The Ministry of Defense has declassified archival documents for the 80th anniversary of the start of the counteroffensive of the Red Army near Moscow

The Ministry of Defense declassified archival documents related to the battles in November - December 1941. The materials are published on the eve of the 80th anniversary of the start of the counteroffensive near Moscow.

A new multimedia section has been opened on the official website of the Ministry of Defense called: "Great turn near Moscow. Dedicated to the immortal feat of the defenders of the capital"... In this section, visitors can familiarize themselves with unique documents previously available only to specialists. The entire section is devoted to the events of the late autumn and early winter of 1941, taking place on the right wing of the Western Front, where units of the Red Army did not allow Nazi troops to bypass Moscow from the north.

In the section, you can familiarize yourself with declassified documents, including: an operational map of the General Staff of the Red Army with a counteroffensive plan, Zhukov's explanatory note to Stalin, orders, operational reports and war logs, as well as other documents telling about the organization of Moscow's defense and the preparation of a counteroffensive. In addition, part of the documents of the German command with plans for the encirclement and seizure of Moscow is presented.

As has been repeatedly stated in the Russian military department, the publication of documents from the Central Archives of the Ministry of Defense is aimed at protecting and protecting historical truth, to counter the falsifications of history undertaken by Western countries. Recently, numerous attempts have been noticed to falsify historical events, distort history and belittle the role of the Red, and then the Soviet army. In some countries, Soviet soldiers are called not liberators, but invaders, and such cases are becoming more and more.

By publishing declassified documents about the events of the Great Patriotic War, the Ministry of Defense does not allow lies to spread, defending the historical truth.

Comments

[75 Sergey]

The question is, why did the chronology of these events have to be kept "secret" for already 80 years ?! After all, that feat of the Soviet people and every Soviet person of that time does not cause doubts! They knew what their fathers were fighting for and it was clear to them what they were fighting for, we have forgotten that.

[Grandfather]

Quote: 75Sergey

The question is, why did the chronology of these events have to be kept "secret" for already 80 years ?! After all, that feat of the Soviet people and every Soviet person of that time does not cause doubts!

question...

[Troll]

In a nutshell: For ideological purposes.
That is, under the Union, for these purposes, they kept secret both the number of victims and the mistakes and / or deliberate actions of the command that caused them. In addition, in order to resolve the national question and educate the Soviet Man, they covered up the delicate decisions and measures applied by the authorities to some individual nationalities that distinguished themselves by massive betrayal during the Second World War.

After the collapse of the Soviet Union, all this was mostly covered up by inertia.

[Olgovich]

Quote: 75Sergey

The question is, why did the chronology of these events have to be kept "secret" for already 80 years ?!

There are a lot of similar questions: the genocide of our citizens is obvious and well-known.

Why the FIRST case of the genocide of our citizens appeared only in... 2019 ?!

WHY only in March 2021 Investigative Committee (IC) of the Russian Federation in
initiated a criminal case on the genocide of the peoples of the USSR during the Great Patriotic War, with which he combined all investigated cases of Nazi crimes against civilians into one proceeding, why was this not done decades ago, in hot pursuit?

[Avior]

Someone recently wrote that all archives are declassified.
And the article is a clear illustration of the fact that archives are declassified selectively, which leaves a wide field for various assumptions, versions, and even conjectures.

[Crowe]

I don’t know who wrote this to you, but more than half of the archive is classified. For example, our men, who are looking for our fellow countrymen, including near Moscow, said that, for example, in Rzhev, almost all combat logs below the regimental level are absent. for access, and most of the maps are not given for review, which makes it very difficult to find. at least a handful of native land should be put in that place for relatives ... "The war is not over until the last soldier who died in it is buried." so that work in this direction would move faster, otherwise we, whose fathers, brothers, uncles fought less and less every year ..

[Avior]

I was recently convinced otherwise

Why are the archives in Podolsk closed then?

They have been open for a long time, work come .. across Rzhev, for example, vme openly

https://topwar.ru/189648-sokrovischa-rejha-torgovlja-ljudmi.html#comment-id-11981491
What is declassified is excellent, but what is declassified selectively, this is not very good - there is too much room for speculation and interpretation

[Kerensky]

"The war is not over until the last soldier who died in it is buried.

