Military Review

Ukrainian script for Kazakhstan?

235
Ukrainian script for Kazakhstan?



While the main attention of the public is focused on events in Ukraine and around it, in the meantime, interesting processes are also taking place in Europe. As an example: just recently, the daily German newspaper Die Welt published an article by Sven Kellerhof “The Stalin Holodomor cost the lives of one and a half million Kazakhs”.

The article praises the dissertation of a German specialist in stories Eastern European Robert Kindler "Stalin nomads." The material is designed in the spirit of the most brutal anti-Sovietism.

The question may arise: what is new in this? In general, nothing else, and quite another is interesting: the topic of the Kazakh “famine” that is little known to the West for now, is obviously becoming one of the percussive in European politics, which is reflected in the media.

A few years ago, the number of publications on the history of famine in Kazakhstan could be counted on the fingers. This topic was on the far periphery of the attention of historians and politicians and was barely touched on even within the framework of the well-known disputes about the Ukrainian “famine”. Now the situation is changing, and obviously not without purpose.

Recall that the “Holodomor” topic, raised during the reign of President L. Kuchma and which became one of the main areas of domestic and foreign policy under President Yushchenko, split the Ukrainian society, opened the way for nationalists to enter into big politics and, in fact, also set the stage for the current coup d'état.

In many publications of the “hunger strikers,” it was clear that they did not want to deal with the true causes of the famine, all the “arrows” were transferred to Moscow, to Russia and to the Russians - the image of “man-made hunger” was molded together.
We see the same picture in today's Kazakhstan. The German historian took the position of the most extreme Kazakh nationalists and also began to accuse Moscow, Russia and Russians. Of course, not so frankly, as the Kazakh "national-patriots" do, but the tendency, as they say, lies on the surface. Is this the intention to repeat the Ukrainian script in Kazakhstan?

Several years ago I wrote a book dedicated to the famine in Kazakhstan. I collected all the publications available to me and, paying particular attention to the reports of those terrible years, analyzed the reasons for the famine from an economic point of view. I was interested in how the leadership of KazASSR and Kazkraykom managed to bring the people to such a large-scale tragedy. The nomadic Kazakh economy was then quite stable, it every 10-12 years overcame jute devastating for livestock - winter warming, when snow is covered with hard crust and animals cannot dig up grass from under the snow. In all the famous written history relating to the nomads in the territory of modern Kazakhstan, never talked about the famine of comparable scale.

The conclusions contradicted what the Kazakh "national fats" said about the famine. Hunger was the result of a series of economic mistakes made by the leadership of KazASSR. Not even a sign was found, not to mention the facts that hunger was planned by someone. Moreover, until the fall of 1932, Kazkraykom and his first secretary, Philip (Isay) Goloshchekin, were unaware of the true extent of the famine, and ignored requests for help from the localities, considering them to be manifestations of panic.

It took a split of the Kazkraykom and the denunciation of the chairman of the SNK of the Kazakh Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic of Uraz Isayev to Goloshchekin, handed over to Stalin personally. Isaev outlined the real situation, acknowledged his own guilt and offered to remove Goloshchekin from his post. A month later, 17 of September of 1932, Stalin gave the answer: to allocate food aid to the population, to exempt it from taxes and harvesting for two years, to allow personal ownership of livestock in the amount of an average nomadic economy. Soon and Goloschekin, a famous revolutionary, by the way, one of the organizers of the regicide, left Kazakhstan ...

Due to the discrepancy between the findings of the study and the official views of the Kazakh "national fats", they refused to publish my book in Kazakhstan.
However, based on the collected material, it is possible and, I am sure, to critically examine the main points of the thesis of Robert Kindler in the statement of the newspaper Die Welt. Firstly, it’s absurd to talk about the unlimited power of Stalin and anyone else in Kazakhstan for the simple reason that there was simply no permanent connection with rural areas. The ombudspersons were cut off from the central leadership, and each leader did what he was in.

In addition, in 1930 in Kazakhstan, the Russian language was not as ubiquitous as it is now. The top management spoke in Russian, and the grassroots in Kazakh. All instructions were translated from Russian into Kazakh with such distortions that it was impossible to understand their meaning. The party journalist of the time, Gabbas Togzhanov, wrote: “We could give here a few“ translations ”that we have, but with all our desire we cannot bring them here, because, despite the fact that these“ translations ”were made from the Russian text, we we can translate them back into Russian. ” The actual lack of control and instructions that can not be understood - what else is needed for kinks in the field?

Secondly, the German specialist believes: "The indigenous people of Kazakhstan led mainly the nomadic way of life and constantly wandered through the boundless steppes." On the contrary, the Kazakh nomadic economy was very orderly, with carefully thought-out routes between winter and summer pastures, between wells and watering places, with detailed rights who and where has the right to feed and water the livestock. The Kazakh nomad camp was so well organized that the experts of this system could at any moment tell where a particular kind of Kazakh tribe was located. Just wander the steppe meant to destroy the cattle. For the same reason, nomads from the Ili and Irtysh border regions migrated mainly to Xinjiang or Kyrgyzstan, from the Syr Darya to Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan, from the northern regions to the Urals, to Siberia and to Kuzbass.

Thirdly, the statement “Like in Ukraine, in Kazakhstan the goal of Soviet collectivization was the radical destruction of the old structures and the establishment of the absolute power of the communist functionaries on their ruins” is absolutely not true.
The goal of collectivization was the creation of commodity farms capable of not only feeding the members of this farm, but also supplying products to the cities. What is said in all the plans and materials on collectivization, but the German expert chose not to notice this at all.

Fourthly, for a German researcher, the figures on the state of livestock do not correspond at all to the data from the primary sources. So, Robert Kindler writes that in 1929, in Kazakhstan there were about 36 million cattle, while the Goloshchekin report shows 40,3 million heads. “After four years of collectivization in Kazakhstan, almost 90% of cattle were destroyed or exported from its territory: now there are a little more than 1,6 million cows and 2,15 million sheep and goats left.” In general, according to the German, it was 3,75 million goals. In fact, in 1933, in Kazakhstan there were 4,5 million livestock heads. In the 1934 year - 5,9 million heads.

It is well known that the distortion of statistics is an old method of both once ardent anti-Sovietists, and of all Russophobes today. But, most importantly, a German expert could not explain why there was such a sharp decline in livestock numbers.
According to him, everything is simple: “The shepherds who did not fulfill the tasks of handing over grain were arrested, and their cattle were confiscated. During the shortest time, giant herds appeared throughout Kazakhstan, which could be neither fed nor maintained. ” Nonsense, and only!

By a strange coincidence, the German scientist, following the Kazakh “national factions,” did not indicate that Kazakhstan had vast grain areas and one of the most important moments of the collectivization plan was precisely the creation of large grain farms. The problem was that the growth of plowing from 3 million hectares to 26 million was completely beyond the power of either the Kazakh Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic or the entire Soviet Union. For such a large-scale plowing, the entire tractor fleet in the USSR would not be enough. Such capacities were achieved only after 20 years. But Kazakhstan is still plowing and sowing according to the recipes of the times of collectivization — large grain farms, sowing about 17-18 million hectares per year.

Further, in the Kazakh Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic were going to create livestock farms - large farms of the European type, which gave the best land and pastures and for which they gathered cattle from nomads. They wanted to make it so that there was a lot of meat and milk, but it did not work out. And now attempts to create large livestock farms in Kazakhstan almost always fail. Climate and conditions are not suitable for European-type animal husbandry.

At the same time, before the collectivization, the Kazakh nomads gradually shifted to settled livestock, made arable land and hayfields. In the Altai, the Kazakhs, under the influence of the Russians, became completely sedentary. Goloschekin made a fatal mistake when he forced this process without a prepared infrastructure: wells, feed facilities, housing and outbuildings. It is precisely this administrative attachment of Kazakh households to the “points of subsidence” that became the decisive cause of the famine. Slaughter from starvation amounted to 47% loss of livestock, or about 17 million heads. For comparison, the delivery of livestock in order of meat and livestock sales had 5,2 million heads. The German specialist turned everything upside down.

What conclusions can be made? Kazakhstan could survive the collectivization, if it were done without haste, pressure and in relation to economic opportunities. The fact that now Kazakhstan is a major grain producer, just confirms that there was rational content in terms of collectivization. Hunger was caused by the collapse of agriculture, which occurred due to management mistakes, but there was no “organized famine” there.

However, now in Kazakhstan there are attempts to transfer all responsibility for the mass hunger to Russians, and to present the Kazakhs as the only victims. In fact, all the peoples who lived then in the Kazakh Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic suffered significant losses from hunger. The economic disaster did not spare anyone: neither a Kazakh, nor a Russian, nor a Ukrainian, nor a Uighur.

Unlike Ukraine, where hunger affected only a part of the population, albeit significant, in Kazakhstan the topic of hunger concerns almost every Kazakh. This is a very sharp, painful memory, and the politicization of hunger problems can lead to the most devastating consequences.

For example, to aggravate and bring to the internal clashes the already divided Kazakh society - with the lines of demarcation on “nagyz” (real) and “shal” (half) Kazakhs, on urban and rural, on Kazakh-speaking and Russian-speaking.

The hunger theme can revive tribalism, which in the western regions will become a burning match thrown in a barrel of gasoline. The descendants of the survivors may recall the descendants of the activists - belsendy (these were mainly Kazakhs), the participation of some ancestors in the death of others. And this is without taking into account the difficult inter-ethnic relations.

Hunger, of course, must be remembered as a brutal lesson of economic disaster, so as not to repeat this again. And the politicization of this topic can lead to great upheavals.
Author:
Originator:
http://www.stoletie.ru/vzglyad/ukrainskij_scenarij_dla_kazahstana_139.htm
235 comments
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  1. svp67
    svp67 April 27 2014 07: 00
    +25
    German newspaper Die Welt published an article by Sven Kellerhof “Stalin's Holodomor cost the lives of one and a half million Kazakhs.”
    - and they repeat ... They work roughly.
    1. family tree
      family tree April 27 2014 07: 40
      +27
      Quote: svp67
      - and they repeat ... They work roughly.

      So, the conveyor does not provide for deviations from the technology, while the circuit works, they will not change anything.
      1. avt
        avt April 27 2014 09: 35
        +7
        Quote: svp67
        - and they repeat ... They work roughly.

        Quote: perepilka
        So, the conveyor does not provide for deviations from the technology, while the circuit works, they will not change anything.

        Quite right! Why would they radically change the script? All new national states were initially built on the basis of hatred for the USSR and Russia in particular, the difference is only in the intensity of the degree of this hatred, well, taking into account the fact that a generation of not frightened idiots has grown up in the spirit of the Western consumer society and `` democratic values ​​'' ala Comrade Bender - “Foreign countries will help us,” and in particular the Anglo-Saks, then as Ukraine shows, it’s not a problem to swing according to this scenario, the main thing is a weak, weak-willed government. Like Akaev and Ssynukovich, but how to achieve weakness in power, they also know The company is an example of this.
        1. aksakal
          aksakal April 27 2014 19: 55
          +13
          Quote: avt
          All new national states were originally built on the basis of hatred of the USSR and Russia in particular
          - Something you confuse, dear, just 23 years have passed, and you already confuse and turn upside down. The first national state that fled the USSR and hates it is Russia itself ... laughing Maybe recall all the vicissitudes of that time? How tired of poor Russia to feed all the "parasites", how dashingly they pushed Gaidar out of the ruble zone with their hands almost on kicks. If you are posting on such a topic, then post somehow so that the historical accuracy does not suffer much.
          1. family tree
            family tree April 27 2014 21: 02
            +1
            Quote: aksakal
            The first national state that fled from the USSR and hates it is itself ... Russia! laughing

            what It, of course, zvizdat, not tossing bags. So, you say that when Russia left the USSR, along the southwestern borders of Russia, there remained a single state called the USSR?
            But what about Lithuania, Georgia, Estonia, Latvia, Armenia, Moldova?
            1. aksakal
              aksakal April 27 2014 22: 13
              +10
              Quote: perepilka
              It, of course, zvizdat, not tossing bags. So, you say that when Russia left the USSR, along the southwestern borders of Russia, there remained a single state called the USSR?
              But what about Lithuania, Georgia, Estonia, Latvia, Armenia, Moldova?
              - a certain Mr. Yeltsin woke up hyperpopular precisely on the wave of "will the RSFSR not be enough to feed all these countries that have been attached to the body of the RSFSR within the framework of the USSR?" And Yeltsin, being the President of the RSFSR, with two other "brothers" in Belovezhskaya Pushcha denounced the USSR agreements, thereby fulfilling his election promises. That is why I objected, because according to your post: ".
              Quote: avt
              All new national states were originally built on the basis of hatred of the USSR and Russia in particular, the difference is only in the degree of hatred, but taking into account the fact that a generation of not frightened idiots has grown up in the spirit of Western society
              - it turns out that from the poor RSFSR all countries were "torn off" by force and then by force they were brought up in the spirit of hatred of Russia. But it was not so. A political mistake was made - in the style of "thinking the best, but it turned out as usual." We thought we would get rid of parasites, make friends with the West and live normally. It turned out to get rid of parasites with a lot of blood, because economic ties were cut with blood, the Americans did not think to be friends, but decided that they were the winners on this basis, behaved completely rudely. They behave in a boorish manner on the basis of "losing" even now, remember the arguments of Samantha Power when she swore at the UN - "you forget that you are a losing power!" It was not a loss, it was a mistake of a naive people, which the state too guarded from a cruel world. After realizing the mistake, the Russian people are not going to admit the loss, and this is correct, because this happened out of ignorance, and not out of impotence. As for powerlessness - I think, gentlemen from the West will be convinced how “powerless” Russia is even after 23 years of turbulence because of that stupid mistake.
              From this point of view, I look at what happened and therefore do not agree with your interpretation:
              Quote: avt
              All new national states were originally built on the basis of hatred of the USSR and Russia in particular, the difference is only in the degree of this hatred
              1. family tree
                family tree April 27 2014 22: 35
                +1
                Quote: aksakal
                - a certain Mr. Yeltsin woke up hyperpopular precisely on the wave of "will not the RSFSR be enough to feed all these countries, which were attached to the body of the RSFSR within the framework of the USSR?"

                These ones
                Lithuania, Georgia, Estonia, Latvia, Armenia, Moldova
                jumped out before Yeltsin came to power.
                The referendum on the preservation of the USSR in the RSFSR: for the USSR-71,3%, against -26,4%.
                And he became hyperpopular not on the wave of "enough to feed" but on the wave of "nafig is needed, such a leading and guiding person, represented by the Central Committee and the Politburo" I was then 28 years old, so I remember everything well.
                By the way, those who were fed, Lithuania, Georgia, Estonia, Latvia, screwed the very first.
                And Yeltsin, being the President of the RSFSR, with two other "brothers" in Belovezhskaya Pushcha denounced the USSR agreements, thereby fulfilling his election promises.
                He did not have such promises. Then they all, like snails in a frying pan spun, inventing and justifying the creation of the CIS, instead of the USSR
                because according to your post: ".
                Quote: avt

                I, perepilka, have nothing to do with avt posts, we, different people, just stand under the same flag soldier . respectfully hi
                1. Aljavad
                  Aljavad April 27 2014 23: 14
                  +2
                  The referendum on the preservation of the USSR in the RSFSR:

                  The opinion of the people expressed in a referendum and the Napoleonic ambitions of republican leaders, including Yeltsin, should not be confused.
                  1. family tree
                    family tree April 27 2014 23: 30
                    +1
                    Quote: Aljavad
                    The opinion of the people expressed in a referendum and the Napoleonic ambitions of republican leaders, including Yeltsin, should not be confused.

                    You should not get into the conversation without understanding the essence.
                    Question
                    - a certain Mr. Yeltsin woke up hyperpopular precisely on the wave of "will the RSFSR not be enough to feed all these countries that have been attached to the body of the RSFSR within the framework of the USSR?"

                    Response
                    The referendum on the preservation of the USSR in the RSFSR: for the USSR-71,3%, against -26,4%.

