Military Review

Patriarch Kirill: You can not continue to ignore the majority of Russian

135
Ignoring the interests of the Russian people, ousting the Russian question from the public sphere led to skyrocketing marginalized and aggressive displays, said the Patriarch of Moscow and All Russia Kirill at the XVII World Russian People's Council.


“In a sense, Russia is a synonym for Russia. Today we have a different geopolitical reality, when in the vastness of this historical Independent states arose in Russia, many of which are also heirs to this historical Russia. Therefore, when I talk about Russia, I always mean this great civilization space, ”the patriarch explained.

In his speech, published on the official website of the Moscow Patriarchate, he stressed that Russia can offer the world the experience of building fair and peaceful interethnic relations, since "there were no peoples-masters and slaves-peoples in Russia".

In his opinion, in the modern world, the “model of the organization of society” prevails, based on “a system of permanent confrontation, competition and struggle, supposedly inevitable and necessary for progress”.

“Our ideal, on the contrary, is a solidarity society, a society of social symphony,” Kirill said, adding that people of different opinions and beliefs do not always understand social values ​​in the same way.

“There are nuances and nuances, there is a space for discussion, for dialogue. However, no dialogue with those who rudely humiliates, mocks, tramples, who destroys interethnic and interreligious world is impossible, ”he said.

“Very often, those who deny our shrines and values, transfer their feelings to the Russian people, who are the main creator of our civilization, the bearer of its ideals. It’s as if these forces are trying to support everything that can weaken, divide, worldview and moral disorientation, ”the patriarch said.

“It seems that these circles fear the real rebirth of Russian civilization, rebirth based on faith, connected to life, with a socially significant action, above all,” he said.

According to him, “the dialogue of peoples will not reach the goal without the presence of Russian voices, the Russian factor”, the World Russian Council can “represent the Russian people at the sites of interethnic discussions”.

Commenting on the events in Biryulyovo, the patriarch said: “The deafness of those in power to the demands of the people, the reluctance to look for joint solutions to the problems of excessive migration and related crime, as well as the sometimes defiant behavior of visitors now bring the situation to the brink of a critical line.”

“If the position of the Russian majority will continue to be ignored, only the destroyers of Russia will win,” he said.

“We reject the position of those who believe that Russia should be a country only and exclusively for Russians. But we will also never agree with those who want to see it “Russia without Russians”, deprived of a national and religious person who has lost a sense of solidarity and unity, ”he explained, stressing that“ no one person belonging to another people in Russia should not be limited in their rights, in their capabilities. "

Attention to the topic of international relations increased after the assassination of the resonance 25-year Yegor Shcherbakov in the metropolitan area of ​​West Biryulevo.

Then the residents of the region organized a “people's gathering”, but the action turned into riots, during which people broke windows, turned over cars, and also broke into the territory of the local vegetable base where migrants work and where, in their opinion, a criminal could be hiding.
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  1. alekseyal
    alekseyal 1 November 2013 12: 09
    47
    What does the Air Defense stand for (The Great Fatherland Party)

    We believe that the Russian People (including Ukrainians and Belarusians, as it was historically) should be officially at the level of the Constitution, proclaimed in Russia state-forming people, while maintaining the fullness of civil rights for any citizen of Russia, regardless of ethnic origin.

    We advocate a simplified regime for granting Russian citizenship to all representatives of the state-forming Russian people and other indigenous peoples of Russia who find themselves abroad of our homeland.

    We demand by legal means to ban Russophobia and its propaganda, as well as the propaganda of everything that popularizes Nazi or separatist views, aggravates interethnic and inter-religious contradictions.

    We are convinced that the demographic problem in Russia must be resolved by all possible stimulation of growth, first of all, of the indigenous population, and not by increasing the influx of migrants. We have developed the "Russian billion" program, which should provide the necessary demographic growth.

    http://партиявеликоеотечество.рф/
    1. Vitlek
      Vitlek 1 November 2013 12: 13
      14
      YES I SUPPORT
    2. seller trucks
      seller trucks 1 November 2013 12: 52
      -16 qualifying.
      “Very often, those who deny our shrines and values, transfer their feelings to the Russian people, who are the main creator of our civilization, the bearer of its ideals. It’s as if these forces are trying to support everything that can weaken, divide, worldview and moral disorientation, ”the patriarch said.


      honestly, I do not like Alexy, but it has nothing to do with Orthodoxy, in the end they go to church to God, and not to the priest, it's lyrics.

      but here in words he is a fine fellow, but with great pleasure I would have seen priests in the crowd of the "people's gathering", perhaps even before clashes with the police did not come
      1. APES
        APES 1 November 2013 13: 06
        +5
        Quote: seller trucks
        I don’t like Alexy, but this has nothing to do with Orthodoxy,


        judging by this, you have not been to any service

        Quote: seller trucks
        but here in words


        he does a lot and has already done a lot, maybe you just don’t know about it
        1. strannik595
          strannik595 1 November 2013 13: 12
          19
          I do not like Alexy
          ....... firstly he is Cyril, secondly he is not a girl to like, but he knows his business and does it well, with good sense and understanding
          with great pleasure I would have seen priests in the crowd of the "people's gathering", perhaps, it did not even come to clashes with the police
          ..... once in the history of Russia it was already, that father was called Gapon and it ended sadly
          1. Uncle
            Uncle 1 November 2013 13: 51
            +8
            Quote: strannik595
            I do not like Alexy
            ....... firstly he is Cyril

            Serious opponent! laughing Doesn't even know the name of the one he is talking about! laughing
            1. seller trucks
              seller trucks 1 November 2013 14: 03
              -3
              Quote: Uncle
              Serious opponent! He doesn’t even know the name of the one he is talking about!


              trolling is welcome yes
        2. seller trucks
          seller trucks 1 November 2013 13: 47
          -11 qualifying.
          Quote: APES
          judging by this, you have not been to any service


          century of will not to see laughing

          Quote: APES
          he does a lot and has already done a lot, maybe you just don’t know about it


          Well, yes, as there in the aneka about the new Russian and the harem "than, I can"

          RAVVIN SHAEVICH - SPIRITUAL MENTOR OF PATRIARCH KIRILL. OR VICE VERSA? ALWAYS HAPPENING ANYWHERE ...

          http://3rm.info/11910-ravvin-shaevich-duxovnyj-nastavnik-patriarxa.html

          however, that's all, the game is on the verge of "warning" you want to read, Dushenov for such sedition was convicted under 282 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation
          1. seller trucks
            seller trucks 1 November 2013 14: 10
            +4
            Quote: seller trucks
            Dushenov was convicted of such sedition according to 282 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation


            the main reason for "landing" is this:


            February 3 2010 of the year was convicted under Art. 282 part 2 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation and sentenced to three years of imprisonment in a penal colony [12] for authorship and distribution of the film “Russia with a knife in the back. Jewish Fascism and the Genocide of the Russian People ”and for the distribution of the magazines“ Orthodox Russia. ” The court also deprived Dushenov of the right to engage in publishing activities for three years [6]. The verdict was actively discussed in the St. Petersburg and federal press [13]. According to Irina Levinskaya, an expert in court, the court drew attention to the fact that Dushenov not only spread slander and hatred towards Jews and adherents of Judaism, but also made quite a lot of money from it [14]. The experience of watching this movie in a maximum security colony is described in the book of V. Pereverzin - Hostage: The Story of the Yukos Manager [15]: 216-217.
            Dushenov’s lawyer Andrei Antonov [16] from St. Petersburg stated that the sentence to Dushenov was unfounded, with reference to the controversial book of the historian Shlomo Zanda Who and how he invented the Jewish people. He claims that “... the absurd and insolvent are the charges brought against Russian citizens for inciting hatred or hostility to persons of Jewish nationality, as well as humiliating their dignity, Art. 282 of the Criminal Code. After all, according to these conscientious studies, the Jewish people, the Jewish nation do not exist in the scientific and practical understanding of the people and the nation ”[17] [18]
            February 2 2011 of the year Dushenov was transferred from the colony-settlement to the correctional colony. [19]. On 28 of September 2012, the Vsevolzhsky City Court decided on the conditional release of Dushenov [20] from custody, but the decision was challenged by the prosecutor's office [21].
            21 November 2012 year released
          2. APES
            APES 1 November 2013 14: 37
            +7
            Quote: seller trucks
            http://3rm.info/11910-ravvin-shaevich-duxovnyj-nastavnik-patriarxa.html


            http://www.patriarchia.ru/db/text/141422

            - if you are really interested.

            One of the quotes is on a subject that bothers you:

            "II.2. The ecumenical character of the Church, however, does not mean that Christians have no right to national identity, national self-expression. On the contrary, the Church unites in itself the universal principle with the national. Thus, the Orthodox Church, being universal, consists of many Autocephalous Local Churches. Orthodox Christians, recognizing themselves as citizens of the heavenly homeland, should not forget about their earthly homeland. "
      2. saveall
        saveall 1 November 2013 13: 15
        +5
        Quote: seller trucks
        honestly I don't like Alexy

        Actually, the Patriarch is Cyril now ... Or is it not important?
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 1 November 2013 13: 21
          +3
          Quote: saveall
          .. Or is it not important?

          Some do not care.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. tomket
        tomket 2 November 2013 09: 20
        +1
        Alexy the second actually died, and the patriarch is Cyril, before you write, first find out who you specifically don’t like, suddenly you neighbor Alexei doesn’t like ....
    3. Orik
      Orik 1 November 2013 15: 23
      +1
      Well written what is needed, and now how, what resources?
      1. alekseyal
        alekseyal 1 November 2013 21: 05
        +1
        Participation in elections, the coming to power of all levels.
        Party program on one page.

        http://партиявеликоеотечество.рф/docs/program

        To create a broad patriotic coalition, factions are created within the party.
        For example "National-patriotic" faction

        http://nstarikov.ru/blog/26419
    4. nickname 1 and 2
      nickname 1 and 2 1 November 2013 15: 51
      -2
      Quote: alekseyal
      the level of the Constitution, proclaimed in Russia by the state-forming people,


      And what is the FEDERATION ???

