Military Review

Without a trained crew, the most advanced tank is useless on the battlefield.

58
As part of the modernization of the Armed Forces tank By 2020, the country's park will be replenished with 2300 units of domestic production. Who will sit behind the armor of new tanks? How to prepare crews and tank units in general? The VPK weekly launches a series of publications on the problems and prospects of training tank crews.

During the year, the media actively discussed the problems of technical equipment of tank forces. Specialists and military leaders evaluated the prospects for tank building in Russia, analyzed the advantages and disadvantages of domestic and foreign tanks. There was a heated debate on the possibility of acquiring foreign military vehicles for the Russian Ground Forces.

But whatever technical capabilities were incorporated into the design of the tank, they are realized through the actions of the crew. Experience shows that the increase in the technical capabilities of each new model of armored weapons, that is, an increase in the combat potential in comparison with the previous one, fluctuates within 5 – 15 percent. The tank crew, depending on its level of training, can realize the combat capabilities of the vehicle from 30 to 100 percent. Therefore, improving the system of manning tank forces and combat and personnel training is a key issue for the modernization of tank forces and the Armed Forces.

Not just a driver

Modern tank is a complex technical complex. He is literally crammed with weapons, instruments, mechanisms. The level of training of the tank crew at the same time should be quite high. For example, the calculation of the 122-mm artillery gun is six people, the portable ATGM complex — two, the 12,7-mm machine gun — two, the 7,62-mm machine gun — one. Total - 11 people. All these weapons are installed in a tank with three crew members.

Without a trained crew, the most advanced tank is useless on the battlefield.

Another example. The aircraft for combat is being prepared by about 20 people, three members of the tank crew prepare the combat vehicle independently (loading ammunition, preparing weapons, maintenance, including refueling, etc.).

The crew must know the structure of all weapons, the rules of firing, have a stable practical skills and training weapons, and its combat use, as well as operation and troubleshooting.

Another major reason for the need for a high level of training of tankers is the complexity of each tank specialty, its difference from similar forces in other troops.

Take, for example, the driver. This is not a simple vehicle driver. He must have the skills to drive an 40-ton cross country vehicle and overcome obstacles in a convoy and in battle formation. As a mechanic, I am obliged to ensure technical readiness and operability of the machine, to be able to eliminate at least the simplest technical faults.

In addition, the driver-participant of fire destruction: conducts reconnaissance of targets by observation, gives target designation to the gunner of the gun, corrects the fire. It creates favorable conditions for firing: when driving a tank on uneven, rugged terrain, he must choose a mode of movement so that the hull oscillations are minimal and thus firing accuracy is achieved.

The mechanic-driver with his skill ensures the survivability of the combat vehicle. In a real battle, the movement of the tank is a "ragged run" - the movement from shelter to shelter with a constant change of course and speed. This requires special driving skills.

After the Battle of Kursk, a special research group immediately collected statistical data on the issues of the failure of our tanks. Various questions were explored: the number of hits that combat vehicles received, in which planes, from what ranges, how many caught fire, etc. It turned out that on 30 percent of the wrecked tanks there was first or second gear. The driver mechanics, who did not have sufficient gearshift skills due to a small driving experience, were afraid to stop the engine and immobilize the car during the battle. Moving only in the lower gears, they did not use all the technical capabilities of the tank and easily became the targets of destruction for the enemy tanks. Immediately after this research, the decision is made to increase the number of hours for training driver-mechanics by one and a half times.

Interchangeability and autonomy

An important requirement for a tank crew is interchangeability. In addition to mastering their profession, each member of the crew must master related specialties: driver mechanics - have the skills of firing from tank weapons, gunner guns - driving a combat vehicle, and the tank commander - be ready to replace both mechanics and gunner.

The complexity of the quality training of tankers is also related to the autonomy of the actions of the crew as a whole and each of its members individually. In combat, motorized infantry acts in a chain or as part of a fire (combat) group, an artilleryman is included in the crew, a sailor is in a compartment as part of a post. Next to them is the commander. If, for example, a motorized rifle has a machine gun jammed, the squad leader or platoon commander will approach it and will be able to assist in eliminating the delay, including encouraging morally. Even in the armored personnel carrier and the BMP it is possible to move from one branch to another.

In the tank, the driver is isolated from other crew members. Having closed the hatch, he remains alone. The tank commander and gunner, while in the same fighting compartment, are isolated from each other. A tanker can only count on himself. Figuratively speaking, everyone is fighting in a trench, and the tankman is in a single trench. Therefore, the level of individual and psychological training of each tanker must be an order of magnitude higher than in other troops. He must have the knowledge, skills and abilities that allow him to act independently, without anyone's control and care.

Half a year of professional service

The problem of the quality of training of specialists in tank forces did not arise today or even yesterday: it was always very acute. We have traditionally spared no expense on the development and production of new tanks, but at the same time we have saved heavily on the quality of training for the specialists who exploited them.