                    This is not about Napoleonic ambitions. You have to be more careful when dragging a lieutenant colonel. smile
              2. Aptimist
                Aptimist April 27 2014 22: 43
                -1
                Before Yeltsin woke up, already in every republic there was more than one candidate for the presidency of a new country. so do not need to invent !!!
            2. family tree
              family tree April 28 2014 21: 31
              +1
              Quote: perepilka
              But what about Lithuania, Georgia, Estonia, Latvia, Armenia, Moldova?

              what Look how many connoisseurs of the modern history of Kazakhstan appeared. By the way, can you remind me in which republic, the only one in the USSR, by the spring of 1990 a whole party was formed that fought for secession from the USSR, organized a whole national democratic movement called "Azat" laughing
              1. Guard
                Guard 11 May 2014 22: 26
                +2
                Quote: perepilka
                By the way, can you remind me in which republic, the only one in the USSR, by the spring of 1990 a whole party was formed that stood up for secession from the USSR, organized a whole national democratic movement called "Azat" laughing

                Information:
                The movement took shape at the end of June 1990 at the Constituent Congress in Almaty. Officially registered on December 25, 1991. The then Declaration of Basic Goals and Principles stated the achievement of political and economic the sovereignty of the republic within the framework of the new Commonwealth of Free States, not aiming to exit the Union.
              2. The comment was deleted.
      2. sledge
        sledge April 27 2014 18: 33
        +6
        In Ukraine, the circuit failed. Now the mattress covers will stir up in another place, the question is what. Who is first? Belarus or Kazakhstan? Yeah, it's time in Mexico to stir up laughing
        1. aksakal
          aksakal April 27 2014 20: 15
          +14
          Quote: Sanya
          In Ukraine, the circuit failed. Now the mattress covers will stir up in another place, the question is what. Who is first? Belarus or Kazakhstan? Yeah, it's time in Mexico to stir up laughing
          - but we will not succeed - we live well and there is no desire to exchange it for maidan hungry romance at all. I rarely go there now - planting season, strawberries, raspberries, tomatoes ... Schaz I will run to the Maidan at the call of the newspaper "Velt" to remember the Holodomor laughing
          And then - everything has long been forgiven. Everyone who was resettled to Kazakhstan, who was sent to ALZHIR and KARLAG, both Russians and non-Russians, all the steppe dwellers, led by Kazakh elders, helped as much as they could, they did not hold back evil. Gertrude Platais wrote about this in the poem "Kurt is a precious stone!" If they kept evil, they would not help. Another thing is that you need to explore these tragic days, but only so that this would never happen again in the future. There were also overlapping economic mistakes, and I don’t know how tactfully the author of SABZh kept silent - I’m not tactful and I’ll say frankly that there was genocide by one of the ethnic groups. Moreover, the genocide affected both Russians and Kazakhs and Ukrainians, and everyone in the USSR. Therefore, to the Russians - no offense, they take on trouble. And about that ethnic group - well, look at the names of those who gladly rotted all our otsts and grandfathers in the camps: "The head of the USSR GULAG - H. Apert. * The head of the camps on the territory of the Ukrainian SSR - S.B. Katsnelson, then - Balitsky . * The head of the camps in the Northern regions - Finkelstein. * The head of the camps in the Sverdlovsk region - Pogrebinsky, then Shklyar "(http://patriot-imperii.livejournal.com). And let them not think that it will cost, the time will come when we will also declare our Holocaust and there will be demand.
          And so - that Verkhoturov, with his tact and attempt to blame the economic mistakes on the cause of the Holodomor, that the newspaper Welt, with his stupid attempt to drive a wedge between the Russians and Kazakhs for the Holodomor, where, in fact, "third" persons are to blame, who have yet to be brought to a clean water - BOTH !!!!!
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir April 27 2014 20: 19
            0
            Quote: aksakal
            - but we will not succeed - we live well and there is no desire to exchange it for maidan hungry romance at all. I rarely go there now - planting season, strawberries, raspberries, tomatoes ... Schaz I will run to the Maidan at the call of the newspaper "Velt" to remember the Holodomor

            will gather a couple of thousand "dissatisfied" and say that everyone is dissatisfied.
          2. Aljavad
            Aljavad April 27 2014 23: 22
            +2
            genocide affected both Russians and Kazakhs and Ukrainians, and all in the USSR

            I absolutely agree! The situation was PRINCIPALLY not at the national level: ALL nationalities suffered, and the repressions were carried out by "children of different nations". Therefore, I can only repeat after Aksakal:
            you need to explore these tragic days, but only so that this would never happen again in the future.

            And to offend the past is an activity similar to torsion blew a mirror.
        2. Aptimist
          Aptimist April 27 2014 22: 46
          +1
          Yes, we would return to Cuba !!!! And the fact that our commander-in-chief recalls now - he took a step and ... !! ??? what's next afraid !!! Waiting!
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Jet
        Jet April 27 2014 21: 27
        +1
        topwar this year has turned into a conveyor belt, like all Russian media, and everyone who disagrees with the official line of "fascist gays" ..
        1. Apollo
          Apollo April 27 2014 21: 30
          +1
          Quote: Jet
          This year, topwar itself turned into a conveyor, like all Russian media

          Explain.
          1. alone
            alone April 27 2014 22: 08
            +8
            Quote: Apollon
            Explain.

            And what is there to explain Apollo! Everyone has the right to think in their own way. Everyone has their own vision. And only here people are called for agents of the State Department, LGBT representatives, the fifth column, Bandera, pan-Turkists, etc. for dissent.
            If a Russian stands for Russian in a certain state, this is normal. If a Kazakh wants to get closer with an Azerbaijani, Turk, Uzbek, this is considered pan-Turkism and a threat to Russia. This has long gone beyond the scope of this site. Here is the whole explanation.
            1. Apollo
              Apollo April 27 2014 22: 27
              +2
              Quote: lonely
              And what is there to explain Apollo!

              Well first hello hi
              Secondly, if my memory serves me, my question was not addressed to you.

              The third time you answered for the visitor
              Quote: Jet
              Jet
              ,
              Quote: lonely
              And only here people are called for dissent by agents of the State Department, LGBT Representatives, the fifth column, Bandera, pan-Turkists, etc.


              I will write this.
              If we are talking about the Administration of the forum, then it has nothing to do with it. The administration of the forum only implements the policy of the forum and monitors the discipline of the forum and maintaining order.
              If we are talking about the comments of visitors, then here everyone has the right to speak out but within the rules of the VO forum.
              Quote: lonely
              This has long gone beyond the scope of this site. Here is all the explanation.

              Everything else is from the evil one. Your answer did not convince me.
              1. alone
                alone April 27 2014 23: 00
                +2
                Quote: Apollon
                Everything else is from the evil one. Your answer did not convince me.

                Of course. And even if I have to give 100 arguments, I won’t be able to convince you. Yes, and I’m not trying. Everyone has their own opinion. But I still did not offend anyone for the opinion, unlike some.
          2. Jet
            Jet April 28 2014 11: 19
            +13
            Let me explain: before, more than 50% of the articles on the site were about weapons or military tactics, strategy, etc. Now 80% is an assessment of the events in Ukraine in the spirit of "get up the country to a mortal battle with fascism", or articles about how "great Russia" will destroy the "stupid West". The same is true on all channels, from Russia 24 to Ren TV, where Kisilev and Solovyov, in the best traditions of the LDPR, with clearly visible foam at the mouth and undisguised pleasure, promise to incinerate America and its allies, and at the same time "fascist Ukraine." Very similar to North Korea. For this reason, I only watch RBC from Russian channels, but unhealthy changes are starting there too. I practically stopped visiting TopWar, because it's unpleasant to read this nonsense.
            PS I warn you, although I am not Russian, I am not a fascist and not gay), and neither a pro-Western, nor a radical Muslim. I want at least a little loyalty to events and common sense. You can start to minus;)
            1. Drummer
              Drummer 18 May 2014 20: 31
              +2
              Exactly the same impression. A plus.
        2. Aptimist
          Aptimist April 27 2014 23: 00
          +10
          So he always was this site so. If you do not support a common line and opinion, then through constant moderatic bans you are simply blocked.
          And the line here: read the leaders of the past as gods, the USSR is sacred !!! If you propose to introduce something from Europe or praise it, then you are a liberal and gay.
          In general, it became boring from the same people. Little has changed in a year! All those who disagree with the general line of the site were knocked out!
    2. Oleg14774
      Oleg14774 April 27 2014 07: 49
      +17
      Quote: svp67
      - and they repeat ... They work roughly.

      But judging by Ukraine is very effective! Unfortunately.
      1. Belarus
        Belarus April 27 2014 08: 20
        +20
        And what do you want,Americans act brazenly, unceremoniously and, most importantly, do not restrain themselves by any obligations.On the contrary they force others to observe some kind of agreement and all kinds of obligations there of some kind of right there.
        And Russia is constantly it limits and restrains itself with something, nods at some signed agreement that everyone has seen and all the more not intend to comply.
        1. asar
          asar April 27 2014 14: 22
          +4
          Russia to conduct its own independent policy! Strengthen the Armed Forces !! And as Russia becomes strong (and we have always been "self-sufficient"!) - the attitude towards it will involuntarily change! For the better!
          1. andr327
            andr327 April 27 2014 23: 04
            0
            Changing and will change, and the best side, if we succeed. then in 2-3 generations. Sorry I will not live.
        2. Jet
          Jet 1 May 2014 21: 30
          +1
          Do you propose that in order to keep up with the United States, too, begin to seize other people's resources and kill people around the world?)
    3. platitsyn70
      platitsyn70 April 27 2014 07: 56
      +10
      a hidden war is being waged against Russia. They want to destroy Russia, or at least subjugate it.
      1. family tree
        family tree April 27 2014 08: 23
        +18
        Quote: platitsyn70
        a hidden war is being waged against Russia. They want to destroy Russia, or at least subjugate it.

        Hidden? Yes, they are already being drawn into the open into armed conflict. And they do not need to destroy Russia. They remember how welded in two world wars, especially the second. They will not survive only the third, they themselves understand, and therefore provoke local warfare throughout Eurasia, away from home. And for himself, it seems not dangerous, and they will not make a gesheft, trading weapons and other things, and driving everyone into debt, because, like any war, it requires three things: money, money and money.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Sea snake
          Sea snake April 27 2014 10: 26
          +9
          daily German newspaper Die Welt published an article

          It would be better to "see the beam in your own eye." We need to remind our newspapers published in Europe once again about the concentration camps in Germany, Poland, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, the Netherlands, France, Austria.
          List --- http://lizunchonok.narod.ru/simple.html
          Remind me with horror photos that don't fit my head.
          And in America, our newspapers need to write articles about the extermination of the Indians, about scalping ... weekly remind about Vietnam, Korea, Lebanon 82-84gg, Grenada, Panama, Somalia, Haiti, Rwanda, Kosovo, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria.
          Do not forget to also ask why in America there is still the death penalty on the "humane" electric chair? After all, this is the same "democratic" state in the world.
        3. asar
          asar April 27 2014 14: 23
          +7
          It's time to stir up near the States!
        4. alone
          alone April 27 2014 22: 10
          +6
          Quote: perepilka
          nor remember how welded in two world wars, especially the second. Only the third they will not survive

          Nobody will survive. Not only them, Everything. And you and I, the whole world !!
          1. family tree
            family tree April 27 2014 22: 59
            +1
            Quote: lonely
            Nobody will survive. Not only them, Everything. And you and I, the whole world !!

            I think that if they stayed, and "the whole world is in dust", they would not think too much.
      2. Aljavad
        Aljavad April 28 2014 00: 02
        0
        hidden war against Russia

        This war began in time immemorial and never stopped. And not only against Russia. This is a war of everyone (who can afford it) against everyone. And the fact that some thought that the war in the past was the result of an information strike. War is not always "hot". Even "cold" can subside. "Information" is always on. Even when the army is defeated and the country capitulates, even if the country is no longer the information war continues.
    4. tokin1959
      tokin1959 April 27 2014 10: 26
      -3
      the Bolsheviks pulled so much that the West-work and work in this direction.
      1. asar
        asar April 27 2014 14: 26
        +4
        What nonsense ?! What does the Bolsheviks have to do with it, it is not clear! They wanted to "ditch" Russia long before the Bolsheviks! Do not juggle!
        1. tokin1959
          tokin1959 April 27 2014 16: 54
          +2
          What did the Bolsheviks do?
          partition empire into national apartments
          incompetent governance, in which there was famine in Ukraine, in Russia, in Kazakhstan
          it is nonsense?
          1. Aptimist
            Aptimist April 27 2014 22: 51
            +3
            Yes! The Bolsheviks have more than enough jambs!
            But they were afraid of us for that! Or rather, our Stalinists think that they were afraid of us!
            And try, do not be afraid of such a fool !?
            1. foxxi
              foxxi April 28 2014 14: 49
              +4
              well ... here you too went too far ...
          2. foxxi
            foxxi April 28 2014 14: 49
            +3
            it was stupid decisions on the ground ... the wrong personnel policy, as always, because the execution was stupid ... there wasn’t enough for all of Stalin and Beria ...
    5. Validator
      Validator April 27 2014 11: 42
      +3
      Quote: svp67
      German newspaper Die Welt published an article by Sven Kellerhof “Stalin's Holodomor cost the lives of one and a half million Kazakhs.”
      - and they repeat ... They work roughly.

      And then the coarser the more effective. Target audience - Kazakh Natsiks do not shine with intellect, shavat and will quote. Need no less effective counter-propaganda
      1. Netrocker
        Netrocker April 27 2014 14: 11
        +4
        Do you think Russian Natsik shine with this same intelligence? Judging about the rotten bazaars about the Northern and Eastern territories of Kazakhstan - Gebel propaganda already works for you in all ...
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. miasoman
          miasoman April 27 2014 19: 04
          +2
          And what have the Russian Natsiks? They do not appear in this topic like .. This is either paranoia or a deliberate desire to "catch on" and make a scandal. Calm down, no one is going to join east and north. Well, Russia does not have such a task - to expand its living space. I repeat - there are enough of our territories! The Chinese say about their land claims - yes .. this is where and direct your anger. And by the way, more than 180 peoples live on the territory of Russia, and no one has a question - where to blame, while in Kazakhstan this is a hot topic, especially among Russians. Draw conclusions.
          1. aksakal
            aksakal April 27 2014 20: 36
            +5
            Quote: miasoman
            I repeat - there are enough of our territories! The Chinese talk about their land claims - yes .. here and direct your anger. And by the way, more than 180 peoples live on the territory of Russia, and no one has a question - where to blame, whereas in Kazakhstan this is a pressing topic, especially among Russians. Draw conclusions.
            - good If most Russians think so, it’s a hot respect, because only a great nation can think so. Nevertheless, in Rambler there is a category of Russian citizens whom you respect am Netrocker about them actually. But they are an insignificant minority in Russia. We also have Natsik - I will not argue. But then again, they are quite a minority, although due to their hyperactivity they seem to be many
            And so we do not have nationalism, and our girls with the same feelings "put on shoes" that the Kazakhs, that the British, even an Englishman who took root in Kazakhstan sang about this - would he take root if we were nationalists?
            [media = http: // http: //www.youtube.com/watch? v = xcEs8kQo768]
            1. aksakal
              aksakal April 27 2014 20: 38
              0
              Quote: aksakal
              nationalists?
              [media = http: // http: //www.youtube.com/watch? v = xcEs8kQo768]
              - I don’t know how to insert this content, share a secret, a funny song about painful laughing And Son Pascal is Italian, not English
              1. bubalik
                bubalik April 27 2014 20: 41
                +2
                aksakal (3) KZ  Today, 20: 38


                ,,, hi ,,,
                1. aksakal
                  aksakal April 27 2014 20: 56
                  0
                  Thank you very much, Bubalik -)))
                2. foxxi
                  foxxi April 28 2014 14: 53
                  +3
                  all to America ... let the harlots destroy Babylon ...
              2. The comment was deleted.
            2. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir April 27 2014 21: 05
              +1
              Quote: aksakal
              But then again, they are quite a minority, although due to their hyperactivity they seem to be many

              the main thing is activity, it is they who will be blown into the square and will create the appearance of general discontent, and after ... we have the "happiness" to observe this very "after" in Ukraine
              1. aksakal
                aksakal April 27 2014 21: 52
                +4
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                the main thing is activity, it is they who will be blown into the square and will create the appearance of general discontent, and after ... we have the "happiness" to observe this very "after" in Ukraine
                - let them not clatter with them. In Jean-Ozen they didn’t tweak, and even more so here. Of course, Nazarbayev has accounts abroad - these are all the famous "Berkut Limited", "Sokol Limited" and other "feathery" accounts, but he does not hold on to them and has proved it more than once, he will not shake for the loot, at this age such things are not important, it is more important to stay in history with a good name. I do not idealize our President, he is still a beetle, one "Kazakhgate" is worth it, when CIA resident James Giffen was the President's advisor throughout the 90s with access to all secrets and with terrible influence, but now all his steps are aimed precisely at maintaining stability and economic growth, which is what matters. And precisely for the sake of stability, Kazakhstan entered the Eurasian Union.
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir April 27 2014 22: 03
                  0
                  Quote: aksakal
                  he won’t shake the loot, at this age such things are unimportant, it’s more important to stay in history with a good name.

                  Well, wait, NAS is not forever
                  1. aksakal
                    aksakal April 27 2014 22: 17
                    +2
                    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Well, wait, NAS is not forever
                    - let's hope the best
                    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir April 28 2014 09: 43
                      -4
                      but you need to prepare for the worst
                      1. foxxi
                        foxxi April 28 2014 15: 00
                        +3
                        as it is in the famous cartoon ... "Haiti .. Haiti! We have not been to any Haiti, we are well fed here!" We do not need such a scenario for the development of events .. it is better to immediately deal with provocateurs and alarmists!
                      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir April 28 2014 15: 30
                        -5
                        Quote: foxxi
                        "Haiti ... Haiti! We have not been to any Haiti, we are well fed here too!"

                        there is a "small" difference I know the situation in the RK as well as yours, if not better
                2. foxxi
                  foxxi April 28 2014 14: 58
                  +3
                  a pessimist and even a whooper ... is waiting. what would happen ... in secret, I guess you will rejoice .. or not even in secret? ....
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir April 28 2014 15: 28
                    -4
                    Well, insulting it is so productive.
                    about two months ago, the same Ukrainian optimists on this site shouted merrily - now we’ll tour Yanuk and live
              2. Aljavad
                Aljavad April 28 2014 00: 29
                +2
                I may not be well informed. In Jean Ozen prepared presentation? What power did it work against?
                I very much want Kazakhstan to be resistant to color revolutions.
              3. foxxi
                foxxi April 28 2014 14: 56
                +2
                I agree with these arguments absolutely!
            3. Aljavad
              Aljavad April 28 2014 00: 23
              0
              they will create the appearance


              And this must be remembered!
              "silent majority" nobody ever counts!
              In the classification - only those who are not silent. And Ukraine is a witness to that.
            4. foxxi
              foxxi April 28 2014 14: 55
              +1
              stop already ... what kind of "pessimistic stubbornness" you have ... I'm afraid there can be anything of course ... but how would many of them know what kind of output and activity can suffer and not from someone, but from their own nation.
          2. Aptimist
            Aptimist April 27 2014 23: 06
            +2
            yes not a minority !!! the same divorced !!! Especially among young people, often healthy patriotism goes beyond healthy !!! And here it’s just in the hands of the instigators of the next Maidan.
          3. Aljavad
            Aljavad April 28 2014 00: 17
            0
            enough of their territories!
          4. foxxi
            foxxi April 28 2014 14: 51
            0
            and don't tell ... our "seagulls" to all "seagulls" seagulls ...
        3. Aljavad
          Aljavad April 28 2014 00: 16
          0
          What does the Russian Natsik have to do with it?

