About one simple and reliable way to destroy the future of our military science, and a little later of our entire military-industrial complex

206
About one simple and reliable way to destroy the future of our military science, and a little later of our entire military-industrial complex

I must state right away that the author of this text is in no way connected with the system of the Central Military Research Institute. As in the famous film, I feel bad for the state... The author himself has a modest relationship with military science - at one of the enterprises that develops cannon artillery, he works in the design bureau and participates in research and development work on the work being carried out.

In our country, the effectiveness of weapons programs and the ongoing scientific and technical policy in the field of armaments, yes, with varying degrees of success, is largely the merit of a number of Central Research Institutes of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation. They are not advertised in the media - there were only a couple of stories on the Zvezda TV channel about some of them, and therefore for the majority of citizens of the Russian Federation, these institutions do not exist, and the specifics of their work do not imply publicity. Although their real contribution to defense capability, to the fact that we have a rational range of weapons and it all works, and works reliably, is difficult to overestimate, as well as the rationale for the directions of future developments.



Historically, the majority of the Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense is located in the hero city of Moscow. In Soviet times, only the best of the best got there, including honored chief designers and their deputies who went to work after retirement, and recruited young people from the best graduates of the Moscow Higher Technical School, Moscow Aviation Institute, and Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology.

The flower of our scientific and technical thought works in these central research institutes, and this center of crystallization of the efforts of the entire military-industrial complex is being persistently sought and systematically destroyed: it began in the 90s, under Serdyukov it continued - as part of the general processes for the transfer/relocation of scientific centers from Moscow, and what is surprising , continue to destroy, and the ongoing NVO, as they say, is not an obstacle.

In our capitalist and democratic country, everything is measured, including the need for a person, any institutions, by a simple and universal measure: money and, in particular, the salary of those who receive it, and then give it away by going to the store or paying utility, mortgage, credit accounts. Let's leave the talk that money is not everything, not the main thing, since those who put the question this way usually work in leadership positions and are not ready to continue working for the common good under any circumstances for the minimum wage, and even in the store for merit before society, the state, no one gives anything for free or even at a discount. Therefore, in fact, there is no way without money. The level of salaries, wider than social guarantees, working conditions, of course, does not boil down to just the number of measly pieces of paper, but their quantity allows or does not allow us to implement personnel policies, attract and encourage the best, pass on the accumulated experience to the younger generation, if, of course, they will be the same ones attracted by conditions. In this vein, I propose to look, without rose-colored glasses and slogans, at the actual personnel policy (read: the policy that will determine our future) in the key central research institutes of military science in our country in terms of the conditions for attracting new personnel. I’ll say right away that there are no and cannot be any complaints against the Central Research Institutes themselves and their leaders: however much money the state allocated to them, that’s how much they can allocate for wages for both current and future employees.

All data is taken from open and official data. List of the Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense from the website of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation: https://ens.mil.ru/science/SRI.htm. Vacancies and salary conditions for each Central Research Institute are presented there.

Let's look at the example of the 46th Central Research Institute, as one of our most outstanding Central Research Institutes, what working conditions are offered - what it is, personnel policy and the prospects for our bright future in this regard. The 46th Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation is a “supra-specific research organization of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation to substantiate the prospects for the development of the weapons system of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation and the formation of a methodological apparatus for the development of the State weapons program, proposals of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation for the state defense order, as well as military standardization and cataloging of supplies of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation.

In addition, the 46th Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation is the lead scientific organization in the Ministry of Defense on the problems of developing programs for the development of the domestic technological base, justifying the implementation of modern high-tech projects in the defense industry, as well as preparing proposals and conclusions on the promotion of Russian technologies and scientific and technological achievements .

The Institute takes an active part in the creation of an automated system for managing the development of weapons and military equipment and the introduction of new information technologies in the interests of information support for the RF Armed Forces.

At the same time, the institute is the lead in the Russian Ministry of Defense in creating special software for an automated complex for generating program documents. Source.

Having taken official data on vacancies, the author, without changing anything in the content, simply structured this data (for example, by listing the qualification requirements/content of work point by point) and made a calculation of how much the candidate would receive at the maximum. The following is data on three vacancies at the 46th Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, taken from the website of the Ministry of Defense:

- according to vacancy Researcher
- according to vacancy head of laboratory.

Additionally, having looked at all the vacancies of the 46th Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation and other Central Research Institutes of the Ministry of Defense, the author was convinced that the income levels are almost identical for other Central Research Institutes of the Ministry of Defense, for example, see. 4th Central Research Institute. 3th Central Research Institute one of the most important, if we can say that there are more important ones at the Central Research Institute.

So, let's start with the first basic vacancy: researcher.

Job title 1: Researcher of the research department (comprehensive research into the problems of development and use of the cataloging system for supplies of the Russian Armed Forces) of the research center.

Qualification requirements:

1. Higher professional education and work experience in the specialty for at least 3 years. If you have an academic degree, there are no requirements for work experience.

2. In some cases, it is necessary to have a valid permit to work with information constituting state secrets, with verification activities carried out by the security authority according to the 3rd form or not lower than the 2nd form.

Bachelor's degree in specialty: Automated control systems and computer science in technical systems.

Labor functions:

1. Conducts scientific research and development on individual sections (stages, tasks) of the topic as a responsible executor or together with a scientific supervisor, carries out complex experiments and observations.

2. Collects, processes, analyzes and summarizes scientific and technical information, advanced domestic and foreign experience, results of experiments and observations.

3. Participates in the preparation of plans and methodological programs for research and development, practical recommendations for the use of their results.

4. Compiles reports (sections of reports) on a topic or its section (stage, task). Participates in the implementation of research and development results

Remuneration:

Official salary, rub.: 10 - 949 rub. + bonus for length of service (up to 22% of salary) + for intensity and high results of work (up to 572% of salary) + payments based on work results (up to 40 rubles).

Calculation of maximum salary per month: salary 22 + for length of service max. 572%. = 5 + 5 (40%) + 25 (22%) + 572 (2 completed works with a maximum bonus of 50 rubles each) = 000 rubles. per month maximum.

Job title 2: Head of the research laboratory (comprehensive research into the problems of development and application of the national technical control system).

Qualification requirements:

1. Academic degree of doctor or candidate (military, technical) sciences.

2. Availability of scientific papers or copyright certificates for inventions, as well as major projects and developments implemented in practice.

3. Knowledge of international treaties in the field of reduction and limitation of weapons and military equipment.

4. A systematic approach to justifying the program-targeted development of information and measurement systems for monitoring strategic weapons tests.

5. Problematic issues of application and operation of complexes abroad.

6. Research experience in the development of radar and telemetry systems, information processing and planning the use of information systems.

7. Availability of a valid permit to work with information constituting state secrets, with verification activities carried out by security authorities.

Labor functions:

1. Conducting scientific research and development on individual sections (stages, tasks) of the topic as a responsible executor or together with a scientific supervisor, carrying out complex observational experiments.

2. Collection, processing, analysis and generalization of scientific and technical information of advanced domestic and foreign experience, results of experiments and observations.

3. Participation in drawing up plans and methodological programs for research and development, practical recommendations for using the results.

4. Drawing up reports (sections of reports) on the topic or their sections.

5. Participation in the implementation of research and development results.

Remuneration:

Official salary, rub.: 15 - 224 + bonus for length of service (up to 23% of salary) + for intensity and high results of work (up to 143% of salary) + for state secrets (up to 40% of salary) + payments for results of the calendar year (up to 25 salaries).

Calculation of maximum salary per month: 23 + 143 × 23 (worked 143 out of 0,2 years) + 10 × 25 + 0,25 × 23143 + (0,3 × 23)/143 = 23 + 143 + 2 + 12 + 23 = 143 per month maximum for a candidate or doctor of sciences in the most responsible area.

Data source.

Job title 3: Head of the laboratory (comprehensive research into the development of military electrical engineering technologies).

Qualification requirements:

1. Experience in senior positions in research organizations and departments.

2. Academic degree of doctor or candidate (military, technical) sciences.

3. Availability of scientific papers or copyright certificates for inventions, as well as major projects and developments implemented in practice.

4. Experience in conducting military-technical and military-scientific support of work on the development of military electric power technologies and research to ensure their creation.

5. Experience in conducting military-technical examination and practical testing of innovative technologies in the field of military electric power and developing recommendations on the directions of their implementation in the creation of fundamentally new models of military equipment.

6. Knowledge in the field of scientific and methodological substantiation of the direction of development of military electric power technologies.

7. Availability of a valid permit to work with information constituting state secrets, with verification activities carried out by security authorities.

Labor functions:

1. Organize the implementation of research work provided for for the laboratory in the scientific work plans, determine the prospects for their development in the relevant field of knowledge and select methods and means for the laboratory to conduct research and development.

2. Carry out long-term and annual planning of the laboratory’s research work.

3. To develop tactical and technical specifications for R&D methodological and work programs, feasibility studies of the requirements of the Ministry of Defense for the promising technical level of military electric power technologies.

4. Carry out scientific management of R&D projects provided for in the department’s scientific work plan, formulate their final goals and expected results and take direct part in carrying out the most important work.

5. Monitor the implementation of tasks provided for in the department’s scientific work plan, contractual obligations, as well as the quality of R&D performed by laboratory employees and co-executors.

6. Ensure compliance with regulatory requirements, complete and high-quality execution of scientific and technical documentation, compliance with the established procedure for its approval and approval.

7. Take measures to ensure the safety and rational use of equipment and other resources necessary for scientific research in the laboratory.

8. Ensure increased efficiency of the laboratory, rational placement of employees, and take measures to increase their creative activity.

9. Ensure compliance with labor legislation and work safety in the laboratory, as well as internal labor regulations.

10. Ensure compliance with the requirements for maintaining state secrets and ensuring secrecy, rules for the use of information on personal computers by laboratory employees.

11. Participate in the selection of laboratory personnel, make proposals for remuneration and material incentives for laboratory employees, taking into account personal contribution to the overall results of the department.

Reward similar to vacancy 2 = 44 per month maximum for a candidate or doctor of sciences in the most responsible area. Moreover, you are not just responsible for the team, R&D, their organization, co-executors, expertise, for state secrets, you are also the first Stakhanovite in this work... The fact that a Stakhanovite is at work is excellent, but the salary is something not like Gref and not even like a taxi driver in Moscow... Let me remind you that a candidate or doctor of sciences who already has experience in managing military R&D should work here...

Data source.

Let’s compare, taking vacancies in Moscow and the average salary of such workers.

Taxi driver. Car rental Comfort +
100 – 000 ₽/month

Loader-picker at Perekrestok (store)
77 ₽/month

Private hairdresser:
60 – 000 ₽/month

And a doctor/candidate of sciences for vacancy No. 3, responsible for R&D, the team, co-executors, the direction of these works throughout the Russian Federation: 44 ₽/month...

Do you and I really have a future with such a personnel policy?!


In connection with the above, I consider it necessary to also raise the following questions:

- Why don’t the management of the institutes and their employees fight for the labor rights of their teams?

- why did the Ministry of Defense make such systemic errors in personnel work and do not strive not only to correct them, but to exclude from the management those who were guilty of this or should have, but did not report in any way, did not act/inactive in this regard?

- why are these problems clear and important to me, but those who are 10 steps higher are not concerned about this - maybe we need to switch places?

- perhaps they all live wonderfully and earn decent money, and I am categorically mistaken and draw erroneous conclusions - but then what other facts should I base my conclusions on?
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  1. +25
    4 January 2024 03: 39
    Yes, people become 30000 people (to work for 50) out of despair. Advertisements - seller 60-80. On a shift, a cook is 100, a driver, a tractor driver, an excavator operator is already under 30000. Therefore, it is not surprising when they say that they have opened a new plant, with the latest equipment, but no one is in a hurry, the salary is up to XNUMX. Of course, besides payment, another question arises, where to get specialists. When the vocational education system is broken. And those who remain are preparing so that they can answer the exam questions correctly. Such a “specialist” comes and doesn’t know anything other than the correct answers. Therefore, the problem here is not just the salary...
    1. +16
      4 January 2024 10: 54
      There will be a normal salary, and there will be specialists.
      A decent salary best stimulates the emergence of specialists.
      1. +6
        5 January 2024 12: 01
        That's not how it works. Correctly like this:
        "If there is a normal salary, there will be opportunity attract a specialist."
        It is the opportunity, not the specialist himself. For a specialist is a huge problem in our time of a market approach, where the worker is nothing more than a resource (commonplace due to the fact that in production, grassroots specialists have been replaced by “masters of one operation”, and in science by “masters of publications in rating publications”)
        1. +3
          5 January 2024 15: 51
          If there is a normal salary, there will be a demand for such potential specialists for training. Programmers are paid a lot - and a bunch of all sorts of online schools have appeared without any government participation. And people with brains go where they will pay, and will not become useless specialists
          1. +1
            6 January 2024 15: 29
            The problem with the schools you described is that they do not train specialists. Just as 30 years ago, universities trained specialists (plus self-study), universities prepare them now (plus a lot of self-study and specialized courses).
            By the way, salaries in the industry are high precisely because there are catastrophically few specialists - and the “fashionability” of the topic is hyper-high, exceeding the real needs for individual solutions (thanks to which it is possible to “cheat” customers into paying a lot even for under-resources in the form of a “master of one” functions", having only gained a little experience after the school you mentioned)
            1. 0
              6 January 2024 19: 41
              Quote: ailcat
              Just as 30 years ago, universities trained specialists (plus self-study), universities prepare them now (plus a lot of self-study and specialized courses).

