Military Review

"Japan leads our game." To the 110 anniversary of the beginning of the Russian-Japanese war

110 years ago, on the night of January 27 (February 9), 1904, before the official declaration of war, Japanese ships attacked the Russian squadron in Port Arthur. The Japanese fleet wanted to inflict a decisive blow on the Russian 1st Pacific Squadron, thereby solving the problem of supremacy at sea, to be able to freely land an airborne army and supply it. On the same day, the superior strength of the Japanese fleet attacked the Varyag armored cruiser and the Korean gunboat located in the Korean port of Chemulpo. The feat of Russian sailors will live for centuries. “We perish, but do not give up!” - the motto of the Russians, faithful to the patronymic to the end.

Thus began a bloody war, full of the heroism of Russian sailors and soldiers, who had to clear up the mess of the prewar and military mistakes of the government. Despite a series of defeats on land and at sea, the Russian armed forces practically solved the task of victory over the Japanese empire. However, backstage intrigues and weak political will of St. Petersburg led to the fact that Russia went to peace negotiations and gave the victory to Japan, which was already on the verge of defeat. Japan was threatened with a financial default (only Anglo-Saxon-Jewish loans allowed Japan to wage war). The Russian army fulfilled Kuropatkin’s strategic plan, which in fact repeated Kutuzov’s maneuver in 1812. By the beginning of the political negotiations, the Russian army was at the peak of its capabilities, the Japanese army ran out of steam, lost its offensive capabilities. The upcoming offensive of the Russian army could lead the Japanese to a military-political catastrophe. The population of Japan was significantly less Russian, its demographic resource was exhausted. Japan has already lost personnel reserve, he fell on the battlefield. Russia, on the other hand, has only "reeled off."

The ratio of casualties says that Russian troops fought on land more skillfully than the Japanese. In the work of V. Shatsillo, L. Shatsillo “Russian-Japanese War. 1904 — 1905. Data. Documents "it is reported that the Russians have lost the killed 50 thousand people, the Japanese - more than 86 thousand people. AT "Stories B. Urlanis military losses: Russian losses on land - 177 thousand people (31 thousand killed and died from wounds), Japanese - 232 thousand people (58 thousand killed and died from wounds). According to General Kuropatkin: the total losses of Japan killed, wounded and sick amounted to 554,8 thousand people. Only in Tokyo, more than 60 thousand people were buried in the honorary cemetery.

In a report to Foreign Minister V. N. Lamsdorf, Russia's envoy to Japan, and then the second representative of Russia during the peace talks in Portsmouth, Roman Romanovich Rosen noted: “... despite all the victories over us at sea and on land, Japan has no means who would give her the opportunity to force Russia to make peace and pay a military contribution if Russia chose to avoid it and decided to continue at least passive resistance. ” Japan simply did not have the strength to transfer the war directly to Russian territories, even to the CER zone. Theoretically, the Japanese could land in Sakhalin, and they landed it. But to support him, they had to hold significant naval forces, and they were ready for evacuation at any moment. In the very first harsh winter, Japanese troops on Sakhalin were doomed to death.

Thus, Japan won, not because of its military and economic superiority, but because of the fact that Petersburg decided to surrender. Russia's western "partners and friends" simply convinced the Russian elite to conclude a peace agreement. They were played up by “agents of influence” like Witte. Japan in general was able to fight with Russia (taking into account the potential difference) only because of the full-scale political-diplomatic, informational, military-material and financial support of the British Empire and the United States, as well as the “financial international” behind them.

"Japan leads our game." To the 110 anniversary of the beginning of the Russian-Japanese war

"Varyag" and "Korean" go to battle.

Background of war

There are two main prerequisites for the Russian-Japanese war 1904-1905: 1) is the strategic weakness of the Russian Empire in the Far East and many lost opportunities to strengthen its position in the Asia-Pacific region; 2) purposeful work so-called. "Financial International", Great Britain and the United States to Russia and Japan. The Anglo-Saxons sought to knock out Russia from the APR by the hands of the Japanese and deploy Russia to Europe, where it had to fulfill the role of "cannon fodder" in the war with Germany.

