Military Review

Did America lose in Ukraine?

136
I would like to express my opinion on the events in Ukraine, but in a slightly different light. To do this, I propose to take for axiom a few statements:


- The United States is politically heterogeneous, Barack Obama and his team belong only to one of the political forces;
- collection "Gold of Scythians" exported to the United States;
- The European Union and the United States are competitors in politics and economics.

And you and I have the following alignment:

- The United States invested billions of dollars in a coup in Ukraine, but only the Scythian Gold collection is worth more than 5-6 times, which means that the United States has done a good business deal, which means they won;

- To squeeze out Russia from the gas market in Europe, Europe needs to be intimidated by the “Russian threat. And what do we see? Russia is annexing the Crimea to itself and in the eyes of Europe immediately becomes an aggressor who can blackmail the EU with gas supplies. What is Europe doing? Looking for other suppliers. And they are surprisingly quickly located, and guess who it is? Well, of course, the United States. Yes, right now they cannot deliver gas to Europe, but the question is put like this: we will do everything so that Russia does not blackmail you with gas for 3-5 years, and then we will give you ours. It means that here the USA won in Europe;

- what does the USA need? For the EU to be strong and compete for America or to continue to remain dependent?
Right, addicted. What can be done for this? Create a hotbed of tension in Europe. What do we see? Ukraine is ready to explode, the Ukrainians, who profess Nazism, will go to Europe. Ukraine will not be a market where Europe can sell its goods, but a hungry and uncontrollable wild field. And if we add to this the "heavily armed Russians", then Europe becomes an obedient and weak calf in front of the USA. So, here too, the USA won;

- well, as a bonus. Obama and his team careers go nowhere. He is replaced by brave Republican guys. And it seems to me that they will play in the same bundle with our president. And this is already a small plus for us - we are not a raw material power, we are participants of big politics.
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  1. awg75
    awg75 April 1 2014 07: 50
    +11
    just an article about nothing. as if the author arrived from Mars only yesterday.
    1. smel
      smel April 1 2014 07: 56
      +1
      Let them spread their thoughts ... It will be considered ... Well, and we will go our own way. Not yet evening. And there is nothing to hope for a good uncle. NEVER BELIEVED SMIERS OF AMERICANS. And apparently he did the right thing, since again they proved that there was no faith in Anglo-Saxon scum.
    2. thrower
      April 1 2014 07: 57
      +4
      Argument, pliz
      1. Bigriver
        Bigriver April 1 2014 08: 32
        +5
        Quote: thrower
        Argument, pliz

        To understand whether America lost or won, you need to know its strategic goals in Ukrainian events.
        I do not presume to say for sure, but I am inclined to believe that the United States fed the Nazis for many years and stratified the entire society of ukrov with hundreds of thousands of NGOs for a constantly smoldering ethnic conflict - Russians versus Ukrainians.
        This conflict should:
        1. To bind Russia "by force" in this direction, to absorb resources.
        2. Guarantee US mediation and a permanent presence in the relationship between Europe and Russia.
        The United States invested $ 5 billion in the coup in Ukraine, but the collection "Scythian Gold" alone costs 6-7 times more, which means that the United States has made a good commercial deal, which means they won

        The storage conditions of the Scythian Gold in the USA are unknown. The reliability of all information on the topic is still questionable. And, the size of the loot of looters does not in any way indicate the victory of the strategy.
        to squeeze Russia out of the European gas market, Europe needs to be frightened by the "Russian threat." we will do our best so that Russia does not blackmail you with gas for 3-5 years, and then we will provide you with ours. This means that here, too, the United States won

        Alternative gas in Europe in a fantastically favorable situation may not be earlier than 2016 with the first gas carriers built. But, in this case, the volume of gas will be less than 10% of the gas supplied by Russia. In addition, its cost is estimated NOW in the amount of about $ 500 per cubic meter, with the price of Russian gas at $ 350-370.
        The career of Obama and his team goes nowhere. He is replaced by the brave republican guys. And it seems to me that they will play in the same tandem with our president.

        What is the basis for the assertion that Republicans will replace Obama?
        And it doesn't matter who comes. We are already playing in the "top echelon".
        SUMMARY.
        Following the results of the first battle, it is too early to draw conclusions about the outcome of the campaign.
        But, of course, this fight is purely ours. Without reservation.
        1. Vladimirets
          Vladimirets April 1 2014 08: 36
          +3
          Quote: BigRiver
          An alternative gas in Europe with a fantastically favorable situation may not be earlier than 2016 with the first gas carriers built. But, in this case, the volume of gas will be less than 10% of the gas supplied by Russia. In addition, its cost is estimated NOW in the amount of about $ 500 per cubic meter, with the price of Russian gas at $ 350-370.

          I would also add that if the states had a real opportunity to replace our gas with their own (these are the corresponding volumes, price, digestible logistics), then they would have long ago displaced us from this market, but the fact of the matter is that, in terms of the totality of qualities, Russian gas most attractive for Europe.
          1. thrower
            April 1 2014 09: 01
            0
            That is why the United States is whipping up the "Russian threat" in Europe, so that all the listed advantages are not important.
          2. Bober
            Bober April 1 2014 09: 22
            +1
            The price of gas is like a rubber band from cowards. We already have it and we can pull it and let it go. The states have no panties or gum yet. As the states are explicitly involved in the transportation process, the price can also be adjusted to show the futility of the American project at a price. The process of playing with rubber can go on forever. A pipe that is and works is already better than what is planned so far in words and already at a much higher price. Second Nabuco.
        2. thrower
          April 1 2014 08: 44
          0
          I agree. It was about this that I said that we won this fight when we became players.
          Regarding Obama, his people are being merged with terrible force, this can be clearly seen from his actions. Why this is done, I do not understand. But it’s real what he could do after all his high-profile statements - to hand over dry packs to Ukraine.
      2. family tree
        family tree April 1 2014 08: 34
        +1
        Quote: thrower
        Argument, pliz

        Yes, they purged, Vitaly. what With their clumsy actions, they showed the whole people who they really are. Many knew this, many understood now, many will think and understand later, and in Europe too. So, they won nothing, and not only that, the game, the time has not yet been played.
        1. thrower
          April 1 2014 08: 49
          +1
          The United States has a wonderful feature - the blame for what is happening will be blamed on the current administration, and the next one will come in white and fluffy.
          And I'm not saying that America won, I say that we won, but they did not lose, that the game has just begun.
          Now the position of those countries that often shone on the Maidan is interesting - Poland, the Baltic states, Germany. They are like a litmus test, especially Poland, which, in case of Ukrainians fleeing to them, even drove the army to the borders.
          1. Bober
            Bober April 1 2014 09: 12
            +2
            We have not won anything yet. We made moves, and these moves at the moment were better than the moves of the enemy. But the party continues. And the successes of previous moves need to be consolidated by subsequent ones.
      3. artifox
        artifox April 1 2014 10: 12
        -1
        Quote: thrower
        Argument, pliz


        Hmm ... but nothing that the collection of "Scythian gold" is not in Omerik, but at two exhibitions - in Amsterdam and St. Petersburg at the moment?

        So why believe unverified rumors, and then also spread them?

