Military Review

Gloomy morning on Bandera Avenue

208



“The task of the enemy was to tear away Ukraine and Ukrainians from us not only politically but also emotionally. The enemy decided to solve this problem completely ... ”Psychotherapist Leonid Tretyak.

So, the Moscow Avenue in Kiev will be renamed into Bandera Avenue. And the avenue named after General Vatutin - in Shukhevych Avenue. And what should we do with it, where should we run from it? Good questions. It is ugly to give advice to adults when they are not asked to do this, and yet: lying is not good. Why? The thing is that as the one who sells drugs, risks getting hooked on his goods, so he who constantly lies to others, he risks starting to believe in his own tales. In both cases there is a barrier, but its strength is not infinite.

This is the basic position in any serious reasoning, when trying to understand this or that problem: you cannot lie, you cannot lie at all, no matter how much you would like. Otherwise it will not work, otherwise you will receive informational garbage instead of the result. But a man is a prejudiced and emotional being, he has tastes and preferences, and there is no escape from it. Such is the dilemma: a human being is certainly reasonable, but addicting and often irresponsible.

What is this all about? And all this is to assess the very "evil" of the Ukrainian situation. The problem here is the following: most authors first of all include emotions to the fullest, after which they proceed to “analysis”. And it does not matter what the result of this analysis is: “ugly ukrofashisty” or “fraternal people, deceived by the State Department,” is not the point. The problem is excessive emotionality and bias.

I have a modest opinion that the problem of Ukraine is a political problem, not akin-emotional one and it only makes sense to consider it in this vein. It doesn’t matter who lives where near Zhmerinka. So the indignation experienced by many Russian citizens, looking at the situation in Ukraine, is the result of outright self-deception. Simply, the incubation period of the national fascist disease ended and she splashed to the surface. But it all started much, much earlier.

What is the reason for the error of the overwhelming majority of Russian publicists writing about Ukraine? They begin to analyze not objective facts and the real situation, they begin to “dance” from their “mriy” and “hotelok.” This is the root of evil. Many start counting on the fact that the Russians and Ukrainians are two fraternal peoples, one blood that we should be together, after which they proceed to analyze the current state of affairs in Russian-Ukrainian relations and remain extremely dissatisfied with them. After that, a sharp criticism of the Russian policy towards Ukraine begins.

Such is the working scheme, according to which most of the articles and comments on Ukrainian topics are written. At the same time, disgruntled commentators somehow forget that they need two to play the fiery Argentine tango. The Ukrainian ruling structures (oddly enough!) Did not enter into a conscious dialogue with Russian public opinion before Maidan-2, therefore all emotions were impinged on the Russian Foreign Ministry and Comrade Zurabov (Why didn’t they?). There was no limit to outrage.

Here, first of all, there are many "uncomfortable" questions. If we are such “brothers” with the Ukrainians, why didn’t the intergovernmental dialogue go on in zero years? A dialogue between politicians, between Russians and Ukrainians, after all? What was the problem? The problem was the frank reluctance of the Ukrainian side to maintain such a dialogue. And you first give cheap gas ... In general, Ukrainians preferred to smile mysteriously and keep silent (in response to direct and frank questions). That is, to all those who accuse Russia of having spoiled relations with Ukraine, I propose to explain this paradox: why did the Ukrainians not try to do anything in this area at all? Moreover, they persistently cut off contacts in the cultural and educational spheres. What is the problem?

For some reason, all the agitators and propagandists of the Russian-Ukrainian friendship preferred to fall on the heads of the Russians, but not the Ukrainians ... Why such selectiveity? All complaints, discontent and anger about the lack of friendliness were also addressed to Moscow, but not to Kiev. And what, there in the "Square" all mentally retarded? No, just propaganda comrades understood perfectly well what kind of reception was waiting for them in Ukraine, therefore they didn’t go there with their “bold” ideas.

Why has there never been a serious discussion in Ukraine about the prospects of relations with Russia? Why Ukrainians have never seen anything wrong and did not even suspect the existence of such? Why was the only form of communication with Russia on the part of the Ukrainians was blatant lies in their eyes (and no one forbids the Russian language!)? If everything was “so good,” why was it so bad?

The truth is that until a certain point in Russia it was customary to turn a blind eye on many things: “no need to escalate.” Closing your eyes became harder and harder: Ukraine rapidly and aggressively "de-Russified" from above, but we continued to "believe in a miracle" and try to be friends with our neighbors. So, in February, 2014 finally became clear that the Ukrainian SSR was over and in its place something completely different and absolutely unacceptable for Russians appeared.

The process went a long time ago, and now we see its results, and we don’t like them at all. And again, there are voices that the majority of Ukrainians are “good” and do not support the junta. And that "do not push them away." Just from February, 2014 (actually earlier!) With regard to Ukraine began a completely different one: a tough and pragmatic policy. In particular, we finally stopped “fighting for Ukrainians”, that's enough, we got a lot of it. For Ukraine, this is extremely painful, as for many Russians. But what can you do if the previous policy of "attracting Ukrainians" ended with a complete file?

And, by the way, yes, statements in the Ukrainian press began to appear that Ukrainians have always been an integral part of the empire, that Russia “abandoned” Ukrainians in 1991 ... Just finally to the most advanced citizens of Ukraine, the depth of that pit into which they had fallen slowly began to reach. It is also true that Ukraine, which has fallen into the western zone of influence, has completely stopped financing. Both from the east and from the west. And it became a complete surprise for the Ukrainian elite. Funny isn't it? And now, after all that was, after all the insults, spits, shelling of Russian territory and ethnic cleansing in the southeast, after the attacks on the Russian embassy ...

They suddenly decided to play a little back and try to interest someone in Russia. You know, it's not even funny ... Guys, where have you been before? Who are you campaigning for? After the final victory of the “revolution of gidnosti”, it suddenly became clear that the massive political party that had emerged in Ukraine, the new owner and its owners do not absolutely need. The political system of Ukraine has been substantially simplified. And here they were out of work, they remembered Russia ...

Gentlemen, it's too late. Who do you need now in Russia? You are "waste material." Previously, it was necessary to think before making a choice. First, you have proved your loyalty to the “pro-Western vector,” well done. In Kiev, you are no longer needed, what makes you think that you are needed in Moscow? Secondly, taking into account the peculiarities of the political system that has emerged in Ukraine, which is modern for us, the pro-Russian sentiments there are absolutely useless for the Kremlin today. The train left. New Vlad can just shoot every second, and the West will not notice it (just kidding).

By the way, every Ukrainian felt the decline of the country's status and the change of its political system. With the "vile panda" and previously there was a "populist democracy" and the power of the skin climbed, trying to prevent the growth of tariffs, save benefits, etc. The "little Ukrainian" was a subject of politics, and they fought for his opinion. Then Yanukovych took 3 billion from Putin in order to spend it on “social sphere”, that is why he did not sign an agreement with the EU, so as not to ruin the social security system and subsidies ... Exactly worked power system in Ukraine. Now everything is much simpler: the authorities will elect what they need, and for non-payment of utility costs, the non-payer will be expelled to the street. But the mine will be closed, and the heating will be turned off. It is precisely because the political status of the “little Ukrainian” has fallen sharply and his opinion is no longer interesting to anyone. It is cheaper to intimidate (beat) than to feed.

Ukrainian "thinkers" were so naive that they did not even try to ask a simple question: what will happen to them after the "complete and final peremoga"? Will there be a new light world "without Poles, Jews and Muscovites"? The ideological struggle for Ukraine is over, the “Bortsuns” are no longer needed, shelling began. But here they are, “Ukrainian intellectuals,” quite stupid people and love tasty and most importantly full of food and gorilochka to polish the whole thing ... But who will pour them vodka now? People themselves, with their own hands (languages) destroyed the system where they were claimed.

Now, if it makes sense to “buy up” someone in Ukraine, then these are not publicists and not journalists, and not even media moguls, but field commanders. Like Latin America, like Columbia ... Sendero Luminoso ... Macho with machine guns ... Who needs idle talkers now? Gentlemen, did you understand this just now? Congratulations! We needed you very much (past time, alas). Russia for so long tried to reach you, to establish a dialogue ... And now it's too late for dialogues. Unfortunately, the time has passed when dialogues meant something in Ukraine.

In general, it is too late to “save” Ukraine, it is senseless and too expensive. At the “entrance” to “independence”, this country had no debts and was among the top ten industrialized countries, now the economy and finances of this country are completely destroyed. The educated and hard-working people were completely declassified, that is, turned into "Euro-bulks". An attempt to "restore" Ukraine bears a terrible cost. And most importantly: Ukraine has completely lost its sovereignty and statehood. And in order to begin to restore it (that is, to lay out hundreds of billions from one’s own pocket), it must first be recaptured from the Americans and Bandera, and they, of course, will fiercely defend the “sovereignty and territorial integrity of the country of Ukraine” Blooming Soviet Ukraine.

And the funny thing is: having accomplished these “feats of Hercules” and having beaten off and rebuilding Ukraine, it will be necessary to transfer it (including the Donbass and the Crimea!) To the tenacious legs of those who literally screwed up so literally before our eyes.

I apologize: here we need it why? Put there? After all, we are talking about the restoration of "independent Ukraine", supposedly now "friendly Russia" (recovery at the expense of, of course, Russia). Sorry, you have to, you and restore ... They themselves broke, glue them together with "superglue".

Gloomy morning on Bandera Avenue
Author:
Photos used:
kremen.today
208 comments
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  1. PKK
    PKK 19 July 2016 05: 35
    +31
    The Ukrainians imagined themselves to be a NATO outpost and are trying to prove it. In addition, they are also "Europeans", and this, you understand, obliges Russia to constantly shit. Of course, we will have to disentangle all this. And that the enemy has clearly identified himself.
    1. dmi.pris
      dmi.pris 19 July 2016 06: 16
      +3
      Eight years ago, it was already so to say, bad. I wanted to watch an old film with McDowell in the title role, and read the comments of the ukrohlopchik to him. There they argued that Moscow had a plan - "Mechanical Orange" for the occupation of Ukraine ..
      1. Ami du peuple
        Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 06: 43
        +36
        Quote: dmi.pris
        About eight years ago it was already bad to say so.
        "Bad" began with the first Maidan, when the dioxin Yushch was illegally pushed into the presidency of Ukraine. And, frankly, this "bad" began back in 1991 - with the adoption of the Act of Declaration of Independence of Ukraine and an all-Ukrainian referendum in its support, when almost the entire population voted for "independence."
        The author of the article is a huge plus. Briefly and to the point.
        1. Temples
          Temples 19 July 2016 07: 49
          +29
          2014, it became completely clear that the Ukrainian SSR was over and in its place something completely different and completely unacceptable to the Russians arose.


          The USSR did not end but continued.
          Evolved.
          But a hundred years ago it was "formed" - cut off from the empire during the war.
          They cut off Russians from Russians and called them to be Ukrainians.

          This is how surgeons would cut off a man’s hand and say why and why ?:
          - Yes, she was left!

          Do not smack nonsense.

          A hundred years ago there was not any Ukraine.
          Take a card.
          And there was no language - look at the last imperial census.
          And just have time to see the native names of cities and villages.
          Many in Russia are ashamed to talk about the Empire and its lands.
          Not politically correct in relation to the budded, their mother's leg.

          The West sawed off part of the Russian world.

          And writers earn royalties with their blah blah blah.

          This is the result - Ukraine and its "independent" inhabitants - we are not Russians, we are Europeans.
          Really non-Russians. Not a couple of their ancestors.
          1. Svyatoslavich
            Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 08: 51
            +3
            ...notRussia.
            Like a cancerous tumor.
            Itself has grown?
          2. tolian
            tolian 19 July 2016 08: 57
            -1
            Ukraine in its current version was made by Himmler. And he talked about it to Hitler. Shortly before the collapse of the Reich. And, according to our historians, it was put approximately like this: "I planted a bomb under the post-war USSR. And this bomb is Ukraine."
            1. Orionvit
              Orionvit 20 July 2016 01: 45
              +2
              Ukraine in its current version was made by Himmler. And he talked about it to Hitler. Shortly before the collapse of the Reich. And, according to our historians, it was put approximately like this: "I planted a bomb under the post-war USSR. And this bomb is Ukraine."
              What nonsense are you talking about. In this case, Himmler also left the Baltic states, the Caucasus, and Central Asia as a bomb, almost forgot about Moldova. The population of the former "fraternal" republics, in the way of thinking, does not differ in any way from the Ukrainians. Ukraine and Ukrainians, this is an Austrian and Polish anti-Russian project, which was fired only after more than a hundred years.
          3. CONTROL
            CONTROL 19 July 2016 09: 01
            +9
            Quote: Temples
            A hundred years ago there was not any Ukraine.
            Take a card.

            Under Ivan the Terrible there were Ukraine! (well, yes, with a small letter ...) There were - in the south, in the north, in the east ... And they sent responsible people - boyars and merchants - to master and populate the "Ukrainian" lands - stronger, smarter and more intelligent ... Kazakov, too - Ermak, for example (to read the orders of the tsar - so there "... send to Ukraine" is written, that is - for the Urals, "for the increment and arrangement of the Russian land ...".
            Quote: Temples
            And there was no language - look at the last imperial census.
            And just have time to see the native names of cities and villages.
            Many in Russia are ashamed to talk about the Empire and its lands.
            Not politically correct in relation to the budded, their mother's leg.
            The West sawed off part of the Russian world.
            And writers earn royalties with their blah blah blah.
            This is the result - Ukraine and its "independent" inhabitants - we are not Russians, we are Europeans.
            Really non-Russians. Not a couple of their ancestors.

            ... that is why the "Ukrainians" deserve their current name - traitors! ...
            1. Army soldier2
              Army soldier2 19 July 2016 11: 01
              +8
              Why traitors? It is we who, in a single impulse, consider them brothers. Poroshenko (Yatsenyuk, Poruby, Yarosh, and anyone else) is bad with us, and the Ukrainian people are fraternal. And they overwhelmingly do not think so.
              15 years enjoyed Russia. According to experts, preferential prices for gas and oil gave Ukraine from 200 to 300 billion dollars. Russia itself went for it, despite the ban on the Russian language, a downed plane, and the conflict on Tuzla. By the way, Parashenko’s elections were recognized.
              And after 2014, Ukrainians decided to milk Europe. Unfortunately, they were mistaken.
              1. potroshenko
                potroshenko 19 July 2016 14: 33
                -2
                Quote: Army 2
                Why traitors? It is we who, in a single impulse, consider them brothers.

                Yah. Even here on the site, many people insult Ukrainians. Some write that Ukrainians should be treated like cattle, there are still different messages in this style, and moderators do not react in any way, despite the fact that this is a violation of the site’s rules. That is, the rules do not apply if you want to insult and humiliate a resident of Ukraine. If such hatred among the population acts in the information field, then what kind of friendship between the townsfolk can we talk about? I am glad that there are adequate people.
                Quote: Army 2
                According to experts, preferential prices for gas and oil gave Ukraine from 200 to 300 billion dollars.

