The Ministry of Defense has published archival documents dedicated to the beginning of the Great Patriotic War

The Russian Ministry of Defense is opening a new multimedia project called "The day the blitzkrieg crashed"dedicated to the first days of the Great Patriotic War. The section was launched on the eve of the 80th anniversary of the beginning of the Second World War.

The users of the section will be presented with archival documents of the German-fascist command on the preparation of the blitzkrieg in the East. According to the documents, Hitler and his generals were assigned from 9 to 17 weeks for the entire eastern company. Archival materials reveal the preparation of the Nazis for the attack on "Soviet Russia", the forces and funds allocated for the "short-term campaign."

The level of preparation for the attack was quite high; the German-fascist command pinned great hope on the surprise of the strike along the entire border line.

Another block of documents speaks of the preparation of the Soviet command for possible hostilities against the background of an understanding of the inevitability of a large-scale war with Germany.

In all directions, the pulling of units and means of reinforcement to the border is noted

- says the report of the Chief of Staff of the Western Special Military District to the Deputy Chief of the General Staff of the Red Army on June 21, 1941.

Despite the preparation, the blow of the Nazis was still sudden. However, the Red Army put up stubborn resistance, bloody battles began on the border with superior enemy forces. In some areas, the enemy was driven back and even had to retreat. The courage and heroism of the soldiers of the Red Army, who did not allow the enemy to carry out a "lightning campaign" in the first days of the war, is described in archival documents disclosed by the Ministry of Defense.

At the same time, the article "National Defense" published an article by the director of the Russian Foreign Intelligence Service, Sergei Naryshkin, dedicated to the beginning of the Great Patriotic War. As follows from the material, for the first time about a possible German attack on the USSR, Soviet intelligence learned back in 1932. And the first information about the beginning of preparations for the invasion was the message of the station in France on August 4, 1940 about the beginning of the transfer of the released Nazi troops from the western front to the Soviet borders.

At the same time, the German special services carried out work on disinformation, strategic and operational camouflage, so it was not possible to determine the exact date of the attack for a long time. Only the foreign intelligence for the period from July 1940 to June 1941 sent to Moscow 120 information messages with the estimated dates, and there was also a residency, various missions, etc.

Comments

[Civil]

Anyone wanting to repeat it? Where are the hyperpatriots?

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Civil

Anyone wanting to repeat it?

Stickers "To Berlin" and "We can repeat" I suppose you are buying hundreds?

[Civil]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

Stickers "To Berlin" and "We can repeat" I suppose you are buying hundreds?

For some reason you are producing them, this is your propaganda action "we can repeat 1941-1945". It is even impossible to imagine a greater mockery of the veterans.

[Shurik70]

And yet, what was the point of secreting such documents?
They should have been declassified on May 10, 1945

[sniperino]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

Quote: Civil

Anyone wanting to repeat it?

Stickers "To Berlin" and "We can repeat" I suppose you are buying hundreds?

More like fridge magnets (Munich, Stuttgard, Cologne, etc.), but without any "on" and "repeat".

[lwxx]

Quote: Civil

Anyone wanting to repeat it?

Yes, the sea. It's just that some of them still have fresh memories. Just relax a little and wait for the guests.

[antivirus]

approx in 94-95 years - TV - "under Yelnya the Guard was born ...", and grandmother - "there they raised companies on machine guns, then the next ones." ...- "maybe not in the forehead?" - "they lifted straight up one by one"
the price of Victory is known, but not realized (until the end and before the beginning)

[Zug]

In my case, the Germans forced our swollen corpses to be removed from the fields, separate arms and legs, entirely into pits and craters. All, according to her, the cowards fled and those who fought by July lay their heads to the west ..

[Oleg Aviator]

Kolya from Urengoy should tell this more often, and it is even better to show it. That would not smear the snot on the poor German soldiers.

[vladimirvn]

Power imitates unity with the people. Tries to cover up any crack in the rift. And in the archives there are facts about cowardice, betrayal, unprofessionalism, drunkenness and moral decay along with exploits and examples of selfless service to the Motherland. The descendants of both of them are marching in a single "Immortal Regiment". And such a blissful picture of the authorities is needed. No, really.

[poquello]

Quote: vladimirvn

And in the archives there are facts about cowardice, betrayal, unprofessionalism, drunkenness and moral decay ...

oh how, facts in the studio!

[poquello]

Quote: vladimirvn

https://ren.tv/blog/iurii-gorodnenko/848782-kto-i-kak-predal-rodinu-v-iiune-1941-goda-fakty-daty-familii?utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com&utm_campaign=dbr

and these are fresh archives? )))))))))))))))

[vladimirvn]

Quote: poquello

Quote: vladimirvn

And in the archives there are facts about cowardice, betrayal, unprofessionalism, drunkenness and moral decay ...

oh how, facts in the studio!

Someone deletes my comments. Probably uncomfortable.
Well, read here more.
https://zen.yandex.ru/media/mironowa/nacsostav-kollaborantov-v-vov-v-sravnenii-s-nacsostavom-krasnoi-armii-kto-chasce-shel-slujit-gitleru-60d26f519e2a48409ac2b8ab?&utm_campaign=dbr

[poquello]

Quote: vladimirvn

Well, read here more.