As everyone knows, the weak are beaten, and the fools are taught. The history of the development of the Far East by Russians is full of examples of self-sacrifice, heroism and asceticism of some, and carelessness, greed, stupidity and frank betrayal of Russia's national interests by others. While devotees and statesmen such as Alexander Baranov, Gennady Nevelskoy and Nikolai Muravyov-Amursky built up, opened, built and strengthened Russian frontiers, others gave away, sold and simply turned a blind eye to the opening opportunities.

Russian researchers and devotees laid at the end of the XVIII first half of XIX centuries. the enormous potential that enabled the Russian Empire to become the dominant force in the Asia-Pacific region, especially in its northern part. Russia owned Kamchatka, Primorye, we got the full right to the Kuriles and Sakhalin, the Aleutian Islands were developing, Russian America, Fort Ross in California was our outpost. The Hawaiian Islands insistently asked for membership in the Russian Empire. On the islands even laid a Russian outpost. In the second half of the XIX - early XX centuries. there was the possibility of transition under the Russian protectorate of Korea, with the gradual inclusion of the empire. Koreans stubbornly did not want to obey the Japanese and looked with hope at the Russians, who were their only hope for a prosperous life. In Korea, there was a strong "Russian party". This opportunity has been missed. The opportunity to establish friendly and even allied relations with Japan was missed. In Nagasaki there was even a parking of the Russian fleet. In reality, for a very long time, there were no particular contradictions between Japan and Russia, and the two powers could become natural allies in the region.

However, thanks to the vague foreign policy of St. Petersburg, bureaucratic red tape and the work of the "agents of influence" of the West, Russia has lost most of its opportunities in the APR. Fort Ross and Russian America were sold. It was a brilliant operation by opponents of Russia, we lost all positions in America and the possibility of full control over the northern part of the Pacific Ocean. Petersburg was literally “occupied” by a pro-Western group that looked only at Europe, which didn’t care what happened in the Far East. Nevelskoy and Muravyov literally accomplished a feat when they were able to join the mouth of the Amur to Russia. Nevelsky even wanted to be judged and degraded into sailors, saved by the personal intercession of Emperor Nicholas I.

As a result, for a long time, the Far East remained an almost unnecessary margin of the Russian Empire. Transport and military infrastructure was not developed. Only in 1903, was the movement on Transsib opened throughout its length. Petersburg did not use the opportunity to annex the Korean Peninsula and to peacefully resolve disputed issues with Japan. When Russia was dragged into Chinese affairs, including participation in the suppression of the uprising of the “boxers”, the construction of the CER, the lease of Port Arthur, the clash of Russian-Japanese interests in Korea, it was no longer a gradual expansion of Russian influence in East Asia, but mistakes. Russia was deliberately pulled into China and confronted with Japan. A group of businessmen from Petersburg, some of whom were associated with the "financial international", dragged Russia into Korean and Chinese affairs. Sergei Witte, the future “half count of Sakhalin”, played a huge role in this matter (read more about the destructive role of this leader in the work of S. Kremlev “Russia and Japan: Bleed!”).

At the same time, "financial international", Britain and the United States did everything to pit Russia and Japan. Russia, as noted above, had every chance to become the dominant force in the Pacific Ocean, especially its northern part. This did not suit the owners of the Western project, as well as the British Empire and the United States, who themselves wanted to dominate the APR. Moreover, the turn of Russia to the East, distracted her from European affairs, which also did not suit England. According to the plans of the Anglo-Saxons, Russia was to play a decisive role in the war with the Teutons. And then the Russians “distracted” from Europe, got bogged down in Eastern affairs.

The operation to remove Russia from the Pacific zone was carried out in several stages. First, the operation “sale of Russian America” was carried out. Then they “raped” and awakened Japan (the mission of the squadron of the American Commodore Perry), who was dozing in her isolation and was not going to interfere in the affairs of her neighbors. England, and other Western countries, took an active part in the militarization of Japan, creating in it a first-class fleet and army, trained and armed according to European standards. The British actually created the Japanese fleet, the United States and France actively participated in this work. The test of strength took place in China, which was then offended and robbed by all and sundry. Sino-Chinese War 1894 — 1895 ended with a complete victory of the Japanese Empire. China was forced to give away the island of Taiwan, Penghu Islands and the Liaodong Peninsula, to pay a large indemnity, which was sent to further militarization.

