Military Review

Media: MiG is developing a light version of the PAK FA

93
The MiG corporation, based on the prototype MiG-1.44, is developing another promising fighter of the 5 generation, reports TASS post its source in the defense industry.


Fighter MiG 1.44

RSK MiG is developing the second version of the PAK FA. Based on the aerodynamic layout of the MiG-1.44 aircraft and those developments that were on this prototype, "- said the source.

“This will be an easy version of the PAK FA, which will not compete with the T-50 model developed by Sukhoi,” he added.

In June, it was reported that the MiG corporation continues to work on a promising fighter, despite the lack of an order. True, the MiG-35 was then called as a possible platform.

The prototype MiG-1.44 was created in the 90-ies as part of the development of the 5-generation aircraft. It was first introduced at MAKS-2015 in the Moscow region.

The company noted that "the project allowed us to make a big leap in the direction of fifth-generation fighters, and the technologies incorporated in it have been successfully developed so far." According to sources, the fighter made a single test flight.
Photos used:
Marina Lystseva / TASS
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  1. Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov 30 September 2015 15: 14
    14
    Lightweight and manoeuvrable we need ... with PAK technology
    1. Ruslan
      Ruslan 30 September 2015 15: 18
      18
      these what le? interesting option
      1. Vitaly Anisimov
        Vitaly Anisimov 30 September 2015 15: 20
        +1
        Quote: ruslan
        these what le? interesting option

        Maybe this one? Why reinvent the wheel ....?
        1. Ruslan
          Ruslan 30 September 2015 15: 31
          13
          her, I'm afraid of yak stealth is impossible. we need both a new case and supersonic dvigla and deliver electronics (or part) from the cabinets. the yak has its own niche. if you start this business, then it’s in good conscience. Yes, and the moment most likely already has groundwork. because my picture seems to be from the instant site itself. I think he is likely to be so.
          1. abrakadabre
            abrakadabre 1 October 2015 09: 52
            +1
            Pretty contours
        2. Engineer
          Engineer 30 September 2015 15: 31
          +3
          "RSK MIG on the basis of the Yak-130 is developing a light fighter" - is nothing confusing? In fact, they used to say that on the basis of the MiG-35, but now according to the 1,44 scheme, i.e. duck scheme. Somehow it all does not fit.
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 30 September 2015 15: 36
            +4
            Quote: Engineer
            "RSK MIG on the basis of the Yak-130 is developing a light fighter" - nothing confuses?

            No, because .....transmits to TASS a message from its source in the defense industry.
            I think the comments are superfluous.
          2. The comment was deleted.
        3. aleks 62 next
          aleks 62 next 30 September 2015 15: 51
          0
          .... Maybe this one? Why reinvent the wheel ....?

          ... Sound idea ....
        4. pilot8878
          pilot8878 30 September 2015 15: 58
          +5
          Damn, well, does not meet the training and combat Yak-130 requirements for aircraft of the 5th generation. Although beautiful. good
          1. theadenter
            theadenter 30 September 2015 19: 22
            +2
            Moreover, the Yak-130 is a 4+ generation aircraft (more precisely, it is intended for training on flights on 4+ generation aircraft).
      2. Engineer
        Engineer 30 September 2015 15: 33
        +1
        Quote: ruslan
        these what le? interesting option

        this is not a duck
        1. Ruslan
          Ruslan 30 September 2015 15: 41
          +5
          if they write that the developments of 1.44 will be used, is it a 100% guarantee of creating a "duck"? :)
      3. Non-jumping
        Non-jumping 30 September 2015 22: 27
        +1
        Quote: ruslan
        these what le? interesting option

        The new light fighter from MiG will be similar to the 1.44 project, but smaller and with one engine - the same one that is being created for the PAK FA, the so-called "second stage", and will also most likely have a more "stealth" shape compared to 1.44. And this drawing is just another fantasy of some fan of military aviation.
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 1 October 2015 01: 28
          +2
          Quote: non-jumping
          The new light MiG fighter will be similar to the 1.44 project, but smaller and with one engine

          I once said that the developments on MIG-1.44 will not gather dust for a long time. But I still think that 5 generation LFI will still be with two engines, as they will use the developments on PAK FA.
          The MIG-1.44 was also notable for its phenomenal speed characteristics, accelerated more to 3 swings. And I think this parameter will be as key as stealth with super maneuverability. hi
    2. barsuk
      barsuk 30 September 2015 15: 22
      +4
      Quote: MIKHAN
      Lightweight and manoeuvrable we need ... with PAK technology


      Why tell me?
      1. RBLip
        RBLip 30 September 2015 15: 32
        +6
        Quote: barsuk
        Why tell me?

        hardly anyone will be able to thoroughly report to you the plans of the Supreme and the General Staff. so there can be two types of answers to such a question: 1. So that’s a blunder. 2. For what purpose are you interested?
        1. barsuk
          barsuk 30 September 2015 15: 41
          -5
          [/ Quote]
          hardly anyone will be able to thoroughly report to you the plans of the Supreme and the General Staff. so there can be two types of answers to such a question: 1. So that’s a blunder. 2. For what purpose are you interested in? [/ Quote]

          Why then shout what is needed if you don’t know why
          1. Atemzug
            Atemzug 30 September 2015 17: 45
            +4
            If the armed forces need it, then they know why.
            They are not obliged to report to us.
            If something is not explained to you, this does not mean that this does not exist.
            1. Vladimir 1964
              Vladimir 1964 30 September 2015 21: 25
              +2
              Quote: Atemzug
              If the armed forces need it, then they know why.
              They are not obliged to report to us.
              If something is not explained to you, this does not mean that this does not exist.