As I understand it, you are posting links to versions of one conjecture from the rentals, which with some changes were reprinted by vesnanext and others, they have nothing to do with recently opened archives and were made on accusations of the NKVD (well, or something like that), moreover - some events are very different in the sources in detail, which raises doubts, for example, a defector from the Front's Front or captured after being wounded in the events is important despite his further work for the Nazis.

[vladimirvn]

I remain with my opinion. I'm not going to convince you of anything.
And this is for broadening one's horizons.
https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/2702876

[Zug]

I’ve been told such a thing that I think it’s not worth writing here, because then they’ll demote me here in penalties. Our neighbor, Baba Anya, told us how our village took them. After the battle, on both sides of the road, corpses were piled in rows, all young boys (and cried)

[Kama74]

Everyone imagines himself a strategist seeing a battle from the side

[Machito]

Quote: lwxx

Quote: Civil

Anyone wanting to repeat it?

Yes, the sea. It's just that some of them still have fresh memories. Just relax a little and wait for the guests.

We will definitely bang. And more than once. The whole world is in dust. But then. (C) DMB
In the Eurofascist Union, a lot of leaders are seriously afraid that we might repeat it.

[nnm]

First of all, we ourselves do not have such a desire - these four years were too terrible for us. What to repeat - 27 million dead, Babi Yar, Auschwitz, the Siege of Leningrad, gas in the catacombs of Odessa, murdered children, crippled lives, the death of guys who did not even begin to shave, tortured wives, girlfriends ... Colleague, this is not the case when one must proudly declare such a thing, not having lived a day in those days, months, years ...
And it is hardly worth so bravely declaring "we can repeat". We, knowing the price we had to pay for clearing Europe of this amount, should least of all want a repetition of such a thing. Be ready? Yes, definitely ...
But to say so ... on the day of the beginning of a huge tragedy for our country, I think, is not worth it ...

[Normal]

Quote: nnm

But to say so ... on the day of the beginning of a huge tragedy for our country, I think, is not worth it ...

Colleague Grazhdansky asked a question, but did not make a statement.
And this question is not with an invoking meaning.

[nnm]

I see what our colleague added after criticism about hyperpatriots. Perhaps, initially, he simply did not express his thought unambiguously enough. Quite possible. But we commented on the text when the second part of it had not yet been completed.

[Normal]

I understood "Civil" from the first time, to the "hyperpatriots" and the appearance of the second post.

[Civil]

Quote: nnm

Perhaps initially he simply did not express his thought unambiguously enough.

Clarified so that there are no misinterpretations.

[Machito]

Quote: nnm

First of all, we ourselves do not have such a desire - these four years were too terrible for us. What to repeat - 27 million dead, Babi Yar, Auschwitz, the Siege of Leningrad, gas in the catacombs of Odessa, murdered children, crippled lives, the death of guys who did not even begin to shave, tortured wives, girlfriends ... Colleague, this is not the case when one must proudly declare such a thing, not having lived a day in those days, months, years ...
And it is hardly worth so bravely declaring "we can repeat". We, knowing the price we had to pay for clearing Europe of this amount, should least of all want a repetition of such a thing. Be ready? Yes, definitely ...
But to say so ... on the day of the beginning of a huge tragedy for our country, I think, is not worth it ...

You're right. For the third time to cleanse Europe of filth? If only American style, carpet bombing. Why save European cities while grabbing their soldiers? He banged a vigorous loaf, and God in heaven will discern: who is in paradise, and who is for the devil's amusement.
But seriously, let us remember with kind words the relatives who died at the front. Eternal Memory to them.

[Living7111972]

I don’t want to join the fighting army anymore, and I just don’t want to join the army. I don't even want to take up a weapon.

[Nastia makarova]

no need to distort !!! "we can repeat" has a different meaning, not the one you want to say !!! it makes sense that if the enemy again attacks our homeland, then we will all go to defend the patronymic just like our grandfathers and great-grandfathers

[Oleg Aviator]

That's it. I just wanted to say the same thing but you wrote earlier. Nobody wants war. And the warning is just for those who dream of it. On someone else's territory of course) they don't want to on their own)

[Normal]

Quote: Nastia Makarova

no need to distort !!!

That's right, you don't have to talk and clown around. The enemy has not attacked yet, but we already - "We can repeat!" You can only repeat what you have already done. PERSONALLY did, not grandfathers and great-grandfathers, They, by the way, are not eager to repeat.

"We were advancing on Rzhev along the corpse fields. During the battles of Rzhev, many" valleys of death "and" groves of death "appeared. It is difficult for anyone who has not been there to imagine what a stinking mess under the summer sun, consisting of thousands of human bodies covered with worms, is. Summer, heat , calmness, and ahead - this is such a “valley of death.” It is clearly visible and is shot by the Germans. There is no way to pass or bypass it: a telephone cable is laid along it - it is broken, and at all costs it must be quickly connected You crawl over the corpses, and they are piled in three layers, swollen, teeming with worms, emitting a sickening sweetish smell of decomposition of human bodies. This stench hangs motionless over the "valley." worms, a fountain of pernicious stench hits your face. But then the fragments flew by, you jump up, dust yourself off and again - forward. "

- Pyotr Mikhin. "Gunners, Stalin gave the order!" We died to win.