In the Soviet Army, the training of driver mechanics, gunner operators and tank commanders was carried out in training divisions (specialized tank schools) under a five-month program. The number of training platoons was 20 – 30 cadets, which did not contribute to individual training. From yesterday's schoolchildren, who often knew little Russian, specialists were trained for the most complex machines at that time - T-80, T-64B, T-72B.

The terms of mastering the program were very tight. So, for example, the gunner of the gun carried out an exercise in shooting a month after starting the training - from the spot, after two - from a short stop, after three - on the move (all from a loose shaft), on the fifth month - on the move by a regular projectile. During the time spent in the training unit, the tank commander and gunner (gunner-operator) carried out one or two firing with a regular shell (at a rate of three shells). The driver received driving experience 250 kilometers. Upon completion of training in the training unit for a graduate cadet, the exam was a simple formality: whether or not he passed, he would still be appointed to the position of gunner, mechanic or tank commander.

Later, after graduating from the training unit, the tanker served in combat units for one and a half years. The commanders received "raw" specialists and were forced to bring their individual training to an acceptable level, while at the same time solving the tasks of harmonizing the units. On average, 6 – 12 regular shells for a year and 10 – 15 shells per year were used by the crew to shoot during tactical exercises with live firing. The aforementioned norm was differentiated according to the operational mission of military formations. Thus, in the groups of troops deployed in the territory of the Warsaw Pact countries, it could be one and a half to two times higher, in the internal military districts, as well as in the reduced military units, slightly lower. The annual experience of practical driving mechanic was about 300 kilometers.

At best, in the conditions of intensive combat training, the formation of a specialist was completed after a year of service in the line unit (by the end of the third period of service). That is, in fact, as a trained specialist tanker served for six months.

Ready for surface use

In one of the reports of 1988, the study of this problem directly concluded that the level of training of tankers did not match the complexity of the tanks. It was noted that graduates of training units are prepared for the operation of combat vehicles at best on 30 – 40 percent and then only to their most superficial operation, without detailed knowledge of systems and complexes. Regarding tank crews, the following assessment was made in the report: “Given the low resource and ammunition consumption rates due to their high cost, the number of crew training on training and combat vehicles over the two years of service is so small that it does not ensure the formation and consolidation of sustainable combat work skills the realization of the fighting qualities of the crew’s crew does not exceed 60 percent on average. ”

It was not in our favor that there was a comparison of the quality of the training of specialists in the armies of potential adversaries (developed countries) and Soviet tankers. NATO prepared more intensively. For example, in the crew during the year we made from 100 to 150 shots. At the same time, 40 – 60 shells per year were assigned to the individual training of the gunner’s guns (for the implementation of shooting practice exercises). The rest were shot during the company, battalion or brigade tactical exercises. In the US Army, the gunner of the gun carried out four crew exercises during the year as part of the crew during the day and as much at night with a charge of seven to eight regular shells. For the training of drivers for the year in NATO countries, 600 – 800 kilometers were allocated (in the USA, 800 miles).

The training system has paid off

If the annual resource and ammunition rates allocated for training tankers of the Armed Forces of the USSR and NATO armies were somehow comparable, then, taking into account the organization of military service for citizens, the difference in training tankers was significant. In NATO countries, armies were recruited on a contract basis, the average service life was three to five years. During this time, the tank crews gained practical experience, as a result of which the average gunner of the gun was shooting 150 – 250 shells. The overall practical driving experience of the driver was at least 1800 kilometers.

In the Soviet army, similar figures were significantly lower. This is due to the fact that the period of military service is two years, every six months the staff was updated by a third, the more experienced left, and newcomers from training units took their place. Therefore, in the course of their service, the gunners of guns shot regular artillery shots at 40 – 50, the driving experience of the driver was about 600 kilometers. With these indicators, they went to the reserve. And their NATO colleagues for two or three years continued to improve their professionalism.

Admittedly, this state of affairs was due to objective reasons. The tank park of the USSR was over 50 thousands of units. The country carried enormous costs to ensure that tank crews were trained for so many combat vehicles. A certain optimum was determined, which allowed keeping the training of tankers at the minimum acceptable level. The calculation was to in the event of a military conflict in the initial period to knock out a probable opponent of professional tank crews, forcing him to put reservists in tanks. The level of training of the latter and our tankists roughly coincided. In this case, using numerical superiority in tanks, we would be able to gain dominance on the battlefield.

On the whole, the system of training tankers that existed in the Soviet army under conditions of limited resources and the presence of a large tank fleet was optimal and provided mass training for tank specialists. There was no alternative to this under those conditions. And whatever assessments are given to this system, it has fully justified itself, allowing the Armed Forces to solve the tasks of strategic deterrence.

