Ex-Minister of Defense Pavel Grachev Dies

In the Moscow hospital named after Vishnevsky, the former head of the Ministry of Defense Pavel Grachev died. The cause of death in the medical institution did not specify, saying only that Grachev died today at 14: 40 MSK, reports RIA "News".

The details of Grachev's hospitalization have not yet been disclosed. It is known that he got 12 September in the intensive care hospital named. Vishnevsky. “Pavel Sergeevich is in intensive care. His condition is stable. There are no grounds for panic,” said a representative of the Omsk radio plant, where the former minister worked as an adviser to the general director.

The media therefore began to speculate that doctors hide the real reason for Grachev’s hospitalization. The hospital even refused to tell reporters where exactly the ex-minister was located, although they confirmed that he was treating him specifically. According to rumors, Grachev poisoned mushrooms at a friend's party: he returned home, suddenly felt bad and lost consciousness. The family was called for him, and the doctors took the general to the hospital.

Grachev left in the newest Russian stories ambiguous trace. Pavel Sergeevich was born on January 1 1948 in the Tula region in the family of a locksmith and milkmaid. After military service in the army, he entered the prestigious Ryazan Higher Airborne Command School and graduated from it in 1969 year. In 1981, Grachev was sent to Afghanistan, where he rose to the post of commander of the 103 Guards Airborne Division. In 1988, Mr. Grachev was awarded the title Hero of the Soviet Union.

Grachev was obliged to continue his brilliant career in the time of the new Russia due to the right choice, which he made in August 1991. As the commander of the Airborne Forces of the USSR, he first obeyed the order of the Minister of Defense Yazov to send troops to Moscow, but then went over to the side of Boris Yeltsin. In 1992, Mr. Grachev became Minister of Defense for the Russian Federation, and during the events of October, 1993 supported the president again.

The post of defense minister Grachev lost due to the beginning of the war in Chechnya. Responsibility for the failure of the Russian military at the beginning of the campaign was assigned to him. In addition, Grachev was accused of corruption and in the rejection of reforms in the army. In 1996, Grachev was dismissed and replaced by Igor Rodionov, by the way, the former commander of Grachev.

“In my 40 Army, Grachev was a good commander of the Airborne Division. He never rose above this level. He became the minister only because he ran to Yeltsin’s side in time,” Rodionov, who didn’t work well with Yeltsin, described him and was quickly fired.

Hero of Russia, Colonel General Gennady Troshev also spoke about Grachev not from the best side. According to him, he expected more from the experienced "Afghan" during the first Chechen campaign. At the same time, Troshev found a positive side in the activities of the ex-minister: according to him, Grachev "did not allow the army to be destroyed under the guise of military reform, as the young reformers demanded."

After his resignation, Grachev worked for a long time in the Rosvooruzhenie (Rosoboronexport) company. In 2007, he was discharged to the reserve and during the last years of his life he served as the head of a group of advisers to the general director of the Omsk Production Association "Radio Plant named after AS Popov".

Comments

[rexby63]

Oh dead or nothing or good

[spender]

He was a Hero, but got into politics and ended up in .... (not allowed today)
In history, it will remain like a Pasha Mercedes ...
I understand that I cause fire on myself, but he can’t forgive young boys who died in Chechnya even after death !!! IMHO
I agree with all the minuses and I understand why they are put In no case do I hold no evil

[Rezun]

Yes, spender, Pasha - Mercedes - he wrote to himself an obituary ...

[ShturmKGB]

Yes, he himself obeyed the order, it was a difficult time ... I am sorry for those close to me ...

[wax]

This does not apply to him: he did not comply with the order of the Minister of Defense, and he himself chose whose orders to fulfill, violating the oath. He drew the army in 1993 to the execution of parliament. For that I received from EBN a personal gold medal weighing 100 grams. So wherever you go, namely Grachev turned the history of our country practically. No condolences.

[Konrad]

Quote: Wax

For that I received from EBN a personal gold medal weighing 100 grams.

And my grandmother a neighbor said - 250 grams. Who to believe?

[Karish]

Quote: Konrad

And my grandmother a neighbor said - 250 grams. Who to believe?

Your neighbor is lying, my neighbor is telling the truth.
He first drank 100 grams and for this he received a medal of 250 grams - gold.

[vezunchik]

There is no such order - to betray the motherland And to break the oath! And even more so fight with your people !!!

[x-men]

with what confusion was he a hero? he was the one who didn’t keep the union about who you are now recalling !!!!!!!!!

[vorobey]

Quote: spender

I call fire on myself, but he can’t forgive young boys who died in Chechnya after death

Lesha hello, there Kvashnin more than a taxi driver puzzled. when he introduced troops without organization of interaction and in the complete absence of combat coordination.

[Grenader]

I want to say a lot about him "or nothing."

[Vadivak]

Quote: Grenader

I want to say a lot about him "or nothing."

How Zyuganov about Yeltsin

I, as a truly patriotic person who knows the canons of Russian life and Orthodoxy, today would refrain from commenting on his deeds, - said Zyuganov to ITAR-TASS. "I have no good words about his policy, but I don't want to say bad ones."

[with]

Quote: Vadivak

How Zyuganov about Yeltsin

I, as a truly patriotic person who knows the canons of Russian life and Orthodoxy, today would refrain from commenting on his deeds, - said Zyuganov to ITAR-TASS. "I have no good words about his policy, but I don't want to say bad ones."

And I do not care about his comments, as well as the memory of the late Khrachev.
I’m still sitting and waiting for those two regiments that they can take to Chechnya in two weeks!
Handurasam has no place in the Russian army !!!
And it’s very unfortunate that he died, and yes he died, and did not die, because people like him do not cause me to associate differently, he should have been suspended in one place and I shouldn’t need to talk about pity for Hitler’s sick person was sick and hto pity him ??

[wax]

Totally agree with you.

[PSih2097]

He (Pavel Grachev) was an excellent regiment commander, a good commander, but turned out to be not just a bad Minister of Defense, but one of the worst ... He got into politics.

[Alex 241]

This is called the limit of human competence.

[Novosibirsky]

Can I change one letter in your word "limit"?

[Alex 241]

I got the hint.

[bachast]

These days you will hear many kind words about him. About the fact that he was one of the best ministers, a competent, intelligent military man ... including from respected people. Shamanov, for example, honored his memory with kind words.

[Filin]

MET


No matter how I treat him, but what you write ... it is taken out of context. He then put it another way. You repeat the stamp of the media once again.
Himself a very long time he was not very well treated, because I have combat experience behind me. BUT .... close seen from afar. And history puts everything in its place only with time. Grachev was against the war in Chechnya and against the fleeting introduction of troops without appropriate training. Find his 93 year commentary and interview.
It’s interesting ... WHO ... in its place would have done better ... in such a short period of time and with so few forces in a civil war against its people ...
WHO ??? Name and surname in the studio ....

[Alex 241]

Agree that each officer is responsible for the lives of his subordinates, and is convicted of the right to send them to death by the force of his order.

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: FILIN

Grachev was against the war in Chechnya and against the fleeting introduction of troops without appropriate training.

Nevertheless, let us judge people not by their intentions, but by their actions! It doesn’t matter what the man said (if he did), it is important what he did!
We have all the masters, no one to resign. I’m not talking about shoot yourself, after the New Year’s 94-95 ...
Ass your diamond pity mana ma!
According to merit and retribution to the bitch!

[Alex 241]

One word NO! It could save so many lives.

[Novosibirsky]

Yes sir! A drunk might have been strewn, but he would have washed himself.
And after the New Year, without haste, you look and other tactics and strategy would have developed. Although, they work out .., for vodka and herring.
But Boriska wouldn’t wash - fired! The trouble is not great for an officer who values ​​his honor and not his general's pension ...
In short, there’s nothing to carry, everything is already clear.

[Vadivak]

Quote: met

And I do not care about his comments, as well as the memory of the late Khrachev.

Don’t spit in all directions; the dead man Grachev served in Afghanistan for five years, the GSS received in 1988, more than 600 parachute jumps, several injuries, he is a military officer, and the fact that the politician is useless is so unknown how any of us would act in his place,

[Civil]

keep silent too, but the aspen stake would come in handy

[iulai]

but about shit? for some reason he did not send his son! and General Raevsky, in 1812, stood with his son, who was 12 years old, in the same ranks! this is the general! and grachev, shit !!!!

[Alex 241]

Two sons participated in the battle near Saltanovka on Raevsky’s battery, and when ours rushed into the bayonet the elder carried the banner inspiring the fighters, and he led the younger by the hand. But there were undoubtedly people of honor: life to the tsar, honor to anyone !!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

[iulai]

Thank you, Alex, I wrote in the heat, it’s boiling, thanks again, in the memory of the people, the glory of the heroes will not fade !!!

[Alex 241]

Everyone will be rewarded according to his deeds. So let him rest in peace. I understand your emotions.

[Generalissimus]

Quote: Alex 241

Two sons took part in the battle near Saltanovka on Raevsky’s battery, and when ours rushed to the bayonet the elder carried the banner inspiring the fighters, and he led the younger by the hand. But there were undoubtedly people of honor: life to the tsar, honor to no one!

. In connection with this your post thought ... They were nobles. A nobleman is a military estate. This is the original meaning of the nobility in Russia. After the 1812 year, nobles began to appear more and more, avoiding military service. There was even some member of the imperial family who did not serve in the army.
What is typical today, many people who suddenly remember their blue bloods, or even buy noble titles (which is ridiculous in itself), no longer remember this essence of the nobility - to serve and fight for the Fatherland.
Everything is fading.

