Lattice screens to cover T-72B3 from Javelins. Doubtful effectiveness with continued threat to crews

109

Photo: mil.ru

Undoubtedly, the accelerated program of increasing the armor protection of the upper projection of the combatant main combatants, announced a few days earlier in Sevastopol, within the framework of the Army-2021 military-technical forum, provided the domestic and Western European expert communities with extremely important and high-calorie food for thought. tanks (MBT) T-72B3 samples of 2011 and 2016 from the strikes of modern anti-tank guided missiles equipped with single / dual-band infrared and multispectral optical-electronic seeker and having specialized dive modes (at angles of 35-75 degrees) at terminal sites trajectories.

As we can see in one of the photographs of the RIA News»Konstantin Mikhalchevsky, who captured a pair of MBT T-72B3 mod. 2016 with specialized lattice anti-cumulative "trusses" -screens over the upper armor plates of the towers, these and very "simple" products (suggesting a hasty installation even in the field) provide cover from the attacks of diving American ATGM FGM-148E Block I "Javelin", French MMP , as well as Israeli "Spike-LR / -2" exclusively of the upper projection of the towers of the MBT T-72B3.



At the same time, the sectors of the upper hemisphere above the engine-transmission compartments, louvers of ejection cooling systems of power plants, as well as guns and upper frontal parts (VLD) of machine hulls continue to remain defenseless against the blows of the above-mentioned promising anti-tank missiles of the 3rd - 5th th generations.

Steel "chicken coops" with dubious efficiency for the sake of economic feasibility. Isn't it time to think about modernizing the Arena-M and Drozd-2 KAZ?


It is here that it is necessary to focus the attention of experts of the defense department and the command of the Land Forces of Russia, as well as highly qualified specialists of Uralvagonzavod on the fact that infrared seeker of anti-tank missiles FGM-8 Block I "Javelin" operating in the long-wave infrared range (12-148 microns) although they do not have the high noise immunity and resolution of telluride-cadmium-mercury matrix IR photodetectors (only 64x64 pixels with no possibility of identifying a detailed infrared portrait of the target), they are still able to select and "capture" the most heat-contrast areas of the attacked MBT against the background of elements with reduced infrared signature.

It is to these areas that heat-emitting MTOs, shutters of cooling systems, as well as 125-mm 2A46M-5 cannons in fire work, which are not covered with an anti-cumulative screen, and therefore will be hit by the third-generation ATGM FGM-148E Block I "Javelin" first of all, leading either to the loss of movement of tanks and the incapacitation of the main armament, or to the final loss of vehicles with the initiation of ammunition and the death of the crews.

In the case of retrofitting the MBT T-72B3 not only with the above-described above-tower anti-cumulative screens, but also with specialized IR traps (containers with heat-emitting chemical reagents), carried on 2-meter rods outside the vehicle hulls (one of such T-72B of the 1st Army hull of NM DNR was captured in a photo published on the Telegram channel "Tanks of the World"), the likelihood of an effective and sustainable "capture" of the engine-transmission compartments of T-72B3 tanks by means of single-range IKGSN ATGM "Javelin" will decrease by orders of magnitude, because the infrared signature of a heat trap will exceed the MTO radiation dozens of times.

In the same turn, such a method of combining anti-cumulative screens and IR traps will only be effective in relation to infrared seeker "Javelins" with low resolution and noise immunity.

If, however, the more advanced Israeli and French anti-tank systems of the 72th generation "Spike-LR / -3" and MMP are used against the T-5B2, the anti-tank missiles of which are equipped with promising multispectral optoelectronic seeker IIR ("Imaging Infrared") based on medium- / long-wave matrix infrared photodetectors, as well as high-resolution television CCD / CMOS photodetectors, capable of identifying an infrared portrait of tanks with the selection of the most priority elements of the hull against the background of "exposure" from thermal traps and optical-electronic countermeasures (KOEP "Shtora" and etc.), then absolutely no rods with IR traps and anti-cumulative gratings will not save tanks from being hit in MTO areas.

Moreover, the presence in the architecture of the guidance systems of the ATGM "Spike-LR / -2" and MMP also blocks of double-sided asynchronous data exchange / control lines between missiles and operator control terminals will provide the combat crews of ATGM data with the possibility of correcting guidance with "manual override" any unprotected area of ​​the attacked tank (including the upper frontal part of the hull and the driver's seat, unprotected by a turret lattice screen) with a completely predictable non-iridescent outcome for the tank's crew.

Therefore, in relation to modern ground-based theaters of military operations, replete with anti-tank systems of the 5th generation, a much more expedient solution would be a deep modernization and delivery of active protection complexes "Arena-M" to combat units of the Ground Forces of Russia with an increase from 45 to 75-85 degrees the elevation angles of the radar beams for the guidance of protective anti-projectiles, as well as a similar increase in the elevation / elevation angles of transport and launch cells with anti-projectiles, varying in the range from -6 to 85 degrees.