For a quarter of a century I have been trying to bury the soldiers near Rzhev. The war is not over ... The comrades-in-arms are already extinct, there is no one to go to the woods with ...

[Roma 1977]

The Ministry of Defense has its own multi-ton archives, unlike the Ministry of Internal Affairs or the FSB. But there is no such folder called "especially fried facts, especially for non-profit bloggers." There are stacks of forms about how much stew was eaten and how many footcloths the fighters of the third company of the twenty-fifth regiment of the three hundred and forty-fifth rifle division lost irretrievably in a fire in a dugout. Only some aspects of plans for military operations are closed to outsiders, but even then, over the years, they have been declassified little by little, since their disclosure will no longer be able to cause any damage to defense capabilities. But the preparation for declassification is not a quick process, because it needs an expert opinion that so many tons of yellowed paper can be given to everyone who wants to read it.

[victor50]

Quote: Roma-1977

Only some aspects of plans for military operations are closed to outsiders, but even then, over the years, they have been declassified little by little

When I was trying to find information about my grandfather, I was informed that the information on the spare shelves was secret. What does this have to do with the preparation and conduct of hostilities?

[Roma 1977]

Like, information about the mobile reserve. They probably have a different degree of secrecy. Bureaucracy, of course. But such orders.

[Avior]

preparation for declassification is not a quick process, because it needs an expert opinion that so many tons of yellowed paper can be given to everyone who wants to read it.

And what is the point in an expert opinion at once and tons of paper? The experts won't even look at them. And if for each piece of paper an expert opinion will never be declassified, the paper will crumble earlier.
There is a second question - what is the real scientific value of documents that have been declassified according to the principle described in the article - what is beneficial to declassify, what is not profitable - not to declassify - selective declassification?

[mikh-korsakov]

Here, many blame why the archives are not declassified, they say, why why are we not allowed to trample on the bones of Zhukov and Stalin once again. Those who are not good explain - they say. this is so that this does not happen again in the future. And do those who do not know know that God forbid it should happen that no one will ask these people with bright faces whether this military operation corresponds to their ideas about the protection of human rights and other heresy. There just won't be time. The commander who, instead of giving the order, begins to hesitate for a long time, he will destroy his soldiers. In addition, who will give a guarantee that all the information in the archives is true, and not because of the decision to whitewash Zhukov, but simply by mistake in a hurry, as a result of an intelligence error and an erroneous report.

[tatra]

Well, yes, the Soviet enemies of the communists declassify, and stubbornly classify their own.

[Paranoid50]

Quote: tatra

the enemies of the communists declassify

What a delight, and back in the arena ...
Are you still alive, my old lady?
I'm alive too, hello to you, hello
S.A. Yesenin

[Spring fluff]

The immediate question is - why are the rest of the files not declassified? are these pests who hide their exploits?

[sad235]

And the archives were classified again for 50 years Not everything is so smooth in the Danish kingdom

[Ros 56]

What has been declassified is great, adequate people will definitely familiarize themselves if they are interested in this issue. And for Russophobes and our enemies it is indifferent, they are stubborn in their stupidity, they piss in the eyes, and they are God's dew.

[YOUR]

By publishing declassified documents about the events of the Great Patriotic War, the Ministry of Defense does not allow lies to spread, defending the historical truth.

It was high time. Or that they were afraid that the mistakes of the command would become known. There is no such thing as infallible.

[Konnick]

Or that they were afraid that the mistakes of the command would become known. There is no such thing as infallible.

You read a combat order for the offensive of a division, then for another division, and the orders are simply carbon-copied with general phrases. And so on up to the company. There are not just mistakes, but simply unsubscribes. Perhaps they somehow verbally made specific instructions, but reading the database log, you are convinced that they did not. The more significant is the feat of a simple soldier with his combat initiative and the lower is the assessment of our command. Perhaps that is why it was classified.

[YOUR]

All orders are written this way. only the description of the enemy, the names of the performers, the numbers of the units, and the combat mission change. And so everything is like a blueprint.
Well, maybe some particularly significant orders will be different. Defend a settlement or a line ... in the event of a withdrawal, firing squad. Briefly and clearly. Die but do it. The specifics of the war.

