Military Review

What did the peasants bring to the city? Paternalism!

546

The irony of "paternal life" ... A can of canned food on the festive table. It is supposed to put the contents of the jar on a special plate or in a salad bowl, but ... it will do just fine, doesn't it ?! Everything is absolutely, the advantages of the social environment and its disadvantages are manifested in such little things! A scene from the film "The Irony of Fate ..."


The classics of Marxism-Leninism warned us about many things, but for some reason they did not go too deeply into the theory and practice of ... paternalism. But in vain! In him, in his psychology, born in the village and then migrated to our cities, is the key to understanding many problems of both the past and the present of Russia!

When the dogs were out of sight, Bashti presented his idea. If people plant banana trees, they get bananas. If they plant yams, yams will grow, not sweet potatoes or fig trees, but yams — and only yams. It is the same with dogs. If all black dogs are cowardly, then all the offspring of these dogs will be cowardly. White people's dogs are brave fighters. By multiplying, they give courageous fighters.
("Jerry the Islander" Jack London)

The beginning and end of the peasant civilization. Today we end this topic so that we, in fact, only have to draw a conclusion. However, we will draw a conclusion only after we answer a very important question: what the “gigantic petty-bourgeois wave” (as we remember it in 1917, it was not someone who wrote, but V. I. Lenin) brought with him to the city, and what consequences did it have for him?

In England - fencing, we have collectivization!


Let us also recall that everything that took place in England at the end of the 30th - beginning of the 30th century was repeated in the USSR in the 50s of the last century. Only there, the reason for the mass de-peasantization was associated with the development of sheep breeding and wool production, and in our country - with the need to eliminate the dependence of the state on the individualism of the peasants in the face of an acutely felt military threat. The country needed a proletariat, and they drew it from the countryside, and, on the one hand, trying to detain old collective farmers in the countryside, and on the other, opening up broad prospects for young people to end their peasant status at the "construction sites of communism" and in cities at industrial enterprises. Such a policy took place in the 90s, during the war years, and then the process went on increasing: the end of the 2000s - the beginning of the creation of a nuclear missile shield in the USSR and ... the massive construction of "Khrushchevs". The creation of nuclear missile parity - and the mass construction of "Brezhnevok". In the XNUMXs, the process continued, and in the early XNUMXs it was also spurred on by the introduction of the Unified State Exam.

End the "petty owner" once and for all


The place of the small peasant owner, who lived according to the principle “I can do whatever I want”, came to large agricultural holdings with a staff of hired workers, and the farmers - they also try not to work themselves, but hire hired workers. In fact, today our modern peasants are our ... summer residents who have acquired land as their property. But the volume of what they produce is completely incomparable with what can affect the interests of the state. So they can grow peppers, and potatoes, and ... grass with flowers there. And the fact that the process of "fencing", that is, replacing communal property with private land, took place in our country simultaneously with an attempt to build "socialism", once again suggests that our leadership during the entire existence of our "workers 'and peasants' state" consisted of from ... very ignorant people who did not understand the processes in him and did not react to them accordingly.

However, could it be otherwise? No, it couldn't. And that's why. Because the masses of people who moved to cities, and the masses of people who were encouraged to participate in public life, were infected with ... paternalism. That is, they were in captivity of paternalistic, petty-bourgeois views on life.

What did the peasants bring to the city? Paternalism!

Three generations in conditions of stability ...


In what year was serfdom abolished in our country? In 1861, right? So, in accordance with the theory of generations, when should the psychology of people independent of this heavy legacy of the past be developed in our country? In 1961! But ... only on condition of stable life and natural change of three generations! And we had it all this time? Not a single day! First, the revolution of 1905-1907, then the First World War, the revolution of 1917, the Civil War of 1918-1922, industrialization, collectivization, "Yezhovism", the Great Patriotic War, "the defeat of the cult of personality" and a host of other perturbations affecting both on the economy and on the consciousness of our citizens. What's next? And then, as soon as things began to improve, the problems began - the "second waves" of the Second World War, a shortage of labor, which was supposed to reach a maximum in 1995 - and how could all this be dealt with? And they found a way out ... in replacing one system in the country with another - state capitalism, covered by pompous "left" phrases about socialism and the state of the whole people, with private capitalism.


Psychology must be studied and then put into practice


And all this tossing back and forth, by the way, was precisely the result of the dual nature of individual peasants who do not exploit hired labor: on the one hand, they are workers, on the other hand, the owners of the means of production. The collective farms seem to have knocked out the basis for such a psychology, but our leaders did not understand that it does not change so easily. That children under 3-5 years old learn more about life than in the rest of their lives, and absorb the psychology of their parents literally with their mother's milk. It is easy "the village is not forgotten," it is easy to educate it in urban areas.

"I consider myself urban now I
Here is my job, here are my friends.
But I still dream of the village at night -
My homeland does not want to let me go. "


It's not just that Leonid Derbenev wrote such poems. And for a reason, when this song is sung from the stage, and people in the hall sing along with the singers. The subconscious "idols of the clan" and "idols of the cave", that is, upbringing and the place of initial residence, from which no one can hide in any city apartment, makes themselves felt.


Purely peasant power ...


What else is paternalism bad? But what: it generates many ideological "squires" who are ready in every way to praise the wisdom of the leaders and to justify in the eyes of people even the most negative of their actions and decisions, since "the father will not say and do bad things." It is expressed in the imperceptible implantation in the public consciousness of ideas about the infallibility of the holders of the supreme power, their deification and at the same time tacit agreement with any unlimited arbitrariness, lack of rights and servility of subjects, the denial of any freedom and democracy.


That is, the Russian centuries-old tradition of paternalism has not disappeared under the new conditions, on the contrary, it has found embodiment in petty-bourgeois leaderism, which is just characteristic of a multimillion peasant country. And the fact that we still have all the successes and failures of the country, people even here, at VO, associate with one particular figure, it is very sad: Stalin is good, Khrushchev is a corn-maker, Brezhnev is nothing, but "Marked" has ruined everything ... How much can you? Where have the people been all this time? I was engaged in "Odobryams" - all in the best, again, traditions of paternalistic culture.

And who went to the party? The same peasants, albeit yesterday's!


And all the problems with the party, cut off from the people, from here. After all, who was it made of? From workers - yesterday's peasants, from officials - yesterday's peasants, at best - from the children of yesterday's peasants, who again went on summer vacation to the village with their grandfather and grandmother. That is, they planted a yam - and a yam grew, and by no means apples or bananas. And therefore there is nothing to be surprised at what happened to our country. It would be surprising and strange if this did not happen!


And, by the way, it's just amazing that in the famous “Short Course stories All-Union Communist Party of Bolsheviks ”(1945 edition) that this is exactly what will happen was written in plain text, albeit with the addition of the word“ if ”. That's just "if" it was predetermined from the very beginning, with the salvo of the Aurora!

Good words, now there would be mass consciousness too!


Let us emphasize that this is a 1945 edition. But ... it was written back in 1938, then a reprint of 1943 ... And everyone read, nodded their heads, repeated from the high rostrum ... And they did everything to make what was written as soon as possible come true!

By the way, all this, apparently, is very well understood by our today's leader, since he once said literally the following (at the ProjeKTORIA forum, Yaroslavl, December 2018):

“Most importantly, you should never wait for some kind of guidance. We have always had a very paternalistic state. This is partly good, because it preserves tradition, but on the other hand, each person individually needs to understand that 90% of his personal success will depend on him personally. That is why there is no need to wait, you need to take advantage of support, where it is, and the network of such support is being created wider and wider, it will be broader in the coming years, more substantive and meaningful in terms of filling with public finances, but each of you must to seek his own way in life, to take his destiny into his own hands. Otherwise, we will not see luck. The only way. Only personal initiative and hard work on yourself. So I want to call you to this. "

We will not talk about support here, even if the state does not interfere with us, but everything else is noticed very correctly!


We drive more quietly - we better be!


And the conclusion from all this is this: nothing in our country will change in a noticeable way (an imperceptible process of change is constantly going on, since new children are born every day, most of them have never even seen a village!), Until a generational change occurs naturally. That is, the generations of the 50s-60s and beyond should give up their place in leading positions to representatives of generations of 2000 and so. But in a natural way. Haste here will only lead to the "swinging of the pendulum", as has already happened in Russia, and more than once.

Then the country will really change. But only you and I will not have to see this, except that sitting on a cloud, we can invisibly observe all this!

Literature for additional reading and self-development:

1. Patterns and mechanisms of socio-psychological paternalism: on the example of paternal relations between school and family. Academic degree: Doctor of Psychology Bonkalo, Tatiana Ivanovna, Moscow, 2011.

2. Paternalism in Russia. Academic degree: Doctor of Philosophy. Author of scientific work: Ermolenko, Tatiana Fedorovna. Rostov-on-Don, 2000. - Perhaps, this is the most interesting and best, and most importantly - also accessible, that is, not too cleverly written and "scientific" dissertation.
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  1. Cowbra
    Cowbra 16 February 2021 05: 20
    +11
    Well, maybe for some people this is news, but we were taught back in the early 90s that in the USSR, cities have a rural mentality. And the sea confirms this.
    1. Olgovich
      Olgovich 16 February 2021 06: 52
      +1
      Quote: Cowbra
      USSR cities - with a rural mentality


      and Western Europe was already with an urban mentality (everything went before for them)

      And what do we see in the West today? Herds of infantile, obese, weak-willed, dying out, spiritless, who have driven themselves into the fetters of LGBT people, libers, self-censorship and insane consumption, people without future.

      this is this "bright" future the author means when he writes:

      generations of the 50-60s and beyond should give up their place in leadership positions to representatives of generations of 2000 and so. But in a natural way.

      Then the country will really change.
      ?
      1. Cowbra
        Cowbra 16 February 2021 07: 03
        +3
        Quote: Olgovich
        and Western Europe was already with an urban mentality (everything went before for them)

        Well, everything is so cool there that you can't blame the difference between a city and a village. There, for example, monasteries have been strongholds of sodom and hemorrhoids from time immemorial, yeah, but they are closer to purely rural life there.
        Here the trick is somewhat different, easier with an example. In the USSR in Russia, if you need to hang a shelf, no one will come to call someone to drill a hole. Rural mentality - I used to rely on myself, until you get to the city. This, of course, is not bad, on the one hand, but on the other hand, it cuts the service industry in the bud. which is exactly in the west - in general, the basis of the economy of developed countries.
        1. Olgovich
          Olgovich 16 February 2021 07: 24
          -7
          Quote: Cowbra
          For example, monasteries have been strongholds of sodom and hemorrhoids from time immemorial, yeah, but they are closer to rural life there

          but the pattern is different: the more the city, the more gays and other similar abominations.
          1. Civil
            Civil 16 February 2021 07: 53
            +4
            That is, the Russian centuries-old tradition of paternalism has not disappeared anywhere under the new conditions; on the contrary, it has found embodiment in petty-bourgeois leaderism, which is just characteristic of a multimillion peasant country.

            Let's say it's not paternalism, it's broader, it's a breed of people bred by landowners - aggressively obedient.
            When obedience is absolute, up to the moment when the herd begins to starve, such as under Pugachev, or he is sent to slaughter, as under Nicholas 2.
            Aggression is directed at the naughty sheep identified in the flock
            And paternalism is expressed in the search for the owner's boot so as not to be responsible for their own destiny.
            1. Olgovich
              Olgovich 16 February 2021 08: 23
              -3
              Quote: Civil
              a breed of people - aggressively obedient.

              nope: such wise, proud, intelligent and wonderful people as my grandfathers and grandmothers and great-grandfathers, years of birth 1888-1906, in later generations met much less.
              Quote: Civil
              When obedience is absolute, up to the moment when the herd begins to starve, such as under Pugachev, or he is sent to slaughter, as under Nicholas 2.

              nope: tsar - hunger of 1891 and no riots.

              wars Russia waged TENS and where are the riots?
              Quote: Civil
              And paternalism is expressed in the search for the owner's boot so as not to be responsible for their own destiny.

              our "enlightened" urban generations would have SUCH responsibility for the country as our ancestors had, who built the largest country in the world ..

              And yes, the USSR was destroyed not by the old "village" generations, but by the new-aggressive-obedient
              1. Civil
                Civil 16 February 2021 08: 28
                +1
                was among the ancestors who built the largest country in the world ..

                What do hungry, illiterate, powerless peasants have to do with building the country? What decisions did they make? Who was the master of the country under the same Nicholas?
                And yes, the USSR was not destroyed by the old "village" generations.

                The country was destroyed by crooks and thieves who, after the death of the real Bolsheviks, ended up in power. And the majority remained obsequiously silent. The answer is not for you.
                1. Olgovich
                  Olgovich 16 February 2021 08: 55
                  -4
                  Quote: Civil
                  What do hungry, illiterate, powerless peasants have to do with building the country?

                  I tell you: they plowed, fought, built, studied, mined, settled, mastered new lands, created factories, temples, ships, weaponsPower piled.
                  Quote: Civil
                  The country was destroyed by crooks and thieves who, after the death of the real Bolsheviks, ended up in power. And most slavishly kept silent

                  again twenty-five: and where is the present. are the Bolsheviks gone?
                  Those. tsarism was able to give birth to the present. the Bolsheviks, and the Bolsheviks themselves are already in power .... no ?! belay

                  the majority said nothing, that's it. And it was not most OLD generations.
                  1. Civil
                    Civil 16 February 2021 09: 11
                    +2
                    I tell you: they plowed, fought, built, studied, mined, settled, mastered new lands, created factories, temples, ships, weapons-the State was piled.

                    The nobles who mercilessly exploited the people built everything good for themselves. That is why we got revolutions. Some survived, others fattened.
                    But in 1991 you came to power. And you can't get drunk either. So tell the manager. And you will also fall under the riot. Unfortunately, old people do not see the future.
                    1. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 16 February 2021 10: 58
                      -11%
                      Quote: Civil
                      The nobles who mercilessly exploited the people built everything good for themselves.

                      Name the nobles who laid down the temples of the Intercession of the Virgin on the Nerl and Moscow, plowmen, explorers, foundry workers, etc.

                      EVERYONE was building a country for YOURSELF

                      Quote: Civil
                      ... That is why we got revolutions.


                      EVERYTHING got a revolution and it didn't seem a little to nobody.
                      Quote: Civil
                      But in 1991 you came to power. ...


                      I am not sideways.

                      But you, such all "formidable / all-conquerors" lol laughing -Where disappeared in 91 g that you elusive joes lol , searched with fire and could not find?

                      Quote: Civil
                      pass. And you will also fall under a riot .. Unfortunately, the old people do not see the future.

                      and you will not fall under the riot, yes fool lol

                      remember how many MILLIONS of lives, suffering, hardships of just ordinary people, how many years of titanic efforts had to be spent to at least first restore everything destroyed by the revolutions.

                      remembered? Now wish it, yeah
                      1. Civil
                        Civil 16 February 2021 11: 00
                        -1
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        remember how many MILLIONS of lives, suffering, hardships of just ordinary people, how many years of titanic efforts had to be spent to at least first restore everything destroyed by the revolutions.
                        remembered? Now wish it, yeah

                        It is about this that tell us on the feedback what you are leading the country to.
                      2. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 16 February 2021 11: 51
                        -6
                        Quote: Civil
                        It is about this that tell us about the feedback, where are you leading the country

                        so I speak directly -you-that YOU want in the country.

                        Or you think that you are smarter than the Ruins, Moldovans, Georgians, etc., and you will RIDE on correct, safe height? belay lol
              2. Cowbra
                Cowbra 16 February 2021 11: 01
                +2
                Quote: Civil

                What do hungry, illiterate, powerless peasants have to do with building the country?

                And who built it? You have a fig plug, or you will have to admit that these same landowners, about whom you spoke, that they have built a country, or you will have to declare that the peasant wasn’t killed, but was building the country. In both cases, somewhere it necessarily turns out that you are lying.
                1. savage1976
                  savage1976 17 February 2021 06: 42
                  +2
                  And he does not understand this, or is not supposed to think.
                2. Revival
                  Revival 17 February 2021 13: 21
                  -2
                  Take Petrograd, for example, do you think the peasants are planning to build a city there at any cost? And they themselves died there in the swamps for this?
            2. Vladimir_2U
              Vladimir_2U 16 February 2021 08: 50
              +4
              Quote: Olgovich
              nope: tsar - hunger of 1891 and no riots.

              wars Russia waged TENS and where are the riots?
              Olgovich, you are simply demonstrating a shameful "ignorance" of the history of Russia:
              “In 1856, a mass movement of serfs“ for freedom ”to Tauride province. The movement embraced mainly the "Novorossiysk" provinces, mainly Yekaterinoslavskaya, in which only two counties gave up to 2 thousand unauthorized migrants; Kherson lips also gave several thousand ”[9].