              Actually, Dear Atemzug, the author of the article specifically indicates that the development is quite so independent, without order.

              Something like this. yes
        2. Throw
          Throw 30 September 2015 16: 33
          +3
          It seems to me that this is being done with an eye on two points:
          1. Financial support for the MIG team, which is right.
          2. A shock drone based on the lightweight PAK FA, which is very correct bully
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. trenitron
        trenitron 30 September 2015 15: 40
        +9
        Good evening ... I'll tell you. To have superiority in the air in the front zone, without distracting the heavy T-50s
      4. theadenter
        theadenter 30 September 2015 19: 26
        +2
        It is possible to solve simpler problems and lower fuel consumption, lower cost, less complicated repair and modernization.
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 1 October 2015 01: 38
          +3
          Quote: theadenter
          It is possible to solve simpler problems and lower fuel consumption, lower cost, less complicated repair and modernization.

          The objective of the LFI is to conquer the sky on the front line and destroy everything that flies from the other side.
          You didn’t list everything. The production of light fighters will be faster, and thereby the renewal of the fighter fleet, too. Plus to all that has been said, we must also remember the price, which by definition will be less than what the PAK FA will be.
          1. theadenter
            theadenter 1 October 2015 03: 22
            +2
            Well, the main points mean I correctly guessed.
      5. swan
        swan 30 September 2015 19: 49
        +1
        Well, the PAK FA flight hour is much more expensive than the Yak-130 flight hour.
        Just quite a lot. And the amounts are impressive. And make them longer and more expensive. And learning to fly them is difficult, for a long time, etc.)

        With aircraft of the MiG-29 and Su-27 family, the story is about the same. Actually, that's why they both have the right to life. Short-range (easier, cheaper, etc.) and long-range.

        For border patrolling, for example, PAK-FA capabilities are redundant. You can get by with simpler planes (not the Yak-130, of course, but a lighter 5th generation fighter will not hurt).
      6. NEXUS
        NEXUS 1 October 2015 01: 33
        +2
        Quote: barsuk
        Why tell me?

        For a simple and understandable reason, the CONCEPT OF A FESTIVAL TWO (Light and heavy fighters) NOBODY CANCELED AND IT IS ACTUAL AND TODAY. So far, technology is not at such a level that a heavy fighter can fulfill a task to create a universal platform, maybe for tasks that are set for LFI, but its use will be redundant and uneconomical. In addition, you should not forget about the price and time of production. hi
    3. zzz
      zzz 30 September 2015 15: 33
      +8
      Litter, that is not the topic: Lord, help us all and keep our military alive! If lead.ru do not lie:

      September 30 201515: 17
      The Russian Air Force launched its first attacks on militants in Syria

      The first air strikes against targets in Syria were carried out by Russian bombers from an air base in Latakia. Two Russian Su-24 front-line bombers flew on a combat mission to the area of ​​the city of Hama, 213 kilometers north of Damascus.
      Among the first, Interfax reports, the Kurdish news channel Slemani Times and the television channel CNN reported on the bombing of positions of militants of the terrorist organization Islamic State by Russian planes.
      http://www.vesti.ru/doc.html?id=2670022&cid=9
      1. Imperial
        Imperial 30 September 2015 16: 09
        +4
        zzz September 30, 201515
        The Russian Air Force launched its first attacks on militants in Syria
      2. Imperial
        Imperial 30 September 2015 16: 12
        -1
        And today
    4. marlin1203
      marlin1203 30 September 2015 15: 44
      0
      Did you count the money? An expensive pleasure is such a development. Maybe it’s more practical to focus on.
      1. dyksi
        dyksi 30 September 2015 15: 55
        +6
        In fact, it is being developed at the own expense of RSK MiG, without burdening the state, and the state, in turn, began to finance the MiG-35, and it was also practically created at its own expense, it remains to work on it new weapons systems that were created for our modern fighters . So the state is not in the loser.
        1. VadimSt
          VadimSt 30 September 2015 16: 14
          +2
          Yes, it turns out that RSK MiG is not a "state"! And what then - Odessa Privoz or Sukhum shop?
        2. g1v2
          g1v2 30 September 2015 16: 44
          +2
          It seems to me more and more that our military men do not like the mig35 and do not want to buy it. But public refusal of his purchases will put an end to his export chances, here comes verbiage. PM will try to deliver it abroad, and the Migovites were given a new technical task, so as not to be upset.
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 1 October 2015 01: 54
            +2
            Quote: g1v2
            It seems to me more and more that our military moment 35 does not like and they do not want to buy it.

            It’s not a matter of whether you like it or not. Up to turning blue you can upgrade the aircraft, of course, but the modernization resource has its own limit. You can draw as many advantages as you like for the 4-ke, but it will never become a fighter of the 5 generation, which, by the way, all the powers capable of this, including the adversary, are developing. A NEW EASY FIGHTER is needed, which would correspond to modern realities and with a new modernization resource.
            And the MIG-35, in fact, is the same 29, only with muscular muscles and avionics, but it will not be a generation 5 LFI. By the way, the 35-th by mass does not even fall into the category of light fighters.
      2. NEXUS
        NEXUS 1 October 2015 01: 46
        +1
        Quote: marlin1203
        Did you count the money? An expensive pleasure is such a development. Maybe it’s more practical to focus on.