      And as in the case of your option, the device of the country of Russia will be called ???

      With this HOW? you?
      1. dddym
        dddym 1 November 2013 19: 15
        +2
        The Federation is a community of equal public entities. Nothing is violated - our state is called the Russian Federation, which means the very federal structure around Russia. And Russia is a national Russian state, because the Russians should be the state-forming majority, if we were in another country then there would be other national centers. Even in the USSR, Russia was a federal republic, and about the inhabitants of the USSR, even if they were, for example, Kalmyks, they said: "Russians."
    5. wk-083
      wk-083 1 November 2013 20: 40
      +1
      I agree only for!
  2. Field
    Field 1 November 2013 12: 12
    +4
    it's time for the patriarch to decide on the power he or the people
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 1 November 2013 12: 19
      +8
      And this one finally remembered the Russian people. Why didn’t you remember then? After Biryulev, everyone immediately remembered this.
      1. APES
        APES 1 November 2013 12: 57
        +7
        [
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        finally remembered the Russian people.


        not just remembered more than once, I’ll say more constantly thinking and thinking about him

        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Why didn’t you remember it before?


        the time has not come

        I want to hope that the choice is made - a bet on the Russian people

        Quote: Ingvar 72
        After Biryulev, everyone immediately remembered this.


        Before Biryulev, significant events had already begun to take place - for example, the arrest of the mayor of Makhachkala, the closure of many North Caucasian banks and much more - hidden from the eyes of the general public ....
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 1 November 2013 18: 33
          +2
          Quote: APES
          I want to hope that the choice is made - a bet on the Russian people

          Hope always dies last. I don’t want to upset you, but it seems to me that you are too optimistic. If Cyril at least a little bit listened to Diomede, Bishop of Anadyr and Chukotka, then the authority of the Russian Orthodox Church would be much higher. And the authorities would look back at the church, and not vice versa.
          1. Vadivak
            Vadivak 1 November 2013 20: 45
            +2
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            If Cyril at least a little bit listened to Diomede, Bishop of Anadyr and Chukotka


            Diomede actually didn’t take money for christening, weddings and funeral services and harshly criticized his superiors. Do you know by what principle a pyramid is being built, for example, the hierarchy of the Greek church? The inverted pyramid, that is, who at its peak is the very lowest type, so, well, patriarch, so what? We also had before Peter, only he broke everything
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 2 November 2013 08: 36
              +1
              Quote: Vadivak
              Do you know by what principle a pyramid is being built, for example, the hierarchy of the Greek church?

              I know. But when the top of the Russian Orthodox Church violates all the canons, deposition relies on it. In the same canons and recorded. As in a song, either take off the cross, or put on your underpants ... And according to Diomede, he is not the lowest rank. Archbishop
          2. APES
            APES 2 November 2013 14: 49
            0
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            I do not want to upset you, but it seems to me that you are too optimistic.


            I just BELIEVE !!!

            and I pray to God for the poor Russian people
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. avt
        avt 1 November 2013 13: 21
        0
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        And this one finally remembered the Russian people.

        Previously, it was not up to him, but now I decided to saddle the topic. In fact, Cyril is quite smart and cunning, he is a good speaker, and it was not for nothing that he met the Metropolitan on TV — he trained, but if anyone thinks that as a good speaker he really fits into the topic and takes the post of leader — they are deeply mistaken. An extremely cautious and guided person . A leader will never be, only a slave.
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 1 November 2013 13: 23
          +1
          Quote: avt
          but if anyone thinks that being a good speaker he will really fit into the topic and go to the post of leader, they are deeply mistaken. An extremely cautious and guided person. A leader will never be, only a slave.

          What are you talking about?
          1. avt
            avt 1 November 2013 13: 53
            +4
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            What are you talking about?

            I’m not talking about anything, I’m talking specifically about him. And what didn’t I like? opinion of him as a person? So he is a man, with all the shortcomings and positive qualities, he is not the viceroy of God on Earth, like the Roman priest, he is VENERANT, you must agree, the difference is significant.
            1. Alexander Romanov
              Alexander Romanov 1 November 2013 15: 11
              +1
              Quote: avt
              . And what did not like?

              I just asked a question hi
              1. avt
                avt 1 November 2013 17: 19
                +1
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                I just asked a question

                And someone slammed a minus, fix it. For the question, why should it be minus?
                1. tomket
                  tomket 2 November 2013 09: 28
                  -1
                  not all are Shrovetide for the cat, although I didn’t minus)
        2. tomket
          tomket 2 November 2013 09: 28
          -1
          Our church is separated from the state, if you have forgotten, Kirril is the leader of all Orthodox Christians, although in a sense you are right, he is led by God, but he is unlikely to enter the political arena, no matter how you provoke him
      4. tverskoi77
        tverskoi77 1 November 2013 13: 28
        +1
        And this one finally remembered the Russian people.
        All the same, we must respect the Patriarch with respect, he is our Patriarch. Not a saint, of course, there are a lot of questions to the current church (more precisely, to people): some on rosters and gelentvagins buzzing in robes around Moscow, others using the express method they make priests from officials, and then they make disassembly disguising them as an apartment conflict and so on and so forth things like that.
        But we ourselves (and without the church as well) need to increase our level of relationship to each other and of course communication.
        And, within the meaning of your comment +
        1. Berserk
          Berserk 1 November 2013 21: 33
          0
          Duck in Russia, not all Russians are Orthodox. And those who are not Orthodox, be they atheists or pagans, are greatly annoyed by these teachings. And the fact that the church intervenes in civil affairs. For example, I do not want my sons to teach the word of God at school. Respect is based on deeds. There will be deeds, there will be respect. There are not so many churches in the country. Do you think there will be at least half of the Russians? Not. Why should others listen to your patriarch? Now, if he says something clever, then you can listen, and when he carries nonsense, why on earth? Now he says the necessary things. The political moment is this. Until recently, he was broadcasting about Slavs, half-humans, barely speaking, and so on, moreover, of the type he described the way they were perceived by Saint Cyril. So civilized, shocked by savages. Yes, Cyril himself was a Slav!
          By such behavior, the clergy set up against themselves completely neutral people like me. And before rushing to Mr., ask yourself - why a true believer needs an armored limousine and a gang of heifers? Whether the case was the Montenegrin Patriarch. Mighty Faith man. I went on a tram.
      5. tomket
        tomket 2 November 2013 09: 24
        0
        and where did you get such confidence that he didn’t remember? Do you personally talk with him every day and note in a notebook, he remembered Ali or forgot?
    2. radio operator
      radio operator 1 November 2013 13: 07
      0
      Quote: Field
      it's time for the patriarch to decide on the power he or the people

      Berezovsky proposed the same to the Patriarch, meaning the people under the opposition. Well-known reception of liberals. Opposition is a smaller part of the people.
    3. EwgenyZ
      EwgenyZ 1 November 2013 13: 13
      +6
      Both the Patriarch and the Church are always with the people! And what, are not our fellow citizens in power? What, the Patriarch should have anathematized Putin after the "elections" and called for a "Holy War" against the Edros? Talk nonsense, dear.
      1. Uncle
        Uncle 1 November 2013 14: 01
        +5
        It has become fashionable to slander, pay attention, we pour mud on both the patriarch and the president, we do not criticize only ourselves. But the entire ruling elite comes from our ranks, from the people. Putin and Medvedev studied in simple schools, members of the government and the clergy live among us, I'm not joking, here at a certain "construction site of the century" I got into a conversation with a man, stood, joked, then they ask me, what kind of TV do you don’t watch, I say no, but what, yes it's .... berg. That is, the country is ruled not by the Martians, but by our fellow citizens, and they are very close to us. Power and the Church are a reflection of our society, if someone does not like our clergy, well, go to the seminary, become pastors, honest, incorruptible, and so on that you want to see in today's priests. Try to resist the temptations?
        1. EwgenyZ
          EwgenyZ 1 November 2013 14: 31
          +1
          Some people don’t understand this, it’s easier to see the mote in the eyes of others.
          1. Snipe 74
            Snipe 74 1 November 2013 17: 07
            +3
            And why do not you like criticism and claims of people? I also do not like the inaction of our patriarch. I believe that he is simply obliged to say in defense of the Russian people. And who else can we hope for? And the Russian people are the basis and core of the entire Russian state and it must be worn in the arms.
            1. tomket
              tomket 2 November 2013 09: 30
              -1
              in defense he speaks every sermon and at every prayer service, or do you want him to call for arms ????
      2. Topside
        Topside 1 November 2013 20: 08
        +3
        Russian authorities have only surnames, and entities far from non-Russian are noticeable by the results of their activities, only blind belay sees.
    4. nickname 1 and 2
      nickname 1 and 2 1 November 2013 15: 58
      0
      Quote: Field
      it's time for the patriarch to decide


      But what about the CONSTITUTION?

      So he decided, respectively.

      Remember Yeltsin and the head of the Constitutional Court - Zorkin!

      And why now Zorkin does not attack Putin?
      Answer: Putin abides by the CONSTITUTION!
      1. Topside
        Topside 1 November 2013 19: 06
        -1
        why isn’t Zorkin attacking Putin now?
        Answer: Putin abides by the CONSTITUTION! You are serious! I didn’t know that the constitution says that you can steal? (Examples above the roof) fool
  3. Hort
    Hort 1 November 2013 12: 14
    +4
    Russia is not in a sense synonymous with Russia, but in the most direct.
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 1 November 2013 12: 55
      12
      Quote: hort
      Russia is not in a sense synonymous with Russia, but in the most direct.

