touch the Mace, everything is fine with her

            And let's touch the Mace. It would have been all right with her, she, as a new product, would not have been urgently sent for modernization. At the same time, everyone, also the leader Solomonov, was dismissed. Nifiga there with Mace is not all right.
        2. Tusv
          Tusv 4 December 2017 13: 07 New
          +2
          Ash trees are not built, but give birth. I will not say anything about Severodvinsk, but the head Yasen-M Kazan, taking into account all the runs and tests, will be accepted 10 years after the bookmark

          Andrew. Ten years is too much. Our wise men already know that we have a skew of the Rocket carriers and the Hunters in favor of the Rocket carriers, and 2 to one, if not more, but it should be vice versa
          To the heap, we have Ellings for submarines additionally built several
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 4 December 2017 13: 12 New
            +4
            Quote: Tusv
            Our wise men already know that we have a skew of the Rocket carriers and the Hunters in favor of the Rocket carriers, and 2 to one, if not more, but it should be vice versa

            True ... but with this knowledge, even the Pikes are in no hurry to modernize, and the modernization of the titanium Barakuds was generally postponed until better times.
            1. Tusv
              Tusv 4 December 2017 13: 22 New
              +1
              Quote: NEXUS
              they are in no hurry even to modernize Pike, and the modernization of the titanium Barakud was generally postponed until better times.

              Here, Andrei is the main condition of the vessel and the reactor. What's cheaper, change the reactor screws and weapons, or build new ones. The latest news speaks of resuscitation, because working reactors are more expensive to dispose of. Although we have really advanced in this direction. Still, it’s not to modernize aviation, it flew there for five years and to complete bulkhead
              1. NEXUS
                NEXUS 4 December 2017 13: 48 New
                +4
                Quote: Tusv
                What's cheaper, change the reactor screws and weapons, or build new ones.

                I would not say that Pike-B is so old that the question should be posed as follows. Moreover, they would embed vertical launchers, wonderful submarines would work and serve them. As for Barakud ... so there is a titanium case, which its essence is much more durable than steel. And with their modernization, again with an inset of vertical launchers, we get very good multipurpose outputs, which, as you rightly noted, the cat wept.
                1. Tusv
                  Tusv 4 December 2017 14: 03 New
                  +1
                  Quote: NEXUS
                  serve them and serve

                  I’m talking about that. Elings are not being built from floundering bay. The submarine has accumulated above the roof. It’s expensive to dispose of, except according to Sowiecki - to flood and forget. And we have Bears in allies. And we give them a dose of radiation in the skin?
                  PS: All data from this site
    6. Petrol cutter
      Petrol cutter 4 December 2017 22: 47 New
      +2
      NEKSUSU:
      In early autumn, there was still talk of increasing the series. At least the authorities reported so. 4-6 pieces, it is you who set aside however. Taki MRK 22800 is not a torpedo boat and riveting it in such quantities a year is unrealistic.
  2. Tusv
    Tusv 4 December 2017 11: 25 New
    +3
    Small ships are capable of threatening most of Europe with cruise missiles, but conventional cruise missiles are not too strong, and several small ships will be required to equal the firepower of a single American destroyer

    The fire power of one Karakurt is quite enough for one Ali Burke. This is already enough, because we don’t need to water the neighbors with Gauges, if they do not greyhound.
    But what a headline!
    USA and NATO. This makes me happy. Section went or Freudian clause? It is necessary to draw in the bourgeois ears, they say the United States is no longer NATO and you will be enslaved soon. Fear the bourgeois - Yankees go
    1. Stirbjorn
      Stirbjorn 4 December 2017 12: 02 New
      +2
      Quote: Tusv
      The fire power of one Karakurt is quite enough for one Ali Burke. This is already enough, because the neighbors are watered with Caliber

      The firepower of one Ali Burke will be enough for 7 Karakurts, which, unlike the onky Burke, have practically no air defense hi
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak 4 December 2017 12: 14 New
        +2
        This is if Burke dares to poke around where Karakurt live. What I strongly doubt.
      2. Tusv
        Tusv 4 December 2017 12: 14 New
        +2
        Quote: Stirbjorn
        The firepower of one Ali Burke will be enough for 7 Karakurts, which, unlike the onky Burke, have practically no air defense

        The range of anti-convincing weapons of Karakurt is almost 2 times higher, the salvo will quickly be washed off, and you are not right about air defense. There zhezh world champion in eating cruise missiles The shell is standing. By the way, he can shoot down automatically, without operator intervention hi
        1. Wedmak
          Wedmak 4 December 2017 12: 20 New
          +2
          There zhezh world champion in eating cruise missiles The shell is standing.

