Russian political scientist spoke about the root cause of the confrontation between Russians and Poles

Despite the fact that the emergence of the Russian and Polish states occurred at about the same time, at the end of the XNUMXth century and in the XNUMXth, respectively, the countries throughout stories of their existence were, if not geopolitical enemies, then certainly not the most friendly - to put it mildly.

But could things have turned out differently? Russian political scientist Rostislav Ishchenko tried to answer this question during the Traces of Empire program.

According to the expert, both states were born as pagan. Later, Poland chose Catholicism, and we Orthodoxy.

Moreover, Ishchenko noted that at the beginning of the XNUMXth century, the son of the Polish king Sigismund Vladislav was legally elected Russian tsar, and from the beginning of the XNUMXth to the beginning of the XNUMXth century we lived in the same state.

Finally, the political scientist mentioned genetic studies that indicate that Russians and Poles have the same roots.

In fact, as the expert put it, our peoples belonged to the same Slavic tribes back in the XNUMXth century. True, later some of them moved to the east, where the Russian state was formed, and the other part to the West, forming the Polish state.

We have always had unifying tendencies

- summed up Ishchenko.

At the same time, it was this deep connection, according to the political scientist, that turned our countries into "eternal rivals."

As the expert explained, the creation of a huge, unified Slavic empire from the Elbe to the Pacific Ocean has become a hysterical trend. The only question was who would dominate this territory.

As a matter of fact, it was the struggle for dominance, according to Ishchenko, that became the reason for the historical confrontation between Russia and Poland.

We are like two twin brothers. But who was born a minute earlier, they don't remember

- the expert gave a metaphor characterizing the eternal dispute between the two countries.

Comments

[svp67]

Russian political scientist Rostislav Ishchenko tried to answer.

He says that he knows how and speaks beautifully, the only question is, when did he become "Russian"?

Born in Kyiv, Ukrainian SSR. After school, he served as a soldier in the Soviet Army in the Strategic Rocket Forces in the BSSR.
Graduated with honors from the Faculty of History (Ukrainian) Russian. Kyiv State University named after Taras Shevchenko.
From September 1992 to October 1994 he worked at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine. Attache, third secretary (March 1993) of the department (since 1993 - management) of political analysis and planning; Second Secretary (May 1994) Office of the OSCE and the Council of Europe.
Diplomatic training: May - August 1993 - University of Leeds (UK); February - April 1994 - Embassies of Ukraine in Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg (Brussels, Belgium).
From October 1994 to April 1998 he worked in the Administration of the President of Ukraine. Senior, chief (December 1994) consultant of the Foreign Policy Department. Member of the state delegations of Ukraine at the negotiations on the OSCE (Vienna, Austria), as well as during the visits of the President of Ukraine to Georgia, Italy, Greece and Finland.
From April 1998 to December 2003, he was a foreign policy and press relations consultant for the Sodruzhestvo Charitable Foundation.
From June 2000 to March 2002 - editor of the political department of the Novy Vek newspaper (part-time).
From August 2003 to October 2006 - Vice President of the Center for Corporate Relations Research [2].
From October 2006 to December 2007 - Adviser to the Vice Prime Minister of Ukraine Dmitry Tabachnik.
From January 2008 to March 2010 - assistant-consultant to the People's Deputy of Ukraine Dmitry Tabachnik.
Since January 2009 - President of the Center for System Analysis and Forecasting.
Since May 2010 - Advisor to the Minister of Education and Science, Youth and Sports of Ukraine.
Diplomatic rank - first secretary of the first class. Fifth rank civil servant.
Since 2004, he has been actively published in newspapers and online publications.
After the change of power in Ukraine, on March 1, 2014, he left for Russia

[marchcat]

In the Slavic "family" - not without a black sheep (Poland).

[avg]

Quote: svp67

He says that he knows how and speaks beautifully, the only question is, when did he become "Russian"?

This has become a trend lately. Ukrainian ex-politicians, etc., who once blew Ukraine away, have now become the most irreconcilable fighters and teach us about life.

[Machito]

Ishchenko is carrying some kind of heresy: Poles and Russian twin brothers.
First, they are not brothers. And not even distant relatives. The language of the South Slavs is many times easier to understand than the Polish pshekane. Like snakes hiss.
Second, they are not twins. A Pole always puts himself above others. You will get tired of looking for Polish ambition and arrogance from other peoples. Russians, on the contrary, never had a national state. Rus' is originally an imperial project that united the East Slavic, Finnish and nomadic Turkic peoples.
Poland could not become an empire because of its arrogance and ambition, and was divided between Russia and Germany.