[Alex 241]

You know, somehow I had to talk with a descendant of a famous noble family living in France. To his question: how can I get Russian citizenship, I just answered him: serve in the Russian army. This topic has not been raised anymore. That's ....

[Generalissimus]

Here I am about the same ...

P.S. I wonder who so minus me for any reason? =)

[Alex 241]

I am also amazed.

[Redpartyzan]

By the way, Raevsky himself denied this fact, claimed that it was just a myth. But the soldiers speak firsthand.

[Alex 241]

I think he denied it out of nobility.

[vezunchik]

so let's be quiet!

[spender]

No mushrooms, died of a stroke

According to his son, an attack on his father occurred due to high blood sugar. Doctors at first assumed that Grachev was poisoned by mushrooms, but later established a more accurate diagnosis - a stroke.

[Oleg0705]

Quote: rexby63

Oh dead or nothing or good

Pharisee dogmas this.

Comrade Stalin is persuaded to anyone, why they do not remember - "about the dead, or nothing, or good"

[rexby63]

In the Russian tradition, it lasted 40 days

[iulai]

I am not Russian, but our family also has not returned from this war and I have every right, on behalf of the 18-year-old children who did not return from this war, to say grachev-shit, it's just a pity, they would say it harder !!!

[Alx1miK]

So it was accepted in ancient Rome. And we are in Russia. Therefore, it is better to say what is.

[Vadivak]

Yeltsin, Grachev., Gaidar, Chernomyrdin ... era

[stariy]

Quote: Vadivak

Yeltsin, Grachev., Gaidar, Chernomyrdin ... era

Black era

[Vadivak]

Quote: stariy

Black era

Chubais doesn’t think so, and Alla Borisovna, and many Moses and others

[stariy]

Quote: Vadivak

Chubais doesn’t think so, and Alla Borisovna, and many Moses and others

Fie on them, their hellish circles are waiting for them

[vezunchik]

Boehner forgot, the main prostitute,

[Grenz]

Nothing about this dead - but the Maikop brigade of the dead breathed a sigh of relief

[Alex 241]

Eternal memory to the guys.

[wax]

And he could remain a hero of Afghanistan.

[Mikado]

This is only part of the proverb, it is necessary to negotiate it to the end:
There was such an ancient Greek sage - Chilo, and so he once decided to come up with some kind of clever statement to be remembered for centuries. Sat and wrote in the sand
"About the dead, or good, or nothing"
He sat, thought, erased, wrote a new
"About the dead, either good or bad"
He sat still, erased, wrote
"The truth about the dead"

So let's get the truth about Pasha Mercedes

[Trailer]

It’s better to keep silent, and honor the memory of those who fell in the winter offensive on the first Chechen one!

[53-Sciborskiy]

I feel sorry for the person. But as a minister, not really.

[Ragnarek]

the complete statement is: about the dead well, about the dead nothing, about the dead truth

[beech]

rexby63,
Better keep silent then !!

[andrey.joshua]

Oh dead or nothing or good

Well, you must, yeah ..... like this, since .... and silently forgot everything .... No, you do this at home, if a rapist and a murderer cruelly treats your friends with your family (God save you , of course) Which then, will be condemned and shot ... let's see how you will rebral, in front of your humiliated relatives: "Oh dead, or nothing, or good" However, I repeat once again: God forbid you, from this cup ... ...
It’s just a shame: As your own ... so it is, EGEGEY ..... DO NOT TOUCH ... But as a general, so at once all such Humanists .... Yes, and we selectively like that of Hitler, Penochet, you don’t remember good ??? Thoth ...
So, YOU, NAMEKLATURA KODLA from the 90s *** TO YOU, NOBODY FORGETS, Nothing FORGOTS .... AND THAT WHAT YOU WAIT FOR, FOR YOUR ABOMINATIONS ON THE EARTH, IN THE LIGHT

[Beetle-a]

The original statement is as follows: About the dead or the truth or nothing.
Feel the difference, as they say in advertising.

[Isr]

I want to say a lot "or nothing". Judging by the way he suddenly left us, they helped him. As a reward for this "or nothing".

[with]

Quote: Isr

I want to say a lot "or nothing". Judging by the way he suddenly left us, they helped him. As a reward for this "or nothing".

How do you feel bad there, oh wey !!
Everywhere Mossad steers ???)))

[Vadivak]

Quote: Isr

he was helped

It is unlikely, we would like to have removed it long ago, there is no "value" as politics, popularity is below the plinth, what's the point?

[Sakhalininsk]

Nicodemus died and to hell with him!
For those deeds that he did as minister, at best, how Garden should have moved ....

[mongoose]

Shamanov spoke well of him today, however, contrary to the opinion of the local "society"

[kadcin-max]

Everlasting memory!

[vezunchik]

Yeah, he left a memory of himself, like Yeltsin ....

[teplal]

Hurried to this forum, at first it seemed like adults. After a while it became not interesting. Comments are predictable. They wrote off iron, it was bad. They took iron, it’s good. Trepidation about a person’s death looks like squalor. Check your conscience first, then measure someone else

[cool.kirko]

Yes Heroes in the Empire did not rush. This does not cancel the subsequent, it exacerbates.
I go with my friends, TUDA. And again, I understand. We talked with the furniture maker for an hour, from 17 p.m.
He took two viskars on his chest (we don’t get drunk, even girls, ets) chemistry, the elders were learned by the Empire, we were young, because there are no more instructors, psychologists, or masters. Notice to me exactly how much he is at the end of December 94.
I’m climbing with insignia of composition. He- mm has eliminated.
Please explain to the people of the military estate and others like them, 60 letters - I will answer within the limits of knowledge and experience.
Only at home I will be at 2. I’ll work, melee, sleep-at 6 already rushing with a fighting girlfriend. So 3 years. Now catch the clip.

Admins, do not ban, there our puppies lay down and is not easy. If you’re going to measure it, I’ll cut down the site, it’s a pity the root is a great site, but be kind. ERGO. Read the dossier to me. Let's not argue before separation is a bad omen.

Kindly explain to the personnel, contact ONLY THROUGH THE PERSON.

[Drappier]

Peace be upon you ...

[fern]

Different personality. and ratings of his activities are also different. In any case, the kingdom be upon him

[vezunchik]

There will be no kingdom of heaven for his soul, too much blood on his hands ....

[Alexander Romanov]

Quote: Farn

In any case, the kingdom be upon him

The kingdom will be, if it manages to answer many questions that have accumulated among the soldiers and officers who died in Chechnya and will soon be asked these questions. But will he be able to answer, if not then instead of the kingdom will be ...........

[gregor6549]

Oh dead or good or nothing. Therefore, no comments.

[oper66]

Let the earth rest in peace to him, and time will judge his affairs — it is one judge, maybe he will reveal to us the secrets of the chancellery-

[Kaa]

Quote: oper66

time, it’s one judge, maybe it will reveal to us the secrets of the chancellery-

Here I am about the same thing, mushrooms ... resuscitation ... 11 days ... somehow ... it is not clear, perhaps ...

[mark021105]

In August 1991, he violated the Military Oath.

[max73]

in August of the 91st Gorbachev with Shevarnadze and Yakovlev at you .... did ..

[mark021105]

So it was necessary to identify everyone in the Matrosskaya Tishina, and not rush "in the wind" ...

[max73]

why didn’t he determine himself, huh?

[iulai]

dog-dog death! how many ruined unshooted boys? he got the curse of mothers, the curse of girls who did not wait for their suitors, the curse of unborn children! dog - dog death !!!!!!

[max73]

I ask you not to be a fool. have, in the truest sense of the word, a conscience. Glory to the commander of the 103rd Airborne Division

[max73]

men who plus, thank you! I feel that the contingent, that the division commander ... that the Minister of Defense ... shpaki .. and you need to wet the creatures ..... or they are us ...

[iulai]

Airborne Forces - GLORY! IF GLORY airborne for such heroes as Rooks, then really airborne glory! By the way, I don’t remember, but where did the airborne forces gain fame?

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: iulai

By the way, I don’t remember, but where did the airborne forces gain fame?

Stop at this place. Remember the 6th company ...

http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%BE%D0%B9_%D1%83_%D0%B2%D1%8B%D1%81%D0%BE%
D1%82%D1%8B_776

[Alex 241]

6th company is a symbol of the Airborne Forces !!! Strength of spirit, courage, fidelity to the oath. REAL WARRIORS! As Suvorov would say, MIRACLE THE RICH !!!!!

[iulai]

sorry, but we all and our sons would do the same.

[Novosibirsky]

I really hope if I get such a test that I have the courage to do the same ...
But to be absolutely sure of this can probably only have already accepted that battle ...

[Alex 241]

Don’t worry buddy, if you explode, you will not be alone. I’ll cover.

[Novosibirsky]

I understand you))
............................................

[Alex 241]

You know Russian and there’s one warrior in the field, and together we will arrange this ..... The whole world will shudder.

[Novosibirsky]

I would still like us to be so million 148.))
Then the world will not have to shudder ...

[Alex 241]

Dreams, dreams ....

[teplal]

I doubt that you are Russian, and your interlocutor. You still dream and haifu. I don’t want Shalom.

[Alex 241]

Dear, what are you talking about?

[lelikas]

The trolls woke up.

[Alex 241]

Now the full-length fun will begin.

[Novosibirsky]

And who is Russian for you?

