Military Review

History of Ukraine through the eyes of a Russian schoolboy. Memories

235
I graduated from school in the South-East of Ukraine (fundamentally not “in Ukraine”, but “in Ukraine”, as “in Tambov”, “in Kamchatka”), in a Russian city. Finished it back in 1996 year. I really liked the school subject историяbut I didn’t like how we were served.


The compilers of the program did everything to prevent me, the Russian, from being proud of their ancestors, but only to be ashamed and repent. Note that this is the middle of the 90-s, Bandera is not yet a hero of Ukraine, but already nauseated by the presentation of the material. I am afraid to think about how the modern scholars in Ukraine brainwash.

I remember that in the school library, the book “The History of the Romanov Family” in Ukrainian caught my eye. Even in the preface it was written that all the Romanovs were terrible tyrants, alcoholics and libertines (I can not vouch for the accuracy of the quotation, but I conveyed the meaning for sure). My children's brain just exploded from contradictions: on the one hand, how drunks and perverts built such a large country, and on the other, “recommended by the Ministry of Education”. At that time I simply did not know that this institution was occupied by the ideological descendants of Mazepa, Bandera and Shukhevych.

Oh, these wonderful lessons of history! We have textbooks on this subject changed EVERY YEAR. Do you think that the Soviet people won the Great Patriotic War? You are mistaken. And not even Western allies. It was Ukraine who defeated the fascists, well, or at least did not allow the Barbarossa plan to materialize. It was explained to us that 22 July 1942, the city of Sverdlovsk (now Lugansk region), was the last defense stronghold in our country (Ukraine), which thwarted all the plans for the Blitzkrieg to the Germans. And then, the Muscovites finished off already exhausted and exhausted enemies. If we proceed from this logic, then Turkmenistan should be given the title “hero-country”. Imagine the Turkmen warriors are so good that the invaders were not allowed a few thousand kilometers before their homeland.

In Ukraine, every student knows who Valuev is. No, this is not the Valuev, who will be appointed ambassador to Kiev, if Klitschko becomes president. Valuev, the tsarist minister, said: "There was no Ukrainian language, there is not and cannot be." I remember, even I, a Russian man, was outraged by such arrogance. By the way, this phrase, showing the true attitude of the “damned invaders” to Ukraine, is known to everyone who has finished school there. But then it turned out that he said: the very question of the benefits and possibilities of using this adverb in schools is not only not resolved, but even the initiation of this question is accepted by the majority of Little Russians with indignation, often expressed in the press. They very thoroughly prove that there was no special Malorussian language, there is no and cannot be, and that their adverb, used by the common people, is the same Russian language, only spoiled by the influence of Poland; that the all-Russian language is as understandable for Little Russians as it is for Great Russians, and even much clearer than the so-called Ukrainian language, which is now composed for them by some Little Russians and especially Poles. The faces of that circle, which is being strengthened to prove the opposite, are blamed by the majority of the Little Russians themselves for separatist designs hostile to Russia and disastrous for Little Russia (excerpt).
Agree, this is, as they say in Odessa, two big differences.

I remember in class we were told that at the beginning of the 20th century there were circles in Austrian Galicia, which could be divided into Austrofiles and Russophiles. The former linked their future with Austria and the entire progressive world — the European integrators, in a word, and the latter, respectively, were “for the Muscovites”. And for some reason, the teacher did not tell us about their further fate - not about the Ukrainian Austrian firms that killed the Russophiles (Russians), or about the first European concentration camps - Talerhof and Terezin.

I remember the class in 9, read the interview of one OUN. He, poor, all lamented that half of the emigrants to America from western Ukraine at the beginning of the 20th century called themselves Russians. Based on this, I began to prove to the teacher of the Ukrainian language that at that time in Galicia half of the population considered themselves Russian, but for some reason did not declare it openly. I could not prove, because it had to be done on the move.

An interesting view of the official Kiev Zaporizhzhya Cossacks. They hammered into young heads that the Cossacks were a sort of fighters for the Ukrainian land and its population. But then it turned out that Zaporizhzhya Cossacks lived as a predatory gang, they were not picky about their connections — they could go to Moscow with the Poles, they could stand up with the Crimeans against Poland. The same Crimean Tatars, it turns out, were much more decent - they did not attack the one-faith Turkey, and it’s all the same to steal slavery into slavery. We are Russian, Polish, Ukrainians are all wrong. We, probably, were not distinguished at all.

Interesting reasons for the constant uprisings of the Cossacks against Poland in the XVI - XVII centuries. Their main goal was to get into the registry, i.e. getting banal salary from Poles. A sort of extortionists - we will fight with you until you give money. It is significant that after the liquidation of the Sich, the Cossacks moved closer to the ever-recalcitrant Caucasus. They were given land, they were given maintenance, and they turned into the Black Sea Cossack army, and then the Kuban army. They became quite happy with their fate and never rebelled against the Russian tsars.

I remember that we guys were very interested, as we called them, “Polish Ninjas”. Let me explain: as a rule, at the end of almost any anti-Polish Cossack uprising, when the guardians of the Ukrainian land began to lose to regular troops, suddenly "the top of the uprising was seized and executed after cruel torture." We were amazed: how can one steal the entire leadership of the uprising in the middle of a guarded camp, and why it could not be done at the beginning of the unrest. The answer I received much later was simple - the Cossacks themselves betrayed their commanders in order to receive forgiveness. These are the brave and brave defenders of the motherland.

My friend studied at the Ukrainian military school. The teachers there made a surprising discovery: it turns out that the role of Nakhimov in defeating the Turkish fleet greatly exaggerated - it turns out that almost all the work was done, yes - yes, the Cossacks. They on their boats - seagulls "udaydakali" all the ships of the enemy, and ours were so, for extras. Even the ancient descendants of Ukrainians - ukry, known to us as Atlanteans, built the Egyptian pyramids, and they themselves came from Venus, and the oldest, the original language was Ukrainian.

Jesus Christ was a Ukrainian, according to another version, he studied in western Ukraine in his youth, and later the Jews misrepresented the whole truth about him. Understand that all his virtues would not have manifested, if he did not know the “shchiroy” of the Ukrainian soul.

When we passed the Great Patriotic War, we were surprised to learn that the OUN-UPA, like real patriots, fought not only with the German, but also the Russian invaders. And my grandfather told me that his part was removed from the front several times in order to calm down Bendera. They, in the Soviet rear, see, with German nedobitkami understood. Father was very indignant at the fact that they distracted the Soviet forces in the situation when they had every day on the account. Crematoriums in concentration camps worked for wear until the approach of our advanced units; retreating, the Germans destroyed the cities and villages along with their inhabitants. It turns out, Bandera accomplices of many murders (in addition to their own hand-on reprisals against Jews, Poles, Russians).

I remember in the textbook about OUN and others like them more was written than about the Soviet partisans. Again, I finished school in the 1996 year, and Bandera was not a hero yet. How and what was taught under Yushchenko, even scary to think.

My friend in Ukraine has a son Maxim. He, a Russian lad, goes to the Ukrainian school (not to get into Russian, there are few of them and, you know, to get there dearly) and bilingualism prevents him from learning - at home they speak Russian, and at school everything is “move”. He, my friend, is thinking of moving to Tula, to his brother. By the way, my class is easier and more convenient to arrange a meeting of graduates in Moscow, and not at home - almost everyone who has a head on his shoulders has long been in Russia. Runs, runs a Russian man from Ukraine. Runs from lack of money, from the lack of prospects, and most importantly, from the aggressive "Ukrainians".

So, about the Ukrainian schoolchildren. They inculcated "Svidomo" and cave Russophobia. Understand, brainwashing in Ukrainian schools is capital, and at the output we will receive ideological enemies, reborn people with altered consciousness.

It is extremely important to conduct counter-propaganda among the Ukrainian youth (I touched on this topic in the article “Why Russia should remain Orthodox”), distribute Russian patriotic literature, shoot high-quality historical films, such as “We are from the Future-2”, “Match”. Tell me, somehow financially encourage the authors of the project. "500 seconds of truth about Ukraine"?

"The map of the Pole" is a very smart move of Warsaw. Where is the Russian map? Kyrgyz is much easier to obtain Russian citizenship than a resident of Ukraine. In order for a “nezalezhnoy” citizen to get a passport with a double-headed eagle, he must wait seven or eight and during this time lay out money, waste time and nerves.

Russia's policy towards the Russian-speaking population of Ukraine is fundamentally wrong. We should not tie together the political course of Kiev and the attitude towards the Russian people of this country. What, strongly pro-Russian sentiment in Georgia intensified in the 2006 year after the deportation of Georgians from Russia?
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  1. antiaircrafter
    antiaircrafter April 6 2013 09: 46
    11
    Where is the broadcasting of "Russian tudoy" to Ukraine?
    1. karbofos
      karbofos April 6 2013 16: 45
      +7
      "Russian tudoy" broadcasts in the open internet, everyone who is interested is watching. in america already hits records
    2. Nevsky
      Nevsky April 6 2013 18: 41
      14
      Respect and respect to the author! According to the article: indeed, it is better for him not to know the modern description of the textbooks of the History of Ukraine. wassat
      1. Atlon
        Atlon April 6 2013 18: 53
        -2
        Quote: Nevsky
        Respect and respect to the author! According to the article: indeed, it is better for him not to know the modern description of the textbooks of the History of Ukraine

        I can imagine what will be in the comments ... I agree with you that this is a cry of the soul, but at the same time (albeit unintentional, as you can see) a drop of excrement on the fan! Hold on guys!
        1. FC SKIF
          April 6 2013 21: 04
          +4
          I didn’t expect rudeness from you (a question about extras). Why are you doing this?
          1. Atlon
            Atlon April 7 2013 08: 37
            0
            Quote: FC Skif
            I didn’t expect rudeness from you (a question about extras). Why are you doing this?

            Yes, you did not understand me correctly ... In a personal unsubscribe. Well, I'm sorry if I offended
      2. Ascetic
        Ascetic April 6 2013 21: 43
        15
        Quote: Nevsky
        Respect and respect to the author! According to the article: indeed, it is better for him not to know the modern description of the textbooks of the History of Ukraine


        On Sunday, March 14, in Sevastopol, citizens of the city solemnly thrown to the foot of the monument to Catherine II Ukrainian textbooks on history and Russian literature. About 150 textbooks were thrown into crates labeled “landfill.”

        Also, Sevastopol broke the portrait of ex-Minister of Education and Science Ivan Vakarchuk.
        “We consider it symbolic that all this rubbish created by Ukrainian nationalists lies at the feet of the founder of our city, Catherine II. In the textbooks of Ukrainian history, the heroism of the Bandera people and the cult of personality of Viktor Yushchenko were promoted to our children. In the textbooks of Ukrainian literature for the 8th grade of our children forced to learn anti-Russian works and rhymes, where Russians are called dogs, and in the textbooks of Russian literature for the 8th grade they tried to teach our children thug jargon. In what country of the world are teenagers offered to study the meaning of the word "godfather" or "six"? This is sophisticated cynicism and an attempt to raise from a new generation "ivans who do not remember kinship"


        one of the organizers of the action, Andrei Merkulov, told reporters.
        The organizers of the action also announced their intention to purchase a batch of textbooks in Moscow.
        link

        Ukrainian textbooks at the foot of the monument to Empress Catherine. Photo of visitors to the city site Sevastopol.info NR2.ru: http://www.nr2.ru/10/03/14/all/


        Next to the textbooks and the portrait of the ex-Minister of Education Vakarchuk, a helmet of a Nazi Germany soldier NR2.ru appeared at the dump: http://www.nr2.ru/10/03/14/all/


        Simferopol: a car with Ukrainian textbooks. Photo of the newspaper Today



        Unlike Simferopol, residents of Sevastopol refused to burn books because they feared historical parallels

        1. Ascetic
          Ascetic April 6 2013 22: 01
          10
          History textbook for 7th grade.



          «the history of the Ukrainian people has 140 thousand years ”. It is from these lines that the history textbook begins, i.e. this is literally the first line of the textbook (see. Fig.). Like this: envy all the peoples of the planet! And if you say for example that the resettlement of ancient people on the territory of modern Ukraine began 140 thousand. years ago, it’s somehow not Svidomo’s



          The textbook further explains how “in Ukraine” (as if such a state already existed!) Neanderthals settled. The fact that they were Neanderthals - “Ukrainians” is implied and follows from the text.
          On page 146, the author of the textbook writes: “In the 12th century, the name“ Ukraine ”was replaced by the name“ Ukraine ”. For the first time the term "Ukraine" is found in the Ipatiev Chronicle of 1187 ... "
          On page 177, in the paragraph describing the events of the 14th - first half of the 16th centuries we read: "the name" Ukraine "has spread from the Naddnipryanschyna to all Ukrainian lands (!), Crowding out the previous name -" Rus ".
          Further, the author of the textbook writes: “From the 14th century the name“ Little Russia ”appeared. And further: "the name" Little Russia "was used in official documents. The people called themselves Rusyns - a word originating from "Rus."
          So the author immediately committed several forgeries and went on an absolute lie.
          the toponym "Ukraine" in those days simply did not exist. The author offers such a chronological sequence of names: “Russia”, “Ukraine”, “Little Russia”. Well is not it nonsense?

          And therefore, only to a landfill, both historical and ordinary, as people already do in Crimea. I would have collected all these textbooks and in Poland to the owners of these works, like De Gaulle dollars to America, but only in contrast to him with the words GIFT IS NOT NECESSARY
          1. tupolev-95
            tupolev-95 April 6 2013 22: 18
            +5
            So the author’s last name is Lyakh! Those. - Pole in the Nashen style. Very symbolic.
            1. Mhpv
              Mhpv April 6 2013 22: 22
              0
              Bravo Ascetic !!!! hi
          2. albert
            albert April 7 2013 06: 13
            +1
            Here is a picture in the subject
          3. alex13-61
            alex13-61 April 7 2013 14: 37
            +2

            So most Crimeans even now in Russia ... only together with their peninsula ....
          4. kenvas
            kenvas April 8 2013 01: 35
            0
            Bravo! survived damn, this is what happens, all of humanity went from s?
      3. Kolya
        Kolya April 6 2013 23: 29
        +2
        The history of Ukraine was distorted in 1991. I saw that at that time I was a student, as historians and professors of the university, knowledgeable people (not politicians!) Were forced to read history in a new way. And they obviously didn’t like it ...
  2. svp67
    svp67 April 6 2013 09: 54
    40
    The article is a clot of pain and misunderstanding. It is really high time for Russia to move from defense to offensive in the “historical question”, our history, this is our history and we have nothing to blame for, for all our mistakes, first of all we paid ourselves with our own blood.
    1. baltika-18
      baltika-18 April 6 2013 12: 57
      0
      Quote: svp67
      The article is a clot of pain and misunderstanding.

      So then it is.
      I have a classmate, at one time he graduated from the Pushkin Higher Military School of Radio Electronics, Academy, Lieutenant Colonel,
    2. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 16: 17
      26
      Below I read a lot of negative comments from Ukraine. Their authors look for some inaccuracies, incriminating evidence, they say that the article is custom-made, etc. Understand, I described my childhood feelings + rethinking many facts from the history of Ukraine over time. All these words from them do not surprise me:
      "fools", "stupid person", "stop smoking grass" and so on. In fact, there is nothing in them - only emotions and drooling. This only suggests that many in Ukraine have already ukry, svidomites and have long been no longer small. We need counter-propaganda, which I am trying to do. By the way, while writing this article, I wanted to embellish something, but then I didn't, because Ukrainians scrutinize such articles under a magnifying glass, looking for contradictions there (for example, it turns out that I did not write Bendery's name correctly). P.S. I am ready to subscribe to every word in this article. However, as in the rest.
      1. Shturmovik
        Shturmovik April 6 2013 16: 56
        +3
        I don’t know how in the South-East of Ukraine, I graduated from high school in 1992 in Crimea and probably according to the same curriculum (I don’t think that it has changed much in 4 years), but that it didn’t. A normal story that spoke about the exploits of the Soviet people, but not about the Ukrainian exploit. Yes, and now every year I go to the Crimea to my parents and I won’t say anything about hatred of the Russian norm or even some negative things from the Ukrainians (not only their place of residence but also their nationality).
        1. Garrin
          Garrin April 6 2013 17: 08
          +8
          Quote: Shturmovik
          And now every year I go to the Crimea to my parents and I won’t say anything about hatred of the Russian norm or even some negative things from the Ukrainians (not only their place of residence but also their nationality).

          Crimea is a separate conversation. You can say, a reserve where people with clear brains remained.
          1. Shturmovik
            Shturmovik April 6 2013 17: 12
            +4
            Trying to stir up. Somehow I got to the festival of the Ukrainian flag (it was the case in Alushta), but what really hurt the local population ended their holiday))))
        2. Egoza
          Egoza April 6 2013 17: 22
          +7
          Quote: Shturmovik
          I graduated from school in the 1992 year in Crimea and probably according to the same curriculum

          The program is one, but the textbooks are different. It all depends on the region in which the local authorities have decided on which textbooks to buy and distribute. Due to the fact that there were few textbooks as such on the Ukrainian MOV, they gratefully accepted (and approved) those printed with Soros's money - the Renaissance Foundation. Well, there you yourself understand what textbooks were introduced. Moreover, the time indicated by the author is the period of Kravchuk, who only under Yushcha admitted that as a teenager he ran to help the "rebels"
          1. Shturmovik
            Shturmovik April 6 2013 17: 59
            +5
            Well, I’m somehow lucky with us. The Ukrainian language and literature were only in Ukrainian.
        3. Nick
          Nick April 6 2013 20: 25
          0
          Quote: Shturmovik
          Crimea to my parents, and I won’t say anything about hatred of the Russian norm, or even some negative things on the part of Ukrainians (not only their place of residence but also their nationality).