      When Russia will be called Russia all, including here on the site. When Russia Belarus and Ukraine will be together again, then from a synonym it will turn into reality.
  4. d1m1drol
    d1m1drol 1 November 2013 12: 15
    10
    The correct words of the patriarch says. A sense ...
    1. ZU-23
      ZU-23 1 November 2013 12: 27
      +7
      Well, even if he says, the thought is material, may God grant all good things come true.
    2. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 1 November 2013 12: 58
      +4
      Quote: d1m1drol
      The correct words of the patriarch says. A sense ...

      There will be no sense, the words of the Patriarch Putin will not be able to ignore. There is no power in power to go against the Church. For power, ignoring in this case will become political and not only suicide.
      1. Hort
        Hort 1 November 2013 13: 22
        +6
        never positively related to the patriarch and the top of the Russian Orthodox Church, but here I support.
        If even the patriarch (!) Raises such a topic, and without accusing "school teachers, the media and nationalist provocateurs", it is clearly time to change the guidelines for our powers that be
      2. Topside
        Topside 1 November 2013 18: 22
        0
        These are links of one chain.
    3. EwgenyZ
      EwgenyZ 1 November 2013 13: 28
      +2
      The sense will be only if we ourselves begin to change: Save yourself, and thousands around you will be saved (Seraphim of Sarov). In the meantime, just listen and do not.
      1. Uncle
        Uncle 1 November 2013 14: 55
        +1
        Quote: EwgenyZ
        In the meantime, just listen and do not.

        Why aren't we doing it? Christians pray, this work is worse than any other, so you quote Seraphim of Sarov, so you know how he prayed. And we try, pull ourselves up.
        1. EwgenyZ
          EwgenyZ 1 November 2013 15: 10
          +1
          I agree, many do. But, nevertheless, the majority are waiting for a "good master" to come and fix everything, it's like Raikin's: "I've been standing and watching for 15 minutes, but at least someone would come up and turn off the tap" ...
        2. Topside
          Topside 1 November 2013 15: 29
          -2
          Uncle: Do you consider yourself a Slave of God? Pray, well, yes, this is a great work! With such a slavish philosophy, you will remain a slave, only in the literal sense of the word. hi
          1. EwgenyZ
            EwgenyZ 1 November 2013 15: 38
            +4
            With such a "slave" philosophy, we built the Great Empire. But what will you build, are you our free?
            And more: Alexander Nevsky, Dmitry Donskoy, Alexander Suvorov, Fedor Ushakov, Mikhailo Lomonosov - also slaves?
            1. Topside
              Topside 1 November 2013 22: 27
              -1
              All whom are listed are great people who have contributed to the history of Russia, not a couple to you. yes
          2. Flooding
            Flooding 1 November 2013 16: 40
            0
            Quote: Fesa
            Uncle: Do you consider yourself a Slave of God? Pray, well, yes, this is a great work! With such a slavish philosophy, you will remain a slave, only in the literal sense of the word.

            Almost all of us are slaves to our habits, and very often to bad ones. This has not scared anyone lately.
            But at the mere thought of being a slave to the Creator, someone starts to sausage and throws into a cold sweat.
            We all live according to the laws invented and established by people.
            But living the laws of God is unbearable for anyone. Yes, you are not being held captive, man. Unlike the state, which requires the strict observance of human laws, the Lord does not bond anyone.

            Also, I don't think the word slave should be taken so literally.
            For the latest ignoramus, it is no secret that the Bible was translated into Russian from Greek. And in this word the attitude of the Orthodox towards the Creator is rather incorporated than HIS attitude towards his children.
            1. Uncle
              Uncle 1 November 2013 17: 12
              +2
              Not so bad, I wrote the word "God" with a capital letter, nice. Therefore, the times have passed about which Archimandrite John Krestyankin, was such a man of holy life, said: "We live in times when the KGB is written with a capital letter, and God with a small letter."
              1. Tyumen
                Tyumen 1 November 2013 21: 55
                +2
                The KGB is an abbreviation; it cannot be written with a small letter. Dissident populism.
            2. Topside
              Topside 1 November 2013 18: 05
              -1
              Are you already with me? Are you upbringing lame and naughty? And do you seriously think that writing arose somewhere near Greece and gradually spread throughout the world? (Brainwashing people from birth) And who do you think, who writes history and with whose filing ??? never thought? No.
              1. Flooding
                Flooding 1 November 2013 18: 12
                +1
                Quote: Fesa
                Are you with me already? Are you upbringing lame and nerves naughty?

                No, you can verify this by going down the comments.
                But the stylistics sometimes allows you to switch to "you" if the old turns of speech and words are used.
                Agree "you, man" does not sound Russian at all.
                Quote: Fesa
                And do you seriously think that writing arose somewhere near Greece and gradually spread throughout the world?

                You are not at all familiar with the subject under discussion.
                It was not about writing at all, but about the Bible in Russian.
                Quote: Fesa
                And what do you think, who writes the story and with whose filing ??? never thought?

                Thought of it, and many times. Before our very eyes, Romanian historians defame and rewrite history for the sake of the political situation.
                But the vain human has little to do with what was discussed.
                1. Topside
                  Topside 1 November 2013 18: 50
                  -1
                  But stylistics sometimes allows you to switch to "you" That's about how the meaning of meanings and concepts is slowly lost. Stylistics is a cover ... Personally, I believe only in myself and my relatives and friends, in my own strength, and all religions in the world created by specialists for their slaves and how you do not squirm yes here you can not convince me - All the best ...
                  1. Flooding
                    Flooding 1 November 2013 18: 54
                    +2
                    Quote: Fesa
                    That's about such a macar and slowly the meaning of meanings and concepts is lost

                    Didn't catch the connection. In the old Russian language, they did not turn to "you" in the singular to anyone and never.
                    So what did I lose by turning to the old Russian rules?
                    Quote: Fesa
                    Good luck...

                    Thank you for your kind wishes. Have a nice one you too.
                  2. Vadivak
                    Vadivak 1 November 2013 20: 58
                    +1
                    Quote: Fesa
                    Personally, I believe only in myself and my family and friends,


                    In this case, in the second and third you will eventually become disappointed. Because you cannot forgive betrayal
                    1. Topside
                      Topside 1 November 2013 22: 07
                      -1
                      did you even understand what you wrote? laughing Those close to me will never betray me, but in my friends I’m sure, or this doesn’t happen? You don’t need to judge by yourself. smile
                      1. Vadivak
                        Vadivak 1 November 2013 22: 53
                        +3
                        Quote: Fesa
                        Relatives will never betray me, but am I sure of my friends, or doesn’t this happen?


                        This is nothing, but confidence will pass with age. By the way, what have we switched to you? Why?
                        Quote: Fesa
                        Are you with me already on you? Education is lame and nerves naughty


                        Quote: Fesa
                        DO NOT judge by yourself.


                        I'm not only on my own. Judas even sold Christ. And as a friend, even kept the treasury. Friends sold Tsar Nicholas, Stalin Khrushev sold, Homeland Gorbachev, the people of Yeltsin.

                        Do not rely on the reigns of the sons of man ...
                      2. Topside
                        Topside 1 November 2013 23: 19
                        -2
                        And of course, Judas was Russian, do not interfere all in one heap. negative
                      3. Vadivak
                        Vadivak 1 November 2013 23: 28
                        +1
                        Quote: Fesa
                        And of course, Judas was Russian, do not interfere all in one heap.


                        And what traitors have a nationality? When we say Judah Gorbachev, we perfectly understand that he is not Jewish by nationality, but by the nature of his occupation, the real Judas

                        And with minus signs do not indulge, not that subject
          3. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 1 November 2013 19: 30
            0
            Quote: Fesa
            And do you seriously think that writing arose somewhere near Greece and gradually spread throughout the world?

            Yes, it is clear that it was not so, and in Christianity, not everything is right. And in Russia it was introduced out of place. But over so many centuries it has been very closely intertwined with the Russian people, that in this situation, the dismantling of Christianity will do nothing but harm. Recently, a lot of Pagan literature has appeared. And most of what they write about is true. But think about it, perfume is also the essence of the truth, that’s how it is, well, or almost everything happens. And what happens if the children watch it? The blow of the Russian gods produces exactly this effect of porn, it seems that everything is true, but there is no respect for father and mother anymore. Christianity is now one of the last pillars on which the unity of our society rests, and undermining it will lead to a split in society. Imagine that someone else’s uncle will show your child a fuck? Pagan ideology is now spreading mainly for this purpose.
            PS I consider myself a Gentile.
            1. Berserk
              Berserk 1 November 2013 21: 40
              +1
              Gentile? Dad and mom no respect? What heathen are you? It cannot harm paganism in this, because love for the ancestors of his backbone. Whatever faith they may be. Figure it out.
              1. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 2 November 2013 08: 26
                0
                Quote: Berserker
                Dad and mom no respect? What pagan are you

                Do you have mom and dad christians? If so, read aloud to them Istarkhov, you will understand what I mean. Speaking of respect, I meant that after those generations of ancestors who believed in Christ, after reading this book you look at least as if you were mistaken. And this is an erosion of respect.
                ps What kind of struggle do you do?
                1. Berserk
                  Berserk 2 November 2013 23: 08
                  0
                  Not. My mother, all her life (born in 1934), was interested in the history of religion, she even had visions of Christ, but she did not believe in God, in hell or in the Communist Party. At the same time, she headed the branch of the institute. And Dad is my artist, seen in a shift in the history of pagan Russia. In the church - not seen. Both were in occupation. So it would fit harmoniously. great-grandmother priestess of Mother Earth (Makosh). The cult was still alive before the war in Donbass. Mother told. And there will be no undermining of Respect. Russia has never been completely baptized. Our ancestors both revered the old Gods, and revered. They go to church, and then to Kupala in the forest, but on the river. So respect for the ancestors should not go anywhere. They remained faithful to their Homeland, no matter what the authorities in the cities did.
                  I’m doing kempo karate. 25 years already. 5th Dan.
                  1. Ingvar 72
                    Ingvar 72 3 November 2013 10: 06
                    0
                    Quote: Berserker
                    So it would fit harmoniously. great-grandmother priestess of Mother Earth (Makosh). The cult was still alive before the war in Donbass. Mother told. And there will be no undermining of Respect

                    That's why you didn’t have a blow to respect. The rest with their ancestors are not so lucky.
                    Quote: Berserker
                    I’m doing kempo karate. 25 years already. 5th Dan.

                    good Army hand-to-hand combat, 8 years, without titles, for yourself.
                  2. Berserk
                    Berserk 3 November 2013 10: 16
                    +1
                    I disagree. Some of the ancestors were still Christians. Dvoevertsy, like almost everything in Russia. So what? Pagans do not appropriate the knowledge of the only and infallible truth; they respect other people's Gods. They can also glorify Christ. "And your God is there too." Therefore, at one time they gave way to the monotheists. There was no religious fanaticism. Although they killed without hesitation for insulting their shrines.
                    Glory to the ancestors!
                  3. Ingvar 72
                    Ingvar 72 3 November 2013 11: 59
                    +2
                    Quote: Berserker
                    They can also glorify Christ.

