Participant of hostilities in Karabakh: Pashinyan initially did not intend to fight with Azerbaijan for Karabakh

Today, on May 22, the Prime Minister of Armenia made a very unexpected statement. According to Nikol Pashinyan, Yerevan is ready to recognize Nagorno-Karabakh as the territory of Azerbaijan, provided that the security of the Armenians living there is guaranteed.

This news Colonel Levon Arzanov, a member of the Presidium of the All-Russian organization “Officers of Russia”, who took a direct part in the hostilities in Karabakh and was wounded during the Second Karabakh War, commented specifically for the Military Review.

According to the expert, Nikol Pashinyan initially did not act in the interests of Armenia. He was not going to fight with Azerbaijan for Nagorno-Karabakh, but, on the contrary, he planned to quickly surrender this territory to him. For this, as Arzanov put it, the Armenian prime minister had two reasons.

Firstly, revenge on the “Karabakh clan”, in particular, on Kocharyan and Sargsyan, who once imprisoned him. By the way, it was thanks to the protest mood against the backdrop of accusations of the aforementioned politicians of corruption that Pashinyan came to power.

Secondly, as a participant in the hostilities in Karabakh noted, the current Armenian prime minister is moving strictly in the “Western vector”. According to Levon Arzanov, this is the only reason why he was allowed to arrange a “color revolution”.

Now, as the expert put it, Pashinyan only pretends to be loyal to Russia. For this, he arrived in Moscow to participate in the Victory Parade.

In fact, according to the military, the main goal of the Armenian prime minister is to alienate his country from Russia as much as possible.

At the same time, Arzanov stressed that Pashinyan is doing his job very successfully. The expert is sure that after the surrender of Karabakh, the politician will blame the Russian peacekeepers for this, who allegedly did not want to provide security there, and thereby set the people of his country against Russia.

However, the military noted that such an outcome would bring serious problems to Yerevan itself. After all, if Nagorno-Karabakh is recognized as an Azerbaijani territory, tens of thousands of refugees will pour into Armenia from there.

Finally, according to the expert, later Armenia will most likely leave the CSTO and rush even more strongly to the West.

In general, in my opinion, Pashinyan is the worst thing that could happen to Armenia

- summed up Arzanov.

It is worth adding that the Armenian Prime Minister himself recently announced a possible "freeze" of his country's membership in the organization.

In addition, Arzanov's conclusions are indirectly confirmed by today's statement by representatives of the British authorities, who expressed hope for deepening strategic cooperation with Armenia this year.

Comments

[dmi.pris1]

Refugees will not pour into Armenia (what should they do there?). But into Russia. The Southern Federal District, in the first place. Well, respectively, both capitals ..

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

Quote from: dmi.pris1

to Russia. Southern Federal District, first of all.

deeply mistaken - Moscow, Leningrad

[dmi.pris1]

Why am I mistaken? I live with them, in the Kuban.

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

they live everywhere, but most of them will go to the capitals

[Aken]

Then we are waiting for the third war with the Azerbaijanis, but already on our territory, because they occupy the same ecological niche.

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

it won’t, they quietly hate each other, but at the same time they only shit on Russia

[Azerbaijan2023]

Quote from Aken

Then we are waiting for the third war with the Azerbaijanis

Azerbaijanis are returning to Karabakh.

[Dost]

It is on the Kuban and in the Stavropol region that they will pour. Their bulk is there, and not in the capitals.

[Azerbaijan2023]

Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir

deeply mistaken - Moscow, Leningrad

in fact, they are more fond of the Black Sea coast, Abkhazia, Sochi and the Stavropol Territory. And from imports France and California

[Orange Bigg]

What kind of refugees? There is almost no one left in Karabakh. Even before the events of September 2020, less than 140 thousand people lived there. Now it is 3 times less.

The territory of Azerbaijan with an area of ​​86,6 thousand square kilometers includes Nagorno-Karabakh. Armenian Prime Minister Nikol Pashinyan stated this today, May 22, at a press conference, answering the question of what is included in the territory of Azerbaijan within the specified limits.