[teplal]

Without the slightest idea, on the basis of the media. Aren't you ashamed, adult Russian people, to dance at the grave?

[Alex 241]

if you didn’t notice, I didn’t say a single bad word to the deceased, although I have the full moral right. And everyone’s personal right to speak here. I’m talking only about what I know, saw, and what I witnessed.

[Novosibirsky]

Before you begin to "explain", take the trouble, as befits an adult, to fully familiarize yourself with the position of your opponent, and not "blow bubbles into a basin of water" ... This time.
Second, you can have concepts based on the media!
Third, I personally try not to draw conclusions only on the basis of the media, and in this matter, I did not depart from my rule.
And fourth, it's not in my rules to blame a person for unsatisfactory Russian, maybe he didn't study Russian at all ... But! If you question the Russianness of your opponents, take the trouble to write the word "Russian" correctly! )))
Sincerely.

[Alex 241]

+ 5, it would be better if no one said. Dear Alexander, maybe we make mistakes in some words, but this is only because the action is ahead of thought, I want to say so much, and no one really pays attention to it, but maybe you opinion is not a standard of education, but people here are real. You shouldn’t understand it in such a way. But you can get to the bottom of the pillar, or why the buttons are not sewn to the side of the Soviet government. And welcome, welcome.

[sapulid]

When they go to fight, heroes are everything. Where do cowards, traitors and deserters come from? You need to visit the hell in order to assert your courage with some confidence. You know, I have always treated the "office heroes" with distrust. I've seen such people in action. Few of them did not break, although, upon arrival, all of them considered themselves, almost Schwarzeneggers.
The statement that the Airborne Forces did not cover themselves with glory, to put it mildly, is idiotic. With the Second World War, landing took on the most difficult tasks. It should be noted the heroism of the paratroopers during Afghanistan, during the collapse of the Union, with the suppression of interethnic conflicts, when the Airborne Forces remained one of the few combat-ready military in the Russian Federation.

[Arkan]

max73,
Even before the First Chechen FGC, it tried to dump Dudaev with the help of the opposition, which was reinforced with tanks. The crews of these tanks were recruited from the RF MILITARY SERVICE. After the defeat of the opposition forces trying to take Grozny, most of the tankers were captured ... Grachev REFUSED these fighters! And you called this Minister of Defense a hero? Who, then, is a coward?

[oper66]

a jackal stinking at the grave of a hero, a shame .. that you are a seeker for defaming the name of which you are not worthy - during your life you were silent like bittersweet females - but you are all ready to kick him, I served with him as a soldier - he was divisive - thank him - you take away filthy creatures ...

[Karish]

Quote: oper66

..that you’re a wicked vicious one whose name you’re not worthy - during your life you’ve been silent like bitten girls

Ancient African Wisdom -
The old lion, even the monkeys fuck.

[max73]

thanks, friend !!! and jackals .... alas .... a lot of them became .......

[alexs30]

He did so much, but unfortunately died his death ...

[Captain Vrungel]

Do not judge, let not you be judged. At the top he will be met and I will show you the way. There everyone gets what they deserve. God knows best.

[ruslan7608]

I support, at the top probably already tired of waiting

[lelikas]

To send down.

[tumbajerry]

dog dog death!
lope this pasha-mercedes-judah-henchman got from ebna for shooting the parliament of 1993?

[yak69]

Something he (grachev) reminds me of bakatin ......
But be that as it may, he already answers TAM by the highest score.
I am sure - TAM will figure it out.

[TekhnarMAF]

The earth will rest in peace for him, and St. Peter will take care of the kingdom of heaven if he sees fit!

[iulai]

boiled! I will not forget his commentary on TV. I quote the words of Grachev from this comment: "soldiers die with a smile on their lips!" Is it that the soldiers who burned in tanks on the streets of Grozny died with a smile on their lips!

[Captain Vrungel]

Yes. And that was it. Debilizma was enough. When we were swinging the thread (checking the route of the column). at the most "modern" radio station R-105M (Parus-M) shederva, "yelled at the column climbing into the gorge" stretch the thread. They will burn you now .. In response. Who's in command is the lieutenant. And I am a colonel (now you will be dead). And we could only watch how they destroyed the column, how our boys were dying under fire, because were on the opposite side of the gorge and the spooks were covered with stones located above us. Who was with Grachev knows that he was a risky officer in Afghanistan, but too self-confident, he believed that he and the Airborne Forces were the key to success. It was very difficult for us to work with his subordinates, who believed that where they were, there was victory. Because there they were mostly in trouble ..
Too much blood was spilled out of the blue and who passed Afghanistan understand, because of the stupidity of the command, the soldiers shed blood. Honor and Glory to the Soldier, Warrior, Private and Lieutenant, who pulled that war on their shoulders. They are WINNERS !!! Lost-TE.

[Strashila]

what about him ... not what.

[kasha]

HOPE BURNING ALREADY IN HELL !!! HOW MUCH PEOPLE LAYED ONCE ON THE EARTH I DIDN’T ANSWER, TASTY ATTEN, HAD A LOW SLEEP, THERE WILL BE ASKED FOR THESE! FOR A PIECE OF AMERICAN SAUSAGES, I KNURED THE HOMELAND IN THE MEAT GRINDER, TOGETHER WITH THE BOREA, BURN THEM TOGETHER !!

[max73]

switch to Claudia, miracle ... Comdiv Grachev - Glory !!!

[kasha]

What is difficult to read? Are your eyes sore? My miracle is not in your mouth ...., You say glory to the divisional commander, my neighbors or at the grave of Sergei Tolstoukhov! The APC burned out in a place with comrades. Are you adequate? Or just hope Troll !!

[max73]

yes right now! how many boys died in afghanistan ?! a lot of? lots of! but! the peasants gave you, schnicks, time ... and you, everything .... dew ... now the enemy is at your place ... a little more and they will fuck you ... do you have fun with verbal battles? .. come on, come on ...

[kasha]

It seems to me that you are raving! These are different things. They entered Afghanistan to protect the country from drugs, extremism, the penetration of xeno Islam, only now we began to understand why we gave such an order! Far-sighted men were then, although they are now scumming them to the fullest! But Chechnya is our grief, our tears, and the Chechen people! And people like Grachev brought to the bleeding wound of our multinational homeland! You think I’m drunk or tired, like your title here speaks of you as a decent person! But whatever you say, but the truth is only one, they ate our homeland, what we loved, respected, proud of !!

[Grenz]

And who brought the enemy into the house with a shot at the white house?
How much did this .... swear the oath?
The boys who died in Afghanistan would not approve of his "scent in the wind"!
And do not touch the memory of those who can not object.
Glory to them!

[iulai]

if you, a goat, would burn in a tank, like my son, you would have the right to discuss it. shut up bastard ..

[oper66]

GLORY I served at his command - jackals get on

[derdeonis]

Good news
Finally, the miscarriage died. And what heaven does he have a direct elevator to hell

[teplal]

The day before yesterday you were buried. Nobody cried either.

[Novosibirsky]

I regret that this did not happen in the summer of 1994 ...

Damn you, creeping bastards, drunk with Borey. And let your names be given to oblivion ...

[APASUS]

............. managed, did not wait for the court!

[Narkom]

keep silent for today nizya.

[erased]

It’s a pity, of course, a man, but as a minister he has done so much that they still remember!
Rodionov correctly said - he was a good divisor, but he became lousy
Minister!
It’s a pity not to hear the opinion of the first Chechen veterans about him, they could say a lot.
But when a person dies, and even so early, it’s always bad ...

[Kern]

In our enlightened time, De mortuis aut bene, aut nihil usually plays the role of the rascal's last refuge. When a particular reptile gives up the spirit, the reptile choir less disciplined starts a goat song about the high mystery of death, the inadmissibility of dancing on the bones and spitting on the grave, about good manners and bestiality of the crowd. Along the way, wishing a painful death to all those who honestly call the deceased the scum and commemorate all the evil that he managed to commit while trashing the earth with his presence. “How can you, you beasts, gentlemen, learn restraint from ancient samples.”

more details oper.ru/news/read.php?t=1051602118

[iulai]

kern, if you say high style, you see all survived in the Chechen war? the war has not touched you? Well, yes, from the side you know better .. and in the Patriotic War, one came to the funeral, and some served in warehouses ...

[Kern]

Do you have cognitive problems?

[iulai]

Yid muzzle. sorry comrade Joseph early in the Bose.

[rexby63]

If he annoyed you so much that you already remembered Latin, then what kind of bolt were waiting for him to lean back? Let's go and get shot. And yet - I can tell you and the Goblin. A Russian person does not speak badly about a dead man, not because he is afraid of evil spirits, but because the dead man cannot answer in any way. And you and the goblin look like jackals yapping at the pad.

[wax]

The last word in the comment is very out of place.

[Walker]

In the article itself, the mistakes made by dates do not converge. So they "love" him ...

[algae]

We understand. You can't be bad about the dead. In memory of his "good" words that in Chechnya, our soldiers were dying with a smile on their faces. After that, only "good" words can be said about the deceased, especially to the relatives of these smiling soldiers.

[Mikado]

Relatives still hope that Pashka also died with a smile on his lips.

[iulai]

thanks mikado, I really hope that he will meet those dead with a smile on his lips.

[Bashkaus]

The kingdom of heaven is a newly appointed slave.
The judgment of man is one thing, the work of God is another. Not for us to judge!

