Military Review

West is ready to go to the division of Ukraine

100
West is ready to go to the division of UkraineNow he needs to convince the Kiev "power" to agree to a "civilized divorce" with the South-East


Back in April, looking through the Ukrainian press, I drew attention to an interesting article by political scientist Yuriy Romanenko “Ukraine and non-Ukraine: where is the border?”.

It is interesting because it voiced a very seditious, especially for the country of the victorious “Maidan”, the idea: no need to drag “ballast” into a bright future. “Ballast”, according to the author, is the South-East, which not only does not share the values ​​of “Maidan”, but does not consider itself to be a part of Ukraine either politically or humanitarianly. Well, or at least the Donbass, in which even then there was restlessness and a premonition of civil war soared in the air.

Despite the seriousness of the situation, official Kiev continues to strangle a protest, not even wanting to hear about the idea of ​​federalization, which, according to most sane analysts, is the only way to preserve the unity of the country. Rather, it was. After hundreds of corpses in Odessa, Slavyansk, Mariupol, there is no longer any talk of federalization, and the past referendum showed this clearly.

The Kiev junta does literally everything to create a wall of hatred between the East and the West of the country. Hiding behind the talk about the need to preserve the unity of the country, it step by step aggravates the split and brings closer the legal consolidation of the collapse of the Ukrainian statehood.

Naturally, against this background, any talk about the fact that the “separatist regions” is the same notorious case without a handle is declared by the enemy propaganda. Thus, the Georgian politician, who declared the need to recognize Abkhazia and South Ossetia, or an Azerbaijani who allowed even the hypothetical possibility of abandoning Nagorno-Karabakh, runs the risk of becoming not only marginal, but a political corpse.

On the contrary, in the same Moldova among the supporters of European integration, the idea of ​​abandoning Transdniestria as a real obstacle to Europe is becoming increasingly popular. It took them 20 years to realize that Transnistria is the anchor that binds them to Russia.

In Ukraine, where events have recently been developing more than swiftly, this has begun to reach faster for some. Federalization has ceased to be a topic of marginal political discourse. If a month ago, only Tsarev, who, by the way, was wanted to bring to justice, spoke seriously about her, now they are talking about her at the highest level. True, somehow blurry, slurred. It is as if they do not notice again that the time to settle for federalization is hopelessly missed, and even Tsarev has long since changed the rhetoric to a more radical one.

Kiev missed the opportunity to offer a federal treaty to the South-East on its own terms. Now the only one who can bring representatives of the warring parties to the negotiating table is Putin, and the conditions for such federalization will no longer be dictated by Kiev. And then if the representatives of the DPR and the LPR agree, and they have already demonstrated to the whole world that they do not depend on the Kremlin in making decisions about their future.

So Yatsenyuk, Turchinov and Co. can stutter as many times as they are willing to make concessions. Against the background of ongoing punitive operations, it looks just mocking. Moreover, everyone understands that this is an empty talking room: those who brought them to power are not ready to make concessions, they want and will fight for the “one and indivisible” to the end.

Nevertheless, a clear understanding comes to Kiev very late that a national project that was born on the Maidan can be preserved only in one way - to get rid of regions that do not share its values. Otherwise - the war, which is still unknown what will end and whether it will end in the coming years.

Understanding that any national project can be built only on the basis of public consensus, and not suppressing those who disagree, which are too many to be easily suppressed, and which, together, can bury this project. Understanding that building anything from incompatible materials is not only useless, but also dangerous.

And on May 11 I read in “Ukrainska Pravda” a material called “Ukraine and its Vendee: what’s next?”. The author of the article admits that the attack on the Donbass was confronted with fierce resistance from local residents, who, although "stupefied by Russian propaganda," but still local residents, armed and ready to kill Ukrainian security forces.

According to him, “the Ukrainian anti-terrorist operation could only stop the spread of gangrene, but in no case could it destroy its source.” According to his idea, Ukraine should abandon the useless shedding of blood for the Donbass, leaving it and creating unbearable conditions for it to exist. This implies both “revenge for treason” to oligarchs, the seizure of all their assets outside the region, their inclusion in all sorts of “black lists”, and sanctions against ordinary citizens, like in Crimea: the impossibility of going abroad and the like. The advantages of the department, for example, are that Ukraine will no longer be “forced to pay pensions to peaceful grandmothers, because of whose back they will kill the siloviki”.

Further, the author proposes “to evacuate from Donbass everyone for whom life in the DPR and LNV is initially impossible, and, stating the actual seizure of this part of the de jure sovereign Ukrainian territory by pro-Russian criminals, isolate themselves from the gray criminal zone with something ideally similar to a wall on the border Israel and Palestine. "

Here you have another one that reaches intelligent thought. Only having arrived a little later, when so much firewood has already been broken, that we will have to forget about Odessa and Kharkov, which the author calls to protect from the spread of "gangrene of separatism". "Gangrene" has reached a size incompatible with the life of the state. So where does all this late epiphany come from?

Another 8 of May in Financial Times published an article “It is better to divide Ukraine than to tear it apart” (“It would be better to split it apart”), in which Eugene Rumer, director of the Russian-Eurasian program of the Carnegie Foundation, states: The scenario of dividing a country is an extreme option, but it is better than a civil war that has already become a reality.

The Carnegie Foundation, if someone does not know, is one of the world's leading expert-analytical centers. Apparently, the West is beginning to understand that in its desire to tear off all of Ukraine from Russia, it can lose, and that it is better to save at least a part of Ukraine, giving up the rest of Russia than losing everything.

Another issue is that in the United States there is no consensus on this. Some continue to focus on creating a situation of constant chaos in Ukraine and drawing Russia into an armed confrontation. And others, apparently, began to realize that these efforts could have the opposite effect: Russia can stop the war, forcing Kiev, Donetsk and Lugansk to sign a federal treaty on its own terms. And then the whole geopolitical game of the West is lost: it will be possible to forget about the possibility of deploying NATO military bases on the territory of Ukraine. And the association with the EU will have to be forgotten, as well as, incidentally, the movement of the East towards the CU: for Moscow, which has long accepted the fact that Ukraine will not be in the CU, its non-neutrality and neutrality guaranteed by the creation of a federation of equal rights will win. subjects of the West and the Center from the South-East.

