Unknown war. Colors of war

Judging by the color of the caps and shoulder straps, the Markovsky regiment is attacking, but not the Kappelites! Still from the film “Chapaev” (1934)

English uniform
Shoulder strap french
Japanese tobacco,
Omsk ruler.

Chorus:
Oh, my scumbag
American,
There will be no money
I'll take it and sell it!

Girls are coming
Raising the skirts
Czechs are behind them,
Gnaw nuts.
Civil War Song

Unknown Wars. In our material today, we will deviate from the rule of presenting clippings from the Izvestia newspaper in the text and will talk about what was not reported in this and other Soviet newspapers at that time. Moreover, it was not reported due to some malicious intent, no, but simply at that time this information was not considered important, that’s all. Meanwhile, today it is of quite definite interest.

Moreover, in order to facilitate the perception of the text, instead of a dry story, an excerpt from the first book of the author’s novel “Three from Ensk” will be used. There, his main characters find themselves in Yekaterinodar, the then center of the Kuban White Guard, and walk around the city, looking at the military men they meet, dressed in the uniforms of the “colored regiments,” named after their former commanders and representing, so to speak, the military elite of the White movement.

“Both at the station and in the city, the bright uniforms of the soldiers and officers they encountered literally dazzled their eyes. There were more of the latter, including those with rifles in their hands. Boris stared at them with all his eyes, and as soon as they settled down, he ran into the city to find out everything. He did not return soon, but later in the evening, when Volodya and Stasya decided to go for a walk, he could already give them explanations and more or less get his bearings in everything.

– Those strange characters on the other side of the street in black uniforms, red and black caps and with the same two-color shoulder straps are Kornilovites. This is, so to speak, the Volunteer Guard. Half of their shoulder strap is red, which means their blood shed for freedom. The other black one is a sign of mourning for the freedom destroyed by the Bolsheviks. And the red color of the crown on the cap apparently symbolizes that in the end they must win. All this, as they say, was established by the late Kornilov back in 1917. However, now it is not recommended to talk about freedom in front of them. For them today it seems like a curse...

Uniform of the “colored units” of the South of Russia 1918–1920: 1. General of the Kornilov Shock Division; 2. Private of the Kornilov Shock Regiments with a battalion badge; 3. Officer of the Artillery General Kornilov Brigade (1920); 4. Corporal of the 1st Officer General Markov Regiment; 5. Officer of the 3rd Officer General Markov Regiment; 6. Fireworks of the 1st General Markov battery (1920)

– Accordingly, the Markovites - in the “Ice Campaign” they were commanded by Lieutenant General Markov - wear shoulder straps and caps of white and black color: with a black band, the top is white, the shoulder straps are black with white edging and gaps. These colors correspond to the motto “Death and Resurrection”: black – “Death for the Motherland”; white – “Resurrection of the Motherland.”

– Alekseevites flaunt in white and blue, which seems to be done in order to remind of the origin of these units, since in the beginning they were formed from high school students and students, whose distinctive color of clothing was blue.

– Drozdovites wear caps with a crimson top, a white band, and black piping, but their shoulder straps are crimson with a different combination of piping and gaps in black and white.

Well, and the letters on the shoulder straps, of course... The Kornilovites have “K”, the Markovites have “M”, the Alekseevites have “A”, the Drozdovites have “D”, although not all of them. And these regimental colors are also reflected on their banners, regimental and battalion badges: black and red badges for the Kornilovites, usually with a skull and crossbones, as on the sleeve emblem, black and white for the Markovites and black, white and crimson for Drozdovites.

“For some reason I used to think,” said Stasya, “that they have a white flag with a state double-headed eagle, that’s why they are called white.” Or at least white-blue-red, but here...

“Well, this flag has been accepted as the main symbol of the struggle for Russia,” Boris said importantly, and it was clear that he had picked up this phrase somewhere, cherished it in his soul for a long time, and now finally had the opportunity to pronounce it. - In addition, as I was told, this is a mandatory element of the flags for all armored trains, and in the Volunteer Army, tricolor white-blue-red chevrons are worn on the sleeves with an angle downward, so traditions are still observed here!

– What kind of person is this? - Stasya pointed with her eyes at a tall officer in pince-nez, dressed in an English service jacket and a khaki cap, but in bright red wide breeches with stripes. - Why is he wearing red pants?

“This is the headquarters captain of the 2nd Cavalry General Drozdovsky Regiment,” Boris answered, looking at the officer walking towards them at the shoulder straps and at the black badge with some white letters sewn on his sleeve. – You see: 2-KDO-P – so everything is simple. And what about the red pants... well, that’s what he wanted. Maybe he took them off some red cadet, sewed on the stripes and is walking around to his health.

- Interesting.

- Yeah! And do you see? He has the “Insignia of the First Kuban Campaign.” These were awarded for the “Ice March”, so the guy, although clearly a dude, has been in battle...

“I don’t understand,” said Volodya, looking at the Drozdov officer who passed them, “why should you single yourself out like that?” A protective jacket and red pants are nonsense. Well, I still understand the red and black shoulder straps, but the white tunics and caps with a red top are just a godsend for sharp shooters. Now there is such a war that the less visible you are, the better, but here, on the contrary, everything is topsy-turvy.

Uniform of the “colored units” of the South of Russia 1918–1920. (continued): 7. Officer of the Artillery General Drozdovsky brigade; 8. Officer of the 2nd Officer Rifle General Drozdovsky Regiment; 9. Officer of the 2nd Cavalry General Drozdovsky Regiment; 10. Non-commissioned officer of the 1st Cavalry General Drozdovsky Regiment; 11. Officer of the Alekseevsky artillery division (1920); 12. Officer of the Partisan General Alekseev Infantry Regiment (1919)

- And you also think about this: an officer captured by the Reds will immediately face a painful death, because it is easier to distinguish him by his band, but... nevertheless, they wear all this, and not only in the rear, but also at the front Same. Moreover, they find a special chic in this.