Russia, Germany and France intervened and took away part of their loot from Japan. Japan was forced to withdraw its troops from the Liaodong Peninsula. Russia concluded an allied treaty with China, acquiring the right to build a railway through the territory of Manchuria. In 1898, Russia received the ports of Port Arthur and Dalny (Dalian) with adjacent territories and water space. Russia also received the right to lay railways to these ports from the CER (South Manchurian Railway). Thus, Russia took Japan’s Liaodong Peninsula captured during the war with China, which led to a new wave of militarization and anti-Russian military psychosis.

Japan nevertheless tried to reach an agreement and conclude an agreement with Russia on the division of spheres of influence in Korea and Manchuria. Ito Hirobumi proposed to leave Manchuria for Russia, and Korea should have become the sphere of influence of Japan. However, Ito's initiative did not find understanding in Petersburg. Therefore, the Japanese government decided to conclude an alliance with the British Empire. 17 (January 30) The Anglo-Japanese Treaty was signed on 1902 of the year, which deprived Russia of the support of any European power. Japan received a reliable rear. Subsequently, Japan received full financial support from England and the United States, without which it would not have been able to fight at all, and the pumping of the military, especially the naval muscles of the Japanese Empire, continued.

At the end of July 1903, Japan again proposes Russia to discuss the Far East issue. Apparently, Japan was still trying to solve the matter in peace. The Japanese knew that the potentials of Russia and Japan were very different, in favor of the Russian state. Russia could transfer almost the entire composition of the combat fleet from the west of the empire to the east. Relations with Germany were good then. During the years of the Russian-Japanese war, Germany in general acted and behaved as practically the only ally of Russia. Berlin was the only one that would benefit from the reorientation of Russia to the Pacific Ocean. The immensity of the Russian army simply frightened the Japanese (the peacetime Russian army was more than 1 million, the Japanese army 180 thousand. People). These fears were all the more justified because there was still no confidence in one’s own army. Japanese soldiers were trained by French and German instructors, but the new Japanese army had not yet dealt with a strong enemy. The assets of the Japanese was only a victory over completely degraded China. It was scary to fight with Russia. The opportunity to negotiate still existed, despite all the podnachivaniya from the Anglo-Saxons.

Russian poster of the beginning of the Russian-Japanese war, 1904. The Japanese emperor and his crafty well-wishers: John Bull and Uncle Sam.

In August, the Japanese handed over the draft agreement to the Russian Foreign Ministry 1903. Both sides had to recognize the independence and territorial integrity of Korea and China, and uphold the principle of equality in the commercial and industrial sphere. Russia had to recognize the predominance of Japanese interests in Korea, the Japanese recognized the special railway-building interests of Russia in Manchuria. Japan received the right to continue the railways built in Korea to South Manchuria, until the connection with the CER and the branch of the southern part of the CER to Beijing. Thus, the Japanese did not demand the abandonment of Port Arthur, but they blocked the economic activity of Russia in Korea and limited it in Manchuria. The Japanese gained wide access to North-East China. Moreover, it was only a project, negotiations could continue.

In general, this project was worthy of attention. Port Arthur, Dalny remained for Russia, the Japanese did not claim the CER and its branches. The further expansion of Russia, taking into account all the lost opportunities of the whole century, did not have much meaning. We already got everything we needed. The most important thing Russia had was a naval base in the southern seas and the railway to it. However, St. Petersburg is going to aggravate. October 5 Japan sent a reciprocal project, which included the recognition by Russia of the predominant interests of the Japanese in Korea, in exchange for Japan’s recognition of Manchuria as lying outside its sphere of interest. The provision on the exclusion of Manchuria from its zone of interests of Japan categorically did not treble. In December, 1903, Japan presents an ultimatum to Russia, demanding full recognition of its rights in Korea.

At the same time, Japan receives an encouraging push from the United States. On the same day, October 8 1903, the United States and Japan enter into trade agreements with China. Both Britain and the United States "advise" (point out) to China not to be friends with Russia. Then, the United States officially assured Japan that in the event of war, American policy would be sympathetic to the Empire of Shinto. Already during the war, US President Theodore Roosevelt will declare: "I will be extremely pleased with the victory of Japan, for Japan is playing our game."

