Evgeny Prigozhin: Despite the statement of the Ministry of Defense, the situation with ammunition for PMCs has not changed

The founder of PMC Yevgeny Prigozhin, answering the question of military commander Vladlen Tatarsky about possible changes in the supply of ammunition to the Wagners, noted that despite the statement of the Ministry of Defense on the supply of ammunition, the PMC did not receive anything. The situation has not changed, he stressed.

According to Prigozhin, earlier the Ministry of Defense issued ammunition not for the Wagner PMC, but for certain units that allegedly fight in the area where the Wagnerites are fighting. This was done due to the fact that officially PMC does not exist. However, after the scandal broke out with the capture of Soledar, where the Ministry of Defense wanted to attribute its units, without mentioning the "musicians" at all, the PMCs had problems.

The curator of the "Wagnerites" emphasized that he had repeatedly applied for the required amount of ammunition, but they were ignored at the very top. He stated that such documents should be signed either by Chief of the General Staff Gerasimov or Shoigu himself, but neither one nor the other wants to do this.

Prigozhin posted on his TG channel photos with the bodies of the dead Wagner fighters (strictly 18+), as he himself claims, and stated that today the losses of PMCs are several times greater, because there is nothing to cover the attack aircraft. It also shows an application with the required amount of ammunition and what the Ministry of Defense is ready to allocate.

Earlier, the Ministry of Defense stated that all statements about the lack of ammunition at the PMC "Wagner" are not true, in fact, "assault voluntary detachments" are supplied with everything necessary.

Comments

[75 Sergey]

Wagner seems to be a private office or am I wrong?
They do a good thing, but not for free, the goods-money-goods.
In general, I have an ambiguous attitude towards Wagner, as well as to what we defend - the people of Russia - yes, Russia - yes, "friends", deputies, other hands of pests and oligarchs - no, no, no!

[Alien From]

The feeling is that the management itself does not understand what is happening! This is a fiasco dear forum users.

[topol717]

Quote: Chariot

A fiasco is when a country that can't make its own iPhone

There are only 2 countries that can make an iPhone, and the US is not one of them. These are China and South Korea.
only there are factories that allow it to be produced.

[Tatyana]

The founder of PMC Yevgeny Prigozhin, answering the question of military commander Vladlen Tatarsky about possible changes in the supply of ammunition to the Wagners, noted that despite the statement of the Ministry of Defense on the supply of ammunition, the PMC did not receive anything. The situation has not changed, he stressed.

The conflict between Prigozhin and Shoigu is heated to the limit.
Here is an audio message from Prigozhin on February 21, 2023 - the day of Putin's message:

... The General Staff and the Minister of Defense are handing out commands to the right and left, which say that the Wagenr PMC is not only not to give ammunition, but also not to help with air transport. Now information has come that they have crossed out the receipt of sapper shovels so that the guys can dig in. There is just direct opposition, which is called nothing else than an attempt to destroy PMC "Wagner"! Her (attempt) can be equated with treason!
At the moment when Wagner PMC is fighting for Bakhmut, losing hundreds of its soldiers every day!

See the video in detail (see from 2:00 min.) and comments to it (from 22605 min.) - "PUTIN'S MESSAGE. NUCLEAR TESTS? PRIGOGIN SPEAKS AGAINST SHOIGU." / Dmitry Nikotin - https://dzen.ru/video /watch/63f4c4334b7cf552362a798f?t=50

According to D. Nicotin, this hypothetically means that:
1. At the top in the Russian Federation there is an intra-elite conflict. Those. that there are various factions within the Russian elite. At the same time, Prigozhin represents a "different" faction, within which he could not resolve this conflict about some kind of behind-the-scenes agreements. And his only way to get his way is PUBLICITY.
2. And this, in turn, means that Prigozhin does not have direct access to Putin, since Prigozhin is forced to start a PUBLIC FIGHT against the General Staff and the Moscow Region.

Frankly, this situation is very familiar to me. At one time, I helped military doctors remove "Taburetkin" from the post of Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation for the fact that he "optimized" not just the RF Armed Forces, but, in particular, military medicine in a market-like way - reducing military hospitals and beds for the military in medical institutions, as well as the number of MILITARY MEDICAL educational institutions in the country.

TOTAL. It seems that the PRO-WEST-"market" liberal ideology of the United States since the 1990s still prevails "at the top" in Russia - even in the General Staff and the Moscow Region - over the PRIORITY of observing the SOVEREIGNTY of Russia as a national state.

[Alf]

Quote: Tatiana

At one time, I helped military doctors remove "Taburetkin" from the post of Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation

Madam, can I find out your full name, the country should know its heroes, the country should know who knocked down the marshal's furniture almost single-handedly.

[Tatyana]

Not alone. I just said who needs to be removed from office, what and how it needs to be done, so that the officers with compromising materials ready for them on the Moscow Region will succeed. They did just that. I myself do not have access to military information. I was not liable for military service and was not interested in military secrets and surnames from the word "completely", since I have no access to military information. The SYSTEM is important to me! I just took the word of the officers, brought me to the right people. Yes, and it has been for a long time. Was. was and gone.
Rђ RІRѕS, As a result of the liberal "market" ideology and liberal market reforms, the system of government in the country has apparently not changed at all.

Here is an example for you from the same "opera", only, as they say - the same eggs, but only from the side. Namely.
A text material from the site "Tsargrad" about a glaring case about the attitude towards Russian volunteers from the ranks of the RF Armed Forces by the Ministry of Defense was recently released on Zen. Moreover, "Tsargrad" raised the topic in connection with the appeal to "Tsargrad" of the volunteers themselves as part of the RF Armed Forces from the beginning of the NWO.
In the article "Tsrgrad" "To whom millions have gone (in the sense of money for salaries) NWO fighters? A "colossal scheme" has surfaced - https://dzen.ru/a/Y_LzXCkTgFbnLUAO - talks about the KIDALOV of the members of the NWO in paying their salaries along with their "combat" ones from the officers of the Russian Armed Forces.
A similar trend of stealing junior salaries by officers of the RF Armed Forces is the same as that observed in Ukraine.
Who will answer for this?
If such theft is not stopped, then Russia will slide into the Ukrainian version. Namely.

