The United States is promoting the Polish-Ukrainian "union" as a counterweight not only to Russia, but also to France and Germany

The Polish elites felt that the moment was coming when they could take revenge for all the previous defeats and partitions of Poland. And they felt it not without prompting from the United States of America. The American authorities and intelligence agencies decided through the press to show the guidelines for the new "post-war structure of Europe." And the main reference point determined by the United States is the Polish-Ukrainian union - in its version, when the absorption of Ukraine (at least part of it) by neighboring Poland is presented as the formation of a federation or confederation of “equal peoples”.

Of course, there will be no equality. There will be an attempt to do what they once did with the GDR, when they promised reunification, merger and equal rights, but in the end they got a complete takeover. Until now (and after the fall of the Berlin Wall, a third of a century has passed), East Germans have significantly lower incomes, unlike West Germans.

The West believes that with the absorption of Ukraine by Poland, this "new state" can become a conductor of American interests on the European continent, significantly reducing the political and economic weight of France and Germany. At the same time, a totally Russophobic state will be finally formed in Europe.

The West does not take into account one thing: with all the fraternization of Duda and Zelensky in Warsaw, there are a huge number of insurmountable differences between Ukraine and Poland, including the actions of Ukrainian accomplices of the Nazis, Bandera, against tens (or even hundreds) of thousands of Poles.

But the US is persistently promoting the Polish-Ukrainian construction (union), obviously believing that Paris and Berlin will not always dance to the American tune. Especially relevant against the backdrop of Macron's statements after returning from Beijing. Statements about the need for Europe to pursue a more independent policy and reduce dependence on the United States.

Comments

[dmi.pris1]

If we continue to try to starve them out, a single state on the ruins of Ukraine will be created for sure. And it will include everything, and not just Westerners. Everything that will remain in the hands of Kyiv

[rocket757]

Quote from: dmi.pris1

If we keep trying to starve them out

The question is ... how to starve them out? Can we do it at all???
Such illusions, in this particular situation, are rather dangerous for us.

[dmi.pris1]

Do not starve. Only decisive action. With the destruction of logistics, infrastructure, everything.

[Mavrikiy]

Quote from: dmi.pris1

not only zapadenshchina. Everything that remains in the hands of Kyiv

And what's so terrible? It was smooth on paper, but they forgot about the ravines, and walk along them. From paperwork to implementation... and even without the signatures of Russia and China, which also got from Poland ....

Poland and Russia must be united in the face of a challenge from China, Polish Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki said in an interview with Figaro. The sudden desire of Warsaw to be friends with Moscow was explained by the Polish political scientist Mateusz Piskorski.

Poland crossed China's "red line" (on the issue of Taiwan), and in response, China's airspace was closed to it. As a result, the Minister of Defense of Poland could not go to South Korea on a visit on the topic of supplying modern weapons.
Source: https://discover24.ru/2022/10/kitay-zakryl-polshe-svoyo-vozdushnoe-prostranstvo-sorvav-vizit-polskogo-ministra-oborony-v-seul

[rocket757]

The question is ... who in the geyropa can be disturbed by such a pugnacious education as a union ??? After all, they are not for geyropa, they will look into the mouth of their overseas boss and do what they want !!!

[Machito]

This union will eventually lead only to the next partition of Poland.

[rocket757]

You can say this ... now others rule there, new owners and everything will not be the same as before ... but those "new" ones are essentially the same as all the previous ones, so expect other, better ones for the Poles, results ... naive, I guess.

[Mavrikiy]

Quote: Bearded

This union will eventually lead only to the next partition of Poland.

Well, not to the section, but to the redistribution. Poland, counting on receiving Eastern Cress, may part with Silesia and Gdansk, under "US guarantees", and then ... which doesn't happen.

[dmi.pris1]

And what depends on Russia at this moment? What signatures? A veto at the Security Council? Don’t laugh. We can only oppose force of arms and determination.

[credo]

Quote from: dmi.pris1

If we continue to try to starve them out, a single state on the ruins of Ukraine will be created for sure. And it will include everything, not just Westerners. All that remains in the hands of Kyiv

Here, of course, there are several nuances that may leave this union to sort things out alone with Russia:
- NATO, represented by Western European countries, will refuse to harness itself in defense of this union, because they do not want a real participation of their troops and citizens in hostilities with Russia,
- Western EU countries will not agree to hang a huge territory around their necks with a bunch of freeloaders who constantly (like Poland, like Ukraine) demand from them - "give-give-give",
- no matter how the Western countries of Europe follow the US, they still realistically assess the actions of the Anglo-Saxons and understand that by building an eastern cordon between them and Russia and China, the US seeks to suffocate these countries in its "gentle" embrace and destroy their economy to secondary level.