Therefore, the idea of ​​divorce by mutual consent will now be actively thrown into the minds of Ukrainian elites. The West does not like to lose, and does not know how. And the danger of his defeat in the largest geopolitical confrontation since the end of the Cold War is now very great.

And, of course, such a civilized divorce is the best solution for Kiev. They now need to stay in power, but the war does not contribute much to this. Putting on the map all the “conquests of Maidan” to preserve the unity of the country, which will no longer exist (and many understand this), is a risky and adventurous step, but in the spirit of Maidan. And the last word will be, apparently, for him.

Whether the junta will succeed in convincing those on whose bayonets she came to power of having to leave the Donbass in order to save the rest is a good question. Moreover, the junta is still not able to voice this thought, and it’s not a fact that it will ever be decided at all.
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http://www.km.ru/world/2014/05/15/protivostoyanie-na-ukraine-2013-14/739976-zapad-gotov-poiti-na-razdel-ukrainy
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  1. older
    older 16 May 2014 14: 28
    +16
    As echoes the current article by Markov on peacekeepers in Ukraine ... Direct continuation and deployment ... lol
    1. zanoza
      zanoza 16 May 2014 14: 52
      +12
      So many words about the need for a section, and at the end:
      ... Whether the junta succeeds in convincing those on whose bayonets it came to power that it is necessary to leave the Donbass in order to save the rest is a good question. Moreover, the junta has not yet decided to voice this idea, and not the fact that it will ever be decided at all.

      That’s the whole point.junta such an option does not consider, maybe for now, maybe before the advice of Western curators pay attention to this option.
      Now, such an option, in their opinion, is a concession to Putin, Moscow, the Muscovite * pits, which Kiev, Washington, and Brussels hate so fiercely
      But now "all the trump cards" are in the hands of the people southeast of Ukraine, only now they have the right to decide their fate.
      I hope they decide who they should be with and how they should be.
      1. alex-s
        alex-s 16 May 2014 15: 13
        +6
        Whether the junta succeeds in convincing those on whose bayonets it came to power that it is necessary to leave the Donbass in order to save the rest is a good question.


        I'm afraid now the fascists will not get off with Donbass alone!
        1. Ivan_Ivanov
          Ivan_Ivanov 16 May 2014 15: 35
          +4
          The foundation of the state.


        2. asar
          asar 16 May 2014 16: 39
          +7
          And why did the "rest" of "rural" dill surrender to the West ?! Only, perhaps, for the deployment of their bases? So the "defenders" will come and describe Lviv, Kiev, Ivano-Frankovsk! laughing And they will pick flowers from a flower bed for prostitutes! You, dill, are not interested in the West without the DPR and LPR industry! Without Crimea and Sevastopol! Only as a territory for their bases! And you, ukroptsy, will be as "outsourcing" for NATO troops - to clean up "outlets", to wash after NATO members ...! laughing
      2. Mikros
        Mikros 16 May 2014 15: 38
        +10
        Yes, the junta will not refuse the Donbass. There is no Donbass - no money - no loans - nothing to steal. That's all the interest in the Donbass. Yes, and New Russia is unlikely to abandon Kharkov, Odessa, etc.
        1. juneart
          16 May 2014 17: 25
          +3
          And also like this: You just need to stop all sorts of empty talk and paperwork. Everything is already clear, the former Ukraine has received a complete "kerdyk". This is confirmed not every day, but every hour. What kind of entry into some kind of union can we talk about? There is simply no country in Ukraine. A very big question, perhaps, is that something to blind from what is the territory of the former Ukraine is very doubtful.
          The Crimeans turned out to be the smartest part of the former Ukraine, quickly realizing what they had made the only correct decision. The South-East waited and, as a result, now pays. Of course, everything will work out, but how much more "khatyn" is needed. It will not be possible to wait or sit out, only the residents themselves The former Ukraine may decide whether to be Ukraine or this country will never again. You won't be able to unscrew something back, but only the horizon is ahead. The Western world is losing its meaning and rushing like a wounded bull, throwing away all agreements and rules of conduct.
          Already now it is clear that the West does not have the slightest chance of winning, which means losing the dominant role in the world community.
          There was only one way to re-assemble the former Ukraine, it is to wait until all that can collapse, collapse. Then there will be leaders, justice will be restored and the will of the people will be revealed. The country will be completely cleansed of the evil that is in Kiev and not only.
          The prerequisites for the development of such a scenario are already being seen. In general, again 1920 year.
        2. AVIATOR36662
          AVIATOR36662 16 May 2014 22: 08
          0
          Unfortunately, while Akhmetov refuses to pay taxes from his business (his enterprises in the Donbass) in the DPR. This is a very important issue that will have to be resolved in a hurry. And it must be resolved positively. For the DNI to be viable and defensive.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. matross
        matross 16 May 2014 16: 01
        +1
        Quote: zanoza
        the junta does not consider such an option, maybe for now, maybe before the advice of Western curators pay attention to this option.

        Before the election, the curators would not even allow such an option to be voiced, not what to implement. Otherwise, Julia will grab hold of this feed and then another maidan will happen - on the topic: oligarchs are selling the country in pieces !!! guard!!
        And the curators put on Poroshenko ...
      5. 1812 1945
        1812 1945 16 May 2014 17: 13
        +1
        Quote: zanoza
        the junta does not consider such an option,