        So it is with everything else in this opus ...
      4. avg
        avg April 1 2014 10: 34
        0
        Quote: thrower
        Argument, pliz

        To get started, you argue this phrase.
        The United States invested $ 5 billion in the coup in Ukraine, but the collection "Scythian Gold" alone costs 6-7 times more,
        And why not 0.5 or 25. If you are such a reputable art historian and appraiser, then try to evaluate the Aivazovsky Gallery in Feodosia, the Vorontsov Palace in Alupka, or the Chersonese Museum in Sevastopol ... And better write about what you understand.
    3. Sirocco
      Sirocco April 1 2014 09: 47
      +2
      Quote: awg75
      just an article about nothing. as if the author arrived from Mars only yesterday.

      You are right, the Thrower forgot to mention the Crimea that we acquired. And this acquisition--return, tens of times more valuable than all that gold, and threats of sanctions. Then geopolitics returned to us with Crimea. And the United States and partners got a click on the nose unexpectedly, unexpectedly. But, I urge everyone not to relax. The enemy is cunning and treacherous.
      1. aleks 62
        aleks 62 April 1 2014 11: 01
        0
        Scythian gold has historical value, like almost none of gold (jewelry was made of base gold) ....
    4. Stalnov I.P.
      Stalnov I.P. April 1 2014 10: 14
      +1
      Only the development of our own country, the entire economy, industry in particular, if this is not understood by our government and the supreme power, is this a crime, will we be economically strong, all these political prostitutes will crawl to us themselves.
    5. aleks 62
      aleks 62 April 1 2014 10: 54
      0
      ... Even I have not observed Scythian burial mounds in the Kiev region .... And therefore, it is possible to accuse the "democratizers" of theft ...
    6. Siberian19
      Siberian19 April 1 2014 11: 20
      +1
      from as it’s closer to reality! the bear only sneezed from the bed and everyone crap one's pants!
    7. Ross
      Ross April 1 2014 12: 31
      0
      awg75

      just an article about nothing. as if the author arrived from Mars only yesterday.


      thrower RU

      Argument, pliz


      Unfortunately, not all of us have strategists, or geopolitics.
      Western civilization is ruled not by the States, but by a supranational group. Recently, Swiss scientists with the help of a supercomputer calculated all the intersecting links in the Global Economy and got the result - only 144 families control 70-80% of the world economy. Therefore, it is clear that this group will win in any scenario. And it doesn't matter, not through the US or through the EU and vice versa. Now the elite is not homogeneous and Putin is playing on their contradictions. In a local alliance with Rothschild, it fights with the US, which is why the EU did not merge in ecstasy with the US on the issue of sanctions. And if Obama is a protege of Rothschild (here is a hint in his "indecision"), then all sorts of Nuland and K are proteges of another clan fighting for the US monopoly.
      This is about politics, and in business they are all, and the Rothschilds and Rockefellers are united, in the framework of joint 144 mega-corporations. This is not so simple.
      1. thrower
        April 1 2014 14: 35
        0
        As I understand it, the Rothschilds are Great Britain, the Rockefellers are USA. Who is behind Europe then? Rothschilds?

        If you can discard the link where the information came from, it would be interesting to read.
  2. Fox
    Fox April 1 2014 07: 51
    -4
    and if we take Darwin's theory as an axiom, then the author-monkey! hi
  3. AleksPol
    AleksPol April 1 2014 07: 52
    +3
    Understood nothing . Is that Russia losing coming out? Is this humor like that? fool
    1. waisson
      waisson April 1 2014 07: 58
      +6
      subtle english humor laughing today is april 1
    2. thrower
      April 1 2014 07: 58
      +8
      Russia did not lose, but became a player, the United States did not lose, Obama and his team lost.
      And Ukraine is just a playing field for Europe.
      1. AleksPol
        AleksPol April 1 2014 08: 15
        +2
        It's like in football. Since there is a winner, that is, a loser. Is not it ?
        1. thrower
          April 1 2014 08: 21
          +3
          No, sometimes it’s a draw.
          In general, there was a phrase about the fact that if there is no sucker in the layout, then it means you are a sucker.
          I see Europe as such a sucker, who thought that she could fuck something from Ukraine. But it turned out that they would have Europe itself.
          1. AleksPol
            AleksPol April 1 2014 08: 34
            +1
            A draw is unlikely to suit the players. Russia needs to strengthen its position, and the United States maintain its image of a superpower.
            1. thrower
              April 1 2014 08: 52
              +3
              The United States is a superpower, it does not cause any doubts and will not cause any time soon.
              There will be nothing, Europe will lose. For one simple reason - they have nowhere to take allies, but they are afraid of us.
        2. avg
          avg April 1 2014 10: 50
          0
          Quote: AleksPol
          It's like in football. Since there is a winner, that is, a loser. Is not it

          The Russian-Chinese-Brazilian-Indian friendship won. fellow
          1. thrower
            April 1 2014 14: 38
            0
            In the word BRICS, you missed one letter, there is also South Africa, once a nuclear power.
  4. avant-garde
    avant-garde April 1 2014 07: 53
    -2
    An old grandmother lived in our courtyard, and when we teased her boys she said this:
    "Ba du.r.ak eb na na" in my opinion this is still relevant!
  5. gandalf
    gandalf April 1 2014 07: 53
    +4
    Tactically - the United States has a win in Ukraine, in Europe. But strategically, the US has lost the initiative and are trying to seize it now.

    Crimea is a battle near Moscow. The battle now for the rest of Ukraine is Stalingrad.
    Hitler "took" Stalingrad several times, the result is known.

    I hope in the battle for Ukraine there are reserves for GDP.
    1. aksakal
      aksakal April 1 2014 07: 56
      +2
      Quote: gandalf
      Tactically - the United States has a win in Ukraine, in Europe. But strategically, the US has lost the initiative and are trying to seize it now.

      Crimea is a battle near Moscow. The battle now for the rest of Ukraine is Stalingrad.
      Hitler "took" Stalingrad several times, the result is known.

      I hope in the battle for Ukraine there are reserves for GDP.

      I agree, the controversial subject. Even so - Europe is not a pity, the very sucker, there’s nothing to lie so relaxed under the USA. And I'm even sorry that the US is too soft with her. Probably still loves.
      Well, the main bonus for Russia is ahead. Ukraine will still be won back, Scythian gold will be returned (though this is a long story), and Crimea has already been returned. And as for gas - I doubt something about the abrupt change to Gazprom. Well, they will find another replacement for a few percent of the total volume to Europe - that’s all.
      1. thrower
        April 1 2014 09: 05
        0
        And I'm even sorry that the US is too soft with her.