The head of the Cabinet was asked a clarifying question: will the Armenian government recognize Nagorno-Karabakh as part of Azerbaijan. In response, Pashinyan pointed out that "all the governments of Armenia recognized the territorial integrity of Azerbaijan."

https://eadaily.com/ru/news/2023/05/22/karabah-vklyuchitelno-pashinyan-podtverdil-territorialnuyu-celostnost-azerbaydzhana

Daytime Stepanakert was a post-apocalyptic picture. Empty streets, closed shops. Occasionally come across the military. According to official figures, only 1500 out of 50 people remained here during the conflict.

https://www.kp.ru/daily/21712087.5/4321898/

[Tryams]

"All Armenian governments recognized the territorial integrity of Azerbaijan"

one can even rephrase - neither one of the governments of Armenia and not one of the deputies elected by the citizens of Armenia recognized the NKR as the territory and population of Armenia.
And half measures always have one end
And then the citizens of Armenia should not blame the Russian Federation or anyone else for this. Everything is in the mirror.

But in any case, only this Pashinyan did a wise act

[Azerbaijan2023]

Quote from Orange Bigg

What kind of refugees? There is almost no one left in Karabakh.

You write correctly. Azerbaijani border guards keep score at the Lachin checkpoint.

[Iran]

Quote from: dmi.pris1

Refugees will not pour into Armenia (what should they do there?). But into Russia

Maximum %10 no more. And the bulk of them will pour into Europe and the United States. Moreover, in the forefront will be precisely those Armenians who have never been to Karabakh at all.

[Thrifty]

It is interesting that the ladies dance, 4 individuals in a row! Arminia Karabakh herself has not yet recognized it, and was not eager to resolve this issue de facto. The behavior of the dog in the hay is not a way out of the problem, but only a distance from the solution of the issue. And with Pashinyan, the Armenians themselves must figure out who he is for them in their eyes.

[paul3390]

Well, thank God. A woman with a cart - it’s easier for a mare .. From such types of allies - one hemorrhoids. Let them live on by themselves. Let's see how it turns out. Something invisibly tells me - nothing good .. The main thing is not to let the Armenians in here, who will inevitably rush from there. And even better - as soon as the entot Pashinyan leaves the CSTO, and send those who have come since the collapse of the Union back to their historical homeland .. You have your own country, democratic, free, pro-Western, what have you forgotten in our terrible and totalitarian?

[Luminman]

Quote: paul3390

send those who have come since the collapse of the Union back to their historical homeland

This should have been done back in 1991...

[Andrey Moskvin]

And what should they do with roses and tulips, to Holland?

[ZAV69]

The main thing is not to let Armenians in here

So they have been living here for a long time, all have citizenship, business. There are even whole porches in Armenian houses.

[alystan]

Somehow easily came and sat down in power.
And there's no way to get this journalist out of there ...

[Azerbaijan2023]

Quote: alystan

Somehow easily came and sat down in power.

With Soros, it's easy. He is a project of the West.

[Cats]

Participant of hostilities in Karabakh: Pashinyan initially did not intend to fight with Azerbaijan for Karabakh

This was evident from the very beginning, given whose protege he was!

[Iran]

Armenians are a copy of Russians. All the time they sat and laughed at the Azerbaijanis, calling them "rams", which no matter how you teach them, they still remain sheep. I read Russian-language Armenian forums, where there was nothing else but laughter at the Azerbaijani soldiers. Approximately as in the Soviet joke about the Chukchi and the Academy of Sciences.

And the Armenians also knew 100% that they were simply invincible in Karabakh, even if the entire Turkish army went to fight there. When I tried to say at that forum that Azerbaijan is rapidly progressing and mastering unmanned systems, the Armenians just rolled with laughter.

All the same we had before the war all 8 years. We all knew in advance what kind of Ukrainians are Selyuks, from whom it is impossible to teach anything except how to twist the tails of horses. We all knew 100% in advance that our army is number 2 in the world, if it enters Ukraine, then in a week there will be nothing left of Ukraine. When before the war I tried to say that the Ukrainians are rapidly progressing and they are professionally trained, they only laughed in response to me and answered with phrases like "the author of the foot ischo!"

In general, I will summarize that Armenia and Russia have become hostages of their own superiority complex and the failed underestimation of the enemy. For the Armenians, this became fatal - they mediocrely pissed off Karabakh. What awaits us in the future is all in the fog. Well, only one thing is clear, that nothing good awaits us, despite some local victories.

[paul3390]

We all knew in advance what kind of Ukrainians are Selyuks, from whom it is impossible to teach anything except how to twist the tails of horses.

