Military Review

Alexander Privalov: Education died

Alexander Privalov: Education diedAlexander Privalov, scientific editor of Expert magazine, has been closely following the fate of national education for a long time. “Do you want to talk about school? Despondency is how the school is described today! ”, This is Privalov’s first reaction to our request for an interview.

The expert told the website of Orthodoxy and the World who and why it took to kill school education, how to save the little that still remains of him, and who to do it.

Violation of the principle

In all that is done in the government with education, the main principle is violated. It is this: in school, in school affairs, only one person understands - the teacher. The one who does not go to the classroom - and not sometimes, as a wedding general - but every day or at least several times a week, generally, in a good way, should be silent about these matters. Shut up and listen politely to what a kind teacher will say. But done exactly the opposite. The only one who received no voice during the endless educational reform was the teacher. Actually, this is enough, this is a sentence.

About fifteen years ago, I, for Expert magazine, wanted to talk about humanitarian issues with the then living academician Alexander Mikhailovich Panchenko. I call him, he comes to the phone, and I introduce myself and say: "Tell me, Alexander Mikhailovich, what is happening to us?" If you have ever seen him on TV, then remember his magnificent mighty bass. And he said to me on the phone: “Well, with his mighty bass, stretching the words. “We are dying.” I remember it for life. I remember first of all because he was right.

In the case of education, we can state that it died. Education as a single system, in my opinion, is located beyond the point of no return. And to restore it, perhaps, is no longer possible. If someone ever gets their hands on, education will have to be done anew.

The fact is that if you look at education - above all school education - it turns out that this is such a dual thing. It performs two key functions. On the one hand, education is a system of socialization of a specific individual. A little man goes to school. He is passed through some kind of gears there, he comes out as an individual, socialized in this particular society - ready for life, for further progress in him.

On the other hand, the education system is, of course, a national institution. Bismarck’s famous phrase that a school teacher won the Battle of Sadovaya was told about it. Without the Prussian school there would be no Prussian army, there would be no Prussian state: the Prussian school made a nation that was capable of such and such acts. Such a thing as a school that would be ready to reproduce the nation is no longer in Russia.

The beauty of saving

I do not have the feeling that the school was not accidental. I have a feeling that it was consciously reformed in such a way that it ended up destroyed. Because when there is a Brownian movement - purely accidental, that will come to mind, then we turn up, based on simple considerations of the theory of probability, there must be something in favor, but something to the detriment. But here, in educational reform, if there are any advantages, they should be very specifically sought. And I honestly do not see them.

I would be glad to join the fashionable conspiracy theorists today and say that the reform is a conspiracy of the world bourgeoisie or someone else’s. But the worst thing is that I can’t say that either. Because even the conspiracy is not visible there. The only thing that can be traced in this endless reformation (in general, it is necessary to have a conscience: more than ten years continuously reformed; it would be better to have taken and killed right away!) - so, the only plan that can be traced from beginning to end is the saving plan.

The government considers education as a costly area. It does not consider education as a productive sphere, even more - as the only productive sphere that the country absolutely needs, because without it no other productive sphere can exist. But for the government, the costs of education are only costs. For him, this is only a loss of money.

Therefore, before those eagles that have won a monopoly on the management of this sphere, our dear education reformers have been given the following task, as far as I understand: it means, guys, money for this education goes to Nemer, but in fact no one really need to. Therefore, please do so that everything is decent - so that it is like that of people, with modern words that education is on the verge of science fiction, according to the latest science of the twenty-first century - but at the same time, so that it is cheaper.

And they took the peak: “Not a question! Let's make it so that it will be cheap and the twenty first century! ”Moreover, note that it is very important - the reformers received quite good money for this business. Our state, which does not see much benefit in education, nevertheless, increased its allocations for it for several years in a row. It was supposed to be something like this: we are giving you money now, and you are using this money, kindly provide further "efficiency". Or, in simple accounting language, make it so that then the money for you go less. Actually, this is what was done.

Money will be less. The spending of the federal budget on education will decrease rather quickly every year - they are already decreasing. We are told that this is because changes were adopted in the budget code and other such provisions, which transfer a large part of the costs of general education to the regions. On paper, of course, the way it is.

On paper, it turns out that the costs of education of the federal center plus the costs of the regions, plus everything else, that is what business is spending on these goals, individuals, it does not matter, all together, the total costs of education will increase. But the regions rightly notice that they have no money. Not just for education - not at all. Therefore, already from this year, and from the future all the more so, every governor will wrestle with the fact that he is under-funded every day. Road construction? Job exchange? Should he not finance the heating program in poor areas, the gasification program, or it will not finance education?

This choice is lethal. Nothing can be underfunded, but there is no money. Therefore, when we are told that the total cost of education will increase, they simply lie to us. Not in good faith are mistaken, namely lie. Because reformers know better than me how things are going with finances in the regions.

Plane and tightness

Why was it necessary to make education cheaper? In my opinion, the thought behind this may be the following. These people gathered in their own circle, looked into each other's eyes and honestly admitted: the country is degrading. During the nineties, dozens of industries died off, dozens more are dying right now. The country is shrinking, the country's economy is flattening. There are exceptions, of course. But if to speak in general, the number of industries, sub-sectors, still living areas of research all the time decreases. And, it means that the amount of knowledge necessary for the functioning of this mechanism decreases.

And these people asked themselves: who are we going to deceive, while continuing with our last strength to maintain a system that teaches the fundamentals of nuclear physics every hook? Why are we doing this, we are inflating whom? At that time there was no “Arab spring”, but it was not difficult to guess to any Tunisia that if you prepare to break through too well-educated young people, these young people, having left school, will realize that there is absolutely nothing to do in their own country. And then they will arrange some kind of revolution. “Do we want this?” Asked themselves. "Probably, we do not want." And what to do? Since the flattening of the country cannot be stopped and we are not able to, then the educational system must be brought into conformity with reality.

One can disagree with this line of thought - for example, I do not quite agree with it. But one cannot deny that there is logic in it. But even if so, all the same, with education it was possible to get along softer. It was possible to sit down and think: how to make the education system with diminishing means, which will nevertheless preserve the possibilities of recovery? Preserve the possibility of restoring the country's self-sufficiency.

It is clear that in the modern world no one has complete self-sufficiency. Everything depends on each other, everything they buy from each other, they delegate to each other. But if the country does not retain any piece in which she herself is the mistress, she has a hopeless situation. Either we retain the possibility of doing some pieces ourselves, and some pieces in the future, maybe, attach to this, or we are degrading. Moreover, if in the education system we degrade faster than in other areas, that's all. The question is removed. In the next four to five thousand years there will be nothing here.

It would be necessary to convene smart people, sit down and come up with something less disastrous. But this is precisely what did not happen. The opposite was done. A phenomenally hermetic decision-making system in education was created.

Probably, even decisions on the deployment of strategic nuclear forces are taken less secretly than all these years, decisions were taken on education reform. Every time when the public was called upon to take part in the discussion, it was done in an extremely mocking way. A great example of this is the big law on education, which was passed in December.