        Well, imagine that you have a wonderful flock of sheep, why will you kick them hard?
        Well, put in the paddock and you will cut it slowly. And the fact that the sheep came up with their money, and so you are struggling with this, even a photograph of a wolf showed. lol
      2. Loki
        Loki April 1 2014 10: 25
        0
        Perhaps the goal was precisely to push Ukraine into Russia as a payload, to divert resources from everything else. Here the numbers already sounded on the site, what Crimea would cost - like from 10 billion in the most minimal form only for the first time, and then more fleet expansion in infrastructure, etc. Plus, losses from capital outflows and falling capitalization of companies - which means a more expensive loan . Plus, maintaining troops in combat readiness on the Ukrainian border. Plus, the loss of reputation in Europe and the complexity of business there. If Southeast Ukraine is also loading in one form or another on Russia, then the United States will definitely win. As for gas, there is a chance that Syria will be finished off and a pipe will be routed from Qatar, all these conversations about gas from the USA seem to me just a smokescreen, usually the simplest solution - the most correct - and the simplest - Syria
    2. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 02
      +3
      Tactically - the United States has a win in Ukraine, in Europe. But strategically, the US has lost the initiative and are trying to seize it now


      I’m trying to convey the idea that Obama personally lost, the US’s strategic initiative will not go anywhere. Just now, the United States is driving Europe into the corner with the help of Ukraine.
      Pay attention to the actions of Obama - he is rushing around, he is trying to impose some sort of sanctions, but his own are being beaten hands. The most striking example is that the US Congress even blocked aid in 1 billion.
      1. nizrum
        nizrum April 1 2014 08: 15
        +2
        An interesting idea ... Since Ukraine and Syria do not merge, merge Europe !!! belay
        1. thrower
          April 1 2014 08: 22
          0
          Well, why is the US such a currency as the euro?
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. alexng
            alexng April 1 2014 10: 03
            +1
            In short, the United States merges Europe, and Putin, together with China and India, will merge the dollar, that is, the United States. The United States has no particular choice now either. So, forced to go with the flow of red flags, deftly exposed by the opposite side. And the gray-haired Lamb will be blamed for the collapse of America.
            1. thrower
              April 1 2014 10: 21
              0
              Firstly, I’m not sure that Russia will do something to strengthen the yuan, the dollar in this case is preferable.

              And about the draining of the dollar, somewhere there was information about such a currency as "amero".

              About Obama - to the point.
      2. Bober
        Bober April 1 2014 09: 34
        +1
        Barack does not have enough free space to maneuver. Because previous moves deprived him of this advantage. In such situations, sometimes they make a knight's move, but this is usually a transition to a different level of confrontation. And it is not a fact that a knight's move will bring a cardinal change. In this case, Barack can certainly cry that he was deprived of the opportunity to be good, but this interview is a press conference with him, I would like to hear from Rostov ........
        Well, the change of one of their clown to another, should not fundamentally change anything in our vector. Leaders sign documents on behalf of the state, and the state bears subsequent responsibility for these signatures. If these are your leaders, be so kind as to acknowledge that you yourself liked them and you chose them yourself.
        1. thrower
          April 1 2014 09: 38
          0
          Obama thought he was a player, but it turned out that he was just a pawn. Perhaps he is being drained due to weak politics when Europe began to rise, or because he tried to grab someone by the pre-default crisis in the USA. The reasons can be very different, but it is leaked, it is a fact.
  6. domokl
    domokl April 1 2014 07: 53
    +1
    He put a plus only because the opinion is original. According to the author, it seems to me that he is mistaken in the main thing, did the USA put at stake the country's prestige, albeit largely imaginary, but still hegemony in world politics for the sake of Ukraine?
    No, the Americans are pragmatic. They understand how much they have lost. And the billions that were taken out of Ukraine cannot be compared with the losses that have already been suffered and still have to be suffered.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 07: 56
      0
      Thank you for the plus, but the point is that the game is not around Ukraine, but around Europe. And the players at the table are the USA and China. And now Russia has become a player.
      1. shuhartred
        shuhartred April 1 2014 08: 19
        0
        Quote: thrower
        Thank you for the plus, but the point is that the game is not around Ukraine, but around Europe. And the players at the table are the USA and China. And now Russia has become a player.

        So early to talk about who won. The game has just begun. Tactical winning does not mean winning the party.
        1. thrower
          April 1 2014 08: 32
          0
          That's right, the game has just begun.
  7. Arkan
    Arkan April 1 2014 07: 54
    +2
    As an option for the development of events.
  8. JoylyRoger
    JoylyRoger April 1 2014 07: 54
    +4
    An interesting look, there is something to ponder.
  9. Wellych
    Wellych April 1 2014 07: 55
    +1
    collection "Scythian gold" exported to the USA

    not a fact yet. Something was taken somewhere, what exactly and where did not come up.
    What does the USA need?

    least of all, the rest of the world doubts that they are not the very best. Empires collapse faster than expand, and usually at the moment when the periphery realizes that the metropolis is no longer the same.
    He is replaced by the brave republican guys

    last time it was the "brave" degenerate McCain. It is one thing to milk the grandmothers from the military complex, and another thing to receive coffins, the Americans are extremely sensitive to human losses, and they are very tired of the unknown who needs wars.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 05
      0
      That's right, but if you look at who the real economic adversary of the USA is, it’s clear that it’s only potential?
      I am sure that Europe, with its own currency and strong economy. Now the United States and lowers Europe from heaven to earth.
    2. Igor39
      Igor39 April 1 2014 08: 37
      0
      Unique exhibits related to ancient times were presented by Ukrainian museums at the exhibition "Crimea. Gold and Secrets of the Black Sea", which is taking place in Amsterdam.
      This was reported to the correspondent of Ukrinform by the Director General of the Crimean Central Museum of Tauris Andrei Malgin.
      "The main goal of the exhibition is to display the interweaving of various cultures, primarily ancient, Scythian and Sarmatian, the center of which was Crimea. This direction is extremely in demand in Europe. The exhibition itself is dedicated to the archeology of Crimea, antiquity and the early Middle Ages. The most ancient exhibits date back to IV-V century BC, and the later ones concern the XNUMXth century AD, "he said.
  10. svetlomor
    svetlomor April 1 2014 07: 55
    0
    The United States invested $ 5 billion in the coup in Ukraine, but the collection "Scythian Gold" alone costs 6-7 times more, which means that the United States made a good commercial deal, which means they won;
    But who evaluated this gold and what to do with it? You don’t exhibit it in the museum, you don’t sell it to anyone, you should work the money, and not be in a safe. Russia for their billions received the gas and oil shelf of Crimea, and gold was not Russian anyway, so there’s nothing to spare.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 09: 08
      0
      And if some big person wants to keep this collection in his country house? How many works of art are in private collections?
  11. Igor39
    Igor39 April 1 2014 07: 56
    -2
    What can I say? ANALiteg ...
  12. askort154
    askort154 April 1 2014 07: 56
    0
    I don’t agree, America does not need a strong Europe, let alone a strong Russia. America needs chaos between them.
    Europe knows how to count, and will not be affected by American shale gas.
  13. Fess
    Fess April 1 2014 07: 57
    +1
    Nevertheless, the author is somewhat right - they managed to scare Europe, now they will try to promote their gas on its market ...
  14. Chifka
    Chifka April 1 2014 07: 58
    -2
    Two crocodiles flew, one pink, the second to the north ... Smoke blends seem to have been banned, where, interestingly, does the author get them?
  15. johnsnz
    johnsnz April 1 2014 07: 59
    +1
    1) the collection, even with the most fig version, will remain for Ukrainians, not Americans
    2) American gas to Europe is nothing more than another slap. EU is not stupid to pay more
    3) Europe sleeps and sees how to throw this parasite from the back - USA
    4) who will be the next state president is not so important. A lesson is presented to them. Will be considered
  16. zzzeka
    zzzeka April 1 2014 07: 59
    +3
    Everything is already clear, to whom it was clear before:
  17. VNP1958PVN
    VNP1958PVN April 1 2014 08: 03
    0
    They simply stole the Zolotishko, to once again back the dollar! (I would not have to return with%)
    They don’t have enough gas to the EU and it’s three times more expensive!
    Europe itself is not a fool, it seems gave the go-ahead to Yaytsenyuham that it’s time to strangle Bander!
    For the fate of the Obamanutyh, we were not particularly sick! hi
    It’s still too early to count the pros and cons! request
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 12
      0
      Gold is unlikely to be exported without any guarantee that it will not be returned to Ukraine. Robbed Iraq, Libya, Egypt got something back?