              The nature of the escapes, thus, completely changes: due to the very mass character of this movement, peaceful resettlement results in a "riot", in a bloody clash with military units.

              Another form of the peasant movement is the calls for mass "disobedience" of the peasants to the landlords and the authorities. The main reason for the disobedience of serfs, as can be seen from government investigations, was the increasing severity of exploitation of serf labor over the years. Of the 423 cases of peasant unrest during the Nikolaev reign, about which there is appropriate information, 208, i.e. about half, was caused directly by economic motives, mainly the strengthening of corvee duties. ... ...
              The usual form of peasants' disobedience is the refusal to work in the corvee and to pay the quitrent and other extortions in favor of the landowner. Often, "disobedience" was accompanied by the fact that "in official sources it is called" arbitrariness ", i.e. change of government, set by the landowner, sometimes by "riot", ie reprisals against the patrimonial authorities, unauthorized disposition of landlord property, etc. ”[19] Of the 423 cases mentioned, about which there is detailed information, arbitrariness manifested itself in 208, i.e. in almost half of the cases.

              All these cases of "disobedience" and "arbitrariness" usually caused the intervention of local authorities, and if their "meek admonitions" did not work, then sending military teams... Often, the appearance of a military command was enough to end disobedience, but often it was necessary to use rods, and sometimes weapons. After the pacification, the teams often stayed for some time in the village, where they made sure that the movement did not resume; in addition, the maintenance of the military unit was a heavy burden on the peasants and served as a serious punishment for them.

              Full of examples!
            3. ivan2022
              ivan2022 21 February 2021 11: 36
              -1
              Quote: Olgovich
              We wish the "enlightened" urban generations of SUCH responsibility for the country,


              Heh - .. heh ... Where did you find "responsibility for the country"?
              Country in 1991-1993 gouged nafig, and "the Bolsheviks or their descendants are to blame for everything"? Nobody fulfilled the oath given in the USSR. For a criminal whom even the commission of the State Duma of the Russian Federation convicted in the 90s of acts under the firing article 275 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation and the corresponding article of the Criminal Code of the USSR- the people voted for him 2 times in the presidential elections

              You have to be not quite "in your mind" to write about some kind of "responsibility for the country" A bunch of descendants of serfs and no responsibility for anything. The history of Russia is now "held responsible" by the Jews or the Bolsheviks of 1917, but not by the Russian people. And those who are not responsible are not entitled to rights ...
        2. EvilLion
          EvilLion 16 February 2021 08: 18
          +4
          I very much doubt that you have any knowledge of sexology to understand gays and their origins. As if from the fact that a homosexual in the old days was forcefully married, he ceased to be a homosexual.
          1. Olgovich
            Olgovich 16 February 2021 08: 39
            -11%
            Quote: EvilLion
            I very much doubt that you have any knowledge of sexology to understand gays and their origins.

            who cares about your ... doubts? belay
            Quote: EvilLion
            As if from the fact that a homosexual in the old days was forcefully married, he ceased to be a homosexual.

            propaganda of this in the cities and licentiousness sharply increase the number of them, for example: "Once with". But that's exactly it, yeah ...
            1. EvilLion
              EvilLion 16 February 2021 08: 59
              +7
              Surely you have no doubts. But it is not the one who has not read a single book in his life that is terrible, but who has read only one.

              If you have started to get up on the men from propaganda, then I'm afraid it's not about propaganda, because sex. attraction doesn't work that way.

              Although, in order for you to read another book, in Central Asia, where a young and, as a rule, an anxious man traditionally did not have easy access to women, since everyone is in burqas, and under protection, such a phenomenon as the use of bachey boys. From dressing up in women's clothing with erotic dances, to the actual exploitation of the ass. And when we have another rape of a child by a guest from sunny Uzbekistan (for a long time, however, there was no longer, perhaps they began to let them in less), then this is a direct result of local traditions. And this phenomenon is developed in inverse proportion to the presence of Russians in those places. In Afghanistan, bachi is a serious business, perhaps even legal under their laws.

              So if you want pederasty and pedophilia, just do not let men near women, such things will flourish that prisons with lowered ones seem like a kindergarten. For any hypocritical and absurd religious restriction, the population will immediately come up with no less hypocritical and ridiculous excuses. And the same Islamic world with its veil is much more homosexual than the most depraved European society.

              Well, monasteries are like hotbeds of homosexuality, a simple question, if a young man does not have girls, and in general there is no interest in getting married, and without this it was difficult in the past, then where should he go? To the monastery, where the roof from the stupid prayers will go completely, and maybe to the Navy (the traditions of the Royal Navy - rum, lashes, pederasty), and then jokes "from somewhere" arise that "I love you cabin boy!"
              1. Olgovich
                Olgovich 16 February 2021 09: 12
                -15%
                Quote: EvilLion
                But it's not the one who has not read a single book in his life that is terrible, but who read only one.

                I agree. yes

                The bad news is that for you this book has become a book about Bachey boys. request

                and the article deals with an industrial European society, not an early feudal Islamic one.
                1. EvilLion
                  EvilLion 16 February 2021 09: 41
                  -1
                  In the article about the industrial society there is nothing at all, in the article about the fact that it did not have time to form in the USSR, since the population in the mass is only in the 1st, it is good if in the 2nd generation.

                  Homosexuals and wild sexual practices have existed in great numbers throughout human history. And it is often attempts to overly regulate sex life that lead to savagery.
                  1. Olgovich
                    Olgovich 16 February 2021 11: 13
                    -6
                    Quote: EvilLion
                    In the article about the industrial society there is nothing at all, in the article about the fact that it did not have time to form in the USSR, since the population in the mass is only in the 1st, it is good if in the 2nd generation.

                    then learn what an "industrial society" is.

                    Successfully, see. definition of IO
                    Quote: EvilLion
                    Homosexuals and wild sexual practices have existed in great numbers throughout human history. And it is often the attempts to overly regulate sex life that lead to wildness.

                    there were a lot of things.

                    And that's all ... the norm?

                    Unbridled obsessive LGBT propaganda, parents 1,2, human milk is NOT the norm for normal people.
                  2. Maki Avellevich
                    Maki Avellevich 18 February 2021 21: 35
                    +1
                    Quote: EvilLion
                    And it is often attempts to overly regulate sex life that lead to savagery.

                    not. society usually comes to "wilds" when civilization declines and moral foundations collapse. this is the cycle.
                    see the end of all civilizations. Nero, Caligula and so on.
              2. Moskovit
                Moskovit 16 February 2021 09: 24
                +4
                What does Holland have to do with the back boys? Or Germany? And in Canada, when did they manage to light up?
                Intrusive propaganda is paying off.
                1. EvilLion
                  EvilLion 16 February 2021 09: 34
                  +6
                  And where did you get the idea that there are more homosexuals in Holland than in Afghanistan? Because a thousand gathered in one place and yells loudly, and the police won't allow them to be stoned?
          2. Bolt cutter
            Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 12: 01
            0
            that a homosexual was forcefully married in the old days
            And it happened that they were sent to the monastery laughing
          3. Machito
            Machito 16 February 2021 19: 51
            +2
            Quote: EvilLion
            I very much doubt that you have any knowledge of sexology to understand gays and their origins. As if from the fact that a homosexual in the old days was forcefully married, he ceased to be a homosexual.

            My platoon commander said that there are only eight types of sexual minorities. To my question: Where did you get such deep knowledge of perverts ?, very hard beat me with a rubber truncheon RP-73.
          4. Maki Avellevich
            Maki Avellevich 18 February 2021 21: 32
            0
            Quote: EvilLion
            As if from the fact that a homosexual in the old days was forcefully married, he ceased to be a homosexual.

            in discussions about homosexuality you can often hear - "The ancient Greeks had homosexuality"
            yes, there was a case but! a citizen in the cities of ancient Greece had the right to choose sexual entertainment but was required to have a household, a wife and children.
            that is, you can be a homosexual, but take out the offspring and the economy and put it down.
        3. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 16 February 2021 08: 25
          +3
          Quote: Olgovich
          but the pattern is different: the more the city, the more gays and other similar abominations.
          "Socialism was destroyed by the big cities" Kara-Murza.
          But monarchism is something that does not bend, in England for example. Fertile soil can be seen for monarchism, these nurseries.
          1. Fat
            Fat 16 February 2021 15: 10
            0
            And there is nothing particularly bad about the monarchy itself. Monarchy and "autocracy" are not entirely synonymous. (not synonymous at all) No. Monarchy is, besides Britain, Thailand, Japan, Spain and others ... and even Canada ... This form of representation of power does not interfere with rampant, democracy in any way. Absolutely.
            And, yes, Andrei Olgovich, not so much a monarchist, he is offended for the State. We must take it for granted and not "hamster Rrrevolutionary necessity"
            1. Vladimir_2U
              Vladimir_2U 17 February 2021 03: 27
              -4
              Quote: Thick
              This form of representation of power does not interfere with revelry and democracy in any way. Absolutely.
              Democracy, yeah
              Quote: Olgovich
              but the pattern is different: the more the city, the more gays and other similar abominations.
              If for a regular admirer of Shpakovsky democracy and homogeia and so on are equal to democracy, then of course.
        4. Simargl
          Simargl 16 February 2021 17: 34
          +1
          Quote: Olgovich
          but the pattern is different: the more the city, the more gays and other similar abominations.
          There is no such pattern!
          Culture, laws, advertising. It's like religion.
        5. ivan2022
          ivan2022 21 February 2021 10: 56
          0
          Quote: Olgovich
          the more the city, the more gays and other similar abominations.

          And at the same time, you have typical USSR ideas about gays ...
          Yes, that's how it happens.

          And what was it like in Russia initially?
          “Intercourse with each other”, “playing with one's neighbor until the seed runs out” - the Orthodox Church recognized sodomy as a sin, but did not take any serious measures to combat it. The punishment for the copulation of men with each other first appeared in Stoglava in 1551. He demanded from the "sodomites" only repentance and correction.
          Ivan the Terrible himself liked to arrange noisy feasts with young men dressed in women's clothes.
          Here, in Russia, they simply joke about such a disgusting crime, and nothing happens more often than publicly, in joking conversations one boasts of sin, another reproaches another, the third invites to sin; the only thing that is lacking is that they commit this crime in front of all the people.

          Yuri Krizhanich
          Croatian Catholic priest, lived in Russia from 1659 to 1677
      2. astepanov
        astepanov 16 February 2021 11: 14
        +4
        The main thing is to find someone to blame. Here, they say, we have a peasant mentality, we are all conformists, and therefore not a damn good can be done under any power - perhaps in a hundred years. And dissertators of all stripes convince us of this. And orders for such "research" are given by the state.
        There are hundreds of such "theories" that can be built, but it is not clear: why did the abolition of slavery in the United States occur later than in Russia, and the economic breakthrough earlier?
        I offer my theory: our problem is that in the seventies the West carried out a large-scale ideological sabotage: it began importing toilet paper into the USSR. This led to a landslide drop in demand for the newspapers Pravda, Trud, Sovetskaya Rossiya, Krasnaya Zvezda and Pionerskaya Pravda. , ideological clichés were erased and the Union ceased to be indestructible. The quotas for the import of scarce paper into the regions in a planned economy seemed unfair, which led to a surge in separatist sentiments, and the country collapsed.
        And what, the theory is not worse than others. Maybe I should also become a candidate of historical sciences? In the end, Rogozin became a technical doctor, I suppose he also composed garbage ...
        1. Cowbra
          Cowbra 16 February 2021 11: 38
          +4
          And what has the guilty person to do with it? For example, the sky is blue ... Is it to blame? And our country was agrarian, forcibly in the cities, consider, resettled the village. There was no exit. Well, the mentality in the cities is rural. Here no one is to blame for anything, but if this FACT is not understood, then all city management without taking into account the specifics will be like sex in a hammock - cool, but ineffective
          1. vladcub
            vladcub 16 February 2021 13: 46
            +2
            "the mentality in rural cities" - depending on where in megacities: Moscow, St. Petersburg, Yekaterinburg, Krasnoyarsk is one thing, and Mtsensk, Suzdal, Yeisk or Kineshma is another
            1. Cowbra
              Cowbra 16 February 2021 14: 42
              +3
              Do you think differently in Moscow? The author of 6 acres did not remember in vain.
              1. Machito
                Machito 16 February 2021 20: 00
                +2
                Quote: Cowbra
                Do you think differently in Moscow? The author of 6 acres did not remember in vain.

                In Moscow, in general - oops: they separated the city from the region. Under the USSR, Muscovites were given land plots in the Moscow region, but now it is a different region, go buy for millions. Where can you get them if you are not a corrupt official? We grow greens on the windowsills. And we remember with good words Eltsin and Putin. Sobakin is called a tiler in the city. He has a tile factory. In two years, the tile is destroyed by ice so that young girls on high heels can fall and break all their bones. Sobakin in Moscow everyone loves with fierce love.
                1. Cowbra
                  Cowbra 17 February 2021 07: 01
                  +3
                  Bhe, girls. I remember how I myself managed to get stuck between the parted tiles with my heel near the RAS. and I have bast shoes of size forty-five, trampled ... This reindeer breeder has bothered with his tile, since it can withstand 30-50 years, why has it been moved twice on the Akademicheskaya metro station ?!
          2. astepanov
            astepanov 16 February 2021 15: 57
            -2
            Quote: Cowbra
            the mentality in the cities is rural.

            That's right. Here the Fulyuganov brothers lived with us - they moved to the city, to the mentality. But, what is characteristic: as the mentality - so from ours, from Olkhovka, and as generals - so entirely from the city. And ishsho about the link between the city and the village gutar ... Disorder!
            But seriously, how can you measure it, mentality? And without sociometry, talking about the "level of mentality" is meaningless. And I would also note that the author of the article cleverly replaces mentality (that is, "a mentality, a set of emotional, cultural characteristics, value orientations and attitudes inherent in a social or ethnic group, nation, people, nationality") with the concept of "conformism." And conformism in our country is cultivated with a terrible force - for example, the inculcation of religiosity and media zombification, and it is equally difficult to resist this pressure for those who are from the countryside and the indigenous townspeople in the nth generation. (Not in the subject, but I remember what I heard about thirty years ago: "I am a fourth-generation Muscovite, and they come and go to us for sausage. Can we feed everyone?" That's why I don't like such townspeople).
          3. astepanov
            astepanov 16 February 2021 16: 05
            -4
            Quote: Cowbra
            Well, the mentality in the cities is rural. No one is to blame for anything

            Sorry, but what kind of mentality meter did you (and the author of the article) determine the level and nature of the mentality of the natives of the village, and even God only knows in what generation? All of this is similar to reasoning about the number of flying saucers, geopathogenic zones, the properties of Bigfoot hair and the usefulness of homeopathy. I strongly suspect that there is absolutely nothing under the surface of the chatter, or there is something - but not at all related to the subject of discussion.
        2. vladcub
          vladcub 16 February 2021 14: 09
          +3
          "carried out a large-scale ideological sabotage" no villains did it: Markoni-Popov and Zvarykin. How good it was without radio and TV. However, the radio in the form of a loudspeaker is very good, and everything else is from the "evil"
          I think it will pass for the candidate's thesis, but for the doctoral thesis too?
        3. Fat
          Fat 16 February 2021 15: 28
          0
          What? Healthy cynicism never gets in the way. yes
        4. ivan2022
          ivan2022 21 February 2021 16: 14
          0
          Quote: astepanov
          And what, the theory is not worse than others. Maybe I should also become a candidate of historical sciences?

          --------

          During, during .... all the troubles from the candidates ... and the bandits, thieves and traitors are "their guys". People are close and understandable. It is not for nothing that their people have been electing them to all posts for 30 years. Starting with EBN, which in the United States would not be elected to the presidency 2 times, but 1 time to the electric chair. For all the good things I've done.

          We love to scold the State Duma. Meanwhile, the Commission of the State Duma of the Russian Federation in the 90s published an investigation, according to which the actions of the EBN contain signs of a crime under the firing article "treason". And what about the "common people"? If you vote, then "for whom else"?
          If the traditions of society are criminal and lawlessness = law, then its finale is obvious. With any power.
      3. Petrik66
        Petrik66 17 February 2021 16: 25
        0
        You cannot invite any service industries for the salaries that part of the population receives. Yes, and a cross-handed Tajik will come.
    2. EvilLion
      EvilLion 16 February 2021 08: 16
      +3
      Yes, yes, look where cursed science leads. We must all go to the village, as under the tsar. Better to introduce serfdom, otherwise they came in large numbers under Stalin in the cities, and then everyone drove and drove.
      1. Deniska999
        Deniska999 16 February 2021 09: 38
        +7
        Here you read the comments and it seems that the main crime of the 2000s generation is that it was born in a rather calm and well-fed time, without wars and other cataclysms, revolutions and famines, that it has access to a huge amount of information about the world around them, the achievements of medicine and technology.

