Unknown wars. "Officer" - an armored train filled with table salt

White armored train "Officer". 1919 Before being sent to the front from Rostov-on-Don. Propaganda photograph of the AFSR

Ten angels beat the silence
like tits, they flock together.
The armored train went to war,
and they sadly read the lists.Alexander Kozheikin “The armored train went to war”

Documents stories. Interesting are the fates of people and... the fates of articles too. Some (at least for me) take years to write, and then are completed in literally 45 minutes. Others, on the contrary, are written quickly, but then lie there. Still others gather from the pine forest, and then only according to the mood. The fourth topics are suggested by VO readers. This is how this material was born.

It just happened historically that I simply “didn’t have time” to deal with the topic of armored trains. A series of articles about them were published in the M-K magazine, in the Military Knowledge magazine, then there was a large series with beautiful color illustrations in the Science and Technology magazine, back when it was published in Ukraine. However, it so happened that when I was writing my novel “Pareto’s Law,” which was published in Germany and then in Singapore, material about the armored train “United Russia” also ended up there, and from there it came here to VO, where one reader really liked it with a characteristic nickname.

But another armored train was also mentioned there - “Officer”, material about which was once published in the magazine “Beloye Delo”.

This material, based on the memoirs of his officers, is very interesting. And it could well be given in the “Unknown Wars” cycle, as a view from the other side, especially since in our previous material we were talking about the events of 1919, and this armored train was noted for its active actions precisely in that year. Moreover, of particular interest, in addition to the rather boring and monotonous descriptions of military operations, in my opinion, is this passage:

“In Simferopol, we received a combat platform (2 guns) of the Bolshevik armored train “Trotsky”, loaded it with shells, and installed 6 machine guns.

October 16 - received rifle 102148, made at the Tula Arms Factory in 1919 - pentagonal star and R.S.F.S.R. It turned out to be unusable - I didn’t throw away the cartridges - I changed it to an English product - a short and convenient Lee-Enfield.

Our train was the last to leave, stopping behind the semaphore station. Taganash. At night (from 12 to 4 o’clock) I am an “orderly” at the combat site (cold, wind), I look to the north: there, in the darkness of the night beyond Sivash, five miles away, stretches from the Crimea to Arkhangelsk, the vast sea of ​​the Red International that has flooded our Motherland, and only here , on an insignificant piece of land left from the once Great Russian State, we, a handful of the White Guard, are holding on.

Let the bullets whistle, the blood flow,
May death carry grenades
We will boldly move forward
We are Russian soldiers.
We are descendants of heroes,
And our cause is just.
We will be able to defend our honor
And die with glory.
Don't cry, grandfathers and fathers,
Don't cry, wives, children,
For the good of your homeland
Let's forget everything in the world.
Do not cry for us, Holy Russia,
No tears, no need
Pray for the fallen and the living,
Prayer is our joy.
Forward boldly to the enemy,
Let's go, brave fighters.
The Lord is for us, we will win,
Long live Russia!"

(Pushkarev S. G. On the armored train “Officer” in White Tavria. 1920 // Pronin G. F. Armored train “Officer”. St. Petersburg, 2006. P. 33–37.)

The poet, however, was the author of these memoirs and poems, but this did not help him - further proof of the operation of the 80 to 20 principle, for when most of the people are not for you, then neither heroic officers nor poets can do anything!

Well, now the actual history of this interesting armored train, one among many, because of which many rightly call the Civil War of 1918–1922 in Russia the “war of armored trains”!

The armored train was formed at the very beginning of August 1918, immediately after the capture of Yekaterinodar by the Volunteer Army. And they assembled it from armored sites left by the Red Army troops on the left bank of the Kuban River. The Reds blew up the bridge across the river. And since the rest of the white armored trains were on the right bank of the river, it was this armored train that became the main striking force of the Volunteer Army.

Initially it consisted of one open platform on which a three-inch Model 1900 gun and two machine-gun armored platforms stood behind sandbags. Captain Kharkovtsev became the first commander of the armored train.

Fighting in Kuban

Already on August 9, in its first battle near the Abinskaya station, the armored train team managed to capture another closed platform armed with small-caliber guns, onto which it moved its three-inch gun from an open platform. Then on August 11, at Tonnelnaya station, not far from Anapa, he destroyed the Red headquarters, which had moved by rail to Novorossiysk. On August 13, the armored train distinguished itself again, supporting with fire the Volunteer Army’s attack on Novorossiysk, where the Whites captured two more Red armored trains.

The name “Officer” was given to the armored train either on August 16 or in November 1918. Moreover, at the end of August he again participated in the battle, helping to storm Armavir. At the Gulkevichi station, one of the machine-gun armored platforms came off the rails and the armored train, retreating two miles in battle, dragged it along the sleepers, and only then the crew of the armored train managed to put it on the rails. On September 3–4, the “Officer”, together with the armored train “Morskoy”, continued to operate near Armavir - the village of Nevinnomyssk. On August 8, near the village of Uspenskoye, Captain Kharkovtsev was seriously wounded, and Lieutenant Khmelevsky took command of the armored train. When the Whites left Armavir, the “Officer” went to the Kavkazskaya station, and on September 17 he was sent to Novorossiysk for repairs and reorganization.

Pennant of the armored train "Officer". 1919

In October 1918, the armored train received two new machine-gun armored platforms and a landing carriage, and in this form, under the command of Colonel Ionin, was sent to Stavropol, where it participated in the capture of this city.

There is no reliable information about what kind of military operations the armored train took part in in November 1918 and the first half of February 1919.

Exterior view of the armored train "Officer" in 1919

Fighting in the Kamenny Coal region

But it is known that on March 9, 1919, in the Kamennougolny region near Debaltsevo, the armored train “Officer” entered into battle with armored train No. 3 of the Red Army. It was commanded by a woman who was the only commander of an armored train in the history of the Civil War - a member of the Socialist-Revolutionary Maximalist Party L.N. Mokievskaya-Zubok, the daughter of one of the leaders of the Socialist-Revolutionary Party N. Bukhovsky. The gunners from the "Officer" managed to plant a shell into the armored locomotive of armored train No. 3, as a result of which she died.

The crew of the armored train "Officer" before going to the front. The whites are dressed, as can be clearly seen in the photograph, some of them are dressed in whatever way they can, and one is even in English tropical shorts

The battle with the Reds on March 30 at the Khatsepetovka station brought new success to the “Officer” armored train: it managed to capture the “2nd Siberian Armored Train” of the Red Army, which in honor of this event received the name “Glory to the Officer” in the Volunteer Army.

There is evidence that just after this he began to be called “Officer”, and in the photograph signed “Armored train “Officer” in Rostov-on-Don. 1919", the armored platforms are clearly visible from the "2nd Siberian armored train".

"Salty March" on Moscow

Fragment of an operational report describing the battle of the armored train "Officer" near the Gertsovka station

In June 1919, the armored train "Officer" supported the Kornilov offensive along the Kharkov-Moscow railway. And from somewhere there was a rumor that there was a terrible shortage of salt in Moscow. And, they say, when we win and enter the Mother See, salt will be in short supply there. And if so, the crew of the armored train literally filled it with bags of salt, hoping to sell it in Moscow at exorbitant prices and make good money on it!

War is war, and no one is stopping them from making extra money from it, the team decided, especially since they have a lot to lose on. Bags of salt made it difficult to fight, the salt creaked underfoot, the salty dust made the heads water, but they threw it away only when the retreat began!

And here is how it is described in the memoirs of one of the crew members of the armored train... “Psychic attack”:

“On July 1, 1919, the armored train “Officer” fought a stubborn battle with two armored trains of the Reds, which occupied the Gertsovka station, 45 versts from Belgorod, and fired at the outposts of the Ingermanland Hussar Regiment. Behind the “Officer” armored train, the path was blocked by a shell explosion. The enemy 42-linear (106,7 mm) guns continued to fire frequently, while all the shells on the lead 75-mm gun of the “Officer” armored train had been spent and it had to go silent. Despite this difficult situation, the armored train "Officer" decisively moved towards the Reds without firing. Impressed by this sudden attack, the enemy armored trains retreated beyond the Gertsovka station.”

Telegram of gratitude from General May-Maevsky to the team of the armored train “Officer” for the battle on July 16, 1919 at Gertsovka station

On the night of September 19-20, the armored train "Officer", supported by fire from the heavy armored train "United Russia", burst into the Kursk station and captured the city station, which forced the Reds to leave the city in a hurry. Then, in October 1919, the “Officer” took part in the assault on Orel in conjunction with the heavy armored train “Ioann Kalita”. Well, when the Whites began to retreat from Orel, the armored train “Officer”, together with Denikin’s troops, retreated to Kuban.

Retreat to Kuban and death

Until the end of February 1920, the armored train "Officer" was based in Yekaterinodar, where it guarded Headquarters and the Commander-in-Chief's trains, after which on February 28 it left for Novorossiysk, where it was blown up.

The crew of the armored train "Officer", according to data for 1920, consisted of 48 officers and 67 lower ranks.

Crimean version

But in the spring of 1920, already in Crimea, the armored train “Officer” was renamed the armored train “Glory of Kuban”. It was commanded by Colonel Lebedev. However, he did not fight for long and died on the night of October 30 at Taganash station (now Salt Lake).

The team, however, survived and, having taken panoramas, sights, gun locks, six machine guns and a battle banner from the armored train, they sailed to Gallipoli on the Dobroflot steamship Saratov. From there, members of the armored train team as part of the 6th separate armored train artillery division were transported to Bulgaria in November 1921, and in the fall of 1925 to France, where they remained to live.

In 1938, a ceremonial meeting was held in Paris dedicated to the 20th anniversary of the founding of the first armored trains of the Volunteer Army, which was chaired by M. I. Lebedev.

Comments

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

Thanks Vyacheslav Olegovich!
Have a nice and fruitful day everyone, with respect to Kote!

[Vlad Baryatinsky]

Quote: Kote pane Kohanka

Have a nice and fruitful day everyone, with respect to Kote!

... and what did you write that to some your message is like a red rag in front of the nostrils of a bull.

[kalibr]

Quote: Vlad Baryatinsky

and what did you write that to some your message is like a red rag in front of the nostrils of a bull.

He told me thank you!

[Vlad Baryatinsky]

Quote: kalibr

He told me thank you!

Then everything is clear.
This is now a trend, Russia is a galley slave. Slander, insult, run over and take away.
Glory to the Lord GOD! I'm far from her.
To you, the Author, I wish you prosperity and long life.
PS
Author!
How do you feel about preparing and submitting to the Reader an article dedicated to the expedition of Admiral Burns?
Thank you.

[kalibr]

Quote: Vlad Baryatinsky

How do you feel about preparing and submitting to the Reader an article dedicated to the expedition of Admiral Burns?
Thank you.

An interesting topic, but I can’t deal with it for a number of reasons.

[89670719026]

You, overseer, don't think much of yourself?

[Old electrician]

I read it and immediately shed a stingy tear for the White Army! What heroism! What self-sacrifice in the name of selling Russia to the interventionists! The heroic white army could not survive without armored trains. General P.N. Wrangel in exile:

... Having laid aside all concerns about the contents of the troops, the army headquarters allowed the troops to be content exclusively with local funds, using them in the care of the units themselves and turning the captured military booty to their advantage.
War turned into a means of profit, and living with local funds turned into robbery and speculation.
Each part was in a hurry to grab more. Everything that could not be used on the spot was taken - sent to the rear for trade and conversion into banknotes. The mobile reserves of the troops reached homeric proportions - some units had up to two hundred wagons under their regimental reserves. A huge number of ranks served the rear. A number of officers were on long business trips: to sell military loot for units, to exchange goods, etc.
The army was corrupted, turning into hucksters and speculators.
In the hands of all those who in one way or another came into contact with the business of "self-supply" - and everyone came into contact with this business, including the junior officer and the platoon distributor, inclusive, there was a lot of money, the inevitable consequence of which was debauchery, gambling and drunkenness. Unfortunately, the example was set by some of the senior commanders, the homeric revelry and the throwing of big money that was carried out in front of the entire army.
...
The population, who greeted the army as it advanced with sincere delight, who had suffered from the Bolsheviks and longed for peace, soon began to again experience the horrors of robbery, violence and tyranny.
As a result, the collapse of the front and uprisings in the rear...