Keep in mind that in these very colored regiments it is customary to differ not only in shoulder straps, but also in their demeanor. The Kornilovites are pointedly contemptuous of death, and after the death of their Lavr Georgievich they even portray a kind of disappointment in life - they say, it’s all vanity of vanities!

Markovites wear crumpled overcoats in memory of their commander, and also—sorry Stasya—they swear so much that their ears literally wither. The Alekseevites behave like students - after all, General Alekseev was a General Staff officer, a “scientist” - well, they copy this manner. But the Drozdovites, as I was told, are ironic, condescending, and almost all of them wear gold pince-nez in memory of their fallen general.

“Well, that’s stupid,” said Stasya. – In the rear it’s all right, but in a combat situation you wear pince-nez. What nonsense!

- It’s not stupid, but that’s how they do it. Tradition,” Boris smiled condescendingly. – The old traditions have broken down, but now they are creating new ones for themselves and trying to follow them religiously. Although the common people don’t like all this...

They even sang a little ditty to me here about the Kornilovites, and it hit me right in the eye: “Who is painted like a poster? That’s Kornilov’s soldier.” Well, and there further in the same spirit. In addition, there are too many of these warriors in the rear, they are almost talking about this out loud, but at the front there are catastrophically not enough soldiers!

"Are you among the volunteers?" – Bolshevik propaganda poster created by artist Dmitry Moor in June 1920, during the Russian Civil War

“Oh, all this is not good,” Stasya said quietly and shook her head.

“Yes, that’s obvious,” Volodya remarked in her tone. – Firstly, all this military tinsel costs both time and money, and secondly, it simply unmasks our soldiers. There is a third aspect to this issue. All this riot of colors makes it possible for red propaganda to present the white army in the most unfavorable light and emphasize its anti-people character, that is, that it is fighting against the toiling peasants and workers and is almost entirely composed of bloodsucking nobles.

– Well, we’ve seen a lot of such posters in the Council of Deputies. There are hanging on almost every corner...

White Guard recruiting poster

“But here,” and Volodya pointed to the guys at the poster hanging on the wall, “everything seems to be deliberately turned upside down.” - No, just look! “Why aren’t you in the army?” - a skinny-looking soldier with a barely noticeable chevron on his sleeve, and all in khaki, asks him.

Is that the case - remember? The Reds have a poster: “Have you signed up as a volunteer?” - and everything is drawn in one red color and there’s also a guy pointing his finger at you?! That poster convinces me, but this one doesn’t at all!”

PS

The text used materials from A. Deryabin’s article “The Civil War in Russia 1918–1920. South – “colored parts”, as well as drawings by R. Palacios-Fernandez. The article was published in the magazine “Tseichgauz” No. 1 in 1991.

Comments

[Uncle lee]

and also tricolor white-blue-red chevrons in the Volunteer Army are worn on the sleeves with an angle down

[Lech from Android.]

Dzhigarkhanyan played a white officer superbly...
"Meet the gentlemen in front of you, the red spien."
Thank you Vyacheslav for the insight into the history of the Civil War.
She gave birth to some very colorful personalities.

[ABC-schutze]

“I don’t understand,” said Volodya, looking at the Drozdov officer who passed them, “why stand out like that? A protective jacket and red trousers are nonsense.”
************************************************** *************************************
It would be nice if the author clarified why Volodya (through the author’s mouth...), “perplexed” about the “color” of the jacket and “pants” (probably more correctly, “trousers”) of the Drozdovite, is not amazed at the style jacket?..

But he is clearly not “from the Russian army.” And it clearly reminds us of something “British-interventionist”...

It seems that the author considers such “details” to be trifles, “unworthy” of the attention of modern young people. Why am I not surprised...

By the way, about the “sour statements” of the participants in the youth dialogue (consider them the author’s...) regarding the sad fate of the white officers who were captured. And I happened to hear that the Bolsheviks (that is, the “Reds”), when they came to power, INITIALLY, were quite peace-loving. And ALL those captured (or arrested) were released on a receipt for “non-resistance to the people’s power”...

The same Krasnov, in particular (as much as a “whole” general, and not just an “officer”)...

Examples (and quite eloquent ones) can be continued...

[ABC-schutze]

“But here,” and Volodya pointed to the guys at the poster hanging on the wall, “everything seems to be deliberately turned upside down.” “No, just look!” “Why aren’t you in the army?” someone asks him a skinny-looking soldier with a barely noticeable chevron on his sleeve, and even all in khaki.

Is that the case - remember? The Reds have a poster: “Have you signed up as a volunteer?” - and everything is drawn in one red color and there’s also a guy pointing his finger at you?! That poster convinces me, but this one doesn’t at all!”
************************************************** *************************************
Well yes...

On the white poster, of course, there is a “soldier” and he “asks”...

But on the Reds’ poster it says “man”. And he, of course, “points his finger.” Although, on the Reds’ poster, it is no longer a “man” at all, but an armed Red Army soldier - a volunteer...

Whose emotional “squint” is this?.. The young man Volodya?.. Or the author?..

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

Good morning everyone and have a nice day!
I noticed that in addition to the chevron, the captain (captain) of the white movement should, in theory, have clean shoulder straps. Stars for captains and colonels appeared in 1943 in the Red Army.
For clarity, shoulder straps from the era of the last emperor:

[Korsar4]

- So, lads, what I want to tell you... - don’t be offended by me: we have neither comrades nor nobles. The men and I decided simply: “bros” and “lads.”
- How will you call women?
“We’ll also figure out what to call him.” You will help.

[Moore]

In the film, Ovechkin is a staff captain. Four stars, one clearance.

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

Quote: Moore

In the film, Ovechkin is a staff captain. Four stars, one clearance.

Indeed, I confess my memory failed me. I remembered that in the film he was a captain, otherwise he forgot the “staff captain”.
Thanks for the edit!