As you know, the elevation sector of anti-tank shells processed by the Arena-M KAZ currently varies in the range from -6 to +45 degrees, while for the Drozd-2 KAZ this range does not exceed -6 - 20 degrees.
109 comments
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  1. +25
    5 September 2021 05: 12
    Mosquito netting, anti-coronavirus mask ... Why didn't the Javelin grill please you?
    lol
    1. +9
      5 September 2021 05: 51
      I remember at school at the lessons of the CWP they told about cotton gauze bandages, and we all laughed, boom a nuclear explosion, but we put on the bandages and escaped smile
      1. +20
        5 September 2021 06: 40
        nuclear explosion bang, and we put on the bandages and escaped
        There are only two correct actions during a nuclear attack:
        - the civilian must cover himself with a newspaper and crawl towards the nearest cemetery.
        - the soldier must hold the machine gun in his outstretched hand so that the molten metal does not drip onto the official uniform.
        1. +20
          5 September 2021 07: 57
          Only not with a newspaper, but with a white sheet.
          And crawl slowly so as not to create panic!
      2. +13
        5 September 2021 17: 42
        Quote: Pessimist22
        I remember at school at the lessons of the CWP they told about cotton gauze bandages, and we all laughed,

        you were taught correctly.
        The main danger for people in the area contaminated with radioactive substances is internal exposure, that is, the ingress of radioactive substances into the body with inhaled air, when eating and drinking. Therefore, it is necessary to protect the respiratory organs using personal protective equipment (gas mask, respirator, anti-dust cloth mask, cotton-gauze bandage, children's protective camera)
      3. +10
        5 September 2021 20: 26
        Correctly told, but why were you laughing then? Were you stupid? If you stay alive, then you need to breathe through a filter, a gauze bandage is the most accessible.
      4. +6
        5 September 2021 20: 46
        "... we put on the bandages and were saved ..."
        Sometimes, rags soaked in their own urine were dressed and escaped from suffocating gases ...
        Of course, against modern MTS, grilles and screens alone will not help 100%. But they will invest their 5 kopecks in the overall security of the tank. There is no need to laugh disdainfully here.
        Separately, KAZ, and the curtain, and the TDA, and the effective remote sensing do not give guarantees, only an integrated approach.
      5. +1
        7 September 2021 18: 46
        I remember at school at the lessons of the CWP they told about cotton gauze bandages, and we all laughed, boom a nuclear explosion, but we put on the bandages and escaped
        For schoolchildren, it is forgivable to treat this issue in this way. However, breathing radioactive dust is also a pleasure, one plus - you will not have to breathe for long if you do not use a respirator or its simplest version - a cotton-gauze bandage. It is a pity that the retired military man who led the CWP (at least in our country) did not hammer this into young brains. We, too, in our youth, practiced a similar wit.
    2. +4
      5 September 2021 08: 39
      Well, compared ...! The mosquito net protects well against mosquitoes! But the Javelin will be bigger and heavier than a mosquito! Conclusion: Each "Javelin" has its own mesh! (And not some horrible mesh!) recourse
      1. +3
        5 September 2021 22: 31
        Quote: Nikolaevich I
        And not some horrible chain-link!)

        Where does the information about the chain-link come from? Corner + bags with something on top.
        1. +3
          6 September 2021 14: 08
          The bags are not "with something", but with the fight of paving stones. Weight ~ 30 kg. Stop the KPVT bullet. Effective against cumulative jet.
          1. -1
            7 September 2021 11: 24
            Quote: Andrew_A
            The bags are not "with something", but with the fight of paving stones. Weight ~ 30 kg. Stop the KPVT bullet. Effective against cumulative jet.

            Why then did the stupid engineers protect the tanks with armor?
            hang paving stones on the frame and business. You can pour tanks from concrete. also good
        2. 0
          13 September 2021 15: 38
          Alas, this from ATGMs hitting the roof and kamikaze drones will not help.
    3. +6
      5 September 2021 20: 58
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Why did the Javelin grill not please you?

      But if, during the battle, the racks of the grill are damaged and it somehow drops (falls) on the roof of the tower and blocks the hatches, where the tankers will run, if necessary, to the landing hatch in the bottom?
      1. +7
        6 September 2021 07: 16
        They won't be in time. He's under the driver's seat. In a very hard to reach place. Well, if the soil is loose, sand and mud, then they will not open it. Since it will support it from below with soil.
        1. +2
          6 September 2021 08: 19
          You and I understand this, is it strange that they do not understand this on the ground or have they found another solution to the problem?
          1. +1
            6 September 2021 09: 16
            And there is simply no other solution.
            1. +1
              6 September 2021 09: 48
              Quote: Old Tankman
              And there is simply no other solution.

