Myths about the "dolce life" of pensioners in the West and the benefits of Western pension systems

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Myths about the "dolce life" of pensioners in the West and the benefits of Western pension systems

There are myths about allegedly "rich" pensioners in the European Union and the United States, who "have fun and carefree lives while traveling around the world." At the same time, the idea is imposed that in the West everyone is "rich and happy", while in Russia everyone is "unhappy and poor."

Of course, in the West, as elsewhere, there are pensioners who live in abundance, but there are also many who can barely make ends meet. Often, when considering the amount of Western pensions, the cost of goods and services, as well as the conditions for calculating pension payments, are not taken into account. For example, in France, in order to receive a pension, you must have 42 years of work experience, while making monthly contributions.



The Danish pension system is considered one of the most reliable in the world. It consists of two parts: the basic one, which is paid by the state, and the accumulative one, consisting of the citizen's contributions to the pension fund. Thus, in all highly functional systems there is an element of self-accumulation.

If we recall the events of the Ukrainian coup d'état in 2014, it can be noted that the citizens of this country often stated during polls conducted by local media that they want to receive pensions, "like in France", namely in the amount of 8 thousand euros. The French would be very surprised by such estimates of their pensions.

When comparing Russian and Western salaries and pensions, as a rule, they forget to take into account taxes, which often amount to up to 50% of the amount of income. Also, the price load, cost and quality of services, utility tariffs, transportation costs and other factors are not taken into account. All these "little things" have a significant impact on the quality of life of citizens.

Each country is different and has its own advantages and disadvantages, which are often manipulated by hiding some factors and highlighting others. In addition, it is worth noting that the Western countries developed consistently, without any strong shocks, which we had, for example, in the 90s of the last century, when production went bankrupt, a category of people appeared who "did not fit into the market", but, in fact, literally thrown into a landfill. With a high degree of probability, the West has yet to experience something similar ...

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  1. +29
    5 September 2023 20: 12
    You look at the prices in the same France, 1 euros is definitely not enough for you for croissants. Well, where we are not, and then when we are not there. There are enough problems everywhere. Best of all, pensioners lived in the USSR, but these are just memories.
    1. +31
      5 September 2023 20: 22
      Pensions in the USSR... were also different, but grandmother always had hotels for her grandchildren!!!
    2. +8
      5 September 2023 21: 08
      Quote from Silver99
      Just look at the prices in France, 1 euros is definitely not enough for croissants

      In France, Germany, and practically throughout Europe, food prices are lower than in the Russian Federation, and significantly so. And you can live normally on 1500.
      1. +11
        5 September 2023 21: 11
        lower than in the Russian Federation, and significantly.
        In England it’s about the same as in Moscow. In France and Belgium it is a little more expensive than in England (10-20%). In Germany, it is 10 percent cheaper than in England. In Portugal it’s about the same as in Germany. Something like this.
        1. +5
          5 September 2023 21: 20
          Quote: Bolt Cutter
          Somehow

          Hmmm... I'll ask:

          - an apartment (with all utilities) - also from $100 per month?
          Is travel by public transport also free?

          Not that I need it, but just for curiosity...
          1. +9
            5 September 2023 21: 23
            apartment (with all utilities) - also from $100 per month?
            If you haven't paid off your long and successful working life on your mortgage, social housing is free, yes. Utilities - it is quite realistic to meet 150, plus all sorts of subsidies. Transport - in England (in other countries I do not know) - travel by bus is free.
            1. 0
              5 September 2023 21: 25
              Quote: Bolt Cutter
              Transport - in England (I don’t know in other countries) - bus travel is free ...

              ... but the snack is 10% more expensive. Than in Germany. Persuaded. I won't go to you Yes laughing
            2. +5
              6 September 2023 00: 53
              Quote: Bolt Cutter
              If you haven't paid off your long and successful working life mortgage - social housing is free, yes

              But..
              It's tough in Canada - even if there is paid housing, mostly people sell it and go to nursing homes, because taxes and requisitions "eat up" half or more of the usual pension.
              The nursing home is paid, but it costs less than paying the municipal, school tax, plus constant repairs at crazy rates and extortions from the authorities at the municipal level.
              If the pension is good, you can give it for living in a good nursing home, and use the money received from the sale of real estate for food, entertainment and travel.
              If the pension is ordinary, then with all the allowances for poverty, it will run up to 2. Of these, 000,00 for a nursing home, for the rest, do not deny yourself anything. In your free time, you can go to humanitarian missions for food.
              I have a man I know, in his seventies he looks like a cucumber. He earns about 2, has his own paid house, where he repairs everything with his own hands. He complains that he does not have enough, he has to earn extra money "in a black way". His neighbor, an immigrant from Germany, has retired and is doing the same.
              Quote: Bolt Cutter
              Transport - in England (in other countries I do not know) - travel by bus is free.

              Great!
              Our old people pay for the bus and metro, although not the full cost.
          2. +3
            6 September 2023 00: 57
            Today in Germany, social benefits for old and young are, in total, perhaps even richer than in the USSR.
            Well, not worse for sure.
            So, who is the “heir to the ideas of the USSR” in the matter of caring for citizens is still a very big question
            But definitely not Russia.
            The trouble with the West is its lack of ideas and consumer frenzy.
            But if they are able to feed their plebs well, then they will be able to educate them if necessary.
            Well, someone is being fed tales about two out of three perverts in the West.
            In Austrian villages pensioner grandmothers are heated by Russian gas.
            Have local grandmothers in all Russian villages earned access to gas from the Russian subsoil for their work?
            Even in the Union, propaganda was not so “involved” in the matter of making crap in the West.
            Apparently there is a crisis of the genre, however.
            1. 0
              6 September 2023 08: 11
              Quote: Red Biker
              In Austrian villages pensioner grandmothers are heated by Russian gas.
              Have local grandmothers in all Russian villages earned access to gas from the Russian subsoil for their work?