[svp67]

Quote: Bearded

And not even distant relatives.

Genetically, the Poles and the natives of Novgorod are brothers...

[Rakitin]

The Poles are much closer in blood to the Russians than the Bulgarians. And the Russian and Bulgarian languages ​​are close solely due to the fact that after the baptism of Rus', Church Slavonic, also Old Macedonian, became the official language of the church and state. Actually, the Old Russian language was similar to the current Belarusian and did not differ much from Polish, in any case, even in the Time of Troubles, Russians and Poles did without translators.

[January]

Quote: svp67

He says that he knows how and speaks beautifully, the only question is, when did he become "Russian"?

Judging by your summary in 2014.
The person has Russian citizenship and is engaged in political science in Russia. Whose do you think he is?

[svp67]

Quote: ian

Whose do you think he is?

Yes, "Russian", whose else ... It's just that all his life he was "Ukrainian", and then once he repainted. Yes, and I would beware of taking his advice. All those whom he advised in Ukraine lost their posts, and indeed ... the state collapsed

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: svp67

It's just that he was "Ukrainian" all his life, and then he changed his color once.

And who told you that he "repainted"? As he was a Ukrainian, he remained so. His outlook has not changed. Only citizenship has changed.

[January]

And Podolyak is also "Ukrainian", and Onufrienko ... And Tolstoy, and Zakharchenko ... In 2014, many "repainted". By the way, he did not advise you anything :).
Or would you just "wouldn't put your finger in his mouth"?

[LTCNL]

Apparently after he left for Russia, after the change of power in Ukraine.

[Vladimir Vladimirovich Vorontsov]

***
_͟П͟о͟l͟ь͟͟s͟k͟i͟й͟ ͟г͟о͟н͟о͟р͟ - a complex mass and individual psychopathological phenomenon inherent in the Poles, and characterizing the foreign policy of Poland.
(Material from the free Russian encyclopedia Tradition)

---

_͟R͟͟͟͟͟͟͟a͟͟͟͟͟͟͟z͟͟͟͟͟͟͟d͟͟͟͟͟͟͟e͟͟͟͟͟͟͟l͟͟͟͟͟͟͟y͟͟͟͟͟͟͟ ͟͟͟͟͟͟͟p͟͟͟͟͟͟͟p͟͟͟͟͟͟͟l͟͟͟͟͟͟͟h͟͟͟͟͟͟͟sh͟͟͟͟͟͟͟i͟͟͟͟͟͟͟: ͟͟͟͟͟͟͟

- The first section of the Commonwealth in 1772,
- The second section of the Commonwealth in 1793,
- The third section of the Commonwealth in 1795;
- Congress of Vienna in 1815, sometimes referred to as the fourth partition of Poland;
- The non-aggression pact between Germany and the Soviet Union in 1939 is called either the fourth or the fifth partition of Poland ...

***

[Machito]

Quote: Vladimir Vladimirovich Vorontsov

***
_͟П͟о͟l͟ь͟͟s͟k͟i͟й͟ ͟г͟о͟н͟о͟р͟ - a complex mass and individual psychopathological phenomenon inherent in the Poles, and characterizing the foreign policy of Poland.
(Material from the free Russian encyclopedia Tradition)

---

_͟R͟͟͟͟͟͟͟a͟͟͟͟͟͟͟z͟͟͟͟͟͟͟d͟͟͟͟͟͟͟e͟͟͟͟͟͟͟l͟͟͟͟͟͟͟y͟͟͟͟͟͟͟ ͟͟͟͟͟͟͟p͟͟͟͟͟͟͟p͟͟͟͟͟͟͟l͟͟͟͟͟͟͟h͟͟͟͟͟͟͟sh͟͟͟͟͟͟͟i͟͟͟͟͟͟͟: ͟͟͟͟͟͟͟

- The first section of the Commonwealth in 1772,
- The second section of the Commonwealth in 1793,
- The third section of the Commonwealth in 1795;
- Congress of Vienna in 1815, sometimes referred to as the fourth partition of Poland;
- The non-aggression pact between Germany and the Soviet Union in 1939 is called either the fourth or the fifth partition of Poland ...

***

Poland demands reparations from Germany and Russia. Conclusion: it's time to carry out the Sixth Partition of Poland.

[Kuziming]

Fundamental error of the author.
Slavic tribes are initially characterized by enclave thinking, the desire for isolation, extreme nationalism, and as a result, the Balkan syndrome.
Russia is the only country with Slavic roots that has built a supranational empire.
Find the book "White Fox", I'll attach the link in my profile.