          Crimea is autonomy within Ukraine, there IMHO orders are different from the rest of Ukraine, given the number of Russians in Crimea.
          1. Shturmovik
            Shturmovik April 6 2013 21: 32
            +3
            Yes, documented Autonomous Republic of Crimea, but only documented. Yes, there is a flag, there is a coat of arms and even a hymn, but there is no autonomy. There is a Crimean region in whose territory everything is happening the same as throughout Ukraine. Poverty and decline. Ukrainian is everywhere. But only thanks to the people living there we do not present ourselves to them in the image of the enemy, rather in the image of a friend (though he threw in difficult times). And as for the Russians in the Crimea, as far as I remember, the last censuses (I may be mistaken) showed about 35 percent, Ukrainians are in second place next to the Crimean Tatars and further to other nationalities. It is not only a matter of nationality but also in the heads of people!
      2. PAC3
        PAC3 April 6 2013 18: 47
        11 th
        From such "counter-propaganda" zero sense. Propaganda involves the use of 100 percent verified data, though sorted and filed in the appropriate direction))). And in the article - error on error, inaccuracy on inaccuracies. So the result is appropriate.
        So the author, never Goebbels)))
        1. Hudo
          Hudo April 6 2013 20: 24
          -1
          Quote: PAC3
          From such "counter-propaganda" zero sense. Propaganda involves the use of 100 percent verified data, though sorted and filed in the appropriate direction))). And in the article - error on error, inaccuracy on inaccuracies. So the result is appropriate.
          So the author, never Goebbels)))


          Your comment, a set of on-duty phrases of an anonymous troll. Yes, and with the specifics of you, somehow liquid No. , apparently you yourself know that you have to sit in a puddle.
          1. PAC3
            PAC3 April 6 2013 20: 35
            -5
            I have already pointed out errors in the author of the article). This is the incorrect spelling of the surname and distortion in the history of the Valuev Circular and simple ignorance of the history of the Cossacks.
            So what about "specifics" - better not). I know the story, definitely better than the author of the article)
            1. Andrey57
              Andrey57 April 6 2013 22: 15
              +1
              If such a connoisseur of the history of the Cossacks, then can you tell everyone how Zaporizhzhya bandits completely destroyed the population around Kolomna, and the population of the city itself? After these scum, the city was moved to another place!
            2. lelyk72
              lelyk72 April 7 2013 15: 18
              0
              But didn’t you write this story for Ukrainian textbooks?
      3. Aeneas
        Aeneas April 7 2013 00: 24
        -4
        Dear, well, what kind of Atlanteans, ancient ukry-Venusians, pyramid builders or Jesus Christ - superstars ..., sorry, Ukrainian, Cossacks on seagulls at Sinope, etc.? you can really appreciate the quality of anabis, if not for your recognition "in counter-propaganda." You can have different attitudes towards your ideologemes, but on this site it is customary of course to respect different forms of integration-Slavophil views, but you are a poor propagandist. However, dare, a little smarter, smarter and you will evolve from a caste of provocateurs into noble propagandists.
  3. zart_arn
    zart_arn April 6 2013 12: 26
    11 th
    From the article
    "Russia's policy towards the Russian-speaking population of Ukraine is fundamentally wrong."
    What is the wrong policy of Russia towards Russian compatriots in Ukraine?
    The conclusion of the article - some sort of presentation, to whom and what they want - is not clear.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg April 6 2013 13: 07
      27 th
      I often come across the opinion that there is no such nation as Ukrainians, but there are simply divisions of Russians into actually Russians, Ukrainians and Belarusians. Here I wonder how Ukrainians feel about themselves as Ukrainians or part of Russians, if Ukrainians have their own language, culture, traditions and finally their own history , which can and should be different from the history of Russians, because everyone has their own bell tower with which everything is seen differently, that is, facts and their interpretation. If Ukrainians are a nation, what kind of resentment do Russians have for how they write their story, or in history For Russians, the truth is the last resort (the opinion of the Tatars is taken into account). In the language as well, if the language is different, it would probably be good to know it (more possibilities) Well, probably if you do not want to know the language, you do not accept their history (without forgetting your language. And your history) there remains a move to the historical Motherland, which is what all Germans do to Germany, Russians to Russia, Kazakhs to Kazakhstan.
      1. Gecko
        Gecko April 6 2013 13: 37
        21
        To this I will tell you Dear, the story is as you like and interpret.

        Kazakhs, too, as a nation gathered from several different tribes.
        Historically, the territory of present-day Kazakhstan in the centuries preceding its incorporation into the Russian Empire was divided into three state entities - the Senior Zhuz, the Middle Zhuz and the Junior Zhuz. The latter included the territories of Aktobe, Atyrau, West Kazakhstan and Mangystau regions of modern Kazakhstan. Zhuz consisted of four tribal unions, and each of them, in turn, was divided into several clan associations.

        Great Russia, Little Russia, Belarus.
        In the end, these three Rus united under the rule of the Horde Volga dynasty into one state.
        Only after this unification the Moscow Grand Dukes began to be called the Sovereigns of All Russia.

        And the most interesting thing is that after all, Russia united earlier than the same Kazakhstan.
        You want to justify separatism, but as I gave the example above, this is a double-edged sword.
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 6 2013 17: 46
          -8
          I read All komenty Russians write that the people are one, and the current division is a temporary misunderstanding. Ukrainians write that there is almost one kindred but different people, like Kazakhs and Kyrgyz, religion, traditions, but not one people means their own history from their bell tower. Then why such hysteria over the content of Ukrainian history, or you don’t admit that others may have their own history. They taught at school that there was Kievan Rus, then Vladimir, then Moscow, and if the Ukrainians are different people, then Vladimir and Moscow are colonies and Kiev is a metropolis such as Rome and Byzantium colony. When Rome fell, the Byzantines considered themselves to be Romans, although they were not them, and then they owned Rome for some time. Maybe I am mistaken, but if two different nations then everyone has their own story, it may coincide in many ways with its Newans. Just don’t beat kicking, not from evil but just interesting? And if the people are one, then Moscow is the continuation of Kiev and just moving capitals like ours from Kyzyl Orda to Almaty and Astana.
          1. Nick
            Nick April 6 2013 20: 42
            +2
            Quote: Semurg
            The school taught that there was Kievan Rus, then Vladimir, then Moscow, and if the Ukrainians are different people, then Vladimir and Moscow are colonies and Kiev is the metropolis

            So if the other is yes, but here is the same. They say the truth - Russians are the largest divided people.
          2. Ingvald_Bueny
            Ingvald_Bueny April 6 2013 20: 52
            +5
            Quote: Semurg
            At school they taught that there was Kievan Rus, then Vladimir, then Moscow, and if the Ukrainians are different people, then Vladimir and Moscow are colonies and Kiev is a metropolis such as Rome and Byzantium colony

            In schools, school programs are constantly changing ... conjuncture. The fact is that the term "Kiveskaya Rus" was artificially introduced by Russian historians Karamzin and Klyuchevsky in the 19th century to designate the Old Russian centralized state with the center in Kiev. At the same time, the Vladimir and Moscow princedoms are not colonies, but subjects of a single Russian state.


          3. Ingvald_Bueny
            Ingvald_Bueny April 6 2013 20: 59
            +1
            Quote: Ingvald_Bueny
            When Rome fell, the Byzantines considered themselves Romans, although they were not, and then for some time they owned Rome.

            Rome was the capital of the united Roman Empire before its collapse into Western and Eastern. Rome remained the capital of the ZRI, and Constantinople became the capital of the VRI. The term "Byzantium" is used by historians to refer to VRI. It was called "Byzantium" - the Roman Empire or Rumia or the Roman Empire, inhabited by the Romans. The Byzantines were Romans. So the Greco-Roman tradition is the Roman tradition.
            1. Semurg
              Semurg April 6 2013 22: 04
              -1
              VRI is the name of the state, but the people in Byzantium are Greeks and others, but not the Romans. As I understand it, they took the big name imperial tradition, and the people are completely different. After all, the Roman Empire was created by the Romans, and Byzantium was a conquered city, that is, a colony. Or the Romans massively cut Byzantium and the surrounding area and settled it with the Romans, then they are Romans. (That is, the Romans)
          4. Andrey57
            Andrey57 April 6 2013 22: 23
            +4
            Well, yes, yes, yes, one word expert laughing Read the notes of Count Potocki and the memoirs of the Austrian general Tolben, where they describe the process of inventing "Ukrainians" so that Russians and Russians would squabble and kill each other fool
        2. Ingvald_Bueny
          Ingvald_Bueny April 6 2013 20: 52
          0
          Quote: gecko
          Great Russia, Little Russia, Belarus.
          In the end, these three Rus united under the rule of the Horde Volga dynasty into one state.
          Only after this unification the Moscow Grand Dukes began to be called the Sovereigns of All Russia.

          Do not explain what this "Horde Volga dynasty" is. And how Great Russia, Little Russia and Belarus could unite under its rule and in what year?
          1. Gecko
            Gecko April 6 2013 22: 11
            +1
            After the Golden Horde finally broke up, Ivan III declared Muscovite Russia the heir to the Golden Horde and made claims to its former lands.
      2. Per se.
        Per se. April 6 2013 14: 24
        13
        Quote: Semurg
        finally its own story, which can and should be different from the history of Russians,
        This is what its own story, is it not when the Russian lands came under the Commonwealth or when part of the lands, after the First World War, under Poland? Kiev is the originally historical capital of Russia, uniting the Russian lands, including spiritually, having adopted Orthodoxy from Byzantium when Vladimir baptized all of Russia. If we talk about the history of Ukraine, as a separate, independent state, then the whole story begins after the death of the Soviet Union. Ukraine, was, is and will be part of Russia, part of Russia. By and large, it was from Kiev that the squads expanded Russia to the Pacific Ocean, and if some Polish servants do not want to remember this, then in Russia they will not let it be forgotten.
      3. andrejwz
        andrejwz April 6 2013 14: 44
        +8
        Quote: Semurg
        ) Remains moving to the historical Motherland, which is what all Germans do to Germany, Russians to Russia, Kazakhs to Kazakhstan.

        Those. in due time, Galicia departed from Russia, now to give away (and for many to leave their homeland) another part of Russia, that small part of renegades, only by the fact that not the most distant people determined the division into republics according to nationality as true, arbitrarily identifying them borders. But what about those who, being Russian, and living in the territory of modern, independent, want to remain Russian and live where he was born. When he and his father and his grandfather could not even imagine that they were living in another state for Russia, it turned out to be irrelevant.
        To put it mildly, advice if not a fool, then certainly not a friend.
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 6 2013 19: 29
          -2
          Maybe I’m mistaken. (As you write a fool or not a friend) But not long ago England left Ireland, where the British lived for generations, and they also had to make a choice or leave or accept the prevailing alignment or wage a war to destroy the people or parts of the people. Maybe history gives a chance now having dispersed all meaningfully, then to build something better than what it was. And such articles where they refuse to relate to their people their history only make it worse. Somewhere I read in a month where the red thread goes that only the Russians have a monopoly on the truth, and the rest are simply inferior peoples who cannot create anything without the Russians. THE GREAT RUSSIAN PEOPLE does not need to belittle other peoples in order to be GREAT. And these pygmies who parasitize in the name of the Russians, appealing to the most base instincts of people, causing only hatred and hostility towards other nations or fools or provocateurs. If I reproach too loudly, I got all the crap.
          1. Gecko
            Gecko April 6 2013 19: 48
            +9
            The British really oppressed and killed the Irish; they had almost the same position as blacks. It’s a sin to complain to Ukraine, it has increased the territory several times at the expense of Russia, Ukrainians have always been equal, and under communism several general secretaries were Ukrainians, industry developed even better than in the rest of the USSR. By the way, the Poles only spread rot and robbed Ukraine.
          2. smile
            smile April 6 2013 20: 22
            +9
            Semurg
            This whole month that you are reading VO and you have the opinion that we all believe that we have a monopoly on the truth ... that's strange, why didn't you notice that even the harshest statements here are just a cry from the heart people who are tired of the unbridled propaganda campaign to slander our people ... and the most offensive is that part of our people were able to convince of this ... so I, for example, have not met a single representative of the titular nation, even the Balts, even Kazakhs, Armenians or Azerbaijanis, who would have recognized - yes, we in the 90s (at least recognized the 90s, when Russians were not just discriminated against - robbed and killed) really discriminated against Russians and Russian-speaking ... even among those. who says that he treats us well ... you just try to analyze even this text of yours ... try to remember what the newspapers wrote for you, the elite said, which all came to power under Russophobic slogans ... maybe at home find the red thread, huh? Don't you think that our deaf enmity arose precisely because of this dishonest attitude towards Russians on the part of the "titular" nations ... look, you are smart and, apparently, a good person ... but even you are simply not able to understand how unfairly and insulting towards the Russians behaved intoxicated by nationalist slogans, guided by base instincts of yours, and not only yours, compatriots ... in general, I'm not surprised that our chernukha got you, I'm not surprised that his chernukha you do not see at close range ... not surprised ... surprised that even you, judging by your speech, are a very reasonable person who calls for objectivity, you yourself are not able to even slightly admit it. that the negative reaction of Russians to those who began to spread rot in the nineties is just a reflex, a response ... Russians are not vindictive ... just ask for forgiveness and they will love and respect you more than yourself ... but for now you even this, unfortunately, they are not capable of ... advice - try to put yourself in our place ... sit, think about what happened to the Russians over the past 20 years in the republics ... maybe you will understand ... do not be offended by me, if you think about it, you might understand that in this case I also have reasons to be offended by you ...
            1. Semurg
              Semurg April 6 2013 22: 40
              +3
              smile. You write ask for forgiveness for the last 20 years, I will write ask for forgiveness for the last two hundred years and where will we go? And you will have our grievances with us, and we will cherish and cherish the grievances. It may be better to start building something new and better than what our ancestors did. And then chernukha blossoms with this everywhere, apparently the ancestors did something tak.A maybe mutual insults have not yet settled down, then only hope for a while (they say the best doctor) On my own behalf, if I offended or hurt someone I repent. And yet, Ukrainians are you part of the Russian people or a close but separate people?
              1. smile
                smile April 7 2013 13: 33
                +1
                smile
                You are only partly right ... the last 20 years are yesterday, this is today, refugees are alive, just people with broken destinies ... I hope you noticed that I did not mention something earlier ... but you mentioned ... unfortunately, it is common for some nationalists of the republics to refer to events of 2-3 centuries ago, and often invented to justify their real crimes ... and practice shows that the further you go, the more chernukha ... you ...
                1. Semurg
                  Semurg April 7 2013 13: 51
                  +1
                  Quote: smile
                  smile
                  You are only partly right ... the last 20 years are yesterday, this is today, refugees are alive, just people with broken destinies ... I hope you noticed that I did not mention something earlier ... but you mentioned ... unfortunately, it is common for some nationalists of the republics to refer to events of 2-3 centuries ago, and often invented to justify their real crimes ... and practice shows that the further you go, the more chernukha ... you ...

                  Well, of course, it remains to wait until you write, refugees, you can’t start rapprochement earlier, so I like to cradle your grievances. I suggest leaving grudges and starting a new better future. Or again you will begin to demand apology for all the sins of this world.
                  1. smile
                    smile April 7 2013 15: 40
                    +1
                    Semurg
                    Come on, no one cradles anything ... it’s really insulting - you do not notice point-blank that even in our polemic I explain to you the reasons for the situation in response to yours ... well, let's say. claims ... the key word is in response ... and you just don’t want to see this ... and this is the main problem ... and the more time passes, the less chance of friendship, a generation that remembers true friendship of peoples. a generation will grow up that remembers that we are one hundred bad imperials and oppressors, guilty of all the troubles of all nations ... not remembering what the Russians had in the 90s in the republics ... here you are, it seemed to me, and now you think that everything was tolerant and politically correct ... it’s sad how much you have changed your psychology ...
          3. Ingvald_Bueny
            Ingvald_Bueny April 6 2013 21: 01
            0
            England did not leave Ireland, gave independence to Northern Ireland, and left South.
            1. Aloger1
              Aloger1 April 7 2013 00: 30
              +1
              vice versa. Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain, as are England, Scotland and Wales.
          4. andrejwz
            andrejwz April 7 2013 00: 20
            0
            Quote: Semurg
            But not long ago England left Ireland

            Yeah, and gave a couple of counties? And those who lived there were probably invited to move closer to London? Well, if they consider themselves British.
            The question is not how to be called, Russia or Ukraine, and not even where the border is drawn by clever men from politics.
            Divided, and now still trying to quarrel, pushing their foreheads with enviable regularity, ONE PEOPLE.
            On the site, we agree and argue, and, to be honest, sometimes we swear. Because it is not indifferent. In what family without it.
        2. kubanec
          kubanec April 6 2013 20: 10
          +2
          everything is correct for hundreds of years in one Russia; then hundreds of years in the Russian Empire; and finally 70 years in the Soviet empire --- WHAT CAN HIS HISTORY BE ???????
      4. densyaophyng
        densyaophyng April 6 2013 15: 02
        17
        For example, there is the concept of Russians. Includes Russians, Tatars (by the way, different Tatars), Mordovians, Chukchi, Karelians, Yakuts, and others. As Goebels said there is no such nation as there is no American nation. So there are no nations of Germanic, Italian. Spanish, French, including Ukrainian. If people begin to live better, there is a unifying link, everyone begins to work for the good of society. If a crisis sets in, currents arise. for example, there are Poles, but there are Masuria, Zhmudins, Shlonszaks, Poles, Kashubians, Teutonic Knights at last. if in Poland such a Well began ... as in Yugoslavia, the country would be divided into many specific principalities, uluses according to yours. Everywhere would sit such a Yanukovych or Nazarbayev, who would teach children in the Sorbonne, Cambridge or Wels, save gold and pore over it.