      There is enough gas in the USA, it needs to be promoted to the market. As they know how, they promote it. Why persuade and reduce prices, if you can scare and sell more. Just a business.

      Europe is not a fool, and Merkel’s U-turn says this. But Europe may not have enough strength, Europe simply has nowhere to take allies.
      1. AleksPol
        AleksPol April 1 2014 08: 41
        0
        As for gold, the news flashed a plot that the Scythian gold is displayed in the Amsterdam Museum. Or I'm wrong ?
  18. demon184
    demon184 April 1 2014 08: 06
    +1
    I agree with the author, the United States killed 3 birds with one stone and we are glad that we managed to save a piece from the fire. Ukraine and Russia are 1 state and the fact that we are divided is a loss, and now we have a wedge, one, two, they took control of the gas transportation system of Ukraine, three took the Scythian gold, four set Europe against Russia and it will diversify gas supplies, signed an agreement on a free trade zone with Europe, well, they just created chaos on the mainland and will be caught by all the net who will sail by.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 14
      0
      Moreover, if my theory is correct, then we will first get in Ukraine a free exit to Europe (under US pressure), and then Ukraine will join Russia and closed borders. Moreover, all of Europe will be persuaded to join.
  19. GRune
    GRune April 1 2014 08: 07
    0
    At the expense of "Gold of the Scythians" at a price of 6-7 billion in my opinion, or there are 20 tons of it ... Does anyone know ??
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 55
      0
      Actually, this is an invaluable collection; it is not considered by weight of gold.
  20. bomg.77
    bomg.77 April 1 2014 08: 08
    +2
    The USA has advantages, it is unequivocally and one of the most important, we quarreled with Ukraine!
    Regarding gas, Europe will not be able to completely abandon Russian gas, it needs stable, long-term deliveries, and this can only be ensured by Russia. Even if Qatar ever builds a gas pipeline, it will not give stability and cheapness (the region is turbulent) so the gas pipe is not the needle on which they sit, but a harpoon! Shale gas in the USA does not know how much it is, how expensive it will cost, and what costs are needed for transportation, liquefaction, etc.
  21. Kite
    Kite April 1 2014 08: 11
    +2
    quote: "Ukraine will not become a market where Europe can sell its goods, but a hungry and uncontrollable wild field"
    - after understanding this in Europe, they will think about the role of states in all such matters. If they are now resisting the introduction of sanctions under pressure from the Americans, then, having felt all the "delights" and right at their borders, they will send such friends to .....
    At the very beginning of this mess, I wrote that the probable reason-idea for the "democratization" of Ukraine is the desire to destroy the remaining industry, which is partially integrated into our military-industrial complex, to wake up the population and create a zone of instability for a long time. It was supposed to restore stability with our participation, i.e. they blew up, and we rebuild. Hope that we will overstrain. Therefore, now we are talking about the federal structure of the new Ukraine, about maximum integrity.
  22. parus2nik
    parus2nik April 1 2014 08: 11
    +2
    And it seems to me that they will play along with our president If tse bulo, how would you do it? In the sense that the United States would play with Russia in one bundle ... They are not completely crazy yet ..
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 18
      +2
      The USA is cynical and pragmatic, if necessary, they will put on a feather wig, but they will buy Manhattan for 20 dollars
  23. Galich Kos
    Galich Kos April 1 2014 08: 16
    0
    Quote: awg75
    the author seems to have arrived from Mars only yesterday


    Why from Mars? Alternative point of view, no more. And quite rightly has a right to exist, like other opinions on this issue! You can agree, you can not. Or, a person who expressed ANOTHER, a different point of view, automatically goes into the category of Martians, liberoids, etc.?
  24. borisjdin1957
    borisjdin1957 April 1 2014 08: 17
    0
    from the Don.
    Nope, the Yankees didn’t win tactically, not strategically, until Ukraine won. Crimea floated away, dill federalization is coming (partition of Ukraine), 140 lard debts will be hanging on Amers, Geyrop gas will buy 500 bales under pressure and in small quantities (+ the cost of infrastructure, tanker fleet, gas liquefaction plants) Ponty all this !!!
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 28
      0
      If America sells its gas expensively, then the costs will pay off.
      Plus, gas and oil supplies from the Middle East are also under US control. Europe will buy at 500 euros and at 700 and 1000, simply because there are no other options.
      Add to this the U.S. plans to move enterprises from China back to the U.S.
  25. smmeh
    smmeh April 1 2014 08: 20
    +2
    The United States wins anyway. Sowed chaos in Ukraine, scared Europe, exported Scythian gold, and so on. Russia is again an aggressor and has been straining everyone for many years. .If Europe does not come to its senses, then the mess will be complete. The staff did their job now only to wait and rejoice, in any situation the USA wins. If they just can not be punished. And who can punish them and how?
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 35
      0
      Russia does not want to rake it - no one wants to join Ukraine (or part of it) to Russia. Russia is proposing the federalization of Ukraine so that Europeans would invest now. Federalization will allow us to support those regions that are of interest to Russia.

      Regarding the punishment of the United States, we have no leverage except to strengthen the BRICS. But then again, this is a long game that has just begun.
      1. AleksPol
        AleksPol April 1 2014 09: 05
        +1
        It seems to have flashed in a neighboring branch that Russia and China are going to sign an agreement on a military-political alliance in May
  26. terrible
    terrible April 1 2014 08: 36
    +1
    ) Europe, the American colony - this is an axiom. that America should lose it is necessary to bring down the dollar!
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 08: 57
      0
      The fact of the matter is that Europe is leaving the United States - its own world currency, its actions in Africa and the Middle East.
  27. scientist
    scientist April 1 2014 08: 39
    0
    Yes, the United States has always spit on everyone but itself. Ukraine, the EU, Syria are all tools to strengthen the position of the world dictator. In the United States, a unique economy, if it stops fighting in a cold or hot war in the World, will cease to be afraid, which means they will stop using their green papers. This is the collapse of the American economy.
    Obama tried to scare Russia with sanctions, out of habit expecting a reaction from the concessions as well as from Iran or North Korea. But it turned out the other way around. Economically, Russia can scare the EU and the US much more, even if it simply turns its back on the West and restructures its relations with the East, removing all restrictions on military-economic cooperation.
    That is why Obama constantly calls Putin, and Kerry turns the plane in flight. The situation for the USA is stalemate and they lose anyway.
  28. maxim1
    maxim1 April 1 2014 08: 42
    0
    Some kind of crap.
    With regard to geopolitics, the one who laughs last laughs. There are no serious reasons to rejoice about the "blown up" Ukraine, the "gas" gain, the arrival of the Republicans in the near future. This is so, at the level of a children's sandbox - I took the toy - now I am in charge.
    No, of course it is not good now. And tomorrow it will turn into a loss. And this is "tomorrow" - yes, here it is, next to it.
    Scythian gold is, of course, a meanness. In the same tomorrow it will not be an acquisition, but a heavy moral damage, a loss - after all, this is participation in theft ...
    In practical terms, gold is expensive, while it lies behind bulletproof glass for all to see. This gold is not money. And money is money when they make other money. Therefore, the true value for 3,14ndos of this gold will come after its smelting into bullion. And what do they have from this? - the same lost billions?
    Sorry, funny. They have continuous losses once again.
  29. alicante11
    alicante11 April 1 2014 08: 44
    +1
    - The United States invested billions of dollars in a coup in Ukraine, but only the Scythian Gold collection is worth more than 5-6 times, which means that the United States has done a good business deal, which means they won;


