Design Bureau "Malachite" presented in Malaysia small submarines "Piranha"

St. Petersburg Design Bureau "Malachite" presented at the international exhibition LIMA 2017, passing the island of Langkawi (Malaysia), small submarines "Piranha", capable of carrying cruise missiles "Caliber", reports news agency RNS With reference to the First Deputy General Director - Chief Engineer of Malachite Nikolai Novoselov.

On some small submarines of the Piranha family there is an apparatus into which Caliber missiles can be loaded. A small number of these missiles can be placed,

- said Novoselov

Archival photo: 865 Piranha

The family of mini-submarines includes, in particular, the boats "Piranha-450", "Piranha-650E", "Piranha-950". On submarines can be placed torpedo, rocket and mine weapon. Some submarines have an airlock that allows you to land combat swimmers or "commandos."
Submarines can work in shallow waters, cheap in production and operation. They are made of titanium, the body is practically corrosion resistant, which is especially important when operating in the southern seas.

Those countries that are seriously concerned about their safety and for whom work in shallow water is important, turn to us,

- said the representative of "Malachite".

Comments

[nik-karata]

I met very little information in the press about these boats. ... but I couldn’t even think that a CALIBER would fit in it ... and drop saboteurs and support them with a twinkle (sarcasm)

[g1v2]

Submarine gauges are launched from 533mm torpedo tubes. PM couple fit.

[NEXUS]

Quote: nik-karata

I met very little information in the press about these boats. ... but I couldn’t even think that a CALIBER would fit in it ... and drop saboteurs and support them with a twinkle (sarcasm)

These are wonderful submarines ... let's put it this way, so to speak, a piece of shipbuilding art ... them, if my sclerosis doesn’t fail me, 2 or 3 pieces were built, and then the project was covered up.

An experimental submarine was laid down at the Leningrad Admiralty Association in July 1984. The project under the number 865 had its own name “Piranha”. Subsequently, two ultra-small submarines were developed and built - the experimental MS-520 and the lead MS-521. Boats were built and launched in the Leningrad Admiralty Association.

The construction of the MS-520 began in 1984, and the MS-521 in 1087, and launching on August 20, 1986 and May 31, 1990, respectively. They entered service with the Soviet Navy on December 30, 1988 (MS-520) and December 25, 1990 (MS-521). Boats were made of lightweight titanium alloy.

And I would really like these mini submarines to be built for our Navy.

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: NEXUS

And I would really like these mini submarines to be built for our Navy.

What for? For what tasks? Nowhere to put titanium?
If there was a demand, then the Chinese would have satisfied it long ago, especially in their region. Not China, so Iran is ready to offer its babies.
Malachite has only one way to revive this project - to convince D. Rogozin that without the "Piranhas" of Russia Khan. It all depends on the percentage of "beliefs". The Ilyushetians succeeded with the resuscitation of IL-114.

[NEXUS]

Quote: Vladimir Postnikov

What for? For what tasks? Nowhere to put titanium?

And on what Piranha do titanium?

Quote: Vladimir Postnikov

What for?

For special operations, reconnaissance, mining, etc. ... to combat swimmers such a submarine would not be out of place ...

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: NEXUS

And on what Piranha do titanium?

If it is not made titanium, then this will be a completely different project.

Quote: NEXUS

For special operations, reconnaissance, mining, etc. ... to combat swimmers such a submarine would not be out of place ...

Over thirty years, a lot has changed. Some old tasks for these submarines are already being solved by other technical means and cheaper.

[NEXUS]

Quote: Vladimir Postnikov

Over thirty years, a lot has changed. Some old tasks for these submarines are already being solved by other technical means and cheaper.

Do you not take into account the appearance of new tasks?

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: NEXUS

the emergence of new tasks you do not take into account?

First you need to know these new tasks in order to determine how to solve them more effectively. But, proceed from the fact that the Piranha was created for specific tasks thirty years ago. There was no production reserve for them. Only documentation. Any resumption of production of the Piranhas will require a revision of this documentation. Having all the information and taking into account the factors listed above, it will be possible to make a competent decision. You may be right, but the likelihood of the latter is very low.

[Alex777]

PLO is a very important task for our fleet.
Ensuring the deployment of SSBNs and others.

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: Alex777

PLO is a very important task for our fleet.
Ensuring the deployment of SSBNs and others.

What is the relationship of this task with the Piranha?