                Can you link to "iksperdov"?
                1. COJIDAT
                  COJIDAT 20 July 2016 14: 18
                  +1
                  I agree - the question is not as flat as presented in the article. You can spit in my face, but the adequacy of the question is relative - today he is a great guy, and tomorrow a serial maniac and vice versa - history knows many examples!
                  1. COJIDAT
                    COJIDAT 20 July 2016 14: 21
                    +2
                    Although, exceptionalism was developed in the minds of Ukrainians precisely due to the constant subsidies and gifts from Russia (Soviet and present), and this is only a mentality - i.e. generalized stereotype of collective thinking. You can spoil one person or the whole team - it does not matter!
                    1. COJIDAT
                      COJIDAT 20 July 2016 14: 29
                      +1
                      Almost all small peoples living side by side with the ethnic majority experience an individual inferiority complex, and therefore are prone to nationalistic ideas and actions, in the spirit of "why are we worse?" Those nations who have lost the former glory and power of their ancestors are subject to the same. Again, the law of relativity works everywhere!
                2. Erg
                  Erg 21 July 2016 18: 40
                  0
                  Quote: potroshenko
                  Can you link to "iksperdov"?

                  What are the experts. A calculator to help. Prices in the internet. yes
            2. The comment was deleted.
          4. Olezhek
            19 July 2016 11: 08
            +6
            The USSR did not end but continued.
            Evolved.


            Or degraded / regressed
        2. Suhow
          Suhow 19 July 2016 20: 37
          +9
          plus about yusch, but voted for independence and you have the Russian Federation, only many believed that it would be as before "peace is a chocolate bar" if the Russians do not want, for example, to be friends with the Chinese, then let them not be friends, the Ukrainians want to be friends, then the hands. But how harshly we all were ... zhuhali. And how they dirtied our brains, for example, here in Ukraine. And the current situation in Ukraine I for myself perceive as a punishment for my base action and cowardice. Heroes Bandera Shukhevych - ugh ... no words.
      2. Altona
        Altona 19 July 2016 06: 56
        +17
        Quote: dmi.pris
        About eight years ago it was already bad to say

        -------------------------
        Yes, since the end of the 80s, it has been bad in principle, but in 1991 it got really bad when the USSR with its ideology collapsed. The Ukrainians were indoctrinated with the simple idea that "the Muscovites are fat and want more ists." When this zhovto-blakitnoe banner flew up so everything fell down. In principle, they themselves have chosen, let them eat Square. But there are still many normal people there. Why didn't they organize themselves like Donbass? This is not clear.
        1. Monarchist
          Monarchist 19 July 2016 07: 18
          +1
          The question is interesting, but there is no answer
        2. Ami du peuple
          Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 07: 26
          +16
          Quote: Altona
          But there are still many normal people. Why didn’t they organize themselves like Donbass? This is incomprehensible.
          Very clear. The above picture shows the dynamics of growth in the number of children who studied on the move. Who was there to organize against the Natsiks, if in the same Russian Donbass almost half of the younger generation was overwhelmed? This also applies to parents who sent their children to Ukrainian schools with Bandera ideology. I’ll keep silent about the other central and eastern regions, and so everything is clear.
          1. revnagan
            revnagan 19 July 2016 09: 10
            +15
            Quote: Ami du peuple
            This also applies to parents who sent their children to Ukrainian schools with Bandera ideology.

            And where was the children sent to the parish? Russian schools were shutting down. But in general, the author is a little disingenuous. So, quite a bit who blames Russians for the situation in Ukraine? Maybe the accusations go to the RUSSIAN LEADERSHIP, which slept! the fascization of Ukraine? And relations between peoples remained at the level of "Slavianski Bazaar" and visits to relatives in Zelenograd and Zhmerinka. At the level of relations between states, ordinary citizens have never decided anything. In Ukraine, by the will of fate, the Waltsman-Kolomoisky were in power, in Russia Abramovich- It was at that time that relations between states were developing. They did not care about ordinary people. The Russian "Waltzmans" had their own interest here, the Ukrainian ones still have their own Iteres in Russia. The fascists do not care, the main thing is gesheft. And when the "good uncles "from the West offered the Ukrainian" Waltzmans "a little more denyushkov than the Russian ones -" love passed, the tomatoes wilted. "And the radicals had already fledged by this time. Neither the Russian people, nor the Ukrainians decided anything here. Ali.
            1. Ami du peuple
              Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 10: 27
              +10
              Quote: revnagan
              And where was the children to be sent to the parish? Russian schools then closed.
              Have you paid attention to my illustration in Crimea? Apparently not. Crimeans did their best to oppose forced Ukrainization, therefore, Russian schools preserved - 7% of secluded schools in the whole Crimea and 2% of them in Sevas is not an indicator?
              Quote: revnagan
              So, very few people blame the Russians for the situation in Ukraine?
              It is the Russians in the Ukraine who accuse the Russian Russians of treason. Here, just now, there was an article by Lzygovbrodsky "Letter from a pro-Russian Ukrainian", so some (including you, dear) directly accused the citizens of the Russian Federation of inaction, like "Russia must fight for us, but we will wait for release." Let me ask you, why the hell is it?
              Quote: revnagan
              ..the charges go to the LEADERSHIP of Russia, which overslept! fascization of Ukraine?
              We ourselves have a mouthful of problems. to decide something else for you. Maybe it was the Russians of Ukraine who slept through fascisation? I don’t remember any active protests (before Maidan-2014, of course) against the violent Ukrainization and banderization of Russians and Russian-speaking. You lived there quite well, not at all taking the creeping regulation seriously. Come back Yanyk right now, and they would not start talking about the "Russian world" - they would sit on the priest exactly.
              Quote: revnagan
              In Ukraine, by the will of fate, the Waltzmann-Kolomoisky were in power, in Russia Abramovich-Berezovsky. Neither Russian people nor Ukrainians decided anything here.
              Yes, yes, Zhdy again to blame. You are not lost in time, dear? Neither Berezovsky nor Abramovich has long been in Russia. It was you who recently hung the Valtsmanov with the Groisman on your neck.
              1. Svyatoslavich
                Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 10: 55
                -8
                Our problems are full of mouth.
                Who is this "with you"?
                We are one nation - Russian.
                The border between present-day Ukraine and Russia is just a line on the map - "Berlin Wall.
                1. SergeBS
                  SergeBS 19 July 2016 19: 11
                  +5
                  Quote: Svyatoslavich
                  The border between today's Ukraine and Russia is just a line on the map - the "Berlin" wall.

                  Uh-huh. And "Hto do not jump - that Moskal", "Moskalyaku - for Gilyak" - "free application". am
                  Well, tell me that the "West" and "East" Germans hated each other. Or only "Westerners" hated "Easterners". How the current "Ukrainians" hate the Russian Federation. It comes to an anecdote: who arrived in the Russian Federation before 201X - more or less. Whoever even earlier DOESN'T BELIEVE that in Ukraine it IS. But whoever later "went to work for a job" - they plow in the Russian Federation, they help their relatives in 404 with TRANSLATIONS from the Russian Federation, and EVERYTHING IS ALWAYS sure - "The Russian Federation offended us, made us poor, DOES NOT LIVE." With a BIG problem about - "what has offended the Russian Federation and how did it become beggars?" What is easily "calculated", if you look - WHY is it blathering. And vyakatsya with a SIMPLE goal - "to sit on the priest exactly, for the PRESENCE in the office to get the loot."
                  However, "especially Europeanized" Russians also suffer from this: "I came here, they pay me little here, so I won't WORK." "Modestly" so forgetting that when he walked - he knew the salary, and agreed to work on these conditions. Pidorgi.
                2. Ria
                  Ria 19 July 2016 20: 46
                  +8
                  Do not be mistaken - in the neighboring state of Ukraine, our blood relatives have long ceased to understand that they are Russian, and they vehemently hate Russia with its inhabitants because of envy and a freebie habit, which has become less. And this reality must be realized without looking into the pink glasses. Each country will go its own development path, and perhaps in 30-40 years, the nations will decide something for themselves if there is a reason. And now the border is the iron limit, we don’t need to go there, and from there we don’t need anyone, just for a short visit, to see relatives. Friendship is friendship (if any), but money apart. And as soon as the Ukrainians understand this, they will begin to pour such poison on Russia that you won’t be glad. Natural dependents and loafers live there, and depriving them of a feeder, you can see their true face. So WE ARE NOT BROTHERS, AND NEIGHBORS. It is much better and calmer. Everyone works in his pocket and lives within his means.
              2. Army soldier2
                Army soldier2 19 July 2016 11: 07
                +1
                and 2% of them in Sevas is this not an indicator?

                If a Russian calls the city of Russian glory Sevastopol Sevas, why shouldn't the Ukrainians call us quilted jackets or Colorado?
                1. Ami du peuple
                  Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 11: 25
                  +1
                  Quote: Army 2
                  If a Russian calls the city of Russian glory Sevastopol Sevas, why shouldn't the Ukrainians call us quilted jackets or Colorado?
                  Yes, let them call as they want - personally I’m fucked. And for me, they call it at least a male penis - just let it more often lick it. bully By the way, the townspeople themselves call the city "Sevasom". Essentially, you have something to say?
                  Quote: Svyatoslavich
                  We are one people - Russian. The border between today's Ukraine and Russia is just a line on the map - the "Berlin" wall.
                  Go tell it in Lviv or even in Kiev. Share your impressions later.
                  1. Svyatoslavich
                    Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 11: 46
                    +3
                    Go tell it in Lviv ...
                    Is this an occasion to allow the non-Russians from Lvov to destroy all the Russians behind the line on the map?

                    Share your impressions later.
                    I was in Donetsk and Makeevka in 2013. I can share my impressions.
                    I can call relatives in Chernihiv.
                    I can call a colleague (he comes from near Rivne).
                    1. Ami du peuple
                      Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 12: 08
                      +4
                      Quote: Svyatoslavich
                      I was in Donetsk and Makeevka in 2013. I can share my impressions.
                      Did I mention my native Donbass somewhere? Believe me, having a lot of relatives in Ukraine, I can call, even to the Dnieper (not to Dnepropetrovsk, but then again, as you kick your feet with Sevastopol smile), even in Kherson, even in Zaporozhye. Everywhere the result will be disappointing - from complete apathy to categorical rejection.
                      1. Lukich
                        Lukich 19 July 2016 13: 08
                        +24
                        Quote: Ami du peuple
                        Everywhere the result will be disappointing - from complete apathy to categorical rejection.
                      2. Who
                        Who 20 July 2016 01: 58
                        +3
                        And he will answer - "I need it! The salaries and pensions will be European, the benefits are different and ... lace panties for doni"
                    2. Al1977
                      Al1977 19 July 2016 15: 55
                      -2
                      Quote: Ami du peuple
                      Everywhere the result will be disappointing - from complete apathy to categorical rejection.

                      Trying to figure out why? You explained to them, I hope, that they are degrading, jumping, turned into Bandera and Obama's bedding! Well, that is, they explained by concepts that they are not our brothers! Damned fascists who are killing children and old people! And there is only one way out, stop watching their TV, watch only Solovyov and go out to the square with a poster "Putin is OUR President !!!"
                    3. Pissarro
                      Pissarro 20 July 2016 17: 28
                      +2
                      What for? It’s strange that it would be strange to explain to inappropriate people that it’s strange to explain the concepts. If your neighbors are influenced by some sect, I think you should first take measures to neutralize the threat from them, and only then, if you consider it necessary, take up their treatment. Which, according to all, without exception doctors are pointless if the patient himself does not want to be cured
            2. sevsor
              sevsor 19 July 2016 11: 34
              +20
              Never real Sevastopol residents talk about their city "Sevas" and do not call Primorsky Boulevard "Primbul", all this abomination appeared 10 years ago, when the occupation ukrovlast intensively populated Sevastopol with immigrants from the western ruins (((
              And in general ... see below))
              1. Ami du peuple
                Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 12: 25
                +1
                Quote: sevsor
                The real residents of Sevastopol never talk about their city "Sevas"
                Sorry if inadvertently offended. Actually, it was not about toponymy at all. It seems, on the contrary, Sevastopol and all Crimeans set an example for all Ukrainian Russians. But, if the form is so important for you ..
                1. sevsor
                  sevsor 19 July 2016 22: 30
                  +2
                  Ami du peuple, of course there are no offenses, I just wanted there to be no delusions. Very often, our "liberal" press or KhokhloSMI write fables or half-truths about Sevastopol and Crimea, in which even our friends involuntarily begin to believe, without first-hand information. Soon the day of the Navy, one of the most beloved holidays in Sevastopol, all happy!)))
                  1. felix47
                    felix47 22 July 2016 14: 09
                    0
                    If Crimea and Sevastopol hadn’t left Ukraine for Russia, now there would have been a new pi-Ndos base Guantanamo there, and the Russian population would have already finished clearing.
            3. SergeBS
              SergeBS 19 July 2016 19: 21
              +3
              Quote: Army 2
              If a Russian calls the city of Russian glory Sevastopol Sevas