          ANY Natsik do not shine with their minds and are being led on to pranks like "they beat ours" without going into details. This means that they can be used in inciting ethnic hatred. They do not want to teach History. It is enough for them to drop the slogan.
      2. Predator
        Predator April 27 2014 22: 01
        -2
        Here's a respected one, explain, last year I was in Semipalatinsk, ran to places where I had previously worked myself and, with surprise, did not see a single Russian in my position! To my surprise, how was it that they explained to me with pathos that they didn’t pass certification! and lazy?! Illiterate?! Only it turns out that only the titular nation deserves this ?!
        1. aksakal
          aksakal April 27 2014 22: 24
          +2
          Quote: Predator
          Here's a respected one, explain, last year I was in Semipalatinsk, ran to places where I had previously worked myself and, with surprise, did not see a single Russian in my position! To my surprise, how was it that they explained to me with pathos that they didn’t pass certification! and lazy?! Illiterate?! Only it turns out that only the titular nation deserves this ?!
          - I don’t know what kind of Kazakhstan you were in, but in our Kazakhstan Russian leaders are full and above the roof. If they are not in akimats (local government bodies) - then they pay a penny. I have a Kent head of the ecology department in the regional akimat, they pay only 500 (!) Bucks laughing Well, he also earns money by sometimes sticking to shops for lying "bulls" at the entrance. And why should a Russian go there? If he earns in a large commercial structure, firstly, more, and secondly, he will also sleep peacefully.
        2. foxxi
          foxxi April 28 2014 15: 02
          +3
          yes tribalism there, not nationalism ... relax!
    6. Guard
      Guard 11 May 2014 22: 31
      +2
      Quote: Validator
      Kazakh Natsiks do not shine with intelligence

      Quote: Validator
      counter propaganda

      Know comment.
    7. The comment was deleted.
  2. jktu66
    jktu66 April 27 2014 12: 27
    +6
    and they repeat ... They work roughly.
    Uncle Goebbels taught them that way. It is necessary to lie impudently and roughly. Sometimes insert real events taken out of context into a lie, for greater credibility
  3. Klibanophoros
    Klibanophoros April 29 2014 16: 28
    -1
    Not rude, rather stereotyped. A consequence of European mechanistic thinking. They will be repeated until they stop working.
  • Name
    Name April 27 2014 07: 00
    +11
    The fact that the Americans will try to apply the Ukrainian scenario in Kazakhstan should be expected and preventive measures taken.
    1. miasoman
      miasoman April 27 2014 19: 05
      -1
      For example, what?
  • saag
    saag April 27 2014 07: 01
    0
    next rake
  • Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 07: 09
    +7
    Kazakhstan is not Ukraine .. The people are very adequate and wise!
    1. blizart
      blizart April 27 2014 08: 50
      +3
      And most importantly, without major civilizational faults.
      1. askort154
        askort154 April 27 2014 10: 36
        +7
        blizart .... And most importantly, without major civilizational faults.

        Therefore, they begin with the "Holodomor", which has been rubbed into the ears of the youth of Ukraine.
        The limit of cynicism - the GERMANS talk about the "victims of the Holodomor" in Kazakhstan, against the background
        26 million who died through their veins in the USSR. Propaganda distorting history -
        a method of educating young generations in the right direction. Unfortunately, as Ukraine has shown, it is a very dangerous weapon of the West.
    2. Semurg
      Semurg April 27 2014 10: 32
      +13
      Quote: MIKHAN
      Kazakhstan is not Ukraine .. The people are very adequate and wise!

      No. it’s just that after the devastation of the 90s it was at least slow but moving forward, but now we’ll skid for 2-3 years and people start to think that they are not in the right place, the driver is not the right one, they are just a stretch of road and then we’ll eat again. Ukraine specifically stalled and there they decide to change the way and the driver was already driven, and maybe even break the car (Ukraine), accusing her of all troubles.
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. RUSS
      RUSS April 27 2014 13: 52
      +8
      Quote: MIKHAN
      Kazakhstan is not Ukraine .. The people are very adequate and wise!



      And the Ukrainians are "inadequate" and stupid?
      1. aksakal
        aksakal April 27 2014 21: 33
        +2
        Quote: RUSS
        And the Ukrainians are "inadequate" and stupid?

        - the people there have nothing to do with business - they work, they try to survive in the conditions that four "brothers" (Kuchma, Kravchenko, Yushchenko and Yanukovych) provided for them and twirl their fingers at their temples, looking at the freaks of the "maydanuts". Here are "maydanutye" - exactly
        Quote: RUSS
        "inadequate" and stupid
        ... The real people of Ukraine demand the resignation of the illegitimate Government and want to be friends with Russia. But there is a very active "Right Sector", we will bring together a few of them - under ten or a little more than thousands, which is a very tiny percentage of the 45 million population of Ukraine, but they are trained, they are hyperactive and therefore they have a noticeable impact on events in Ukraine.
        1. Aljavad
          Aljavad April 28 2014 00: 46
          0
          - the people there is nothing to do with the business - it works, tries to survive in those conditions

          This is the question of the "silent majority" and their own hut on the edge!
        2. foxxi
          foxxi April 28 2014 15: 08
          +2
          fully support this opinion
      2. foxxi
        foxxi April 28 2014 15: 06
        +1
        but it’s not about that ... the problematic nature of the relationship between Russians and Ukrainians is still a problem from Tsar Gorokh ... it’s necessary to dance from there, rather than clinging to words and not replacing the meaning of what was said.
    6. asar
      asar April 27 2014 14: 30
      -8
      Well, let's see the "wise" Kazakhs! And at the same time - on the "wise" Kyrgyz, Uzbeks! And yourself, slowly ...!
    7. Lone wolf
      Lone wolf April 28 2014 08: 43
      -8
      Especially in the south of Kazakhstan .. there is "adequate! And there are a lot of" wise ")))
      This is in the north of Kazakhstan in close to Russia is still normal
      1. Semurg
        Semurg April 28 2014 09: 31
        +3
        Quote: Lone Wolf
        Especially in the south of Kazakhstan .. there is "adequate! And there are a lot of" wise ")))
        This is in the north of Kazakhstan in close to Russia is still normal

        Well, Kazakhs read carefully and think about how we began to divide in Ukraine into good and bad Kazakhs (in Ukraine they divided it into the southeast and west, us into the north and south). Divide and conquer - the eternal motto.
        1. Lone wolf
          Lone wolf April 28 2014 13: 01
          -3
          North Kazakhs and South. Kazakhs cannot find a common language among themselves)
          They themselves have long been divided among themselves.
          If this is not so, then why not?
          ----
          Those Kazakhs who are in the north of Kazakhstan, everything was normal and is with the Russians, and they never squeezed anyone. But the southern Kazakhs are a slightly different people and they differ (even their languages ​​are different).
          ----
          I myself was born and raised here from Kazakhstan, my parents were born and raised here.
          ----
          I do not want to insult or humiliate anyone! I myself live here born and raised. For them, Kazakhs do not care who you are by nation, Pole, German, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Russian. All one, we are Russian to them! If such a tramp starts like there in Ukraine, then where should we run ?? And what shall we do?
          This year my grandmother will be 95 years old. She is Ukrainian, but she was born here in Kazakhstan!
        2. Lone wolf
          Lone wolf April 28 2014 13: 10
          -2
          Tell me, how do you look at those girls of Kazakh women who give scarves and skirts to the bottom?
          1. Semurg
            Semurg April 29 2014 12: 36
            +2
            Quote: Lone Wolf
            Tell me, how do you look at those girls of Kazakh women who give scarves and skirts to the bottom?

            if the question is for me, then until they violate the laws of the Republic of Kazakhstan, and by their faith they do not infringe on me neutrally (though sometimes Jehovah’s desire to beat Maleh when they aggressively drum in the gate, and then offer to hear the good news). And where is how much and to whom do they pray this is their personal affair (does this apply to all religions, but do you see Muslims straining you?)
    8. foxxi
      foxxi April 28 2014 15: 03
      +3
      In Kazakhstani history there were no such personalities as Bender and others like him ... this is also an indicator!
  • Strashila
    Strashila April 27 2014 07: 12
    -19%
    "On September 17, 1932, Stalin gave the answer: to provide the population with food aid, to exempt them from taxes and procurements for two years, to allow personal ownership of livestock in the amount of an average nomadic economy" ... just answer the question from where the help was taken ... rightly, they cleaned out the latter in the neighboring Russian regions and imposed additional taxes on them to feed the nomadic parasites.
    1. andj61
      andj61 April 27 2014 07: 46
      +20
      Quote: Strashila
      "On September 17, 1932, Stalin gave the answer: to provide the population with food aid, to exempt them from taxes and procurements for two years, to allow personal ownership of livestock in the amount of an average nomadic economy" ... just answer the question from where the help was taken ... rightly, they cleaned out the latter in the neighboring Russian regions and imposed additional taxes on them to feed the nomadic parasites.


      Just keep in mind that these, as you say, "parasites" had previously handed over to the state a huge amount of cattle - for boots, and for stew, and wool, and at that moment they were simply dying of hunger. And they were dying of the bungling of local communists: both Russians and Jews, and Kazakhs. Therefore, help was necessary, and its failure to provide it was a crime.
      1. Strashila
        Strashila April 27 2014 11: 17
        -5
        As they say the question in the studio ... from where help could come from ... from where ???
        In this situation, the whole country was ... only from the Russian territories in which they cleaned and swept everything out of the way.
        Why parasites ... every private trader, and then he prevailed in the form of a production worker, in those days, and even now, he considers himself the most cunning ... I myself with a mustache, each for himself ... but when they remembered for the time being ... Awkward, because there is a state that must ... is obliged, no one in the field was in a hurry to solve the problem, how could I help someone ... they could, but so far they have not covered everyone ... then they wondered.
        The entire gadyushnik was bred by local grassroots links ... their own, not the Russians, who are credited with all their problems ... the Russians solved these problems.
        Given the peculiarities of Kazakhstan ... clan-teip construction ... north-south gave its local problems.
        Tax is part ... where did the rest go ??? They drove in anticipation of high prices, as they say neither to themselves nor to people.
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 27 2014 13: 02
          +4
          Quote: Strashila

          The entire gadyushnik was bred by local grassroots links ... their own, not the Russians, who are credited with all their problems ... the Russians solved these problems.
          Given the peculiarities of Kazakhstan ... clan-teip construction ... north-south gave its local problems.
          Tax is part ... where did the rest go ??? They drove in anticipation of high prices, as they say neither to themselves nor to people.

          everything is right, the king is good, the boyars are to blame for everything laughing and it’s even better to write the rulers did not sleep and didn’t eat thoughts about the people, but they got the shitty people on the ground, they all perverted and crap negative
          1. Strashila
            Strashila April 27 2014 13: 35
            +7
            For example, I can give another historical fact ... Khrushchev corn ... how many jokes about it have been written.
            Just not long ago, Nikitki ... the USSR is no longer there, but how they sowed corn and they sow it all over the country ... there is no better alternative as feed for silage.
            1. RUSS
              RUSS April 27 2014 14: 02
              0
              Quote: Strashila
              Just not long ago, Nikitki ... the USSR is no longer there, but how they sowed corn and they sow it all over the country ... there is no better alternative as feed for silage.


              This is no longer important; Khrushchev will go down in history and in folklore with corn for centuries.
            2. Aljavad
              Aljavad April 28 2014 01: 21
              +4
              and how they sowed corn and sow it

              That's it: on the silo. And not throughout the country, as under Khrushchev, but only where it is cost-effective.
      2. Strashila
        Strashila April 27 2014 13: 30
        0
        "Parasites" previously handed over to the state a huge amount of cattle - both for boots, and for stew, and for wool ... I probably agree only with wool ... but the animal does not die from this.
        A huge number of cattle ... what ... sheep and horses ... this is the main backbone of livestock farming of the Kazakhs ... now the answer to the question ... how much these animals are in the diet of a Russian person ... rightly actually no way, from this it may follow that the tax was withdrawn for domestic consumption, as the local historical question addressed them.
        Boots ... for boots mainly comes the skin obtained from cattle, simply what we call beef, but this is not the horse of the Kazakhs of that time.
        Stew ... until the mid-30s of the last century, industrial meat processing was virtually absent as a type of industry.
        After Mikoyan bought the corresponding plants in the USA in the mid-30s, it allowed the USSR to get its stew and condensed milk.
        1. Guard
          Guard 11 May 2014 23: 05
          +2
          Quote: Strashila
          A huge number of cattle ... what ... sheep and horses ... this is the main backbone of livestock farming of the Kazakhs ... now the answer to the question ... how many of these animals are in the diet of a Russian person ...

          1) Sorry, but the Russians did not need these animals? Did you make fur coats from beef skin in Russia? Did you ride piglets?
          2) The meat was confiscated so that the processed products (along with the Ukrainian and Volga grain) could be given to the West as payment for services rendered by American engineers within the first two five-year plans. Although in Russia they still think that it is the "Russian people" who built Dnipro HPPs and car factories.
          3) The export of sheep and horses from the Kazakh steppe to the European part of Russia was gigantic before the revolution. So do not be smart about the fact that the alleged "Russian people" did not need "Kazakh cattle".
          Quote: Strashila
          Stew ... until the mid-30s of the last century, industrial meat processing was virtually absent as a type of industry.

          The cattle left "live weight". For you, who has no idea what a Kazakh horse and a Kazakh sheep are, and how Kazakh breeds differ from European ones, it is difficult to imagine, but the cattle calmly chased from southern Kazakhstan to "the very outskirts" of Russia. So it was in tsarist times, so it was in Soviet times.
    2. RUSS
      RUSS April 27 2014 13: 08
      -6
      Quote: Strashila
      correctly, they cleaned up the latter in neighboring Russian regions and imposed them additional taxes to feed the nomadic parasites.


      I agree!
      1. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 27 2014 22: 38
        -9
        Quote: RUSS
        Quote: Strashila
        correctly, they cleaned up the latter in neighboring Russian regions and imposed them additional taxes to feed the nomadic parasites.


        I agree!

        100 percent for !!! So it was! My grandmother, the kingdom of heaven, told her how she was.
      2. Aljavad
        Aljavad April 28 2014 01: 23
        +5
        cleaned the last

        still remember the Horde raids bully
    3. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist April 27 2014 22: 32
      -5
      Well, judging by the modern history of Kazakhstan, help was taken from the quote: "... danik (3) KZ April 25, 2014 19:52 ↑
      YOU WANT TO PLAY IN WORDS REMEMBERED THE HISTORY SO I WANT TO SAY AND ALREADY TOLD US MANY TIMES RUSSIA SHOULD FOR THE BLOOD OF 1 MILLION PEOPLE, IN MY BLOOD I HAVE TO PAY FOR BLOOD, AND IN DEATH, TO DEATH TO DEATH SPOTS, THIS IS NOT YOU TO REMEMBER THE HISTORY ... "that is, the enemies of the Russians.
      Aksakal !!! Here you (you can treat it like that ??? by age it looks like somewhere next to you) you state everything correctly, but there is a big one ... with which it began in Ukraine, namely - the image of the enemy - Russian, b, not recognition the right of any nation to preserve its language of communication and culture, and mutual respect. Without this, alas ... Look for yourself how you have already managed to rewrite and distort Soviet reality, you are simply amazed !!! And how did you manage to survive during that "terrible" time?!? And after all, young people firmly believe in all these nonsense and with foaming at the mouth proves that it was so terribly bad then: they did not give the language to teach, there were no Kazakh schools (although in every city of the Kazakh SSR there were necessarily several specialized schools with training in the Kazakh language, and In secondary schools, teaching the Kazakh language was compulsory !!! Another thing is how! This was taught, but now for more than 20 years of independence ... and things are still there) and the image of the enemy is still indicated, albeit veiled.
      Sincerely, RUSSIAN.
      1. Guard
        Guard 11 May 2014 23: 35
        +2
        Quote: ekzorsist
        And how did you manage to survive during that "terrible" time?!?

        Russified. Violently. And the Kazakhs don't like it. Even to Russified Kazakhs. We completely changed our language and culture to "Soviet", which in fact was just Russian. It seems normal to you, but not to us.

        Quote: ekzorsist
        there were no Kazakh schools (although in every city of the Kazakh SSR there were necessarily several specialized schools with instruction in the Kazakh language, and Kazakh education was compulsory in secondary schools !!!

        Kazakh schools were only in villages. and even then, not in all. In cities in general, I was with education in my native language. therefore, Russification occurred. Even in the capital of the Kazakh SSR, in the one and a half million Alma-Ata, there was ONLY ONE school with the Kazakh language of instruction. The second appeared before the collapse of the USSR after the December events, when Moscow realized that they had gone too far.
        As for higher education in the native language, its Soviet government did not bother to organize it at all. And any attempts were harshly suppressed. The only university in the Kazakh SSR where Kazakhs could get higher education in their native language is the Almaty Women's Pedagogical Institute, where teachers were trained for rural schools.
        There were a few faculties, but they were fictitious, because Teaching was on textbooks in Russian. Attempts to establish training in the Kazakh language were perceived with hostility by Moscow.
        As for the "compulsory teaching" of the Kazakh language in secondary schools (with Russian as the language of instruction), it was also a fiction. Tiny textbooks that could not give the student an ounce of linguistic knowledge. The same applies to "textbooks on the history of the Kazakh SSR". There is even more paper in a toilet roll of paper than was allocated for a history textbook approved by the USSR Ministry of Education.
        And even the difference in the number of hours devoted to the study of the Kazakh language and the history of Kazakhstan compared with the lessons of the Russian language and the history of the USSR (which 90% consisted of the history of Russia) is not even worth talking about.
        If we talk about the state administration of the republic, then the Kazakhs were "allowed" to rule their republic only three times in all the Soviet years. Usually they appointed all sorts of Mikoyans-Goloschekin-Kolbins, who had no idea where Kazakhstan was located before.
        And in general, the vaunted "Soviet fair system" has never allowed Kazakhs to any more or less position in the state administration of the country. Some Slavs, a few Jews, even fewer Balts and Caucasians. The question is - is this a deliberate policy, or were the Kazakhs so stupid that they were not suitable for the position of the head of a department in some thread of the union ministry, or was the Soviet education system incapable of raising national cadres?
        And sho is surprising - as soon as the Kazakhs began to manage their country and appoint the Kazakhs themselves, it turned out that the Kazakhs had excellent managerial skills.
      2. Guard
        Guard 11 May 2014 23: 35
        +2
        Quote: ekzorsist
        And how did you manage to survive during that "terrible" time?!?

        Russified. Violently. And the Kazakhs don't like it. Even to Russified Kazakhs. We completely changed our language and culture to "Soviet", which in fact was just Russian. It seems normal to you, but not to us.