Today, the tank fleet of Russia is significantly reduced. It would seem that economic prerequisites have been created for moving away from the system of mass training of specialists for tank forces, for its cardinal restructuring, for putting quality parameters at the forefront. However, it must be stated that the quality of training compared with the Soviet army has not changed for the better.
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  1. Sasha 19871987
    Sasha 19871987 5 September 2012 15: 27
    -8
    modern warfare is still a special forces war ....
    1. Alekseev
      Alekseev 5 September 2012 18: 26
      +15
      And what would that special forces do, say, in Chechnya, without tens of thousands of "ordinary" infantrymen?
      All professions are important, all professions are needed. laughing
    2. crazyrom
      crazyrom 5 September 2012 22: 56
      +2
      The Kursk arch in our time probably will not be there, but tanks are still a very important army unit. As I understand it, you can send special forces, shoot missiles, but then tanks come and fix the seizure of the territory, without them nothing. Not for nothing we are preparing Armata.
    3. sv-sakh
      sv-sakh 6 September 2012 08: 08
      +2
      If the enemy has weak air defense, then the main weapon will be attack aircraft, with the support of heavy equipment.
      If the enemy has strong air defense, then the main weapon will be heavy equipment, with the support of aviation.
      But to consolidate and clean up the territory, infantry is needed.
      Specialists are only assigned to the solution of "specific tasks", not unimportant, but their contribution should not be overestimated either.
      It is worth looking at modern local conflicts and it becomes clear that the methodology of waging war of aggression is not very different from the second world war (except for mass). Yes, and the occupation war - also not much.
    4. 1tankist
      1tankist 6 September 2012 09: 29
      0
      Quote: sasha 19871987
      modern warfare is still a special forces war ....


      It's a delusion.
      In India, tank forces are the second deterrent after nuclear weapons. This assessment is given by Indian military experts.

      Although, of course, we need all kinds of troops, including special forces. Each unit has different tasks, but they all do one big thing - they defend their homeland.
  2. vorobey
    vorobey 5 September 2012 15: 27
    +9
    Author. but why compare. It’s clear about the Soviet school, they passed, we know, And now? The topic is not disclosed. not set off.
    1. klimpopov
      klimpopov 5 September 2012 15: 34
      +1
      Moving only in lower gears, they did not use all the technical capabilities of the tank and easily became targets for enemy tanks. Immediately after this study, a decision is made to increase the number of hours for the training of driver mechanics by one and a half times.

      In many ways, the transmission was selected by the mechanical drive for earlier because switching speeds in the T-34 is a serious process that requires not little effort, and therefore drove to the second trying to switch as little as possible. The author did not understand why jam the car in battle?
      1. PLO
        PLO 5 September 2012 15: 54
        +6
        for switching speeds in the T-34 is a serious process requiring not small efforts

        actually in the 42 year on the t-34 began to install a new 5-speed gearbox

        in general, the meaning of the article is not clear, what did the author actually want to say?
        What is the need for quality training? so nobody argues with that

        and some comparisons like
        So, for example, the calculation of the 122-mm artillery is six people, man-portable ATGM complex - two, 12,7 mm machine guns - two, 7,62 mm machine guns - one. Total - 11 people. All these weapons are installed in a tank with three crew members.

        generally incorrect
        1. klimpopov
          klimpopov 5 September 2012 16: 02
          +1
          actually in the 42 year on the t-34 began to install a new 5-speed gearbox

          That the problem with the lever is not particularly solved.

          generally incorrect

          Totally agree!
        2. Su24
          Su24 5 September 2012 19: 11
          0
          Why? The author shows that a limited tank crew must be able to handle a wide range of weapons.
      2. vorobey
        vorobey 5 September 2012 15: 58
        +1
        Quote: klimpopov
        Moving only in lower gears, they did not use all the technical capabilities of the tank and easily became targets for enemy tanks. Immediately after this study, a decision is made to increase the number of hours for the training of driver mechanics by one and a half times.


        Where does the author take such examples? Yes. it is written in the RPMBM before leveling the vehicle and shifting to a lower gear.

        We were really taught at the school that you can pass the ruts on the fifth and sixth pass. You can twist the snake on the third twist. the author is silent that on driving the mechanic had to be shown the time norm too. From here, the average speed was calculated and conclusions were drawn.

        A liner 14,5 I would not blame. at least the skills of observation (mainly shot with BZT ammunition) and the adjustment of fire received the entire crew.
        1. s1н7т
          s1н7т 5 September 2012 23: 40
          0
          By the way, yes. The time standard spurred on. We always drove at the maximum possible - the mark was given for passing and for time. I drove "nice", but I was late - it was "bad". And after my torsion bars "flew", I also drove as smoothly as possible. laughing
      3. Andy
        Andy 5 September 2012 18: 29
        0
        The author did not understand why jam the car in battle?
        ---
        I translate the author, they were afraid to STOP. because they moved to a lower one. and switching to t34 was still there. strange but the Germans and Finns about the gearshift lever in the captured T34 do not say anything. and maneuverability is praised.
        1. klimpopov
          klimpopov 5 September 2012 19: 03
          +2
          No, in principle, why turn off the diesel in battle? My friend, the tankman, told the baht that the driver did not switch without a mat, but if he got used to it and got used to it, he became an ace. The maneuverability allowed the 34 to become the best tank, of course.
      4. 1st_user
        1st_user 5 September 2012 22: 05
        +2
        Why jam a car in battle?