              And sho? My classmate (almost, he got his diploma in 1983, I got it in 1982), a native of Sevastopol, now plows in Mendeleevo, he also called it that. We BOTH called Dolgoprudny Dolgopa. And sho? I am a schoolboy (and my classmates too), the subject "Civil Defense" was called the STOFF. And sho?
              San Francisco local "Frisco" call, and sho?
              I do not understand the claim. recourse
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. The comment was deleted.
          4. inferno_nv
            inferno_nv 19 July 2016 11: 58
            -1
            It would be interesting to see you skins proving something on Tverskaya !!! I think we would have passed by and kept silent, and throwing speeches in the style you yourself all pissed away is easy. In fact, the blame for all the outrage in Ukraine lies with the country's leadership (Yanukovych and Co.), and ordinary people (mostly uneducated) do not decide what and where in Ukraine or in Russia. And here + everything else was well brainwashed through the zombies and raguli flooded from the villages, and here the most interesting part begins: THE MOST QUALIFIED are just from the countryside with the formation of vocational schools in the best case, and they controlled this whole mass of eggs and Co. So tell me how 100 normal can stop 10000 stubborn? And the ratio is about this. And tell me one more in Russia, the common people decide for the top or goes where the top says? hi
            1. Ami du peuple
              Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 12: 18
              +5
              Quote: inferno_nv
              It would be interesting to see you skins proving something on Tverskaya !!!
              I didn’t prove anything to them at one time, we just fought with lovers and other gopot. Yes and no now on Tverskaya skins ..
              Quote: inferno_nv
              and throwing speeches in the style you yourself all prosrali easier than ever.
              And you didn’t bleed it? Well, well ..
              Quote: inferno_nv
              So tell me how 100 normal can stop 10000 stubborn?
              Donetsk could, Lugansk could .. People united, albeit at the hand of local oligarchs with their own interests, but the popular outburst was massive and sincere. Oh, and you want to say that in Ukraine there are about 90% of those who are obstinate (well, if you say, the ratio is 100 to 1000)? Q.E.D.
              Quote: inferno_nv
              And tell me one more in Russia, the common people decide for the top or goes where the top says?
              Why are you nodding to Russia? We have while There are no significant reasons for popular unrest. If (God forbid) be, then we'll see who goes where.
              1. inferno_nv
                inferno_nv 19 July 2016 13: 26
                +6
                Dear, I have lived all my adult life in Russia, by the will of fate I now live in Ukraine and what I know in Russia is not by hearsay. I found all the mess in Ukraine from the very beginning. I can tell you with confidence that everything started under completely different slogans (at least in the central regions), the power was thrown off. she got drunk and people wanted a change for the better, but it worked out as always. I do not justify the overthrow of the government in such a way as it happened in Ukraine and have always been against violence, but you cannot imagine what the powers that be were doing here before the start of the riots (this is a hunt for people (like game), it is also the selection of land for far-fetched cases , this is the chapel of the prosecutor's office, court, police, deputies, etc.). Here are the common people who stood up against the power of the spineless Yanukovych and his protestors (by the way, they all used the so-called "titushki" as mercenaries, who added fuel to the fire and who did not disdain any methods including murder, rape, etc. ), but the ghouls got from this again! You write about Donetsk and Lugansk, great, cities with a million people can withstand the influx of gopniks from other regions (mainly Western), but my town with a population of 8 could not because youth who could resist had no more than 000-100 people, and those with sticks and melee weapons, but the "titushki" rode loaded AK, PKK, SVD, etc., I saw them and believe it if at one time the skins were given such the arsenal is unlikely you would have fought with them, so no need to throw mud at all the people because they are just stupid in the crowd, you don't need to get a lot of crowd, and then do whatever you want! When Bolotnaya gathered in Moscow, something I did not notice that the opponents of the Marsh took to the street and fought them back, but dispersed the swamp riot police, and people like you sat at home near the computer and screamed victorious comments from the All-Russian Social Security Center. networks! If you think that all people in Ukraine are stupid and then you have not gone far from the raguli and pans-heads from the Maidan! Good luck, Marshal, it's so easy to crap everyone and everything and be proud of it to the shit! hi
                1. Svyatoslavich
                  Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 13: 38
                  -1
                  Good luck, Marshal ...
                  People like him have already written off you.
                  You (as if) no longer.
                  1. inferno_nv
                    inferno_nv 20 July 2016 06: 00
                    +3
                    laughing Yes, and x .... with them, I personally do not care who they wrote off there. These remind me of the most stubborn maydaunov wassat . After all, the virtual marshal believes that he is the smartest and knows everything, well, so let a man at least raise his self-esteem! After all, people like him have long recorded all the inhabitants of Ukraine in dill, hohlopithecus, etc., although they themselves are no different from them. They like to spoil the whole nation without going into details, because it’s easier to live, think, analyze - this is not about them! They do not understand that everywhere there are normal and not quite normal or even frostbitten personalities, in Ukraine, in Russia! They have one thing in mind: If they could not break this whole mess, then it means all the bad people, etc. All comments come down to mockery, veiled insults and stuff like that!
                2. Ami du peuple
                  Ami du peuple 19 July 2016 13: 39
                  +4
                  Quote: inferno_nv
                  Good luck to you, Marshal, it’s so easy to crap everyone and everything and be proud of it to shit!
                  Why should I rbsirat you? You yourself do a pretty good job of it .. Was Yanukovosch not like you?
                  Quote: inferno_nv
                  they threw off power she snickered and the people wanted a change for the better, but it turned out as always.
                  Thrown off and what? "Oh, it’s so shitty itself", "It was not for that there was Maidan" and even "Vitya, come back!" Is Russia to blame again?
                  1. Svyatoslavich
                    Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 13: 55
                    -6
                    Didn’t you like Yanukovosch?
                    Is Russia to blame again?
                    Is Yanukovoshch to blame for the genocide of Russians in the Caucasus?
                    Or is Russia still relevant?
                    http://istorja.ru/forums/topic/662-kto-vooruzhil-chechenskih-boevikov/

                    Is Russia related to Russians in general?
                  2. potroshenko
                    potroshenko 19 July 2016 15: 00
                    +3
                    Quote: Ami du peuple
                    Didn’t you like Yanukovosch?

                    Well, that was the main reason for people to go to the Maidan. The people voted for Yanukovych because he was "pro-Russian", in any case there were no others (here the main question to the policy of the Russian Federation, why such a candidate was approved). But after all the lawlessness of the thief and the raketer, the people gladly responded to the calls to go out into the street. If Putin at the beginning spoke in the style: "Wow, you are in the power of the chaos that was, of course, throw off this thief faster, Russia supports the Ukrainian people", then Western political strategists would not have succeeded in denigrating Russia, and Putin would still be popular collected from the population. But Putin chose Crimea, not all of Ukraine, tit in hand, and not pie in the sky. That's the result, for the population of Ukraine Yanukovych is an enemy, respectively, Russia supported Yanukovych and rescued him, hid him on its own land - So Russia began to become an enemy at that time. And then it went on and on, the Crimea even more moderate and even pro-Russian tore away from sympathy for Russia, many said "I am not against Russia, but after the Crimea it is kapets, as if humiliated by squeezing." Then Girkin in Donbass, etc.
                    You can argue with me, but I just gave you a brief description of the mood of the population of Ukraine. And if you add to all the incredible, even unimaginable exaggeration of these topics in the media, I think you will understand.
                  3. SergeBS
                    SergeBS 19 July 2016 18: 48
                    +2
                    Quote: potroshenko
                    Crimea even more than moderate and even pro-Russian tore away from sympathy for Russia, many said "I am not against Russia, but after the Crimea it is kapets, as if humiliated by squeezing out." Then Girkin in Donbass, etc.
                    You can argue with me, but I just gave you a brief description of the mood of the population of Ukraine.

                    Nda. Arrived.
                    At first, the cries - "we fed Russia, we will not be any more."
                    Separated - got sick "for some reason".
                    The same cries - "we fed Crimea, Donbass."
                    Crimea seceded - "OUCH! Squeezed out!" So you FEED the Crimea, and now - no. They saved some money. smile
                    And Donbass ALSO "fed", only "for some reason" again, as they decided to "break away" (and save money for YOU), they were so offended.
                    And "Girkin in the Donbass" - well, WAH, a complete fly away. Just SUPER authority. In terms of provocations, Gapon's reincarnation is direct. But there were people, they sent this "hero" -defeated away and held the positions that he had THROWED, having previously "valiantly" climbed "into the offensive" and provoked a "response".
                    Quote: "You can argue with me, but I just gave you a brief description of the mood of the Ukrainian population."
                    Uh-huh. Even shorter, this description looks like this: "we (Crimea, Donbass) - FEED you, therefore we are PANS, and you are slaves." And as "freeloaders" on you, "lords", hammer in a bolt - so immediately "Oh-ay, PRESSED!". "Freeloaders" disappear - there is nothing to eat. The paradox of "nezalezhnost". smile
                  4. bk316
                    bk316 19 July 2016 19: 02
                    +4
                    Quote: potroshenko
                    But Putin chose Crimea, and not all of Ukraine, a tit in his hand, and not a crane in the sky. That’s the result,

                    Aha! And I kept waiting for it to sound "it's Putin's fault."
                    Damn, when will you stop looking for the guilty over the hill ...
                    You may be relatives, only until the brain is correct, don’t call on a visit, and PLEASE yourself, yourself.

                    And as for the swamp, as they say the score on the scoreboard, where are they Russian Maidan? There are no others, but those farther ...
                    Here are 93 we yes .. if I repent. But it will not happen again, we won’t let the boat turn over, actually thank you for that - you won’t forget such a lesson.
                  5. Alex_Tug
                    Alex_Tug 21 July 2016 13: 32
                    +1
                    But Putin chose Crimea, and not all of Ukraine, a tit in his hand, and not a crane in the sky. That's the result, for the population of Ukraine Yanukovych is the enemy, respectively, Russia supported Yanukovych and saved him, sheltered on his land - So Russia began to become the enemy at that time.

                    Distorting the facts in chronology. In reality:
                    - Putin rescues Yanukovych from the Maydanovites
                    - Krymnash
                    And not in the reverse order
                3. Suhow
                  Suhow 19 July 2016 21: 10
                  +3
                  Russia is blamed for all the troubles that are stubborn and short-sighted ... But the crowd is a serious thing, and it is a pity that Yanyk was left without a farm in 2014, many would have followed him before escaping from Ukraine, not because he was good, but because at that time he was legal elected, and as opposed to ragul (so as not to be written for everyone) .Then in 2014, Yanyk could unite opponents of the European course, and he had good opportunities (the president was a secretly elected one), but he preferred to run away. There is no leader who led, Natsik in ecstasy (look at those BP meetings after the escape) the congress in Kharkov passed and nothing (appeals and slogans) apathy and do not believe in those who are in power, roughly speaking, opponents of the current government do not have a Banner.
                4. inferno_nv
                  inferno_nv 20 July 2016 05: 46
                  +3
                  Where in my comment did you read the accusation towards Russia? You yourself have screwed something up there, personally, I have never blamed Russia for anything, but you take a cliche from the censor and try to prove it to be right. Although I painted you the mood of the people at the time of the Maidan, what the authorities were doing and this did not suit many. I wrote to you that personally I was against this whole mess and tried to convey to many that it would only get worse, but the wound up crowd, a minimum of education, unemployment, powerlessness and a bunch of other factors pushed people into this whole madhouse. But it’s easier for you to pull a couple of phrases out of context — twist them and make everyone idiots.
              2. Lukich
                Lukich 19 July 2016 14: 25
                +2
                Quote: inferno_nv
                I saw them and, if you had given skins such an arsenal in due time, you would hardly have fought them

                but there is a difference. WE do not give them weapons. and those who have weapons you distribute to SCAMS YOU CHOOSE YOURSELF. on the Maidan, and not by constitution
                1. Svyatoslavich
                  Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 14: 31
                  0
                  WE do not give them weapons.
                  Wrong.
                  They handed out.
                  http://istorja.ru/forums/topic/662-kto-vooruzhil-chechenskih-boevikov/
                2. inferno_nv
                  inferno_nv 20 July 2016 06: 14
                  0
                  Dear you, please read my comment for a start, it is written in black and white that many, including myself, were against such an overthrow of power, it is also written there that those who were against did not have anything other than cold weapons, and in contrast were humanlike with a firearm and how do you think it was necessary to resist with a stick against AK? But it’s easier for you to snatch a piece of the phrase and begin to blame and put everyone under one comb. I thought the marshals (albeit virtual) were smarter. request
              3. Suhow
                Suhow 19 July 2016 20: 55
                0
                Respect. Older.)))
              4. Ruslan67
                Ruslan67 19 July 2016 21: 31
                +2
                Quote: inferno_nv
                I didn’t notice that the opponents of the marsh took to the street and fought back, but dispersed the marsh riot police, and people like you were sitting at home near the computer and frightened the victorious comments of the All-Russian Communist Party. networks!

                So you yourself and crossed out all that is correct that you wrote before request We have, although deservedly criticized authority, which is criticized, there is OMON who, upon receiving an order, complied with it. A citizen whose taxes they live on can sit at a computer or a TV with a beer and scribble comments to watch the news ...
                1. inferno_nv
                  inferno_nv 20 July 2016 06: 24
                  0
                  So that’s exactly what Russia has power (for me personally, power should be with teeth), and under Yanukovych it simply wasn’t there, this vegetable itself could not suppress the Maidan in the bud, the Golden Eagle stood as much as it could, honor and respect for them. But the Maidan itself and the events that followed it were played according to the run-in scenario (Egypt, Libya) hi .
            2. Al1977
              Al1977 20 July 2016 09: 47
              0
              Quote: Ami du peuple
              Donetsk could, Lugansk could ..

              What unites these two cities, and how are they different from other cities? Hint - look at the map. Another tip is "to type in the Internet" Shooters, how it all began "
              1. Olezhek
                20 July 2016 09: 52
                +1
                What unites these two cities, and how do they differ from other cities? Hint - look at the map


                They are united by PEOPLE.
                Kharkov could rise ... And they would also send help.
                What is the trick: there should have been a popular opposition to the junta.
                At the time of the coup, the junta did not have much.
                For two or three weeks you could safely take power into your own hands.
                BUT...
          5. The comment was deleted.
          6. Lukich
            Lukich 19 July 2016 13: 14
            +4
            Quote: inferno_nv
            and raguli flooded from the villages,

            so do we do it for you ???????
            1. inferno_nv
              inferno_nv 20 July 2016 06: 34
              +4
              Marshal, I didn’t ask you for help, I wrote in my comment how it all started. all this happened before my eyes. I described to you the moods of ordinary people, and you take a piece of the phrase and start to juggle, maybe you would have completely singled out the sentence, but if it's difficult for you, I will duplicate it in this comment: from the villages, and here the most interesting thing begins: the MOST CONVENIENT is from the countryside with the formation of vocational schools at best, and all this mass of eggs and co. were in charge. " Where is the request for help here? Show me at least one of my comments where am I asking for help? Learn respected to read and understand. recourse
          7. Alex_Tug
            Alex_Tug 21 July 2016 00: 58
            +3
            Just remember how GDP came to the helm. Below, frantic gangsterism, even the children cried out to be an honorary gangster. Upstairs are oligarchs who could no longer control the lower classes. Either some bandits plant a bomb for the oligarchs, then others. The oligarchs could not stand the first, it is necessary to stop the lower classes. We ran to bow to GDP. GDP stopped the bottoms, then tamed the oligarchs. The country should be governed by a government, not the oligarchs. Only in Russia no one aspired to any EU and did not expect semolina (lace panties too) from the EU shelves. Just everyone learned to work. One ruined you - to wait for freebies from the EU.
            Look like that's it. Briefly so.
          8. Epifan
            Epifan 21 July 2016 10: 57
            0
            You sir are a hundred times wrong. Everywhere is ruled and ruled by an aggressive minority. This is from history. There is no need to immediately put them in their place, so no one wants to dirty their hands and take responsibility. That's it. Normal people are the majority. Your statistics not correct. And it does not depend on education.
        3. Volzhanin
          Volzhanin 21 July 2016 12: 38
          +2
          And the ZhIDs are not particularly guilty - those who are mentally defective are the ones to blame who allowed the Zhidov to power. And when ZhYdy come to power, they absolutely do not give a damn about everything except their own pockets, and therefore lawlessness begins. We had it in the 1917s and 90s, on the outskirts now. It's just that everyone forgets the axiom - if you want to completely destroy the state - put the Zhidov in power. Proven throughout history with hundreds of examples! It is only necessary to pick them out from there for a long, troublesome and high price.
  2. Maxom75
    Maxom75 19 July 2016 08: 14
    +19
    My aunt has been from Astrakhan since 1974. lives in Ukraine (she studied at the institute there and got married), in Dnepropetrovsk since 1978. So all the years she complained about only one thing: Any dispute or conflict with neighbors ended with the words: "The sworn Muscovites have come in large numbers here, there is no life from you, so that your Russia will burn out!" And this is 1978! And also, according to her, there will be no popular uprising, which our rulers are counting on. Ukrainians live according to the principle "I know nothing from my house on the edge." She is confident that they can be cut like rams one at a time and they will not defend each other, they will not help their neighbors - this is the psychology of Ukrainians. So, having lived with them for nearly 40 years, she confidently says that Russians and Ukrainians are different peoples! We are different, Ukrainians are more like Romanians in their psychology, while those of them have a psychology of slaves (Ottoman rule left its mark), and they always need a strong master whom they will serve. That is why, when the USSR collapsed, they together went over to the United States.
    1. CONTROL
      CONTROL 19 July 2016 09: 47
      +5
      Quote: Maxom75
      Any dispute or conflict with neighbors ended with the words: "The damned Muscovites have come in large numbers here, there is no life from you, so that your Russia will burn out!"
      ... Russians and Ukrainians are different nations!