        Quote: ekzorsist
        there were no Kazakh schools (although in every city of the Kazakh SSR there were necessarily several specialized schools with instruction in the Kazakh language, and Kazakh education was compulsory in secondary schools !!!

        Kazakh schools were only in villages. and even then, not in all. In cities in general, I was with education in my native language. therefore, Russification occurred. Even in the capital of the Kazakh SSR, in the one and a half million Alma-Ata, there was ONLY ONE school with the Kazakh language of instruction. The second appeared before the collapse of the USSR after the December events, when Moscow realized that they had gone too far.
        As for higher education in the native language, its Soviet government did not bother to organize it at all. And any attempts were harshly suppressed. The only university in the Kazakh SSR where Kazakhs could get higher education in their native language is the Almaty Women's Pedagogical Institute, where teachers were trained for rural schools.
        There were a few faculties, but they were fictitious, because Teaching was on textbooks in Russian. Attempts to establish training in the Kazakh language were perceived with hostility by Moscow.
        As for the "compulsory teaching" of the Kazakh language in secondary schools (with Russian as the language of instruction), it was also a fiction. Tiny textbooks that could not give the student an ounce of linguistic knowledge. The same applies to "textbooks on the history of the Kazakh SSR". There is even more paper in a toilet roll of paper than was allocated for a history textbook approved by the USSR Ministry of Education.
        And even the difference in the number of hours devoted to the study of the Kazakh language and the history of Kazakhstan compared with the lessons of the Russian language and the history of the USSR (which 90% consisted of the history of Russia) is not even worth talking about.
        If we talk about the state administration of the republic, then the Kazakhs were "allowed" to rule their republic only three times in all the Soviet years. Usually they appointed all sorts of Mikoyans-Goloschekin-Kolbins, who had no idea where Kazakhstan was located before.
        And in general, the vaunted "Soviet fair system" has never allowed Kazakhs to any more or less position in the state administration of the country. Some Slavs, a few Jews, even fewer Balts and Caucasians. The question is - is this a deliberate policy, or were the Kazakhs so stupid that they were not suitable for the position of the head of a department in some thread of the union ministry, or was the Soviet education system incapable of raising national cadres?
        And sho is surprising - as soon as the Kazakhs began to manage their country and appoint the Kazakhs themselves, it turned out that the Kazakhs had excellent managerial skills.
        1. Orik
          Orik 12 May 2014 00: 07
          -2
          The smearing of snot on the face began. The Soviets first of all slaughtered the Russian culture, and the Soviet culture indulged EVERYTHING, the Russian language was redone at the councils and indulged in this form as the language of interethnic communication, the struggle against Great Russian chauvinism went on ALL the years of Soviet rule.
          I wonder what kind of high culture you had before the Soviet regime ?! I don’t ask about industry and stuff. smile
          1. Guard
            Guard 13 May 2014 19: 01
            +3
            Quote: Orik
            The smearing of snot on the face began.

            Is it cold? Get well.
            Quote: Orik
            Russian culture councils were cut primarily

            And what was cut out of Russian culture in Soviet times? Starting from kindergarten throughout the Soviet Union, Soviet children were taught essentially exclusively only Russian fairy tales (with a small "optional" addition of "fairy tales of the peoples of the USSR"), by the first grade, children knew Russian folk songs (while completely ignoring national songs), at school the main language - Russian (the number of hours allocated for the study of the Russian language many times exceeded the number of hours for the study of the native language), the history of the USSR consisted of 90% of the history of Russia. Kazakhstan and the countries of Central Asia were given two scanty paragraphs, and even then they were written in the mainstream "before the arrival of Russia, they lived in the dark under the yoke of bastards-bays, and when the Russians overthrew the king, then in general these Asians went to heaven."
            Russian culture was promoted on TV every day - dances, songs, epics and so on. And so on and so forth. "Soviet Culture" is a light aesthetic sketch of ordinary Russian culture.
            No fight against Great-Russian chauvinism was carried out. If in the 20s in Turkestan the Soviet newspapers denounced this phenomenon, then from the time of Goloshchekin they began to hush up this topic, although it has not disappeared, it has only been strengthened.
            Amazingly, before the revolution, the vast majority of Russians (usually represented by Cossacks) in Kazakhstan were fluent in the Kazakh language. Sometimes owned better than Russian. Under Soviet rule, not only Kazakh-speaking Russians disappeared, but the vast majority of Kazakhs were deprived of their native language. And this was done very simply - Kazakh schools were massively closed. The apogee was in 60-70 years. All these decisions to close Kazakh schools in the Kazakh SSR were not and are not secret.
            Quote: Orik
            I wonder what kind of high culture you had before the Soviet regime ?! I don’t ask about industry and stuff.

            It is difficult to understand for a person who is convinced that he does not suffer from "Great Russian chauvinism", that the neighboring peoples had and have a culture that is in no way inferior to the Russian.
            And as for the industry - so it was not really in Russia during the tsar's time. Industrialization began under Stalin. What's in Kazakhstan, what's in Ukraine, what's in Russia. And the Kazakhs paid for it at the highest price - the size of half the number. All to pay for the services of Western engineers who taught the Russian peasant how to design factories. If you are not aware of who was actually the main executor of the first two Stalinist five-year plans, then type in Google "Albert Kahn". And at the same time, take the trouble to find out what the USSR paid the West for in the pre-war years. And not in rubles, but in natural products, raw materials and gold.
    4. Aljavad
      Aljavad April 28 2014 01: 11
      +3
      cleaned the last in neighboring Russians

      The imperial authorities often acted according to the principle of "Trishka's caftan". Here's one example from the past:
      Before the first accession of Crimea, Empress Catherine organized the resettlement of Armenians to the Don. For Armenians - getting rid of national and religious oppression. For the Russian Empire - the economic weakening of the Crimean Khanate. And for the inhabitants of the village of Poludenka near the fortress of St. Dmitry Rostovsky (including Armenians resettled there) - eviction from their huts to a clean field (in winter).
      But today, Armenians and Russians in Rostov-on-Don live peacefully.
  • mig31
    mig31 April 27 2014 07: 21
    +16
    But they won’t write how many Germans killed people during the First World War and the Second ??? We need an article to answer the article ...
  • Dimy4
    Dimy4 April 27 2014 07: 21
    +9
    What the author writes is the voice of reason, which no one needs. What is needed now is a frank delirium, into which they will sooner believe and which will be heard by everyone, such as the Americans plan to bury their radioactive waste in vast steppes, and the first batch is already waiting for its turn. You can remove a couple of some cars.
  • 11111mail.ru
    11111mail.ru April 27 2014 07: 47
    -1
    Conclusion on the article: tell me who your sponsor is and I will say who you are, it's about Kindlera (Geetlera) Therefore, the hints are appropriate.
  • Strashila
    Strashila April 27 2014 07: 49
    +7
    This article ... an article about the Caucasus ... what unites them is the presentation of the image of the Russian people as an enemy to everyone and everything ... people thanks to which these ethnic groups actually survived as original cultures.
  • their
    their April 27 2014 07: 56
    +10
    The West wants to apply and is already applying the Ukrainian scenario in Kazakhstan. They hit the most painful places, since February they have brought down tenge by 20%. In the hope of causing discontent among the people and mass demonstrations, which are immediately initiated by the 5th column. Did not work. Frightened, the authorities drove military equipment in Almaty under the guise of exercises.

    Only the West will have a problem making such a scenario in Kazakhstan. They’ll just shoot everyone if they act according to the Independence Manual. A great example of Zhanaozen 2011, crushed the riot in an hour. They introduced an emergency, blocked everything; Internet, cellular, telephone. They shot all the rebels, put the organizers in jail.
    1. blizart
      blizart April 27 2014 08: 53
      +6
      Here in the East, indecision is a sign of weakness, and the weak do not stand on ceremony, which is not the Karimov family’s incursions.
    2. miasoman
      miasoman April 27 2014 19: 13
      -1
      Yes, they worked well there ... but this is not the capital. In Astana it would be more difficult ..
    3. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist April 27 2014 22: 40
      -4
      Quote: sus
      The West wants to apply and is already applying the Ukrainian scenario in Kazakhstan. They hit the most painful places, since February they have brought down tenge by 20%. In the hope of causing discontent among the people and mass demonstrations, which are immediately initiated by the 5th column. Did not work. Frightened, the authorities drove military equipment in Almaty under the guise of exercises.
      Only the West will have a problem making such a scenario in Kazakhstan. They’ll just shoot everyone if they act according to the Independence Manual. A great example of Zhanaozen 2011, crushed the riot in an hour. They introduced an emergency, blocked everything; Internet, cellular, telephone. They shot all the rebels, put the organizers in jail.

      Are there any organizers ??? It's the same as in the case of the shot outpost, they found the "scapegoats".
  • dim242
    dim242 April 27 2014 08: 00
    +7
    can we swing Japan on the topic of nuclear genocide or the German "night of the long knives" or again "express concern" about their "Barbarossa" plan, etc. our history is long, unlike the "s", although these are in such a short time pretty much pissed around the world
  • siberalt
    siberalt April 27 2014 08: 15
    +2
    Well yes. Let's talk about the processes of "zombie" in Ukraine and Kazakhstan. Isn't the same thing happening in Russia? All on a single tracing paper.
  • sem-yak
    sem-yak April 27 2014 08: 16
    +8
    And we need to remember and throw the public a sea of ​​Indians of North America with the prices of scalps and extermination of indigenous peoples during the development of new territories of the current USA! As well as the mass inquisition in Europe, the rights of the first wedding night of the bonfire at the absurd charge of witchcraft! And then they are white and fluffy, and we are continuous genocide! Than judging judges to dress up, it’s not better to turn on yourself! You should not be shy to apply the enemy technique to him yourself! So to speak -Your fat and yes to your muslim!
  • Andrey KZ
    Andrey KZ April 27 2014 08: 17
    +23
    Many suffered during those times. It is criminal to divide along ethnic lines who suffered more and who suffered less. I have already exhibited photos from the district archive of my maternal ancestors. Great-great-grandfather, after dispossession of kulaks, died at a mine in Krasnogorsk, Uzbek SSR. Under the photo there is an inscription "Temirlanovka. The estate of a villager Chernyavsky, who has 400 heads of Kyrgyz sheep".
    1. Kazbek
      Kazbek April 27 2014 09: 30
      +14
      Quote: novobranets
      It remains to say thank you. Everything is clear, understandable and short - without any water. For a topwar, it’s usually uncharacteristic. For this and respect hi
      Quote: siberalt
      The fact that the Bolsheviks staged genocide is complete nonsense!
      "Good intentions ..."
      Of course they didn’t want to, but by the results ...
      Quote: Andrey KZ
      Many suffered in those days. To share on a national basis who is harmed more, who is less, is criminal.
      Here the nuance is that the Kazakh and Russian people developed, the so-called. "culture of hunger" - adaptation to critical moments, in this case to hunger, especially the Kazakhs already had an understanding of unfavorable cycles and developed mechanisms to mitigate the consequences.
      But, the famine of the 30's. was a completely new phenomenon for the Kazakhs, therefore, it hit the Kazakhs so hard, it was because they were completely unprepared for this .. Hence the scale of the disaster for the Kazakhs, which affected almost the entire people and the siege, and accordingly extremely painful attitude to these events ..
      If, somewhere wrong correct and supplement .. hi
  • Arkan
    Arkan April 27 2014 08: 24
    +11
    Is this the intention to repeat the Ukrainian scenario in Kazakhstan?


    Khan is getting old, the receiver is not named, and a wide field for "activity" opens up. "Die Welt" is not a tabloid leaf, so this is a provocation coming from the top of the German, European political and economic elite. The Drang nach Osten policy continues.
    1. Netrocker
      Netrocker April 27 2014 10: 49
      +7
      There is already a successor - his nephew for his first wife ... But how will the people perceive this? Wait and see...
      1. hommer
        hommer April 27 2014 14: 01
        +20
        Quote: Netrocker
        There is already a successor - his nephew for his first wife ...


        Well, that is not a fact.

        And according to the article, we very clearly differentiate who is guilty of terrible hunger, where we lost a third of the population.
        The Russians living in Kazakhstan suffered from this in exactly the same way as the Kazakhs.
        And to go down to the indictment specifically against the Russian people, as in Ukraine, our people will not.
        Put out the brackets of Natsik marginals on both sides.
        1. miasoman
          miasoman April 27 2014 19: 18
          0
          Your words - yes to God’s ears! hi
        2. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir April 27 2014 20: 09
          -5
          Quote: hommer
          Put out the brackets of Natsik marginals on both sides.

          if a person is told 99 times that he is a pig, then at 100 he grunts.
          if you regularly write about the terrible consequences of "colonization", that all Russian pigs, the younger generation will end up hating Russians
          1. ekzorsist
            ekzorsist April 27 2014 22: 50
            -5
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            Quote: hommer
            Put out the brackets of Natsik marginals on both sides.

            if a person is told 99 times that he is a pig, then at 100 he grunts.
            if you regularly write about the terrible consequences of "colonization", that all Russian pigs, the younger generation will end up hating Russians

            But in reality it already is! Although they "try" "very hard" to show that this is not so, but! as soon as something is not according to their layout, this will remind ...
        3. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist April 27 2014 22: 47
          -5
          Yes !!! Your words to God in the ears !!!
          Better yet, somewhere in capital letters, but in all languages ​​write ... and do not forget to perform.
  • novobranets
    novobranets April 27 2014 08: 35
    +14
    Further, in the Kazakh Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic were going to create livestock farms - large farms of the European type, which gave the best land and pastures and for which they gathered cattle from nomads. They wanted to make it so that there was a lot of meat and milk, but it did not work out. And now attempts to create large livestock farms in Kazakhstan almost always fail. Climate and conditions are not suitable for European-type animal husbandry.
    From time immemorial, Kazakhs were nomads. How, where and when to overtake herds, this, I am not afraid of this word, art, was passed down from generation to generation. Depending on how dry or rainy the summer was, the old people decided which cattle would go at the beginning, and which at the end of the winter. Each clan had its own land, and the borders of the pastures were honored by neighbors. No one knew better than them how to do it better. Wrong and erroneous organizational decisions, without taking into account local conditions, have undermined cattle breeding in Kazakhstan. It’s the same as, during the flight, go into the cockpit and start telling him how to control the plane, the result will be one, disaster. If not for this, the Kazakhs would feed meat to half of the country, at least.
    1. siberalt
      siberalt April 27 2014 08: 57
      +8
      When they talk about "Holodomor", they forget to remember the extremely severe drought across the entire latitude of Ukraine - Volga region - Kazakhstan. 2 years of total drought! And no one will remember that all the people gave their last savings to help those affected by the drought. Or was it not? Want a certificate? My father, born in 1903, secretly from my grandfather, the Knight of St. George, stole the only gold ducat from his chest and took it to the village council for the starving in the Volga region. Until the end of his life he reproached himself that he had not admitted this to his father. The fact that the Bolsheviks committed genocide is complete nonsense!
      1. siberalt
        siberalt April 27 2014 09: 08
        -1
        Look at Soviet posters and plunge into that time, and not into pi * ndosovskoy propaganda!
        http://topwar.ru/uploads/images/2014/897/ogww800.jpg
        1. siberalt
          siberalt April 27 2014 09: 09
          +2
          Or so.http: //topwar.ru/uploads/images/2014/639/tcpt728.jpg
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Netrocker
        Netrocker April 27 2014 10: 53
        +13
        But the article is not the whole truth. It seems that they are trying to whitewash Goloshchekin, throwing the blame from him on some local heads. The main difference between hunger in Kazakhstan and Volga is in its artificial origin! If there was a drought in the Volga region for several years, then in Kazakhstan there was simply a weaning of cattle, and besides! And this was the main product among the Kazakhs ...
  • edmed
    edmed April 27 2014 08: 49
    +5
    The method has been rolled out, so change it, Ukraine, Kazakhstan, and then Siberia, where there was also a famine of the 30s. So they will drive wedges, maybe it will burst somewhere else. By the way, there, in the West, they did not manage to cook up something " the organized famine cost the lives of millions of Americans, "perhaps democracy does not allow it?
  • blizart
    blizart April 27 2014 09: 02
    +5
    It’s like, during a flight, go into the cockpit and start telling him how to control the plane, the result will be one, disaster
    And that one "psheprashem Panov" has already entered, so what? The entire government of the country was "ugrohal", but again who is to blame? Of course the Russians! In general, it seems to me that the bogey of the world "extreme" is gradually passing from the soft Jewish hands, into the strong, weary hands of the Russians.
  • Asan Ata
    Asan Ata April 27 2014 09: 16
    +32
    Our past is with us, not going anywhere. Independence games are exciting, but deadly if you lack a conscience. My father's teacher, Professor Vozdvizhensky, who received a mandate to study the geology of Kazakhstan from Lenin's hands, said that when he rode along Turksib, thousands of Kazakhs lay along the embankment of the railway, dying, stretching out their hands for help, but there was no way to help everyone. In the aul of the mother, in the north of Kazakhstan, there is a grove "Adamolgen", where thousands of hungry people from the steppe found their end, where, apart from the selected cattle, there was nothing to eat. How many people died near Lake Balkhash, relying on fish that Kazakhs could not catch? All this was, the perpetrators died. There was everything, even cannibalism. The book "Unsyz gave" about these events, written by an eyewitness, was recently published. The perpetrators are the nominees from the Goli, themselves nothing, and left nothing behind. Kazakhs, Jews and Russians were all there. I am convinced that in our steppes for animal husbandry, wheat, rice, cotton are the costs of the USSR, when there was no currency to close the gaps. But not about that. The victory of communism could not be without mistakes, no one had experience. Millions of deaths are tuition fees. Having buried the USSR, we also buried the memory of them, leaving no high words in history about a society of honor and conscience. Capitalism, as a social manifestation of the basest passions of man, has won. Alas. But the story is not over, the anti-human essence of capitalism is obvious to people, and people will look for the way of life that makes everyone happy.
    1. Zymran
      Zymran April 27 2014 09: 51
      +7
      Quote: Asan Ata
      The victory of communism could not be without mistakes; no one had experience.