        This meant accidental jamming due to a jerk in high gear. They were afraid of this, so they drove on the first two.
    2. Dimitr
      Dimitr 5 September 2012 16: 56
      0
      Quote: vorobey
      Author. but why compare. It’s clear about the Soviet school, they passed, we know, And now? The topic is not disclosed. not set off.

      vorobey, yes it is already good! "We were Soviet, ho-ho, and you are so-so nowadays." The elders also spoke about you once. The guys are no worse now. If a person wants to master a profession, then he will be a cool specialist even now, and if he is gouging, then no school will teach. And do not say that in your time there were none and everyone was conscious!
      1. vorobey
        vorobey 5 September 2012 17: 24
        +3
        Quote: Dimitr
        And do not say that in your time there were none and all were conscious!

        And I do not say. I also managed to pass the gunfire and control for myself and for that guy. He quit afterwards.
        Quote: Dimitr
        yes it is already good! "We were Soviet, wow, and you are so-so nowadays"

        And who said that. Read carefully. What to compare with? What are the techniques now? If as written a series of articles will be, and write to be continued. As they teach now I do not know.

        Quote: Dimitr
        "We were Soviet, wow, and you are so-so nowadays"

        But the complexes must be disposed of. Are you interesting tanker? How long does it take to master a car mechanics? The gunner is simpler.
      2. Uruska
        Uruska 5 September 2012 21: 28
        -1
        People need to be taught. That's all. And use simulators more. It will be cheaper.
    3. Vadivak
      Vadivak 5 September 2012 16: 58
      +5
      Quote: vorobey
      Author. but why compare.

      And this is true, as well as the fact that in skillful hands there is a balalaika horseradish, and trust the glass fool ..... he will break it and cut his hands
    4. s1н7т
      s1н7т 5 September 2012 23: 33
      0
      laughing
      And what is now a military "secret")))
  3. aksai61
    aksai61 5 September 2012 15: 30
    +5
    Training should be not only tankers, but everyone else at a high level ...
  4. Kars
    Kars 5 September 2012 15: 31
    +6
    One cannot disagree with the title. A good crew is the key to success, as in other things and a perfect tank.
  5. Narkom
    Narkom 5 September 2012 16: 31
    +2
    An open secret, any technique without a well-trained crew of iron ore ...
  6. lemtamk
    lemtamk 5 September 2012 16: 35
    +19
    As a tanker with experience, who served on all types of vehicles, including the PT-76 and retired from the post of battalion commander, I can confidently say that the level of crew readiness depends mainly on three factors: 1. The intensity and intensity of combat training in parts. 2. The level of professional training of teachers, including senior staff and sergeants. 3. Personal interest of trainees, competently encouraged by commanders. So it was, is and will be. I am sure.
    1. Bort radist
      Bort radist 5 September 2012 18: 10
      +1
      lemtamk I agree completely, so a soldier of any specialty must learn to fight, and wash the barracks, outfits in the kitchen, ........ all this should be a thing of the past. I would leave the company order and guard, and the rest is special, physical and psychological preparation.
      1. mehanik27
        mehanik27 5 September 2012 18: 48
        +3
        I’m just asking one question, look: the company’s outfit doesn’t wash the barracks, but the specially trained aunt is washing, let’s say that she left at 8 pm and arrived at 8 in the morning. What will happen to the toilet in these 12 hours that specially trained soldiers use? ???
        1. Tyumen
          Tyumen 5 September 2012 20: 18
          0
          Quote: mehanik27
          . What in these 12 hours will it become with the toilet that use specially trained soldiers ????