              For the crew of the T-72-90, the driver's hatch, what kind of problems get out? it will be a problem if the gun barrel is also lowered onto the hatch, but this will be too much. In the T-80, the ammunition rack will prevent the commander and gunner from reaching the driver's hatch.
              1. +9
                6 September 2021 10: 52
                The problem is timing. The tank is on fire, well, very quickly. And from the acrid smoke in general, two breaths and a skiff, I lost consciousness. And to open the hatch for the mechanic at the same time. It was necessary to take out the mechanics who were suffocated (both from the smoke and from the activated PPO system), who were hanging on the column of the lifting mechanism of the hatch. And you mean the commander and gunner, who still need to crawl out of the tower. Especially the gunner will have to take some trouble. And this is without a fire in the tower. And if there is a fire in the tower, there can be no question of any evacuation through the mechanic's hatch. Burn before they get to him. Life is not what it seems in theory.
                1. +2
                  6 September 2021 11: 37
                  Quote: Old Tankman
                  The problem is timing.

                  I don’t argue here. They just remembered about the evacuation hatch, and I reminded that the driver also had his own hatch.
                  And I put out the tank: the mechanic driver, when servicing the tank, he washed the transmission with gasoline, and then climbed to light it with a carrier. It banged so much that I was surprised when I saw the boxing windows in place. One carbon dioxide fire extinguisher (standing in the clamps next to the meyuvod site) was enough for me to extinguish the fire (the engine compartment of the tank was like a trough - it was filled with carbon dioxide and everything went out).
                  There was a case when I pressed the "fire in the fighting compartment" button. Maintenance of the tank, as a driver-mechanic, everything is not very clean (I was cleaning the engine), I found that the crew was just sleeping in the tank, and I pressed a button (there is one in the control department). A gas cylinder under a pressure of 150 atmospheres, empties through nozzles in a matter of seconds (there are 62 of them in the T-3). I didn’t time the time, but I think the time the crew left the tank was blocked at times. True, the platoon commander was figured out, got hit in the head and forced to change the cylinder to a new one.
                  In general, I have little experience in extinguishing a tank.
                  1. +3
                    6 September 2021 13: 49
                    This is very fraught. In our neighboring regiment, the mech-waters closed in a fighting way, probably decided to sleep. But he pressed the PPO button and while opening the hatch he breathed, only managed to lean out of the hatch and hung on it dead. In my battalion, too, one mechanic pressed the PPO button and did not immediately understand what had happened, had time to breathe, and swam. The hatch was well open, I pulled it out. Then, even after some time, I myself climbed into this tank. So and that the little ones were driving and dull in my head.
                    Tanks in both cases are T-80. So your joke could turn into a tragedy.
                    1. +2
                      6 September 2021 17: 04
                      Quote: Old Tankman
                      Then, even after some time, I myself climbed into this tank. So and that the little ones were driving and dull in my head.

                      The T-62 has carbon dioxide in cylinders. The mechanic, to the right of the seats, has another fire extinguisher in the clamps, but not in the system, but for manual extinguishing. Almost all of them were empty due to the fact that all the gas was vented by passing it through the water, making soda. In the system, as I understand it, there was the same gas. As I already wrote, when extinguishing the fire, at the moment, he filled the transmission and immediately extinguished everything. There didn't even have time to burn anything. I wonder why it was replaced with the poison that is now in modern tanks, the fire properties of the old, it seems, were quite enough?
                      That the joke was stupid, I agree. There were others, no better.
                      1. +2
                        6 September 2021 17: 33
                        You only had gasoline vapors burning. And the MTO volume is small and there are very few voids in it. Therefore, it went out quickly. Halon is much more efficient than carbon dioxide and spreads faster. But you will also die of asphyxiation from carbon dioxide in a closed tank. Since it will displace oxygen.
                      2. +2
                        6 September 2021 18: 08
                        Quote: Old Tankman
                        Since it will displace oxygen.

                        On TV, the news somehow showed: in a private pool, dry ice was poured into the pool - and some of the guests suffocated. Odorless gas, loss of consciousness from lack of oxygen, fell to the floor and is ready.
                  2. +1
                    6 September 2021 13: 57
                    Quote: Bad_gr
                    They just remembered about the evacuation hatch, but they forgot that the driver also had his own hatch,

                    Not at all - it's just that the place has already been taken, but I just reminded about the bottom hatch in order to emphasize what trap you can find yourself in when you don't think with your head and fence whatever you hit on the tank.
      2. 0
        6 September 2021 09: 59
        will run ??? in the tank ??? lol
    4. +1
      6 September 2021 09: 30
      I heard a story that during the Second World War, Soviet tank crews ripped off their pockets from their uniforms and took off their belts, so that during a fire it was possible to quickly leave the car and not get caught with nothing. In this regard, will the gratings on the roofs prevent you from leaving the tank quickly? Or are the mothers still giving birth?
    5. 0
      6 September 2021 14: 39
      The fact that budgets are hindering
  2. +12
    5 September 2021 05: 59
    The middle of the last century, our grandfathers, great-grandfathers doubted the effectiveness of such protection against the Faustists, and in the courtyard of the 21st century and the means of defeat have gone far ahead. Do not tell the enemy, they would have stuck an umbrella on top.
    1. +9
      5 September 2021 08: 51
      Quote: Vdi73
      another umbrella would have been stuck on top.