              As a person who graduated from Moscow State University and now hires graduates, I can say that this is nonsense. In universities they teach you how to take colloquiums, study philosophy, difurs and other useless nonsense, calling it training in learning. But in reality, in two years in real work, a 20-year-old boy will outshine any graduate of a paper graduate school.
              Quote: ailcat
              salaries in the industry are high precisely because there are catastrophically few specialists

              There are few specialists everywhere, but in some places they also pay well for non-specialists, and in some places even doctors of science with 20 years of experience are offered 50 thousand. And where they pay enough, people themselves are ready to break into pieces and pay themselves so that someone can teach them . For them, there are not even books in the library; study as you wish in another language. And for technical specialists there are plenty of materials, but it’s like the joke - in order to get a lot you need to work a little without turning on your brain, and in order to get a penny you have to study hard for a long time and then break into work.
        2. 0
          20 January 2024 11: 44
          You just expanded more)
          Decent wages stimulate the emergence of specialists. Give engineers more salaries than managers, and people will train their children to be engineers, not managers)
          The huckster should not receive more than the manufacturer.
    2. -6
      4 January 2024 11: 16
      Quote: Fitter65
      Such a “specialist” comes and doesn’t know anything other than the correct answers. Therefore, the problem here is not just the salary...

      “Now forget what they taught you there and listen here” (c) - I’m still in 1970 I heard.
      Without oligarchs and the Unified State Exam, but the approach was the same...
      1. man
        +23
        4 January 2024 11: 51
        Quote: your1970
        Quote: Fitter65
        Such a “specialist” comes and doesn’t know anything other than the correct answers. Therefore, the problem here is not just the salary...

        “Now forget what they taught you there and listen here” (c) - I’m still in 1970 I heard.
        Without oligarchs and the Unified State Exam, but the approach was the same...

        So what? After college, I received an assignment to an academic institute, so for my work I only needed one (!) lecture, “Synthesis of microprogrammed automata.” smile CVM course laughing .Yes, there were also AVMs back then laughing The strength of Soviet technical education was that students were taught to think! And if you are accustomed to thinking, then you will be able to handle almost any task, even if you did not study this area at university.
        And this happened not only to me.
        And it must be noted that Soviet senior comrades, as a rule, easily helped the young, especially at first, because they were doing one thing
        1. -13
          4 January 2024 12: 18
          Quote: mann
          The strength of Soviet technical education was that students were taught to think!

          Therefore, this formula was voiced in feuilletons in Crocodile in the 1970s???
          Won what ...
          And then the same people with the best education in the world (with digital computers and automatic computers, I don’t know what it is, but with them too) - they applied sore spots to the TV and charged the water....
          1. man
            +22
            4 January 2024 12: 21
            Quote: your1970
            Quote: mann
            The strength of Soviet technical education was that students were taught to think!

            Therefore, this formula was voiced in feuilletons in Crocodile in the 1970s???
            Won what ...
            And then the same people with the best education in the world (with digital computers and automatic computers, I don’t know what it is, but with them too) - they applied sore spots to the TV and charged the water....

            You shouldn’t be doing that, none of the techies I know suffered from this nonsense, they just laughed
            1. -4
              4 January 2024 12: 53
              Quote: mann
              Quote: your1970
              Quote: mann
              The strength of Soviet technical education was that students were taught to think!

              Therefore, this formula was voiced in feuilletons in Crocodile in the 1970s???
              Won what ...
              And then the same people with the best education in the world (with digital computers and automatic computers, I don’t know what it is, but with them too) - they applied sore spots to the TV and charged the water....

              You shouldn’t be doing that, none of the techies I know suffered from this nonsense, they just laughed

              I worked in Dubna at JINR in the 90s - the nuclear workers of our laboratory suffered almost without exception. Moreover, in the institute canteen this was the main topic of conversation at lunch...
              1. +17
                4 January 2024 13: 17
                Quote: your1970
                I worked in Dubna at JINR in the 90s - the nuclear workers of our laboratory suffered almost without exception. Moreover, in the institute canteen this was the main topic of conversation at lunch...

                We also had a couple of them at the airfield, and when they met in the flight technical meeting, they also only talked about this topic. So this does not mean that everyone at the airfield was at the same level. Someone's making fun of me. asked me to bring “charged water” to dilute the alcohol, because after that my head won’t hurt so much... And now, without kidding, there are vending machines with holy water, though for money...
                1. -3
                  4 January 2024 19: 26
                  Quote: Fitter65
                  We also had a couple of them at the airfield, and when they met in the flight technical meeting, they also only talked about this topic. So this does not mean that everyone at the airfield was at the same level.

                  The problem is that they weren’t kidding, but they were discussing in all seriousness...
                  And not only in the dining room...
                  When Kashpirovsky came, they even installed equipment - “like we’ll measure the power of energy, create an electronic analogue and become famous”...
              2. +10
                4 January 2024 13: 27
                Educated does not mean smart.... This phenomenon needs scientific study, as half of the country of conditionally communist-materialists watched Kashpirovsky and Chumak and not just watched, but directly followed their “recommendations” and still had a religious faith in what they were saying from the screens TV... A big experiment was set up over the country then, I must say.
                1. +9
                  4 January 2024 18: 17
                  If a person’s brain is 24x7, then it’s a matter of time until he goes crazy. Let's take, say, Academician Sakharov...
                2. +6
                  5 January 2024 15: 55
                  In the USSR, people were accustomed to being allowed into the screen from the other side only after a bunch of checks. And since they let him in, it means there is something there. This nonsense, that since the camera is standing in front of a person, means he has been verified and must be trusted, has not come to the end
              3. man
                +10
                4 January 2024 13: 35
                I worked in Dubna at JINR in the 90s - the nuclear workers of our laboratory suffered almost without exception. Moreover, in the institute canteen this was the main topic of conversation at lunch...
                Maybe you've heard enough of the cleaners? I can’t believe that nuclear physicists believed in this!
                1. -3
                  4 January 2024 19: 30
                  Quote: mann
                  I worked in Dubna at JINR in the 90s - the nuclear workers of our laboratory suffered almost without exception. Moreover, in the institute canteen this was the main topic of conversation at lunch...
                  Maybe you've heard enough of the cleaners? I can’t believe that nuclear physicists believed in this!

                  The canteen was for coupons (ORVU and RVU) and in cash - not cheap.
                  The cleaners didn’t go there in principle - there were no more than a dozen ORVU cleaners for all the laboratories, and the rest were not given coupons
          2. man
            +6
            4 January 2024 13: 49
            Therefore, this formula was voiced in feuilletons in Krokodil in the 1970s???
            In the 70s??? Kashpirovsky and other evil spirits appeared on TV in the 89-90s!
            1. -2
              4 January 2024 19: 32
              Quote: mann
              Therefore, this formula was voiced in feuilletons in Krokodil in the 1970s???
              In the 70s??? Kashpirovsky and other evil spirits appeared on TV in the 89-90s!

              fool the conversation was about the formula
              Quote: your1970
              "Now forget what they taught you there and listen here" (c) - I heard this back in the 1970s.
        2. +14
          4 January 2024 13: 12
          Quote: mann
          The strength of Soviet technical education was that students were taught to think!

          Here is the main difference - then they taught to THINK.
          1. 0
            5 January 2024 15: 58
            What was the point of all this? At the very beginning of Brezhnev, Soviet computers ran out, there were no outstanding scientific breakthroughs, life expectancy was falling, people were drinking themselves to death. And then these smartest people plundered and squandered the country
        3. -2
          4 January 2024 16: 58
          The strength of Soviet technical education was that students were taught to think!

          Proofs will be?
          How was the ability to think measured before and after training?
          Maybe, on the contrary, someone who initially has high intelligence and the ability for abstract thinking is able to memorize all the logarithms and other topics that are absolutely unnecessary for him?
          1. +8
            4 January 2024 18: 07
            It was no use cramming. One or two additional questions and it immediately became clear that the student understood the topic or had stupidly memorized it
            1. -4
              4 January 2024 20: 08
              No sublime understanding eliminates the need to memorize a lot, and I repeat the question - are logarithms absolutely necessary for the development of intelligence, or, on the contrary, is intelligence necessary for their assimilation?
              And what about non-techies? How do they live without mathematics in large doses?
          2. +3
            6 January 2024 14: 13
            People with high intelligence and the ability for abstract thinking do not engage in cramming (especially logarithms).
            1. 0
              6 January 2024 14: 29
              People with high intelligence and the ability for abstract thinking do not engage in cramming (especially logarithms).

              The student’s intelligence and other personal qualities have nothing to do with it at all, and if you don’t understand this, the question arises whether you even studied at the university.
              The question in the program is how much reference information is required to be remembered.
              1. +2
                6 January 2024 14: 38
                There is no need to remember the help program (you probably meant information). That's why it's a reference book. You need to know where to look for this information!
                For reference, I studied at a university. Candidate of Technical Sciences
                1. 0
                  6 January 2024 21: 14
                  There is no need to remember the help program (you probably meant information). That's why it's a reference book. You need to know where to look for this information!

                  Maybe your university was a branch of heaven on earth and everything there was reasonably organized, or maybe this is from the series “in the USSR there were no queues and everyone had separate apartments and four children.”
    3. DO
      +6
      4 January 2024 18: 55
      Another question arises: where to find specialists. When the vocational education system is broken. And those who remain are preparing so that they can answer the exam questions correctly. Such a “specialist” comes and doesn’t know anything other than the correct answers.

      About the engineers
      Not a single technical university provides complete and comprehensive answers to the questions that a future development engineer has to solve in the workplace. No university has or can have such answers. A technical university has other functions:
      - firstly, SELECTION, first from among applicants, and then in junior courses (through expulsion for poor academic performance), young people who are able to absorb technical knowledge and apply them in the educational process;
      - secondly, training in fundamental technical knowledge that is likely to be useful to future specialists (for example, programming languages ​​and technologies for programmers, strength materials for mechanics and builders, electrical engineering and circuit design for electronics hardware developers).
      And then, not everyone can work in a technical specialty at a university. Some people don’t have enough jobs (mainly those who live outside of Moscow and St. Petersburg), some lack abilities or don’t like engineering work despite their higher education, many don’t like the salary of a young specialist and leave after a year or two where they pay more.
    4. +1
      5 January 2024 17: 46
      [quote]]Therefore, the problem here is not just the salary...[quote]
      Undoubtedly. The education system (both vocational and university) has been destroyed. Almost according to Mayakovsky: “If the stars go out, it means someone needs it...
  2. +13
    4 January 2024 03: 39
    Interesting data...
    And everything works - the inertia is huge, but a huge amount of successful work has already been done over 30 years.
    I wonder how many more masochists will be able to earn doctorates to earn 40 thousand?
    They fit perfectly into the international division of labor - oil and gas, and little things. Everything was harmonious, according to plan - and then they bucked.
    And I remember a good friend of mine who works in an American company in San Diego, which does a lot for the military... I probably won’t cover his salary, so as not to confuse people’s minds...
    1. +23
      4 January 2024 09: 20
      Quote from tsvetahaki
      I probably won’t cover his salary so as not to confuse people’s minds...

      Why did you decide that you would confuse someone here?
      There are individuals at VO who will unabashedly explain that your friend there somehow ekes out a salary! Because in America the prices are huge. And they will explain that here you can prosper even with thirty thousand because of the unrealistically low prices for everything. Our citizens are simply too picky! Give them free eggs and luxurious Chinese ones
      cars!!
      And in general, the guarantor said that citizens began to live better. And the first thing we did was buy all the eggs!
      1. +6
        4 January 2024 10: 23
        I appreciated the humor... Why is he doing there, he’s just a traitor...
        1. +3
          4 January 2024 21: 30
          Quote: Sergey_K
          I appreciated the humor... Why is he doing there, he’s just a traitor...

          Considering that he is actually Iranian laughing laughing
          And besides this, there are Canadians, and, horror, Americans who worked for me - and now in such companies, from Qualcomm and TI to Raytheon, they are in poverty due to high prices and low wages laughing laughing
    2. 0
      5 January 2024 16: 02
      Quote from tsvetahaki
      I wonder how many more masochists will be able to earn doctorates to earn 40 thousand?

      And look for the salaries of Moscow State University researchers, these are still rich. And at the same time, at Moscow State University they fight for part-time work. Because with such a salary the demand is small, you can drink tea at work. But someone is plowing in the hope that some grant will fall
  3. The comment was deleted.
    1. +3
      4 January 2024 09: 19
      Do you always strive to emphasize the merits of those with whom you communicate?
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. +1
          4 January 2024 13: 04
          For part one:
          about the obviousness of the topic:
          Regarding the obvious: the author does not claim a Nobel Prize (for a discovery of great importance for the development of science and society), but highlighted a very particular, but in his opinion, a strategic problem, the failure to solve which will come back much worse than the loss of half of our army, since half of the army can be recruit again, teach, and if scientific schools are lost, it will not be possible to replace them.
          About the obvious, “the destruction of the country is being carried out purposefully by those clans that usurped power through betrayal and the collapse of the USSR.” -not obvious and here's why:
          Purposefulness presupposes properly formulated goals, controls and any kind of process control - in this case destruction, which presupposes high intelligence and design, as well as energy purposefully directed towards achieving the goal. In this regard, I do not share your optimism regarding the intellectual abilities of those pursuing relevant policies on the ground. I don’t believe in various conspiracies and don’t demonize the political system at all - there are quite ordinary people there with ordinary human needs and weaknesses - they didn’t come to us from Mars. Obeying the general law of entropy and movement along the path of least resistance, as well as the principle of capitalism that man is a wolf to man, they only take natural actions within the framework of established socio-political relations based on the same basis (economy) = maximize profits and minimize costs, in to the extent of your understanding of these processes and to the extent of your ability to influence them. As a maxim it sounds like this: worse than a saboteur with a nuclear bomb in the rear is an idiot commander. An idiot not in the clinical sense - everyone has certificates, and real ones. Idiot comes from the word not to, but from, that is, against something. For example, not to develop, and not to spend more than the budget guidelines, as the authorities said, there would be no unnecessary questions, and so on. It's not about people, but about the conditions, the rules of the game in which people necessarily find themselves.
        2. 0
          4 January 2024 13: 44
          Regarding part two: “overthrowing the clan of scoundrels, traitors and enemies of the people and restoring the Soviet Union” and the mistakes of replacing political struggle with economic demands.
          First about the overthrow.
          I’m still in my right mind and I don’t allow myself to publicly call for what you wrote, not because my conscience or even fear for my own skin, but let me remind you that what you call for me to call on in our country, regardless of what right or wrong views I have, is assessed as follows Articles of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation Art. 280 Public calls for extremist activities, paragraph 2, Spanish. Internet :
          “punishable by forced labor for a term of up to five years with deprivation of the right to hold certain positions or engage in certain activities for a term of up to three years or without it, or imprisonment for a term of up to five years with deprivation of the right to hold certain positions or engage in certain activities for a term of up to three years "
          Of course, people live in Siberia, but why do you need this? I recommend that you edit your post for your benefit...
          Now what did V.I. say about these theses? Lenin: article “What to do” part 4 I quote “a) What is handicraft?
          Let's try to answer this question with a small picture of the activities of a typical Social Democratic circle of 1894-1901. We have already pointed out the craze for Marxism among students of this period. This passion, of course, related not only and not even so much to Marxism as a theory, but as an answer to the question: “what to do?”, as a call to go on a campaign against the enemy. And the new warriors went on a campaign with surprisingly primitive equipment and training. In most cases there was almost no equipment and absolutely no training. They went to war like men from a plow, taking only one club. A circle of students, without any connection with the old leaders of the movement, without any connection with circles in other localities or even in other parts of the city (or in other educational institutions), without any organization of individual parts of the revolutionary work, without any systematic plan of activity for any length of time significant period, makes connections with workers and gets down to business. The circle gradually develops wider and broader propaganda and agitation, and by the fact of its performance attracts the sympathy of quite a wide section of workers, the sympathy of a certain part of educated society, which provides money and places more and more groups of young people at the disposal of the “Committee”. The charm of the committee (or struggle union) grows, the scope of its activities grows, and it expands this activity completely spontaneously: the same people who a year or several months ago spoke in student circles and decided the question: “where to go?”, who started and maintained relations with the workers, produced and published leaflets, established contacts with other groups of revolutionaries, obtained literature, began publishing a local newspaper, began to talk about organizing a demonstration, and finally moved on to open military action (and this open military action could be, depending on depending on the circumstances, the very first propaganda leaflet, the first issue of the newspaper, and the first demonstration). And usually the very first beginning of these actions immediately leads to complete failure.