      So there was no victory of communism, as well as communism itself. laughing
      1. alone
        alone April 27 2014 10: 20
        +8
        Quote: Zymran
        So there was no victory of communism, as well as communism itself.

        laughing
        1. foxxi
          foxxi April 28 2014 15: 14
          +2
          there were a couple of steps to victory, but then a fateful labeled type appeared and sold for a premium, it all collapsed ... but this country was built on bones, soldered with blood, and this tip had no right to bring it down ... but the words from the song do not throw ...
      2. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 27 2014 22: 56
        -7
        Quote: Zymran
        Quote: Asan Ata
        The victory of communism could not be without mistakes; no one had experience.


        So there was no victory of communism, as well as communism itself. laughing

        If it were not for the victory of communism, there would be no you either ... as Comrade Sukhov said - "... that's for sure!"
        1. Zymran
          Zymran April 28 2014 00: 01
          +5
          Remind me in which country communism was built? It seems to be in no way. He is such a communism, you know, you can build, but you can’t build it.
    2. tokin1959
      tokin1959 April 27 2014 10: 36
      +3
      this is the result of the fact that every cook can manage the state.
      competent, competent people had to be put in power, and they were put - stupid, but devoted to the idea of ​​Bolshevism.
      manage it in the end learned, but "screwed up" pretty much.
      and people will not be returned.
      1. Strashila
        Strashila April 27 2014 13: 38
        0
        "this is the result of the fact that every cook will be able to govern the state." ... only there was still to study, study and study again ... for some reason they modestly forget about this.
        1. tokin1959
          tokin1959 April 27 2014 16: 58
          +1
          who argues - learned.
          and before that all their "shoals" were dumped on the intrigues of enemies of the people and British spies.
      2. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 27 2014 22: 59
        -4
        Well, about "literate, competent people" ... as it was not so long ago passed - Gaidar, Berezovsky, and there are still a bunch of gramoneous and most competent "people" only ended even worse.
      3. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 29 2014 19: 46
        -3
        No, everything that is happening now is the result of finger-bending and folding - which nation is cooler, which is more titular.
        Under the Soviet Union, everything was more modest ... and the language of grinding time was less - they worked, studied, and, oddly enough, they built up, and now they are more occupied with brain-boltology and, instead of studying, buying diplomas ... but there’s no time to work. the stupid newfound missions from Uncle Sema mow around the cities and villages of the USSR, and the people are being led as at one time by the Papuans to beads and mirrors, and again to the same Amerikans, to see a gift from them, among Amers, to breed such suckers for beads and mirrors.
    3. Strashila
      Strashila April 27 2014 12: 34
      +2
      "Kazakhs, Jews, and Russians. All were there." ... key.
    4. 11111mail.ru
      11111mail.ru April 27 2014 13: 56
      +3
      Quote: Asan Ata
      Having buried the USSR, we buried the memory of them, without leaving high words about the society of honor and conscience in the history

      Thank you for your reasonable thoughts and the right words! M.B. they will understand a certain number of "rabid", tearing each other's throats for green candy wrappers. "Sponsors" will be sobered only by the block, because they are mankurt. I agree with you!
  • Kuvabatake
    Kuvabatake April 27 2014 09: 18
    +5
    It's time to start writing about fascist purges throughout Europe and Asia, about American Indians and blacks. There you don't even need to embellish, just inflate the topic and feed our "bosom friends" in Geyropa and Yusei ...
  • Zymran
    Zymran April 27 2014 09: 33
    +2
    However, now Kazakhstan is witnessing attempts to transfer all responsibility for the mass famine to Russians, and present the Kazakhs as the only victims.


    On the commies actually, and not on Russian. But in general, the USSR in the minds of the Kazakhs is inseparable from the Russian Empire.
    1. vovan1949
      vovan1949 April 27 2014 09: 51
      +8
      Are the commies again to blame? You will compare the "commie" Kunayev DA, what he did for the development of the country and the current "commie" - a shape-shifter who has been enriching his family and a handful of confidants for a quarter of a century.
      1. Zymran
        Zymran April 27 2014 09: 55
        +9
        Quote: vovan1949
        Are the commies again to blame?


        Who? Again the Masons and the Anglo-Saxons?

        Quote: vovan1949
        You will compare the "commie" Kunaev DA, what he did for the development of the country and the current "commie" - a shape-shifter, who has been enriching his family and a handful of confidants for a quarter of a century.


        And it didn’t occur to you that the entire current government consists of former commies and party nomenclature and they are doing what they are used to doing?
        1. alone
          alone April 27 2014 10: 21
          +5
          Quote: Zymran
          Who? Again the Masons and the Anglo-Saxons?

          No, Obama and Saudi Arabia)) wassat
          1. romb
            romb April 27 2014 10: 36
            +2
            No, they were not forgotten. They just go - by default.
          2. tanit
            tanit April 27 2014 16: 34
            +1
            No, you are also personally. laughing Best regards hi
            1. alone
              alone April 27 2014 21: 55
              +5
              Quote: tanit
              No, you are also personally. Yours faithfully

              laughing belay What an honor !! I'm flattered repeat About respect mutually)) hi
        2. 11111mail.ru
          11111mail.ru April 27 2014 13: 59
          -4
          Quote: Zymran
          And it didn’t occur to you that the entire current government consists of former commies and party nomenclature and they are doing what they are used to doing

          You such a concept as the Yeltsin set does not suggest anything?
          1. tanit
            tanit April 27 2014 16: 38
            +4
            And what was that in Kazakhstan? Can you read more about this set in a particular country? - In Kazakhstan? I doubt it, I'm sorry.
            1. 11111mail.ru
              11111mail.ru April 27 2014 21: 29
              -1
              Quote: tanit
              I doubt it, I'm sorry.

              "Kazakh President Nursultan Nazarbayev said he could extend his longest rule of any former Soviet leader by running for a fifth term in 2016," source: http://www.diapazon.kz/
    2. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 02
      -5
      Quote: Zymran
      However, now Kazakhstan is witnessing attempts to transfer all responsibility for the mass famine to Russians, and present the Kazakhs as the only victims.


      On the commies actually, and not on Russian. But in general, the USSR in the minds of the Kazakhs is inseparable from the Russian Empire.

      Than you here remind a kind of Novodvorskaya very cool !!! This is the one that would not happen - "damned commies !!!" and will roll back the ruin again.
      1. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 29 2014 19: 57
        -4
        Quote: Zymran
        On the commies actually, and not on Russian. But in general, the USSR in the minds of the Kazakhs is inseparable from the Russian Empire.

        Hmm, human memory is short, and most importantly - shameless ...
        But these quotations: "... a commie actually ...", communists, Komsomol members, pioneers, octotes ... were and are much more expensive than any currently trained Babapanov or Balashokite, and they were smarter. And they defended their homeland not with chatter-tongues and finger-poking into the keyboard, but with real deeds - the Great Patriotic War, Vietnam, Cuba, the Middle East ... and the whole geography of the earth.
        Have you personally helped anyone and what? Where did you stand up for the weak? .... and in response, another howl and diarrhea will be heard now, that’s the difference! Look for the root of all evil in yourself first, and only then poke and teach others.
  • Giant thought
    Giant thought April 27 2014 09: 36
    +1
    Russophobes are everywhere, including in Kazakhstan.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg April 27 2014 09: 53
      +7
      Quote: Giant thought
      Russophobes are everywhere, including in Kazakhstan.

      Why is any different opinion from your perceived as Russophobic or fascist or something like that. I understand that this is such a method in a dispute that the opponent should be made an initially excusing side (he should not talk about his point of view, but that he is not a Russophobe or a fascist). By analogy, you can immediately write Kazakh or Turkophobes everywhere in the Russian Federation, and marked their posts on this thread.
      1. Zymran
        Zymran April 27 2014 09: 56
        +8
        No, well, strictly speaking, he is right. Russophobes / Turkophobes / Anglophobes and other phobes are everywhere. laughing
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 27 2014 10: 03
          +4
          Quote: Zymran
          No, well, strictly speaking, he is right. Russophobes / Turkophobes / Anglophobes and other phobes are everywhere. laughing

          phobias and phobias are everywhere who argue. Just why their opponents in the dispute immediately write in Russophobia request.
          1. alone
            alone April 27 2014 10: 22
            +6
            Quote: Semurg
            phobias and phobias are everywhere who argue. Just why their opponents in the dispute immediately write in Russophobia


            Because there are no arguments and arguments for what was said, that’s why! If you think a little differently, then you’re the fifth column, a traitor and work for the State Department’s money. That's the whole argument !!
            1. 11111mail.ru
              11111mail.ru April 27 2014 14: 20
              -7
              Quote: lonely
              That’s the whole argument !!

              Learn why there are gaps in writing sentences, applying a soft sign after hissing, then argue with your opponent, and do not knock him on the virtual physiognomy with the handle of a virtual gun on virtual teeth.
              1. tanit
                tanit April 27 2014 16: 30
                +5
                Good advice - have you tried to use it yourself? laughing
                1. 11111mail.ru
                  11111mail.ru April 27 2014 20: 50
                  0
                  Quote: tanit
                  have you tried to use it yourself?

                  Point out my mistakes, and I will not be lazy, and I will not hesitate to apologize and correct. But, from my point of view, the expression "my tongue = my enemy" is more suitable for / user / lonely /.
              2. alone
                alone April 27 2014 18: 05
                +6
                Quote: 11111mail.ru
                Learn why there are gaps in writing sentences, applying a soft sign after hissing, then argue with your opponent, and do not knock him on the virtual physiognomy with the handle of a virtual gun on virtual teeth.

                This advice is better reserved for your compatriots. I studied in the national sector, but I write much better in Russian than those who were born and grew up in Russia. And about my comment, do you have anything else to say? Because what I wrote is TRUTH.
                1. 11111mail.ru
                  11111mail.ru April 27 2014 20: 57
                  0
                  Quote: lonely
                  You have nothing to say?

                  The New Testament (Gospel of Matthew, ch. 13, vv. 24-30) tells how a man sowed good wheat seeds in his field, and his enemy scattered weed seeds in the same field at night. When the field turned green, the slaves said that weeds and weeds also came up with the wheat and offered to pull them out. The owner decided differently: “But he said: no, so that, choosing tares, you do not pull out wheat with them; let both grow together until the harvest; and during the harvest I will tell the reapers: first collect the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them, and take the wheat to my granary. "
                  1. alone
                    alone April 27 2014 22: 00
                    +4
                    And where is the New Testament? With this story, you want to say that we are all those who don’t support you with the Russian flag and we don’t mentally support you — are we all enemies? You should not look for enemies where they are not. Enemies in your home. Your enemies are your oligarchy, your thieves - officials. And the search for external enemies is a great way to cover up the actions of internal enemies. A clever trick to avert eyes. A simple way of counterintelligence.
      2. romb
        romb April 27 2014 10: 17
        +8
        Recently, when reading the Russian press, I have a persistent feeling that some Russians are consciously beginning to instill a lot of different kinds of mania and phobia. Here is one clear example. A priori, any opinion that runs counter to or at least somewhat differs from the general line of the "party" automatically becomes liberal, anti-Russian and, in general, openly Russophobic. In short, raising mindless hordes of hamsters is going strictly according to plan. That's just, this has already happened once in Europe, and it all ended very badly.
        1. Koshel2901
          Koshel2901 April 27 2014 11: 33
          +3
          romb, it seems you are not indifferent to Russians, they cause you rather ambiguous emotions. What is the reason?
          1. romb
            romb April 27 2014 12: 23
            +16
            I can assure you that this is an extremely erroneous opinion. I have a very good attitude to the Russian people! This applies not only to me, but also to most of the Kazakhs, who consider the Russian people very close in terms of their inner worldview. The Kazakhs have several peoples (not counting the Turkic peoples), to which the epithet "baurym" - brother is applied without any irony. Russians are just one of these peoples. The real relationship between our peoples can be judged at least by the fact that over the past twenty years since the proclamation of independent Kazakhstan, there have been practically no incidents of an interethnic nature between the two peoples. And this in conditions of general chaos, says a lot. hi

            And at the same time, on my part, it would not be fair if I did not say the following: personally, I do not respect stubborn Natsik (not to be confused with nationalists) and fascists from among the representatives of the Russian people, because I believe that they, with their outbursts and stinks, worsen relations between our two peoples and undermine the level of bilateral trust.
            So they need to troll wink
            1. Koshel2901
              Koshel2901 April 27 2014 22: 51
              -4
              I read several of your opuses on various topics and, unfortunately, I have a definite opinion about you. What do you suffer from Russophobia to a certain extent and your style is similar to the style of amers in information processing, do not tell me which educational institution you graduated from? And the style of amers is to assure of a great friendship and immediately ask for something (or even demand) to confirm this friendship from another.
        2. RUSS
          RUSS April 27 2014 13: 13
          +4
          Quote: romb
          anything that runs counter to or at least somewhat different from the general line of the "party" automatically becomes liberal, anti-Russian and, in general, openly Russophobic.


          There is such a thing, I also talked about this, "who is not with us that liberal." Personally, I do not share the ideas of socialism and communism, and I am not unambiguous about Stalin, so what? it turns out that I am a liberal or a Russophobe, a traitor?
          1. foxxi
            foxxi April 28 2014 15: 18
            +2
            Well, you yourself need to decide ... who you are ..
        3. 11111mail.ru
          11111mail.ru April 27 2014 14: 23
          +1
          Quote: romb
          is already was once in Europe and all that it ended very badly.

          Nothing, gentlemen, comrades, you are capable people, you still have everything ahead.
        4. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 09
          -4
          romb !!! A similar question - why, when expressing their opinion on any issue, do Kazakhs simply stand on their hums ???
          And why forgetting why they boast so much and everywhere - with respect to elders and so on, so on ...
          How strange it turns out and is rather one-sided - don’t you?
          1. romb
            romb April 29 2014 19: 03
            +1
            At what forgetting why they boast so much and everywhere - with respect to elders and stuff, stuff, stuff

            And how does this "stream of consciousness" relate to what I wrote? wink
            1. ekzorsist
              ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 06
              -4
              Quote: romb
              And how does this "stream of consciousness" relate to what I wrote?

              God forbid?!?!
              Where are we to you, oh the wisest, most just, light and support of peace and darkness !!!
              For you, no barriers.
              Only now your question changed too ... and as you see the title ones do not sleep !!!
              1. romb
                romb April 29 2014 20: 14
                +2
                Carefully read what you have done yourself, and then think: "what did I want to say?"
                And here: "respect for elders"? What are you - do not understand? laughing
                As for "rearing up" - but how to behave if the opponent, more often than not, just bullies stupidly? I see no point in scattering beads where you can send a person somewhere further.
                Is it clear now wink
                1. ekzorsist
                  ekzorsist April 30 2014 21: 23
                  -2
                  Well, I calmly and carefully read your entire bullshit ... I do not send.
                  I’m trying to show that the world is not black and white, but there are also a bunch of other colors and opinions, and you are stubborn only cut.
                  Time will tell who is right.
                  1. romb
                    romb April 30 2014 23: 43
                    +1
                    You know, there is a significant difference between us. Yes, I agree, indeed, I do not exclude the likelihood that in some cases I carry frank delirium. But, you see, even in this case, I do not allow myself the freedom to write any kind of emotional vileness towards the whole people.
                    Therefore, to your claim, I will answer this way: what did you want? Here you want, if you want to, you just have to read your comments, the conclusions themselves are straightforward, and they beg: admit you really pound, turn inside out, only from the mere mention of the existence of such a state as Kazakhstan, and Kazakhs, you obviously you don’t think of people. You’re already ready to use bricks to write one more, another disgusting thing about the country in which you live, and about the people who surround you poorly. Maybe instead of presenting it to the Kazakhs, you just take it, look at yourself from the side and honestly (at an old age) tell yourself that what you are in this life is nobody's calling you.
                    And if this at least somehow reassures you, then, in my opinion: there is no black and white, but there are various shades of gray. wink
                    1. ekzorsist
                      ekzorsist 1 May 2014 23: 12
                      -3
                      Quote: romb
                      and Kazakhs, you obviously don’t think of people.

                      Here you are deeply mistaken! I have many true friends - Kazakhs, who will say this - would like to see you far with your national patriotic slogans, well, let’s say so - with your hosts, the Amers.
                      And it’s quite normal and calm that we can discuss any crazy idea on the great formation of Kazakhstan in the current reality.
                      Quote: romb
                      You are already ready to bricks, if only to write another, another muck about the country in which you live, and about the people who surround you poorly.

                      You see, you yourself are simply that can only be rude ...
                      Yes, thank God many people are surrounded by different people and it’s very bad that there are people like you among them.
                      Quote: romb
                      (in old age) you will say to yourself: that you are in this life - nobody calls you in any way.

                      And where is already older ??? Are you really a schizophrenic ??? I kind of made it clear that I was born in the Kazakh SSR, when the current president of Kazakhstan was still
                      was a worker in construction management (at least so in his biography).
                      Well, about the "presentation to the Kazakhs" ... this is your luscious maximalism and cookies from the US State Department are banging, but it will pass.
                      Just compare the slogans and ideas of the Maidan and the slogans and ideas that immediately moved all the kagal on behalf of Kazakhstan ... read, read - they look like they were copying, even disgusting.
                      Well, okay, explaining anything to the Nazis is useless, because there are no brains.
                      1. The comment was deleted.
                      2. ekzorsist
                        ekzorsist 2 May 2014 20: 39
                        -3
                        Not respected "romb" ... I understood why you are "romb", think, maybe you will figure it out and come out like "crug".
                        And your verbal nonsense has simply become uninteresting to everyone - Adyu.
                      3. The comment was deleted.
  • Scandinavian
    Scandinavian April 28 2014 07: 28
    -3
    semurg KZ Yesterday, 09: 53 ↑

    Quote: Giant thought
    Russophobes are everywhere, including in Kazakhstan.

    Why is any different opinion from your perceived as Russophobic or fascist or something like that. I understand that this is such a method in a dispute that the opponent should be made an initially excusing side (he should not talk about his point of view, but that he is not a Russophobe or a fascist). By analogy, you can immediately write Kazakh or Turkophobes everywhere in the Russian Federation, and marked their posts on this thread.