        Grandmother complained about Stalin, but Den Xiao Ping was smarter than Stalin. Corruptionists are being shot, the country is getting richer, and soon will start buying land in other countries. And neither the military nor the armed forces will be needed. Everyone will buy for full, full-fledged yuan.
        Zhōngguó Gòngchǎndǎng Quánguó Dàibiǎo Dàhuì
      5. Uhalus
        Uhalus April 6 2013 15: 28
        +7
        And what they inspire, they will feel themselves. They were once Russian (albeit different), but now they are already divided. The point is that when you feel yourself as Ukrainians, Belarusians or Russians, you feel like brothers, part of a Slavic ethnic group, and do not drive in wedges of sectarian enmity.
        And, by the way, there was no Ukrainian language as a single one - there was a bunch of dialects, in which people from different regions did not understand each other and in conversations they used Russian, "Moscow" language. The modern "Ukrainian language" is a surzhik, invented by the nationalist Hrushevsky, just as Volapuk or Esperanto was invented in their time.
        1. karbofos
          karbofos April 6 2013 17: 07
          0
          I didn’t understand, I put a plus and it shows that it is minus request
        2. Egoza
          Egoza April 6 2013 17: 33
          17
          Quote: Uhalus
          The modern "Ukrainian language" is a surzhik, invented by the nationalist Hrushevsky, just as Volapuk or Esperanto was invented in their time.

          A bit wrong, dear! Grushevsky always wrote in Russian, because I was never able to learn the Little Russian dialect, which I lamented. It's just that the Poles began to intensively develop this dialect in order to tear the Little Russians from the Great Russians. It was at the end of the 19th century that the word "Ukrainian" appeared as a nationality, and it was so introduced that the majority of the population today do not remember the word "Little Russian" or perceive it as offensive. Unfortunately, the Bolsheviks also had a hand in this, trying to show tsarist Russia as a "prison of peoples". However, the essence of people does not change this. And I am sincerely proud of those people who considered themselves Ukrainians, but were real Soviet people, partisans. underground members, but simply patriots who devoted all their strength to the fight against the fascists.
      6. Atlon
        Atlon April 6 2013 18: 57
        +6
        Quote: Semurg
        .I’m wondering how Ukrainians feel about themselves as Ukrainians or part of Russians, if Ukrainians have their own language, culture, traditions and finally have their own history, which can and should differ from the history of Russians, because everyone has their own bell tower with which everything is seen differently, that is, facts and their interpretation.

        Russia is big ... And the dialect (dialect) in the Urals is different from Moscow, and the Rostov dialect from Tambovsky. And the history of different regions is different. And traditions too. And the clothes. So what? Ukraine, part of Russia, part of the Empire. And Kiev, the father of Russian cities. So about the nation, anyway too loud ...
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 7 2013 11: 15
          +1
          Dear Pavel, I understand that Russia is not so big and there are different dialects. But why Ukrainians stubbornly position themselves as separate people. Yes, there is propaganda and machinations of enemies, but time puts everything in its place. And Ukrainians consider themselves separate people for a long time or misconceptions so deep that they live so long, or yes they are a nation close to Russian but different.
          1. Atlon
            Atlon April 7 2013 13: 31
            0
            Quote: Semurg
            But Ukrainians consider themselves to be separate people for a long time, or delusions are so deep that they live for so long, or yes they are a people close to the Russian but different.

            How long ago? If you look at the official documents of the 19th century, the word Ukraine is practically not used. Only Little Russia. Including in the texts of the classics. Including Ukrainian ones. Or will you, as in the textbook of Ukrainian history, appeal to the Neaderthals - "Ukrainians"? Again, the invented pearl "great ukry" is like the opposite of the great rus. But excuse me, let's start with the fact that Ukraine is a Russian word! And Ukr, which has one root with Ukraine (outskirts), is at least idiocy. You can comfort yourself with the hope of "greatness", but this is rather ridiculous, because only as part of Russia, Ukraine (Little Russia) can be great, and nothing else. Otherwise, one can also talk and invent about "great Tambakhs" (Tambovites), "great Muscovites" (Muscovites), and "great Sibahs" (Siberians). Anyway, you can agree, to anything! For example, the most fashionable trend now that the Cossacks are a nationality. Well, isn't it nonsense? However, it is useless to argue with them (who consider themselves Cossacks)! And everything is simple, people do not know history, and do not want to know!
            1. Semurg
              Semurg April 7 2013 14: 12
              -2
              Otherwise, one can also talk and invent about "great Tambakhs" (Tambovites), "great Muscovites" (Muscovites), and "great Sibahs" (Siberians). Anyway, you can agree, to anything! For example, the most fashionable trend now that the Cossacks are a nationality. Well, isn't it nonsense? However, it is useless to argue with them (who consider themselves Cossacks)! And everything is simple, people do not know the history, and do not want to know! [/ Quote]
              Perhaps you are right. But the formation and disappearance of peoples is ongoing and there are no eternal peoples, maybe just recently by the standards of history, the people of Ukrainians appeared who you refuse the right to feel like yourself, but say that they are a stray or intoxicated part of the Russians. Maybe I'm wrong , according to comments under the flag of Russia they are part of the Russian, under the flag of Ukraine, most of them are separate people.
      7. Gecko
        Gecko April 6 2013 19: 56
        +5
        Who does not know, even in Russia, in some primordially Russian regions, the dialect, dialect, pronunciation differs from the "standard Moscow", and I mean not different republics, but Russian regions.
      8. Nick
        Nick April 6 2013 20: 34
        +4
        Quote: Semurg
        Well, probably, if you do not want to know the language, do not accept their history (without forgetting your language. And your history), you will only have to move to your historical Motherland, which is what all Germans do to Germany, Russians to Russia, Kazakhs to Kazakhstan.

        The problem is, dear, that Ukraine is Russia, or rather part of Russia. Therefore, the Russians in Ukraine at home, they have nowhere to go, and why not, it is time for the Ukrainian authorities to call to account for everything they have done to the people.
      9. zadorin1974
        zadorin1974 April 7 2013 13: 22
        -1
        If you continue, it will turn out: bonfire torchlight processions and ghettos with concentration camps?
    2. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 15: 19
      12
      Imagine a situation: war, you and your comrades are sitting in the trenches. An attack signal sounds, with shouts of cheers, an attack goes. Your unit captures the first line of defense and here ... what closes the leadership, it makes peace with yesterday’s enemies, and all who were at the territory of the enemy at the time of the signing of the treaty are declared enemies. How would you feel in this situation? That is how abandoned Russians feel in the post-Soviet space. They, damn it, built a country, an empire, were an outpost of Russianness, and now they have betrayed and forgotten. This is a crime against one’s own people.
      1. Semurg
        Semurg April 7 2013 11: 29
        0
        Quote: FC Skiff
        Imagine a situation: war, you and your comrades are sitting in the trenches. An attack signal sounds, with shouts of cheers, an attack goes. Your unit captures the first line of defense and here ... what closes the leadership, it makes peace with yesterday’s enemies, and all who were at the territory of the enemy at the time of the signing of the treaty are declared enemies. How would you feel in this situation? That is how abandoned Russians feel in the post-Soviet space. They, damn it, built a country, an empire, were an outpost of Russianness, and now they have betrayed and forgotten. This is a crime against one’s own people.

        Do you have a call to war? Okay, Asians, but Ukrainians aren’t the same enemies, because, as Russians say here, Ukrainians are part of the Russian people. Did you attack the Ukrainians, are you an invader on a foreign land? It seems to me that the Bolsheviks smell simple answers to all complex questions (kill, take away, destroy and then build your world standing knee-deep in blood) and judging by the pros you have a lot of them here
  4. The cat
    The cat April 6 2013 12: 34
    25 th
    Article set of fantasies and phobias. I graduated from high school in 1996 in Ukraine and I can say that the author is balabol. Even somehow lazy to refute this whole lump of absurdities and nonsense and poke the author with his nose into the humus. But if you ask ...
    1. Kars
      Kars April 6 2013 13: 19
      0
      What can I say 11th grade, 1999 on the history of Zaporozhye.

      I confirm the opinion and expression
      Quote: Elgato
      I can say that the author is balabol.



      And by the way, when I read the headline, I thought that there would be an extract from the program of schoolchildren of Russia about Ukraine.
      1. Melchakov
        Melchakov April 6 2013 13: 37
        +5
        The cat
        Kars
        I partially agree with you. Recently I was in Kiev. There are a lot of Russian-speaking people. When we left, they frightened us with nationalists. But for 4 days of stay "nasty mosk ... and" never heard. We walked literally five meters from the Presidential Administration (looking for a road to the "national" or "national" hotel, I don't remember), wanted to go for a tea, but then changed their minds - they were in a hurry laughing. Were in the ethnographic museum near Kiev. They showed the old Ukrainian village. A good guide caught us. A man under 60, about. He said one wonderful phrase, I will try to quote.
        Once we were one state, but our politicians were too clever.
        .....
        to unite, you must first disconnect.

        Only one moment raised a question. They showed us a monument to some Getman, who, under Anna Ioannovna, had already taken Moscow 12 times.
        1. densyaophyng
          densyaophyng April 6 2013 15: 18
          +6
          They showed us a monument to some Getman who, under Anna Ioannovna, had already taken Moscow 12 times

          Sahaidachny. If I lived now. The Russian Siemens produced in Russian Mnikhov (Munich now which) would go along the CER.
        2. Corsair
          Corsair April 7 2013 06: 36
          +2
          Quote: Melchakov
          They showed us a monument to some Getman who, under Anna Ioannovna, had already taken Moscow 12 times.
          There was such an activist, but only in the Time of Troubles, and not during the reign of Ivanov. They took the Kozaki Belokamennaya, with the subsequent looting and general rape of the nuns of the Novodevichy Convent. This is such a dark fact in a common story. Well, Cossacks of Muscovy would have avenged for any sins, oppression - there wasn’t anything like that on the part of Moscow at that time, it would have survived itself. It’s a shame, however, for the scolded ancestors ....
    2. tupolev-95
      tupolev-95 April 6 2013 13: 55
      16
      Come on ! I remember very well how in our history class, in 92 - 93, a portrait of Mazepa appeared (I was then studying at the school at the military town of DOS Zhitomir-21). How publications for the school appeared, where there was always an illustration - " mos.-whether to run Kiev ", where the Petliurists and Bandera suddenly became heroes. It was. I put the plus article for only one thing - (only, in principle, not “in Ukraine”, but “in Ukraine”, like “in the Tambov region”, “in Kamchatka”). I am Russian and I speak Russian and it is not necessary to force me to mutilate my language for the sake of incomprehensible political correctness.
    3. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 15: 21
      +4
      What am I balabol. I described my feelings and memories. Explain.
      1. yavol
        yavol April 6 2013 17: 19
        -6
        De is not a balabol, an atlantic scribbler.
        1. Hudo
          Hudo April 6 2013 20: 19
          +2
          Quote: javol
          De is not a balabol, an atlantic scribbler.



          Your scolding, at least vulgarity. Site rules do not allow you to express a true attitude towards your comment.

          PS If there was such an opportunity, I would give you a second "minus" for your nickname. Do you have such an irrepressible desire to catch a chicken or a hog in someone else's courtyard for a representative of the "higher" race - the German sergeant?
    4. A. Yaga
      A. Yaga April 6 2013 15: 23
      12
      Quote: Elgato
      Article set of fantasies and phobias. I graduated from high school in 1996 in Ukraine and I can say that the author is balabol. Even somehow lazy to refute this whole lump of absurdities and nonsense and poke the author with his nose into the humus. But if you ask ...

      No. The author writes the truth. My children studied in Kharkov universities on cross-border student exchange 2003-2008. In general, Kharkov considers itself a Russian city, but ... Students from all over Ukraine were different. There were also those who repeated these textbooks with foam at the mouth with aggression towards my ka-tsa-p-ok (dad - ho-hol), though most students were of the opinion similar to the author. My children told me this with great surprise and regret.
    5. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 16: 20
      +7
      And you try, wise guy, refute. I’m both versions of the history of Ukraine from cover to cover. But do you know how to dance something other than hopak?
    6. karbofos
      karbofos April 6 2013 17: 09
      +1
      please refute
  5. avt
    avt April 6 2013 12: 34
    16
    Quote: svp67
    It is really time for Russia to move from defense to offensive in the “historical issue”, our history, this is our history and we have nothing to blame for, for all our mistakes, first of all we paid ourselves with our own blood.

    Yes, I vote for both hands! But first, you need to clean and strengthen your rear. Where will you advance if there is no single history textbook in your own country ?! And when will be and which is not known! request First we must clearly set the guidelines, and only then all those who are ours, to help. And so there will be one turmoil, misunderstandings and insults.
    1. opkozak
      opkozak April 6 2013 15: 44
      10

      Now, history and language should evolve in the right direction. And given the conditions of globalization, then only in this ...
      1. avt
        avt April 7 2013 12: 30
        0
        Quote: opkozak
        Now, history and language should evolve in the right direction. And given the conditions of globalization, it’s only in this ..

        And not the worst option! good laughing Something I did not see that other candidates drawing bagpipes or banduras in such pictures were very worried about historical authenticity and tormented with remorse.
    2. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 16: 47
      12
      Ukraine is the rear.
      Moreover, the most Western, most attacked and most dangerous.

      Incidentally, Poles are also pushing into White Russia.

      Poles, by the way, the very first Russophobian project зWest, and to the emergence of the "Ukrainian nation" which has the most direct relationship.

      Many words in the text most but, alas, everywhere to the place.
    3. Atlon
      Atlon April 7 2013 13: 40
      0
      Quote: avt
      Where will you advance if there is no single history textbook in your own country ?! And when will be and which is not known

      In fact, the Ministry of Education promised a textbook by the next school year ... And then we'll see.
  6. domokl
    domokl April 6 2013 12: 41
    +5
    As always, they didn’t take anything, but they should ... The pain of the author is clear, the offense against Ukraine is clear, the desire for Russia to intervene is clear ... It is not clear only on what basis ... We respect the people, but we respect the law .. . You can intervene only in the affairs of the wife, and even then with a risk to health ...
    And about the results of the Ukrainian education, we got them now ... We got exactly the ideological enemies of Russia .. By inertia we are talking about brotherhood, but, alas, only by inertia ...
    1. A. Yaga
      A. Yaga April 6 2013 15: 36
      +6
      Quote: domokl
      And about the results of the Ukrainian education, we got them now ... We got exactly the ideological enemies of Russia .. By inertia we are talking about brotherhood, but, alas, only by inertia ...

      What kind of brotherhood? This is our people, i.e. it's us! These are our lands! Our people and our lands are in occupation! in captivity! destroyed! And you respect all occupation laws! Correctly, the author screams in pain. We are slaughtered alive, not by inertia.
      . It is not clear only on what basis ..
      1. domokl
        domokl April 6 2013 15: 48
        0
        Quote: A. Yaga
        ? This is our people, i.e. it's us! These are our lands! Our people and our lands are in occupation! in captivity
        Did you yourself understand what you wrote? Who occupied Ukraine? Ukrainians? And you captured yourself? Is it that Russia has been choosing presidents and parliament for 20 years in Ukraine?
        And they started to cut it alive when the Russians (of all nationalities of Russia) began to die under the bullets of Ukrainians, also of all nationalities of Ukraine, and vice versa ... Not a single president personally fought against Russia or Ukraine, we were never at war .. But after military conflicts in the Caucasus, I don’t want to be called the same people with the Ukrainians ... I can’t at the grave of a comrade ... and I don’t want ...
        1. Garrin
          Garrin April 6 2013 17: 47
          +4
          Quote: domokl
          Who occupied Ukraine? Ukrainians?

          Fascists.
        2. Hudo
          Hudo April 6 2013 20: 41
          0
          Quote: domokl
          Did you yourself understand what you wrote? Who occupied Ukraine? Ukrainians? And you captured yourself?