[Richard]

Judging by the color of the caps and shoulder straps, the Markovsky regiment is attacking, but not the Kappelites! Still from the film “Chapaev” (1934)

This scene from the movie is a complete blunder.
Firstly, the Kapelevites never belonged to the colored units of the White Army - so they wore the khaki combined arms RIA uniform. Secondly - Indeed, black tunics with white piping, white caps with a black band and black shoulder straps with white gaps, like the Kappelites in the film, were worn by officers of the Markov Officer Rifle Division. The color matches perfectly. True, on Markov’s shoulder straps there was the letter “M” (“Markov”) or “GM” (“General Markov”). There are other serious inconsistencies. First of all, the Markovites had only one type of sleeve patches - a white-blue-red Denikin chevron with a downward angle. In the film, it is clearly visible that on the sleeves of the White Guards there are stripes in the shape of a shield. Patches of this configuration were at one time a common occurrence among the White troops in eastern Russia. In the Siberian People's Army and the People's Army of KomUcha (of which the Kappelites were an integral part), they served as insignia, replacing shoulder straps. But this was in the summer of 1918, almost a year before the battles with the Chapaev division. And most importantly, it is known exactly who at that time was the enemy of the 25th Chapaev division and launched the famous psychic attack against them. It was not officer units that took part in this attack, but the opponents of the 25th Chapaev Division in that battle were the rebel Izhevsk and Votkinsk workers (from these workers Kolchak formed his two most combat-ready divisions - Izhevsk and Votkinsk), and that the Votkinsk people went into a psychic attack under the Reds (!) with banners and singing “Warsaw” (!) - a paradox, but in the chaos of the Civil War something different happened. Something like this.

[Aviator_]

This scene from the movie is a complete blunder.

This is, of course, true, but the film was made when there were more than enough GW participants. And they wanted it just like in the movies. An analogy is the footage of our offensive in Ozerov’s films of the 70s. He himself is a participant in the war, but in his films there are very picturesque tanks, cavalry, and airplanes above them. and all at the same time. Think. This discrepancy can be forgiven for the direct participants.

[Fat]

Quote: Richard

Votkintsy went on a psychic attack under red (!) banners and singing “Varshavyanka” (!) - a paradox,

Greetings, Dmitry. Let's just say it's worth looking into. Izhevsk and Votkinsk people used the Komuch flag during this period? In November 1918, from the Izhevsk and Votkinsk workers who escaped from encirclement, the Kolchak command formed the Izhevsk brigade and the Votkinsk rifle division (of larger numbers). Votkinsk division at the beginning of 1919. acted as part of the Siberian Army of Lieutenant General Gaida, and the Izhevsk brigade became part of the 3rd Ural Corps of General Golitsyn (Western Army of Khanzhin). I know for sure that the Izhevsk regiments had a green banner with a red edge.

...Izhevsk and Votkinsk residents had green banners with a wide red stripe all around. In the center of the field there is a wrench and a hammer. The peasant regiment also had a banner, which is shown in the picture - the face of Christ on a white background. The inscriptions - the name and number of the regiment were located on the border.
Memories of others. “There was no uniform uniform. There were economic and medical units, and a brass band. The rebels did not yet have a banner; they were awarded to the regiments after their organization.” In one of the drawings, the rectangle of the panel is shown with an arrow and written “font in gold letters.”

http://kolchakiya.ru/uniformology/ij_vtk_rebels_01.htm - знаки отличия. Подробнее о полковых знаменах есть на этом-же сайте.

[Richard]

It's worth dealing with this.

Well, let's figure it out. Firstly. We immediately dismiss the pictures you provided of the armbands of Votkinsk residents, this is not a banner, and Votkinsk residents are not Izhevsk residents
Secondly, we are talking specifically about the psychic attack of the Izhevsk residents on the Azin residents, on the Pirogov Heights - and I draw attention to the date - November 7, 1918.
fragment of a diorama in the Izhevsk Museum of Local Lore : “psychic” attack by Izhevsk rebels on the Pirogov Heights on part of Azin’s division. November 7, 1918. (picture can be enlarged by clicking)

The diorama was created back in Soviet times and, accordingly, its main characters are in the foreground - the commander of the 2nd consolidated punitive division advancing on Izhevsk, the red Latvian Vladimir Martinovich Azin (in a leather jacket) and his henchmen. In the background you can see Izhevsk workers marching without shots into their desperate “psychic” attack, converted by Soviet filmmakers into a mythical attack of a certain Kappel officer regiment.
What color are the flags of the rebels of Izhevsk? That's right - red
Now to your question:

Izhevsk and Votkinsk people used the Komuch flag during this period?

Absolutely right. Exactly him!

Since the rebels recognized the power of Komuch:

After the victory of the uprising in Izhevsk, the rebels faced the need to organize power. In the very first address to the population, it was announced that Izhevsk recognized the sole and legitimate supreme authority in Russia as the authority of the Committee of the All-Russian Constituent Assembly, temporarily located in Samara. The Local Council was declared “only a class workers’ organization.” This implied a legitimate transfer of power from the Council to the newly formed structure - the Committee of the Constituent Assembly. For this purpose, on August 10, 1918, members of the future local Komuch were co-opted into the Executive Committee of the Council. The organization of the Committee of the Constituent Assembly was entrusted to Vasily Ivanovich Buzanov, a member of the All-Russian Constituent Assembly who was in Izhevsk.

And in conclusion, regarding the red-green banners, I will quote you:

Memories of others. “There was no uniform uniform. There were economic and medical units, and a brass band. The rebels did not yet have a banner; they were awarded to the regiments after their organization.”