    Dear, that I do not really hear such a term among the people as Kazakhophobia and Turkophobia. I think the term Kazakhophobia should not be used, because, in essence, it is not in nature. For the following reasons:

    1) Too different demographic (number of population) weight categories - this is to compare the elephant and the Pug

    2) Historical events - in general, Russia was an empire, and accordingly the small peoples of the current CIS countries were "afraid" of the Russian Empire ... I specially wrote it in quotation marks.

    3) The confrontation was in the person of the West and Russia ... but not in the person of the Kazakhs and the West, or the Turks and the West ... Asia has always been submissive and, in fact, a multi-vector policy for this reason, since the time of the "King of the Peas"

    Therefore, let's not come up with new terms and absurdities, such as Kazakhophobia and Turkophobia ....
    1. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist 1 May 2014 23: 16
      -2
      Quote: Scandinavian
      Dear, that I do not really hear such a term among the people as Kazakhophobia and Turkophobia. I think the term Kazakhophobia should not be used, because, in essence, it is not in nature. For the following reasons:

      1) Too different demographic (number of population) weight categories - this is to compare the elephant and the Pug

      2) Historical events - in general, Russia was an empire, and accordingly the small peoples of the current CIS countries were "afraid" of the Russian Empire ... I specially wrote it in quotation marks.

      3) The confrontation was in the person of the West and Russia ... but not in the person of the Kazakhs and the West, or the Turks and the West ... Asia has always been submissive and, in fact, a multi-vector policy for this reason, since the time of the "King of the Peas"

      Therefore, let's not come up with new terms and absurdities, such as Kazakhophobia and Turkophobia ....

      I agree ! Well, here the nazpaty "got a taste for you" too ... they don't like the truth, they don't like it !!! They are simply puffy from her.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • 11111mail.ru
    11111mail.ru April 27 2014 14: 12
    -1
    Quote: Thought Giant
    Russophobia is everywhere

    Oddly enough, but you are amazingly perspicacious: Gorbachev, Yeltsin, Shushkevich, Kuchma, Gaidar, Shakhrai, Burbulis, Sobchak, Chubais ... Koch, Urinson, Serdyukov, twice Prime Minister. It’s just surprising that all this shushera is fat (in) in the upper echelons of ErEf’s power, and doesn’t eliminate (economically) the consequences of their activities in places where their activities are controlled by relevant structures?
  • hommer
    hommer April 27 2014 14: 12
    +7
    Quote: Thought Giant
    Russophobes are everywhere, including in Kazakhstan.


    I’ll tell you more - there are enough Russophobes even in Russia!
    1. Argyn-suindyk
      Argyn-suindyk April 27 2014 17: 56
      +7
      Kazakhophobes exist in Russia and Kazakhstan, and Russophobes live all over the world! Is there a difference yes ?! Therefore, sometimes in the assessments and comments of the Russian brothers, such notes of resentment are traced as if the whole world, including the Kazakhs, were against them! Therefore, there is no need to react sharply to some inappropriate comments! I know for myself!
    2. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 11
      -6
      Can add ? And in Kazakhstan there is darkness - darkness !!!
      1. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 09
        -3
        Quote: ekzorsist
        Can add ? And in Kazakhstan there is darkness - darkness !!!

        What is the truth pricks eyes ???
  • Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 09: 48
    0
    Kazakhstan is a stable state with a vast territory (effective nature and natural resources) Northern Kazakhstan is generally abandoned ..)) There are many who wish for this tidbit .. So, Kazakh brothers do not relax!
    1. romb
      romb April 27 2014 10: 43
      +7
      Northern Kazakhstan is generally abandoned ..)) There are many who wish for this tidbit.

      Northern Kazakhstan - there are many who want it? And who is our neighbor in the north? They themselves were scared, and they themselves answered - who should be afraid. cool wassat
      1. Yeraz
        Yeraz April 27 2014 13: 18
        +10
        Quote: romb
        Northern Kazakhstan - there are many who want it? And who is our neighbor in the north? They themselves were scared, and they themselves answered - who should be afraid. cool

        either burned, or subtly hinted))))
        1. alone
          alone April 27 2014 22: 13
          +7
          Quote: Yeraz
          either burned, or subtly hinted))))

          "My tongue is my enemy" worked here !! laughing He just forgot that in the North Kazakhstan borders only with Russia))
          1. ekzorsist
            ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 13
            -7
            Quote: lonely
            Quote: Yeraz
            either burned, or subtly hinted))))

            "My tongue is my enemy" worked here !! laughing He just forgot that in the North Kazakhstan borders only with Russia))

            No, I just showed my face ... by accident.
    2. Smiles to you
      Smiles to you April 27 2014 12: 33
      +1
      effective nature


      Nature-virgin... hi
      1. romb
        romb April 27 2014 12: 38
        +6
        In this case, the disclaimer is correct. She - nature, unfortunately, is no longer virgin. hi
  • Zymran
    Zymran April 27 2014 09: 49
    +4
    Quote: MIKHAN
    Northern Kazakhstan is generally abandoned ..)) There are many who wish for this tidbit ..


    For this piece, only one is willing. laughing
    1. Semurg
      Semurg April 27 2014 09: 58
      +7
      Quote: Zymran
      Quote: MIKHAN
      Northern Kazakhstan is generally abandoned ..)) There are many who wish for this tidbit ..


      For this piece, only one is willing. laughing

      while I heard three names Zhirinovsky, Limonov, Shtygashev, well, a couple more people, though they didn’t very articulate their demands.
      1. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 15
        -4
        Quote: Semurg
        Quote: Zymran
        Quote: MIKHAN
        Northern Kazakhstan is generally abandoned ..)) There are many who wish for this tidbit ..


        For this piece, only one is willing. laughing

        while I heard three names Zhirinovsky, Limonov, Shtygashev, well, a couple more people, though they didn’t very articulate their demands.

        Well, well ... and the owner is another and also one - NAS and his family.
        1. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 15
          -3
          Quote: ekzorsist
          Quote: Semurg
          Quote: Zymran
          Quote: MIKHAN
          Northern Kazakhstan is generally abandoned ..)) There are many who wish for this tidbit ..


          For this piece, only one is willing. laughing

          while I heard three names Zhirinovsky, Limonov, Shtygashev, well, a couple more people, though they didn’t very articulate their demands.

          Well, well ... and the owner is another and also one - NAS and his family.

          Oh, just don't say it's not true !!! This is the "great" open secret in Kazakhstan.
    2. 11111mail.ru
      11111mail.ru April 27 2014 14: 27
      -3
      Quote: Zymran
      For this piece, only one is willing.

      Learn Chinese if you don't want to speak Russian. yes
      1. Argyn-suindyk
        Argyn-suindyk April 27 2014 17: 57
        +7
        Dunce, we speak Russian if that, but we don’t forget our native!
        1. 11111mail.ru
          11111mail.ru April 27 2014 21: 36
          -1
          Quote: Argyn-Suindyk
          Therefore, there is no need to react sharply to some inappropriate comments! I know for myself!

          Quote: Argyn-Suindyk
          Dunce we talk

          Polite you, however ... Sundyk.
          1. ekzorsist
            ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 17
            -5
            Quote: 11111mail.ru
            Quote: Argyn-Suindyk
            Therefore, there is no need to react sharply to some inappropriate comments! I know for myself!

            Quote: Argyn-Suindyk
            Dunce we talk

            Polite you, however ... Sundyk.

            Yes !!! Well, what, and what they can’t take away from them! Politeness is rushing !!!
            And most importantly - truthfulness, where profitable.
          2. foxxi
            foxxi April 28 2014 15: 22
            +3
            do not distort the login ... not a chest, but a chest! if anything...
  • sova8
    sova8 April 27 2014 09: 57
    0
    A lot of bukfs ,,, in short, the meaning is clear .. Now, in response, the Russians should write about fascism ... In the same Ukraine, Belarus and other countries ,,, look in Germany. Jews who suffered. ,,, further according to the scheme
  • Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 10: 00
    +2
    Quote: Zymran
    Quote: MIKHAN
    Northern Kazakhstan is generally abandoned ..)) There are many who wish for this tidbit ..


    For this piece, only one is willing. laughing

    China ... bully
    1. Zymran
      Zymran April 27 2014 10: 06
      +5
      Why not NATO? By the way, yesterday, not a single patriot could explain where NATO could carry out military aggression against Kazakhstan.
      1. romb
        romb April 27 2014 10: 26
        +4
        Sus generally has problems. He happens to blurt out what others say and write, and when you start asking about his personal opinion on the situation, he then goes into a stupor. In a word, it reminds me more not of representatives of the homosapiensev species, but of something similar to artificial creature laughing
        1. their
          their April 27 2014 12: 22
          -2
          Quote: romb
          Sus generally has problems. He happens to blurt out what others say and write, and when you start asking about his personal opinion on the situation, he then goes into a stupor. In a word, it reminds me more not of representatives of the homosapiensev species, but of something similar to artificial creature laughing


          So what is this discussion of me? Are you trying to discredit me in the eyes of readers and offend you with your message? Why is it asking? I think anyone is interested in why you are doing this, just look at the history of my messages and understand the reason for your not so beautiful behavior.

          I expressed my opinion, I do not answer because I do not follow the answers, now I paid attention and once again became convinced of my version.
          1. romb
            romb April 27 2014 12: 25
            +3
            And what did you answer. I didn’t see the answer? laughing
            1. their
              their April 27 2014 13: 55
              -2
              I just answered you, and who said that I should answer you? :) Think for yourself, no one owes you anything.

              Given that you have an Israeli name in general, Kazakhstan proxies ... And according to your behavior, you fully reveal yourself. There is no difference between atalef and other Israelites.
            2. The comment was deleted.
              1. foxxi
                foxxi April 28 2014 15: 24
                +2
                laughing class ... respect
      2. Vitaly Anisimov
        Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 10: 33
        -1
        Quote: Zymran
        Why not NATO? By the way, yesterday, not a single patriot could explain where NATO could carry out military aggression against Kazakhstan.

        I can explain in secret ... You have no borders and no one guards them ..! A small mobile gang through your vast territory will pass like a knife in oil .. ( bully We protect your airspace .. (well, the missiles are in the mines.) (No offense, but the way it is ..) Your army is for parades .. laughing And in our Army, the Kazakhs serve as expected ..
        1. Zymran
          Zymran April 27 2014 10: 54
          +6
          Quote: MIKHAN

          I can explain in secret ... You have no borders and no one guards them ..! A small mobile gang through your vast territory will pass like a knife in oil


          Well yes. Covering a gang in the steppe is not difficult.
          1. romb
            romb April 27 2014 11: 15
            +12
            The Poles and other NATO members also believed that this could be done: "like two fingers on ...." - when they first arrived for an exercise at one of the Kazakhstani training grounds. After heatstrokes and general dehydration of the body, and as a result of a considerable number of fainting spells among the brave warriors, they were forced to honestly admit that their chance of survival in the desert-steppe zone of Kazakhstan is extremely low.
            1. foxxi
              foxxi April 28 2014 15: 26
              +3
              That's right! They didn’t come in the winter, and they would also freeze ...
          2. ekzorsist
            ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 23
            -5
            Yeah, remember how under the Alma-Ata for three months they searched not so long ago with a whole horde ... and? And here you look - we’ll close the whole territory with a hat! Yes, under the Union it was not so simple.
            1. Zymran
              Zymran April 28 2014 00: 02
              +3
              What does this have to do with NATO aggression?
              1. ekzorsist
                ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 22
                -3
                Quote: ekzorsist
                Yeah, remember how under the Alma-Ata for three months they searched not so long ago with a whole horde ... and? And here you look - we’ll close the whole territory with a hat! Yes, under the Union it was not so simple.

                Quote: Zymran
                What does this have to do with NATO aggression?

                So about how under the Alma-Ata they searched for a gang of their dozen people for more than three months - is it true ??? At what quite a large force with the participation of even military units !!!
                And here you want to cover the whole territory of Kazakhstan with one Kazbat !!! Do not make laugh ... and so funny. Yes, in the same steppes for ten years, people who are wanted cannot be found until they themselves accidentally show up.
                1. Zymran
                  Zymran 1 May 2014 11: 33
                  +2
                  Quote: ekzorsist

                  So about how under the Alma-Ata they searched for a gang of their dozen people for more than three months - is it true ???


                  A gang of ten people can be searched for long and hard both in the city and in the mountains.

                  Once again, what does this have to do with NATO aggression?
        2. Semurg
          Semurg April 27 2014 11: 06
          +4
          Quote: MIKHAN
          Your army for parades .. laughing

          if the neighbors think so, we should think about it the same, if this is really so, then this is a direct invitation to aggression, if we have the military, like in Ukraine, every second "potential traitor" should think about it the same. If that war is possible with our neighbors or as an internal conflict, and both of these options are possible with a weak army.
        3. The comment was deleted.
          1. Zymran
            Zymran April 27 2014 11: 08
            +7
            Well, in principle, this is true - the ancient soviet technique and the same ancient regulations. Give Leopards 2, Rafali, Patriots and Rolands, and also Spikes, Javelins, Milans, Exosets, Apaches and Boxers! bully
            1. Semurg
              Semurg April 27 2014 11: 16
              +3
              Quote: Zymran
              Well, in principle, this is true - the ancient soviet technique and the same ancient regulations. Give Leopards 2, Rafali, Patriots and Rolands, and also Spikes, Javelins, Milans, Exosets, Apaches and Boxers! bully

              weapons are important, but the main thing is the brains of the warriors (in Ukraine, warriors merge in general unarmed or lightly armed). First of all, the Armed Forces should be well cleaned and sifted for those who will merge tomorrow with the "aliens" (in Ukraine, almost half of the generals had dual citizenship, it was given to them for their beautiful eyes laughing )
              1. Zymran
                Zymran April 27 2014 11: 18
                +3
                To be honest about the drain, the "aliens" first need to sift through the government, starting with ... laughing
                1. Semurg
                  Semurg April 27 2014 12: 46
                  +2
                  Quote: Zymran
                  To be honest about the drain, the "aliens" first need to sift through the government, starting with ... laughing

                  if the president presses, they are replaced even very quickly, and you won’t replace the army so quickly, you won’t replace it. And as you can see in Ukraine at this moment, the shifts will be fucking. There the Kyrgyz ruled out the ruler two times and even with the massacre of the national minority who wanted to move along with the land, but they were lucky the states around them said that it was their own business to decide for themselves and did not get to protect compatriots or restore historical justice or give lessons to popular democracy.
              2. 11111mail.ru
                11111mail.ru April 27 2014 14: 45
                -5
                Quote: Semurg
                First of all, it would be necessary to clean the aircraft well and sift it for those who will merge tomorrow with the "aliens" (

                So what was the matter? Reporting in Kiov, tai nehai stink;
                1. Argyn-suindyk
                  Argyn-suindyk April 27 2014 17: 59
                  +2
                  Are you such a villain brother?
        4. tanit
          tanit April 27 2014 17: 05
          +6
          There are borders. And they are being guarded. Try them (borders) to move along secret paths. hi . And the army of Kazakhstan - not only for parades, although at parades it does not look much worse than ours. Kazakhstan is not the most unsuccessful state formation. hi
        5. Aptimist
          Aptimist April 27 2014 23: 19
          +2
          Well, you guy bent !!!! I have not heard such a heresy about my former country yet !!!
          you at least some kind of info own about KZ? Or so, on top and polavka rumors and prejudices are you collecting?
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. miasoman
        miasoman April 27 2014 19: 33
        -2
        From the air. It's all right?
    2. The comment was deleted.
      1. Vitaly Anisimov
        Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 10: 59
        -2
        Quote: romb
        Honestly - choke. bully

        The north of Kazakhstan is now desolate (after the collapse of the USSR) The main population concentrated where oil and gas are .... (the rest of the territory is abandoned ..) You will not restore it explicitly .. (wait when we begin to develop ..))
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 27 2014 11: 09
          +2
          Quote: MIKHAN
          Quote: romb
          Honestly - choke. bully

          The north of Kazakhstan is now desolate (after the collapse of the USSR) The main population concentrated where oil and gas are .... (the rest of the territory is abandoned ..) You will not restore it explicitly .. (wait when we begin to develop ..))

          nope this is the foundation of future generations laughing actually .
          1. Vitaly Anisimov
            Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 11: 13
            0
            Quote: Semurg
            Quote: MIKHAN
            Quote: romb
            Honestly - choke. bully

            The north of Kazakhstan is now desolate (after the collapse of the USSR) The main population concentrated where oil and gas are .... (the rest of the territory is abandoned ..) You will not restore it explicitly .. (wait when we begin to develop ..))

            nope this is the foundation of future generations laughing actually .

            They launched their own fund .. (locusts and all sorts of muck. Comes from you ..))) Really!
          2. The comment was deleted.
            1. Zymran
              Zymran April 27 2014 11: 16
              +4
              Quote: MIKHAN
              They launched their own fund .. (locusts and all sorts of muck. Comes from you ..))) Really!


              You hesitated with the locusts, it always migrates to us from you, and not vice versa.

              2012 year http://total.kz/society/2012/07/16/sarancha_iz_rossii_gubit_posevy

              2013 http://www.inform.kz/eng/article/2566412

              This year the campaign will fly again.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. romb
          romb April 27 2014 11: 18
          +1
          Have mercy. You can't figure it out at home: "they've arranged a giant Muhosk on half of the country." And you try to help everyone else.
          Russia is a generous soul wassat
          1. Vitaly Anisimov
            Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 11: 40
            0
            Quote: romb
            Have mercy. You can't figure it out at home: "they've arranged a giant Muhosk on half of the country." And you try to help everyone else.
            Russia is a generous soul wassat

            Don't be so angry .. Well, a little criticism .. hi We, too, have a lot of problems hehe heh And do the Army all the same (you never mind ..) bully
            1. romb
              romb April 27 2014 11: 43
              +4
              And I'm not angry! So - the usual irony over Russian Russians and their idea of ​​Kazakhstanfellow
              1. Vitaly Anisimov
                Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 11: 53
                -2
                Quote: romb
                And I'm not angry! So - the usual irony over Russian Russians and their idea of ​​Kazakhstanfellow

                I just observe a resection zdorovskaya ..))) it is interesting to cling to you (for nerve endings)) laughing Agree, you have no Army ..!
                1. hommer
                  hommer April 27 2014 14: 27
                  +7
                  Quote: MIKHAN
                  I just observe a resection zdorovskaya ..))) it is interesting to cling to you (for nerve endings)) Agree, you have no Army ..!