        Of course: the junta may not consider or consider options. The junta cannot make decisions. And whoever can, who has built the UN, OSCE, PACE in the first line of offensive orders, who can blind international organizations so much that they do not see, in truth - worthy to be along with the horrors of the Second World War - the Odessa nightmare, they hardly consider it appropriate "bargaining" - "to split, or, - to tear it apart?"
      6. yushch
        yushch 16 May 2014 17: 34
        0
        I think they considered such an option, but there are only minuses from its implementation for the junta. Something like the loss of confidence in them in the western part of the country and the inability to restore confidence in them in the South-East. They put themselves in such a position, thoughtlessly following all the instructions of the pin dos that generally do not own the situation in Ukraine.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Aryan
          Aryan 16 May 2014 18: 20
          0
          yes they are sick full head
          Arguments of reason and simple mercantility to them! fool
  2. Giperboreec
    Giperboreec 16 May 2014 14: 31
    +7
    A letter from Zhirinovsky in action :))
    1. vsoltan
      vsoltan 16 May 2014 14: 44
      +13
      Quoting yourself: 29 March 2014 17: 00 | Why signing a political association with the EU does not make me optimistic

      "The clown Zhirik put forward the idea of ​​dividing Ukraine into several parts .... and he is right, from the historical and geopolitical point of view, the Dnieper is the border of completely different civilizations ..... like Cupid - with China. That's the whole story." damn mother! ""
      1. Terrible ensign
        Terrible ensign 16 May 2014 18: 04
        +1
        In-in, "Cut to hell without waiting for peritonitis! .."
  3. Dmitriy69
    Dmitriy69 16 May 2014 14: 31
    +16
    That's it! Where is the border ?!
    Odessa, Kharkov, Zaporizhia, etc. give chtoli ?!
    Not greasy will be adversaries ?!
    1. Lelek
      Lelek 16 May 2014 14: 40
      +25
      Theoretically, the border is, it seems to me. But perhaps there will be more blue.
      1. vsoltan
        vsoltan 16 May 2014 14: 55
        +8
        Here's a card - almost ten. Only the demarcation line should be much farther east - along the entire course of the Dnieper + Kiev. Carthage must be destroyed .... sorry, Ukraine must be divided according to the prevailing geopolitical principles ..... then equilibrium will come. I did not like the author's article, crumpled and vague, Zhirik previously outlined this issue more honestly and frankly; who knows, maybe it was a "trial balloon"? For what opposition is Zhirik? In fact, I believe that the issue of the division of Ukraine was resolved on March 18 at the Lavrov-Kerry meeting in Brussels. Perhaps they discussed gas wounds - mattress-makers need to sell their shale somewhere ... a piece of the market to them, justice and a headache in the form of restoring plundered southeastern Russia. This is a cruel historical necessity. Hungarians have already expressed their opinion .... next in line are Poland, Romania, Slovakia.
        1. Serg 122
          Serg 122 16 May 2014 15: 10
          +19
          Only the demarcation line should be much east - along the entire course of the Dnieper + Kiev
          So do you like it? laughing !
          1. vsoltan
            vsoltan 16 May 2014 15: 21
            +4
            I personally - well, really like fellow Plus!
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. 120352
            120352 16 May 2014 16: 18
            +8
            Of all the variants of the division, this one is the closest to justice, although what is today called Western Ukraine, starting from the 13th century, was Russian. Galicia or Galicia is called so in honor of the Russian prince Daniil Romanovich Galitsky, who came from the Monomakh family, and he received this nickname, this surname in view of the fact that for the first time at the age of 10 years in 1211 he was enthroned in the princely throne in Galich, now Kostroma region (on the Volga). However, a year later, after the death of his father, he was deprived of the throne and with loyal people went to the South-West, where he managed to unite the Volyn lands and Galicia, where at that time there were no signs of statehood and civilization. Soon after this, the Tatar-Mongol invasion of Russia took place and that part of it, which is today called Ukraine, was devastated, depopulated and began to bear the name "Wild Field". People left there to the North, where the influence of the Horde was not so tough. The Galician principality was left alone with the Horde and Daniil Galitsky was forced to ask for intercession from the Western states, and therefore, for a more positive perception by his western neighbors, he agreed to accept Catholicism and the king's crown from the Pope. Officially he was called so in the West: "Russian King". But the main thing is that he remained Russian and his lands were also Russian. The city of Lviv was named after his son Leo. Until the beginning of the 20th century, when Ukrainians were invented as an ethnic group with the aim of dividing Russia, they spoke Russian in this city. (One of the symbols of Ukrainian nationalism, TG Shevchenko did not yet know the word "Ukrainian". He considered himself a Russian, a Little Russian, like everyone else living in those parts of the world). The Ukrainian language, more precisely Mova, a dialect, an adverb (officially at first it was called that way), composed of the Russian language, strongly diluted with Polonisms with the addition of the languages ​​of neighboring states, was created artificially. One of its authors was Panteleimon Kulish, who taught Russian (an active member of the Cyril and Methodius brotherhood, which existed in Little Russia from 1845 to 1850). It is interesting that when the distributors of this dialect tried to communicate in MOV with the Little Russian peasants, communication did not arise, since the men simply did not know this MOV. Subsequently, Kulish very much regretted his idea. So it is more correct to replace the yellow color on the presented card with blue.
          4. sv68
            sv68 16 May 2014 17: 09
            0
            serg122-a lot of ukroiny left on your map. It’s necessary to give Crimea another 90 percent of the territory, and it will be true wassat
          5. balyaba
            balyaba 16 May 2014 17: 25
            0
            Lord! You have beguiled west and east wink
          6. maxxdesign
            maxxdesign 16 May 2014 18: 35
            0
            this is the most competent option! and let Natsik geirize themselves on that scrap ... prepare their own (_o_) for the Europeans!
          7. Cynic
            Cynic 17 May 2014 19: 19
            0
            Quote: Serg 122
            So do you like it?

