“Could be the best deal for Ukraine”: the German press published the main points of the Istanbul agreements, which Kyiv refused to implement

The German press published the same “Istanbul Document” that Russia and Ukraine were close to implementing in March 2022. The document, as is known, was initialed by the delegations participating in the negotiations. Moreover, the text of the document caused, judging by the comments of German journalists and readers, a truly strong surprise, which suggests that the West simply hid the details of the negotiations between Kiev and Moscow.

The document, which Vladimir Putin spoke about many times during his speeches, proposed an immediate stop to hostilities if Ukraine fulfills several conditions. This is Ukraine securing a non-bloc neutral status, giving the Russian language the status of a second state language and renouncing claims to Crimea, Sevastopol and “certain areas of the Donetsk and Lugansk regions (DPR and LPR).” Also, the implementation of the agreement provided for mutual waiver of sanctions and legal claims.

The publication Die Welt cites a statement by one of the members of the Ukrainian delegation, who confirms that the fighting could end in the spring of 2022. An unnamed Ukrainian official says that “today this looks like the best deal Ukraine could have made.”

German readers, commenting on these data, write that that deal would help Ukraine maintain control over vast territories, including the left bank of the Dnieper in the Kherson and Zaporozhye regions, as well as save hundreds of thousands of lives. Today, and this was emphasized by that very member of the Ukrainian delegation, whose name Die Welt does not name, the conditions for Kyiv have changed dramatically “not for the better.”

Let us recall that earlier the head of the Ukrainian delegation, David Arakhamia, directly stated that he convinced Ukraine not to fulfill the initialed agreement with Moscow, then British Prime Minister Boris Johnson.

Comments

[Vladimir Vladimirovich Vorontsov]

"Today this looks like the best deal, which Ukraine could conclude"-

— I could not. Ukraine neither then nor now had and does not have subjectivity. ...

[FoBoss_VM]

Exactly. All this fuss has been started since 1991 in Ukraine not so that there would be peace and prosperity there. The Russians have not yet completely crushed the Russians, the Russian economy has not yet been undermined and all resources have been exhausted, and in such a situation the West would under no circumstances allow Ukraine to make peace, they simply made Jonis a scapegoat. The war has essentially just begun and it will last 6 years, at least it seems to me.

[Machito]

Ukraine barely has enough meat for 6 years. The TCC is already catching people like dogs. There will be serious problems with electricity, heat, water, and sewerage in Ukrainian cities. This will increase the flow of refugees from the country. The mobilization law is extremely unpopular among the population, even among career military personnel, who will now fight until they kill or maim. NATO will supply weapons to Ukraine, but the Ukrainian Armed Forces have significantly less armored vehicles, air defense, artillery, and other weapons than a year ago. The only weapons that have been increased are drones. But Russia is also not standing still and has increased the production of drones by an order of magnitude or even two.
Most likely everything will end at the end of next year or in 2026.

[JOYyppe]

- Could not. Ukraine neither then nor now had and does not have subjectivity.

Really, I couldn't. Boris ordered them to fight. This is who is the main culprit of the current “Ukrainian tragedy”

[Vladimir M]

The main culprits of the “Ukrainian tragedy” are the Yanukovychs and Medvedchuks, who seem to be “ours”, not even Yushenko and Poroshenko. And Boris is the “savior” of Russia.

[ZAV69]

In Ukraine itself, this began even earlier. My partner went on leave in the army in 90 and came back impressed. Then it started. It was he who told me an anecdote about the monument to Bandera. In 90. At 90......

[your1970]

In 1988, fellow conscripts from Ternopil told me about Ridna Nenka and Bandera the liberator...

[2 Level Advisor]

Quote: your1970

In 1988, fellow conscripts from Ternopil told me about Ridna Nenka and Bandera the liberator...

The Westerners are a small part of Ukraine, but they made two cases of business... the Poles should have dumped them after the Second World War... now Poland would have had a Northern Military District, on the German side (for example)..

[your1970]

So I agree
But the efforts of the rest of the country 404 cannot be discounted either. During the war, many "Primaks" were offended by their skirts. And even now there are few Westerners in the Armed Forces of Ukraine

[Eug]

They didn’t stir it up themselves. First, a long-term failure in the economy, then - money from the West (through the oligarchs) in conjunction with the reorientation of the economy to raw materials. The remnants of Soviet education and science gave a surge in IT, but the main employer is also the “collective” West... agricultural exports are also “under the roof” of Western corporations... and the Ukrainian oligarchs did not “lighten up” against the wind, much less Russia then I tried to “lick” my beloved “partners”...