      There is also an umbrella ...


    2. +5
      5 September 2021 14: 07
      Tell everyone that anti-cumulative grilles are not needed.
      1. +4
        5 September 2021 14: 18
        If you want to live, you will not get so excited! (Feature film "Features of the national hunt")
      2. +4
        5 September 2021 18: 20
        Quote: Slaven
        Tell everyone that anti-cumulative grilles are not needed.

        that's what they say. what a nightmare! a high-tech javelin will break some kind of grate instead of a tank. adherents of high technologies cannot cope with such arbitrariness! wassat
      3. +3
        6 September 2021 07: 20
        I wonder why they limit themselves to the installation of only grilles, and do not put out the dynamic protection as on bulwarks? Don't want to weigh down your car?
        1. 0
          7 September 2021 11: 30
          Quote: Old Tankman
          I wonder why they limit themselves to the installation of only grilles, and do not put out the dynamic protection as on bulwarks? Don't want to weigh down your car?

          it looks like this. if you make a bulwark, then the area that will need to be covered by the DZ will increase in proportion to the square of the increase in the average radius from the center. (I hope I didn't confuse myself and others)
          DZ weight will jump
    3. +2
      5 September 2021 16: 19
      A power umbrella would have been nice.
  3. +3
    5 September 2021 06: 09
    Of course, these armored beds on the turret of the tank are laughable to the chickens. lol
    1. -8
      5 September 2021 09: 24
      Quote: CRONOS
      these armored beds on the turret of the tank - to the chickens to laugh.

      When for the first time onboard anti-cumulative grilles appeared on armored vehicles, the chickens also laughed! And now it is almost a "standard"! Don't forget about it, cockerel ...
      1. -1
        7 September 2021 11: 32
        Quote: Nikolaevich I
        When for the first time onboard anti-cumulative grilles appeared on armored vehicles, the chickens also laughed! And now it is almost a "standard"

        KAZ is what you need, the lattice solution is so-so. but cheap
    2. +6
      5 September 2021 14: 06
      Well, armored beds may be laughing, but a normal factory screen worked quite well.
  4. The comment was deleted.
    1. 0
      5 September 2021 06: 56
      Is covid life-giving?
    2. +6
      5 September 2021 07: 30
      But the "analytical" article is replete with beautiful words and expressions. And yes, the campaign, except in the Ground Forces, according to the author, tanks in service do not stand anywhere else, since they do not need modernization?
    3. +30
      5 September 2021 08: 46
      "It was in TurkVO ... During the CSU. I am on the KShM through the checkpoint, past the PTOR. Escort: front - BMP, rear - RPK on armored personnel carriers. In case of the use of weapons of mass destruction, each means of IZ, well, the PPO was turned off due to the heat ...
      And then the DRG of the conditional enemy with RPG and RPG! I'm not talking about AK - and so it is clear ... "


      Did I succeed in Damansky's style? laughing
      1. +12
        5 September 2021 10: 17
        Almost succeeded, but more incomprehensible numbers are needed
        1. +6
          5 September 2021 10: 22
          Test !!! Still, the truth is a little more numbers, fractions, foreign abbreviations and damants are not suitable for marking
          1. +4
            6 September 2021 07: 25
            Yes, the Leader of the Redskins has outdone Damantsev. At least he understands what he is writing about, unlike Damantsev.
      2. +5
        5 September 2021 21: 47
        Quote: Leader of the Redskins
        it was in TurkVO ...

        DKRN I have the main engine, I check the KShM in the crankcase, I hear - "fire!" but you just had to read the PTE STS and K and observe the PTB ...
  5. +8
    5 September 2021 07: 35
    If, however, the more advanced Israeli and French anti-tank systems of the 72th generation "Spike-LR / -3" and MMP are used against the T-5B2, the anti-tank missiles of which are equipped with promising multispectral optoelectronic seeker IIR ("Imaging Infrared") based on medium- / long-wave matrix infrared photodetectors, as well as high-resolution television CCD / CMOS photodetectors, capable of identifying an infrared portrait of tanks with the selection of the most priority elements of the hull against the background of "exposure" from thermal traps and optical-electronic countermeasures (KOEP "Shtora" and etc.), then absolutely no rods with IR traps and anti-cumulative gratings will not save tanks from being hit in MTO areas.