            Like, like it, just peel, peel and peel!
            Then, in general, the meaning is NOT ALL Ukraine to clear out?
            wink
      2. usn2garin
        usn2garin 16 May 2014 15: 33
        +6
        Tighten the situation for a month or two and this map will change a lot, while the geyropa will just start yelling about the partition of the Ruins along any border that the GDP will draw.
        Tighten the situation for three four months, and the geyropa will beg the GDP to send troops to the ruins.
        1. 120352
          120352 16 May 2014 16: 28
          0
          usn2garin
          And if you wait six months, then maybe there will be no one to yell. It’s just that as a result of a series of referenda, the Autonomous European Republic will appear in Russia with the general approval of what has happened by Europeans and the bewilderment of Americans urgently preparing for the next referendum.
        2. asar
          asar 16 May 2014 16: 41
          +1
          On a fig of Russia ruins, especially dill!
          1. 120352
            120352 16 May 2014 20: 13
            0
            asar
            And we will stock them, especially since the land is historically Russian.
      3. Nika-10
        Nika-10 16 May 2014 15: 59
        -3
        Residents of the Kherson region are strongly opposed to secession from Ukraine or accession to Russia. What to do with this? Have you heard something about the fact that the Kherson region, without which the Crimea for Russia, like a suitcase without a handle, wants to join the Russian Federation? I live here and I know for sure that no. Has everyone decided for us? I wonder who?
        1. Uncle
          Uncle 16 May 2014 16: 16
          +11
          Quote: Nika-10
          Has everyone decided for us? I wonder who?

          Do you know that before the war your region did not exist at all? And they created it without asking you. After all, they survived nothing. Leave the dreams of democracy, there is only the right of the strong, it will be necessary - we will take it to Russia, it will not be necessary - continue to rot as part of Ukraine.
          1. strannik595
            strannik595 16 May 2014 16: 30
            0
            there is only the right of the strong, it will be necessary - we will take it to Russia, not necessary - continue to rot as part of Ukraine.
            .... Dmitry, here you are wrong when people are being raped, this creates an unbroken hotbed of tension, Russia does not need it and this is not its way ........nobody will forcibly attach anyone to Russia......... but when they make a showcase of Russia from Crimea and the Khersons see how cool it began to live there, then there will be a repeat of the Donetsk scenario ........ in any other way, we are not fascists .. ..... You, judging by the Cross, are Orthodox people, but you reason and write like the Kiev authorities
            1. Uncle
              Uncle 16 May 2014 17: 01
              +3
              Quote: strannik595
              and reason and write as Kiev authorities

              And you as a democrat, in the modern sense of the term. Do not be offended, Russia has a destiny to be strong, now you will not convince anyone by exhortations.
              1. balyaba
                balyaba 16 May 2014 17: 30
                +1
                What’s the strength?
                1. Lukerya Weaver
                  Lukerya Weaver 16 May 2014 18: 16
                  +2
                  In truth, brother.
              2. MirVlad
                MirVlad 17 May 2014 01: 55
                0
                Russia will not impose ANYTHING on anyone. There is a postulate in Orthodoxy: If they don’t ask, don’t get involved and don’t help. It is necessary to exhort but to force and call to Russia, it is dearer to oneself. They help those who have a back in soap, and in this case also with blood ... Unfortunately, legitimacy needs to be proved comprehensively. Crimea showed it and they don’t recognize it. Putin is a strategist. Wise strategist.
        2. Executer
          Executer 16 May 2014 16: 41
          +4
          Nick-10, it is not ripe ...
        3. Fin
          Fin 16 May 2014 17: 03
          +6
          Quote: Nika-10
          I live here and I know for sure that no. Has everyone decided for us? I wonder who?

          By the fall, if the problem is not resolved before this, people will think differently. There is no country, without an economy and an independent policy, there is a territory. Therefore, it’s up to you to decide how they will be, you have your own.
          Did you enjoy Odarchenko’s performance on May 9? Are you ready to go to the grave of your grandfather and call him Colorado? But it will be necessary ... Nazi insanity will only grow stronger, do not think that everything will remain as before.
        4. Lukerya Weaver
          Lukerya Weaver 16 May 2014 18: 15
          +2
          Nothing, six months will pass and you will personally change your mind comparing the situation in the Crimea and in your Kherson region. But we have nowhere to rush in Russia. Want to eat and the opinion will change.
      4. g1v2
        g1v2 16 May 2014 20: 35
        0
        Unfortunately, Kolomoisky fully controls Dnepropetrovsk, hunters strictly control Zaporozhye, it is quiet in Nikolaev and Kherson, but Odessa and Kharkov are next in line for a referendum. By the way, the junta understands this and strengthens the troops there.
      5. Cynic
        Cynic 17 May 2014 19: 15
        0
        Quote: Lelek
        perhaps there will be more blues.

        In my opinion you are shown _ MINIMUM!
  4. Neighbor
    Neighbor 16 May 2014 14: 32
    +6
    Whether the junta succeeds in convincing those on whose bayonets it came to power that it is necessary to leave the Donbass in order to save the rest is a good question. Moreover, the junta has not yet decided to voice this idea, and not the fact that it will ever be decided at all. But is it just Donbass. And who will be happy to receive the same Galychin.
    1. older
      older 16 May 2014 14: 42
      +4
      Quote: Neighbor
      Will the junta be able to convince those on whose bayonets she came to power the need to leave the Donbass,

      It seems to me that the loss of Donbass has already taken place de facto. It means that the central region remains. They will try to maintain it at all costs. The missile defense systems in the south, in the DPR, could allow controlling all of Russia to the Urals, inclusive. But it didn’t grow together. Kiev and the center of Ukraine to control the most populated part of the Russian Federation and Moscow (10% of the country's population)
    2. vsoltan
      vsoltan 16 May 2014 14: 58
      +3
      Yes, the so-called "junta" absolutely does not give a damn .... puppets are jumping in the hands of puppeteers .... and along the way filling their pockets .... the treasury, which is very meager after Yanukovych, has been stolen at all .... where? By whom? Well, what are the interests of the junta, except selfish?
    3. Darc
      Darc 16 May 2014 15: 26
      +2
      Without a population, anyone, with a population of banderlogs, I think there are no fools! I am sure that there are a lot of normal people there, but in my opinion there are many times more. And who needs aggressive, inappropriate, scumbags who do not want to work?
  5. Baron Wrangell
    Baron Wrangell 16 May 2014 14: 32
    +7
    the card is not correct! it is necessary to remove all access to the sea from Ukraine. Especially Odessa! and on the Dnieper!
    1. k1995
      k1995 16 May 2014 14: 53
      +1
      Does Odessa want to visit us?
      1. vsoltan
        vsoltan 16 May 2014 15: 01
        +1
        Maybe not really .... only local Jews are afraid of the Zapnentsi much more than us ... and remember the history of the Jewish pogroms in 900? Where did they happen, huh? Therefore - they will not refuse!
      2. Egoza
        Egoza 16 May 2014 16: 01
        +13
        Quote: k1995
        Does Odessa want to visit us?