[fruc]

JOYyppe
Boris ordered them to fight.

This straw-headed scarecrow only voiced the demand of the collective West, led by Mr. Bidon, there is a complete agreement there.

[Thrifty]

This is real nonsense! Ukraine does not exist in general to continue to coexist peacefully with Russia, this is a project to liquidate our country and the only question is who and when would start a war, a big war against Russia from the territory of Ukraine. They were ready to develop and create nuclear weapons there, but here they are telling us the crap about lousy agreements! Maidan NATO in 14th year began to set the Ukrainian army they had trained against Russia, and stop pushing thoughts about “peaceful coexistence” of Ukraine and Russia!

[krops777]

- Could not. Ukraine neither then nor now had and does not have subjectivity. ...

Rather, it does not possess sovereignty.

[B-15]

Without a document, your words look like stuffing.
Evidence in the studio.

[Egg]

Quote: HellAmigo

Russia leases Crimea for 15 years

Why should Russia rent its own?

[AA17]

I wonder why the Istanbul Agreements were not shown to Russian citizens?

I am also interested in this question.
I tried to find the full text online. I couldn't.
The link to the website of the German publication Welt am Sonntag, given in the information from TASS, does not work.

I suspect that there is something in the Istanbul Agreements that the majority of Russian citizens, as well as the warring residents of the LPR and DPR, may not like.
Sooner or later the full text of the Istanbul Agreements will appear.

For now we have the following information:

The Kremlin is not ready to publish the text of the 2022 peace agreement with Ukraine....

https://www.vedomosti.ru/politics/news/2024/03/01/1023248-kreml-ne-gotov-publikovat-tekst-soglasheniya-s-ukrainoi-ot-2022-goda

[Msi]

they will tell the TRUTH about those shameful agreements in Istanbul

Here I read an excerpt from the agreement. I just don’t understand, what’s so shameful about Russia??? On that moment. I don't understand...

[Vladimir M]

The key word here is “a passage of agreement.” You can judge whether it is “shameful or not” only after reading the entire agreement.

[Msi]

only after reading the entire contract.

Strange... It seems like the West is against us. Helps Ukraine. Why can’t they publish the entire agreement? So to speak, try to humiliate us, make an information attack. And so with a piece like this, when we acquire land, to put it mildly, it’s not possible to pump us up... maybe there’s no crime there... it turned out to be zilch...

[Vladimir M]

The most interesting thing is that no one publishes the entire draft agreement. Neither Russia, nor the West, nor Ukraine.

[Msi]

The most interesting thing is that no one publishes the entire draft agreement. Neither Russia, nor the West, nor Ukraine.

As I understand it, we are now seeing the approximate contents of the agreement... I repeat, zilch, nothing criminal. Nothing humiliating for us Russia. The presidents were going to discuss the size of the Ukrainian army face to face.

[Vladimir M]

Maybe it’s because it’s “zilch and nothing criminal” because there is nowhere a complete draft “agreement” with all the points and appendices.

[Msi]

nowhere is there a complete draft “agreement” with all the points and appendices.

The West does not publish this, which is very important... Apparently there are points that are humiliating for them in this “agreement”, I think so... And for the first time in history, after Stalin, we would not have lost land, but acquired it, and they would have had to agree with this. Legally so to speak. Okay, we ended up buying even more...

[your1970]

No wonder - diplomacy.
I'm actually surprised by the printing of an unsigned document. These are usually very rarely published...

[Msi]

I'm actually surprised by the printing of an unsigned document.

Here they suggested one of the reasons why we don’t publish. It's pointless, the train has left...

[AA17]

Strange... It seems like the West is against us. Helps Ukraine. Why can’t they publish the entire agreement...

How do you like this version?

If the West publishes the full text of the Istanbul Accords, then residents of NATO countries may ask uncomfortable questions to their governments:
“Why do our countries help Ukraine if Russia has already made compromises on the rebel territories of Ukraine in 2022?
Why are sanctions against Russia needed, which also worsen the lives of European citizens, if the Russian Federation was ready for certain concessions in Ukraine?