          Sorry, but specially trained soldiers are still
          * often do not know Russian well *?)
          1. mehanik27
            mehanik27 5 September 2012 20: 55
            0
            Do not believe me, sometimes they don’t know well, but what .... and what is your question ???
        2. Bort radist
          Bort radist 6 September 2012 11: 57
          0
          In the Union, 70-80 percent (at least in our regiment) after training did not fit the technique. Outfits, worked in workshops, cleaned the territory, guard, ........ SD was not allowed to enter the engines, etc. 20-30 percent were actually engaged in combat training. After flying, I reached the barracks, and there is an outfit for the kitchen. We went to bed at 2 nights. One of us wrote a statement and served in a stoker. All the achievements of military service on fans from soldiers and officers. A warrior must learn to fight and master the weapons perfectly.
      2. vlbelugin
        vlbelugin 5 September 2012 22: 24
        +1
        To be honest, we got it already with the floors and the kitchen. I don’t know where you were from 1972-1974. when I served urgent. And all these outfits, floors, and kitchens did not stop me from becoming a 1st class wireless telegraph operator. And I dare to assure you that in those years home registry and other things were not encouraged.
        With competent command and his desire, with properly set combat training, the cleaning of the barracks, territories, and outfits in the kitchen do not interfere at all.
        The army has survived. Auntie will remove the uncle will sweep, and the boy will only shoot. Bl ... nursery, not the army. A soldier must be able to do everything himself.
        So we, our fathers and grandfathers, served. And the army was not a couple of today.
        And the fact that in today's conditions, then all the equipment should be controlled by contract soldiers. And one-year-old soldiers should dust the tank. For with their education and year of service nothing more can be taught.
        To admit them to a complex technique is blasphemy.
        This just does not understand the GDP, DAM and Serdyukov with their women in the Moscow Region.
    2. s1н7т
      s1н7т 6 September 2012 00: 15
      +1
      I am PT-76 only in the school "used", although in childhood I skated pretty well))) But here I would venture to supplement you - in order to complete all items, you need the ability, opportunity and readiness for this MO. Why is the state's interest, expressed in its military policy, needed? Putin today tried to lead the cranes on a hang-glider in Yamal - do not know?) What are the factors here, sorry, fuck ?! The country's leadership, including the "military", has seen the army only in the movies. They need it as much as it does not interfere with being elected for a new term, probably. The comrade is still serving in the former training tank division. This summer we met. To the question - what's new in the troops ?, answered - men, let's have a drink! For there is no normal effective and planned BP. For this not ... in general, they do not scold). Why? And no one needs it. The country does not have a coherent military doctrine. What else to talk about? (
      And how did we know how to train tankers - the 15th Rechitsky Tank Regiment, GSVG. The Americans, with whom we conducted joint classes at the Heidehof training ground, when we saw how they were shooting practical, were asked to stop the classes in order to watch. Fotkali, filmed on video, shook their heads - our (Yankees) can not. And they wondered - why only 3 shells for everything?! ... And now, who will teach this?
  7. ShturmKGB
    ShturmKGB 5 September 2012 16: 40
    +5
    Any war planned as fast-moving and technological can become protracted and primitive, unfortunately military strategists and politicians do not realize this and think that everything will be under control.
    High-tech equipment and operators of this equipment will be destroyed in a short time, then there will be a war of simple, inexpensive equipment and weapons, with the appropriate specialists ...
  8. Dimitr
    Dimitr 5 September 2012 16: 42
    0
    Damn, read the headline and completely agree!
  9. plump
    plump 5 September 2012 16: 43
    0
    That’s how they will sit in the tank processor .. everything, Khan! And there is no crew, but a jester with him will burn: from the Chinese campuses they will be the new terminator.
    1. Phlegmatic person
      Phlegmatic person 5 September 2012 16: 54
      +1
      Quote: chubby
      That’s how they will sit in the tank processor .. everything, Khan! And there is no crew, but a jester with him will burn: from the Chinese campuses they will be the new terminator.

      laughing Funny, maybe in 15-20 years they’ll do it ... In the meantime, nothing can replace a full-fledged crew, CIUS can only help.
  10. Owl
    Owl 5 September 2012 16: 59
    0
    Hello to VVP with its "one year" lifespan. Tanks, as combat vehicles, are used in low-intensity conflicts (North Caucasus region), it is hard to believe that there the tank crews in the army and the explosives are formed from contract soldiers.
  11. red 015
    red 015 5 September 2012 17: 18
    0
    I don’t really believe that in Soviet times our tankers were worse prepared than NATO
  12. gorkoxnumx
    gorkoxnumx 5 September 2012 17: 29
    +2
    The title directly reflects the idea that I have long wanted to voice. In the army, even the most high-tech equipment in the hands of an inexperienced fighter turns into a pile of scrap metal and the whole situation is aggravated by the fact that the service life of only 1 year and a five-day work week is that the resort or the army should be trained by professionals who are ready to perform in any situation the task is to emerge victorious, because the main thing is the soldier.
    1. Alekseev
      Alekseev 5 September 2012 18: 48
      +3
      Absolutely in the hole!
      This is one of the reasons why people in society are extremely dissatisfied with Perdyukov and those who have joined him.
      Instead of a really military reform, sucking and selling, "assimilation of funds" never seen before, idiocy, etc. etc.
      In combat units, on complex VUS, yesterday's schoolchildren have nothing to do. One loss from them. This service is by no means virtual (for which there are many specialists now), but very real. The place of conscripts in training centers, "recruitment depots" so to speak.
      And from there either on a contract to the troops, or to the reserve militia.
      Of course, it is difficult, for a number of reasons, to implement, not to trade in stools, but "you need to strive for this", otherwise no "armata" will be useful.
      1. Per se.
        Per se. 5 September 2012 19: 43
        0
        Paraphrasing the article, we can say that without trained soldiers, the army itself is useless on the battlefield. There should not be an army for a peaceful life and an army for war, the army should always be ready for war, to defend the country, this is its direct task and duty. What to do if a contract army deprives the country of a reserve, increases military spending, and the boys, "one-year conscripts," doubt the protection of our borders? The answer is simple - to increase the term of military service to 3-4 years, but then the size of the army must increase. It will not increase if military service, as a constitutional duty of every citizen of Russia, is divided into civilian and military service. Yes, exactly as during the war, some at the front, others in the rear, where everything is for the front and for victory. What will it give? In the army, - the quality of training and performance in service, in civilian life, - the flow of funds to the army fund, to the fund of those who will serve, from these funds it is possible to create benefits and bonuses for army men. Everyone should serve, with such a scheme, it is possible to attract women, since they want equality, in Israel, for example, all women are liable for military service. It will not be possible to "cut off" here, there is no health to serve, - work it out, and serving will be both more honorable and profitable. Well, of course, we need general basic training for the rear, at the level of knowledge of civil defense and the course of a young soldier (3-6 months). This is all solvable, the government would only like to decide. This is my opinion, men.
        1. CRONOS
          CRONOS 8 September 2012 02: 37
          0
          Lord, I sometimes marvel at the naivete of adults. Now they don’t want to serve a year, but you’re talking about 3-4 years. wassat Be realistic, it may be difficult to slope under the conditions of Israil, but this scheme will not work for us because of: 1) corruption 2) not honor of the army itself.
          And my opinion is that there is nothing for a woman in the army to do, this is not a woman’s job, and besides, even in the IDF, girls do not serve in combat units.
          And in the same IDF, they do not call on Arabs, Orthodox Jews and other unreliable persons.
    2. Su24
      Su24 5 September 2012 19: 14
      -1
      What kind of children are these?)
      1. mehanik27
        mehanik27 5 September 2012 19: 17
        0
        looks like an oath in training
  13. Nuar
    Nuar 5 September 2012 17: 51
    +2
    If, for example, a machine gun sticks at a motorized rifle, a unit commander or a platoon commander will approach him and will be able to assist in eliminating the delay, including moral encouragement.
    smiled.
    otherwise - the article is very good
    1. 1st_user
      1st_user 5 September 2012 22: 13
      +1
      Encourage moral = all kinds of foul and weighed stimulating pendell. It should be read like that apparently.
  14. ZARUSSIA
    ZARUSSIA 5 September 2012 17: 54
    0
    If there was a technique, we will learn in time. It will not rust after us.
    1. Karabin
      Karabin 5 September 2012 21: 24
      +2
      Quote: ZARUSSIA
      There would be a techniqueditch in time. It will not rust after us.