          Its ammunition is at least an order of magnitude different from the ammunition of the Zur Berk. In a smaller direction.
          1. Tusv
            Tusv 4 December 2017 12: 41 New
            +1
            Quote: Wedmak
            Its ammunition is at least an order of magnitude different from the ammunition of the Zur Berk. In a smaller direction.

            It does not matter. The Americans have not yet found the antidotes from Onyxes (and Zircon is just around the corner), and they cannot get the Harpoons of Karakurt. Distance does not allow
            1. tlauicol
              tlauicol 4 December 2017 13: 20 New
              +2
              the distance allows Arly Berks to shoot at the territory of the Russian Federation from the North Sea - why the hell is Karakurt, and what will he do to them?
          2. KaPToC
            KaPToC 5 December 2017 20: 12 New
            0
            Quote: Wedmak
            Its ammunition is at least an order of magnitude different from the ammunition of the Zur Berk. In a smaller direction.

            Who cares? Berks have no RCC at all
            1. Wedmak
              Wedmak 6 December 2017 06: 10 New
              0
              Berks have no RCC at all

              Someone's gone? On the first two episodes there are 8 Harpoons. They were abandoned due to the cheapening of ships. I don’t think that putting them back will be very difficult.
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 6 December 2017 18: 26 New
                0
                Quote: Wedmak
                In the first two episodes there are 8 Harpoons.

                even abandoned them
                Quote: Wedmak
                I don’t think it will be very difficult to put them back

                The place is not provided initially, except for the first two episodes you mentioned.
        2. Stirbjorn
          Stirbjorn 4 December 2017 13: 07 New
          +1
          Quote: Tusv
          , And about the air defense you are wrong. There zhezh world champion in eating cruise missiles The shell is standing. By the way, he can shoot down automatically, without operator intervention
          Why did he become a champion? and then the capabilities of the ship’s version are currently unknown, but the fact that the air defense for ships and ground forces are different is seen in the example of Almaz-Antey, which still cannot complete Poliment-Redut for the fleet
          1. Tusv
            Tusv 4 December 2017 13: 31 New
            0
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            can be seen in the example of Almaz-Antey, which still cannot complete Poliment-Redut for the fleet

            The land hero also does not accept. There are missiles, there are Calculations, and there is a BIUS, but he cannot beat without an operator, like the Shell, and this, as the bourgeois say, is a Trend hi
        3. tlauicol
          tlauicol 4 December 2017 13: 17 New
          0
          there is no Shell there. Maybe someday will appear
      3. KaPToC
        KaPToC 4 December 2017 12: 18 New
        0
        Quote: Stirbjorn
        The firepower of one Ali Burke will be enough for 7 Karakurts, which, unlike the onky Burke, have practically no air defense

        What will Arly Berks shoot at karakurt? Torpedoes? Maybe a gun? they have no anti-ship missiles.
        1. Wedmak
          Wedmak 4 December 2017 12: 22 New
          +1
          they have no anti-ship missiles.

          If ours can work with surface-mounted missiles, why do you think that Burke can't do this?
          1. Tusv
            Tusv 4 December 2017 14: 09 New
            0
            Quote: Wedmak
            If ours can work with surface-mounted missiles, why do you think that Burke can't do this?

            In the part of missiles. Ours can, but not further than 15 km. American SM-3s can also, but with bags of diamonds in squares hi
          2. KaPToC
            KaPToC 5 December 2017 19: 58 New
            0
            Quote: Wedmak
            If ours can work with surface-mounted missiles, why do you think that Burke can't do this?