        And then let's start stupidly riveting the MIG-21. There is no need to bother cheaply and do not care that in the courtyard the 21 century and the adversary create new fighters. But it’s practical and cheap.
        You don’t say anything stupid. Technology has always been an expensive pleasure. And if we don’t develop new generation fighters now, we’ll leave it behind. In addition, 70% of the trade in all fighter aircraft is accounted for by LFI, and not by helicopters, heavy fighters and so on ... And this is a matter of earning the state, and it’s not cheap at all. hi
      3. iouris
        iouris 1 October 2015 13: 08
        0
        And when will the war begin, in which such a plane is needed?
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 1 October 2015 13: 40
          +1
          Quote: iouris
          And when will the war begin, in which such a plane is needed?

          For this, a new weapon is being created so that there is no war, so that the adversary thinks three times whether he needs it ...
    5. evfrat
      evfrat 30 September 2015 16: 13
      +3
      And what is "PAK technology", please?
    6. War and Peace
      War and Peace 30 September 2015 16: 27
      0
      first you need to decide on the engines, is the engine more difficult to make than a glider, radar? invisibility? weapons? In short, start and finish ...
    7. Lt. Air Force stock
      Lt. Air Force stock 30 September 2015 19: 05
      +1
      Quote: MIKHAN
      Lightweight and manoeuvrable we need ... with PAK technology

      The 5th generation light fighter is almost impossible to create.
      Firstly, one of the requirements for a 5th generation aircraft is the placement of missile and bomb weapons in the internal compartments, and how much will fit in a light fighter rocket? Two? And it will cost as PakFa, and it will be developed for 10 years.
      Secondly, well-known fuel tanks are contraindicated during a sortie of a 5th generation aircraft, which means that there should be roomy internal fuel tanks, but then again enough roomy fuel tanks will not fit in a light fighter so that the radius is 900-1000 kilometers. Refueling in the air also deprives the stealth plane of its invisibility, as the refueling tanker will be seen for 400-600 kilometers.
      In the end, what's the point of building a light fighter? There is not a single 5th generation light fighter in the world.
      1. Awaz
        Awaz 1 October 2015 09: 10
        0
        Well, here you generally need to understand the essence of the fifth generation. If so, then this aircraft should not use the radar (any radiation will see FIG knows how far), it should also fly to the enemy’s radars at a certain angle (to reduce visibility) and so on and so forth ... Although I generally agree with the theme that the USA did not get 5th generation airplanes and knows when it will work out, and we also have this tyagomotin for a long time. If the MIG has extra money, let them build it. I don’t understand the 5th generation concept at all. When changing generations, a qualitative leap should occur in all respects. At the moment, everything is so slippery and the characteristics come only from the words of the manufacturers, which begs a bunch of questions. All characteristics come from ideal conditions, but in reality with a serious adversary aircraft will have a bunch of problems about which the manufacturers even if they imagine but are quietly silent.
  2. edeligor
    edeligor 30 September 2015 15: 19
    0
    Is it 1.44 easy? Choi is misunderstood again. But what about the KLA? It looks like a fake.
    1. Penetrator
      Penetrator 30 September 2015 15: 23
      +1
      Fake is not fake, journalists could confuse something. But there is no doubt that a light front-line fighter is necessary. Again, competition is only good for the cause. And then the firm "Sukhoi" specifically "Mig" crushed.
      1. aleks 62 next
        aleks 62 next 30 September 2015 15: 55
        +1
        .... And then the firm "Sukhoi" specifically "Mig" crushed ....

        ... Nobody crushed anyone .... Everything must be done in time, and not with a delay of "six" years ... And there will be happiness ...
    2. dyksi
      dyksi 30 September 2015 15: 27
      +4
      This means that they will take the "Duck" scheme from 1.44 as a basis, while the machine itself will be approximately the size of a MiG-29, and accordingly lighter. This will probably be our first fighter with such a scheme, we will wait.
      1. 0255
        0255 30 September 2015 15: 36
        10
        Quote: dyksi
        This means that they will take the "Duck" scheme from 1.44 as a basis, while the machine itself will be approximately the size of a MiG-29, and accordingly lighter. This will probably be our first fighter with such a scheme, we will wait.

        The revival of the LFI developed with the IFIs?




        1. Ruslan
          Ruslan 30 September 2015 15: 43
          +3
          how do you insert a lot of pictures at once? for me they are interchanged for some reason.
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 30 September 2015 15: 53
            +5
            Quote: ruslan
            how do you insert a lot of pictures at once?

            First you insert one and publish it, then add it through "fix".
            By the way, there is an article on VO on the topic MIG-1.44 - http://topwar.ru/37855-smi-edinstvennyy-obrazec-sekretnogo-mig-144-zakonservirov
            an.html
            1. 0255
              0255 30 September 2015 16: 01
              +4
              Quote: Ingvar 72
              Quote: ruslan
              how do you insert a lot of pictures at once?

              First you insert one and publish it, then add it through "fix".