On the one hand, it hung on sites specially prepared for discussion, for accepting comments from citizens. He hung there for almost two years - so much is not necessary, this is madness. Because everyone who had something to say was told in the first weeks. But how was this discussion organized? First, they made it so that people, leaving comments, did not have the opportunity to look at what was already said. Therefore, it was not possible to create public pressure at specific points. Secondly, the authors of the draft law summed up the discussion. What comments they wanted to accept, such and accepted. Which did not want - and they dropped. And most importantly, there was nothing to argue. "Guys! - could ask the authors of the law. - We brought the project to a national discussion? Carried out Did you discuss? Discussed. What more do you want? ”

The result was bad. Indeed, it was possible to create all the foundations for the cheapening of the school. But, I repeat, I consider this task false. I really like the favorite phrase of my constant companion, Yevgeny Aleksandrovich Yamburg, a school director well-known not only in Moscow: “Save on schools - go broke in prisons”. For me, this is obvious. For Yamburg, obviously. For any person on the street it is obvious. For reformers, no.

Standards and Warranties

So, a basic condition has been created - it has been decided to save on schools. What's next? According to the Constitution of the Russian Federation, universal secondary education in our country is free. But the Constitution is a synthesis document. It does not say what specifically is called secondary education, the gratuity of which is guaranteed. And as a result of gigantic efforts in this very hermetic booth where reform is being done, new state standards of school education are being adopted. And in them, in fact, nothing is said.

They say only that a graduate, for example, high school students should have such and such competence. Moreover, they are registered with a large margin. For example, a high school graduate after listening to a course of literature is supposed to have linguistic flair, editing skills, some other skills ... Yes, such people cannot be found in the editorial offices of Moscow journals! And this is supposedly required from every graduate of each class of each school. The trick here is that the requirements are as non-specific as possible.

If the standard said that a graduate of a school, after listening to a course, for example, geography, should know the main objects of the Northern Sea Route, be able to explain its economic, political, military significance - that would be verifiable. But when a standard says that a person after a geography course should be able to think geographically - what can I check? Should he know the Northern Sea Route or should he not? Not written. Should be able to show it on the map? Not told.

It became completely unknown - from the moment the standards were adopted - what the state actually guarantees by guaranteeing children free secondary education? What he wants, it guarantees. What will give, thanks for that.

Teacher, official and pedagogical measurements

The country's leadership says: it is necessary to raise the status of the teacher. This means that it is necessary to raise his salary. But the main idea is to save on everything. So what should be done? Right! Reduce the number of teachers.

First there is a simple juggling. Instead of talking about the magnitude of the staff rate, they talk about his salary. No one asks how much a teacher needs to take bets on his chest in order to at least wear his pants sometimes. They say to him: your salary will be as average in the region, but you should be so kind, come on ... According to the “roadmap” of education development, which was published at the beginning of this year, actually, it was published on December 30, under the tree, and read it In early January, it is directly written: how much will the number of teachers decrease, how much will the average load on the remaining teacher increase.

If the reformers had a goal - to save today, but to give the school a chance to recover in the future, they would have kept the hotbeds of "live" schools where deserved teachers work and would not interfere with them. Even Prince Kropotkin reasonably noticed: people are better than institutions. The education system in the Russian Federation, in my opinion, is very bad, but some people are still very good in it. And, in principle, it would be possible to let them move - which, in fact, was in the nineties.

The nineties for education were, on the one hand, a terrible time, because there was no money at all. But on the other hand, they have remained the time that many people remember with delight, because people did not touch. Yes, the money was practically not paid, but did not interfere. Educators could do what they could. Many brilliant schools still preserved - they are from there, from the nineties. When the people whose eyes lit up, no one interfered. They worked. They composed something. Someone consulted. Did. And now this will not work, because the educational branch of the power vertical has been very prolific.

These bureaucrats educational very much. In my opinion, already if not more than the teachers themselves, then a comparable amount. And they need to prove all the time that they eat their bread for good reason. And here they come to schools and naturally prevent teachers from living. “But show us the lesson plan you developed in August.” “Why do you say that in March 42 you will talk about that, but you didn’t talk about it, but talked about 41?” “And would you like to go out and never work in any other school?”

This is all a bitter madness, but it is explicable. These officials - apparently, often looking in the mirror - do not trust anyone. No one. And they believe exclusively in what they themselves call "pedagogical dimensions." Just recently there were twenty years of the Higher School of Economics. This is the main ideological center of the entire educational reform. And in the ceremonial interview, the rector of this school, Yaroslav Ivanovich Kuzminov, the second most important achievement of the university he heads, called the development of these same pedagogical dimensions. What it is? In my opinion, their essence is explained very simply. Pedagogical measurements are the art of judging the quality of education, not looking at the student or the teacher, but looking only at the pieces of paper.

Officials do not believe people. Well, how am I going to ask you, is a good school in the next block? Who are you? Who am i? I myself also do not believe. Therefore, let's create such a bunch of pieces of paper so that we can judge about the quality of the school in the next quarter, ostensibly, impassively and objectively. And this mountain of papers in school is growing every year. And the phrase that a school is the place where children prevent teachers from filling out papers for the education department has long ceased to be a joke.

Of course, the officials were always - no less arrogant and no more literate. The Bolshevik officials of the first years of the revolution are another song, and then they also destroyed the tsarist education system. But there is one “but”: in tsarist Russia, although it was at that time a very good education, it was, in fact, elitist. Within its framework, not even fifty studied, but on the strength of fifteen to twenty percent of the youth. That is, compared with the Soviet system of universal education, the remnants of which are dying now, coverage was much less.

Tasks for complication

With all its drawbacks, the Soviet school was the current system, which provided a certain basic level of education for almost everyone. Of course, towards the end of the Soviet Union, this system was already slipping strongly. But, nevertheless, she passed most of the population through her gears, and from this a lot of things followed.

For example, it followed that people - ours, Soviet generations - have a common canon. A lot of general knowledge was crammed into us. We have common quotes from Griboedov and Ostrovsky, general knowledge about "War and Peace". In the modern school of this canon is less and less. She is today incomparably more difficult than the school was in Soviet times. The tasks that it faces are more and more different from the Soviet tasks in the direction of complexity.

The first is the children themselves. The material that goes to school today, these kids are more unhealthy. They have a lot of congenital diseases, which limit their possibilities in various ways.

The second is that it has grown incredibly, compared to Soviet times, and social stratification continues to grow. For school this is a scourge. It is one thing, a well-established pattern, when people of one social stratum live in the West End of London, and people of another stratum live in the East End. In modern Moscow, this is not. Social stratification passes through most school classes, and this is a convicted complication of the teacher’s work. Then, the national composition is changing dramatically. In many schools of the same Moscow, most of the children who come to the first grade speak little or no Russian at all.

The USE has radically changed the approach to schooling. He made school education flat. In recent years, children are not taught, but they are being drafted into pointless business. Well, this test is meaningless! He may be good in itself: when a child studies diligently, it will fill out any such piece of paper between deeds, put ticks in it and will not even remember it the next day. And when all schooling comes down to filling out this piece of paper, it turns out very quickly: no one has time to carry on any meaningful conversations with the child, and he does not want to.

When children are taught to tick, it's a disaster. Because the main function of the school is quite different - to instill in the child the ability to learn. And the children who today leave the majority of schools are no longer taught. These are humanly lost people, they are insanely pitiful. This is why the classical gymnasium in tsarist Russia, with stubbornness, many seemingly wild, continued to force children to learn not only Latin, but also ancient Greek. Because the school is in urgent need of deliberately difficult work. A man with brilliant natural abilities read a textbook on physics and remembered - it is not necessary to teach him. But ancient Greek must be taught with all abilities. Moreover: the higher your abilities, the harder it is to make yourself sit straight and work.

And when we are told today that the school should teach, in the interests of children, that the same homework should not be given to children - I do not mind. But then say this openly, out loud: guys, the school is a place like a locker. You surrender your baby there in the morning. It does not run through the streets, does not sniff glue in basements, does not attack with a knife on its own kind. It sits quietly until the evening. And that's all. And don't ask us about anything else. If you do not know anything else, say it out loud. And, maybe, you will rather be replaced at your posts.