          Immediately and completely precisely because these military actions were not the result of a systematic, pre-meditated and gradually prepared plan for a long and persistent struggle, but simply a spontaneous growth of traditionally carried out circle work; because the police, naturally, almost always knew all the main figures of the local movement, who had “proven” themselves since their student days, and only waited for the most convenient moment for them to raid, deliberately allowing the circle to grow and develop enough to have a tactile corpus delicti, and deliberately always leaving a few people known to her “for routing” (as the technical expression says, used, as far as I know, by both our brother and the gendarmes). Such a war cannot but be compared with the campaign of gangs of peasants armed with clubs against modern troops. And one must only be amazed at the vitality of the movement, which expanded, grew and won victories, despite this complete lack of preparation among those who fought. True, from a historical point of view, the primitiveness of equipment was not only inevitable at the beginning, but even legal, as one of the conditions for the widespread involvement of warriors. But as soon as serious hostilities began (and they began, in essence, with the summer strikes of 1896), the shortcomings of our military organization began to be felt more and more strongly. Having been taken aback at first and having made a number of mistakes (such as appealing to society with a description of the atrocities of the socialists or exiling workers from the capitals to the industrial centers of the province), the government soon adapted to the new conditions of the struggle and managed to put its own detachments of provocateurs, armed with all the improvements, in their proper places, spies and gendarmes. Pogroms began to be repeated so often, to capture such a mass of people, to sweep out local circles to such an extent that the working masses lost literally all their leaders, the movement acquired an incredibly spasmodic character, and absolutely no continuity or coherence of work could be established. The astonishing fragmentation of local leaders, the randomness of the composition of the circles, lack of preparation and narrow horizons in the field of theoretical, political and organizational issues were the inevitable result of the conditions described. Things have come to the point that in some places the workers, due to our lack of restraint and secrecy, are imbued with distrust of the intelligentsia and shun them: intellectuals, they say, lead to failures too thoughtlessly!

          That this amateurism has finally begun to be felt by all thinking Social Democrats as a disease—everyone who is at all familiar with the movement knows this. And so that the reader unfamiliar with him does not think that we are artificially “constructing” a special stage or a special movement disease, we will refer to the witness already mentioned once. Let them not complain about us for the long statement.

          “If a gradual transition to broader practical activity,” writes B-v in No. 6 of “Rab. Dela,” the transition, which is directly dependent on the general transition time experienced by the Russian labor movement, is a characteristic feature... that is, another no less interesting feature in the general mechanism of the Russian labor revolution. We are talking about the general lack of revolutionary forces capable of action, which is felt not only in St. Petersburg, but throughout Russia. With the general revival of the labor movement, with the general development of the working masses, with the ever-increasing frequency of strikes, with the increasingly open mass struggle of the workers, intensifying government persecution, arrests, exile and expulsion, this lack of qualitatively high revolutionary forces is becoming more and more noticeable and, undoubtedly, remains not without influence on the depth and general nature of the movement. Many strikes take place without strong and direct influence from revolutionary organizations... there is a shortage of propaganda leaflets and illegal literature... workers' circles are left without agitators... Along with this, there is a constant need for funds. In short, the growth of the labor movement is faster than the growth and development of revolutionary organizations.

          The number of active revolutionaries turns out to be too insignificant to concentrate in their hands influence on the entire agitated working masses, in order to give all the unrest at least a touch of harmony and organization... Individual circles, individual revolutionaries are not collected, not united, do not constitute a single, strong and disciplined organization with systematically developed units." And, having made the reservation that the immediate appearance of new circles, in place of the broken ones, "proves only the vitality of the movement... but does not yet show the presence of a sufficient number of quite suitable revolutionary figures," the author concludes: "The practical unpreparedness of the St. Petersburg revolutionaries also affects in the results of their work. Recent processes, especially of the “Self-Liberation” and “Struggle of Labor with Capital” groups, have clearly shown that a young agitator, unfamiliar in detail with the working conditions, and therefore the agitation at this plant, who does not know the principles of conspiracy and has learned” (has he learned?) “Only the general views of social democracy, it can work for some 4, 5, 6 months. Then comes the arrest, often leading to the destruction of the entire organization or at least part of it.

          The question is, is the successful and fruitful activity of a group possible if the existence of this group is determined by months? Obviously, the shortcomings of existing organizations cannot be entirely attributed to the transition time... obviously, the quantitative and, most importantly, qualitative composition of existing organizations plays an important role here, and the first task of our Social Democrats... should be the real unification of organizations with a strict choice."
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            1. 0
              5 January 2024 12: 20
              Hello ! I will answer you from the end:
              - Definitely no one pays me for my articles, I don’t know if anyone else is paid, I think it’s more likely no than yes.
              - the article, of course, reflects my convictions that without preserving military science, and these are scientific schools and continuity in their development, first these schools will not exist, then the Makhnovshchina will begin in the development of weapons, and then there will simply be a degradation in the level of development, and this is strategic our country is a loser and cannot be changed by any political decision. In this sense, the loss of scientific schools is comparable to the death of part of the army and navy, and even more dangerous, since the material and personnel content in the armed forces is relatively easy to restore, then the physical departure of the head of a direction in science in the absence of a successor usually leads to the closure of this direction for decades, if not forever.
              As for money (material resources) and life: with any form of power, political and military leadership, in conditions of limited resources, have to solve the difficult task of choosing short-term and long-term priorities, what and who to sacrifice in the name of more.
              In 1941, despite the difficult situation on all fronts, the State Defense Committee continued to finance science and, in particular, the work of the special committee (the future nuclear bomb), although in general it was not obvious that something would work out and when it would work out. Stalin and Beria can be treated differently, but even the most notorious enemies and propagandists did not consider them idiots.
              The issue of preserving scientific schools and their development is a strategic issue and perhaps thousands of arrows will fly at me, but for the truth it does not matter who proclaimed it, an enemy, a friend or anyone else, so let there be no division, half the army, pay less to pensioners, the allowance for children will be lower, they will even get into the profits of the oligarchs, but without military science the question is only 5-15 years, when no courage and will to win will replace modern models of technology, and I repeat, simply by a strong-willed decision to restore, let’s do such issues are not resolved by words at all. In absolute numbers, these central research institutes require pennies; after all, there are not millions or hundreds of thousands of people working there. Several thousand throughout the country. Moreover, if in Moscow you don’t change the same tile three times a year, there will still be money left not only for science, but also for new factories, so that everything that science creates can be brought to life.

              On the intelligence of political opponents
              I don’t consider political opponents fools at all, all fools work, like the author, for 35-70000 rubles and write articles for free, for example, here, smart people work for completely different incomes and do not spend personal time on what they consider important for the common good . I just don’t think it’s right to demonize them, dehumanize them and give them some kind of super abilities, for example intellectual ones. But the fact that the state has an apparatus of violence is not new, nor is the fact that it is quite effective.
              1. The comment was deleted.
    2. +12
      4 January 2024 10: 14
      Quote from Viktior Vinland
      The country and people are really being destroyed, and this policy has been carried out continuously since 1991.
      First of all, high-tech production, science, and education are destroyed. And not only in the military field.

      Yes. But systemic destruction began in the fall of 1993, when a certain “group” seized all power.
      That's right - they destroy everything that is good and useful and honest... and pious.
      ---------------
      The people (but not all!!) instinctively resist... relying on a 1000-year genetic memory,
      -----------------
      The author of the article is right about the meager salaries. But this not the only (and not even the main) instrument of destruction.
      From all deeds and fruits it is clear that the goal is to turn people into the “blotter” from the famous film. Mentally.
      PS ( And Fox (Prigozhin) was killed .. because - “Wow! Shameful wolf!” ).
    3. 0
      4 January 2024 10: 58
      The country has been destroyed since 1953, at least.
      Since the 80s, we have reached higher rates and this has become noticeable to the “naked eye”, only there are a minimum of people with eyes left, they have raised a flock...
      1. +8
        4 January 2024 11: 59
        Quote: BelkaGrandf
        The country has been destroyed since 1953, at least.

        No need to exaggerate so much! Priorities and goals began to change only with Perestroika. And they began to systematically introduce (impose) new (criminal) priorities and goals (concepts) in the fall of 1993.
    4. +10
      4 January 2024 13: 31
      Yes, you can’t argue with that... Until 1994, I worked at the Siberian Institute of Aviation... I prepared my Ph.D. thesis... The salary was such that my family (including two children) ate almost nothing but potatoes, grown with my own hands... Gaidar then declared to the whole country that we don’t need aviation, we’ll sell the oil and buy the rest... I took the hint - I went to work in the oil industry.
      1. +9
        4 January 2024 14: 40
        Quote from Andy_nsk
        worked at the Siberian Aviation Institute

        It’s nice to meet here, albeit a former one, an employee of SIBNIA. I wrote a thesis there (calculation of the strength of the suspension unit on the SU24 wing). I also stopped working in my specialty a long time ago for the same reason.
        1. +5
          5 January 2024 12: 18
          I also stopped working in my specialty a long time ago for the same reason.

          I work in my specialty (electronics engineer), we develop and produce instruments for the oil industry. By the way, I was at a meeting of graduates; out of our entire cohort (about 100 people), only two continue to work as engineers, besides me there is one more (he lives in Kazakhstan, he is Russian). Thanks to Gaidar and Chubais!
      2. +5
        4 January 2024 17: 02
        The salary was such that my family (including two children) ate almost nothing but potatoes, grown with my own hands...

        How much did you pay for housing and communal services then, what part of your salary did they make up?
        did your guardianship come to you to see what was in your refrigerator, whether there were any cracks in the wallpaper, and whether the children needed to be taken away from you until you somehow earned money for a glossy European-quality renovation?
        1. +3
          4 January 2024 17: 40
          Quote: Stinging_Nettle
          How much did you pay for housing and communal services then, what part of your salary did they make up?
          did your guardianship come to you to see what was in your refrigerator, whether there were any cracks in the wallpaper, and whether the children needed to be taken away from you until you somehow earned money for a glossy European-quality renovation?

          You probably didn't understand his comment. He writes about 1994.
          In 1981-85, science workers were paid very well. More than skilled workers.
        2. +3
          5 January 2024 12: 35
          How much did you pay for housing and communal services then, what part of your salary did they make up?
          and guardianship came to you to see what was in your refrigerator

          I don’t remember how much I paid for housing and communal services, now I know that this payment is an insignificant part of my salary (I also receive a pension, but I continue to work). I simply wouldn’t allow guardianship into my house, none of my friends have any guardianship, there’s no need to make waves, I only believe in what I see and hear personally! What I wish for truth-tellers like you: sometimes look behind your blinders!
  4. -3
    4 January 2024 03: 43
    Why don’t the management of the institutes and their employees fight for the labor rights of their teams?

    Because a person cannot be terribly afraid of saying the wrong thing about politics and sit down and at the same time be proactive and courageous in other issues. It doesn't happen that way.
    As for the defense industry specifically, the article does not indicate the main thing - what is the average age of employees there. They usually don’t hire young people there, as elsewhere (they don’t hire people without experience, you can’t gain experience without work, kids, get a higher education, it’s very useful in life). Although in the defense industry you can understand that they are not hiring, a normal young person will not be able to stand working in an older group for long.
    1. +5
      4 January 2024 07: 04
      About fears and political freedoms. We haven’t jailed anyone yet for fighting for their labor rights, and there is a chance of getting into difficulties in relations with higher management, but you have to have balls and not only think about yourself personally, that’s all. Let’s be honest, we don’t put people in jail right or left. Therefore, I see the lack of struggle largely due to the fear of losing a position and separation from the management team. I may be wrong.
      About age: the facts are presented, I’m not a part-time employee of the intelligence agencies - I don’t have a database with data on the age of workers throughout our military-industrial complex, and I think it’s not appropriate to fantasize. Is there a lot of it in our design bureaus and central research institutes for those who are well over 60? I’ll assume that it’s not a little, but I don’t know how much in grams.
      As for endurance when working in a group of older people: youth is a disadvantage that quickly passes. In my coordinates there is no concept of old or young: there is a specialist of different skill levels and nothing more, and his age has nothing to do with the matter at all.
      1. +21
        4 January 2024 10: 13
        I slightly disagree. And you can suffer for labor rights. It’s one thing to fight for rights in the “Zhuravlik” kindergarten, with a team of 12 people, but a strike by truck drivers is something completely different. With armored vehicles and cutting circles - 24. Don't remind me what minor problems the union leader had. You can search for the video, I think not everything was deleted. Or a tractor march in Kuban. True, this is a little different, but not too far from the question. How many months did the leader serve? He recently died without having achieved the truth in continuously drawn-out trials. From the age of 16. So they imprison you for everything, and for nothing at all. It’s just that the character is not widespread, and they imprison those who greatly interfere with the leadership’s ability to live in peace. Something like this.
        1. -1
          4 January 2024 11: 21
          Quote: Lykases1
          How many months did the leader serve?