Quite clearly anti-Russian game noticed in Berlin. 9 January 1904, Kaiser Wilhelm wrote to Emperor Nicholas: “... God grant that everything goes smoothly and that the Japanese listen to the voice of reason, despite the bitter efforts of the vile press of some country. It seems that she decided to throw money without end into the bottomless well of the Japanese mobilization. ” True, here it is necessary to correct the German emperor. More precisely, "they decided" - England and the United States.

At the beginning of 1904, at the special invitation of the Japanese emperor, the American war minister Taft arrived in Japan, who conveyed Roosevelt’s promise to give Japan military support if France and Germany took the side of Russia. And Japan decided to go to war.

A break up

The Japanese Foreign Ministry 5 in February 1904 of the year instructed by telegraph the ambassador in St. Petersburg to stop negotiations and terminate diplomatic relations with the Russian Empire. February 6 Japan officially announced the severance of diplomatic relations with Russia. The Russian response to the December ultimatum left 3 in February, but was detained in Nagasaki and delivered to Rosen only in February 7. January 22 (February 4) 1904 of the year in Japan held a joint meeting of the members of the Privy Council and the Cabinet of Ministers, at which it was decided to start a war against Russia. On the night of January 23 (February 5), an order was issued to disembark the assault force in Korea about the attack of the Russian squadron in Port Arthur. January 24 (February 6) Japanese fleet leaves for combat positions. Formally, Japan declared war on Russia on January 28 (February 10).

The landing of Japanese troops in Chemulpo.

To be continued ...
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  1. Denis
    Denis 27 January 2014 08: 55
    England and the United States did everything to pit Russia and Japan
    Aw, peace activists and proponents of gay integration, what are you lying about or what has changed?
    Although it changed, instead of Japan there was Germany. Yes, and now they don’t mind picking a candidate, only this
    1. Civil
      Civil 27 January 2014 09: 12
      Here we can’t return Crimea ...
    2. Alexander Petrovich
      Alexander Petrovich 27 January 2014 21: 12
      Then the Japanese started the war without declaring it, it was unexpected for the Russian squadron and Russian troops in the Far East, now they will also start the war - first by firing, and then declaring it.
      1. Shogun23
        Shogun23 28 January 2014 12: 08
        And the words "Little victorious war" do not tell you anything about how this war was "unexpected" for Russia?
  2. Prometey
    Prometey 27 January 2014 09: 07
    Everything is clearly written, there is nothing to add.
    1. Vovka levka
      Vovka levka 27 January 2014 15: 15
      Quote: Prometey
      Everything is clearly written, there is nothing to add.