              In order to warm other people's grandmothers and grab currencies, the USSR dragged gas pipelines there
              And by 1986 he gasified his own - 6% in rural areas (of which 1,9% was bottled gas)...
              1. +8
                6 September 2023 13: 14
                The Soviet Union for "grabbed currency" did not buy palaces and estates abroad for its people's commissars and ministers.
                And he bought the latest technologies, bypassing the "cocom", created a nuclear shield and an army, the remnants of which are now messing with the Nazis.
                Today's capitalist Russia is the heiress of Kerensky and Nikolashka's Russia, but not the USSR, to our great regret.
                1. -2
                  6 September 2023 21: 32
                  Quote: Red Biker
                  And he bought the latest technologies, bypassing the "cocom", created a nuclear shield and an army, the remnants of which are now messing with the Nazis.

                  and the population continued to heat their houses in the winter with what they stole. It was not possible to buy coal/firewood everywhere and not always; it was not cheap. Permits for heating with 3-phase electricity were almost never given - the transformers were weak...
                  Gasification.....
                  Slowly - from 1950 to 1986 - 6%, 1990-2020 67%
                  Do you notice the difference in gasification? And this is taking into account the fact that under the USSR these 6% were smeared throughout

                  the USSR
                  Quote: Red Biker
                  The Soviet Union for "grabbed currency" did not buy palaces and estates abroad for its people's commissars and ministers.
                  -in return, he built the Dead Road, a tunnel to Sakhalin, turned rivers, etc....
                  No oligarch could ever dream of how much money is buried there (and on other useless objects) .....
                  Have you ever wondered why, after Stalin’s death, construction was abandoned almost instantly? Even steam locomotives were abandoned on the Dead Road, although there was not enough traction throughout the country
        2. +4
          6 September 2023 10: 00
          In England it’s about the same as in Moscow. In France and Belgium it is a little more expensive than in England (10-20%). In Germany, it is 10 percent cheaper than in England. In Portugal it’s about the same as in Germany. Something like this.

          They compared the purchasing power of the pensions of the USSR and the West (I can’t find the link now).
          I remember that the average pension in Germany turned out to be equal to our personal pension of a pensioner of republican significance (120 rubles).
          This is taking into account the fact that he also bought goods in special feeders. wink
          1. +2
            10 September 2023 06: 04
            Quote: Arzt

            I remember that the average pension in Germany turned out to be equal to our personal pension of a pensioner of republican significance (120 rubles).
            This is taking into account the fact that he also bought goods in special feeders. wink

            You're not the only one with a memory.

            I remember that my aunt, who lived and worked in Kamchatka, moved to Leningrad in the 60s and received a pension of exactly 120 rubles.

            At the end of the 70s, a person who went to the oil fields for 3 years brought 10 thousand.... My friends in the 80s worked on piecework, on an assembly line - they had deposits of 10-15 thousand. And by the way, these Soviet "poor “The money is still frozen... In the USSR, whoever worked hard and didn’t sit his ass on the couch got paid accordingly.
            1. 0
              11 September 2023 17: 58
              Quote: ivan2022
              And by the way - these Soviet "poor" money is still frozen

              Everyone who wanted to receive compensation long ago.
      2. +5
        5 September 2023 21: 29
        A very important aspect is missing. Is it an apartment or a house. If your own, paid in working years, then enough, if rented, then for an apartment (depending on the area, size and quality) you need to unfasten monthly from 500 to 900, or even more. Therefore, even with a good pension, almost half goes to housing.
        1. +10
          5 September 2023 21: 52
          And in Russia, can you shoot while living on a pension?
          1. -5
            5 September 2023 22: 05
            And in Russia, an apartment is owned for retirement.
            1. +5
              5 September 2023 22: 29
              And in Russia, an apartment is owned for retirement.


              Which the USSR built?
              1. -4
                6 September 2023 00: 15
                And it's so important to you who built it?
                1. +6
                  6 September 2023 12: 57
                  And it's so important to you who built it?


                  Of course, because it was the USSR that provided citizens with affordable housing, and not the capitalist Russian Federation.
                  1. -6
                    6 September 2023 21: 24
                    The capitalist Russian Federation gave people a choice and the opportunity to decide for themselves whether to buy an apartment, rent it, build a country house, etc. And the socialist USSR forbade even building a garage on your own summer cottage. As for free housing in the USSR, nothing is ever free. It’s just that many others paid for the housing given to one, and others distributed it, and not always for free.
            2. +2
              7 September 2023 14: 42
              Yeah, if you managed to get it under the USSR, but if you didn’t, then here in the Russian Federation not everything is so rosy.
          2. +2
            7 September 2023 18: 36
            And in Russia you still have to live until retirement))) Based on the latest available data from Rosstat, life expectancy in Russia for 2022 was: Women: 77.77 years Men: 67.57 years As they say, I worked in a wooden mac
        2. +2
          6 September 2023 01: 03
          Social housing/apartment with an area of ​​up to 70-90 meters for three is paid for by the state, at least in the countries of old Europe. Traveling on a social song will not work, but living with dignity is quite possible.
          If you have excess housing, you can rent it out.
          Many people inherited their homes from their great-great-grandfathers.
          A 300-year-old house in a German village is not the exception, but the rule.
      3. +5
        5 September 2023 22: 33
        Quote: karabas-barabas
        food prices are lower than in the Russian Federation, and significantly.

        Well, how much, for example, does meat cost in Germany?
        Chicken - 6 euros, (600r) per kg...
        Potatoes-1,2 euros (120r) per kg...
        This is called much cheaper than in Russia?
        1. +3
          6 September 2023 01: 14
          And how many times did your children go with cool trips to Spain, England, France with a payment of 120 euros?
          Maybe your children are paid extra for sports, 40 euros per month?
          Or can you visit the flying club in the nearest village and make five flights every weekend, for a fee of 20 euros, per quarter?
          With all responsibility - socialism in old Europe, today no less than in the USSR, but it is different.
      4. -2
        6 September 2023 00: 01
        Quote: karabas-barabas
        In France, Germany, and almost throughout Europe, food prices are lower than in the Russian Federation

        And where is such information from?
      5. -1
        6 September 2023 08: 07
        Quote: Bolt Cutter
        lower than in the Russian Federation, and significantly.
        In England it’s about the same as in Moscow. In France and Belgium it is a little more expensive than in England (10-20%). In Germany, it is 10 percent cheaper than in England. In Portugal it’s about the same as in Germany. Something like this.