        And so yes, drive everyone to the village and immediately wisdom and spirituality will gush out)
      2. Cowbra
        Cowbra 16 February 2021 11: 08
        0
        You just have to realize that things that work in Europe do not work in Russia. And they don't understand this.
        Want an example? Not about Europe? Catch any liberast or Sterninist "pink" pseudo-communist - in fact, they are one and the same flock. And tell me that the Chinese path of development in the Russian Federation is impossible. You will never prove to him that this is so - he simply will not understand. And here science is even simpler - not sociology, but stupid mathematics - if you have 10 times more population, you can do 10 times more. All one will not understand. Science is in their pen. And in principle they do not understand the differences between countries.
        1. EvilLion
          EvilLion 16 February 2021 12: 04
          +1
          It is not about the size of the population, but about its structure. The USSR was originally built to win a big war, and then to meet domestic demand, as another question turned out, but the structure of the Soviet economy and then the Russian one is extremely complex and not export-oriented. So you can shout that we are selling oil and gas, well, how difficult it would be to single out what the USSR and Russia could brutally export, but almost all our basic needs are satisfied without export, and therefore the prices for electronics change from the dollar exchange rate, but not for that, without what you will die for sure.

          China, and South Korea in the middle of the 20th century, is a mass of illiterate population in villages that cannot feed itself, this population was attached to produce consumer goods for Western countries, that is, there are several industries where such countries are in the West. money can succeed, but it becomes extremely dependent on foreign trade. In the case of China, this is simply less noticeable, since it is really big and can find resources for something else.
          1. depressant
            depressant 16 February 2021 13: 35
            +1
            China, and South Korea in the middle of the 20th century, is a mass of illiterate population in villages that cannot feed itself, this population was attached to produce consumer goods for Western countries, that is, there are several industries where such countries are in the West. money can succeed, but it becomes extremely dependent on foreign trade. In the case of China, this is simply less noticeable, since it is really big and can find resources for something else.

            It should be added that China's advantage over us is that, due to its enormous population, it also has a huge domestic market, due to which China may well increase the pace of economic development.
          2. Fat
            Fat 16 February 2021 15: 59
            0
            You are right, except that export and import have changed places. The "dependence" on the external (global) market of the southern "giants" is due to the cheapness of both workers and the maintenance of production (climate) At times! Not interest. Who in their right mind would prefer the excellent quality of a domestic product to a completely competitive Asian "cheap".
            When this not good Asian "balance" settles down in favor of domestic consumption, the "Japanese situation" will turn out ... When all of humanity is stuffed with their goods under the neck, along the edge of the glass ...
            Note that Japs have very few natural resources of their own. In China, there are noticeably more labor and natural resources, but they are already on the verge of stagnation ... Oh, what will happen, I can't even imagine request
            1. EvilLion
              EvilLion 17 February 2021 08: 29
              0
              export with import in places


              I noticed it while rereading.

              When the whole of humanity is stuffed with their goods under the neck, along the edge of the glass ...


              Not everything, but Japan was actually moved, transferring this role to China. => They can also move China, and in the West they seem to realize the mistake that a very large country, even with small relative investments in science and the military-industrial complex, can get significant results in absolute terms, so that China will be replaced by Mexico and Nigeria. So as not to rock the boat. The same Brazil, which is the South American counterpart of Russia, will definitely give nothing.
              1. haron
                haron 17 February 2021 16: 04
                0
                Quote: EvilLion
                so Mexico and Nigeria will replace China. So as not to rock the boat. The same Brazil, which is the South American counterpart of Russia, will definitely give nothing.

                Sho Again !! ?? After all, they have already tried Mexico and Nigeria and Brazil ... they all tried. We even managed to try everything that became on the rails of free trade after the collapse of the USSR. And now China, oddly enough, won as a result of Darwinian natural selection.
                Only in China, the combination of all the factors gave the cheapest and most massive product of all possible on the globe. And for no shortage of the world will it be possible to achieve the best results in any currently existing country. Well, the aborigines in Nigeria, Brazil and other Palestinians will not work en masse, even 8 hours a day. So the same as there will be no Russian, Ukrainian, Pole and so on. work for $ 1 an hour.
                Everything has already been tested and passed. China won. Now, except perhaps to populate Antarctica with people of a new type.
              2. Fat
                Fat 18 February 2021 15: 56
                -1
                Japan, unlike China, is a direct vassal of the United States.
                Is the Celestial Empire kicking? Let's wait and see who will be eating noodles at Stoltenberg's headquarters.
                1. Fat
                  Fat 18 February 2021 16: 07
                  0
                  Like in an old joke ...
                  A man comes to the andrologist. Complains.
                  A friend said that with his beloved 16! once a night.
                  The doctor looked sadly and said:
                  "What's stopping you? Tell me too ..."
        2. vladcub
          vladcub 16 February 2021 13: 39
          +1
          the "sternen" pink "pseudo-communist is no longer the heir to the RCP (b), but some kind of" neo-wise "
        3. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 17: 02
          +1
          The only trouble for the Slavs is that they are "white people" .... outwardly ... Isn't it?
          This "advanced humanity" cannot understand from the very beginning.
        4. ivan2022
          ivan2022 21 February 2021 17: 23
          0
          Quote: Cowbra
          Catch any liberast or Grudinin "pink" pseudo-communist - in fact, they are the same flock


          Sorry, I'm not an expert in politics. Therefore, the questions:
          1. What should not be a pseudo-communist?
          2. Specifically, what is the same thing in the political programs of the "Grudinin" and "liberasts"?
          3. If you don't like existing "packs" or parties, why not create your own? Real and folk. It seems that we have 145 million people .... Or who should do it?
    3. Fat
      Fat 18 February 2021 15: 52
      0
      Andrei. I strongly disagree. A worthless generalization. yes
  2. Bar1
    Bar1 16 February 2021 10: 20
    -2
    I didn’t even know a word like that - paternalism, I had to go into the dictionary. But it turned out that this was just our authoritarianism, or, as in the army, not otbalism, but hazing. In general, all this is just the authority of the authorities, which in these orders and this system always puts pressure on people, over the people.
    But has it always been this way? It has not always been like this. In Russian society there has always been a community / peace / meeting at which all the most pressing issues were resolved. This is the joint production of agricultural products, further delegating to one elected member of the community the functions of selling goods in markets and fairs, i.e. This member of the community became a merchant registered in a guild and was engaged in the sale of the harvest of the community. Then the world distributed the proceeds from the markets to the members of the community. That was how the Russian community stood.
    Neither the tsarist government nor the Bolshevik government liked this state of affairs.
    It was here, just the power of the RULES of the Russian world, and opposed the power of power in the state. the organized people, as they could, were always in opposition to the bad state decisions and laws adopted by both the tsarist government and the Bolshevik government.
    Stolypin tried to split the Russian society. Under him it turned out to single out wealthy peasants, middle peasants, horses and poor peasants, horseless. There is a lot of heap and speculation, NOT ALL wealthy peasants became kulaks / world eaters / rural bourgeoisie employers of farm laborers and interest-holders, many of them with their families by their own labor achieved great prosperity and had houses, horses and large tracts of land.
    What became of the Russian community after the Stolypin reforms is mostly not clear. Then there was a revolution and the soldiers / peasants simply took the landlord's land and began to do what they did best - growing agricultural products.
    The Bolsheviks never liked market relations and markets were forbidden, and the peasants were offered at firm and low prices to hand over the products of the Bolshevik government to which the peasants did not go. The Bolsheviks responded by introducing a policy of war communism and surrender, when armed townspeople simply came and took away from the peasants bread ...
    The peasants responded with uprisings and riots, the Tambov uprising, the Chembarniki uprising, which the Bolsheviks drowned in blood. The peasant army of the anarchist Makhno was destroyed.
    As a result of such actions of the Bolsheviks, there was no bread at all in the country and Lenin READY to allow the NEP
    What happened to the Russian community? And we do not know anything about this about the Russian MIR, just as we did not report it at the Republic of Ingushetia, so Soviet historians also kept silent about the fish.
    Most likely, the community survived and again, as under the Republic of Ingushetia, was able to resist the authority of the authorities with its collective authority.
    The Bolsheviks continued the policy of destruction of the Russian community, which they slyly called “collectivization.” Like, there were many small owners and they need to be united and this is progress, although this was not the case. As a result, all the land from the owners was taken away, and all agricultural production (agricultural implements , horses and even their own cattle, cows, sheep) were taken to "collective farms".
    And what happened again after such "collectivization". And after all these actions HOLEDOMERS followed in the Volga region, in the Ukraine. Again TENS of thousands of peasants died of hunger.
    It was the Bolsheviks who completely destroyed the Russian world, and the production of agricultural products in the USSR became the most ineffective in the world. But they got the FULL authoritarianism of the authorities, which our historians have now called this word - paternalism / otsenalism, such as the authority of the fathers, but this definition is not accurate, as we see, and therefore there is a lie.
    1. EvilLion
      EvilLion 16 February 2021 12: 06
      +4
      Do you even understand that NEP is about free trade in bread ?? And free trade in something that everyone needs, but not enough is a direct road to scarcity and horse prices. All the kulak uprisings are precisely for the fact that the state does not interfere with the kulaks to arrange hunger and sell grain at exorbitant prices.
      1. Bar1
        Bar1 16 February 2021 12: 16
        -1
        Only a free market on which prices are formed is the NATURAL natural order of existence of human society, i.e. a way of exchanging goods between town and country.
        Those. markets are always needed, where peasants and urban producers could bring their goods and where natural bargaining takes place.
        Further, firstly, the main grain producers before collectivization were by no means kulaks, but middle peasants.
        Secondly, the peasants did not want to hand over bread for candy wrappers and tic-tac-toe, that is why they were subjected to violence by prodrazvorie and later "dispossession-collectivization".
        Or in the period of post-civil hard times it was possible to negotiate with peasants at CONTRACT prices, who would surrender grain to the state, but the Bolsheviks did not go for it, they simply destroyed the markets, and the peasants were forced to surrender grain for what caused uprisings, blood and complete impoverishment of the peasants.
        1. Foul skeptic
          Foul skeptic 16 February 2021 13: 40
          +1
          Those. markets are always needed, where peasants and urban producers could bring their goods and where natural bargaining takes place.

          You are describing a pre-industrial model of trade between town and country. Then it works. In the model with completed industrialization, when goods of group A were switched over to production of goods of group B, this also works. This doesn't work in the transitional phase. A peasant in Russia at the beginning of the 20th century needs a tiny amount of goods from a city - iron (and more often iron, not iron goods, because their blacksmiths and horseshoes will make, and hoops, etc., etc., namely of iron goods, the running gear is nails), kerosene, tea, sugar and the like, which are not by and large non-industrial goods, but handicraft. New industries have appeared that produce means of production, not consumption, what will they offer here and now to the countryside? Workers who work in a power plant, or make concrete, or assemble optical instruments, or make sulfuric acid, etc. with what will they come to the market? With concrete, electricity, acid? The peasant does not need them, he has lived without them for centuries and is in no hurry to change his way of life. And these workers need to eat. Tell us what to do in this situation?
          1. Bar1
            Bar1 16 February 2021 13: 53
            -2
            Quote: Nefarious skeptic
            With concrete, electricity, acid? The peasant does not need them, he has lived without them for centuries and is in no hurry to change his way of life. And these workers need to eat. Tell us what to do in such a situation?


            It is not necessary to simplify, markets have existed since ancient times, therefore, the equivalent of a commodity, money, was invented by mankind. Working power plants simply received money and went to the markets with the money to buy food and everything else.
            What's so incomprehensible?

            The Bolsheviks abolished markets and replaced it with DISTRIBUTION, which was done by officials, who in fact became a gasket between town and country and therefore the prices of goods RISE than if there was a simple and natural exchange of goods, the officials who participate in the distribution process - in the Bolshevik way - are always parasites on the body of the market economy.
            By the way, what is happening now. What is happening with the product? It goes through a whole chain of different intermediaries who stupidly throw up their percentage and from this they have their own grand piece. Is this socialism or not socialism? This is PARASITOLISM, that's what it's called.
            1. Foul skeptic
              Foul skeptic 16 February 2021 15: 00
              +1
              It is not necessary to simplify, markets have existed since ancient times, therefore, the equivalent of a commodity, money, was invented by mankind. Working power plants simply received money and went to the markets with the money to buy food and everything else.

              And labor money will draw, apparently. Or is it necessary to sell them electricity first? Who?
        2. EvilLion
          EvilLion 17 February 2021 08: 47
          +3
          If I sell bread, then I am primarily interested in the high prices for my goods, it is obvious that the highest prices for bread will be during famine. In my opinion, living in the 21st century, a person must have sufficient intelligence to build such a single-link logical connection.

          So free trade in a scarce resource for which there is an endlessly renewable demand will not satisfy in principle.

          As for "handing over bread for candy wrappers", when there is a famine in the cities, food detachments will simply come to you from the cities, including soldiers with weapons, and you will not only give bread for free, but you will also be hanged over a burning tire ... Because you decided to starve people. Moreover, the sellers of bread were not peasants, the middle peasant, having a certain surplus of several bags for the market in the city, will not be lucky, therefore all the grain surplus, if any, is bought up with a fist. And the locals will willingly show the city guests who to go to for bread, especially since a significant part of the peasantry also bought bread, and they will dance around this burning tire together with the city guests.

          The very first dispossession of kulaks by order of the authorities was recorded at least in the 17th century during the reign of Aleksey Mikhailovich, when for the survival of the population, the grain trading mafia was forced to sell bread for fix. prices. And then it hurt a lot of "smart", trying to hold back the bread in order to raise prices higher.

          who would donate bread to the state


          You yourself just wrote about "change for candy wrappers." The state needs to feed the population, it will never offer superhigh prices. And in wartime, free grain trade in any country is simply canceled.
          1. kamakama
            kamakama 17 February 2021 11: 17
            -1
            https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Хлебные_законы
            Not to be unfounded - an example of how the problems with the pricing of bread were solved at another time and in another country. Moreover, with similar problems - their own production was limited in volume due to the results of mass sheep breeding, and large cities were teeming with poor workers and former villagers. In short - all the extra people under arms and in the colony, let them get their own food there. Those who disagree are sent to workhouses (light concentration camp, https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabotny_dom). So similar problems are not alien there, the transition to an industrial society gives rise to similar problems - https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poor_Law_(1834)
        3. ivan2022
          ivan2022 21 February 2021 17: 44
          0
          Quote: Bar1
          markets are always needed where peasants and urban producers could bring their goods

          ---
          I saw the markets where "the peasants brought" in the USSR. There were plenty of them. And I myself bought very good meat in these markets for 5 rubles, versus the store one for 3 rubles.
          Quote: Bar1
          Secondly, the peasants did not want to hand over bread for candy wrappers and tic-tac-toe, that is why they were subjected to violence by prodrazvorie and later "dispossession-collectivization".

          Provisional allocation began in 1916 by the decision of the State Duma. And it continued in a violent form without compensation from March 1917.
          And not just because of no shit, but because then there was a war and there was no one to sow grain.
          And now the MAIN THING. Collectivization is also not a damn thing to do. And from the fact that the consolidation of farms under market relations is ALWAYS AND EVERYWHERE. So lie to me here about some kind of paradise "free market" - no need! The big ones crush the small ones "freely" and everywhere. Large farms are more productive. And the small peasant doesn't care if the kulak will ruin him, which gives grain for sowing "use" (return half of the harvest). Or join the collective farm.

          People like you haven't even learned to lie. You have at the same time, and the collective farmers were robbed by the state and the collective farms lived on subsidies from the state and did not produce anything. For information, according to Rosstat, only in 2015 in the Russian Federation the meat production was restored at the level of the RSFSR of 1989. Moreover, at the expense of poultry, which they learned to grow on hormones.
          1. Bar1
            Bar1 21 February 2021 18: 44
            0
            Quote: ivan2022
            I saw the markets where "the peasants brought" in the USSR. They were full


            I have already said. Markets under the USSR were the markets of private traders of their personal plots and summer cottages, and not markets like the Novgorod Fair, where goods were brought by both large and small manufacturers, but also urban goods.
            Quote: ivan2022
            Provisional allocation began in 1916 by the decision of the State Duma. And it continued in a violent form without compensation from March 1917.


            the surplus appropriation system under the Republic of Ingushetia and the surplus appropriation system under the Bolsheviks, it was a big difference. Under the Republic of Ingushetia, they did not destroy the markets where the peasants could bring grain and sell it. Under the Bolsheviks, markets were IMMEDIATELY destroyed and a system of bureaucratic distribution was introduced. the Bolsheviks, the peasantry no longer trusted the state, and apparently there was a reason.
            In addition, there were large landowners' farms in RI, and under the Soviets the land was already divided by the peasants, who could not sell their crops and were forced to surrender their sovereignty for a penny and therefore did not surrender. In response, the Bolsheviks simply requisitioned grain, and the peasants responded with uprisings and poured people's blood. In response, the Bolsheviks declared everyone to be kulaks and bandits and began to gasse and shoot the people with guns.