          The first trade union leaders in the USA were simply killed...
          Or do you think that under the Tsar Stalin/Lenin was entitled to dessert for revolutionary activities??!!
          1. +8
            4 January 2024 12: 51
            Exactly. And even earlier, human rights defenders were eaten. And why do you compare rallies and revolutions, trade union leaders and Stalin/Lenin? In your opinion, if a trade union defends the rights of its members, then this is loosening the bonds and shaking the foundations? Hard? What about the Constitution? Federal Law? Or is this all wrong? Do you need to understand?
            1. 0
              4 January 2024 13: 02
              Quote: Lykases1
              In your opinion, if a trade union defends the rights of its members, then this is loosening the bonds and shaking the foundations?
              if Now there was socialism, then everyone would have Feng Shui on the trade union leaders. What they demanded was paid from the state budget, out of nowhere...
              And now any wishes - out of pocket capital.Any pushback against capital is perceived as pushback against itself personally.
        2. +3
          4 January 2024 13: 49
          So they imprison you for everything, and for nothing at all. It’s just that the character is not widespread, and they imprison those who greatly interfere with the leadership’s ability to live in peace. Something like this.

          In fact, the more important figure is that it is nowhere to be found - how many people were not imprisoned only because they fought for their rights, realized that the matter smelled of kerosene, quit everywhere, where they had not yet been fired, and fell silent.
          If they avoided arrest at the cost of becoming silent invisible people, that's the whole iceberg. Those who got to the point of landing are just the tip of the iceberg.
          And we must say separately about the servants of the law, from whom, since the time of Major Dymovsky, quite a few stories have received wide coverage. In Sochi, the guys were put on the federal wanted list, also a well-known case.
      2. +6
        4 January 2024 11: 24
        We haven’t jailed anyone yet for fighting for their labor rights,

        For drugs found in a pocket, for unpaid taxes, for murder, for LGBT propaganda, for which, by the way, until recently heterosexuals “have not yet been imprisoned,” but “they are not imprisoned for this yet,” as you can see, in any the moment may change.
        And you continue to believe that there is no difference between thirty-year-olds and ninety-year-olds.
        1. +4
          4 January 2024 13: 01
          And you continue to believe that between thirty year olds and ninety-year-olds there is no difference.

          Yes, of course.
          Of course, amongthirty year olds“There are competent specialists, but their number is negligible.
          With unconditional alertness of mind, they have neither the opportunity to learn nor the motivation to spend time on it. It is much more important to develop effective self-presentation skills.
          1. +3
            4 January 2024 17: 08
            It is much more important to develop effective self-presentation skills.

            And who is to blame that in our time this is really much more important?
            If you don’t have a hairy paw, you come from the street and mumble something, no one will spend a long time figuring out whether you are a genius or not.
            If you also need to talk not immediately with the manager, but first with the HR/HR officer, then the best chance is for the one who speaks the same level of development and speaks the same language with this HR officer.
            1. +2
              4 January 2024 18: 36
              And who is to blame that in our time this is really much more important?

              It's not a fault, it's a problem.
              Of course, you can gradually build a reputation that reduces your job search to choosing which offer to accept, but this takes years and the outcome is by no means guaranteed.

              If you still need to talk not immediately with the manager, but first with HR

              But this plays both ways, since among recruiters there are often girls after school, without brains or education, and it’s easier for someone of the same age to jump over them than for a gray bison, whose qualifications are, in principle, incapable of assessing them.
              But the leader also may not understand anything about the subject, this is now a common thing, and young pies are generally the norm of life.

              This wasn’t even said the day before yesterday:
              Any worker two years younger than you is a green youth; any worker five years older than you is a retarded old man.

              And nothing can be done about it; we are always more comfortable among those close in age.
      3. +5
        4 January 2024 13: 10
        but you have to have balls

        From urban horror stories. There are unofficial "black lists" of personnel officers. When I got there, they wouldn’t even take me by courier. The reason for the hit was that he “brazenly demanded compensation for missed vacation.”
        Well, since the list is unofficial, it’s problematic to remove yourself from there.
        1. +3
          4 January 2024 13: 27
          There is some truth in this. I worked in a network organization (which is not the Internet, but gives light)), ran away from there due to the tyranny of the management, decided to get a job in another company for the same profile, fig. In a private conversation, the HR officer explained that there was an agreement not to hire employees from “competitors.”
        2. -3
          4 January 2024 14: 15
          The best recipe is the growth of professionalism, the presence of a non-ordinary (easily replaceable) profession and the availability of skills for related professions. And of course there are all sorts of lists, but the private owner doesn’t care about all these games. If there is no criminal record on serious charges, all this may interfere with working in state-owned companies.
          And the global recipe is to build a strong trade union. Further more
          1. +7
            4 January 2024 16: 10
            What you say is correct. I'm talking about the trade union. In some parallel universe this might even work. What about reality? We have opposition in the State Duma. As if. AND? The same thing will happen with the trade union - friendly approval, or those who disagree will begin to have difficulties. Further more.
            1. -5
              4 January 2024 16: 41
              It all starts with the micro-collective, and the micro-collective with itself. Know your rights. Do the work in accordance with your job description - read it well and copy it at home and this will solve 95% of the issues.
              It is always wise to build the issue of the struggle for rights by searching for allies and relying on the requirements of the law. It may sound like a slogan, but it works.
              1. +5
                4 January 2024 17: 00
                Sorry, I don't mean to offend you, but this is starting to sound like a blind man talking to a deaf man. Maybe somewhere it works like this, everything is according to the Labor Code, everything is according to the employment contract, where the responsibilities are clearly stated, but I don’t see it. For me it's a world of pink fairies and blue unicorns. By the way, did you hear someone from the government say that we have reached fourth place in the world, overtaking Japan. How so? It turns out that everything is fine with you, your salaries are decent. There are certain difficulties, but they are gradually being resolved.
                1. 0
                  4 January 2024 17: 27
                  Someone somewhere does not work according to the Labor Code of the Russian Federation. There are several options: don’t fight without knowing your rights, know and don’t fight for your rights, know and negotiate, and when it’s impossible to retreat, fight. Fine. What other options do you see?
                  1. +5
                    4 January 2024 21: 02
                    That's the thing, colleague, I don't see any options. Normal. Now, tell me, why do the top people change anything? Do you think they are worried about the state of science? Not at all. Maybe if your design bureau goes on strike in its entirety, and this is covered in the media, something will change a little. Big people will come, promise a 5k increase and, most of them, will run to work like a sweetheart. There are plenty of examples. Maybe they won't be deceived. Only this is not a solution, and if there is a solution, it will be a local one. You will have a higher salary - the rest will have the same salary. The system needs to be changed. And she has no need to change. She feels so good. Change it by force? This is a revolution, and it can destroy even what exists to the ground. Yes, and there they need a leader, who will allow him? Let's remember Rokhlin. So I don’t know, colleague, I don’t know. It seems to me that it's too late. The system was born, grew and strengthened. You can kill a child with your finger, you will break a finger on an adult, and a trained fighter will break his arm in all joints before it reaches him. And the fighter is prepared. So nothing will go anywhere beyond our conversations. Because it’s not convenient to eat with a plastered hand
                    1. 0
                      6 January 2024 03: 46
                      It’s quite normal that they don’t give a damn about my life, the main thing is that I don’t give a damn! To add a 5, revolutions do not need, like trade unions, a conversation with management and a constant increase in skill. Here, doubling your salary is a more creative question.
          2. +4
            4 January 2024 17: 14
            The best recipe is the growth of professionalism, the presence of a non-ordinary (easily replaceable) profession and the availability of skills for related professions.

            Related professions in terms of skills in the absence of a diploma in them are useless, and a non-ordinary profession can lead to the fact that you are needed only in one office in the city, and the boss there understands perfectly well that you have nowhere to go.
            1. -4
              4 January 2024 17: 24
              If a person is a design engineer who designed, for example, gas turbines, master the development of technological equipment - how will this interfere with finding a job in a new specialty?
              Now the piece of paper as such is the second question, the main thing is that the person really knows how to do it. There are two options: develop or complain about a difficult life, and life is really difficult.
              1. +6
                4 January 2024 17: 29
                Now the piece of paper as such is the second question, the main thing is that the person really knows how to do it.

                The piece of paper is just the first and main question. This isn't the nineties. All your reasoning is very naive, as they say now - uncomplicated.
    2. +10
      4 January 2024 11: 18
      Young people in production need to be taught, he doesn’t understand why the guy next to him, having time to drink tea (which they are now trying to ban everywhere due to the stupidity of the managers), has more and doesn’t get so worked up. And that guy has an engineering diploma and his own equipment and he doesn’t need a technologist and reads a drawing like a young man, say, a book of bunnies. Now about the workers drinking tea on the spot - the manager is shaking it like he has seizures as a violation of the labor regime. Well, okay, we don’t drink tea, but we don’t do more than the norm, so a couple of percent - the worker’s rates will be cut due to the stupidity of their managers. In a word, when they think that they pay well, then let them think that the worker works well. In a word, such a circle is closed in many industries, since it is not production technicians who rule, but managers from who the hell you understand.
      1. +8
        4 January 2024 12: 39
        I work at a bakery factory, I’m an electrician, young people come and look at my salary (+-34 in hand), they’re aghast, and say it’s better to work in delivery, the salary is 000 times more and a flexible schedule. At the same time, the knowledge is 2, but what the hell with it, we will train, we will help, BUT, they are not interested in this with such payment. point 0 - our immediate leadership is adequate, they do the cutting for us, BUT, the higher-ranking leadership lives in a different reality. For example: “we need to make 2 tons of LOaves, without stopping the line! They are grating, no way, because this line can only make LOaves, and only 15 tons! They, ok, understood, got it, BUT! so that by the end of the shift there would be 10 tons of LOaves! And so it is everywhere and in everything.
      2. -1
        4 January 2024 19: 05
        Quote: saigon
        Well, okay, we don’t drink tea, but we don’t do more than the norm, so a couple of percent - the worker’s rates will be cut due to the stupidity of their managers. In a word, when they think that they pay well, then let them think that the worker works well. In a word, such a circle is closed in many industries, since it is not production technicians who are in charge, but managers from who the hell you understand.

        I absolutely agree - in Novocherkassk in 1962 they also ruled
        Quote: saigon
        managers from hell who knows.

        The main thing is that there were no oligarchs and the government was native....
    3. +3
      4 January 2024 15: 39
      Quote: Stinging_Nettle
      As for the defense industry specifically, the article does not indicate the main thing - what is the average age of employees there. Young people are usually not taken there,

      For example, we have young people, but mostly etc. And so workers are mostly over 40. Recently, one young man left from 40 thousand to 80. He worked for us for a year and their salary was raised at their old place
  5. +17
    4 January 2024 03: 45
    Everyone knows and understands everything perfectly. You need to ask yourself a simple question: who benefits from this? Traitors have long destroyed all industries, education, science and medicine. You can’t get them, because they sit very high... I think another 6 years and we won’t recognize our country, everything is according to plan.
    1. -9
      4 January 2024 03: 53
      Traitors have long destroyed all industries, education, science and medicine. You can't reach them because they sit very high...

      Nothing of the kind, everything was ruined mainly by ordinary employees. They took advantage of opportunities to fool themselves, humiliate subordinates and students, drag them upward through connections and leave behind the doors those without connections. Now these people are proud of their many years of experience.
  6. +22
    4 January 2024 04: 38
    - Why don’t the management of the institutes and their employees fight for the labor rights of their teams?

    Fighting windmills? Or with those who are assigned to manage the “filthy” achievements, “licious” confirmations of scientific qualifications and annual incomes of hundreds of millions of rubles? Look at the Labor Code of the Russian Federation (Labor Code of the Russian Federation) and you will immediately understand whose rights are protected the most in the country.
    - why did the Ministry of Defense make such systemic errors in personnel work and do not strive not only to correct them, but to exclude from the management those who were guilty of this or should have, but did not report in any way, did not act/inactive in this regard?

    And in the Ministry of Defense, are all personnel selected taking into account experience and merit? Are there really no “hey, general or hey, general’s lady” positions there anymore? Even in this system, difficulties arise in suitability for the position due to the system of appointment from among the “pleasant” and “executive”, rather than the smart and smart ones.
    - why are these problems clear and important to me, and those who are 10 steps higher are not concerned about this - maybe we should switch places?

    Yeah, so that you flash before your eyes every day and cut your truth? Does anyone need this? “Truth” should be such that it pleases, and does not reveal various shortcomings.
    - perhaps they all live wonderfully and earn decent money, and I am categorically mistaken and draw erroneous conclusions - but then what other facts should I base my conclusions on?

    I like the word “earn” in this sentence. Our country has built the most shameful practice in the world, when a working person can live in poverty, while being considered “middle class”:
    1. +8
      4 January 2024 13: 24
      Does anyone need this? “Truth” should be such that it pleases, and does not reveal various shortcomings.