                    Namely, because we perceive Christ as a wise person. He was. But this cannot be said of Christians. There are DOGMS.
                    PS I really liked the phrase of Christ from the film The Master and Margarita - "He walks here one after me and writes down, and when I tried to see what he was writing, he pushed me away and ran away." Istarchs demonizes Christ, and this is also wrong, just his teaching was used to enslave the world.
                2. Berserk
                  Berserk 5 November 2013 16: 59
                  0
                  So I train for myself. For myself, sons and the future)))
            2. Hort
              Hort 5 November 2013 07: 43
              +1
              Istarchov is a very interesting character. I would say a provocateur in many ways.
              And his "Blow of the Russian Gods", if it should be read, is a well prepared mentally and mentally (knowledge of the subject of discussion - first of all the Ancient faith, and secondly Orthodox Christianity) person. Otherwise, the cuckoo can easily fly off.
              1. Berserk
                Berserk 5 November 2013 17: 02
                +1
                If you approach dogmatically any question - the cuckoo easily flies off - that's for sure. I know of those types who, at first, fervently propagandize all for Orthodoxy, then for Kabbalah, and then kick out those who are suggested to Zen Buddhism with kicks.
        3. Topside
          Topside 1 November 2013 22: 18
          0
          So no one even says that Christianity needs to be dismantled. Let people believe what they want, the main thing is not to forget who they are and what is happening around, while remaining a person with a capital letter.
        4. Vadivak
          Vadivak 1 November 2013 23: 18
          +1
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          And in Russia it was introduced out of place.


          Introduction - use in production, in practice, the results of any. research, experiments.
          Doesn't fit don't you find? Another question is that Christianity in Judea, Greece, the Roman Empire was established first through the common people and then emperors bowed before it, and in Russia, as always, with the highest command, although the people were already drawn to it by mother Yaroslav Princess Olga already praying in Kiev churches ... .
  5. Snipe 74
    Snipe 74 1 November 2013 17: 12
    0
    Do not presume to talk about what you do not understand.
  6. Vadivak
    Vadivak 1 November 2013 22: 45
    +1
    Quote: Fesa
    You consider yourself a servant of God


    Slave Abbreviated employee. This is the scornful name of working people by all parasites and crooks living at their expense at all times.
    1. Topside
      Topside 1 November 2013 23: 11
      -1
      So it means "the servant of God is getting married" - the words spoken in the church say those you have listed? Krasava!
      1. Vadivak
        Vadivak 1 November 2013 23: 23
        +1
        Quote: Fesa
        So it means "the servant of God is married"


        Servant of God. This is not someone's slave. This is Work for God, as we call ourselves, that it’s not clear here and please keep yourself in hand, otherwise I will make comments to others.
        Quote: Fesa
        Are you with me already on you? Education is lame and nerves naughty
        1. Topside
          Topside 2 November 2013 06: 25
          0
          I make comments on how I wrote one above, to whom the "style" allows (but at the expense of the minuses and how I should behave, it's not up to you to decide, I hope it came to pass)
  • svp67
    svp67 1 November 2013 12: 16
    +5
    Patriarch Kirill: You can not continue to ignore the majority of Russian
    Well, for sure, GLORY TO GOD and the top "RAPE", if only it's not too late ...
    1. Hort
      Hort 1 November 2013 13: 25
      0
      Duc, apparently it became clear that if we continue to ignore the Russian majority, everything will end as in 1917 here or as in the Weimar Republic. What is worse in this case is a rhetorical question, since one hell will hurt everyone at once
  • Flooding
    Flooding 1 November 2013 12: 24
    +8
    Quote: Patriarch
    Russian people, who are the main creator of our civilization, the bearer of its ideals

    Quote: Patriarch
    But we also will never agree with those who want to see it as “Russia without Russians,” deprived of a national and religious person, having lost a sense of solidarity and unity

    Let the Patriarch and the ROC be abused. It will not decrease from the Church, but will only increase.
    Of course he is not an angel. Though the Most Holy.
    But it seems to me that the Orthodox Church, having passed through the crucible of new trials, will come out of it together with the Russian people cleaner and stronger.
  • andrei332809
    andrei332809 1 November 2013 12: 28
    0
    after all, the power holders are maneuvering, maneuvering ... but is it being caught? which Ukraine with two chairs, our leaders want to stretch their backside to the concert hall
  • morpogr
    morpogr 1 November 2013 12: 32
    12
    It is necessary that the Constitution was introduced that the Russian people are state-forming.
    1. Vasily Ivanov
      Vasily Ivanov 1 November 2013 12: 51
      +4
      obviously not under the current government ...
  • Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 1 November 2013 12: 53
    +5
    The patriarch also said the right words in the presence of the highest ranks of Russia, whether they would make the CORRECT CONCLUSIONS, I would like to reach them at last - DELAY IN THE CARDINAL DECISION WILL MEAN THE GREAT SURROUND, to the delight of THE ENEMIES OF RUSSIA.
  • Savva30
    Savva30 1 November 2013 12: 54
    +3
    Well ... the Russian Orthodox Church woke up, personally I'm glad.
  • Russ69
    Russ69 1 November 2013 12: 58
    +2
    We are waiting for the end of the Olympics. For any, there should be some changes. I’m not talking about the honesty of the authorities, but they are not fools and understand perfectly well that it is necessary to resolve the issue ...
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 1 November 2013 13: 01
      +3
      Quote: Russ69
      We are waiting for the end of the Olympics. For any, some changes should be

      ............ ********** I already wrote everything in one of my comments, I won’t repeat it.
  • killganoff
    killganoff 1 November 2013 12: 59
    +2
    I even began to respect him !!!
  • Yuzver
    Yuzver 1 November 2013 13: 15
    +3
    Quote: seller trucks
    in words he is well done

    Words are also an act.

    Once already openly talking about such things, then we should expect some changes. Authorities see that nationalism is growing. And since he (nationalism) is ignored, or even worse, they are spreading rot, he also begins to ignore power by passing to radical methods.
    Without solving the “Russian question” it is useless to talk about some kind of prosperity for Russia. On the contrary, it will slowly move to the collapse. Russia is founded by Russians and Russians make up the vast majority of its population. Russia without Russians is also impossible.

    “Very often, those who deny our shrines and values, transfer their feelings to the Russian people, who are the main creator of our civilization, the bearer of its ideals. It’s as if these forces are trying to support everything that can weaken, divide, worldview and moral disorientation, ”the patriarch said.

    Yes, openly from the TV screens they say that there have been no Russians for a long time, they say that everyone has died out. The same Kandelaki for example.
    1. Berserk
      Berserk 1 November 2013 21: 46
      +2
      Kandelaki? This crazy f ..? Only stupid people, imbeciles and other oligophrenics listen to her. Although she certainly considers herself a figure. "There are no Russians" - as I wanted to see this, to move her sucking on the table.
    2. Tyumen
      Tyumen 1 November 2013 22: 10
      +1
      Russian is not a nationality, it is a worldview.
      1. Berserk
        Berserk 2 November 2013 08: 24
        0
        Tyumen. Stop repeating stupid cliches. Russian is a nationality, and then a worldview.
  • radio operator
    radio operator 1 November 2013 13: 17
    0
    “Very often, those who deny our shrines and values, transfer their feelings to the Russian people, who are the main creator of our civilization, the bearer of its ideals. It’s as if these forces are trying to support everything that can weaken, divide, worldview and moral disorientation, ”the patriarch said.

    I totally agree.
  • DAGESTAN333
    DAGESTAN333 1 November 2013 13: 23
    -4
    “Our ideal, on the contrary, is a solidarity society, a society of social symphony”
    - igmy .. right now, just run away, let the Russians ...
    We reject the position of those who believe that Russia should be a country only and exclusively for Russians
    - and how many YOU like that? 20 people? No, you are probably 50 people ...
    never agree with those who want to see her as “Russia without Russians”
    - it’s fine here, it starts, a very bad story ...
    1. Tatarus
      Tatarus 1 November 2013 16: 12
      +3
      A rhinoceros came on a kakal and left. Although what else to expect from a rhino. In mountainous areas there are many good, courageous and honest animals. They rarely catch the eye, and only a rhino, due to the volume of the brain, can come out of the bushes and for all to poop. Without thinking, for nothing.