.........................

Quote: Nastia Makarova

we can repeat it has a different meaning, not the one you want to say !!!

"We can repeat!" has just such a meaning, which is put into it by narrow-minded uryakals, who have not spent a day in the trenches ankle-deep in ice porridge, on breadcrumbs and vobla, but pasted over their GERMAN cars with idiots like "Trophy", "To Berlin!" and "We can repeat!" ... "We can" .... Not "We will definitely do it", but "we can" do it. I mean, not a manifestation of an unyielding will. Not a statement of the inevitable, but a show-off. Empty bravado and intimidation of a potential adversary - hold me seven !, or we can repeat it.
In such a dugout for two weeks to Rzhev and Olenino. In April, from the icy swamps, retrieve and bury the bones of unnamed fighters that have not yet been buried.
To freeze the desire to "repeat" with your fingers, so that they do not pound on the keyboard, expounding nonsense.

Initially, the phrase was like this:
"" And if someone dares to do something like that, we will repeat"- Putin said."
You need to know the subject so as not to bliss with three exclamation marks.

[Vasya_20]

Why is the smart guy so excited? People like you can only shit that we need to "pay and repent, pay and repent", yes, even in the Bundestag congresses you can speak out like that Kohl from Urengoy and others. And we don't need to scatter quotes from the memoirs of real participants in the Second World War, I think many of these memoirs have read more than once, and many have heard from their parents, grandparents and relatives who were direct participants in those events - having made for themselves the values ​​corresponding to their system of values and worldview conclusions.
But if you, like a guppy fish, do not understand where today's purposeful and step by step realizing is going, by those who promote it at the highest level, the substitution of concepts and values, "pumping", hysteria and escalation of the militarized situation around Russia - then with someone like you, firstly, there is nothing to talk about at all, and secondly, during a real mess you all automatically pass into the category of unreliable collaborators subject to isolation and liquidation.
And you can continue to bleat about what you are writing - for the next big war and our victory in it, this will not hinder in any way and will not have any influence on it!

PS: And people like you remind me of representatives of a well-known nationality, who are just excited on the eve of tragic and great dates from the history of our country and people, inevitably reaching, in their "high" inferences, to the point that "Stalin was worse than Hitler "- this is generally their obligatory and duty statement, such is their mantra-chutzpa, so that it is imprinted in the minds and souls of little thinking and fragile individuals, on whom it is, in fact, directed; "And they could drink Bavarian" and the like - and many understand why and for what specific purpose they are doing this. It is incomprehensible only how the descendants of the great nation of peacekeepers and victorious warriors can become incomprehensible to whom, and indeed allow themselves to be brought to their knees, and whose worldview is turned upside down, where white is replaced by black, and instead of brains - a skull filled with substance brown!

PS: Probably we all need to start mocking those representatives of the "izbgan" who promote this very necessary agenda for them, on the eve of their 9 Av every year, telling that the Persians and Romans, and Hitler with Himmler-Goering-Goebbels, too, were not at all such monsters as all "historians" are trying to portray them to us, so that they understand what Victory in that war means to us and what price our people paid for it by sacrificing the best their sons and daughters!

[Normal]

Quote: Vasya_20

Vasya_20

With such a manner of communication, vocabulary, and mental abilities ...
but shouldn't you go, Vasya ...
on a walking trip along the well-known route?

[Terenin]

Quote: Vasya_20

to scoff at those representatives of the "elected" who are promoting this very necessary agenda for them, on the eve of their 9 Av every year, telling that the Persians and the Romans, and Hitler and Himmler-Goering-Goebbels, too, were not at all like that monsters, as all the "historians" are trying to portray them to us,

Why is modern Europe in anti-Russian hysteria? Because he cannot forgive us for his defeat. And, the USSR fought with all of Europe, which, in addition to the economy, had colonies around the world.

[ccsr]

Quote: Civil

Where are the hyperpatriots?

Yes, here they are. You should keep Vaseline on hand just in case ...

[Incvizitor]

There are enough people who want to repeat such aggression against our people, and to this day pro-Western fascists are trying to undermine the situation from within.

[nnm]

K. Simonov
"That longest day of the year
With its cloudless weather
We were given a common misfortune
At all, for all four years.

She pressed such a trail
And so many people laid down,
What is twenty years and thirty years
Living does not believe that they are alive.

And to the dead, straightening a ticket,
Someone close
And time adds to the lists
Someone else who isn’t ...
And puts
puts
obelisks. "

[Ruslan Sulima]

And to the dead, straightening a ticket,
Someone close
And time adds to the lists
Someone else who isn’t ...
And puts
puts
obelisks. "

Eh, and someone is struggling with these very obelisks, memory. Give free rein, so it was a day of mourning not for 20-40 million who died at the hands of the invaders, but mourning for the failed blitzkrieg. So already around a dime a dozen civil stake, mykol and other rubbish crying about Bavarian beer.
The Kingdom of Heaven to all those who died in the meat grinder that began on this day 80 years ago ...