            Quote: ivan2022
            And from the fact that the consolidation of farms under market relations is ALWAYS AND EVERYWHERE.


            here is probably the most important thing. I already talked about the Russian community and the Russian world. It was a self-organizing society, when the peasant community itself worked in the fields and itself sold agricultural products in the markets through SELECTED merchants from the community.
            Was the Russian peasant community left after the thief? We know little about this, apparently it stayed. In the village there were not only fragmented small owners, poor peasants / farm laborers, middle peasants and wealthy peasants, but there was still a society that was the peasant world. It was a society of producers. And it was against this society that the crafty "collectivization" was directed, because the rural collective is the POWER of the people in the countryside.
            And what we are told about "through a strip" of private traders and about the fragmentation of allotments, it was all a lie.
            It was all about power, who produced and who traded, he actually had power. The Bolsheviks wanted to have power in the countryside, i.e. Dictate prices and distribute goods, that is, they swept away any market.

            Quote: ivan2022
            Moreover, at the expense of poultry, which they learned to grow on hormones.

            Do you approve of this, or what? Only idiots can voluntarily eat chemistry.
            1. ivan2022
              ivan2022 22 February 2021 10: 25
              0
              [quote = Bar1] I have already said. Markets under the USSR were the markets of private owners of their personal plots and summer cottages, and not markets like the Novgorod Fair, where goods were brought by both large and small manufacturers, but urban goods were attacked. [/ quote [quote = Bar1]

              Hehe, that's stubborn! This is how your brains were given. Sorry. The market is the market. If "goods were brought in" and prices are not set by the state, this is the market. Even from the dacha, even from the nag, even in the USSR, even where .. In the USSR, the markets were collective farm. And we went there to sell not only from their personal plots, but also from collective farms. Whole rows were marked with the names of collective farms. And the collective farms were not state. enterprises.
              1. Bar1
                Bar1 22 February 2021 10: 44
                +1
                Quote: ivan2022
                And we went there to sell not only from their personal plots, but also from collective farms.


                the collective farms and state farms had a plan for handing over to the state. The plan is a law. For the failure of the plan, they could have removed and planted even during the Brezhnev era.
                And to the markets the collective farms exported what was left OVER the plan. And since in the USSR there was always a vicious practice to add to the plan additionally those who manage, those who drag, then the collective farms brought little to the market.
                In addition, have you ever wondered why the Bolsheviks closed and then destroyed the fairs, the same Novgorod fair?
                That's how it was. This is NOT a natural Bolshevik approach to economics.
                And why so, do you at least understand something or not?
                The article itself is called paternalism-authority of power. an article about power. And the power belongs to the one who controls the flows of goods and sets the rules, but the whole point is that if you start to manage goods and distribute goods, then prices will inevitably jump up, because an official is squeezed between the producer and the buyer who wants to have his own granny piece of pie.
                Therefore, to the progressive exchange of commodity producers in the free market, any distribution of commodities is economically regressive, not progress.
                The more this regulation, consider power, the higher the prices are, therefore this kind of "socialism" is of course not socialism, but parasitolism, when a bunch of parasites appear in the form of power.
            2. ivan2022
              ivan2022 22 February 2021 10: 46
              0
              Quote: Bar1
              Do you approve of this, or what? Only idiots can voluntarily eat chemistry.

              It is of course, if there is nothing to cover, you can be rude .... A universal argument!
              Quote: Bar1
              It was all about power, who produced and who traded, he actually had power.

              Heh, heh ... and when it was not about the authorities? Maybe 300 years ago? Maybe now? If big capital rules, it sets prices.
              It is only the descendants of serfs who can live in the world of "free market, muzhik paradise", "epics of antiquity" with the terrible three-headed Bolsheviks who "wanted" something there, invented by them. There was no economic need! Everything they did, they did because "the Bolsheviks in the terrible USSR wanted so." There were no holy market relations, but people with dog heads lived ... Your remarks, all such nonsense is the best confirmation of the words of the Author about dense peasant paternalism. Did not notice ?
              1. Bar1
                Bar1 22 February 2021 10: 59
                +1
                Quote: ivan2022
                It is of course, if there is nothing to cover, you can be rude .... A universal argument!


                want to consume hormones? Yes, please, you will be like state niggas over, over, over size.

                Quote: ivan2022
                It is only the descendants of serfs who can live in their own world of "free market, peasant paradise", "epics of deep antiquity" with the terrible three-headed Bolsheviks who "wanted" something there


                if you were engaged in history or at least visited here regularly, you might know that before Peter in Russia there was a complete prosperity in everything, especially in food. This was noted by foreign ambassadors and travelers of those times of the 16-17 centuries.
                -Juan Persian
                -Adam Olearius
                -Pavel Alepsky
                -baron Herberstein.
                There was so much food that they simply carried it out on the road to give it to someone. Peasant women wore pearls and brocade, like boyars, as the ambassadors of the Russian society of that time celebrated.
                And why? And one has only to live in accordance with the laws of nature and society, and there will always be prosperity and prosperity in society.
                And today's society is when the minority accumulates unthinkable wealth, and the majority lives in poverty. This is slavery in a new way.
                It is the FREE MARKET that is both the path of progress and power at the same time.
            3. ivan2022
              ivan2022 22 February 2021 10: 55
              0
              Quote: Bar1
              It was a self-organizing society, when the peasant community itself worked in the fields and itself sold agricultural products in the markets through SELECTED merchants from the community.


              If a society is "self-organizing" - then it does not need the State either. Why then the police, courts, internal troops, if there is such a universal democracy? This is what the communists wrote about when they talked about the classless society of the future.
              Nonsense of dreamers who do not understand that any state apparatus at all times is an apparatus of violence.
              And about the "elected merchants" - this is the finish! The merchants were of a higher class than the draft peasants. A society divided by Imperial Laws in fact into castes; "estates and
              1. Bar1
                Bar1 22 February 2021 11: 19
                +1
                Quote: ivan2022
                If a society is "self-organizing" - then it does not need the State either.


                yes it was. Russian society has always had its own governing bodies in the form of popular assemblies.
                -public Veche-calling / removal of the prince for military action, in the evening
                - Cossack circle-election / re-election of the chieftain
                -Mirskaya rural community in the village.
                What kind of police do the Cossacks need? No, they did everything themselves, if someone was guilty, then he was punished at a general meeting / circle and this was not the case anymore.
                The cities used to be not the same as they are now - megalopolises, but small cities-fairs / marketplaces, industrial production was also established there, and by no means always it was in the cities. Many factories in Russia were in villages and small cities. And this is confirmed by the finds of archaeologists old abandoned factories all over Russia.

                Quote: ivan2022
                Nonsense of dreamers who do not understand that any state apparatus at all times is an apparatus of violence.


                no, this is not so, because in a society where all are relatives of each other, the level of trust in such a society is high and in such a society the crime rate is low and tending to zero and no violence is required or in a minimal form.

                Quote: ivan2022
                And about the "elected merchants" - this is the finish! The merchants were of a higher class than the draft peasants.


                you don’t know anything.
                There was such a historian, Doctor of Historical Sciences, Professor Pyzhikov, so it was he who discovered, it turns out that he discovered the peculiarities of the Russian world.

            4. ivan2022
              ivan2022 22 February 2021 11: 00
              0
              Quote: Bar1
              self-organizing society, when the peasant community itself worked in the fields


              Yes, this is no longer funny .... In a class society with serfdom - a level of democracy that is not attainable even now anywhere in the world?
              1. Bar1
                Bar1 22 February 2021 12: 03
                +1
                Quote: ivan2022
                Yes, this is no longer funny .... In a class society with serfdom - a level of democracy that is not attainable even now anywhere in the world?


                democracy is not the power of the demos, but of the demon.
                And at the expense of modern imposed cliches and prejudices, then so.
                According to the theory of Scientific Communism, there are 5 types of social and economic structures.
                -primitive communal
                -slavery
                -feudalism
                -capitalism
                -socialism / communism
                moreover, this textbook says that such an alignment was made by Marx himself.
                But opening the work of Marx, we see that Marx divided human periods not like this, but like this.
                -ancient period
                -feudal way
                -German way

                but then who has so impudently remade Marx himself? And these were the Stalinist theorists of "scientific communism" and they "creatively reworked" Marx.
                This is the "story" left to us by the Bolsheviks.
      2. Fat
        Fat 16 February 2021 16: 09
        0
        Is the "fair price for the product" sabotage against the government? However, it was thanks to the world crisis that the USSR retained its independence and developed into an advanced industrial power. Then the party chose the only correct path.
        But Stalin warned about the possible consequences. And it’s too bad that the events went according to the worst scenario.
  3. Bar1
    Bar1 16 February 2021 11: 13
    +1
    Here is this maxim of Stalin in general, some kind of casuistry. Stalin says that the Bolsheviks should stand on the ground and have a connection with the people, but at first, under war communism, they took away agricultural products from the peasants, which led to peasant uprisings, then they took away the land from the peasants altogether, which led to famines and the creation of the most inefficient agriculture in the world.

    1. EvilLion
      EvilLion 16 February 2021 12: 07
      +2
      Don't confuse Stalin with Khrushchev. Although you do not even know what NEP is. Okay, at least you can distinguish between Peter I and Vladimir Putin.
      1. Bar1
        Bar1 16 February 2021 12: 18
        +1
        Quote: EvilLion
        Don't confuse Stalin with Khrushchev. Although you do not even know what NEP is. Okay, at least you can distinguish between Peter I and Vladimir Putin.


        damn people like you who don't even read the article you just have to kill on the spot. This is an excerpt from Stalin, which the author cited in the article.
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 16 February 2021 05: 29
    +4
    Oh, it will start soon.

    Recently I learned that there are "millennials", and now there are "buzzers".
    Who will be the messiah-leader born in 2000?

    What the Brave New World will be like.

    And the lyrics are good.
    Vital. The roads of a man are a breadwinner and depend on work and friends.

    Dreams are subtle matter.
    And you think - about the dear. And it cannot work otherwise.
  • Kote Pan Kokhanka
    Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 05: 30
    +11
    All right, khana to the kitten! Yes, Vyacheslav Yaroegovich - this must be able to annoy everyone, literally everyone -
    In essence, the work of Vyacheslav Olegovich is the view of the intelligentsia from the outside. The view is unpopular and, alas, not objective. In fact, all the postulates are controversial, but okay, the truth is born in a dispute !!!
    Let's start, minus 100, this is not the bottom, but only the beginning!
    All the good days!
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 16 February 2021 05: 53
      +7
      Good afternoon, Vladislav!

      We will raise the topic: what is the intelligentsia?
      Will we remember Lokhankin Vasisualia?
      1. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 08: 44
        +5
        We will raise the topic: what is the intelligentsia?
        "Declassed elements - in the first row!" (FROM)
      2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 11: 45
        +4
        Quote: Korsar4
        We will raise the topic: what is the intelligentsia?
        Will we remember Lokhankin Vasisualia?

        Since 1919, one of the "peasants" aptly glued the "lousy" label to the "intelligentsia"!
        In 1991 - again, probably not without their participation, they presented a "kitchen" with a chase!
        The peasantry, as such, is a very broad concept in itself. In the Russian Empire, with all the scarcity of opportunities to rise, people achieved big and small. For example, Menshikov, Demidov, Lomonosov and many others. Whether this was the rule, probably still an exception, which, due to economic processes, became the rule.
        Example, white generals! In fact, getting to the top gave you education, talent and protection!
        What changed in 1917? Education has become more accessible and even compulsory. In fact, Vyacheslav Olegovich and Olegovich are right in saying that with the development of industrialization, the processes of "destruction" of the peasantry, as a mental self-awareness, began, but ...
        If in order, was there a possibility of industrialization, not to the detriment of the peasant economy? The answer is no!
        So the conflict was inevitable, all the same, the urban dweller would have to face the rural dweller. So "industrialization" like a vacuum cleaner pumped out human resources from the village. With all the pros and cons !!!
        The trouble is, not all "intellectuals" were ready for such competition. Hence, the breaking of stamps and claims to each other!

        In my opinion, the term "intelligentsia" is contrived. Although conditionally, the end itself can be attributed.
      3. Trilobite Master
        Trilobite Master 16 February 2021 18: 13
        +5
        Quote: Korsar4
        We will raise the topic: what is the intelligentsia?

        Intelligentsia? smile
        The intelligentsia is people with a developed intellect, intellectuals (by the way, this is how it sounds in French). These are people who, from the same amount of information, can draw slightly more useful conclusions than others. The intelligentsia is different, even rural. In any village there is a man, as they say, "in authority", who is respected and whose opinion is attached - this is the intelligentsia.
        It is, if you will, the engine of progress and, at the same time, its indicator. This is science, art, culture, in general, creativity in all its manifestations, ranging from the improvement of agricultural tools such as the plow and the invention of new ways of hunting mammoths, and ending with philosophical reflections on the topic of paternalism. smile
        This is criticality and independence of thinking, based on knowledge accumulated over the centuries, eternal doubts and the search for something new, this is confusion and vacillation, when everyone tries to go his own way and, at the same time, is able to carry hundreds and thousands of others along with him, perhaps only so that later, when it turns out that this path is the most correct (or convenient), to be trampled by them.
        The concept of "intelligentsia" has nothing in common with the image of a half-drunk, unshaven, shabby peasant (certainly in sweatpants stretched out on his knees, bald and wearing glasses), talking about high matters in the kitchen with cockroaches, because the degraded intelligentsia is not in itself such.
        And the main feature of the intelligentsia, in my opinion, is the ability to create something new, something that did not exist before, in other words, the ability to create, and not just repeat.
        Vyacheslav Olegovich, as an unconditional representative of the intelligentsia, sets out in the article his view on some issues of Russian (Soviet) paternalism. But the intelligentsia, as a stratum of society, is different in that it can never and under no circumstances form a single, consolidated position on any occasion - there will always be those who think "a little differently", just "differently" and "completely different" ... smile So, as Vlad wrote -
        Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
        the view of the intelligentsia from the outside

        does not roll here. smile Unless, if you say "some part of the intelligentsia."
        On the topic of the article - the author is largely right. But personally, I also remembered dialectics and looked for peasant paternalism, with which Vyacheslav Olegovich decided to "fight", the dialectical pair is the opposite. And the opposite is that the hope for a "good tsar" in our country inevitably generates a lack of trust in the leadership of the lower level, such as "bad boyars". Hence: "trust in God, do not make a mistake yourself", "the tsar favors, but the huntsman does not favor", "high up to God, far from the king", "the law is like a pillar - you cannot jump, but you can get around", etc.
        What do we end up with? A funny, in my opinion, paradox. Disbelief in the closest bosses, lack of hope for his help and support gave rise to the so-called "Russian ingenuity", independence and the ability to solve tasks of almost any complexity at their lower level without the help of the state - the main thing is not to interfere. Adapt something, replace something, do something yourself, steal something ... And also, for example, pull a child out of a hole without waiting for professional rescuers or rescue a grandmother from a burning house before the arrival of firefighters. And in war, this ingenuity and initiative, as we have always come in handy ...
        Do we want to kill such abilities in our compatriots? But this is the reverse of the medal, on the obverse of which the paternalism described by the author is visible.
        So, brothers, not everything is so simple. smile
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 19: 18
          +3
          The song is persistently recalled from "Don't be afraid, I'm with you":

          "There is no salvation for an intellectual from himself" (c).
          1. Trilobite Master
            Trilobite Master 16 February 2021 21: 25
            +3
            Well, not that kind of intelligentsia and harmless, otherwise with the troubles that it brings to everyone, it would have been to the nail for a long time ... smile
            In such cases, I always remember another song:
            Smart is troublesome, d (y) cancer is boring
            You need something in between, but where can you get it ...
        2. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 17: 14
          +1
          Thank you, Mikhail, but although I am wearing sweatpants and glasses, I am a terribly hairy paternalist and very angry lately. On the tram, you don't have to rush to apologize when you step on your foot. I will hold back 70%.
          But I can and fatherly hard to argue ...
    2. The leader of the Redskins
      The leader of the Redskins 16 February 2021 08: 23
      0
      And today I learned a new term)))
      Well, I haven't heard before paernalism!)))
      Although I studied at the institute, I missed couples in moderation. In other words, they explained these reasons.
      My grandparents and grandmothers come from the village.
      Well, thanks to Vyacheslav Olegovich. His articles are sometimes controversial, but these disputes are ... good, or what? I don't want to strangle my opponent))) wink
      1. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 08: 32
        +6
        Igor, don't bother!
        In our country, this term has always been called "house building".
    3. Fat
      Fat 16 February 2021 16: 37
      +6
      hi
      "Paris is worth mass" (c) Vladislav, I liked the article. This is bold, but wildly controversial, although that way by two-thirds, I point of view V.O. sorry. In the end, I personally am an "intellectual", only it is not known in what generation. Great-grandfather was a "landowner" lol from the military ... Grandfather, first a "peasant", then a proletarian at an arms factory, father ... He worked as a teacher after the war. Mom graduated from Kazan University (economics), worked all her life in a state bank. Grandfather was an accountant at Izhmash.
      Father to his last breath is a communist and an atheist ...
      And I still respect the president's "rascal". Paternalist? Only that I don't want discord and confusion? Is it my problem that I hate marauders of any color, no matter what legal clothes they may wear? Always in the event of a "bad" change of power, a brazen thief replaces a moderate thief. I will resist this to the best of my ability. I stand on that.
      1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 17: 50
        +5
        Quote: Thick
        In the end, I personally am an "intellectual", only it is not known in what generation.