        Quote: karabas-barabas
        Quote from Silver99
        Just look at the prices in France, 1 euros is definitely not enough for croissants

        In France, Germany, and practically throughout Europe, food prices are lower than in the Russian Federation, and significantly so. And you can live normally on 1500.

        There is only one question - if food costs the same as ours, buses are paid, utilities, etc., and salaries are even on average less than 500 euros, even at the exchange rate of 78 rubles (real at the level of 300) - then why don’t we have heaps of people who have died of hunger on the streets ?
        Something doesn't add up....
        1. 0
          11 September 2023 18: 13
          Quote: your1970
          then why don't we have heaps of people who died of starvation on the streets?

          They won’t let you die, they’ll send you to the hospital for treatment. You can only eat potatoes
    3. +5
      5 September 2023 22: 28
      Best of all, pensioners lived in the USSR, but these are just memories.


      Precisely, then the most fair pension was. It was quite possible to live on it.
      1. -2
        6 September 2023 08: 16
        Quote: vovochkarzhevsky
        Best of all, pensioners lived in the USSR, but these are just memories.


        Precisely, then the most fair pension was. It was quite possible to live on it.

        A great-grandmother with 60 years of experience received 1974 rubles in the village in 12 and was considered a “rich woman” - her neighbors received 6-7 rubles.....
        How much was the pension for 60 ruble cleaners, nannies, postmen, janitors and other low-paid personnel)?
        How much was the pension for engineering and tax officers with 120 rubles?
        1. +1
          6 September 2023 10: 04
          Hm, it was necessary to try hard - to remain MNF until retirement. However, I knew one such lady.

          And the salary of 120 publics from the Ministry of Taxation - 'this was in the 70s, later they raised quite decently, but Perestroyka had just begun.
          1. 0
            6 September 2023 10: 35
            Quote: Outsider V.
            Hm, it was necessary to try hard - to remain MNF until retirement. However, I knew one such lady.

            And the salary of 120 publics from the Ministry of Taxation - 'this was in the 70s, later they raised quite decently, but Perestroyka had just begun.

            I knew quite a lot of MNS - next to the research institute of fish, something happened with a chic buffet with orders. A distant relative ruled this buffet.
            They raised it just a couple of years before 1985, no more ...
        2. +3
          6 September 2023 13: 12
          I knew you were in for it. lol I didn’t say in vain that a fair pension.
          By the way, you lied a lot about the size of the collective farm pension.
          Well, you probably don’t know that the collective farmers had a choice to receive a collective farm or working pension. My aunt in that 1974 preferred 25 re collective farm pension. And all because the collective farm pension relied on a land plot much more than the prescribed 15 acres. Plus other collective farm benefits. And in this area, she started growing strawberries. It was enough to buy a son-in-law, to start with, to buy a motorcycle with a sidecar, then a new VAZ-2101 and put it aside well in a pod.
          So there is no need for fairy tales about poor collective farmers.
          And further, there were no problems with work in the USSR. Because those who wanted more just worked harder.
          And if you were looking for a job so as not to overwork, then what was there to complain about later?
          1. 0
            6 September 2023 21: 56
            Quote: vovochkarzhevsky
            , Plus other collective farm benefits.
            So there is no need for fairy tales about poor collective farmers.
            And further, there were no problems with work in the USSR. Because those who wanted more just worked harder.
            And if you were looking for a job so as not to overwork, then what was there to complain about later?

            In our city, 6300 were drafted into the war, 5600 died. How many women do you think were left without husbands and without fathers, and then toiled for the rest of their lives just to somehow feed themselves? Those who often did not have enough education for their profession to be at least a little better paid?

            Quote: vovochkarzhevsky
            And on this plot she started growing strawberries.
            -oha...there was a million-plus city nearby - 200%...
            Here in Saratov, 200-odd kilometers away, and even if the collective farmer grew strawberries, no one needed them for nothing. You know, the problems with delivery were global...
            1. +1
              7 September 2023 10: 30
              In our city, 6300 were drafted into the war, 5600 died. How many women do you think were left without husbands and without fathers, and then toiled for the rest of their lives just to somehow feed themselves? Those who often did not have enough education for their profession to be at least a little better paid?


              Why are you spinning like a snake? Those who worked hard, he received a pension. He himself cited the MNS as an example, higher education by the way.

              -oha...there was a million-plus city nearby - 200%...
              Here in Saratov, 200-odd kilometers away, and even if the collective farmer grew strawberries, no one needed them for nothing. You know, the problems with delivery were global...


              Again you have a blunder, Seryozha. We didn’t have a millionaire nearby, the district center. It was just that in Soviet times it was possible to earn money everywhere, not only in Moscow. And after buying a motorcycle with a sidecar, the regional market became available.
              1. 0
                7 September 2023 19: 10
                Quote: vovochkarzhevsky
                We didn’t have a millionaire nearby, the district center.

                Quote: vovochkarzhevsky
                After purchasing a motorcycle with a sidecar, the regional market became available.

                Yep ..
                I had a regional center - at the bazaar one the grandmother sold fruits and vegetables. There was enough for the entire regional center - it was expensive. And everyone had their own...
                And for the strawberries to survive to the region, the mileage for a motorcycle is no more than 50 km.
                So sorry - either the regional center was very rich or the regional city had a population of over a million...
                Quote: vovochkarzhevsky
                It’s just that in Soviet times it was possible to earn money everywhere, not only in Moscow
                - I’m embarrassed to ask - what’s the difference? You can make money always and everywhere - you need to have the ability... An acquaintance who works on a garbage truck makes engravings on axes. As he did in Soviet times, so now.
                Quote: vovochkarzhevsky
                Those who worked hard received a pension
                that is, a cleaning lady who worked so hard doesn’t count? With her crazy amount of experience, her ceiling was 50 rubles.....
        3. +2
          6 September 2023 17: 32
          A great-grandmother with 60 years of experience received 1974 rubles in the village in 12 and was considered a “rich woman” - her neighbors received 6-7 rubles.....
          In the village there was a household plot, for potatoes it was necessary to go down to the cellar, and not go to the store.
          1. -3
            6 September 2023 21: 58
            Quote: Aviator_
            A great-grandmother with 60 years of experience received 1974 rubles in the village in 12 and was considered a “rich woman” - her neighbors received 6-7 rubles.....
            In the village there was a household plot, for potatoes it was necessary to go down to the cellar, and not go to the store.