If you look at the Bible and judgment on Sadom and Gomoriah, then God exterminated infants as well. Many will ask, where is mercy and justice for innocent children? Grace and justice to them consists in the fact that God took the babies so that these innocent children would not absorb the sin of their parents with age and did not indulge in hell fire along with them. Thus, through cruel death, he saved the souls of infants.

If we are talking about the thousands of dead children, I want to draw your attention to the fact that they died as the heroes of whom they threw alive in a meat grinder, in our hearts they will remain wars forever. But who knows, if they had survived and returned home after the war, if they hadn’t been in the organized criminal group, as they had grown by leaps and bounds in those troubled times? Would they not become murderers and especially dangerous attackers with a broken life after this war? Would they not kill us and our children? That is the philosophical question.
But God has a business for each of us, only he knows how to live this life with dignity, what to do and how to die in order to remain forever in glory.
So let us be merciful and do not wake up to judge this man, who is now interrupted by God and looking into his eyes. Let us leave the judgment to God, we would realize and comprehend our sins and not forget that sooner or later we ourselves will stand before God and answer for our life and if God finds in us something unworthy that we would enter heaven, the only thing we can say to him is "FORGIVE ME" to which he will ask in a kind voice "HAVE YOU FORGIVED?" So think about all those who gloat so much, and you forgave?

[Alex 241]

Russia does not favor us not with fame or ruble, but we are its last soldiers, and we must hold out until we die, ata bats, ata bats .....

[Bashkaus]

That's right, the homeland of its soldiers does not favor - I agree with this, and I also remember about the decision to drop the tank battalion into Grozny ...
It’s just all the same disgusting to look at the gloating and joy from someone’s death.

[Grenz]

Bashkausu
And you hint this to Obama and Hilary - they didn’t have to giggle like that when Benya Ladan was killed on the air, or when Hussein was hanged, or when Gaddafi was tormented.
What can they and we again repent and forgive?
For business and memory.
Don't you think that many mothers have now approached the photograph of their son - they said, "Here is my son and God's judgment has taken place!"

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: grenz

Don't you think that many mothers have now approached the photograph of their son - they said, "Here is my son and God's judgment has taken place!"

Well said...

[Alex 241]

The worst thing is to bring relatives that their father, husband, son is not !!!!!!!!! Several times happened, God forbid !!!!!!!!!

[Bashkaus]

Guys, I don’t agree with much that Grachev did, I’m talking about something else, about the deceased either good or nothing, you can’t forgive - keep quiet.
Let's add here Kadyrov, how many Russian guys did he kill? Why doesn’t anyone go to him now and say a killer to his forehead and hang him up for a typewriter? And when he dies, everyone will dance on their bones ...
My classmate was shot down in a Mi26 helicopter, though already in the second, they were symbolically missed by the jaw, or rather by the seals verified with the dentist's card. His mother then went crazy. Woe to many has come, but one cannot be likened to beasts and savages?

[Grenz]

Novosibirsky (1)
Thank you!
But these are not invented words by me.
This is my neighbor said tonight!

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: grenz

This is my neighbor said tonight!

Yes, just like that, a simple Russian woman "opens" a casket called "Truth" ... In principle, this can be the end of the conversation, boys ...

[Alex 241]

You can’t deceive a woman, she can smell it inside.

[Novosibirsky]

)) (c) Carp. Era of Mercy.

[Alex 241]

Absolutely true, Weiner immortal.

[Bashkaus]

Well, let's become the same as Hillary Clinton and Obama. What else can I say? I understand that it is difficult to remain human when emotions overwhelm, but still ...

[oper66]

there are none and we are alive - well, what do you bleat jackals

[oper66]

Watching the comet, I understand that there is one whiteness hanging — if he didn’t live, he didn’t sin — and which of you wretched could have gone through the crucible of war 0 such problems fell on his shoulders — and how can you stay alert on the Internet — Mshov well done — I’ve followed all the asses now huyray-what are you all primates no shakolopodobnye

[andrei332809]

I feel sorry for the person. but somehow I don’t want to talk about him.

[Yuri11076]

In my opinion, it’s not worth saying anything, just keep silent ...

[Kyrgyz]

So, the hero of Afghanistan, a professional paratrooper, held the first Chechen one, and the furniture maker Commerce reassured Georgia, however

[iulai]

Kirghiz, if it were not for the "east" battalion of the Chechens, I don't know how things would have turned out. they went first, with one casualty casualty. and our commander-in-chief of this district fired back from under the tank with a pistol.

[T72B]

"East" won the whole war? Alone, without artillery and tanks? Oh well. A bold and very "professional" statement.

[andrey903]

The East could not go first, because at any time it could go over to the side of the Georgians. And losses, as a rule, during the movement, among peacekeepers, you can’t do anything about it.

[vovan234]

I agree with the majority, all right guys, as the Minister of Defense, Grachev left a bad reputation behind him, recently read the book "The Chechen Trap", Grachev was looking for his own benefit, period.

[tumbajerry]

Kern Today, 19:23
1 In our enlightened time, De mortuis aut bene, aut nihil usually plays the role of the rascal's last refuge. When a particular reptile gives up the spirit, the reptile choir less disciplined starts a goat song about the high mystery of death, the inadmissibility of dancing on the bones and spitting on the grave, about good manners and bestiality of the crowd. Along the way, wishing a painful death to all those who honestly call the deceased the scum and commemorate all the evil that he managed to commit while trashing the earth with his presence. "How can you beasts, gentlemen, learn restraint from ancient samples?"

I’m translating a quote from kerna: guys, do you piss like noble college students?
if the cattle died, say so !, otherwise they shy bashfully (about the dead it’s good or nothing)
this is pure Pharisaism, an ostrich non-male position imposed on us by liberals, defenders of eltsinoids !!

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: tumbajerry

I’m translating a quote from kerna: guys, do you piss like noble college students?
if the cattle died, say so !, otherwise they shy bashfully (about the dead it’s good or nothing)
this is pure Pharisaism, an ostrich non-male position imposed on us by liberals, defenders of eltsinoids !!

I support your opinion! Because of such pseudo-value attitudes, such as "about the dead or good or blah blah blah", "God gave God took", "The Supreme Court will repay, but don't you dare" we cannot call the enemy an enemy even after death! You can see us, if not by concepts ... But who told us, brothers, that we do not understand? Who "programmed" us for this slavish behavior? Think, Slav ... Think ...

[Yarbay]

Quote: NovoSibirets

I support your opinion! Because of such pseudo-value attitudes, such as "about the dead or good or blah blah blah", "God gave God took", "The Supreme Court will repay, but don't you dare" we cannot call the enemy an enemy even after death! You can see us, if not by concepts ... But who told us, brothers, that we do not understand? Who "programmed" us for this slavish behavior? Think, Slav ... Think ...

But something else surprises me !!
The current patriotic leadership of Russia and Chubais and Grachev and all the other villains are well suited !!
Like Grachev all this time he worked in official positions, that is, it means they were satisfied !!?

[Alex 241]

Alibek, just these people are convenient and predictable, well, how can you not please your dear little man.

[Novosibirsky]

So sure, satisfied. Or did not want to ted. Or considered normal. Or were they should and are obliged to someone. Or not make money from this. Or now it’s to the detriment of the Russian state ...
Or, or, or ... But this is a completely different story ...

[iulai]

yarbay, so Chubais fucking Putin, it was he who brought the unemployed Lieutenant Colonel Putin, whom you .... were from the KGB, and from the deputies of the dog, where he was introduced to the leadership, to the Alcoholic! here is working out a guy for a place. Chubais is now in nanotechnology and even the Court of Accounts does not have the right to check it. gave the godfather a bread place!

[Bashkaus]

In general, the Slavs, for that matter, we at least buried our enemies with honors and respect.

[Novosibirsky]

And he will be buried, so be calm ... More beautiful than many ... Tomorrow turn on the "magic box".

That's just not the Walk of Fame! Places are taken there!

To the Slavs, for that matter, even during life, it was allowed to give a retribution! Their gods did not call them slaves!

I don’t want to say simply, for the time being ... I keep myself for one place simply, so as not to start talking about WHAT the Slavic spirit has expelled from us. The Slavs would not allow such dishonor on their land.
And you are right in saying that you need to speak during life, and not after the death of nits. Well, if he is gone, he also needs to pay back.

[bachast]

You don’t even have to wait tomorrow:
"Pavel Grachev became an example of courage and allegiance to the oath
This is how the current head of the department, Anatoly Serdyukov, spoke about the former defense minister who left today. He recalled that Grachev was a Hero of the Soviet Union and headed the Ministry of Defense at the most difficult time for Russia"
(Yes, I almost forgot, the source of ECHO Moscow)

[Novosibirsky]

.................................................. ...........................

[Oleg0705]

Quote: Bashkaus

In general, the Slavs, for that matter, we at least buried our enemies with honors and respect.

paid tribute to the valiant warriors (enemies) who came from outside, who fell on the battlefield.

[Apollo]

[quote = Oleg0705]

I promise you, with all, under your very ears, you will enter Winnie's skull

[Izzy]

Apolo
You are off topic, do you want to be a man? Yes, you will not become him litter
Oleg can’t answer you, the posts are over, so don’t yap mongrel

[spender]

Quote: Izzy

You are off topic, do you want to be a man?

Hear you subhuman Everyone knows perfectly well that you are leaving Vinka under a proxy under the nickname Izya, why Admin suffers this, I don’t know, but it’s not a matter of news about the death of a bad person, but to breed srach ...
Hold on !!!
Apollo I think, too, understood !!! More and more of my comments will not be, I hope everyone understood !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There are enough topics for "skirmishes" and I will take part myself, but here it is somehow disgusting !!!!!!!!!