Totally agree with you But the organization of these regiments will only happen in December 1918, and as I asked you to pay attention to above, the psychic attack of the Izhevsk people occurred earlier - on November 7. And it was not mental, but an act of desperation - they simply did not have cartridges - so they went into hand-to-hand combat with machine guns.
a photo Volunteers of the Izhevsk People's Army November 1918

[Fat]

Now that we have figured out the date, everything is clear. They had a really bad time with ammunition from the very beginning. Somehow they lasted 100 days. However, regarding the “mythical Kappelites”, it is worth noting that Lieutenant Colonel Vladimir Kappel also began his “White Guard career” in Samara under the Komuch flag.
With respect.

[N.M.]

"Volunteers of the Izhevsk People's Army November 1918"
It doesn't really feel like November.
Summer is coming soon

[vladcub]

“Izhevsk” I’ll add: “Chapaevites” had a favorite proverb: “The war is over. The soldiers go home, and the Izhevsk people go to their graves.”
“Izhevsk residents” wore homemade knives behind the tops of their boots, the so-called “shoemaker.”
Periodically, Izhevsk residents staged “booter” attacks: they went on the attack with knives. As a rule, the enemy could not withstand such attacks.

[Richard]

Greetings, Svyatoslav!
What’s interesting to me is that in the photo above there is an Izhevsk rebel in the center - it looks like he’s wearing a cap. Were they already there then? I always thought that they would appear after the civil war.

[kalibr]

Quote: Richard

Were they already there then?

At the pilots!

[3x3zsave]

The pilots' caps were black and of a different cut. In this photo the cap is clearly khaki. Such caps were used in RIA along with Adrian's helmet.

[Richard]

Thank you, Vyacheslav! Thank you, Anton!
I became intrigued by this question, scoured the Internet, and found something interesting. It turns out that before 1935 there were no caps in our army - neither in the RIA, nor in the Red Army

[3x3zsave]

Hello Dmitry!
I suggest you read:
https://vladlib.ru/n16_06_21_6/

[Fat]

Hello Anton. In WWI, in addition to grenadiers (assault platoons), caps were primarily worn by scooter riders and soldiers of armored units, in general, those who used a helmet.

[Richard]

It turns out that before 1935 there were no caps in our army - neither in the RIA, nor in the Red Army

In the RIA, pilots had two headgear: a cap and a leather helmet. But the cap was inconvenient to carry with you, because during the flight a helmet was used, and at the airfield there was already a cap that the pilot took with him. Therefore, in 1909, instead of a cap, a folding black headdress was introduced under a black leather helmet, which was officially called “polyotka”
a photo. Russian pilot in flight. 1911

After the revolution, with the advent of the new government, they forgot about flying, since it was an attribute of the old government. Back then they preferred “budyonovkas” and caps. But there were a lot of them in military warehouses, so in 1919, military school cadets were dressed in black stripes. In 1934, the dark blue flight jacket became an element of the official uniform of the Soviet aviation pilot. And the “cap” “flying” became the result of a banal grammatical error of the secretary-typist in the order of the People's Commissar of Defense of the USSR No. 176 dated December 3, 1935: “For private and junior command staff of the Red Army and the RKM, install a cloth saw for constant wear instead of cloth budenovkaоweaved as a summer headdress.” That’s how this word entered our vocabulary. But the cap stuck, and the name itself stuck. So December 3, 1935 can safely be considered the cap’s birthday.

[3x3zsave]

So December 3, 1935 can safely be considered the cap’s birthday.
But the Scots don’t know!

[Fat]

What a cap this is! This is "Glengarry" (Glengarry cap, Glengarry hat or simply Glengarry)
Scots may be offended

[3x3zsave]

Borisych!
I know what is it. Considered as the ancestor of the cap. Although, most likely the ancestor was the French cap

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: 3x3zsave

Borisych!
I know what is it. Considered as the ancestor of the cap. Although, most likely the ancestor was the French cap

They had different ones. The one you refer to with the bayonet was subsequently replaced. It is unlikely that she could be the ancestor.

[3x3zsave]

And I don’t insist. However, I always have the opportunity to clarify.

[deddem]

Quote: 3x3zsave

Borisych!
I know what is it. Considered as the ancestor of the cap. Although, most likely the ancestor was the French cap

The French cap is a kepi.
And the equivalent of a cap is bonnet de police, “police cap.”
It was introduced en masse since 1916, as a casual headdress instead of the more expensive cap.

[Richard]

But the Scots don’t know!

They know perfectly well! Before WWI, the British were the trendsetters for pilots. Only they called their caps not Glengarry like the Scots, but Aeroautrian hat “Austrian caps for a flight helmet”
British Royal Flying Corps uniform 1912-1923.
Fig. English military pilot-crew commander 1913

Fig. English military observer pilot 1913

link:https://sitekid.ru/istoriya/pervaya_mirovaya_vojna/forma_britanskih_letchikov.html

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: 3x3zsave

The pilots' caps were black and of a different cut. In this photo the cap is clearly khaki

During the civil war, the Red Army had international units...for example, the Hungarian “Red Hussars”! The Hungarians wore red caps..."from Austria-Hungary"!

Quote: 3x3zsave

Such caps were used in RIA along with Adrian's helmet.

Oh really ??? PS Once a very old Soviet film was shown called... something like "Commissar"! In this film there is an episode where red cadets of some command courses went into the last battle towards the advancing white units, covering the withdrawal of the red units, wearing “khaki caps”! Critics ridiculed this episode as a “movie blooper”(!) ... they say, “they took the first military unit that the filmmakers came across and “threw it into battle” without changing clothes!

[3x3zsave]

They shouldn't have laughed. For cadets of the Red Army command courses, caps have been a uniform headdress since January 1919.

[Richard]

Only the color was not khaki; since 1919, the cadets had been wearing black flight jackets from the tsarist military warehouses.

[3x3zsave]

“With the introduction of steel helmets, the folding cap, now we will call it a cap, became widespread in the army as a headdress worn under a helmet. The only difference from aviator hats was its color - khaki” (c)

[bubalik]

Only the color was not khaki; since 1919, the cadets had been wearing black flight jackets from the tsarist military warehouses.