Kiev has no funds for the previously promised payments to the military personnel of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, the money allocated by the West to support the Ukrainian army is flying past it, settling in the pockets of various officials.

See details - https://topwar.ru/211311-istochnik-ministr-oborony-ukrainy-reznikov-podpisal-prikaz-znachitelno-urezajuschij-zarplaty-i-boevye-vyplaty-v-vsu.html?yrwinfo=1676931579976248- 2115949247800249956-balancer-l7leveler-kubr-yp-vla-9-BAL-3629

[Alf]

Quote: Tatiana

I just said what and how it needs to be done, so that the officers with the compromising materials ready for them on the Moscow Region will succeed. They did just that.

And without your advice, they did not know this?

Quote: Tatiana

connected with the right people.

Do you have access to senior officers? However...

[Tatyana]

Quote: Alf

And without your advice, they did not know this?

At the meeting and conversation with me, military doctors were very surprised by my analysis of their situation and real adequate advice on how to solve their problem. I even had to convince them that I was right.
They reminded me of a pack of wolves driven behind red flags by hunters. It didn’t even occur to them that it was possible to go beyond the flags of their SYSTEM

Quote: Alf

Do you have access to senior officers? However...

There was access to retired officers, let's say, from the "OLD Guard", then rotating in the highest echelons of power in the country.
Actually, you can make a movie about it! But the time has not yet come for that.

[Alf]

Quote: Tatiana

They were very surprised by my advice. I had to convince them that I was right.

Hmmm, arrogance is going through the roof...
By the way, could you tell these very senior officers that it is not just time, but it is high time to change the power in the country? Tell me, suddenly they don’t know, but they will listen and do it ...

[Dmitry_7]

It seems that the PRO-WEST-"market" liberal ideology of the United States since the 1990s still prevails "at the top" in Russia - even in the General Staff and the Moscow Region - over the PRIORITY of observing the SOVEREIGNTY of Russia as a national state.

Urka will always remain urka.
That's the whole story.
They cannot NOT steal.
This is the basis of being and the principle of life of these .... citizens.

[Stas157]

How can Prigozhin be deprived of ammunition if, according to even the Ukrainian side, the Russians have the highest consumption of ammunition there? How can that be? And the Ministry of Defense says they give out as much as it should in full. Khodakovsky also confirms that the PMC receives no less than the army itself, consider the Moscow Region.

He listened to Prigozhin's accusations (no other way to call it). He was very persuasive and certainly right in his own way. He has the hottest direction and needs more ammunition (than others).

The correct answer lies in the plane - to whom you obey from that and ask. Shoigu has already disowned Prigozhin, saying that the PMC has nothing to do with the Moscow Region and Prigozhin receives all vacation limits (and even more). After that, nodding at MO is already wrong. The army has its own tasks and also needs ammunition. Even if they have too much (as Prigozhin says), is there any transport to bring them up, does the logistics allow?
If you want more - ask your boss, what does Shoigu have to do with it? Shoigu will be ordered to do it.

There is a problem of management and subordination here. And it is obvious that there is no unity of command at the front. Although there was news that now the National Guard and the army of Donbass are subordinate to Gerasimov, but apparently this did not affect the PMC.

[Tatyana]

Quote: Stas157

There is a problem of management and subordination here. And it is obvious that there is no unity of command at the front. Although there was news that now the National Guard and the army of Donbass are subordinate to Gerasimov, but apparently this did not affect the PMC.

In his commentary on the article "Evgeny Prigozhin: Despite all efforts, the issue of the supply of ammunition to Wagner PMC has not been resolved" I already wrote

Tatyana February 20, 2023 14:15 .....+51
Leaving PMC "Wagner" ON THE FRONT without the proper amount of ammunition is TREASON to the Motherland and Russia! Especially in WAR!

It seems that either a "mole" is sitting in the Ministry of Defense and the General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces, or parasites-bureaucrats-traitors from the "6th column" (among officials) are sabotaging this matter! Those. "pulling the rubber" in office work ACCORDING TO PEACETIME STANDARDS!
And this is in WAR TIME !!!

Stalin FOR THIS would either have shot ALL the saboteurs-bureaucrats and bureaucracies, or would have sent them all TO THE FRONT and to LABOR camps for ENEMIES OF THE PEOPLE!!

Ibid.

Tatyana February 21, 00:56
PMC "Wagner" is fighting well and continues to fight in the NVO for RUSSIA !!! You can't spit in the well from which you drink water. The goal is GENERAL - for VICTORY over the ENEMY!

[saigon]

Here, an army soldier or a PMC fighter does not care what motives and quirks lack shells.
It’s for them to go on an unsuppressed defense, for them, and not for the Minister of Defense of the infantry battle, for them, and not for the generals in large headquarters, to advance on machine guns.
You know, it all smells bad and in this conflict I am on the side of Prigogine, ambitions and other crap are out of place.
In a word, God bless the infantry.

[Stas157]

Latest News:

“Today at 6 in the morning they reported that ammunition shipment begins. Most likely, the train started moving. So far on paper, but, as we were told, the main papers have already been signed. I would like to thank all those who helped us make this happen. You saved hundreds, maybe thousands of lives of guys who are defending their homeland, gave them the opportunity to live on. Their mothers and their children will not receive coffins with their bodies,” Prigozhin said.

[hagen]

Quote: Chariot

that is, you don’t even understand that “iPhone” is a collective image?

Rather, you don’t understand that the fiasco is not determined by iPhones and TVs, but by the speed of surrendering your capital to the occupying forces.

[decimalegio]

Designed by an American company. Which are made in China to contain costs and increase profits.

[Fabrizio]

And China can't make an iPhone that assembles one designed in the US in factories built by Western investors can. But certainly China has made a huge technological leap over the past 30 years, largely due to cooperation with the United States.

[Alex Cross]

Do not pretend to be a felt boot, we are talking about development and licenses, and not about where the Americans decided to place mass factories for its production. From the Chinese there is only plastic and bolts.
And in general, we are talking about a gigantic technological gap between countries.

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

Quote: Chariot

begins to consider himself equal to the United States

as you have already tired, you have nothing to do in Sumeria except hang out on growing forums?