These tasks are complicated by the waves, and the freedom of the hands and financial possibilities to solve them is becoming less and less. This is very, very bad. What should I say to every normal person? To every normal person I must say to the old maxim: the salvation of the drowning is the work of the drowning themselves. Living people by themselves, without the state, cannot save the unified education system. But they can and should save individual schools that their children attend.

Way of salvation

How can parents save school? There are some formal reasons. The fact is that in schools there are so-called board of trustees - they have certain powers, and if they do not, they can seize them. Come to the school where your children go, where your children should go, talk with the teacher, talk with the director. They are living people, they love when they communicate with them normally, and do not mutually yell. Ask for help. They really need to help. Moreover, it is often necessary to help not only and not always necessarily with money. There are lots of other ways.

You can tell the kids something as a specialist - tell us. Can you bring someone who can tell - bring. You can “cover” them with the connections from the department of education - do it. If you have found a school for your children that basically suits you, do everything you can for it.

Before the final stages of reform, I literally every week talked about it with a variety of people. And they all gave me the same rating. According to experts, at the end of the 2000s, every seventh school was in Russia. Or every sixth, seventh, eighth. This figure depended on the speaker's optimism, but they all singled out some share of the schools where they really taught. And the education of children is increasingly becoming the responsibility of the parents.

Home School - the underground. Paid school is inevitable

The role of home education today turns out to be hypertrophied, and this is not good. It has its advantages, of course, but in general, its popularity - from misfortune. Something bad has to happen to the country so that home education becomes widespread.

In recent years, the best Moscow teachers have been trying to crawl away from school. They took the minimum workload and went into tutoring, where they earned more than a month of school work in one day. And those parents, who nevertheless wanted to teach their children, and not train them on the USE, also necessarily moved to the tutors.

But, alas, parents are different too. To say that they all equally understand the value of education for their children would mean to greatly embellish reality. Do not fool the child's head, do not load his homework. Keep him sitting quietly in the classroom, and then give him a certificate and leave him alone forever - unfortunately, so many adults think so. And so I am a supporter of the collection of all the forces that are. Supporter that parents, who really want education for their children, do not go into the home underground, but unite efforts around the surviving schools. It must be done. Schools will die without you, and you without them, so this is a mutual interest.

We must be aware that secondary education will increasingly become paid - it is inevitable. Do not be too sad about it. Remember? Back in Soviet times, they said: "Whoever is treated for nothing, he is treated for nothing." Or: "Who learns for free - he learns for nothing." It is necessary to create civilized tools for working in new conditions. We need educational loans, we need patrons of arts, we need funds to support talented children.

In general, we need non-state things, but capable of mitigating gaps in public policy. To soften not frontally, but specifically in specific areas, for a specific capable child, in a specific block, where two dozen not only clever, but active smart fathers and mothers, who huddled together and keep the local school afloat, accumulated.

In 1981, I had a chance to go to Poland. There then was a terrible crisis; in Warsaw, there were two items in free sale: from non-food products - flowers, from food - vinegar. And the Poles told me a wonderful joke: “What is the way out of this situation? Outputs two - one more likely, the other less likely. The more likely is that angels will descend from the sky and arrange everything for us. Less likely - that we ourselves will do something. " This anecdote is about our school today and about us.
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  1. saag
    saag 22 October 2013 07: 53
    “He who learns for free - he learns for free”
    It is doubtful that we studied at a Soviet school less time, and now studies begin with a kindergarten, but we knew more, so paid education at school is generally nonsense, you will give any kind of assessment for money, this is a new channel of corruption, we must move away from the Bologna process, USE, and take the model of the Soviet school
    1. loft79
      loft79 22 October 2013 08: 23
      Quote: saag
      It is doubtful that we studied in a Soviet school less in time, and now study begins with a kindergarten, but we knew more

      I agree.

      Nephew's 3rd grade already in some tasks answer options!
      I already lost weight when I saw. My sister asked me to work out with him. I see reflecting on a decision he is having difficulty. Everyone is trying to guess. I ask how the teacher explained to you? Nothing really can answer. sad
      And also in English and computer science... Yes! They have Computer Science in Pictures! My sister faints at the words "Linear algorithm, branching algorithm, cyclic algorithm". They even wrote a memo to their parents. Here I go and try to study with him.

      Z.Y. Task on a mat. textbook 3rd grade. (not verbatim)
      "Two numbers arrive at the input of the machine, where the action is performed (the task follows), what the machine will give at the output"
      How do you like this for understanding a 3rd grader !?
      1. klimpopov
        klimpopov 22 October 2013 09: 19
        Education is the foundation of the country! Remove the foundation and? ... To be honest, I've been watching this for five years. I studied in the nineties and my knowledge is not comparable with knowledge, well, for example, my father (an excellent student of the Soviet school), but they still gave me the base and I more or less successfully fill in the gaps (including on this site), because there is a BASE on which these gaps are filled. Current graduates, despite the fact that by nature they do not have a stupid base, there is a mess in their heads, from their thoughts, well, for example, about history, their hair stands on end and you want not to hear all this (especially reasoning and conclusions). You begin to slowly explain what and how, like listening, but GUYS are a factory, when will we work? To be honest, it's high time to beat the half-moon, but everything is "quiet" and "good". In 2 - 3 years there will be no one to work at the plant !!! There is no one else, we live at the expense of pensioners! I would like to take an ax and tell all this you know to whom, although you can knock on a pumpkin with his iPhone ...
        1. loft79
          loft79 22 October 2013 09: 54
          Quote: klimpopov
          although you can knock it with your iPhone on a pumpkin ...

          I'm afraid the answer will be: "Oh! IPhone! There is a bluetooth and a wifi"

          Quote: klimpopov
          for there is a BASE on which these gaps are filled

          + I would add the ability to analyze. Previously taught to "think", not memorize.
          At school, a physicist gave us problems from the introductory KhAI, MAI. And with a smile on his face he said: "Decide" smile
          1. Gari
            Gari 22 October 2013 14: 20
            Quote: loft79
            + I would add the ability to analyze. Previously taught to "think", not memorize.