      A freebie didn't bring anyone to good!
      A fertile land got for free - the Russian army won back from the Poles and Ottomans; The Russian Empire settled Galicians "in the Ukraine" ... The USSR invested in full - created a powerful industry from scratch; and now the opinion began to grow - "we feed everyone ..." From here - and such a psychology! Dependency ...
      ------------
      Sweet life - leads to the hardest, incurable systemic disease - diabetes! which "Ukraine" is sick - in the absence of sugar ... (Poroshenko, by the way, is a diabetic: by physiognomy and complexion (on high-quality videos - and by the condition of the skin) it is visible; and, secondly, as a consequence - hypertensive ...) And diabetic coma is an analogue of psychosis ...
    2. Olezhek
      19 July 2016 11: 11
      +2
      So, having lived with them for nearly 40 years, she confidently says that Russians and Ukrainians are different nations! We are different, Ukrainians are more like Romanians in their psychology, and for those, the psychology of slaves (Ottoman rule left its mark), and they always need a strong master


      Like ... We are different, although we speak the same language.
    3. potroshenko
      potroshenko 19 July 2016 15: 14
      -5
      Quote: Maxom75
      We are different, Ukrainians are more like Romanians in their psychology, and those of them have the psychology of slaves (Ottoman rule left their mark), and they always need a strong master whom they will serve.

      It is because of such nonsense that the wrong public opinion is being formed. Aunts from Astrakhan, daughters of officers, crucified boys. I have been living with Ukrainians all my life and no one ever told me about Muscovite, except as a joke.
      But now the opinion has changed and the attitude towards Russian citizens is negative.
      1. Maxom75
        Maxom75 19 July 2016 17: 11
        +1
        I didn’t talk about the crucified boys, and this year my aunt left for Dnepropetrovsk this April and really didn’t want to go back to Ukraine. Here, in her expression, she feels like a man, and there she is by whom. Regarding jokes, you better tell grannies from the bench who already wrote a denunciation to her at the SBU that she was Russian and was in Russia. so we should not treat the brain, but the Ukrainians. By the way, who honors himself as a Ukrainian should know that at the beginning of the last century Ukrainians called themselves the inhabitants of Galicia adherents of the Greek Catholic (Uniate) church and those who converted from Orthodoxy to Catholicism - in other words, apostates. By the way, many Orthodox Galicians considered them to be an insult to the Ukrainians and demanded to call themselves Russian. But the memory in Ukraine is short and everyone has become Ukrainians.
      2. SergeBS
        SergeBS 19 July 2016 19: 48
        +1
        Quote: potroshenko
        I have been living with Ukrainians all my life and no one ever told me about Muscovite, except as a joke.
        But now the opinion has changed and the attitude towards Russian citizens is negative.

        Oh well, don’t ... I in 198X - I visited Kharkov more than once. There was a certain research institute (a small one, about 1,5-2,0 thousand), working at the MGA. And in the research institute - everything is fine, but in the market - how lucky.
        In the same 198X - he visited the Baltic states, also through the MGA.
        And AGAIN - in the research institute - it's normal, but on the street - how lucky. Trend.
  3. Lukich
    Lukich 19 July 2016 08: 44
    +6
    Quote: Altona
    Why didn’t they organize themselves like Donbass? This is incomprehensible.

    yes this is just understandable. "myhataskrayu" haven't you heard on the site? while others are waiting for the GDP to come and give them happiness
    1. Al1977
      Al1977 19 July 2016 15: 59
      +1
      Quote: Lukich
      while others are waiting for GDP to come and give them happiness

      I’m still waiting, even in Moscow.
  4. Svyatoslavich
    Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 08: 58
    +3
    This is incomprehensible.
    What's not clear?
    Terror.
    And what prevented the Russians from organizing themselves in 1996, when in power by election Remained forever drunk half-corpse?
  5. CONTROL
    CONTROL 19 July 2016 09: 34
    +7
    Quote: Altona
    Yes, since the end of the 80s it has been bad in principle, but in 1991 it got really bad when the USSR with its ideology collapsed. The Ukrainians were indoctrinated with the simple idea that "the Muscovites are fat and want more ists."

    I will repeat once again: - well, the power elites gave a damn about that referendum, they destroyed the USSR! What for? So everyone fervently believed - now, let us become "nezalezhny" - and we will live! For that, they knocked on helmets on Gorbaty Bridge in Moscow! ... And they got indispensability, "who could take as much ...", hapanuli - Mom, don't worry!
    ... And in the 90s - Russia almost laughed at the drunk president ...
    And then - ... well, everyone knows! Like Putin and Medvedev or not; The USE is there with the housing and communal services ... the Taburetkin reforms ... the Khodorkovskys, the Berezovskys ... the Yukos-Gazprom ... the "matzo ear" and so on and so obscene! ...
    They started to straighten out!
    What can not be said about the rest of the "independent" - the richest, small but proud Baltic is about to become completely impoverished "within the framework of European integration" (did you think that the cheese in this box is free? It's a mousetrap ... you don't know - if look from this side?). The Caucasus - well, Georgia with Mimino and Dato Tutashkhiyas ... who have been obsessed with Russian laws since 19! "Dengi is power! And dengi is where the market is ..." ... Belarus again - with palms outstretched for free-of-charge loans - and with - excuse me ... - grown out for a secure sitting on three chairs priests ... Central Asia - well, nowadays it's not so much the middle one, but - let's face it: much lower than the average ... And - like them, all the rest ...
    (for obvious reasons, let’s keep silent about Ukraine ...)
    -------------
    So - according to the assessment of both stability and independence; both the economy and the state of culture ... what else is there? social networks, crime ... protection of the poor, national and social minorities ... and te de ... Russia, sitting on an oil needle, with lost industry and agriculture, lost medicine, ruined education, ruined by science ... disastrous culture. ..and all that ... which THEY ALL used to feed — some with fat, and some with tangerines ... So - this Russia looks - and is - the best among the FORMER Union republics! And feeds them ... all are - WAS brothers! from old memory ... paying old TOTAL debts ... answering old TOTAL obligations ... well, and there is more! ...
    -------------
    So is the question to the FORMER Union republics - "Kamo gryadeshi?" ... What will be the European way - Kvo, your mother, wadis ?!
  6. tolian
    tolian 19 July 2016 10: 18
    0
    This is a long process - comprehending what happened with them. And given that it is still being dragged out by gay propagandists, it will not soon be that the slogan "Glory to Ukraine" will acquire a different pronunciation - "Glory to Novorossiya". Here they will rob them to the point of impossibility, and only then will the stirring begin there. After all, now there are clouded young people only dream of lard in chocolate and a visa for a Mercedes. When they grow up, they begin to understand what happened, only then can we hope for their admonition. And appropriate action. The only benefit for Russia from what is happening in Ukraine is the enlightenment of our elite. Show on the example of Ukraine - what can not be done. If they do not understand, they will neglect - we will have a Maidan field too. Even without s and gay Europeans. Volodin and Shuvalov - ay!
  7. Volzhanin
    Volzhanin 21 July 2016 12: 26
    +1
    And what is incomprehensible - I haven’t pinned it even before "I can not", they are afraid.
    But, in any case, the chimera state will not last long. As soon as he doesn’t eat, they will think about the future, at once they will see clearly what’s what.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • siberalt
    siberalt 19 July 2016 06: 20
    +6
    The author considers the perception of the situation by Ukrainians as a reality? laughing
    Then he himself is from a parallel world. The same boxer with a beaten off head and the Kuevsky mayor backtracked. Even he realized the mistake of renaming Moskovsky Prospekt. Making another "big" against the "Moscow" (and this is the whole trick), they raised the ears of the Poles, against whom genocide was carried out by the heroes of the Square. Or is it not clear? Then tell me who is the source of the obvious loosening of relations between the Outskirts and Poland, oddly enough, on the same basis - Russophobia? Something the maestro misunderstood. And the fact is that reality is reality, not artificially created by Russophobic propaganda.
    1. inkass_98
      inkass_98 19 July 2016 06: 52
      +2
      You are of too high opinion about Pedalik; he also does nothing without a command (given clearly, unambiguously and loudly), there is simply nothing to think about. The author is right in that it is useless to invest in the restoration of a used one, it is necessary to build something else and on new principles of relationships.
      Then Skomorokhov once crumbled a loaf of Dzygovbrodsky, I remember. So, with all the ambiguities of the above tovarischa, his thoughts flicker sound. One of them was published just the other day, the second a little earlier:
      http://antifashist.com/item/polemicheskie-zametki-kto-ubil-novorossiyu.html
      http://antifashist.com/item/pismo-prorossijskogo-ukrainca.html
      Since Dzygovbrodsky himself comes from the Ruins, who fled to Russia, for some reason I believe his words.
      1. Lukich
        Lukich 19 July 2016 08: 58
        +1
        Quote: inkass_98
        //antifashist.com/item/polemicheskie-zametki-kto-ubil-novorossiyu.html

        yes, the answer to so many questions ... good
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. ordinary
      ordinary 19 July 2016 07: 49
      -7
      in general ... the analyte did not take into account that there are just a lot of ordinary Soviet people there, and these people are not very interested in the propaganda
      1. avt
        avt 19 July 2016 08: 22
        +9
        Quote: ordinary
        in general ... the analyte did not take into account that there are just a lot of ordinary Soviet people there

        “Ordinary Soviet people" would have long since really fought partisans with weapons in their hands, as Ded Kovpak, Hero of the Soviet Union did, if they could not have organized themselves like the LPNR. But "ordinary Soviet people" there either in old age and physical weakness, or have weathered and in spiritual weakness, and the Kovpaks passed away as a class, as did the Makhnovists. They will slowly die out as a biological species in accordance with the program laid down by the Naglosaki up to 10 million, cursing everyone in their eurovibor. I still talked about this, at the beginning of the glorious deeds "maydaunnyh wrote on the site. The author is right, in contrast to the adherents of the Girkin / Strelkov sect with their" Putin, bring troops. " Russia does not expect anything good from the annexation of the Ruins, and even now. It's funny, but during it, Vladimir Monomakh did not immediately sit on the Kiev table, although he was called more than once and had the right. He only ascended when the stabbing at Cuyabe really began not for children and spilled over the edge on the cities and villages. For all that, most of the population of the Ruins understands everything perfectly, BUT! He understands that he understands, but he won’t accept, they stupidly scoff - “Ukrainians have realized that they are a nation.” about anything in Kiev. And yet they have not gorged on eurointegration.
        1. tolian
          tolian 19 July 2016 10: 37
          0
          They need help. Urgently. Suck shit with a spoon to the bottom! TV and radio channels broadcasting to Ukraine both in Russian and in mov. They will listen. as we once listened to Voice of America and Freedom. But don't make the best kinds of lies out of half-truths. Is that why we don't need these stations now? Because you can find any "truth" in your media. But the truth about Ukraine must be shown to them day and night. But there is something to show. And the truth will reach them. Considering that there is a whole spectrum of Ukrainians in Ukraine - from Russian and Ukrainian Ukrainians through Jewish Ukrainians to Galician "Ukrainians", abundantly flavored with Bandera, one cannot indiscriminately call them all "brothers" and "one people", which is clearly visible now. This territory and the bulk of the people will live in peace and friendship with the Russian peoples! But we need to work in this direction.
          1. avt
            avt 19 July 2016 10: 56
            +2
            Quote: tolian
            "But don't make the best sorts of lies out of half-truths.

            And here the interesting-e-e-thing begins! Pay attention - somehow really documented programs disappeared, which shared the same lamb from the goats, specific collaborators - Natsiks, not only from the Patriotic era, from our own patriots of OUR Fatherland, but also deeper in history in distant times, now almost epic from Rurik! request This is the topic of a completely separate and serious conversation, not even with Ukraine, but with Russia itself! As a result, we hear the repetitions of the mantras of political scientists and politoluhi of different calibers, instead of targeted propaganda.
          2. Al1977
            Al1977 19 July 2016 16: 04
            0
            Quote: tolian
            They need help. Urgently. Shit to spoon to the bottom choke!

            Help, please chill !!! We are brothers !!!! For all of us, take a spoon only wider !!!!
          3. SergeBS
            SergeBS 19 July 2016 20: 39
            0
            Quote: tolian
            They need help. Urgently. Shit to spoon to the bottom choke!

            I'm an IT guy. And as a result, I VERY OFTEN hear the phrase - "you need to help XXX". Only this is a trick. Since it is REAL - "not to help XXX, but to do for XXX", while XXX will be "in chocolate", and whoever did everything for XXX will not even hear thanks. And what is WORSE OF EVERYTHING, next time with the same problem - AGAIN "do it for XXX", like "help", so that XXX again had everything "in chocolate". DO I NEED IT? Nekhai XXX plows.
        2. inferno_nv
          inferno_nv 20 July 2016 06: 49
          +3
          Come on, I’m looking at how the avenue or the bridge appeared in St. Petersburg, I don’t remember the name of Kadyrov who knocked Russian boys down in the first Chechen one and two times and his son Ramzan loved to cut his heads very much, and now the hero of Russia, he takes Something no one even squealed (apart from a few guys who refused to get a nettle after he was given to Ramzan)! So, according to your logic, the Russians were transferred and no one can defend the honor of the Russian soldier who died in Ichkeria, when blacks idle on the streets of Russian cities and give back units, and more often feet in arms and home, why are you sitting at home and not trying to defend the honor Russian, what is the majority only on the Internet are heroes, but as in real life there are a lot of them at once, they are athletes, etc. etc. What do you see a speck in someone else's eye, but do not notice in your log? I understand it’s easier to crap someone request Why don’t you partisan at night in Moscow, St. Petersburg, Ekb, Tyumen, etc., sykotno?
          1. Olezhek
            20 July 2016 09: 57
            +1
            Come on, I’m watching a prospect or bridge appear in St. Petersburg, I don’t remember the name of Kadyrov


            Comrat, a big request: change the training manual.
            Read books or something, develop ...
            The problem is when communicating with former fellow citizens from the Republic of Belarus of Ukraine, and often Germany: they stupidly use standard propaganda cliches ...
            Time after time ... three-decked yachts of Abramovich and Chubais, Putin's KGB ...