        I will smile! I calculated my great-great-great-grandfather from the archives of the gendarmerie surveillance.
        "A student of a mining school (such and such, such and such) of the peasants, was taken under supervision, as not trustworthy ...."
        In fact, he was a serf worker at the Ural plant, like all my other ancestors, with the exception of 1/8 Cossacks (in the metric, peasants from Miass) and 1/8 of Chuvash blood. Although the fact that from the peasants, still in the wild is written with a pitchfork. Since the data are post-revolutionary, and the great-grandfather managed to fight for the whites and for the reds, however, as a director of the sausage shop and mill, he was eventually repressed.
        The rest were divided from simple coal burners and blacksmiths, to managers of mining plants and dam craftsmen. Then both main lines were taken to the internal affairs bodies! Although everyone except me had a second technical education, and my father even worked as a rolling mill change foreman. So who am I "anti-ligent" or "cop", I tend to the second! Moreover, given that my great-grandfather married the daughter of a policeman on his own head, I can be proud that he is in the fifth generation!
        As for the perception of the political situation, my position is simple. Any revolution is blood and misfortune. You can love or not love power, but it is necessary to realize your will within the established framework. Going beyond the flags is the Civil War, territorial losses, devastation. Twice this rake was stepped on in 1917 and 1991 - that's enough. Not satisfied, express your disagreement in the elections! The rest is from the evil one.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Fat
          Fat 16 February 2021 22: 01
          +1
          Vladislav, I deleted my comment not because of any rejection. There are simply no words, as if I took it off my tongue. Social transformations above the roof were enough for mine. Grandma's relatives scattered around the world. Great-grandfather tried to lay hands on himself when the local "dispossessed".
          They rehabilitated, but they had to merge into the city anyway, out of sin. You don't need to be a historian to know what "repairs" are ... and "priimok", Priimok -dar is "like a Far Eastern hectare" only in the Vyatka province and 150 years earlier .... and not a vulgar hectare ... and how much strength is enough. Grandfather had enough charm of the Guards, and took the first 17 families with him. And wow, there were some repairs, people still live there (to be honest) I remember the first few families. Because Uncle Pasha, a fellow countryman of his father, fought with his father, along the way he carried him to Our shore. And when Pasha said that "our" estate is still working properly, the sisters almost fell into a mess. God forbid from such an inheritance. My father said nothing, I, as an older man, then the same. I hate agriculture and the courts.
          Well, the local landlord, I had to entrust my sons-in-law, but then they had enough other troubles in abundance ...
          Life is like that.
          Politics? Yes, EBN had nothing but the buzz from the defeat of the "White House"
          My father left during the "uprising", my mother was glad that my father did not know.
          She lived after a short time, until the beginning of March.
          They looked, hanging their legs down from the cloud, and called each other by name and ... they probably saw us ...
          That's it.
          1. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 22: 09
            0
            Quote: Thick
            I hate farming

            Well, you Kazel, zhirtrest.
            1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
              Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 22: 30
              +2
              Vladimir, do not get boiled over! Everyone puts their own in this concept. Someone 6 acres, and some 12 hectares.
              For me, a vegetable garden is a basic factor in the stability of my family and a component of prosperity. Potatoes, parking, cabbage, tomatoes, cucumbers and much more, depending on the season, are not bought in the store, but taken from the cellar. As a result, money is saved, which is spent on something else.
              Many people I know live differently, this is their choice.
            2. Fat
              Fat 16 February 2021 23: 21
              +2
              Yes, city Casel and some other hi There are acquaintances, a stick is stuck in the ground, after a couple of years - an apple tree ... Wonderful, but not mine. Craftsman and builder. A bull is a bull, a locksmith is a locksmith, and a god is a god ... laughing
        3. Revival
          Revival 17 February 2021 14: 22
          -1
          "You can love or not love the power, but you need to realize your will within the established framework."

          Here is an interesting question, but what, for example, is the option to realize your will, in a situation where the "framework" just contains a direct ban on the implementation of your will?
          1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
            Kote Pan Kokhanka 17 February 2021 14: 34
            +1
            An example in the studio?
        4. The comment was deleted.
          1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
            Kote Pan Kokhanka 18 February 2021 06: 26
            +3
            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            And despite all the negativity, revolution is always a movement towards a better life.

            By and large, this is the exception, not the rule. An example of modern North Africa! How far have they rushed from outside after their color revolutions? Or is France a country of 4 revolutions and one misunderstanding, how sovereign is it today? How beautiful it started? Cappuccino, Laos, Cambodio, Brunney? They are only recovering from their revolutionary efforts.
            The revolution in our days, in our country, is blood and the inevitable Civil War. Do we need it?
            Example Ukraine! Macaques are those who think that they will sit out when they take out the prop from the genie lamp - revolution! She will sweep away everyone and everything !!!
            Now the question is, I did not drink vodka with you, so further on to you and with a capital letter.
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 18 February 2021 23: 58
              0
              What you say is sheer stupidity. It does not matter whether the revolution wins or not at the moment, the main thing is that in the end, step by step, humanity is moving forward. Of course, if this is not walking on the spot, which our caricature as liberal as opposition offers us. A revolution is needed to break the rotten old system. And change it to a new, more efficient one. This has always been the case in human history. Bughagaga, what about the American Revolution? Or "is it different"? But in fact, it is you who take the conversation aside and are engaged in demagoguery. laughing One must be frankly naive to the point of stupidity in order to hope that as a result of the bourgeois elections, radically affect the situation in the country. Also tell me that this can be done with the help of meetings. Sanctioned or not, don't care. For example, when all this furgalschina began, I knew how to end up. Actually, there is no need to be a man of seven spans in the forehead. Well, let's say I passed a law on the seizure of any of your property in my favor, it's like I'm the bourgeoisie, and you're the people smile How do you think I will be worried about your indignation within the framework of the law passed in my favor? Well, will you make some noise somewhere in a place specially designated for you and the same naive as you, and what? Never mind. It won't ruin my life in any way. It's another matter if you get into my pocket with strikes and other revolutions. Then yes. You can make temporary concessions well, or under the slogans what all these ungrateful slaves are to suppress performances with iron and blood. And no need to talk about Ukraine to nausea, this filthy hackneyed protective rhetoric is tired.
          2. Fat
            Fat 18 February 2021 15: 32
            +1
            Bro! this is the evolution of everything. With macaques for "banana" with-Fighting on the net in the early 90s yet. Sorovshchina got it, and your pranks are the same ... outdated. On a paternalist who has gone nuts in his world, your words are worthless "oversalting", for which the owner of the house has the right to endow the mistress with a fault (in housebuilding) with a sharp rejection. I hope I was mild in expression.
            1. Fat
              Fat 18 February 2021 15: 47
              +1
              Yes, there was one really powerful revolution, a couple of million years to that occasion.
              Result? Dinosaurs are extinct. bully
  • Destiny
    Destiny 16 February 2021 05: 43
    +10
    What else is paternalism bad? But what: it generates many ideological "squires" who are ready in every way to praise the wisdom of the leaders and to justify in the eyes of people even the most negative of their actions and decisions, since "the father will not say and do bad things." It is expressed in the imperceptible implantation in the public consciousness of ideas about the infallibility of the holders of the supreme power, their deification and at the same time tacit agreement with any unlimited arbitrariness, lack of rights and servility of subjects, the denial of any freedom and democracy.

    I agree. "The king is good, the boyars are bad" from the same song.
  • Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 16 February 2021 06: 05
    +3
    Brad. request
    First, the revolution of 1905-1907, then the First World War, the revolution of 1917, the Civil War of 1918-1922, industrialization, collectivization, "Yezhovism", the Great Patriotic War, "the defeat of the cult of personality" and a host of other perturbations affecting both on the economy and on the consciousness of our citizens.
    belay The same analysis for Germany in the studio .... what
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 16 February 2021 06: 23
      +1
      Swipe. And show me. It will be interesting.
    2. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 16 February 2021 09: 27
      +3
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      The same analysis for Germany in the studio ....

      Shpakovsky and analysis, but you need hot ice! laughing
      1. Fat
        Fat 16 February 2021 17: 05
        +1
        Yes there is. V.O. there are priorities, and you, Vladimir?
        Of course, a "party of moderate progress within the framework of the law" is now possible. And what do you personally want for yourself and your family now, and not in a generation? Swaras? I doubt it!
        Shpakovsky gave us the opportunity to reflect on what everyone wants for themselves, the family.
        Well, thanks for that. There is no ice scalding there, from an honest person.
        Do not play the fool when you live quite tolerably.
        And you, you quite allow yourself.
        Oh, my friends told me girls, first kiss, and then "be smart" ... recourse
        1. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 17 February 2021 03: 07
          +2
          Quote: Thick
          Shpakovsky gave us the opportunity to reflect
          Very funny! (Not really)
    3. kamakama
      kamakama 17 February 2021 12: 32
      +1
      In fact, with Germany, it's not all that simple either. Loss of Alsace following WWI. Bavarian and other people's republics. The USSR had large spending on the army in the Interbellum, and Germany paid reparations, so it was difficult for both. She didn't have to carry out industrialization, it had already taken place, although the conditions were so-so there (in large cities by the end of the 19th century there was a concept of "bed renter" - people slept in shifts in one bed https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki / Tenants_beds)
      Instead of Yezhovism - nights of long knives, crystal night. WWII was also. And after that there was no longer Germany as such, Germany was pumped up with dollars from the outside. Although now, 35 years later, they are divided into Ossi and Vessey
  • Krasnodar
    Krasnodar 16 February 2021 06: 07
    +5
    Stalin is good, Khrushchev is a maize worker, Brezhnev is nothing, but "Marked" has destroyed everything ... Well, how much can you? Where have the people been all this time? I was engaged in "Odobryams" - all in the best, again, traditions of paternalistic culture.

    good Golden words
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 16 February 2021 06: 13
      +5
      The people worked. Sometimes he drank.
      Where is the line separating in our case the plebeians from the patricians.
      I think there is a process of formation of estates.

      Very painful.
      Moreover, against the background of continued concentration of capital.
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 06: 31
        +5
        Very simple and clear - education. Quality education. Mostly overseas. And money for that. In very rare cases, you come across talented children who independently enter Bauman and Moscow State University (for example). In very rare cases, they are able to support themselves while studying in Moscow, not without the help of their parents. The two above categories are the future patricians hi
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 06: 48
          +10
          Probably disagree.
          There is self-education.

          It so happened that lately I have come across Baumanka. I have been communicating with the University for a long time.

          Yes. University mark. But there is also a layer cake. And the horizons are being developed.
          The University is often far from practice.

          As for Baumanka: I came to a disappointing conclusion - students are not always loved there.

          Is it possible to get a decent education in regional universities?
          My answer is you can.

          Although it is probably more difficult every year.
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar 16 February 2021 07: 04
            +4
            Self-education - certainly. But. What I see here ... lacks the versatility and subtlety of perception that is inherent in a well-educated American or British. Analysis and traditions of analysis of philosophers, psychoanalysts, artists and writers are absent.
            As for Baumanki, he took an example from the lamp. Prestigious and high-quality, as far as possible, the capital's university.
            As for regional institutions, the system must be broken. High-quality training of the teaching staff, more funding for big salaries ... and the inevitability of punishment for bribes.
            Then yes, it will work out
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 16 February 2021 07: 22
              +5
              Maugham also remarked: "In no Russian novel do heroes go to a museum or an art gallery."

              The system is already breaking down.
              But what is being replaced by?
              Rewriting papers.

              And the idea of ​​choosing 40 universities - and there to create "Heaven on Earth" - is not an idea.

              Scientometrics is the wrong way.
              And the leaven can be a combination of tradition and modernity, without contamination.
              1. Krasnodar
                Krasnodar 16 February 2021 07: 53
                +6
                Yes, bribery in education must be eliminated. And it will be ok.
                1. Fat
                  Fat 18 February 2021 17: 44
                  +2
                  This is not enough. Alas for Us.
                  The normal professorship is not enough, the Fatherland should not bother. A couple - three good assistants at all. This is very bad.
                  Bribes are an inevitable evil with such a ... common "kake".
                  and for the "financial elite" - all education should be paid, they will not go bankrupt.
                  And God bless them, let them choose between "Christ Church" and the Ivy League, only for "blood"
                  Not a prosecutor, for example, I ... I can condemn others, but it's pointless.
                  Fuck, how many times he conveyed sympathetic greetings to the creatively unhealthy "Mara" ....
                  1. Krasnodar
                    Krasnodar 18 February 2021 17: 55
                    +2
                    I wrote about this, Andrey Borisovich
              2. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 16 February 2021 09: 05
                +5
                Scientometrics
                Is it now the so-called bureaucracy in the field of science and education?
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 16 February 2021 10: 15
                  +3
                  This inquisitorial system deserves a separate story.
                  But globally it is not very different from the "likes" system. And harmful.
                  1. 3x3zsave
                    3x3zsave 16 February 2021 10: 18
                    +4
                    I know. I lived with a teacher for six years.
                    1. Korsar4
                      Korsar4 16 February 2021 10: 21
                      +3
                      So you know practically from the inside.
                      1. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 19: 41
                        +1
                        Not without it.
              3. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 16 February 2021 09: 10
                +7
                Maugham also remarked: "In no Russian novel do heroes go to a museum or an art gallery."
                Maugham is still an expert on Russian culture.
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 16 February 2021 10: 17
                  +3
                  View from the outside. But the writer is talented.
                  Incidentally, while "Petrovich" Makanin came to my mind.
                  1. 3x3zsave
                    3x3zsave 16 February 2021 10: 20
                    +3
                    Looking from the outside
                    From the inside too.
                    1. Korsar4
                      Korsar4 16 February 2021 10: 22
                      +3
                      Yes. He also spied on us.
              4. BAI
                BAI 16 February 2021 13: 15
                +2
                Literally like this:
                I don’t remember a Russian novel in which at least one of the characters would have visited an art gallery

                No museum. But these are particulars. Said in 1917 ..
                Can you give an example from foreign literature before 1917, where the characters visited an art gallery or museum?
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 16 February 2021 20: 04
                  +4
                  Just the first thoughts - Maugham himself. But obviously later. "Vacation in Paris", "Moon and Penny", etc.

                  The Forsyte Saga - later? Remarque also later.

                  Dickens? Balzac? Maupassant? Jerome?
            2. vladcub
              vladcub 16 February 2021 13: 20
              +2
              Please take the risk. Even if someone publicly agrees, he will keep a fig in his pocket. "High-quality training", but what to do with the previous staff? And you can't change the whole system overnight.
          2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
            Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 17: 59
            +4
            Quote: Korsar4
            Is it possible to get a decent education in regional universities?
            My answer is you can.


            The quality of regional universities is growing from year to year.
            By the way, you can study at Moscow State University, but you won't get a crust of knowledge! The most important thing is motivation.
            How is it with Lomonosov - "The Russian land is capable of giving birth to both Platons and Newtons!"
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 16 February 2021 20: 06
              +4
              “And maybe own Platonov
              And fast with the mind of Neutons
              Russian land to give birth "(c).
        2. Fat
          Fat 16 February 2021 20: 26
          +3
          Albert. There are such people in my generation, even to take classmates. Themselves, themselves ... Moscow State University, Baumanka, MITHT ... and the wagons at the vegetable warehouse ...
          Never "patrician" workaholics are frostbitten (yes I am). Nobody has the inclination to steer.
          I hope for our younger ones, that is, the eighties in the first place. They were already eating a spoonful of grief and learning about life. But I don't know many, alas ...
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar 16 February 2021 20: 47
            +2
            So this is the patrician. hi
      2. Deniska999
        Deniska999 16 February 2021 07: 38
        +2
        http://www.consultant.ru/document/cons_doc_LAW_51534/338ab21583732c497d5158fae3e6b83105b776f0/ Табель о рангах свой у нас есть уже)
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 07: 54
          +8
          Oh, okay.