            That's all correctly taught to think, analyze how I am grateful to the teachers of geography, history, my favorite subject, I probably re-read all literature in general throughout the entire Soviet school.
        2. Andrey Yuryevich
          Andrey Yuryevich 22 October 2013 12: 34
          . After 2 - 3 years, no one will work at the factory !!! Already no one, at the expense of pensioners we live! yes true truth, we beg pensioners not to leave and not die, we won’t find a normal turner or milling machine operator! our director even brought a specialist from his house and took away after work, all the conditions - just make it dear! the situation is not funny at all, but Rogozin sings about the latest developments ... who will do it soon? call the Chinese?
          1. klimpopov
            klimpopov 22 October 2013 16: 29
            Increasingly, we beg not to die but to suffer. But the prospects are not visible ...
      2. Goodmen
        Goodmen 22 October 2013 09: 35
        The eldest daughter is in 7th grade. He studies well. If there are problem points, then the wife is engaged with her. If something is complicated, then I am attracted. Recently brought to homework in physics. )))))))
        I partially precipitated ... The task was to name physical processes:
        UZBEK PROVIDER "The nose feeds the wolf" ... what is the physical process? ))))))
        I started pushing something out of aerodynamics, but they still did not go through aerodynamics ...
        diffusion on the topic of the lesson ... (if only snot, and the rest is pure physiology with chemistry, anatomy, or even with hell knows what, but not physics)
        I explained to the child what was happening ... my calls to go to school and my wife myself rejected the right answer)))))
        already silent about the presence and content of the Uzbek proverb))))) so as not to incite ...)))))
        And such pearls in textbooks at every step ... for the seventh year already at a loss ... whether there will still be, sco small will go to school.
        Fortunately, the old Soviet textbooks remained; we will study physics and mathematics using them.
        1. klimpopov
          klimpopov 22 October 2013 09: 51
          Here I also have textbooks from 50's in physics and mathematics. I come to the conclusion that we will teach our children ourselves. If that grandparents help, which I can’t master. Plus there are teachers of the old school (still alive, God will give them a long life), there is no hope for a modern school ...
          1. pahom54
            pahom54 22 October 2013 12: 07
            I myself have kept these textbooks, in particular, Kiselev, so I’m doing quietly with my granddaughter ...
            And the knowledge base needs to be built by our grandchildren and children somehow, while our own Soviet base has been preserved ...
            Right, someone at the top said: in the Soviet school they were taught to THINK !!! The same thing happened in Soviet higher education. The luggage that I received while studying at the university still helps me in life. And with many modern connoisseurs with diplomas of higher education you talk like an alien ...
          2. Bober
            Bober 22 October 2013 19: 09
            Textbooks of the 50s are the most. The country after the war and at the desk had to put people of different ages. The textbook should be written without crap. Simple and clear. Any process can be explained intelligibly. And not what then went, I'm not talking about the modern edition. Turbidity.
    2. nov_tech.vrn
      nov_tech.vrn 22 October 2013 11: 07
      in general, why does the Bologna process need Russia? We have been "reformed" education, and the main goal voiced is the recognition of Russian education abroad, let's put aside the fairy tales about students who have to come to Russia in droves for education, some difficulties in the preliminary study of the Russian language, put a solid barrier to this, and in the bottom of the recognition Russian education abroad, facilitating the emigration of our children, naturally already educated, those intellectual robbery of Russia.
      1. serg_uhp
        serg_uhp 22 October 2013 12: 55
        The Bologna education system is when the lapdog is smarter than the owner ...
    3. arkady149
      arkady149 22 October 2013 14: 11
      friends, help, Maybe not in the subject, but washed down,, Advise. Who is Rich In The Meaning of Experience.
      1. andrei332809
        andrei332809 22 October 2013 14: 16
        Quote: arkady149
        but washed down, Advise. Who is Rich In The Meaning of Experience.

        you drink the first day to amazement. the second day you start to hangover in the morning, in the evening again very warm. the third day in the morning, one hundred grams and a bottle of beer, for lunch hot liquid and grams 200. in the evening before going to bed you can have a couple of beers. on the fourth day in the morning like a cucumber (not in the sense that it’s green and pimple) drinks
      2. klimpopov
        klimpopov 22 October 2013 14: 24
        What is "washed down" in your understanding?
        "For some I am a drunkard, for others an utter teetotaler"
      3. Gari
        Gari 22 October 2013 14: 27
        Quote: arkady149
        friends, help, Maybe not in the subject, but washed down,, Advise. Who is Rich In The Meaning of Experience.

        Dear, I like to have a drink with friends and it’s very good to sit like that, but only once a week, well maybe two, but no more. Then I can’t watch a drink.
        Until nobody helps himself, no one helps, try to tune in, I don’t know, hold on but don’t drink - if you are a man you can quit.
      4. serge
        serge 22 October 2013 15: 41
        You can’t get out of hard drinking abruptly - you can get delirium tremens. Any binge sooner or later ends itself. The onset of binge can provoke a large dose of strong alcohol - 350-400 grams. With a couple of bottles of beer, drinking will not start. If drunken drunkenness has formed - this is for the rest of your life. You need to either stop drinking or at least completely eliminate the intake of any strong alcohol.
        1. Gari
          Gari 22 October 2013 16: 03
          Quote: serge
          The onset of binge can provoke a large dose of strong alcohol - 350-400 grams.

          I don’t boast, but we sit down to drink, we don’t drink a bottle, but a bottle for a brother, at least, in principle, how it will succeed in the evening, well, how can one drink beer, and how much it is drunk, who believes that the main thing is to have fun, that the company be good. After all, we not only drink, but speak and drink between things.
          In general, walking like walking, I can normally sit like that, it used to be more often, now it’s already once a week, well, a maximum of two, still it’s a little old, but the next day neither.
    4. Polovec
      Polovec 22 October 2013 14: 13
      Not an article but a cry of the soul! Ready to subscribe to every word. It seems to me that the situation with education is a reflection of everything that happens in the country. Amateurs try to assert themselves and show their need by carrying out reforms for the sake of reform. The issue of professional suitability for positions held by officials is not raised at all today. Hence, Serdyukov at the post of the Defense Ministry, and DAM at the post of prime minister, etc., etc., etc.
      And paid education in some Western countries, which our reformers love to equal, is often regarded as weaker. It is believed that children attending paid schools are not able to independently learn the program for one reason or another (for example, due to the need to tighten the language of instruction) and require increased care.
      The current government, in principle, does not consider conservatism as a healthy state policy. For some reason, the prevailing opinion is that until recently, the country was ruled by solid idiots for whom everything had to be redone.
      This is sad!
      1. alone
        alone 22 October 2013 19: 29
        I owe everything that I know to the Soviet education system. This is a fact. Against this, it is not a mistake. Conscience will not allow it.
  2. Fox
    Fox 22 October 2013 08: 12
    probably a smart man, this Privalov ... but the conclusion is idiotic. if the state is profitable to have a herd of sheep, it (the state) is engaged in selection. What does the patrons have to do with it?
  3. Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 22 October 2013 08: 18
    ... who and why needed to kill school education, how to save the little that was left of him, and who should do it.As an average citizen:
    -It took the Anglo-Saxons to "kill" Russia;
    -the government resigned without fail with prison terms;
    - only to the President together with the FSB, to gain determination and ... see paragraph 2.
    1. New Russia
      New Russia 22 October 2013 10: 44
      "it took the Anglo-Saxons to" kill "Russia;" Awesome! What is the name of the main Anglo-Saxon who conducts this and removed the penalty from Livanov?)

      "Only the President, together with the FSB, to muster up the resolve" And hand over the accomplices?) Well, the lads will cease to respect him!
    2. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 22 October 2013 12: 39
      it’s how they themselves will be planted? Well, what revolutionary consciousness should wake up! lol
    3. andrejwz
      andrejwz 22 October 2013 12: 58
      Quote: Valery Neon
      ... who and why needed to kill school education, how to save the little that was left of him, and who should do it.As an average citizen:
      -It took the Anglo-Saxons to "kill" Russia;
      -the government resigned without fail with prison terms;
      - only to the President together with the FSB, to gain determination and ... see paragraph 2.