              Only 1 picture can be downloaded from a computer.
              Several images can be inserted from other sites by inserting a link to the image in the corresponding tag, for example:
        2. Black Colonel
          Black Colonel 30 September 2015 16: 01
          0
          I am not special, but it is not clear to me why a single-engine aircraft has two air intakes. The MiG-23 is clear, there they are on the side of the nose fairing, but here ... Is this the artist’s fantasy or a real need? winked
          1. 0255
            0255 30 September 2015 16: 07
            0
            Quote: Black Colonel
            I am not special, but it is not clear to me why a single-engine aircraft has two air intakes. The MiG-23 is clear, there they are on the side of the nose fairing, but here ... Is this the artist’s fantasy or a real need? winked

            It is necessary to ask the designers of the Design Bureau Mikoyan-Gurevich, or the artist Joseph Gatyal, who painted pictures from the LFI. LFI was really designed, it had to be unified with a heavy IFI. LFI was canceled back in the late 1980s, and MFI was bent in the 1990s.
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. gjv
              gjv 30 September 2015 16: 33
              +3
              Quote: 0255
              LFI was really designed, it had to be unified with a heavy IFI. LFI was canceled back in the late 1980s, and MFI was bent in the 1990s.

              The only flight copy of the IFI is in the LII them. M. M. Gromova in Zhukovsky, abandoned in the open.

              And under the LFI program, the Yak-201 with vertical takeoff and landing was also designed. However, the project was not implemented in hardware. In 1996-1997, the aircraft was offered to the customer, but the project remained unclaimed, primarily for financial reasons, as well as due to the lack of certainty of the Ministry of Defense on the LFI program.
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. gjv
            gjv 30 September 2015 16: 15
            +1
            Quote: Black Colonel
            it’s not clear why a single-engine aircraft has two air intakes

            The air intake here is one. A wedge-shaped shield is located in the center, covering the view of the turbocompressor blades to reduce the EPR. Perhaps the flaps of this shield are movable to adjust the air intake and protect the engine on the runway.
      2. aleks 62 next
        aleks 62 next 30 September 2015 15: 56
        +1
        ... will use the "Duck" scheme as a basis ...

        ... The "duck" has serious aerodynamic shortcomings ... Dead-end way ...
        1. Black Colonel
          Black Colonel 30 September 2015 16: 03
          +3
          Nevertheless, according to this scheme and "Grippens" with "Wiggens", "Eurofighter", "Mirages", "Lavi". I don't think this is a dead-end path.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. gjv
          gjv 30 September 2015 17: 20
          +1
          Quote: aleks 62 next
          The "duck" has serious aerodynamic shortcomings ... Dead-end way ...

          Quote: Black Colonel
          Nevertheless, according to this scheme and "Grippens" with "Wiggens", "Eurofighter", "Mirages", "Lavi".

          "Eurofighter", "Mirages" - tailless with PGO, in which the front empennage is used not for pitch control, but for improving takeoff and landing characteristics or balancing at supersonic speeds.
          MiG 1.44 - Biplane-tandem - "duck" with a closely spaced front wing - a scheme in which the main wing is located in the bevel area of ​​the stream from the front horizontal tail (PGO). According to this scheme, the Saab JAS 39 Gripen is balanced.
          1. Non-jumping
            Non-jumping 30 September 2015 23: 05
            +1
            Quote: gjv
            Quote: aleks 62 next
            The "duck" has serious aerodynamic shortcomings ... Dead-end way ...

            Quote: Black Colonel
            Nevertheless, according to this scheme and "Grippens" with "Wiggens", "Eurofighter", "Mirages", "Lavi".

            "Eurofighter", "Mirages" - tailless with PGO, in which the front empennage is used not for pitch control, but for improving takeoff and landing characteristics or balancing at supersonic speeds.
            MiG 1.44 - Biplane-tandem - "duck" with a closely spaced front wing - a scheme in which the main wing is located in the bevel area of ​​the stream from the front horizontal tail (PGO). According to this scheme, the Saab JAS 39 Gripen is balanced.

            Examples of tailless with front horizontal tail are the Israeli Kfir - the old Mirage III modernized by their IAI corporation and the Swedish Viggen - they have uncontrollable PGO. And for Eurofighter it is rotary and is used for pitch control - hence it is a "canard". Like the French Rafale and the Chinese J-10.
        4. Vadim237
          Vadim237 30 September 2015 19: 35
          +1
          Do not tell me which ones?
        5. Non-jumping
          Non-jumping 30 September 2015 23: 12
          +2
          Quote: aleks 62 next
          ... will use the "Duck" scheme as a basis ...

          ... The "duck" has serious aerodynamic shortcomings ... Dead-end way ...

          Poghosyan liked to talk about this when he criticized the MiG 1.44. In fact, firstly, these shortcomings are eliminated by a modern digital remote control system under the control of a computer, and secondly, 1.44 was not in its pure form a "canard" - it still had control planes located in the tail area - something like elevators.
          1. aleks 62 next
            aleks 62 next 1 October 2015 10: 11
            +1
            Poghosyan liked to talk about this when he criticized MiG 1.44.