    There is an old proven protection against these ATGMs - aerosol. There are relatively new developments. Specialists of the United Instrument-Making Corporation have developed the Zont aerosol protection complex to protect armored vehicles from missiles
    https://rg.ru/2015/06/17/zont-site-anons.html
    https://russian.rt.com/russia/article/869502-boepripas-rosteh-razrabotka
    1. +13
      5 September 2021 10: 15
      Quote: riwas
      There is an old proven protection against these ATGMs - aerosol.

      Even putting aside the question of the effectiveness of "aerosol" and other smoke screens against infrared and multispectral seeker, such an "old proven protection" has one small drawback - in order to activate it, you need to notice in time that a missile has been launched at the tank. And for this, again, KAZ or OLS is needed. Which are really not on our tanks.
    2. +4
      6 September 2021 07: 28
      There is an old proven protection against these ATGMs - aerosol.


      Damantsev does not know this, and he does not need it. The main thing is to litter the article with "smart" terms.
    3. -1
      7 September 2021 11: 34
      Quote: riwas
      There is an old proven protection against these ATGMs - aerosol.

      give examples of armored vehicles that were saved by the use of aerosol.
  6. +3
    5 September 2021 07: 39
    As you know, the elevation sector processed by means of the Arena-M

    Who knows? Where is it known? again the secret secrets of the General Staff personally reporting to Damantsev?!?!
  7. +8
    5 September 2021 08: 10
    The Americans made "roofs" even for the Hummers.
    1. +3
      5 September 2021 09: 32
      And what ? I like it! True, the description says about "armored doors with an explosion-proof ERC coating", but so these are "little things" ...! If "zhu-zhu" just does not happen, then even more so the "roof" on the hummer! Yes
  8. +9
    5 September 2021 08: 22
    There is no gold reserve at KAZ. Even Israel and the United States, with big problems, are massively equipping armored vehicles with KAZs. In the realities of Russia, this is a front box on May 9. The rest of the tanks will go into battle either without anything or with a welded grill. Better with a lattice, at least morally calm the crews.
    1. +6
      5 September 2021 10: 31
      Quote: donavi49
      Better with a lattice, at least morally calm the crews.

      I already wrote that in the 90s on the BV in one of the tank subunits they came up with "solid" canopies over the entire tank ... But it was protection from small-caliber cumulative bombs, "scattered" by NATO over tank columns from cluster bombs ... But there were and other attempts to protect, for example, MTO from ammunition with thermal homing, not without reason, assuming that it is there that the PT-ammunition will fly in first! For example, the cooling ventilation grilles on the engines were covered with heat shields, and the heat was forcibly removed behind the stern, heated "panels" on telescopic brackets behind the stern were also offered ... "Crazy" ideas appeared! Type of explosion-proof special panel - "sandwich" with shaped charges and active radio-frequency sensors over MTO ... Now there are proposals of the same "canopies" from corners with remote sensing devices or "boxes" with ceramic balls (ceramic "sand") on "canopies "...
    2. +1
      6 September 2021 07: 38
      But such a lattice would have strained me with the danger of supporting the manhole cover. You still have to get to the javelins, getting on the way from aviation, rocket and cannon artillery. And how this lattice will warp from all this is unknown.
  9. +4
    5 September 2021 08: 49
    The campaign will have to revise the classic concept of the tank design for all-round protection, perhaps the armor as such is no longer so effective and only increases the weight and now you should not chase its thickness.
    We need something new in the design and tactics of use, taking into account protection against nuclear weapons.
  10. +7
    5 September 2021 08: 54
    Not KAZ is already needed but mini air defense for the tank. because from above a lot of things can fly not only Spikes and Darts but also all sorts of Harpies, MAMLi and others.
  11. +6
    5 September 2021 08: 55
    And I'm glad that Eugene is back! fellow I missed him! Yes
  12. +2
    5 September 2021 09: 01

    ... "simple" products (assuming a hasty installation even in the field) provide cover from the attacks of American diving ATGM FGM-148E Block I "Javelin" ...


    It seems that the javelin, although the defeat of the tank in the upper hemisphere, but not a dive?

    For the javelin, the tower is the priority, and this type of hit is probably the most probable and most dangerous for the crew.

    Those. this kind of "handicraft" makes it possible to increase the security of the tank and the crew, and equipping the tanks in a short period of time.

    Equipping with new promising KAZ will take a long time and the tanks will be waiting for modernization without any protection. When the KAZ is installed, new versions of the ATGM will appear.