Heroes who fought for Russia:
1. Kolchak, appointed Supreme Ruler of Russia by decision of the French general. Zhanin and the English gene. Noxa is an ordinary puppet. Sold by the Allies like a sheep for permission to travel along the Trans-Siberian Railway.
2. Denikin and Wrangel were appointed by the Entente instead of Kolchak. Denikin's government was never recognized by the allies. Wrangel's government was recognized at the very last moment - before the heroic escape from Crimea. This is like a promise to invite Ze to the EEC and NATO. Nothing new.
3. In the North (Murmansk, Arkhangelsk), the anti-Soviet movement was led by General Miller. Unlike Kolchak, he did not even have fictitious power. The White Army under the command of Miller was organizationally part of the British occupation corps. Classic native army under the command of the white sahibs.
4. General Yudenich near Petrograd was a complete analogy of Miller. He fought heroically for the right of the sahib to plunder Russia. Which of the whites fought for Russia?
In general, the etymology of the phrase “White Movement” comes from “White Sahib”. The most famous fighter for the White Idea is the Head of the Main Directorate of Cossack Troops of the Imperial Ministry of the Eastern Occupied Territories of Germany, General Krasnov. From General Krasnov’s speech at a propaganda course in Potsdam in 1944 (published in the newspaper “Russian Life”, San Francisco, 1961):

Remember, you are not Russians, you are Cossacks, an independent people! The Russians are hostile to you. Moscow has always been an enemy of the Cossacks, crushing them and exploiting them. Now the hour has come when we, the Cossacks, can create our own life independent of Moscow

.
Let me remind you how the white army saw the political future of the Russian Empire.
On November 15 (28), 1917, the Supreme Council of the Entente made an official decision to intervene in Russia.
In development of this decision, on December 10 (23), 1917, the Anglo-French convention on the division of the territory of Russia was signed in Paris. In history it is known as the "Franco-English Agreement of December 23, 1917". According to this convention, Russia was divided as follows: the Caucasus and the Cossack regions entered the British zone, and Bessarabia, Ukraine and Crimea entered the French zone; Siberia and the Far East were seen as areas of interest for the United States and Japan. Moreover, Great Britain also claimed the North of Russia.
On November 13, 1918, the Anglo-French, under the patronage of the United States, indefinitely extended the validity of the convention on the division of Russia. It has not yet been officially canceled.
Like the modern Armed Forces of Ukraine, the White movement had the only right and privilege - to die for the interests of the White sahibs. On May 26, 1919, the Allied Coalition Powers sent a “Note from the Supreme Council to Admiral Kolchak”:

...Fourthly, the independence of Finland and Poland must be recognized and, in the event that any issues relating to borders or any other relations between Russia and these countries cannot be resolved by mutual agreement, the Russian government will agree to turn to arbitration of the League of Nations.
Fifth, in the event that relations between Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, the Caucasian and Trans-Caspian territories and Russia are not quickly established through mutual agreements, this issue will also be resolved with the help of the League of Nations, and until then the Russian government undertakes to recognize autonomy all these territories and to reaffirm the relationship that may exist between their existing de facto governments and the governments of the Allied coalition powers.
Sixth, the government of Admiral Kolchak must recognize the right of the peace conference to determine the future of the Romanian part of Bessarabia.
...
J. Clemenceau, Lloyd George, Orlando, Woodrow Wilson, Saionji

.
This note (essentially an ultimatum) demanded from the “Supreme Ruler” a written refusal to restore the previous regime. Those. The Entente was not satisfied not only with the tsarist regime, but even with the Provisional or any other government, as long as it was All-Russian. This was echoed by another point in the note, which demanded not to interfere with the free election of local self-government bodies. In conditions when the fire of separatism of all stripes was blazing in the country, this meant its end. On June 12, 1919, Kolchak responded to this ultimatum with his written consent separately for each of its points.
In general, these days, kicking the Bolsheviks in passing is sacred. Recently, in a conversation about Soviet artistic art, a television announcer pleased with her phrase:

...that was that time when in the USSR artists were not yet shot for expressionism...

– name at least one artist of the USSR who was executed for expressionism. Who forces television announcers to insert complete Russophobia into the most innocent news about art? Because anti-Sovietism is the highest form of Russophobia. Moreover, from the White Guard Melgunov to the Nobel Prize laureate Solzhenitsyn, all anti-Sovietism is based on total lies. After such impromptu announcers, all television discussions about the denazification of Ukraine are perceived as a bawdy joke.
PS. I look forward to an article from the author about how the 15th Cavalry Corps of the Waffen SS heroically fought for the Third Reich until the last bullet. The tactics of punitive campaigns, uniforms, weapons, interaction with the Ukrainian brothers from the OUN - UPA will be very interesting.

[Lewww]

PS. I look forward to an article from the author about how the 15th Cavalry Corps of the Waffen SS heroically fought for the Third Reich until the last bullet.

Dear, do you enjoy posting nasty things in the form of personal speculation?

I have long noticed that there are many times more negative reviews on VO than positive ones

[Fat]

Victor. Everything you wrote is true. You painted another fence in bright colors - it's wonderful.
Everything you wrote is true, but it is not the truth. This is your personal reflection of her - “point of view”.
I am convinced that you are a good “artist”, there is a lot of expression in your words, it’s already enviable.
Can you draw? Everything written by Shpakovsky is also true, only from a different angle. That’s why the cycle is called “the unknown war.”
And so the “drawing” is for you personally, “comrade” prosecutor...

[Old electrician]

I present the drawings from a different angle. The drawings sequentially show the opening of the memorial plaque to Mannerheim. The direct consequence was Istanbul 1. Convince me that this is a coincidence. The second drawing is the grand opening of the monument to the Czechoslovak interventionists. Convince me that these are the heroes of the new Russia. The next drawing is a monument to the war criminal, deserter of the Russian fleet, British intelligence agent Kolchak. The last drawing is a monument to another war criminal, General Krasnov. Convince me after this that anti-Sovietism is not the highest form of Russophobia, but just an alternative view of history.

[Fat]

Oh how great everything is with us. "Beautiful, colorful, bright... but missed!"
Don't make cults out of these monuments. And your “I remember here!”, and the other, the crime... it’s impossible to remember. “Whoever remembers the old will get out of sight, and whoever forgets will get both!”
Wonderful selectivity in assessing monuments is inherent not only to the Soviet Government - it was Lenin’s plan for “monumental propaganda!”
But also to Russophobes, of all stripes
I have nothing against the “Bronze Horseman” in St. Petersburg, the monument to Alexander III....
I have never been against returning the Dzerzhinsky monument to Lubyanka, etc. I think that everything needs to be preserved, even Krasnov in Yelanskaya (you just need to write on the sign about the “merits” of the traitor). It's a pity that it's on private property. However, let it be on the conscience of the owner.
Disgraced himself.

[Old electrician]

Wonderful selectivity in assessing monuments is inherent not only to the Soviet Government - it was Lenin’s plan for “monumental propaganda!”
But also to Russophobes, of all stripes
I have nothing against the “Bronze Horseman” in St. Petersburg, the monument to Alexander III....

- It’s funny how you equate the monument to Peter I and the monument to the Czechoslovak interventionists. You are probably glad that children are taken to this monument and taught how to serve the interventionists and trade their homeland? Or does he represent something else? Let's build a monument to Hitler at the same time.
In fact, neither Lenin nor anyone else even mentioned the demolition of the monument to Tsar Peter.
As for the monuments to Alexander III, there are two of them and both are new.
The first monument was erected in St. Petersburg on May 23 (June 5), 1909 on Znamenskaya Square. This monument was not understood and immediately became a hero of folklore.
I will express my general point of view in the words of the artist Boris Kustodiev, who wrote about the monument to his wife on May 23, 1909:

I saw the monument to Alexander III last night. Very funny and absurd, the horse is completely without a tail, with his mouth open, as if he is screaming terribly, resisting and does not want to go further, and he himself is absurd and clumsy, especially comical from behind! The back is like a woman's chest and a horse's butt without a tail. There are a lot of people around, making very apt and ironic remarks...

The Provisional Government, being ultra-revolutionary, decided to demolish it. The monument was covered with shields, but they did not have time to eliminate it. They demolished them themselves.
Under Soviet rule, on October 15, 1937, the monument to Alexander III was dismantled and moved to the courtyard of the Russian Museum. Currently, this equestrian statue of Alexander III is installed in St. Petersburg in front of the entrance to the Marble Palace. There were and are no problems with this monument. Therefore, I sincerely do not understand what you are hinting at.
The second monument to Alexander III was unveiled in Irkutsk on August 30, 1908. However, just 12 years later, on May 1, 1920, the statue of Emperor Alexander III was toppled from its pedestal. During the civil war, Siberia in general and Irkutsk in particular suffered much more from the hare than St. Petersburg. Therefore, it is not for me, nor for you, nor for anyone else, to condemn the Siberians of that time for their anti-monarchist radicalism.
Since September 2003, a remake has stood in Irkutsk in the same place. It's worth it, and it's worth it. Doesn't bother anyone. Unlike their sons - Nicholas II, Alexander III, at the very least, they built Russia, and did not destroy it. Therefore, I don’t understand what you have against him.
Speaking of birds. The monument to Kolchak in Irkutsk was erected with blood money from the Andreevskaya organized crime group. The volume of the criminal case of the Andreev-Novoseltsev gang is 275 volumes. 87 episodes of criminal activity were proven, including more than 10 murders and about 50 robberies. Andreev is still on the international wanted list. Visual continuity of generations: a monument to the best people of Russia, which we lost, erected by the best people of our time.

[Fat]

Victor, it’s even surprising that you never mentioned the Yeltsin Center, which was built up by “corrupt oligarchs” with public money

[Doctor]

.it’s funny how you equate the monument to Peter I and the monument to the Czechoslovak interventionists.

To be fair, Herr Peter strangled an order of magnitude more Russian people than the Czechs.
Who were not interventionists, but on the contrary, tried to escape from this madhouse to France. And they left, revealing Kolchak as red along the way.
And before that, they fought well on the side of the Republic of Ingushetia in WWII.

[Old electrician]

...the Czechs, who were not interventionists, but on the contrary, tried to escape from this madhouse to France. And they left, revealing Kolchak as red along the way.
And before that, they fought well on the side of the Republic of Ingushetia in WWII.

- gee-gee-gee! a classic example of debilitation as a consequence of the installation of a monument to the interventionists.
26 September 1917 years Chief of Staff of the Supreme Commander General N.N. Dukhonin signed the order on the formation of a separate Czechoslovak corps of two divisions and a reserve brigade At that time, only two divisions with a total number of 39 thousand soldiers and officers were formed. The 1st Czechoslovak Division, in particular, included the Kornilovsky Shock Regiment, renamed Slavyansky. Its personnel included Czechs, Slovaks and Yugoslavs. This amusing army did not fire a single shot at the front. As you write there:

And before that, they fought well on the side of the Republic of Ingushetia in WWII.

– once again gee-gee-gee! What are the heroic battles of September 1917 in which the Czechs distinguished themselves?
Read the adventures of Schweik. The Czechs did not want to die for the Habsburgs. Why would they suddenly want to fight heroically for Kerensky? The Czechs distinguished themselves in another way. On November 15 (28), 1917, almost immediately after the October Revolution, a military meeting was held in Iasi. This meeting was attended by representatives of the Entente, White Guard officers, the Romanian command and delegates from the Czechoslovak Corps. The Entente representative raised the question of Czechoslovakia’s readiness for armed action against Soviet power and the possibility of occupying the region between the Don and Bessarabia. However, at that time the Czechs did not dare to speak out and remained neutral.
On January 15, 1918, the leadership of the Czechoslovak National Council (CNS, the Czechoslovak government in exile, had been in force since 1916). The CHNS, by agreement with the French government, officially proclaimed the Czechoslovak armed forces in Russia

an integral part of the Czechoslovak army, which is under the jurisdiction of the French Supreme Command

.
The National Security Council in Paris gave the commander of the Entente forces in Siberia, M. Janin, the authority to use the Czechoslovak Corps for the purposes of the interests of the allies, i.e. for intervention purposes. Together with Janin, the Minister of War of the Czechoslovak Republic, M. R. Stefanik, arrived in Vladivostok. The old Russian army at this time was rapidly falling apart, so soon the Czechoslovak corps became, in fact, the only military force in the entire territory of Russia.
On May 25, 1918, at the command of the “allies,” the Czechoslovak Corps began a rebellion and by June 9, 1918, the entire Trans-Siberian Railway from Penza to Vladivostok was under the control of the Czechs. It is noteworthy that the Czechs “stomped around” near Yekaterinburg for more than a month until Nicholas II and his family were shot there on July 17, 1918. Only after the “allies” were finally convinced of the authenticity of this news, on July 25, 1918, the Czechs heroically entered Yekaterinburg, which there was simply no one to defend from them. However, when searching for those responsible for the execution of the Romanov family, the British and French, like Caesar’s wife, are, of course, above suspicion.
No one hid the fact that the actions of the Czechs were an occupation of Russia. So on June 23, 1918, US Secretary of State R. Lansing offered to help the Czechs with money and weapons, expressing the hope that those

may mark the beginning of the military occupation of the Siberian Railway

.
And on July 6, 1918, US President Wilson read out a memorandum on intervention in Russia, in which he expressed hope

achieve progress by acting in two ways - providing economic assistance and assisting the Czechoslovaks

.
After getting acquainted with what the Czechs were doing in the occupied territories of Siberia, the adventures of the good soldier Schweik personally no longer make me laugh.