[dmi.pris1]

It's funny to hear in the plural from yesterday registered "patriot" ....

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

Quote: Chariot

us, patriots of Russia

Hey, patriot, would you go through the forest to Poland

[Igor Malyshev]

Name the brand of modern American television.

[Fabrizio]

You can name American technologies that are present in almost any TV.

[AAK]

You are probably talking about the one that is called Ukraine in the west? Did I understand correctly?

[Stanislav_Shishkin]

Quote: Chariot

Fiasco...

"Piasters!...Fiasco! Fiasco!" Replenishment is coming to the regiment of all-weapons.

[vikie1778]

much worse than originally thought, Prigozhin has just come forward with a bombshell photograph of his dead soldiers and documents proving internal sabotage of Wagnerian logistics.

[Sebostyuan]

Prigogine said a lot in two days. If we sum it all up, we get the following.
First. Shoigu and Gerasimov, instead of preparing the army for war, were engaged in fraud
and personal enrichment.
Now cover their failures.
The second is more about Shoigu. While the soldiers are dying - without remorse, the family - lives the former luxurious life. Daughter in Dubai. The son-in-law shoots moronic tik-toks. Father-in-law makes decisions while sitting in a massage chair and eating from golden dishes.
Third. Officers on the ground - act contrary to the system. There are also those who, as a sign of disagreement, like Teplinsky, write a report on leaving.

Ps. I did not add anything from myself personally, just a brief squeeze.

[Belisarius]

Quote from Sebostyuan

Prigogine said a lot in two days. If we sum it all up, we get the following.

The only difference between Prigogine and Shoigu is that he put everything to war and in case of defeat he will be finished. But Shoigu thinks otherwise.
As for their social-class appearance and mode of action, it is exactly the same.

[Natalya Yurievna]

And who provides weapons for Shoigu and Gerasimov? Well, they don't run around the enterprises themselves?!

[igorbrsv]

. proving the presence of internal sabotage in relation to Wagnerian logistics.

Yes, there is no sabotage. You can’t just take the barrel out of the gunsmith and give it to just anyone. Even if he is for us and he is good. They can be jailed for it. They said that the allocated ammunition was written off to other units. Since they cannot officially carry out the delivery, since there is no such thing as a PMC in the laws. After this circumstance was revealed, someone was given a hat. Yes, so now even Shoigu is afraid to sign. He also has a lot of inmates who sleep and see themselves in his place. And they dream of either deposing him or imprisoning him.
This question is taken to a new level. The question is now for the legislators. To the Duma and the deputies, who have taken care to reduce the holidays for students, or at least postpone them. What the hell no one knows but no one bothered about the legalization of PMCs. And who do you think is to blame?
I know damn well. The legislators did not bother, because they would say they did not know about such a need. The MO will say: we are not engaged in lawmaking.
I wonder how the MO paid for them for eight years
And I understood that they were supplied quite well. So even the regulars are jealous

[SKVichyakow]

Quote: Alien From

The feeling is that the management itself does not understand what is happening! This is a fiasco dear forum users.

Why doesn't management understand? Even Putin said in his message that we must stop all squabbles and misunderstandings and move together towards a common goal (not verbatim). But he did not say a word about PMC Wagner. It turns out that it is Shoigu who settles scores with PMCs, and to satisfy his ambitions, nothing more. His department lied, and continues to dodge lie.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Alien From

The feeling is that the management itself does not understand what is happening! This is a fiasco dear forum users.

The signature under such documents must be put either by the Chief of the General Staff Gerasimov or Shoigu himself, but neither one nor the other wants to do this. Generally merge "Wagner". That's just who Bakhmut will take tomorrow if Wagner leaves today? As has always been the custom in Rus' - whoever works best, who fights best, those are rotten from time immemorial. It is impossible for Russia to lean forward, they will peck.

[Ilya22558]

I absolutely agree with you and this is not only in the army. At one of the trainings, back in 2010, the lecturer said that any company that grows to a certain size begins to repeat the state in miniature, from experience in production I can say: who has the knowledge, who works well and conscientiously, who does not eyewash and sincerely believes that the management needs to convey the true state of affairs; it is not needed. Never be his leader. Whoever fawns, licks the ass of the leadership, is ready to salute any nonsense and say "yes", whoever fails all projects - well done, ambitious and talented, he must be promoted. As a result, we have what we have: the time of non-professionals in power. And if so in any industry, where you don’t spit, then why in the army it will be different.

[flicker]

That's just who Bakhmut will take tomorrow if Wagner leaves today?

Now there is no task to take settlements at any cost.
We are currently using the "war of attrition" strategy. With such a strategy, n.p. taken only when the enemy's resistance is critically weakened.
PMC Wagner is, of course, the pros of assault attacks, but they also suffered significant losses during the capture of Soledar.
Here is what Prigozhin said about the losses of the Wagnerites:

So Prigozhin answered the question about the losses in the Wagner PMC, which the US government estimated at 30 people. “Indeed, since the beginning of the NMD, a large number of deaths. There are more than 30 thousand of them. I think about 100-110 thousand, but your wording is wrong. They did not die in the ranks of the Wagner PMC, but died when they got into the battle formations of the Wagner PMC,” the businessman said.

The figure is appalling, probably overestimated. But Prigozhin did not reject her, but turned the conversation about the losses of the enemy from the Wagnerites.
One thing is for sure, the successes of the Wagnerites are the result of good training, motivation of the fighters and extremely risky operations (fraught with heavy losses). True, the topic of Wagner's losses is bypassed by the military commanders.
While the losses of the Russian Armed Forces by the same military commanders are quickly spread over the network.
---

It is impossible for Russia to lean forward, they will peck.

Russia must remember the commandment "Do not make yourself an idol."

---

[ivan1979nkl]

Despite the statement of the Ministry of Defense, the situation with ammunition for PMCs has not changed

looks rather nasty... Maybe that's why there is no special progress anywhere, that there are regulators?

[flicker]

This is a fiasco dear forum users.

This will be a "fiasco" in Israel.