        Here is the correct map. This is how it will be. True, Kiev will have to be made a "historical and cultural center" Painfully soiled itself with Maidans. And the capital should be moved to Donetsk. Until there "everyone came in large numbers"
        So Kherson can calm down, it will remain "at home", which will be called differently.
      3. ran nearby
        ran nearby 16 May 2014 16: 24
        +5
        I won’t tell you for all of Odessa, all of Odessa is very large (C), but for the independent Odessa Republic, which will have good trade and not only relations with Europe and Moscow in Odessa, there are many. If you correctly format the undecided - there will be a confident majority hi
    2. B.T.V.
      B.T.V. 16 May 2014 14: 56
      +11
      Kolomoisky really wants to seize Odessa, now it’s time to neutralize whom.
      1. asar
        asar 16 May 2014 16: 44
        +4
        His Israel itself, perhaps, will soon "crash"! (Mossad does not sleep!) For Odessa! laughing
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. vsoltan
      vsoltan 16 May 2014 15: 00
      +1
      I agree, agree, agree !!! See my comment just above!
  6. Arh
    Arh 16 May 2014 14: 34
    +7
    Hee Western Ukraine we are not brothers so let it move to the west and the rest to us !!! smile
  7. silver169
    silver169 16 May 2014 14: 36
    +5
    A very wise decision is to split urkaine. Only you need to do this not along the border of Donbass / Lugansk as shown in the picture - all 8 Southeast regions should leave from Ukrina. The only way! good
    1. IgorM
      IgorM 16 May 2014 16: 08
      +1
      Plus Zhytomyr, Rivne region, Kiev, Dnepropetrovsk.
    2. Lukerya Weaver
      Lukerya Weaver 16 May 2014 18: 20
      +1
      Not yet Vinnitsa. I was born and lived there. I do not want her to become a foreign country.
  8. mig31
    mig31 16 May 2014 14: 37
    +1
    Ukraine is not only an anchor for geyropa, but also a collar, a yoke, and a drawbar - how to get rid of a ballast ?, but it’s very simple - the people themselves will decide how and with whom, just don’t interfere ...
  9. blizart
    blizart 16 May 2014 14: 37
    +10
    If we, half a year ago, were thrown into today, read the press, many with the face of Savely Kramorov, exhaled: "Brahnya ?!"
  10. tokin1959
    tokin1959 16 May 2014 14: 38
    +5
    Federation or integration of the Southeast with the rest of Ukraine is a passed stage.
    if the junta changes his mind a little, he can promise anything.
    but there are no guarantees of keeping promises.
    only a complete divorce from the rest of Ukraine.
    and it does not seem that the junta can promise something constructive.
    the anti-Russian project "Ukraine" must be finished.
    the time for this has come.
    1. revnagan
      revnagan 16 May 2014 18: 02
      0
      Quote: tokin1959
      but there are no guarantees of keeping promises.

      Guarantees of the fulfillment of the promised could be:
      a) the dissolution of all illegal militias of the junta;
      b) the announcement of all who did not want to dissolve themselves outside the law;
      c) a court pronouncing the most severe sentences to all the radicals who took part in the events in Odessa, Mariupol, Nikolaev, Kramatorsk (and indeed in all the Southeast, where they were shitting).
      d) a court pronouncing the most severe sentences to all the organizers of these bloody actions.
      After all this, it would be possible to raise the question of the federalization of Ukraine, of dialogue with the Donbass ... But something tells me that the junta will not take such steps ... wassat So, Ukraine, unified and indivisible, unfortunately does not have a future.
  11. gandalf
    gandalf 16 May 2014 14: 38
    +6
    I agree to give the West 3 region - Ivano-Frankivsk, Lviv, Ternopol ... More - no, no ...
    1. tokin1959
      tokin1959 16 May 2014 14: 41
      +3
      let there be western Ukraine and central Ukraine.
      The South - East of the former "Ukraine" should become the South - West of Russia.
      and then with the condition - that in central Ukraine - the second state. Russian language.
      Well, Transcarpathia is also Russia.
      the only way.
    2. vsoltan
      vsoltan 16 May 2014 15: 03
      +1
      Well done, I fully support!
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. sv68
      sv68 16 May 2014 17: 15
      0
      gandalf-when you give the west to the lions do not feed them and as you should, send a laughter from the result drinks
    5. Klarsen
      Klarsen 16 May 2014 19: 57
      0
      I completely agree. And not a single area more.
  12. Raven2705
    Raven2705 16 May 2014 14: 39
    -1
    A superficial article, sucked out of a finger, I would say. In my opinion, this is the author’s desire and only ... Arguments?
  13. Not angry
    Not angry 16 May 2014 14: 42
    +3
    Another thought about what will happen. It seems that people are not interested in the junta. At the moment, they have one order to wage a war until Russia is drawn into it.
  14. bubalik
    bubalik 16 May 2014 14: 44
    +5
    ... "According to Ukrainian assessments of the competitiveness of certain regions of Ukraine, only Kiev is in the top five. Donetsk is the leader in the efficiency of corporate governance, the railway infrastructure of the Kharkiv region corresponds to the level of Holland, in the efficiency of commodity markets, Odessa is in the lead, in the availability of the latest technologies, it is not Kharkiv, but Donetsk that leads Donetsk is the leader in terms of business development, Kharkiv region is the leader in innovation development.