    Perhaps this is due to the fact that several states have appeared on the western borders that have recently received a fairly large number of ATGMs of this type. This is a fast option that increases the survivability of the tank and crew.
  13. +4
    5 September 2021 10: 01
    There is a perfectly reasonable sense in such "visors". If on top, in addition to the grille, there is also a heat-insulating material in a camouflage paint.
    1. The most primitive: in hot desert conditions, less heating of the steel tower, more comfortable conditions for the crew.
    2. The heat-insulating coating partially hides the direct thermal radiation of the tank, in particular the MTO. Reduces the visibility of the tank in the infrared range.
    3. Camouflage color distorts the shape of the tank when viewed from above, which reduces the detection and recognition range of reconnaissance UAVs.
    And 4th, the grill protects from ATGMs diving onto the tank from above at a certain angle.
    1. 0
      5 September 2021 17: 44
      But it is worth driving through the forest once and a couple of fallen birch trees will completely rip off this umbrella. Or are tanks being asked to move only on open terrain? In short, I think that these small towns are complete nonsense, but if the DPRs somehow squeeze the Darts off the skakuas in some way, and then they could be tested for breaking this umbrella, then everything will immediately become clear
  14. +10
    5 September 2021 11: 03
    People are kind and knowledgeable, tell me, how can you shoot from an anti-aircraft machine gun now?
    1. +3
      5 September 2021 12: 10
      Most likely this is for individual operations, and not for all, and is removed within a few minutes.
      1. 0
        5 September 2021 17: 48
        Quote: Berg Berg
        and not for everyone and is removed in a few minutes.

        and where to put this harrow then?
        Quote: VohaAhov
        People are kind and knowledgeable, tell me, how can you shoot from an anti-aircraft machine gun now?

        I propose to make such roll-type metal blinds
        1. 0
          25 September 2021 13: 05
          Most likely, it leans back, like a hatch to the attic, simply and quickly.
          1. 0
            25 September 2021 16: 12
            Quote: Berg Berg
            , simple and fast.

            you can simply and quickly:
            -see photo / video = there are no hinges / hinges
            -it is not so "just" the mass there is decent
            1. 0
              27 September 2021 12: 36
              What could they have seen in that photo, if everything is done correctly sometimes and you cannot see the hinges in front of the door!
              1. +2
                27 September 2021 19: 10
                Quote: Berg Berg
                , if everything is done correctly sometimes and you cannot see the hinges in front of the door!

                on the inside of the screen you can see that there is a hatch opening under the screen.
                no matter how I looked: I did not consider the loops. and shoot ... t
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. +2
      5 September 2021 13: 08
      Very simple! It is necessary to make a hatch in the lattice !!! And how the rocket flies back to close it! laughing
      1. +2
        6 September 2021 10: 59
        Quote: Alexey G
        Very simple! It is necessary to make a hatch in the lattice !!! And how the rocket flies back to close it! laughing


        And be sure to weld the loops and lugs so that the lock can be hung. And the key must be kept by the tank commander.
    4. +1
      6 September 2021 15: 34
      Quote: VohaAhov
      People are kind and knowledgeable, tell me, how can you shoot from an anti-aircraft machine gun now?

      Well .... for example, so! ...................

      Or so! .............................
  15. +3
    5 September 2021 11: 49
    The word terminal instead of the final section gives the author.)))

    And on the case - someone tested these screens on real ammunition?
  16. +1
    5 September 2021 11: 52
    Looks like a marchioness from the pouring sun. If it was somewhere in Syria, then I could understand ...
  17. +2
    5 September 2021 12: 07
    Better to let it be something than nothing! The main thing is to save the crew and not interfere with quickly leaving the car!
  18. +4
    5 September 2021 12: 14
    I already wrote in another thread - the solution is quite expected. If this is put on the sides against the cumulative - why not put it on the roof? Hopefully, the effectiveness of such protection was tested before surprising the world with photos of tanks with a "chicken coop" above the tower. :-)
  19. 0
    5 September 2021 12: 52
    Quote: Roman Efremov
    I already wrote in another thread - the solution is quite expected. If this is put on the sides against the cumulative - why not put it on the roof? Hopefully, the effectiveness of such protection was tested before surprising the world with photos of tanks with a "chicken coop" above the tower. :-)

    I also wrote in another thread that such homemade products (like the "bags" of sand) have insufficient efficiency and this has been tested a long time ago ...
  20. 0
    5 September 2021 13: 26
    The gloomy Teutonic genius already had all this!


    1. +7
      5 September 2021 18: 34
      ummm ... all except the last photo are antennas and have nothing to do with protection wink
      1. 0
        5 September 2021 19: 32
        How would he know this?
        1. +2
          5 September 2021 23: 09
          Look how the antenna is used!
      2. +1
        5 September 2021 19: 41
        laughing Yes, even a sun awning, the main thing is that the idea of ​​a superstructure on top for armored vehicles ...
        You need to understand jokes ...
  21. The comment was deleted.
  22. -6
    5 September 2021 14: 11
    Soon the tank will not be used at all.
    The Chechen wars have shown that this is a coffin for soldiers.