[Alex777]

Submarine missile defense tasks best solve submarines.
And if you read the article, then it is not about decommissioned and cut Piranhas from the movie, but about new developments, some of which even carry 4 Caliber. Not to mention torpedo and anti-torpedo weapons.
By the way, to destroy 1 submarines we need just 4 anti-submarine caliber

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: Alex777

And if you read the article, then it is not about decommissioned and cut Piranhas from the movie, but about new developments, some of which even carry 4 Caliber. Not to mention torpedo and anti-torpedo weapons.
By the way, to destroy 1 submarines we need just 4 anti-submarine caliber

Are you seriously? At first, I decided that you were joking. Now I see, do not joke. Do you even know where the main areas of "SSBN deployment" are? And here in these areas will come “Piranhas” with 4 anti-submarine calibers, and even without HACKs? And what if, moreover, it happens in the winter? M-yes! However, not funny.

[the most important]

Quote: Vladimir Postnikov

What for? For what tasks? Nowhere to put titanium?

And I would let this baby out to sea and arrange a small performance (imitation of a malfunction, etc.) so that the noise was in the sea right up to Melbourne ... and under its noise to carry out the advancement of missile carriers into combat duty zones.

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: the most important

Quote: Vladimir Postnikov
What for? For what tasks? Nowhere to put titanium?

And I would let this baby out to sea and arrange a small performance (imitation of a malfunction, etc.) so that the noise was in the sea right up to Melbourne ... and under its noise to carry out the advancement of missile carriers into combat duty zones.

To simulate sound waves, a submarine is not needed. You need a sound wave generator, and nothing more. And even more so do not need so much titanium.

[the most important]

Quote: Vladimir Postnikov

To simulate sound waves, a submarine is not needed. You need a sound wave generator, and nothing more.

It’s too simple ... and the tasks can be more complicated, while fishing for live bait, you still need a live bait. And it’s also necessary to carry the generator by sea with something ... Sometimes it is necessary to make some noise in the Tokyo area, when the Japanese really want the “northern territories”. Do not drive the submarine there. And titanium, of course, is clearly superfluous ..

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: the most important

Yes, and to drag the generator by sea, too, than you need ..

If you faced such a problem, then I recommend that you consider the option of a drone (here, the simplest diesel-electric will do). Go ahead.

[Ratmir_Ryazan]

B .... destroyed at the request of the United States ... So many resources, so many labor people invested to make our country more secure, and these bastards Gorbachev, Yeltsin and a gang of sloths around them all let out on the mark ... No words, damned damned , damn you ... They sold the country and its people for a house in Germany ... Although such houses can be built in Russia for everyone, but of course it is necessary to work ...
I really hope that the project will be restored and made even better. These are exactly the boats that are needed in the Baltic, these Western "partners" will throw mines there and block all the nets so that the sprat does not sail, and these boats will pass and where they will make a hole in the metal net (let the divers out and the passage is ready), and then how the “Caliber” is craving ... Of course, the US was afraid of them ...
Urgently urgent need to restore this project ... Let the fund be created if there is no money, I am ready to regularly throw it off ...

[Sergey S.]

Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan

Let the fund be created if there is no money, I am ready to regularly throw it off ...

I agree, but ... I have "experience" ...
In 1979, when I was still a Komsomol member, I bought a set of postcards "Ships of the Lenin Komsomol."
And there is a handsome watchman "Leningrad Komsomolets", project 1135.
I’m in the cell for the guys - how is the ship so, and we have nothing to do with it ...
The idea was simple. LAO built diesel boats, they decided to collect money for the Komsomol boat.
We got to the party committee. Those asked the district committee.
As I understand it, the district committee consulted and understood.
Then we were told: The matter is real, to collect, but it’s better to work out the bill, you can. Even if it’s not enough, the district committee will add from the communists of the district ...
But ... they decided upstairs ... no need to escalate in front of the Moscow Olympics ...
We are a peace-loving country, youth donations to a submarine in the west can not understand adequately ...

In general, the initiative was hacked ...
But a little later, troops were sent to Afghanistan.