            Do you know the phrase - hammer nails with a microscope? They have different principles of guidance, different methods of hitting a target.
            In addition, of all missiles in the Americans, only SM-3 have an acceptable range, and for her, think about it, the kinetic warhead
            1. Wedmak
              Wedmak 6 December 2017 06: 17 New
              0
              Do you know the phrase - hammer nails with a microscope?

              If you want to live, you will hammer nails with an electron microscope. Nobody says that this is a regular means of destruction.
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 6 December 2017 18: 29 New
                0
                Quote: Wedmak
                If you want to live, you will hammer nails with an electron microscope.

                I think the nail will win
        2. Stirbjorn
          Stirbjorn 4 December 2017 13: 01 New
          0
          Quote: KaPToC
          What will Arly Berks shoot at karakurt? Torpedoes? Maybe a gun? they have no anti-ship missiles.

          They have everything, study the subject
          Orly Burke destroyers are based on various types of missiles. In the fore and aft parts of ships of all series, there are universal mine launchers Mk 41. On ships of series I and II, the bow and stern launchers have 30 and 60 cells, respectively. On the IIA series, the number of cells increased to 32 and 64. A transport and launch container with the BGM-109 Tomahawk cruise missile, SM-2 or SM-3 anti-aircraft missile or a block of four containers with the RIM-7 Sea Sparrow anti-aircraft missiles can be placed in one cell. .
          https://topwar.ru/12154-esmincy-arli-berk-rekords
          meny-s-raketnym-vooruzheniem.html
          1. KaPToC
            KaPToC 5 December 2017 20: 19 New
            0
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            They have everything, study the subject

            And you take it and in your own words tell us what RCC Arly Berkov has.
            And I can send everyone away.
      4. Vlad.by
        Vlad.by 4 December 2017 12: 35 New
        +2
        To begin with, let that destroyer single out Karakurt from a group of seiners, yachts and pleasure boats. To identify a threat. Or will he drown everyone?
        And how, in fact, to drown? Tomahawk or SAM SM-6? But the MRK teeth are sharp and even have a chance to approach even a pistol shot.
        By the way, Karakurt’s firepower, too, if not at 8, then at 3-4, will be enough.
        As for air defense, the presence of the Shell or even Dagger in many respects equalizes the chances.
        I repeat - Karakurt is so small that in the coastal zone it is extremely difficult to distinguish it from the background of civilian ships, that of aviation, that of surface ships. And when the plane gets into the field of view of the OLS, the grandmother in two said who would remain intact.
        1. Wedmak
          Wedmak 4 December 2017 12: 59 New
          +3
          There are always chances, but Karakurt is not for an open battle with the destroyer. The impact capabilities are too unequal. Its task, being under the umbrella of coastal air defense, artillery and anti-ship missiles, is to deliver targeted strikes where no one is waiting for them.
          You don’t think that Burke will trample on the attack alone, at full speed? Here, as is customary with the Americans: we will get up close, with a dozen ships and submarines, we will launch hundreds of axes 2-3 to demolish air defense and other troubles, in which electronic warfare aircraft and anti-radar missiles will actively help. And when the dust settles, they will finish off another two weeks with drones and other bombers.
          The truth about Russia, of course, is the question of whether this group will grab the nuclear loaf at the first volleys in our direction. For knocking down the 300 KR is problematic even for us at the same time, but we need to shut up this shooting pack with something.
        2. Stirbjorn
          Stirbjorn 4 December 2017 13: 10 New
          +1
          Quote: Vlad.by
          To begin with, let that destroyer single out Karakurt from a group of seiners, yachts and pleasure boats. To identify a threat. Or will he drown everyone?

          I think that will be, because it’s like “Grad” to put in the yard of the kindergarten, who then will be sorry for the pit - responsibility on the one who put it .... so you can destroy the destroyer, among the tankers ...
          1. Vlad.by
            Vlad.by 5 December 2017 15: 38 New
            0
            I will repeat once again - WHAT WILL the Berks shoot at Karakurt?
            And as for a single destroyer - so every destroyer to cover - not like aircraft carriers, planes are not enough. And they will walk alone or in a couple, as a last resort.
          2. Vlad.by
            Vlad.by 5 December 2017 16: 07 New
            0
            I don’t propose to surround Karakurt with a “peace”. It's just that his destiny is swimming in the coastal area, where coastal swimming is developed.
        3. Tusv
          Tusv 4 December 2017 16: 39 New
          +1
          Quote: Vlad.by
          To begin with, let that destroyer single out Karakurt from a group of seiners, yachts and pleasure boats. To identify a threat. Or will he drown everyone?