          “You are nobody's slave, and nobody’s master.
          Truly, your friend is lucky ”(c).
      3. Catfish
        Catfish 16 February 2021 09: 40
        +4
        The people worked. Sometimes he drank.

        If about the Soviet era, then rather the opposite.

        Hello, Sergey. hi
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 10: 18
          +5
          Hi Constantine!
          It was in every way.
          Generalizations roughen up.
        2. vladcub
          vladcub 16 February 2021 12: 31
          +5
          We can do both together.
          Kostya, good day
          1. Catfish
            Catfish 16 February 2021 12: 54
            +6
            Hello, Sergey! hi
            That's for sure - we can do a lot, and even more can. laughing drinks
            1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
              Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 20: 42
              +6
              Quote: Sea Cat
              Hello, Sergey! hi
              That's for sure - we can do a lot, and even more can. laughing drinks

              And the cat is for what ???
              I will smile! The cat in the food chain is higher than the dog. Why? Because when the dog is under the tree, the cat is in the tree! laughing
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 16 February 2021 21: 00
                +7
                Cats, they are generally interesting people. drinks
            2. vladcub
              vladcub 16 February 2021 21: 08
              +3
              Kostya, you find funny pictures as always. It's hard to compete with you here
              PS. I'm not Sergei, but Slava. These are slightly different names.
              However, one friend stubbornly calls me: Uncle Vadik "
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 17 February 2021 18: 20
                +2
                I beg your pardon, Buddy, this is all from permanent insomnia. And now my head is like a cast-iron cauldron, although I slept for almost half a day. I got fed up with this curse. request
          2. Fat
            Fat 16 February 2021 20: 50
            +3
            Surprising and true ... wassat Cinnamon does not spoil coffee. Hello Svyatoslav hi
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 17 February 2021 19: 31
              +3
              The most delicious coffee, which has so far been met with cinnamon.
              1. Fat
                Fat 17 February 2021 19: 57
                +2
                My beloved woman made me coffee with garlic. Song!
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 17 February 2021 20: 21
                  +3
                  What the beloved woman does is all a song.

                  "Who is young - to that wormwood, like honey" (c).
                  1. Fat
                    Fat 17 February 2021 21: 42
                    +2
                    Minnesinger! laughing
                    And now Khlyupek the Dostoslavny comes out on the lists, with a height of half an arshin, wielding a sword-Zweigander, three times exceeding his weight! Shudder, Dear viewers! .... Gasps and pauses in time, each phrase honed to the point of complete impossibility ...
                    1. Korsar4
                      Korsar4 17 February 2021 21: 46
                      +3
                      Villon is a genius.
                      1. Fat
                        Fat 17 February 2021 21: 58
                        +2
                        Quote: Korsar4
                        Villon is a genius

                        Undoubtedly!
                        I am François, which is not happy,
                        Alas, the death of the villain awaits,
                        And how much does this ass weigh
                        The neck will soon recognize.

                        Whose translation I do not know, Alas. But cool to the ideal!
                      2. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 17 February 2021 22: 02
                        +2
                        Offhand - Korneeva.
                        But "The Ballad of Proverbs" is more like a different version.
                      3. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 17 February 2021 22: 07
                        +3
                        Obnatushki. This is Ilya Ehrenburg.
                        So familiar that I was sure that it was from a favorite series of books, where Korneev's translations.
                      4. Fat
                        Fat 17 February 2021 22: 48
                        +2
                        Thank you, Sergei, otherwise, we often use old-fashioned phrases, without even remembering those who first introduced them into everyday life ...
                      5. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 17 February 2021 22: 52
                        +3
                        Villon just understands quotes.
                        But what a school of translators we have.

                        Thank you. The question asked is also catchy. And a lot leads to the system.
                      6. Fat
                        Fat 17 February 2021 23: 14
                        +2
                        Come on, for your compliment, undeserved,
                        and there are a lot of exceptional "interpreters" in both the Old, imperial, Russia, the USSR, and in modern times.
                        For some reason I single out Marshak, I got to know Burns only through his translations.
                        Awesomely I like the translation of "Alice", and there not one foot trampled.
                        There is an awesome 1982 edition with comments by Martin Gardner, maybe you know the translator. Tell me! My gratitude will have no boundaries, within reason (C)
                      7. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 17 February 2021 23: 22
                        +2
                        Demurova.
                        I was given an amazing edition a few years ago, but I only admired it for a few days and put it off.

                        Of the translators, Lozinsky and Zabolotsky are simply brilliant.
                        Zabolotsky is very close as a poet, although he was caught late.

                        And fantasy translated by Nora Gal!

                        But "Faust", unlike most connoisseurs, is more pleasant in Pasternak's translation.
                      8. Fat
                        Fat 17 February 2021 23: 45
                        +2
                        So, all the same, Demurova ...
                        BARMAGLOT

                        Cuddled. Cocktail Shawls
                        They were poking around,
                        And the grimaces were grunting,
                        Like muamziki in mov.
                        Fear the Jabberwock, son!
                        He's so swirling and wild
                        And in the wilderness a giant is roaring -
                        Vicious Brandashmyg!
                        But he took the sword, and he took the shield,
                        High is full of thoughts.
                        In the globach his path lies
                        Under the tree Tumtum.
                        He stood under a tree and waits.
                        And suddenly thunder rumbled -
                        The terrible Barmaglot flies
                        And blazes with fire!
                        One-two, one-two! The grass is burning
                        Vz-vz - shears the sword,
                        Alas! Alas! And the head
                        Drumming off the shoulders
                        Oh my shining boy!
                        You won the battle!
                        Brave hero
                        I sing your praise! Slinky shorts
                        Puffed about.
                        And the grimaces were grunting,
                        Like muamziki in mov.

                        "Very nice rhymes," said Alice thoughtfully, "but it's _not so easy_ to understand them.
                        It's easy to translate, you open every word like a wallet, and there are two halves ...
                        .... Nava is the grass under the sundial, half of the day it slopes to the left, and in the afternoon - to the right ...
                      9. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 17 February 2021 23: 55
                        +2
                        Not immediately accepted "Alice".

                        I liked very much the epigraphs to 'Pioneers' by Cooper from The Hunt for the Snark.
                      10. Fat
                        Fat 18 February 2021 00: 10
                        +2
                        Oh, Sergei. So far I got hold of the first edition with Gardner's comments. I did not even suspect that such a text is possible. And with illustrations by Tenniel, Dodgson's friend (Do-do)
                        Snark hunting is cool, but all the translations were mediocre ... they say not to throw words out ...
                        Let the mathematicians suffer. In the end, Poincaré's conjecture is proven for all common cases in 3 dimensions .... laughing
                      11. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 18 February 2021 00: 15
                        +3
                        Yes. That's it. I think what kind of version of "Alice" I got in high school. But it was in the summer and at the neighbors.

                        With the "Snark" too. Looked at different translations. And in memory - all the same epigraphs from childhood.
                      12. Fat
                        Fat 18 February 2021 00: 35
                        +2
                        Once in a distant galaxy, a paper book fell into my hands, as a law-abiding citizen of the empire, I was obliged to hand it over to the authorities, but amazing illustrations stopped me and I plunged into this amazing text. Honestly, but I didn't understand and didn't accept anything. And so the only paper ancient book lay on the shelf. Until her time has come ...
                        Freedom of thought struck me. If you want to bite off the mushroom, said the smoking caterpillar, if you want to bite off the other side ...
                        The retarded girl asked in shock "the other side of what"
                        --- Mushroom! said a stoned caterpillar ...
                      13. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 18 February 2021 00: 40
                        +2
                        This creative retelling of the story of a book not returned to the library?
                      14. Fat
                        Fat 18 February 2021 01: 12
                        +2
                        Bro! I honestly bought two copies of the second edition. And the first one reluctantly had to be returned to the owner, they don’t scribble books from friends. Fair exchange. There was nothing to offer then. I would have gotten an option later than 10 years later. Aki the lawyer of the unclean, I would even grieve the Virgin Mary from the true path to another encyclopedia ...)))))
                      15. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 18 February 2021 01: 20
                        +3
                        Today a friend bought a book of Chinese poetry from his hands. "Morning frost on maple leaves." Price for 1-3 cups of coffee in Moscow.

                        Someone else supports paper publications. But they are leaving more and more.

                        And we are from the last Mohicans.
                      16. Fat
                        Fat 18 February 2021 01: 37
                        +2
                        Not! You are the last of the minnesingers. Edition edition difference. Edition, second amended and
                        Corrected (sounds wonderful)
                        But in fact - often, huge perturbations
                        That is why I appreciate that other libraries will not lose anything. Fair exchange!
                        (in fact, a cunning deception, of course)
                      17. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 18 February 2021 06: 23
                        +2
                        This is, like, the hypostasis of Anton.
                        But I like the idea.

                        Will they be fed?
                      18. Fat
                        Fat 18 February 2021 11: 52
                        +2
                        Fairy tales ... as many as you like! drinks laughing
                      19. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 18 February 2021 16: 03
                        +2
                        You can last a couple of days. However, no one canceled pasture.
                      20. Fat
                        Fat 18 February 2021 16: 37
                        +2
                        Sergei, no offense. Come, we will make a barbecue and Hypatius ... I will show you through a small pull ... how the "brotherhood" exists. But in the Patriarch's chambers is a will. I myself was there only once, on occasion, the furniture was taken out due to the departure of the local "Vladyka"
                        New ... - I do not appreciate, although he is worthy of respect, does not accept "worldly grace" ... Sincerely believes ... - a rarity ... museum.
                        We are lucky if we visit the "Gate Temple" - the beauty is extraordinary, its restorers have been "straightening" for the public for a very long time ...
                        I haven't been for a long time, I hope it has become available already.
                      21. Korsar4
                        Korsar4 18 February 2021 17: 19
                        +3
                        Not that there were many, but I like the Kostroma region.
                        And Kologriv. And Bui and Ney.

                        I also got out with my family. And the Ipatiev Monastery is good. And the Museum of Wooden Architecture is also alive. I even got to the theater on a countermark.

                        So who knows. Suddenly everything will turn out.

                        Thank you very much for the invitation, Andrey Borisovich. It's tempting.
                        For now, just understand that the most urgent thing needs to be done.
              2. vladcub
                vladcub 18 February 2021 07: 33
                0
                I also visit the library
        3. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 01: 19
          +2
          I read it in the original. But this edition just shook. Awesome.
        4. Korsar4
          Korsar4 18 February 2021 01: 22
          +2
          I will not appreciate the play on words.
          Kipling tried. But with Shakespeare it didn't really work out.
          There is nothing to be a bummer at school.
        5. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 02: 04
          +1
          Didn't it work with Shakespeare? Not each of us Marshak, we do not compete with the classics. But you can understand WHAT the translators have done for us, keeping the style, rhythm and content of each individual "thing" ...
        6. Korsar4
          Korsar4 18 February 2021 06: 26
          +3
          Marshak is Burns's translations for me.
          And, of course, a separate world - Shakespeare's 66th sonnet.
        7. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 14: 38
          +1
          http://engshop.ru/shekspir-sonet-66-na_anglieskom/
          I call death. I can't stand to see
          Dignity that begs for alms
          A mocking lie over simplicity,
          Insignificance in luxurious clothes
          And a false sentence to perfection
          And virginity, abused roughly,
          And inappropriate honor is a shame,
          And power is held captive by toothless weakness,
          And the frankness that is reputed to be stupidity,
          And foolishness in the mask of a sage, a prophet,
          And a closed mouth of inspiration
          And righteousness in the service of vice.
          Everything that I see around me is disgusting ...
          But how can I leave you, dear friend!
          Sonnet 66 translated by Samuil Marshak

          But ... recourse
        8. Korsar4
          Korsar4 18 February 2021 16: 09
          +2
          Mezhirov:

          “That there are no answers to my questions.
          And there is no friend. Only the sound is empty.
          And roads from Shakespeare's sonnets
          Only 66th ".
  • vladcub
    vladcub 18 February 2021 07: 42
    +3
    I like the translation of Pasternak and Marshak, but I don't remember Zabolotsky. Not really the greatest poetry fan
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 18 February 2021 10: 14
    +2
    "The Knight in the Panther's Skin", "The Word about Igor's Regiment" and much, much more.
  • Fat
    Fat 19 February 2021 00: 23
    0
    Svyatoslav! You don't need to love poetry, She is in Us and Always with Us, we always remember our childhood ...
    There was no nail
    horseshoe is gone
    There was no horseshoe - the horse limped,
    The horse is lame, the commander is killed!
    The cavalry is broken
    The army is running.
    The enemy enters the city,
    Not sparing the prisoners
    Because of,
    there was no nail in the forge!
    Do you remember? Bro!
    (Marshak's translation is a ballad about a nail and a horseshoe, poems for children.)
  • vladcub
    vladcub 18 February 2021 07: 38
    +2
    "thanks a lot. Come back again" (c)
  • vladcub
    vladcub 18 February 2021 07: 31
    +1
    I answer today. Yesterday the parking lot was major at work, and then at home.
    Cinnamon coffee? Haven't tried it yet. Now I take it in grains, with the flavor of Irish cream.
    1. Fat
      Fat 18 February 2021 15: 07
      0
      Svyatoslav, after the first smell of Coffee with a capital letter in pavilion 69 of VDNKh, I pinned myself to the Italian ... 2002 was in the yard. His name was Alexander (Well, his signature coffee is the same - "Alexander") We got into conversation to the best of our ability. Years 6, every year we met 2 times - talked ... Amazing Master. And the coffee of its roast and its name, I still "search and search", but unsuccessfully.
      And there was just something "espresso" ...
      In general, reading Heinlein, I realized that there are not many varieties of Coffee.
      The classic highlighted the main ones.
      1 Mocha
      2 Robusta
      3 Crushed coal
      I will add 1 more grade. In which position to place you choose yourself.
      "Made by a professional". laughing
      1. vladcub
        vladcub 18 February 2021 17: 14
        +1
        Andre, right? If a professional cooks, then thick coal will be: "mocha" and vice versa, if hand-baked, then everything will be: "crushed coal".
        I'm 20 years old, a little over 20, addicted to coffee, and in childhood and adolescence I had tea, a certain time of cocoa, and now coffee
        1. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 18: 09
          0
          You are right, Svyatoslav ... A master makes a candy from rubbish, and a mediocre amateur will not build anything from the best raw materials except warm brown water. request
  • Fat
    Fat 16 February 2021 17: 20
    +4
    hi It's a very, very painful process, my daughter and I haven't talked about politics for 10 years ...
    A. She sometimes slips. I just grin to myself: "What did you expect from this (next) clicker" ...
    He says I want a jewelry manufacturing company in Switzerland (they have an office there). I answer - Russian cannot be Swiss. You will cook in euro sauce, you yourself dream about your native land. My elder nephew has been found there, in western Europe for many years. But all the same, he and his children are Russian. And this is not because the Russians are some extraordinary people. It's just that euro shit has bad adhesion to the Russian soul ...
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 16 February 2021 20: 49
      +2
      I will say this - in Europe everything is much more honest and humane. And scanty class.
      1. Fat
        Fat 16 February 2021 23: 54
        +2
        Humane? Yes Yes. Highly.
        Breivik is complaining about the Internet connection in the "camera". Kapets! Kill 70 innocent compatriots and go complain about "unbearable conditions of detention."
        The apotheosis of humanism.
        Is it fair?
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 17 February 2021 09: 50
          +4
          Honestly and humanely - any German pensioner and janitor have access to any operation and other medical procedure of any degree of complexity. We are talking about the highest world standards of medicine.
          It's humane.
          The German Deputy Ministry of Defense quit after it turned out that her son had used the Luftwaffe Bundeswehr military transport aircraft for a free flight.
          It's fair.
          If about prison - Brevik Breivik, and in Russia there would be money, in prison everything will be. Internet, girls, etc.
  • bubalik
    bubalik 16 February 2021 06: 43
    +12

    Krasnodar
    Today, 07: 07

    ,,, and what has changed? And now every iron is approved by the existing authorities.
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 16 February 2021 07: 05
      +5
      "For there is no power more beautiful than the power of Caesar" (C)
      Duc has not changed for a long time
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 16 February 2021 09: 43
        +6
        "Homeland is everything, the suzerain is nothing"
        And it will not change. drinks
      2. bubalik
        bubalik 16 February 2021 10: 07
        +7
        ,,, that Caesar or the example of Paul I clearly demonstrates that the careless behavior of even an absolute emperor towards the noble classes can result in a sudden deterioration in health and loss of legal capacity. repeat
      3. Fat
        Fat 16 February 2021 17: 42
        +4
        And nobody needs "global" changes. The Moscow financial elite literally crushed everything for themselves. We are moving quickly towards a state monopoly, or rather a mosmonopoly. And move the capital to, say, Novosibirsk, well, at least a part, say, the executive ... In vain did they fight for the digital government? Therefore, the unloved "Dima-iPhone" is still in trend - safety advice.
        1. Fat
          Fat 16 February 2021 17: 49
          +2
          I am "generally" satisfied with the central government, but without fanaticism .... Too many bad things in memory. But this is inevitable. Whom to entrust the country, when marauders, who have not stolen their "legitimate" around?
    2. vladcub
      vladcub 16 February 2021 13: 06
      +1
      How else? NO power can do without "approvals"
      That the Horde khan, that the autocrat, that the general secretary, that the president, they long to hear "approvals".
      What's in Russia, what's in America everywhere and everywhere
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Far B
    Far B 16 February 2021 06: 11
    +1
    Paternalism (from Lat. Paternus - "paternal, paternal") is a system of relations in which the authorities provide for the needs of citizens, and citizens in exchange for this allow the authorities to dictate models of their behavior, both public and private.
    And why hell, I beg your pardon, the authorities still need, how not to provide the needs of the population?
    As for the dictatorship of a model of behavior - well, forgive me, any government in any country in the world is doing just that.
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 06: 23
      +5
      Quote: Dalny V
      Paternalism (from Lat. Paternus - "paternal, paternal") is a system of relations in which the authorities provide for the needs of citizens, and citizens in exchange for this allow the authorities to dictate models of their behavior, both public and private.