[dubowitskij.vick]

Quote: NEXUS

Quote: nik-karata

I met very little information in the press about these boats. ... but I couldn’t even think that a CALIBER would fit in it ... and drop saboteurs and support them with a twinkle (sarcasm)

These are wonderful submarines ... let's put it this way, so to speak, a piece of shipbuilding art ... them, if my sclerosis doesn’t fail me, 2 or 3 pieces were built, and then the project was covered up.
[media = https: //youtu.be/PXHtb0LcIqQ]

An experimental submarine was laid down at the Leningrad Admiralty Association in July 1984. The project under the number 865 had its own name “Piranha”. Subsequently, two ultra-small submarines were developed and built - the experimental MS-520 and the lead MS-521. Boats were built and launched in the Leningrad Admiralty Association.
The construction of the MS-520 began in 1984, and the MS-521 in 1087, and launching on August 20, 1986 and May 31, 1990, respectively. They entered service with the Soviet Navy on December 30, 1988 (MS-520) and December 25, 1990 (MS-521). Boats were made of lightweight titanium alloy.

And I would really like these mini submarines to be built for our Navy.

Was it on her who went for the kodira left in Finland by our Kuzmich and k0? And which dvigun works for "everything that burns"?

[NEXUS]

Quote: dubowitskij.vick

Was it on her who went for the kodira left in Finland by our Kuzmich and k0? And which dvigun works for "everything that burns"?

Yes, on her ...

[Evgeniy667b]

Andrei is wrong, these boats should initially go to the Russian Navy. and only then somewhere. The whole spectrum! As for the MS-520 and MC521. then they were simply disposed of. most likely due to the used titanium alloys. The period of their cancellation fell precisely on the heyday of thoughtless and greedy metalworkers.

[kapitan92]

Quote: nik-karata

I met very little information in the press about these boats. ... but I couldn’t even think that a CALIBER would fit in it ... and drop saboteurs and support them with a twinkle (sarcasm)

I don’t understand why everyone is speculating with these “Caliber”. This is an impact, expensive weapon, which is absolutely not intended to be placed on a piranha type semi-finished gun, which has specific functions. Disembark military swimmers or put stealthy minefields, and then shy away from the Caliber and completely unmask the boat. It’s easier and more functional a couple of torpedoes "Physicist" - there will be more benefits. (IMHO)

[Evgesh91]

It seems to me, or soon the "caliber" can be introduced in the package Suite for Kalina and Grant?

[RUS96]

I’ll give my Ministry of Defense my own garage for "calibers" ... if necessary

[Wedmak]

Soon the "caliber" can be introduced in the package Suite for Kalina and Grant?

Well, the caliber is not needed, but I would gladly put a couple of anti-tank systems. You see, on the roads of boors it will decrease.

[bouncyhunter]

Quote: Wedmak

Well, the caliber is not needed, but I would gladly put a couple of anti-tank systems. You see, on the roads of boors it will decrease.

This is unlikely - the boors will switch to the same "stuffed" cars. "Mad Max" nervously smokes on the sidelines ...

[Wedmak]

boors will switch to the same "stuffed" cars

Well, not a fact. Now such boors are "supported" by impunity. Well, he cut you off turning from the left row to the right and flew away, what will you do? You will cover it with a mat and move on. And here, as it were ... and you can get a rocket in the ass.
Ah yes ... the rocket charge should be reduced. To only tear off the trunk and damage the rear wheels.
And if this ghoul uses a rocket to make his way, heels will fly into it. Here you can’t get off the trunk ...
But ... dreams are not marketable. In addition, you also have to invent some kind of security cocoon.

[bouncyhunter]

Quote: Wedmak

In addition, you also have to invent some kind of security cocoon.

The armored capsule has already been invented.

[Cat man null]

I read you here, and for some reason I thought that "allowing the short-barrel" is still too early ...

[Wedmak]

still too early ...

Well, I wrote it in jest mode. Who in their right mind would put the ATGM on the car. Yes, even in the city.
A short-barreled need to be resolved, but:
1. Be sure to study in handling weapons with passing an exam.
2. According to the first, only allow those who served or owned a smoothbore for at least 5 years.
3. A check with doctors is mandatory, including a psychological test.

And so smoothly and enter.

[Cat man null]

Quote: Wedmak

Well, I wrote it in joke mode ...

- uhh ... mountain from shoulders

[Paranoid50]

Quote: Wedmak

But ... dreams are not marketable.

Well, how to say ... Someone is trying to translate. At least so:

[Asadullah]

I desperately need this!

[Alexeyklg]

"- The place here is deaf, here it is better to approach by boat, on the underwater.
- At the Baby.
- How do you know that? This is a state secret!
- So last year we went to the islands for berries on it! "
Features of national fishing

[bratchanin3]

These babies must be a formidable force.

[mine]

Quote: bratchanin3

These babies must be a formidable force.