[Doctor]

. - gee-gee-gee! a classic example of debilitation as a consequence of the installation of a monument to the interventionists.
On September 26, 1917, Chief of Staff of the Supreme Commander-in-Chief General N.N. Dukhonin signed an order to form a separate Czechoslovak corps of two divisions and a reserve brigade. At that time, only two divisions with a total number of 39 thousand soldiers and officers were formed.

On July 25, 1914, on the day of the official declaration of war, the “Czech National Committee” (CHNK), which united Czech colonists in the Russian Empire, adopted an appeal to Emperor Nicholas II, which noted: “The Russian Czechs have the obligation to give their forces for liberation our homeland and be side by side with our Russian heroic brothers..."
The decision to create Czech volunteer military units to participate in the war on the side of Russia was made at the anti-Austrian demonstration in Kyiv, and the project was submitted to the government by the Kyiv Czech Committee created during the demonstration. On July 30, the Council of Ministers of the Russian Empire, supporting this initiative, decided to form a Czech squad.

The fact that the Czechs chose whites is natural, because initially they hoped for the collapse of the Habsburg Empire and the formation of their own state. The Bolsheviks, with the ears of the German General Staff sticking out behind them, did not seem to them an adequate candidate. Especially after the murder of Nikolai.

[Old electrician]

Affection for the interventionists simply flows out of you like a deep river. Speaking of Nikolai's murder. The Czechs stupidly waited near Yekaterinburg until he was executed and did not even lift a finger to save the former tsar. The White Guards complain in their memoirs that the British stubbornly blocked any attempts to save the Romanovs.

[Doctor]

Affection for the interventionists simply flows out of you like a deep river. Speaking of Nikolai's murder. The Czechs stupidly waited near Yekaterinburg until he was executed and did not even lift a finger to save the former tsar. The White Guards complain in their memoirs that the British stubbornly blocked any attempts to save the Romanovs.

There is no tenderness. I don’t care about the Czechs, I’ve never seen one. I am writing - for the sake of fairness.

The same with the British. Listen to me, they actually played for the Reds in the Civil War.

[Altmann]

There is a lot of truth in your article. The Czechs fought bravely near Zborov and their goal was to return home. Unfortunately, the situation was different and the Czech units tried to exploit everyone. The Czechs reclaimed their way around the track and once again made a big effort to harass the Czechs. Yes, the pressure on the Czech troops was strong, but the Czechs love most of all to leave Vladivostok to their home, their new homeland. I would like to apologize a little to the Czech Legion, but it is true that in the fight against Russia they were abused, this is something I personally and my friends regret.

[ln_ln]

This monument was not understood and immediately became a hero of folklore.

Read V.V. Rozanov "Paolo Trubetskoy and his monument to Alexander III."

[your vsr 66-67]

Quote: Old electrician

I present the drawings from a different angle. The drawings sequentially show the opening of the memorial plaque to Mannerheim. The direct consequence was Istanbul 1. Convince me that this is a coincidence. The second drawing is the grand opening of the monument to the Czechoslovak interventionists. Convince me that these are the heroes of the new Russia. The next drawing is a monument to the war criminal, deserter of the Russian fleet, British intelligence agent Kolchak. The last drawing is a monument to another war criminal, General Krasnov. Convince me after this that anti-Sovietism is not the highest form of Russophobia, but just an alternative view of history.

That's why my surname Shpakovsky is associated with a famous movie character?!

[Lewww]

Everything you wrote is true, but it is not the truth.

Strongly worded
I remembered a similar aphorism from the Golden Calf:

I did this not in the interests of truth, but in the interests of truth.

[Saxahorse]

Quote: Thick

Everything written by Shpakovsky is also true, only from a different angle.

We have been fed this “crap” about the relativity of truth for twenty years now. No that's not true. Pedophile rapists are evil. Preemptive executions are evil. And there is no need to practice sophistry here.

[BAI]

name at least one artist of the USSR who was executed for expressionism.

I remember an interview with one sufferer from the yoke of the Soviet regime.
In the 60-70s, he had a house on the territory of the Abramtsevo museum-reserve (where, by the way, both then and now all construction is prohibited) and in this house “40-50 people were constantly hanging out.” As I understand it, they are the same sufferers. Attention, question - what kind of shishi? Who in Soviet times could afford to support 50 dissidents? And this is not a camp, everything is clear there.

[kalibr]

In 1937 - 1938 in the Yaroslavl region the following artists were shot on falsified charges:


Alekseev Petr Alekseevich, 11.01.1884/26/26.08.1937, St. Petersburg. At the time of his arrest, he was a quality inspector at the Khudozhnik partnership. Living: Yaroslavl, st. Sovetskaya, 03.10.1938. Arrested on August 08.06.1957, XNUMX. Shot on October XNUMX, XNUMX near the village of Selifontovo. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX.

Ashmarin Vadim Stepanovich, born June 13.06.1915, 72, Tetyushi, Kazan province. At the time of his arrest, he was a cinema artist. Lived: Rybinsk, Lenin Ave., 02.10.1937. Arrested 21.02.1938/09.07.1957/XNUMX. Shot on February XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX.

Bazhenov Nikolai Ivanovich, 27.07.1873/03.10.1937/15.05.1938, p. Big Salts, Yaroslavl province. Painter of the “Artist” artel branch. Prozh.: p. Big Salts, Yaroslavl region. Arrested 06.07.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on May XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Evdokimov Nikolai Pavlovich, born September 15.09.1897, 6, village of Agafonovo, now Bolsheselsky district, Yaroslavl region. Chairman of the Yaroslavl Association "Artist". Living: Yaroslavl, Kotoroslnaya embankment, 01.06.1937. Arrested 30.12.1937/08.06.1957/XNUMX. Shot on December XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX.

Zhukov Nikolai Nikolaevich, 26.04.1878/141/13, p. Klimatino, Rostov district, Yaroslavl province. Artist of the club at warehouse No. 03.11.1937. Lives: Rostov, st. Lenina, 18.01.1938. Arrested 14.11.1957. Shot on January XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Sievert Ernest Frantsevich, born September 18.09.1879, 19, Tukumsky district, Courland province. (now Latvia). Artist of the Rybinsk branch of the “Artist” partnership. Living: Rybinsk, Severny lane, 03.12.1937. Arrested 28.06.1938/20.10.1958/XNUMX. Shot on June XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Zolotukhin Viktor Tikhonovich, 17.04.1904/29.09.1937/21.01.1938, Elizavetgrad (now Dnieper, Dnieper region, Ukraine). Artist of the cultural base YARAK. Prozh. in Yaroslavl. Arrested 21.07.1958/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on January XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Kadak Anthony Martynovich, 19.08.1896/45/26.08.1937, m. Nunya, Livlyandskaya province. (now Estonia). Chairman of the Yaroslavl Union of Artists. Living: Yaroslavl, st. Pervomaiskaya, 30.12.1937. Arrested on August 08.06.1957, XNUMX. Shot on December XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Kapralov Alexey Nikolaevich, 30.06.1903/15/22.10.1937, Fomkino village, Vologda province. Artist, member of the Yaroslavl Union of Artists. Living: Yaroslavl, st. B. Danilovskaya, 21.01.1938. Arrested 14.11.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on January XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Kopkin Alexander Vasilievich, born May 12.05.1901, 65, Vzdykhailovo village, Myshkinsky district, Yaroslavl province. Artist of the Yaroslavl Association "Artist". Lived: Yaroslavl, Volzhskaya embankment, 23.10.1937. Arrested 21.01.1938/14.11.1957/XNUMX. Shot on January XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Kulpinsky Marian Boleslavovich, 02.07.1902/13/29.07.1937, Lysolaya village, Lublin province. (now Poland). Artist of the Rybinsk cooperative "Artist". Lived: Rybinsk, Pilotskaya sq., 18.01.1938. Arrested 28.10.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on January XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Makarov Sergey Ivanovich, 1888, Kostroma. Design artist of the Kostroma Association "Artist". Living: Kostroma, Yaroslavl (now Kostroma) region. Arrested 11.06.1938/03.10.1938/11.06.1964. Shot on October XNUMX, XNUMX near the village of Selifontovo, Yaroslavl region. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Pavlov Boris Pavlovich, 06.08.1909/13/05.11.1937, Yaroslavl. Artist of the Yaroslavl Association "Artist". Living: Yaroslavl, st. Vologodskaya, 30.12.1937. Arrested 8.06.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on December XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Potekhin Nikolay Davydovich, born December 04.12.1891, 25, village of Melenki, Borovskaya vol., Yaroslavl province. Chairman of the Yaroslavl Association "Artist". Living: Yaroslavl, st. Pervomaiskaya, 27.10.1937. Arrested 30.12.1937/8.06.1957/XNUMX. Shot on December XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Saturov Nikolay Vasilievich, 1892, Tambov province. Artist of the club Art. Rybinsk Yaroslavl railway Prozh. in Rybinsk. Arrested 31.07.1937/27.11.1937/20.10.1989. Shot on November XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Sergeev Georgy Vasilievich, 25.01.1904/57/24.10.1937, Kostroma. Artist of the cooperative partnership "Artist". Living: Rybinsk, st. Pushkina, 03.10.1938. Arrested 08.12.1960/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on October XNUMX, XNUMX near the village of Selifontovo, Yaroslavl region. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Smirnov Sergey Ivanovich, 15.09.1899/47/05.11.1937, Yaroslavl. Artist of the Yaroslavl Association "Artist". Living: Yaroslavl, st. Republican, 30.12.1937. Arrested 8.06.1957. Shot on December XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Sokolov Vladimir Pavlovich, 01.06.1900/26/41, Rybinsk. Artist of the Palace of Culture of the Rybinsk Plant No. 26.10.1937. Lives: Rybinsk, Lenin Ave., 03.10.1938. Arrested 08.06.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on October XNUMX, XNUMX near the village of Selifontovo, Yaroslavl region. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Tregubov Gennady Nikolaevich, 1873, Kostroma. Artist of the Kostroma Association "Artist". Living: Kostroma, Yaroslavl region. Arrested 31.08.1938/03.10.1938/11.06.1964. Shot on October XNUMX, XNUMX in the forest near the village of Selifontovo, Yaroslavl region. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Uspensky Alexey Alexandrovich, 20.05.1887/8/06.11.1937, p. Kolychevo, Podolsky district, Moscow province. Artist. Living: Rostov, st. Oktyabrskaya, 11.03.1938. Arrested 28.02.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on March XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Tsarnakh Boris Nikolaevich, 1894, Yaroslavl. Artist of the Kostroma Association "Artist". Living: Kostroma, Yaroslavl region. (in 1936-1944). The date of the arrest is unknown. Shot on October 03.10.1938, 11.06.1964 in the forest near the village of Selifontovo, Yaroslavl region. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Shalaev Konstantin Nikolaevich, 17.05.1895/42/11.11.1937, village of Sterlyadevo, Rybinsky district, Yaroslavl province. Artist of the cooperative partnership "Artist". Living: Rybinsk, st. Lunacharsky, 30.12.1937. Arrested 08.06.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on December XNUMX, XNUMX. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

Shcheglov Sergey Vladimirovich, 24.09.1903/111/05.01.1938, Yaroslavl. Artist of the Yaroslavl Association "Artist". Living: Yaroslavl, st. Volodarsky, 03.10.1938. Arrested 08.06.1957/XNUMX/XNUMX. Shot on October XNUMX, XNUMX in the forest near the village of Selifontovo. Rehabilitated XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX

[Old electrician]

And which of them exactly was shot with the wording “for expressionism”? You claim that there was allegedly a political campaign against expressionist artists - evidence to the studio. And in general, among these innocent artists was there at least one expressionist? Name his works?
As for the innocent victims of political repressions of 1937-1938, I have long since passed the age at which they believe in the innocence of the “innocent”. Rehabilitation was widespread; its meanness can be illustrated by one simple example. In 1952, the former senior lieutenant of the Red Army Vasyura, who surrendered in 1941, received 25 years for collaboration with the German camp administration. After the 1985th Congress of the CPSU he was rehabilitated and received a certificate of innocent repression. On holidays he spoke to the pioneers, and was even named an honorary cadet of the Kyiv Higher Military Engineering Twice Red Banner School of Communications named after M.I. Kalinin - the one he graduated from before the war. In 40, on the 118th anniversary of the Victory, Vasyura finally became insolent and demanded for himself, as a war veteran, the Order of the Great Patriotic War. Only then did it become clear that the innocent victim of political repression was in fact the former chief of staff of the 360th Schutzmannschaft battalion, a punisher who personally supervised the massacre of the residents of Khatyn. During the trial, it was established that he personally killed more than XNUMX civilians - women, old people, children.
And also about innocent victims. All the foremen of Perestroika tore their shirts to the navel, cursing Stalin’s executioners. Today they are all as one in the West and are calling for the killing of Russians. Do you want to convince me that the artists you listed who were spanked in 1937-1938 were not like that?