[The leader of the Redskins]

Why now?!!!
Not twenty - thirty years ago, when all sorts of Rezuns-Suvorovs climbed out from under the bunk and scribbled their libels, trying to rewrite history? !!!

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

Not twenty - thirty years ago, when all sorts of Rezuns-Suvorovs climbed out from under the bunk and scribbled their libels, trying to rewrite history? !!!

It had to start from 1] 954, but the Khrushchevs and similar democrats came and were silent until now.

[antivirus]

there was a purposeful policy of Yakovlev, MSG, Bakatin and ?? Lgachev with the EBN and the entire ruling class to deal with the vector of the country's development and the country itself.

[Normal]

Quote: Leader of the Redskins

all sorts of Rezuns - Suvorovs climbed out from under the bunk and scribbled their libels

If the Rezuns-Suvorovs had not come out 20-30 years ago, then we would still be fed with fables about surprise and unpreparedness for war.
If one opinion totally dominates, and all attempts to question it are rigidly suppressed, then it is impossible to understand the reasons for the multitude of failures.

[Alex Justice]

Why now?!!!
Not twenty - thirty years ago,

It can be seen that there is something to hide. There will still be 50 years of quietly publishing archives.

[nnm]

Colleague, I will give you the words of the same Isaev in response to a similar question (not a quote, but I will convey the meaning for sure).
1. Imagine the amount of archival material that is only in TsAMO ... and then how much the declassification commission can process it. It will take decades more.
2. They are very attentive to personal data. Because many have preserved relatives, people have survived who work in the residence in the next generations, etc. And you have to study each sheet before deciding on declassification.
Indeed, in fact, all the main documents have long been disclosed, including those voiced by Naryshkin. It is a pity that he leads to the eternal "intelligence warned", not to mention what is described in the last paragraph of the commented article. But it can be understood.

[A. Privalov]

I understand very well what you are talking about.
I beg your pardon, but I have been dealing with the issues of military history for more than forty years and I cannot accept the excuses of three generations of secretaries. I have something to compare with.

[nnm]

I remembered. Another reason he voiced. Restricting access to documents for foreigners, who then turn everything upside down. At the same time, when writing studies, Russian historians have full access to the materials through the registration of admission. But in general, I completely agree with you - you need to know your history and be able to accept it whatever it may be. Otherwise, we will be doomed to repeat mistakes.

[A. Privalov]

Quote: nnm

But in general, I completely agree with you - you need to know your history and be able to accept it whatever it may be.

Very grateful for your understanding!
I confess, I am very surprised, annoyed and even angry that materials, say, on the 266th separate ski battalion of the 4th Shock Army of the Kalinin Front, are easier and easier to obtain from the Library of the US Congress than from any of the branches of the Central Archives of the Russian Ministry of Defense. Federation (TsAMO RF).

[aszzz888]

A. Privalov (Alexander Privalov)
Today, 08: 36
NEW
I confess that it surprises me very much, annoys and even makes me angry,

go to the "World League of Sexual Reforms," ​​there and please.

[Alex Justice]

when writing studies, Russian historians have full access to the materials through the registration of admission.

Not true, the archives are still inaccessible to historians. They give out only those materials that are beneficial to the authorities.

[Alex Justice]

In the West, after 50 years, all archives are available.

[not main]

Quote: Alex Justice

In the West, after 50 years, all archives are available.

This is of course ... All, but there are exceptions (not so small), for example, at least remember Hess!

[Normal]

Naturally from us.
And the same amount will be hidden.
Or do you think that everything has been declassified, and not just what is profitable at the moment.

[Clear]

Quote: A. Privalov

said in archival documents disclosed by the Ministry of Defense.

From whom have they kept secret and kept secret for 80 years?

And from whom have the Anglo-Saxons this period, just recently classified for another 50 years?

[A. Privalov]

Quote: Clear

And from whom have the Anglo-Saxons this period, just recently classified for another 50 years?

So they are such and such bastards, what to take from them?
By the way, where did you get such data? What, where, when is it "recently" and by whom is it classified? Well, and most importantly "Anglo-Saxons", this is just a figure of speech adopted in the Runet. And in your understanding, who is this?

[Clear]

Quote: A. Privalov

So they are such and such bastards, what to take from them?

Initially, let the loot in the colonies be returned

Quote: A. Privalov

Well, and most importantly "Anglo-Saxons", this is just a figure of speech adopted in the Runet. And in your understanding, who is this?

Yes, these are all the same representatives of the united political elite of Great Britain and the United States (not to mention their vassals Canada, Australia and New Zealand).

Quote: A. Privalov

By the way, where did you get such data? What, where, when is it "recently" and by whom is it classified?