            .... He knew what he was saying .... And he spoke from the standpoint of the laws of aerodynamics .... Read at your leisure (only credible sources - not Wikipedia) at least a textbook on general aerodynamics for 2-3 year students of an aviation university. ... Any scheme has both pros and cons .... The reality is that the "duck" has serious drawbacks, however, as well as the flying wing (at least corkscrew characteristics, for example) .... And these drawbacks are no electronics you can't fully compensate ...
            1. Non-jumping
              Non-jumping 2 October 2015 01: 19
              +1
              In this case, you must agree that it also has serious advantages in super-maneuverability - it was not for nothing that TsAGI once recommended the "duck" for the Soviet fifth generation. And in Western Europe they went the same way, creating very good cars, especially Rafale. I have already written that the MiG 1.44 is not a "duck" in its pure form. By the way, the dry C 37 project with a forward swept wing (renamed to the public later in the Su-47) did not have a stabilizer in its original version and was also a "canard". I remember how the Russian media praised him and said that this was the first time this was done and that he was successfully passing tests. However, all this turned out to be a lie and it was he who turned out to be a dead end project. But he looked impressive, which Poghosyan took advantage of. He should work as a magician somewhere in the USA. I also got the impression that you yourself are related to his company. wink
    3. vladimir_krm
      vladimir_krm 30 September 2015 17: 59
      +2
      Yeah, 1.44 will be heavier than PAK FA. But this is a mistake for journalists, not a fake.
  3. MolGro
    MolGro 30 September 2015 15: 21
    +2
    So there was news about the moment))
    I wonder how are you doing on the project mig41?
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. ZU-23
      ZU-23 30 September 2015 15: 25
      +4
      I agree, I also always expected a healthy competition between these offices.
      1. MolGro
        MolGro 30 September 2015 15: 34
        +1
        There have been rumors about this for a long time, but have not officially announced)
        Indirect data only)
        In an instant, 41 decisions were also made a long time ago, but we are not waiting for information yet.
    3. dyksi
      dyksi 30 September 2015 15: 32
      0
      If you are talking about a promising interceptor (replacing the MiG-31), then work is underway on it (R&D), it’s kind of said that now they are negotiating a price with the Ministry of Defense, at least there was such information.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. gjv
        gjv 30 September 2015 17: 12
        +1
        “Such modernization was supposed to take place 20 years ago. However, this did not happen then, so now the requirements are increasing. They include, inter alia (increasing) the speed of the interceptor to Mach 4–4,3, ”Kvochur said, RIA Novosti reports.
        So he commented on the report of State Duma Deputy Alexander Tarnaev that a new MiG-41 fighter is being developed in Russia based on the heavy MiG-31 interceptor fighter, whose speed was Mach 2,8.
        For comparison: the US Air Force strategic supersonic reconnaissance Lockheed SR-71 speeds up to Mach 3,2.
        At a meeting of aerospace defense experts, Tarnaev announced that the Chief of the General Staff had signed a decree on the deep modernization of the Soviet interceptors MiG-31.
        Business newspaper Sight, February 28, 2014
  4. Haettenschweiler
    Haettenschweiler 30 September 2015 15: 22
    0
    - It's good that MiG decided to compete. Because with the Sukhoi Superjet, for example, everything turned out very badly. It is not a fact that the Sukhoi will not "fill up" the T-50 either.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Penetrator
      Penetrator 30 September 2015 15: 27
      +3
      Quote: Haettenschweiler
      It is not a fact that the Sukhoi will not "fill up" the T-50 either.

      Is not a fact. Already for a year the deadlines for transferring the machine to the troops were postponed. And this, in the current situation, is not good ...
      1. Haettenschweiler
        Haettenschweiler 30 September 2015 15: 30
        +3
        Quote: Penetrator
        Is not a fact. Already for a year the deadlines for transferring the machine to the troops were postponed. And this, in the current situation, is not good ...


        - Well, that's right, the MiG got down to business. Even if he does not build a full-fledged multifunctional machine, he will create the necessary competition, fray the nerves of those who like to "saw" in the Sukhoi Design Bureau. And then, you look, he will remember his best days and give out on-the-mountain something the same as the MiG-9 was for its time.
        1. Black Colonel
          Black Colonel 30 September 2015 16: 05
          0
          If only the design engineers still remained in the design bureau.
  5. ZU-23
    ZU-23 30 September 2015 15: 23
    +2
    Will be shorter matryoshka T-50
  6. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 30 September 2015 15: 24
    +1
    Migi and Su in different "weight classes". But it will not hurt - to bring down the pelvis like fu-35.
  7. Serafim-k
    Serafim-k 30 September 2015 15: 24
    +2
    This is good news, since we do not know how to make good passenger cars, why not make good fighters ... but there is a buyer .. !! soldier
  8. dchegrinec
    dchegrinec 30 September 2015 15: 25
    +2
    Then it can immediately switch to an unmanned version of a light aircraft of the 5th generation ..
  9. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 30 September 2015 15: 27
    +2
    Quote: Haettenschweiler
    - It's good that MiG decided to compete. Because with the Sukhoi Superjet, for example, everything turned out very badly. It is not a fact that the Sukhoi will not "fill up" the T-50 either.


    Will not overwhelm. Polishing "fifty kopecks" ends already.
    1. Haettenschweiler
      Haettenschweiler 30 September 2015 15: 32
      +1
      Quote: iliitch
      Will not overwhelm. Polishing "fifty kopecks" ends already.


      The T-50 fighter will arrive at the Air Force as scheduled - in 2016

      Read more at RBC:
      http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54c351fd9a7947ca9a5a7674