[kalibr]

That is, all those shot by Stalin and his henchmen, including two people's commissars of the NKVD and three marshals, were Polish, German, Japanese spies? That the spies were Tupolev, Korolev, Meretskov, Meyerhold... Aren't there many spies per square meter of Russian land? And there are also examples of heroes who turned out to be not heroes, yes. One of the 26 Panfilov men, for example, was also... a bad person, but was considered a Hero!

[ZloyCat]

"That is, all those shot by Stalin and his henchmen, including two NKVD people's commissars and three marshals, were Polish, German, Japanese spies?"
Not everyone was shot for espionage, but everyone was shot for sabotage. Stalin personally did not shoot anyone. Just like Putin personally did not put Strelkov and Navalny in prison. For him, the competitors were removed by his henchmen. and Stalin did not eliminate competitors, but pests, Tukhachevsky, Blucher, do these names tell you something? Why did Korolev go to prison, do you know? Yezhov, in your opinion, is also an innocent victim?

[kalibr]

Quote: ZloyKot

there are competitors for him

For him...

[Old electrician]

Stop singing Khrushchev-Solzhenitsyn propaganda here! They're already tired of it.

...That the spies were Tupolev, Korolev...

If you were a historian, you would quote historical documents, and not the Russophobic propaganda of the Washington Regional Committee. About the espionage of Tupolev and Korolev.
A few months before his arrest, Tupolev once again went on a business trip to the United States of America, where he once again selected aircraft for the purchase of licenses for its production. He bought licenses for three aircraft there. One of them was the famous Douglas commercial third - a truly fabulously successful car. Suffice it to say that the DC-3 has an unlimited flight fitness certificate - that is, with proper routine maintenance of the vehicle, the DC-3 can be operated indefinitely. But the other two aircraft chosen by Tupolev, upon detailed examination by the board of the People's Commissariat of the Aviation Industry, were considered completely useless for the country. Thus, two out of three aircraft were considered unsuitable for our production, and public money was wasted. Naturally, the question arose: why did such a competent specialist as Tupolev decide to purchase them, why didn’t he realize on his own and immediately that we didn’t need such aircraft? This, of course, is not a basis for arrest, but a basis for suspicion. Further. When purchasing licenses in the United States of America and Britain, we always required the conversion of designs from the inch system to the metric system. Why did they demand it? Because this is in no way a formal task. Let's say, at some point in the original design, a quarter-inch thick sheet is 6.35 mm, and our industry does not produce sheet that thick. Produces either 6 mm or 6.5 mm. Only a designer who has all the initial data for strength calculations can unambiguously say whether in this case it is possible to limit oneself to a 6 mm sheet or whether a 6.5 sheet is needed. Without initial data, the entire strength calculation has to be done anew, from scratch. In particular, calculations to convert the DC-3 from an inch measure to a metric one took one of Tupolev’s closest collaborators - designer Vladimir Mikhailovich Myasishchev - and his working group for six months. Naturally, this has already aroused suspicion: did Tupolev receive some kind of kickback from the company for taking this work from it and shifting it onto the shoulders of our designers. The last straw in the cup of patience was that during this business trip, Tupolev at the same time bought for himself a company car and an air conditioner for his office. In principle, due to his official position, he was entitled to these rare things at that time. But he did not have the right to make a decision on their purchase on his own. He was obliged to request permission either from the People's Commissariat of the Aviation Industry or from the USSR Trade Representation in the SGA. He did neither one nor the other, and this is already an abuse of official authority and even a breach of trust. Based on the totality of all these charges, he was imprisoned. For proven sabotage. And what does espionage have to do with it?
It is known that the future designer of space technology Sergei Pavlovich Korolev was convicted - but not everyone knows what exactly he was convicted of. Korolev in 1937-38 developed guided missiles - cruise and anti-aircraft. Currently, cruise and anti-aircraft missiles are the most serious combat force. But when Korolev had just begun his work, the autopilot developers immediately said that they were not able to make a control system capable of operating in rocket flight conditions - if only because there the starting overloads are an order of magnitude higher than the overloads during any evolution of the aircraft. Unfortunately, they turned out to be right. Even the Germans, who were a couple of generations ahead of us in terms of instrumentation, managed to create a flying cruise missile - the Fieseler-103, better known as the V-1 - only in 1943. Fau is the first letter of the German word Vergeltung - retribution. The Germans declared England's participation in the war against the Germans to be a betrayal of its racial origin - accordingly, the weapon, capable of reaching England, was called "Retribution". The use of such missiles against targets other than London was impossible. The probable circular dispersion of the V-2 when flying to London was 10 km, the calculated circular deviation of the V-1 at this distance was 0,9 km. Nobody checked what it was like in reality with the V-1. If the USSR had produced such systems during the war, it would have been a waste of financial resources and strategic materials, and, as a result, would have led to irrational utilization of production capacity.
Until the very end of the war, German anti-aircraft missiles did not leave the experimental stage, although they were vital to Germany to counter the massive raids of British and American bombers on German cities. However, even the Germans could not create normally flying anti-aircraft missiles.
Given the unique technical difficulties in the design of liquid-propellant rockets, Korolev in 1938 would certainly not have succeeded in either. He was told this. He knew it. In addition, the Germans used an air-jet engine on the V-1 - it takes an oxidizer from the surrounding air, and only fuel is stored on board. In contrast, the Korolev cruise missile with a liquid-propellant rocket engine had to carry both fuel and an oxidizer on board. It is clear that the total energy reserve is an order of magnitude less than in the German version. V-1 flew up to three hundred kilometers, and the Korolev rocket, according to the project, was calculated for a flight range of 30 km.
The military immediately told him: in principle, they do not need a missile of this range; at such a distance it is easier to send an ordinary plane on a low-level flight - it will fly unnoticed, hit the target without a miss; and the Korolev rocket, firstly, will inevitably hit the wrong target, and, secondly, it costs almost the same as the plane, but the rocket is disposable, and the plane will return. Therefore, in general, a rocket with such characteristics has no prospects for practical application.
Despite these objections, Korolev was simply very interested in building rockets. He was a highly enthusiastic person, like all rocket scientists of that era (it was not for nothing that the abbreviation GIRD - Jet Propulsion Research Group - was deciphered by the participants themselves as “a group of engineers working for nothing”), and he really wanted to do at least something. As a result, he built 4 prototypes of the cruise missile. They all flew wherever God sent them. God even sent one of them to the dugout at the missile range, where at that moment there were several generals who had come to look at such exotic weapons. Naturally, Korolev was arrested on charges of attempting to assassinate representatives of the command staff of the Workers 'and Peasants' Red Army, misappropriation of public funds and undermining the country's defense capability through misappropriation of funds, since the Missile Research Institute where Korolev worked was financed from the defense part of the state budget . But during the investigation, the charge of assassination was immediately dropped: after all, if a missile flies anywhere, if it is impossible to create an autopilot for it, then it is impossible to deliberately aim it at the dugout with the generals. Therefore, although Korolev was arrested under the first category, crimes for which were punishable by death, this charge was dropped during the investigation, and he was given 10 years for a combination of other acts. From which, by the way, it is clear how, under the bloody regime, they attributed any kind of crime to everyone, and punished them for what they attributed.
This was under Yezhov, and under Beria this accusation was revised and they came to the conclusion that there was misuse of funds (when you do something obviously useless, which you have already been told from all sides that it is useless, then this is undoubtedly misuse of funds ), but there was no undermining of defense capability, because Korolev acted not out of malice, but out of sincere delusion - and, accordingly, his sentence was reduced from 10 years to 8, prescribed by law precisely for the misuse of government funds. True, he spent these years in closed design bureaus - the so-called sharashkas - and his talent was used for its intended purpose. But, as you can see, the accusations were, unfortunately, quite justified. Now, for such an attitude towards government money, Korolev would have received about the same amount, if, of course, someone had bothered to protect the treasury.
However, despite what has been said, Korolev might not have been imprisoned if not for Kostikov’s denunciation of Kleimenov, Langemak, Korolev and other employees of the Jet Research Institute (RNII). As a result, Kleimenov and Langemak were shot, and Kostikov became the father of the Katyusha. This happened too.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: kalibr

That the spies were Tupolev, Korolev, Meretskov, Meyerhold...

Where is Korolev’s article for espionage?
He was given "political economy" - Art. 58-7. Which was used for theft or embezzlement of public funds in cases where an ordinary criminal article was not enough.
And in fact, Korolev’s work amounts to a deliberate waste of budget funds and labor resources. For the future Chief Designer was well aware of the lack of a control system for his product - but continued to work. Instead of reporting to the top about the need to close the topic due to technical impracticability.

In 1936, he was developing a gunpowder winged torpedo; Knowing in advance that the main parts of this torpedo - devices with photocells - for controlling the torpedo and aiming it at the target, cannot be manufactured by the central laboratory of wire communication, Korolev, in order to load the institute with unnecessary work, intensively developed the missile part of this torpedo in 2 versions ...

As a result of this, tests of four torpedoes built by Korolev showed their complete unsuitability, which caused damage to the state in the amount of 120 rubles and delayed the development of other, more relevant topics.

The second factor that determined Korolev’s sentence was the ongoing campaign to bring various design bureaus “to the meridian.” For Kurchevsky and Dyrenkov were just the tip of the iceberg. In those days, even well-deserved design bureaus drove such things into the army that you were amazed. For example, a divisional gun is unable to fire military-grade shells. Or a large-caliber machine gun costing the same as an anti-tank gun, which took 7 years to fine-tune after being put into service.

[kalibr]

Alexei! Let's say this: ALL those convicted under Stalin, I emphasize ALL, were guilty and convicted FAIRLY. Is it coming? I think this will suit you. Then the question is, if all the enemies were exterminated, and the criminals were punished, but the Union eventually collapsed anyway, then... what was the point of punishing them at all?
So much blood, tears, children's tears and broken destinies and for what? Maybe we shouldn’t have bothered with this at all, and then it would have fallen apart faster and without blood and tears? If you were punished and still fell apart...What is the point of punishment then. They are absolutely MEANINGLESS! Oh, you hoped they would help? But isn’t it said (and in the Caucasus!) that the blood of martyrs feeds revenge and gives birth to grapes of wrath?

[Fat]

Quote: Old electrician

You want to whiten me

Victor. Nobody wants to “convince” you. All the same, you will continue to carry “fried facts” to support your point of view.
Try to prove better that the RSDLP (b) was not an extremist organization supporting terrorist methods in order to achieve the declared goal.

In the RSDLP (Bolsheviks) in 1905–1907, expropriations were widely used - armed confiscations of weapons, ammunition, explosives, cash and other valuables for the needs of the revolution.
The largest expropriations were controlled by the Combat Technical Organization, created in 1905 under the leadership of L. B. Krasin.
At the end of 1905 - beginning of 1906, combat groups were also created under many committees of the RSDLP.
The largest expropriations were carried out by militant groups of the RSDLP in the Caucasus, the Baltic states, Finland, and the Urals.

(C) YandexGPT neural network based on information from archive.aif.ru

[Old electrician]

Unlike you, I am not a Vlasovite to prove the illegitimacy of the Soviet government, which hoisted the red flag over the Reichstag.
To come to power, the Romanov dynasty organized the Time of Troubles, brutally killing the entire family of the legitimate sovereign Fyodor Godunov. Did people throw bombs at these ghouls? That's where they go.
PS. Prove that Nicholas II, popularly nicknamed “Bloody,” was not bloody.