      So who agrees with paragraph No. 2, take and vote. Egypt weird and then collected 20 million signatures, and we shout in comments, and at least someone’s initiative appeared, and then only 2 million signatures
  4. major071
    major071 22 October 2013 08: 21
    Dull cattle easier to manage. What are the pro-Western liberalists striving for? They don’t need smart people, otherwise smart people will start asking questions, but they’re not used to answering, they’re used to only fill their pockets. fool
    1. Tatanka Yotanka
      Tatanka Yotanka 22 October 2013 09: 34
      Quote: major071
      What are the pro-Western liberalists striving for?

      are these the guarantors of the constitution - the appointment of Livanov, Fursenko, and other liberoids?
  5. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 22 October 2013 08: 47
    And again, on the same rake ... Russia has two troubles: fools and roads, but now the third fools have added to them in the leadership of the public education! Only the enemies of the stkany and the people could come up with a reform in which the leadership of the education turned out to be laymen, and in other words, fools (unprincipled managers), ready for thirty pieces of silver to destroy their country and people.
  6. Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 22 October 2013 08: 49
    The main reason for constant reform is the reform itself. Because it’s very convenient to write off tens of millions with him, and no court will ever catch thieves. What did the money go for? For reform? Who spent the money? I! And who will determine whether this is reform or theft? I will determine, according to the position ...
    The premise that the elite wants to save is false. The country has heaps of money, that's what the sea of ​​that sea is. Much more promising is the idea that you need to limit the number of smart people. That is, people who have been raised above their abilities. If you teach a tiger cub various circus tricks from milk claws, his brain will be much more developed than that of an ordinary taiga tiger. Will it help him in the taiga? No, it won't help. Most likely he will die. And if it does not die, it will have a devastating effect on the tiger population.
    There was a moment in the Soviet school, which in the end led us to where we are now flourishing ... Knowledge is power. The statement is powerful, but intentionally incomplete. An immeasurably greater power - the ability to manage knowledge ... Therefore, training in hard and difficult things is a reward. Prize, privilege, something that needs to be achieved and serious efforts must be made to keep it. And the Soviet school gave, or rather struggled to educate everyone. And most spit violently ...
    People began to perceive education as something that they are obliged to give ... but they are not obliged to receive. Parasites squared. Not only does most of the class not study by itself, it also hinders those who wish to study. Which in itself causes enormous damage to the learning of the best.
    Decades of reform destroyed the Soviet school. But reforms are still needed ...
  7. mixxlll
    mixxlll 22 October 2013 09: 09
    The problem of school reform, like all other reforms, is that it is carried out at best by theorists, and usually by deletants.
    1. klimpopov
      klimpopov 22 October 2013 09: 33
      Mostly traitors! The rest is secondary ...
  8. v.lyamkin
    v.lyamkin 22 October 2013 09: 09
    Far from the modern school, no one is studying in the family. But in the article everything is very similar to the truth. Thanks to the author.
    1. klimpopov
      klimpopov 22 October 2013 09: 34
      The article describes the current situation. This is exactly what I am observing.
      1. Starfish
        Starfish 22 October 2013 13: 05
        urgent need to do something. it is necessary to return the Soviet system of education, otherwise it will be too late. My mother is a teacher - they’ve been retired for a long time, they don’t let me rest. All the time, former students ask their children to work out, because they don’t really teach them anything at school.
        cousin teacher. so she stubbornly defends the ege and these fucking reforms. we’ll lose teachers soon. the elderly will leave, but the youth does not know another.
        1. klimpopov
          klimpopov 22 October 2013 13: 45
          This situation is everywhere. People who lived and worked in the USSR are leaving, they really have no change.
          About the exam, but what is your sister motivating?
          It’s just that when I lively start arguing about the Unified State Exam, no one can really answer me, only general phrases.
          1. Starfish
            Starfish 22 October 2013 15: 25
            About the exam, but what is your sister motivating?

            the same phrases as the Fursenians with Lebanese. about how any graduate from the collective farm will go to Moscow State University, and without any corruption and hassle at the final and entrance exams.
            I’m lucky laughing it was our year from the 4th grade that I passed exams every year. If we were in the 5th grade, then in the 4th grade we already canceled, but in the 6th we haven’t accepted yet. and so year after year. and nothing used to.
            1. klimpopov
              klimpopov 22 October 2013 16: 21
              And your sister is aware of the situation with the EG in the UK? When, due to the fact that "excellent students" from the republics were recruited to universities and the quota was closed, the child could not enter? This is just one example. Does she really believe in all this Fursenkov's nonsense? True, I do not want to offend, but here I have the opinion that your sister is just after ped. institute.
              And in general, all this is interesting to me in the context of the final result, namely, the person who comes after the university, and even better in the process of studying in it, into any field of activity and starts working. So I’ll say for sure that graduates, or not, are not right, applicants and students studying in the Bologna system are not competitors to students, well, or young people who studied "traditionally". Maybe somewhere is not correct, but this is what I see.
  9. mixxlll
    mixxlll 22 October 2013 09: 11
    The problem of school reform, as in principle, of our other reforms, is that it is carried out in the case of theorists, and as rules by amateurs. 1. Ministry of Internal Affairs, 2. Air Force, etc.
  10. Goodmen
    Goodmen 22 October 2013 09: 18
    Fursenko (Since March 9, 2004 - Minister of Education and Science of the Russian Federation in the Government of M.E. Fradkov.
    September 24, 2007 retained his post in the Government of V. A. Zubkov.
    Since May 12, 2008 - again the Minister of Education and Science in the government of V.V. Putin. Since January 11, 2010 - a member of the government commission for economic development and integration): "The disadvantage of the Soviet education system was an attempt to form a person-creator, and now the task is to nurture a consumer who is able to skillfully use the results of the creativity of others."

    We will discuss further? )))))
    It’s time to hammer nails into their freaks ... alive ... (I do not urge / incite - I express my opinion)
    1. New Russia
      New Russia 22 October 2013 10: 50
      And what does Putin have to do with it?) These are agents of the State Department in the government) yes
      1. Goodmen
        Goodmen 22 October 2013 11: 25
        Ahhhhhh !!!! )))))))))))))))) laughing
        The counterintelligence agent in the government has State Department agents !!!!
        So he is also useless counterintelligence? !!!!))))))) wassat
        1. military
          military 22 October 2013 11: 49
          Quote: Goodmen
          Ahhhhhh !!!! ))))))))))))))) The counterintelligence agent in the government has agents of the State Department !!!! So he is also useless counterintelligence? !!!!)))))))