And they are. The main problem is that we are fighting the Russians .. With the connivance of our big ones, we pretty much managed to brainwash .. In fact, this is a civil war. But who and how allowed this is a separate question .. And why it turned out that fighting for Tsegabonia - it seems to them more correct than for Russia. Despite all the cute tricks in their address.

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: paul3390

We all knew in advance what kind of Ukrainians are Selyuks, from whom it is impossible to teach anything except how to twist the tails of horses.

And they are. The main problem is that we are fighting the Russians .. With the connivance of our big ones, we pretty much managed to brainwash .. In fact, this is a civil war. But who and how allowed this is a separate question .. And why it turned out that fighting for Tsegabonia - it seems to them more correct than for Russia. Despite all the cute tricks in their address.

It's really a mystery. The Russians are fighting against the Nazis, although this is a state of bestial Russophobia, which oppresses and humiliates Russians in every possible way.
The slogan is cut Rusnya. It is clear that someone was brainwashed, someone was intimidated, and yet.

[Orange Bigg]

And what awaits us in your opinion? Wang boldly. Otherwise, Zelensky does not have time to create a new army from conscripts one after another - they quickly end.

[Installer]

I agree with you on almost everything. But if it does, it won't be much worse. Almost everything that the West could have already done. And we can’t turn on the back! They will devour.

[Kapany3]

Stupid analysis.
I am an Armenian, originally from Karabakh. Back in the sixties, Armenians in Armenia itself called us "Shur Tvats" (inverted) and considered us second-class Armenians. They did not understand our dialect (the language is very different). So, for Armenia, Karabakh was originally a suitcase without a handle.

[Azerbaijan2023]

Quote from iran

For the Armenians, this became fatal - they mediocrely pissed off Karabakh.

They could not live in peace in Karabakh. Azerbaijanis would never allow Armenians to live there forever. Now they are waiting for reparations. This is just the beginning. God is not a fraer, he sees everything. It is impossible to eat someone else's food and keep it for yourself. The return of KARABAKH was a matter of time.

[Ascetic]

On the eve of Pashinyan's speech, the American Embassy in Yerevan announced (https://twitter.com/usembarmenia/status/1660569985796669440?s=19) the arrival of two high-ranking representatives of the US Department of Defense.
On the left in the photo is Major General Keith Phillips, who, since December 2022, has served as Director of Operations for the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) of the United States.

And on the right is a Mr. Patrick Pryor also an employee of RUMO
I wonder what kind of cooperation they can talk about professional military intelligence officers with the Pashinyan government?
Considering Pashinyan's statement, which is aimed at surrendering Karabakh and squeezing Russia out of the Transcaucasus, it is quite interesting what this visit will lead to.
Campaign we are again waiting for the Ossetian scenario, more and more alarming times are coming.

[Seal]

Pashinyan did everything in accordance with the general lines of the party .... that is, Russia. Which since 1992 has consistently and consistently recognized Azerbaijan within its internationally recognized borders. But we wanted the restoration of Azerbaijan's sovereignty over its entire territory to take place peacefully.
Pashinyan, apparently, knew "his own" better and realized that this task would not be possible without a war.

Leave the CSTO? Generally wonderful!!! For without this irritating country, the CSTO will only strengthen.
If Pashinyan turns "his people" against us, nothing bad will happen. And maybe even get better. Maybe Armenia will stop asking us for "technical loans" and maybe (I hope) a certain number of Armenians will still leave Russia. Including this expert.

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: Seal

Pashinyan did everything in accordance with the general lines of the party .... that is, Russia. Which since 1992 has consistently and consistently recognized Azerbaijan within its internationally recognized borders. But we wanted the restoration of Azerbaijan's sovereignty over its entire territory to take place peacefully.
Pashinyan, apparently, knew "his own" better and realized that this task would not be possible without a war.

Leave the CSTO? Generally wonderful!!! For without this irritating country, the CSTO will only strengthen.
If Pashinyan turns "his people" against us, nothing bad will happen. And maybe even get better. Maybe Armenia will stop asking us for "technical loans" and maybe (I hope) a certain number of Armenians will still leave Russia. Including this expert.

In fact, even without Pashinyan, anti-Russian sentiments are strong there. It was on their wave that Pashinyan came to power.
Let me remind you that all Russian schools were closed in Armenia.
But Azerbaijan has them.