            Guys, at first it's funny ... then it bothers ...
            The fact that someone once lived in one country of the USSR does not provide an understanding of today's Russia.
            1. Svyatoslavich
              Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 10: 48
              0
              ... Chubais ...
              Chubais doesn't "saw" anything anymore?
              Did I miss something?
            2. inferno_nv
              inferno_nv 20 July 2016 15: 25
              +1
              Dear, what the hell are the training manuals? Where did you see in my comments about Abramich, Chubais, the KGB, Putin, yachts? Where did I write this? If you think in a template, it does not mean that others think so. For your information, I lived in the Russian Federation until 2012, then due to everyday circumstances I had to go to Ukraine, what does the USSR have to do with it? I read no less books a year than yours, and maybe more (you do not know this and are talking nonsense), here is the answer to the question: What are you reading at the moment? I will answer this question for you: Personally, I am now reading the book by G.K. Zhukov "Memories and Reflections". What are you reading? I'm trying to explain to you that not all in Ukraine are stoned maydauns, and you cannot oppose anything to me except templates, only one thing and I see: you are hohlopitheks, maydauns, etc. and in this spirit, you twist some templates, take phrases out of context, turn them over and like YOU are all the smartest and most advanced here, you know more than others and you will understand the situation better! The censor reminds you already, maybe you got infected and you can't understand it !? I am Russian, I have been living in Ukraine for 5 years, I speak Russian and no one has ever presented me for it, no one has told me anything, although many know that I am for the Russian Federation, but I see that many of the Russian Federation are on their own fellow citizens who, by the will of fate, ended up in Ukraine (a few years before the war and all this madhouse) look at them as inferior and maydauns, if only you had a conscience before throwing words and expressions, without knowing the person you immediately attribute it to to the enemy just for the fact that my Ukrainian flag is highlighted! You are just super patriots of your homeland who dishonor your homeland more than benefit it! hi
              1. Olezhek
                21 July 2016 14: 10
                0
                Come on, I’m watching how the avenue or the bridge appeared in St. Petersburg, I don’t remember the name of Kadyrov who knocked Russian boys in the first Chechen one or two times and his son Ramzan loved to cut his heads very much


                The answer will be the same. yes
              2. Alex_Tug
                Alex_Tug 21 July 2016 14: 34
                0
                I’m trying to explain to you that not all in Ukraine are stubborn maydaunas


                This is so clear (that is not all).
                Who are maydaunas? Natsik (Bandera) or EU workers (wrapped in the EU)?
                - Now Natsik is at work.
                - And the EU workers are all looking at Poland and licking their lips. And we want freebies from the EU. Freebies will not wait. The power (more precisely, the oligarchs) scored in the EU’s head - a boom in the EU and you will have a sandwich with butter. And the authorities are robbing the country and getting ready to take off when it smells fried. While Ukrainians pray 3 times a day for the EU icon, they are safe. Maybe it's time to stop praying for the EU and start doing business (sew lace panties). And then you have to wait a long time.
                1. inferno_nv
                  inferno_nv 21 July 2016 19: 20
                  +1
                  Is that what you decided? Or have they revised the zombies? I don’t know anyone who prays to the EU, I don’t argue about them in the box, but ordinary people have other problems (how to feed their families, how to secure their families, where to get money, etc.), but those who pray to the EU like since they don’t want to do anything, just don’t have to write that all Ukrainians are loafers and freeloaders, many work tirelessly from early morning until late evening. Of course, as elsewhere, grab bukharas, loafers and just idlers, but this is not all residents. There are many such people in any post-Soviet state, and not only in Ukraine and everywhere, so don’t try to defame ordinary people, hard workers, collective farmers, etc. Everyone who understands that even if the EU comes, everything will be sold to them, but just the common people from the village will remain naked and without land. hi
                  1. Alex_Tug
                    Alex_Tug 21 July 2016 23: 17
                    +1
                    I don’t know anyone who prays for the EU, I don’t argue about them by the box, but ordinary people have other problems (how to feed a family, how to secure a family, where to get money, etc.)


                    - I also don’t know who specifically prays for the EU (I don’t live in / in Ukraine). But to read your press and listen to your deputies (I’m not talking about Russian sites, namely Ukrainian ones), they’re just a combination of Ukrainians - just wait a moment, tomorrow we will have a visa-free regime with the EU. And honestly, there will be no Europeans. No one is recognized. (DAM said in Russia - there is no money, health to you. Already a meme, but everyone is in the know)
                    - Common people have problems everywhere (how to feed a family, how to protect a family, where to get money, etc.). This is in Russia too. But the Russians are not aching in the ass, there isn’t such zombies like yours — the EU will help us (the IMF will give us money). All rely on themselves and are not going to the Maidan.
                    - As if you live in a parallel world, Russian laws work in Russia. So Poroshenko in the EU runs to complain - in Russia there are laws that interfere with my chocolate business. Why does not Amers complain that in the EU there are such laws that interfere with Petya’s business? But Petin is not allowed to enter Europe, but he does not complain.
                    - Russian business is also tired of Ukraine and wants to shed it from there, but tolerate GDP, there will be a sane government in Ukraine. This cannot go on forever.
                    - As a result, Russian laws work in Russia without benefits for Ukraine. Give Ukraine benefits so we sit on the neck.

                    And the simple people of Ukraine, be patient. Russia has not appointed you President Poroshenko. Sami chose. You can of course say to yourself - I voted against. But from this, Russia is neither hot nor cold.
    4. investor
      investor 19 July 2016 07: 56
      -5
      Quote: siberalt
      The author considers the perception of the situation by Ukrainians as a reality? laughing
      Then he himself is from a parallel world.

      Yes, they are all crazy there, they can't even rename normally.
      That's right!
      1. Ivan65
        Ivan65 19 July 2016 09: 02
        +6
        You are our selective ....
        You differentiate a story for moments and, under a microscope, redirect attention to a specific micro-moment .... preventing it from seeing the whole story.
        What are you investing in us?

        There were many moments in history when enemies, antagonists became like-minded people and created new communities.

        I'm afraid to relate to the era of Kievan Rus when the brothers fought with each other, the children fought with their fathers .... there is so much mixed up. If you believe Likhachev, then for the entire Mongol Tatar yoke, about 300 thousand people died, and from internecine wars more than 3 million over the same period. Unions broke up and rallied again. But we all cheated. We believed investors of Western values ​​and prosrali conquest of our ancestors.
      2. CONTROL
        CONTROL 19 July 2016 09: 58
        +1
        Quote: investor
        Yes, they are all crazy there, they can't even rename normally.
        That's right!

        (C) "Goran Irukansky wrote:" And when the Lord came out to the people from Pitansky bolt, his feet were covered in mud ... "
        - For what Goran and burned! .....
        - And this is said about us! ... "(C) (A. and B. Strugatsky "It is difficult to be a god")
        -------------
        Do not get dirty so that it is impossible to wash ... Otherwise, you will have to wash your blood - most often yours!
        ... what he (Akhmat Kadyrov) did! ...
    5. Al1977
      Al1977 19 July 2016 16: 01
      -2
      Quote: siberalt
      The author considers the perception of the situation by Ukrainians as a reality?

      I agree, complete nonsense)) There are no normal people in the DPR and LPR, but outside there are simply inhuman!
  • Alekseev
    Alekseev 19 July 2016 07: 10
    +3
    Quote: PKK
    Ukrainians imagined themselves

    And not yesterday at all! yes
    Nationalism, treason, interference from neighbors, like other bad dancers, in an independent hundred years.
    And many, many people.
    Therefore, the enemy did not have to strain very emotionally in order to "... tear away from us emotionally. The enemy solved this problem completely ..."
    Naturally, the question arises - is such a damn kindred?
    Only the division of the current education on the basis of the Ukrainian SSR into Ukraine and Ukrainians, not only politically, but also into the states of the Russian orientation, which can enter the "Russian world" and the banderlozh regions with a living on their own pennies, will be both fair and safe.
  • Sergey S.
    Sergey S. 19 July 2016 08: 38
    +3
    In general, “saving” Ukraine is late, pointless and too expensive.

    Here the author is wrong.
    There is no need to save Ukraine at all.
    This Bandera entity must be destroyed, that is, reformatted.
    The best option is to Novorossia.

    And it’s time to forget about Ukraine.
    Dishonored and robbed, which has become a nest of traitors and idiots ..
  • sever.56
    sever.56 19 July 2016 05: 38
    +39
    https://topwar.ru/uploads/images/2016/028/pqss312.png

    The author is absolutely right, saying - "Here we need it why"?
    Again, of course, with the help of "damned non-brothers", having restored, at the very least, any kind of economy, they will start to spit in our faces with relish? Enough, we have already worn out these spits. This "brotherly friendship" is costing us too much — it cost hundreds of billions of dollars for a quarter of a century of "independence."
    Money - to hell with them, gain. The worst pay is the pay with the lives of thousands of innocent people.
    Themselves have done, even if they themselves rake, Pokemon jumped!
    1. Magic archer
      Magic archer 19 July 2016 06: 05
      +15
      Plus from me, Valery)))) In general, I support the author of the article. I keep in touch with Ukraine. People who understand what is happening in the country, or have already left or simply cannot leave the country. The vote for Russia is considered a betrayal. Therefore, people are like old times quietly curse the current Bandera power in the kitchens. The worst thing is that there are many such people but there are no real leaders! Those who would raise the people! After all, there are more and more voices that it was better under Yanukovych ... They see it so late ...
      1. sever.56
        sever.56 19 July 2016 06: 28
        +21
        Vladimir, welcome hi
        The worst thing is that they began to see clearly not because they understood the criminal essence of the Bandera government, but because their belly is empty. So they remember Yanukovych. And if they had full refrigerators, they would shout with the same inspiration at the Maidans about “gilyaks,” “hto ne skache,” and ukraine ponaduse. ”This is Selyukov's essence - to think with stomachs, not with your head.
        And those who could raise the people to fight, they are fighting with Bandera in the Donbass, or they are sitting in prisons, or they left because of the threat to their family and themselves.
        I’m afraid that the future of Ukraine is sad. It will not be, or it will be within the borders of the UPR of 1918. Only one big plus from the collapse of this historical misunderstanding - I hope that ALL Novorossia will be free.
        1. Monarchist
          Monarchist 19 July 2016 07: 51
          +3
          Once again, I am convinced that the founders of the Union gave a blunder, to put it mildly. The territorial boundaries were drawn from the lantern. Themselves hypnotized by the "proletarian consciousness of the inviolability of the union and further in the text" Everything negative was carefully hushed up, and all the wrongs were attributed to: vestiges of accursed tsarism, and then they still found somewhere to write off and were written off before!
          1. CONTROL
            CONTROL 19 July 2016 10: 04
            +1
            Quote: Monarchist
            Once again, I am convinced that the founders of the Union gave a blunder, to put it mildly. The territorial boundaries were drawn from the lantern. Themselves hypnotized by the "proletarian consciousness of the inviolability of the union and further in the text" Everything negative was carefully hushed up, and all the wrongs were attributed to: vestiges of accursed tsarism, and then they still found somewhere to write off and were written off before!

            Well, yes, yes ...
            But - it worked for some time!
            ------
            The question is why it rained down. or is it - this question is rhetorical?
        2. Siberian
          Siberian 19 July 2016 08: 18
          +8
          Yes, and I would not say that they began to see clearly. This is not insight, but calculation. It became bad - move in the opposite direction - this time it did not work. The anti-war rallies that took place everywhere with them were exclusively against the participation of male relatives in the war, and against the war itself, something is still not being looked at even with binoculars. Yes, gatherings are against raising everything (dill prices, housing and communal services tariffs, bank rates, something else) - they are not afraid of this, but it is scary against killing. If they realized that they were mistaken, then they should have a good drink, get vaccinated for several generations and tell their great-grandchildren with tears how the Crimea, Donbass slipped through. Even their svidomo lawyer T. Montian, who was screaming: leave everything behind us, both Russia and America, we will figure it out ourselves, claims that Russia could intervene and stop the Maidan (?), And now nothing will help them. The West was not unwell, and Russia didn’t give a damn. That's when they go in the same procession (as believers are now), let them call it their own campaign under the leadership of any Montians, then help with good advice!
        3. Sergey S.
          Sergey S. 19 July 2016 08: 26
          +3
          Quote: sever.56
          Only one big plus from the collapse of this historical misunderstanding - I hope that ALL Novorossia will be free.

          It will be a plus when all of Ukraine will be New Russia.
          The main problem of Ukraine by the author is not voiced directly.
          The main problem is the Ukrainians, who do not want to work hard on the state, they want everything for themselves. And for the Motherland they can bawl, they can look for enemies in order to divide the loot, they can fuss between the "rich Buratino".
          But to tear something from yourself for the sake of other people, you will not wait for this from them ...
          And still no self-criticism ...
          They are the smartest ...

          In a word, that's it. that in Russian fairy tales is ridiculed and defeated by Ivan the Fool, this is today's Ukraine.

          Only the recognition of Russian national values ​​can save Ukrainians from extinction and dissolution in a European (Euro-Arab) melting pot.
          And this means working at home and not complaining about personal problems and troubles.
          1. avt
            avt 19 July 2016 09: 22
            +5
            Quote: Sergey S.
            It will be a plus when all of Ukraine will be New Russia.

            No. EVERYTHING will not be, here it is not necessary to buggy with thoughts about mriyki. For ALL preconditions NO, simply there are no.
            1. Sergey S.
              Sergey S. 19 July 2016 21: 40
              0
              Quote: avt
              FOR ALL preconditions NO

              Today no, tomorrow will be.
              Not the first time.
              And they themselves will be brought.
      2. Monarchist
        Monarchist 19 July 2016 07: 34
        +2
        You hit the very spot: "They see clearly, but it's too late"
      3. tolian
        tolian 19 July 2016 10: 47
        -1
        Magic Archer, USSR existed for almost 80 years. It was all the speeches of the people with his execution, and jokes with humor about communism, and communism itself for a narrow circle of people. But everything collapsed only when the elite stirred and began to change something. So it will be in Ukraine. And in short - will be robbed !!!
        1. tatra
          tatra 19 July 2016 10: 55
          +2
          Quote: tolian
          But everything collapsed only when the elite stirred and began to change something

          If people begin to "change" something by slandering others, like the enemies of the USSR and the Communists have been slandering the Communists for almost 30 years, starting with their "Liberator" Gorbachev, who launched a monstrous slander against the Communists in the late 80s, when "from each iron "rushed" the communists destroyed 40-60-80-100 million innocent, the best, most hard-working, gene pool and color of the nation ", by this they prove that they are" changing "for criminal purposes.
        2. Al1977
          Al1977 19 July 2016 16: 05
          0
          Quote: tolian
          But everything collapsed only when the elite stirred and began to change something.