[Fat]

Quote: Old electrician

Unlike you, I am not a Vlasovite to prove the illegitimacy of the Soviet government, which hoisted the red flag over the Reichstag.

Was it an insult? Or recognition of the wretchedness of your shallow agitation and propaganda.
I don't know anything about your age. But it was not my grandfather who fought in Stalingrad, but my father.
By calling me a Vlasovite, you are taking a big risk. Re-read the "rules"
You better apologize.
.

[BAI]

name at least one artist of the USSR who was executed for expressionism.

I remember an interview with one sufferer from the yoke of the Soviet regime.
In the 60-70s, he had a house on the territory of the Abramtsevo museum-reserve (where, by the way, both then and now all construction is prohibited) and in this house “40-50 people constantly dined.” As I understand it, they are the same sufferers. Attention, question - what kind of shishi? Who in Soviet times could afford to support 50 dissidents? And this is not a camp, everything is clear there.

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

I read it and immediately shed a stingy tear for the White Army!

Good day, Ivan!
It’s as if I’m also one of the Reds, both by upbringing and by conviction, but history is a capricious lady and plays with all its colors when you study it from different sources.
What Vyacheslav (Author) is great at is how he throws out negative points like a PR man. Sometimes without a purpose, like today’s opus about a rifle with RSFSR markings, and sometimes, so that “battle hamsters with a bare heel on a saber.” In my opinion, this article is nothing more than a provocation.
I just want to add in the epigraph “how, following the victories in Russia, we emigrated to France.
R.s. The rubicon for the white movement was the attack of Nazi Germany on the Soviet Union. It was this “red line” that showed who is a real Russian and who is not.

[kalibr]

Quote: Kote pane Kohanka

and who doesn't.

I am surprised at the reaction of some of my comrades. The article is a memoir from which you cannot erase words. There are no ratings in it. A simple statement of facts, and about salt, in my opinion, it’s just funny. One of the highlights of why White lost. But no. Immediately some kind of hysteria begins, they drag in Russophobia and the SS. For what? For what? Strange affair. Why is it possible to write about the actions of armored trains during... the Civil War, but not about how they acted in our country, and from “the other side”? Or should each such material end with the words THE RED WON, long live the USSR! So they will mistake him for a patient... Although, probably, someone will be happy.

[Tim666]

Typical communist propaganda.
One might think that if Lenin and the Entente company had been offered help, they would have refused. The Bolsheviks owe a lot to Kolchak for their victory, for if he had shown more flexibility and promised independence after the victory to the Finns, Balts and Poles, Yudenich very likely would have taken St. Petersburg, but Kolchak was not a politician, he tried to be a knight, fought for the one and indivisible, and in the end lost everything. In any conflict, everyone is looking for allies whenever possible, so accusations against whites are ridiculous; in the Civil War, everyone has their own truth and, as a rule, the more cunning and flexible ones win

[Old electrician]

...but Kolchak was not a politician, he tried to be a knight, fought for the one and indivisible...

gee-gee-gee! Ze is campaigning against corruption all the way. And what? Is there no more corruption in Ukraine?
The best definition of the word "knight" that I know. P. von Winkler in the book “Weapons” (1894):

The government did not interfere with this increasingly increasing development of luxury; as a result of robbery, it was easily obtained, and military men were constantly on campaigns, equally robbing both the owners and the enemies of the conquered areas. Velvet, Venetian silk, gold and silver brocade - these are the common materials from which military dress was made, material taken from the chests of citizens and often paid for instead of money with a blow of the sword. Whether the warriors meet a man or a woman, they completely rob them, sometimes not even leaving a shirt, and in the southern border areas the warriors even sold girls and women to the Turks...

.
Note that von Winkler is a hereditary nobleman and a conscientious researcher of weapons and historical facts.
Kolchak was a true knight in Winkler's understanding.
Kolchak took command of the Black Sea Fleet on July 9, 1916, under the persistent patronage of “Russia’s best friend,” the British Ambassador to Petrograd, Sir George William Buchanan. The same one who organized the overthrow of the Tsar on March 4, 1917. Convince me that the British protege Kolchak was rooting for the interests of Russia, and not Great Britain.
On October 20, 1916 (according to the new style), the battleship "Empress Maria" took off on the roadstead of the Sevastopol Bay. After this explosion, a bold cross was put on the planned Bosphorus landing operation of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Empire. Learning about this event in Berlin and London, they rubbed their hands with equal joy.
Despite the fact that the indifferent Nicholas II paternally expressed his sympathy to Kolchak for the loss of the flagship, an investigation was appointed. The first thing the commission of inquiry faced was that Admiral Kolchak made such a mess on the flagship that you will not find in a gypsy camp. Violations of the Naval Regulations on the battleship were simply egregious. In any fleet of any country, they are hanged for such a thing, even in peacetime. It should be especially noted that the gypsy camp on the battleship "Empress Maria" in particular, and on the Black Sea Fleet in general, was organized not by sailors, but by gentlemen officers. This, apparently, is explained by the fact that service in the Navy was more prestigious than even in the Guards, and therefore only the highest noble elite of Tsarist Russia served in the Navy, confident in their celestial existence and, as a result, in impunity.
The most likely reason for the explosion of the battleship Empress Maria was a German sabotage. However, no matter for what reason it exploded, the final conclusions of the commission were expected to be the saddest for Kolchak. And then lo and behold - the February Revolution! The joyful Kolchak personally informed the sailors about the course of revolutionary events in Petrograd, and on March 5 (February 20), 1917, he ordered a parade and a prayer service on the occasion of the overthrow of the Autocracy. Naturally, after this, the investigation into the explosion of "Empress Maria" immediately died out - the Hero of the Revolution is not a tsarist satrap for you, he should be beyond suspicion.
By June 1917, Kolchak, suddenly remembering the Naval Regulations, brought the relationship between sailors and naval officers to the boiling point. And this is in conditions of legalized anarchy after the February Revolution. Then, thanks to the democratic reforms of the Provisional Government, both the Russian army and navy were split into two camps that hated each other, formed by the rank and file and officers. The slightest spark was enough for the flame of this mutual hatred to explode with all its might. Therefore, in the summer of 1917, having pushed the Black Sea Fleet to a point of no return, Kolchak abandoned the fleet to its fate and left Russia, going without permission to his patrons in England. In the language of military jurisprudence, this is called desertion. Almost immediately, at the request of the American ambassador in England, the “promising” admiral for the “allies” was sent to the United States, where he was recruited by the diplomatic intelligence of the US State Department. The recruitment was carried out by former Secretary of State Eliahu Root. So Admiral Kolchak betrayed the fleet and Russia and became a servant of two masters.
On October 12 (25), 1917, Kolchak and his officers, filled with the most rosy political plans for the reconstruction of Russia in the interests of its new masters, set off on a Japanese steamer from San Francisco to Vladivostok. Two weeks later they arrived in the Japanese port of Yokohama, where they learned about the overthrow of the Provisional Government. There in Japan, Kolchak sent a request to the English envoy in Tokyo, Sir Greene, “... to bring to the attention of the English government that I am asking to be accepted into the English army on any conditions...”. On December 30, 1917, the British government officially granted Kolchak's request. From that moment on, he ceased to be a Russian admiral and became a British officer.
The British did not immediately decide where and how to use Kolchak. Therefore, in order to carry out their not entirely clear instructions, he had to wander around for some time. But, in the end, the die was cast, and on November 5, 1918, through the efforts of the same generals Knox and Janin, Kolchak was appointed Minister of Military and Naval Affairs of the Provisional All-Russian Government.
On November 18, 1918, Kolchak overthrew the Provisional All-Russian Government (Ufa Directory). After the overthrow of the Directory, member of the Constituent Assembly Nil Fomin and 9 prominent Socialist Revolutionaries and Mensheviks - members of the Directory were hacked to pieces with sabers and shot by Kolchak's officers. This is not the snotty statement of the anarchist sailor A. Zheleznyakov “the guard is tired” at the closing of the meeting of the Constituent Assembly, but a program for legitimizing the new government enthusiastically accepted in the circles of modern admirers of the Bulkokhrusts.
From the first to the last day, Kolchak, who appropriated the title “Supreme Ruler,” was a puppet in the hands of the “allies.” Kolchak was not considered by them as the ruler of the state, and the White Guard movement as a whole was not perceived by the Entente as an application for the creation of a sovereign state. These were nothing more than native troops, blindly obeying the colonialists. Kolchak did not have any political independence at all. The commander-in-chief of the forces of the allied states in East Russia and Western Siberia was General Janin, and General Knox was the head of the rear and supply of the Kolchak army. Nowadays, with a stingy tear in a blue eye, it is customary to call the intervention a “fratricidal war.” Let's list our brothers. In Siberia, to support Kolchak, in addition to the Czechoslovak corps, there were an American corps (about 10 thousand), three Japanese divisions numbering 120 thousand people, 60 thousand Chinese, a Polish division, two English battalions, a Canadian brigade, French units, a Romanian legion of 4500 people, several thousand Italians, a regiment of Croats, Slovenians and Serbs, a battalion of Latvians numbering 1300 people.
I have already written about what was behind the chatter about “One and Indivisible”. I won't repeat it.
A separate topic is the looting of the royal treasury by Kolchak and the Kolchakites. I will say this very briefly.
On August 7, 1918, Kolchak’s troops seized the tsar’s gold reserves, which the Bolsheviks inherited from Kerensky. In total, according to the Russian emigrant S.G. Petrov, as of November 1917, the reserves of the central bank of Imperial Russia, taking into account the 38,75 tons received from the mines during the war years for the amount of 50 million rubles, amounted to 852,97 tons of gold worth 1101,69 million rubles.
Since tsarist times, the gold reserves of the Russian Empire were under the jurisdiction of the Council of Department Managers - the Bolsheviks did not touch them. On December 3, 1918, all members of the Council were arrested by General V.O. Kappel and shot. Kolchak and his gang had no need for witnesses, so no one else interfered with the great “tyring”. Moreover, exactly how much was “stolen” will apparently forever remain a mystery of history. Since the initial figures of gold captured on August 7 were taken from the air.
In May 1919, a group of employees of the Omsk Bank began counting gold. It was established that in total there was gold in Omsk in the amount of 651 rubles. These are 532 million gold. rubles and are called in our time as captured in Kazan in August 117. Judging by the report, at that time one hundred million rubles in credit notes, the royal reserves of platinum, at least 651 poods (1918 tons) of silver coins and much more had already completely evaporated. Subsequently, gold parts of instruments belonging to the Main Chamber of Weights and Measures, gold frames of icons, together with icons, other religious objects made of gold and precious stones, etc. were stolen. gold. The total weight of the missing jewelry is more than a thousand tons. From the royal treasury, the Czechs returned only 30000 tons of gold to the Bolsheviks.

[dump22]

name at least one artist of the USSR who was executed for expressionism

Well, for example Alexander Drevin (1889–1938)

[kalibr]

83 years after the tragic events, KOSTROMA.TODAY recalls one of the most tragic cases of 1937: 8 Kostroma artists were executed on charges of conspiracy. Rambler reports this. Next: https://weekend.rambler.ru/other/43082025/?utm_content=weekend_media&utm_medium=read_more&utm_source=copylink

[Chief Officer Lom]

83 years after the tragic events, KOSTROMA.TODAY recalls one of the most tragic cases of 1937: 8 Kostroma artists were executed on charges of conspiracy.

Of course, purely statistically, there were artists among those executed. But they weren’t shot for expressionism, were they?

[kalibr]

Quote: Chief Officer Lom

But they weren’t shot for expressionism, were they?

They undoubtedly wanted to kill Stalin!

[Chief Officer Lom]

Well why? They could be supporters of the overthrow of the Soviet regime, or they could simply be denounced by their fellow artists, with whom they were in a quarrel or bypassed them in organizing an exhibition or working with publishing houses and other employers. Denunciation at that time completely replaced a knife blow from a neighbor or rat poison in soup in a communal kitchen on the basis of personal hostility, and was also a means of clearing the way on the career ladder and solving the housing problem. And the NKVD investigators at that time were mostly not graduates of law schools and police schools, but former peasants and workers who had completed a literacy program; in those days, higher education was probably less common than noble origin...