            force you to weed once and kill the beetle on 30-40 acres - you will hate those potatoes “in the cellar”
            1. +2
              6 September 2023 22: 04
              make you weed once and poison the beetle
              Don't scare me with agricultural work, I know what it is. And the whining about collective farmers with a small pension has bothered me since the late 80s, the asphalt farmer Chernichenko made an inoculation to this topic with his publications in Ogonyok.
    4. 0
      23 September 2023 02: 20
      This kind of income means living in a dirty area in a basement behind a curtain, eating potato peelings.
  2. +3
    5 September 2023 20: 13
    pensions, "like in France"
    Father-in-law changed the car three times in 10 years. Mother-in-law - twice.
    1. -5
      5 September 2023 20: 51
      Well, in Moscow there are people who, six months after the start, (a three-letter word), exchanged their Mercedes and Audis for hawalas and jaks.
      1. +2
        5 September 2023 20: 56
        for hawals and jaks.
        They prefer the domestic auto industry. And French pensions are enough for them.
  3. +7
    5 September 2023 20: 13
    The old "truth" ... "everywhere is good where we are not!"
    Believe it or not...
  4. +12
    5 September 2023 20: 14
    Let's use the example of the United States to understand, there is: a social pension is to make ends meet, but there is insurance; these are investments at interest that they then spend: had a good job, successfully invested money, you will be happy, no: well, no luck ...
  5. +5
    5 September 2023 20: 31
    My acquaintance, well, almost a friend, from Finland, a simple man, worked for more than 40 years, retired. 65 years old. In good shape, thank God, a pension of 1000 euros, well, 100 thousand rubles with our money. I ask, is it enough? No! I worked part-time in eastern Finland on Russian tourists, but in 2022 it was all covered ... For a normal life, you need 1300 - 1500 euros ...
    1. 0
      6 September 2023 01: 19
      An important clarification is needed - what exactly is missing from your friend with his Finnish pension?
      I think, for something that pensioners in Russia do not even dream of
  6. +21
    5 September 2023 20: 31
    What is this article for? What do our pensioners fatten? Many work from a "good" pension.
    1. +4
      5 September 2023 20: 52
      No, this is about the fact that not everyone is fattening in the West, and even more so, it’s not worth destroying your country for this very pension. She may fail expectations.
      1. -5
        5 September 2023 21: 54
        A typical American, Canadian or British lives much harder and poorer than a typical Russian.
        1. +6
          5 September 2023 22: 06
          the Briton lives much harder and poorer
          But according to the British minimum wage, he earns the Russian monthly minimum wage in 13 hours.
          1. 0
            23 September 2023 02: 11
            What does it matter, since he has to pay his bills there, and not in Russia. The fact remains: the standard of living of categories of the population receiving even minimal income in Russia turns out to be actually higher than that on the other hand, simply because of the opportunity to own real estate, pay taxes and other mandatory payments while living in expensive areas of large cities. This is not possible anywhere in the world.
        2. +4
          5 September 2023 23: 40
          Here typical Canadians with Americans will be surprised.
          1. 0
            23 September 2023 01: 55
            Canadians and Americans are surprised when they learn that almost all Russian citizens are owners of apartments and houses, often several, and those who rent housing because they are unable to buy it are an absolute minority. They are surprised when they see that the “American dream” of a house and a couple of cars for a family is available to anyone who works. While in the USA, Britain and Canada, and even more so in Europe, the opposite is true - property owners are no more than 15%.
    2. 0
      6 September 2023 00: 19
      And we also have pensioners who have not worked a single day, but their pension is more than that of those who have honestly plowed their whole lives
  7. +7
    5 September 2023 20: 47
    We always looked out for every speck in our own eye and did not see the logs in someone else's eye.
    1. +11
      5 September 2023 22: 06
      The people are just stubborn. When there is nothing to brag about themselves, they begin to look for something on the side. I wonder how many articles are published in the West where they compare their pension with the Russian one? Probably 0 . Because there is simply nothing to compare
      1. +10
        6 September 2023 01: 26
        Ukrainians are told how the Russians steal the toilet from their washtub, but at the same time build nuclear missile carriers.
        Russians are told about Bandera in every Ukrainian house and about homosexuals who have invaded Europe.
        In Europe they are afraid of the environment and Putin.
        It's simple...
        Scared and fools are easier to manage
        1. 0
          6 September 2023 06: 16
          So it is... DIVIDE AND CONQUER!
          Invented a long time ago, it always works.
          Those in power do not even need to come to an agreement, the basic principles of governing peoples are written in their subcortex ...
    2. +2
      6 September 2023 01: 42
      Well, yes, and also tell how “they have it there” is bad, but you hold on, you are almost good.
  8. +7
    5 September 2023 20: 49
    When comparing Russian and Western salaries and pensions, as a rule, they forget to take into account taxes, which often amount to up to 50% of the amount of income. Also, the price load, cost and quality of services, utility tariffs, transportation costs and other factors are not taken into account. All these "little things" have a significant impact on the quality of life of citizens.
    Let's take the official data and see: average pension in the Russian Federation is 19322,21 rubles (as of 01.01.2023/XNUMX/XNUMX). This is a very small amount. Considering that many receive a smaller pension (and not everyone lives up to it), then the reasoning of the author of the video looks rather hypocritical...
  9. +2
    5 September 2023 20: 52
    The article is not about anything. Of course it’s good where we are not, but about
    When comparing Russian and Western salaries and pensions, they usually forget to take into account taxes, which often amount to up to 50% of income