The Piranha Project

Unfortunately, the development of SMPL in the Navy of the USSR clearly followed the erroneous way of applying to small submarines a number of requirements for large ones. This led to the creation of a double-hulled SMPL project "Piranha" with a huge displacement and extremely low TTX. Usually, the submarine of the 941 project was called a water carrier in our fleet. They not only had a record displacement, but also carried on themselves huge volumes of seawater. However, the criticism of the 941 project was largely unfounded. Within the strict conditions and requirements that put its developers in 70-s, the project turned out to be the most successful and talented. And even seemingly flaws (the same "water content") eventually worked for the cause, ensuring high missile readiness in the Arctic due to the ability to break thick ice.

Pitfalls of Severodvinsk

The use of the two-part architecture for the SMPL project 865 killed him. Comparison of the performance characteristics of the 80-s with the 205-project (FRG) 60-s is amazing. Practically in all TTX our submarine is not just lagging behind, but completely unsatisfactory. With a close displacement (319 tons versus 450 tons in “Germans”), the maximum speed is 6,5 node versus 17, two torpedo tubes for small torpedoes against eight for the 53 caliber centimeter, etc. And this is despite the use of titanium and expensive alloys for the body of titanium alloys. silver-zinc rechargeable batteries on the Piranha.

Here, for example, are some simple questions that developers find it difficult to answer at salons. What weapons are they going to put on the new Piranha? Torpedoes "Latush", which had TTX at the level of German TV during World War II? What hydroacoustics, RES?

The “Piranha” variants of increased displacement do not have any advantages over the Amur submarine versions of the Rubin Design Bureau.

SMPL is extremely necessary for the Navy, but instead of the really desired and possible fleet, some fantastic searchlights are offered. Though in Iran or North Korea SMPL buy.
Read more: http://vpk-news.ru/articles/21481

[pl675]

On some small submarines of the Piranha family there is an apparatus into which Caliber missiles can be loaded. A small number of these missiles can be placed,
- said Novoselov

but it may not be placed, it will not pass in size.
something I hardly believe in it.
and the seller’s mood is not the same, you won’t sell such an elephant.

[pl675]

Thanks for the information of course.
to the reality of the existence of these projects in the gland, you still need to survive.
Well, from the “frets” I agree - negative emotions, and only

[mine]

Quote from rudolf

But why they are not for sale is a question.

because shit
the late Pashin answered this question at one time "the case is in Malachite itself"

[Navuxonastupil]

Quote: Alekseyklg

"- The place here is deaf, here it is better to approach by boat, on the underwater.
- At the Baby.
- How do you know that? This is a state secret!
- So last year we went to the islands for berries on it! "
Features of national fishing

And the fuel is suitable, judging by this film! Piranha and I are of the same blood!

[domnich]

Quote: NEXUS

These are wonderful sub ...

In the Soviet Union, work on ultra-small submarines began in the 20 of the last century. The ideologist was the head of the Special Technical Bureau for Military Inventions of Special Purpose Vladimir Bekauri. Already in 1936, the “Autonomous underwater special vessel” was built and successfully tested with a surface displacement of 7,2 tons, with a crew of one person and armed with one torpedo. Moreover, this mini-submarine could also be controlled by radio - from a ship or aircraft, in this case the boat carried an 500-kg explosive charge and was used as an underwater firearms.

In the same year, the Black Sea began testing an autonomous submarine "Pygmy" with a surface displacement of 19 tons, armed with two 450-mm torpedo tubes. After completing the trials in 1937, it was planned to build 10 of such “super-babies”, but that year turned out to be fatal: for the submarine (it remained in a single copy and went to the Germans with the outbreak of war), and for Vladimir Bekauri (he was arrested on trumped-up denunciation and shot).

During the war years, three SMPL projects proposed by TsKB-18 (projects 606, 606bis and 610) were rejected by the People's Commissar Nikolai Kuznetsov: he believed that all efforts should be concentrated so far on the construction of ordinary submarines, and after the victory there were not numerous special forces of the Navy disbanded as "unnecessary." Accordingly, “super-babies” were not needed, because the party and the government set the task of creating an ocean nuclear missile fleet.

Only at the beginning of the 1950-s the leadership of the Ministry of Defense and the command of the Navy of the USSR began to recreate special forces units of naval intelligence. However, it turned out that recruiting capable fighters and training them accordingly was only half the battle. The personnel of special forces groups must also be properly equipped. The Navy tried to solve this problem on its own and in an almost artisanal way.