[Glory1974]

You read a combat order for the offensive of a division, then for another division, and the orders are simply carbon-copied with general phrases. And so on up to the company.

If you look at the map of the counterattack on Yelnya in 41, you will see that there are only two arrows drawn there. There was no time to write and send orders to the troops.
In general, all orders are formalized, just substitute your data. In the Caucasus in the 90s, too, they did not differ in particular variety. As I remember now: "The situation continues to be difficult and tense, in some areas it tends to aggravate ..."

[A. Privalov]

They made it secret.
It is a sad joke that today's youth, when they talk about the feat of Panfilov, think that they are talking about the employees of the election commission.

[Uncle lee]

Quote: A. Privalov

we are talking about the employees of the election commission.

Their "feat" is classified for more than the battle of Moscow in 41 .....
Your joke is sad, but relevant.

[Vovk]

Hopefully, all the secrecy about the defense of Moscow will be removed. How many years have passed, and information about the first Siberian divisions, which consisted practically of conscripts - they were practically unarmed, thrown under German tanks near Moscow, is still secret. They glorify the Panfilovites, but long before them other Siberians paid with their blood for the mistakes of the leadership and at the cost of their lives won time for defense ... no one remembers them ...

[Serg65]

Quote: Vovk

They glorify the Panfilovites, but long before them other Siberians paid with their blood for the mistakes of the leadership and won time for defense at the cost of their lives

Will you be late for school?

[Paranoid50]

In the photo, the Red Army soldiers go on the attack with the support of ... yeah, T-40 floats.

[Sergey Kuznetsov]

THE TOOLS SAVING MOSCOW IN 1941.
TO THE 80TH ANNIVERSARY OF THE BATTLE FOR MOSCOW!

I want to tell you about my grandfather, a man who played a huge role in the GREAT VICTORY, the history of the country and the city of Korolyov, and was undeservedly forgotten.

Moscow. September day in autumn 1940. The car, which is the chief designer of plant No. 8 Mikhail Loginov, is heading to the station. Not far from the central square of the country, the inventor asks to stop the car. He goes to the Mausoleum. Red Square is crowded, but quiet at the same time. Chimes are heard. The constructor merges with the crowd. None of the people suspects that now there is a man among them, whose guns in a few months will cover their houses, enterprises and this very square from enemy attacks ...

Loginov Mikhail Nikolaevich - chief designer of the plant N8 named after Kalinin (now NPO ENERGIA) is the creator of ALL Soviet anti-aircraft guns of the Great Patriotic War, both land and sea and the legendary anti-tank gun "forty-five", as well as guns for medium and light tanks that took the first battles with German armored vehicles. Author of the first Soviet anti-aircraft machine gun, holder of the Orders of Lenin and the Red Star, laureate of the Stalin Prize.

Loginov's anti-aircraft guns were the first to meet the enemy on our land in Sevastopol while repelling enemy air raids at 3 a.m. on June 22, even an hour before the German offensive on the western front, and they also put an end to the end of the war with the Victory salute on May 9, 1945! Only thanks to anti-aircraft guns and air defense pilots Moscow and Leningrad were saved from destruction.

Anti-aircraft guns had a dual purpose and were used both against enemy aircraft and against fascist tanks, having both high-explosive and armor-piercing shells in the kit. The 85-mm anti-aircraft gun 52-K, model 1939, became one of the symbols of the Battle of Moscow. It was the most powerful anti-tank gun until 1944 and became the prototype for the T-34-85, IS-1, KV-85, SAU-85 tank guns.

His legendary anti-tank gun "forty-five" 53-K (45-mm) at the beginning of the war was the most massive anti-tank gun in the Red Army and practically the only effective means of fighting enemy armored vehicles until the end of 1942, since other factories were unable to establish production of reliable anti-tank guns.

IN THE FIRST YEARS OF THE WAR, THE BASIC WEAPONS AGAINST Enemy's equipment in the RKKA WERE THE WEAPONS OF THE KALININGRAD PLANT # 8, CHIEF DESIGNER M.N. LOGINOV

HE WAS THE INITIATOR OF GIVING THE VILLAGE KALININSKY OF THE STATUS OF THE CITY OF KALININGRAD (now THE CITY OF KOROLYOV).