          This, apparently, you did not understand what you yourself wrote! If people on the streets speak Russian, and officials speak only another, foreign language, hire an interpreter to write documents, because current Ukrainian Mova Galitsai sample, has little in common with the one that I taught at school in the USSR. If the Olkhovka rivulet, in which I swam and fished as a kid, is popularly called the same now, and the road sign says "Vilkhivka" (it would be interesting to know for whom?). If the name of my city, the streets in it are written in foreign language --- does it not really remind the inscriptions in German on the same land in the year 1942? If my youngest daughter (2nd grade) is hammered into her head that we are all Ukrainians, and not citizens of Ukraine, and other rubbish and nonsense.
          1. Windbreak
            Windbreak April 6 2013 22: 15
            +2
            If you were to learn the Ukrainian language under the USSR, you would know that Alder will be Ukrainian in Ukrainian. Let’s not exaggerate, the current language is not very different from the one you taught. Dictionaries issued in the Soviet years to help you
            1. Hudo
              Hudo April 6 2013 22: 34
              -3
              Quote: Burel
              If you were to learn the Ukrainian language under the USSR, you would know that Alder will be Ukrainian in Ukrainian. Let’s not exaggerate, the current language is not very different from the one you taught. Dictionaries issued in the Soviet years to help you


              I have some doubts that you, having learned to read, also learned to understand the meaning of what you read. You - about Thomas, and you - about Erema,
          2. domokl
            domokl April 7 2013 06: 16
            0
            Quote: Hudo
            ! If people in the streets speak Russian, and officials speak exclusively in a different, alien language, hire a interpreter to write documents,

            Do not tell me why these same people from the streets choose nationalists to Rada? Why do they sit on the Maidan in support of the thief of the former prime minister? And do not talk about Western Ukrainians ... Today in Ukraine, nationalists and fascists live quietly in the east ...
            It’s somehow not logical .. Judging by the comments, Ukrainians are against joining the EU, against NATO, against integration into Europe ... But according to the results of the vote, everything is the other way around ... According to Russian analysts, now the alignment of desires is about such-32% for rapprochement with Russia (of course, it’s a funny figure for joining), more than 40 (or rather 43-44%) for rapprochement with the EU, the rest have not decided .. Europeans give roughly the same numbers ...
            So, I understand your desire to return what was, but alas ... two times you can’t enter the same river ...
            1. Hudo
              Hudo April 7 2013 10: 49
              -1
              Quote: domokl

              Do not tell me why these same people from the streets choose nationalists in the Rada?


              For the most part, this is a protest vote, and even superimposed on a 20-year brainwashing with Russophobia.

              Quote: domokl
              .Today, in Ukraine, nationalists and fascists live quietly in the east ...


              Well, it’s not so calm, and their number is not so great in the South and East, the stench is true from them a lot. With full indulgence of the current regime.

              Quote: domokl
              It’s somehow not logical .. Judging by the comments, Ukrainians are against joining the EU, against NATO, against integration into Europe ... But according to the results of the vote, the opposite is true ...


              And, personally, does this surprise you? Here, for example, I am very surprised. And all these dimensions, personally, cause little trust in me - in communicating with real people, one thing, in different kinds of cabinet online-tags - is different. And with the informational support of Russia, somehow weakly, what have we already written off to the military in the Kremlin?

              Quote: domokl
              So, I understand your desire to return what was, but alas ... two times you can’t enter the same river ...


              Twice not, but God loves the Trinity !!! Do not sit with your hands folded, but put your tongue deeper into ****.
    2. Luna
      Luna April 6 2013 22: 47
      +1
      Yes, did not intervene, but woke up. They already wrote about the Russian Map, but who will do it? Our diplomatic mission, in my opinion, is in a terrible grudge against its state for such a business trip abroad. They would be to the west ... Therefore, they scored a big bolt for work. I was very surprised by the photos from last year’s celebration on May 9 in Kiev, when after our Mikhail Zurabov’s light did not see the St. George ribbon. Very cool am It looked against the background of a bandera A. Herman, who had a pin not even a yellow-black ribbon adopted in Ukraine, but a St. George ribbon.
      After that, I see no reason to shake the air on the topic of doing nothing to Russia on the Ukrainian front.
  7. Krasnoyarsk
    Krasnoyarsk April 6 2013 12: 44
    10
    Almost every week, local authors pour water on Ukraine and propaganda for the Eurasian Union, but in Ukraine in the 90s they did not kill Russians, did not take away their apartments, and did not squeeze them out of all spheres of life.
    1. densyaophyng
      densyaophyng April 6 2013 15: 22
      +8
      Even as a plus, ask any Russian living in Ukraine if he wants to move, well, for example, to Pskov, or Novgorod.
      1. Krasnoyarsk
        Krasnoyarsk April 6 2013 15: 42
        +6
        I have a huge number of friends of Ukrainians from Lviv, Kiev, Sevastopol, Poltava and so on. NO discrimination!
        1. Garrin
          Garrin April 6 2013 17: 26
          +5
          Quote: Krasnoyarets
          I have a huge number of friends of Ukrainians from Lviv, Kiev, Sevastopol, Poltava and so on. NO discrimination!

          Well, yes, they haven’t driven the plantation yet. And the fact that the Russian language is actually banned (Russian schools are closed), and the fact that our veterans are beaten in Lviv, and pensions are added to Bandera, and the fact that they are fighting against us in all conflicts (Abkhazia, Chechnya, 08.08.08)? And so, yes. There is no discrimination.
          1. porevith
            porevith April 7 2013 12: 06
            +2
            what is the ban ??? You yourself were in Ukraine ???? Look less telly, but read such articles, I’m not living here. And what is the Regular Army of Ukraine or volunteers fighting there ???? As if there were no Russian militants in Chechnya, so that all Russian traitors ???? do not make me laugh. And as for Abkhazia, where the prisoners of war are Ukrainians, And we sold weapons before the conflict (there is also the USSR, so everyone lived in the USSR), you won all Chechnya armed and everything is fine.
        2. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov April 7 2013 06: 39
          0
          Quote: Krasnoyarets
          I have a huge number of friends of Ukrainians

          olrrp
        3. Sevastopol
          Sevastopol April 7 2013 14: 02
          0
          And the fascists in the Rada-what is this? Bandera also do not exist? Yes, this power and country are occupiers. And no other way.
      2. Hudo
        Hudo April 6 2013 20: 51
        -1
        Quote: densyaophyng
        Even as a plus, ask any Russian living in Ukraine if he wants to move, well, for example, to Pskov, or Novgorod.

        And why on earth am I, a Russian, supposed to gather a family and go somewhere? On this earth my grandfather was born, and great-grandfather, and their grandfathers and great-grandfathers - Russian people! And if someone came from beyond the Zbruch River to study, as he thought of a construction lumberjack, but it turned out that he was a plasterer, then let him not shake the rights to the detriment of the rights of others, but carefully study the schedule of trains going west.
    2. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 15: 25
      +1
      I agree that the Ukrainization was softer than in Tashkent Uzbekistan. So ukry were not so strong. Look now at "freedom" - this is a consequence of the fact that Svidomye have grown stronger and obese. If this continues, soon Kiev will be like the capital of Uzbekistan.
      1. Krasnoyarsk
        Krasnoyarsk April 6 2013 15: 42
        -1
        The Svobodovs’s faces are not even remotely similar to the Slavic ones.
        1. Hudo
          Hudo April 6 2013 20: 55
          0
          Quote: Krasnoyarets
          The Svobodovs’s faces are not even remotely similar to the Slavic ones.



          And what surnames are "truly Slavic" !!! laughing Farion, Seh ...
    3. aleksandr1959
      aleksandr1959 April 6 2013 15: 56
      +5
      Thanks for a sober look. But now it’s NOT FASHIONABLE. GlavPut said that, luminium, means luminium .... And he practicing a comfortable old age in Spain, pits the Slavs so that we will spit at each other for about 100 years.
      PS Russian. I live in Nikolaev. NO hom ... on 20 years have not met. When the factories collapsed, they thought they would buy for nothing and launch in the interests of the Russian Federation. Pipes ... Remember, after 20 years, the king will come up with the same werewolf. as labeled. Only smarter.
    4. densyaophyng
      densyaophyng April 6 2013 17: 06
      +7
      Let me be present in the analogy (not to be confused with anal).
      1. yavol
        yavol April 6 2013 17: 21
        -2
        Do not scare the Germans with children at night, there will be enuresis
        1. Hudo
          Hudo April 6 2013 21: 30
          0
          Quote: javol
          Do not scare the Germans with children at night, there will be enuresis


          With your verbal enuresis, you need a special, sharply planed aspen diaper.
    5. yavol
      yavol April 6 2013 17: 20
      -5
      There is no type of parash in Russia
    6. smile
      smile April 6 2013 20: 54
      +2
      Krasnoyarsk
      Now, please tell me, if the author cites facts of distortion of history in the educational programs of Ukraine - why is this watering of parashes? Because it is intolerant? If what the author wrote were sucked out of a finger, then of course it would be so, but are you sure that all of the above is a figment of imagination, and there are no problems in this area?
      My relatives live in Fastov, Kiev and Lubny ... we communicate ... and I would not blame Skif for a lie ... And the fact that in Ukraine the Russians were not really killed and not robbed does not mean that we need joyfully welcome the imposition of a young generation of Ukrainian citizens Russophobic distortions of history .... or, in your opinion, do we need to be silent in a rag in the name of friendship of peoples?
      1. Kars
        Kars April 6 2013 22: 54
        +2
        Quote: smile
        if the author cites facts of distortion of history in educational programs of Ukraine


        He does not give anything. In this case, it is necessary to prove that this is a distortion, and not what happened during the USSR, or the Russian Empire / Commonwealth, etc. has been distorted.
        Then he retells rumors from a third party. He was even shy to name the city where he graduated from school, and according to his profile he is from Yekaterinburg, he is Sverdlovsk if I am not mistaken.

        Of course, I understand that some people hate that our too preoccupied with ukrainism rob Russia of the opportunity to be the birthplace of elephants, but this is not as scary as it seems.
        Quote: Ascetic
        For the first time the term "Ukraine" is found in the Ipatiev Chronicle of 1187 ... "

        For example, from a militant Ascetic, he cited a quote, but did not say whether it is in the Ipatiev Chronicle or not,
        even though most of such antiquity to a light bulb)))) but if YOU hurt.
        1. Ascetic
          Ascetic April 7 2013 03: 36
          +6
          Quote: Kars
          For example, from a militant Ascetic, he cited a quote, but did not say whether it is in the Ipatiev Chronicle or not,
          even to most such old times


          Really, why do the polished euro-peas in which they turn with the help of such textbooks know YOUR HISTORY

          1. Kars
            Kars April 7 2013 14: 34
            +2
            Really, why do the polished euro-peas in which they turn with the help of such textbooks know YOUR HISTORY

            Really? Are you so sure that in the Russian Federation and Ukraine there is a big difference between the desire of students to learn history?

            And yours, which is in your interpretation? And the one that diverges from YOUR OPTION automatically becomes Euroholuy, Turkoholuy, or Polish Kholuy.

            But to the question whether it is true or not in the quote that I took from you, do you hesitate for some reason?
        2. smile
          smile April 7 2013 13: 18
          0
          Kars
          It’s strange, you didn’t notice that all our indignation was directed at your preoccupied ones, but you didn’t forget to kick us with elephants ... you’re smart, how can you? Here, I confess, it's a shame to hear this from you ... it's a shame for you ...
          1. Kars
            Kars April 7 2013 14: 37
            +2
            All our indignation is directed at your preoccupied

            Yes, it doesn’t seem, in my opinion, most of them simply deny such nationality

            It's a shame for you.

            Well, not worth it, they offend me.
  8. djon3volta
    djon3volta April 6 2013 12: 49
    0
    a bit off topic, but read comments))) http://news.tut.by/economics/342690.html
    1. yavol
      yavol April 6 2013 17: 21
      -3
      Reading at night is very harmful - eyes spoil
      1. Hudo
        Hudo April 6 2013 21: 32
        0
        Quote: javol
        Reading at night is very harmful - eyes spoil



        That’s why your Zenki got cloudy from reading Nazi propaganda from Oleg Tyagnysrak at night. fool
  9. Corporal
    Corporal April 6 2013 12: 54
    17
    I studied in Ukraine in 89, 91 years. Eastern Ukraine, Novomoskovsk, near Dnepropetrovsk. Dislike for "zapadentsy" and "natsmen". Even then, my peers were clearly convinced that Ukraine was captured by the Russians and they wanted independence. I tried to find out what the reasons for the discontent were, but I didn’t achieve anything intelligible. I studied at a Russian-language school, and the guys who studied in the Ukrainian gave out pearls and worse.

    I am a citizen of Russia, was born and live in Russia, although a purebred crest. And I am proud of my country, because there is something to be proud of.
    And imagine yourself in the place of a citizen of the Baltic countries, Ukraine, etc. 99% of the great in their history was accomplished during the period of their unity with Russia. But they separated and we must look for new reasons for pride and justification for separation. And the rest is a bunch of stupidities and villains. And we are already used to being proud. What to do?
    1. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 16: 51
      +4
      Explain the phrase they separated .
      US shared - and this is what you need to clearly understand.
      Now they are introducing a "nation of Cossacks" - and this is very alarming and dangerous, in fact.
    2. yavol
      yavol April 6 2013 17: 22
      -9
      He studied poorly once he became mature enough
      1. Corporal
        Corporal April 6 2013 18: 19
        +5
        The corporal is my rank in dismissal from the army. Well, I didn’t serve the sticks =)
        And he studied, yes, not really.
  10. PAC3
    PAC3 April 6 2013 12: 57
    32 th
    The author teach the story). Bandera is written through A, not through E. It is immediately clear how competent the author of this vyser is)))))
    1. Corporal
      Corporal April 6 2013 13: 02
      10
      BandEra is pronounced by ear, and in Ukrainian, the sound E is written as E, and this is how Bender gets it. Find more reasons to expose
    2. omsbon
      omsbon April 6 2013 13: 11
      +2
      Well monument bandere we are not going to bet, but we learn history, we know and remember.
      1. 89501358976
        89501358976 April 6 2013 13: 38
        +7
        carafe or caramel! write a pizyryok and go to sleep laughing
      2. Simon
        Simon April 6 2013 20: 47
        +2
        No, better than Blandner. Sounds nice!
    3. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 15: 27
      -1
      Thanks, I will consider. I don’t have much to write about this.
    4. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 17: 11
      +3
      You, thrice ... races, it would be nice to know the origin of Styopka Bandera.
      And his methods of "strengthening the spirit" suggested by the "senior comrades" (and about these comrades themselves, by the way, too). For some reason, his (stupka) is also remembered as "stupka-cat-dog".
  11. PAC3
    PAC3 April 6 2013 13: 05
    29 th
    There is nothing special to "expose" here. A set of stupid horror stories about "Ukrainian foshists making ritual borscht from Russian babies." ))))))
    Here neighing over the moron author, yes!
    1. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 15: 28
      +6
      The ability to be rude is not a sign of the mind. Write an article - a refutation, and I read.
      1. Mhpv
        Mhpv April 6 2013 15: 31
        +4
        SKIF and RAS3 Toko is rude and knows how
        1. PAC3
          PAC3 April 6 2013 18: 31
          -7
          No, I still understand history a little (this is like a hobby) and understand a little about military technology (it's like a profession).
          And I have not started to be rude yet)))).
          1. smile
            smile April 6 2013 21: 14
            +2
            PAC3
            My God, you did not expect that anywhere in the military equipment they allow hydrocephalus (an association immediately comes to mind - an anecdote about a monkey with a grenade) .. :))))) .. like you are our hobbit .... versed in type stories .... like a professional ..... like a new type of dead end branch of humanity ....... - homo nifiganesapienza ....
    2. smile
      smile April 6 2013 21: 04
      +2
      PAC3
      Hmm, the existence of people like you confirms the veracity of the author of the article ..... by the way, your moronic laughter causes nothing but compassion for your normal compatriots .....
      1. Mhpv
        Mhpv April 6 2013 22: 33
        +2
        PAC3 such as you disgrace for the army and your fate to drag round, square to roll. Had a warrior on such a mountain, who on duty run to the wife of a young lieutenant or plump into a captive with grandfathers, so you are setting out, or rather trying to state your sayings. a country where such warriors and their history are hobbies
  12. Volyna
    Volyna April 6 2013 13: 09
    24
    Quote: Elgato
    Article set of fantasies and phobias. I graduated from high school in 1996 in Ukraine and I can say that the author is balabol. Even somehow lazy to refute this whole lump of absurdities and nonsense and poke the author with his nose into the humus. But if you ask ...