      What about Comrade Prigogine? So he ran, shouted, cut the truth.
      And let me tell you, comrades, he ended very badly!
      So I completely agree with you, no one in management (and even the lowest echelon) can do all these feats what for (cough cough) are not needed.
      In our military-industrial complex (I think whoever works there knows what I’m talking about) only the bosses and their relatives/godfathers/in-laws/brothers receive money. Who are also bosses. but less.
      The rest are 35000 rubles.
      1. -5
        4 January 2024 14: 25
        There’s another everyday-political question here:
        When thinking about leadership and its features (and rarely do people like bosses), it is worth remembering that they always lead only with the consent of those they lead. That the one who leads needs those whom he leads no less than the other way around. And the main thing here is not the presence of fools at the top, but not the ability of the lower classes to minimally organize, not to seize power, change the political system, no, simply to defend their human dignity and economic interests.
  7. +23
    4 January 2024 05: 02
    The day before yesterday, in a cart, a “military informant” read a letter from a soldier from near Kremennaya. One of the problems (the second year of the war is ending) is the continued lack of normal working noise-free communications. As I understand it, there are simply no people left who know how to do anything in this area. There are a lot of directors of enterprises and heads of various departments, and there are no specialists left doing business at such rates. Some to Israel, some to the USA, some to private shops. Maybe I'm wrong and soon everything will be different (with communication). Same thing with night lights. The Internet is full of advertisements for sales by companies, but there are few in the army... Money was found for the titanic Poseidon, but there is not enough money for night lights, communications, copters, loaf-type machines. Questions remain, answers are not yet in sight.
    1. +6
      4 January 2024 05: 50
      One of the problems (the second year of the war is ending) is the continued lack of normal working noise-free communications. As I understand it, there are simply no people left who know how to do anything in this area.

      I am sure that you understand perfectly well that the problem is much deeper. The Russian Federation is now a backward country in terms of microelectronics production. Communication is a clear indicator. Look at what the FSB, FSO and other services use. Do you think there is communication between Russian manufacturers on Russian chips?
      1. +7
        4 January 2024 12: 47
        Yes, we don’t have simple bearings, but what we do have is a quiet horror. Yes, almost the entire set is complete.... Well, with a small trailer, they introduced TU instead of GOST and began to rivet whatever they wanted.
    2. +22
      4 January 2024 06: 01
      Billions were found for a lot of things. What is not necessary.
      To shoot a feature film (shit they say) in zero gravity in space, for example, Billions were found.
      There were no night lights.
      Apparently the State Department is doing shit
      1. -4
        4 January 2024 11: 34
        Quote: Ivan№One
        To shoot a feature film (shit they say) in zero gravity in space, for example, Billions were found.

        20 million dollars and it’s not even in the first hundred of our new films in terms of cost - Viy, for example, costs 26 million.
        The film is not a masterpiece, but not bad.
        Quote: Ivan№One
        There were no night lights.
        and they were found, but there are nuances...
        Go to Avito and see how much is being sold there b / a -excellent night lights and sights.
        “You’re not a guest at work, just take away a nail” (c) still works today...
    3. +2
      4 January 2024 11: 23
      So the sailors needed him, but what about the general? They shouldn't climb on the front end.
    4. man
      +1
      4 January 2024 15: 30
      One of the problems (the second year of the war is ending) is the continued lack of normal working noise-free communications.
      Unfortunately, communications have always been our weak point, even under the USSR.
      Radio platoon commander.
  8. +14
    4 January 2024 05: 22
    That's right. My friend’s son, after graduating from Mechanics and Mathematics, works in the USA, where he is paid, by our standards, just crazy money. Unfortunately, we cannot earn that kind of money. The state needs to look towards people with higher education, who are promoting science and production, and not at traders and hairdressers
  9. +8
    4 January 2024 05: 50
    most likely nothing will change in the foreseeable future. this is a fundamental property of the system existing here in all its manifestations.
    The solution is to continue along the path of borrowing and stealing technologies developed by more developed countries.
    1. +13
      4 January 2024 06: 05
      Quote: VZEM100
      the way out is to continue on the path of borrowing and stealing technology

      The trouble is that even this is not being done...
      1. +15
        4 January 2024 09: 40
        The trouble is that even this is not being done...


        Unfortunately, to do this, we need the same highly qualified personnel who understand a certain topic.

        After reading the article I was dumbfounded. It turned out to be much worse than I thought.
        Then he calmed down.
        I understand - everything is logical for this system of government.
        In the USSR, many ministers began their careers as a production site foreman or a design engineer. During their activities, they gradually climbed the personnel ladder, becoming a competent leader who well understands all the problems in the field of management.

        Currently there is no such selection for leadership positions.
        But there are various management training programs at RANEPA, HIGH SCHOOL OF BUSINESS NRU HSE, etc.
        Therefore, many of our ministers do not have experience in the field of their leadership, moreover, they do not have specialized education. One can say about each minister:
        "...Character is Nordic, self-possessed. Maintains good relations with his workmates. Fulfills his official duty impeccably...he has not been noticed in any connections that discredit him. Recognized with awards..."

        PS
        I have little hope for changes in the government system after the return of people from the North Military District combat zone.
        1. +2
          4 January 2024 11: 38
          I have little hope for changes in the government system after the return of people from the North Military District combat zone.

          It was said: mobilized indefinitely.
        2. +3
          4 January 2024 11: 49
          Quote: AA17
          In the USSR, many ministers began their careers as a production site foreman or a design engineer. During their activities, they gradually climbed the personnel ladder, becoming a competent leader who well understands all the problems in the field of management.

          Yeah ...
          L.P. Beria is an architect by education. Without a legal education, he is the People's Commissar of Internal Affairs. Without a technical education, he supervises the nuclear...
          There is no direct connection between leadership ability, long climbs and eventual effectiveness.
          Stalin did not rise slowly, studying each step for a long time.
          Kalashnikov had no special or weapons training at all.
          What kind of military education did Budyonny have - when he commanded the 1st Cavalry Army?
          And such examples are not even the notorious carriage with a trolley, but trains
          And the opposite situation - MSGs with EbN grew up the career ladder from step to step, carefully. The result is obvious...
          1. +7
            4 January 2024 12: 03
            I'm not surprised by the examples given. There will always be a few talented people.
            You got excited when you said:
            And such examples are not even the notorious carriage with a trolley, but trains
            1. man
              +8
              4 January 2024 12: 17
              Quote: AA17
              I'm not surprised by the examples given. There will always be a few talented people.
              You got excited when you said:
              And such examples are not even the notorious carriage with a trolley, but trains

              Not just talented, but brilliant. And the glory of the Soviet government, which gave these people the opportunity to realize their abilities
              for the benefit of the country
            2. 0
              5 January 2024 10: 47
              Quote: AA17
              I'm not surprised by the examples given. There will always be a few talented people.
              You got excited when you said:
              And such examples are not even the notorious carriage with a trolley, but trains

              The problem is that talented people are sufficiently studied and the results are immediately visible.

              А Research activities CONDITIONAL the Minister CONDITIONAL the electronics industry - which grew from masters and brought the industry to the point of "- and on the shelf - batteries for watches" (c) - well, they don’t exist in nature.....
              Just as there are no memoirs of the ministers who brought high chemistry, pharmaceuticals, and so on in the USSR to the state in which they were, and this was NOT flourishing - as in the nuclear or defense industry.
              Didn’t you know any tyrants who passed through the forest and were nothing of themselves?
              Haven’t you seen nuggets in the army that were easier to push upward than to be kicked out of the army with a bang? In the SA, by the collapse of the USSR, there were such without exception- careerists and mediocrities. It was they who pumped up the USSR and 1 Chechen
          2. +3
            4 January 2024 14: 34
            There is no need to take the post-revolutionary period, when amateurs came to power. Therefore, the famine in 33 happened because the country was ruled by illiterate people. The communists just hid it. And, let’s say, in Brezhnev’s times the personnel career ladder already clearly existed. The Minister of Defense had a military education, and the Minister of Railways had a railway background, and often began with a position like the head of a small station.
        3. +6
          4 January 2024 12: 29
          I knew a beekeeper who was smart, cheerful and kind. One day, while drinking a glass of mead, he talked about his life. Commander of the reconnaissance platoon, after the war he led a gang, robbed stores, served 20 years. I don’t know, I’m not particularly deluded, I don’t believe that people with combat experience will rush into power, or rather, they will, but who will allow them. Peskov’s son also fought, he is our future government.
        4. BAI
          +6
          4 January 2024 15: 25
          But RANEPA has various management training programs

          RANEPA is a cooperative for issuing diplomas to high-ranking businessmen and government officials.
          I suspect that Matvienko, Shoigu, Zyuganov and others don’t even know where RANEPA is located, but they have diplomas
  10. +14
    4 January 2024 05: 57
    “they started in the 90s, under Serdyukov they continued - as part of the general processes of transferring/relocating scientific centers from Moscow, and, surprisingly, they continue to destroy, and the ongoing NWO, as they say, is not an obstacle...”

    Apparently you were afraid to write the names Putin or Shuiga?
    I see.
    Oh, the damned West, it’s destroying our scientific thought
    1. +11
      4 January 2024 09: 46
      Quote: Ivan№One
      Apparently you were afraid to write the names Putin or Shuiga?
      I see.

      I understand too. Strelkov was very brave! But where is he now?
    2. +1
      4 January 2024 15: 00
      The issue here is not only about personal skin, although I don’t plan to sell it cheaply, just as I don’t plan to sell it at a high price. The question is different.
      Despite all that the President and the Minister of Defense are unconditionally responsible for this issue, there is no one to point the finger at, no less, but for me more important is that the team of the relevant Central Research Institutes and the public do not change the situation, at least they do not raise it for discussion . The president can be great, but in the end he can be worthless, just a person... But the state, society is not one person, but all of us....
  11. +14
    4 January 2024 06: 02
    The situation is the same in citizen science. The West, having accumulated a critical mass of knowledge and technology, went into a hopeless gap. Now China and India have moved along the same path.
  12. -11
    4 January 2024 06: 12
    I think this direction is the right one. You just need to hire private traders and pay them Grants, they are more efficient and you can feel the results. But these structures have become bronzed and outdated; it is high time to liquidate them. There is a central research institute, but there are no copters or communications. The meaning of their existence? This money can be given to civilian universities and they will do an excellent job with this work, or private entrepreneurs are the same.
    1. +1
      4 January 2024 06: 23
      who sits there in these bronzed structures? It would be interesting to try to attract Western scientists as in the time of Peter the Great. Will there be anyone willing or is it unrealistic?
      1. +9
        4 January 2024 09: 01
        Quote: ivan2022
        who sits there in these bronzed structures? It would be interesting to try to attract Western scientists as in the time of Peter the Great. Will there be anyone willing or is it unrealistic?

        Even an electrician from Afghanistan would not agree to work for that kind of money. There, his salary under the Taliban starts at $300. For a company with a foreign investor, about $500.
    2. +14
      4 January 2024 06: 27
      Scientific grants have existed in our country for a long time. But getting them is a problem with the necessary connections with grant givers. The money is received, the work is completed, a report is written, which is swallowed by the grantors. Then we finish and apply for a new grant. laughing You are as naive as a child. In a country that does not need industry, and import substitution is just a PR campaign, science is even less needed. Neither with grenades nor without grants.
      1. 0
        5 January 2024 12: 08
        We need grants for the development of fundamental science and grants for solving production problems that arise today; we need grants for the assimilation and implementation of algorithms developed abroad into production. There are interested industries, but the interest of the industry is by no means the interest of managers. In the country, unfortunately, the strongest lobby is the lobby interested in selling raw materials abroad, this is the fastest and least expensive way to get rich.
    3. +10
      4 January 2024 12: 44
      It’s interesting which industry, over the 30 years of capitalism, civilian fee-paying universities have advanced forward to the level of developed capitalist countries. Maybe it’s not the structures that have become bronzed, but the structure management system that has rusted. Our nuclear industry survived because the private sector was afraid to take responsibility.
      1. +1
        5 January 2024 01: 15
        Quote: Sergei Fonov
        Our nuclear industry survived because the private sector was afraid to take responsibility.

        Yes, even if there was such a private owner who is not afraid of responsibility, he would, if not be imprisoned, then be sent away. After all, it’s not comme il faut to lead a radioactive desert. And everyone understands that private management of any industry means savings on everything, including safety. And selling illiquid assets for scrap metal, literally! Let such private owners into the nuclear power plant and that’s it, an accident is guaranteed, while all of So and So NPP LLC has been liquidated, the management is abroad. That is why they did not allow the nuclear industry to be privatized. But Chubais wanted stopudov!
  13. +6
    4 January 2024 06: 15
    The author...there is a serious flaw in the article...the specifics of remuneration for our opponents in the Pentagon (in scientific military laboratories of private companies in the USA, Britain, Sweden and then) are not disclosed...everything is learned by comparison.
    1. +2
      4 January 2024 06: 21
      probably a mixed system. some are allocated by governments and some by corporations on a contractual basis.
    2. +10
      4 January 2024 07: 33
      I am grateful to the author without quotes for pointing out the growth points. But you know, before their Pentagon salaries, it’s neither cold nor hot, even if they are flooded with dollars or die out... I really care about our Motherland. And then why go to great lengths about their science in the military-industrial complex - he made a comparison with our own Moscow loaders, taxi drivers, sellers...
      Then they don’t have such a central research institute system, they have a military-industrial complex there and science works differently, which often leads to the fact that the interests of Corporations actually defeat their own national interests.
      1. +2
        4 January 2024 14: 59
        Quote: gromovanton
        I’m not too cold or hot for their Pentagon salaries, even if they’re flooded with dollars or die out... I really care about our Motherland

        Don’t you see a causal connection between “their Pentagon salaries”, working conditions and the “brain drain” from Russia?
        Here's an example from a couple of academics:
        RAS President Alexander Sergeev announced the following data: in the 1990s and early 2000s, 40 thousand professors left Russia. Only professors! In your opinion, is this not a loss of the country’s intellectual potential?

        https://spbvedomosti.ru/people/artem-totolyan/

        and about the imitation of scientific activity, fake master's, master's and doctoral dissertations for sale, too, a lot could be said...
        1. +2
          4 January 2024 15: 03
          There are several questions in your question, about brain flow and about imitation of scientific activity.
          I won’t write about imitation - I haven’t deeply studied the issue and understanding the causes and consequences with you, so I can’t share it with you.
          Regarding the flow, the question is not that people go abroad for internships, work is good experience and normal practice, the question is what conditions are created here so that they want to return and develop!
  14. +3
    4 January 2024 06: 16
    It would be interesting to look at the results of an experiment to increase the salaries of these employees by 10 times...would this lead to the same multiple increase in productivity.
    1. +8
      4 January 2024 06: 39
      We have always had a lot of people who like to turn work into an idiotic “interesting experiment.” You have cave-like interests, that’s the thing.