[Rome]

PMCs fight heroically, it's unbelievable! But, their status is not defenders of the motherland, but a mercenary unit! True, the fighters fighting in Russia consider themselves volunteers!
The problem is that the MoD treats them like mercenaries, and the mercenary should just do the job and not stick his nose where he shouldn't! At all times there were mercenary units, but when the city was taken, no one shouted that the mercenaries won, the victory was always attributed to the one who paid them: the duke has a brave heart!
And PMCs do not follow this tradition! Taking victories from your employer! here is the relationship!
Musicians should be officially listed as volunteers, and for greater efficiency, victories should still be given to those who set tasks! Those. Bakhmut will be taken, for example, by the 20th army, the successful operations of the Airborne Forces and volunteer units! Then everyone will be happy

[SaLaR]

Betrayal................................................. ................... Shame on Russia

[Lech from Android.]

Quote: 75Sergey

Wagner seems to be a private office or am I wrong?

Yes, yes ... but for some reason this private office, as you say, solves government problems ... and much more efficiently.
Why would this private office lose so many of its fighters privately?
In my opinion, the Moscow Region simply does not like the successes of the Wagnerites and they were put on a common ration as a punishment ... the generals of the Moscow Region behave ugly ... very ugly.

[vikie1778]

Prigozhin’s official telegram revealed the truth, our people are dying en masse, sent to assaults with a lack of ammunition while Shoigu is holding art exhibitions.
The 5th pillar is alive and well.
[media=http://file:///C:/Users/LaTerraza/Desktop/treason%20g.GIF]

[vikie1778]

here is the ammo request document, other photos show a field of about 50 dead fighters or more, it will be a disgraceful failure and western media vultures will surely pick it up and turn it into a circus.

[saigon]

People, of course, I apologize and are completely on the side of Prigozhin (infantry cannot be substituted) That's just anything in the photo, but not an application form for ammunition (although it may be so now).

[Vladimirovich_7]

I wonder if they can spit and leave? Let the Ministry of Defense fight

[Prisoner]

The contract needs to be looked at. If the State, represented by the Moscow Region, scored, then ... truncated. But then, instead of PMCs with Prigozhin, Muradov-"Ugledarsky" will have to be put on Artyomovsk. And do we need it? It looks like MO has nothing to do but fight the "musicians".

[Trapp1st]

I wonder if they can spit and leave?

[hellman]

I think they will be able to leave, but do you understand what consequences this will lead to?

[arthh]

Prigogine clearly said no one would leave until all the Wagners were dead, it was clearly stated. And then let Shoigu go into battle

[dmi.pris1]

They can leave. Perhaps. Or they can go and smash these gentlemen from the Moscow Region. In general, the situation is increasingly slipping back to a hundred-year-old history.

[Ryazan87]

This photo should be shown to everyone who talks about "grinding" and "bleeding". Including on this site.

[Lech from Android.]

Quote: Pulkovo1942

This photo should be shown to everyone.

The photo is not signed. Here, as with the "execution" - you can win back.

A lot of things are not signed there ... purely for ethical reasons ... so that relatives and friends do not find out.
This applies not only to photography ... enough video already with the heroic death of the Wagner soldiers ... they have earned respect for themselves.

[igorbrsv]

And what? And what about grinding and bleeding and legislation with bureaucracy?
The legislation with the bureaucracy is to blame, and in whose face the prosecutor's office should look for the court. And the photos won't change anything. By the way, the same Prigogine could take care, or maybe he should have, of legitimizing his organization. When everyone became aware of the participation of PMCs in a special operation. You could at least raise this issue in the media. Unless he was bound by a non-disclosure agreement. But then it was necessary to act through the Moscow Region. Why is it now possible to act when it has become impossible to receive shells, and before it was impossible? Or he, like all of us, has a Russian maybe. We always create problems for ourselves, and then heroically solve them. And this applies to everyone. And those who are now on the front line and me lying on the couch. I myself am. And then I blame someone too

[dmi.pris1]

This issue has already been raised at the level of legislators.

[TAMBU]

That's interesting PMC works on the basis of some kind of contract ... apparently. Isn't the obligation of the parties spelled out in the contract? It is a PMC, first of all, and therefore it can probably leave its positions or not fulfill the terms of the contract if the conditions are not met by the "customer" ... in general, everything is somehow strangely organized there ...

[fax66]

What are you talking about? Judging even by official news reports, Wagner is the only unit that has recently carried out such large-scale and successful assault operations (especially considering the opposition of the Armed Forces of Ukraine). And to discuss now - who they are, whether they are legally registered and how much they receive - this is simply baseness (other parts of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation also do not roam). And to deprive them of part-time power supplies and supplies, UNDER ANY PREVENTS, is sabotage and sabotage. IMHO

[arthh]

Losses, as he said, are five times more, and judging by the photo of the shells, you can say no there

[Pulkovo1942]

He stated that such documents should be signed either by Chief of the General Staff Gerasimov or Shoigu himself, but neither one nor the other wants to do this.

Well, there is a high probability that the situation with Lapin is repeating itself. Only now there will be other personalities in his place.

[Sergey985]

So, as a result of someone's ambitions and grievances, people are dying. In general, there are no words.

[opuonmed]

they seem to be doing one thing, but MO puts spokes in the wheels!

[forty-eighth]

applications for the required amount of ammunition ... such documents must be signed either by the Chief of the General Staff Gerasimov or Shoigu himself

No, they don't sign. Prigozhin was carried somewhere in an open field

[alexander 66]

To someone he stepped on the tail well or stirred up a viper. Petersburg or mo, or maybe all together.

[Prisoner]

Against the background of the fact that the United States has declared the Wagner Group a transnational criminal organization and, for sure, money has been allocated for this case, a question arises, and a very unpleasant one. "Kontryki" only work for drug addicts, mother's Nazis and frostbitten fools, or do they keep grains under the hood? I would like it to be kept.

[igorra]

There have always been general intrigues. There were military generals, there were parquet generals. You can’t get away from this, even in the harsh times of the Great Patriotic War, under the strict leadership of Stalin, there were such heroes - generals. Yes, remember the first Chechen one, with its corrupt generals. And today, under our liberal president, whom will they be afraid of? It is a pity that the cause is suffering and the soldiers are dying.

[Geniy ​​yev]

But this is treason of pure water, here people should already think and ask questions about who we have in the Moscow Region

[Boson]

Prigozhin is already threatening and directly hinting that he will transfer all applications for military support to the military prosecutor's office and counterintelligence.