      THIS IS ALL YOU DAGESTAN 333

      And when in your reserve rhinos will be transferred? After all, there used to be eagles, leopards ... no damn demographic explosion of rhinos.
      1. Flooding
        Flooding 1 November 2013 18: 49
        +2
        Quote: Tatarus
        THIS IS ALL YOU DAGESTAN 333

        I personally refrained from commenting.
        For I did not understand what he wanted to convey.
        Literally, it’s too rude and not at all smart.
        I am waiting for him to return and explain in more detail.
      2. DAGESTAN333
        DAGESTAN333 1 November 2013 20: 07
        0
        Quote: Tatarus
        on kakal and left
        - I am alone? mm ... no faults ...
        Quote: Tatarus
        In the mountains there are many good, courageous and honest animals.

        - and on the plains, which animals live, and what are their characteristics? And where do you attribute yourself?
        Quote: Tatarus
        due to brain volume

        - I agree. But this does not mean that he is smaller than yours.
        Quote: Tatarus
        After all, there used to be eagles, leopards ...

        - Well, of course ... only we have problems, and only we. Always, someone else is to blame.
        1. Tatarus
          Tatarus 1 November 2013 20: 54
          +1
          Quote: DAGESTANETS333
          Well, of course ... only we have problems, and only us. Always, someone else is to blame.


          As soon as everyone around the sick suddenly see
          It's time for me to go to the doctor soon
          But why should I chew someone else's jelly.
          I do not like enemies, but I believe in their children

          JUST YOUR COMMENT
          Quote: Flood
          Literally, it’s too rude and not at all smart.


          And so it’s like you (in the sense of DAGESTAN333) are not a fool at all

          Quote: Flood
          I am waiting for him to return and explain in more detail.


          But the smoke didn’t bring explanations to me.

          Quote: DAGESTANETS333
          I am alone? mm ... no faults ...



          Quote: DAGESTANETS333
          - and on the plains, which animals live, and what are their characteristics? And where do you attribute yourself?


          To reasonable and educated ... visitors to the zoo

          On the other hand, I do not know you. And my opinion about your comment. And in life, maybe you are a good person.
          1. DAGESTAN333
            DAGESTAN333 1 November 2013 22: 26
            0
            Quote: Tatarus
            I do not like enemies, but I believe in their children

            - forgive me for my stupidity, (all the same, I have something with a brain there ..) but could you explain to me here in more detail ..?

            Quote: Tatarus
            And in life, maybe you are a good person.

            - What are you saying?! (fell from a chair ..) ... or maybe it’s upsetting me for the Power at all .. who spat on people like me ..?
            1. DAGESTAN333
              DAGESTAN333 1 November 2013 22: 44
              +1
              To reasonable and educated ... visitors to the zoo

              - Well, see? For you, I, a priori, one of the animals of the zoo, and you .. You are a decent visitor in full dress ... You have a good mood ...
              - No, it won’t, and never happened, for people like you, for truth and justice ... Remember this ...
              1. Berserk
                Berserk 2 November 2013 08: 28
                0
                People tend to generalize. If your relatives did not behave like animals on our streets, no one would have thought to consider them a beast. As it comes around, it will respond. Do you really think that they just don't like your faces?
    2. Russ69
      Russ69 1 November 2013 17: 43
      0
      Quote: DAGESTANETS333
      - and how many YOU like that? 20 people? No, you are probably 50 people ...

      Here, you're wrong ...
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 1 November 2013 13: 27
    +3
    Quote: radio operator
    “If the position of the Russian majority is still ignored, only the destroyers of Russia will benefit”,

    Still ignored .. and rubbed his hands
  • The comment was deleted.
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. Tatarus
      Tatarus 1 November 2013 16: 19
      +1
      Did you yourself watch the first video to the end? And about the second I’m generally silent. Old something with senility in the head of the mouth open with empty words. So generally do not care on whose head with * p * a * t * b, if only to spoil
  • 3935333
    3935333 1 November 2013 13: 36
    0
    Quote: EwgenyZ
    The Patriarch and the Church are always with the people!

    they are not with the people, but as if with the people - the Church in Russia (Russia) is always a political component, it is the spiritual part of the people and the state, it is a lever of power (or is it a lever of power?) - it is always with the state !!! The Orthodox Church is a powerful Ergregor !!!
    1. EwgenyZ
      EwgenyZ 1 November 2013 14: 17
      -1
      Quote: 3935333
      they are not with the people, but as if with the people - the Church in Russia (Russia)
      - old song. You forgot to mention the millions of the Patriarch, about His "dacha" in Gelendzhik, about the fact that you have never seen a skinny priest, and so on. by the list.
      1. Flooding
        Flooding 1 November 2013 14: 30
        +2
        Quote: EwgenyZ
        You forgot to mention the millions of the Patriarch, about His "dacha" in Gelendzhik, about the fact that you have never seen a skinny priest, and so on. by the list.

        this is what you deigned to call an old song.
  • kapitan281271
    kapitan281271 1 November 2013 13: 39
    0
    Once I read some chapters of "Mein Kampf". I was amazed at the same handbook as, and what to do, so that God forbid repeating the sad experience of Germany. And it all started with the fact that the Germans were in the most deplorable state in relation to the rest of the peoples of the then multinational Germany ...
  • individual
    individual 1 November 2013 13: 42
    0
    The Patriarch of the Orthodox Church expressed his opinion. And I agree with him.
    I would like to listen to the opinion about the troubles of modern Russia from the patriarchs of Islam, Jews, Buddhists and other religious denominations and various branches of religion.
    This will be the first step for holding the GENERAL CHURCH OF THE RUSSIAN CATHEDRAL to develop the goals of a single state RUSSIA.

    Otherwise, no way.
  • kapitan281271
    kapitan281271 1 November 2013 13: 43
    +1
    I completely agree with the indevide rights to all 100
  • Drosselmeyer
    Drosselmeyer 1 November 2013 13: 55
    -5
    Well talked and talked. At Christmas, he will again stand with candles in the church with Putin and Medvedev, surrounded by FSO officers. The ministers of worship all the talk about power is always very streamlined, trained for centuries.
    1. EwgenyZ
      EwgenyZ 1 November 2013 14: 26
      +4
      Do you think Putin and Medvedev can’t go to church? It may still forbid them to go to the toilet, otherwise it turns out that g *** about also with them for one, since they run there so often.
      1. Yarosvet
        Yarosvet 1 November 2013 18: 06
        +1
        Quote: EwgenyZ
        Do you think Putin and Medvedev can’t go to church?

        Putin is definitely not allowed - according to the 70th rule of the apostles, he should have been excommunicated for a long time
        1. Vadivak
          Vadivak 1 November 2013 23: 07
          +1
          Quote: Yarosvet
          according to the 70th rule of the apostles


          And here I put a plus. For objectivity

          Rule 71.

          As soon as the Christian brings the oil to the pagan temple, or to the Jewish synagogue, on their holidays, or lights a candle: may he be excommunicated from the church.


          Fesa advise you to calm down
      2. Drosselmeyer
        Drosselmeyer 1 November 2013 18: 26
        0
        As an employee of the KGB, a committee whose function was to control religion, as well as a member of the Communist Party of the USSR, whose ideology was atheism, of course you can go to church.
        1. Yarosvet
          Yarosvet 1 November 2013 18: 48
          +1
          Quote: Drosselmeyer
          As an employee of the KGB, a committee whose function was to control religion, as well as a member of the Communist Party of the USSR, whose ideology was atheism, of course you can go to church.

          As a private person - not forbidden.

          At the same time - as it should be from the position of the church, I wrote above, and from the standpoint of law - all these standing on the camera with candles are another violation of the Constitution.
          1. Flooding
            Flooding 1 November 2013 19: 12
            -1
            Quote: Yarosvet
            from the standpoint of law - all of these standing on the camera with candles are another violation of the Constitution.

            You can wonder what its point?
            1. Yarosvet
              Yarosvet 1 November 2013 20: 24
              0
              Quote: Flood
              You can wonder what its point?

              Articles 14
              1. Flooding
                Flooding 1 November 2013 20: 32
                -1
                Quote: Yarosvet
                Articles 14

                Are you in all seriousness?
                That is, according to your Putin, his visit to the Orthodox church makes the Orthodox religion state and mandatory?
                1. Yarosvet
                  Yarosvet 1 November 2013 21: 29
                  +1
                  Quote: Flood
                  That is, according to your Putin, his visit to the Orthodox church makes the Orthodox religion state and mandatory?

                  In my opinion, attending or not attending a temple is his personal affair, but when it happens for the purpose of public relations in the main thing, like a temple in front of television cameras broadcasting throughout the country, this is at least propaganda of a particular denomination and violation of the spirit of the Constitution regarding observance of the provision on secularism of the state , since in the church at that moment there was not a citizen VV Putin, but the president or prime minister of the Russian Federation.
                  1. Flooding
                    Flooding 2 November 2013 18: 08
                    -1
                    Quote: Yarosvet
                    In my opinion, attending or not attending a temple is his own business

                    It’s good that this is only your opinion.
                    Such weak reasoning does not even require refutation.
                    But I’ll try to explain the position in more detail.
                    When the president enters the church as an unofficial person, expel the parishioners from the church?
                    For it is not clear where, on how many witnesses you want to stop this action, so that it does not pass into the category of "PR".
                    By the way, the category "PR" is a very subjective thing. Try to prove to me that Putin visits the church for this very purpose, and not, say, to celebrate the holiday with the Orthodox of Russia. Maybe it seems so to you or wants to seem?
                    Further, if you follow your logic, then the president is not entitled to answer the question about his religion, since this again, in your interpretation, is contrary to the Constitution. And laughter and sin.
                    Next, how do you order officials to be buried? Without observance of rites regardless of religion? After all, it can hurt those who think like you.
                    And at the same time think, because officials in the state. oh how much apparatus. What position would you recommend staying in the application of your recommended norm?
                    And finally, what can you say about the non-observance of the Constitution by other officials of other states?
                    Have heard, for example, about the "Mass of Reconciliation" held in 1962. at the Reims Cathedral, which was attended by French President Charles de Gaulle and German Chancellor Konrad Adenauer?
                    1. Yarosvet
                      Yarosvet 2 November 2013 19: 15
                      +1
                      Have you decided to hit formalism? Well let's try:

                      Quote: Flood
                      When the president enters the church as an unofficial person, expel the parishioners from the church?
                      When he, as an unofficial person, walks around St. Petersburg, it is necessary to disperse pedestrians and "recommend" not to look out the windows?
                      When he moves around the city as an unofficial person, do tens of thousands of people get stuck in traffic jams?