[Apollo]

Quote: spender

Apollo I think, too, understood !!!

I have long understood Alex, proxies by the way change one of the Netherlands, the country of free ........................................ .... mores !!! IMHO

[Alex 241]

You are somehow off topic then burst into their showdown. Kindergarten with carousels.

[Novosibirsky]

I didn’t think that I would ever agree with your opinion ...))

[T72B]

Quote: tumbajerry

I’m translating a quote from kerna: guys, do you piss like noble college students?
if the cattle died, say so !, otherwise they shy bashfully (about the dead it’s good or nothing)
this is pure Pharisaism, an ostrich non-male position imposed on us by liberals, defenders of eltsinoids !!

Quote: NovoSibirets

Because of such pseudo-value attitudes, such as "about the dead or good or blah blah blah", "God gave God took", "The Supreme Court will reward, but don't you dare" we cannot call the enemy an enemy even after death! You can see us, if not by concepts ... And who told us, brothers, that we were not by concepts?

Two pluses !!! You will notice whoever invented it, when they need to, makes deviations from this rule. There is some non-official list of deceased persons who can be watered (even encouraged), but there is a list of other people who just try to hint - you won’t stink.
The truth is always the same. And there is no need for this pseudo-deviant in the form of "good or nothing". Deserved - get it. But I'm still more in favor of speaking the truth in person and during life. Grachev deserves all the "flattering" epithets. I do not see anything wrong with remembering to him all his "valor" today.

[andrey.joshua]

Due to such pseudo-value attitudes, such as "about the dead or good or blah blah blah",

Who "programmed" us for this slavish behavior?

I support you, and I will try to answer you with another question: And who invented (by the way, only for Russians) Any power from God !? Here's a respected one, from where, for the naive .... but it’s more correct to say for uneducated people, all the stench draws .... And how many more disguised thought forms, but behind Christ’s deeds, are hidden ???

[Novosibirsky]

I admit, I prefer to remain silent about this for now ...

"From now on, I keep my thoughts a secret, so that these thoughts do not frighten my neighbors ..." (c)

[andrey.joshua]

"From now on, I keep my thoughts a secret, so that these thoughts do not frighten my neighbors ..."

What, what thoughts can scare you ??? That’s it, they’ve already sailed .... The nuclear shield, they’re already rapping ..... Tomorrow we’ll wake up the serfs, and with that barcode on their foreheads .... And you say so that you don’t scare your fellow man with these thoughts .... It's worse. .. By the way, the present is an echo of yesterday's late Grachevsky ....

[Alex 241]

I recall a quote about the Russian revolt senseless and merciless.

[Novosibirsky]

All those who "let loose their snot" for the bright image of Grachev.
Here is the opinion of a person who paid for his officer honor and his honest name with his life. And another question - who was behind the death of Lev Yakovlevich.
Lev Rokhlin bow to the earth ...

[Alex 241]

Rumor had it that Rokhlin was preparing a military coup.

[Novosibirsky]

Rumors circulated that his SPN MO "executed".

[Alex 241]

it means that it was.

[Novosibirsky]

Real Officer! What I thought, what I considered right, useful for the Motherland, I said so.
Watch the whole interview, and you will already understand a lot about the causes and effects ...
If he was preparing a coup (which I doubt, because he had no real leverage), then I regret that he did not have time to accomplish it.
(for someone who listens attentively, although it would be better to be silent at all - I do not welcome, and do not approve, I, stsuk_o, am very sorry!)

[Alex 241]

I don’t remember where I ran into the info about the coup, but if I dig something, I’ll definitely drop the link.

[Grenz]

Maybe it is necessary to say that he was not preparing a "coup" but certain events to restore the situation in the country before the real coup?

[d.gksueyjd]

Quite right, and the majority of the army supported and waited for him! Eternal memory to the hero, did not let Yeltsin free Russia.

[Alex 241]

Alexander is hard to judge about this, at least for now, but according to fragmentary information, the troops loyal to him were ready to enter Moscow, but only how to verify this, although the murder of Rokhlin is better than any evidence.

[Grenz]

Alex 241
Yes, now it doesn’t matter.
Important that honor Rohlin (or Grachev will think) he didn’t drop it.
А Marshal Akhromeev! Also the hidden truth of his death. And the same honest soldier.
So for business and memory! +

[Karabin]

alex 241,
can be read here
http://expert.ru/russian_reporter/2011/28/myi-dolzhnyi-byili-arestovat-prezident
a/

[Alex 241]

Thank you, be sure to familiarize yourself.

[Yarbay]

The worthy officer was Rokhlin !!
Despite numerous threats, he found the courage and in the Duma spoke about the illegal transfer of arms to Armenia in the amount of a billion US dollars !!
Refused the star of the Hero of Russia !!

[Alex 241]

Yes, Alibek, such units, about the rest we can say: stripes do not sew on pants.

[Novosibirsky]

The worthy officer was Rokhlin !!
Refused the star of the Hero of Russia !!

The man was cleaner than the first snow ...

[Captain Vrungel]

You are right, how would the hero of Russia Kadyrov (bandit and murderers) look like a) during the time of the Combat Honored General Rokhlin "father" and "BATI" of his fighters.
Not fat-bellied "generals" and the iconostasis of anniversary trinkets on the chest (like 300 years of balalaika) ... but a warrior, the father of his children. Ordinary soldiers. Who has always carried the Victory to Russia.
о

[Alex 241]

We called jubilee tsatski stubs.

[Sasha 19871987]

gentlemen, it’s better not to say anything bad about the dead, because they cannot justify themselves, they will be honest with their conscience and keep silent about his negative achievements ....

[tumbajerry]

hear, ostrich, what kind of "gentlemen" we are to you
there are only comrades, but look for gentlemen on liberal sites ... something like that ..

[stariy]

Quote: sasha 19871987

for they cannot justify themselves

Why, he made excuses (In the style of Orshavin, or Orshavin in the style of Grachev)

[Grenz]

Sasha
He didn’t make excuses for something alive.
They will leave one by one, and we will forgive them.
And live in the crap they left for us?
If there was no judgment on earth for them, then what happens - do lawlessness - will you still be forgiven?
Well, Sasha should not be like that.
The memory of those dead - to whom he left no place on earth - does not allow this.

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: grenz

The memory of those dead - to whom he left no place on earth - does not allow this.

And that’s right ...

[Alex 241]

only the dead survive to the end of the war ....

[wax]

From the 96th there was time to make excuses. I failed, however, because there is no excuse.

[GG2012]

Quote: sasha 19871987

will be honest with their conscience and keep silent about his negative achievements ....

To be silent is to swallow.
Swallowing means it will be repeated again.
So what needs to be discussed ... to the level of truth.
The truth is more important.

[BARKAS]

In the army, they grabbed Grachev immediately remember how the 94th before the start of the 1st Chechen officers were not embarrassed about anyone who was the material of their minister!

[V. Salama]

Took note. Thanks to all. I don’t believe in God, that's why I’m upset.

[Orthodox warrior]

Here you read about the pawn and I want to rejoice at such news! It is impossible, of course, for moral reasons, but one cannot but rejoice! How many guys didn’t come back from Chechnya simply because of the dullness and bragging of Grachev. In the majority, everything was correctly assessed. Of course, not for us to judge. But you can’t forget when the people were at least a little happy, when both EBN and Chernomyrdin died. Now, and another reptile rested. It is high time! Forgive me for such a syllable, but it’s hard to resist ...

[tumbajerry]

don't and apologize all the way

[Vadivak]

Quote: Orthodox warrior

grow me for such a syllable,

We’ll be fine, but there are people who really grieve,

[Chukcha]

It’s better to keep silent.

[iulai]

here, let's keep silent about this, then we’ll help about the other and everything is fine. and I will not be silent! that Gorbachev betrayed his homeland, that Yeltsin drank, that Grachev ruined the boys who had never kissed? let's keep silent?

[Bashkaus]

Nobody makes anyone silent, if you are not happy with something, go to Kadyrov, Chubais, etc. who are still alive and ask from them, otherwise you only gloat about the dead like vultures indeed! I also do not agree with Grachev, he did a lot wrong, but this is not a reason to mock the dead so! Judge YES over the living, NO now over the dead
POINT

[Novosibirsky]

Oh, how right you are ..., and, oh how crafty is your truth ...

You urge a person to commit suicide! Do you have a moral right to judge him for the innate instinct of self-preservation ..?! For what people call cowardice? !!
Or do you justify your own inaction by at least honoring the memory of your tyrants? !! Like, since I was silent during his lifetime, it justifies me that I am silent after his death ... Interesting solitaire, right?
I already wrote to you above, of course you are right .... You offer the slave to rise and overthrow the dictator! But not like the Leader, or Spartak, leading the movement !!! But as an equal in cowardice, as a mocker of his and his weakness.
Your position is undeniably win-win in form ... I really hope that throughout your life you will be sure that it is true in content ...
Sincerely.

[Alex 241]

As my friend, an honored paratrooper, told me: a man will not live bent all his life, when he will someday unbend ....

[ilichstar]

YES HOW MUCH SAME CAN YOU BE SILENT ?? !!! WHEN SOLDIERS HOW IN THE DASH SHOWN SILENT! WHEN THE FIGHT GENERALS WERE SHOT OUT AND THE COLONELS ARE ALSO SILENT ... ALSO WHAT SHOULD BE DONE WHICH WOULD NOT BE SILENT?