          So everyone knows this, since 1985, where is the Purpose, and where is the civilian hi
      5. Petrol cutter
        Petrol cutter 4 December 2017 21: 15 New
        +2
        "The firepower of one Ali Burke will be enough for 7 Karakurts, which, unlike the one Burke, have practically no air defense"
        He needs air defense mainly for complacency. It will be closed by coastal air defense and the other Bastions there ... When people finally understand, no one will send the MRC to the battle with the Nimitz somehow on itself! Why take your admirals very much for the coming of the rivers?!.
  3. Magic archer
    Magic archer 4 December 2017 11: 25 New
    +1
    In the article below, corvettes are equipped with URANOM, and here the RTOs are Caliber and Onyx ... WHERE TO ... LOGIC? !!!
    1. Bronevick
      Bronevick 4 December 2017 11: 37 New
      +2
      Because 20380 are older than 22800. At 20385, calibers are already on.
    2. Vadim Zhivov
      Vadim Zhivov 4 December 2017 11: 43 New
      0
      Different projects and all hi
      1. marlin1203
        marlin1203 4 December 2017 12: 03 New
        +1
        Have you forgotten about the radar? What will he see, where to shoot? Who will give him target designation? And it turns out that he shoots further than he sees.
    3. NEXUS
      NEXUS 4 December 2017 12: 40 New
      +2
      Quote: Magic Archer
      At 20385 calibers are already on.

      I believe that over time, Uranus will be replaced either by Onyx or by Caliber ... I do not think this is critical now. Project 20386 has already been developed.
      1. Bronevick
        Bronevick 4 December 2017 12: 51 New
        0
        Uranium is cheaper than Onyx, and these are missiles of various categories. Caliber for ships generally can not shoot. 20386 is an excellent project, it incorporates the concept of a distant ocean patrol ship with high automation and autonomy.
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 4 December 2017 13: 07 New
          +3
          Quote: Bronevick
          Caliber for ships generally can not shoot.

          Seriously? The caliber for naval targets hits very well, dear.
          Quote: Bronevick
          20386 is an excellent project, it incorporates the concept of a distant ocean patrol ship with high automation and autonomy.

          He is excellent, but it is believed that he is oversaturated with weapons.
          1. Bronevick
            Bronevick 4 December 2017 13: 26 New
            0
            From what sources did you find out that the caliber hits sea targets well? About 20386, there are never too many weapons, and are there really 24 universal launchers?
            1. NEXUS
              NEXUS 4 December 2017 13: 58 New
              +2
              Quote: Bronevick
              From what sources did you find out that the caliber hits sea targets well?

              Dear, Caliber-NK strikes at sea targets at a distance of 300 km. These CDs are in the arsenal of coastal complexes Bastion.
              Why was she brought into the arsenal of the Bastion, if this complex is anti-coral?
              1. Bronevick
                Bronevick 4 December 2017 15: 56 New
                +1
                In the bastion, the P-800 Onyx missile. At least check the wiki. NK in Caliber means that the missile is mounted on surface ships.
              2. Dangerous
                Dangerous 5 December 2017 10: 41 New
                0
                Chet Nexus do not say that. Caliber-NK - means the rocket is placed on the ship! And Uranus is cheaper than Onyx, but it also flies less and power is also less. Onyx is placed in the Bastions, the name of this missile is P-800, and the export name is Yakhont.
                1. KaPToC
                  KaPToC 5 December 2017 20: 32 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Bronevick
                  Bronevick

                  Quote: Dangerous
                  Dangerous

                  Apparently both of you have been banned in Google
                  1. Vlad.by
                    Vlad.by 6 December 2017 00: 51 New
                    0
                    Gracefully! I respect bully
            2. Vlad.by
              Vlad.by 5 December 2017 16: 21 New
              +1
              So sources like ... For example, this one:
              http://wartools.ru/krylatye-rakety/kalibr-krylaty
              e-rakety
              Why then Caliber active radar seeker ARGS-54E?