                      For it is not clear where, on how many witnesses you want to stop this action, so that it does not go into the category of "PR"
                      It’s just - if this is not covered by the federal media - it’s not PR, if for the sake of religious holidays the streets do not overlap, then there is no violation of the Constitution.

                      By the way, the category "PR" is a very subjective thing. Try to prove to me that Putin visits the temple for this very purpose, and not, say, to celebrate the holiday with the Orthodox of Russia
                      And this is not important, although if he celebrated, he would have been noticed at some kind of religious procession, but if he believed ... - see the 70th rule of the apostles.

                      Further, if you follow your logic, the president does not have the right to answer the question about his religion, as this again, in your interpretation, is contrary to the Constitution
                      So it is - you are not surprised that employees of structures like the FSB, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the Ministry of Emergencies, etc. forbidden to communicate directly with the media? If the president has a special status, then the responsibilities for this status are appropriate.

                      Next, how do you order officials to be buried? Without observance of rites regardless of religion? After all, it can offend thinkers like you
                      Do you have to make a play out of a funeral? It is impossible to conduct a religious ritual without cameras?

                      And at the same time think, because officials in the state. oh how much apparatus. What position would you recommend staying in the application of your recommended norm?
                      Have you noticed yet that the acre of 1 or 2 persons and the tops of EP do not show anyone particularly? Why is that?

                      And finally, what can you say about the non-observance of the Constitution by other officials of other states?

                      This is the business of citizens of those countries where it is violated.
                      1. Flooding
                        Flooding 2 November 2013 19: 44
                        -1
                        Quote: Yarosvet
                        Have you decided to hit formalism?

                        What do you. So far I have only reasoned at the level of the philistine.
                        If we approach the issue formally, then an unambiguous interpretation of a particular norm of the Constitution is possible only within the walls of the Constitutional Court and not otherwise.
                        Everything else is subjective reasoning and speculation.
                        point 1. personal insult
                        point 2. sort it out - the media or blocked streets
                        point 3. seen in Jewish celebrations?
                        point 4. nonsense. communicate and give interviews, but only if the position or the bosses allow and only within the limits of what is permitted
                        point 5. I understood everything. shoot only from here and here. What to do with the cross?
                        point 6. did not answer the question
                        point 7. does it not occur to you that the fact is that the Constitution is not violated at all?
                      2. Yarosvet
                        Yarosvet 3 November 2013 11: 13
                        +2
                        Quote: Flood
                        So far I have only reasoned at the level of the philistine
                        Do not be shy.

                        If we approach the issue formally, then an unambiguous interpretation of one or another norm of the Constitution is possible only within the walls of the Constitutional Court and not otherwise
                        So you bring to this.

                        point 1. Questions similar to yours - there is no difference between creating inconvenience to citizens on the street and in the church.

                        point 2. Either the cross, or cowards - the topic itself is deeper, and we analyze only one moment.

                        point 3. Oh yes.

                        point 4. That's exactly what is in the framework. And who, on the basis of what and for what determines this framework?

                        point 5. The cross has long been traditionally a symbol of death - I do not see a particular problem.

                        point 6. Complete prohibition. When officials rest we don’t see them - the same thing.

                        point 7. You know, the laws are spelled out in an imperfect way, but in addition to the letter, there is the spirit of the law: you can verbiage for a long time, the essence of this will not change - formally, neither the red nor the stools violated anything either.
                      3. Flooding
                        Flooding 3 November 2013 16: 56
                        +1
                        Yarosvet, everything is obvious to me.
                        But I admit that I could be wrong.
                        You, it seems, do not allow such a thought.

                        1. Completely different things that you mixed in one bunch. Why did I ask about the parishioners? Because it’s difficult to determine where the line passes that you designated by your own understanding.
                        You wrote: federal television.
                        But what about print publications that publish materials and photos?
                        But what about the video from the mobile phone posted on youtube?
                        You see, why did I talk about this? Having gone in the direction indicated by you, I tried to point out to you a bunch of problems and questions that you yourself first try to figure out.
                        2. There too. Understand and sort out instead of giving vent to emotions.
                        3. I am not familiar with this issue. Share.
                        4. This is just about the framework that you define. The law on this subject has already been expressed, and in my opinion is quite clear.
                        5. The cross is a symbol of FAITH, ETERNAL LIFE AND SALVATION.
                        6. Rampant fantasy.
                        7. Charles Louis Montesquieu "On the Spirit of Laws"
                        They must correspond to the physical properties of the country, its climate - cold, hot or moderate; soil qualities, its position, size, lifestyle of its peoples - farmers, hunters or shepherds; the degree of freedom allowed by the device of the state, religion of the population, its inclinations, wealth, size, trade, mores and customs; finally, they are interconnected and determined by the circumstances of their occurrence, the goals of the legislator, the order of things on which they are approved. They need to be considered from all these points of view.
                        This is exactly what I intend to do in this book. It will explore all these relationships; their totality forms what is called Spirit of laws

                        In my opinion, the president’s actions in no way contradict either the letter or the spirit of the Constitution. In essence, the spirit of the law is the goal pursued by its adoption. How does Putin's visit to the temple of the secular state harm? About the same as his judo classes harm the development of water sports in the country.
                        But supporters of such ideas of yours can go even further in their zeal: to shout about the complete prohibition of any government officials from observing any religious rites.
                        How? After all, a government official is part of the state apparatus, and the church in our country is separated from the state. From here follows the message that I wrote about above.
                        On the one hand there is logic, very pale but still. On the other hand, you cannot forbid thinking and speaking, including carrying nonsense.
                        It was not for nothing that I raised the topic of visiting temples by foreign high-ranking officials. With their rampant democracies long ago they could have put "presumptuous officials" in their place. But no ...
                        8. To your words about the stool and the red one, with all the desire, I can’t take it seriously. I'm sorry.
                      4. Yarosvet
                        Yarosvet 4 November 2013 15: 18
                        0
                        Quote: Flood
                        Completely different things that you mixed in one bunch
                        What is the difference? Parishioners are more worthy that they should not be disturbed, and other citizens (including those forced to give birth in an ambulance) - less?

                        You wrote: federal television
                        I wrote "federal media".

                        2. There too. Understand and sort out instead of giving vent to emotions
                        For myself, I have laid out everything for a long time, where do you see emotions?

                        3. I am not familiar with this issue. Share
                        http://pomnimvse.com/72pb.html

                        4. This is just about the framework that you define. The law on this subject has already been spoken out, and in my opinion quite clearly
                        There is article 14 of the Constitution and there is the first person of the presidential republic - a person who is a function whose public actions and statements are regarded as official (and indeed they are) - you understand that perfectly.

                        5. The cross is a symbol of FAITH, ETERNAL LIFE AND RESCUE
                        The Christian cross is a murder weapon (I wonder what would be the symbol if the main character of Christian myths were hanged - a rope?), This symbol came into use after 2-3 centuries after the alleged crucifixion (before that the symbol was fish)
                        Now the cross is associated with the church and the cemetery, which in turn are associated with each other. At the same time, if they bury, they bury an ordinary citizen, not the president, who has the right to his religious views and symbols (he had the right to live them, but not to demonstrate them)

                        6. Revelry fantasies
                        Well, curb your imagination - do not let her walk around.

                        In essence, the spirit of the law is the goal pursued by its adoption
                        Right.

                        How does Putin's visit to the temple of the secular state harm? About the same as his judo classes harm the development of water sports in the country
                        Something like the advertising of chips aimed at children increases their sale.

                        shout about the complete prohibition of state officials to observe religious rites
                        So DEMONSTRATIVE worship is just unacceptable.

                        government official is part of the state apparatus
                        Here, in order to ensure that it is separated in practice, and not in words, such promotions should be excluded - while the church is separated only in words.

                        With them then rampant democracy
                        If Western society is happy with this state of affairs, then who am I to go to them with my charter? But they are not an example to follow in terms of public relations.