    We calculate our taxes according to the legislation of 2023.-
    uniform insurance premium rates - 30 percent. This includes contributions to the Compulsory Medical Insurance Fund and the Pension Fund, and the “cumulative” part of pension contributions has been frozen since 2014, i.e. The employer deducts 6 percent of the “savings” from the salary, but they do not affect the increase in pension.
    -NDFL- 13 percent
    - contribution “for injuries” - from 0,2 to 8,5% (the amount is determined by the work and the employer)
    And soon we can expect a “Long-term Savings Program”, that is, an additional plus of up to 6 percent (but here at the request of the employee)
    You can calculate the amount yourself
  10. +13
    5 September 2023 20: 54
    Today I was thinking about this topic. When it was necessary for us to support the perestroikaists, they described to us the “charms” of capitalism. Now that we are not going anywhere, we can cynically tell how we were deceived.
  11. +11
    5 September 2023 20: 56
    People in the Russian Federation are afraid of being retired. Without the support of relatives, without work, without additional income, retirement is a slow death.
    1. -2
      5 September 2023 21: 49
      In Russia, they manage to live on a state pension in their own house or apartment, even in Moscow, and pay all mandatory payments. In Canada and the USA, this is impossible, the state pension will not cover real estate taxes, rent and other obligatory payments, even in a small provincial town.
    2. +6
      6 September 2023 01: 29
      Unfortunately, from my observations, people in Russia are more coming out-fascists and euro-fagots - they are afraid of their own fucking officials who are out of permissiveness.
      1. -6
        6 September 2023 08: 32
        Quote: Red Biker
        Unfortunately, from my observations, people in Russia are more coming out-fascists and euro-fagots - they are afraid of their own fucking officials who are out of permissiveness.

        Well, ours have not yet come up with the level of water consumption and the triple tariff in case of excess - as in Germany.
        But the officials there are democratic, you see, they are close to the people...

        And yes, classic, the woman is 32 years old and wants to get married
        "And start keeping a diary telling the whole truth about Bridget Jones.
        All the truth.
        Weight 136 pounds, smoked 42 cigarettes, 50 drinks.
        Promise number one: definitely lose 20 pounds.
        Number two: start putting dirty panties in the dirty laundry basket."(c) The Diary of Brittgit Jones

        They never paid attention - why does she drag around dirty panties for so long - that the task of changing them for her is task for the year, and even number 2???
        Maybe it's due to washing, water consumption and high cost?
        A woman is looking for a man but rarely changes her panties - nonsense, right?
        1. +4
          6 September 2023 09: 05
          Why is she dragging dirty panties around for so long?
          It is implied that she scatters them anywhere, like an avid bachelor, and does not wear them for weeks. This is such a cliché of Western culture.
          1. -3
            6 September 2023 10: 44
            Quote: Bolt Cutter
            Why is she dragging dirty panties around for so long?
            It is implied that she scatters anywhere, like an avid bachelorette, and does not wear it for weeks. Such is the cliche of Western culture.
            - you see, dirty men's socks are one thing, and women's underpants are another. Gender is different ...
            I don't know English that well - but they speak feel what is in the originalchange".
            And our translators brought everything into a more correct form - "like a bachelorette"
            1. +4
              6 September 2023 11: 13
              I watched the film in the original - there is no “change” there. In addition, her apartment in New York costs a million dollars. So you are wrong with your hasty conclusions.
              1. -1
                6 September 2023 21: 23
                Quote: Bolt Cutter
                I watched the film in the original - there is no “change” there.
                - I believe. It may well be that the translation problems have not been canceled.
                Quote: Bolt Cutter
                In addition, her apartment in New York costs a million dollars. So you are wrong with your hasty conclusions.
        2. +3
          6 September 2023 13: 36
          This is NOT true about the “triple” tariff.
          In Germany, it’s definitely different.
          You pay an average amount every month. And at the end of the year there is a reconciliation.
          If you spent more, you pay the difference and your monthly fee is set a little higher for the next year.
          Otherwise, save money.
          Then the difference is returned to you and the whole next year, the average monthly payment will be less.
          They can give an interest-free loan to install solar panels on the entire roof.
          They can help insulate the house, etc.
  12. +6
    5 September 2023 21: 04
    Yes, they live there. Recently I interviewed the deputy chairman of the regional TEC on the eve of a single voting day, his son lives in France from his first marriage. He rents huts for free - the state compensates the rent once a year. And he got the tower for free, now he works according to his profile. Everything, as in the USSR, in short. And his father sailed the seas, he says - he does not believe in propaganda, in Europe everything is for people)
    Z.Y. And the son of a sailor who was from his second marriage in the NWO is fighting, he defended the hayvoron in certain days. Where, according to rumors, they forgot to cover a very interesting object in advance from the Ukrainians.
  13. +4
    5 September 2023 21: 21
    I agree with the commentators, and with the author, that we also have pensioners with decent payments, and in Western Europe there are not only happy pensioners. I don't know about Eastern Europe and the Baltics.
    And the best pension is health, a healthy spouse nearby, children and grandchildren who will not forget to call and talk, and visit, and remind you to move ...
  14. m..
    0
    5 September 2023 21: 28
    In general, somehow it doesn’t matter how they live there, we have the age of survival, so you are doing better for the majority, and not for yourself and your loved ones
  15. 0
    5 September 2023 21: 35
    In Canada, the general state old-age pension after 65 years is 400 Canadian dollars and 100 dollars for every 10 years of service. In total, the state guarantees a maximum of 800 Canadian dollars for a person who has worked for 40 years, and an idler will receive the same amount, because this is the level of survival and he will be paid extra from social assistance funds. Pensions in other countries are taken into account, so they won’t add too much. Civil servants such as police officers and school teachers receive a professional allowance. Those who worked in large corporations receive a corporate allowance. Entrepreneurs and business owners do not receive anything in addition to the minimum wage that they themselves have not put aside before. The rest is your own savings for retirement. A typical tax for a small house in Toronto is $300 per month. OSAGO auto insurance $250 per month or more. 20 years in Toronto.
    1. +3
      5 September 2023 23: 24
      and what are you actively misleading people in the topic? why only talk about Old Age Security Pension and don’t say that the main part of a pensioner’s income is not it, but individual pension accounts, the system of which is very developed in Canada and EVERYONE uses it + there is a Canada Pension Plan, this is another additional payment - no one lives on only one mandatory pension and without housing, otherwise there would be no crowd of homeless people... have you not understood the issue or are you deliberately misinforming with such an interpretation of the issue, affecting only one payment and not talking about other “goodies”? also about Toronto - one of the most expensive cities in Canada, I’ll see how you survive on 19 rubles in Moscow time..