              ARGS-54E is designed to detect and accurately point cruise missiles at a surface target at the finish section of the flight path of 3M-54E missiles

              3M54E1
              Base TTX

              -Can be used both for single and group use of missiles.
              -Provides missile guidance at a target in the sector of angles in azimuth + ...- 45 degrees, in elevation - from +10 degrees. up to? 20 deg.
              -Maximum range - up to 65 km.
              -Can be operated at any time of the day at an ambient temperature of + ...- 45 degrees C., in the conditions of rain and fog, storm up to 6 points.

              Range data is apparently for export only.
          2. Wedmak
            Wedmak 4 December 2017 13: 29 New
            0
            but it is believed that he is oversaturated with weapons.

            Strange opinion. Especially with regard to ships, there are many more. And replenishing ammunition is not such a simple task as on earth.
          3. Tusv
            Tusv 4 December 2017 17: 05 New
            +1
            Quote: NEXUS
            The caliber for naval targets hits very well, dear.

            . How they eat is not important. The main thing is that our people are shaking the main thing so that it will not be excruciatingly painful during the flight of the Yankovsky drone 20 km from the border. I know we are ready to eat these for breakfast, lunch and dinner. And honestly, even teams from the Kremlin are not needed. And there is no upsetting water. The agreement is not closer than 20 km on land, not closer than 70 km from the sea. Vsezh, which is acquired by back-breaking labor, it is necessary to displace them, in the sense of some staff
  4. den3080
    den3080 4 December 2017 11: 26 New
    +5
    I did not know that in other fleets of the world the main place is given to battleships! and destroyers ...
    ))
    1. Jedi
      Jedi 4 December 2017 11: 39 New
      +3
      Quote: den3080
      did not know that in other fleets of the world the main place is given to battleships

      I was also quite surprised by this fact. belay lol
    2. Vadim Zhivov
      Vadim Zhivov 4 December 2017 11: 45 New
      0
      Especially the Psheks were handed over by a minesweeper with a long-term construction and the submarine was drowned.
    3. Chertt
      Chertt 4 December 2017 12: 00 New
      +1
      "therefore, they are smaller than the battleships and destroyers, which are assigned the main place in the fleets of other countries of the world"
      - Ha ha. Well, the author is not a specialist. But in any case, the article went through several hands, which didn’t hurt anyone
  5. Vard
    Vard 4 December 2017 11: 45 New
    +1
    A modern analogue of torpedo boats, and a couple of orders of magnitude more deadly and effective ... Deliver a sudden strike from afar, hiding somewhere in the bay ...
  6. rocket757
    rocket757 4 December 2017 11: 56 New
    +5
    You can agree with the expert
    Most likely, they are intended for "sorties and volleys at battle groups of ships or aircraft carrier strike groups of the enemy, if they approach the Russian coast." Moreover, the ships of the Karakurt project are “an effective platform for deploying anti-ship weapons and deterring forces of NATO or the United States in case of conflict,” the expert concluded.
  7. Asthma
    Asthma 4 December 2017 12: 25 New
    +1
    less stable compared to other ships, "which makes them ineffective for attacking by land."