The only difference from the aviator hats was its color - khaki."

[3x3zsave]

Moment of truth! Thank you, Sergey!
By the way, I didn’t know that there were tunics with welt pockets.

[3x3zsave]

By the way, comrades, have you noticed that those photographed have caps of different cuts? The left one has a chin strap, the right one doesn't.
By the way, the chin strap on the cap is still an accessory of the dress uniform of the Spanish Foreign Legion.

[bubalik]

,, ,

,,,Anton, in this photo there is both a cap and a chevron of Muslim units (crescent and star).

[3x3zsave]

“But this, Comrade Bubalik, you will have to deal with on your own!!!”

[bubalik]

,,,the cadets then wore a lot of things.

All good evening

[3x3zsave]

, the cadets then wore a lot of things.
Especially during the senior year...

[bubalik]

“...I went to the First Petrograd Course of Artillery Commanders, located on the Vyborg side near the Liteiny Bridge, and opened on the basis of the Mikhailovsky Artillery School. (...) Newly accepted cadets were first of all sent to the bathhouse. From there they came out in cadet uniforms and greatcoats, from which their shoulder straps were worn off. Five or six names on the lining indicated that this clothing had already had more than one owner...”
Lombak A. Yu. Fiery years. Memories /

[Nagaibak]

vladcub (Svyatoslav)
“Izhevsk residents” wore homemade knives behind the tops of their boots, the so-called “shoemaker.”
That's right. Only the knives in the sources are called workers. I found it on the Internet from
The image of similar working knives is more like cutlasses with a blade 40-50 cm long. And weighing under a kilogram. Yes... and it was mainly the 3rd battalion of the 1st Izhevsk regiment, led by its commander, staff captain Nikolai Lozhkin, who went into similar attacks. They carried rifles behind their backs. Some had one knife, some had two.

[ABC-schutze]

Well, actually, this film is based on Furmanov’s book. Earlier than the appearance of the film "She Who Saw the Light". And not “scientifically popular”, but, first of all, propaganda...

And there were no “blunders” about the uniforms of regiments and battalions. And there is a reason for the Soviet cinema of THAT time, almost a CENTURY later, when “criticizing”, do not forget about this. This is how it is described in the book...

“The night dragged on for a painfully long time. Almost none of the commanders slept that night, despite extreme fatigue from the previous hard day. Everyone was notified of what the worker had told. Everyone was ready to meet the enemy. And then the time came...

In black columns, quietly, without a human voice, without the clang of weapons, the officer battalions with the Kappel regiment went on the offensive...

They spread across the field and covered a huge area at once. Apparently there was an idea - to silently come close to the exhausted, sleepy chains and with a sudden blow to chop, shoot, raise panic, destroy...

This meeting was terrible... The battalions were brought close, and at once, on command, dozens of ready-made machine guns roared... They started working, mowed down... They laid rows upon rows, destroyed... The soldiers jumped up from the trenches, small holes, and rushed forward. The mowed down officer battalions lay in chains, Kappel's men rushed in panic - they were pursued for several miles... This unexpected success inspired the regiments with the brightest hopes."

Chapaev “didn’t fight” with Kappel?.. But the Red Army, of which Chapaev’s division was part, definitely fought. And in the end, she won without any “blunders”...

[Ulan.1812]

That is, based on the text, the Kapel regiment was given an officer battalion?
By the way, in the film only the advanced chains were in black uniform.
Behind them, in the usual RIA uniform, khaki color. For some reason no one paid attention to this.

[ABC-schutze]

Two officer battalions...

But I simply did not include the previous paragraph, with the text telling how the Chapaevites received “information” about the attack planned by the Whites and what forces were involved in it.

He limited himself, in fact, to the “mental”. What is she named in the film...

[Nagaibak]

ABC-schütze (Werner Holt)
"Two officer battalions..."
It seems to me that Kolchak did not have any officer battalions. There was a mess with personnel there. There was a terrible shortage of officers. And so scatter...) But Comrade Furmanov could have embellished it completely. It's a work of art. And in the memoirs of the same Kutyakov, for example, I did not see any mention of officer battalions.

[ABC-schutze]

Well, why the author didn’t pay attention to “this” is completely clear to me...

Why not “convict” the Bolsheviks, along with their cinema?.. “Fire”, so “doublet”...

[solar]

It was not officer units that took part in this attack, but the opponents of the 25th Chapaev Division in that battle were the rebel Izhevsk and Votkinsk workers (from these workers Kolchak formed his two most combat-ready divisions - Izhevsk and Votkinsk), and that the Votkinsk people went into a psychic attack under the Reds (!) with banners and singing “Warsaw” (!)

this nuance completely changes the meaning of the event. This is not a psychic attack with the aim of intimidating the enemy, it is an attempt to show that “our own people” are coming, the same workers who do not shoot.

[ABC-schutze]

“This is not a psychic attack with the aim of intimidating the enemy, it is an attempt to show that “our own people” are coming, the same workers who do not shoot...."
************************************************** *************************************
Not at all...
For, neither the “Izhevsk” nor the “Votkintsy” were “their own” to the workers of the capital’s enterprises (and this is mainly the “audience” of the Bolsheviks, i.e. the “Reds”)...

Izhevsk and Votkinsk residents of the Ural gun factories were “rear workers”. They have always advocated “war to victory.” During the war, they had hefty “bonuses” from additional rations and land plots. And all other “favor” of the authorities. In general, no deprivations, of which by 1915 - 1916 the workers of industrial enterprises in the western industrial regions, which became “front-line”, did not have the Ural “rear workers”...

And the same Kurlov, if my memory serves me correctly, noted, with reference to the gendarmerie department, that the attitude of “local workers and workers of the capital’s industrial enterprises and large enterprises of the western industrial regions who arrived at the factories (with evacuated equipment) is very “tense.” And first of all, on the issue of “continuing the war”...