                  And the point is to cling to us? Or is there another goal not advertised?
                  We have an army. For protection and peace on the borders with Central Asia. Enough. And to create an army to compete with two neighbors - China and Russia, thank you, there are no fools.
                  Yes, and with regard to the remark "Russian Russians have an idea of ​​Kazakhstan" - the true truth. I visit Russia and see how Russian Russians differ from Kazakh Russians. I am not saying that for the better or for the worse, but the truth is, they differ.
                2. Argyn-suindyk
                  Argyn-suindyk April 27 2014 18: 00
                  +3
                  All of course in comparison, not for you! For someone there!
                3. Kasym
                  Kasym April 27 2014 22: 25
                  +5
                  Eh, Mikhan, Marek is not enough for you here - he probably "composes" the technical regulations for the new Union (Khristenko recently came to see if he warmed them up).
                  I will answer this way. In tanks - 1000 units are capable of T-72B. This is more than in Germany and England combined. Another 4 in reserve (T-000, T-62). BMP and armored personnel carriers in abundance. It was said that armored personnel carriers were even delivered to the border guards. In fact, everything is in order with the armored vehicles thanks to the Semipalptinsky factory for the repair of armored vehicles. Our specialists, when they got there after the collapse of the USSR, there were only walls left. So they restored it themselves - then technical documentation and help was provided by Ukraine (Kharkov), of course, not for free. I know people who were involved in this plant.
                  Aviation 2nd largest in numbers and readiness after the Russian Federation. According to the authorities, the pilots raid for about 150 hours (one of the largest in the CIS). In service with the Su-25,27,24; MiG-23,27,29,31; Mi-8,24,6. There is an acute shortage of transport workers - during the events in Zhanaozen, soldiers were thrown over by a citizen. sides. Therefore, due to the inability to buy in Ukraine and Russia, they purchased the S-295 (in my opinion, there are 8 boards, some of them have already been received). There are 20 Mi-6s (26), but the Russian Federation is repairing ... 1 unit per year, the An-12 is at a joke due to the impossibility of repair. Generally speaking, aviation began to modernize in 2007. For example, at the beginning of the year received 3 modernized (repaired) Su-27s from Belarus (if I am not mistaken), there is a program for the MiG-31. Even the MiG-23 (27) were not thrown out as in the Russian Federation, but they repaired everything they could. We confirmed interest in up to 98 units of the MiG-35, but it is not there yet. And in general, at the moment, Russia cannot supply everything that Kazakhstan is interested in in the field of aviation. Either tolerate, or in development.
                  Air defense. There are from Tunguska to S-300. Recently, several divisions of the S-300 RF handed over to us for free. True, modernization is required. Not enough medium range Buk, Thor. Since we are creating a single air defense space, this kind of troops, I think, will be a priority.
                  Artillery. There are Tulips and Peonies, Acacia and Hyacinths, etc. .. In Petropavlovsk (North. Kaz.) Tochka-U was gathered, which is in service.
                  The Navy is weak, but much attention is paid to it.
                  The Armed Forces of the Republic of Kazakhstan have a population of up to 70-80 thousand people. There are mountain infantry units that were recently restored in Russia after Chechnya. We had a reform - now there is a brigade manning. You just recently started to do it. Airborne troops appeared. All this is on the internet, Meehan.
                  I don’t know how it will be this year, but in the past there was a parade with a demonstration of live firing (look, there is on the Internet). Talking about the combat capabilities of the army of Kazakhstan is difficult. But the exercises are going on regularly. Maybe not on such a scale as in Russia, but often at the level of battalions. Food for a long time (earlier than in the Russian Federation) is civil, the floors do not wash. About half of the contractors. Pass the term - the parents give bribes to the military enlistment offices - a problem, because of the greater competition. Without service promotion in state. service becomes a problem.
                  According to the authorities, military equipment is being upgraded to 10% per year. In the region of Central Asia is considered the most prepared and modernized. All strike weapons are of Soviet (Russian) origin. We have Western Hammers (gifted and very expensive to operate), Huey helicopters (a few pieces, gifted), communication systems, S-295 transport, and our peacekeeping contingent (which Humvey and Huey uses) has Western weapons.
                  1. Kasym
                    Kasym April 27 2014 22: 35
                    +5
                    Much attention is paid to the military-industrial complex. Recently, an optics factory was opened with the Turks (thermal imagers and all that). There are contacts with Israel, Turkey, France, etc. .. Helicopters have begun to collect. Like the Russian Federation woke up, let's see what comes of this. Soon we have a military exhibition - let's see what new products threaten us. The last ones were Terminators - BMPT. Took 4 pcs. , checked and now we’ll take it into service, on the basis of our T-72s they will do from the reserves. In my opinion, Terminators have not even been accepted from you, but ours have already given the go-ahead. hi
                    1. ekzorsist
                      ekzorsist April 27 2014 23: 30
                      -6
                      Quote: Kasym
                      based on our T-72 of stocks will do.

                      This is one of those who "buried" under Otar to please amers?
                      So the same may be offended.
                      1. Kasym
                        Kasym April 28 2014 16: 30
                        +6
                        At the time of the collapse of the USSR, only 10 units of armored vehicles were on the Semipalatinsk armored vehicle. hi
                      2. ekzorsist
                        ekzorsist April 28 2014 21: 55
                        -2
                        And there was a motorized rifle division cropped ... in the vicinity of Temirtau, Tselinograd, Karaganda, etc. .. And the training division in the flock .. there were also vehicles above the roof, etc. .....
                        But here is that in order to please precisely the amers at the dawn of the proximity of Kazakhstan, they buried them in huge ditches in the ditches ... they didn’t even bury them, but simply dumped and dumped the armored vehicles, often without even properly disassembling them (they were in a hurry to please this uncle) ... and witnesses there was - DARKNESS, international representatives from the striped states were also, and even applauded.
      2. Vinnipukh
        Vinnipukh April 27 2014 12: 27
        +13
        Coachman, do not drive, you drive, coachman! Where did you see desolation in the north of Kazakhstan? Something I do not see any desolation in our Kostanay region.
      3. tanit
        tanit April 27 2014 17: 10
        +2
        Honestly, there is a border, there is an army. There is also the north of Kazakhstan. All this is and coexists in a single period of time. hi At least as of now.
    3. The comment was deleted.
  • Turk
    Turk April 27 2014 10: 01
    0
    Quote: sem-yak
    And we need to remember and throw the public a sea of ​​Indians of North America with the prices of scalps and extermination of indigenous peoples during the development of new territories of the current USA! As well as the mass inquisition in Europe, the rights of the first wedding night of the bonfire at the absurd charge of witchcraft! And then they are white and fluffy, and we are continuous genocide! Than judging judges to dress up, it’s not better to turn on yourself! You should not be shy to apply the enemy technique to him yourself! So to speak -Your fat and yes to your muslim!

    +100000, and you can’t forget about Africa.
  • pakconsi
    pakconsi April 27 2014 10: 03
    +1
    They give a card to the Chinese, Kazakhs say their teeth:
    All this is like dying cramps!
    The worst thing is that anything can be expected from these jackals ...
    1. sova8
      sova8 April 27 2014 10: 37
      +2
      At first, I was also bothered ,,,))) then, looking at the map, there are many other territories included not only in Russia, and plus there are no territories that China now has, so if something comes up to him at first it’s time to get its own back then the beginning before than looking at other territories .. I. Generally. What happened 1000 years ago or when there ... you can generally outline the entire globe and skzat before the Slavs lived everywhere. Or everything belongs to the Africans as the first people on earth ,,, in short. We got everything with all this division of lands ,,,
  • sova8
    sova8 April 27 2014 10: 08
    0
    And as they say, whoever the past will remember that eye out ,, Let’s then. And another little article. We will write about the genocide of the Indians. And we will come to America with a good mission. Let them return to their places from noble soil, pay everyone up to one injured compensation, and for life Or will we bring discord and support the ideologists in this? Hmm ,,
    1. Semurg
      Semurg April 27 2014 10: 17
      +3
      Quote: sova8
      And as they say, whoever the past will remember that eye out ,, Let’s then. And another little article. We will write about the genocide of the Indians. And we will come to America with a good mission. Let them return to their places from noble soil, pay everyone up to one injured compensation, and for life Or will we bring discord and support the ideologists in this? Hmm ,,

      write. they only care about it, and the topic of hunger in the RK has been studied and described for a long time in our country, and if you have the time and desire, you can find a lot of materials. As accusing and justifying the Soviet regime in this, and you already draw a conclusion yourself who is lying and who is writing the truth.
      1. sova8
        sova8 April 27 2014 10: 38
        -2
        To whom do Indians or Americans?
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 27 2014 10: 53
          +3
          Indians are not Americans?
        2. The comment was deleted.
    2. foxxi
      foxxi April 28 2014 15: 32
      +3
      US Indians are not for the most part citizens of this country ... simply out of principle.
      1. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 28 2014 21: 58
        -4
        Quote: foxxi
        US Indians are not for the most part citizens of this country ... simply out of principle.

        Is it like Russians in Kazakhstan or what?!?
        1. foxxi
          foxxi April 29 2014 06: 57
          +5
          we have all the citizens ... do not exaggerate!
          1. ekzorsist
            ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 28
            -3
            Quote: foxxi
            we have all the citizens ... do not exaggerate!

            Yes, of course, BUT NOT "TITLE" !!!!!
            Yes, and they do not speak the "correct" dialect, and in general they are to blame for everything - they "staged a famine," they built cities, all kinds of factories ... in short, of course, citizens, but how was it explained to me not so long ago somewhere here on the site - "... bye ..." citizens.
            1. ekzorsist
              ekzorsist 1 May 2014 23: 21
              -2
              Quote: ekzorsist
              Quote: foxxi
              we have all the citizens ... do not exaggerate!

              Yes, of course, BUT NOT "TITLE" !!!!!
              Yes, and they do not speak the "correct" dialect, and in general they are to blame for everything - they "staged a famine," they built cities, all kinds of factories ... in short, of course, citizens, but how was it explained to me not so long ago somewhere here on the site - "... bye ..." citizens.

              What is the minus sign for? Or Russians in Kazakhstan have become "TITLE"!?!? I'm getting old completely, I listened to the latest news from the Maslikhat.
              It will be necessary for acquaintances to say let them run faster to put the stamp "title".
  • sv68
    sv68 April 27 2014 10: 17
    +8
    Kazakhs are smarter than the president’s president and Yanukovych. Therefore, in Kazakhstan, repeating the Ukrainian scenario can be considered virtually impossible for Kazakhstan as such in modern conditions, only open intervention can hypothetically threaten it, but it’s out of the category of fiction and even more so Russia will never abandon its Kazakh brothers in trouble and Kazakhs will be able to figure it out themselves with the fifth column
    1. hommer
      hommer April 27 2014 14: 44
      +7
      Quote: sv68
      Kazakhs people smarter president than Yanukovych can not be compared


      You can have a different attitude to our president.
      But to compare with Yanukovych (and the three previous ones combined) is not correct.
      Different weight categories. laughing

      Quote: sv68
      all the more so, Russia will never abandon its Kazakh brothers in trouble, and the Kazakhs will be able to deal perfectly with the fifth column themselves


      Thank you for not giving up, we firmly know. And on the fifth column - don't worry, we'll figure it out. The muzzles have already been beaten by the homosexuals who were trying to whitewash the organizers of the Turkestan Legion.
  • Standard Oil
    Standard Oil April 27 2014 10: 24
    -3
    And what if everyone suddenly began to starve? Stalin, of course, personally shot a couple of billion people and a few more trillions together with Beria. Was it such a whim to look at how people die of hunger? He took everything from them and what did he take to his barn? all agricultural products? Maybe because the West agreed to sell technologies only for agricultural products? And the young Soviet state did not have enough gold to pay for everything. Cultural values ​​have already been sold to the West and are not going to buy villas with the proceeds they built themselves in the Canaries, and factories. Or maybe we didn't need all this, why we need it, they would have devoured it. And then we would have met the German tanks with sticks and stones. If we could live happily ever after. We are here under the Germans, and the Kazakhs are probably under The Japanese would have turned around. The Japanese did not take the Chinese for people, so talking brute. Sometimes you want to take and send the doctors screaming about the "Stalinist Holodomor" in such an alternative future, let them see how life is there. I especially liked it, because a Japanese samurai could cut off the head of any Kazakh, Chinese or any other "talking cattle" just because he thought he was looked at with disrespect. That would be fun.
    1. romb
      romb April 27 2014 10: 33
      +1
      Have you tried anything smarter than that? wink
      1. 11111mail.ru
        11111mail.ru April 27 2014 14: 57
        -1
        Quote: romb
        Have you tried anything smarter than that?

        Dear, you, I hope you are not smarter than L.N. Gumilyov? Read with him, as the Incas ordered the petition to be submitted to the superior: on his knees, without raising his head and BACK to the requested person. So what about the Japanese sekim head offensive, your opponent is absolutely right.
        1. romb
          romb April 27 2014 17: 29
          +1
          If you are talking about general erudition, then I have no question. It is possible and Iiken heisatsu, due to the reluctance of the subject to carry out voluntary euthanasia by conducting hara-kiri.
          The question was a bit about other things.
    2. Argyn-suindyk
      Argyn-suindyk April 27 2014 18: 02
      +1
      Do you have a temperature or something?
  • Alekst
    Alekst April 27 2014 10: 35
    +2
    Zadolbali with similar articles, they don’t live there calmly!
    I didn’t even read!
    it’s a pity that the filter is here.
  • Koshel2901
    Koshel2901 April 27 2014 10: 45
    +1
    It is time to puzzle America and Europe with their internal problems, such as racism in America, Islamism in Europe, otherwise these will not lag behind Russia
  • The comment was deleted.
  • bubla5
    bubla5 April 27 2014 11: 12
    -2
    And I generally fuck
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 11: 20
    +1
    Quote: bubla5
    And I generally fuck

    Well done! )) briefly and to the point!
  • gozmosZh
    gozmosZh April 27 2014 11: 22
    -6
    Quote: bubla5
    And I generally fuck


    How so? And Pavlodar? and Baikonur? And our people?
    1. Argyn-suindyk
      Argyn-suindyk April 27 2014 19: 12
      +2
      The Chinese will eat them!
  • ruslan__86
    ruslan__86 April 27 2014 11: 58
    0
    yes, they were already staggering with these famines; I have not yet had dinner.
  • Turkir
    Turkir April 27 2014 11: 58
    +5
    As they are, these German "historians" were alarmed.
    They began to read books, as if to quarrel us with someone else. That's just how they killed us, Kazakhs and Russians, Ukrainians and Belarusians, well, they don’t want to remember. How they hung children, women, nurses and prisoners. They don’t remember anything.
    Such humanists are just creepy becoming.
    1. 11111mail.ru
      11111mail.ru April 27 2014 15: 01
      -1
      Quote: Turkir
      Don't remember anything

      Unfortunately, the memory is selective, and with the appropriate "grease" of the handyman it becomes selective (escheat).
  • Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 12: 07
    +1
    Kazakhs when we plow virgin lands ..? Wheat will be super! And what kind of crucian carp are you there .. raki .. geese duck .. Oh damn ..
    1. romb
      romb April 27 2014 12: 40
      +5
      Do you like trolling, Dear Leonid. laughing
    2. Semurg
      Semurg April 27 2014 12: 50
      +2
      Quote: MIKHAN
      Kazakhs when we plow virgin lands ..? Wheat will be super! And what kind of crucian carp are you there .. raki .. geese duck .. Oh damn ..

      Ukrainian salts were tried laughing Now you look at the geese-uteya of Kazakhstan wink
      1. Vitaly Anisimov
        Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 13: 30
        -1
        Quote: Semurg
        Ukrainian salsa we tried laughing now at the geese-uteya of Kazakhstan

        Ukrainian salt (there are military industrial complex factories there ..) And you have a wild steppe and Baikanur .. In the Soviet Socialist Republic, towns built towns .. (they tried to mine and grow something ..)) the USSR didn’t all fall apart .. (yurts are just good for 100 km ..)) no offense he checked .. laughing
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 27 2014 14: 57
          +5
          what resentment? the fact that we have room? The Chinese came to me a dozen envied saying, there are a lot of land, green grass is holoso. And the most vivid impression of childhood is the summer vacation spent with my grandfather in a yurt. And one cop per 100km was really high, but somehow I went to Moscow and ate cops full.
          1. Stavros
            Stavros April 27 2014 20: 26
            -5
            You be careful there, otherwise the Chinese will return again and send you back to the grandfather's yurt. This time forever.
        2. Zymran
          Zymran April 27 2014 15: 08
          +7
          AND locust locust !! laughing laughing
      2. 11111mail.ru
        11111mail.ru April 27 2014 15: 03
        0
        Quote: Semurg
        Ukrainian salts are now tasted on Kazakhstan geese

        Consume your salmonellosis yourself.
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 27 2014 19: 39
          0
          Quote: 11111mail.ru
          Quote: Semurg
          Ukrainian salts are now tasted on Kazakhstan geese

          Consume your salmonellosis yourself.

          Thank. After Ukrainian fat, you already got pork tapeworm, not counting its natural worms.
          1. 11111mail.ru
            11111mail.ru April 27 2014 21: 12
            -4
            Quote: Semurg
            After Ukrainian fat, you already got pork tapeworm, not counting its natural worms.