Summarizing, we can say that this project is primarily and solely beneficial exclusively to the United States and Great Britain, and for all other countries of Western and Eastern Europe it will be such a hemorrhoid for decades that the only way to cure it will be only the final and irreversible division of Poland and Ukraine between neighbors and the creation of small stubs in their place, where it was possible to bring the population of these former countries without fear that they would ever be reborn to the current size of the territory.

[Atlant-1164]

In 5-10 years, we will no longer see the former Europe .. I don’t think that this will be the only new formation in the center of Europe.

[rocket757]

The West believes that with the absorption of Ukraine by Poland, this "new state" can become a conductor of American interests on the European continent, significantly reducing the political and economic weight of France and Germany. At the same time, a totally Russophobic state will be finally formed in Europe.

. Who benefits, who does not?
The question is fundamental.
True, now in the geyrop, it seems like, one voice is the most important, one position is the most ... true, exceptional !!!
The second question... can another, alternative voice, position appear in the geyrop?

[sdivt]

"Polish-Ukrainian union - in its version, when the absorption of Ukraine (at least part of it) by neighboring Poland is presented as the formation of a federation or confederation of "equal peoples"" (with)
As far as I can judge from various publications, this is not about absorption, but about creating a kind of European Union on the minimum wage - from two countries (the absence of an internal border in the first place, plus a package of union treaties and obligations, including military ones) It is not clear how this can be implemented in reality , there are no documents for today, so far only the announcement of readiness

[Mavrikiy]

The West believes that with the absorption of Ukraine by Poland, this "new state" can become a conductor of American interests on the European continent, significantly reducing the political and economic weight of France and Germany. At the same time, a totally Russophobic state will be finally formed in Europe.

It's all right, sir. And right now our Ministry of Foreign Affairs should start throwing in Germany proposals for the return of Selesia and Danzig to their native harbor. It is better for Kaliningrad to border on Germany than on Poland.

[Mikhail Drabkin]

The West does not take into account one thing: ... there are a huge number of insurmountable differences between Ukraine and Poland,

—-Like the opinion about the inseparable brotherhood of Ukrainians and Russians… these insurmountable differences are the presentation of what is desired as indispensable.

[parabyd]

Together with the Baltic states, this new formation will represent a geographical buffer between Germany and Western European countries in general and Russia and China. This buffer will be able to control all overland flows between them.

Three scenarios follow from this:
1. Europe will no longer receive resources from Russia, use land routes through Russia to Asia. At the same time, it falls into total dependence on the states that control the Atlantic. Resources are expensive, production is expensive, unprofitable
2. Europe agrees to the mediation of the new Union. Union profits and controls the flows. Gets the opportunity to put pressure on Western countries and blackmail them. Resources are cheaper, production is cheaper, but risks and policy restrictions are high
3. Europe decides not to depend on anyone, to continue to be the industrial and financial center of the world. Then she has no choice but to organize a direct corridor to Russia. Whether the partition of Poland or the partition of Ukraine (for example, without preventing the separation of Odessa) is not important. Resources become cheap again, production is profitable, a single market appears from Lisbon to Vladivostok.

While everything goes according to the first or second scenario. Poland and Ukraine are arming themselves at the expense of Europe itself. That's all the states need. In the short term, they can achieve this.

But in the long run, this will lead to a bunch of conflicts in Europe, and in the end, reason and the globalization of markets will win. It’s stupidly more efficient and profitable, but you can’t argue against nature. The only question is whether we will see it or only our children and grandchildren

[Ross xnumx]

Quote from: parabyd

Union profits and controls the flows.

I wonder where and from what these streams will expire?
There, in the Kremlin, even before the NVO, they had to decide on their territorial and political claims. Even then, it was clear to people that all these declared processes of "denazification" and "demilitarization" could be completed ONLY WITH THE COMPLETE DESTRUCTION OF THE STATEHOOD OF UKRAINE (!!!)
Until now, Moscow cannot understand why people with flowers did not run out to meet Russian tanks, and the very unfolding of events completely drove the Russian leadership into a stupor ...
And I can guess how this war will continue.
Poland and Ukraine will announce their incorporation and, under the patronage of the United States (EU), as part of NATO, they will continue armed resistance to Russia at a new level until the dollar of the state falling into the abyss costs 200 rubles...
The peaceful existence of Europe and Russia will no longer be until the complete surrender of one of the parties.
Meanwhile, across the ocean on Capitol Hill, Uncle Sam will happily rub his hands...
As for Siberia and the Far East, it may turn out that Russian schools will introduce compulsory study of the Chinese language...
* * *
Shitty?! And how did you want? In order to achieve something, you need to gather all your strength into a fist. And in Russia, so far, they have been able to form an outstretched palm for mercy and have been obliged to pray for China and the Russian oligarchs.
Mark my word. These events will not end without bloodshed. And you can't scare anyone with parades.