[Old electrician]

About another victim of political repression. Quote from the biography of theoretical physicist L.D. Landau:

...Since 1935, the situation in the UPTI [theoretical department of the Kharkov Institute of Physics and Technology] has changed tragically. The terror that gripped the country in the second half of the 30s did not escape the UPTI. The fabricated “cases” resulted in the arrests and executions of a number of leading employees of the institute. Shubnikov was shot in the dungeons of a Kharkov prison. Landau was not arrested at that time, but the threat of arrest was very real. She forced him to “flee” from Kharkov. Fortunately, Landau had an invitation from Kapitsa to take the position of head of the theoretical department of the Institute of Physical Problems (now named after Kapitsa) organized by the latter...

- just horror of our town!
On the night of April 27–28, 1938, Landau was arrested. The very next morning, April 28, P.L. Kapitsa writes a letter to Stalin in defense of his employee. Throughout the year, Kapitsa has not stopped efforts to free Landau. In the fall of 1938, Niels Bohr also appealed to Stalin in defense of Landau:

if there was a misunderstanding, [Landau] will be able to continue his research work, which is so important for the progress of mankind

. As a result of such intercession, in April 1939, Landau was released “under the personal guarantee” of Kapitsa. So in the USSR people were shot for studying physics.
Alas and ah! As it later turned out, physics had absolutely nothing to do with it. In 1991, Landau's criminal case was published. Along with other innocent victims of executions for physics, he burned to death on the production of anti-Soviet literature(!!!) - a favorite hobby of the Soviet intelligentsia. In underground agitations, Landau compared Stalin with Hitler and called for the overthrow of power. An analysis of Landau’s statements and activities suggests that, despite his release from arrest, he remained an anti-Soviet until the end of his days. I just started acting smarter.

[kalibr]

Quote: Old electrician

In underground agitations, Landau compared Stalin with Hitler and called for the overthrow of power. An analysis of Landau’s statements and activities suggests that, despite his release from arrest, he remained an anti-Soviet until the end of his days. I just started acting smarter.

Nothing is smarter. The reports of the sexots who were sent to him about his open anti-Soviet statements have been preserved. But... they didn’t do anything to him! Because he was already “Landau” and a bomb was needed... I’ll have to write about this in detail sometime. That some in the USSR were allowed to say everything. If only they worked. There is material!

[Aviator_]

Because he was already "Landau" and a bomb was needed...

There is little left to find out what exactly Landau did for the bomb. This is not Kurchatov, not Zeldovich, not Khariton, not Zavenyagin, not Negin... - these were the ones who worked. In addition, they left a decent scientific legacy, at least Zeldovich’s textbook “Shock Waves”. And the course by terfiz Landau and Lifshitz is very specific, although it was republished several times, but for some reason I have not met users of this multi-volume book - these issues are presented quite well by other authors.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

And the course by terfiz Landau and Lifshitz is very specific, although it was republished several times, but for some reason I have not met users of this multi-volume book - these issues are presented quite well by other authors.

I don't know, I'm not an expert. But the fact that he was allowed to say things for which others were imprisoned is certain. If not “for the bomb,” then for what else?

[Old electrician]

Contemporaries criticized Drevin for

formalism" and "naturalism"

And what does expressionism have to do with it? At the same time, there is no evidence of his innocence. Because after rehabilitation, the criminal cases of the rehabilitated were immediately destroyed. This is how they hid the evidence. Therefore, he could equally well be an Abwehr employee and an ideological Trotskyist. Prove that this is not so.

[kalibr]

Quote: Old electrician

Therefore, he could equally well have been an Abwehr employee,

So many artists are Abwehr employees?

[Senior seaman]

Quote: Old electrician

At the same time, there is no evidence of his innocence.

This is 5 !!!
Presumption of innocence? No, have not heard))

[Old electrician]

Please forgive my legal ignorance. The presumption of innocence is when those convicted by a court under Article 58 of the Criminal Code of the RSFSR "anti-Sovietism" are automatically declared innocent?

[Senior seaman]

Quote: Old electrician

Please forgive my legal ignorance.

There's no shame in not knowing something. It's a shame not to want to know anything.

Quote: Old electrician

The presumption of innocence is when those convicted by a court under Article 58 of the Criminal Code of the RSFSR "anti-Sovietism" are automatically declared innocent?

No. This means that the innocent do not have to prove their innocence. It is the prosecution authorities who must prove that there is guilt. Because if something exists, its existence can be proven. If something does not exist, then it is impossible to prove or disprove its existence.
Therefore the phrase

Quote: Old electrician

At the same time, there is no evidence of his innocence.

absurd.

[kalibr]

Quote: Old electrician

I look forward to an article from the author about how the 15th Cavalry Corps of the Waffen SS heroically fought for the Third Reich until the last bullet. The tactics of punitive campaigns, uniforms, weapons, interaction with the Ukrainian brothers from the OUN - UPA will be very interesting.

I don't have to wait. Here was my material about foreign units of the German army and the SA in particular. You can find it through a search engine.

[Captain45]

Quote: Old electrician

PS. I look forward to an article from the author about how the 15th Cavalry Corps of the Waffen SS heroically fought for the Third Reich until the last bullet. The tactics of punitive campaigns, uniforms, weapons, interaction with the Ukrainian brothers from the OUN - UPA will be very interesting.

If you are interested in this topic, I recommend the books by D.A. Zhukov and I.I. Kovtun: “29 SS Division”, “Russian Police”, “Russian SS Men”, they co-authored with I.V. Gribkov “Special Headquarters” Russia"

[Aviator_]

And from somewhere there was a rumor that there was a terrible shortage of salt in Moscow. And, they say, when we win and enter the Mother See, salt will be in short supply there. And if so, the crew of the armored train literally filled it with bags of salt, hoping to sell it in Moscow at exorbitant prices and make good money on it!

This is how the “select 20%” also wanted to get rich. And my grandfather, who belongs to the remaining 80%, for some reason opposed these hucksters in uniform. And at the same time he drove them to Novorossiysk. And he did the right thing, no matter how much the current crystal bakers whine about it.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

This is how the “select 20%” also wanted to get rich.

That's why they lost, because they wanted to get rich like in the good old days!

[Lewww]

Quote: Aviator_
This is how the “select 20%” also wanted to get rich.

That's why they lost, because they wanted to get rich like in the good old days!

Not for this reason, but primarily because the white army was small in number and had no reserves.
Well, then there are other factors, and among them the lack of properly organized propaganda work - in this category the Bolsheviks were the clear leaders, there were all fiery orators who masterfully mastered demagogic techniques
The whites had many talented military men, but no talented politicians

[parusnik]

Not for this reason, but primarily because the white army was small in number and had no reserves.

They went to the White Army at the behest of their souls, and to the Red Army at gunpoint from the Mausers of the Chekists. Therefore, there were no reserves and it was small in number. About military talents. Somehow there wasn’t enough talent to defeat what was essentially a partisan army, the Red Army, in 1918 and early 1919.

[Lewww]

They went to the White Army at the behest of their souls, and to the Red Army at gunpoint from the Mausers of the Chekists.

Most of the RIA officers went to the Red Army under duress, and the soldiers voluntarily, because the Bolsheviks immediately put forward very accessible and tempting slogans

Somehow there wasn’t enough talent to defeat what was essentially a partisan army, the Red Army, in 1918 and early 1919

There was enough talent, but alas, there was no strength and means.
The outcome of wars of that level was no longer decided only by the talents of commanders

[Aviator_]

They went to the White Army at the behest of their souls, and to the Red Army at gunpoint from the Mausers of the Chekists.

Alexey, to be honest, did not expect such insanity from you. If this is trolling, then it is so subtle that it is not visible. My grandfather, a Voronezh peasant, was not forced into the Red Army by any commissar with a Mauser. But for some reason my grandfather avoided Denikin’s mobilization. He probably had a choice, and he made it, like the majority of the Russian population.

[parusnik]

Sergey,

If this is trolling, then it is so subtle that it is not visible.

Yes, he is. I’ll tell you about my own. Five brothers, my grandmother, not high officer ranks, at the level of centurions, voluntarily went to the Red Army without mobilization, retreated with the 11th Army to Astrakhan in 1918, then their fate scattered them along the fronts. Grandfather, he served with Budyonny , by the way, an employee of my great-grandfather. Beat Denikin, fought with the White Poles, finished off Wrangel. The maternal line was from nobles, small-scale residents, those registered Cossacks whom Catherine later wrote down as gentry. And my great-grandfather, on the paternal side, was a participant in the first uprising in the village of Sedelnikovo against Kolchak in the same 1918, also not from poor peasants. If the whites had not been helped with weapons, everything would have ended much earlier. I wrote a long time ago that I did not intend to dance on the bones of my ancestors, who established Soviet power, fought for it, restored, built, they fought for her again, on her mother’s side, no one returned from the front of the Second World War. My paternal grandfather defended Leningrad, was captured, escaped, there is a family legend why they weren’t shot, he made boots such that they were left alive. He escaped for the second time, in Italy , were taken to Africa, Rommel, to build fortifications. The train was bombed. He joined the partisans, but not the communists, those who were caught. For the loss of political vigilance, he spent a year in exile, in Poti. This was after the war. But we have lovers jump on the bones.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: parusnik

About military talents. Somehow there wasn’t enough talent to defeat what was essentially a partisan army, the Red Army, in 1918 and early 1919.

Belash had an excellent description of the degradation of the tactics of career officers of the Russian Army during the Civil War.

IMHO, most of all the civil war resembled a war not even of the XNUMXth, but of the XNUMXth-XNUMXth centuries - large and small gangs (sic) of unknown orientation and unknown numbers roam the ruined country in an unknown direction. With their heads at the peaks and hatred of all living things.
Instead of assault teams - walking in the attack with thick chains without a shot, without bending down and not lying down, and the officers are proud of it. My God, many years before this, the last blacks in Africa knew what a machine gun, shrapnel and magazine rifles were. On the WWII fronts, even half a head could not be raised, or looked out into a loophole.
Since August 14th, when the hands lying under shrapnel were digging shelters, fortification and tactics have developed incredibly. And then "the simplest tactical truths were perceived as a revelation." In the 18th, “trenches and fortifications were not built. The largest that was dug by a hole to protect the shoulders and head, for the most part lay open ”, in the 19th“ our trenches were built extremely remotely ”and in the 20th already on Perekop it was the same. Artillery pulls up and openly shoots at close range, forgetting just everything. Intelligence is such that even in the 18th, the Reds attack suddenly, despite the fact that their plans and radio were read freely. And a constant refrain: “But if the hand of the red machine gunner / gunner didn’t flinch, we would all remain there.”

But what happened to the leaders?
Kornilov - four days later the Reds finally hit the headquarters (I wonder how many tens of seconds Kornilov would have lived in the same situation in WWII?).

[Aviator_]

that they wanted to get rich like in the good old days!

Only the rest of the population was fed up with the “good old days”, since they were only “good” for 20%. Whether these 20% should be considered the smartest is not obvious. I would not, despite the knowledge of foreign languages ​​by some of them.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

Whether these 20% should be considered the smartest is not obvious. I would not, despite the knowledge of foreign languages ​​by some of them.

Remember Orwell. Sometimes the higher ones lose their grip, become drunkards, the authorities corrupt them... Then the middle ones call the lower ones to the barricades and with their help overthrow the higher ones. This is exactly the case. Long years of power and prosperity corrupted the elite, despite all their knowledge of foreign languages, they degenerated socially. They had nothing to offer their people in the new conditions. So they were swept away... Everything is logical... You can’t even come up with an emblem for the Whites that would be stronger than the emblem for the Reds, and that says a lot.

[Doctor]

.Only the rest of the population was fed up with the “good old days”, since they were “good” only for 20%. Whether these 20% should be considered the smartest is not obvious. I would not, despite the knowledge of foreign languages ​​by some of them.

Yes, we lived normally. As always, those who worked.
Here is a photo of an ordinary mechanic, 1916 by the way.

He is 22 and has been married for two years. The salary of this unskilled mechanic is 45 rubles per month. At the same time, black bread costs 2 kopecks per pound, sieve bread - 5 kopecks, one egg - 1 kopeck, 400 grams of lard - 22 kopecks, new boots - 6 rubles. A mechanic rents a three-room apartment (living room, kitchen, dining room, bedroom). Since the mechanic is young, he has not yet received high qualifications, so he works as a simple mechanic.

A highly qualified mechanic earns up to 90 rubles a month. This mechanic later left memoirs in which he wrote that “after the revolution, wages dropped, and even greatly, but prices rose greatly,” and also recalled that when he “conducted party work in Moscow, he didn’t have even half of this, although he held quite a high place."