    You, dear, forget that 5 billion (in my opinion, since 91, they had this in mind) was spent from taxpayers' funds, but the collection is unlikely to fall into state hands. However, even if it does, you can't buy anything for it, as for those bucks that were spent. The Americans will not use this gold as security for transactions or transfer it to the Germans against the gone gold. In general, if we talk about money, then "Scythian gold" is absolutely not a liquid commodity. So at most, someone very large, but very private, had their own very large, but very private gesheft.

    the question is posed like this: we will do everything so that Russia does not blackmail you with gas for 3-5 years, and then we will provide you with ours. So, here the USA won in Europe;


    How will Europe live for 3-5 years? And if Russia does not "blackmail", then it makes sense to move to amers, whose gas is more expensive? Now, if they could already supply this gas, then it would be another matter. And so they are not ready.

    Right, addicted. What can be done for this? Create a hotbed of tension in Europe. What do we see? Ukraine is ready to explode, Ukrainians professing Nazism will go to Europe. Ukraine will become not a market where Europe can sell its goods, but a hungry and uncontrollable wild field


    Well, Europe did not sell its goods to Ukraine, and will not sell further. A banderlog they quickly put to the wall, since they will interfere underfoot. They don’t have enough hands for the police.

    And if we add to this and "Russians armed to the teeth", then Europe becomes an obedient and weak calf before the United States. This means that the USA won here too;


    What if in Europe they decide to obey Katz - Katz offers to surrender (with) a Russian armed to the teeth? But what, our gas is cheaper, armed to the teeth, and even nearby, and not through the Ocean. With whom, then, will the military gesheft stir up their Americans?

    well, and as a bonus. The career of Obama and his team goes nowhere.


    Obama will go nowhere if and only if he is asked about it. And not American voters.

    He is replaced by the brave republican guys. And it seems to me that they will play in the same tandem with our president.


    Like, Republicans are actually hawks. I’m afraid that these games would not end with the growth of nuclear fungi and the decline of mankind.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 09: 22
      +1
      You, dear, forget that 5bn (in my opinion from the 91 of the year they had it in mind) was spent from taxpayers, but the collection is unlikely to fall into state hands.

      If you do not know, then the United States does not print dollars, but the union of the largest banks - the Fed, and these are private individuals. I repeat once again - the collection is a unique thing, no one will melt it, will settle in a private collection.

      And 3-5 years, how will Europe live?
      like Ukraine 23 of the year - under tough information pressure

      A banderlog they quickly put to the wall, since they will interfere underfoot.
      Bandera is a CIA project, until it is allowed there, they will not be merged.

      Like, Republicans are actually hawks.
      That's right, they are hawks, but not suicides. There will be no direct military operations, and indirect ones - as many as you like.

      But for the United States, we are not now opponents just because of our low weight; their opponent is Europe. But if there is an opportunity to play a trick on us, they will do it without hesitation. This is such a country, we accept it as it is and proceed from this. We don’t scold the cat for eating mice.
      And what our President does is beyond praise. If you apply the game terms, then he sat down at the table, said we were not playing in the Crimea and removed him from the playing field and asked for cards for the next deal.
      1. alicante11
        alicante11 April 3 2014 03: 35
        0
        If you don’t know, it’s not the US state that prints the dollars, but the union of the largest banks - the Fed,


        I am aware, but the US state still provides their value, with its "treasuries" (if anything, it is collective. There are a lot of securities out of which the amersky debt is formed) and AUG. So it's not the Fed bosses who pay for everything, but the amersky taxpayer, albeit now in debt.

        like Ukraine 23 of the year - under tough information pressure


        And has Ukraine diversified its supplies under this "pressure"?

        Bandera is a CIA project, until it is allowed there, they will not be merged.


        If they "get" Europe, then there will be someone in the USA to lobby for their "drain".

        That's right, they are hawks, but not suicides. There will be no direct military operations, and indirect ones - as many as you like.


        So who is against it, but to do with it:

        He is replaced by the brave republican guys. And it seems to me that they will play in the same tandem with our president.


        It seems to me that VVP does not suffer from masochism and even "indirect VD" doesn’t need it.

        But for the United States, we are not now opponents just because of our low weight; their opponent is Europe.


        Sorry, dear. But you have porridge in your head. Do not be offended. Just look at your logic.
        1. We have a light weight for amers. So why the hell do they climb into our sphere of influence? Okay, Syria is far away, and why are they always trying to get into the post-Soviet space, which is nearby? The enemy of the USA is Russia. Because we are the only country in the world that can destroy the United States without the possibility of restoration. And they will beat us either until they finish off, or until they get a knockout, like Hitler. However, you should not relax even in that case. The USA will be replaced by others. This has already happened.

        2. Europe is an adversary of the USA. Then the question is why so?

        Bandera is a CIA project, until it is allowed there, they will not be merged.


        I either don't understand something, or there is no logic here. And the CIA decides in the camp of the enemy, whom and when to merge? Then either this "enemy" has been defeated, like Russia in the 90s, or it is not an enemy, but a satellite, a "junior partner".
      2. alicante11
        alicante11 April 3 2014 03: 35
        0
        This is such a country, we accept it as it is and proceed from this. We don’t scold the cat for eating mice.


        Yes, they went to he.r. Sorry for the expression. What should we take? What do they do in Libya, in Syria, do they do in Vietnam? That they have already destroyed our country several times, directly or indirectly killing several million of our fellow citizens? Or the fact that they want to arrange the same thing that we have in Libya and Syria and Vietnam? Get down to the ground. This is not chess. Here they play football with the heads of living people. Moreover, often with the heads of women and children.

        And what our President does is beyond praise. If you apply the game terms, then he sat down at the table, said we were not playing in the Crimea and removed him from the playing field and asked for cards for the next deal.