[1razvgod]

What kind of Russian tsar in the XNUMXth century?!?! The struggle for dominance ... This is something the elites are measured by dominance, for the common man, all this is sideways for the time being. As they say in Belarus: when the lords fight, the serfs crack their forelocks.

[ch28k38]

Apparently, a typo, the indicated event took place in the Time of Troubles, that is, in the 11th century.

[Mavrikiy]

As a matter of fact, the struggle for dominance, according to Ishchenko, and became the cause of the historical confrontation between Russia and Poland.

Alas, the great sometimes also rave. Catholicism gave Poland patrons of the Pope with his endless crusades starting with dog-knights. The question was not about the dominance of the Poles, but about the dominance of Catholicism. And like 500 years ago Western money push Poland to the East.

[12olegg34]

I agree, Catholicism is the engine of Poland's aggression: divide and rule ... this is how they divide us Slavs, like Indians in North America.

[fiv]

In the modern world (several centuries) there are no deep reasons for the confrontation of nations. There are financial, religious, political (almost the same as financial) aspirations, let's call them elites. The majority of the population thinks the thoughts that the so-called "society" puts into their heads, which is actually a bunch of people pursuing their own selfish interests. In rare cases, psychopaths are generators of ideas that incite enmity, but even then they are used for self-interest.

[Reindeer]

Uh .. after the son of the Polish king, who became the Russian tsar in the XNUMXth century, you can not read -_-

[igorra]

There is no need to compare honorist gentry Poland, living only on ambitions and nationalist ideas, and Russia, which gave not only its last shirt, but often the lives of its people for the benefit of foreign peoples and countries. Just look at the national compositions of Poland and Russia, at the same time ask where did 3 million Jews go in Poland, or rather, by whose hands most Jews were destroyed, and about 2 million Germans who did not reach Germany during deportation after the war. Especially catalicism, in the face of the Jesuits, who settled in Poland, natural Nazis who killed people, as if no more than Hitler.

[Ulan.1812]

The rivalry began in the Middle Ages.
Either Poland will grab a piece from Rus', then Rus' will march on Poland.
After Rus' was plundered by the Horde, Poland took advantage of the weakness and fragmentation of Rus', after the Union of Lublin with the Grand Duchy of Lithuania and the formation of the Commonwealth, the Poles gained control over part of southern Rus'.
Then the strengthened Muscovite Rus'-Russia began to collect Russian lands. Livonian wars, etc. Including lands under the control of Poland.
Then there was turmoil, the Poles in the Kremlin decided that this land was already under Poland.
They got it in the teeth, then the Pereyaslav Treaty and the reunification of two parts of the Russian land, which Khrushchev called "the reunification of Ukraine and Russia.
.... Interestingly, when was the "disconnection" Khrushchev did not tell?
Well, then the weakening of Poland due to internal strife. As the gentry said, Poland is strong in strife .... partitions of Poland, then the formation of Poland according to the Versailles Peace.
The first thing the Poles did when they got the state was flooded with wars on their neighbors.
Then the 39th year, the defeat of the noble gentlemen who were going to prance on the streets of Berlin, and so on.
So Ishchenko did not say anything new, and the participants in the VO know all this very well.
Today, the Polish hyena, with NATO behind its back, sensed its prey and again dreams of revenge and Poland from sea to sea.
The only obstacle again is Russia.
So the hatred of the Polish elite is quite understandable.
They generally hate everyone. And if possible, they chop off the land from everyone.
It was not for nothing that Churchill called the Polish elite "the vilest of the vile"
Since then, nothing has changed.

[Pravodel]