                        8. To your words ... I can’t take seriously
                        Yes, and yours really do not work out - go on top, no specifics.
  • hrych
    hrych 1 November 2013 14: 07
    +5
    It's good that at least somehow spread words along the tree. But, on Saint Sergius I didn’t do it, again some bashful mention of the Russian factor, etc. GDP is a Eurasian or Asian, returned to Russia the status of a superpower, in fact outplayed the United States in the nuclear missile arms race (of course, thanks to the Soviet margin of safety), undoubtedly preserved the integrity of Russia, not in snotty negotiations and persuasion, but on the battlefield in the Caucasus, but , what's next. This surkovism continues and has reached the point of complete failure of domestic policy. All the fragments of the USSR are national states, one Russia is made in the likeness of the Union, for such figures the Russian people are like cement, which holds other peoples together like stones in concrete. And, we believe that our people are white marble with dark inclusions, which was not only kneaded in a mixer, but it was formed for millennia. It is a pity that VVP is not Prince Svyatoslav, and Gundyaev is not Saint Sergius, very sorry. There is certainly hope that people are changing and the GDP itself is an example of this. The take-off of Kolokoltsev began with "Manezhka", but apparently "Biryulyovo" will be his fall;
  • gameover65
    gameover65 1 November 2013 14: 47
    -1
    I didn’t understand, but for what are the cons? Why do I have cons? is it that I called the Slavs second-class people?
    at least one minus signer would take and justify his minus!
    1. Hleb
      Hleb 1 November 2013 14: 58
      +1
      cons not for the video, but for the opinion
      "Respect for what? for what he called the Slavs animals and second-class people?"
      or maybe for, its not traditional orientation "
  • Samsebenaum
    Samsebenaum 1 November 2013 15: 11
    +4
    Finally it came to Cyril, he held the speech for the Russian people ... And what does the GDP say?
    He seems to be preoccupied with others - so as not to offend the minority inadvertently ...
  • Topside
    Topside 1 November 2013 15: 54
    -1
    the Russian people, who are the main creator of our civilization, the bearer of its ideals) I agree with Cyril only in this. People of this rank can insert good phrases into a bunch of unnecessary words, as a result, everything is ok. Wordy chatter has been fed for several decades, but to sense .. .
    1. Flooding
      Flooding 1 November 2013 16: 28
      +3
      Quote: Fesa
      People of this rank can insert good phrases into a bunch of unnecessary words

      In order not to repeat their mistakes, read the speech of the Patriarch in full and find unnecessary words. Do not overpower?
      Quote: Fesa
      Verbal chatter has been fed for several decades, but to sense ...

      Oh oh You certainly feed at other catering points.
      By the way, "verbal chatter" is a tautology, in other words, butter.
      To summarize: in your two lines there is much more empty chatter and emptyness than in another 10-minute speech.
      1. Topside
        Topside 1 November 2013 17: 51
        0
        and what does catering do? learn to read between the lines. Conscience, justice and other spiritual qualities are inherent in the Russian person at the genetic level. And in recent years this has been systematically killed in the human mind. And if you are not stupid as you put it, human, you will understand me
        1. Flooding
          Flooding 1 November 2013 18: 26
          +1
          Quote: Fesa
          where does the catering? learn to read between the lines.

          Well, well, you advise me to learn what you yourself do not know how? It can not be.
          In this case, by catering I meant the media.
          Quote: Fesa
          Conscience, justice and other spiritual qualities are laid down in the Russian person at the genetic level

          I do not argue. Although scum enough, as everywhere else.
          Quote: Fesa
          and in recent years this has been systematically being killed in the human mind

          Willingly I believe. But I do not understand what the ROC has to do with it?
  • 787nkx
    787nkx 1 November 2013 16: 38
    0
    “It seems that these circles fear the real rebirth of Russian civilization, rebirth based on faith, connected to life, with a socially significant action, above all,” he said.


    The key phrase of the whole statement.
  • Sergey Medvedev
    Sergey Medvedev 1 November 2013 16: 51
    +2
    So the Patriarch spoke about Biryulyovo. We need to "play spirits" a little more, then you look and the right things will begin, not just words.
  • Snipe 74
    Snipe 74 1 November 2013 17: 24
    +4
    The patriarch is saying everything right now. But somehow it all looks like a rusty weather vane that turned in the wind only when the wind reached the level of an assault warning. And I perceive his words as a late speech. Now, if he had said this 3-4 years ago, my trust in him would have been on a completely different level.
    1. Flooding
      Flooding 1 November 2013 17: 33
      +2
      Quote: Snipe 74
      The patriarch is saying everything right now. But somehow it all looks like a rusty weather vane that turned in the wind only when the wind reached the level of an assault warning. And I perceive his words as a late speech. Now, if he had said this 3-4 years ago, my trust in him would have been on a completely different level.

      And what, all the other weathercocks have already moved?
      Name at least one official who deigned to speak on this subject so openly.
    2. Berserk
      Berserk 1 November 2013 21: 53
      0
      Snipe. Plus you. I fully support.
  • Stinger
    Stinger 1 November 2013 17: 43
    -2
    There is nothing to argue. Everything is clear, albeit a churchman.
  • asadov
    asadov 1 November 2013 18: 25
    +1
    his words are correct, only in reality the closeness of the church and the people is not noticeable.
    1. Yarosvet
      Yarosvet 1 November 2013 18: 51
      +2
      Quote: asadov
      his words are correct, only in reality the closeness of the church and the people is not noticeable.

      Because these are just words: what’s called - keep your nose upwind
  • igordok
    igordok 1 November 2013 19: 12
    +3
    From bashorg.