Sasha, the impression is that you do not look anywhere except in VO. Or does the technique not order?
You certainly don't know that the United States and Great Britain are in no hurry to open the archives for fear that their cooperation with Nazi Germany will become known.
You also don't know (here are those cross ) that in Great Britain several tens of thousands of government documents concerning the most acute episodes in the history of Britain of the twentieth century have disappeared. They were removed from the National Archives by government officials and then reported missing ... and so on ...

Holy innocence

[A. Privalov]

Quote: Clear

Holy innocence

Yes, I am like this!
Tales from the series: "everyone knows that ...", a lot on the net. Or, as the Editorial Board likes to write on VO "American media report ...". Do you have something intelligible?
By the way, the main secretary of the United States is not an "Anglo-Saxon", but quite a proud descendant of African slaves.

[aszzz888]

A. Privalov (Alexander Privalov)
Today, 09: 18
NEW

0
Quote: Clear
Holy innocence

Yes, I am like this! good

The one who would have doubted!)) "You won't die of modesty!"

[Clear]

Quote: A. Privalov

Tales from the series: "everyone knows that ...", a lot on the net. Or, as the Editorial Board likes to write on VO "American media report ...". Do you have something intelligible?

Oh, how attentive we are to the VO edition ... And what about the former Prime Minister of Great Britain - Terezka May with her "figle-blink", translated from the English "high-like-like" little comment?

Quote: A. Privalov

but quite a proud descendant of African slaves.

How can a descendant of slaves be proud? I understand that the school of western acrobatics and balancing act is unsurpassed

[A. Privalov]

Quote: Clear

And what about the former Prime Minister of Great Britain - Terezka May with her "figle-blink", translated from the English "high-like-like" little comment?

Sorry, madam, I did not grasp the depth of your thought. Why would I suddenly start commenting on Lady May here? How do I relate to the former Prime Minister of Great Britain?

[Clear]

Quote: A. Privalov

Why would I suddenly start commenting on Lady May here? What do I have to do with the former Prime Minister of Great Britain?

So I wrote something about indistinctness from the ceiling:

Quote: A. Privalov

Or, as the Editorial Board likes to write on VO "American media report ...". Do you have something intelligible?

Quote: A. Privalov

Sorry, madam, I did not grasp the depth of your thought.

Take a closer look, Sasha.
Or old again, are you distracted by strangers?
"Again I look at young virgins, but that's why, I don't remember "

[A. Privalov]

Don't rush girls
Take care of grandfather.
Grandpa also has
How to entertain someone (s)

[aszzz888]

A. Privalov (Alexander Privalov)
Yesterday, 19: 45
NEW

-1
Don't rush girls
Take care of grandfather.
Grandpa also has
How to entertain someone (C)

was going to "entertain" with sand? Or Parkinson's sausage that you can't get out of your pants?

[aszzz888]

Clear (Clear)
Yesterday, 19: 12
NEW
.... "Again I look at young maidens, but that's why, I don't remember request

"Something has become with his memory,
He does not remember what happened to him! "

But there too!

[A. Privalov]

Quote: Clear

How can a descendant of slaves be proud?

Is it forbidden to be proud of them? Are you for discrimination against the descendants of slaves?

[Clear]

Quote: A. Privalov

Is it forbidden to be proud of them?

Than? That they were slaves?
Yes, to your health!

[ccsr]

Quote: Clear

And from whom have the Anglo-Saxons this period, just recently classified for another 50 years?

They haven’t heard about it, so they are spawning from scratch, although it’s clear that they will NEVER open all the archives, for example, 8th Directorate of the General Staff and the GRU General Staff, at least due to the specifics of their work. As for the rest of the archives of the Ministry of Defense, at least several thousand qualified specialists need to be involved there so that they can somehow assess the non-secrecy of certain documents stored in the archive. More recently, in Germany, only in the Stasi archive worked according to their data.

At first, up to 3 thousand people worked in it, now only 1300, but still it is more ...

a huge number of specialists, and our "experts" demand that you tell them everything at once and now.
In general, some kind of kindergarten around these archives was formed, although it is clear that they will not be completely disassembled in our lifetime. And the overwhelming majority of the country's citizens do not need it, because this business should be done by professionals.

[Alex Justice]

And from whom have the Anglo-Saxons this period, just recently classified for another 50 years?

They have a law after 50 years, the archives are open. Only intelligence is classified.

[Grandfather]

Quote: A. Privalov

said in archival documents disclosed by the Ministry of Defense.

From whom have they kept secret and kept secret for 80 years?

this, so as not to spoil relations with the defeated, there are many things classified, and the atrocities of the Nazis and henchmen, from which normal people will vomit ...

[A. Privalov]

Quote: Dead Day

this, so as not to spoil relations with the defeated, there are many things classified, and the atrocities of the Nazis and henchmen, from which normal people will vomit ...

Under the atrocities of the Nazis, the process in Nuremberg drew a line. With henchmen, yes, it's more complicated. But this has nothing to do with classifying the composition of a number of military units that participated in certain operations at any stage of the War.

[Paranoid50]

Quote: A. Privalov

Under the atrocities of the Nazis, the process in Nuremberg drew a line.