      Quote from: Alex Priest
      Typical tax for a small house in Toronto is $300 per month.

      The tax return is filed once a year no later than April 30th. If a citizen receives less than 7 CA$ (500 ₽) per year, then he fully exempt from paying taxes, plus many types of other deductions, for different categories.
      and so on, as described by you...
      1. -4
        6 September 2023 08: 48
        Quote: Level 2 Advisor
        I’ll see how you survive in Moscow time on 19tr..
        and everyone is dying of hunger, living in 19 thousand... and they are lying on the streets in crowds...
        I told a colleague who received 21 with Moscow additional payments - “Sell your apartment, they will give you at least 000 million (before SVO) for it easily. I will find you a good house in our city, the regional center, for 10 million. The city is clean, there are no migrant workers, everything is nearby, even a special car no need. You will live in the fresh air, keep chickens and sell eggs to your neighbors. Interest-bearing money is an increase in your pension."
        Yeah, right now, he’s already running
  16. +12
    5 September 2023 21: 47
    Author, don't be embarrassed. Let's write down how pensioners live well in Russia. For 15 thousand rubles, go live with dignity. There is even nothing to compare with any difficulties in the West. Well, how much can you disgrace yourself with these rubbish sedative articles?
    1. +8
      5 September 2023 22: 04
      It is enough to type in a search engine “taxation in the USA” and “pension provision in the USA” or about the same thing in EU countries, read different articles and compare with similar ones in Russia. This is what those who really want to understand the issue do. Those who prefer to be in the mainstream of propaganda that is comfortable for them do not need to do anything of this, just read similar articles that we are discussing.
      1. +5
        5 September 2023 22: 48
        It is enough that let the people find a Western video where they compare Western pensions with Russian ones. I think this simply does not exist, since it would never even occur to them to compare it
        1. +2
          6 September 2023 02: 56
          . I think this simply does not exist, since it would never even occur to them to compare it
          hi
        2. -2
          6 September 2023 08: 51
          Quote: All_Good
          It is enough that let the people find a Western video where they compare Western pensions with Russian ones. I think this simply does not exist, since it would never even occur to them to compare it

          Because they are NOT INTERESTED. They confuse Iraq with Iran, and strain compare pensions with someone else.
          But ours is interested, eternal curiosity
  17. -10
    5 September 2023 22: 03
    Do pennyuks deserve at least some kind of pension? Who should work instead of them? They did not give birth to changers. I think it would be fair if the retirement age is raised again.
    1. +3
      5 September 2023 22: 07
      Years up to 80-85 definitely need to be raised. And there the statistics of survival will be tightened
      1. +5
        5 September 2023 23: 32
        We definitely need to raise it to 80-85 years old

        And if the retirement period is raised to 100 years, then the size of the pension can be made 10 times larger than in England.
  18. +8
    5 September 2023 22: 04
    "they forget to take into account taxes, often up to 50%"
    And that they also charge taxes from the boarding house ?!.
    This is basically the end.
    "It also does not take into account the price burden, the cost and quality of services, utility tariffs, transportation costs and other factors. "
    Are you talking about the capitalists or are you talking about us?
  19. -2
    5 September 2023 22: 16
    Pensioners in Russia live better than in the West.
    Because we have stability and confidence in the future.
    1. +6
      6 September 2023 04: 24
      Quote from: dump22
      in tomorrow.

      And the BOTTOM has not yet been reached! what
  20. +8
    5 September 2023 22: 25
    Yes, yes...how bad everything is for them. Whether it's our pensioners ..
    The author is generally inadequate - go to Magnet or Pyaterochka, stand near the cash register and see what pensioners can afford to buy..
    And then mess up the paper
    1. -2
      6 September 2023 00: 49
      In general, I am for socialism. And I perfectly understand the difference between socialism and capitalism.
      In Magnet and Pyaterochka there are discounts for pensioners and every day discounts for a certain type of product up to 50%. There is a relatively cheap network "Svetofor" there, too, there are good goods at a low price.
      There are also shops with cheap manufactured goods.
      But in general, the country has wild or oligarchic capitalism. Prices on the principle until they stop buying will increase.
      Until we choose a good government that cares about pensioners, orphans and the poor, we will whine like this. All the benefits of pensioners in the West from the struggle for power, and pensioners vote for those who will increase their benefits and pensions. They understand that the capitalists will never let go of a penny and force them to work to the grave.
      Now, in order to ride like cheese in oil in retirement, you need bank savings, and Gaidar spoke frankly about this. But we fell for the tales of the liberals that we will all live from the belly, but life shows that this does not happen.
      Apartments, free education gave us current pensioners the USSR, socialism.
      So pensioners do not sit at home, if you still have brains, go and vote for whom you see fit. soldier
      1. 0
        7 September 2023 18: 52
        “Until we elect a good government that cares about pensioners, the orphaned and the poor, we will continue to whine like this...” We can only guess three times - will they give you (us) choose be it good power, or smart power, or any kind of power at all...
  21. +2
    5 September 2023 22: 39
    In France, the minimum pension is 1100 euros, and the maximum is 2600. Usually 1200-1500 euros. For a minimum pension, you can buy 50 kg of boneless beef (meat is expensive in Europe). In St. Petersburg, 50 kg of beef cost about 35000 rubles. The cost of a new Renault (Dacia) Sandero in France starts from 9 minimum pensions, they are no longer produced in Russia after well-known events, but the price of 2022 cars in good condition starts at 1500 rubles, that is, for a purchase in 000 months, you need 9 month. Already in these two examples, we can see that the ratio of prices for different categories of goods differs significantly. In beef, the "minimal" French pensioner receives only 167 rubles (like a very cool Russian), but in cars as much as 000 (like very few even working Muscovites). But in onions, an elderly Frenchman has a miserable 35 rubles - more than the bulk of Russian comrades in misfortune, but less than the average working Russian.

    But my mother, having honestly worked until the age of 60, from a Soviet engineer to a Russian department head, paying full taxes from a very good (almost French) salary for the last ten years until retirement, now receives a generous 14 rubles. Worse than the French onion. And so, yes, "in each country everything is different and there are advantages and disadvantages, which are often tried to be manipulated, hiding some factors and sticking out others."
    1. -1
      5 September 2023 22: 59
      Quote: Yaroslav Tekkel
      In France, the minimum pension is 1100 euros.