    I don’t know how in Ukraine, but I can say for Moldova. In 1990 he studied in the 10th grade in the city of Bender (now Transnistria). So even then, when the USSR was still existing, we were given textbooks on the history of Moldova of a new type, which said that the Moldavian people never existed, all the Jewish Communists invented it. And there was always only the Romanian people, which is the best on earth (I exaggerate of course, but the meaning is the same) !!! Here is such propaganda, and the younger generation of Moldavians (I myself am Russian) still believes in this. And my grandfather, a veteran who participated in the Iasi-Chisinau operation, said that the Romanians held Moldovans by their cattle.
    So I tend to believe the author
    1. Semurg
      Semurg April 7 2013 08: 34
      0
      Recently, he talked with the Moldovan (Mihai) on the site, at least he wrote it like that, and found out for himself that the Romanians and Moldovans are one people who was divided and lived in different states. And they have a dispute in only one of them is more significant than Moldovans Romanians, roofing felts Romanians are part of Moldova. Well, at the expense of holding the cattle, sometimes it happens that one part of the people keeps the other part of the people in the position of cattle, and almost all peoples passed it.
  13. Mhpv
    Mhpv April 6 2013 13: 13
    +7
    [
    Quote: PAC3
    There is nothing special to "expose" here. A set of stupid horror stories about "Ukrainian foshists making ritual borscht from Russian babies." ))))))
    Here neighing over the moron author, yes!

    here is a jingoistic patriot who has drawn a picture, go chatting on a dating site, girls have a headache or look for same-sex love, you will need it soon in European Ukraine
    1. Tatarus
      Tatarus April 6 2013 13: 43
      0
      Quote: mhpv
      here is a jingoistic patriot who has drawn a picture, go chatting on a dating site, girls have a headache or look for same-sex love, you will need it soon in European Ukraine


      Listen SALAGA follow the bazaar. You are a puppy to talk to reputable people like that. Your comment is an insult. You will also lead the fly away. I certainly know 3 warnings after all.
  14. Conepatus
    Conepatus April 6 2013 13: 14
    -4
    My daughter goes to the 7th grade. At the school they teach not only the Russian language, but also literature. This is about Russophobia. I let her read this epic vyser.
    I read, laughed, twirled my finger at the temple and said that the author was fools.
    The author urgently needs to change the grass. (This is my wish) By the way, this is article 3 about Ukrainian affairs, in 2 days.
    1. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 15: 32
      +5
      It doesn’t seem strange to me that they call me a moron and a fool from Ukraine. It means it was not in vain that he wrote, it means that he pinched Svidomo pichindaly!
      1. Conepatus
        Conepatus April 6 2013 16: 18
        -9
        They called you a fool for writing frank stupidity. But judging by the fact that it doesn’t seem strange to you, I’m not the first one to see it. You are used to seeing other people to evaluate them mentally.
      2. Technocrat
        Technocrat April 6 2013 17: 10
        11 th
        Before writing such nonsense and presenting them as absolute truth, remember that for every word we will hold the answer. By the way, they consider you a fool not only in Ukraine. My son will be 5 soon, but he will be smarter than you.
        1. tupolev-95
          tupolev-95 April 6 2013 19: 42
          +3
          Clever, please answer, who is drawn on a bill of 10 hryvnia?
          1. Conepatus
            Conepatus April 6 2013 19: 53
            -4
            Well, where does Mazepa have to do with it?
            1. tupolev-95
              tupolev-95 April 6 2013 20: 01
              +4
              It must be assumed that the national currency depicts national heroes.
              1. Conepatus
                Conepatus April 6 2013 20: 05
                -8
                As in any normal country. Or should Ukraine coordinate its national heroes with Russia?
                1. tupolev-95
                  tupolev-95 April 6 2013 20: 14
                  +3
                  Well, if Mazepa is a hero for you, then what is the debate about and why should people be called fools. Mazepa, Bandera, Shukhevych - everything is clear. The article does not contain a word of untruth.
                  1. Conepatus
                    Conepatus April 6 2013 20: 20
                    -5
                    For me, Mazepa and everyone else are not heroes. But Ukraine is an independent state. And as an independent state, it has the right to determine its own heroes. And Bandera and Shukhevych do not have the status of a national hero, if they are considered heroes by a couple of thousand citizens of Ukraine, then this their personal affair. They are not obliged, as you incidentally, to coordinate their views and worldview with another state.
                2. Egoza
                  Egoza April 6 2013 20: 24
                  +7
                  Quote: Conepatus
                  Or should Ukraine coordinate its national heroes with Russia?

                  Is Mazepa a national hero? And what are the names of people who first take an oath and then run over to the side of the enemy? In my opinion, traitors! "And since for Ukraine he is a" hero ", it means that the Ukrainian people are completely traitors!" This is how they create a negative image of the country and the people !!!! And who benefits from it?
                  1. Conepatus
                    Conepatus April 6 2013 20: 35
                    -5
                    And if you recall Vlasov, Pavlik Morozov, then who are the Russians?
                    1. tupolev-95
                      tupolev-95 April 6 2013 21: 01
                      +6
                      But I didn’t see something in rubles.
                      1. Conepatus
                        Conepatus April 6 2013 21: 10
                        -6
                        Yes, at least you type Hitler in your own currency. This is your internal affair. I may not like this, but I have no right to tell the other state who is the hero and who is not.
                      2. tupolev-95
                        tupolev-95 April 6 2013 21: 23
                        +4
                        And who points? I asked you a question - you answered. Where are the directions? It was only said above that the article is false and there is nothing like it in Ukraine. But it turns out there is. No indication - a simple statement of fact.
                  2. smile
                    smile April 6 2013 21: 22
                    +4
                    Conepatus
                    Well, we consider Vlasov to be a fighter with the system only scum, who are flustered with your bandarlogs ... we don’t count them better than Bandera’s - they were born in one ditch .... but we won’t argue about Pavlik Morozov - how much can ... the very fact that liberalists and fascists approve of the brutal murder of a teenager testifies to their initial immorality ..... although, of course, if you remember that for Bandera it was the norm ....
                  3. Tambov we ...
                    Tambov we ... April 6 2013 21: 43
                    +1
                    Pavlik Morozov did not betray the country. Parent betrayed. Yes, it’s bad. Is Vlasov put him in a row simply unwise.
                    1. Egoza
                      Egoza April 6 2013 22: 27
                      +3
                      Quote: We are from Tambov ...
                      Pavlik Morozov did not betray the country. Parent betrayed.

                      So, according to the modern, "democratic" way, he acted exactly according to juvenile justice! What are the claims? laughing
                    2. Was mammoth
                      Was mammoth April 6 2013 22: 56
                      +1
                      An article on how history is rewritten. I put a plus. It's the same story with Pavlik Morozov. Together with him, his 8-year-old brother was killed. Also a traitor? The underlying reason is one, denigrating Pavlik, denigrating the "commie". Has anyone thought, what is it like for a boy to oppose adult men. And the last one:
                      "In the spring of 1999, the co-chairman of the Kurgan Memorial Society, Innokenty Khlebnikov, sent on behalf of Arseny Kulukanov's daughter Matryona Shatrakova a petition to the Prosecutor General's Office to review the decision of the Ural Regional Court, which sentenced the teenager's relatives to death. [24] [9] The Russian Prosecutor General's Office came to the following conclusion. : \
                      The verdict of the Ural Regional Court of November 28, 1932 and the determination of the judicial cassation board of the Supreme Court of the RSFSR of February 28, 1933 in relation to Kulukanov Arseniy Ignatievich and Morozova Ksenia Ilinichna change: retrain their actions from Art. 58-8 of the Criminal Code of the RSFSR at st. Art. 17 and 58-8 of the Criminal Code of the RSFSR, leaving the previous sentence. Recognize Sergey Sergeyevich Morozov and Daniil Ivanovich Morozov reasonably convicted in the present case for committing a counter-revolutionary crime and not subject to rehabilitation.
                      The Prosecutor General's Office, which is involved in the rehabilitation of victims of political repression, concluded that the murder of Pavlik Morozov is purely criminal in nature, and the killers cannot be rehabilitated on political grounds. [25] This conclusion, together with the materials of an additional examination of case No. 374, was sent to the Supreme Court of Russia, which decided to refuse rehabilitation to the alleged killers of Pavlik Morozov and his brother Fyodor. "
            2. Corsair
              Corsair April 6 2013 22: 37
              +4
              Quote: Conepatus
              It must be assumed that the national currency depicts national heroes.
              Each nation calls on its heroes, the fact that Ukraine has SUCH like Mazepa is its internal affair. For the last 20 years this state has been wandering in the darkness of its history, stuffing more and more bumps, unsuccessfully trying to find a unifying nation. idea. But alas, in vain. And God will judge them. More important than WHO we raise to the podium and who are proud
              1. Corsair
                Corsair April 6 2013 23: 15
                0
                Dear forum users, something cannot be attached to the image. Is such an attack only with me, or is it a common glitch?
            3. Semurg
              Semurg April 7 2013 08: 53
              +2
              It seems to me that each nation has its own heroes. Mazepa for you is a traitor for Ukrainians, a politician who tried in those conditions to create a national state, playing on the contradictions of the strongest states of Eastern Europe at that time. Here is another example of Stolypin for Russians (most), he is an unconditional hero and statesman .For Kazakhs, on the contrary, he is a person who began a resettlement policy with a massive land allotment among the Kazakhs. Nevertheless, he is a hero for Russians, which I agree with, but for Kazakhs, there is nothing you can agree with. It’s the same for Mazepa. Each nation has its own heroes that we like or not.
    2. yavol
      yavol April 6 2013 17: 23
      -7
      And how to write, since you are a smart person? Moron or stuck?
      1. smile
        smile April 6 2013 21: 24
        0
        yavol
        Well, if you characterize your comments and your personality, then write correctly - go. :)))))
        1. tupolev-95
          tupolev-95 April 6 2013 21: 30
          +1
          One nickname is worth it. Along the way - always ready! (in NATO). Yavol, Mine Führer!
    3. PAC3
      PAC3 April 6 2013 18: 34
      -8
      .This, for example, Kars-Svidomo ??? )))) With a red ensign on the profile picture, admiration for Soviet tanks and dislike for am ???
      1. Garrin
        Garrin April 6 2013 18: 38
        +7
        Quote: PAC3
        admiration for Soviet tanks and dislike for am ???

        Our pilots in Georgia were also shot down by your compatriots. And from Soviet technology, mind you.
        1. PAC3
          PAC3 April 6 2013 18: 59
          11 th
          As Dima Korchinsky used to say (before he got sick and became just a politician) - "in order not to have a front in Crimea, you need to have a front in the Caucasus." I understand that the Russians are not very pleased, but my country matters to me.
          1. Garrin
            Garrin April 6 2013 19: 12
            +3
            Quote: PAC3
            As Dima Korchinsky used to say (before he got sick and became just a politician) - "in order not to have a front in Crimea, you need to have a front in the Caucasus."

            I set the minus. This is your whole vile essence. However, they did not go to war on this front on the Russian side, the creatures are corrupt.
            1. PAC3
              PAC3 April 6 2013 20: 25
              -5
              on the minus, as it were, to give a shit), karmadrocherstvo is fun for youngsters. But as for "did not go to fight on this front on the Russian side," are you, as it were, adequate? In the 1990s, the Russian Federation needed to "hang out" in the Caucasus. And those who lived in Crimea in 1993-96 can confirm how the intensity of the actions of the "russopatriots" decreased during the periods of active hostilities in Abkhazia and Chechnya. The RF was not up to the Crimea and Ukraine. So Korchinsky was cynical, but right.
  15. Egoza
    Egoza April 6 2013 20: 20
    +3
    Quote: Conepatus
    My daughter goes to the 7 class. The school teaches not only Russian, but also literature.

    The grandchild goes to the 8th grade. Russian language - 1 hour per week. Literature - in terms of foreign literature. If this is a "study of language and literature" - then I'm sorry. Compare the number of hours spent in English. (The school is Ukrainian. In Kiev, there are only 600 Russians for 4 schools and you can't get there)
    1. Aeneas
      Aeneas April 6 2013 23: 47
      +4
      Quote: Egoza
      Quote: Conepatus
      My daughter goes to the 7 class. The school teaches not only Russian, but also literature.

      The grandchild goes to the 8th grade. Russian language - 1 hour per week. Literature - in terms of foreign literature. If this is a "study of language and literature" - then I'm sorry. Compare the number of hours spent in English. (The school is Ukrainian. In Kiev, there are only 600 Russians for 4 schools and you can't get there)
      read the instructions from the Minister of Education Dmitry Tabachnik or Vadim Kolesnichenko on how to "open" a Russian class. The parents' request, and you are obliged to ensure the study of Russian. And do not wait for manna from heaven to write later that the Ukrainians are to blame.
      1. xan
        xan April 7 2013 00: 49
        +1
        it’s clear that there are problems with Russian schools
        first pressed, and now instructions write how to open
        Quote: Aeneas
        And do not wait for the manna from heaven to write later that the Ukrainians are to blame.

        Of course not to blame, they wrote the instructions
  • PAC3
    PAC3 April 6 2013 13: 16
    -6
    Quote: mhpv

    here is a jingoistic patriot who has drawn a picture, go chatting on a dating site, girls have a headache or look for same-sex love, you will need it soon in European Ukraine


    First learn your native language so that you can write without glaring mistakes, then write. And it's a shame to read such a "russopatriot"))))
    1. Mhpv
      Mhpv April 6 2013 14: 18
      +6
      So don’t read you were told to go chat on other sites.
      And for your mistakes, look, it’s natural for anyone to make mistakes, but you don’t understand it, you’re from a large, non-fall tongue
    2. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 16: 56
      +6
      Study conditions native to the vast majority of Ukraine, the Russian language to put it mildly, not comfortable .
      Now take a look who is in power - i.e. who benefits.
  • erased
    erased April 6 2013 13: 18
    +2
    that Valuev, who will be appointed ambassador to Kiev, if Klitschko becomes president

    This is a good joke!
    With regards to the Outskirts ... Artificial rarely lives long. Or do not replace constantly.
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 April 6 2013 13: 33
    +3
    The Kremlin and Kiev are undoubtedly enemies of the Russian people of Russia and Ukraine, if they wanted our unity and prosperity, they would have long ago come to an agreement and cooperation.
    Economic problems are caused by the rupture of a single Soviet economic space and the selfish selfish interests of the oligarchs, and all nationalist fuss and the heroization of scum and traitors is one way to strengthen the disunity of peoples.
  • Technocrat
    Technocrat April 6 2013 13: 37
    -6
    In February of this year, my wife and I went to Ukraine, my wife had the first cultural shock - in the west of Ukraine (namely, in the Volyn region) in the cities they speak and understand Russian normally. Nowhere can you see the armed Bandera on the terrible fighting oxen, you can not see the "her" hanged on poles, the second culture shock is broadcast on cable and satellite channels ALL !!!! Russian channels. During the two weeks of our stay, we did not hear a single bad word about the Russians ...... Draw your own conclusions, gentlemen. And I can recommend a good psychiatrist to the author of this opus.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg April 7 2013 09: 09
      -2
      I don’t understand what the technocrats are putting down. The man went to or to Ukraine wrote what he saw and for what the minuses. Probably if I wrote how everything is bad in or in Ukraine then they would put the pluses. Well, I just wanted to find out for myself the Ukrainians is it a part of the Russian people or a separate people. (Instructed the minuses) or a taboo to ask such questions? Well, about the article chernukha which quarrels or parts of one people or very close peoples, well, then think for yourself, decide for yourself to have or not to have (at the expense of the new union of states on the basis of the former USSR.
      1. Technocrat
        Technocrat April 8 2013 17: 09
        0
        As a person born in the USSR, I would like to find myself again and feel like a citizen of a powerful country, but I see that so far these are only dreams. Only a common misfortune or a common enemy can unite us, alas, it is not sad.
  • Makarov
    Makarov April 6 2013 13: 40
    -7
    You and I obviously studied at different schools, because as I myself live in the South-East, I finished Russian and school two years later, and I have not read or heard such nonsense, no one told us this. The only three proposals that I can confirm this - the books changed every year, the Valuevsky circular was presented in this way, and the Ukrainian people were always presented as living under oppression, but there were always two sides, Russia and Poland, NEVER said that only Russia oppressed Ukrainians, ALWAYS two Empires or powers were indicated, so "You must have a snack" (C) and respect the place where you live. "Where do not shit live" (c)
    1. Conepatus
      Conepatus April 6 2013 13: 47
      +1
      Textbooks are now often changed, and not only by history. But this is not because they want to redraw the story, or introduce a new training program. This is an ordinary business. It’s just that some tricky top deputy, or minister, decided to cut the dough on public procurement of textbooks for schools. The quality of such books is mediocre, but the price is naturally the highest.
      1. Makarov
        Makarov April 6 2013 13: 56
        -2
        That's for sure, but all the same then they were offered in an alternative posed of the question - is there a good and new one, and there is an old library for 89 years. They will ask in a new way, but in the old one the same can be learned .... in general, we somehow learned))) As now, I have no idea)
        1. Conepatus
          Conepatus April 6 2013 14: 08
          -1
          Now it's even cooler. They ask a topic that you need to know for the next lesson. In the book, this topic is not originally. There are only 3 answers to the question, "What to do?"
          1 library
          2-internet
          3 private lessons.
          Everyone chooses according to income level.
  • PAC3
    PAC3 April 6 2013 13: 43
    -7
    Hehe.From me in PM demanded specifics.
    Well, "you want songs - I have them")
    About the fact that Bandera is written through A, it’s already said.
    Next, about Valuev. The author of the vyser quotes Valuev trying to show the falsity of the school textbook. But here's the thing, Mr. Valuev not only spoke about the "Little Russian dialect", he issued a circular on which the printing of books in Ukrainian was actually prohibited. It was forbidden to print educational, religious literature in Ukrainian. He did not just speak out - he outright banned it. What they say in Odessa is two big differences). The Valuevsky circular is a historical and irrefutable fact. And the "author" shows either absolute illiteracy in this matter or deliberately distorts the facts.
    1. yavol
      yavol April 6 2013 17: 24
      -4
      Quote: PAC3
      Valuev Circular - a historical and irrefutable fact

      And so he left the ring ...
    2. Egoza
      Egoza April 6 2013 18: 02
      11
      Quote: PAC3
      It was forbidden to print educational, religious literature in Ukrainian. He didn’t just speak out - he explicitly forbade

      Sly a little, dear!
      The reason for the publication of the circular, which appeared at the height of the Polish uprising of the 1863-1864 years, according to the version set out in the document itself, was “purely political circumstances” - an attempt to implement “separatist intentions” “under the pretext of spreading literacy and enlightenment”. According to the original intentions of its author, it was assumed that the action of the circular would be limited exclusively to the period of the Polish uprising, but in practice the circular was valid for many years
      With the beginning of the Polish uprising of 1863, the rebels sent proclamations to the Right-Bank Ukraine, agitators were recruited here, people were inspired by the historical community of the “shamrock” - Poland, Lithuania and Western Russia, promises were made to create an independent Ukrainian state “from the Caucasus to the Carpathians”. To top it off, the program of the rebels, drawn up as far back as 1861, fell into the hands of the Russian government, which included the following lines: “The incurable demagogues need to open a cage for flying to the Dnieper; there is an extensive Pugachev field for our belated Khmelnitsky region. That is what our entire Pan-Slavist and Communist school consists of. That’s all Polish Herzenism! ... Let Russian tsarism replace themselves with anarchy, let them deceive themselves with the motto that this radicalism will serve "for your and our freedom." The government began to consider the Ukrainian movement as separatist and supported by the Poles. The official press organized the persecution of the Ukrainian movement, followed by the arrests of members of Ukrainian communities. But since the authorities tried to use the “Ukrainophiles” in the fight against Polish influence in the region, the repressive measures against them were much milder than against other opponents of the empire, which was recognized by the victims themselves, for example, M. P. Drahomanov
      And fiction books continued to be published, albeit in small quantities. Likewise, plays were staged in theaters as "performances for the people."
  • old rocket man
    old rocket man April 6 2013 13: 47
    14
    Right now a "dialogue" will begin in the form of "clever, clever himself"
    Ukrainian nationalism was born, grew and matured among the so-called "rural intelligentsia" (teachers, doctors, petty civil servants), so it is not surprising that it penetrated, first of all, into the education system.
    The traditional respect of the "villagers" for the "learned" people gave rise to the relative mass character of this phenomenon, and the disdainful attitude of the authorities and the complete absence of counter-propaganda allowed this phenomenon to acquire its present forms.
    THEREFORE, INTERFERING IN THE INTERNAL AFFAIRS OF UKRAINE IS NOT POSSIBLE, but it is necessary to conduct propaganda against the "Nazis", and at the state level angry
    1. Anti
      Anti April 6 2013 13: 53
      0
      [quote] [quote]
      Avatar General of the Army
      Online
      old rocket launcher (5) RU April 4, 2013 11:43 ↑
      - 0 +
      [quote = Asgard] Since we are not gregarious animals like Jews or Caucasians, Anglo-Saxons or Chinese.
      This is a plus, the rest is not indisputable. drinks .... [/ quote] [/ quote]

      wink
    2. yavol
      yavol April 6 2013 17: 25
      -8
      Quote: Old Rocketman
      Now the "dialogue" will begin in the form of "smart guy, smart guy himself"

      Let's start.
      "-Smart ass.
      - The wise guy himself.
    3. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 17: 29
      +9
      I’ll add a touch: the Poles liked to study in malorosy.