    According to world estimates, Ukraine occupies the 10-th place in the world in the list of the most attractive countries for buying land. Ukraine accounts for one third of the arable land in Europe, and most of them are again located in the Southeast. And do not forget that the lands of France or Germany are hydroponics, and without intensive fertilizers, nothing will grow there, and in Ukraine - black soil. From all this we can conclude - when we say about the economy of Ukraine, we are talking about the South and East Ukraine. We are talking about those territories that are now being destroyed by the Nazis, and which will inevitably rebel against this Nazism, and which will inevitably force Russia to join
    "

    ,,,10 areas. Two areas cannot unite, but 10 can. Moreover, this accession will begin in the fall. Summer is relaxation, it is gardening, everything is fine, everyone is drinking and relaxing. But when in front of people winter will loom and it turns out that there is nothing to eat, work is over, and there are no cash reserves, then they will get up. That is, if Lugansk and Donetsk rebelled for cultural and political reasons, then the South and East as a whole will rise for purely socio-economic reasons - there will be nothing to eat. (c) Director of the Institute for Globalization, Mikhail Delyagin.

    http://www.nakanune.ru/articles/19009/
    1. Executer
      Executer 16 May 2014 16: 47
      0
      Quote: bubalik
      But when the winter looms before people and it turns out that there is nothing to eat, the work is over, and the cash reserves for gas no, then they will get up.
  15. lexxxus
    lexxxus 16 May 2014 14: 46
    +2
    And then if the representatives of the DPR and LPR agree, and they have already shown to the whole world that they are not dependent on the Kremlin in deciding on their future.

    Ah cunning Putin. And I thought, he was seriously talking about postponing the referendum ...
  16. Nikolav
    Nikolav 16 May 2014 14: 50
    +2
    Hmm ... The question is, of course, controversial, and the expert himself doubts. Why was the garden fenced? Only to voice the thought that has been on the air for a long time ??
  17. nikrandel
    nikrandel 16 May 2014 14: 53
    +5
    It is necessary to take away all the gifts of Ukraine, presented to her by our rulers at different times, leave them this yellow piece, and let them live there for themselves. And the West to take out the entire Maidan for fattening.
  18. VNP1958PVN
    VNP1958PVN 16 May 2014 14: 55
    +2
    In short, both the Maidan and the Maidanutye must be wandered to Lviv. And they themselves for some time jump and the former Ukraine will decide faster!
  19. Rurikovich
    Rurikovich 16 May 2014 14: 56
    +4
    Always in any planning of any action, you need to calculate the possible scenarios for the development of events. Preferably both positive and negative for planners. Then there will be an opportunity to achieve the desired result with the least loss. Those. it was necessary to take into account other variants of "post-Maidan", and not one correct one - that everything would pass "namazi." This once again proves the degradation and rottenness of Western thinking. It was also necessary to take into account the fact that Russia is not a Western power, but a separate Russian civilization, and its leader, GDP, is simply silent. Silently completely destroys all the plans of the "planners". Consequently, the whole comic of the situation is to get everything without doing anything. Ukrainians fell for the promises of the West (stubbornly not noticing that the West ALWAYS lies), Ukrainians, by their stupidity ... or their country, Ukrainians are killing Ukrainians like themselves ... Ukrainians themselves are to blame for what they now have. After all, Putin is silent and does nothing. The Ukrainians themselves will do everything for him. But this was not planned. H ... e planners, however ...
  20. lexxxus
    lexxxus 16 May 2014 14: 59
    0
    And then the whole geopolitical game of the West is lost: it will be possible to forget about the possibility of deploying NATO military bases in Ukraine.

    Really Westerners miscalculated so seriously !? And really they did not imagine such consequences !? Really their political scientists, military experts have not prepared a clear plan of action in different situations !?

    But could it all be a veiled preparation for something more serious for Russia ...
    And all that we see is a beautiful performance ...

    Maybe I'm wrong, I hope I'm wrong ...
    1. vsoltan
      vsoltan 16 May 2014 15: 05
      0
      What serious is the ghastly West capable of?
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Lukerya Weaver
      Lukerya Weaver 16 May 2014 18: 30
      0
      I read that the countries of Europe do not have combat-ready armies. All hope is only for NATO, that is, for the United States. And we have military parity with them. Therefore, there will be no war. There will be efforts to split society in Russia, undermine its economy and ultimately overthrow Putin and pull Russia apart.
  21. jktu66
    jktu66 16 May 2014 14: 59
    +1
    Whether the junta will succeed in convincing those on whose bayonets she came to power of having to leave the Donbass in order to save the rest is a good question. Moreover, the junta is still not able to voice this thought, and it’s not a fact that it will ever be decided at all.
    Do not dare! The recognition and divorce of the Kiev junta and the FRN is an example for other regions of Ukraine. And this ghouls are more afraid of war
  22. Bobxnumx
    Bobxnumx 16 May 2014 15: 05
    +2
    Well, if Hungary spoke about the autonomy of the territory of Ukraine, where ethnic Hungarians live, with the provision of dual citizenship, we can conclude. On the sidelines of Europe began to divide Ukrainian lands and oppose only by inertia.
    1. Orc-xnumx
      Orc-xnumx 16 May 2014 15: 45
      +2
      , ... under the pressure of the Yankees.
  23. Balamyt
    Balamyt 16 May 2014 15: 08
    +1
    I think that time will put everything in its place! If not reason, then the elementary instinct of self-preservation "will plant everything in its beds!" Haste in this matter is fraught with great troubles.
  24. Giant thought
    Giant thought 16 May 2014 15: 16
    +1
    Maydans leave only a few areas, let them live as on a reservation.
  25. vsoltan
    vsoltan 16 May 2014 15: 18
    +1
    This is a really interesting analytical article on Ukraine.
    Follow the link:
    http://warfiles.ru/show-56636-ukraina-voennye-prestupleniya-i-interesy-transnaci
    onalnyh-korporaciy.html
  26. Russian jacket
    Russian jacket 16 May 2014 15: 19
    +1
    It seems that the pastor and the company are from the breed of giraffes. It takes them a very long time ... wassat
    1. The point
      The point 16 May 2014 15: 57
      +1
      Quote: Russian quilted jacket
      It seems that the pastor and the company are from the breed of giraffes. It takes them a very long time.