[with]

Quote: ilichstar

WHEN SOLDIERS HOW IN THE DASH SHOWN SILENT!

You yourself BLACK SOLDIER!!!
In truth, "Make the fool pray to God, he will break his forehead." !!

[Alex 241]

You need to feel like a PEOPLE. Not an electorate, a state and a bunch of crackling names. It’s the people, the whole who unfortunately happens when something happens. And so we all go home. Kursk, Beslan, Nord OST, house bombings, we all understood, we are all in the same boat. As soon as we quietly got loans, bought cars, apartments, cottages. And we are silent. The guys’s imaginary well-being.

[with]

Quote: Alex 241

. As soon as they quietly scored loans, bought cars, apartments, cottages.

To help your post !!))
And I ... and I ... and I ... (pressed the hedgehogs with a bare ass !!)

[Alex 241]

In the words of Zhvanetsky: what can be corrected in the hospital?

[Brother Sarych]

It would be better if he remained the division commander ...
It is not for us to judge him - God will judge ....

[T72B]

Quote: Brother Sarich

It is not for us to judge him - God will judge ....

Why not to us? Just do not need about some higher space authorities. If you follow the principle God will judge, then in this way any scum can be left unpunished.

[Brother Sarych]

This character is unlikely to me, I have never had a special regret about his fate, but I do not consider it possible to judge a person by the more than politicized statements of no less sympathetic characters ...
By the way, in Chechnya it is to him that I don’t have much complaints - it’s not his main fault ...

[T72B]

I will not talk about Chechnya, because there is a lot of dregs and it’s hard to understand what he specifically did and what was attributed to him. I have only one question for this character: he didn’t know who Yeltsin was when he rushed into his camp with his pants up?

[SenyaYa]

As one regiment said in a day, it’ll take a formidable ... mmm ... eternal memory

[Imperial]

Do not forget, do not forgive !!!

[segamegament]

My dear 131omsbr completed the task on December 31.12.2004, 01.01.1995, and already on XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX it was this fag who passed it !!!

[Drappier]

The breivik is too smart, and about this General Petrov said, Pasha the Fool

[ilichstar]

to burn him in hell .... I hope the new year of the 95th will be reminded of him there!

[Gorchakov]

I read the message about the death of Pasha-Mercedes ... Nothing sank in my soul ... But in general, for me it has ceased to exist since 1992 ... I just don’t want to respond badly, but I don’t remember it with a kind word either ....

[Bort radist]

Some sighed - finally paid off, while others - finally, will be to whom to write off.

[Mr.Fox]

Brothers, do not judge, but you will not be judged. Somehow it's not human. He died on that point. In the end, to prove someone's guilt or innocence is a court.

[ilichstar]

Ie guys .... kids to send to the slaughter, men to betray it humanly ?! Yes, I prayed that his heavenly punishment would overtake .. since laws on the earth were not written to him! I'm sorry that he died so easily! let him sit in water and slop for a couple of months and then cut off his head!

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: Mr.Fox

In the end, to prove someone's guilt or innocence is a court.

It’s strange this saying of yours ... Do not consider it insolence, are you a man who has lived? I mean - not young?

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

Brothers, do not judge, but you will not be judged. Somehow it's not human. He died on that point. In the end, to prove someone's guilt or innocence is a court.

And the fact that this nigga..we betrayed the Russians living there, yes, no, I personally won’t curse him, but I will also give condolences. Now the main point to put in this story. And in order to do this, you need to send the rest of the participants to a meeting with God.

[field commander]

I still remember his moronic smile when he said that we would take Grozny in one regiment. Our team was already raised to be sent to Chechnya in 94. They cursed him all from a soldier and above. It’s a pity that he was not dead until the trial.

[Ruslan67]

for so many years you weren’t tired of remembering it without bothering to think: why did he say that? he was right - the formidable could have been taken by one or two regiments if the drunken battle set the army a real combat mission — to destroy the enemy! instead of establishing a mythical constitutional order, first carpet bombardment, then shelling of MLRS over areas, then by forces of two regiments, it is better than internal troops to clean the territory, which is not clear?

[lewerlin53rus]

There are absolutely no good or bad people. So no need to break spears and quarrel now

[ilichstar]

how sorry Budanov was !!!!!!! AND BEFORE WHAT THE DEATH OF THIS NITA rejoices!

[iulai]

tomorrow at work, I fall asleep, another bad person died, I feel good, I believe God is in the world, good night to everyone, my huge and beloved country! God forbid, tomorrow some kind of bad person will die, that’s the joy of everyone!

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

tomorrow at work, I fall asleep, another bad person died, I feel good, I believe God is in the world, good night to everyone, my huge and beloved country! God forbid, tomorrow some kind of bad person will die, that’s the joy of everyone!

Most likely not God, but the GRU or the FSB. Hands reached out to him that's all.

[ilichstar]

it is unlikely ... if only someone outside working hours has earned money ... secretly from the authorities.

[Novosibirsky]

I agree, there is no motive. Would have been, would have been "glued" earlier.

[Alex 241]

He is a beaten card, nobody needs it.

[Normal]

For the division with the Chechens of Soviet stocks of weapons, for the outbreak of the Chechen war, for the boys dying with a smile on their lips to burn him in hell forever!

[kNow]

The soldier is Rokhlin. Soldier - Shamans. And Grachev - .... I will not say anything better ...

[Captain Vrungel]

Fate brought Grachev together twice The first time in Afgan. The second time was in Klaipeda (Lithuania), when the Western Group of Forces was withdrawn from Germany on the Mukran-Klaipeda ferries. On our line, we observed the mess that Grachev's subordinates were doing. "Pasha-Mercedes" - that's putting it mildly. In Klaipeda, quartermasters sold everything from vegetable oil to pasta. "Smirnovskaya", up to auto equipment and everything that can be sold. The commandant service from the Western Group of Forces (majors, captains, lieutenants) was changed to Muscovites (colonels, lieutenant colonels and one major). We lived in one hotel "Jura" (in Lithuanian "More"). Before our very eyes, equipment was unloaded from the ferry according to the document "cars that cannot be repaired". But in fact, in half-wagons, mayors, audi, bmws, but that was the end of my career. We were sent to the "homeland" as if they had been fought in Ukraine. They sang the wrong tune.

[Novosibirsky]

I have the same information.

[Alex 241]

Kupino IAP.In terms of anxiety, as the crews say about the cars. The team went on the air, everyone went out, the team started and steered through the UPC. They started and 4 cars steered. There is no kerosene ...

[d.gksueyjd]

I offer my condolences to my relatives.
Something Chubais was delayed, but it’s time.

[mechanic11]

I well remember the interview where Grachev was outraged that some kid had a Mercedes, and why he shouldn’t. War is too serious a matter to trust the military, which confirmed Grachev’s behavior.

[I-16M]

About the dead, good or nothing. But in history he WILL NOT GO IN as: soldier, good commander, talented commander, patriot, man of honor. The main dirty trickster surrounded himself with gray mediocrities, and this was one of them.

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

Well, today they just remembered him, that’s the irony. Okay, that's the end of the story. True, not all of its participants have died yet, but this is a fixable matter... As for Pasha, to hell with him. About the dead it is either good or nothing. So personally, I will remain silent.

[I-16M]

Something was not right in Ryazan in those years. Second miscarriage, after Lebyodkin

[Prosto vovochka]

He broke the fates and souls of thousands... peace be upon him, he died as he deserved...

[andrey903]

Compared to Serdyukov, he is Mother Teresa

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

andrey903

What the hell are you... fucking... do you even know what you just said right now???!!!!!!!!

[ilichstar]

God forbid under Serdyukov such a new year as under Pasha in 94-95

[x-men]

Grachev owed the continuation of his brilliant career during the times of the new Russia to the right choice that he made in August 1991. As commander of the USSR Airborne Forces, he first obeyed the order of the Minister of Defense Yazov to send troops to Moscow, but then went over to the side of Boris Yeltsin
how so?????? I ask you how is this possible? he betrayed his homeland, he betrayed what was entrusted to him (what would happen if they entrusted your life to him?) he betrayed the country nefi praise him, I am a Russian child, I remember how I plowed the gardens for the great Russia, for their sovereignty, for ours deflot, for us to those creatures who abandoned us, and now the bitches have forgiven us, for the base behind the airfield, for Sevastopol, our grandfathers, our grandfathers and their grandfathers, their sons and our sons drank in 0-1941, and we are squabbling, everyone in the CIS has a grudge against us has, and I want to ask, were you creatures then when the default destroyed us? you were creatures when we almost had a khan?

[bachast]

Former world heavyweight boxing champion, South African Corey Sanders, was killed during a restaurant robbery on September 22 at the Thatch Haven restaurant near Brits, where Sanders' nephew was celebrating his birthday that day. A witness to the robbery said that there were three attackers - they burst into the restaurant and opened fire. According to the witness, Sanders was not being a hero, he was simply unlucky to be in the wrong place at the wrong time - he was standing at the door and one of the bullets hit him. The athlete was wounded in the stomach and died a few hours after hospitalization. Corey Sanders was the WBU world champion from 1997-2000 and the WBO world champion from 2003-2004. In 2003, Sanders won the championship title by knocking out Wladimir Klitschko.

And I will remember the warrior...

[Novosibirsky]

Quote: bachast

And I will remember the warrior...