Everything fell into place only in the 1966 year, when all the work on the Triton-2 SMPL project was transferred to the Volna Central Design Bureau, and the construction was entrusted to the Leningrad Novo-Admiralteysky Plant. In 1967, refinement and testing of a prototype of a six-seater SMPL were carried out and the design of the new Triton-1M apparatus was started - for two people.

A total of 32 ultra-small submarines were built in Leningrad - transporters of light divers such as the Triton-1M, as well as the 11 mini-submarines Triton-2. Their unique feature was the construction of the so-called wet type - the submarine lacks a sturdy hull and the “passengers” are in the fully-filled SMPL cabin. The robust, small-sized, tight compartments on the SMPL are designed only for appliances, batteries and electric motors. Moreover, during the Triton-2 SMPL, during the transportation, the special forces did not use their apparatuses for breathing, but the stationary respiratory system.

But the most famous example of domestic “super-babies” was the Piranha SMPL, which even managed to become a movie star: its “output” in the film “Features of National Fishing” will not leave anyone indifferent. This mini-submarine was already capable of carrying not only fighters with weapons and equipment, but also torpedoes and mines, and could independently attack surface ships and vessels in the coastal zone. The “super-baby” with a length of 28,2 and a width of 4,7 meters had a displacement of about 200 tons, could sink to a depth of 200 meters and develop underwater a course to the 6,7 node. Autonomy in fuel reserves and provisions - 10 days, crew - three people and six light divers, weapons - two outboard devices for setting mines or launching 400-mm torpedoes. Foreign experts who learned about these submarines after the fall of the Iron Curtain agreed that the USSR was ahead of the West in this direction for at least 10 – 15 for at least years. Unfortunately, both mini-submarines were withdrawn from the Navy in 1999 and were disposed of after unsuccessful attempts to find a buyer abroad.

Triton-1M


Triton-2


In 1978-1982, as the commander of a diving vessel in Balaklava, he provided divers with the Triton-1M carrier. Mostly tested weapons (underwater pistols, machine guns).

[mine]

Quote: domnich

The “super-baby” with a length of 28,2 and a width of 4,7 meters had a displacement of about 200 tons, could sink to a depth of 200 meters and develop underwater a course to the 6,7 node. Autonomy in fuel reserves and provisions - 10 days, crew - three people and six light divers, weapons - two outboard devices for setting mines or launching 400-mm torpedoes. Foreign experts who learned about these submarines after the fall of the Iron Curtain agreed that the USSR was ahead of the West in this direction for at least 10 – 15 years

led to the creation of two-hull submarines of the Piranha project with a huge displacement and extremely low performance characteristics. Usually, in our fleet, the water carrier was called the 941 submarine. They not only had a record displacement, but also carried huge volumes of sea water. However, the criticism of the 941 project was largely unfounded. In the framework of the harsh conditions and requirements that its developers put in the 70 years, the project turned out to be the most successful and talented. And even seemingly flaws (the same “water supply”) eventually worked for the cause, providing high missile readiness in the Arctic due to the ability to break thick ice.

Pitfalls of Severodvinsk

The use of the two-part architecture for the SMPL project 865 killed him. Comparison of the performance characteristics of the 80-s with the 205-project (FRG) 60-s is amazing. Practically in all TTX our submarine is not just lagging behind, but completely unsatisfactory. With a close displacement (319 tons versus 450 tons in “Germans”), the maximum speed is 6,5 node versus 17, two torpedo tubes for small torpedoes against eight for the 53 caliber centimeter, etc. And this is despite the use of titanium and expensive alloys for the body of titanium alloys. silver-zinc rechargeable batteries on the Piranha.

Here, for example, are some simple questions that developers find it difficult to answer at salons. What weapons are they going to put on the new Piranha? Torpedoes "Latush", which had TTX at the level of German TV during World War II? What hydroacoustics, RES?
Read more: http://vpk-news.ru/articles/21481

[Alex777]

Vladimir Postnikov,
Why did you decide that they are without hooks?

[Vladimir Postnikov]

These are tears, not HACKs. They are not intended for hunting enemy submarines. The piranhas themselves will be objects of hunting for them. These small-sized HACs have completely different tasks.
But your main mistakes in the application of Piranhas to the tasks of PLO are not related to the HACK. They are listed in my previous comment. You better tell me how, according to your intentions, the Piranhas will be deployed in the Arctic seas. I promise that I will not laugh.

[Alex777]

What kind of Piranhas are you asking about?
Judging by the aplomb, are you a submariner?