Uh-huh ... I let it down that SS patrols are still marching through the cities of Europe.
Is long memory worse than syphilis?

[A. Privalov]

Quote: Paranoid50

Uh-huh ... I let it down that SS patrols are still marching through the cities of Europe.

Anyone who became an SS man (they all burn to the last man in Hell!) At the age of 18 in 1945 is already 94 today. They will not march too much. It's another matter that young people see in this some kind of perverted romance and neo-Nazism today in considerable force, alas ...

[aszzz888]

A. Privalov (Alexander Privalov)
Today, 09:24 ... But it has nothing to do with classifying the composition of a number of military units that participated in certain operations at any stage of the War.

This is your personal opinion, and your personal grief)) ... And then there is a secret production case: Law, orders, Decrees, instructions, instructions. Enough or you will still be killed)) on access to documents? Pi.C. do not forget to minus, IR! story.

[sniperino]

Quote: A. Privalov

Under the atrocities of the Nazis, the process in Nuremberg drew a line.

Unfortunately, this is not a line, but a dotted line without limitation of convicted persons, events and statute of limitations.

[ccsr]

Quote: A. Privalov

From whom have they kept secret and kept secret for 80 years?

But they kept secrets from various swindlers and paid propagandists so that they would not distort the essence of historical documents. In order not to be unfounded, I am citing the text of one swindler from history, who in recent years has been writing on VO about military intelligence, and shamelessly lying on any occasion, for which he was repeatedly beaten with a candelabrum:

Quote: AsmyppoL

Further about exploration. Where did you get the idea that German intelligence knew about the number of our combat-ready divisions and that they were examining them? What nonsense! If you look at their documents, then they generally had little idea about our troops in the North Caucasus Military District, in the Volga Region, in the Ural Region, in the Moscow Region. There are some questions and assumptions about the presence of rifle divisions there.
Moreover, German intelligence has a poor understanding of the boundaries of our military districts. For example, their western district occupies the territory almost to the Moscow region.
The pre-war data even show that they poorly represent the number of our divisions in the ZAPOVO and in the KOVO.

https://topwar.ru/184125-izmenenie-scenarija-vtoroj-mirovoj-vojny.html
And here there was a refutation of his lies, tk. with the advent of new archival documents, a map of the Wehrmacht was opened with the exact location of our troops on the entire western border on June 20, 1941:

And how can you now relate to this liar who lied from three boxes about German intelligence?
However, he lied even more about Soviet intelligence, I don't even want to re-expose his nonsense.
So it makes sense to keep secrets - so that various liars could not get to the archives, and by manipulating historical facts to impose on us a perverse idea of ​​our Second World War.

[Normal]

The Russian Ministry of Defense is opening a new multimedia project called "The Day That Blitzkrieg Crashed"

Alas, there is no need to wait for a revelation from the MO multimedia project with such a title.

[nnm]

What other revelations about this day do you expect?

[Normal]

Your question contains a challenge, do I understand correctly?
Perhaps I didn’t put it exactly.
Not revelations, how to tell about something that is still not vocal, vague or concealed, but frankness, that is, truthfulness.

[Clear]

Quote: Normal

Not revelations, how to tell about something that is still not vocal, vague or concealed, but frankness, that is, truthfulness.

And, the final truth was written in RUSSIAN words at the Reichstag in 1945.

[Grandfather]

Quote: Clear

Quote: Normal

Not revelations, how to tell about something that is still not vocal, vague or concealed, but frankness, that is, truthfulness.

And, the final truth was written in RUSSIAN words at the Reichstag in 1945.

and Uzbek, and Tatar, and Kazakh, and Armenian, and Georgian ... and so on ... there are no English ...

[Clear]

Quote: Dead Day

.no english ...

That's it!

[Normal]

Quote: Clear

And, the final truth was written in RUSSIAN words at the Reichstag in 1945.

Paphos is of course good ...
in place.
What relationship does your pathos have to the meaning of my post?
It was not about the final truth of 1945, but about the truth of June 22, 1941.
What did you want to say on the topic of discussion?

[Zug]

I think for anybody. Isaev and Timin got sick, yes. Did they open the archives, declassified and the CHO? We are in the archives every day and we don't see crowds of people eager to get the truth of history - as there were two and a half excavators, the same faces are sitting there as before the opening of these archives. Shouting and screaming only: the archives have been opened! What's the point? Look, in the discussions of KIN Morozov's lectures on the Baltic: And he provides documents, tables, reports, interrogators. Here, I say, read it. And in response, we will not watch liberalism! We will write on Wikipedia what we like and we will ourselves read and be touched

[Zug]

Morozov once gave the Zvezda TV channel an interview. They cut everything out of it, because he touched on the unsightly moments of the command. According to him, nothing remained of the interview, castrated and erased - neither meaning nor content.