      The state order for the Advanced Aviation Complex of Frontal Aviation (PAK FA) is planned to be drastically reduced, which may adversely affect a similar Russian-Indian project

      http://expert.ru/2015/03/26/sekvestr-pyatogo-pokoleniya/

      Bondarev: the Ministry of Defense will start receiving PAK FA at 2017 g

      http://topwar.ru/83268-bondarev-minoborony-nachnet-poluchat-pak-fa-v-2017-g.html


      - So, you say, "polishing" ends? Oh well.
      1. iliitchitch
        iliitchitch 30 September 2015 15: 48
        +4
        I’m writing about "fine-tuning", and not about the lack of money for equipment.
        1. Haettenschweiler
          Haettenschweiler 30 September 2015 15: 52
          +1
          - It is not only and not so much the lack of money. Dates are shifting. So far - until the seventeenth year. But no one can guarantee that in the sixteenth they are again moved for a year, or even two.
  10. Maksus
    Maksus 30 September 2015 15: 29
    0
    MIG - well done, of course, but the budget of the Russian Federation is not rubber. Development money - GIVE; prototype construction - GIVE, and where to put them later? If for export only ... But with the money of the customer.
    1. Engineer
      Engineer 30 September 2015 15: 36
      +5
      Doesn’t it bother you that we do not have a replacement for the Mig-29 so far? And the Mig-29 was a massive Su-27, which should replace the T-50. In addition, against the backdrop of the not-so-successful F-35, there will be a great need for a new front-line fighter in the international market, and we have not even begun work in this direction.
      1. dauria
        dauria 30 September 2015 16: 34
        +1
        You do not mind that we do not have a replacement for the Mig-29 so far


        She is not needed. Mig -29 from the very beginning a failed project.
        It is small for the requirements of armaments even of the 80s and is expensive because of the 2-motor scheme for export. The price of the general mistake .. Therefore, the Su-27 came forward.
        As for the F-35 - do not forget, this is a "three-in-one" car originally. For the Air Force, Navy (aircraft carriers) and VTOL Marine Corps. They are forced to deteriorate their performance characteristics, but they saved a lot on development and further operation.
        For us under attack (front-line bomber) it is easier to remake the T-50 by analogy with the Su-27 in the Su-34.
        And forget about "healthy competition". Development prices are not the same now. Even the Americans have "competition" for projects, not flight specimens.
      2. Maksus
        Maksus 30 September 2015 16: 34
        +2
        It doesn’t bother you, because why do we need MIG-29 / 35? In terms of the fighter - no range, for work on the ground - is also not suitable, and the attack aircraft will not come out of it. Plus a fragile glider. A modern aircraft should have a long range, because all suitable stripes (and jet vehicles from the ground somehow do not take off very well) will be the first target of operational-tactical missiles. But with the range of the MIGs just problems.
    2. 0255
      0255 30 September 2015 15: 42
      +3
      Quote: Maksus
      MIG - well done, of course, but the budget of the Russian Federation is not rubber. Development money - GIVE; prototype construction - GIVE,

      Should a light 5th generation MiG be developed and built for free? Or do you want to finally finish off RSK MiG without funding?
      Quote: Maksus
      and where to put them later? If for export only ... But with the money of the customer.

      Already 100500 times they wrote on the site why you need a light fighter
      1. aleks 62 next
        aleks 62 next 30 September 2015 16: 06
        -1
        ... Or you want to finally finish off the RSK MiG ...

        .... Maybe his time has already passed .... Since the time of the design bureau of Myasishchev, Polikarpov and others has passed ???? ... Yak could find his niche in the nomenclature of technology .... And Migu does not chase and break there , where, in general, it is already "occupied", but will focus, for example, on shock drones and be the first and best there ...
    3. Corsair0304
      Corsair0304 30 September 2015 15: 49
      +4
      It is clear that the development, testing, running-in will require a lot of money.
      But the fact that the army now needs a deeply modernized, and in the long term - a new light front-line fighter, also just can not be ignored.
      Perhaps today's article is a groundwork for the future. Despite the fact that 1.44 was created a long time ago, many of its design solutions are still looked at with envy from behind the hillock. Yes, and I dare to suggest that it was precisely because of the attempts of "sworn partners" that this project was closed, because the T-50 was still on paper and may have been run in a wind tunnel somewhere, and 1.44 was lifted into the air. Even as a flying laboratory, but FLYING! And there, and the series is not so far.

      So MiG is a green light! And- Yes: Su and MiG are not competitors, they are mutually complementary machines with different tasks and tactics. I will cite an excerpt from the VO article http://topwar.ru/64207-v-teni-bolshogo-brata-o-protivostoyanii-mig-29-i-su-27.ht
      ml:
      "Mikoyan Design Bureau representatives did not doubt that the MiG-29 was the best in its class, moreover, they were sure that in many respects it even surpasses the heavy Su-27. To decide which aircraft has the advantages - MiG-29 or Sy-27, It could be very simple: in a training air battle. In addition, such a battle would make it possible to simulate the actions of your mixed aircraft fleet against a conventional enemy. To develop tactics of action both against a single heavy fighter and against the F-15 - F-16 "bundle" and many military and civilian institutes TsNII-30, GNIKI, LII, TsAGI, NIAS supported this idea. The only opponent was Mikhail Petrovich Simonov. Lipetsk Sylambek Askanov. And the battles were carried out. More than a hundred battles showed that 80 percent of the advantage was on the side of the MiG-29. Moreover, the MiG won both close and medium and even long-range maneuvering battles, which were obviously considered the "skate" of the Sy-27. As suggested by the Mikoyanites, it was not the power of its locator that came to the fore, but the size of our "twenty-ninth". This result became deafening for many, and they preferred not to advertise it .... "
      1. lazy
        lazy 30 September 2015 15: 58
        +4
        and in Africa, su lost its momentum in a real battle, Algeria returned the Migi of Russia while actively purchasing other military equipment, Malaysia, having started to exploit the Migra, then bought the Miguel. It must be admitted that the Migi lost not only in the domestic but also in the foreign market. But I sincerely wish Migu success in the development of a new light fighter of the 21st century and I wish that he would become no less legendary than the Mig-21
        1. Corsair0304
          Corsair0304 30 September 2015 16: 09
          +3
          One battle in Africa is far from an indicator of the superiority of one vehicle over another. Exactly the same circumstance for the return of previously purchased MiGs by Algeria and Malaysia: one good marketing move and proposals from competitors, as a result: "This is only business, nothing personal."
          Yes, it’s not a matter of which car is better, they were originally intended for different purposes, albeit overlapping in something.
          Here's more: "The second mistake of Rostislav Apollosovich Belyakov in those years was that he did not want to embody the next modification in metal - the MiG-29MZ. It was a MiG-29-sized machine, but at the same time capable of performing tasks with a radius of action greater than that of the Sy-27 with a range of about 4000 km, equipped with an air refueling. In addition, it was a full-fledged multifunctional fighter capable of "working on the ground" in difficult meteorological conditions day and night. The MiG-29MZ represented a modernization of the MiG-29M - a welded structure made of an aluminum-lithium alloy was 10 percent larger in area than that of the MiG-29, plus a front-controlled horizontal operation was added. work on ground point targets. "
      2. Corsair0304
        Corsair0304 30 September 2015 15: 58
        0
        The interaction of different types of machines.
      3. aleks 62 next
        aleks 62 next 30 September 2015 16: 10
        0
        ... Moreover, the MiG won both close and medium, and even long-range maneuvering battles, which were obviously considered the "skate" of the Sy-27 ...