      And what about the increase in the retirement age? How much does electricity and gas cost? More or less than in Russia? And the property tax?
      1. -2
        5 September 2023 23: 48
        In France, the minimum old-age pension is 961,08 euros. https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/actualites/A15712
        If you don't have your own home, it's hard for you to make ends meet.
        I know I live there :)
        1. +4
          6 September 2023 01: 44
          If you don't have your own home, it's hard for you to make ends meet.
          I know I live there :)
          If you haven’t been able to buy a home by retirement, you will be provided with social housing or subsidized the one in which you already live. My wife lived there until recently.
        2. -1
          6 September 2023 20: 42
          Quote from: zorglub bulgroz
          In France the minimum pension is

          The question is not the size, but how much you have to spend and on what.
    2. 0
      6 September 2023 10: 50
      Quote: Yaroslav Tekkel
      In beef, the "minimal" French pensioner receives only 35 rubles (like a very cool Russian), but in cars as much as 000 (like very few even working Muscovites).

      The joke is that in the car us sat up to 30% of the cost of customs duties and VAT. Even at an industrial assembly with a 0 duty rate, VAT is still paid ....
      And the French have their Renault - native
      Therefore, it is for cars that the comparison is incorrect
  22. -4
    5 September 2023 23: 30
    Commentators!!!
    Stop!
    In France, in Germany, in the USA there are no old people who are begging?
    We, in Russia, do not have old people who receive a pension of 60-80 thousand rubles? I'm not talking about the deputies and those who saved up, but about those who worked, worked hard, but are alive and praise the country.
    1. -1
      6 September 2023 11: 36
      Quote from Fangaro
      Commentators!!!
      Stop!
      In France, in Germany, in the USA there are no old people who are begging?
      We, in Russia, do not have old people who receive a pension of 60-80 thousand rubles? I'm not talking about the deputies and those who saved up, but about those who worked, worked hard, but are alive and praise the country.

      Everyone unanimously believes that obviously EVERYTHING Our pensioners are poor.
      And they don’t see that practically daily in the crime news feed there is:
      "A pensioner was robbed of 1-2-3-5-10 million..."
      That is, among pensioners there are people with money.
      And this NOT bosses or deputies left immediately so that the next ones wouldn’t start to bully them
  23. +6
    5 September 2023 23: 32
    A stupid article, with a link to an equally stupid channel. Why is this?
  24. +4
    5 September 2023 23: 44
    When I first went to a tavern in Belgium during working hours, that is, an inexpensive restaurant, I was simply shocked that only “dandelions”, that is, pensioners, were sitting there.
    Not all pensioners in Belgium go to restaurants, some have not even earned a pension corresponding to the living wage of a thousand euros, but in this case they receive a supplement from the social security service.
    My friend at the same time in Kazan at the age of 68 is forced to continue working as a teacher of Russian and literature, because, as she claims, she will not be able to live on her pension.
    1. 0
      6 September 2023 17: 56
      For the most part, teachers are afraid not that they will not be able to live, but that she will not be able to live. For a Russian teacher (a real one), his work always forces him to keep himself in good shape. Without it, they do not see the meaning in life and try to either somehow replace it, or, having not found a replacement worthy of their work, they leave us.
  25. +4
    6 September 2023 00: 06
    Here they are trying to compare pension contributions to citizens of developed economies with Russian ones.
    One question.
    The constant, since the beginning of Yeltsin's "democracy", the devaluation of the national currency in the Russian Federation, which worsens the quality of life of citizens, is the same as in developed countries, or are they somehow more stable with currencies than Russian "stability"?
    And further. Does the annual amount of compensation to our pensioners cover the growth of real inflation, not according to VTsIOM?
    Now, compare Persians in the West and in the Russian Federation.
    In the USSR, the first thing was a stable ruble and prices, which day after day did not take the summit of Everest, as they do now. wink
    A riddle for intellectuals.
    Why did some Soviet citizens keep money in three-liter jars? wink
    PS
    If you have accumulated something from your hard-earned savings in rubles for old age and hope to live "worthily" in retirement, do not hope! Who knows how many loaves of bread your savings will last in 10 years ..... Unless, of course, you live to see this "happy" moment with our "free" medicine.
    laughing hi
    1. -3
      6 September 2023 08: 58
      Quote: Sovetskiy
      Why did some Soviet citizens keep money in three-liter jars?

      Because it was impossible to buy anything with them. The pinnacle of consumption was a cooperative or a car.
      I don’t know about cooperatives, but the cost of the VAZ 2106 was about 800 rubles. The remaining 5 were to extract excess money from the population.
      For this purpose, by the way, the cult of the Volga was cultivated in the Caucasus and Asia - even more money was seized...
  26. -5
    6 September 2023 00: 36
    In most comments, the authors do not mention one point: in the prosperous West, for a good pension, you had to pay contributions to the pension fund from your SALARY ALL your life. TO YOURSELF and not to the EMPLOYER. How many of us saved for retirement, at least in the bank? If, at the moment, you have 3-4 lamas in the bank, then the monthly interest would provide a very good addition to your pension. Which of our young people is thinking about retirement? That's right, almost no one. Just don’t talk about burst banks and so on. Their banks also burst.
    1. +3
      6 September 2023 00: 40
      YOURSELF and not the EMPLOYER
      In most countries, like in Britain, everything is one tax.
    2. +3
      6 September 2023 09: 51
      In most comments, the authors do not mention one point: in the prosperous West, for a good pension, you had to pay contributions to the pension fund from your SALARY ALL your life. TO YOURSELF and not to the EMPLOYER. How many of us saved for retirement, at least in the bank? If, at the moment, you have 3-4 lamas in the bank, then the monthly interest would provide a very good addition to your pension. Which of our young people is thinking about retirement? That's right, almost no one. Just don’t talk about burst banks and so on. Their banks also burst.

      Where do you think the pension contributions came from in the USSR? And also for medicine, school, etc. It’s just that they didn’t talk about these taxes here, they were removed secretly, so as not to excite the people.