          an agent shusher does not always have to know his resident ... winked
  11. Standard Oil
    Standard Oil 22 October 2013 09: 19
    Knowledge-Strength, depriving people of knowledge and depriving them of their strength, people will turn into a dull herd submissive to the will of the owner. This is probably the blue dream of our government.
  12. Goodmen
    Goodmen 22 October 2013 09: 55
    I noticed a trend - instead of explaining normally why, that 3 + 5 = 8, in a perverted form, they are simultaneously trying to develop non-standard thinking.
    Thinking outside the box, logic is a good thing, but maybe you need to isolate them as a separate subject, and not push them into all the rest (applies to mathematics, physics, etc. technical subjects.)?
    but they won’t do it, because these hybrids are a good screen for the electorate ... a screen behind which hides the lack of depth of study of objects ... IMHO
    if anything, I studied at the Physics and Mathematics Institute at MEPhI, there is something to compare ...)))))
    1. nov_tech.vrn
      nov_tech.vrn 22 October 2013 11: 17
      and I also noticed that memorizing absolutely unnecessary information, instead of studying processes and technologies, why cram the name "dichloro-some kind of salt, God knows what" in chemistry, there is a chemical formula, there is a zone theory, you need to know the valence and molecular weights, and to develop memory, please cram words in foreign language lessons, and memory develops and knowledge of words is one of the whales of language proficiency. by the way there was such a school ZFTSh.
    2. Anatolich
      Anatolich 22 October 2013 13: 03
      +++ I completely agree, instead of explaining how much it will be twice two, they consciously seek to confuse. Why not introduce separately items for quick wits.
  13. Boot under the carpet
    Boot under the carpet 22 October 2013 10: 26
    Education requires modernization! The deepest and not the one that our officials are pushing through! I unlearned at a technical university and I can’t say that I am glad about this, because the material base provided by the university is outdated and depended back in Soviet realities. Now the labor market is equipped with other conditions that require other knowledge. Now to unlearn at the university (I’m not talking about advanced Moscow universities, because I don’t know what is there and how), it’s just to show the future employer that you are a smart person who is able to understand one or another high-tech field of activity. Of course, military schools still teach, because there are moral principles where people are more or less honest about the quality of education.
  14. 3935333
    3935333 22 October 2013 10: 42
    Our education does not need any modernization, the Soviet school and education, the Institute of Education in general, our fundamental science is the best model of the educational process in the world, from kindergarten to retraining and certification courses in production! you just need to fit this model into the current realities a little (as the Anglo-Saxons and other partner countries did). We will soon lose the main thing - the Intellectual and Scientific ELITE of Russia. There will be only upstarts with "Red" diplomas of Western economic educational institutions, so to speak MASTERS and Luminaries whose parents are in the Financial Elite of our homeland. Why do we, the country from which they make the BANANA Republic - the Scientific Elite! our "friends do not need it ....." friends "need obedient, watching" TV shows ", devouring stupid slaves!
  15. grafrozow
    grafrozow 22 October 2013 10: 42
    With all its drawbacks, the Soviet school was an operating system that provided a basic level of education for almost everyone.
    So the teachers were different, and the profession-teacher was prestigious, and now? Everything fell apart to hell, soon teachers from Asia will be invited to work, then in general there will be a full 3,14..Ts.
  16. My doctor
    My doctor 22 October 2013 10: 43
    here about the work of Tolstoy mentioned. Answer honestly. Did you read war and peace at school? Do you remember how many pages you had to read before the next lesson? I can say with 99 percent certainty that the boys did not read. Do not read as a loser and excellent students.
    1. military
      military 22 October 2013 11: 28
      Quote: MyVrach
      Did you read war and peace at school? ... I can say with 99 percent certainty that the boys did not read. Do not read as a loser and excellent students.

      today the problem is that not only did the boys not read "War and Peace", but the "teachers" themselves ...
  17. pensioner
    pensioner 22 October 2013 10: 46
    Quote: klimpopov
    Here I also have textbooks from the 50s on physics and mathematics.

    At home, somewhere, I have a trigonometry booklet of the 1911 (sort of) publication year. For high schools. Mom darling !! Now it would be called tasks of increased complexity. It is unrealistic for today's schoolchildren to solve these problems. And the tests will finally drive the formation into the coffin. And further. In fact, the main component of education is self-education! The teacher only shows the direction and helps with the study of the material. The school should first of all educate students in the desire for education. What tests really do not contribute.
    1. klimpopov
      klimpopov 22 October 2013 11: 15
      Naturally! I, too, about this. He simply called it a BASE on which everything that was obtained during the so-called self-education is superimposed. If a person has an idea of ​​a particular area, then he will easily fill in the missing knowledge. Again, you DO NOT NEED to cram everything, there are Internet directories and so on, but to know how to find the information you need, you need a comprehensive understanding, this is true for all sciences. My opinion.
      I have a 1911 trigonometry book somewhere in my home

      If it does not complicate with pleasure I would look at a couple of scans.
      1. pensioner
        pensioner 22 October 2013 11: 28
        Quote: klimpopov
        If it does not complicate with pleasure I would look at a couple of scans.

        I will try to find.
    2. My address
      My address 22 October 2013 11: 17
      Hi, Yuri!
      Many of my teachers tried not only to give me knowledge, and in an understandable form, but also taught me to think. Grateful to many for this.
      Now two grandsons are studying - I want to cry like that, swearing and fighting! Normally they teach only in paid and in circles.
      1. pensioner
        pensioner 22 October 2013 11: 27
        Hello Sasha! My head of the department (by the way, a student of NN Bogolyubov) said: "We do not give you knowledge! We give you an algorithm for obtaining knowledge!" A thousand times I was convinced of his correctness, because I had to do a lot of things in life. If there is a desire, time and literature, then you can understand any area of ​​knowledge. Well, if not at a high professional level, then at the initial professional level for sure.
  18. My address
    My address 22 October 2013 11: 05
    Most of the site believes that the formation of a decade is commanded by almost pests.
    Most on the site believe that the decade's economy is almost a command of pests.
    And the most interesting thing is that the majority on the site believes that GDP has nothing to do with failures in education and the economy.
    1. military
      military 22 October 2013 11: 20
      Quote: My address
      ... commanding education almost pests.
      ... the economy is commanded almost pests.
      ... GDP has nothing to do with failures in education and the economy.

      ...probably... "nearly" has laughing
  19. SHOCK.
    SHOCK. 22 October 2013 11: 15
    Why go to school? Why strain your head? I’ve been away all these years. After graduation, the parents of the exam have bought, and go on to study further, anywhere, again for money. Everything is bought, everything is for sale. Again, I served, for example, at a medical university, please receive diploma, you’re already a doctor. And what will be visible there next. Think of someone who has been treated, someone who has not been cured on the contrary, someone died because of this, it’s business, one more, one less. My friends have come to a terrible time.
  20. vvvvv
    vvvvv 22 October 2013 11: 37
    Forced to minus material. I will explain why.
    1. Excessively thicken the paint.
    2. Two of his wife’s little nephews are in elementary school and we have all heard about the progress of their studies.
    So, the training program is extremely rich and complex! I would not say that the level of school education is low! No! I know the situation in high school - very many, in addition to school, attend many extra. classes with tutors. Those. who wants - gives a very good education to children today!
    Many of my acquaintances' children are lured to the United States, which I am categorically against, but this speaks of the value of our specialists. And in universities in full-time departments a high level of education! I myself have been in this area all my life and I know something. I also studied at a technical school in Samara - also only praise to the teachers! When one teacher tyrannized me a little about "E-machines", he told me: I want to make a Man out of you ... So, there is no need to overcharge our education too.
    1. klimpopov
      klimpopov 22 October 2013 11: 56
      Key phrase "who wants to" ...
      According to the Soviet system, ANY student who studied poorly and poorly entered a vocational school and then went to work. Those who wanted more (and most importantly could) went to college, that is, there was an integrated approach to education from kindergarten to graduate school. Now this is not.
      The program can be of any complexity, the question is its relevance and assimilation, can I begin to learn (exaggerate of course) quantum mechanics in the first grade?
      The fact that the United States and the West lures the talented and educated is not new, you must agree that there are always talents and those who want to study, here they (the West) take them out to put at their service. Again, his own country can not offer them anything.
      Naturally, you can educate yourself if you wish. Then the children of children who studied under the new system will grow up, then the children of those children, understand what I mean? ...
      1. vvvvv
        vvvvv 22 October 2013 12: 32
        I don’t think that on this topic you can just so seriously think, and not abstract enough. And note, there is an emphasis on school education!
        You go much beyond that accent. Then I could also make an argument, like you, that the connection between production and education, etc., has been broken. But, this is too broad a topic ...
        1. klimpopov
          klimpopov 22 October 2013 12: 43
          Yes, but after all, school is a base that cannot be divorced from all education. For the rest, I agree, an extensive topic.
  21. Boot under the carpet
    Boot under the carpet 22 October 2013 11: 55
    Quote: 3935333
    you just need to fit this model into the current realities a little (as the Anglo-Saxons and other partner countries did).