    Reading the bill:
    1: Russians should live well.
    2: Russians must live.
    3: Russians must.
    1. Topside
      Topside 1 November 2013 23: 43
      +1
      do not copy comments, but express your thoughts, I have already read this more than once. stop
  • 416494
    416494 2 November 2013 00: 23
    +2
    Firstly, our state is secular and here all religious communities on the territory of the state have nothing to do with power.
    Secondly, during the formation of the Russian Federation, we stepped on the same rake as during the formation of the USSR. The Russian Empire had no national formations and therefore remained in the territory after the Revolution. During the formation of the USSR, a time bomb was laid; national republics that left the USSR as soon as possible. Now this mine lies under the Russian Federation, where the National Republics are again highlighted, and this always leads to national problems.
  • yatko
    yatko 2 November 2013 02: 27
    -1
    Church hierarchs take care of our souls, and not organize parties.
    Although the declared goals are close to me.
    1. Monk in the world
      Monk in the world 3 November 2013 16: 52
      +1
      The "church hierarch" Patriarch Kirill did not organize the party, but addressed his flock as he should in such a situation. And the matter of saving the soul is a personal matter for everyone, everyone decides what he should be and Kirill is not able to influence your personal choice if you have already made it.
      In Saudi Arabia, a change or propaganda of a faith other than Islam is punishable by death - this is the norm. In Kiev or Moscow, where prayer in the middle of the day near our churches is already the norm, and only ourselves are to blame. Patriarch Kirill, calls for patience and mutual understanding, this is really the answer of a true Christian and shepherd. But only real Muslims have been preparing jihad for us for a long time.
  • Monk in the world
    Monk in the world 3 November 2013 17: 37
    +1
    Ps You can consider yourself Christians, pagans, Muslims, Buddhists, Satanists, etc. You live in a free country and for the right to practice your worldview you are not thrown into prison. But think about what Islam brought to our land? Terrorist attacks? Intolerance? The dominance of the Caucasian communities that dictate to us the rules of life on our own land? What did paganism bring? Neo-Nazism? Racism? What is paganism now and what is its meaning? You worship stone women Perd ... excuse me, Perun? Reading your comments, your hair stands on end, most of you are baptized, half of you stand in churches with candles at Easter, your grandfathers and great-grandfathers, your land is watered with the blood of martyrs and saints, Christian warriors, are you familiar with history? Do you know how many priests were shot by bandits in Chechnya? All of them prayed for each of us, and now we are calling ourselves pagans and spitting in their backs where Chechen bullets have already hit. Do you know how many shelters for the homeless were opened with "Gundyaev's" money? How many tons of material aid were distributed to refugees and victims? How many people have the priests saved by literally pulling a person out of the suicide loop? - One of them, by the way, I myself. And in general, "the government and the priests with Gunday are to blame for everything," and what are we going to do? - Nothing, our house is on the edge, we will consider ourselves moral atheists, and pagans "armed with the knowledge of the ancients" ... Do you know that just 200 years ago the expression "there is no cross on you" was a grave insult? It is unlikely that you are brought up on the tabloids, forums, and Internet news. Who is to blame for this? Priests with Gunday and the government ... I personally did nothing. Nothing at all. As it should be ...
    1. Berserk
      Berserk 5 November 2013 17: 34
      0
      Check out the question about worshiping Perun. Who described all this in an unsightly form in the annals? Are they not Christians? Pagans, Gods are not worshiped. They praise them. For them, the Gods are the ancestors and ancestors of their ancestors. They are glorified and honored regardless of the belief that these ancestors professed. How we glorify and honor those who "For Stalin !!!" shouted in attack. These are our ancestors! Glory to them!
      There is no need to write nonsense about neo-Nazism. Paganism has nothing to do with it. Racism is a completely Christian invention. Again, take an interest in leisure - where did it come from and by whose name millions were exterminated in Africa and both Americas. Maybe the conquistadors were pagans? Could the American settlers and Big White Father be Gentiles? Not. These were quite respectable Catholics and Protestants. Paganism was always tolerant, until the worshipers of the one God defiled their shrines. You say that they were actually bad Christians? So now, those who spit, as you say, following the right priests, are not pagans.
      1. Monk in the world
        Monk in the world 6 November 2013 01: 55
        0
        Perun was worshiped in Russia about 900 years ago, are you familiar with the history? What kind of ancestors are we talking about? About that people that you don't know? Can you personally name your great-grandfather's grandfather? Can you tell a kind of story over the last 300 years? And you are talking about those who lived much, much later, and this reconstructed cult is more like a game. What names of pagan ancestors do you know? I know Yaroslav the Wise, his father Vladimir the Great, Princess Olga, Alexander Nevsky, Kutuzov, Suvorov, this list can be continued without end, their names are inscribed in history in golden letters. These are the ancestors. They were all real Christians. And what names of pagan heroes are we to be proud of? Tell me if you know, and I'll take my words back. Your ancestors who shouted "For Stalin" didn’t turn to God before the battle and didn’t they secretly hang grandfather's crosses around their necks ?? Or to Perun and Veles? After that war, my grandfather began to go to church, like thousands of the same soldiers, because THERE he experienced and understood what we cannot understand in our comfort and satiety. You'd better take an interest in the collection of the so-called. "Veles's book" about the sacrifices of whom are we talking? Here your conquistadors are resting, and what have Catholics and conquistadors have to do with us, we have been living with the cross for more than a thousand years, we swore to it, they beat the invaders with it, gave birth to children and built houses and dedicated cities. With the same success, I can ask you a pagan why the Maya sacrificed people, in Africa among the pagans cannibalism was in the order of things, in Babylonia, selected children were burned in a furnace, just so that it would rain, the Pechenegs made dishes out of people in general ... And it is unlikely that those conquistadors were real Christians - ordinary bandits, who were sent to conquer new lands in the name of the king. The missionaries taught them to read, count and write, they opened schools, churches and orphanages ... True, they ate them for that. Read the story, you will discover a lot of useful things.
        1. Berserk
          Berserk 7 November 2013 01: 26
          -1
          Had some fun. If you cannot name your great-grandfathers, that does not mean that others cannot. I will not say about 300 years, but for 280 I can quite report. It would be necessary to dig deeper - but there are difficulties with the documents. what are the names of the Gentiles? Yes, please - even according to the PVL: Gostomysl, Rurik, Oleg the Prophet, Igor Stary, Svyatoslav the Brave. And in later times - Kolovrat, who is Evpatiy, the princes you listed, who had a pagan princely name separate from the baptismal one and placed above it, the author of "The Lay of Igor's Host", in which Christ is not mentioned with a single word, it is completely pagan. Their names are also written in gold letters in history, IN SPITE of the fact that the Christian chronicler tried to mention them less. So take your words back. Advise someone else to teach history, I understand it a little, unlike you. My ancestors shouted for Stalin and did not pray to anyone, no need to generalize. My great-grandmother was generally a pagan priestess. This is already the Soviet era. Paganism in Russia has never completely disappeared, all the historians of Religion say this. Stop living in stamps. Veles's book is a fake, forget about it. Did you beat the enemies with the cross? well yes. Nobody argues, and no one rejects. The cross is an ancient symbol of the sun, like the swastika. Christians have privatized it, take the trouble to find out what was the symbol of Christianity for 300 years A.D. What do the conquistadors have to do with us? Moreover. People who consider themselves the only faithful and correct followers of the only faithful God are dangerous for those around them, as shown by centuries of religious wars and murders, on the basis of not even disbelief, but discrepancies in interpretations. Millions of people were destroyed in the name of Christ. The pagans were not even close. And of course I know that Christ himself taught quite differently, people have perverted everything. Paganism - it is initially tolerant. And your God is, but do not prevent us from praising ours. This is the main postulate. And the missionaries, you know, not only opened schools, they really loved to destroy other people's shrines, for which later, as you put it, and ate them. Although they ate it in America, but in our country they just soaked it in cruel forms. Shelters))) My God, but shelters in Russia, under the leadership of the Family, were not needed at all. And if you need examples of savagery and disgusting cruelty, read the Old Testament. There you will find them in abundance, but not on the part of the Gentiles in general. And leave the old trick with dumping all the paganism of the world into one heap to others. All peoples had their own. Some - cannibalistic, and some - quite worthy. Here are Hindus, they are pagans. And the Japanese, with their Shintoism, the cult of ancestors - too. And what are the savages? The pagans the Hellenes knew that the earth was round, but do the Christian church fathers know when they agreed with this? The engine of progress, right? Don't teach history from church books.
          And yes - in Russian the word "Soldier" is written in the plural. And leave your neologism "soldiers" to the pupils of the 5th grade, that's where the mistake comes from.
      2. Monk in the world
        Monk in the world 6 November 2013 03: 02
        0
        What makes you think that racism is a Christian invention ??? "There is neither a Greek nor a Jew" - i.e. there is neither Greek nor Jew. "All people are brothers" "what you have done to people, you have done to Me" - are these not lines from the Bible? Among the Christian saints are Jews, Turks, Greeks, Russians, Palestinians, etc., etc. Is this racism ??? The greatest fighter for the equality of people, for the rights of blacks, for the movement against segregation was a Protestant priest, his name was Martin Luther King, more than half of the movement he led were Christians of various denominations and parishes, did you know about that? Did they invent racism ??? Now, remember who their opponents in white caps looked like, who burned the crosses? Christians?
        1. Berserk
          Berserk 7 November 2013 01: 50
          -1
          Yes, but racial theory appeared in Catholic Europe. And what is postulated in the Bible has never been fulfilled. Tell me the pope is a black man. Or a Tatar - the patriarch of all Russia in the pre-Soviet period. One must look not at the postulates, but at the deeds. But in reality ... All people are equal ... Yeah, but some are more equal. And in the above quote, it’s not religion but nationality that is indicated, that is, here you are already engaged in misinterpreting the text of your holy book. And do not pry me Martin Luther King. It is like a consequence, not a cause. Who are the KuKluxKlanovs like? - to myself. And most of them were respectable Christians. Read more about them - maybe you will learn something new.
          In general, the original racial unity and tolerance in the Christian world stems from the fact that initially it was a church of slaves and persecuted, and only then it began to dominate. Plus, in the ancient (pagan) world, they didn’t really look at the race at all. We looked at personal qualities. Therefore, in Christianity, which grows entirely from ancient, and even earlier times, there were no racial prejudices. They appeared later. But it was precisely in Christian then Europe. In general, a statement similar to yours is called PGM. When a person, not understanding the issue, immediately yells at the gevalt, hits his chest with his heel and overshadows everything around with a sign of the Cross. I, unlike you, at least know how your church was called before the revolution and since when suddenly it began to be called the Orthodox. After all, you even pulled this term from the Gentiles. Do not know why?
          1. Monk in the world
            Monk in the world 7 November 2013 13: 49
            0
            Uv. Berserker, in the ancient world they did not look at the race?)) Tell me, among whom were slaves and gladiators recruited ??? Is it not among the Roman citizens or the Greeks ?? )) The Thracians were not considered people, as were the Murmillons as were the Suebs, etc. and so on. They had no prejudices ??? See code of laws Rom. Senate under Diocletian - causing damage to Rome. non-Roman citizen - flogging to death. The body is thrown into the Tiber. If on the contrary - nothing, at Rome. citizens have unlimited rights. Before the revolution, it was called the Holy Apostolic Orthodox Church, from the beginning of its existence in Russia to this day and not otherwise. Forgive me, your completely illiterate "arguments" do not stand up to any criticism, only boltology, What can you argue about? Instead of presenting something reasonable, you come up with some completely absurd things, this is some kind of homemade jelly from Pelevin and neo-paganism, you yourself cannot clearly explain what its essence is, it reminds me of the Nazis of the Reich - by the way, they too decided to return to paganism, everyone still remembers how it ended, but this is not the point, but the fact that there, too, due to the loss and ignorance of ancient cults, they began to mold their religion from the works of racists, legends, Tibetan Bon and research of charlatans from Ananerbe, it turned out the same as now pseudo-pagan porridge, although you hardly know about this, which you can still talk about))) Tell me, what is your personal knowledge and ideas about paganism based on? On Wikipedia? Forgive me and all the best to you.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Monk in the world
    Monk in the world 8 November 2013 02: 42
    0
    Berserker, my brother, it's not for you to teach me, I defended my diploma in theology, what other materiel are you talking about ??? Talking to you is the same as with a wall, nothing reasonable, I have asked you several times what your ... religion is, you yourself cannot competently answer this, just empty chatter about some ancestors, about which you never sleep spirit, completely illiterate reproaches from the series "you tortured Galileo" if all new "pagans" have the same mess in their heads as you do, then what else can you say, with the same success you can consider yourself not only a "pagan" but for example Napoleon or Caesar, there will be no big difference, I will not read your libels anymore, I will not read such nonsense, let alone answer it, I will not respect myself. Regarding the "kick of the long-dead", this "dead" is more alive than the living, all your abstract ancestors, Peruns, stone women and wooden idols, he experienced and conquered not such "pagans", Who is He and who are we? Learn materiel "pagan". The same as you are former atheists and pioneers - atheists in their declining years suddenly begin to go to church, repent and bow down, trampling on yesterday's idols. Everything has its time. Please forgive me if you offended me, I didn’t want this, you’re just a person who, spitting into a clean well, drinks from a puddle himself, forgive me again, and all the best.
    1. Monk in the world
      Monk in the world 8 November 2013 03: 25
      0
      Oh, and also, about the kick in the ass, weren’t your stone women getting it 1000 years ago when they flew head over heels from the Dnieper hills directly into the river?)) Insider))) Although this was not a kick, but rather a light breath, then what are all your wooden idols, if you could not resist it, but crumbled to dust. Goodbye, and do not waste in vain)
  • Berserk
    Berserk 8 November 2013 03: 29
    0
    Diploma in Theology. Have you downloaded? You know, I don’t need such brothers. You leaked the topic with pagan names - not me. You did not name your church in the source — will you dispute? Try it. I know a lot about my ancestors. That you have no idea about them. And to say that I do not know my ancestors is the height of idiocy - we are not familiar with you. They are not abstract — they are concrete. I know the history of my family until 1832. By name.
    I’m not going to go to your church, I was there, I saw the priests on the arrows in the 90s. With guns. And much more. After that, your obeisances did not come to me for nothing. And your supposedly clean well. Porridge in your head - with you. You can lead a discussion only with unfounded statements about someone else’s mess and ignorance. You do not answer specific questions. My Faith does not concern you. For people like you, it does not exist. may you live with your Orthodoxy of the brain, and give you your God of health. You can offend only a child, I have the glory of Rod, 43 years of independent life behind me, three sons, and 25 years of martial arts. Your insult has not grown. And will not grow. You are as blinkered Orthodox as many are now. But there are normal, truly Christians. Familiar personally. Including with the Archbishop even. Strange, but these people, unlike you, perfectly see the crisis of the modern church (not Faith) and are looking for ways out of the impasse. You prefer the position of an ostrich. Yes to youpol. And your God will forgive you.