      But I don’t understand, but what, a can of sprats cannot be put on the table, must it be put on a plate?
      1. Korsar4
        Korsar4 16 February 2021 06: 26
        +9
        As far as you need it.
        If you really want to eat. And together with a friend - you can do without ceremony.

        And we have already talked about sprats. In the current version, sprat in tomato sauce is better.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 06: 28
          0
          Quote: Korsar4
          As far as you need it.
          If you really want to eat. And together with a friend - you can do without ceremony.

          A can of canned food on the festive table. It is supposed to put the contents of the jar on a special plate or in a salad bowl, but ... it will do just fine, doesn't it ?! Everything is absolutely, the advantages of the social environment and its disadvantages are manifested in such little things! A scene from the film "The Irony of Fate ..."

          Here I do not understand nichrome.
          1. bubalik
            bubalik 16 February 2021 06: 38
            +14
            The author gave an example:
            You can take a girl out of a village, but never a village from a girl.
            This is his attitude towards the villagers.
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 06: 46
              +3
              Quote: bubalik
              The author gave an example:
              You can take a girl out of a village, but never a village from a girl.
              This is his attitude towards the villagers.

              The author himself does not know how to cook, but teaches others how to organize a table? NOT GOOD. negative
              1. Gardamir
                Gardamir 16 February 2021 08: 00
                0
                The author himself doesn't know how to cook, but teaches others how to organize a table?
                The author suffered under Soviet rule, and now he shares his suffering.
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 08: 07
                  +1
                  Quote: Gardamir
                  The author suffered under Soviet rule, and now he shares his suffering.

                  The main thing is to hold the fork and spoon correctly!
                2. Aviator_
                  Aviator_ 16 February 2021 08: 18
                  +5
                  The author suffered under Soviet rule, and now he shares his suffering.

                  Well, who would have doubted. For the author, a peasant is a savage.
          2. Far B
            Far B 16 February 2021 06: 40
            -1
            I didn't understand nichrome
            There is no in you because there is no blue blood, no white bone. In short, you lack noble ambition and arrogance, unlike the author.
            PySy. And as for me, the sprats from the can always seemed tastier)))
          3. Korsar4
            Korsar4 16 February 2021 06: 43
            +5
            I understand something like this.
            What is etiquette: convenient and beautiful.
            Only the way of life in each family is different.
            It depends on the possibilities. And needs.
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 16 February 2021 07: 10
              +7
              Quote: Korsar4
              I understand something like this.
              What is etiquette: convenient and beautiful.
              Only the way of life in each family is different.
              It depends on the possibilities. And needs.

              And traditions. I eat hummus exclusively by raking it with my hand with pieces of flatbread laughing
              1. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 16 February 2021 07: 23
                +9
                What a lack of spirituality!
                1. sergo1914
                  sergo1914 16 February 2021 07: 40
                  +3
                  Quote: 3x3zsave
                  What a lack of spirituality!


                  Exactly. Everything is spiritless like theirs. Where are the fasteners ???
                  1. vladcub
                    vladcub 16 February 2021 12: 22
                    0
                    You can't do without clamps. It's like a barrel without hoops
                2. Krasnodar
                  Krasnodar 16 February 2021 07: 55
                  +7
                  So the Romans slaughtered the Jewish aristocracy laughing
                  1. 3x3zsave
                    3x3zsave 16 February 2021 08: 16
                    +7
                    No, Albert!
                    "An unpicked ticket doesn't work for an excuse!"
                    1. Krasnodar
                      Krasnodar 16 February 2021 11: 43
                      +3
                      I thought the cut ticket was enough request
                      1. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 19: 43
                        +2
                        Don't you know this anecdote?
                      2. Krasnodar
                        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 20: 31
                        +1
                        No way soldier request Weiss nicht
                      3. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 20: 44
                        +3
                        Come on!
                        "The end of the seventies. Peter. The Soviet hippar got a job to avoid criminal liability for parasitism. He got a job as a conductor. He walks on the tram and broadcasts:
                        - Peeply run tickets. Check tickets! If the ticket is prokotsan, then there is a cool excuse. If there is no ticket, then there will be a rotten bazaar. People, varning! An unpicked ticket doesn't work for an excuse! "
                      4. Krasnodar
                        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 21: 06
                        +3
                        Quite a St. Petersburg anecdote good
                      5. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 21: 14
                        +3
                        Duc, Ely-Pali! Or am I not a St. Petersburg miserable?
                      6. Phil77
                        Phil77 16 February 2021 21: 19
                        +3
                        Hi Anton! Paaazvolte. This anecdote took place in Moscow too. wink
                      7. 3x3zsave
                        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 21: 30
                        +3
                        Sergei, I'm having a little fun, no offense ...
                        "And there were hippans in the village too,
                        But all for a long time, alas, were taken away "(C)
                    2. Fat
                      Fat 17 February 2021 00: 16
                      +3
                      Quote: 3x3zsave
                      Duc, Ely-Pali! Or am I not a St. Petersburg miserable?

                      Nope. Minnesinger ... Petersburg wassat
                    3. Pane Kohanku
                      Pane Kohanku 17 February 2021 14: 48
                      +3
                      Nope. Minnesinger ... Petersburg

                      Yeah, exactly - he is a virtuoso lute player, and at the same time also Caravaggio in one bottle. drinks
                      - Blackmore, uncover your balalaika! ("The Lord of the Rings", 3rd part, translation of the Goblin). laughing
    2. vladcub
      vladcub 16 February 2021 12: 24
      +3
      Quote: Krasnodar
      So the Romans slaughtered the Jewish aristocracy laughing

      Is it weak to grow a new one?
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 13: 05
        +4
        Quote: vladcub
        Quote: Krasnodar
        So the Romans slaughtered the Jewish aristocracy laughing

        Is it weak to grow a new one?

        And the fig? laughing
        1. vladcub
          vladcub 16 February 2021 13: 10
          +2
          How can you do without it? Whatever it is called, but it is present everywhere
        2. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 16 February 2021 20: 37
          +3
          The elite among the Jews are:
          Pilots, special forces, doctors, scientists, IT specialists, university professors, big businessmen, some reputable and popular rabbis.
          All people are brothers, just everyone has different abilities. hi
          Inherited position and status sucks. By definition, aristocracy should not exist!
        3. 3x3zsave
          3x3zsave 16 February 2021 20: 59
          +6
          Aristocracy should not be by definition!
          A good call, however, in Israel throughout its short history, the military aristocracy rules. Early feudalism of a new formation?
        4. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 16 February 2021 21: 10
          +3
          What does she rule there, Anton? laughing
          It is clear that the rank of general in such a militarized country provides you with popularity and a piece of bread and butter (in addition to a good pension), but:
          There is no continuity;
          Like the authorities
        5. 3x3zsave
          3x3zsave 16 February 2021 21: 53
          +6
          There is no continuity;
          Like the authorities

          There is a tear in my voice ...
        6. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 17 February 2021 09: 53
          +3
          Dripping sparingly down an unshaven cheek laughing
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 16 February 2021 07: 55
    +5
    How? How to eat it correctly?
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 16 February 2021 07: 23
    +4
    Good product for fasting.
    How to eat it correctly?
    Is it kosher enough for everyone?
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 16 February 2021 07: 58
      +9
      Kosher for Jews, if the chickpea grows full, which is allowed to rest once every seven years. Before processing, inspect for the presence of insect larvae, etc.
      To consume correctly - add a bit of Extra Virgin olive oil to the finished paste. You can add pine nuts to a bowl of hummus. Delicious with tomatoes.
      It is fashionable to spread on sour black bread.
      Best consumed in lavash chunks - scooping hummus from a plate with them good
      1. Korsar4
        Korsar4 16 February 2021 08: 00
        +6
        How everything is thought out. Just the foundation for sustainable use.
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 16 February 2021 08: 02
          +7
          The main thing is not to overdo it with cakes))
          1. Korsar4
            Korsar4 16 February 2021 08: 11
            +7
            For a healthy working body, the amount of food is not a problem.
          2. vladcub
            vladcub 16 February 2021 12: 16
            +2
            And without cakes, it's also lousy
          3. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar 16 February 2021 13: 06
            +3
            Without bread - no, no way
    2. 3x3zsave
      3x3zsave 16 February 2021 08: 09
      +6
      It goes well with a shaverma too.
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 08: 14
        +6
        Quote: 3x3zsave
        It goes well with a shaverma too.

        Great - plus add salad and chips to pita bread - yummy good
        Quote: Korsar4
        For a healthy working body, the amount of food is not a problem.

        The issue is the amount of food and the loss of calories from work. laughing But to the Orthodox post - the most tsimes. Meat can be replaced with baked eggplant
        1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
          Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 22: 14
          +3
          Quote: Krasnodar
          The issue is the amount of food and the loss of calories from work. But to the Orthodox post - the most tsimes. Meat can be replaced with baked eggplant


          Or replace it with Ural dumplings! laughing
    3. Moskovit
      Moskovit 16 February 2021 09: 42
      +9
      And here's a recipe: you take paternalistic black Russian bread, toast it in a toaster, then you smear a thick layer of hummus, which, by the way, is produced here, so it is free from imperialistic and Zionist influences. Hummus must be transferred from the jar, well, the kid knows that, especially those born in the 2000s. Then you put the product on top, which brought us a high-tech eastern state, which many generations ago (at least more than three) got rid of the heavy legacy of the past - pickled ginger. Take this sandwich and slowly eat it, dreaming of the spiritual realms
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 10: 09
        +6
        This is an Arabic dish, which is made here by "Russian Israelis" laughing It's just popular in the lair of the Zionists
    4. vladcub
      vladcub 16 February 2021 12: 19
      +5
      And if I like sunflower or corn oil, what then?
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 12: 22
        +5
        Corn - absolutely nothing, sunflower - spoil the taste
  • BAI
    BAI 16 February 2021 13: 30
    +6
    In theory, it should be like this:
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 22: 19
      +5
      Almost commercials!
  • vladcub
    vladcub 16 February 2021 12: 26
    +5
    "sprat in a tomato world run" (c)
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 17 February 2021 13: 11
      +3
      Quote: vladcub
      "sprat in a tomato world run" (c)

      Hello namesake!
      The first half of the ecumene, having read your comment, shuddered, the second half licked its lips dreamily!
      On weekends, we stay with the cat on the farm together. Let's study the "sprat" command! good
  • Kote Pan Kokhanka
    Kote Pan Kokhanka 16 February 2021 22: 11
    +6
    Quote: Korsar4
    And we have already talked about sprats. In the current version, sprat in tomato sauce is better

    So what, what kind of a mass grave or a cattle carrier from my cadet youth.
    The yellow grooves (buses) were also called cattle breeders. Legend has it that the driver in winter had the choice to direct warm air into the cabin or into his cabin. Naturally, he chose the second option.
    By the way, I confess, alone from my family, I can afford to buy a can of gobies or sprat in tomato and wrap it up with instant noodles! True, you can't yawn here, Sonya (a cat) is not indifferent to bulls in a tomato. The only thing for which he can climb on the table and, like a real "peasant", take out the whole can with the sound of a small jet engine. Moreover, the lip is not stupid in the case of buying two cans, it tries to crawl into mine with a mustachioed muzzle in order to sweep both into your stomach! She understands the dream of a moth that it’s dumb for me to pop it off the floor.
    1. vladcub
      vladcub 18 February 2021 07: 58
      +2
      When I was a child, I didn’t try sprat .. They brought it to the village, only in tomato sauce, but I became an adult and kept silent. I took Estonian, Pacific and: "a la Stirlitz'-Portuguese. But I didn’t get hooked. From time to time I take it in a tomato, but my relatives do not share my passion and now I rarely have high-quality canned food.
      1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka 18 February 2021 08: 24
        +1
        Quote: vladcub
        From time to time I take it in a tomato, but my relatives do not share my passion and now I rarely have high-quality canned food

        Comrade get a cat! For a couple, any confectionery in a tomato leaves more fun! Tested empirically. Today my wife got it on my ears that the cat smells like sprat again!
        1. vladcub
          vladcub 18 February 2021 17: 26
          +1
          With such a wife it is difficult: she instantly learns alcohol or another.
          I had a girlfriend "tumbled" with her. Like your bloodhound, sniffing when she comes home. If the accounting is suspicious and begins to look closely
  • A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 16 February 2021 06: 40
    +14
    Quote: Mordvin 3
    But I don’t understand, but what, a can of sprats cannot be put on the table, must it be put on a plate?

    Sprats are a bad example. The original source was about a jar of cucumbers. They should definitely be laid out, since the head does not fit into the jar. hi
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 07: 02
      +7
      Quote: A. Privalov
      They should definitely be laid out, since the head does not fit into the jar.

      What disgusting this your aspic fish is ... Your head will fit into a salad, and what else would you like to attach cucumbers on your face, no, thank you. Let them be in the bank.
      1. A. Privalov
        A. Privalov 16 February 2021 13: 39
        +7
        Quote: Mordvin 3
        The head will fit into the salad Olivier, and that would also attach cucumbers on the face, no, thank you. Let them be in the bank.

        This idea is supported and shared by your followers and supporters. It is enough to look at the number of cons on my previous comment!

        Congratulations, you are the real leader of the masses! hi
        1. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 18: 34
          0
          So what? were there any downsides? Major Golovanov, with your point of view on the conservation product. I agree, I called - so it is .... Academy, grow up, Chemical protection (!)
          Their fairy tales ...
          Why does Colonel Korobets not eat pickled cucumber? (C)
      2. Ruslan67
        Ruslan67 17 February 2021 03: 41
        +1
        Quote: Mordvin 3
        ... The head will fit into the salad Olivier, and that would also attach cucumbers on the face, no, thank you.

        Fu how lano! stop I put my face in jellied meat and rest culturally wassat
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 03: 46
          +1
          Quote: Ruslan67
          Fu how lano! I put my face in jellied meat and rest culturally

          I'm nasty now. Yesterday I got drunk, I ate one and a half bottles of moonshine, plus I polished two hundred grams of awl, I'm suffering right now ... crying
          1. Ruslan67
            Ruslan67 17 February 2021 03: 48
            +2
            Quote: Mordvin 3
            Yesterday I got drunk, ate one and a half bottles of moonshine,

            I myself have been on duty since Friday sad Already heartburn and the reasons do not end
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 03: 50
              +2
              Quote: Ruslan67
              and the reasons don't end

              But for this you have to drink! laughing Right now I'll look at the bottom of the barrel, where it should be a hundred grams. drinks
              1. Ruslan67
                Ruslan67 17 February 2021 04: 14
                +2
                Quote: Mordvin 3
                But for this you have to drink!