        There is no point in arguing. Although I would say differently. VVP pulled the ace of trump from his sleeve and took the jackpot - Crimea. But no one will allow him to stop the "game", it's like two katals (or rather, several) sit at cards and each has a loaded revolver, and they can only leave for the next world. When someone's nerves can not stand and he starts shooting either at opponents or at himself.
  30. pahom54
    pahom54 April 1 2014 09: 14
    +3
    I don’t know why they attacked the author of the article so badly ... The man sensibly, right at the beginning of the article, made tolerances, and then he began to talk about some factors of the current geopolitics, in particular, our "Beloved" partners ... ...
    And his (the author's) fears about ... I would not say dirty, since the Americans are simply playing in achieving their goals (like we, Russia), but simply OWN policies (American, I mean) are quite obvious. The fact that the Arabs are trying to cut off the trade in gas and oil for us is also the participation of the United States in this. And now they are already trying to get in with their "product" ... Is that obvious? Absolutely obvious...
    But from this, our president and his team must draw conclusions and make sound management decisions that will reduce (or even completely, the chemical damage they are trying to inflict on us. That's something like that.
    If we are patriots of Russia, then we should think like patriots, and not engage in cap-slaughtering. It is necessary to anticipate the threat and understand the fact that although, to our mutual joy, Russia is finally returning to the international arena with imperial ambitions (with imperial - in the good sense of the word), and so, we still have not so much, and directly it’s too early to confront NATO with (yet !!!) It’s too early 10 years to re-equip the army and navy, train crews and specialists — and not spare money on this, in any case! And there it is already possible, when OUR gas and oil pipelines will be blocked to us, it will be possible to slam a fist or shoe on their wires without fear of surrender. Something like that.
    And the author of the article normally reasones, he writes not in defense of Amer, but about how they all again n.a.e.a.li ...
  31. Duelist
    Duelist April 1 2014 09: 28
    +2
    It was not Russia that created the crisis in Ukraine, it did not carry out a coup d'etat. The steps taken by Putin are an attempt to compensate for the geopolitical, military and economic damage caused by the instigators of the coup (the United States and the EU). The reunification of Crimea with Russia is a very worthy answer. Like in chess ... We are waiting for the continuation of the geopolitical party, it is too early to talk about the results.
  32. The comment was deleted.
  33. ed65b
    ed65b April 1 2014 09: 36
    +4
    For Scythian gold - Scythian gold in Austria at the exhibition. for several days on tv suck on this topic. boxes with incomprehensible contents were exported to the United States. According to calculations, it was not Ukraine’s gold reserves that was discussed at the forum. The thrower is right in that Russia has the most pragmatic and business relations with the Republicans for the entire period of our cooperation both in the USSR and in Russia. guys are tough but don't throw. Gas - until the year 20, the United States will not be able to deliver anything to Europe, and after 20 too. Europe’s daily consumption is equal to US daily gas production. And if you take into account the cost of transportation, the construction of a fleet of tankers, gas liquefaction plants and terminals for its acceptance, the cost at the exit will be higher than the cost of pipe gas from Russia. All US gas has already been sold in the Asian market, and redirecting it to the European market, the Asian market that Russia may occupy will be freed up, given that Qatar, in a deep conflict with the Saudis, has little prospect for the United States to play a gas gambit.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 09: 44
      0
      Qatar has recently played with the Saudis in the same team against Libya, they will agree if they are ordered. And they will become stubborn - right there is a Maidan in Saudi. In addition, the United States can act not only as sellers of its gas, but also as an intermediary in the sale of the Middle East.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b April 1 2014 09: 54
        0
        Quote: thrower
        Qatar has recently played with the Saudis in the same team against Libya, they will agree if they are ordered. And they will become stubborn - right there is a Maidan in Saudi. In addition, the United States can act not only as sellers of its gas, but also as an intermediary in the sale of the Middle East.

        No, they don’t agree. The differences are very serious, in fact, Qatar and the Saudis are now on the brink of war. And Obamych could not do anything during his visit to Saudi Arabia. The Saudis after the United States kidnapping and have lost confidence in them. Regarding US mediation in the sale of gas, it’s not serious that gas is sold on the market; you can’t mediate at the state level. This happened with Russia and Iran, and how, we just buy Iranian oil and sell it logically, the United States will have to buy all the gas on the market and sell it ourselves, but this is not realistic.
        1. thrower
          April 1 2014 10: 04
          0
          How big is it to have another "Arab Spring" in Saudi Arabia? Provided that for the United States there is like a home. Yes, the Saudis are now looking for allies to leave the United States, but who will allow them?
          1. ed65b
            ed65b April 1 2014 10: 36
            +1
            Quote: thrower
            How big is it to have another "Arab Spring" in Saudi Arabia? Provided that for the United States there is like a home. Yes, the Saudis are now looking for allies to leave the United States, but who will allow them?

            The Saudis now have an extremely difficult situation, primarily because of the internal contradictions of the weak sick king and the struggle for the future power of the clans. So far, Obamych has failed to do anything. Let's see what will happen next.
  34. Good_Taxist
    Good_Taxist April 1 2014 09: 41
    0
    [quote = smel] didn't blackmail you with gas for 3-5
    ha ha! 3-5 years for politics (in this scenario) is an eternity, especially taking into account the American elections. How many "camels die" during this time? ... and how many will be born :-)) ha ha! 3-5 years for politics (in this scenario) is an eternity, especially taking into account the American elections. How many "camels die" during this time? ... and how many will be born :-)))
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 09: 46
      0
      3-5 years for politics (in this scenario) is an eternity, especially considering the American elections


      The president in the USA is not an independent figure, a puppet in a puppet theater. Puppeteers in the Fed. And they have a lot of time.
  35. Semenov
    Semenov April 1 2014 09: 45
    +1
    "Scythian gold" is of low quality, products are often gilded, are only culturally valuable, no one will melt it down, it is unprofitable, very little 999 gold will be obtained.
    1. ed65b
      ed65b April 1 2014 10: 38
      0
      Quote: Semenov
      "Scythian gold" is of low quality, products are often gilded, are only culturally valuable, no one will melt it down, it is unprofitable, very little 999 gold will be obtained.

      The most valuable is cultural. who knows that the royal gold coin of 100 francs in denomination will cost today from two million rubles? the cost of Scythian gold is hard to imagine.
  36. maxim1
    maxim1 April 1 2014 09: 47
    0
    Yes, let it be so - we lost. In what sense?
    And this is our payment for unity and unity, which will inevitably come.
    A heavy fee to be redeemed by our strength.
    In the revelation of John the Evangelist it is said so - a wife giving birth in agony to a child of the masculine sex. On her head is a crown of twelve stars, and behind her are two eagle wings.
    This is Russia, our union of twelve former republics, and the Russian coat of arms ...
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 10: 05
      0
      We, Russia, did not lose, but began to play. Ukraine did not play at all, I apologize to her how the tool was used.
  37. Wedmak
    Wedmak April 1 2014 09: 52
    +1
    The United States did a good business deal, which means they won;

    They could take out this collection at any time, because All these years, Ukraine has actually been under US control. So no argument.
    Yes, right now they cannot deliver gas to Europe, but the question is put like this: we will do everything so that Russia does not blackmail you with gas for 3-5 years, and then we will provide you with ours. So, here the USA won in Europe;

    The price of the promises of the USA does not know only a stupid and narrow-minded person. They cannot provide for themselves, because many fields are still subsidized and the price of gas is offset by payment from a printing press. In addition, how much gas delivery across the Atlantic will cost is an extremely interesting question. Also past.
    then Europe becomes an obedient and weak calf in front of the USA. So, here the USA won;

    Was she once strong and independent? All my life I danced to the tune of the United States.

    Bottom line: the US lost in Ukraine. It was possible to tear off the Crimea, but ... he went to Russia. UUUps. What to do now with Bandera Ukraine, which is about to grapple with the pro-Russian part, is a headache. So no one has finally won anything yet. And which is better, Scythian gold or Crimea? I think the answer is obvious.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 10: 09
      0
      They could take out this collection at any time, because All these years, Ukraine has actually been under US control.


      They couldn’t, things were declared national property, therefore no deals with them were possible, they are always under supervision. And with a mess, it is easier to take out and hide.

      The price of the promises of the USA does not know only a stupid and narrow-minded person.

      It depends on who promises.