          What did the elite begin to change? Maybe vice versa, because the elite did not want to change anything?))) Or ... it can’t be ... Hello Dmitry Anatolyevich, you don’t need to change anything, we love you !!! ))))
    2. engineering
      engineering 19 July 2016 06: 22
      +4
      Quote: sever.56The author is absolutely right, saying - "Here we need it why"?
      Again, of course, with the help of "damned non-brothers", having restored, at the very least, any kind of economy, they will start to spit in our faces with relish? Enough, we have already worn out these spits. This "brotherly friendship" is costing us too much — it cost hundreds of billions of dollars for a quarter of a century of "independence."
      Money - to hell with them, gain. The scariest board - pay with the lives of thousands of innocent people.
      Themselves have done, even if they themselves rake, Pokemon jumped!

      The worst thing is Valery, this is their lobby, if you knew how many there are in the power and security structures, a huge mass, if, for example, the Armenians, Azerbaijan is a diaspora and it is still in sight, then this caste is not visible to us, "get out" in Russia it is very difficult to consider and this caste occupies the highest positions in a number of regions of Russia, this is what is most terrible.
      1. sever.56
        sever.56 19 July 2016 06: 33
        +3
        Nothing, Vladimir, and we'll figure it out with the lobby over time. To hit at once in all directions is unrealistic. We focus on the main ones at the moment, and solve the issue. And so, step by step.
      2. CONTROL
        CONTROL 19 July 2016 10: 17
        +2
        Quote: engineering
        this caste is not visible to us, it is very difficult to "get out" in Russia, and this caste occupies the highest positions in a number of regions of Russia, this is the worst thing.

        ... "Their penetration into the ranks began ..." - according to my observations - in the 60s of the twentieth century ...
    3. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 09: 08
      0
      ... these woodpeckers still crawl themselves ...
      Unfortunately, now you can’t wait for them to crawl.
      Many of us have relatives living in Ukraine.
      If relatives beat up an artel every day, what to expect?
      1. Army soldier2
        Army soldier2 19 July 2016 11: 29
        0
        Then you must either transport relatives to yourself and help them here, or take a machine gun and go to Bankovaya. But you seem to be a proponent of the third option ...
        1. Svyatoslavich
          Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 11: 49
          +1
          Then you need to transport relatives to yourself ...
          My relatives are not dribly - choose yourselfwhere they live and where to die.

          And in my family - I am the last surviving man. And I have no "options". I will die where I was born.
        2. Svyatoslavich
          Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 13: 05
          0
          ... or take a gun and go to Bankova.
          I’m closer to Manezhnaya.
          But in this situation, the "Maidan" in the "Russians" will only aggravate the situation.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  • Naum
    Naum 19 July 2016 05: 38
    +13
    We, Russia and the Russians, IT IS NOT NECESSARY! Let the independent ones shit their shit! Svidomity fucking. Did your Poles help you? Hail away, come and go! Hto not jump, that ... (if you don’t understand Russian already) Gop-gop-gop! fellow wassat
  • EvgNik
    EvgNik 19 July 2016 06: 05
    +6
    Two years was written and discussed about events in Ukraine. Oleg Egorov, in fact, summed up the results of these two years. Quite disappointing for Ukraine, but it’s not sweet for us either. The nest of Nazism was brought up, raised. And no one knows what to do with this yet.
    1. Sergey S.
      Sergey S. 19 July 2016 08: 28
      +1
      Quote: EvgNik
      Raised, raised the nest of Nazism. And no one knows what to do with this yet.

      What to do is known - to destroy.

      It is not clear how to do this.
      1. Al1977
        Al1977 19 July 2016 16: 08
        0
        Quote: Sergey S.
        it’s known to do something, to destroy it.

        It is not clear how to do this.

        This is a military site that is not known ???
        Everything is known, we are waiting for the team !!!!
        1. Sergey S.
          Sergey S. 19 July 2016 21: 40
          0
          God help you!
      2. inferno_nv
        inferno_nv 20 July 2016 15: 28
        0
        Who-what and what to destroy indiscriminately? Then how will you differ from punitive? hi
    2. The comment was deleted.
  • Dart2027
    Dart2027 19 July 2016 06: 06
    +5
    Simply put, either there is no Ukraine and it’s just a part of Russia where Russians live, or it is an independent state populated by Ukrainians, which itself must solve its problems.
    1. Sergey S.
      Sergey S. 19 July 2016 08: 31
      +3
      Quote: Dart2027
      Simply put, either there is no Ukraine and it’s just a part of Russia where Russians live, or it is an independent state populated by Ukrainians, which itself must solve its problems.

      Two thoughts are incompatible.
      And both live in reality.
      Conclusion. One of these thoughts will have to be abandoned.
      Those. who are Russians - welcome to Russia.
      The rest is behind the Iron Curtain and ... all in the fight against fascism ...
    2. tolian
      tolian 19 July 2016 11: 11
      +3
      There is no Ukraine. There is a territory with a population that is heterogeneous in its intelligence and historical roots. Anyone who teases stories about great ukras is just a dropout. They are clearly visible on our television in the programs where they are invited so that we can see their intelligence - like Olesya, Voronova, Kovtun, Karasev. Well, these are little goebbels! And the historical roots are completely different for the followers of Bandera and the residents of Donbass, for example. And although our leaders talk about the country Ukraine, about the need for its statehood, looking at what is happening, all this is perceived as diplomatic speeches. The only way of this "walk the field" is a piecewise voluntary entry into Russia. But for this it is necessary not to buy them, but to show the way. And this is labor and cooperation with Russia. Let them work, sweat. They do not allow themselves to be robbed. No one, neither ours nor Western thieves. When they see that life turns out to be better, they can agree to enter into an alliance with Russia. But as with the Crimea - it will not work. There was a homogeneous population - Russian. And the land was Russian for a long time. Ukraine in its current form is completely different. Yes, and worried about the Bandera everywhere. So let them eat for now .... oh!
  • grandfather Mih
    grandfather Mih 19 July 2016 06: 32
    0
    "The problem is being overly emotional and biased." And in the inertia of thinking. Alien to us, right.
  • Mihail55
    Mihail55 19 July 2016 06: 42
    +9
    Thanks Oleg for the article! We have created the Ukrainian people! All tried, it started before 17g. The result is obvious. People with Russian surnames hate Russia as much as they do with the ending in "o" and "iy". They are DIFFERENT! Many have relatives in Russia, but for them it is FOREIGNERS. They will go to rallies, demanding higher salaries and pensions, scolding their powers that be, but in the main they will be united with their masters - we are "aggressors" for them. All evil is only from us. This state, in this form, will last a long time, hatred unites and moves. Though trashy, BUT YOUR OWN, SEE! The process of separating the cut-off slice (I mean Donbass) will take a long time, but the people there will definitely not enter the same river. Blood lay between them. I am sure that NATO will accept Svidomo and NATO missiles will threaten us, everything will be fine. And I just feel sorry for them, from free people, turned into HOLOPOV!
    1. Victor Demchenko
      Victor Demchenko 19 July 2016 07: 10
      +8
      Quote: Michael55
      And I just feel sorry for them, from free people, turned into slaves!

      you know, Misha, and I am NOT sorry for them at all ... no matter how scary it is, but even coming to visit in those distant 70s, even then I was faced with outright rudeness and ... looks "downwardly" from my relatives. they say that we live so well, and even feed the whole Union! and then there ALREADY dreams of the Svidomites: if only they lived in the West, there is freedom, well, etc.
    2. Lukich
      Lukich 19 July 2016 09: 18
      +1
      Quote: Michael55
      from free people, turned into slaves!

      have turned ???? yes they were at the genetic level
  • Kos_kalinki9
    Kos_kalinki9 19 July 2016 06: 46
    +12
    And the funny thing is: having accomplished these “feats of Hercules” and having beaten off and rebuilding Ukraine, it will be necessary to transfer it (including the Donbass and the Crimea!) To the tenacious legs of those who literally screwed up so literally before our eyes.

    No, gentlemen, comrades, brothers-brothers, Ukrainians, let us do it yourself. What you have destroyed, then restore. We will wait. And indeed
  • Arkan
    Arkan 19 July 2016 06: 51
    +5
    Ukrainians were divorced classically, having promised lace panties and EU membership, using the features of their mentality, for example, such as envy, greed and lack of mental ability. The output turned out that, residents of Ukraine who know how to take off their panties or feel perfectly at all without them, at the time of public renunciation of their roots, already integrated into the European entertainment business, did not get anything. Those residents of Ukraine, ready to perform unskilled work, in fact for nothing, remained with their own. The eastern neighbor’s market is lost, and the western neighbors don’t need local goods either. Let the horses ride on to where Makar did not chase the calves.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • avg-mgn
    avg-mgn 19 July 2016 06: 55
    +13
    I personally almost feel sorry for the Ukrainians as a nation living in the territory, they chose their own path of development and lifestyle. I am sincerely sorry for Russians and people of other nationalities, by the will of fate, or due to other circumstances that appeared on this territory at the time of the collapse of the union. At first, none of them even noticed where he ended up, and even rejoiced that they did not shoot the White House, there was no Chechen war, and bread, lard and gas cost 2-4 times cheaper than in Russia. The insight came to 2014 when they tried to make them second-class people, but .... The train left, the station remained and they with their suitcases on the platform.
    Now there are two ways: pitchfork in your hands and throw the banderlogs and their support from this land, or live with gritted teeth, getting spitting and slap in the face for life, there is no third. More or less like this.
    1. Olezhek
      19 July 2016 12: 36
      0
      I personally almost feel sorry for the Ukrainians as a nation living in the territory, they chose their own path of development and lifestyle. I am sincerely sorry for Russians and people of other nationalities, by the will of fate, or due to other circumstances that appeared on this territory at the time of the collapse of the union.


      Yes, it turned out funny with the Ukrainian SSR ... It’s too big, too different ...
      And where are the Ukrainians? And what are their achievements in state building?
      And yes, the territory.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • sever.56
    sever.56 19 July 2016 07: 07
    +32
    https://topwar.ru/uploads/images/2016/845/zzre257.png

    Friends, please forgive that is not the topic, but I want to congratulate
    a real combat commander - Givi (Mikhail Tolstoy) happy birthday
    and wish him all the best! And most importantly - to Donbass
    was free and happy !!! drinks drinks drinks
  • Mihail55
    Mihail55 19 July 2016 07: 27
    +1
    Quote: Viktor Demchenko
    you know, Misha, and I am NOT sorry for them at all ... no matter how scary it is, but even coming to visit in those distant 70s, even then I was faced with outright rudeness and ... looks "downwardly" from my relatives. they say that we live so well, and even feed the whole Union! and then there ALREADY dreams of the Svidomites: if only they lived in the West, there is freedom, well, etc.

    Good morning Victor. Passed ... "bone gnawing" jokingly called! But is it only a matter of daily bread? And they did not feed us at all! The subsidies were still the same! And I pity them that they began to live not with their own mind. It's a pity that new brains cannot be inserted.
    1. tolian
      tolian 19 July 2016 11: 48
      +3
      Bush Sr., director of the CIA .... CCCR killed two black holes - subsidies for agriculture in Ukraine and social subsidies to the republics of Central Asia .....
  • Mihail55
    Mihail55 19 July 2016 07: 30
    +5
    Happy Birthday Michael !!!! Long and Good Summer!
  • Gormenghast
    Gormenghast 19 July 2016 08: 02
    +6
    Even abstracting from the godless Maidan; and not paying attention to the last two years, it’s still clear that Ukraine, as such, did not become a sovereign state.

    The economy is full of seams. The level of the 90th year has not been achieved for any indicators; still 40% of the level of the 90th year. Virtually nothing has been created; everything that works is Soviet. Each heating season is like the end of the world.

    Sun collapsed - long collapsed. If you look at the list of weapons of the ground forces - there are entirely Soviet models. But even they were cut and sold out to everyone.

    In politics - some kind of horror. The constant illegitimate transfer of power, the apotheosis of which is a coup and junta.

    And if you also consider the hydraulic, Svidomo Ukraine of recent years, then there’s a nightmare here. Industry is flying down; social standards are absent at all; survival technique - loans; exports fell at times; the total theft of all that is bad. Any freedom from the time of Yanukovych turned into totalitarian fascism. Hate and war are being promoted.

    And how will it all end?
    1. Olezhek
      19 July 2016 11: 18
      +4
      And how will it all end?


      The best analogy with Ukraine and Ukrainians is South Africa.

      While whites had power, the economy flourished and the country developed
      Black came to power - full of seams.

      There, by the way, teaching at the university is also translated into local dialects ...

      Higher mathematics and Shakespeare in Bushman ...
  • The comment was deleted.
  • gg.na
    gg.na 19 July 2016 08: 04
    +1
    Sorry, you need to, you restore ... You yourself broke, glue them with "superglue."

    Well, or at worst, wink snot wassat !!!
  • Aleksander
    Aleksander 19 July 2016 08: 08
    +4
    why didn’t there be any interstate dialogue in the zero years? Dialogue between politicians, between Russians and Ukrainians, in the end? What was the problem? The problem was frank unwillingness of the Ukrainian side maintain such a dialogue. First, give me cheap gas ...


    Was the desire of the RUSSIAN side? What kind of initiatives did the "thinker" Chernomyrdin show, or Zurabov, who flunked EVERYTHING he touched (is he still "ambassador"? Where were the Russian NGOs, pro-Russian parties supported by Russia?there was nothing.

    It was easier, without bothering, to buy loyalty (false, as it turned out) with cheap gas, while still having a share of its resale.

    And according to the state, it was necessary to sell more expensively, and the difference should be spent on pro-Russian parties, NGOs, pro-Russian leaders, lobbyists. And do not actually give tens of billions of dollars ukkrelite. Itself had to work.

    The West won on an ALIEN site, Ruin, having invested only 5 billion, Russia lost on its site, having millions of its direct supporters and tens of millions of potential supporters, for the organization of which it did NOTHING.

    It’s easier, of course, to blame the West for a dishonest coup game on Ruin, but it’s cry of the loser: Nobody bothering you to work in your favor either.
    1. Olezhek
      19 July 2016 11: 20
      -2
      The West won on an ALIEN site, Ruin, having invested only 5 billion, Russia lost on its site, having millions of its direct supporters and tens of millions of potential supporters, for the organization of which it did NOTHING.


      Do you even own a theme?

      Did you communicate with Ukrainians / Belarusians?

      Potential supporters, damn it ...

      The point is not in the West, but in the fact that many people dream of "falling under the West."
      1. Svyatoslavich
        Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 11: 27
        -2
        Did you communicate with Ukrainians / Belarusians?
        And if you destroy not only the Union, but also the current "Russian"?
        Retrospective:
        Did you communicate with the Siberians / [Krasnodar, Stavropol, Novgorod, Vologda]?
        1. Svyatoslavich
          Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 15: 28
          0
          Are you minus?
          I do not like?
          What do you actually dislike?