      And you know, you know who and who loved to do education and spirituality of the Poles.
    4. Hudo
      Hudo April 6 2013 21: 16
      -1
      Quote: Old Rocketman
      Ukrainian nationalism was born, grew and matured among the so-called "rural intelligentsia" (teachers, doctors, petty civil servants), so it is not surprising that it penetrated, first of all, into the education system.


      You should not bring everything together, there is a real rural intelligentsia - they grow bread as agronomists, teach children as teachers, treat people as medical workers. There is also a pseudo rural intelligentsia - the diploma bought did not make him an intellectual - as he wiped his finger, it continues, and this is its true essence - it is like that.
      1. old rocket man
        old rocket man April 7 2013 01: 33
        0
        Hudo

        In those days when this problem arose, diplomas were not bought, it was a true intelligentsia, who read a lot and sincerely wished good for their people, but she had no idea what their "searches" would lead to, education, like upbringing, does not provide guarantees against mistakes and misconceptions.
  • stalkerwalker
    stalkerwalker April 6 2013 13: 47
    14
    Russia's policy towards the Russian-speaking population of Ukraine is fundamentally wrong.
    It is extremely important to carry out counter-propaganda among Ukrainian youth

    1. Article "plusanul" - article "in the subject", especially in the light of current events. One gets the impression that Ukraine, as a state, is literally "ripped out" from the host of Slavic republics, the CIS in the end.

    2. Seeing the "gestures" of the country's leadership, and the president in particular, you begin to understand that these are not spontaneous events. The Rada, split in two, is a good proof of this.
    Who and how affects what is happening in Ukraine - I personally do not understand. I would like to see an assessment of the situation through the eyes of Ukrainian citizens.

    3. Conducting propaganda or counter-propaganda is late today. The Ukrainian people themselves must decide their fate in legitimate ways.
    But, I'm afraid that the train has left - the nationalist movement and slogans have a semi-official status (the state even says "Yes" more than "No").
    For example.
    In neighboring Belarus and Russia (especially the first), the fight against the "Nazis" is going on more or less successfully. At that time, as in Ukraine, they literally raised the "fifth" column.

    The result of the above.

    In a country where even the assessment of the Great Patriotic War is extremely ambiguous, and the "heroes" of the UPA are elevated to the rank of "national heroes", the question of stability will not even be raised. And the events of recent years are proof of this. Political permanent "mess" smoothly flows into a POTENTIAL political barrack.

    Good luck, Ukrainian brothers and sisters!
    hi
    1. WWW.budanov
      WWW.budanov April 6 2013 13: 57
      +3
      FINE!
      (old teacher)
    2. Conepatus
      Conepatus April 6 2013 14: 03
      0
      Citizens of Ukraine are only concerned about stable work. If you see somewhere a team, or a group of people actively screaming about the ideas of Ukrainian nationalism, this is not evidence that all of Ukraine thinks so. You just saw a group of teachers who are more than yelling slogans are not able to do anything (but to eat hotstsa) They paid, they shout. They did not pay, they actively search for a customer.
      1. yavol
        yavol April 6 2013 17: 26
        -2
        Quote: Conepatus
        Citizens of Ukraine care only about stable work

        No, it's better to lie under a banana with an open mouth.
      2. Hudo
        Hudo April 6 2013 22: 56
        +1
        Quote: Conepatus
        Citizens of Ukraine care only about stable work.


        Stop wagging with your broomstick. If you don't care deeply how your children grow up and who they will grow up, if you have forgotten who you are, and the top of your "dreams" is to somehow fill your womb with a pork syail, roll a glass of muddy and with a trained, perfected throw, throw your carcass on sofa, then you should not generalize so "globally".
  • Sergey_K
    Sergey_K April 6 2013 13: 49
    -1
    Give two articles a day! And the blacks are bigger !!!
    1. yavol
      yavol April 6 2013 17: 26
      -3
      Quote: Sergey_K
      Give two articles a day!

      Give THREE articles a day!
  • WWW.budanov
    WWW.budanov April 6 2013 13: 49
    +4
    The author showed his example: "I remember, in the school library I came across the book" History of the Romanov Family "...
    And, it is even BETTER to process Pikul: "It is worth depriving the people of their memory, and you can twist ropes from it!
    (old teacher)
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker April 6 2013 14: 19
      +6
      Quote: WWW.budanov
      Pikulya: "It is worth depriving the people of their memory, and you can twist ropes from them!

      "Ivans who do not remember kinship" are the leaders of the campaign to "nowhere" ...
  • PAC3
    PAC3 April 6 2013 13: 50
    16 th
    Further. Thesis about the Black Sea Cossack army, which after the liquidation of the Sich "moved" closer to the Caucasus - tore up completely. let the "author" know that they first moved not to the Caucasus, but to the Dniester)))). Geography was also very fond of the "author" at school))))))
    1. A. Yaga
      A. Yaga April 6 2013 15: 48
      +5
      Quote: PAC3
      Further. Thesis about the Black Sea Cossack army, which after the liquidation of the Sich "moved" closer to the Caucasus - tore up completely. let the "author" know that they first moved not to the Caucasus, but to the Dniester)))). Geography was also very fond of the "author" at school))))))

      It seems that the author writes the absolute truth: Kuynia was in the textbooks, each year is different. He has one, PAC3 is different.
      1. PAC3
        PAC3 April 6 2013 18: 35
        -4
        I generally studied at the Soviet school according to Soviet textbooks)))
        1. Hudo
          Hudo April 6 2013 21: 23
          +1
          Quote: PAC3
          I generally studied at the Soviet school according to Soviet textbooks)))



          Apparently your studies did not go. As the saying goes, not in horse feed.
  • ochakow703
    ochakow703 April 6 2013 13: 51
    +5
    Just don't say, "It's high time for Russia ..." or "Russia should ...". What it is high time for Russia to do is to spit on all this rabble, and there is no need to pull all this garbage into friendship. And about debts ... so if you think about it, we owe half the world, and we owe nothing to anyone. My pearl has one small, but weighty clarification - simple brothers do not belong to outcasts at all, but for the most part they are normal guys and girls.
    1. A. Yaga
      A. Yaga April 6 2013 15: 56
      +5
      Quote: ochakow703
      Just don't say, "It's high time for Russia ..." or "Russia should ...". What it is high time for Russia to do is to spit on all this rabble, and there is no need to pull all this garbage into friendship. And about debts ... so if you think about it, we owe half the world, and we owe nothing to anyone. My pearl has one small, but weighty clarification - simple brothers do not belong to outcasts at all, but for the most part they are normal guys and girls.

      Just do not need to consider the current Russia a full-blooded Russia, when a third of its people, along with Russian lands abroad. Are there so many of us to scatter our people? And no we are not brothers - WE ARE ONE PEOPLE!
    2. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 17: 22
      +7
      Give away such pieces of Russia with the words "yes spit" - you will spit all over Russia. Look - the Cossacks have already formed as a nation. A couple more steps - and they too will become Muslims and Russophobes. As the current "Ukrainians".
  • Algor73
    Algor73 April 6 2013 13: 57
    -7
    The author has clearly overdone it. My sister is a history teacher, I have all the textbooks - but I haven't found one. If you remember 1996, then many still lived in the Union, and this could not have happened at all. After 2004, maybe the teachers made some deviations depending on their political views. But earlier - no. I don’t know who benefits from it, but for some reason they want to humiliate Ukraine. I am more than sure that the author has never been to Ukraine, either in Eastern or Western. Well, God be his judge, this "brother-Slav".
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker April 6 2013 14: 28
      +7
      Quote: Algor73
      I have a history teacher sister, all the textbooks are there - but I haven’t found one

      I don’t know how many times a year textbooks in Ukraine are reprinted.
      I can judge by Russia - every year I bought (and continue to buy) NEW editions of the same textbook - although this is more of an economic factor.
      And, if, for Physics, Mathematics and Chemistry, laws and rules are almost eternal, then the question of HISTORY largely depends on the person WHO, WHERE and HOW the material teaches ...
      Agree - the "new" heroes of Ukraine did not "emerge" by themselves, just mentioning in the press such an effect cannot be achieved.
      hi
      1. Algor73
        Algor73 April 6 2013 14: 34
        -8
        I completely agree with you, but nevertheless, the author claims that he studied in Southeastern Ukraine, where even now the majority of the population is pro-Russian. If I said that in Western Ukraine, the bulo would be more believable. I’m leading to the fact that it’s become custom-made, just to inflate the bad excitement.
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker April 6 2013 15: 03
          10
          Quote: Algor73
          I’m leading to the fact that it’s become custom-made, just to inflate the bad excitement.


          Guys ...

          How can you "order" enduring pain for your COMMON country?
        2. Misantrop
          Misantrop April 6 2013 18: 31
          11
          Quote: Algor73
          If I said that in Western Ukraine, the bulo would be more believable

          Just the very heat of propaganda is precisely in the southeast. For example, having arrived in Crimea, try to find at least one Russian-language VHF radio station. You will not find, they are not. As in no other Crimean pharmacy, you will not find medicines with an annotation in Russian. Although in all other areas - bilingual. It seems to be a trifle, but ...
          1. Hudo
            Hudo April 6 2013 21: 27
            +1
            Quote: Misantrop
            Quote: Algor73
            If I said that in Western Ukraine, the bulo would be more believable

            Just the very heat of propaganda is precisely in the southeast. For example, having arrived in Crimea, try to find at least one Russian-language VHF radio station. You will not find, they are not. As in no other Crimean pharmacy, you will not find medicines with an annotation in Russian. Although in all other areas - bilingual. It seems to be a trifle, but ...

            By the way, even the announcers on the "RUSSIAN radio", for some reason, rummage on the move.
            1. Misantrop
              Misantrop April 6 2013 22: 53
              +1
              Quote: Hudo
              By the way, even the announcers on the "RUSSIAN radio", for some reason, rummage on the move.

              Not "for some reason", but in accordance with the strictest indicating threatened closure. And HOW entrepreneurs, who are FORBIDDEN to advertise in Russian, howl (and in Ukrainian, instead of stimulating a purchase, it causes a strictly opposite process) ...
            2. Aeneas
              Aeneas April 6 2013 23: 56
              +1
              oh, sorry I didn’t read it. winked A few words in Ukrainian in the news, do not cause heartburn?
          2. Aeneas
            Aeneas April 6 2013 23: 54
            +1
            and in Kivev there are no VHF radio stations in Ukrainian ... Of course, almost none :-) And the most popular: "Ruusskoe radio, Everything will be fine!"
    2. FC SKIF
      April 6 2013 15: 36
      +3
      Do you need to show a photocopy of the old Ukrainian passport?
      1. Aeneas
        Aeneas April 6 2013 23: 58
        0
        in my Ukrainian passport all info is in two languages: Russian and Ukrainian. Of course a little annoying, sho in the Ukrainian passport sho something is written on a certain Mov! wassat
  • zart_arn
    zart_arn April 6 2013 14: 26
    +1
    [quote = Gecko] I’ll tell you this Dear, the story is as you like and interpret.

    Great Russia, Little Russia, Belarus.
    In the end, these three Rus united under the rule of the Horde Volga dynasty into one state.
    Only after this unification the Moscow Grand Dukes began to be called the Sovereigns of All Russia.

    What kind of historical news is this about the Horde Volga dynasty.
    Do you know that the Belorussian ethnos generally formed only in the 17th century, when the Horde was no longer in sight, and Yermak Timofeevich (died in 1585) had already joined Siberia.
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker April 6 2013 15: 17
      +4
      Quote: zart_arn
      these three Rus united under the rule of the Horde Volga dynasty in one state.


      An original vision of the history of Russia laughing

      It's all the same "plus"
      hi
  • Urrry
    Urrry April 6 2013 14: 37
    +8
    I don’t know how much the author is right about the Ukrainian history textbooks - I didn’t read them (and I see different opinions in the comments) - but the Russian history textbook on Russia recently read to my daughter (like a short course book, they read it in grade 9). I was shocked .. :)
    And after that reading, I think that it is more important to first take up your own, domestic textbooks. There such "anti-Russian" things are written to which no Benderaite would think of ... so we would have to deal with our "textbook authors" for a start, with our "directors" and "writers", at home there is still an endless edge of struggle for historical truth.
    And so - what can we offer Ukraine instead of their "history textbooks" criticized in the article? Our own, Russian, those that we now print for our students? God forbid, from that "Russia" that is presented in our textbooks he himself would have fled to the European Union out of fear .. :)
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker April 6 2013 15: 20
      +6
      Quote: UrRRy
      There such "anti-Russian" things are written to which no Benderaite would think of ... so we would have to deal with our "textbook authors" for a start, with our "directors" and "writers", at home there is still an endless edge of struggle for historical truth.


      So we have to "teach" our children the "correct" interpretation of the past and what is happening - I see no other way out yet.
    2. cherkas.oe
      cherkas.oe April 6 2013 15: 57
      +2
      Quote: UrRRy
      .so that we would have to deal with our "textbook authors" for a start, with our

      And what about Ukraine, that in Russia the authors are the same, the sons of Turkish subjects, Bender or Badera. In general, horseradish radish is not sweeter.
    3. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 17: 07
      +4
      That's it. So you can rely on the opinion of the author of the article - the situation is exactly as he wrote.
      GDP has only recently taken care of the contents of a history textbook for Russia. No matter how late.
  • TekhnarMAF
    TekhnarMAF April 6 2013 15: 07
    +2
    So I read the article, scanned the comments and became a stupor! Well, what about you, as in a communal apartment, divide the queue into a latrine! Yes, we don’t have any differences - those who are interested in finding the differences want the powers that be! Ordinary people will never become ENEMIES, NEVER. no matter how interested those try, on either side, even if they are helped from outside!
  • Alikovo
    Alikovo April 6 2013 15: 16
    0
    Ukraine followed the path of desecration of the history of Russia after the west.
    1. Kars
      Kars April 6 2013 15: 26
      +4
      Quote: Alikovo
      about the way of desecrating the history of Russia


      I don’t understand one thing. Why do you assign to YOURSELF the RIGHT to the HISTORICAL Truth?

      Under the USSR, Nikolai 2 Romanov was Nikolai the Bloody and a tyrant, under the Russian Federation he was cononized. Moreover, he is a close relative of Kaiser Germany and the current Queen of England.

      Kolchak was not remembered by anyone, but a bad counter-revolutionary - now he is called the warship of the Russian Navy.

      how so? which story is right?
      Most of the guests here studied under the USSR, but I had the Primer of the USSR, with a mausoleum, and 15 pairs in national clothes of the republics.
      1. Krasnoyarsk
        Krasnoyarsk April 6 2013 15: 49
        -2
        There are no heroes or traitors in the Civil War; there will be more blood on red than on white.
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker April 6 2013 16: 02
          +7
          Quote: Krasnoyarets

          There are no heroes or traitors in the Civil War, there will be more blood on red than on white


          And they drag us there, slowly and confidently.
          Only now they will be distinguished not by color, but by geography - remember the history of the Slavic war in Yugoslavia - and there appeared "bad, wrong", uncivilized Slavs together with "victims" ...