So, the workers of Izhevsk and Votkinsk did not want to “show” anything. Because, initially, the MAIN mass of them was never a Bolshevik “audience”... It’s the same as calling Makhno a “red” ataman, because he was awarded the “Order of the Red Banner”...

Not really. The Red Ataman is a former Modovan raider, and later a Red brigade commander, Grigory Kotovsky...

And the same Makhno, and Mishka Yaponchik, are a gangster, for one reason or another, to the Bolsheviks and the Red Army, who “stuck” at various moments of the Civil War. But in her soul and essence, she has always been and remains a gangster...

[Alexander Kuksin]

Kappel never fought against Chapaev during the battles of the Civil War. His opponents on the Volga were Tukhachevsky and Trotsky. Both lost to Kappel's military talent. Trotsky almost got captured and escaped through the yards with his personal driver. By and large, Kappel did not lose a single battle. His methodology and military thought of constructing battle tactics were clearly the forerunner of the military thought of the Soviet victories of the second half of the Great Patriotic War.
Who is interested: A.A. Fedorovich *General Kappel* Melbourne, 1967
V. Povolyaev. *Kappel. If you are destined to die.* Moscow, 2004

[old_pferd]

Yah. In 1914, the staff captain's shoulder straps had four stars.
https://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A8%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%B1%D1%81-%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%BF%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BD

[Richard]

I noticed that in addition to the chevron, the captain (captain) of the white movement should, in theory, have clean shoulder straps.

His shoulder straps are correct. Because the movie Ovechkin was not a captain, but a staff captain, which is one rank lower

Staff captain corresponds to the rank of modern captain. For civil service, titular councilor. Shoulder straps, just like the captain's now. In the Navy, the equivalent of a staff captain is a lieutenant. There are three stars, not four and one stripe.
And the captain was a major until 1884. Shoulder strap - one stripe without stars.

[Senior seaman]

Quote: Kote pane Kohanka

I noticed that in addition to the chevron, the captain (captain) of the white movement should, in theory, have clean shoulder straps. Stars for captains and colonels appeared in 1943 in the Red Army.
For clarity, shoulder straps from the era of the last emperor:

As far as I remember, Dzhigarkhanyan’s hero is Ovechkin, a staff captain.
so everything is fine with his stars on his shoulder straps.

[vladcub]

Namesake of good health. Thank you for the addition with shoulder straps.
Regarding the star on the shoulder straps. This is probably not a search by a military consultant.
It seems that General Oslekovsky was a consultant?

[kalibr]

Now, Vladimir, I remembered and remembered where I saw this so I could insert it at the beginning of the article. It's good that you remembered!

[Richard]

To accurately determine whether a White Guard belongs to a colored regiment of the White Army, without inserting pictures, you can use this convenient table

[Richard]

But there is one important nuance here - defectors to the white army and new recruits to the colored regiments, regardless of rank, wore ordinary khaki uniforms from WWI, and they received the right to colored shoulder straps and caps only after direct participation in battle

[Richard]

Composition of the “colored” units of the white army:
1. Kornilovites:
Kornilov division
1th Kornilov shock regiment
2th Kornilov shock regiment
3th Kornilov shock regiment
Kornilov artillery brigade
2. Drozdovites:
1st shock Drozdovsky armored detachment
1st railway Drozdov brigade (three armored trains, an ambulance train, a repair train, 7 maneuverable locomotives)
3rd Infantry (Drozdovskaya) Division
2nd Officer General Drozdovsky Regiment
Drozdovskaya Artillery Brigade
3. Samburians
Sambur Partisan Regiment
1st Sambur Cavalry Regiment
2nd Sambur Regiment
Sambursky equestrian partisan regiment
1st Sabur Horse Artillery Brigade
4. Markovians:
1st Infantry (Markov) Division
1st Officer General Markov Regiment
2nd Markovsky Infantry Regiment
3nd Markovsky Infantry Regiment
Markov artillery brigade
5. Alekseevtsy:
Alekseevskaya (partisan) division
Alekseevsky partisan regiment
2nd Alekseevsky Regiment
3nd Alekseevsky Regiment
Alekseevsky Cavalry Partisan Regiment
Alekseevskaya Artillery Brigade

[Richard]

The 1st Drozdovsky shock armored squad had interesting emblems on their shoulder straps (machine gun, cannon and anti-aircraft armored vehicles)

Interestingly, there were similar emblems in the RIA armored detachments in WWII? Or is this the know-how of the Drozdovites?

[26rus]

Here's how... If you remove the image of a machine gun from the emblem, you get the emblem of the SA Automobile Troops. I went with these guys in the army myself.

[Lewww]

“Interestingly, similar emblems were also in the RIA armored detachments in WWII?

This is the emblem of the RIA Automobile Machine Gun Platoons (BAM), only the color was usually golden

[Richard]

Thank you, Lev, I didn’t know such subtleties. Thank you for your reply

[Nikolaevich I]

There were also 3-color “circles” on airplanes and, in my opinion, on armored cars! At first I didn’t know the correct arrangement of flowers...I had to specifically ask!

[Korsar4]

Thank you!

It’s interesting about the universal pince-nez among Drozdovites.

[Richard]

This is a widespread fake on the internet. And the author of this myth is known - the “red count” A. Tolstoy. To debunk this fake, you just need to look on the Internet for real photographs of Drozdovites from the times of the Civil War and emigration
stupidly offhand

[Korsar4]

Thank you, Dmitry! So doubt crept into my mind from a position of common sense.

It's like the shot of the violins playing in "Welcome!" Entry to outsiders is prohibited” to conclude that everyone in the pioneer camp wore glasses.