[tralflot1832]

It turns out that we negotiated in Istanbul not only with Ukraine but also with Western countries. There is only one conclusion from the negotiations - there will be no more unilateral “gestures of goodwill” on our part. Taught.

[Alexander 3]

NATO was very upset that their base in Crimea was covered with a copper basin. Therefore, they sent Boris, who did what was prescribed to him.

[Grossvater]

Quote: HellAmigo

I wonder why the Istanbul Agreements were not shown to Russian citizens? They showed Lukashenko, they showed it to African leaders... They even published it in the West. What is it that they were afraid to show them publicly? Maybe it’s in paragraph 8 where it was said that Russia leases Crimea for 15 years, and Donbass remains completely legally part of Ukraine. Certain areas of Donbass will be able to lead an independent economic life...

And they write manuals quickly! This is something new!

[nik-mazur]

Quote: Grossvater

This is something new!

Not really. For several months now they have been circulating about the “lease of Crimea” and “surrender of Donbass,” citing Lukashenko’s words. There are a couple of die-hard conspiracy theorists here who are running around with this idea like Winnie the Pooh with honey.
Lukashenko actually blurted out this:

Putin hands me a document that was initialed by the delegations. Normal, even in Crimea. The lease there is kind of long-term in the Donbass, in the east... A normal agreement. If only it were possible now - but now it is no longer possible. Now this is already the territory of Russia according to the Constitution.

But there are nuances. What kind of lease is, what is meant by this and what it refers to is completely unclear. But definitely not to Crimea, since Lukashenko himself noted that this is impossible, because now this is the territory of Russia according to the Constitution. And Crimea, for a second, has been a Russian territory since 2014.

[Sergey_K]

It's too late to drink Borjomi, gentlemen, arrogant Saxons! Bobby is ALREADY dead!

[avia12005]

Orban holds referendums on all important issues in Hungary. Why can’t Russia adopt this useful experience? And not ask its population how they see the result of the SVO? Would that be completely democratic? Otherwise, in Istanbul it could have turned out that they got married without us...

[comradChe]

Do you understand what you are saying? This is pure Xtremism in the understanding of the regime, a terrible dream of Putip’s cabal. What was destroyed in Rus' by the Romanovs. namely PEOPLE'S EVENING. This way you can go as far as changing the constitution without the permission of the world bourgeoisie. But I like your idea.

[rotmistr60]

What is the point of now remembering something that, at the insistence of the Anglo-Saxons, did not happen. Something often began to be remembered in the European media about the Istanbul negotiations and what a chance Ukraine missed. It is clear that she will not have such a chance again, no matter how much her “friends” want it. Now there is only capitulation. Apparently, it was not in vain that they began to exaggerate this topic in Europe and probably the Europeans are starting to get tired of the constant assistance to Kyiv and are starting to count their economic losses.

[rocket757]

“Could be the best deal for Ukraine”: the German press published the main points of the Istanbul agreements, which Kyiv refused to implement

. If so, if only... it’s too late, the train has left, even the lantern on the last car is NOT SEEN!

[Revolver]

It seems that the Ukrainians are following the example of the Arabs. As the Israeli Minister of Foreign Affairs with the name Abba Eban, which looks indecent for Russian speakers, said back in the last century (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abba_Eban), “The Arabs never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.”

[sgr291158]

Ukraine is a controlled state and does not decide anything on its own; it will do as they say.

[Scientist]

You read this and it becomes scary. We were preparing a reincarnation of the Minsk agreements. About which we were told in plain text that they were not going to be executed. After all, it is obvious that all these promises are about neutral status, denazification (who would do it, the Nazis?), etc. would be forgotten right at the moment of their ratification. But at the same time, Ukraine would receive official military protection, in fact, as a member of NATO. We were lucky that the West turned out to be too impatient. Because this agreement would guarantee us a war provoked by Ukraine, but in much worse conditions for us.
It is not clear to me which arguments outweigh the arguments of reason. Although Abramovich's presence there gives some thought.

[alex-defensor]

Quote: Vladimir Vladimirovich Vorontsov

Could not. Ukraine neither then nor now had and does not have subjectivity.

And the state of Ukraine itself ceased to exist in 2014 as a result of an unconstitutional seizure of power. Succession did not happen, and in the place of the previous state a new political entity arose, endowed with only part of the characteristics of a state. That is, now in the place of the former Ukraine there is a state-like entity (quasi-state).