          The finale, as basked, is known ....
        2. PAC3
          PAC3 April 6 2013 18: 38
          -8
          Now think that the events in Western Ukraine in 1944-1954 were almost a civil war.
          1. tarks
            tarks April 6 2013 20: 01
            +4
            In part - it was.
            From which part it is very easy to see, if you ask a question - whose money contained all these "heroes".
            By the way, the question is - why did the "bloody gebnya" allow the "UPA veterans" to survive?
            Threat.
            In Syria now - also a civil war in part. Exclusively in the sense that contradictions between citizens are created and used for the purposes of non-citizens.
          2. Garrin
            Garrin April 6 2013 20: 21
            +2
            Quote: PAC3
            Now think that the events in Western Ukraine in 1944-1954 were almost a civil war.

            Where did the civil war come from? Continuation of the Second World War, the destruction of unfinished fascist trash, which did not lay down arms.
            1. PAC3
              PAC3 April 6 2013 20: 51
              -1
              Why not a civil war? Citizens of one state are fighting, and quite numerous - just look at the summaries of the NKVD and the MGB on these events, there we are talking about hundreds of thousands of active supporters of the OUN-UPA.
              and "unfinished fascist trash" is a convenient propaganda cliche, no more,
        3. Aloger1
          Aloger1 April 7 2013 01: 26
          +1
          this is still a question, read the "History of the Civil War". I have nothing against both of them. All of them are ours.
    2. Urrry
      Urrry April 6 2013 18: 00
      +3
      It seems to me that not a single Ukrainian history textbook will be able to turn Ukrainians away from Russia more than the "Russian" film "Citadel" ... I repeat once again: our, Russian authors and directors with their "works" push away from Russia not only neighboring countries and peoples - they kill any self-esteem, even among the Russians themselves ... that's what you need to fight first of all! Not a single pro-Russian history textbook can cope with such "films" later ... after all, no matter how cautious attitude towards the USA was formed in the Soviet school, Hollywood films still created a rather positive image of them among the masses in the early 90s. So both the correct history of Russia and the correct image of Russia can be formed outside of Ukrainian history textbooks - if at least within Russia itself we begin to do this. Otherwise, it’s nonsense: well, let's say Ukraine publishes a "pro-Russian textbook, but schoolchildren, seeing" Russian "films like" Citadel ", will still shy away from it ... :(
  • Avenger711
    Avenger711 April 6 2013 15: 48
    -2
    Such articles should be repeated once a week.
  • vostok1982
    vostok1982 April 6 2013 16: 03
    10
    I live in Ukraine. I graduated from the school in 2000. I can testify - the article is absolutely true. I live in the town where the nuclear power plant - everyone speaks Russian. But in schools they teach in Ukrainian. As a result, children grow up stupidly illiterate. It is time for New Russia to return to Russia. This is a matter of survival - if the south and east of Ukraine do not return to the Russian Federation, then this flourishing and rich Russian region will turn into Africa.
  • treskoed
    treskoed April 6 2013 16: 12
    0
    Ukraine, like Russia, countries with unpredictable ... PAST!
    1. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 17: 35
      +4
      in fact - everything is very clear.
      just compare any Soviet or imperial twenty years with
      last twenty + years.
    2. A. Yaga
      A. Yaga April 8 2013 22: 28
      0
      Quote: treskoed
      Ukraine, like Russia, countries with unpredictable ... PAST!

      Chu. Yes, there’s one country.
  • radar75
    radar75 April 6 2013 16: 34
    -8
    Quote: FC Skiff
    It doesn’t seem strange to me that they call me a moron and a fool from Ukraine. It means it was not in vain that he wrote, it means that he pinched Svidomo pichindaly!


    Well no. Tі is wrong. Just tired of all the crap that people like you carry. TIRED !!!. All this is Crap. Those who write it either, or a custom article.
    For the Russians. Gentlemen, rummage through Ukrainian sites. Especially for those that are positioned as electronic ZMI. There is an option in Russian. Do not shed, read. I recommend - Ukrainian Truth, Mirror of the Week, Correspondent, etc.
    1. Garrin
      Garrin April 6 2013 17: 29
      +4
      Quote: radar75
      For the Russians. Gentlemen, rummage through Ukrainian sites.

      In the garbage can not rummage.
    2. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 17: 32
      +3
      ... and other rubbish contained on dubious money for the separation and destruction of Ukraine.
      you, by the way, have already been killed. if you were alive.
    3. Imperial
      Imperial April 6 2013 17: 41
      +5
      The Censor is especially pleased No. It seems that this resource has received the task of splitting Ukraine. The message is simple, like a chopped orange - Donbass and Putin personally, who leads the horde of always drunk ugofinomvordin, are to blame for all the troubles of Ukraine.
      1. tarks
        tarks April 6 2013 18: 02
        0
        The right feeling.
  • Omich
    Omich April 6 2013 18: 00
    -9
    fool dear participants in the dialogue. it seems that the author of this article is an ordinary balamut who became bored and decided to have fun. i finished school in 95. the city of Izmail. this nonsense about which the author writes was not taught. moreover, the reviews were always positive. served in Kiev 95 -97 and did not hear anything negative about Russia. Our brigade guarded the General Headquarters of military unit a-0139. Among the top command personnel, this was not observed either. And by the way. 90% of the command personnel spoke Russian and regretted the collapse of the union !!! the top of the most influential lords from the Verkhovna Rada danced the hapak to the tune of the West. That is why the end of the union has come. And people like you "respected author" are trying to throw mud at those and those who are you to judge !!!! friendship was and will be !! ! drinks pisarchuk troublemaker for soap !!! negative
    1. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 18: 14
      +6
      You, not a shit, still ask a question. a little more serious.
      For the seed - in the Supreme Rada of Ukraine now - there is a nationalist party of the fascist persuasion - "freedom". This - thanks to history textbooks - as well. And, I suppose, thanks to modern history textbooks in Russia, this is also your position. If you are Russian at all.
      1. Conepatus
        Conepatus April 6 2013 18: 22
        -1
        The Svoboda party got into the Rada only because the people are already tired of both the "orange" and the "regionals". The people are ready to vote for anyone, if only they put things in order and this mess in the country ends. This has nothing to do with history. ...
        1. tarks
          tarks April 6 2013 19: 28
          +6
          Conpatus,
          "svoboda" got into the Rada only because a very large part of Ukraine, which the PR "threw" just did not go to the polls - this time.
          in absolute terms, the number of voters for freedom has not increased significantly, but symptomatically - these are two.
          the concept "if only they put things in order" has a direct relation to history - these are three. special "if only"
      2. Good man
        Good man April 6 2013 19: 12
        -2
        Quote: tarks
        For the seed - in the Supreme Rada of Ukraine now - there is a nationalist party of the fascist persuasion - "freedom". This - thanks to history textbooks - as well.

        This is because it is the only ideological party in Ukraine. Ideas can be treated differently. But she has no representatives of the oligarchs in the parliament, the leadership does not live in mansions and does not drive Lexus and Caens like the same "communists". Only ideological ones are collected for rallies and actions and not for 50-100 UAH like everyone else. Plus social projects at the local level. Plus not the readiness of the other opposition for a real fight. This is where the popularity comes from. My father voted for freedom, although he is unlikely to say a few words in Ukrainian. It's just that all other parties do not correspond 100% to the declared content.
        1. tarks
          tarks April 6 2013 19: 32
          +4
          to ideЕ really can be treated differently.
          That is why the equalization of Hitler and Stalin - chewing gum for those preparing for the war for the resources of Russia.
        2. tupolev-95
          tupolev-95 April 6 2013 21: 50
          +2
          Vote further and they will have everything - and Lexus and Caen.
        3. Egoza
          Egoza April 6 2013 22: 37
          +1
          Quote: Good man
          At rallies and actions they collect only ideological and not for 50-100 UAH like everyone else.

          Well, don't tell it! They pay like the rest. Especially when the whole "oppa" gathers together a rally!
          Quote: Good man
          Plus social projects at the local level.

          Is this an addition of pensions to OUN_UPA veterans? So that they receive more than the veterans of the Second World War? "Great" social projects. If there are other projects, please indicate specifically. I'd be glad to know.
        4. Luna
          Luna April 6 2013 23: 03
          0
          What other social projects at the local level, other than how to put Bandera’s head on Lenin’s torso due to lack of money, but to raise the pension for UPA soldiers? Lviv as it was sniffed, so it is. Ternopol is drowning in trash, and drowning. They covered a little shame before Euro 2012, and then with Kiev money and under the supervision of Kiev, that's all.

          Do you think that “Freedom” is eager for power with such frenzy? Just because the Carpathian fights, which once became the core of the OUN (b), and now created the VO "Freedom", want to establish their dominance over Little Russia? Not only. Among other things, Lviv, Ternopol and Ivano-Frankivsk are well aware that, only having established control over the Russian Ukrainian, Galicia will be able to live in prosperity and comfort. This is a matter of political domination and money. That is why the Galicians captured Kiev. After all, the mother of Russian cities is the key to establishing her dominance over the “pits” and “skidnyakams” in all senses of the word. This is the real essence of modern Ukrainian, or rather Galician, nationalism. For the heirs of the OUN, we are consumable anthropological material, the lower race that should lie in the foundation of the so-called Great Ukraine.
          This is Vajra and I completely agree with him.
      3. Omich
        Omich April 6 2013 19: 20
        +1
        I’m Russian, but I’ve lived for 10 years in Ukraine. And these parties are in parliament. So the more they support, the bigger they become. In Russia, I didn’t hear that they rolled a barrel to Ukraine. And you have gangs of seniors trying to embroil the fraternal peoples and pour slops. by the way in our textbooks there is no heresy !!! hi
        1. tarks
          tarks April 6 2013 19: 51
          +1
          romanized "Omich",
          a gang of senile people just promoted the meme "fraternal peoples" (supposedly my left hand is fraternal with my right) - once.
          you write the word Russia with a small letter - two.
          1 + 2 - three.
        2. Good man
          Good man April 6 2013 20: 03
          -7
          Quote: Omich
          .in Russia, I have not heard that they rolled the barrel to Ukraine.

          laughing Have you not watched federal channels and Russian films about Ukraine, like "White Guard" for 15 years?
          You can write anything, but we see it every year: in any Russian propaganda: we are stupid and greedy or, at best, ridiculous. For its own money, the Russian Federation is digging a gulf between Ukrainians and Russians.
          Quote: Omich
          By the way, there is no heresy in our textbooks !!!

          Well, of course, your story is the only true earth on the planet. We did not expect another answer ...
          1. Luna
            Luna April 6 2013 23: 06
            -1
            Uh-huh.
            Entot wedge was driven back in the USSR, when the first version of the White Guard was shot. By the way, the current one does not suit her.
    2. Semurg
      Semurg April 7 2013 09: 35
      0
      Here is another balanced comment where a person writes that not everything is so bad in or in Ukraine and that the article is chernukha and then he gets a lot of minuses. If he wrote that everything would be bad, he would get a bunch of pluses. After reading the article and komenty Ukrainians will probably start even more to think about entering into an alliance with Russia. Well, if the story or assessment of certain events does not coincide, well then it is the story of a neighboring people, you write your story for yourself.
      1. Egoza
        Egoza April 7 2013 10: 59
        +1
        Quote: Semurg
        Well, if the story or assessment of certain events does not coincide, well then it is the story of the neighboring people, you write your story for yourself.

        Dear Sagat! If a dispute about history was going on between the peoples of two states - the Russian Federation and Ukraine, then your attitude would be fair. The trouble is that in Ukraine itself, the population's opinion on historical events and their assessment are diametrically opposed. We have, as it were, "two peoples in one." "Westerners" gravitate towards Europe, and support neo-Nazis (not all, of course). "Easterners" agree more with the Russians. And between all of them there is a layer that does not care about history, and the most important thing is now to find their own warm place. And for this, they will adjoin the side that can guarantee this "place". They will agitate and shout for him the loudest.
        1. Semurg
          Semurg April 7 2013 14: 38
          0
          Dear Sagat! If a dispute about history was going on between the peoples of two states - the Russian Federation and Ukraine, then your attitude would be fair. The trouble is that in Ukraine itself, the population's opinion on historical events and their assessment are diametrically opposed. We have, as it were, "two peoples in one." "Westerners" gravitate towards Europe, and support neo-Nazis (not all, of course). "Easterners" agree more with the Russians.
          Thank you Elena finally finally intelligently explained that the Ukrainians are two peoples, or rather one people that is divided and the main question is whether they are Russian or not (hence the division into Westerners and Easterners). And then I all thought that they decided that they were Ukrainians, and Russians abroad they tell them who to be. Yes, it’s probably painful because it’s the main question who-I’m cutting.
  • Egoza
    Egoza April 6 2013 18: 14
    +5
    At present, both Russian and Ukrainian historians (with rare exceptions) write what is prescribed by the political authorities. And, by the way, they cannot decide to write a general history textbook. Although there was such a project. However, then many of the achievements of the USSR will have to be recognized, and this already goes against the current capitalist (excuse me) states. The oligarchs will not allow it! Well, in addition, as an example:
    "Azarov called the Communist Party of Ukraine, "Svoboda" and "Batkivshchyna" agents of the Kremlin belay
    Opponents of shale gas production in Ukraine defend Russia's interests.
    This was stated by Ukrainian Prime Minister Mykola Azarov at a meeting with US Deputy Secretary of State Wendy Sherman in Kiev, RBC reports.
    According to Azarov, the Freedom movement, the Communist Party of Ukraine and the Fatherland joined forces against a government project to develop shale gas in the country. As the prime minister noted, in fact, they are “agents of the Russian Federation”.
    Azarov also recalled that shale gas is successfully produced in many countries, including the United States. According to him, Ukraine is aware of the possible environmental risks during the production of this gas and will take all measures to minimize them. "
    http://polemika.com.ua/news-113140.html
    xxxxx
    So in the next history textbook there will be a whole chapter on how Russia created these parties in spite of Ukraine and hindered the prosperity of Ukraine! laughing
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker April 6 2013 21: 59
      +5
      Quote: Egoza
      So in the next history textbook there will be a whole chapter on how Russia created these parties in spite of Ukraine and hindered the prosperity of Ukraine!


      Madam, take off my hat ...
      I sincerely worry about everything that is happening now in Ukraine
      hi
    2. Semurg
      Semurg April 7 2013 09: 55
      -2
      It will be very difficult to write a common story without being in one state. Each nation has its own heroes and its own interpretation of events, it is difficult to find and agree on common heroes. But writing one point of view and introducing it into the school curriculum without hard dictatorship of one of the parties above the other will fail either. There is only one way out to know your story, but keep in mind that the neighbors have their own history and their own interpretation of the same events where the hero of one side is a traitor to the other side. For example, we have Kazakhs if he is a batyr for one part of the Kazakhs, for the other part he can be a barytmach .
  • Good man
    Good man April 6 2013 18: 18
    -8
    He graduated from school in Kiev in 98godu. In each class there were 2-3 versions of a history textbook on hand. The subject itself did not fit in the allotted hours - everything was taught at a gallop in three or four chapters (sometimes a section), you read it yourself, one understood the lesson. Everything is casual and on key dates. The content of the textbooks was approximately the same. Events of 17-20 years - Ukrainian statehood was destroyed by Poles and soviets. For 39-45 years, Ukrainians in the SA and OUN-UPA fought for different options for the future of Ukraine. They could not defend their statehood because of the Germans and the same advice. Between the lines it was read that 2MB was also civilian for Ukrainians. And that the West (Germans and Poles) and the Russians (RI, USSR) and those who roam here and because of which the Ukrainians are fighting against each other in different armies in wars they do not need are to blame. And all because the Ukrainians did not have their own state, and now they have ... Something like that, but it has long been and is already difficult to remember.
    The author’s article is a set of common horror stories and distortions as with the Valuev circular. Schools teach the fact that he banned, not what he said. Well, as for the national myths, as the author writes about the Cossacks ... then there is such an increase in the history of any country. I did not read Russian textbooks, but I read Soviet books from the library. And delirium and ridiculous in them no less. I’m sure in the Russian Federation this can be found in textbooks.

    Jesus Christ was Ukrainian, according to another version, he studied in his youth in western Ukraine, and later the Jews misinterpreted the whole truth about him. Understand that all of his virtues would not have manifested, had he not known for the “broad" of the Ukrainian soul.

    And this author’s nonsense is generally beyond the reasonable. After that, there’s no further reading. Either the paid propagandist article, or another bowel movement Ukrainophobe ...
    1. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 18: 37
      +3
      Between the lines it was read that 2MB for Ukrainians ...


      It is always necessary to keep in mind that at that time "Ukrainians" as an ethnos, and not as a geographical concept, were something exotic, and that the concept of "Ukrainians are a brotherly people" and "Mova" were hammered into their heads precisely under Soviet rule - the fact that the consciousness of Svidomo simply "slips".

      The concepts of "mova" and "Ukrainian people" were very willingly used by Goebbels' propaganda. Bonists are very interested in the German karbovans of the occupation period.
      If we correlate this fact with the plans for the “Ukrainians” of the “true Aryans” - then the result of this correlation breaks all the templates of Svidomo - and therefore they “slip” so as not to become patients.
      1. Good man
        Good man April 6 2013 19: 43
        -7
        Quote: tarks
        It is always necessary to keep in mind that at that time "Ukrainians" as an ethnos, and not as a geographical concept, were something exotic, and that the concept of "Ukrainians are a brotherly people" and "Mova" were hammered into their heads precisely under Soviet rule - the fact that the consciousness of Svidomo simply "slips".