[Dilettante grandfather]

Prigozhin is already threatening and directly hinting that he will transfer all applications for military support to the military prosecutor's office and counterintelligence.

Since there is no mutual understanding, then this is how it should be done. That's just first do and already then talk about it in the media.

[Grandfather Mozai]

Prigozhin is already threatening and directly hinting that he will transfer all applications for military support to the military prosecutor's office and counterintelligence.

surprisinglyhow this same prosecutor's office and counterintelligence itself did not become interested in what was happening. Oh, in vain I thought that the drains of the Russian army, which were in the Chechen company, will never happen again, how wrong I was in people.

[igorbrsv]

. It is surprising how this same prosecutor's office and counterintelligence itself did not become interested in what was happening.

Yes, as usual: no body - no case.
There is no statement from the victim - there will be no case

[Fangaro]

Quote: Igor Malyshev

Name the brand of modern American television.

Iphone

[Mint Gingerbread]

What the hell is going on with them? Some say there is no ammunition, others say there is ammunition, and others promise to solve the saturation of ammunition.

Since the situation is difficult, gentlemen of the Wagner, it is worth retreating from their positions and stop being subjected to unnecessary losses. And if the enemy takes something, then let those who put or didn’t put ammunition figure it out.

[Alf]

Quote: Mint Gingerbread

And if the enemy takes something, then let those who put or didn’t put ammunition figure it out.

In this case, they will make the "musicians" extreme, such as opening the front, meanly running, etc. ... And the theme of shell hunger will be quietly buried.

[Vashek]

It's just that Shoigu's office shows who is the boss in the house. And then, you know, they swelled up, boasted. Here we are for you ... and we will take you. Shoigu was offended, Gerasimov relaxes, and then they come in with applications.

[Fangaro]

Quote: Chariot

we, the patriots of Russia, certainly have something to do, and we are doing it.

Don't stay here long.
Approving for patriots, quickly responding to the remarks of others in VO, is not something that is important to do.
If you're on sick leave, fine.

[GOR_XVII]

Quote: 75Sergey

... In general, I have an ambiguous attitude towards Wagner, as well as to what we defend - the people of Russia - yes, Russia - yes, "friends", deputies, other hands of pests and oligarchs - no, no, no!

That is, you consider yourself to be pests and oligarchs?
PMC Wagner is the only military organization in our country that can, knows how and, most importantly, wants to fight and has multiple successes. And not only in the NMD, but also in Syria, the Central African Republic and elsewhere. And they die not for money, but for the prestige of the country and for the Victory. And no money is a pity for this, although no less money is spent on military personnel with zero results.

[Belisarius]

Here we need to clarify the situation. In reality, there is a shortage of ammunition. It is generated by the fact that the Soviet stocks are running out, and their own production is scanty. The first to run out of 122 mm ammunition (so now Gvozdika is a very rare guest), now the turn of 152 mm has already come,
The limits are very limited, it’s just that earlier parts of the NM of the DPR and LPR suffered from this first of all. They suffered heavy losses from this, but they all somehow didn’t care ...
Now these limited limits have been transferred to Wagner with the corresponding result. So Prigogine is partly right - these restrictions are purely political reasons generated by the desire to seize control of Wagner and show that they can do nothing without the MO.
But partly wrong - they will give Wagner ammunition, limit the rest. Although, of course, if you look at the effectiveness of actions, it would be better if they gave Wagner.

[korwalol]

It's not about Wagner, shell hunger in the entire NWO grouping

[alexander 66]

And Prigozhin says that everything is there and the release is going well

[Belisarius]

Quote: alexandr 66

And Prigozhin says that everything is there and the release is going well

If Prigozhin says anything else, it will turn out that he admits that until now Wagner was in a privileged position. Moreover, questions will immediately arise about exactly the same offensives of 1 and 2 AKs without shells and with heavy losses. Nobody needs this.
So from his point of view, Prigogine says everything correctly.

[forty-eighth]

And Khodakovsky said that the Wagner shell norms were cut down to army standards. Now get shells "like everyone else"

[Blackmokona]

Quote: alexandr 66

And Prigozhin says that everything is there and the release is going well

He simply compares the release with his needs. He will have enough, and the rest will not care how he will live.

[igorbrsv]

I think so too. Even if we have a production of 6 million shells per year, this is less than 20 shells per day. And we have a consumption of more than 000 per day. And this is with a front width of 20 km. That is, 000 shells per day per kilometer of the front. And this despite the fact that we produce more shells than all of Europe, and even NATO combined.
True, these are only artillery shells. In addition to them, we produce a lot of other things.
And 10 shells were transferred to Wagner for a month, against this background that there are not so few. Wagner demanded 000 of the 76 produced in all. We've been shooting them like crazy for a year. Stocks are not endless. From Europe, all the arsenals have already been raked out for the APU, but they cannot provide them with more than 000 shells per day, against our 600

[Alexander X]

Give the Wagner shells!
And spit on the short text of the comment

[mag nit]

The Wagnerites will have to take the Kremlin, and then Artyomovsk. You won't get through Shoigu's Ministry of Emergency Situations otherwise.

[VladimirNET]

Quote: 75Sergey

Wagner seems to be a private office or am I wrong? They do good things, but not for free.

Any work should be done by professionals.
And the higher their qualifications, the higher the pay should be.
PS. An analogue is state and private enterprises, after all, war for soldiers is also work.

The goal of any war is not to save money, but only to win. For us - the victory of Russia.

[Helicopter]

So we will fight for a long time. They took one city of Soledar, and they were going to divide the victory among the entire generals. And it would not hurt to send the offenders to the front line in the trench, there they will be reconciled and the insults will go away.

[flicker]

Evgeny Prigozhin: Despite the statement of the Ministry of Defense, the situation with ammunition for PMCs has not changed

First of all, remember that Prigozhin ≠ PMC Wagner.
And the majority considers them almost synonymous.
In some cases, it comes to the point of absurdity: when asked who Joseph Prigozhin is, they say that the founder of PMC Wagner ?!
It is understood that both Prigozhins, both bald, both Jews, but the names are still different.
---
Now to the topic
It's high time for Prigozhin to either put on his underpants or take off his cross.