      They are from the breed of ostriches, and their policy confirms this.
      By the way, do you know that if you scare an ostrich in a cemetery, then it will be scared twice. laughing
  27. individual
    individual 16 May 2014 15: 21
    +1
    Ukraine is split by the Maidan.
    You can search for any kind of braces, but the blood shed and the death of civilians will not be restored. How territorial unity of Ukraine will not be restored.
    First, Crimea, then Donetsk, Lugansk and then - the collapse of the degree of rejection of Kiev.
  28. Bobfia
    Bobfia 16 May 2014 15: 27
    +2
    Something really very cheerful here we share))) So far, only 2 regions have swung ... To talk about a section, draw borders along the Dnieper - it is necessary that the people rise in other areas ... Without the people - I think that nowhere. .. And so far in fact - Donetsk and Lugansk ...
  29. aud13
    aud13 16 May 2014 15: 32
    +1
    It is doubtful that the west and the junta will go for it ....
    The fact is that already three regions (Crimea Donbass and Lugansk) by their economic indicators make up about 30 percent of the economy of all Ukraine. And given the gap in economic ties between east and west, the situation is getting worse. Add to this the fact that there are also the debts of Ukraine, which were taken for the whole of Ukraine, and it is only the remaining regions that need to be repaid, and then the question of voluntary disconnection and their recognition as the current junta generally makes no sense.
    Therefore, it is thought that if they can come to terms with Crimea internally, although they will try to get something from Russia here as well, the loss of Donbass and Lugansk is a disaster for the remaining Ukraine and therefore they will fight for it.
  30. smershxnumx
    smershxnumx 16 May 2014 15: 35
    0
    Hungary is aiming at the privatization of Transcarpathia, let them hold a referendum there, the outcome of 200 thousand votes is clear. This WILL NOT LIKE the right-wing sectarian and banderlogists will have to send hundreds there, and part of the army will have to pull up there. It's ONLY ON THE HAND OF THE SOUTH-EAST !!! will reach and once they have declared martial law they can safely administer justice by military tribunals without looking at the world community. Badly, only many leaders of the junta will have time to scatter. The tribunal works very quickly, this is not a civil court and it seems that there will be practically only death sentences, because for a crime committed by gr .the court can be received conditionally, but according to the laws of wartime, this is already the death penalty, it is a pity THAT THESE BANDERLOGS DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS when they understand it will be too late. I think Poland and Romania are also eager to chop off "their own ?!" land, flag in their hands and forward
  31. kelevra
    kelevra 16 May 2014 15: 40
    +1
    The junta will hold its grip in the Southeast for a long time, until its face is full and until a thousand people die from their teeth, then it may come to them that it’s better to leave a large territory for yourself than to lose everything because of two areas that they will never live in peace with the West.
  32. Sirius-2
    Sirius-2 16 May 2014 15: 40
    +4
    It is necessary to correct the kindness of Lenin and Stalin. They, Ukrainians, poorly disposed of these gifts. New Russia should, in my opinion, become a completely separate republic. And New Russia and Ukraine should be common only border. And a common past. But I see the rest of Ukraine as a federal state, where the peoples will be called by their own names. Where zastryki will not be Ukrainians, but Galicians, in their small Nazism reserve.
  33. mamont5
    mamont5 16 May 2014 15: 40
    +2
    "Kiev missed the opportunity to offer a federal agreement to the South-East on its own terms. Now the only one who can bring the representatives of the opposing sides to the negotiating table is Putin, and the conditions for such federalization will no longer be dictated by Kiev."

    I think that we are no longer talking about federalization. And now Novorossia will dictate to Kiev whom it will accept in its state. So, now Kiev may well be in the margins. As it was in antiquity, when the capital of Russia was moved to Vladimir, and then to Moscow. As it was at the dawn of Soviet power, when the capital of Soviet Ukraine was Kharkov.

    "... with a great delay, Kiev comes to a clear understanding that the national project, which was born on the Maidan, can only be preserved in one way - to get rid of the regions that do not share its values."

    Well, isn’t it too late? And now the regions can get rid of Kiev.
  34. Orc-xnumx
    Orc-xnumx 16 May 2014 15: 43
    +1
    It seems that the Council will soon discard Turchinov, and they will not be up to the Donbass! Yaytsenyuk is more sane, and with him this proposal will probably pass.
  35. muhomor
    muhomor 16 May 2014 15: 48
    -5
    I have already posted on this topic. No sections! Only ONE ALL UKRAINE (already without Crimea) is friendly and economically developed in alliance with Russia. Even if only some region in the west of the country is captured by Geyropa, it will be a victory for the West. There was nothing!
  36. petrT
    petrT 16 May 2014 15: 59
    +1
    Ukraine will no longer be united, but the current lack of power to divide Ukraine will not work, the puppeteers will not, with permission to divide Ukraine, almost all regions will be asked to hold a referendum, and the results there are unpredictable.
  37. vlad.svargin
    vlad.svargin 16 May 2014 16: 11
    0
    The Kiev junta does literally everything to create a wall of hatred between the East and the West of the country. Hiding behind the talk about the need to preserve the unity of the country, it step by step aggravates the split and brings closer the legal consolidation of the collapse of the Ukrainian statehood.

    Everything is correct here, maybe the Kiev junta is not independent in its actions. To whom all this "madhouse" is beneficial, these temporary cheeks serve that. And it is beneficial, first of all, for the USA. The whole geopolitical game of the West (more precisely the USA) lost: it will be possible to forget about the possibility of deploying NATO military bases on the territory of Ukraine. And they have to hold elections in Ukraine no matter what, so that at the request of the "president" to introduce "peacekeeping forces" (as part of NATO, it is not in vain that they pull together, ostensibly to protect their partners in the bloc, their contingent on the border with Ukraine and RF). At the same time, launching a "smoke screen": distracting the public, allegedly by the aggressiveness of the Russian Federation, imposing sanctions against Russia, are making their policy of legitimate penetration into Ukraine That is why the junta is "stubborn" on anti-separatism and intransigence, or rather, it fulfills the instructions of American "advisers" (if they can be called that way)
  38. ASASHOKA
    ASASHOKA 16 May 2014 16: 15
    +1
    Quote: alex-s
    Whether the junta succeeds in convincing those on whose bayonets it came to power that it is necessary to leave the Donbass in order to save the rest is a good question.