      And also there is always an irresistible desire to destroy the country because “the economy is not working efficiently.” It's the same as drowning a child because he doesn't swim well.

      In fact, if a country needs its own industry and technology, there will be ways to finance those scientists who are useful.

      Even in fundamental science. In the USSR, for example, the president of the USSR Academy of Sciences had a higher salary than the minister. And no one was afraid of it.
      You're not afraid that thieves and bandits are becoming billionaires, are you? And as soon as it comes to science, a great truth-seeker immediately awakens in people like you. And there are tens of millions of them
      1. +1
        4 January 2024 06: 47
        I worked for a while at a state-owned enterprise, and although it’s not super-duper, the system is the same, so I’m asking. It seems to me that there are some internal reasons that we are always in this situation.
    2. +4
      4 January 2024 06: 42
      Not immediately, of course, but in a few years, personnel will begin to arrive there who will be interested from the university bench. If you don’t change anything, then the only conclusion is... I won’t use bad words. Bad conclusion. But our statistics have already reported that the average salary in the country is 70 thousand. So...
    3. +11
      4 January 2024 06: 43
      In any serious matter - for example, in health, if you kill the body for decades and bring it to the 4th stage of cancer, and then start drinking handfuls of vitamin pills and at the same time assert that the body is to blame, well, it’s not only fair, but also reasonable.. In order for something to work out in science-intensive areas, long-term conditions and clear rules of the game are needed, since working and essentially investing one’s life into a business that is needed today, and tomorrow, thank you, we all go our separate ways, is impossible on a systematic basis.
      1. +3
        4 January 2024 06: 49
        A normal body would not allow this
    4. +7
      4 January 2024 13: 19
      “here and now” would not lead to a multiple increase in performance. But a good salary allows you to take not those who came, but at least weed out the worst ones, this is the minimum. Because the “hole” in the staff is the manager’s desire to reduce the salary, as if you are already coping, naturally, without increasing the salary of existing workers.
      And at most, a normal salary allows you to demand something from employees.
  15. -3
    4 January 2024 06: 35
    The article is crazy, no one in Moscow works for 50000 and will not work, and without registration they will not take such a job
    1. GGV
      0
      4 January 2024 08: 56
      Why, in Moscow, now even in regional centers a specialist’s salary is in the region of 70-80 thousand rubles. considered the norm.
    2. +9
      4 January 2024 11: 54
      77alex77
      Some time ago they offered me a job as a programmer in an enterprise subordinate to the KRET concern (if you don’t know, google it). Salary 35 rub. Moscow, Baumanskaya metro area. Now look at the salary of a programmer in private offices. The employees there spend so much on coffee
  16. The comment was deleted.
  17. +1
    4 January 2024 06: 48
    Apparently, in addition to the actual salary, there are also monthly bonuses. Moreover, the size of these bonuses can be quite officially many times greater than the size of salaries. That's how it is with us.
    1. +6
      4 January 2024 07: 50
      The organizations are not private, they don’t pay in envelopes. The conditions are presented on the indicated resources.
      1. GGV
        0
        4 January 2024 09: 13
        What does this have to do with private organizations? I worked in one organization (the owner is the regional administration), they paid extra: for length of service, part-time work, class, night, holidays + bonus. With a small overall salary, it turned out to be a decent (for a peripheral) salary. Now I work in Moscow (on a shift basis in the budget), also the salary is small (for Moscow) + KTU, holidays, bonuses (not always) in general I am satisfied. At the same time, the salaries in my organization are not the highest.
        1. +7
          4 January 2024 09: 14
          If you noticed, all additions and bonuses are taken into account in the terms of the contract. The article examines not only the salary, but also the bonus part.
          1. GGV
            +1
            4 January 2024 09: 26
            I haven’t seen all the bonuses listed in more than one sentence. Usually they write: “+ bonus and social package” and that’s it. I gave you an example that all the additional payments were not in commercial enterprises and everything was “in white”. By the way, all my friends who have children or other relatives who got into scientific work only boast about this (especially those who work in universities) and are happy with their income. Maybe we live in different Russias?
            1. +4
              4 January 2024 09: 35
              Let's go in order. As science teaches, logic, when talking about one thing, speaks to the topic in the same terms.
              1. “I haven’t seen all the bonuses described in more than one sentence” - the article provides links to the terms of the Central Research Institute contract - just the contract itself. The article analyzes labor functions, salary and amount with the calculation of all due under the terms of the contract with figures.
              Attention to the question - where have you not seen “so that all bonuses are listed” in the article under discussion?
              2. The fact that your friends boast about their work and love it is great, how does this relate to the level of payment for their work?
              If they have a high level of remuneration, then what is the order of the numbers “high” and most importantly, how is this related to the salary indicated on the website of the Ministry of Defense at the Central Research Institute discussed in this article?
            2. +4
              4 January 2024 12: 51
              Usually, when they are looking for people to hire, on the contrary, they describe mountains of gold, but they don’t hide the goodies at all.
      2. 0
        4 January 2024 09: 20
        Quote: gromovanton
        The organizations are not private, they don’t pay in envelopes.

        Quote: Dart2027
        bonuses may be quite officially
        We are also a state organization and everything is strictly according to the law with taxes, pension contributions, etc.
    2. +5
      4 January 2024 11: 33
      Apparently, in addition to the actual salary, there are also monthly bonuses. Moreover, the size of these bonuses can be quite officially many times greater than the size of salaries. That's how we do it

      Such a system means that the employee is a slave to the boss and for not smiling can be left on a bare salary; he cannot confidently predict his future and plan expenses, so this is not done in the West. Before the SVO, Matvienko spoke out about the depravity of this system and that the bonus should be no more than some part of the salary, but now they have forgotten about it.
      Perhaps the system of issuing money to employees based on the personal conviction of the boss is effective where the entire office is the private property of the boss and any of his nonsense will immediately affect his personal property, but this is not the case. By the way. practice shows that private traders also do a lot of stupid things, and even their own, not budgetary, financial losses do not stop them.
      1. -1
        4 January 2024 11: 39
        Quote: Stinging_Nettle
        Such a system means that the employee is a slave to the boss and for not smiling can be left on a bare salary; he cannot confidently predict his future and plan expenses, so this is not done in the West.

        Well, don't talk about "smiles". I don’t know why the system is this way, perhaps because now everything works under different contracts, but in general, the deprivation of bonuses is something exceptional.
        1. +4
          4 January 2024 13: 02
          but in general, deprivation of a bonus is something exceptional.

          This is from the series: “We don’t imprison people left and right.”
          As long as it doesn't affect you personally, you don't care. When it touches you, no one else will care in the same way.
          That's how we live. It is clear that such a system is very shaky and one can only hope that the brick will fly past.
          1. 0
            4 January 2024 13: 16
            Quote: Stinging_Nettle
            As long as it doesn't affect you personally, you don't care.

            In 20 years, I have only heard of two such cases, and they were not about ordinary employees.
  18. 0
    4 January 2024 07: 06
    put them on a keg of gunpowder and let them fly
  19. +13
    4 January 2024 08: 17
    All questions to the Supreme Commander-in-Chief. The system built over a quarter of a century is his own doing.
    1. +5
      4 January 2024 13: 20
      The Tsar is good, but the boyars are bad... The SVO has revealed a lot about the bureaucracy in the Moscow Region, which will continue to exhort to the last that everything is fine.
      But in general this is the case - demand from the Supreme, because Ignorance is no excuse from responsibility. And it’s a pity that he didn’t have such a question on the direct line (and could there have been one)
  20. +5
    4 January 2024 08: 20
    - Why don’t the management of the institutes and their employees fight for the labor rights of their teams?
    It is the trade unions that must fight, not the management... But they are not in this area.
    1. +4
      4 January 2024 08: 57
      A trade union is not a thing in itself and not a horse in a spherical vacuum. A trade union is a collective organized together and nothing more, but nothing less. Any leadership is small, but a large one is part of the team.
    2. +1
      4 January 2024 13: 14
      And in principle it cannot be. It is obvious.
  21. +4
    4 January 2024 08: 31
    As knowledgeable people explained to me when I was studying at the institute, out of ten thousand graduate candidates and doctors of science, only one can truly contribute something to science and production. But it is almost impossible for a genius to break through in order to defend himself.
    For example, at the Armed Forces Academies, all teachers are candidates and doctors of science, but how do we fight?
    The situation is the same in aviation, the situation with engines is dire, there is not enough knowledge to simply copy an excellent engine and replace it with imported ones.
    The salaries of employees who actually work for defense are from oligarchs who hid money abroad where they were arrested and used against our country. soldier
    1. +6
      4 January 2024 09: 09
      If you put everything together and blame scientists for this, that they teach poorly and give little to this country, then we can conclude that science is a harmful thing from your theses...
      Anyone can defend themselves. It's just difficult. You need to invest a lot of time and effort. It was your envious non-comrades who misled you. They would also add then that if you do nothing at all in life, then there will be nothing to regret, because if you do, bad people may not allow you to do something and will not be happy at all with your successes.
      I have always been amazed at how easily people who have never made an airplane out of plywood in their life, this is not about you, claim the ease of copying something that can be made across the entire globe in fewer countries than fingers on crayfish, and yet they don’t do it all from ore to the end , and in cooperation with each other...
      1. +1
        4 January 2024 22: 12
        At school there was an aircraft modeling club, they made an airplane out of straws with a rubber motor, it flew in circles. But then a high school student ran up, grabbed him, and crushed him.
  22. +6
    4 January 2024 09: 21
    Scientists, animal psychologists, have found that if in a herd of chimpanzees a low-ranking individual chimpanzee manages to open the door of a cage with a banana, no one in the herd will pay attention How did he do it Because the banana will be taken away from him anyway. But if she is high-ranking, a leader or a close associate, then everyone will immediately begin to repeat his achievement.
    Therefore Our people never listen to scientists. These are low-ranking individuals.
    And it’s impossible to explain to the people how the naive enlighteners of the 19th century thought of doing this. They won't listen

    It is customary to listen and obey only those who are feared. They are afraid - that means they respect. They are not afraid - they will mock them even if History itself punishes them for this later. The temptation is too great.... laughing
  23. +7
    4 January 2024 09: 52
    Such low salaries all over Russia, in private shops, with a particularly greedy owner and a high turnover of staff, in military-industrial complex factories, with huge vacancies and working pensioners or pre-retirees, I’m not even talking about state employees. And so that we do not arise, they are intensively importing and giving citizenship to nationalities from Central Asia. For some reason, Stalin or Lenin managed to monitor and manage almost every aspect of the country’s development, but our Putin did not. In some places it’s good, in others it’s great, and in others it’s complete zero. There is a feeling that entire areas of state activity are farmed out to intermediaries, such as the Polish gentry in Ukraine who leased out entire villages to the Jews. Popular support for Putin is very high and deservedly so, so he began to rest on his laurels. Is not it too early?
  24. +2
    4 January 2024 09: 52
    Rent a one-room apartment on the outskirts of Moscow - 40 rubles... How can a nonresident work? Yes, and no bank will give you a mortgage with such a salary.
  25. fiv
    +6
    4 January 2024 10: 14
    When people in leadership positions grew up from the workbench, from the drawing board, from the machine, there were fewer problems of misunderstanding between the “tops” and the “bottoms.” The modern leader tells those who disagree with him - quit, there is a line outside the gate. When the need arises to recruit new qualified personnel, it turns out that there is no crowd outside the gates. The leader leaves to manage the next victim. A new, self-confident Dunno comes to the enterprise. Usually. For all levels.
  26. +3
    4 January 2024 10: 18
    Quote from tsvetahaki
    I wonder if there are many more masochists out there hammer out doctoratesto get 40 thousand?


    I don’t want to be a cynic, but a counter question arises: - Can they do anything else? - how not to hammer???
    and if they “gotten” them, then what will they do next? - to put a spoke in the wheels of those who follow them...

    but in general, the article - Pass!
    the questions raised in it were visible 30, 20 and 10 years ago, people left what was called science (and some simply left the Fatherland), but “at the top” - this did not bother anyone

    the only thing that needs to be corrected in the article is that the person in charge is usually a senior researcher (senior researcher, as usual - “graduated”) - because manages a small team, not a researcher
  27. +2
    4 January 2024 10: 31
    Quote: ivan2022
    Scientific grants have existed in our country for a long time. But getting them is a problem with the necessary connections with grant givers. The money is received, the work is completed, a report is written, which is swallowed by the grantors. Then we finish and apply for a new grant.