        ... As for medium and long-distance details, please ..... How interesting is it - what is the difference for the rocket in the geometric dimensions of the aircraft ???? .... Especially at these distances ...
    4. aleks 62 next
      aleks 62 next 30 September 2015 15: 58
      0
      ... If only for export ... But with the money of the customer ....

      ... clever idea ...
  11. Zaurbek
    Zaurbek 30 September 2015 15: 40
    +2
    What engines do you want to deliver interestingly?
    1. dyksi
      dyksi 30 September 2015 16: 08
      0
      There was information that Klimovtsy were ready to issue the engines of the first stage for the LFI, (for a twin-engine aircraft). During MAKSA, Sergey Korotkov reported to the president about the development of the MiG Design Bureau and the president approved all of the RSK MiG's undertakings, therefore, to see things went off the ground.
  12. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 30 September 2015 15: 42
    +1
    Quote: dchegrinec
    Then it can immediately switch to an unmanned version of a light aircraft of the 5th generation ..


    But when will we crawl again?
  13. gladysheff2010
    gladysheff2010 30 September 2015 15: 44
    +1
    Quote: Engineer
    "RSK MIG on the basis of the Yak-130 is developing a light fighter" - nothing confuses?

    Read more carefully: "The MiG Corporation, based on the MiG-1.44 prototype, is developing another promising 5th generation fighter." An engineer cannot face such mistakes! Healthy competition only benefits. Our Air Force would be very useful for a light front-line fighter with reduced visibility , especially since this is the path on which hard-won and unexpected discoveries can take place.
  14. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 30 September 2015 15: 46
    +3
    In theory, there should be a heavy two-seater fighter with two XXX engines, with powerful electronics, with a large range and number of strike weapons and high performance for long-range air battles - for a "serious" war. Plus, a single-seat light fighter with one XXX engine is needed. With more modest equipment, strike weapons and highly effective missiles for air combat at medium and close ranges, for conflicts with low effectiveness or limited targets.
    1. lazy
      lazy 30 September 2015 16: 01
      +1
      I would add a shortened takeoff and landing and less demanding on the runway. note the Su-27 has never been used on the freeway landing exercise. MiG-29, Su-25 but not Su-27
    2. Vadya718
      Vadya718 30 September 2015 17: 13
      -1
      Ideally, everything is correct, if only the allocated budget funds are enough without shredding money intended for other types of weapons ... Or they will look for "alternative" ways in the form of freezing pension deposits ...
      1. chunga-changa
        chunga-changa 30 September 2015 17: 33
        0
        Pension contributions are shredded for completely different purposes, and others get out there, about fifty times more expensive than developing an airplane.) There is already a heavy T-50, officially costing 2 billion. The development of a new MIG should cost less, much has already been worked out, and the plane is supposed to be simpler and cheaper. But even if it’s also 2 billion, it’s a drop in the ocean; a bridge to the Crimea will be five times more expensive.
  15. 501Legion
    501Legion 30 September 2015 15: 50
    +1
    To be honest, it's high time!
    1. padded jacket
      padded jacket 30 September 2015 15: 58
      +2
      Most likely they will do it for export to other countries, for example, information flashed on one of the forums that Russia is helping to develop a new fighter for Iran as far as the truth I can not judge.
      1. 0255
        0255 30 September 2015 16: 10
        +1
        Quote: quilted jacket
        Most likely they will do it for export to other countries, for example, information flashed on one of the forums that Russia is helping to develop a new fighter for Iran as far as the truth I can not judge.

        The size is more like a training aircraft than a fighter.
        1. padded jacket
          padded jacket 30 September 2015 16: 13
          +3
          Yeah, most likely. Here is a photo of the prototype:

          Something very light and very similar to the Yak-130.
  16. Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov 30 September 2015 16: 04
    +5
    This one would be shown in all its glory ...! Work with him and work ...! But the bastard will be cunning if everything is with him .... hi
  17. Maks7877
    Maks7877 30 September 2015 16: 13
    +1
    It is high time to develop a competitor F-35, more massive, but traditionally with 2 engines.
    And then the T-50 is too big for the deck.
    1. Izotovp
      Izotovp 30 September 2015 16: 47
      0
      For the deck, it is more profitable to have a heavy aircraft in terms of impact characteristics and light in operational)))
      And the length of the deck is decided by a good thrust-weight ratio.
      1. mav1971
        mav1971 30 September 2015 18: 33
        0
        The length of the deck is the subject of the development of electromagnetic catapults. In the case of Russia - although it’s necessary to steal from World War II steam from Merikos. Plus, the full course of the carrier itself should not be forgotten.