    I'm afraid now the fascists will not get off with Donbass alone!


    ... “to evacuate from Donbass all those for whom life in the DPR and LNV is initially impossible, and having ascertained the actual seizure of this part of de jure sovereign Ukrainian territory by pro-Russian criminals, isolating themselves from the gray criminal zone with something ideally similar to a wall on the border Israel and Palestine "...
    For me, it is not necessary to divide the pieces, but to make the entire territory of the former Ukraine a new state - NOVOROSSIYA. All others, you understand, should be sent to where they wanted and let them be "sheltered" there, if they cannot already live like a human being in the old place. Let them arrange lawlessness there. The EU likes it, and the US just loves it. So let this happen ON THEIR territory! So I would say. Why should we distribute the territory conquered by our grandfathers !!!
  39. maxim1
    maxim1 16 May 2014 16: 20
    0
    "And the danger of his defeat in the largest geopolitical confrontation since the end of the Cold War is now very high."
    Defeat of the west inevitably.
    "Moreover, the junta has not yet decided to voice this idea, and it is not a fact that it will ever decide."
    I wonder if there was any long-playing junta somewhere in the vastness of history.
    The current ceases to exist by the upcoming May 25 elections.
    The new president is waiting for a lump of unsolvable problems, the way out of which is not expected for him either. Of course, the junta will not dare to "divorce", and there is no time. One side. On the other hand, the southeast will not consult with her. The same as with the new president.
    Either the junta or the president will take the "divorce" for granted. This is their lot, a heavy cross, this is their desolation.
    The boundaries of "divorce" will be specified in the near future.
  40. X Y Z
    X Y Z 16 May 2014 16: 28
    0
    Even if everything goes according to the scenario described by the author, the EU and the US should clearly understand where the red line is. And even in this version, the location of their military bases, and even more so of some missiles, in any part of Ukraine is a declaration of war on Russia with all the ensuing consequences.
  41. jovanni
    jovanni 16 May 2014 16: 34
    +1
    The stupidity and stubbornness of this Yaytsenyukhov-Turchinovskaya gop-company give rise to strong doubts about a civilized separation. Looks like you can't do without "KULIVLOB" ...
  42. vilenich
    vilenich 16 May 2014 16: 37
    0
    Quote: alex-s
    I'm afraid now the fascists will not get off with Donbass alone!

    Yes, everything goes to that ...
  43. Agent 008
    Agent 008 16 May 2014 16: 38
    0
    As long as there are such people in the DPR and LGR as Pavel Gubarev, there will be no agreements with the Bandera fascist junta ... In general, I admire his unbending will and courage! A true patriot of Donbass!
  44. DanSabaka
    DanSabaka 16 May 2014 16: 57
    -2
    That's right ... The partition of Ukraine is beneficial to geyrop and America. That’s why they pushed Kiev’s leaders of arms so stubbornly into a confrontation with Donbas.
    Russia needs ONLY ONE Ukraine. Well, not counting the Crimea, of course.
  45. siberalt
    siberalt 16 May 2014 17: 52
    0
    Westerners are generally in a complete stupor. Well, they didn’t calculate all possible options on the computer. You can't digitize life. But "manual" is no longer possible - here Putin is on horseback. Now it is impossible even to predict the development of the situation in Kiev. "Surprises" are expected every day.
  46. Cristall
    Cristall 16 May 2014 18: 10
    0
    Quote: B.T.W.
    Kolomoisky really wants to seize Odessa, now it’s time to neutralize whom.

    Odessa is a very tasty morsel ... after the reorientation of all flows to the last cluster - consider all almost imported products and all export (except for land to the Russian market) will go through the Odessa port cluster ...
    shorter loot ... a lot of dough and control ...
    Do you think Kolomoisky will let you go? Dnepropetrovsk, as - as Kiev rattles all the time .. The headquarters of "edinatorukraina" ..
    And there are not so many Jews in Odessa ..
    Ukrainians 622,9 (61,6%)
    Russian 292,0 (29,0%)
    Bulgarians 13,3 (1,3%)
    Jews 12,4 (1,2%) ..
    I’m looking at Wiki already changed the info about Odessa .. now we are the main base of the Navy .. damn ...
    In short, I realized .. it seems that they want to make Odessa the second KIEV only at sea .. you just need to remove 29% of the population and all sympathizers from the rest ...
  47. dFG
    dFG 16 May 2014 18: 27
    +1
    Well, common sense begins to prevail)) did not want to live in a single but artificial country, you will live in independent and different)) is the main achievement of the Maidan)) and where are those liberals who shouted glory to Ukraine? )))
  48. Ajent cho
    Ajent cho 16 May 2014 18: 31
    0
    West is ready to go to the division of Ukraine

    It is understandable that the West needs to pull NATO closer to its borders. If we occupy the southeast, they will automatically come to western Ukraine.
  49. Lukerya Weaver
    Lukerya Weaver 16 May 2014 18: 52
    0
    In fact, it’s more profitable for Russia to have Ukraine whole and indivisible at hand. Only naturally friendly. In theory, Putin should help form a liberation army in Ukraine, which will liberate Kiev from the maydan government. In theory, only the rulers in Kiev and split the country. Normal Ukrainians themselves can wash the brains of the population from fascist ideology. Only a sane government is needed. Well, stubborn nationalists are planted and the whole business. Only it will work out all at once. The country is out. It will take a long time to restore the economy.
    1. Aleksandr2012
      Aleksandr2012 16 May 2014 20: 21
      0
      It’s unlikely to succeed. The train has gone. It will take several years, the central one will break off. Although everything can happen faster. I also think that it is more profitable for Russia to have a buffer state than a direct border with a potential enemy.
  50. smershxnumx
    smershxnumx 16 May 2014 19: 15
    0
    Quote: DanSabaka
    Russia needs ONLY ONE Ukraine. Well, not counting the Crimea, of course.

    Russia does not need a FASCULAR UNIFIED UKRAINE !!!!, WITH THE HEAD IS ALL NORMAL?