HIS TOOLS STAND ON THE KNOWN MOUNTAIN AND MANY MUSEUMS OF RUSSIA, ON THE MEMORIALS OF THE WAR, BUT THERE IS NO MEMORABLE PLACE IN HIS HONOR, EVEN ON HIS GRAVE IN THE FEDERAL MEMORIAL CEMETERY IN MY.

Kuznetsova (Loginova) Tatiana
[email protected]
[email protected]

LINKS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frFbngf4udA
https://max659.livejournal.com/888.html
https://ru.m.wikinews.org/wiki/К_80-летию_наступления_советских_войск_под_Москвой
http://redstar.ru/pamyat-o-velikom-cheloveke/
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Логинов,_Михаил_Николаевич_(конструктор)
https://w.histrf.ru/articles/article/show/loginov_mikhail_nikolaievich
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn_A-L8rkuc
https://cbr.ru/cash_circulation/memorable_coins/coins_base/ShowCoins/?cat_num=5015-0049

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Sergey Kuznetsov

His legendary anti-tank gun "forty-five" 53-K (45-mm) at the beginning of the war was the most massive anti-tank gun in the Red Army and practically the only effective means of fighting enemy armored vehicles until the end of 1942, since other factories were unable to establish production of reliable anti-tank guns.

Uh-huh ... 53-K was the most effective anti-TB drugs because it was the only one.
In fact, this gun before the war was withdrawn from production as it did not provide the proper armor penetration: 40 mm of armor at a range of only 150-200 m did not suit the GAU absolutely. The 53-K was replaced by a 57-mm ZIS-2 and a "budget replacement" in the form of a long-barreled 45-mm cannon (the future M-42).
The "forty-five" was saved by the war and Hartz. The huge losses of anti-tank vehicles, the formation of unplanned new connections, the evacuation and mobilization of the industry put an end to the establishment of the serial production of the ZIS-2 and postponed the production of the M-42 for a year. And Anatoly Andreevich by November 1941 was able to solve the problem of insufficient armor penetration - albeit at the cost of reducing the armor impact of the projectile.

[Alex Justice]

In England there is a law in 50 years, the archives are available to everyone. We also need such a law.

[Glory1974]

In England there is a law in 50 years, the archives are available to everyone.

Why don't you write that the archives, if necessary, are kept secret again for 50 years? They have this way classified until 2045.

[fa2998]

Quote: 75Sergey

The question is, why did the chronology of these events have to be kept "secret" for already 80 years?

Quote: 75Sergey

The question is, why did the chronology of these events have to be kept "secret" for already 80 years?

"The Ministry of Defense does not allow the spread of lies, defending the historical truth" - and it was not required to defend that year? Or 10 years ago. They cry about rewriting history - but for 80 years they have been declassifying a teaspoon.

[Vovk]

Quote: Serg65

Quote: Vovk

They glorify the Panfilovites, but long before them other Siberians paid with their blood for the mistakes of the leadership and won time for defense at the cost of their lives

Will you be late for school?

Well, it's not something to cover.
In the race about Panfilov, By September 8, 1941, the division, crossing the Msta River near the village of Ust-Volma, arrived at Kresttsy, where took up positions in the second echelon of the army и for almost a month the division has been equipping a defensive zone.
Well, tell me why, personnel divisions, fully armed according to wartime states, with heavy weapons have been quietly equipping the defense zone in the second echelon for a month? Maybe because in the first echelon, the 1st and 2nd wave of Siberian non-cadre divisions (conscripts) without heavy weapons and armed with 20% of the equipment necessary for the battle were simply smeared in battle by the tracks of German tanks and gave time to cadre divisions?
Maybe that's why they were not given them at the places of call-up and collection of equipment and weapons necessary for battle (according to a criminal and still classified order - to protect weapons and equipment only for regular military personnel) ... they threw phrases - you will get them on the spot (all the same, will die - they will only gain time due to the sea of ​​blood on the battlefield) ... and maybe that's why the list of these divisions, as well as the list of their weapons and equipment, are still classified? But most of the relatives of these nameless heroes received only the news that they were missing ...