    + 100500!
    yes, I forgot - this is how Skolkovo works (at least - there is one example in my memory)
    and as you remember, the transition “from the particular to the general” has not been canceled
  28. +6
    4 January 2024 10: 38
    I was faced with this schizophrenic situation when my favorite newspaper was closed and I was forced to pay pennies so as not to lose my qualifications. work as a department editor in the magazine of the Voeninform agency of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation. It turned out that all civil servants of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation are in such a slave position, and many do not leave because they are devoted to their profession.
  29. +1
    4 January 2024 10: 46
    It is incorrect to compare the salary of a taxi driver with salaries at state enterprises, because the driver has a direct connection between the results of his work and his salary. It is optimal when a state-owned enterprise, in addition to salary, should have large bonuses after a positive result of work under the contract. In general, an agreement must be concluded with concrete results and developments.
  30. +5
    4 January 2024 11: 08
    I believe this is a problem of a general personnel disaster, especially at all levels of government. Where are the people who understand that the Cold War 2.0 has begun, and if they lose, everything will be taken away from them? China is actively hobbling digital technologies, this should hint at something. Preparedness for the war of the future is not a return to the past, which destroyed the economy of the USSR: more guns, more tanks. Each autonomous swarm of killer UAVs will require very serious computing power, if this is done on today’s domestic chips, the result will be flying tons of batteries or zero autonomy. After all, this is a full-fledged mesh network of adaptive combat units, including fighters, jets, distractions and illusionists (generating a “picture” for enemy radars). Gigabytes must be transmitted over the air per second, using not only radio channels, but also Li-Fi. Distributed computing in a constantly changing configuration will require really serious microelectronics, which does not exist and no one will sell. At the same time, the government that is most actively trying to return the country to the past, not only militarily (the dominance of the KGB and the single party of senile people), hardly looks attractive to talents capable of developing at least something approximate. Even if the bonds break and they start paying engineers like Boeing $10000-15000 when working on critical technologies.
    The age of echeloned air defense and the principle of dominance in 3-4 elements is rapidly ending, since no superpower can really handle this. Global conflict becomes likely, despite nuclear shields and swords. But the elite lives in a world of its own illusions that everything will be overcome at the expense of the people...
  31. +5
    4 January 2024 11: 22
    Maybe someone works there and even earns money somehow, but such a payment system certainly does not contribute to the influx of new personnel! And this is a violation of continuity and a break in logical chains.
  32. +5
    4 January 2024 11: 22
    I'll add my two cents. When I was doing my PhD, I worked at a quarter-time job as a teacher at a university. Behind year have paid 10000r.... Because at that time I did not yet have an academic title. Now, of course, teachers’ salaries are higher, but I don’t think by much. But for me, these 10000 are like a nightmare.
  33. +2
    4 January 2024 11: 22
    Maybe someone works there and even earns money somehow, but such a payment system certainly does not contribute to the influx of new personnel! And this is a violation of continuity and a break in logical chains.
  34. +4
    4 January 2024 11: 31
    At research institutes, the salary is rather made up of the grant portion. But this has a strong subjective factor - how much the scientist/his management knows how to get grants. And the path to normal salaries is very long. And the income is not bad, but not stable.
    All sorts of honored professors and academicians work until they are 80 years old at very good salaries. Some of them are irreplaceable, cool specialists, but many simply clung to their chairs. Accordingly, young people have to wait a very long time.

    I don’t have exact data on the salary at the research institute, but in good universities in Moscow the salary of a doctor of science is about 200 thousand, this is in total with all sorts of additional payments, St. Petersburg: 150 thousand, in the provinces 100+ thousand.
    It is quite possible to become a Doctor of Science at 35, up to 40 if something prevents this - a change in the topic of research, the need for part-time work due to marital status, etc.
    It turns out that a teacher-researcher reaches a normal income very slowly + and after that he has to work a lot.
    In domestic universities, the workload per teacher is 600-800 hours of classroom work per year, for comparison in all other countries except post-Soviet countries, 300-400 in ordinary universities and 100-200 in universities with a strong scientific school.
    As a result, good, sought-after specialists leave for places where there is a normal balance of life and work.
    1. +2
      4 January 2024 17: 36
      That's right, and this situation is typical for civilian and military (only without grants) universities...
  35. +9
    4 January 2024 11: 50
    We must say thank you to Putin and Co. for such salaries.
    Ivleeva, who has 1000000 rubles per day and diamonds worth 23000000 rubles on her underpants are more expensive to them than the smart people of Russia.
  36. +6
    4 January 2024 12: 11
    But now many “disconnected... corporations” and “state concerns” have been created. They all have luxurious offices with monitors at the entrance several meters long. The salaries of every official there are the same as those of a whole team. So those who can leave production go to these offices. They also like to have all sorts of “strategic sessions” and draw “strategic maps” for 10 years in advance, where everything is “so good.” And the budget for such “sessions” is several million... At least count how much champagne is drunk and sandwiches eaten...
  37. +6
    4 January 2024 12: 14
    Let's remember the notorious Checkmate Su-75. There is no plane, but there is a great presentation! I wonder how much they gave to production? Probably almost half the budget for the plane
  38. +5
    4 January 2024 12: 30
    Enchanting. Is the state really less interested in Central Research Institute employees than in housing and communal services employees? The delirium is fierce. This is a systemic error and if it is not corrected, then there will be no new weapons systems in Russia.
  39. +3
    4 January 2024 12: 30
    Author! Thank you for your opinion! You touched on the topic, more or less preparing for it.
    But you respond poorly to comments.
    Having published your opinion on VO, you need to be ready to separate criticism from spitting. And the authors of the comments can also be divided into those with whom you can argue, and whose comments you can ignore.

    On the topic that you raised... After all, people, living people, who then, after receiving their wages, go to stores and buy groceries, giving their small income to cashiers, who are almost moneybags in comparison with them. Well, it doesn’t happen that tens of thousands of people receive crumbs, but remain in their jobs. Yes, there are, and always will be, those who work not even for an idea, but because they personally decided so for themselves. But tens, maybe hundreds, thousands of institute employees cannot work well while living from hand to mouth. This means either there are some additional payments, or... Or... I don’t know. Those who work in government institutions are not masochists. And not one hundred percent thieves.
    1. +3
      4 January 2024 13: 04
      Well, it doesn’t happen that tens of thousands of people receive crumbs, but remain in their jobs.

      Happens. As children, their parents and teachers explained to them that they were fools and unintelligent people, oh, cool auto-correction here.
      Self-esteem is forever. What will you name the boat...
      And then, they managed to spend years getting a higher education, so it’s a shame for them to give up everything and become cashiers, but in their specialty they can only work here.
    2. +6
      4 January 2024 13: 31
      Well, it doesn’t happen that tens of thousands of people receive crumbs, but remain in their jobs.

      In such places there are 4 categories:
      1. Those who have nowhere to go yet. Young people who have 0 work experience are almost from school/technician/university.
      2. Those who have nowhere to go. Yes, it’s hard for an employee to get a job with a normal salary of 40+. Ageism in its purest form. And getting it right is only half the battle; more terrible stories have been told
      3. Those who do not receive their main salary in this place. In short, a communication club, to scratch your tongues.
      4. Fans of this institution/work.
    3. +4
      4 January 2024 15: 14
      Thank you for attention. What would you suggest to strengthen in my answers? Regarding the credibility of the situation: the data is official. Several years ago I went to work at the 3rd Central Research Institute - the personnel problem was confirmed. I don’t know how much they “really” get, I rely only on official data, which is generally normal. Why is it that half the country lives from hand to mouth on such salaries and even thinks that this is also good, unless of course these are capital cities...
  40. +8
    4 January 2024 13: 36
    These are all consequences. Mr. Medvedev's words
    The most important thing is personal choice. I am often asked about this. Both for teachers and teachers, this is a calling. And if you want to earn money, there are a lot of great places where you can do it faster and better. Same business. But you didn’t go into business, as I understand it
    - clearly reflect the tasks and attitude of the authorities in all three areas (education, medicine and the armed forces) during the period of developing capitalism. Only when difficulties arise, they all immediately begin to echo the message of cohesion in society
  41. +3
    4 January 2024 13: 41
    If the stars are shining, it means someone needs it (not verbatim)
    Everyone probably remembers: “this is a calling”, “there is no money, but you hold on”, “you need money - sign a contract with the Moscow Region” (not verbatim)
    It turns out that a well-thought-out, targeted policy has been described...
  42. +6
    4 January 2024 14: 27
    So to speak from my own bell tower. More than 20 years of experience. Over the past 5 years, 2 closed R&D projects, 1 launch of products into production. Experience with the supply of components, incl. difficult to import.
    For the announced amounts, I apologize for the phrase I won’t raise my ass.
    I continue to work in a commercial office for normal money.
    I don’t want all the new ones to get permission.
    Position of the Civil Code, territorially St. Petersburg.
  43. +3
    4 January 2024 14: 43
    It's like that. A really working, proven method. The school and clinics are proof of this.
    It remains to remember "If the stars light up..."
  44. +2
    4 January 2024 15: 10
    Why don’t the management of the institutes and their employees fight for the labor rights of their teams?

    Because it is impossible. There are pricing rules prescribed in Federal Law 275, and there is practice in their application. It is impossible to raise the salaries of employees there. That is, it’s real... but at your own expense. And if the enterprise works only partially for the state defense order, and mainly for the civilian population, then yes, it is still possible. And if only for the state defense order, then that’s it, turn off the lights.
  45. BAI
    +1
    4 January 2024 15: 19
    the author of this text is in no way connected with the system of the Central Military Research Institute. As in the famous film, I feel sorry for the powers

    I served in the military Central Research Institute for 20 years and I’m not offended.
    1. All scientific positions in the military Central Research Institute are occupied either by officers or military pensioners (from the same Central Research Institute). With corresponding military payments. Do you feel the difference? There are practically no civilians in these positions.
    Military Central Research Institutes have always been considered court units - service is much easier than in linear units, but the requirements are different - you have to think a lot.
    2.
    Why are these problems clear and important to me, but those who are 10 steps higher are not concerned about this - maybe we need to switch places?

    Everyone knows how to govern a state, play football and raise children.
    1. +3
      4 January 2024 15: 41
      I agree with point 2.
      According to clause 1, the vacancies that were presented were considered.
      Let’s assume that 95% of the Central Research Institute are career officers and receive salaries in accordance with their rank, does this negate the question that for doing science, a doctor/candidate of sciences receive the “additional payment” specified in the article? The leadership of the institute is a colonel, so everyone of lower rank is definitely not a colonel. And in peacetime, our major and captain are paid enormous amounts of money?
      1. BAI
        +1
        4 January 2024 19: 13
        The leadership of the institute is a colonel, respectively, everyone who is of lower rank is exactly

        Head of the Central Research Institute, now (and for a long time) - Major General. All positions have been raised by 1 level.
        In your calculations there are no allowances for a scientific degree - fixed and scientific title - a percentage of the official salary. Moreover, these allowances are taken into account when calculating additional payments for state secrets, intensity and length of service
    2. +2
      4 January 2024 19: 23
      The first point brings sadness, if this is the case. The military service does not allow initiative without an order. Even if someone comes with a good invention, they tell him that he is very smart, keep his head down and don’t make his boss look like a fool. That is why at the beginning of the Northern Military District we did not have various UAVs, and much more. The colonel, as a rule, can only find where on the payroll to sign for the allowance. what
      1. 0
        5 January 2024 12: 54
        Quote: V.
        The military service does not allow initiative without an order.

        The military loves and knows how to make money no worse than anyone else. It is logical to organize such research institutes on the principles of PMCs, with the difference that they make money with their brains. This is much more commercially promising than copying the Western version where chvkashniks are used in all sorts of holes in the world.
        1. 0
          5 January 2024 13: 25
          I agree with you, but you need control over money and obtaining a license. soldier
  46. +4
    4 January 2024 15: 33
    Our country has no future with the current economic, social and political policies. This is clear as day.
    It is also clear that nothing will change under the current government. Vicious circle…
  47. +5
    4 January 2024 17: 57
    Is the deal being done for a salary of 37000?
    Done
    That means the boss doesn't have a headache.

    With a bureaucratic(1) method of management, any improvements at the bottom and in the middle of the pyramid, if they produce results, will only be temporary.
    The idea of ​​government responsibility is recognized as extremism in the Russian Federation.