    well, we’re not going to work on land by them, they’re not made for this ...
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 4 December 2017 12: 53 New
      +3
      Some garbage, why can’t it hit on land?
      For art installation, pitching can be a problem, but for rockets?
      When a wave above the deck, not every artillery ship can fire, even the battleship had its limits and limitations!
      In short, the expert wrote that what can you do, it seems that such a concept as the "expert community" has greatly lost its value, objectivity!
      1. Asthma
        Asthma 4 December 2017 12: 58 New
        +1
        hi
        Greetings, Kamrad. the money fell, so this article turned out. "them" there, in the expert community, generally have problems =)
        1. rocket757
          rocket757 4 December 2017 13: 28 New
          +4
          I understand that there can be a pitching on the lake, take Baikal or Great Lakes!
          On the sea at all ... beautiful, impressive. For the Atlantic ... it's scary to remember at all, ooh, what waves are there.
          Does not matter. cool ships turned out and dangerous ... for a heap !!! The question is, and who, vorogov, who called here? They rake what they deserve.
          All this lyrics, in fact we do what we need, do what we can!
          Asymmetric and very serious such an answer ... we also have ukrovoyak tactics. with their wolf \ jackal flock to repeat no trace. Not by rank, and we did not jump. brains are not shaken up to the state of fried eggs!
          1. Asthma
            Asthma 4 December 2017 16: 21 New
            0
            omelet well or gogol-moghl! hi
            1. rocket757
              rocket757 4 December 2017 18: 07 New
              +2
              No difference. If the brain is rolled out into a flat one, hiding all the convolutions ... or shaking a googol-mogul, then you definitely can’t do without a pan on your head!
  8. NEXUS
    NEXUS 4 December 2017 12: 53 New
    +4
    Small ships are capable of threatening most of Europe with cruise missiles, but conventional cruise missiles are not too strong, and in order to equal the firepower of a single American destroyer, it will take several small ships,

    The author is burning. On which RTOs to try to equalize in firepower with a destroyer? Why not immediately with a missile cruiser then? fool
    At the same time, the same destroyer will have enough hits from one to two Onyx missiles (it depends on where the anti-ship missiles fall), and to drown the Cruiser of Tikanderog, 3-4 anti-ship missiles Onyx.
    "Karakurt" are less stable in comparison with other ships, "which makes them ineffective for attacking by land."

    Apparently, the author is very taut for the whole head, if for two years of the Syrian company, it didn’t even reach him that the Caliber on the ground worked very well.
    1. Asthma
      Asthma 4 December 2017 13: 00 New
      +1
      Greetings, comrade. Well, it was necessary to add a fly in the ointment, so that "their" rejoiced. ugh on them.
    2. tlauicol
      tlauicol 4 December 2017 13: 24 New
      0
      A couple of Berkov will stand in the North Sea and will hammer on Kal.obl. and Len.obl. Question: what will Karakurt do to them?
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 4 December 2017 15: 00 New
        +2
        Whose berks? - Oh, are the Yankees bullies? So get the fascist grenades ... yars, mace or isho that long-range, flying time is not very different from the winged winged ones!
        This is an unrealistic scenario, as previously proposed.
        By the way, winged ones are not a fact that they will fly, but long-range ones will burst through anyone, no one has such means of counteraction. Schaub to repulse a massive missile strike ... and it will be the final point of our existence.
        1. tlauicol
          tlauicol 4 December 2017 15: 07 New
          0
          those. do you confirm that Karakurt Berku will not do anything with his brilliant post?
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 4 December 2017 15: 54 New
            +2
            Why is this.
            From the unreal, as it were, but which had a place to be - ram.
            Shaw, you say, the Yankees did not get on board and in the snout, as they say.
            No need to be brilliant, to invent any ... unrealistic scenario.
      2. NEXUS
        NEXUS 4 December 2017 17: 38 New
        +3
        Quote: Tlauicol
        A couple of Berkov will stand in the North Sea and will hammer on Kal.obl. and Len.obl. Question: what will Karakurt do to them?

        If a couple of Berkov becomes and begins to hit with axes across our territory, then a hotel in the form of ICBM warheads will fly into the United States and take away not empty ones. And then answer me, will it matter to the mattress Berks to Kaliningrad and Peter?
        1. tlauicol
          tlauicol 4 December 2017 18: 24 New
          0
          The title of the article that is being discussed here is "American Media: Russian RTOs Can Restrain NATO and US Forces"
          - they are not capable of nichrome! Since you immediately remember about the hotels and flood
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 4 December 2017 18: 33 New
            +2
            Quote: Tlauicol
            Since you immediately remember about the hotels and flood

            No ... the article itself is one continuous flood ... why not write-Russian RTOs are not able to contain the onslaught of aliens !? The same message, only in profile.
          2. KaPToC
            KaPToC 5 December 2017 20: 40 New
            0
            Quote: Tlauicol
            The title of the article that is being discussed here is "American Media: Russian RTOs Can Restrain NATO and US Forces"
            - they are not capable of nichrome! Since you immediately remember about the hotels and flood