          I did not want the collapse of the Union (like hundreds of millions of others). But the Union collapsed.
          I do not want the collapse of Russia. But it can be ruined in exactly the same way - the current "Russians" are much weaker than the previous Union.
          And where will we - Russians - run then?
          1. SergeBS
            SergeBS 19 July 2016 20: 27
            +2
            Quote: Svyatoslavich
            I do not want the collapse of Russia. But it can be ruined in exactly the same way - the current "Russians" are much weaker than the previous Union.

            About "exactly the same" - FIG! During the EBN we received a "vaccination", and looking at the Balts and 404 - EVERYONE understands everything even to the "locksmith-Vasya".
            Quote: Svyatoslavich
            And where will we - Russians - run then?

            Totally bad? When did the Russians flee from Russia?
            In history - "a little differently": they attacked the state (the Russian Empire, the USSR), but FUNGED - from the Motherland. Real Russians do not flee from their homeland, but defend, even knowing - "to me, a specific Russian, kirdyk." am
            This "phenomenon" is not clear what the "European civilization", that the crap from the United States.
            It is with them - "where the ass is warmer, there is homeland."
            1. Svyatoslavich
              Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 08: 34
              +2
              Totally bad?
              Am I really bad?
              Learn to read.

              ... but the ROBBER - from the Motherland.

              A piece of the Motherland was torn from us. Battered her Bandera infection.
              And now a whole bunch (of those who are really "very bad") denies our fellow tribesmen in trouble in kinship, insulting them in every message.
              1. inferno_nv
                inferno_nv 20 July 2016 15: 31
                +1
                I agree 100% with you !!! To insult and humiliate it so in Russian! Now, if we take the Armenians who live on the territory of Ukraine and support the junta, even from their fellow tribesmen they will not hear what our Slavs write! That is the main trouble of the Russians - when a neighbor feels bad, they feel good !!!
    2. Dart2027
      Dart2027 19 July 2016 20: 18
      0
      Quote: Aleksander
      The West won on an ALIEN site, Ruin, having invested only 5 billion, Russia lost on its site, having millions of direct supporters there

      You forget that we had Yeltsin and seven-bankers. And whether the USA won is still a question.
      1. Svyatoslavich
        Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 08: 40
        0
        And whether the USA won is still a question.

        In fact, they have already won.
        One part of historical Russia is at war with another part of historical Russia. Wherein citizens of present-day Russia are participating in this conflict on both sides.
        Are "non-brothers" already inside Russia?

        The USA failed only the capture of Sevastopol.
        1. Dart2027
          Dart2027 20 July 2016 18: 36
          0
          Quote: Svyatoslavich
          One part of historical Russia is at war with another part of historical Russia.

          He is fighting. But they only need a war that, if it does not kill, then at least weaken Russia as much as possible. What is happening now on such a scale does not pull, and they have to maintain the junta.
  • Wolka
    Wolka 19 July 2016 08: 11
    0
    Well, I really hope that there will be no freebies anymore
  • Scud
    Scud 19 July 2016 08: 19
    0
    What can I say about simple Ukrainians if almost everything seems to be advanced-adequate people, the same Shariy, the late Buzina, people's deputy Yevgeny Muraev are sleeping and see Crimea as part of dill. Yevgeny Muraev cuts the truth of the womb on TV channels about fascist power in Ukraine, but the paradox. On his TV channel he almost meets with flowers, Parasyuk, Lyashka and other similar scum. Recently, Dmitry Kisilev gave a big interview to the weekly 2000-Ukraine has not passed and will pass soon maybe a bigger bloody meat grinder, and only after that there is hope for sobriety in the heads of Ukrainians.
    1. Siberian
      Siberian 19 July 2016 09: 21
      +1
      On your channel, it's money. And they are necessary and loved in the process of life.
      True, a healthy and sound sleep - it is also necessary, Let the dream ukrokrym. You know, as in the good old Gabrovo joke (from the Slavs-Bulgarians): "Dad, today I dreamed that you bought me a chocolate bar - so small." "Good. If you behave yourself, you will dream that I bought you a big chocolate bar."
      Let them dream and be aware.
    2. felix47
      felix47 21 July 2016 22: 24
      +1
      To all the words (and groans and cries) about Crimea that it is Ukrainian, I would like to recall the legality of the transfer of the Crimean Autonomous Republic to the Russian Federation. But with a different scenario, which was prepared long before the Maidan, already now in the Crimea they would have finished cleansing the Russian population and a new ova enclave would have already appeared in Sevastopol: New Guantanamo, which these Kiev prostitute godfathers would have already registered in lawfully furnished rents so for 100 years. And the largest US Navy base would have appeared in Crimea, and the air base too. That would be 100% real!
  • Tihas
    Tihas 19 July 2016 08: 20
    +4
    Dragged from here: https: //aftershock.news/? Q = node / 418963 & page = 1 # comments
    A comment on an article about Belarus, but the fate of all post-Soviet republics is the same, either to become Russia or Gabon conditional.
    Belarus is, by and large, a kind of fake, a kind of intermediate formation between Poland and Russia thanks to the Brest Peace (the Bolsheviks retreat) and then accession to the territory of the eastern and western regions.

    In the Brest world, the Germans left Vitebsk and Mogilev regions for Soviet Russia, the Gomel Germans recognized Ukraine (it was then that Ukraine appeared, then the Ukrainian SSR). - These are 3 eastern regions of the future BSSR.

    After the loss of the war to Poland by Soviet Russia in 1920, everything a little west and north of Minsk (actually, Mensk, from the word change in Russian, and they wrote on the maps - Mensk, not Minsk in the Republic of Ingushetia), the future BSSR was attributed to 3 regions - Gomel, Mogilev and Vitebsk. Otherwise, there would be nothing from Belarus. But since the Bolsheviks, who were never Russian in origin and mentality, fought in "Great Russian chauvinism." attributed to the BSSR.

    In 1939, another 2 western regions of Belarus were assigned to the BSSR.

    And this is how Belarus was created by the Bolsheviks under the USSR. In contrast to bourgeois Great Russian chauvinism.

    In principle, they, the Bolsheviks, and all the other SSRs did just that.

    ...

    There was one shortcoming of the Bolsheviks. - All the outskirts of Russia, which they, in order to preserve power and strengthen it, opposed "Great Russian bourgeois chauvinism", and so they are not self-sufficient from the point of view of maintaining their own statehood. - The state is an expensive thing, it is necessary to support officials, the army, and ideologists of statehood, etc. and so on. And the states were formed in a natural way earlier, in the 16-17 centuries, on the technology of harnessing energy through the technology of extraction and processing of iron.

    And now we see how artificial states created by the Bolsheviks within the framework of the USSR are crumbling under the conditions of "transfer to self-financing". While in the USSR Russia was a subjectless RSFSR, the territory of a free resource for the outskirts, they flourished. And now they are deaf. This is an inevitable process. This is a return to the real scale before 1917 of who and what is. On the territory of the former. The USSR is only Russia of itself. So it was until the 17th year, and so it comes back to that.
    1. Olezhek
      19 July 2016 11: 29
      +1
      The state is an expensive thing, it is necessary to maintain officials and the army, and ideologists of statehood, etc. etc .. And the states evolved naturally in the 16-17 centuries, on technologies to curb energy through technologies for the extraction and processing of iron.

      how artificial states created by the Bolsheviks within the framework of the USSR collapse under the conditions of "transfer to self-financing"


      Absolutely!
    2. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 16: 19
      0
      And now we see how artificial states created by the Bolsheviks within the framework of the USSR are collapsing under the conditions of "transfer to self-financing."
      Today's Ukraine is a good example of the fact that a pseudo-state entity aimed at an armed conflict with Russia can exist indefinitely due to external financing (including by Russia itself).
      1. Al1977
        Al1977 19 July 2016 16: 53
        +1
        Quote: Svyatoslavich
        Today's Ukraine is a good example of the fact that a pseudo-state entity aimed at an armed conflict with Russia can exist indefinitely due to external financing (including by Russia itself).

        The only conclusion is that it is a small source of financing. A cancerous tumor on Earth must be excised surgically. How much can you train, it's time for Ch.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • oracul
    oracul 19 July 2016 08: 59
    +2
    In my opinion, we can state the following:
    1. Ukrainian nationalism began to form long before the Bolsheviks came to power (read the white émigré N. Ulyanov "The Ideology of Ukrainian Separatism").
    2. The Bolsheviks would not have held out in power without taking into account the real desire of the elite of the national suburbs for independence from the Russian Empire. Here the interests, but not the goals, coincided, and at the initial stage the struggle was on a common front against the united and indivisible (white slogan). Then the goals diverged, the Red Army of Soviet Russia grew stronger, and the nazokrains again reached for a strong hand - this is familiar to them (the American historian Cowen wrote about this). The USSR arose on this basis, but it was really necessary to take into account the interests of national elites, which was done.
    3. The problem was that the "collective mind" of the Central Committee, which they liked to talk about during the Brezhnev era, actually turned out to be senile insanity and could not (or did not want) to see that the new community - the Soviet people - does not automatically free from problems especially since the West was actively working against the USSR. This is what the absence of a real leader means, if you want a leader.
    4. The elites of the former Soviet republics got what they wanted: power, but not real independence. Using national privileges and subsidies at the expense of the RSFSR in the conditions of the USSR, they forgot how to work themselves and began to trade in their sovereignty in the hope of a freebie of the good West. Russia, while it was itself weak, did not interest them, therefore, the desire to build new economic relations (one has to work), not to mention friendly relations, they (with the exception of Belarus) did not seek until they started having problems and the new Russia began to grow stronger. Either a light tilt towards her and simultaneous trade with the West began in the hope of still getting a freebie (the Alts have managed to get it), or frenzied Russophobia for the same purpose (Ukraine, Georgia, the Baltic states and the former socialist camp).
    4. It is necessary to build relations with everyone, first of all, taking into account the security interests of Russia and the quality of life of its population. Even in an ordinary family, there are situations when you have to abandon loved ones parasitizing on it. Here we are talking about interstate relations. A ray of hope gives the story of China. There was a period when we were on the verge of war with him, but years passed, people in power changed and relations began to be built anew, and on a new pragmatic basis. The main thing is not to live in the looking glass and not entertain yourself with illusions, no matter how tempting they are.
    1. Olezhek
      19 July 2016 11: 34
      0
      A ray of hope gives the story of China. There was a period when we were on the verge of war with him, but years passed, people in power changed and relations began to be built anew, and on a new pragmatic basis.


      Mao lit not childishly ....
      In general, the Chinese are serious people and China is the oldest state on the planet. So China and Ukraine are two big differences!

      Taiwan, by the way, the Chinese also built ...
    2. SergeBS
      SergeBS 19 July 2016 21: 40
      +2
      Quote: oracul
      1. Ukrainian nationalism began to form long before the Bolsheviks came to power (read the white émigré N. Ulyanov "The Ideology of Ukrainian Separatism").

      Uh-huh. You can also remember the "Zaporozhye Sich" as an example of this separatism. How did this Sich end? smile
      The next question is - what is this "Ukrainian separatism"? In the robbery of YOUR farms? In the robbery of the Crimea? In the robbery of Russian villages and villages? Or just robbery? Lots of "nationalists" who DO care who to rob, if only fat and vodka were?
      Or are there other examples of "separatism"? Especially if you consider - well, there was nowhere for the "separam" (nationalists) to run.
      Psheki considered them for (cattle, in a simple way). And in the Republic of Ingushetia, those who like "live freely, rob everyone and trade with all the prisoners from raids" were not welcomed, but on the contrary "extinguished." The funny thing is that the peasants of "their Sichs" happily "pawned", because these bandits got everyone with their "Cossack will".
  • Vadxnumx
    Vadxnumx 19 July 2016 09: 00
    +14
    Here is the same "baida" and with dill-like ...
    1. Khariton
      Khariton 19 July 2016 19: 28
      0
      It’s rightly noticed ... We always have the Russians! (in Chechnya a small example ..)))) bully
  • darksoul
    darksoul 19 July 2016 09: 02
    0
    I agree in many ways .... but I don’t understand which side Ukraine understood and is trying to turn to us ..... in my opinion they are turning in our direction to pour a bucket of slop or even a bastard ... not leaving the cash register
  • masiya
    masiya 19 July 2016 09: 27
    +3
    Well, if the hetman himself said this, then no words ...
  • Cosmonaut
    Cosmonaut 19 July 2016 09: 58
    +2
    Article (+).
    Excellent analysis and logical conclusions.
    1. Olezhek
      19 July 2016 12: 34
      -1
      Thanks for your kind words.
  • Koronik
    Koronik 19 July 2016 10: 26
    +5
    "Recently, it seems that Ukraine is a large psychiatric hospital. What had to be done with people so that their brains would go to one side like this? Maybe they are really being irradiated with something ... Besides embroidered shirts, flags, painted shops, garbage cans, bridges, where trident can and cannot be, nothing else interests them. "
    Do not take away any more.
  • midshipman
    midshipman 19 July 2016 11: 08
    +6
    In my subordination in Ukraine from 1979 to 1989 (the USSR Ministry of Radio Industry was liquidated) there were 12 enterprises (research institutes and factories). About 90 thousand specialists worked for them. I tried to analyze the situation that had developed and published an article in "VO" "Betrayal or incompetence". Who has a desire to read, please. It was difficult for the heads of the State Administration to work in Ukraine, our secret notes were constantly sent to the Central Committee of the CPSU. No action was taken.
    It is impossible to throw Ukraine, as well as Kazakhstan, Belarus, Uzbekistan and Tajikistan. You see what is happening there right next door.
    There is a solution, but whether our Government will accept it is a question. I have the honor.
  • pavelty
    pavelty 19 July 2016 11: 19
    -3
    I didn’t read to the end, the topic of Ukrainians was tired, nothing interesting, a lot of people think that they understand the essence of the problem, but this is not so. All this causes boredom and rejection. There must be a way to solve all this in the shortest possible time, otherwise this protracted conflict will hang over our heads.
    1. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 11: 30
      +4
      ... otherwise this protracted conflict will hang over our heads.
      For many, he had already decided - they were killed.
      And they will kill.
      If the "factory" for the production of non-Russians will not be stopped.
      1. pavelty
        pavelty 19 July 2016 13: 23
        +1
        Yes, Svyatoslavich, you are right. And what did you do? Have you got up from the couch? Are you already in the Donbass? This is not my war, I already participated, that's enough for me, I won’t harness for 404 for the country.
        1. Svyatoslavich
          Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 13: 42
          -3
          Are you already in the Donbass?
          The fate of the Russians (including my relatives from the Donbass) is now being decided not in the Donbass.
          1. pavelty
            pavelty 19 July 2016 13: 50
            +1
            Excuse me, I'm incomprehensible, why are you still not with relatives? Do you expect from afar that everything will somehow settle down? The position is good.
            1. Svyatoslavich
              Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 14: 09
              0
              Excuse me, I'm incomprehensible, why are you still not with relatives?
              The question is not posed correctly - why aren't my relatives?
              I already answered him.
              https://topwar.ru/98169-hmuroe-utro-na-prospekte-bandery.html#
              (Today, 11: 49)

              Do you expect from afar that everything will somehow settle down?
              Will not settle down.
              Three options.
              1. Killed.
              2. They will send to ... "Minsk" and take up arms.
              3. They will throw the ashes of their home and come to Russia, where no one is waiting for them, except my family.
          2. The comment was deleted.
        2. Svyatoslavich
          Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 14: 20
          +1
          ... I will not harness ...
          And you don’t have to harness it.
          There are plenty of Russian (and not only Russian) men with combat experiencewho have already harnessed this matter.
          1. pavelty
            pavelty 19 July 2016 14: 32
            0
            Yes, I do not want to listen to your tearful fabrications) I specifically ask why you and AKM are not in the Donbass? With relatives, I have no relatives there.
            1. Svyatoslavich
              Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 14: 42
              -1
              ... why are you and AKM not in the Donbass?
              Because in the Donbass, those who want to break into the Kremlin with AKM are killed first of all.
              1. pavelty
                pavelty 19 July 2016 14: 47
                +1
                I realized that it is useless to discuss, you have in your head some set of false concepts ... What kind of Kremlin? And then what is it? Have a good trip.
                1. Svyatoslavich
                  Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 15: 10
                  +2
                  you have in your head some set of false concepts ... What kind of Kremlin?
                  I am a simple Russian man. And in my head everything is simple:
                  Many different peoples live in Russia. But when the war of trenches comes to Russia only two - the Russian and the enemy.
                  It's time to decide - who is in whose trench?
                  Kremlin tycoons must also make their choice.
                  1. Svyatoslavich
                    Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 15: 46
                    -1
                    It's time to decide - who is in whose trench?
                    Speaking of two trenches ...
                    In the current armed conflict in Ukraine immigrants from Russia are fighting on both sides.
                    Who will answer: Why?
                    1. SergeBS
                      SergeBS 19 July 2016 21: 10
                      +2
                      Quote: Svyatoslavich
                      Speaking of two trenches ...
                      In the current armed conflict in Ukraine, immigrants from Russia are fighting on both sides.
                      Who will answer: why?