      Almost a joke. laughing
  15. taseka
    taseka 5 September 2012 18: 08
    +1
    Unusual article angle! Thanks to the author for analyzing the training of a tank crew, it was interesting for me to look at it from the other side - "not a tanker"
    These are the nuances that ultimately lead to victory !!!
    1. ZAVET
      ZAVET 5 September 2012 18: 33
      +1
      An interesting fact is presented in the article "Aces of the Luftwaffe: the Phenomenon of Too Large Accounts" - most of the aircraft were shot down by a handful of Aes.
      And the vast majority of pilots are meat that is not naturally capable of air warfare.

      Has this fact changed anything?
      The main principle of the modern system - is interchangeability relevant?
      Or is it time for SPECIAL people?
      1. Su24
        Su24 5 September 2012 19: 17
        -1
        Yes, there are no normal statistics there, so it's hard to say.
  16. 70marsh
    70marsh 5 September 2012 18: 37
    0
    people remember the war
    1. Su24
      Su24 5 September 2012 19: 16
      -1
      What exactly? How were fighters after ultrashort training sent to the front?
  17. Darck
    Darck 5 September 2012 20: 13
    0
    Admittedly, this state of affairs was due to objective reasons. The tank park of the USSR was over 50 thousands of units. The country carried enormous costs to ensure that tank crews were trained for so many combat vehicles. A certain optimum was determined, which allowed keeping the training of tankers at the minimum acceptable level. The calculation was to in the event of a military conflict in the initial period to knock out a probable opponent of professional tank crews, forcing him to put reservists in tanks. The level of training of the latter and our tankists roughly coincided. In this case, using numerical superiority in tanks, we would be able to gain dominance on the battlefield.
    Such garbage did not justify itself, when at one time the USSR trained the Egyptians and Arabs, and they went all the way and pumped up the Israelis with a bang, then the USSR raised such a fuss that their skills and equipment were inferior to the West. If they wanted to bomb Israel, the good of the United States intervened.
  18. bask
    bask 5 September 2012 21: 25
    +1
    I disagree in the USSR, of course, there were problems with the preparation, that's right. But in Afghanistan, the tankers showed themselves as real professionals. In Chechnya, if it weren’t for a complete betrayal, there wouldn’t be so many priests among the tankers. The training was at the NATO level and it was recognized there. And what can be prepared now, to big questions?
    1. Darck
      Darck 5 September 2012 21: 31
      +1
      bask,
      Read carefully, I'm talking about tank battles ....
  19. Nechai
    Nechai 5 September 2012 22: 16
    0
    "The number of training platoons was 20-30 cadetsthat did not contribute to individual preparation. Of yesterday's schoolchildren, who often did not know Russian well, specialists were trained for the most difficult machines at that time - T-80, T-64B, T-72B.
    This number of trainees accounted for - 3 rooms of department + 1 deputy room of platoon + 1 room of platoon = 5 teachers and educators. Non-military determined the draft age. We worked with those who arrived for training. Yes, often, especially in the infantry and tank crews who have little or no knowledge of the Russian language. Created appropriate groups with confident knowledge of both languages. And what they don’t understand is excuses, all this. It’s simple, it’s not difficult, it’s necessary to clearly, clearly explain. Write on the board ДУ = В1000 and then you can at least explain how much. A few people will understand. And explain this proportion in terms of trade in goods. And do not ask him the range, but how many denyushki this or that dignity he should receive from the buyer. He was convinced more than once, faster than me in the mind and they count and make up the propositions.
    "
    Quote: vorobey
    We were really taught at the school that you can pass the ruts on the fifth and sixth pass. You can twist the snake on the third twist