If you are talking about Corey, then I will add you another true legendary fighter! A man whom his fans and lovers called nothing less than “Lionheart”.
The great and fearless Arturo Gatti!!!
Killed by his wife (or her hirelings) with a down pillow...
True, this death was later reclassified as suicide... but those who followed Gatti knew that this was the evil truth. ))

(and yes, by the way, Corey fought like a tiger back then!)

[bachast]

Well, who doesn’t know Gatti..Especially the trilogy with Word
It’s just that the death of Sanders gives me more emotions than the death of Grachev. That’s how it is, although he also served under Minister Grachev

[red 015]

about the dead it’s either good or nothing, so I won’t say anything

[jagdpanzer]

Are you slandering Grachev, why is the current one better? your angry tirades make him neither cold nor hot. Yes, he did a lot of business in his time, but what if Serdyukov had been in his place at that time? would it be better? I don’t want to justify him in any way, what happened and what happened, but you can’t spit bile like that, people like

[x-men]

that time is not right, don't give a damn, we lost!!!! and this haunts us because it’s like it’s 1 on 1, they’re trying to convince us that John Rambaud will come running without shooting and shoot us the khan, when in response the characters fire at them from Kalash guns, chewing devil, it’s not us who were firing! !!!

[x-men]

dk, we are brigade shaks, or rather trolls who did not serve, God forbid, there is a war, what are we doing?

[Zomanus]

Yes, for people like Grachev, there is a “soldier’s tribunal”. The stupid and terrible losses of the beginning of the first Chechen war are the last thing that will be remembered when his name is pronounced. Well, as for theft... Then everyone stole as much as they could and as best they could. The only thing that evokes sympathy is the fact that he did not live to see the trial.

[x-men]

Damn, listen to the words. As the commander of the USSR Airborne Forces, he first obeyed the order of the Minister of Defense Yazov to send troops to Moscow, but then went over to the side of Boris Yeltsin. how so, call this creature a shame!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Alex 241]

During the August putsch, the regiment was ready once, we were standing with a suspended ammunition, and we couldn’t understand what was happening, it’s good that the guys in TECH had a TV, at least they occasionally told us something. Then the readiness was repulsed. And after a few days they began to find out who we were fighting for They got together, the officers’ meeting decided who they were for Yeltsin, and then they parted ways. It was so bad in my soul... the operetta army. After all, everyone understood that this was not so.

[vladimir64ss]

No comment.

[vladimir64ss]

Well, why -! The Samara regiment died in Grozny. Do you think it's easy not to swear?

[Novosibirsky]

Did you fight? Is “no comment” swearing? )) Say everything you think, don’t be silent! The very fact that you speak up and don’t remain silent is already great. Maybe someone will put a cross!

[vasek-3180]

he's fucked up and away!!!!!!

[Novosibirsky]

Haven't seen it for a long time. What's so?

[vasek-3180]

There were a lot of problems, there was no time...

[sapulid]

You know, I read the comments and thought a little. Personally, my attitude towards Pashka-Mercedes is sharply negative. He did not serve under his command in Afghanistan. He marked the rest of his life with corruption and copious amounts of soldier's blood. Maybe some of the Afghan veterans will remember his good deeds? Can someone put in a good word for him?
I will not mock the corpse. I hope he will have to answer to the souls of the guys who died through his fault.

[Alex 241]

I would not like to appear before this court.

[davoks]

We remember him Pasha Mercedes. and the airborne regiment with which he was going to take Grozny. It’s either good or nothing about the dead, but I can’t say anything good about this dead one. There are servants, and there are veterans - this one belongs to the latter. He will feel warm next to Yeltsin

[Oleg14774]

Give up this saying “about the dead it’s either good or nothing.” What you deserve is what you should get. Otherwise, this is fraught with the fact that everyone, thinking about it, will do what he wants. Having earned good respect means respect for centuries! He earned the nickname Mercedes Pasha, which means the people gave it to him rightly so. People see everything. The fact that he didn’t put the army under the knife. This is a merit (although if I had supported the putsch, then maybe we would have followed the path of development of China or maybe there would have been an even better path, without destroying or destroying anything, but this is a “regret if” and “maybe”) The fact that he sold out and went over to the side of the exiled Cossacks, violating the order and oath, is not forgiven. It was for ordinary people that the Yeltsinoids and Gorbys were democrats, for people who did not understand politics. And for such figures who graduated from higher party schools and were given truly correct lectures, this was an open betrayal of the people and the country. Perhaps the very fact that he did not allow the army to be “reformed” at that time is an indicator of “repentance”. But history is silent about this. We have what we have.

[wolverine7778]

doctors are hiding the true reason for Grachev’s hospitalization.
A clear cause of death was never reported

[needles]

It’s just that his level was... the level of an airborne regiment commander.

[Onotollah]

Consign it to oblivion as it never happened. He is not worthy of memory, even if it is unkind.

[kontrzasada20]

How come the medical institution did not clarify the cause of death? What does this even mean? Either it’s this morning, or I don’t understand something.

[Notarius]

TRAITOR! After death he will have judgment

[Oleg14774]

Yes, Gaidaryon is already there, but Chubais really stayed behind. The guys are doing a bad job!

[Larus]

This man betrayed his homeland and violated his oath for the promised 30 coins.

[pogis]

Started well, ended badly! Heaven does not threaten him!

[pogis]

http://partizzan1941.ucoz.ru/load/3-1-0-38

[Ruslan67]

I didn’t want to write anything for a long time, but I finally decided about the nickname: what do you think the Defense Ministry of a nuclear superpower should drive? on the Volga of the 60s or better by tram? who directly gave the order to send troops into Chechnya? who threw the tanks into the city? Grachev personally or the one who commanded on the spot? In addition to young conscripts, were there junior and senior officers with higher military education, or did a crowd of conscripts go to the assault without permission? By the way, at that time almost all officers received their education in the USSR, so what did they study in schools and academies? to fight? I already doubt it, it seems more like they learned to whine about how small their salary is and that Grachev is personally to blame for all this, who was against sending troops without proper preparation? Oh well!

[V. Salama]

Ruslan67, in order to discuss this subject, you must at least graduate from military school. You don't own the item, absolutely...

[Ruslan67]

I would like to hear an explanation from a specialist, except for the question about the gelding, everything is already clear here

[V. Salama]

I got the impression that you took on the unseemly role of shifting the blame to the wrong people, but if this is not the case, then you will have to explain, since I got involved. I wouldn’t want to pretend to be a specialist and look like a bore, but I can’t sum it up briefly without abstractions:
1. The army is a hierarchical structure, with strictly regulated areas of responsibility and competence of control bodies (subjects of control: commander, chief). Designed for combat operations (essence: destruction of the enemy and increasing survivability - various sets of measures, including combat and other types of support). All this is subject to management (two dozen functions, including “identifying and assessing the situation, making decisions, communicating tasks, organizing interaction and comprehensive support, monitoring, developing corrective decisions, providing assistance to performers”), which has the goal of maintaining combat readiness and combat effectiveness , successful completion of assigned tasks. Management bodies at all levels must manage “continuously and promptly” their management objects, within the established competence and allocated resources, naturally, with the required efficiency, for which everyone is fully responsible.
On the one hand, the management activity of a higher level is a special type of support for the activities of a lower level, on the other hand, a lower level is a means of a higher level to achieve its goals. Consequently, in this hierarchy it is impossible to be effective if the management process above you is absent or it is harmful (the goals of the higher and lower levels do not coincide), if for these reasons you have a lack of your own resource in quantity and quality (otherwise the set goals are achieved “ a specific resource or depletion of a subsystem” - at the cost of courage, fortitude and the lives of soldiers). What should an officer do under these conditions? To be indignant, to “ring the alarm” - but there is a Combat Order and Military Regulations. To take it and refuse is to disrupt the combat mission and take responsibility for additional losses. And why should he refuse? - there are difficulties in the country, but the Motherland ordered, and he cannot “see the whole picture” and know that he was basely set up, and in the war the businessmen of one, and the other, and a third party learned to actively make money.

[V. Salama]

2. The army is an instrument of the state and it cannot be outside of politics, since war, by definition, “is a continuation of politics by other means.” And the Minister of Defense is called a minister because he must be aware of this policy and know that the first Chechen war began as a mafia showdown at the state level, as a struggle of the EBN team for property - oil refineries. And the command to the troops from above “forward - stop - back” was given not based on military expediency, but depending on how successfully or unsuccessfully the negotiations on the division of this property progressed. Well, for the quality of his management, he is also in demand “along its entire length,” Rokhlin partly formulated.
This is on an abstract level, but those who shed blood can tell you specifically, I don’t think I have the right to do that.