[Aviator_]

Yes, we lived normally. As always, those who worked.

On whom? And how did it work? What about the fine system, work barracks, 12-hour working day? So von Meck, who built the Moscow-Ryazan section in the 60s of the 12th century, forced him to work on his railway for 10 hours in the summer and XNUMX hours in the winter (it was a pity for the wood to illuminate the route and heat the workers).

[Doctor]

. On whom? And how did it work? What about the fine system, work barracks, 12-hour working day? So von Meck, who built the Moscow-Ryazan section in the 60s of the 12th century, forced him to work on his railway for 10 hours in the summer and XNUMX hours in the winter (it was a pity for the wood to illuminate the route and heat the workers).

Well, I don’t know, he left his memoirs, he says “I’m not complaining.”

“Now for some... it sounds strange. But it's true. When before the revolution I worked as a mechanic and earned my 40-45 rubles a month, I was financially better off than when I worked as secretary of the Moscow regional and city party committees. I’m not complaining, I’m just illustrating how we lived then.”

[Aviator_]

I’m not complaining, I’m just illustrating how we lived then.”

This is true, you just need to replace the pronoun “we” with “I.” And then continue, as he personally crunched on a French roll.

[Doctor]

This is true, you just need to replace the pronoun “we” with “I.” And then continue, as he personally crunched on a French roll.

When he says WE, he means AFTER THE REVOLUTION.

There it goes like this:

“Now for some... it sounds strange. But it's true. When before the revolution I worked as a mechanic and earned my 40-45 rubles a month, I was financially better off than when I worked as secretary of the Moscow regional and city party committees. I'm not complaining, I'm just illustrating how we lived then. We lived for the cause of the revolution, for the sake of the future of communism, everything and everyone was subordinated to this. It was difficult for us. But we remembered that we were the first in the world to build socialism and therefore must tighten our straps in order to allocate more funds for the industrialization of the country.”

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

12 hour work day?

Sergey! Well, stop demonstrating your ignorance, do better physics. We worked a lot, yes, 10-12 hours, yes. But we also rested to our heart's content. In addition to physical non-working days, there were also religious holidays, when no one worked either. I accurately calculated how many non-working days there were and it turns out that with an 8-hour day, our worker worked in general more than the Tsar’s with 12!!! I had an article about this, but a long time ago. It is necessary to repeat, to revive, so to speak, the memory.

[Aviator_]

Well, stop showing your ignorance,

Vyacheslav, don’t you want to look in the mirror? Better study medieval rags, your class interest sticks out less there. I live not far from the Moscow-Rzan road, here are Morozov’s factories built in 1868-1873, and barracks buildings, and a museum, etc. I wish you to work 12 hours a day for at least a month, this is not teaching Marxism-Leninism.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

Well, stop showing your ignorance,

Vyacheslav, don’t you want to look in the mirror? Better study medieval rags, your class interest sticks out less there. I live not far from the Moscow-Rzan road, here are Morozov’s factories built in 1868-1873, and barracks buildings, and a museum, etc. I wish you to work 12 hours a day for at least a month, this is not teaching Marxism-Leninism.

Why immediately “you”, Sergey? In principle, we don’t know each other personally; we didn’t drink at brotherhood. What kind of boorish plebeian manner is this to immediately “poke” strangers if they think almost differently from us? And my class interest is also the interest of my country today.

[ZloyCat]

“What is this boorish plebeian manner of immediately “poking” strangers?”
"boors, ha-amas." Shpakovsky Zhezh from the Palestinian nobles, and you call him like that! although there is a reason, in my opinion. an ardent anti-Soviet, with his whole family, who has been sucking the blessings of life from the wrinkled nipple of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union all his life. I can’t stand people like that, “they would be disgusting if they got smaller.” here for sure, either panties or a cross

[Aviator_]

sucking the blessings of life from the shriveled nipple of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union

So while this subject was in his youth and student age, the nipple was very elastic, but then it suddenly became what it is.

[ZloyCat]

"So while this subject was in his youth and student age"
I don’t argue, but I sucked it with all my might.” Our whole family is like that.”

[kalibr]

There is a good saying, Sergey, you should know it: “Take from life what you want, but pay for it.” Now, I have to read a couple of idiots, but this is a small price to pay!

[kalibr]

Quote: ZloyKot

Shpakovsky Zhezh from the Palestinian nobles

Not Palestinian. Of the Belarusian ones, only by his stepfather, and he by his mother. Remember for the future and don’t misinterpret it anymore.

[ZloyCat]

"Remember for the future and don't misinterpret it again"
Maybe you can prove it? or is a noble word enough?

[kalibr]

Quote: ZloyKot

"Remember for the future and don't misinterpret it again"
Maybe you can prove it? or is a noble word enough?

Don't know how to use the Internet? There is the coat of arms of the Shpakovsky family, and there is also a society of people bearing this surname. There are also my articles about my family here on VO. But, yes, my word should be enough for you, because you can’t lie to me on the Internet.

[ZloyCat]

“You don’t know how to use the Internet? There is the coat of arms of the Shpakovsky family, there is also a society of people bearing this surname”
not all people bearing the surname Sheremetv, or Golitsyn, are from those same ones. more often than not, they are not even namesakes. do you have proof that you are one of those? Well, except for your word, of course?

[ZloyCat]

“Of the Belarusians, only by his stepfather, and he by his mother”
that is, a nobleman by stepfather, and not by blood? and dad is a lawyer, like a famous character? and his mother is not from Grodno? after all, they consider their nationality based on their mother

[kalibr]

Quote: ZloyKot

and his mother is not from Grodno? after all, they consider their nationality based on their mother

You really want to register me as a Jew, right? But my own mother is quite Russian. But as for the stepfather, again the Internet will help you, the Shpakovskys are from near Minsk Mazowiecki and, judging by the coat of arms, served in the gentry cavalry. By the way, the coat of arms is inscribed in some sort of velvet book of the Russian Empire. Although, it is clear that all this has very little to do with me personally. My great-grandfather on my mother’s side was a tradesman in the city of Morshansk; he moved to Penza after the reform of 1861. Here on VO there was an article about him... with a photograph.

[Aviator_]

Why immediately “you”, Sergey?

Not right away, I’ve already responded to your specific communication like this before. So sensitive, just like a college girl.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

So sensitive, just like a college girl.

No, it’s just that in our social group this is the usual address of well-mannered people.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

workers' barracks,

They were much cleaner than peasant houses with earthen floors and also (obligatory!) had a toilet with a hole, while the peasants didn’t even have a toilet, but relieved themselves at the fence, and the old people in the hut at the washstand!

[Aviator_]

whereas the peasants didn’t even have a toilet, but relieved themselves at the fence, and the old people in the hut at the washstand!

Where does such knowledge come from, from Penza life? I have been to the villages of Orenburg, Penza (the vicinity of Bekovo) and Crimea, quite a long time ago, in the 60s of the last century. This did not happen even in Uzbekistan in the Fergana Valley (Tyura Kurgan). For some reason this has never happened anywhere. Maybe the bloody Bolsheviks were eliminated, if suddenly they were?

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

For some reason this has never happened anywhere.

Sholokhov re-read... "Virgin Soil Upturned". The place where Shchukar ate too much steamed veal... And then someday I’ll go to the archives and find a letter to the newspaper “Gubernskie Vesti” dated 2000. It’s just about toilets in a village in Belarus in 1941. Wrote by one of the readers... About his relatives.

[Aviator_]

Sholokhov re-read... "Virgin Soil Upturned".

And where is there about toilets near the washbasin? Did the peasants really gorge themselves on veal every day?

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

Did the peasants really gorge themselves on veal every day?

About the departure of needs in the book "The Life of Ivan", the daughter of Semenov-Tanshansky. And don’t ask, re-read Sholokhov...

[Aviator_]

I am convinced by my own impressions and information from those people I trust.

[kalibr]

About the departure of needs in the book "The Life of Ivan", the daughter of Semenov-Tanshansky. And don’t ask, re-read Sholokhov...

[ycuce234-san]

Quote: kalibr

Sholokhov re-read... "Virgin Soil Upturned". The place where Shchukar ate too much steamed veal

This is a local problem, Sholokhov and Shchukar, so to speak. But materials and reference books of ethnography and the history of architecture (and latrines and customs of their use run along these lines) do not contain these anomalies as historical norms.
On the other hand, even now problems in public hygiene can be easily found, for example, in African countries, only the Sholokhovs are now bloggers, with reports from favelas.

[kalibr]

Quote: ycuce234-san

problems now

There is a book by Semenova-Tianshanskaya (daughter of the famous traveler) “The Life of Ivan” - there is a lot of interesting stuff in there about our history.

[ZloyCat]

“For whom? And how did you work? And the system of fines, the workers’ barracks, the 12-hour working day?”
I remember that the Khrushchev mechanic did not mention this. although I might have forgotten, I read it a long time ago

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

And did the right thing

At that time "yes". But only Aurora’s salvo foreshadowed not only his victory, but also his eventual defeat, didn’t it?

[Aviator_]

But only Aurora’s salvo foreshadowed not only his victory, but also his eventual defeat, didn’t it?

Strange maxim. What defeat? And this is what the historian says?

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

But only Aurora’s salvo foreshadowed not only his victory, but also his eventual defeat, didn’t it?

Strange maxim. What defeat? And this is what the historian says?

What flag is flying over Russia today? Isn’t it the same one that developed over the “Officer” armored train? And our economy today is completely different. Is not it?

[Aviator_]

The color of the flag only says that the EBN could not be overthrown in 1993. And the economy also means the same thing. Modern realities should not be blamed on past generations. Moreover, our bourgeoisie will not be accepted into the world bourgeoisie after 2022 (there were hopes before), now it has already reached the very top. So there is a difference, the further away, the more significant.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

So there is a difference, the further away, the more significant.

A system is a system, property is property, a flag is a flag. A stubborn person is a stubborn person, a stupid person is a stupid person, a scoop is a scoop!

[Aviator_]

A stubborn person is a stubborn person, a stupid person is a stupid person, a scoop is a scoop!

Well, if it makes you feel better, you can consider me a scoop, stupid, stubborn. How, relieved, 20% elected propagandist?

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

How, I feel better

No, it's sad. He seems to be an educated person, but is still in captivity of illusions. What is there to be happy about?

[ZloyCat]

"a scoop is a scoop!"
I wonder if, as an instructor at the district committee of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, you said the same thing? or did they glorify the Communist Party of the Soviet Union in all directions? people trading their beliefs for lentil stew. for me, they’re not people at all, but stomachs...

[kalibr]

This only speaks of your stupidity and narrow-mindedness. And I was not an instructor. He taught the history of the CPSU at the institute. And as a lecturer of the Republic of Kazakhstan CPSU, he gave lectures as a social burden. We, teachers, participated in social. competition. And the number of lectures given mattered. And then how could I not praise the CPSU? I didn’t know much that I found out later. I hoped that the “growing mistakes” would be overcome. And he just died. Should I praise a dead corpse?

[ZloyCat]

"This only speaks of your stupidity and narrow-mindedness"
oh, you can immediately see the nobleman! but still, Palestinian . you will know them by their deeds
“And then how could I not praise the CPSU? I didn’t know a lot of things that I learned later.”
but you were a learned historian, and not, like me, an amateur. how could you not know this? One could find a lot of things in libraries, even in completely unclassified ones. although it’s me, you didn’t need knowledge, but a diploma. Without a diploma, it was more difficult to make a career in the Communist Party of the Soviet Union

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

Moreover, our bourgeoisie will not be accepted into the world bourgeoisie after 2022,

They've already accepted it a long time ago. Houses all over the world, accounts in all banks, but not in Cyprus officially 15 thousand. And some of our propaganda materials... Well, yes... it happens to some. It always happens to some... Recently, one editor-in-chief of one of our Russian publishing houses flew to Germany for a book fair. No one robbed him, no one persecuted him... Some Western museums also stopped giving me permission to publish their photos and materials “because of the war and sanctions.” Some yes. And some write - “but we don’t care - take it, use it!”

[Aviator_]

They've already accepted it a long time ago.

I somehow trust other information than the one from the defrocked propagandist.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

undressed the propagandist.

This is how your communist friends, from the CPSU Central Committee, cut my hair, canceling the USSR, my position, and my specialty... And then, my information is easily verified.