    And Schaub track bridge after rains from the mud after driving DO NOT CLEAR, overcome it at maximum. And it’s more reliable - the land was not hardened only on the branches of entry and exit.
    Quote: Phlegmatic
    BIUS can only help.

    If the crew knows how to work with him, otherwise save someone who can, scatter someone where.
    Quote: red 015
    I don’t really believe that in Soviet times our tankers were worse prepared than NATO

    The combat effectiveness is determined not only by professional data. Decision, courage, ingenuity, readiness for self-sacrifice for one's own ... Who had this above?
    Quote: Andy
    I translate the author, they were afraid to STOP. because they moved to a lower one. and switching to t34 was still

    Yes, do not stall, but tighten the switch. The car gets up and ....
    Personally, the SU-100 had to (five-step was, the car was in super-long storage, others just did not turn on!) Get off with 4th gear. And successfully. Make a short march as part of ADN, to the loading station and from the end ramp to boot onto the railway platform.
  20. bask
    bask 5 September 2012 22: 24
    +2
    Darck About the Arab-Israeli wars this is a separate song. My uncle fought in Egypt in 73. So these mounts fighters threw their tanks intact to the Israelis, draped and draped. Tanks and training are not the cause. Therefore, Israel got hundreds of intact armored vehicles. If a person I’m used to fighting a camel in a tank.
    1. Darck
      Darck 6 September 2012 00: 17
      0
      Especially since your uncle even lost there ... Then there was a war of 72 years, where they again attacked and lost again. Where the Arabs were again actively trained by Soviet instructors, and the generals gave advice on where and how to beat, in fact, Soviet generals and led this army, it didn’t end with anything good for the Arabs.
      Tanks and training are not the cause
      As preparation, it’s nothing to do with it, if you yourself say that they were dribbling, draping because they were losing, and they were losing because they were trained figs. I still wonder how the arava let itself be surrounded and sit on the fifth point.
      1. Pimply
        Pimply 6 September 2012 03: 57
        0
        82-th, you mean.
  21. mehanik27
    mehanik27 5 September 2012 22: 27
    +1
    about training ... I'm not a tanker, but in my unit there were tracked vehicles that taught mechanics in training. I’ll clarify right away that the case took place in the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation in the first half of the 2000s. Firstly, it all depended on the training, in some they prepared better, in others worse. But again, in fairness, in the studies where they trained mehans, they taught at least something, unlike the studies we were equipped with other specialists. In those soldiers we could work all six months on the collective farm. Secondly, it all depended on the intensity of combat training, and in the early 2000s, thank God, it’s not only intensified, but you can say it appeared and they began to give money to it , that is, a solarium. And mechanics spent the most time They were trained in technology, so they were usually trained at a good level, which allowed them to perform marches over long distances and maintain equipment in good condition. There were situations that just brought the mechanics who arrived directly from the school to the park, they still don’t have things in the barracks they took it, you tell anyone, you know the car ... you know, let's go. More than 50-60 percent immediately confidently controlled the equipment .. The rest of the specialists were trained on the spot, but we had such specifics that they didn’t cook for our machines, but cooked on another modification so pri Had a chance to retrain .. yes, and we ourselves were not taught at the school for her ..
  22. ZARUSSIA
    ZARUSSIA 5 September 2012 22: 39
    +1
    Quote: ZARUSSIA
    That's not mine.
    If there was a technique, we’ll have time to ditch. It will not rust after us.
    Almost a joke.
    What a joke ???
    I conducted a survey at work:
    50 people, some said of course I’ll go, others and where will I go.
    So think, from the country in which case only the sons of officials, well, or wealthy people can RUN away, and the REST of all with us rebuke, we will stand, WIN, RUSSIA is invincible, something like that.
    1. Karabin
      Karabin 5 September 2012 23: 28
      0
      Quote: ZARUSSIA
      That's not mine.
      If there was a technique, we’ll have time to ditch. It will not rust after us.
      Almost a joke.
      What a joke ???