      Bottom line: the US lost in Ukraine. It was possible to tear off the Crimea, but ... he went to Russia. UUUps. What to do now with Bandera Ukraine, which is about to grapple with the pro-Russian part, is a headache. So no one has finally won anything yet. And which is better, Scythian gold or Crimea? I think the answer is obvious.


      They played not against Russia, and not against Ukraine, but against Europe.
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak April 1 2014 10: 37
        0
        They couldn’t, things were declared national property, therefore no deals with them were possible, they are always under supervision.

        You might think that the United States would stop. And the cost of this gold, compared with the income from the revolution ... a trifle.
  38. sancheloboroda
    sancheloboroda April 1 2014 09: 53
    0
    The article was sucked out of the finger of course, apparently the author wrote it in 5 minutes, but there were probably his reasons ...
    But about America lost or not. Do not you think that the East is rebelling, and we won’t be able to help it. We won’t enter the troops, it’s useless to wait for the pro-Russian president, to dictate their conditions with the help of blackmailing gas, they can throw the tricks in the Crimea, and Europe will stink even more. So, as I see it right now, a precarious balance has come to the further fate of Ukraine.
    But why the United States climbed into Ukraine, I myself still can’t understand ... I just can’t believe that for all their superiority, it could be miscalculated.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 10: 14
      0
      Russia has no task to help all of Ukraine. Why help Bandera? And for Russia we need not divided Ukraine, with a single supreme government, but with a federal structure. There will be help, but it will be selective. And Russia will send troops only when absolutely necessary, when issues of influence, politics or finance will not be important, but it will be important to save compatriots from physical extermination. But this is far, I hope.
  39. Horla
    Horla April 1 2014 10: 01
    0
    Shale gas production is several times more expensive, plus it needs to be made liquid and transported by tankers. Specialists say that the price difference will be big. The second-cost of the Crimean gold collection is several tens of millions of dollars, but not billions. The third is the huge strategic importance of Crimea. In fact, front-line aviation reaches anywhere in Europe. And most importantly, for the first time in many years, it was not us who put cancer, but we!
  40. Cristall
    Cristall April 1 2014 10: 06
    +3
    as for me, the United States won, again having made a color revolution, and even twice in one country.
    Yes, and absolutely in unfavorable conditions (Janus had a dofig of opportunities to stop the rudiments in the fall)
    Yes, and at everyone’s side.
    The fact that they are 23 years old - well, they have such things everywhere - they generally try with 91 everywhere. Somewhere right away somewhere. But, when it is necessary.
    The Moscow agreements and the Brussels refusal broke out - get Izengrad.
    The fact that some weak puppets frankly went ...
    They just had to quickly go any army to shoot any barrel in / Crimea. And here it’s not rewarding .. people didn’t want / didn’t receive an order / deliberately slowed down such decisions - well, in general, typical Ukrainians ...
    But now in Kiev, an American henchman. Even not YUSH 2, SuperYush.
  41. Shaki's memory
    Shaki's memory April 1 2014 10: 12
    +1
    Well, in the paintings of Raphael and Da Vinci there’s not even a gram of gold at all, but they are valuable. In Baghdad, after all, the US military first developed the history museum. Nothing personal, just a business ..

    The article is definitely about nothing.

    And from history .. Nicholas the First is a pretty good tsar, only he believed in Europe and helped her, and helped until the Crimean war. Alexander III did not believe and did not love Europe, and with him no one could even fart in the direction of Russia, because it was too much. "Europe will wait until the Russian tsar catches fish .."
  42. Giant thought
    Giant thought April 1 2014 10: 14
    0
    This grandmother in two said that America won. Firstly, it’s not yet evening, the game is not over. Secondly, there are some advantages tactically, but strategically there are some disadvantages. In general, everything interesting is yet to come.
  43. Lyynn
    Lyynn April 1 2014 10: 29
    -3
    Quote: AleksPol
    Understood nothing . Is that Russia losing coming out? Is this humor like that? fool

    Of course she lost. Crimea was the beginning of the end for her. Do you think you won with green mold without firing a shot? Naive ... You will be strangled in this way, without a single shot. Well, we, Ukrainians, will drive the "green mold" out of Crimea with sticks. laughing
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 10: 31
      +2
      I would not like to upset you, but Ukraine is an instrument in big politics. You didn’t lose Crimea, but we saved.
    2. Wedmak
      Wedmak April 1 2014 10: 36
      +1
      Oh ... nuka-nuka, you can learn more about strangulation and driving away. Straight already intrigued.
      1. Lyynn
        Lyynn April 1 2014 10: 38
        -2
        Well, you understand the subtext ... Why explain.
        1. Wedmak
          Wedmak April 1 2014 10: 46
          +1
          Well, you understand the subtext ... Why explain.

          Nope. We also know how to shout and toss our caps. But the troll cannot adequately and fully express its thoughts, it simply does not know how.
          Well, you understand the subtext?
      2. Lyynn
        Lyynn April 1 2014 10: 38
        -3
        Well, you understand the subtext ... Why explain.
        1. ed65b
          ed65b April 1 2014 12: 44
          0
          Quote: Lyynn
          Well, you understand the subtext ... Why explain.

          Are you going to drive Russians from Crimea with them?
          Himself not ashamed of such an army?
    3. ed65b
      ed65b April 1 2014 10: 43
      +3
      Lyynn- you would write the name otherwise you will die unnamed and even on the monument there will be nothing to write, and so at least we will write you an epitaph like " Here lies MIKHAIL SAMUELEVICH PANIKOVSKY, a man without a passport " and we will speak over your hill " I was often unfair to the deceased. But was the deceased a moral person? No, he was not a moral person. It was a former blind man, an impostor and a gusekrad. He put all his strength into living at the expense of society. But society did not want him to live at his expense. And Mikhail Samuelevich could not bear this contradiction in his views, because he had a hot-tempered character. And so he died. All!"
      And I won’t even minus you, read the chat, take off your zombie skin and open your eyes to life, look at it as it is.
  44. Lyynn
    Lyynn April 1 2014 10: 35
    -5
    In general, Russia, in the person of its Putin, imagines itself a superpower. It's too early. Sobering will come, and very soon. The USA will correct your brain, and very soon.
    1. Wedmak
      Wedmak April 1 2014 10: 41
      +3
      I advise you to drink tea with thyme, calms the nerves, sometimes the brain clears of delirium.
    2. thrower
      April 1 2014 10: 45
      +1
      "America is with us!" we have already heard. Tell me, have any financial promises of the United States and Europe been fulfilled with regard to Ukraine? Did any money come from?
      About dry rations is not necessary, we saw them, bon appetit.
    3. TAGIR
      TAGIR April 1 2014 11: 14
      0
      Stock up on diapers
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak April 1 2014 11: 18
        +1
        It’s a vile thing to beat lying. And two or three for one ... It's not wall to wall, it's just some kind of wild showdown.
    4. ed65b
      ed65b April 1 2014 11: 54
      +1
      You native speak slogans and read mantras. you argue your position. but about falling apart, it will crumble, America will take revenge on us since the 90s, and as you see it has become even stronger and more united. But you are not. and America will not take revenge on us for anyone.
    5. PPL
      PPL April 1 2014 12: 59
      +1
      The USA will correct your brain, and very soon.