[Zemaan]

In general, in my opinion, Pashinyan is the worst thing that could happen to Armenia

Everything was going towards this ... He will still substitute Russia with this statement, no matter how the massacre starts again. For Karabakh, a lot of blood of Armenians was shed and in order to give it away so easily .. Oh, it’s not for nothing that I feel all this

[DeadPahom]

You might think that Pashinyan decides something in this situation. It is clear that he caved in under pressure from Moscow. Minus one territorial conflict at our borders. One can only rejoice.

[Ulan.1812]

Could Pashinyan fight for Karabakh with Azerbaijan?
How does anyone imagine this? What could he do.
Armenia should attack Azerbaijan, and Russia should intervene to annex Karabakh to Armenia? Present on a silver platter?
After all, it is clear that Armenia will not be able to do this on its own.
And then on what basis should Armenia fight for Karabakh?
Do Armenians live there? They live all over the world. It seems like there are more of them in France than in Karabakh.
Armenia did not even recognize!!! referendum on the independence of Karabakh.
Moreover, even before Pashinyan, they did not recognize it. And Russia first recognized the independence of the Crimea, the DPR and the LPR, and only then began to act.
They expected that Russia would be the first to do this and recognize the independence of Karabakh.
Russia will not solve the problems of Armenia at its own expense.
In the last war, not a single Azerbaijani soldier entered the territory of Armenia, so the CSTO had no reason to interfere.
So, for all my negativity towards Pashinyan, this henchman of the West, he acted correctly and pragmatically. Recognized the reality and the status quo that cannot be changed.
In my opinion, this is good for Russia. The ever-smoldering conflict near Russia's borders will fade away and be resolved.
It will not be possible for the United States to constantly kindle it there.
Although for the Armenians, Pashinyan will certainly be a traitor.
Now the task is to ensure the security of the Armenian population living in Karabakh. And this is already working for Russian peacekeepers.
Although do not go to a fortuneteller, the Americans will try to spoil here and there will definitely be provocations.
And, of course, in my opinion, it would be better for Karabakh to gain independence.
But it's not real. More like aliens are coming.

[Seal]

Quote: Ulan.1812

In the last war, not a single Azerbaijani soldier entered the territory of Armenia, so the CSTO had no reason to interfere.

There was no last war. The first and only war unleashed by Armenia in 1992 is still going on. Understand the simple truth: war is easy to start but hard to end. It's very easy to get started. It is enough to send our armed forces to the territory of a neighboring sovereign country. This is what Armenia did as soon as the USSR collapsed. But the only way to end the war is either by the complete surrender of one of the parties, or by a mutually acceptable Peace Treaty. As everyone knows, since 1992 there has not been a capitulation of one of the parties, just as there has not been a signing of a Peace Treaty.
This means that de jure there is a state of war between Armenia and Azerbaijan.
And this means that even if the Azerbaijani troops go to take Yerevan, then the CSTO will still have no reason to interfere. Since the CSTO helps only in case of aggression against a CSTO member country.
And not if a CSTO member country, itself an aggressor, begins to suffer setbacks from a victim of its aggression that has become stronger and has found allies.
Now, if Georgia, for example, attacked Armenia, then it would be another matter. In this case, the CSTO would immediately come to the aid of Armenia.

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: Seal

Quote: Ulan.1812

In the last war, not a single Azerbaijani soldier entered the territory of Armenia, so the CSTO had no reason to interfere.

There was no last war. The first and only war unleashed by Armenia in 1992 is still going on. Understand the simple truth: war is easy to start but hard to end. It's very easy to get started. It is enough to send our armed forces to the territory of a neighboring sovereign country. This is what Armenia did as soon as the USSR collapsed. But the only way to end the war is either by the complete surrender of one of the parties, or by a mutually acceptable Peace Treaty. As everyone knows, since 1992 there has not been a capitulation of one of the parties, just as there has not been a signing of a Peace Treaty.
This means that de jure there is a state of war between Armenia and Azerbaijan.
And this means that even if the Azerbaijani troops go to take Yerevan, then the CSTO will still have no reason to interfere. Since the CSTO helps only in case of aggression against a CSTO member country.
And not if a CSTO member country, itself an aggressor, begins to suffer setbacks from a victim of its aggression that has become stronger and has found allies.
Now, if Georgia, for example, attacked Armenia, then it would be another matter. In this case, the CSTO would immediately come to the aid of Armenia.