        The thrust-weight ratio is too good, but the loss of 500 kilometers of combat radius due to terrible gluttony in take-off mode is too behind :(
    2. saturn.mmm
      saturn.mmm 30 September 2015 20: 41
      0
      Quote: Maks7877
      And then the T-50 is too big for the deck.

      It depends on what size the deck is.
  18. Engineer
    Engineer 30 September 2015 16: 23
    +3
    Quote: Haettenschweiler
    - It's good that MiG decided to compete. Because with the Sukhoi Superjet, for example, everything turned out very badly. It is not a fact that the Sukhoi will not "fill up" the T-50 either.


    The fact is that the T-50 and the Super-Puperjet were different people. For work on Puper, an office was organized - GSS (civil aircraft dry). So, even students, 3d max designers worked there, they even had the head of one department, sorry - a department, there was an advertiser who was engaged in frame structures made of pipes. This whole gang was slightly diluted by specialists of the profile plan and a bunch of contracts from other organizations, in particular, the Tupolev Design Bureau. Since all this pack could not have given birth to even this, the project was initially sketched by experts on military topics, i.e. working on KB fighters. This is where the biggest problem of the aircraft came from - the technology of manufacturing and processing parts and components of a civilian aircraft according to the standards of a combat fighter. Therefore, Duper crackled at TsAGI at 70% of the load. Typically, a prototype aircraft can withstand more than 100% of the load, which indicates a greater safety margin of the aircraft, laid down in the calculations, therefore it is possible to lighten some of the parts, which will have a positive effect on the weight of the aircraft. The all-milled Su-27 caisson is good, but the Puper's all-milled frame is bad. But until the statistical tests were passed, the "specialists" of the SCAC did not know this, and they could not, they had another task - to shove imported equipment on the plane. I had to modify the design, but how they did it is not difficult to understand - the vigorous French bolts did not fail laughing
    1. Rus86
      Rus86 1 October 2015 07: 25
      0
      CCJ is quite a comfortable plane, got on it one day. that everyone is blaming him.? not fully assembled in Russia?
  19. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 30 September 2015 16: 49
    0
    Quote: Haettenschweiler
    - It is not only and not so much the lack of money. Dates are shifting. So far - until the seventeenth year. But no one can guarantee that in the sixteenth they are again moved for a year, or even two.


    I agree, there are many problems, but the fact that the terms will be moved is unlikely. A "raw" plane will not be allowed into the sky, but fifty dollars will fly, it will fly. The constructors will strain. As far as I know, there was a serious problem with the engines, and there were some troubles with weapons too ... But when this handsome man joins the troops, we'll be glad! ... Well, it's like a child in a young family - until the whole bouquet of sores hooks ...
    1. mav1971
      mav1971 30 September 2015 18: 40
      +1
      Being an optimist, but seeing our engine-building enterprises wang about the fact that the engines for the 5 generation will be brought to the required characteristics not earlier than the 2020-2022 years.
  20. fa2998
    fa2998 30 September 2015 18: 05
    0
    Quote: Black Colonel
    Nevertheless, according to this scheme and "Grippens" with "Wiggens", "Eurofighter", "Mirages", "Lavi". I don't think this is a dead-end path.

    Well, not all "duck" here - some made do with a delta wing, some used small horizontal aerodynamic surfaces (by the way, on the Su-33, we do not call it a "duck"). And then there are aircraft of the 3rd and 4th generations, and the MiG 1.44 It was designed as a 4th generation fighter. IT IS NOT POSSIBLE TO BUILD A 5 GENERATION AIRCRAFT ON A BASE 4, which is 30 years old at lunchtime. We need to start AGAIN !!! Well, first, let's deal with the "heavy" fighter of the 5th generation - PAK FA. ... hi
  21. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 30 September 2015 19: 43
    0
    Quote: mav1971
    Being an optimist, but seeing our engine-building enterprises wang about the fact that the engines for the 5 generation will be brought to the required characteristics not earlier than the 2020-2022 years.


    One can only guess what is happening in engine building. This is a weak place with us. It has always been.
  22. tinibar
    tinibar 30 September 2015 20: 00
    0
    Quote: MIKHAN
    Lightweight and manoeuvrable we need ... with PAK technology

    And moderate in price ...
  23. Tjeck
    Tjeck 30 September 2015 23: 16
    +1
    It's time, the MiG Design Bureau deserves more attention. although I consider the 27x-series of dryers the most elegant and successful fighter in the last ~ 40 years, but the Mikoyanites have always been at the forefront: for a moment, 25/31 is worth it, and the 29th is a good horse.
  24. Leeder
    Leeder 1 October 2015 14: 41
    0
    Quote: MIKHAN
    Quote: ruslan
    these what le? interesting option

    Maybe this one? Why reinvent the wheel ....?

    Yak -130, this is a maximum light attack aircraft.
    A light fighter of the same MiG-35 would not hurt us, it’s very good, to finalize avionics, engines, and stealth will not hurt ...