    Sir, you said that modernization is unnecessary, but in this quote you are contradicting yourself. Everyone is accustomed to singing that we are losing everything, we are lagging behind everywhere, to persecute masons is generally above all. I do not argue, this is how it happens, but what is the use of it? Believe me, no one will return the fundamentality of the former Soviet state, because it is not beneficial for those who sit in bureaucratic chairs, since you need to invest money. In your words, the word "a little" does not fit at all for the development of the modern model of today's successful education. You just cut the air with your saber, no more ...
  22. AlexCPP
    AlexCPP 22 October 2013 12: 13
    I do not know the article is not quite complete. Here the problem is considered from the point of view of precisely the humanities (which I’m sorry for the harshness of the statement I can’t consider as sciences, but only I say as probabilistic teachings where you can’t find the truth or fact). So, I myself am a graduate of NSU mehmat, I graduated from graduate school there. From the point of view of the exact sciences and natural sciences, we have not yet been taught very badly (especially taking into account the fact that, for example, in many European countries they have not studied Euclidean geometry in schools for a long time). And the children know the math with physics, one can say quite well that it is better than peers from Europe. And if my words are not enough for you, then multiply see the statistics on international olympiads in mathematics and physics among schoolchildren. The problem with us is not in higher and school education. Namely, the formation or acquisition of the status of a young scientist after the completion of higher education. Also, the life of a young scientist is not really sugar. With me, several very talented people emigrated abroad to unfortunately promote their ideas and their science.
    1. Civilian
      Civilian 22 October 2013 21: 23
      My brother has a red diploma from MEPhI (he’s now flying to Nice, oligarch). The godson is studying in Bauman ...
      Do you really think that such results are the merit of the general education program, the school ???
  23. pahom54
    pahom54 22 October 2013 12: 17
    The article is smart and useful ...
    However, the author speaks somewhat one-sidedly about the economic side of reforms in education. Something here is not sticking a bit from the point of view of economic theory.
    How rich is the state? Primarily economic resources. However, human resources are one of the components of economic resources, and in them the acquisition of a quality general and professional education is an important factor. And those who allegedly decided to reduce the cost of getting an education in Russia could not understand this misunderstanding.
    The conclusion is, as always, the same: enemies, enemies, enemies everywhere. Confirmation of the "enemy" attacks against our education is the fact that the children of almost all officials study abroad.
    By the way, the fact that our universities in some ranking which year are not included in the first hundred, or in the first two hundred, is, I think, a purely political nonsense. that is, a game of politics, transferred to the pseudo-scientific sphere. Such people as the rector of Moscow State University Sadovnichy, and many other rectors, teachers of higher education, managed to keep both the staff and the level of education today.
    Just what will happen in 5-7-10 years ??? Dumb graduates of secondary schools will come to universities, and the same dumb teachers will teach them ???
    So this reformism in education can again be defined as high treason ...
  24. general.bnw
    general.bnw 22 October 2013 12: 34
    Lord! The Russian Empire had a brilliant education, and many of the achievements of the USSR owed him. In the Soviet Union, much was saved from the old education system, despite attempts to break it down, for example, in the 1920s / * brigade methods * of training, one assessment for everyone and other * innovations * /. There was indeed a surge of creativity in the early 1990s: for example, I and my comrades-in-arms managed to revive the country's first Cadet Corps in Novosibirsk ... Now there is a KILLING of education, moreover sophisticated, and the author of the article clearly shows this: the essence of education is being destroyed and education, and instead reigns paper reports in incredible quantities, the exam and the notorious * pedagogical measurements *. But they should not be the main thing: TEACHER and Pupil - this is the basis of the school, which must be saved! This is not an unfounded appeal - I work in public education / which must now be called disgusting: * educational services *! / For the 44th year and I want to have time to do something else ...
    1. Egor.nic
      Egor.nic 22 October 2013 14: 56
      You are absolutely right! It is unfortunate that people like you, ordinary teachers and teachers, are held hostage by this crazy ministerial machine and are powerless to fix it. If the people do not stop such a crusade against him.
      Perhaps the only thing that can be done is to save what was saved from the crashed whole - those smart and wonderful teachers with great experience and knowledge, who individually will be able to transfer their knowledge to those who truly need them and who later become new shoots, will be able to revive everything again in Russia.
      I shake my hand and with deep respect!
  25. waisson
    waisson 22 October 2013 12: 36
    ruined the shame and when it was told it was the smithy of the mind in the world and there could not be without amers
  26. runway
    runway 22 October 2013 13: 31
    Ay-ya-yah, who would have thought. Like - didn’t wait, didn’t guess, but open the gate? Well naive, clear water. After all, this is the CURRENT STATE POLICY - to turn the population into illiterate and stupid. These are easier to manage.. They gave you the opportunity to have a roof over your head, have a drink and a snack, a garden and a car, well, sit by the TV and do not rock the boat. We ourselves will solve everything here with homies. There is no alternative to us. We graduated from the academy abroad, we are now very smart and our children are outstanding. They will steer after us. Well, like, to lift Russia from its knees (to pull it out of the pit).
    Wait a bit, or else there will be .... There will certainly be less optimism.
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 23 October 2013 06: 14
      "Children is our future".
      A state that does not remember this has no future!
  27. killganoff
    killganoff 22 October 2013 14: 17
    Why do slaves need education? Slaves pipes have enough minimal knowledge. In this country, thinkers are not needed - if they think, they will want true freedom.
  28. sem.sorok
    sem.sorok 22 October 2013 14: 32
    Quote: saag
    “He who learns for free - he learns for free”
    It is doubtful that we studied at a Soviet school less time, and now studies begin with a kindergarten, but we knew more, so paid education at school is generally nonsense, you will give any kind of assessment for money, this is a new channel of corruption, we must move away from the Bologna process, USE, and take the model of the Soviet school

    I agree. The wife works as a teacher in college. And he admits that every year more and more stupid and stupid students come. Not even knowing axioms such as the Pythagorean theorem. Yes, and my own feelings from communicating with the younger generation - school graduates, applicants, students of the first three courses - this is sadness. They ruined the education system that developed their horizons, and did not poke a person in one particular area. A system in which there was still an individual approach to students. Oh damn, what can I say
  29. Egor.nic
    Egor.nic 22 October 2013 14: 41
    The author is deeply wrong. Offering his point of view, he actually goes away from the essence. The economic side is only a cover for achieving the goal - the complete and total destruction of education in Russia, as in other medicine, science, culture, etc. What will follow - and degradation of society will follow. An uneducated, semi-literate society is easier to manage through TV, the Internet and various miracle workers. And this process has long been actively conducted. Look carefully at what your television sets broadcast, what and who is laying out and promoting it on the Internet, who is calling in swamps and other squares and streets ....
    A state where an educated, intelligent and cultural people cannot be defeated. But the country where the people are divided and turned into a stupid controlled herd is destroyed by itself, it is enough to come and take what you need. Those who have studied history know such examples.
    The future of the country, as well as education, medicine, science, culture, industry, agriculture, depend on those who live in the country, and not on those ministerial workers and lower officials who destroy it all, who is intent and who are out of stupidity.
  30. Renat
    Renat 22 October 2013 15: 01
    To undermine the very foundation of the Russian state is the main task of the Freemasons. Future perspective. It is much easier to cope with a generation that thinks by templates than with a thinking nation. Well, "our" government willingly helps them. Rather, it works out its dividends.
  31. AlexCPP
    AlexCPP 22 October 2013 15: 18
    Quote: sem.sorok

    Not even knowing axioms such as the Pythagorean theorem.