    Chechnya was pacified by the force of long-range artillery.
  23. +4
    5 September 2021 14: 46
    There is a lot of jerking in the comments, but the article is actually sensible. I can add in favor of the modernization of the KAZ. In the B-B class rockets (on which I served) there is a mode - if the missile loses its target (aircraft), then it flies to the calculated lead-in point, where it explodes. The plane most often does not have time to change course and speed and is amazed. The difference in speed between the rocket and the tank is even greater, so neither aerosol nor heat traps will help. And the lattices are a temporary measure and this is already better than nothing.
    1. 0
      6 September 2021 15: 26
      Missiles (ATGMs), which are now hitting the masses ... have relatively little penetration, because were originally designed for top-down attacks. Drones too, not all have a powerful warhead. ... from them, can and will save the spaced booking. The West is not so worried about this, because their opponents do not have such anti-tank systems. But China has already presented, Iran has presented ..... So we are waiting for the thickening of the reservation and building up the remote sensing ... and KAZ.
  24. -4
    5 September 2021 15: 34
    soldier There is a problem and it must be solved. In case of war, before a tank attack on the positions of anti-tank batteries and positions of "Javilins", art and rocket fire are applied, and only then will the armored forces and infantry go forward. It was understood even during the Second World War. Now, in the case of, for example, a NATO attack on Russia, to begin with, destroy the NATO headquarters in Brussels, and then all NATO capitals, in whatever order, for example, alphabetically, will not surrender. It is necessary to think more broadly and not to pull the netting over the tank to the net. soldier
  25. +8
    5 September 2021 15: 36
    Quote: TexHo

    Chechnya was pacified by the force of long-range artillery.

    Oh really.
    Companies at different stages are very different in approaches and tactics of using forces and means.
    It came to pass that the "Turntables" were carrying BMDs, mortars and support equipment, but they used artillery to a minimum. In all cases, Chechnya was considered their own, that there were excesses. And from both sides. Tanks, contrary to the opinion of Mr. TekhNo, were used both for the first time and for the second company. In the three of them, mainly Vovanians fought in tanks, and in old T-62s. Although there were 72, there were also merry-go-rounds. When three or two tanks changed each other at the firing range, firing off an automated ammunition rack. The Internal Troops of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Russia have always had a hard time with artillery, especially long-range ones. Tanks were more accessible, more mobile, they could cover the infantry with armor. In fact, the most terrible beast was the mortar. Even worse is the GAZ-66 or the Ural with the ZSU-23 in the back. The Army men had stocks and tungusks. Considering, the shearers of the Caucasus make houses at best with walls of one (one and a half) bricks. Small-caliber artillery tore down the "barmaley's den" in five minutes in short bursts. The specifics of that war gave birth to monsters. I personally saw the 62 MVDeshnaya with a ZSUshka on channels above the engine compartment.
  26. +2
    5 September 2021 17: 54
    If at least one crew rescues, then let it be!
  27. 0
    5 September 2021 19: 30
    Such "umbrellas" are clear bells that speak about the problems of the industry. Normal countries put KAZs like the Israeli Trophy, which has already established itself, and trampolines mold grates and put sandbags. Russia wanted to be on a par with them?
  28. +1
    5 September 2021 20: 57
    Quote: Berg Berg
    Better to let it be something than nothing! The main thing is to save the crew and not interfere with quickly leaving the car!

    Like armored bed nets on the T-34, they definitely have psychological protection.
  29. 0
    5 September 2021 21: 15
    Opss. And where did the photo of the chicken coop disappear from the article?
  30. +1
    5 September 2021 22: 19
    The sofa swelled. It is interesting in what troops and on what products this author worked. There is a plug for each barrel. Well, they showed three tanks with umbrellas on some KShU. Do you have technical specifications for the development of umbrellas, or have they passed preliminary tests? You never know what general or colonel will get into his head, but the photographer has only one thought, how to take a picture. It seems that the author has successfully learned to tyrit everything from the Internet. Good luck in copying.
  31. +2
    6 September 2021 07: 09
    Damantsev burns as always. The people are amused by illiteracy with an abundance of "scientific" terms. Especially pleased with the passage with ejection cooling systems on the T-73B3. There is no trace of them there! It's just a fan. Edector on T-64 and T-80UD. From the Khokhlyatsky site, perhaps, did you rip up the article?
  32. 0
    6 September 2021 09: 52
    If we take the side surface as an example, then we do not swear and are not surprised by the "Sandwich" - armor-DZ-spaced screen / grille ...... here they are trying to "Try on" the same approach, but from above. Moreover, this approach does not negate either smoke grenades or AZ.
  33. 0
    6 September 2021 16: 40
    KAZ is needed in the troops, and not only at exhibitions. As for the ATGM, the tank must change its thermal signature in a wide range, as the Swedes demonstrate in an experimental tank. Use of foams and spraying of aerosols, pyrotechnic sources, etc. but all this should be done on the basis of research and development and development work, and specialists, and not just enthusiasts, should be engaged in this. Unfortunately, there is no BTV Academy. Therefore, we have what it is.
  34. 0
    6 September 2021 18: 33
    The campaign must move away from passive protection to active, i.e. interception of a flying ammunition directly above the vehicle with 100% protection, especially since the active armor cell is disposable and cannot be changed in battle.
  35. 0
    7 September 2021 01: 40
    Our Strikers have similar grilles, which are very good at protecting against RPG-7s. So far, more than 130 hits from RPG7 have not had a single penetration. I think that the same armor installed above the tower and MTO will not be superfluous. I do not know whether this remedy was tested for stability or not. And it is not necessary to test such a grid with an ATGM attacking from above. It is simple and banal to put this grill in front of a 30mm armor sheet and blow it with a Whirlwind. If there is no penetration, then there is a chance to survive against Javelin and Spike. If it breaks, then you need to look for another option. And do not be jerky. It is possible that such spaced armor will work as it does on our Strikers against RPGs.
  36. 0
    7 September 2021 08: 13
    Any protection will not hurt, including the mesh. It is generally better to make a special ATGM destruction vehicle that follows the tanks at a distance of 500 meters and destroys missiles flying into the tanks and there is no need to fence a garden with a heap of equipment hanging on the tanks that prevents the tank from performing its tasks.
  37. -1
    7 September 2021 18: 53
    Quote: Baron Pardus
    Our Strikers have similar grilles, which are very good at protecting against RPG-7s. So far, more than 130 hits from RPG7 have not had a single penetration. I think that the same armor installed above the tower and MTO will not be superfluous. I do not know whether this remedy was tested for stability or not. And it is not necessary to test such a grid with an ATGM attacking from above. It is simple and banal to put this grill in front of a 30mm armor sheet and blow it with a Whirlwind. If there is no penetration, then there is a chance to survive against Javelin and Spike. If it breaks, then you need to look for another option. And do not be jerky. It is possible that such spaced armor will work as it does on our Strikers against RPGs.