      According to various estimates, the hidden tax in the USSR ranged from 68 to 74% of the salary. Yes
      1. -1
        6 September 2023 20: 43
        Quote: Arzt
        According to various estimates, the hidden tax in the USSR ranged from 68 to 74% of wages

        The law of physics is that nothing comes from nothing.
  27. -2
    6 September 2023 02: 37
    Pensioners everywhere have a hard time. The only option in which a Western pensioner can feel comfortable is a nursing home. From there they can afford to go out into the world, several times a week, if their pension allows. In this case, they do not starve and can afford a cup of coffee in a decent cafe.
  28. -2
    6 September 2023 03: 25
    ***
    - And I have a pension, though small, but good ...
    ***
  29. +4
    6 September 2023 04: 17
    Quote from Silver99
    You look at the prices in the same France, 1 euros is definitely not enough for you for croissants. Well, where we are not, and then when we are not there. There are enough problems everywhere. Best of all, pensioners lived in the USSR, but these are just memories.

    1500 euros is certainly not enough to buy croissants in a cafe in the center of Paris, but you can live quite well, and that’s not by eating pasta.
  30. +5
    6 September 2023 05: 46
    Quote: guest
    Quote: karabas-barabas
    In France, Germany, and almost throughout Europe, food prices are lower than in the Russian Federation

    And where is such information from?

    From a camel, it’s enough to go to the website of the German hyper to go and see the prices, and also take into account the features of the discount system - if they have a day left for the sausage, then it has a 50-90% discount, and not a tag with a new date. In the evening, awesome discounts on milk and cooking. Students and ostorbeiters in this regard expanse
  31. -1
    6 September 2023 09: 02
    Quote: Bolt Cutter
    apartment (with all utilities) - also from $100 per month?
    If you haven't paid off your long and successful working life on your mortgage, social housing is free, yes. Utilities - it is quite realistic to meet 150, plus all sorts of subsidies. Transport - in England (in other countries I do not know) - travel by bus is free.


    and what was introduced there in Germany - a single travel card for 49 euros for a month??
    I have - in the fly zaska - for students 2400 rubles... and this is only for the fly jack, and if I go to MAskva - then it’s exorbitant there - for the salary of the fly jack

    censorship is very zealous...
    1. +7
      6 September 2023 10: 23
      For 49 euros, an intercity travel card. You can travel from Munich to Hamburg by train. And from there, to Bonn, if you want. And all for 49 euros per month.
  32. +1
    6 September 2023 09: 06
    Quote from Voronezh
    Pay contributions to the pension fund from your SALARY ALL your life. TO YOURSELF and not to the EMPLOYER.


    and trade unions, why are they there?
    ask ...
  33. +4
    6 September 2023 09: 15
    As a child, I heard a saying: "we must fight dampness, not mold" ...
    now on topic:
    we need to talk about the standard of living (not only in the capitals but also in the periphery) in order to talk about pensions, here is an example:
    a friend moved from Blagoveshchensk a long time ago, but every year he goes to visit his relatives. Neighbors - pensioners, moved beyond the Amur, to China, also for a long time and live there, coming only to receive a pension. Why? because electricity is cheaper there, food is cheaper, and the apartment is rented to the Chinese ...
    Therefore, the question is not about the amount of pensions, but about the fact that a dollar costs 100 rubles, and everything is being pulled up to this ratio ...
    Cars began to cost several million rubles ... bananas exceeded 100 rubles ... and so on.
    even what we (supposedly) produce on the territory of the country becomes more expensive!
  34. +7
    6 September 2023 13: 47
    You can simply compare.
    How many of our ordinary pensioners (teachers and nurses) go there regularly on tours.
    And how many of them came here?

    Met them.
    Ours - only if the children are rich.
  35. 0
    6 September 2023 14: 16
    Quote: your1970
    and the cost of the VAZ 2106 was about 800 rubles.

    no, not like that: VAZ 2101 at a cost was close to 1 ruble/kg (weighed about 880 kg), and 2106 was much more expensive, GAZ 53 - about 2400, Volga - about 4200, if memory serves
  36. +3
    7 September 2023 11: 12
    How S-propagandists know how to teach the material! Several phrases evoke affection: “in the West, as elsewhere, there are pensioners who live in abundance, but there are also many who can barely make ends meet.” And “in France, to receive a pension, you must have 42 years of working experience, while making monthly contributions.” Is this a hint that we do not make monthly transfers to the Pension Fund, or that our pensioners have less experience and therefore are forced to work in retirement in order to survive while their legs are still moving? The federal cost of living for a pensioner is 12 rubles in 363. Simple transfer of 2023 rubles to $: 12.363 = $97,84 per month. Per day =126,4$.
    Igor Guberman has lines on this topic:
    I feel sorry for this blue sky, I feel sorry for the earth and life fragments; I'm scared that well-fed pigs are more terrible than hungry wolves!
  37. 0
    7 September 2023 18: 31
    Yes, you can’t compare with our pensioners:
  38. 0
    11 September 2023 18: 12
    Those who don’t remember or don’t know: the pension ceiling in the USSR was 200 rubles for junior officers, 350 for senior officers.
    Whether this is a lot or a little, someone remembers, others can be asked from their parents / grandfathers. The average wage in the country was 140 rubles, the minimum wage was -70.
    A nuance, true, but an important one - this ceiling applied not only to pensions, but to the entire total income; if a person continued to work and earn good money, he still received the same total amount.
    But it was, although it is difficult to compare, like the current 80 and 140 thousand, respectively (my subjective opinion, I do not pretend to be academic).
    The Russia we have lost.
  39. 0
    30 September 2023 19: 48
    I live as a pensioner in the Czech Republic. I am a pensioner, so I will mention free treatment. Currently, a routine eye test at an ophthalmologist costs 750 CZK. New eye lenses 5000 CZK. In addition, there are other diseases and therefore I have to buy recommended medications that I need, but the doctor does not prescribe them. Of course, it is impossible to go on vacation from retirement, perhaps to go to the theater or cinema. The pension is for survival, not for living. Replacing two teeth in the form of a small bridge costs 24 CZK. Of course, every pensioner is sick with something, and this is a problem today. Well, this is probably the opinion of a Czech pensioner living in the “west”. am