            Theoretically, if we consider only the military component, without the political or nuclear part, Karakurts simply went to sea to force Burke to retreat to the distance of the RCC battle range from them.
            Are you familiar with the concept of “offside”? Two squads of missile ships diverge to the sides and begin to move away from the shore, the enemy AUG will be forced to retreat in front of the threat of the environment.
            1. tlauicol
              tlauicol 6 December 2017 04: 37 New
              0
              In the Baltic? And AUG in the North Sea?
              In the Barents, AUG around the corner? At any point of the oceans, a pair of Hornets with pleasure will riddle defenseless boats. And how many Karakurts do we have and how many do we need against 10 AUGs? Utopia
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 6 December 2017 18: 33 New
                0
                Quote: Tlauicol
                At any point of the oceans, a pair of Hornets with pleasure will riddle defenseless boats.

                Quote: Tlauicol
                And how many Karakurts do we have and how many do we need against 10 AUGs? Utopia

                The Americans cannot put up more than five aircraft carrier groups against us at the same time, according to their own words. Are you going to fight one American fleet with one karakurt?
                Utopia - is to fight against the Russian fleet with only "harpoons" in service.
                1. rocket757
                  rocket757 6 December 2017 19: 05 New
                  +3
                  Shaw for fantasy!
                  The shelling of the territory and the military, of another state, is an act ... war. Military operations between serious opponents, first of all, DESTRUCTION of the enemy's intelligence infrastructure - satellites, radar and other means of target designation !!!
                  And tell me how far can "see" and why "see" any means of attack WITHOUT THEM ??? How far is this any point of the world, sea, ocean from our coastal, land defense means, "seeing" is not a little worse, with which they will "smash" us?
                  1. KaPToC
                    KaPToC 6 December 2017 19: 12 New
                    0
                    Quote: rocket757
                    Shaw for fantasy!

                    You have fantasies. They fantasized a nuclear war.
                    Quote: rocket757
                    The shelling of the territory and the military, of another state, is an act ... war.

                    We are talking about the confrontation of the fleets, if everything that is available came into play - why compare the fleets? In a nuclear war, one aircraft carrier cruiser is equal in value to ten aircraft carrier groups - and they all have zero value in a nuclear war between Russia and the United States.
                    1. rocket757
                      rocket757 6 December 2017 21: 49 New
                      +3
                      To dream so fully!
                      You can fantasize and the confrontation of the fleets. What will happen - the large colonial fleet of Americans, the fleet of attacks, projections of force, always and everywhere, as they say ... against the remnants of a specialized fleet of the coastal zone, a defense character, the former USSR, now Russia!
                      What and how to compare? Which theater of war?
                      On the ocean, far from their shores (resp. Coastal defense complex), we have nothing to catch! Approaching our shores, the Yankees are not stupid people in the end ... everything that gurgles will be sunk!
                      Consider moronic assumptions, such as some kind of burke will be from the North Sea, or else from afar firing at our bases ??? ... this is UNCONDITIONLY war and the embodiment of all the worst fears of all sane humanity !!! Let's put everything down, the burke and the other fleet including ... we are normal, we will not even hypothetically consider it.
                      The simplest option is a hypothetical draw with no one against the same ownerless karakurt ... in all respects they are VERY different and in a direct, linear battle, the burke must win! but if I didn’t confuse something (I read for a long time, very much) there was a precedent when at the mouth of the Danube or the Dnieper two Soviet armored boats almost killed the German destroyer / destroyer? Those. everything in life happened.
                      1. KaPToC
                        KaPToC 6 December 2017 22: 05 New
                        0
                        Quote: rocket757
                        What and how to compare? Which theater of war?

                        Off our coast
                        Quote: rocket757
                        You can fantasize and the confrontation of the fleets. What will happen - the large colonial fleet of Americans, the fleet of attacks, projections of force, always and everywhere, as they say ... against the remnants of a specialized fleet of the coastal zone, a defense character, the former USSR, now Russia!