    So you have factory grilles and, presumably, their material and geometry of elements are calculated and tested, and not made figuratively from "Mr. and sticks" in a bicycle workshop. By the way, shots from RPG-7 are different, this should also be taken into account ...
  38. 0
    11 September 2021 10: 18
    And at one time they laughed at 404 when they welded lattices onto their technique. Direct cognitive dissonance of some kind.
    1. 0
      16 September 2021 19: 43
      Those grids and our lattice screens really have little in common, both in design and in alloys.
  39. 0
    13 September 2021 21: 00
    There was a problem, they are trying to solve it at the expense of ingenuity. I have no doubt that engineers will find the best solution and all countries will start copying it. Any defense is better than a bare ass in the sense of the head.
    1. 0
      16 September 2021 19: 48
      The problem is that modern ATGMs of the 4th and 5th generation have manual guidance when the operator himself controls the flight of the rocket via a fiber-optic channel and evaluating the target image can direct the missile to the place of the tank where there is no protection, so all these protective elements from above are so for self-complacency. Without complexes that intercept missiles and shells flying from above, a tank is not a tenant in modern warfare.
  40. ada
    0
    25 September 2021 04: 48
    The problem is that we evaluate weapons and military equipment and other equipment based on the conditions and results of its application or use in conflicts for which it was not designed or developed. It is impossible to concentrate efforts for the successful creation and use of weapons and equipment for various wars, both in scale and in intensity and theater of action. The expenditures of reserves and resources (including human resources) can be comparable both in the case of an insignificant transient conflict and in a protracted local war, but their result may not be comparable in terms of the goals and costs achieved. Armament programs, more or less appropriate to local and temporal realities, for achieving specific tasks in initially relatively small conflicts (by determining international and geographic factors) are characteristic of small countries such as Israel, cutting off a huge range of other weapons. Large countries and blocs, based on geopolitical interests, cannot afford to have different sets of armed forces for all types of conflicts (they simply do not pull) - they use what they have.
    Under this condition, the technical struggle of the tank and the means of its destruction is endless, variable - stepped and controlled only by a scientific and technical breakthrough with the possibility of implementing or changing capabilities for organizing combined arms combat tactics in large and prolonged wars in the planned theater of operations. A trifle doesn't count. Any momentary wagging of the military-industrial complex and strategy is fraught with both the defense system and the economy.
  41. 0
    28 November 2021 17: 53
    -Comrade Lieutenant Colonel, a commission from the district found a shortage of a 40x40 steel angle, the same 10 tons that we sold to a summer cottage cooperative!
    - Calm down, ensign, quickly gather in the park everyone who has seen the welding machine at least once, and give them the remains of that corner, and in 15 minutes I will be there and tell you what to do.
    2 hours passed...
    - And this is not, Comrade General, our rationalization proposal - to protect the upper projection of the tank from modern weapons! One machine requires only 100 kg of rolled steel, we have already cut the blanks for the entire regiment, and for one platoon - now, we even managed to install them before your arrival.
    - Well done, lieutenant colonel, solved the problem over which these civilian engineers have been fighting for 2 years! Send a platoon of modernized tanks to the Army forum !!!