[Aviator_]

You see, I was never a member of your charitable organization, although Evdokia Davydovna Bershanskaya, commander of the 46th Guards NBAP, told me in the mid-70s: “Join the party.” But it was impossible to break through a crowd of people like you - you had to swear allegiance to the party from all the stands, this is not the 40s, when you joined the party at the front, it was stagnation. And the communists of the 40-50s saw where everything was going, especially since there were fewer and fewer of them. Here it comes.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

And the communists of the 40-50s saw where everything was going, especially since there were fewer and fewer of them. Here it comes.

Right! Fanaticism became less and less. People wanted to live the way they wanted. Here it comes. That's right, dear Sergey!

[Aviator_]

Dear Vyacheslav! This is not fanaticism. I’m afraid you won’t understand this - after all, all your life you’ve been chasing a comfortable life at any cost. A fleeting stay in the regional committee sanatorium (it seems) determined your entire future fate. I wrote it myself, no one forced me to.

People wanted to live the way they wanted.

Yeah. The bulk of the people really want to raise the retirement age, debilitate education, and deprive the country of actual sovereignty (they seem to have begun to fight this).

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

The bulk of the people really want to raise the retirement age, debilitate education, and deprive the country of actual sovereignty (they seem to have begun to fight this).

The bulk of the people want to work less and get more, they don’t give a damn about sovereignty, this is for chatting over beer and vodka, the main thing is that they don’t touch or strain them. That's why she gets what she gets. I don’t know about any debilitation of education; whoever wants to give children an excellent education. And these are again those who do not know how to raise children themselves, and want the school to do everything for them. So I don’t need to talk about the majority. Most are a big pile of manure!

[Aviator_]

The majority of people want to work less and get more

These are not people. These are organisms. The limit of their dreams is the life of a breeding boar on a pig farm - they are fed and allowed to fulfill their sexual needs. Life is good! So there is no need to talk about the people and the masses. I somehow still communicate with hard workers, students, and engineers. And they do not have animal interests.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

And they do not have animal interests.

But they are not the majority. I once wrote here about workers I knew. By the way, I recently visited the same school and talked with 6th graders in the library. I was surprised by the difference between both of them from the schoolchildren of my granddaughter’s education... For the better.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

A fleeting stay in the regional committee sanatorium (it seems) determined your entire future fate.

When you were young, did you dream of living in a barracks with a common toilet at the end of the corridor and a kitchen with four stoves for 12 people? You were just unlucky to get there, that's all.

[Aviator_]

When you were young, did you dream of living in a barracks with a common toilet at the end of the corridor and a kitchen with four stoves for 12 people? You were just unlucky to get there, that's all.

Well, why didn’t he live - from 1958 to 1960 he lived in a communal apartment in Orenburg at Pushkinskaya 20. There was a room of 12 square meters. m., where our family lived - 4 people, the kitchen was for 10 owners. Large corridor, I played football there. None of the neighbors behaved like dogs or spat in the soup, as in Zoshchenko’s stories. Take a look at my last post, I briefly described my housing before moving to a more comfortable communal apartment.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

to a more comfortable communal apartment.

I can only sympathize and remember that existence determines consciousness. Yours and forever, alas, this communal apartment has determined.

[Aviator_]

Yours and forever, alas, this communal apartment has determined.

Certainly. I grew up among hard workers who worked for the military-industrial complex and among the military, who were the newly victorious army. And the communal apartment was not at all what Zoshchenko described; the “Moscow intelligentsia” did not live in my communal apartments.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

did not live in my communal apartments.

That's noticeable! "You can take the girl out of the village, but you can't take the village out of the girl!" This also applies to men...

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

debilitation of education

By the way, if it comes to that, then it’s me who is fighting it with all my might. My next book will soon be published for teachers and schoolchildren, as well as students and their teachers, as well as everyone interested in the history of the Middle Ages - “The Hardworking Middle Ages”.

[kalibr]

Quote: Aviator_

But it was impossible to get through the crowd of people like you

No need to lie! The intelligentsia was accepted according to the order; cattle farmers, pig farmers and tractor drivers had a direct path. It’s not for nothing that I was only in the village and was able to get an offer there as one of the best teachers in the area. “We’d rather accept two illiterate pigs into the party than one teacher!” - that’s what one of the bosses blurted out to me at the banquet. This was the policy of the CPSU in the Soviet countryside.

[Aviator_]

And also about the White Guard and other hucksters. In the first Chechen war, one of our FSB officers started a rumor that a laser tank rangefinder had a ruby ​​rod (this is true), and that it could be sold on the black market at an exorbitant price (and this is unlikely, no one would have this crap separately from the rangefinder needed). As a result, the “fighters for a free Ichkeria” deprived a lot of their tanks of sights.

[ZloyCat]

"As a result, the "fighters for free Ichkeria" deprived a lot of their tanks of sights"
How much mass is this? in the Shali training there were either five or seven of them, as far as I remember

[Aviator_]

There were also trophy ones - gentlemen officers from Tamanskaya and Kantemirovskaya again tried to make money, as during the execution of the Supreme Council, but it did not work. The Chechens demonstrated the captured captain Rudoy; there was a photograph in Anpilov’s “Molniya”.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Aviator_

There were also trophy ones - gentlemen officers from Tamanskaya and Kantemirovskaya again tried to make money, as during the execution of the Supreme Council, but it did not work.

Gentlemen, the officers in Chechnya, before the official entry of troops, were doing the same thing they had always done - they were extinguished according to the orders of the military and political leadership. Or does someone think that even in damn nineties could crews with tanks just go halfway across the country for money to fight for Avturkhanov and company?

[BAI]

Pennant of the armored train "Officer". 1919

Very Orthodox symbolism. And after that they wanted Holy Rus' to pray for them?

[Lewww]

At that time, Adam's head on a black background was not yet associated with SS units

[dump22]

Very Orthodox symbolism.

You are absolutely right here.
The skull with crossbones in Russian culture bears the stable name “Adam’s Head” and is of Christian origin.
The image of a skull is included in many versions of the Crucifixion or Cross and is applied to the Orthodox monastic schema.
And in the Russian imperial army this symbolism was used during the War of 1812. The cavalry regiment of the St. Petersburg militia, called the “Immortal Regiment,” had a silver skull over crossbones on its headdress.

[dump22]

Uniform of the 1st Cossack volunteer St. Petersburg militia “Immortal Regiment”:

[Lewww]

You can also recall the Alexandria 5th Hussar Regiment and the Kornilov Shock Regiment, whose badges also had an Adam’s head.
In those years, the skull and crossbones on the badges of military units personified contempt for death
So it’s quite a patriotic emblem for bepo

[kalibr]

Quote: Lewww

So it’s quite a patriotic emblem for bepo

By the way, the largest swastika in the world is on a Buddha statue in China.

[runway-1]

Why didn't the majority support the "whites"? Perhaps a somewhat subjective view, but nevertheless it gives some answers:

Without a king in my head. Why seven million people emigrated from Nikolaev Russia
A. Shirokorad
Voluntarism, the Gulag and embezzlement - the “gigantic legacy” of the last of the Romanovs

https://svpressa.ru/blogs/article/397589/

[dump22]

Thanks for the link.
In today's times this sounds prophetic:

The trouble is that Nicholas II had no plans for post-war development of Russia...
Nicholas II, on principle, did not want to carry out any political reforms in Russia, but preferred to wage continuous wars....

[pettabyte]

How can you capture something with an armored train?
Didn't expect it to appear at all?
Or very sharply and suddenly, stepping on the heels of the enemy train?
Otherwise, take apart a piece of rails and watch how it gets stuck while people run around and swear.

[Lewww]

How can you capture something with an armored train?

Whatever.
For example, a bepo crept up on an enemy bepo in the morning fog, opened fire on it from all guns, and the enemy team ran away in panic.
Then they attached the bepo to theirs and dragged it to their rear.
As a result, the red bepo became white (or vice versa)

[kalibr]

Quote: Lewww

As a result, the red bepo became white (or vice versa)

There were many such cases in the Civil War on both sides. This will be about...

[ycuce234-san]

Quote: pettabyte

Otherwise, take apart a piece of rails and watch how it gets stuck while people run around and swear.

In fact, it was possible to dismantle the armored trains themselves in those days.
Railroad ferries and train transport ships were and were used in the 19th century. So the interventionists could organize a dimensionless sea and river Lend-Lease, supplying their units with such armored vehicles (tanks have not yet been invented, like airplanes) and transferring forces, rolling stock, supplies and logistics. In any case, in modern games based on civilians, such a move with the ears is quite possible.

[KVU-NSVD]

I looked at the site this morning. I got hooked on the name ''Officer''. It seemed familiar, but I couldn’t remember where it came from. Out of principle, I decided not to read until I remember. Useless. All day I remembered where I came across this title and in the evening I gave up and started reading. And almost immediately - Taganash, we passed the semaphore... Oh my! Unlubricated sclerosis! This is "Running" by Michal Afanasich Bulgakov! Khludov, Retreat, messenger Krapilin, ''Officer'' passed the semaphore... . Here are the tricks of the memory. Interesting article. Thank you

[Lewww]

If anyone wants to get a correct idea of ​​the Civil War, I recommend the book by S.I. Mamontova Hiking and horses.
Written in the 70s. when everything in the author’s mind has already fermented, so the events are covered without malice and with a philosophical understanding of these tragic years for Russia

[kalibr]

There is also the Encyclopedia of the Civil War... a very interesting book.

[Senior seaman]

And if so, the crew of the armored train literally filled it with bags of salt, hoping to sell it in Moscow at exorbitant prices and make good money on it!

Elegant!
Armored vehicle named after Chubais

[S.Z.]

Thanks to the Author for an interesting article.

As a child, it was interesting to read about armored trains, there was even a feature film about a woman - the commander of an armored train. Probably the author is talking about her death. She also died in the film.

There were few books about them.

The stores were full of military toys, but for some reason there were no armored trains. By the way, for some reason today there are no computer games in which an armored train would be at the forefront. It’s probably difficult to do and the audience is small.

[kalibr]

Quote: S.Z.

Thanks to the Author for an interesting article.

As a child, it was interesting to read about armored trains, there was even a feature film about a woman - the commander of an armored train. Probably the author is talking about her death. She also died in the film.

There were few books about them.

The stores were full of military toys, but for some reason there were no armored trains. By the way, for some reason today there are no computer games in which an armored train would be at the forefront. It’s probably difficult to do and the audience is small.

You watch the wonderful film "Mikolka the Steam Locomotive" - ​​there is a gorgeous armored train in action.

[Frank Muller]

Armored trains from the civilian era appear not only in “Nikolka the Steam Locomotive”, but also in other films: “And on the Pacific Ocean”, “Wagtail Army”, “They Were First”, “Oleko Dundich” and others, you can’t list them all. As for Lyudmila Makievskaya, the film “Lyudmila” (Lenfilm, 1982) is dedicated to her military biography. True, she is mentioned in the film as Lyudmila Nikolskaya, and her last battle is shown not as a battle with a white armored train, but as being caught in an artillery ambush. The film cannot be called a masterpiece, but it is shot quite decently and, I believe, deserves viewing by those who have not seen it before.

[Severomor]

The stores were full of military toys, but for some reason there were no armored trains.

I had. Not from the civil war, but from WWII, a T34 turret and an anti-aircraft gun

[S.Z.]

Class, although, of course, simple. I haven't seen any of these.

It may not be an anti-aircraft gun. And the cannon on the locomotive is strange.

[Severomor]

Py Sy and the third car is a platform with a wheeled tank T 34 85, I understand that there were no such things, but there was one in my armored train

[S.Z.]

Quote: Severomor

Py Sy and the third car is a platform with a wheeled tank T 34 85, I understand that there were no such things, but there was one in my armored train

Thing!

[irontom]

Mokievskaya-Zubok is a unique personality, that’s what “Optimistic Tragedy” is about, a young fragile girl whose 17-21 year old becomes a commissar and then commander of an armored train.

[Frank Muller]

You guessed wrong. The hero of the "Optimistic Tragedy" was the commissar of a sailor detachment, whose prototype was Larisa Mikhailovna Reisner, who came from a very wealthy circle of the Polish intelligentsia. She did not command an armored train (like its cinematic incarnation), but she had to be the commissar of the reconnaissance detachment of the Volga-Caspian Flotilla and the commissar of the Naval General Staff of the RSFSR.

[Vlad Baryatinsky]

Quote: 89670719026

You, overseer, don't think much of yourself?

Little.
Just right!
What, do you have any experience of communicating with a supervisor?!
Oh, it’s not easy for you galley slaves...

[75 Sergey]

The whole point of these people is to speculate.