                      The answer is easy: "compare the figures." And no longer scream "immigrants from Russia are fighting on both sides."
                      I will reveal a "little secret": take ANY nation, there will ALWAYS be found in it both those who defend the Motherland, and those who "are ready for anything for big bablosik (increased rations)."
                      What's your "why" out of topic, okay?
                      I will add: Donbass began to "crush a little later" than Crimea. Well, purely historically, Donbass was "fastened" to 404 in the 192s, so that “the working class would become larger,” and Crimea in 195X.
                      What was later given "for nothing" is easier to return BACK. There are fewer parasites.
                      1. Svyatoslavich
                        Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 08: 50
                        0
                        What's your "why" out of topic, okay?
                        Do not understand.
                        Very much in the subject.
                        Nerus and "non-brothers" in Ukraine are understandable. There, Russophobic propaganda is an integral part of government policy.
                        And what about the nerus and "non-brothers" (Russian geeks) in Russia? Where are they from?
              2. The comment was deleted.
      2. The comment was deleted.
    2. tatra
      tatra 19 July 2016 11: 31
      -1
      Quote: pavlentiy
      There must be a way to solve all this in the shortest possible time.

      The only way is to deal with these Bandera fans as with the Germans after the Second World War, by knocking out anger and hatred, hatred, racism from the brains.
      But nobody needs this. So let the Ukrainian enemies of the communists continue to destroy Ukraine and the Ukrainian people.
      They can no longer be saved.
  • Zomanus
    Zomanus 19 July 2016 13: 12
    +2
    When I read the news about life in Ukraine, I always repeat "-This is because they are allowed everything."
    The main scourge of our 90s was called "permissiveness". It was possible to do everything: sell pronos on the street in stalls, have sex with schoolgirls. shootouts, buying ships and police, everything.
    And now everything is possible in Ukraine. And this is presented as freedom, for the conquest of the "revolution of dignity."
    So we'll see when they come to their senses ... although most likely they will not be allowed to do this.
    1. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 13: 30
      0
      So let's see when they come to their senses ...
      Never.
      With our tacit consent, they will slaughter everyone and intimidate all Russians.
      And their children will be brought up on memoirs: "How I fought with the Muscovites."
  • Brigadier
    Brigadier 19 July 2016 13: 15
    +3
    The author correctly says - "the patient is more likely dead than alive ...". The main thing is that our top leaders finally take up their minds and understand that it is impossible to feed a mad dog, which is just waiting for the right moment to grab the throat of its breadwinner! And all the screams of the local Svidomo and our pseudo-patriots about the "Ukrainian brothers" who now need to be urgently saved, you just need to throw into the dustbin of history. Let them devour themselves in their bank to their "victorious end"! Paraphrasing words from our film, we can say: "You are not my brother, bitch Bandera ..."
    1. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 19 July 2016 13: 34
      0
      ... you just need to throw in the trash of history.
      ... any region with a Russian population in which Russophobic propaganda will begin to win?
  • Paul zewike
    Paul zewike 19 July 2016 14: 36
    +1
    An analysis of our relations with Ukraine finally comes out of the hysterical phase. The article is one of the attempts of sound analysis. Although, it seems to me, the analysis is not entirely complete. Plus of course.
  • berezin1987
    berezin1987 19 July 2016 17: 30
    0
    There is a great way to fix the brains of the population of any country in the world. It can be Ukraine, Germany, Honduras, etc. This method is to let the population of the territory through the crucible of total war. Roughly speaking, to arrange a meat grinder like Vietnam or Korea with millions of victims without the direct involvement of a third party. After such conflicts, a reassessment of values ​​takes place and society can begin to reassemble. The Vietnamese were able to unite after a fierce war, the Russians after the civil war. So nothing is impossible, although the price of the union is huge.
    1. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 08: 54
      0
      ... although the price of pooling is huge.
      What kind of association are you for?
      Who should unite?
  • bk316
    bk316 19 July 2016 19: 14
    +2
    Quote: Al1977
    Everything is known, we are waiting for the team !!!!

    Maybe enough troll ..
  • akm8226
    akm8226 19 July 2016 20: 18
    +4
    One thing I can say is absolutely certain - the Ukrainians are over. Forever and ever. The road to Russia is closed to them forever. At least for the entire foreseeable future. If they want to join, then first they have to put several million corpses - like Germany in the war. This is cruel - but fair. For there will be no second betrayal! In order for them to return, they must have very good reasons. For nothing, no one needs them for three hundred years. And how do you imagine it? Yesterday Parasha was screaming about Russian horse divers who burst into the "Ridna Nenka" in countless hordes - but is he already a friend today? And what will you do with the hundreds of murdered children in Donetsk and who will you blame? And the downed plane? And the hundreds of civilian bodies in Donetsk?
    No, panov - they themselves betrayed, now they themselves beg forgiveness.
    Like in that movie:
    - Sama-sama-sama!
    If you die, the road is there for you. We dig you up and plant potatoes in that place - it’s all good. Come out - well, we'll see if it’s possible to deal with you.
    CYSES. Hunchback, of course, she’s a bastard, but for one I’m grateful to him - for the moment of truth. Here we would be sitting in the USSR, and we would think what kind of Ukrainians and Balts we are brothers ... and here he is, the moment of truth.
    1. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 09: 11
      +1
      One thing I can say for sure - Ukrainians are over.
      1. They did not end.
      2. Of them make our enemies. Forever.
      3. Present-day Russia itself helps to make our enemies of them.

      and the Baltic states are brothers to us ... and here he is, the moment of truth.
      And in the Baltic, brothers (Russians) were left to their fate.
      Have you ever seen a Latvian "non-citizen passport"? Have you ever lived by such "frog paper"?
      1. Olezhek
        20 July 2016 10: 03
        +1
        . Of them make our enemies. Forever and ever


        As far as I know, during the fighting in the Donbass, the number of non-brothers decreased by about 30 servicemen and "volunteers". How do you look at it?
        1. Svyatoslavich
          Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 10: 55
          0
          As far as I know, during the fighting in the Donbass, the number of non-brothers decreased by about 30 servicemen and "volunteers". How do you look at it?
          1. Russian "non-brothers" and Russian brothers kill each other in tens of thousands. What is so good about it?
          2. There are more and more "non-brothers" - Russophobic propaganda is ahead of the most advanced methods of warfare.

          PS. In the battle of Stalingrad, Germany lost 300 troops. And the war did not end there.
          1. Al1977
            Al1977 20 July 2016 12: 04
            0
            Quote: Svyatoslavich
            There are more and more "non-brothers" - Russophobic propaganda is ahead of the most advanced methods of warfare.

            That is, their propaganda is much more influential and more effective than our truth ??
            What is her success. Provided that no one has canceled the Internet, satellite channels, family ties.
            The same question, watching our TV, of all experts in Ukraine, Soloviev-Kiselev-Tolstoy, can an ordinary Ukrainian understand that Russia loves the Ukrainian people. Or should he understand that he is a Bandera geek. . How do you personally think?
            1. Svyatoslavich
              Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 13: 31
              +1
              That is, their propaganda is much more influential and more effective than our truth ??
              1. The truth is ours.
              But we are monstrously divided.
              The Russian people are weak from this. As a result: Russia is weak from this.
              And nobody needs a weak Russia.

              2. The propaganda of "non-Russians" is really quite effective. This is a fact that we will have to admit if we want to survive as a people.

              ... can an ordinary Ukrainian understand that Russia loves the Ukrainian people. Or should he understand that he is a Bandera geek. . How do you personally think?
              Personally, I believe that Ukraine should be divided in 2014. by language, since this is the only reliable ethno-determining attribute.
              Western Ukraine would have sailed almost peacefully to European brothels.
              Eastern - reunited with Russia, like the Crimea.
              But now time is lost.
  • nesvobodnye
    nesvobodnye 19 July 2016 23: 16
    +1
    Now restore yourself. Sami, all by yourself.
  • Balagan
    Balagan 20 July 2016 04: 31
    +1
    We now have a good vaccination against the non-brothers. Now Ukrainians in word and deed must prove their need to us. And without it - fuck ... overboard!
    1. Al1977
      Al1977 20 July 2016 12: 02
      0
      Quote: booth
      Now Ukrainians in word and deed must prove their need to us.

      Nobody will prove anything to you. Why do they need you?
  • magdama
    magdama 20 July 2016 07: 35
    -1
    I did not even read nonsense. I will say. we are not brothers, about 100 years old. Then you crawl up on an empty stomach. Definitely and sadly. And we will take away Odessa, because it is Russian, but not at all Khokhlyat. Ask the Jews of Odessa ...
    1. Svyatoslavich
      Svyatoslavich 20 July 2016 13: 39
      0
      ... about 100 years old.
      ...
      And we will take away Odessa, because it is Russian, but not at all Khokhlyat. Ask the Jews of Odessa ...
      Yeah! And also Alaska and California ...
      In a hundred years it’s time to take it. And MedvePutin in the Kremlin will last a hundred years.
    2. inferno_nv
      inferno_nv 20 July 2016 15: 40
      +2
      You can understand or not that not everyone here is what you think, there are still a lot of normal people, and you wrote them down long ago, etc. request
  • morozow-su114
    morozow-su114 20 July 2016 18: 41
    +1
    absolutely accurate analysis !!! ... they destroyed it themselves, let them now restore it and it would be nice to remember the wise proverb "break down, don't build" ... and we will see as an outside observer ...
  • taseka
    taseka 21 July 2016 06: 47
    0
    Soon, US suckers in Ukraine will sooner or later perish in a foreign land with their 30 pieces of silver, a bitter awareness of the people will come, then understanding and the will to recreate friendly relations with Russia and restore Slavic unity - the only question is how long this will stretch!
  • Gvfrog
    Gvfrog 21 July 2016 09: 10
    +2
    Quote: Ami du peuple
    Quote: dmi.pris
    About eight years ago it was already bad to say so.
    "Bad" began with the first Maidan, when the dioxin Yushch was illegally pushed into the presidency of Ukraine. And, frankly, this "bad" began back in 1991 - with the adoption of the Act of Declaration of Independence of Ukraine and an all-Ukrainian referendum in its support, when almost the entire population voted for "independence."
    The author of the article is a huge plus. Briefly and to the point.

    It did NOT start well much earlier, only many did not notice it. The first signs are when the "corn" stopped pursuing the OUN-UPA, and later they did not pay attention to the games coming out of the patriots, I myself remember how in the late 80s, even before the collapse of the USSR, in high school they discussed how to draw a "fork" correctly. coat of arms and the school administration turned a blind eye to this. At the discos, those who came from Lviv boasted of "zhovto-blakytnyy" badges. And this is in our Kharkiv region. And later, while parents were engaged in survival in the late 90s and early 00s, children began to be taught corrected history in Ukrainian schools. Here is a real case. 2005 on the eve of MAY 9, my 11-year-old daughter, when asked about the holiday, who fought with whom and who won whom, answered: "Yes, in my opinion, ours and the Russians, and it seems ours won." True, I can be at least a little proud that I caught myself in time and instilled in her a correct view of history, but after all, many of this grown generation firmly believe that poor Ukraine has always suffered under the yoke of invaders, then "Poles", then "Germans" and of course the most terrible Russian imperialists, with it doesn't matter what, what is the monarchy before 1917, what the communists after but the most terrible in Russia!
  • Maxim73
    Maxim73 21 July 2016 14: 40
    0
    Quote: GVFrog
    and of course, the most terrible Russian imperialists, and it doesn’t matter what, that the monarchy was before 1917, that the communists after but the Russian are the worst!

    Fear is a bad adviser ...
  • yehat
    yehat 21 July 2016 15: 28
    +1
    the author voiced an extreme isolationist position, mixed somewhat with nationalism in the article.
    But only a few. What will happen if we fence off from Ukraine? And tension will increase, as in Afghanistan. Now Yatsenyuki and biathletes are coming from Ukraine to Chechnya to shoot from the back and young deer who are engaged in vandalism, and then? And then, as in Israel, we will see a kind of martyrs!
    If the author is not in the know, I will remind you that Ukraine’s schools are actively promoted to Ukraine in Vladivostok and they won’t leave it there. Do we need it? No, don’t. Therefore, you need to influence. How?
    Buying loyalty, as it was before, seems extremely negative, as a way. I believe that it is necessary to act, but otherwise, without crossing the line of philanthropy and not crossing the line of isolation.
    But the main thing should not happen in Ukraine, but with us. We must build in ourselves what we can present as a proud example to our neighbors. We must live as neighbors, not as 2 fighting dogs. Because the Russian Federation needs an external market. And it is not necessary to build Ukraine and the rings of Saturn around Moscow, but the Urals, Siberia, the Far East, the fishing and merchant fleet, industry, and to rebuild the system of financing citizens. We have something to build and this is very, very much! And let the Ukrainians decide whether they will be part of this or not.