[north 2]

I am very much afraid that the global annual and ever-increasing celebration of the beginning of the Second World War may gradually turn into a counterbalance to Victory Day on May 9. The Russian Defense Ministry has nothing to do with it, but liberalism will constantly and methodically itch tediously, that there is nothing to celebrate the joy of Victory and the capture of Berlin, but we must cry and blush for the fact that the war took place in general and that Stalin, through his own fault, allowed the war and the death of Soviet people. And so it will be. And then we will not notice how liberalism has replaced our values. It will be the same, as Christians did not believe that demonstrations of homosexuals and perverts would become commonplace. But liberalism and tolerance managed to replace the values ​​of Christianity in such a way that no one is surprised by the holidays of these perverts. And the fifth column will do everything so that June 22 with repentance
and with tears of the Russians, to replace instead of May 9, that is, instead of the pride of the Russians for the Great Victory. So, June 22 should be celebrated not only without pompous shedding of tears and without pretentious repentance, but when noting it is necessary to take into account that liberals with tolerasts are tedious and will itch every year, that Russians need a poster and repent ...

[Clear]

Quote: north 2

And the fifth column will do everything so that June 22 with repentance
and with tears of the Russians, to replace instead of May 9, that is, instead of the pride of the Russians for the Great Victory.

If we do not remain silent, then these gozmans will not succeed.

[cniza]

We are promoting too many of them ourselves, shut them up and forget, apply the articles of the criminal code and jail those who do not understand ...

[Clear]

Quote: cniza

We are promoting too many of them ourselves, shut them up and forget, apply the articles of the criminal code and jail those who do not understand ...

Finally, one sane thought!

[cniza]

I think there are an overwhelming majority of them ...

[qQQQ]

Quote: north 2

I am very much afraid that the global annual and ever-increasing celebration of the beginning of the Second World War may gradually turn into a counterbalance to Victory Day on May 9.

This will never happen, tk. the two dates are opposite in meaning. Probably someone would like this very much, but the holiday of May 9 will always remain the Victory Day, and June 22, as far back as I can remember, has always been the Day of Sorrow and Remembrance.

[rocket757]

You cannot learn anything fundamentally new from those documents.
Particulars, details that are important to someone in particular, but in general, this picture of those events cannot change ...
Someone learned something fundamentally new from those documents ???

[cniza]

Historians will be interested to clarify episodes and facts ...

[rocket757]

Historians, specific people ... must not forget anything. These are documents for individual, calm comprehension, and not a reason to assert that the authorities were hiding something super important ...

[cniza]

There is nothing to hide, but it will be interesting for study and for writers ...

[qQQQ]

Quote: rocket757

You cannot learn anything fundamentally new from those documents.

And what is fundamentally new to learn there? The command of the Red Army was simply not ready for a new type of war, they learned from their own bitter experience. And even if you had carried out all the preparations for the attack and even knew the exact date, the result would have been the same, to our deep regret.

[rocket757]

Quote: qqqq

And even if you had carried out all the preparations for the attack and even knew the exact date, the result would have been the same, to our deep regret.

No, not in all cases it would be useless, I will never believe it !!!
There is a difference between the preparation of the team composition and those tasks, plans, ORDERS that were initially / prioritized for the commanders of subunits at various levels ...

[qQQQ]

Quote: rocket757

No, not in all cases it would be useless, I will never believe it !!!

It is clear that the result would have been different, but as an example, the campaign in 42, everyone knew everything, prepared, mobilized, but it was in 42 that the Germans reached the Volga. Those. to know and prepare a little, you need to be able to fight.

[rocket757]

Quote: qqqq

Everyone knew everything, prepared, mobilized, but it was in 42 that the Germans reached the Volga.

Everything is clear, although it is not pleasant to realize it!
Such is the logic / mathematics of the war that after SIGNIFICANT losses of the TRAINED personnel of the Armed Forces, the restoration of the combat capability of the troops is very difficult.
It is NOT POSSIBLE to simply mobilize, replenish equipment, weapons, and bring the troops to the proper level!
Those Germans faced a similar problem at the end of the war!
These rules are for everyone.

[qQQQ]

Quote: rocket757

Such is the logic / mathematics of the war that after SIGNIFICANT losses of the TRAINED personnel of the Armed Forces, the restoration of the combat capability of the troops is very difficult.

I am of the opinion that the decisive factor is the talent of the commander, i.e. it is they who determine success or failure. In the generals, after 41, we did not have any special losses.

[rocket757]

About commanders ... this topic can be discussed separately, but now you can talk a lot, but it happened, as it happened. We can only remember ... and in military and political circles, take into account past mistakes and not produce new ones.

[Normal]

Quote: qqqq

I am of the opinion that the decisive factor is the talent of the commander, i.e. it is they who determine success or failure.

Zhukov and Konev were talented military leaders?

[qQQQ]

Quote: Normal

Zhukov and Konev were talented military leaders?

Zhukov - yes, but there is not enough of him in all directions, Konev grew up much later.