      Again, someone will come, someone will correct, but what does Ukraine itself want? And what is it ready for?
      It is a pity that Gogol does not live in our time, how many stories disappear ... What characters are living in obscurity. lol
  45. Warlock_r
    Warlock_r April 1 2014 10: 39
    +1
    If you look only from the point of view of the author - then yes, America won. But if you look at the different facets of this diamond, then the statement about winning is very controversial.

    Yes, having invested 5 yards, they raped a good gesheft for the gold of the Scythians (which, too, is not a fact). But at the same time - they lost Crimea, Sevastopol. They could not clear the Black Sea from the Russian fleet.

    Yes, at first glance, Russia is exposed as an aggressor. And now (for now) the West is shaking with fear and in panic is looking for an alternative to Russian gas. But the VERY elegant political game of GDP has led to the fact that the myth of the bloodthirsty Russia is slowly melting away. And Europe begins to slowly think about the fact that a goof is slowly beginning to appear in the mirror. When this fact finally comes, the cooperation, I think, will resume, or else it will worsen. Only now the attitude towards Russia will not be the same as in the last 20 years, a la "loser" in the Cold War, but rather as "if I become too impudent, I will get a tambourine."

    Yes, a competitive Europe is beneficial for the states. Is it profitable for Europe? Oh, I doubt it. And sober heads in that very Europe, I repeat, have already begun to think that the states are throwing it somewhere.

    And Obama is being dumped precisely because the current tour cannot be considered won by the states. For in the best case (right in the very best) everyone remained "with their own people." Even though I doubt that this is the best case for America ...
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 10: 54
      0
      About Obama - it seems to me that he is simply being poured out, like a very narrow-minded person. Just by saying that you can take away power in Ukraine and thereby annoy Putin for the Olympics. Obama was seduced by this and the trap slammed shut. Now he is rushing around, but he has no plan. At the same time, in the congress, he is subtly trolling; some dry rations instead of military aid are worth something. He even had to accept Yatsenyuk at the White House.
      Europe, it seems, really began to understand who the goof is, but does not know how to get out of this situation.
      The United States can lay out some more talk of Europeans, it can provoke a real civil war in Ukraine, and the majority will run not to Russia ("yaku to gilyak"), but to Europe.
  46. siberalt
    siberalt April 1 2014 10: 49
    +1
    You can set different tasks for winning or losing. Was the goal of the States to get hold of a collection from the museum of Ukraine on the cheap, which would give Russia the Crimea and lose face? Or give 5 lards for removing Yanukovych and dunk Sashko Bilogo? Well, that is their business. But Russia got what you can’t buy for any money - it regained its world prestige with all the consequences and without a single shot it grew over the territories. Russians do not write history, they do it.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 11: 02
      0
      Look - the goal of the game is Europe, the game is being played against it. Scythian gold is a small present for some "Big Man". All the fuss is around the European oil and gas market. And Ukraine is just a ball that is played. The fact that we took Crimea was naturally not included in the plans of the United States, but the loss for them is not great either.
      Regarding the restoration of world authority - we have only taken the first step towards restoration. But we did it.
  47. sevtrash
    sevtrash April 1 2014 10: 54
    +1
    Of course, the Americans won.
    The acquisition of Crimea with its problems and the loss of the rest of Ukraine, which is likely to become a country with an anti-Russian orientation and a base for destabilizing Russia. In my opinion, an unequal exchange. And the Russian will become uncomfortable in Ukraine, to say the least.
    The Americans can only envy - they built all their enemies - the whole world, in fact: they shook the Arabs and now they will fight with themselves, Russia is under the attack of sanctions (you can, of course, consider them nothing - but that's just not true, especially in the long run) , Russia's reputation is undermined, Americans again have chances to break Russia, which they always wanted. China is in line, well, not yet an evening.
    But hatred is disgusting - it hides the truth, which will lead to errors.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 11: 03
      0
      Moreover, if my theory is correct, then we will first get in Ukraine a free exit to Europe (under US pressure), and then Ukraine will join Russia and closed borders. Moreover, all of Europe will be persuaded to join.


      And as for hatred - so I just do not have it.
      1. sevtrash
        sevtrash April 1 2014 11: 24
        -1
        Quote: thrower
        And as for hatred - so I just do not have it.

        You may not have this - although the last comment ?, but many have, which is sad. The main thing is that it should be less among those in power.
    2. Wedmak
      Wedmak April 1 2014 11: 14
      +2
      The acquisition of Crimea with its problems and the loss of the rest of Ukraine

      The problems (which, by the way, YOU created) are solved. The rest of Ukraine, the eastern and southern regions have not yet been lost, and the western ones have never been pro-Russian.
      Americans can only envy - all their enemies - actually the whole world - were built:

      What envy them, the whole world begins to turn away from them.
      Arabs shook up and now they will fight with themselves

      These are their problems.
      Russia under attack from sanctions

      Funny sanctions that no one actually noticed.
      Russia's reputation is undermined

      What was it like? "US-ruled country in decline, supplier of raw materials." Yes, it is undermined. But now, they will think before going to us with their democracy.
      Americans again have chances to break Russia, which they always wanted

      They missed this chance in the 90s. Forgot to make a control shot. Now you can’t even make the first one.
      China is in line, well, not yet an evening.

      China is not yet a competitor to the United States. But if it grows at the same pace, we will still see who will tear whom.
      1. sevtrash
        sevtrash April 1 2014 21: 10
        0
        Here it is - hatred and cheers-patriotism.
        God grant that the West would "forgive", because the forces - the economy - are incomparable. They will live without Russia, Russia will not. Isn't it clear.
        Around Russia, predators must be maneuvered, and not rush headlong.
  48. Lyubimov
    Lyubimov April 1 2014 11: 38
    0
    The author's desire to neutralize the importance of the annexation of Crimea to Russia, by means of such insignificant arguments, is at least stupid. From the article it turns out what the Americans are great and how cleverly they turned everything. Investing billions of dollars for decades, carrying out titanic work to reanimate all sorts of banders and other scum, in order to take out the collection of "Golden Scythians" and supply Europe with its own gas in the medium term? But the author portrays the Americans as just some kind of idiots, which of course is not true. But judging by the article, this can be said about the author. The main question about the author is how old is he?
    Transporting gas from America to Europe is just crazy. Even if technically feasible, the Americans, with their exorbitant greed, will never surrender anything of their own free will, much less energy. They give the world only green paper and instability, the rest is taken away. They have all the politics built on such principles.
    1. thrower
      April 1 2014 11: 51
      0
      From the article it turns out which Americans are well done and how cleverly they turned everything.


      No, it turns out from the article that it is very, very early to shout "Hurray, we won".

      Investing billions of dollars for decades, carrying out titanic work to reanimate all sorts of banders and other scum, in order to take out the collection of "Golden Scythians" and supply Europe with its own gas in the medium term?


      Ukraine is the key to Europe, which, through the accession of 40 millions of parasites to Europe, can cause destabilization in Europe. The United States beat its competitor (Europe) with a hammer (Ukraine).
      The annexation of Crimea is our success that was not planned by anyone.
  49. ed65b
    ed65b April 1 2014 11: 58
    +2
    In general, the thrower is a plus. Well done. I was not afraid to speak out and engage in controversy. I respect you. hi
  50. Bosk
    Bosk April 1 2014 14: 34
    +1
    Here recently the idea came up that all this bacchanalia in Ukraine was thought not against Russia, but against the European Union, and if you compare the pros and cons, it may very well be that this idea is not the most wrong ...