Then he yells at the top of his lungs that PMC Wagner is a completely INDEPENDENT unit from the Defense Ministry
it turns out that they are completely DEPENDENT on MO.

So independent or dependent?
----
Once again I will repeat

There was such an attacker in CSKA, Vagner Love, a very good striker.
I don’t remember exactly who CSKA played against, but the events unfolded as follows: the game was generally equal, Akinfeev carried all the balls, CSKA’s defense spread in tackles, CSKA midfielders plowed the entire field, and only one player Wagner could be said to be jogging. I remember watching and thinking why Gazzaev would not replace him? It was somewhere in the 80th minute of the match, the score was 0-0, and then suddenly Wagner got the ball, beat three defenders and scored the winning goal. Cool goal, Wagner's merit was undeniable.
I just think if Akinfeev did not drag the balls, and the rest of the field players would not plow the field, could Wagner's goal be victorious for CSKA?

Anyone who has ever played football understands that victory is always the result of a common effort.
---
In other words, if now the Russian Armed Forces suddenly stop exerting pressure along the entire front (or even worse, they bring down the front along the flanks of Wagner PMCs), then I strongly doubt that Wagner (in this situation) will not be surrounded.
=====
Now the most important thing.
Most importantly, these are Prigozhin's constant raids on the Russian Defense Ministry.

Everyone knows the saying that Russia has only two allies - the Army and the Navy.
So Prigozhin hits the Army during a military operation.

Prigozhin strikes at the backbone of the state!
Either a very unintelligent person or an ENEMY can hit the support of the state.
And he does it very cunningly, hiding behind the dead PMC fighters. Those. as if from a patriotic position.
And when the captured ukrams (who killed your soldiers) brought a box of tangerines, did you remember this?
On account of patriotic positions:
PMC Wagner and the Russian Defense Ministry have different degrees of responsibility to the state of Russia, in the end to the people.
The answer to the people of Russia, to History will be held by the Supreme Commander-in-Chief and the Russian Defense Ministry, and not by PMC Wagner.
So the Russian Defense Ministry has no reason to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.

How the Russian Defense Ministry works is not up to Prigozhin, but to the Supreme Commander.
---
Once again we remember
PMC Wagner are excellent fighters, low bow to them.

and that Prigozhin ≠ PMC Wagner. he's just a hired manager, maybe not devoid of charisma.

[Dmitry_6]

Well, I hope you are ready to take the place of the Wagnerites in Artemovsk? Everyone understands who will go to die next until the Supreme deigns to change something.

[flicker]

Well, I hope you are ready to take the place of the Wagnerites in Artemovsk?

Somewhere I didn’t speak complimentary about the Wagner fighters?
Where?

while the Supreme deigns to change something.

Have you ever heard of the "war of attrition" strategy?

War of attrition is one of many military tactics that consists in weakening the enemy through constant attack or threat, so that the enemy suffers constant human and material losses and eventually is on the verge of collapse due to the exhaustion of resources. In a war of attrition, subject to approximate equality in arms and tactics, the side that has more reserves or resources usually has a better chance of winning.

We do not have NOW the task of taking Artemovsk or another settlement at any cost.
We must take them when the enemy's ability to resist drops sharply.
And not to lay down the fighters (for the sake of their own political hype) when taking some Soledar.
---
Here is how Prigozhin answered the question about the losses of PMC Wagner:

So Prigozhin answered the question about the losses in the Wagner PMC, which the US government estimated at 30 thousand people. “Indeed, since the beginning of the NMD, a large number of deaths. There are more than 30 thousand of them. I think about 100-110 thousand, but your wording is wrong. They did not die in the ranks of the Wagner PMC, but died when they got into the battle formations of the Wagner PMC,” the businessman said.

Note that he did not deny the number (because this would be a betrayal of Wagner's soldiers, that is, living witnesses), but switched the topic to the losses of Wagner's opponents.

But now he is blaming the death of the Wagner fighters on the MO, which ALLEGEDLY does not supply them with power supplies.

What we get in the bottom line: it cannot be ruled out that Prigozhin (or those who stand behind him) for the sake of his political hype, went crazy about taking Soledar at any cost.
After the capture of Soledar, he burst into an angry tirade against the Moscow Region and some kind of "Kremlin Tower".
All this was just before Putin's expected speech in January.

Prigozhin's new activity again coincided with Putin's speech.
What should Putin say that is so important?
And in his speech to the Federal Assembly yesterday, Putin essentially proclaimed a new course for the country, and the country's course is a question of the successor.
And this is the main thing in his speech.
And those forces that are behind Prigogine seem to have lost.
So Prigozhin's exhaust turned out to be idle and he killed the fighters in vain - so he rushes about, not knowing what to do.

[Dmitry_6]

War on WHOSE attrition? Do you seriously believe that the collective West will run out of resources earlier than ours? They are just heating up production, they just need to know who will pay for the banquet, and then you will be surprised at the volume of production and supply of weapons to the conflict zone. If there are few Ukrainians, Poles, Colombians or other natives will be brought in, this is a matter of the proposed fee. And the more we trample on without clear success, the more there will be those who want to fight in Ukraine for money.

[flicker]

Do you seriously believe that the collective West will run out of resources earlier than ours?

It's not me, it's the collective West that thinks so.

Polish Foreign Minister Zbigniew Rau said that the EU industry will not be able to provide Ukraine with ammunition

For the states, the main threat is China, which, according to their own forecasts, will equal it in military power in 1-2 years and catch up with it in the development of high technologies (in terms of GDP, it has long surpassed them).
In a year or two, they must deal with China, which means they must resolve the issue with us.
And they cannot resolve the issue with us (with the hands of the Ukrainians - whose human resource is already close to exhaustion) in a conventional war in 1-2 years.
In addition, we are the strongest nuclear power, which will use it in case of failure.
---
So the tactics of the war of attrition are our victory.
We can only lose if total anti-war rallies begin inside the country, and they can be provoked by huge losses, which are usually accompanied by storming cities.
Here we are not storming.
---
On one transmission, Yasha Kedmi was outraged why we were not storming the city. Wanted our huge losses. Prigozhin also proposes through the public that the Russian Defense Ministry begin to storm cities following the example of Wagner.
Both Prigozhin and Kedmi really want us to start storming the cities and begin to suffer huge losses.
What does Kedmi and Prigogine have in common?