                        That is precisely what is “specialized,” and specialization is the destruction of the enemy’s fleet.
        2. rocket757
          rocket757 4 December 2017 18: 27 New
          +3
          The hotel will be, there is no doubt, I’m sure that those berks cannot reach their native harbor !!! Our fleet is not alone in karakurt! Coastal get it, boat, aircraft, ship more powerful !!! One fig, they feed the crabs.
          I’m straight from these couch experts ... do they even know how it really works ??? They even listen, they know real facts and expert opinions, from the same foreign generals who do not express such optimism, in the sense of the unconditional advantage of their armies over us, China ....
          1. tlauicol
            tlauicol 5 December 2017 06: 29 New
            0
            Quote: rocket757
            The hotel will be, there is no doubt, I’m sure that those berks cannot reach their native harbor !!! Our fleet is not alone in karakurt! Coastal get it, boat, aircraft, ship more powerful !!! One fig, they feed the crabs.

            Oh, enlightened, great strategist (and the singers who foolishly instructed you in the pluses)! Explain how coastal complexes will get Aberki in the North Sea? fool How aviation breaks through the 1000km air defense corridor in Europe. How can ships armed with the same anti-ship missiles as Karakurt be able to approach the launch range of destroyers launching cruise missiles (from the coast of Belgium, for example) in case of war? Not to mention the turtle submarines?
            And, yes, if you didn’t read the title of the article, then read: “Russian RTOs are able to restrain the forces of NATO and the USA” and comment, and there’s enough flood
            1. rocket757
              rocket757 5 December 2017 09: 38 New
              +3
              You won’t put a plus for yourself, who will put it!
              On the topic - delusional fantasy with shelling the Yankees of our territory, in fact it will be the beginning of the war ... we will proceed from this. I suppose that all normal people understand this and this can only be seen in films for the apocalypse or computer games.
              Since it’s fantasy, that’s the answer ... is fantastic. Seriously, no way to discuss it.
              Small missile ship, a threat to Europe? This is also the author’s fantasy, although MUCH MANY mobile launch platforms for cruise missiles can really scare many.
              In fact, the layout is simple - fantasize what you want. just do not press the red button for it will probably be the end of humanity.
  9. Zomanus
    Zomanus 4 December 2017 13: 56 New
    +1
    It is thought that these small rocket platforms are
    mining for the construction of larger platforms in the future.
    And what about land work, it’s a matter of exclusively target designation
    and the speed of loading the coordinates of the target into the rocket.
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 4 December 2017 15: 55 New
      +2
      Like, a running wave will not prevent a missile from aiming at a target?
  10. Dedall
    Dedall 4 December 2017 20: 32 New
    +1
    "Caliber-caliber!" - you only hear around. And I think that the very first hours of a more or less severe conflict will overwhelm all the satellites of our "glonass". And then what will the course adjustment be done? Will it be like a V-1 flying in the direction of a gyro? By the way, I’ll say that we also did not learn how to do MEMS sensors with accelerometers and magnetometers. We buy through China what is produced by Haneywell. And the most interesting thing is that when the Americans themselves long ago spoke about the possibility of making a guided missile based on the "PlayStation", where these sensors are. Here our wise men and have picked up this idea.
    1. Petrol cutter
      Petrol cutter 4 December 2017 21: 22 New
      +4
      So, similarly, an adversary without satellite constellation remains in the very first hours. So the chances will be equal. Everything was invented before us.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 4 December 2017 22: 11 New
        +3
        Now EVERYONE has abruptly taken care of navigation without satellites, they are not really hoping for the safety of satellites, in which case!
        We can’t fight for it and they don’t plan, right now, but there are already concerns.
        Our rockets can fly without jp and others with ... not now the system has been invented, finalized, improved and darling will fly where necessary.
        They won’t get into the window, there wasn’t such accuracy, but for nuclear munitions it’s not critical.
        This is the scenario of the apocalypse. but in another way, why shoot down satellites?
  11. Old military officer
    Old military officer 5 December 2017 19: 06 New
    0
    Small ships are not effective enough and, although they are far from the IGIS destroyers, well, they are on nach.
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 5 December 2017 20: 33 New
      +3
      So far no one has proven the opposite. Proof can only be a real failure, upon application, without receiving the planned / declared effect. Applications of any different experts are not accepted.
      In short - a real battle and a real assessment of combat qualities, the rest is all speculation.