[Lynx2000]

Question about the caption of the third picture:

Is number 10 a non-commissioned officer of the 1st Cavalry Regiment? He has one narrow transverse stripe/strap on his shoulder strap, a senior non-commissioned officer has three narrow transverse stripes/stripes (consider it a sergeant in our opinion), a non-commissioned officer (if I’m not mistaken after 1912 or 1914) wore two narrow transverse stripes/straps, until these years, it seems that such shoulder straps corresponded to the rank of ml. non-commissioned officer (as in our days, two snot - junior sergeant). I see this cavalryman has one - not loved by many in the Soviet army.

[Richard]

The caption to the picture is quite true. According to the military encyclopedia I.D. Sytin 1911-1915 The military regulations classified non-commissioned officers (in descending order): sergeant - in the infantry, sergeant - in the cavalry, captain, ensign, cornet, corporal, constable, company clerk, orderly, orderly and corporal. The position of a non-commissioned officer in the military hierarchy was determined as follows: “Those who are below the ensign have their place, are called “non-commissioned officers,” i.e., lower-ranking people.”

[Lynx2000]

Quote: Richard

The caption to the picture is quite true. According to the military encyclopedia I.D. Sytin 1911-1915 The military regulations classified non-commissioned officers (in descending order): sergeant - in the infantry, sergeant - in the cavalry, captain, ensign, cornet, corporal, constable, company clerk, orderly, orderly and corporal. The position of a non-commissioned officer in the military hierarchy was determined as follows: “Those who are below the ensign have their place, are called “non-commissioned officers,” i.e., lower-ranking people.”

Well, it’s the same as in the RF Armed Forces, the category is non-commissioned officers, however, when specifically addressed, they still call the actual military rank (then probably rank), for example, ml. sergeant of such and such a Cossack regiment Semirechenko...
Otherwise, a mess will begin with shoulder straps, and in the army there will be subordination and length of service!!!

[Sergey Valov]

Please share in which article of the Sytin Encyclopedia did you read the composition of non-commissioned officers? The publication did not reach the letter U; the article “Military Regulations” does not exist.

[Sergey Valov]

Theoretically everything is correct. But if you read the memoirs of white officers, the situation changes somewhat. Due to the disgusting supply, the whites wore whatever they could - soldier's uniforms, officers' uniforms, imported ones, supplied by a variety of allies, and all of this mixed up. In numerous photographs of that period, both the white and the red army, especially at the front, are a bunch of ragamuffins. Only a few rear and headquarters units were well dressed.

[kalibr]

Quote: Sergey Valov

In numerous photographs of that period, both the white and the red army, especially at the front, are a bunch of ragamuffins.

Yes, you are absolutely right. I also read the memoirs and they described a parade where the white units walked barefoot, and one soldier was completely wearing pink underpants!

[tatra]

Denikin recalled: “Not only among the “people”, but also in “society” the plundered stocks of uniforms from the Novorossiysk base and army warehouses found easy sales. Speculation has reached extraordinary proportions, capturing in its vicious circle people of the most diverse circles, parties and professions: co-operator, social democrat, officer, lady of society, artist and leader of a political organization... Embezzlement, embezzlement, bribery have become commonplace phenomena. Traditions of lawlessness permeated people's life, causing the emergence of many adventurers, impostors - large and small... In the cities there was debauchery, revelry, drunkenness and carousing, into which the officers who came from the front rushed headlong... There was a feast during the plague, arousing anger or disgust in outside spectators, oppressed by need, in those righteous people who were fed on starvation rations, huddled in the cramped and cold of a requisitioned room, walked in tattered clothes, sometimes occupying very high positions of public or government service and carrying it out with the greatest selflessness. There were quite a few of them, but, unfortunately, they were not the ones who set the general tone of life in the South.”

[Fangaro]

Thanks for the fairly detailed description!
And a few months earlier, also in History, there was one of the images of this article. But I can't remember the author.
Was that you? Or is my memory failing me?

[kalibr]

Quote from Fangaro

Was that you?

No, most likely not. As far as I remember, this is the first time I have accessed the materials of this magazine.

[Dekabrist]

“This is the headquarters captain of the 2nd Cavalry General Drozdovsky Regiment,” Boris answered, looking at the officer walking towards them at the shoulder straps and at the black badge with some white letters sewn on his sleeve. - You see: 2-KDO-P - so everything is simple

Boris was wrong. Moreover, twice. Both in the name and in the description of the regimental badge of the 2nd officer cavalry general of the Drozdovsky regiment. It turns out that not everything is so simple.

- Yeah! And do you see? He has the “Insignia of the First Kuban Campaign.” These were awarded for the “Ice March”, so the guy, although clearly a dude, has been in battle...

And here “Boris” was not mistaken. "Uncle" really saw action.

The Badge of the First Kuban (Ice) Campaign, which was approved by order of the Commander-in-Chief of the AFSR, Lieutenant General A.I. Denikin No. 499, was awarded only to participants of this campaign with a personal identification card. 5000 signs were produced.

[Senior seaman]

It seems that Zhigulin wrote that he thought that everyone in the family fought for the Reds, until he found a hidden badge “For the Ice Campaign”))

[Richard]

It's possible. that indeed everyone in the family fought for the Reds, and the badge itself turned out to be a trophy. And they hid it because it was silver and gilded.

badge of the “First Kuban (Ice) Campaign of the Volunteer Army” Silver, the sword is gilded, size 33 x 48 mm (sword length 52 mm, wreath with eyelet 33 mm), weight with industrial link 8,32 grams.

Today such a sign is very rare; only 5000 copies were produced.
Greetings, Ivan, my respects!

[paul3390]

An officer captured by the Reds immediately faces a painful death

So is death inevitable? But the future Marshal Govorov, Hero of the Soviet Union, Knight of the Order of Victory, Academician of the Academy of Artillery Sciences, etc., etc. - in his youth, he fought for Kolchak for a whole year, and it seemed like a volunteer. And - what? Did it bother him a lot?