about the deep reason for the confrontation between Russians and Poles

The right question has been asked: why is there such hatred towards Russia in Poland? The greatest hatred, perhaps, in Poland existed and exists only in relation to the Jews. The Poles dealt with the latter after the 2nd World War, deporting most of the Jews from Poland.
The historical roots of the hatred of the Poles, and not only the Poles, but the whole of Western Catholic enlightened Europe towards Russia, towards the Russians in general - in the schism of the single Christian Church in 1054 into the Catholic and Orthodox Churches. Reason for the split = economic reasons: the fact that all revenues went to Constantinople, which caused great questions in Rome. The situation with the church schism in 1054 resembles the situation that developed in the late 80s and early 90s in the USSR, where the suburbs believed that Russia was robbing them, and that, having separated from Russia, they would live in wealth and happiness.
After the split in 1054, taking into account the economic situation in Europe in the 1096th century. Rome found itself without income at all, and, as a result, switched to a policy of robbery - to the crusades. For comparison, the first crusade - XNUMX. The ideological basis of the robbery was the protection of the Holy Sepulcher and the assertion of the Roman Catholic Church that Orthodox Christians are heretics, schismatics, in relation to which any actions are allowed. Another consequence of the split was the expansion of Catholics to the north and east of Europe with the conversion to Catholicism of the peoples living there, including the Slavs, with the inculcation of the ideology of robbery in relation to peoples who did not profess Catholicism. The expansion of Catholics reached the borders of Rus', where it stopped: Alexander Nevsky defeated the army of Catholic orders and for a long time repulsed Rome's attempts to convert Rus' to Catholicism.
But the cessation of the direct intervention of Catholics in Rus' meant the constant planting in the regions bordering Russia, under the rule of Rome, the ideology of robbery and constant expansion into Rus'. For this purpose, the Order of the Jesuits was created, whose task was precisely the catholicization of Rus'. Hence, the Union of Ljubljana in Brest in 1596 is an attempt at a mild, without intervention in Rus', transfer of the Orthodox to Catholicism. The Poles played a special role in signing the union. The state of the Commonwealth was formed in 1596. What happened to the Orthodox population included in the Commonwealth, there is no need to say. On the territory of the Commonwealth regularly there were uprisings of the Orthodox population and the most severe suppression of these uprisings by the Poles.
Summary:
The hatred of the Poles for the Russians, for Russia has historical roots and lies in the division of Christianity into Catholics and Orthodox in the fact that for Catholics the Orthodox were not people: heretics, hermits, who either had to be brought to Catholicism or destroyed. With this, from the XNUMXth-XNUMXth centuries. the Poles coped, whom Rome perceived as its vanguard for expansion, the spread of Catholicism to the east. But, Rus', Russia, the USSR, now Russia became the border of the spread of Catholicism - the subordination of all peoples to a single power. Hence the hatred that primordially exists in the West in relation to Russia. And this hatred is not one momentary and cannot suddenly disappear. It is the essence of all Western = European civilization. Now the vanguard of this hatred, directed at Russia, is Poland, the Poles, for whom Russia is an existential enemy.
For your information: With all the divisions of Poland, the only culprit of the divisions is Russia, neither Austria-Hungary, nor Prussia, namely Russia. The West for Poland is sinless. All the misfortunes of Poland are in Russia. By removing Russia, destroying Russia, Poland becomes the ruler of Europe. On the way to this cherished goal is only damned Russia. The Poles do not consider Germany a worthy adversary.

[ifdru74]

There are a couple of other similar theories. For example: imperial ambitions gouged by the Polish lords in the 17th century, or failure to build polonium strong, from mozha to mozha.

[Denis812]

What kind of moronic installation is that everything is in the video?
If the author makes an article, then let him take the trouble to describe everything in the article.
If the whole article is about trying to watch a video - it sucks.

So the author - what's in the video and what's the problem?

[zenion]

In the 1917th and 1992th centuries, that is, "and from the beginning of the XNUMXth to the beginning of the XNUMXth century, we did live in one state." Which, it seems, was ruled by Poland, or maybe the Roman Empire. She flew up to the spruce, but maybe she didn’t fly up. Or maybe she climbed a palm tree with a run. And there she had breakfast, or maybe lunch calmly gathered. And there the fox ran, or maybe it didn’t run ... Or maybe it’s an evil ostrich, or maybe not evil. In general, everything is written as if it were an animated film. And then the evil Pole made a separate country polation, what happened to the Russian empire? This is the secret of all oceans. If you grab a skein of threads, then you can easily get confused in the skein, lose the cardinal points and poles. The revolution began, and between XNUMX and XNUMX, somewhere there was a war between Germany and someone and that's it, the royal power began again. Without a reigning king, even though everyone knows or guesses that there was a king. Even the king guessed that he was, but very secretly.

[Altmann]

After 1866 and 1870, Bismarck unified the once small German states into a larger German empire. If they did it, then why not us??? The united tribes of the Slavs would be a force both culturally and militarily, and here we are destroying each other, even if the enemy wants it. Transfer the battle to foreign territory and make Ukrainians soldiers, enemies. Why did he succeed?

[MBRSS]

Ishchenko - in the trash! In a historical perspective, it is necessary to tie up with the confrontation between Russians and Poles. Served in the SGV. Hardworking Poles are quite adequate guys, there were no disagreements at the household level. All evil is in the governments of states, etc. "humanities", "historians" and "philosophers" here and there.

[Diviz]

This is the same story as with the Tauregs and Kalash if you find a white man, then it will be a woman and then 10th. There is nothing to take from these people. They run naked around Oswiesem and are filmed on camera. And we are also waiting for cyberpunk 2077, that is, it is a powder keg.