        Well, yes ZUNR and UNR were exotic, like the war of the Poles and the USSR with them.
        The USSR had no choice but to lead, what could no longer be officially banned by the next Valuev Circular. And even after the 20s, almost all of this Soviet Ukrainian elite was repressed in the 30s.
        Quote: tarks
        The concepts of "mova" and "Ukrainian people" were very willingly used by Goebbels' propaganda. Bonists are very interested in the German karbovans of the occupation period.

        Gebels' propaganda also used the concept of "Russian people" and "Jewish communists" and so what?
        Quote: tarks
        If we correlate this fact with the plans for the “Ukrainians” of the “true Aryans” - then the result of this correlation breaks all the templates of Svidomo - and therefore they “slip” so as not to become patients.

        The Germans had only plans, and the USSR already had a rich portfolio:
        - famine 33years
        - collectivization
        - repression of 37-39 years
        On the one hand, plans on the other ...
        1. Avenger711
          Avenger711 April 6 2013 19: 50
          +3
          Another bruised ...
        2. tarks
          tarks April 6 2013 20: 17
          +1
          X h, 19:43,
          Now combine your text with the OBLIGATORY MOV training in the Ukrainian SSR and with the history of the formation of the canonical "Ukrainian language" and the personalities involved in this event. you can start with Lazar Moiseevich Kaganovich, for example.

          about your portfolio ... just try to take it critically - check the sources and compare it with the world around you at that time.
          1. Good man
            Good man April 6 2013 21: 06
            -3
            Quote: tarks
            now combine your text with MANDATORY teaching of mov in the Ukrainian SSR

            Quote: Good man
            The USSR had no choice but to lead, what could no longer be officially banned by the next Valuev Circular.

            Quote: tarks
            and with the history of the formation of the canonical "Ukrainian language" and the personalities involved in this event. you can start with Lazar Moiseevich Kaganovich, for example.

            Take an interest in Ukrainian folk songs, thoughts, sayings and carols of at least left-bank Ukraine. Which for 300 years was part of the Republic of Ingushetia. And do not write this heresy about the fact that agents of the Austro-Hungarian General Staff and even more so Kagonovich traveled around the Poltava province of the Republic of Ingushetia and learned its folklore with the people. Well, think with your own brains at least once, and do not repeat after others. 30 million people at the beginning of the 20th century and the mass of Ukrainian folklore. Of course there were very few books. See Valuev Circular. But folk art across Ukraine, even in the most remote villages, cannot be counted. And they are hundreds of years old.
            Quote: tarks
            Do you regret not becoming a German?
            I assure you, according to these plans, you would not have a chance to even live up to today's conversation.
            Anyway - to be born.

            I am Ukrainian and do not regret hi
            Most of my relatives died of starvation and were repressed until 1941. The Germans did not have much left. The fact that my ancestors survived a miracle and an accident. Without exaggeration.
            1. tarks
              tarks April 6 2013 21: 43
              +1
              I am familiar with the content of modern ukrouchebnikov.
              As for folklore, there are a lot of it and the most diverse in Russia.
              South Russia is no exception.
            2. Imperial
              Imperial April 6 2013 23: 34
              +1
              I read your comments "Good man", I'm sorry, but! for me you are a bad radish man.
        3. tarks
          tarks April 6 2013 20: 22
          +2
          The Germans had only plans,

          Do you regret not becoming a German?
          I assure you, according to these plans, you would not have a chance to even live up to today's conversation.
          Anyway - to be born.
  • Urrry
    Urrry April 6 2013 18: 20
    0
    ... in general, the history of Ukraine is very complex and tragic, contradictory and difficult to describe in any textbooks. Once the "center of the Russians" had turned out to be weak in the subsequent geopolitical whirlwind due to historical fate. But Ukrainians love their land no less than Russians love Russia. Inside Russia itself, Ukrainians often feel a disdainful and derogatory attitude towards themselves: "little crops", etc. ... all this is looking for a way out for self-respect, unfortunately, often finding it in some fantastic ideas, far-fetched "extolling" Ukraine, pouring out into sly shift of emphasis in historical processes ... these perversions in self-identification - on the part of Russia cause a corresponding rejection, because we are more accustomed to think that Ukrainians are "our own, brothers-Slavs", but still somewhat less worthy of "historical glory" than "Slavs -Russian ". It takes very fine work of both historians and sociologists, and perhaps even psychologists in order to find formulations of the general idea of ​​Russia-Belarus-Ukraine, which do not offend any of this holy trinity of truly fraternal states and peoples ... otherwise we can really disperse like ice floes in high water and it's scary
  • PAC3
    PAC3 April 6 2013 18: 25
    -3
    Quote: Egoza
    [
    And fiction books continued to be published, albeit in small quantities. .

    as far as I remember, the number of books published in the Ukrainian language, after the circular, fell not even several times, but by orders of magnitude. In the 5 years after its publication in the empire, only about 20 books were published in Ukrainian. So the ban was actually - FULL.
  • rodevaan
    rodevaan April 6 2013 18: 29
    +6
    Yes, how much is already possible!
    Gentlemen, we won’t be able to rewrite textbooks - and all this trash that pits a single people against each other inside must be destroyed at the state level! And people should understand all the vileness of these writings dictated from behind a hill!

    Stop dogging! We must be together, for together we are power! We must support and help each other, because there will be no unity - no one will help us, they will only destroy us one by one! Do not get fooled by this all modern pro-Western der-mo!

    Can it be that the old Russian feuds of Russia will not go for the future? Gentlemen, we have already passed this a long time ago, when Kiev, Ryazan, Moscow, Suzdal, Vladimir, Novgorod, Chernigov slaughtered each other, and at that time the Mongol-Tatars fired on our land with fire and sword, cutting everyone one by one! If Russian princes were united against a common enemy - no Batu would come, and no yoke would exist! They would all gather in a powerful fist and drive them all from here to the neck!
    We must be together, and not do their work for the enemies, sharpening knives against each other!

    I repeat - it’s not peoples who are hostile to each other, but some scum lonely scum that bring confusion and split into our society, they work out their 30 pieces of silver. It is necessary to get rid of this pus - first of all - and moreover, on both sides of the time line between our united Slavic people!
    1. Omich
      Omich April 6 2013 19: 22
      0
      good wrote correctly
  • TAGIR
    TAGIR April 6 2013 19: 05
    +2
    "Was there a yoke" Everyone who doubts watch the video lecture on YouTube. I am a Tatar married to a Russian, my brother is married to a Ukrainian (every year he travels to Ukraine to visit his mother-in-law until the visas were introduced) This is the commonwealth at the level of the people. This is the future of the "single" Russian world. And no need to talk about the Mongol who did not know who Genghis Khan was until they were told from Europe
    http://youtu.be/crATAaik7SU
    1. Omich
      Omich April 6 2013 19: 25
      -1
      good I’ll add a bit. if during the time of the Mongols the princes would not have been doggy like the majority in this dialogue. they would not have thought to attack. the unity of power. and the author of this correspondence pisarchuk is a loser negative
    2. rodevaan
      rodevaan April 6 2013 22: 02
      +2
      Quote: TAGIR
      "Was there a yoke" Everyone who doubts watch the video lecture on YouTube. I am a Tatar married to a Russian, my brother is married to a Ukrainian (every year he travels to Ukraine to visit his mother-in-law until the visas were introduced) This is the commonwealth at the level of the people. This is the future of the "single" Russian world. And no need to talk about the Mongol who did not know who Genghis Khan was until they were told from Europe
      http://youtu.be/crATAaik7SU


      - No, nobody swears here, the usual discussion. The main meaning of my post was completely different! I’m not saying that, excuse me, it was allegedly scientifically proven that the Tatars of the Pontic type allegedly came and captured and burned everything ... The Mongol-Tatars are not a specification of the modern Tatar people, but the collective name of all the troops of the invaders, which was controlled by Batu and Sorry, but made a terrible and devastating campaign on our land. Dependence on them - and there was a yoke. And in these hordes there were peoples from all the lands conquered by them, such as the territories of the Far East (Zhurchcheni), China, Manchuria, Central Asia, Bulgaria, the Volga region, etc. etc. And all this mass of a motley crowd of horsemen to Ancient Russia was called the Mongol-Tatars.
      And the meaning of my post was precisely that only being united - we will be invincible! And not to say that there was a yoke or it was not there. Whoever came to us at that moment - Mongol-Tatars, Polovtsy, Chinese, or Western-looking knight dogs carry fire and sword democracythat is, at that time Catholicism, and various other invaders - no one would have defeated a single Russia!

      And the fact that the Russian and Tatar (namely the Tatar nation) peoples have been living side by side for centuries, perfectly coexisting in peace and harmony, in abundance and in mutual understanding, without reservations, wars and strife - this should only be welcomed and as an example put. And the fact that you cited your personal situation as an example confirms and proves this once again. And I really hope that this was and will continue to be so, because we, having lived together for so many centuries, are already so inextricably linked that we should not be apart. And you rightly said - "This is the future of the" united "Russian world. I fully agree with this and support it.
    3. Technocrat
      Technocrat April 6 2013 22: 26
      +2
      Dear to Ukraine, they travel on internal Russian passports, do not know the question, do not say nonsense.
      1. TAGIR
        TAGIR April 7 2013 21: 16
        0
        Domestic Russian passports for now, but soon passports will be introduced and if Ukraine does not join the TS, there will be visas
  • TAGIR
    TAGIR April 6 2013 19: 12
    0
    see
    1. Omich
      Omich April 6 2013 19: 40
      0
      Thank you Tagir. Very interesting information. That’s what happened. And that the Mongols are extreme in our discussion wink
  • pink
    pink April 6 2013 19: 36
    +1
    "I just didn't know then that this institution was occupied by the ideological descendants of Mazepa, Bandera and Shukhevych."

    I wonder whose descendants our Minobras are occupied
  • Avenger711
    Avenger711 April 6 2013 19: 53
    +1
    Or Little Russia, or to Poland. Cancer cells must be eliminated; their cancer can no longer be cured.
    1. tarks
      tarks April 6 2013 20: 36
      -1
      An ax is not a good remedy for a headache.
      For starters, you can try citramone.
      1. rodevaan
        rodevaan April 6 2013 22: 11
        +2
        And in general - a little bit away from the article.

        Gentlemen pouring mud to Ukraine - I myself am Russian, I live in the Far East, I visit Ukraine almost every year, since there are many relatives there. What is being done there is obscurantism, it is the same mockery of people that we had not so long ago! Ours 90s with the drunk EBNom, you will not tell in another way. The corrupt power is shared, and the people survive as best they can. It is very sad that this bacchanalia still continues there and it does not see the end-limit. The people and people are sorry that they still live in this political chaos and discord.
  • awerkiev
    awerkiev April 6 2013 22: 40
    0
    [img] http: // http: //www.google.com/imgres? imgurl = http: //ric.ua/uploads/posts/2011-
    11/1320157501_bank_8273_44265.jpg&imgrefurl=http://ric.ua/index.php?newsid=1426&
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    t_5tm54SJ4Zi8M:&tbnh=124&tbnw=106&ei=zmhgUdzrM7LW4AT8mYDQBg&prev=/search?q=%D1%8
    0%D1%83%D1%81%D0%BE%D1%84%D0%BE%D0%B1%D1%8B+%D0%B2+%D1%83%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B
    8%D0%BD%D0%B5&hl=ru&newwindow=1&biw=1366&bih=634&tbm=isch&itbs=1&sa=X&ved=0CDAQr
    QMwAg [/ img]
    Like no other demotivator reflects essence
  • Semurg
    Semurg April 6 2013 23: 42
    0
    I read all the comments, I made a conclusion for myself, most write under the Russian flag, there is no such nation as a Ukrainian, but there is one divided people. Most write under the Ukrainian flag that they are a separate people. Ukrainians draw a separate people for themselves, which means they have a different story Interwoven with Russian history but its own. So Kiev is the metropolis and Vladimir and Moscow are colonies or federates, although then there were neither Ukrainians nor Russians but there were glades drevlyans and others as the subjects of a single state wrote to me, but the direct descendants of Kievan Rus are Ukrainians, and Russians are the side branch that grew up wrote its history and made all schoolchildren of the USSR study and believe it. As I was taught that nomads are only blood and tears and there is no steppe civilization, but there are killers and robbers.
    1. rodevaan
      rodevaan April 7 2013 08: 01
      +3
      Quote: Semurg
      I read all the comments, I made a conclusion for myself, most write under the Russian flag, there is no such nation as a Ukrainian, but there is one divided people. Most write under the Ukrainian flag that they are a separate people. Ukrainians draw a separate people for themselves, which means they have a different story Interwoven with Russian history but its own. So Kiev is the metropolis and Vladimir and Moscow are colonies or federates, although then there were neither Ukrainians nor Russians but there were glades drevlyans and others as the subjects of a single state wrote to me, but the direct descendants of Kievan Rus are Ukrainians, and Russians are the side branch that grew up wrote its history and made all schoolchildren of the USSR study and believe it. As I was taught that nomads are only blood and tears and there is no steppe civilization, but there are killers and robbers.


      - How do you not understand, damn it! Together - we are power - and individually - nothing and no one! Yes, we are a divided people, because it is wanted by someone or not - the cradle and birth of the state of our Slavic people is Kievan Rus! And if we, as at one time in time our ancestors-princes, will be dogged and divided into a bunch of all kinds of sub-nationalities, and those, in turn, will scream that our farm is a separate tribe, they will cut us all, like Batu at one time - easily , at ease and separately, click as Iraq or Libya. The proverb about a divided broom - almost every nation has it, that when all the reeds of one whole are together - you’ll break the horseradish, but click separately and you don’t even need to get your hands dirty!
      I know that many ordinary citizens in Russia, Ukraine and Belarus want to be a single, strong and powerful country. Not individual fascist scum, paid from abroad or made political capital for themselves, and which bring confusion and split into our divided people, but normal ordinary people. Until we still got on our feet completely. In our countries, so far there is great chaos and disorder. But when we put things in order, we will be together, be sure! Personally, I believe in it. Because who will really help us if not ourselves to each other? We have never had any allies.
    2. Per se.
      Per se. April 7 2013 16: 36
      +1
      Quote: Semurg
      the direct descendants of Kievan Rus are Ukrainians, and the Russians is a side branch that has grown, wrote its own story and made all schoolchildren of the USSR study and believe it
      Your conclusions are a personal matter, but they very much coincide with the propaganda that Western "well-wishers" are pouring with tubs. Many here have tried to explain the obvious to you, but in response, deafness and blindness to common sense, apparently, the conclusions are only the result of the desired, as in the CIA and the US State Department.
  • de klermon
    de klermon April 7 2013 02: 23
    +4
    RUSSIA UKRAINE, BELARUS - TOGETHER WE ARE HOLY RUSSIA !!!

    Little Russians, Great Russians and Belorussians - geographical concepts! Surprisingly, for some reason, in Ukraine, Westerners do not pay attention to the fact that their friends are Poles who live in Mazovia, who in Greater Poland, who in Lesser Poland, who in Silesia, and who in Posen do not divided, although they lived for 100 - 500 years (or even more) in different states! Small Russia is small not by value, but by territory, White Russia is not because of the color of the skin, but because it did not pay tribute, and the Great Russians (Vladimir, Vologda, Novgorod, Muscovites) simply settled widely, that’s Great Russia !
    EVERYTHING IS SIMPLY SIMPLE !!!
    1. Sevastopol
      Sevastopol April 7 2013 12: 11
      +2
      If it were so easy to explain to the Zapadents ... They don’t want to listen ...
      1. rodevaan
        rodevaan April 8 2013 08: 18
        +1
        Quote: Sevastopolets
        If it were so easy to explain to the Zapadents ... They don’t want to listen ...


        - And Zapadentsev also do not need to measure with a single measure! There are also different people there, and I talked with them - and there too I found a response of understanding. We Russians also have something to strive for and work on! Do not treat Ukrainian citizens as non-Slavs and try to crush them with their great power! This will only cause retaliation and misunderstanding on their part! Whom we crush - we crush ourselves, because they are us, and we are them!
        Understand, then, at last, everything — if we do not stop making any claims to each other on every occasion — this discord will be endless! You distinguish normal people from any fascist or Nazi rabble! These are units, black sheep in normal society, both on the one hand and on the other!

        Here is a pure example - the Ukrainian government selling to the West issued another anti-Russian trick, which was generously paid for by foreign enemies - what are we doing? We are beginning to pour anger and discontent at ordinary citizens of Ukraine, at all who have come to hand, although 80-90% of these people themselves spit and hate their own corrupt bastard at the top! Therefore, they respond with the same anger to our misunderstanding and to our snobbery! That's where it all comes from! I see this on the forums all the time - dog barking, mate, insults, and nothing more!
        Perhaps enough, fellow citizens on both sides of the border? Maybe it's time to turn on the brain, not emotions and learn to think, hear and understand each other?
  • Fitter65
    Fitter65 April 7 2013 03: 38
    +1
    Quote: Ascetic
    "The history of the Ukrainian people has 140 thousand years."

    Here, the actual evidence that Ukraine is the motherland of mammoths, as OUN researchers say, Ukrainians and mammoths began to migrate across the continent, and it was the Ukrainians who brought the cave people knowledge, rules for using open fire, and instructions for making the first tools. Well, mammoths were also used as humanitarian aid. All the same, nationalism and senility are not separable, although to be honest the senile is not always Natsik, but the Natsik is always senile.
  • Algor73
    Algor73 April 7 2013 10: 41
    +1
    Do not fight. We are all wrong. For everything is known in comparison.