I have no objections. Then the clarification is the last aggravation of the Armenian-Azerbaijani war. (conflict).

[IgorIP]

So that's great! The sooner Azerbaijan regains its lands, the better it will be for Russia. This hemorrhoids with the peacekeepers will go away, the point of tension in the relations between our countries will disappear. And to the Armenians: now on your own, on your own. They themselves pissed off Karabakh, they themselves recognized it as part of Azerbaijan.
It would be nice if they would leave the CSTO)) And then the last reason why Armenia still exists will disappear)

[bessonov932]

Pre

Pre-sale preparation of the republic. The Ottomans will get something, the Persians will get something.

[dump22]

Very interesting.
And what alternative does this colonel Levon Arzanov offer?
Continue the war with Azerbaijan?

[sdivt]

The topic of Karabakh did not arise today, and not yesterday, and not even at the time of the dissolution of the USSR
The first conflicts there were, God forbid, back in the 19th century. And it would be naive to think that such a conflict will end with some kind of recognition of the current President of Armenia.
Such conflicts have been going on for centuries. Years will pass, revenge-seekers will appear, and the conflict will again take on an armed character.

[A17ttt]

The best option in the near future (7 years) is to give Nagorno-Karabakh under the control of the Blue Helmets and the Russian Federation. And organize a free corridor to it from the territory of the Russian Federation (Dagestan), Iran. So that the area can develop.
It may well be that 7 years will be enough for Armenia and Azerbaijan to find points of peace.
While the free corridor and Nagorno-Karabakh will become a kind of free economic zone. According to the principle (model) of interaction between Finland and RUSSIA. With its internal economy, management, laws.

[A17ttt]

Complement

And yes, Georgia is no exception: they could also provide a corridor for Nagorno-Karabakh, with a fork in the final section, towards North Ossetia, Ingushetia, Chechnya.

In this way, territorial areas (bands) for free economic activity would be formed. As well as peaceful areas - as an example, Switzerland.

[Seal]

Quote from A17ttt

The best option in the near future (7 years) is to give Nagorno-Karabakh under the control of the Blue Helmets and the Russian Federation.

And what about our principled position regarding the invariable recognition of the borders of Azerbaijan within the borders of the Azerbaijan SSR since the collapse of the USSR? What, do you want us to look like a country with reduced social responsibility?
Blue helmets can be introduced only with the consent of all the conflicting parties. Are you sure that Azerbaijan will agree? Why does he need it? It is much more profitable for Azerbaijan to wait another two years, that is, wait until the mandate of our peacekeepers ends and calmly occupy the rest of Karabakh.
And third. At the UN now, God knows how good it is with money. And sending the Blue Helmets somewhere is a costly undertaking.

Quote from A17ttt

It may well be that 7 years will be enough for Armenia and Azerbaijan to find points of peace.

It was a joke ? Maybe first you still need to legally end the war that has been dragging on for over 30 years?

[A17ttt]

Well, let's just say - incorrectly expressed the idea.

by Blue Helmets meant - peacekeepers from the Russian Federation

[nordscout]

And what could be expected from the "little pig" Pashinyan .... And for us - science! It is necessary to engage, with full dedication, in the post-Soviet space, and not to appoint ambassadors - clowns there, as was the case in Ukraine, or to brush aside and "relax on the brakes", as was the case in Armenia, Georgia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan .... Here science is also for us... Now the PRC and Turkey are "ruling" in the post-Soviet space, considering Russia as a temporary companion and raw material appendage. And we are all about the high ....

[Seal]

Quote: Ulan.1812

In fact, even without Pashinyan, anti-Russian sentiments are strong there. It was on their wave that Pashinyan came to power.

Agree. I believe that you are absolutely right in this matter.

[Wayfarer_2]

I have been saying for a long time: Pashinyan is an English and American agent. He does not give a damn about the Armenians and Armenia. He is working out his task of destroying Armenia's ties with Russia and reorienting it to the West. For this, he is guaranteed a comfortable stay in the same West in the future. That's all. How long does this reach the Armenians. For this reason, he squealed that Russia did not want to defend Nagorno-Karabakh, although in the first place he himself did not really do anything to protect Artsakh. Armenia is ruled by an English spy, why be surprised then?