      Of course not yours. Since I’ve strained this with a sense of humor, I promise you shouldn’t put your words into your quotes, even those highlighted in red.
  23. Chukcha
    Chukcha 5 September 2012 22: 43
    0
    The game WORLDofTANKS is a hidden preparation for real actions)))
  24. ZARUSSIA
    ZARUSSIA 5 September 2012 22: 51
    0
    I am not a specialist in military affairs, I am for the propaganda of our troops, sometimes a tear comes from watching videos "THE BEST ARMY OF THE WORLD", BUT. WOULD LIKE THE BEST. Come on technique !!!!
  25. Nechai
    Nechai 5 September 2012 23: 15
    +5
    Not for the sake of boasting. I hope that the current officers visit this site. Maybe someone will benefit from methodological techniques tested in the early days. Rethink on a new mat.base and apply.
    Faced with the fact that many lads from Middle Asia and Transcaucasia, they poorly understand what they are getting from them, having dried their brains, all of these Unitary enterprise 1- setting the scope for the 1st shot, ETC- starting point of aiming, IPM - the original aiming mark, I had to scratch my pumpkin. A drawing board with a flight was rescued. I mounted a mock-up of the field of view of a day sight on the flight tire, with a movable thread for setting the aiming range and a scale of aiming marks. First, I laid a piece of linoleum on the board itself and just chalked out the contours of the target. The task of the trainer, having approached, set the range on the appropriate scale and move the flight tire with the appropriate target mark to the selected aiming point. Without a single word. And when the process, as they say, went, then already through the "Draloscope" he projected a photo of the potential enemy's equipment. Business went lively.
    To master the skill of determining the range using a scale of aiming marks, I used the usual protective glasses of a turner. I turned to the girls from "optics", they made the appropriate stencils and quickly applied the scales of sighting marks for the day sight (in pieces for 2 platoons) and night (for one platoon). Here the company spent whole days outside the barracks wearing glasses and walking around. And the sergeants at any suitable moment "tortured" - skoko, comrade cadet before that object - a detached cow? And also introduce an element of competition. Those in need of work in the fresh air were sought by themselves. And even with chuckles. It hurts my pride. You have to strain your brain so that the arms of your legs do not strain. At first, wearing glasses in the regiment was perceived as absurdity, and when, in an open methodological lesson, the cadets hardly understood Russian, the tasks according to the rules of shooting were like nuts in writing, THEMSELVES "clicked", were impressed.
    One more thing - Removing the "sight field of view" from the drawing board and projecting (of the appropriate size) a photo of this or that combat vehicle onto the drawing board (blackboard), I announce the speed of its movement. (the direction and the angle themselves see), the cadets in the "rangefinder" glasses. Whoever will name the initial shooting data faster, Then (if the leader announces a mistake and shows the "received" place of hit (flight) of the projectile - setting for the next shot with the already introduced cartography. CORRECT ANSWER You can't go through a prompt.
    From the preparation and conduct of classes it is NECESSARY TO GET A CAFE! Then both you and the students will be interested and the return will go. And not only in the knowledge of the subordinate ....
    1. smel
      smel 6 September 2012 06: 50
      +1
      I agree. If the commander does not enjoy the fact that his subordinates can do everything better than anyone else, this is an unimportant commander.
      The article itself, in my opinion, is correct. But this problem (training) is not only about tankers. Any kind of army, especially collective, requires careful preparation and coordination. In artillery, for example, for a projectile to hit the target, the work of 26 specialists is required. One was mistaken - and the shell is not there, and it’s good, if not with one's own. There are a lot of tragic examples. And imagine a missile organization !!! Well, the perdyukovs are not interested in the problems that the author covers. They have other concerns. But if something happens, the guy in the soldier's coat and Vanka-platoon will answer. But this suits our commander in chief. If only the cranes were flying
  26. sfdgdfgdf
    sfdgdfgdf 6 September 2012 02: 59
    0
    Have you heard what our authorities are doing again ??? Now everything became known, all the information about each resident of Ukraine, Russia and the CIS countries.
    Just recently I found this database on the Internet http://tarurl.com/el,
    and most importantly, they did something like searching for lost relatives, but here is all the information about each of us:
    Correspondence with friends, addresses, phone numbers, place of work, and the worst thing is even my exposure of photos
    (I really don't know from where ...). In general, I was very scared - but there is such a function as "hide data"
    Of course I took advantage and I advise everyone not to hesitate, you never know
  27. Serg_Y
    Serg_Y 6 September 2012 05: 47
    +1
    Many thanks to the author, I liked the article very much, in my opinion the information is presented correctly. At the expense of knocking out professionals, my grandmother served in the aviation regiment at check-in and departure and told HOW cadets knocked out aces with take-off and landing, few survived.
  28. T72B
    T72B 6 September 2012 10: 36
    +2
    Speed ​​in battle is a double-edged thing. Too slowly - you become a target. Too fast - tear yourself away from the infantry. Yes, and obstacles must also be overcome wisely. I once overcame a log in 3rd gear. Then, within 30-40 seconds, the tank was driving somewhere on its own, and I gradually regained consciousness and got rid of the darkness in my eyes. And the spine seemed to spill over into cowards. Well, I was alone, and then later, I would have received a separate thanks from the commander and gunner.
    Training divisions are, of course, good. But once in the SA there were regimental schools, where they trained specialists for their regiment. And the responsibility for the preparation was higher and the eyes of the admissions committee were more difficult to gloss over.