    Sorry, of course, but axioms are axioms and this fact does not require proof. In particular, all Euclidean geometry is built on 5 axioms. Roughly speaking, axioms should possess the property of completeness, consistency, and uniqueness. Although this is not suitable for all axioms, for example, Kolmogorov axiomatics. And theorems are a fact that requires proof. Which are proved, among other things, thanks to the lemmas. And now I don’t know about the level, but now it’s not among all schoolchildren, of course, but the fashion has gone and studying and with whom they talked, they read, decide, etc. .. And in general, the education system has become skewed now everyone wants to get a higher education that isn’t OK. Many go to study just for the sake of rubbing 4-5 years of pants. But at the same time, we must clearly understand that the country needs both the working hands of which we have a large deficit with.
  32. mithridate
    mithridate 22 October 2013 15: 58
    See it at the root!
    Quote: nov_tech.vrn
    in general, why does the Bologna process need Russia? We have been "reformed" education, and the main goal voiced is the recognition of Russian education abroad, let's put aside the fairy tales about students who have to come to Russia in droves for education, some difficulties in the preliminary study of the Russian language, put a solid barrier to this, and in the bottom of the recognition Russian education abroad, facilitating the emigration of our children, naturally already educated, those intellectual robbery of Russia.
  33. scientist
    scientist 22 October 2013 19: 39
    Education reform is a common example - they wanted the best, but it turned out as always! Education standards and a differential approach to teaching children of different abilities are certainly progress. However, in fact, over the past 2 years, children have only been doing what I am training in USE tests, turning them into computer zombies. But this is a period when the abilities and creative abilities of adolescents are revealed, when moral and ethical foundations need to be invested in them. Instead, the teacher is forced to automate the solution of the tests on which the status of the school and the future of young people depend.
    In addition, there are a lot of young people who, with very high abilities in physics and mathematics, have very low abilities in the humanities or vice versa. How to be? In Soviet times, they had a chance, the selection committee usually took into account not only grades, but also the personal abilities and characteristics of the student. And since now studying in universities is mostly average mediocrity, wishing to get not a knowledge and skills, but a diploma crust. Real knowledge comes only with experience in organizations. But in the specialty less than 50% of university graduates go to work. The question is, who and for what are we teaching?
  34. Civilian
    Civilian 22 October 2013 20: 39
    "The only design that can be traced from start to finish is the design of economy."
    Economic management, I would say. American "management": set goals, develop criteria for goals, monitor and distribute finances based on the results of measurements. We will get the product at the exit. In fact, it is not a product at all, but "correctly" verified reporting - "managers" are not only those who have diplomas, certificates of courses and not only in America. An eyewitness and participant in the implementation of all these USE and GIA, specialized centers and project activities. What was at the entrance and what I saw now after a four-year break in teaching. Culture shock !!! They actually died !!! Simply, to amaze !!!
  35. Civilian
    Civilian 22 October 2013 21: 09
    “Save on schools - go broke in prisons” ...
    So. But also the emergence of new near-prison conditions in schools. I can not say anything about prisons, but the specific changes in schools have been obvious for a long time. For example, there were no teachers and labor equipment for boys. There were no attendants. They canceled NVP, closed shooting galleries and locked up even air rifles. The headmaster doesn’t shoot at the airman. To a person who dug a shooting range with a military instructor at this school, and ... an arsenal of small-caliber rifles, air guns, victory in competitions, five graduates of the class combat officers) ... But in each school there are security guards, video surveillance systems. During all the changes, children are not allowed to leave the schools at all schools of the city, and the promotion of children into the locker room and out of it resembles feeding in a concentration camp (well, the most sacred is property).
    And during their usual school life, the children swear (guard !!! new attack !!!), but on the exam "shmon" and the confiscation of cell phones (in case of colossal other violations).
  36. Civilian
    Civilian 22 October 2013 21: 44
    "They only say that a graduate of, say, senior classes should have such and such competencies."
    Not "such and such", but at the level of formation of educational actions. Federal state standard. New children's surprise - FGOS (from ship to ball, last year I have 120 hours of courses on them). So, I didn’t understand much during the courses, but I bought books with standards and gasped. They wrote there that the student should have in terms of formation at the exit from the 9th grade. On the one hand, they took away this knowledge, abilities, skills (ZUNs) and removed unnecessary taffetology: The student should not do this and that, but, guard, BE ABLE OR KNOW HOW TO DO IT !!! But on the other hand, what did they do ??? Abolished all pedagogical and psychological science !!! The results for the 9th grade are written, but what you need to get in the 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th grades is not. And the head teachers say - that's it, federal state educational standards, educational-methodical complex, correct teachers. And I have 33 hours a week of lessons and almost 300 children without housekeepers !!! And the publishers of textbooks and programs do not care !!! For their salary, they will change a few words in their programs and textbooks (in one class there are 4 different versions of the same textbook on social studies; Bogolyubov - he, not mathematicians, lobbied for the Unified State Exam !!! As an excise stamp, the globe symbolizing the Federal State Educational Standard for new textbooks and From scratch they created difficulties for the teacher !!! And not only for the teacher, but in our politics there are managers! Business is idle !!! The school must provide children with new textbooks at the price of 400 rubles !!!).
    That is, they did, they did, the Soviet and Russian education systems. And now "doing" means what ??? Are you breaking ???
  37. Civilian
    Civilian 22 October 2013 22: 20
    Tasks to complicate ...
    To the above should be added a consolidated, synergistic result. Teachers were removed from the top management of school life. The teacher has less ability to manage meaningful learning activities in the classroom. Problems with the content, took place "in full" last year. You tell them about understanding, and they ... They send it in plain text, then massively write off the GIA and it turns out to be right. (One girl from the past 9th grade is still suitable: "Here, you said ..." When she thought about the test, she wrote worse than at random, less than 20% of the answers were correct, and wrote off 100 points on the exam) ... So, this place (management) is never unoccupied. For example, a courtyard group grappled with football fans, united by interest "who is cooler than a nationalist", and you won't do anything with this tandem - they will disrupt the lesson. Either you take it as cubs and train it, or among adolescents, the imbitil or sociopath most of all affects the educational activity - you look up to them so that God forbid, you do not break. And here it is difficult to do something ... At least for me. All in obstruction, 7 lessons with unfamiliar and wild for you - work for burnout, wear and tear, and fitness does not help ... And when you still become your own. Nothing will change, sociopaths will take over management in a number of schools - this is my forecast.
  38. Civilian
    Civilian 22 October 2013 22: 56
    “What is the way out of this situation? There are two ways out - one more probable, the other less probable. More likely is that angels will come down from heaven and arrange everything for us. Less likely is that we ourselves will do something. ”
    In London, my colleagues have a salary 15 times more than mine, they go on strike (and some of my students, including in London, studied at colleges and universities - and it’s not at all a fact that the money for their education is not really mine). I do not mean "on strike", "rioters" and hooligans, they will give a club, I will go to beat them myself. I am in the sense of providing the correct forceful impact, because otherwise the present will not understand. From last year's arsenal: Let these souls fund, they love it !!! Leave for the second year !!! They, the repeaters, (and I just did not observe this before) in the new conditions are completely different, more peaceful and quiet. And it is also extremely important in this way to destroy anti-worker groups in the classes. And the fact that the director knocks the bows is his problem. Themselves were directors. If you're right, they won't do anything special there, except for minimizing wages (and she's already like that). (An advertisement for winter tires will be thrown, but planting drugs or a real accident is unlikely).