      This is a convenient version, but unfortunately without the right conclusions.
      1. sss5.papu
        sss5.papu 27 January 2014 18: 05
        This is a convenient version, but unfortunately without the right conclusions.
        This is not a version, but a lie!
        1. The Army of Russia -1,5 million. The Army of Japan-145tys.
        2. The causes of the war - Russia's capture of Korea and the territories of China
        3. Both sides were preparing for war. Japan warned Russia of the outbreak of hostilities in the event of refusal to release the occupied territories.
        4. After a defeat on land, Russia was defeated at sea already in 1905, sending a whole fleet there. Only three ships that managed to escape returned, the rest were sunk or captured.
        Whatever you write for the patriots, they will accept Toko praise their heroism
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 27 January 2014 23: 18
          The soldiers really fought heroically, the blame was the command that was openly thieves and treacherous, like the current Serdyukovs, etc., plus the Japanese fleet was much more modern than the Russian one, possessed smokeless powder at that time, which was absent in the Russian artillery, this made it possible for the Japanese to the number of shots and accuracy to outrun the Russians, however, the main reason was the absolutely mediocre command, the only worthy man in this war was Admiral Stepan Osipovich Makarov, who, after the mediocre Stark, was able to competently organize coastal defense and select competent and effective tactics for the struggle of the Russian squadron at sea, if not for the tragic exit to the sea of ​​the battleship "Petropavlovsk", which was blown up by a mine and took the life of the commander of the first Pacific squadron, the admiral would have been able to defeat the Japanese. And I don't even want to talk about the mediocre campaign of the second Pacific squadron, Admiral Rozhdestvensky should be considered a criminal in general. A frank "drain" of the war, and I believe that this war should be a lesson and an example of what corruption and theft in the army lead to to the current leadership of Russia.
        2. c3r
          c3r 27 January 2014 23: 21
          The article is certainly chaotic with an admixture of far-fetched patriotism. But you, dear, are not right:
          1. The number of the Japanese army in the Far East was 347 thousand people, 1140 guns, 147 machine guns, 80 warships.
          2. Russian forces were inferior to the Japanese 4 times in manpower, 8 times in artillery, 18 times in machine guns, and 1,3 times in ships.
          3. Initially, the Russian war plan was focused on deterring then, after concentrating the main forces, the landing on the Japanese islands.
          4. The Japanese warned this correctly, but the note of declaring war was indeed delayed and this is a fact.
          5.And the ships did not run away and complied with the order of Admiral Rozhdestvensky to follow to Vladivostok and were interned in foreign ports or accepted the battle.
          6.You are a respected accuser of cheers of patriotism, do not slip into the side of the blackening of your heroes, and another 1,5 million soldiers were dispersed throughout Russia, and not at the theater of operations. They also had to be transported there through the transshipment in conditions of worthless bandwidth and revolution of 1905 of the year. It’s somehow strange about her, and you and the author of the epic are silent. And by the way, fighting in a troubled rear is still a pleasure.
          1. sss5.papu
            sss5.papu 28 January 2014 12: 17
            The whole army of Japan is -145 thousand. These are the numbers I have against your 347 thousand. And no one will convince you or me. The excuse about railway problems, as old as a fairy tale, after the defeat in the Crimean War, everyone blamed on its absence. Ground battles took place in 1904 - with which the revolution of 1905. And what railways prevented defeat at sea?
            Where did I slander the heroes? And then, aren't you tired of writing about heroism? In the same way, the Japanese can shout about the heroism of their soldiers. But the fact remains - Japan won, and Russia lost. And waving hands after a fight does not honor anyone!
  3. Trapperxnumx
    Trapperxnumx 27 January 2014 09: 20
    Thank! The topic is very good and to this day most Russians are painful. Because we not only could - we had to win that war. And only by reading materials and documents you begin to wonder about the behavior of generals and admirals.
    The development of the Far East is also like building up Dalniy, setting up zoos and other facilities there, while other Russian ports did not even have normal coastal artillery. Yes, if there were at least a pair of batteries in Aleksandrovsk and in Korsakovsk, the landing could be repelled. There were no studies, herd, but there was even no normal map of Sakhalin! After all, it was quite possible to build a shipyard in Vladik and to build ships on the Far East, even patrolmen and gunboats, which were so lacking. And why wasn’t the Volunteer Fleet used for the trade blockade of Japan ??
    In general, the war of missed opportunities, the roots of which grow in the pride of the then aristocracy "Japs, where are they against us" and so on.
  4. nikkon09
    nikkon09 27 January 2014 09: 22
    So the conclusion suggests itself - missed opportunities, what to learn from mistakes. Between China and Japan, friction again, Russia can again be used in a game to limit China’s influence, for example, I really hope that this time our politicians have enough wisdom not to play other people's games .
    1. Lk17619
      Lk17619 27 January 2014 10: 17
      Quote: nikkon09
      I really want to hope that this time our politicians have enough wisdom not to play other people's games.

      One can’t believe it at all, the State Department will show where all liberalism will run there.
  5. Moore
    Moore 27 January 2014 10: 30
    Tell me, who should I be in order not to put the fleet on alert by the fact of termination of diplomatic relations (February 6) before the night of February 9?
    Our intelligence in Japan was not, apparently, since no one for three days gave signals that the Japanese fleet had gone in an unknown direction. Chemulpo is also understandable - the information did not reach the consul.
    But in Arthur, they could already begin to move ???
    Or, as always - "not to give a reason for provocation"?
    1. Bosk
      Bosk 27 January 2014 11: 56
      In-in- "Do not give a reason for provocation" ... and this is not the first and not the last rake on which we are "marking time"!
  6. Yarik
    Yarik 27 January 2014 11: 14
    Interesting photo, but why "go out to battle"? Rather, they are leaving the battle. The Varyag has a roll to the left side and the stern is on fire.
    1. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 27 January 2014 17: 28
      Quote: Yarik
      "Varyag" roll to the port side and the stern is on fire.