[igorbrsv]

I support all your comments on this article.

[flicker]

Well, at least someone supports
And then recently he just asked, "what happened in Vugledar", how about 30 minuses flew in))

[Dmitry_6]

I wouldn't be too upset

Quote: flicker

It's not me, it's the collective West that thinks so.

Polish Foreign Minister Zbigniew Rau said that the EU industry will not be able to provide Ukraine with ammunition

let's look at the facts: the volume of military aid is constantly growing both in quantity and in the range of weapons supplied.

Quote: flicker

For the states, the main threat is China, which, according to their own forecasts, will equal it in military power in 1-2 years and catch up with it in the development of high technologies (in terms of GDP, it has long surpassed them).
In a year or two, they must deal with China, which means they must resolve the issue with us.
And they cannot resolve the issue with us (with the hands of the Ukrainians - whose human resource is already close to exhaustion) in a conventional war in 1-2 years.
In addition, we are the strongest nuclear power, which will use it in case of failure.

Are we one hundred percent sure that China will grapple with the collective West? Neither China, nor the United States, nor Europe needs a war. Diplomats will spit, they will introduce tariff restrictions and everyone will remain with his own. On the contrary, the weakening of the Russian Federation in a long-term meat grinder is beneficial to everyone, including China, in dependence on which we have already fallen a little more than a sword.
Will we be satisfied with the agreement of the next president with the Chinese Communist Party?

Is this how you imagine "to gasp vigorously with a loaf"? For example, Ukraine has reached the borders of 2014 and the battles are being fought somewhere on the outskirts of Sevastopol, what kind of charge and most importantly where should we slap? Direct NATO aggression has not been and will not be. In Kyiv or in Kherson, so that later you can enjoy the delights of eliminating radioactive contamination, but what experience do you have, right?

The rallies will begin exactly when the number of deaths on our part exceeds the limits of the patience of the population. When Vietnam began in the United States, it was not that they were strongly opposed, but when the lack of results and constant losses / expenses began to put pressure on society, they had to "leave". Yes, and the experience of the USSR with Afghanistan, in my opinion, is very indicative.
Under no circumstances should the war be prolonged. War eats lives and resources in progression, and I don't care if the enemy has more losses.

[spirit]

The "Parquet Crown Prince" has already written off "Caesar" and begins to crush and weaken his competitors in order to seize power at X hour. He does not care about the soldiers, he is only interested in power and money, but he will eventually get a pool at an angle of 45 degrees, somewhere in the villa from his friend Erdogan. "Parquet" is an open enemy of Russia, which is worse than any Abrams, Bradley and patriots combined

[Archivist Vasya]

I agree, almost ... Well, they will ban me - I'll rest for a week)
The question is what is there in the BC with us:
1) There is a BC and they simply don’t give it, since it was given under Surovikin, who was removed for some reason (hmm, coincidence?). Ready for the attack? Maybe, but where is the offensive then? In the meantime, the most productive is Wagner. If in abundance, then the most unpleasant thing comes out - they don’t give it on purpose.
2) BC is generally small - then it is clear why they cut it. But, in this case, the Defense Ministry in its right mind would have notified the PMC / Prigozhin leadership in advance that hard times had come and for now it would be necessary to tighten the belts. Then there would be no questions from Prigogine. PMCs would go on the defensive near Artemovsk.
And here we have, the Ministry of Defense does not say anything like that, but on the contrary, that the applications for February (one week left, by the way) will soon be fulfilled. - How shoud I understand this? Fight during the day, and the BC will be in the evening? Coming soon is like, this month or next month or in? This is strange.

[Glagol1]

All this is sad. So you can't win a war. Of course, Putin is obliged to stop all this bedlam. But, apparently, even he is not strong enough. But our collective enemy is united as never before. What's next? Defeat in the war can lead to the disintegration of the country. Do Shoigu, Gerasimov, Beglov and Prigozhin's other "friends" think about this?

[Hey]

From all this scandal of Prigozhin with the Moscow Region, I would single out 3 reference points:
1. Deprive Prigozhin of any forces that could support him in the confrontation with the Moscow Region (and he fell for the scandal with Strelkov for this).
2. Deprived "Wagner" of a good replenishment, forbidding to recruit ZK (January of this year, the last set).
3. Shell "hunger" and all subsequent events associated with it.
The reason, banal, and as old as the world, is described by all religions of the world as the most terrible and dangerous sin - envy (and all other sins are drawn to her, do not kill (the death of soldiers), do not bear false witness (statements of the Moscow Region), etc.).

[Mol_18]

And after all, the PMC fell into the same conditions as the shooters in Slavyansk, namely, in the lack of ammunition, that is, Prigozhin, he himself fell into such a situation. Boomerang is back

[flicker]

The reason, banal, and as old as the world, is described by all religions of the world as the most terrible and dangerous sin - envy

Yeah, envy)) Can you also tell me that the woman was not divided?)

The reason is banal and as old as the world

The struggle for power, or rather for victory in the elections in 2024.
And the forces behind Prigogine lost it.
---
After the explosion of SP-1,2, the Russian Defense Ministry decided to switch to a "war of attrition" strategy.
This is positional activity mainly with the help of artillery along the entire front line.
A war of attrition does not involve assaults on a settlement. until the enemy's resistance is significantly weakened.
PMC Wagner could and should have acted in the same paradigm.
But they decided not to wait, but to attack without much concern for losses. As a result, the capture of Soledar.
We don't know what the losses were. But here is what the Wagnerian answered

During the video message, the PMC representative answered many questions that concern the Russian and international community.