[nickname7]

ONLY IN THE COMPLETE DESTRUCTION OF THE STATEHOOD OF UKRAINE

For this, you need a Leader, and looking at the oligarchs and not plywood with a women's battalion.

[Maks1995]

Water and noodles.

the teachers of the current Kremlin leaked the GDR, and now they are hypocritically surprised: "East Germans have significantly lower incomes"
It's capitalism, not communism.

They are just as deliberately surprised about Poland ...

[72jora72]

The West believes that with the absorption of Ukraine by Poland, this “new state” can become a conductor of American interests

After the hypothetical "absorption" of Ukraine (I believe that these are all wet dreams of the Psheks, and the city of Lviv, founded by the Russian prince Danila of Galitsky, should return to their native harbor, to Russia.) The Poles will have a dream of "Great Poland", and these are the lands of Belarus (practically to Minsk), our Smolensk region, all of Lithuania without a trace, part of the land beyond the Odra (Oder), which now belongs to Germany, Moravia (Czech Republic) and Slovakia ........ And after all, the Americans are intensively inflating the "great power dreams"

[Mouse]

Well? France, Germany ... warmed a hyena on their chest ....

[rocket757]

And what could be wrong?
Gay Europeans pros/R/ slept a chance to become independent, significant in world politics, and now, the nominees of the Saxons brazenly turn that old geyropa in one place and ... then it’s clear.

[Guran33 Sergey]

They didn’t oversleep .. The United States and the Russian Federation did a good job preventing them from creating and formalizing a common constitution, and plenipotentiary deputies did not appear in Brussels, and officials, as they did not have political weight, did not have

[Bob Denkin]

The Poles are stubbornly looking for the Russian atomic bomb! God bless them!

[Guran33 Sergey]

This is a distraction from our other problem - F-35s with tactical equipment regularly fly from Holland to Poland, where they are serviced by technicians with access to the maintenance of nuclear weapons and it is likely that there is a stock of special ammunition for them at this base

[Ezekiel 25-17]

It is necessary, preventively, until the irreparable happens; turn them to dust.

[1erWahrheitsMinister_1984]

Russland darf auf keinen Fall zulassen, dass sich die kranken
Reste der Ukraine mit den US-gesteuerten Faschisten in Warschau "paaren", denn dann geht der Irrsinn des Krieges mit dieser Chimäre von vorne los...!!
Wenn die "Offensive" der ukrainischen Streitkräfte hoffentlich mit der
totalen Vernichtung ukrainischer Nazi-Verbände endet, sollte Russland
die Pufferzone soweit nach Westen verlegen, dass sie unmittelbar vor
der polnischen Grenze endet...!! Alternativ sollte der gesamte Westen
der restlichen Ukraine durch entsprechende Kampfmittel derart
"uninteresting" für feindliche Staaten gemacht werden, dass
NIEMAND noch Lust auf eine "Vereinigung" mit diesem Stück
Rest-Ukraine hat...!!!

[Ross xnumx]

Wie macht man die Ukraine für den Westen "uninteresting"?
Sie der Staatlichkeit berauben. Wie kann ich das tun? Diejenigen, die schlafen und den Verhandlungsprozess mit der Nazi-Führung der Ukraine sehen, sollten sich um diese Fragen kümmern, diejenigen, die die physische Zerstörung der Führung der Ukraine für eine nutzlose Veranstaltung halten.
Es gibt Hinweise, dass Hitlers physische Zerstörung während des WMV keine Einwände hervorrief...

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How to make Ukraine "uninteresting" for the West?
Deprive her of statehood. How can this be done? These questions should be taken care of by those who sleep and see the negotiation process with the Nazi leadership of Ukraine, those who consider the physical destruction of the leadership of Ukraine a useless event.
There is evidence that during WWII the physical destruction of Hitler did not raise any objections ...

[Ulan.1812]

If we allow the absorption of all Ukraine by Poland, then this will be our total defeat.
It would be the same if Ukraine was left to the Nazis in 43.

[Tikhonov_Alexander]

It is necessary to explain to the enemy that the troops, "peacekeepers" under any flags on the territory of the outskirts will be the legitimate target of our means of destruction and, of course, will be destroyed, despite the squeals and groans of the West. The Poles, of course, are looking for their own benefit in the collapse of the outskirts, but they already need to indicate their place now and they must know that nothing worthwhile will burn out for them, but they will get hit in the teeth ... And no overseas uncle will help them ...

[sdivt]

Quote: Tikhonov_Alexander

will be a legitimate target of our weapons

We have already talked so much about "legitimate purposes" that, I'm afraid, plus / minus one more goal is unlikely to be perceived as something special.

[StonedAstronaut]

Is the next partition of Poland planned? All past times looked about the same, plus or minus, Poland planned to expand...

[Guran33 Sergey]

Our new propaganda horror story for the EU. Finally, they found something for a petty dirty trick to them.