      And the smoke doesn’t come from the chimneys. It just stands after the battle, maybe preparing for flooding
  7. Stinger
    Stinger 27 January 2014 11: 23
    At the beginning of 1904, at the special invitation of the Japanese emperor, the American war minister Taft arrived in Japan, who conveyed Roosevelt’s promise to give Japan military support if France and Germany took the side of Russia. And Japan decided to go to war.

    But the heavy hoof of justice struck Pearl Harbor in the following, confirming the truth that history teaches that it teaches nothing.
    1. Trapperxnumx
      Trapperxnumx 27 January 2014 11: 32
      Quote: Stinger
      But the heavy hoof of justice struck Pearl Harbor later,

      I agree. The heavy hoof of justice kicked off all these "conspirators" in full force.
      1. mamba
        mamba 27 January 2014 15: 23
        Quote: Trapper7
        The heavy hoof of justice kicked off all these "conspirators" in full force.

        Yes, the Japanese subsequently "adequately thanked" everyone who helped them start a war with Russia:
        - The Far Eastern colonies were taken from the Germans after the 1st World War. According to its results, the Japanese Empire received German territories in Shandong, as well as part of the former German colonies in the Pacific Ocean, which formed the South Pacific Mandate;
        - among the British - during the 2nd World War they captured Hong Kong, Malaya and Singapore, invaded Burma;
        - The Americans defeated the Pacific Fleet, captured the Philippines and began the capture of the Aleutian Islands (Kyska and Attu).
        The attitude of the Japanese towards prisoners of war is indicative. During the Russian-Japanese war, Russian sailors were normally fed in captivity, were not involved in work and were not even guarded, taking their word of honor that they would not run away. Russian prisoners were treated as "guests of honor". The attitude of the Japanese towards them at that time was an example on the basis of which future international conventions related to the treatment of prisoners of war, sick and wounded were created.
        But the British and Americans during the 2nd World War were kept in concentration camps for cattle and mercilessly exploited in hard work.
  8. Goldmitro
    Goldmitro 27 January 2014 11: 41
    <<< A huge role in this matter (playing off in the interests of the Naglo-Saxons of Russia and Japan) was played by Sergei Witte, the future “half-Sakhalin count” (more details about the destructive role of this figure can be found in the work of S. Kremlev “Russia and Japan: Set It Off!”). >>>
    Isn't that why our lib..rals have so imbued with respect for Witte, naming the street in his honor - "Witte Alley" in Moscow, in South Butovo! And this is not the last destructive role that this figure played in the history of Russia!
    1. Goldmitro
      Goldmitro 28 January 2014 16: 35
      The most destructive role of Witte’s policy is that, with Western influence, Witte’s economic policy led to the impoverishment of the people in Russia and voluntarily or involuntarily aimed at overthrowing the monarchy and drawing Russia into war. The logical outcome of such an antisocial policy was the revolution, which was supposed to overthrow the king and put at the head of the country leaders who were pleased with the West. The fertile soil for such a development of events has become the unthinkable division of people in Russia into super-rich and poor and the emergence of a huge number of state corrupt officials who had capital in Western banks. Before Witte, this was not. Russian industrialists have always invested money in their country, giving the state the opportunity to manage this money for the benefit of the Fatherland.
      It is not surprising that the example of financial management practiced by Sergei Yulievich found such an enthusiastic response in Russia among the new young reformers. As in the days of S. Witte, the huge loans received by Russia in the West in the early 1990s were used not for the development of the country's manufacturing sector, but for the “creation of private enterprise”, mainly oriented to banks, insurance investment companies, financial funds in which the funds received from the state disappeared without a trace.
  9. Standard Oil
    Standard Oil 27 January 2014 11: 45
    This war was kind of strange, and I want to say muddy. It seems that the Russian leadership was seized by some kind of apathy, okay they managed to lose the fleet, but how did they manage to lose land battles? And then also make peace when Japan was on its last legs, with the collapsed economy living on only IOUs? Okay, there was a "rEvolution", since it could affect the hostilities going on the other side of the globe? What did you need to remove the troops from the front? That the troops were not at hand so that And why did Nicholas II not make any conclusions? He was so stupid? It is very useful to have a regiment of other reliable people. That’s not “brainwash” figuratively speaking when it was necessary, I had to “brainwash” in the literal sense of Ipatievsky home.
    1. Prometey
      Prometey 27 January 2014 13: 32
      Quote: Standard Oil
      This war was somehow strange, and I’d like to say a muddy one. The feeling that the Russian leadership was seized with some apathy did manage to lose the fleet, but did they manage to lose the land battles? And then make peace when Japan was on its last legs, with a collapsed economy living on debt alone?