    (1) the result of the Case is assessed not by the recipient of the result of the Case, but by the authorities
  48. +3
    4 January 2024 18: 34
    The problem is not new and salary (especially recently) is not a key factor here. Remember how it was in the USSR?
    1. The level of education at the school did not depend on the region, there was only one program and the teachers and the vast majority of students coped with it.
    2. Schoolchildren are all different (it was not necessary to drag everyone to the 9th grade), but the hunt was on for the talented ones. All schools de facto held all-Union Olympiads, the winners advanced to the next level. Leading universities conducted their own correspondence courses and visiting Olympiads (ZFTS, for example), participation in which provided some preferences for admission.
    3. In leading universities, students already from the 2nd-3rd year underwent permanent internship in industry and scientific institutions, where they actually prepared and defended their thesis in the presence of leading industry experts. If it was too far, then a hostel was provided (For example, from the 3rd year I lived 3 days in Dolgoprudny and 3 days in Korolev)
    4. Enterprises had the opportunity to send (without exams or competition) their young employees to study at leading universities, subject to assignment upon graduation to this particular enterprise. And in the USSR there was generally a law on 3 years of compulsory work according to distribution.
    6. The enterprises had growth plans (with dates) for young specialists and internships in the place of the immediate superior during his vacation. Specialists quickly moved up the professional and career ladder.
    7. For military-industrial complex enterprises and State corporations, a reservation from conscription into the army was provided (This secured young specialists at the enterprise until at least 27 years of age).
    8. The salary of young employees before the collapse of the USSR was quite sufficient and those who wanted could always earn extra money by performing various R&D.
    After Yeltsin (whose advisers included up to 17 CIA employees) and the first wave of democrats came to power, the systematic destruction of industry and the transformation of the country into a gas station, a market for consumer goods and food began. Many of the negative consequences of the technical policy pursued at that time are still alive:
    1. Formalization of the development process, the dominance of officials and managers, the engineer has ceased to be the leading link in progress.
    2. Personnel policy has come down to the appointment of one’s own person to leadership positions, without the participation of the work collective; previously, appointment required the consent of the Komsomol organization, the Communist Party and a vote of the unit’s work collective.
    3. The gap in the salaries of technical specialists on the one hand, and economists, managers and multiplied directors on the other hand, has increased. Salaries began to differ by more than 10 times. At this time, the best specialists went into business and insurance.
  49. +2
    4 January 2024 18: 56
    Aren’t those who send such salaries to the Central Research Institute working part-time in the CIA? They also seem to be underpaid, so they earn money on the side, but it’s not their fault. I would like to know the size of such part-time work, because it’s interesting. And it’s scary...
  50. +4
    4 January 2024 20: 04
    The author asks the question: “why don’t the management of institutions and their employees fight for the labor rights of their teams?”
    The question is posed incorrectly. It is necessary to ask from the vertical of power why there are no social differences in salaries. If there are none, then the manager draws zeros to his salary until his hand gets tired. (the slogan “For yourself as for the front” has not been canceled). Then the manager will add a few zeros to the salaries of his associates. For the rest of the workers, he will say something familiar to everyone: “there is no money, but you hold on.” This situation could be corrected by a progressive tax of 50% or more. (But this is not our method). Without implementing everything previously listed, employee salaries will be “training”, with all the ensuing consequences.
  51. +4
    4 January 2024 20: 05
    I read the article. Maximum salary size. I couldn’t believe my eyes - how was that?
    And then I remembered that in the entrance of my Khrushchev block there is still an advertisement in which the ordinary administrator of our village Housing Maintenance Office is offered a salary of 90 thousand rubles, repairmen - 50-60, and an electrician - 25.
  52. +3
    4 January 2024 22: 18
    Alas, the method described by the author is far from new and has been tested in many sectors of the economy. For example, in my favorite education. It was under the Union, in the direction of which only the lazy did not spit, that the teacher’s rate was the same throughout the USSR, both in hours and in rubles. Plus for working in rural areas, in difficult climatic conditions, etc. allowances were due. Plus, in the same rural area, it was easier for teachers to solve the housing problem than in the capital of our Motherland. This is the main thing, we won’t mention the little things. So the young people went to cities and villages to arrange their lives. What kind of education are we talking about outside the Moscow Ring Road, if in a number of regions the teacher’s salary is 3000 (three thousand!) rubles. No, not Soviet ones, but current ones. Are there many young teachers and teachers of middle age (from 35 to 50 years old) in the wonderful Zamkadye these days? That's it. All the students have to do is climb the pine tree to catch the Internet and get to the video lesson. And doctors of sciences for 44000 rubles a month have not surprised anyone for a long time. And if they surprise, it is only because of their respectable age.
  53. +4
    4 January 2024 23: 06
    What did you want? If in St. Petersburg Military Mechanics you need to study for a fee to become a gunsmith designer, and then work for pennies in a design bureau.
  54. +4
    5 January 2024 09: 41
    The article is voluminous, informative and of course correct.
    But! What kind of professionalism can we talk about when people like Serdyukov, Shoigu, and his other deputies are engaged in the formation of the Russian Armed Forces. The top of the RF Armed Forces is overrun with women in general's and marshal's uniform.
    None of them even have basic military education.
    And how many of them multiplied? Like cockroaches. More than lieutenants.
    How many times has this been said? How many problems are there at SVO because of this?
    How many guys, due to the stupidity and stupidity of these “generals”, died on the battlefield.
    This does not need to be “reformed”. This must be broken. Decisively and toughly.
    BUT!
    Who will do this?
    Hucksters in the Genius Headquarters.....??????
  55. +2
    5 January 2024 11: 43
    Quote: avdkrd
    Enchanting. Is the state really less interested in Central Research Institute employees than in housing and communal services employees? The delirium is fierce. This is a systemic error and if it is not corrected, then there will be no new weapons systems in Russia.

    You seem to be far behind reality. The state has not worried about housing and communal services employees for a long time. They are all now in private management companies. And these management companies pay the locksmiths only so that they don’t run away. If they run away, they will accept “foreign specialists.”
  56. +1
    5 January 2024 12: 45
    Quote: BAI
    Head of the Central Research Institute, now (and for a long time) - Major General.

    via the above link (https://ens.mil.ru/science/SRI/information.htm?id=12008@morfOrgScience) Head of the 12th Central Research Institute - Colonel
  57. +3
    5 January 2024 14: 23
    I served in one of the Central Research Institutes you mentioned. There, the total salaries of scientific workers for 2020 were no less than 120-130 thousand. I don’t know now. The problem is the opaque payment system. Every month the salary is really small. But quarterly and annual bonuses are large. In order to comply with the May decrees, they were paid additionally to the required level in bonuses. As for the employees themselves, half of them could be fired and nothing would happen. There, 20 percent actually advance science, another 30 help them, and the remaining 50 read newspapers. And they hire them because there are no particularly willing workers due to this opaque and inconvenient payment system. Well, “nepotism” plays an important role - former colleagues, colleagues, acquaintances.
  58. +1
    5 January 2024 16: 33
    This is the situation in many areas. In our culture, for example, in a city of 2017, wages are now lower than in 400000. It seems that there were presidential decrees that raised salaries. But the allowances were immediately cut))). The result is a catastrophic lack of directors. Many managers leave and create their own private circles, paid, of course!)) The same problem occurs in hospitals and schools. But at the head office of Roscosmos, the average salary is 25. And they shout that at your defense plant (I still work there part-time in personnel), in general the salary in the province should be 30-5 thousand. As a result, many professionals, instead of rocket science, go to private companies, where they are paid really large salaries with less brainwashing. So this is a common problem for the whole country. But this is generally a problem with the Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense. How to live in 7-XNUMX years?
  59. +1
    5 January 2024 18: 14
    The problem is old, and one increase in salary cannot solve it.
    Arguments:
    1. One salary does not solve anything; resources are needed in the form of equipment, materials, samples, information, time, testing grounds.
    2. Even if there is a working sample that is successful in terms of performance characteristics, the insufficient speed of putting it into mass production can neutralize the effect of its creation, while the customer himself, due to his bureaucracy, will be a brake on innovation.
    3. The creation, testing, and implementation of improved products often takes place in the same areas as mass production, which impairs the work on both tasks.
    4. Equalization flourishes in factories and those who know little but sit around a lot will receive more than those who are more competent but value their time; besides, flatterers who agree to solve any problem, even a deceitful one, get promoted more often than others.
    5. There is no exchange of ideas, technologies, catalogs, which prevents the implementation of already successfully mastered technical solutions.
    6. The customer does not have the creative technical potential to reveal the product’s capabilities to the maximum, and the contractor does not have the motivation to search for innovation, confining himself to mass production, solving mainly the problems of logistics rather than quality and development.
    7. Under conditions of pressure from the Customer on the Contractor in order to fulfill the production program numbers, the latter will easily sacrifice everything that prevents the product from moving through production stages. In this situation, an engineer in the military-industrial complex is more likely not the basis of production, but a guide to solving bottlenecks.
    8. Despite all the disadvantages, the system under the SVO came to life, people began to flock to manual labor, but for the development of engineers, other approaches are needed to suit the task.
    9. And with humor, if you imagine that suddenly everyone was told that you can offer your technical ideas, then what will you do with the 10 million army of applicants, most of whose ideas have no other benefit other than ambition, are not feasible or reinvent the wheel ? These 10 million people who want to will have to hire a million technical experts to give a competent answer and a couple of thousand orderlies for those who are especially restless, that is, the system is bad in that it does not produce technical competencies and innovations, but it is also an “industry threshold” without overloading itself yourself, highlighting only expert opinions based on status and reputation.
    So the problem is as old as mammoth shit and cannot be solved only by increasing salaries or grants, as well as a prison regime for “creative engineers.”
    By the way, to get the system to react, you can try the following, if, of course, you are an expert in the field of weapons and at the same time have a good understanding of enterprise economics and management - write to the Ministry of Defense, offer them the creation of a working group in your area and, at best, you will receive an answer that The Moscow Region already has the appropriate structures and institutions, but they don’t know you and are not obligated to create preferences for you.
    1. 0
      8 January 2024 19: 49
      Thank you for your attention to this issue and the author’s article.
      According to paragraph 1, the level of salary and its connection with labor results is not the only, but an important factor in the multifactor system of scientific and technological development in the military-industrial complex. The author did not create a quantitative factor model for managing scientific and technological progress in the military-industrial complex and did not even propose a qualitative model (verbally describing the interconnections of subsystems and their mutual influence on the achievement of final results, which was not stated in the article). But it should be noted:
      - among our people it’s just some kind of disease, pointing out that just doing one thing cannot solve the whole problem (for example, if you just start squatting, you won’t immediately become much healthier, from which the conclusion is drawn that you haven’t lived well and there’s nothing to start = nothing needs to be done). The problem is not that this is not so, and indeed in complex systems there are many factors and they do not boil down to one thing, or rather they have different weights and the whole task is to isolate them, give weights and determine the connections between them and mutual influence. The root is that behind the screen of reasoning that this is not the whole solution to the problem, they do not begin to solve the problem and do not take the first step. And this is a life tragedy or a strategy of millions, for example, what depends on me, if I vote, then why should I go vote, etc. With voting, as with religion, the matter is intimate, but in matters of practical life everything is the same. Instead of taking a step, a person begins, well, this is only one step, and in order to get a result you need to take more than one - a logical decision to do nothing because why and I have no influence on anything...
      - When top managers of Sberbank, Gazprom and other state-owned companies are paid by the carload of something, no one raises the question, on the contrary, they explain to us where we will find such qualified managers - everyone will run away and we will lose competitiveness.
      The same disease - the unwillingness to pay subordinates more than their manager and administrator - is right at the level of biological prohibitions.
      As for testing equipment and testing grounds, everything is fine in the part where I work, which does not mean that it is like this everywhere and for everyone.
      P. 2 -3 Was solved in the USSR with the following tools:
      -Most large design bureaus had pilot production facilities that worked in the interests of design bureau orders, now this has become an exception to the rule
      -There were decrees of the Government and the Central Committee of the CPSU and a system of control over the fulfillment of deadlines for the development and launching of production of new products
      -In addition to slogans, there was resource support for the assigned tasks (not everything was perfect)
      point 4 there is a problem
      point 5 there is such a thing, but there is also a problem: how to exchange best practices with competitors?
      p. 6 Ultimately, it all comes down to the quality of technical specifications and its implementation on the one hand; on the other hand, technical specifications are written not by gods, but by people.
      p. 7 Everyone is only interested in fulfilling the plan.
      p. 8 I agree with the disgusting author, but they didn’t start flowing on their own, they started paying people something less than decent
      p.9 I work with this professionally and not with the creative amateur performances of the masses, but with the best in the country or with some of the best. And I responsibly declare that not every solution thought out by a professional is free from known shortcomings.
      The flow of thought and the desire to create something that has no analogues in the world among the masses is cut off by 2 most primitive steps:
      1. Put your idea in writing and sign it
      2. Write what problem the author solves, why what is proposed is better than what is already known, but only known not personally to the author, but in relation to what has been done in the world, done with specifics in measurable parameters, better in geometric and physical parameters.
  60. 0
    7 January 2024 11: 10
    It is necessary to take the purchasing power of the ruble and its relation to the green one, for example at the beginning of the 80s, and the salaries of research institute employees of that time and recalculate. Return the tariff schedule. Well, consider the requirements and funding of institutions from what is necessary, and ask how then. The 90s sharply hit the qualifications of research institute personnel. Yesterday I read an article about how Comrade Stalin moved from persuading officials to stop “nepotism” in power to action. I was impressed.
  61. +1
    8 January 2024 01: 23
    Yes.
    With such a salary level, it seems that only MOSSAD or NSA officers will be employed in our Central Research Institutes.
    I thought that for our military-industrial complex, the 90s passed like a bad dream.
  62. 0
    8 January 2024 08: 09
    Quote: Stinging_Nettle
    They usually don’t hire young people there, as elsewhere (they don’t hire people without experience, you can’t gain experience without work, kids, get a higher education, it’s very useful in life). Although in the defense industry you can understand that they are not hiring, a normal young man will not be able to stand working in an older group for long.

    I don't agree. They are trying to attract a lot of young people. Another thing is that not everyone is eager to stay.
  63. 0
    8 January 2024 13: 17
    Well, what you wanted is socialism. All these research and production facilities are forms of management left over from the USSR, almost unchanged. the state already spends trillions on government orders and support for state-owned enterprises - it simply cannot spend more.
    the fact that in the private sector, without any government subsidies, even for unskilled employees, salaries are many times higher - whose fault and whose problem?
    In the same, God forgive me, the USA, the “damned capitalists” of all sorts of Lockheed Martin and others for some reason do not experience problems with the level of wages
    1. 0
      8 January 2024 21: 44
      Do not lie. In Russia, the percentage of the budget allocated to science is one of the lowest. In the USA or Israel the highest. That is precisely why they do not experience problems, because if in the USA the State needs Lockheed Martin, then Lockheed needs science. And if science is not needed in Russia, then you can guess why. Because you don't need Lockheed Martins. All you need is money.
  64. -1
    8 January 2024 13: 20
    It is necessary to create a contractual payment system (like in football) in key industries
    https://m.vk.com/club201281709
    1. +1
      8 January 2024 21: 37
      Quote: orlovtube
      It is necessary to create a contractual payment system (like in football) in key...
      It’s not like in football. Because science is not football.
      In football, the result is obtained at the end of the match. In science, in a few years. If the direction of work was chosen successfully. Therefore, science is financed either by huge corporations or by the state. What exactly should be included in the contract? Commitment to discover a new law of nature?
      In the USSR, low-level scientific positions had low salaries. For achievements in science, the employee was transferred to a higher salary. The dissertation took several years to write. A bonus was paid for a specific result.....
      But if the State does not need industry, why does it need science? Open your eyes. On the site of industrial zone factories....
  65. 0
    8 January 2024 17: 00
    I wonder why this institute still exists? In our country, something like this has gone into oblivion, but here for 30000 rubles. -my respects, most likely they didn’t get around to it, and some funds are allocated, hmm!
  66. 0
    10 January 2024 04: 41
    Author, those to whom you addressed this letter will not hear you. They spend more for dinner at a restaurant in Barvikha than the 38 thousand you indicated. And then - on a service A8 with girls in the sauna.
    If you are not happy with something in the system, you need to change the system. You will have a chance to start in March
  67. 0
    10 January 2024 05: 53
    Where is the zine money?Where is the zine money?

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