            Lard, like dollars, has no fatherland! In all my life I have not eaten a single piece of bacon! Honest pioneer !!! According to your natural worms: I am not a proctologist, but I haven’t looked into your hollow, I cut my nails regularly and wash my hands with soap and water. In Russia, for a long time, it was customary to go to the bathhouse at least once a week and not eat pilaf and other culinary delights with dirty hands (by the way, do you remember the translation of the word "beshbarmak" into Russian?).
            1. Semurg
              Semurg April 28 2014 09: 23
              +3
              Quote: 11111mail.ru

              In all my life I have not eaten a single piece of bacon! Honest pioneer !!! In Russia, for a long time, it was customary to go to the bathhouse at least once a week and not eat pilaf and other culinary delights with dirty hands (by the way, do you remember the translation into Russian of the word "beshbarmak"?).

              fat did not eat hmm ..... maybe not Russian. Yes, we eat the traditional Kazakh dish with our hands, so why not be shy (although some ask for spoon-forks). With dirty hands? - probably judge by yourself.
            2. The comment was deleted.
        2. The comment was deleted.
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. Netrocker
      Netrocker April 27 2014 16: 30
      +4
      Interestingly, why bother her? To again blow it all down as in Khrushchev?
    5. tanit
      tanit April 27 2014 18: 05
      +3
      You forgot about the snakebird (snakehead) hi Because the thing is not like "carp".
  • shevart89
    shevart89 April 27 2014 12: 18
    0
    Ltd., preparation for the World Cup started
  • sanek0207
    sanek0207 April 27 2014 12: 25
    +1
    It is sad that, as Ukraine "got stuck" in all sorts of "Kuchma", and so it began!
  • Strashila
    Strashila April 27 2014 12: 51
    +3
    If you just type in the Internet "Holodomor of 1930", you will see a lot of interesting things.
    Famine has covered the whole world !!! And the advanced USA and civilized Europe ... everyone was starving !!!
    And the Russians are to blame for this ???
    1. Semurg
      Semurg April 27 2014 13: 05
      +5
      Quote: Strashila
      If you just type in the Internet "Holodomor of 1930", you will see a lot of interesting things.
      Famine has covered the whole world !!! And the advanced USA and civilized Europe ... everyone was starving !!!
      And the Russians are to blame for this ???

      SOVIET AUTHORITY is guilty in Kazakhstan in hunger. Or do you have the Soviet government and the Russian people (Russians) the same thing?
      1. Strashila
        Strashila April 27 2014 13: 43
        -4
        This is the author of such articles.
        I will repeat myself on the wing of everyone ... and hunger would be no exception in Kazakhstan, this is a global trend of that time, only thanks to the Soviet government they did everything to prevent it.
        No need to hope for the exclusivity of one nation in the world community ... will affect everyone, but not us.
        Just telling it would not be anyone.
        And by the way, about the birds ... in Ukraine they like to attribute the famine to the Soviet regime ... but only at the same time the same thing happened in the so-called Western Ukraine (the territory of Poland, Romania, Hungary) on a smaller scale ... exactly the same famine ... but it was in civilized Europe ... for what to talk about it.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. romb
      romb April 27 2014 13: 10
      +5
      And if you look carefully, you will easily understand that the famine in Kazakhstan was not as a result of any currency fluctuations on the London Stock Exchange or the Rothschild manipulation, but was a direct consequence of the criminal policy pursued by the authorities to eradicate the institution of nomadic cattle breeding for account of forced collectivization.
      1. Vitaly Anisimov
        Vitaly Anisimov April 27 2014 13: 50
        -1
        Quote: romb
        conducted by the authorities with the aim of eradicating the institution of nomadic cattle breeding through forced collectivization.

        Well, eradicated .. and what? "20 years without occupation) and the pastoralists are not visible on the horizon ..)) laughing
        1. Strashila
          Strashila April 28 2014 07: 17
          -2
          Naturally, it is not observed ... Kazakh state-owned millionaire farms collapsed after coming to local government with an awakened self-awareness ... so little things ... the Germans who processed all this went to Vaterland.
      2. 11111mail.ru
        11111mail.ru April 27 2014 15: 10
        0
        Quote: romb
        Institute of nomadic cattle breeding

        Please tell me the location (location), the approximate number of employees, the number of doctors, candidates, graduate students, a list of departments, vacancies ..., development topics ..., number of grant holders from m -ra Soros. However, if the information is secret in part regarding, then at least an open name.
        1. romb
          romb April 27 2014 17: 26
          +5
          Which institute you are interested in: in the framework of economic analysis; the totality of legal rules governing certain types of legal relations in the branches of law; as a concept for the development of civilization; related to socio-social formation? wink
          Well, if you want to get a higher education - unfortunately, I have to upset you - I have no acquaintances in the selection committee.
          1. 11111mail.ru
            11111mail.ru April 27 2014 21: 24
            -2
            Quote: romb
            in the framework of economic analysis;

            Preferably with an economic profile.
            Quote: romb
            as a concept for the development of civilization;

            As a concept for the development of civilization es ist PHANTASTISCH.
            Quote: romb
            related to socio-social formation

            Feudalism has already passed the stage.
            Quote: romb
            unfortunately, I have to upset - I have no acquaintances in the selection committee.

            Well, damn it, and it seemed a respectable Maine ...
            1. ekzorsist
              ekzorsist April 28 2014 22: 07
              -2
              Quote: 11111mail.ru
              Quote: romb
              in the framework of economic analysis;

              Preferably with an economic profile.
              Quote: romb
              as a concept for the development of civilization;

              As a concept for the development of civilization es ist PHANTASTISCH.
              Quote: romb
              related to socio-social formation

              Feudalism has already passed the stage.
              Quote: romb
              unfortunately, I have to upset - I have no acquaintances in the selection committee.

              Well, damn it, and it seemed a respectable Maine ...

              No, most likely it’s so rushing not childish ...
              In general, about education in Kazakhstan - by the way, education turned into a baaaalshchiy bazaar, but by the way, like much more.
            2. romb
              romb April 29 2014 18: 38
              +2
              As a concept for the development of civilization es ist PHANTASTISCH.

              As I understand it, I need to write a little easier - not everyone gets it. The scale of moral and ethical values ​​and the existing social and social institutions, on which the nomads relied, were quite different from those on which agricultural-urban civilizations were formed. That is, what was valued and what guided the nomads was by no means always generally accepted and did not necessarily find approval among the farmers-townspeople. Each civilization had some kind of "attributes", which, as a distinctive feature, also included various (social, socio-economic, political, etc.) institutions that make it different - unique in comparison with others.
              Feudalism has already passed the stage.

              I am not talking about that. Institute of family, clan, tribe; protection of the interests of the group (political institution) farming, forms and types of extraction of livelihoods (socio-economic institutions), etc.
              And what you indicated is more related to the type of socio-economic formation: the primitive communal system; slaveholding, feudal, etc. etc.
              Well, damn it, and it seemed a respectable Maine ...

              Do you again torment phobias?wink
              1. ekzorsist
                ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 31
                -2
                Quote: romb
                Do you again torment phobias?

                Well no ...
                Simply, if we argue from the point of view of banal erudition, then each local individual has his own point of paradoxical emotions.
                Something like this .
                1. romb
                  romb April 29 2014 20: 51
                  +3
                  laughing
                  How do you predict in your inferiority. For some reason I was ninety percent sure that you would answer me, and moreover, in that form.
                  Bravo! fellow
                  1. ekzorsist
                    ekzorsist April 30 2014 21: 29
                    -2
                    I just want to answer you, yours: "... why throw beads in front of pigs?!?"
                    You have your own story invented by you, but I have my own which was.
                    1. The comment was deleted.
                      1. ekzorsist
                        ekzorsist 1 May 2014 23: 29
                        -2
                        Quote: romb
                        Come on, stop fevering - I realized that you are: "sleeping with your grandmother, and I saw the locomotive twice."

                        No, I met the shaitan-arbu, but the steam train ... I did not see.
                        It's just that your children's conclusions about the "great farming" that will feed and enrich the whole world are just utopia and delirium.
                        Any private firm can work only for profit and only for profit, and charity in it is possible only at the level - "and it is not a pity to throw it away, and donate not to the bastard" ... But to take care of the well-being of all the people of the country ... this is for a private trader - I'm sorry - move over, he doesn't care. For him, the only incentive is HIS well-being, at the expense of others and at any cost.
      3. Strashila
        Strashila April 28 2014 07: 07
        -1
        I repeat ... "There is no need to hope for the exclusivity of one nation in the world community ... will affect everyone, but not us."
        Western Ukraine (8 regions) was part of Poland, Romania, Czechoslovakia and Austria-Hungary. Chronology of press releases. Berlin. 09.01.32/XNUMX/XNUMX, the Deutsche Algemein Zeitung newspaper: “The three-year economic crisis in the country and the enslaving peasantry led to ruin and collapse of Polish agriculture, which was already weak and backward. A state living under the threat of bankruptcy mercilessly squeezes these arrears from the poor peasantry. Particularly ferocious requisitions fall on Ukrainians and Belarusians. The arrival of the bailiff plunges the village into a panic. "He appears accompanied by guards and maklaks, describes everything that is more or less valuable, the one described is immediately sold for next to nothing."
        Polish newspaper "New Hour": "In the Hutsul region, the number of starving farms in 1932 reached 88,6%. The property of the Polish landowners in these years reached 37% in the Stanislavsky Voivodeship, 49% in Polesie. In March, about 40 villages of Kosivsky, 12 villages of Naddvirnyansky and 10 - of Kolomia counties were completely starving. ” The newspaper notes: “People swell with hunger and die on the go. Famine is especially fierce in villages - Perekhresnya, Old Gvizdtsy, Ostrovtsy. Typhoid fever and tuberculosis quickly spread with hunger. ”
        Lviv newspapers reported that in the Carpathian region, the population of Western Ukraine lives in terrible poverty. There are villages in the Kalush Voivodeship where entire families die out of hunger. After the ban by the Polish government to engage in woodworking in a lean year, the Hutsuls did not have any means of subsistence. The government did not provide any help to the starving. People became extinct families.
        The American newspaper Ukrainian National News describes in detail the horrors of famine in Western Ukraine. Here are just a few: “Terrible famine among the mountain population of Western Ukraine” (Zhahlivy famine in the middle of the population of Girsk. “USCHV”, 10.04.32 p.). Describing the horrors of hunger, the newspaper names the reasons: “If three years ago, a lumberjack earned 6 evils from deforestation, 8 from rafting, and in the city this forest was estimated at 70 evolutions, now it’s 2 deforestation and 18 in the city angry Such money is not enough to feed not only the family, but the lumberjack himself. In the article “What they write from Galychyna” (Scho write from Galichini. “USCHV”, 05.04.32/5/10 p.), The author writes about excessive taxes and, due to the low purchasing power of the population, hungry peasants sell their horses for 04 or 05 evils, t i.e. - for half a dollar. The author writes that he wanted to buy a pig, but it is not allowed to cut it privately, but in order to kill, pay a tax, get permission, etc., you need to have a lot of money, but they don’t. 31. 3. 04.04.32. “Ukrainian children in Western Ukraine are forbidden to speak the Ukrainian language” we are talking about a Polish teacher, Maria Voitsychalskaya, who fines Ukrainian students 15000 pennies for using their native Ukrainian language at school. 05.04.32/12.5/50 "Poland and Romania are awaiting the opportunity to attack Soviet Ukraine." The article “XNUMX children in Transcarpathia is threatened with starvation” (“USCHV” on XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX p., F.XNUMX.) Sets out the statements of deputies of opposition parties in the Czech parliament. “In the mountainous districts there are many villages where the food of children consists of a small amount of oat bread and several half-rotted potatoes. Pet and property prices are unusually low due to high taxes. The Czech authorities are to blame for the Ukrainian Transcarpathia and the fact that in this poor province, where there is not enough bread for the half-million population, resettled XNUMX thousand Czech colonists, mostly former military and civil servants, who, with the cruelty of medieval conquerors, pursue a policy of Czechization and economic exploitation there. ”
      4. Strashila
        Strashila April 28 2014 09: 07
        -3
        No need to blame on collectivization ... then it was in its infancy.
        The problem of private economy is ... that private traders sell to those who pay more, and not to those who need it more.
        Hunger is not only the result of the actions of the authorities, on which everyone wants and is trying to hang ... they are mostly the actions of private producers, who took advantage of the moment to try to get rich.
        1. Strashila
          Strashila April 28 2014 19: 47
          -2
          I understand the minus ... I appreciate !!!
          Denial of evidence ... COOL !!!
          For the fifth time I will repeat ... the private owner is only interested in money, the axiom "money does not smell."
          What has changed in this world ... you saw a private trader distributing surplus production ... right !!! rather destroy than allow prices to drop.
          Is it affordable for everyone ???
        2. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist April 28 2014 22: 25
          -4
          Quote: Strashila
          No need to blame on collectivization ... then it was in its infancy.
          The problem of private economy is ... that private traders sell to those who pay more, and not to those who need it more.
          Hunger is not only the result of the actions of the authorities, on which everyone wants and is trying to hang ... they are mostly the actions of private producers, who took advantage of the moment to try to get rich.

          That's right !!!
          Not even one, even the most embarrassed and gilded private owner, will NEVER feed the country's population. For this reason, collectivization was carried out ...
          In principle, the Finns, unlike the ungrateful descendants, perfectly apply the laws of socialism and collective farming and let someone say that they do poorly ... But we have a huge agricultural base before ... we have tomatoes from China, shoes from there too (although there was a wonderful shoe factory near Alma-Ata, at least at that moment, well, smelly ala-turkey sneakers weren’t stamping there!), clothes from ala-versace-urumqi, macaroons and those in Turkish factories are sculpted, and buried their KBC.
          Yes, and not when the private trader will not be able to do something without personal gain ... and even if the country will receive grants ... and the examples of all the famines have shown it perfectly. When hundreds were dying of starvation nearby, and in order not to bring down the price, the grain was buried and putrid, but only no one would get it.
          The same happened with amers, when oranges and meat were drowned in cars at sea, it was not profitable to sell the price was small.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. ekzorsist
              ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 38
              -3
              Quote: romb
              Three million farmers not only supply the population of their country with agricultural products (314 million people), they still manage to export their products to half the countries of the world.

              Have you personally seen these farms ??? The number of workers on one farm? Perhaps the financial component of the American farm was also studied?
              Then compare with the Finnish model and you will see a huge difference.
              And then look back at the so-called "farming" on the ruins of the agricultural complex of the USSR, at least in Kazakhstan ... well, and ??? Is THIS going to feed someone ???
              1. romb
                romb April 29 2014 21: 01
                +3
                Yah...? Are these my words: about the impossibility of feeding the country by private owners?
                Looking for facts? Please, information in bulk in the internet. What else is needed for an "elder"?
  • nnnnnn
    nnnnnn April 27 2014 13: 02
    +5
    X ????? WAIT !!!!!!!!!
  • hhhhhhh
    hhhhhhh April 27 2014 13: 56
    -5
    Quote: svp67
    - and they repeat ... They work roughly.

    It worked in Ukraine - why it won’t work here. (((
    1. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist April 28 2014 22: 30
      -2
      It is sad to admit, but it can work just fine ...
      And the natspaty themselves constantly help this, because the slogans are the same maydanuty, it remains only to bring the cookies with foolishness ... although dope is enough for it.
  • Polarfox
    Polarfox April 27 2014 14: 02
    0
    Here: http://rusarchives.ru/publication/famine/famine-ussr.pdf
    139 megabytes of PDF copies of archival documents from 1930-1934 relating to famine in the USSR. For those who are accustomed to think with their own mind and understand everything on their own, an invaluable thing. Documents have been classified for a long time, the collection was released in 2008. The comments are in English, but the documents, of course, are in Russian. So, sorting out is not difficult. If you want to delve into and have enough patience to rummage through archival documents. There are documents in Ukraine and Kazakhstan, the Volga region, in general, throughout the USSR.
  • silberwolf88
    silberwolf88 April 27 2014 14: 03
    +2
    Nationalism works everywhere and always ... you can always find what to play on ... and a wonderful principle AGAINST WHO FRIENDS is very popular.
    I hope Nazarbayev and his supporters have enough wisdom in governing the country and understanding many of the counteraction factors. In an atmosphere of opposition from the old elites and clans, Nazarbayev rules and much has been achieved.
  • mackonya
    mackonya April 27 2014 14: 06
    +4
    I don't understand why the Kazakhs should blame the Russians for the Holodomor. As far as I know, the victims were Uyghurs, Tatars, Uzbeks, Kazakhs, and Russians. The reason: mismanagement of the "Soviet" authorities in this region, in general, as far as I know, the consequences of collectivization were experienced by all states of the USSR.
    1. Netrocker
      Netrocker April 27 2014 16: 34
      +5
      What other Uighurs in the KZ in the 30s? They only appeared there after the 50s from China. It was precisely the Kazakhs who suffered, since in the 30s cattle were taken precisely from nomadic Kazakh cattle breeders during the struggle against nomadism. Or were Russians and Tatars also engaged in transhumance in the KZ ?! laughing
  • na76
    na76 April 27 2014 14: 14
    0
    They decided there that North Kazakhstan would not hurt Russia either. wassat
    1. their
      their April 27 2014 14: 22
      -4
      You can now Akim of the North and East regions of the KZ dig a ditch 4 meters long and 2 wide, 3000 km long - you can also cut it into aryk-arak and the besparmak can stay on Camry and a couple of toi will remain.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Argyn-suindyk
        Argyn-suindyk April 27 2014 19: 21
        +1
        It’s time for the Kazakh Chechens and Ingush to whisper about the independence of the North Caucasus!
      3. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist April 28 2014 22: 33
        -3
        Quote: sus
        You can now Akim of the North and East regions of the KZ dig a ditch 4 meters long and 2 wide, 3000 km long - you can also cut it into aryk-arak and the besparmak can stay on Camry and a couple of toi will remain.

        Arak-pajero-beshparmak-dibs-drank the same - a national game in Kazakhstan, as in England curling, or amers baseball ...
        1. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist April 29 2014 20: 41
          -3
          Quote: ekzorsist
          Quote: sus
          You can now Akim of the North and East regions of the KZ dig a ditch 4 meters long and 2 wide, 3000 km long - you can also cut it into aryk-arak and the besparmak can stay on Camry and a couple of toi will remain.

          Arak-pajero-beshparmak-dibs-drank the same - a national game in Kazakhstan, as in England curling, or amers baseball ...

          Well, what do you immediately react inappropriately ??? Well, THIS IS THE SAME TRUTH !!!
          Excuse me, what is ... "there is no reason to blame the mirror, since the face is crooked."