      I have the same feeling that in the tsarist military leadership (with the exception of units) there were immediately defeatist sentiments and simply did not want and did not want to win. At the same time, it is even more surprising that Japan has not shown its greatest military successes either on land or at sea. She had barely defeated the technically backward Qin China before that. In this regard, the complete apathy of both the Russian army and the squadron in Port Arthur, which until the very last sat behind the walls of the fortress until it was driven out by Japanese siege artillery, looks even stranger. As a result, all attempts to save the ships for something turned into their complete loss.
  10. Bosk
    Bosk 27 January 2014 11: 54
    If the war lasted another year or two, then Japan would definitely lose, at the end of the war the advantage was already on the Russian side, but the politicians made a compensation for this, we must say "thanks" to both our politicians and other "Englishmen" ... because the pressure on the top was not weak.
    1. Prometey
      Prometey 27 January 2014 13: 20
      Quote: Bosk
      If the war lasted another year or two, then Japan would definitely lose

      Japan could no longer wage war after Tsushima, all the more so by the summer of 1905, fresh reinforcements of a half million Russian army were concentrated at Sappingai. The Japanese understood that they could not stop her, and therefore they urgently began to ask for peace talks.
  11. dmb
    dmb 27 January 2014 13: 22
    Glybko; especially about Kuropatkin-Kutuzov he famously turned. However, contemporaries with higher military education assess this "strategist" somewhat differently.
    1. Prometey
      Prometey 27 January 2014 13: 36
      Quote: dmb
      especially about Kuropatkin-Kutuzov famously turned

      Correct comparison, only Kutuzov has nothing to do with it. Kuropatkin's tactics were correct - to wear out the Japanese in battles and wait for reinforcements from Russia. Another thing is that there was not enough determination and blind faith in the Japanese "military genius" interfered.
  12. moremansf
    moremansf 27 January 2014 14: 08
    But we almost lost our entire fleet ... including the outstanding naval commander Admiral S.O. Makarov ..
    1. Prometey
      Prometey 28 January 2014 07: 30
      Quote: moremansf
      including the outstanding naval commander Admiral S.O. Makarov ..

      What is outstanding in him that he constantly escaped from Togo?
      1. Shogun23
        Shogun23 28 January 2014 12: 24
        When did he flee? When did ships that embarked on maneuvers take to the raid? This is not an escape, this is a retreat, due to the unpreparedness of the ships for military operations. And Makarov, unlike the rest of the admirals, was really engaged in training the crew, joint actions of different types of ships, and died just at the moment when he went on a military campaign. On March 9, one of the battles of the Russian and Japanese squadrons took place, and then the Japanese were draping, thanks to his actions, the Japanese were unable to block the port from the sea or land troops on the peninsula (which was immediately done after the death of Makarov)
        1. Prometey
          Prometey 28 January 2014 13: 48
          Quote: Shogun23
          When did he flee?

          As soon as he saw the Japanese battleships, he immediately returned to Arthur.
          Quote: Shogun23
          And Makarov, unlike the rest of the admirals, was really engaged in training the crew, joint actions of different types of ships

          It was necessary to deal with this before the war, and not during (well, this is no claim to it). The only way out was to go to battle with the Japanese fleet, and if you did not win, then inflict damage on him, and not sit out in a fortified pool.
          1. Shogun23
            Shogun23 28 January 2014 14: 50
            Quote: Prometey
            As soon as he saw the Japanese battleships, he immediately returned to Arthur.