[kalibr]

Quote: paul3390

An officer captured by the Reds immediately faces a painful death

So is death inevitable? But the future Marshal Govorov, Hero of the Soviet Union, Knight of the Order of Victory, Academician of the Academy of Artillery Sciences, etc., etc. - in his youth, he fought for Kolchak for a whole year, and it seemed like a volunteer. And - what? Did it bother him a lot?

Paul! Please be a little more careful when you read. Kolchakites in field uniform are one thing, and “colored officers” are another thing. We are not talking about all white hare, but only about the above-mentioned ones. And then... it happens in the novel. People talk at an everyday level and receive information as well. This is not an encyclopedia of the Civil War.

[Richard]

Only one order of the Chairman of the Revolutionary Military Council is known to be outlawed and prohibiting the capture of military personnel from colored regiments. And it’s not about the Kornilovites, Markovites, or Alekseevites, but specifically about... the Samurites. The fact is that the Samur Regiment is a military unit of the Volunteer Army and the All-Russian Socialist Republic in 1918-1920. was known as a formation, the basis of which was made up of captured Red Army soldiers who voluntarily went over to the side of the Volunteer Army. And it got its name after the 83rd Samur Infantry Regiment RIA, which broke through from the German front, joined the White Army with the regimental banner. His officers and non-commissioned officers made up the command and personnel of the new unit of the Volunteer Army. Subsequently, the ranks of the Samurs began to be replenished by volunteers from workers, peasants and Cossacks who were not happy with Soviet power. The Samurs were considered one of the most combat-ready volunteer units. Knowing that there would be no mercy for them, they were particularly cruel not only to prisoners and sympathizers of the Soviet regime, but also to the civilian population. The 5th Samur company constituted Wrangel's personal guard; it had yellow bands and black crowns. All other Samurs had black bands and yellow crowns. In April 1920, due to huge losses, the remaining Samurs were disbanded and consolidated into the 7th company of the Drozdovsky Rifle Regiment. After the end of the civil war and the "Gallipoli Sitting", the entire volunteer army was disbanded, but the "Samur" 7th company remained a cadre unit until the end of the 1930s.
rice. Samur personal guard of Wrangel

a photo samurians during the civil war.

[Ulan.1812]

Not only in the magazine "Tseichgauz" (I have such an issue), but a separate small book was also published. (Also available)
By the way, there is a photo of the commander of the Volunteer Army, General Mai-Maevsky, in the uniform of the Markovites.
Behind him stands his adjutant, Captain Makarov.
The prototype of Captain Koltsov from the film "His Excellency's Adjutant."
And Mai-Maevsky is shown there as General Kovalevsky.
But the Red Army also did not shy away from colored uniforms. For example, they wore red hussar riding breeches, etc.
There is a wonderful film - "Forty-First".
Probably many have seen it. The film is based on the story by Boris Lavrenev.
So there was such a character in the story - the commander of a detachment of Red Army soldiers - “crimson” Evsyukov.
Because he wore a crimson leather jacket.
But of course, this was not a conscious choice, simply, as the author writes, due to a shortage of dyes, jacket manufacturers dyed them in the color that they could get.
In blue, black, yellow, etc.
Whether or not the author believes that this actually happened, I don’t know.
But Boris Lavrenev himself is a former officer of the imperial army and perhaps knew what he was writing about. He has a lot of great things - “Wind”, “Marina”, “Strategic Error”, etc.

[Fat]

Greetings, Boris.
“For labor consciousness, worker-peasant discipline, understanding of the current moment and prize shooting, award cadet Alexei Trofimov with red revolutionary trousers” (c)

.
Thus, the writer Nikolai Ravich once recalled that in Sumy a horse patrol approached him to check his documents. Their appearance was striking - scarlet tunics, riding breeches, caps. And even the boots were brick-colored. To the remark that such bright patrol officers would be a good target, their commander importantly objected that this is how they differ from the “variegated” Red Army soldiers

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: Thick

Greetings, Boris.
“For labor consciousness, worker-peasant discipline, understanding of the current moment and prize shooting, award cadet Alexei Trofimov with red revolutionary trousers” (c)

.
Thus, the writer Nikolai Ravich once recalled that in Sumy a horse patrol approached him to check his documents. Their appearance was striking - scarlet tunics, riding breeches, caps. And even the boots were brick-colored. To the remark that such bright patrol officers would be a good target, their commander importantly objected that this is how they differ from the “variegated” Red Army soldiers

Good afternoon. A great example.

[jaroff]

The article once again reminded us that what a tragedy the Civil War was for our people! You look at old photographs, simple Russian faces. The wound from this tragedy still bleeds to this day. Truly, there is no winner in the Civil War. Only losers

[Cure72]

Shpakovsky became completely lazy. Not only is he promoting his book, but he also made an entire article out of it.

[deddem]

Quote: Ulan.1812

Not only in the magazine "Tseichgauz" (I have such an issue), but a separate small book was also published. (Also available)
By the way, there is a photo of the commander of the Volunteer Army, General Mai-Maevsky, in the uniform of the Markovites.
Behind him stands his adjutant, Captain Makarov.
The prototype of Captain Koltsov from the film "His Excellency's Adjutant."
And Mai-Maevsky is shown there as General Kovalevsky.
But the Red Army also did not shy away from colored uniforms. For example, they wore red hussar riding breeches, etc.
There is a wonderful film - "Forty-First".
Probably many have seen it. The film is based on the story by Boris Lavrenev.
So there was such a character in the story - the commander of a detachment of Red Army soldiers - “crimson” Evsyukov.
Because he wore a crimson leather jacket.
But of course, this was not a conscious choice, simply, as the author writes, due to a shortage of dyes, jacket manufacturers dyed them in the color that they could get.
In blue, black, yellow, etc.
Whether or not the author believes that this actually happened, I don’t know.
But Boris Lavrenev himself is a former officer of the imperial army and perhaps knew what he was writing about. He has a lot of great things - “Wind”, “Marina”, “Strategic Error”, etc.

Crimson leather jackets were the uniform of Parisian taxi drivers before WWI.