Foreign media write that this cemetery has recently increased almost several times. But they do not write that in the summer this cemetery did not exist at all, there was a wasteland, an open field. Yes, unfortunately, the moment has come, and this place has become in demand. The cemetery has actually increased, the losses have increased. And they are more than in the Ministry of Defense or other power structures participating in the NWO

They are more than in the Defense Ministry and other law enforcement agencies.
There is speculation that Prigozhin (or the forces behind him) financed the capture of Soledar in time for Putin's expected speech to the Federal Assembly in January.
After the capture of Soledar, Prigozhin began an open attack on the Russian Defense Ministry, and the "Kremlin Tower" also got it.
Putin's speech was rescheduled for February.
And again, an undisguised raid on the Russian Defense Ministry, now due to supposedly non-delivery of ammunition.
Further more, Prigogine announced that because of the Russian Defense Ministry, the Wagnerites are suffering heavy losses.

Or maybe the Wagnerites suffered huge losses due to the fact that SOMEONE gave the order for the sake of political hype to take Soledar as soon as possible?

[7 poplar]

things are not normal! Musicians need to be supplied with EVERYTHING according to the enhanced version !!!

[Two]

Everything according to Turgenev is solid MuMU, in the role of the mistress Mr. Sh-u, in the role of Gerasim, Mr. G-v, but in the role of MuMu PMC Wagner is sad and terrible. Although Mr. Prigozhin has already gone through this in Syria.

[Carlos Hall]

It is a pity that this issue has not yet been resolved. Someone must answer for putting stones in the way of the most effective force fighting in Ukraine

[Just_Kvasha]

I come to the conclusion that Prigogine is not quite right. It is very likely that he wants complete independence from anyone, but these anyone must fulfill any of his wishes, taking under the visor and clicking their heels. If, as he claims, the musicians are an independent military organization, then so be it. Otherwise, it turns out that the Minister of Defense and the Head of the General Staff should work for him as suppliers, signing his applications. What they have to sign (approve) is the Wagner war plan. Interesting, is there one? And applications within the approved plan (!), must be signed by the heads of supply structures.

[Chack wessel]

Quote: Belisarius

But partly wrong - they will give Wagner ammunition, limit the rest. Although, of course, if you look at the effectiveness of actions, it would be better if they gave Wagner.

How to understand "give"? Wagner is legally a private shop. Therefore, if Prigozhin needs ammunition, then let him buy it ... However, I don’t know what conditions he put forward when signing a contract in the Russian Federation ...

[Dmitry_6]

Will he buy for the money of the budget of the Russian Federation that he is paid for performing tasks in the NWO zone?
Do not you find any nonsense?
Or maybe he is right, at least in part, that if some officials from 2014, when the high probability of a war in Ukraine had already become obvious, prepared the army accordingly, then his services would not be needed. Something tells me about the presence of the Wagners in the NWO not at the whim of Prigogine, but rather about plugging up unexpected problems.

[Andron78]

This is where the puzzle came together. There were so many assumptions about the reasons for the appointment of Gerasimov to the post of commander of the NVO, and the casket just opened. Armageddon simply could not, but rather simply did not refuse to provide Prigozhin with weapons and ammunition. The motive is the achievement of the result, which the Wagnerites provided with his support, well, plus the established personal relationships that made it possible to act directly and promptly. It can be assumed that for this reason, the supply of parts of the Defense Ministry began to decline, as a less effective tool, and maybe it was the appetite of the Wagners, albeit justified, that did not allow creating a reserve of the same ammunition for the offensive. Here we add Prigozhin’s position that the Wagners are not the Moscow Region, “bulging out” (albeit objectively) the merits of the Wagners, belittling the importance of parts of the Moscow Region in supporting the Wagners, and the conflict is ready, and has already reached the President. The saddest thing in this story is exactly what Khodokovsky said, the lack of ammunition for everyone. Meanwhile, when you watch reports from the NVO zone, dedicated to artillerymen or just filming the APU supporters from the air, I personally understand that artillery often fires in that direction or approximately there or on squares, and this does not fit with the lack of ammunition at all.

[RoTTor]

if you advertise this shady guy for money, then okay, forced to make a living with nonsense. If it’s just out of stupidity ... It’s not hell for anyone to meddle in military affairs, and even with their illegal organized criminal group-PMC

while in the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation there are two articles for "Mercenary" and "Organization of an illegal armed group" = PMC "Wagner".
Prigozhin declares that he had nothing to do with the Russian army, does not have and will not have. Let him buy, there is something for https://ianed.ru/2023/02/21/ft-%D0%B4%D0%BE%D1%85%D0%BE%D0%B4%D1%8B-%D0% B5%D0%B2%D0%B3%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%8F-%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B3%D0%BE%D0%B6 %D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B0-%D0%BE%D1%82-%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BC%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B8 /… And how did Sukrovikin's armagandon player chemise with shells for PMCs?

[Moneron]

it's time for the forum smart people to grow up. pissing against the wind is more expensive for yourself, you get splashed all over. Prigozhin does this without thinking that these are not meteorological whirlwinds, but a RIGID SYSTEM built by the "arbitrator", the supreme commander in chief, the president of the country, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin. so it is useless to appeal to him through any media and respected people in search of the truth. the creator will never destroy his brainchild ... for the sake of an upstart ... from an African nowhere.
the fate of Wagner PMC workers is unenviable .... and is in the hands of its creator. it is impossible for him to humiliate himself before Shoigu and Gerasimov to the point of apologizing ... according to the code of his dark past ........ and the company's employees will categorically not accept this .... the company does not need a pissed-off lion. it remains either to put all the employees, led by themselves, under bakhmut ... or, slamming the door, return to Africa .... let Gerasimov perform feats in Artyomovsk.
there is another option .... with North Korea ... try to negotiate with Comrade Kim. artillery systems of the same caliber. and drive trains through Hassan. but here money and the gracious permission of the supreme are needed. but Wagner in this case becomes a state within a state.

[mexanik62]

Let me remind you: Line - the location of military personnel, units and units for their of joint action on foot and by car.

[Evgeny Ivanov_5]

To be honest, the chaos reigning at the front just kills. The situation is worse than in the first Chechnya. Special forces of all stripes on the front line, the LDNR police with incomprehensible subordination, volunteer battalions, l / s of which can rush home at any time (by the way, what is their status in general?), PMCs, personnel units of the Moscow Region. And all this is being promoted, quarreling, tearing up preferences in provision, jealous of fame and unanimously swearing at the country and the General Staff. Maybe it's time to sort things out? Reminds me of a brothel from the civil era, but now is a different time.