            These clashes occurred during training maneuvers, when Makarov was making up for what he had not had time to do before the war. And to go into battle, when there is no confidence in the successful conclusion of the battle, it would be criminal.
            Quote: Prometey
            The only way out was to go to battle with the Japanese fleet, and if you did not win, then inflict damage on him, and not sit out in a fortified pool.
            He planned this - the fleet’s active operations, but for this it was necessary to at least wait for the return of damaged ships from repair. If you give the enemy a battle, then it is advisable to decide why you need to gain as much strength as possible (another consequence follows from this - he tried to save the ships that were in service, retreating to the raid, not getting involved in a major battle), but as you know S.O. Makarov stayed as commander, less than 2 months (and directly commanded even less), for which he did not have time to completely prepare the forces to meet with the Togo fleet.
            And this, knowing how the war ended and knowing the fate of the squadron and Port Arthur, you say that it was necessary to "inflict damage on him, and not sit in a fortress puddle.", But only the loss of a ship, this is not the loss of a gun or a line of defense, so quickly the loss of the ship cannot be made up, and for a guaranteed victory time was needed, which, unfortunately, was not given to Makarov.
  13. Galich Kos
    Galich Kos 27 January 2014 14: 18
    Another article on the topic: "If my grandmother had ... it would not be a grandmother, but a grandfather"!
    Time put everything in its place, 1945 for the USSR.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 27 January 2014 18: 13
      Now, alas, given the level of combat readiness and the state of our fleet, and also taking into account the mentality of officials, in the event of a hypothetical clash between the Russian and Japanese fleets, I am afraid that we would lose again. We at the Pacific Fleet in general, the combat personnel is not updated. All ships are already 20-30-40 years old, smoke like steamers of the 19th century. But the Japanese have a brand new fleet built in the 2000s.
  14. Marat
    Marat 27 January 2014 16: 02
    I believe that, at best, for us the war would end in a draw. On land, most likely the Japanese would have been poured into devils (although again the question is at what cost, after all, Russia is "used to" fighting with a lot of blood), but the Japanese fleet dominated the sea.
  15. polkovnik manuch
    polkovnik manuch 27 January 2014 19: 11
    Why wave your fists after a fight? If, as perhaps, the terms are not on the topic, so the late Lebedev said: if grandmother had ..., then she would be a grandfather "
  16. Rurikovich
    Rurikovich 27 January 2014 19: 14
    If, yes, if only ... History does not know the subjunctive mood. And the benefit of studying the war itself and its results will be only when we analyze and learn its lessons, so as not to step on the same rake in the future.
    It’s now easy for us to clever on different topics, because we know the result. And then what happened was supposed to happen due to both objective reasons and subjective ones. The commotion of the command was somehow overtaken by the heroism of subordinates. Reeling near Mukden, surrender of an advantageous position near Qingzhou predetermined the close blockade of Port Arthur. The inability to organize a more or less sensible cruising war to disrupt transportation resulted in a good siege artillery in the invasion of Japanese troops. The incompetent leadership of the fleet and the defeatist mood after the death of Makarov led to the fact that the fleet did practically nothing good. Although it was possible to bring a lot of harm to the ships of Togo. The Japanese, however, drew conclusions from their actions and the actions of the enemy, which resulted in increased combat training of the fleet and the introduction of improvements in firing control. Plus, tactical fusion and more or less the same type of combat formations increased the combat effectiveness of the fleet. Even if the Russian 2nd squadron was twice as large, the result would still be unambiguous - defeat.
    So you need to give honor to the fallen and study the mistakes of the past, so as not to mourn the sacrifices of the future because of the failure to learn the lessons of history.
    This is just my opinion.
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  18. Shogun23
    Shogun23 28 January 2014 12: 06
    And why no one recalls that in Russia, too, everything was not so smooth, there was no longer any money for the war, and due to popular unrest, the war was an impermissible luxury. the loss of two squadrons (and a shameful loss), the lack of talented leadership of the armed forces (Kuropatkin did not win a single battle), all this was far from Russia's hand, and it was simply pointless to continue such a war.