[poquello]

Quote: rocket757

Someone learned something fundamentally new from those documents ???

and this is who was looking at what, the author on VO saw about a lot of intelligence reports, and TASS about the fact that, in addition to Brest, Hanko and Liepaja were kept on the border, and preparations for repelling possible aggression began in May 41st. And of course the cherry is an excerpt from the "Preliminary Plan of Operations in the East",
"To achieve success, it is necessary to act suddenly and swiftly, as was the case in Poland and in the West. Since the Russians this time do not have a numerical superiority, as it was during the world war, they most likely will not be able to concentrate their troops stretched along the front and take orderly retaliatory actions. And then in battles of local importance they will quickly be defeated as a result of the superiority of the German troops and command "

[rocket757]

Quote: poquello

in addition to Brest, Hanko and Liepaja also kept on the border,

held out, fought and even attacked ... "Operation Danube landing - capture of Kiliya-Veke".
We really don't know many details. Not everything is so brightly covered in books - films.
There are many particulars, cases ... about intelligence, there are also a lot of different things. But on the general understanding of what happened and how, how can this all affect?

[poquello]

Quote: rocket757

on the general understanding of what happened and how, how can this all affect?

and this strongly depends on the subject, there are those for whom, in addition to Brest, they fled everywhere

[rocket757]

They do not want to know, they believed in the ranting of all traitors and crooks .... it is necessary to flog such, on the place of execution, so that they would know that for their words it is necessary to ANSWER!

[poquello]

Quote: rocket757

They do not want to know, they believed in the ranting of all traitors and crooks .... it is necessary to flog such, on the place of execution, so that they would know that for their words it is necessary to ANSWER!

flogging is not our method, but archival documents are quite suitable for such "historians" instead of flogging

[rocket757]

As Armen Sumbatych said ... to scream for the truth and lies, such "historians of truth-lovers" are much and even very much! only in the ARCHIVES you will not find them, from the definition at all and never.
It is useless ... they will yell the same thing, so it is written in their subcortex.

[cniza]

The level of preparation for the attack was quite high; the German-fascist command pinned great hope on the surprise of the strike along the entire border line.

A deep bow and eternal memory to all who got to survive, survive and win ...

[aszzz888]

Here some

A. Privalov (Alexander Privalov)
Today, 08:36 - very surprising, annoying and even angry,

and perhaps not only. And the child understands that so many years are not needed !!!

I have been dealing with military history for over forty years

, in order to know one thing that the materials of the Second World War will be classified for more than a dozen years, and many have a stamp "Keep forever!" ... And if there is a stamp of "Special importance" so whatever, he almost swore, someone, at his whim, should lay out and show everything.

[Silver bullet]

How would such pseudo-historians really want these archives to "accidentally" burn down. And so, then they would have unfolded in full in their total lie.

[aszzz888]

Silver bullet (Ivan)
Yesterday, 14: 18
NEW

0
How would such pseudo-historians really want these archives to "accidentally" burn down. And so, then they would have unfolded in full in their total lie.

I totally agree with you! At this point, these halts would have turned around!

[urik62]

And how do you like this?
The Chairman of the Ryazan City Duma called the Day of Memory and Sorrow a "holiday"

Yulia Rokotyanskaya called the Day of Memory and Sorrow "a holiday"

- Tomorrow will be a very important day - June 22. And I invite you all, dear deputies, to honor the memory of those people who just gave right and did not beat themselves in the chest officers, but did their job for our people and for our Ryazan people. Happy holidays to all and thank you for your active work.

[Kostadinov]

Quote: Civil

Anyone wanting to repeat it? Where are the hyperpatriots?

There are those who wish in the West. It has already been scored that after 22 yun, May 9 inevitably comes.

[Normal]

Quote: Kostadinov

There are those who wish in the West.

Can you confirm this with an appropriate quote of no matter how significant Western politician?
What is there in the West we really do not know,
or do you think that the Germans want to repeat Dresden?

But here, many have forgotten that May 9 did not come for everyone.

"I am killed under Rzhev,
In an unchanged swamp,
In the fifth company, on the left,
With a cruel raid.

I did not hear the rupture,
I did not see that flash, -
Like a precipice from a cliff -
And neither the bottom nor the tires.

And in all this world,
Until the end of his days,
Neither loops, nor crochets
From my tunic.

I am where the roots are blind
They look for food in the darkness;
I am where with a cloud of dust
Rye walks on a hill;

I am where the cock crow
At dawn the dew;
I am where your cars are
The air is torn on the highway;

Where a blade of grass to a blade of grass
The grass river spins, -
There, where at the wake
Even the mother will not come.

In the summer of a bitter year
I am killed. For me -
No news, no reports
After this day.
.......................

The front burned, not abating,
As on the body of the scar.
I'm dead and I do not know,
Is our Rzhev finally?
....................... "

A. Tvardovsky.

[fa2998]

Quote: Nastia Makarova

no need to distort !!! "we can repeat" has a different meaning, not the one you want to say !!! it makes sense that if the enemy again attacks our homeland, then we will all go to defend the patronymic just like our grandfathers and great-grandfathers

"I love my homeland, but I hate the state" - I think it is dangerous for our people to put arms in their hands. Many will turn against the corruption clique in the first place.

[Old Horseradish]

Where is the Soviet Union? Where are the Soviet people? where is the socialist fatherland? Where is Stalin, where is Beria, where is Abakumov? And finally, a prize in the studio where are the socialist gains of the people?