[Ruslan67]

You answered very specifically and generally without abstractions, but it’s a little bit different, I had something completely different in mind: what was the order? How did the lower and middle level commanders act? who ultimately launched heavy armored vehicles into the city ahead of the infantry? How was reconnaissance carried out? Was artillery preparation carried out before the assault? You can quote charters, job descriptions, etc., but behind each specific action there is a specific unit commander who has people and equipment subordinate to him, fire support equipment, what were the actions these officials directly on the spot before and during the assault? we know the result, we would like to understand why he is like this and who is personally to blame and not blame everything en masse on Grachev alone, and note that no one ever mentioned either his deputies or the general staff or the district commander with a pack of adjutants and guarantors, as if Grachev personally ordered the introduction of tanks into the city ahead of the infantry so that they would be burned there

[V. Salama]

I missed (did not explain): I cited the statutes to the point that, according to their requirements, the subordinate must first carry out the order and then appeal it. And now, in peacetime, in the Court we have the problem of appealing against illegal decisions of the leader, but here is a war zone, there is no time for records for the prosecutor.
Undoubtedly, he is not the only one to blame; he could not have done anything without his entourage, recruited according to the appropriate principles, who, like him, turned out to be unable to resist the “new values” imposed at that time by the unofficial ideology on the entire society. But clearly, this essentially applies to representatives of upper-level management bodies. This is their fault, since it is precisely within their competence to develop the plan of the operation based on identification (organization of all types of reconnaissance and obtaining intelligence data) and assessment of the situation in the proposed area of ​​​​combat operations. This is their competence in determining the composition of the group (the totality of the necessary and sufficient composition of forces and means to carry out the operation plan) and assessing its capabilities based on the entire set of indicators of combat effectiveness and combat readiness. According to General Rokhlin, neither the necessary reconnaissance nor other important types of support were organized, and the required level of combat effectiveness was not achieved (they trumpeted from the stands about a professional army, but recruits were sent into battle, there are no modern means of communication, etc.). They will all be mentioned again, there will be a reason. But Grachev still bears the main responsibility, because these personnel were appointed by his orders, and his Decision lies at the basis of the operation plan (although formally it was developed on the basis of proposals from the corresponding headquarters). Because this Army is an extremely centralized system, there is a fair statement - “if you claim centralized control, you must understand that you accept full responsibility for the final result.” Either the Supreme Commander-in-Chief is to blame; I don’t think he delved into issues of troop command and control at all (he delegated authority, so to speak). And Grachev did a lot to increase the combat effectiveness of the militants; here it will be more difficult to place the blame on his subordinates. In general, they did not deal with combat effectiveness - the entire reform of the Armed Forces boiled down to attempts to solve economic problems at the expense of the Army, while not forgetting to grab their pockets. As for the assault itself, I am not a witness, but I have already argued that little here could depend on the middle management. As far as I remember from open publications: they were simply ambushed, they underestimated the enemy’s strength (it’s clear why), they could not ensure the secrecy of control (largely due to the imperfection of communications and underestimating the enemy’s radio interception capabilities), moreover, for this reason they succumbed to "radio game" Naturally, what kind of artillery preparation is it if you don’t know the targets? The tanks were sent forward for the same reason - they underestimated the enemy, but they wanted to save people. Such a decision is part of the operation plan, and even if it was made directly during the operation, it was at the very top level or was authorized by this level (the headquarters in these conditions is the structure that develops proposals, formalizes the decision and organizes its implementation).

[Ruslan67]

I convincingly agree with you in many respects, but as always there are, but already at the division level there are serious means of reconnaissance, fire support for communications, etc., and all this is not commanded by a captain or major, but as was customary in the USSR, a general with the corresponding entourage, most of them received their stars back in Soviet times and finding ourselves in a real combat situation we were unable to organize prepare to evaluate the enemy, the list can go on for a long time. I myself don’t sympathize with Grachev very much and I’m not trying to whitewash him, but when a combat officer who is now deceased is thrown mud at him for something that he physically could not do alone - to be personally in in all places at once and to control everything myself, I don’t like it; there is a large share of the blame on him, but along with him it is necessary to put a long line of those to blame to a much greater extent and for specific cases and mistakes directly on the spot and not for holding a position and carrying out the orders of the supreme

[V. Salama]

Regarding the “Soviet generals” - it was the case, he complained, that he hoped, trusted. This reeks of slyness, although he doesn’t seem to be sly, so there’s more likely a discrepancy in the level of competence (arguments like: “I physically couldn’t do it alone - to be personally in all places at once” and “it’s necessary to put a long line of people at fault to a much greater extent and for specific cases and mistakes directly on the spot and not for holding a position and carrying out the orders of the supreme” are not suitable here). I don’t want to spoil this assessment because it is based on assumptions, albeit reasonable ones. And why am I talking about the “abstract level”, because the purpose of all my writing was the desire to show that in such situations (the combat effectiveness of troops, the quality of the command and control system) the main fault “formally and legally” lies at the top (EBN, Minister), but in fact the information only confirms this. At the same time, all this “evidence base” of mine is divorced from reality (I am not a participant in the events) and does not take into account many factors, perhaps very significant, but which, I believe, in such a situation, will not be able to change this assessment. This is just my opinion.
“... when a military officer who is now deceased is thrown mud at him...” - I refrained, I don’t know what worked, dogma, or just tired of swearing at the TV at one time. I can’t condemn others for this, if only because it corresponds to the morals of our society (let’s remember the great people whom everyone has slandered all over the country).

[Ruslan67]

So we come up against the fact that history must judge and much more time must pass to put everything in its place and to organize dances on bones, well, I don’t know, it seems to me that many should look in the mirror and hang everything on one or two people when everything is old the system collapsed and a new one hasn’t been created yet, it’s just stupid

[V. Salama]

As a preamble: “Truth spoken out loud is a lie. Therefore, only one thing can be asserted, that nothing can be asserted. The only truth is that everything is relative.”
From these positions (to keep it short) I will make several statements:

This is not a logical conclusion based on the results of our dialogue. I guess I still don’t know how to explain. Rumor condemns (more correctly, people accuse), the Court judges (and whether it condemns or not depends on two things: whether this Court is righteous or not and whether the person is guilty or not), and History will judge whether both the rumor and the Court were right.
Rumor will not condemn - and the court will not condemn (no statement - no case). We all have the right to judge everything and everything we see fit. This is the moral right of a free person. This was not always the case (morally) or even legal (for example: in a non-legal state). Now in Russia, a bill is being prepared according to which it will be punishable to condemn the work of judges, although we are all consumers of a service to protect our own legal rights (they say, we are not professionals and cannot understand anything either about the laws or our conscience). Namely, the Law and conscience are the only things (according to their Code) that a judge should be guided by in his activities. Following this logic, one can pass a law according to which only the shoemaker can judge the cobbler, and the pie-maker can judge the pie-maker, and, accordingly, only the criminal can judge a criminal.
The biblical “judge not, lest ye be judged” - I will not explain the meaning (at the everyday level about everyday things - let it work), although I have already explained why this phrase does not work here (we live in a time when religion no longer fulfills the function state ideology). Rumor condemned - guilty! He has every right. Only now there was no Court and perhaps there will never be (it depends on the state, on the authorities - “a raven is a crow... do not judge and you will not be judged”, corporate interest so to speak..) it is the people (victims, witnesses, parents of the dead) who express your righteous anger with your “immoral” speeches. After all, nothing prevents the state from publishing the necessary materials about problematic events. Well, History, of course, will judge, but it does not punish according to deeds, that’s the problem (the dream of a criminal). So, let her reason, but the victims should blame, and the righteous Court should judge.
Well, if the accused did not live to see the Court, the dogma “to speak about the deceased is either good or nothing”, I have already explained - this is everyone’s personal business (the mother of a deceased soldier can be asked what she considers it necessary to say about the one who escaped punishment), especially since that for our society this is moral, encouraged by the state - let’s live until the anniversary of the start of the First World War, we will see how much crap will pour from the highest stands onto great people. I personally didn’t, although I went to the page with this, read the comments and for some reason changed my mind.
The statement: “it seems to me that many people should look in the mirror, but pinning everything on one or two people when the entire old system has collapsed and a new one has not yet been created is simply stupid” is not suitable as an argument here. “Well, I looked at myself in the mirror - crap, crap, so what? “It hasn’t gotten any easier, you can’t bring your son back” - this is only one of the possible answers. And it’s not all about him alone, but about the system, it’s just that a reason has appeared to talk about him.

[8 company]

In Afghanistan, I never heard anything bad about Grachev; he commanded a regiment and division with dignity. But then he clearly didn’t pull it off: there was a lot of negativity about him and about the withdrawal of our troops from Germany, and about other topics. And there’s nothing to say about sending troops into Grozny in 1994-95 without proper preparation - it’s just a shame. He fell under Yeltsin and did everything that this drunkard commanded him. I hope that at the top he will meet with the boys who were laid up in Grozny.

[jakondana]

it should have been closed under Article 278 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation http://www.pravoparitet.ru/uk/s273/ for his tricks with Yeltsin

[Mr.Fox]

Quote: NovoSibirets

It’s strange this saying of yours ... Do not consider it insolence, are you a man who has lived? I mean - not young?

Let’s just say that I’m not 18 for a long time and I’ve had time to live and see different things.

[Allegedly]

I don’t think you can find many *combat officers* with the nickname *Pasha Mercedes*, it’s like *Uncle Misha TWO percent*. And even if once upon a time he did something worthy, his subsequent deeds not only crossed out everything, this man, so to speak, cursed himself. And I am very sorry that there is no hell in the understanding of Catholics, with its devils and cauldrons, it is a great pity. Young, intelligent boys who would like to live and live, they are the color of the gene pool, at the most fertile age. Has anyone even remotely tried to calculate how many children were not born because of them? How many young women (forgive my frankness, there are no insults here) were deprived of their future loved ones, grooms, husbands? And it was not the worst who died, not the sick or lame, not even the intelligentsia or any minorities. How many mothers have had a piece of their heart torn out, sadistically, alive? It personally offends me that someone else dares to say something kind about him, and people like him. How is this possible? Do you know what kind of sin you take on your soul?...

[Ulysses]

This is the case when a short period of time in a person’s life can spoil a long life path.
For the majority, he still remained “Pasha the Mercedes” and “one parachute regiment in 24 hours.”