                Flayer-entertainer sad laughing
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 04: 18
                  +1
                  Quote: Ruslan67
                  Flayer-entertainer

                  No, I love birds.
                  1. Ruslan67
                    Ruslan67 17 February 2021 04: 21
                    +2
                    I also yes Fried .....
        2. Fat
          Fat 18 February 2021 18: 41
          +1
          Aspic is not given to every mistress stop
          And Olivier is available and wide-plate ...
  • Hantengri
    Hantengri 16 February 2021 08: 30
    +10
    Quote: Mordvin 3
    But I don’t understand, but what, a can of sprats cannot be put on the table, must it be put on a plate?

    If you depict cultures-cultures, then yes - be sure to put on a plate, and also decorate with green stuff, there, with lemon ... And take food by all means holding a knife in your right hand, and vetch in your left (the main thing is not to confuse! laughing ) And if there are no reasons to portray cultures-cultures, then you can directly from the bank and with your hands!
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 08: 48
      +3
      Quote: HanTengri
      And if there are no reasons to portray cultures-cultures, then you can directly from the can and with your hands!

      Once we bought a bottle and a can of sprat for a snack. Not a knife, nothing ... Canned food was opened on the asphalt, forks were ripped up in the bushes ... Culture!
      1. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave 16 February 2021 09: 21
        +10
        How much fuss around one bottle! Three butterscotch is enough!
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 09: 25
          +2
          Quote: 3x3zsave
          How much fuss around one bottle! Three butterscotch is enough!

          Yeah, as they walked, we see such a picture, three men sit at the hemp, there is a liter of moonshine and three cherries. One pulled half a glass, reached for the cherry, the other bang his hand: Don't touch it, what will we eat later? "
          1. 3x3zsave
            3x3zsave 16 February 2021 09: 28
            +7
            No, well, if a liter, then in my opinion, three is not enough. But it all depends on experience!
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 09: 47
              +2
              Quote: 3x3zsave
              No, well, if a liter, then in my opinion, three is not enough.

              Moreover, they were also green. laughing
              1. 3x3zsave
                3x3zsave 16 February 2021 10: 10
                +9
                Moonshine "sly" - generally offset!
                1. Catfish
                  Catfish 16 February 2021 18: 14
                  +4
                  Anyone can, except for treacle - out! I thought it was impossible to scare me after "Solntsedar", how naive I was in my forty years ...
                  1. Mordvin 3
                    Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 01: 02
                    +2
                    Quote: Sea Cat
                    I thought that after "Solntsedar"

                    By the way, we went to the state farm for apples, where they sold apple wine for two rubles, nothing at all. And the beer there was generally fucking. 22 kopecks - light, 24 - dark ...
            2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
              Kote Pan Kokhanka 18 February 2021 08: 18
              +2
              Well, yes - a club of interests !!! good laughing drinks
              So what is next!



              laughing
              And who am I friends with ... request
              1. Fat
                Fat 18 February 2021 18: 53
                +1
                Norm! decent people! The first time "thundered" in the 95th, the entrance (sorry) did not guess! No, we didn't drink! They ate Canadian bourbon in three throats, escorting the drink to the archive of life ...
                All disgusting, but did not hang too much. They didn't even get fined, which is generally surprising ...
                And everyone is talking about cops, but they have a difficult task - to protect us, gouges, from really serious troubles.
                Huge respect!
      2. Fat
        Fat 17 February 2021 00: 56
        +3
        One! One is enough and not toffee, but candy - a soy bar. Three butterscotch is bad taste. Disrespect for the sanitary completeness of the drinking buddy
    2. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 16 February 2021 09: 29
      +1
      Quote: HanTengri
      If you depict cultures-cultures, then yes - be sure to put it on a plate, and decorate it with green stuff, there, with a lemon.
      I'm all worried, but what about saury, what about saury? Throw the soup with the can too? tongue
      1. Hantengri
        Hantengri 16 February 2021 09: 45
        +10
        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        I'm all worried, but what about saury, what about saury? Throw the soup with the can too?

        Don't throw Sarah into the soup. This is anti-Semitis.
        1. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 16 February 2021 10: 01
          +1
          Quote: HanTengri
          Don't throw Sarah into the soup
          Well, Moira is also non-kosher, oh wey! laughing
          1. Hantengri
            Hantengri 16 February 2021 10: 21
            +7
            No, Moira can be, she is Greek! Oh, very kosher! After all, as Jesus said, in the Bhagavad Gita: "Only a true sage who has attained Krishna consciousness can enjoy the bitter concoction from his Destiny ..." laughing
            1. Vladimir_2U
              Vladimir_2U 16 February 2021 10: 23
              +1
              Quote: HanTengri
              No, Moira can be, she is Greek!
              Live and learn! And I, out of the simplicity of my soul, sparklingly joked about saury and Moira and halal, Shame on me! laughing
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 12: 16
                +1
                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                And I, out of the simplicity of my soul, sparklingly joked about saury and Moira and halal, Shame on me!

                And on the Sea of ​​Okhotsk, radios were howling in earnest in the 70s: "No fish, only cod!"
            2. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 16 February 2021 11: 56
              +4
              Quote: HanTengri
              No, Moira can be, she is Greek! Oh, very kosher! After all, as Jesus said, in the Bhagavad Gita: "Only a true sage who has attained Krishna consciousness can enjoy the bitter concoction from his Destiny ..." laughing

              As Engels said in the Kamasutra:
              any deed for the glory of Dharma, Artha and Kama is good, together and separately, but not one that, contributing to one side of life, interferes with the fulfillment of the other two
          2. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar 16 February 2021 11: 50
            +4
            Quote: Vladimir_2U
            Quote: HanTengri
            Don't throw Sarah into the soup
            Well, Moira is also non-kosher, oh wey! laughing

            Why not kosher? laughing Any Fish with scales and fins is considered kosher and is usable by every Ultra-Orthodox.

            A yeshiva student sees a rabbi from the street eating a boar's knee with gusto in a German restaurant. Runs into the establishment:
            - Rebbe, this is pork!
            - And I eat something and think: what a delicious fish ..
        2. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 16 February 2021 11: 44
          +4
          Quote: HanTengri
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          I'm all worried, but what about saury, what about saury? Throw the soup with the can too?

          Don't throw Sarah into the soup. This is anti-Semitis.

          Even if she's Sarah Connor? laughing
          1. Hantengri
            Hantengri 16 February 2021 12: 26
            +5
            Quote: Krasnodar
            Even if she's Sarah Connor?

            Still, I don't understand, are you for Homo Sapiens, or for Skynet?
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 12: 54
              0
              Quote: HanTengri
              Still, I don't understand, are you for Homo Sapiens, or for Skynet?

              He's against Sarah Connor. And you can't trample after all ...
            2. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 16 February 2021 13: 05
              +3
              Taki for Genesis fellow
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 13: 31
                +1
                Quote: Krasnodar
                for Genesis

                Og. laughing
          2. Fat
            Fat 18 February 2021 19: 03
            +1
            Oh Albert. "You need to know when to stop."
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 18 February 2021 19: 05
              0
              Shaw, too expensive a coffin? what
    3. Korsar4
      Korsar4 16 February 2021 20: 09
      +3
      I like to eat with a spoon. Fit more. The wife is trying to criticize.
      1. Phil77
        Phil77 17 February 2021 06: 59
        +1
        Hi Sergey! The same story. 5 more from the time of the army remained! I fought, fought with it, then spat and left it as it is. But this certainly applies only at home. And so ... conventions. Etiquette, sir. laughing
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 17 February 2021 07: 17
          +3
          Hello Seryozha!
          Since childhood it is.
          You can go out with chopsticks or a toothpick ..

          By the way, it is no coincidence that tourists and climbers take KLM with them - a mug, a spoon, a bowl.
          1. Phil77
            Phil77 17 February 2021 08: 26
            +2

            This spoon is more than fifty years old, I ate it as a child. Now I use it for its intended purpose at work, when I don't want to go to the cafeteria. The price was fifty cents.
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 17 February 2021 08: 39
              +2
              I caught myself thinking that in this case, size and shape matter.
              1. Phil77
                Phil77 17 February 2021 13: 39
                +2
                It is medium in size, somewhere between a table and a teaspoon.
                1. Fat
                  Fat 18 February 2021 19: 08
                  +1
                  Dessert option "Unacceptable! Nasty things should be consumed full, dining room!"
                  1. Korsar4
                    Korsar4 19 February 2021 05: 45
                    +2
                    The mouth is not only happy with a large piece.
      2. Fat
        Fat 19 February 2021 00: 04
        +1
        wife the same. You will find points for mutual understanding .... But honestly, how to eat spaghetti? Mm horns (pasta) with a spoon is logical. and these are long pieces?
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 19 February 2021 05: 47
          +2
          If there was something to reel, we would reel.
  • Anatole Klim
    Anatole Klim 16 February 2021 08: 42
    +5
    Quote: Mordvin 3
    But I don’t understand, but what, a can of sprats cannot be put on the table, must it be put on a plate?

    I remembered either a reality or a fiction, when the last Russian emperor received the French ambassador at the court, the nimble Russian merchant Shustov offered him a glass of cognac of his own production. Nicholas II loved Russian vodka, he did not use cognac, but could not refuse, after all, the French ambassador, where the cognac is the national drink, and the cognac was Russian, having drunk a glass of the emperor, in order to hide his grimace of disgust, he ate a slice of lemon. After that, the entire court nobility began to use cognac exclusively with lemon, although in the West this is considered bad manners, since citrus fruits kill the taste and aroma of the drink. In Soviet times, cognac was also eaten with lemon. When I served, there was a colleague's birthday at the exercises, the vodka ran out, there were a couple of bottles of brandy left, what should I eat? no lemon, no cheese, no chocolate either. The cognac was drunk under lard and stew, went well, no one had any complexes. drinks hi
    1. Pane Kohanku
      Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 11: 35
      +5
      then the agile Russian merchant Shustov offered him a glass of cognac of his own production

      Anatoly, hello! drinks There is a legend that the cunning Shustov conducted "aggressive intricate advertising" of his products.
      One example of guerrilla marketing was the case of Nikolai Shustov and his cognac at the beginning of the XNUMXth century. For little money, Nikolai Leontyevich hired actors, whom he expensively dressed in elite clothes and ordered to do the following.
      They came to large establishments in Moscow, made a large order of expensive dishes. When the dishes were served, the actor loudly, so that everyone in the hall could hear, called the waiter and demanded to serve them Shustov's cognac.
      Estessno there was no such cognac in the assortment and our actor did not accept any alternatives, without skimping on evaluative statements about other brands. In anger, without touching the food, he threw money for the dishes on the table and, under the gaze of all those present, made it out of the institution. Imagine what the conversations between the visitors of the establishment were about that evening, not to mention the fact that the owner of the establishment found out about such a client.
      Such situations occurred in all large establishments during the week. Well, at the end of the week, Nikolai Leontyevich already had a list of supply contracts.

      What is Figaro! laughing drinks
      after drinking a glass, the emperor, in order to hide his grimace of disgust, ate a slice of lemon

      Lemon, sprinkled with coffee and sugar, and served with cognac, used to be called "nikolashka" in some circles. But this is also a legend. With respect, Nicholai drinks
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar 16 February 2021 12: 07
        +3
        Greetings, Nikolay! hi Cognac I advise you to eat tiramisu. Or a pork-flavored doshirak to sponsor a bullet aimed at the heart of the Juche leader Eun, who probably drinks cognacs behind our backs by the proletarian intelligentsia, which we cannot afford am
        1. Pane Kohanku
          Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 12: 17
          +3
          Greetings, Nikolay!

          Albert, hello! drinks
          Cognac I advise you to eat tiramisu.

          You talk too fancy, my patterning mind does not know how to furnish the magic of a snack with such chic. wink But I sketched it! good
          And count how the courtiers of Heliogabalus ate - nightingale tongues in half with pearls. The guests broke their teeth, some even gagged, but ate together. laughing
          who probably drinks cognacs behind our backs of the proletarian intelligentsia, which we cannot afford

          I read somewhere that there are rumors (from sources already shot) that he also loves cheese very much. Moreover, some expensive varieties. That's why it's so round. drinks
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar 16 February 2021 13: 07
            +2
            You can also bite with the nipples of a she-wolf - Rome laughing
            1. Pane Kohanku
              Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 13: 18
              +3
              You can also bite with the nipples of a she-wolf - Rome

              By that time, all the wolves were already exhausted there, go, on the capes for the signifer-bearers. wink
      2. Anatole Klim
        Anatole Klim 16 February 2021 12: 13
        +2
        Quote: Pane Kohanku
        For little money, Nikolai Leontyevich hired actors, whom he expensively dressed in elite clothes and ordered to do the following.

        Good day! Nikolay.
        You will probably laugh now, but such stories are not uncommon. As an example, I will give a story about the Kuvaka mineral water from the Penza province, which was popular in many cities of Tsarist Russia and was sold in the best restaurants in Paris.

        At the same time, Voeikov, a noble prince and a calculating merchant at the same time, launched an advertising campaign in the largest publications and reference books of that time. The main thing in the advertisement were numerous assurances of the usefulness and high healing properties of the new drinking water.
        Not relying on advertising alone, Voeikov himself contributes to the promotion of his goods as much as he can. In October 1913 - for the 300th anniversary of the Romanov dynasty - he erects in the center of the village of Kamenka a monument to the "Tsar-Liberator" Alexander II, to the opening of which he invites the Penza governor and the entire provincial nobility. And soon the Kuvaka mineral water begins to be supplied to all railway stations, first in the Penza province, and then throughout the Russian Empire. At the same time, he devises an ingenious plan for promoting the water abroad. Voeikov goes to Paris, where he goes to the most prestigious restaurants, orders the most expensive dishes for 50 people and loudly asks for the healing water "Kuvaka". When the French, in bewilderment, answered that they did not have such water, Voeikov loudly refused the order and indignantly left the restaurant. The reception worked, French restaurateurs began to order Kuwaku from Russia. The Count was greatly assisted in this matter by the President of France, Raymond Poincaré, a great admirer of Kuwakin water.
        If interested, read in full here: https://little-histories.org/2017/08/01/kuvaka/
        1. Pane Kohanku
          Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 12: 51
          +4
          The reception worked, French restaurateurs began to order Kuwaku from Russia.

          Ahaha, too sly! good
          I heard about him. IN. Shpakovsky at one time published an article - "General from Kuvakeriya". drinks https://topwar.ru/140644-postradavshie-za-veru-general-ot-kuvakerii-chast-vtoraya.html
      3. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 13: 06
        0
        Quote: Pane Kohanku
        Well, at the end of the week, Nikolai Leontyevich already had a list of supply contracts.

        What a portrait, what a landscape! laughing Once I read how the merchant received an order from the imperial court for sweets, got drunk, and sowed a bag. So he walked with a hangover, grieving quietly, and then the girls from Smolny. Kupchina turned out his pockets, here girls, eat! The girls liked the candy, and they also ordered him. Pads or something.
        1. Pane Kohanku
          Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 13: 14
          +3
          Once I read how the merchant received an order from the imperial court for sweets, got drunk, and sowed a bag.

          Vladimir, welcome! He simply did not have a codpiece, like the character of your favorite Bruegel painting. drinks It would be possible to hide sweets there - not a single girl would get it just like that. wink
          About candy, I remembered the notes of the first teacher Pavel Petrovich, Semyon Poroshin. Like, at some court masquerade, the little Tsarevich liked the performer of some role, and in the evening he ordered "send him some candy"... Nicely! good Poroshin sincerely loved the boy, and wrote everything down by day ... yes
          1. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 13: 25
            0
            Quote: Pane Kohanku
            Poroshin sincerely loved the boy, and wrote everything down by day ..

            Nevertheless, he did not give him any book. From whom only Pasha did not ask her. Even Suvorov, as they say. Catherine forbade. Don't remind me, Radishchev, or what?
            1. Pane Kohanku
              Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 13: 45
              +4
              Don't remind me, Radishchev, or what?

              "Hamlet", Vladimir. These are all legends. It is necessary to look at the sources, one way or another, although there are a lot of legends.
              Even Suvorov, as they say.

              Sergei Grigoriev describes this scene in his novel "Suvorov". I think many have read it. And then Alexander Vasilyevich made fun of him, a virtuoso joker ... laughing No, in this case I am not making any excuses for Paul! stop
              Nevertheless, he did not give him some book.

              And Poroshin could not give it. He taught the Tsarevich when he was still small.
    2. Bolt cutter
      Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 12: 15
      +6
      in the west, this is considered bad manners, since citrus fruits kill taste and aroma
      Frankly, I drank the collectible Hennessy from my throat and ate it with green onions. Please understand and forgive sad .
      1. Pane Kohanku
        Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 12: 53
        +3
        Please understand and forgive

        The main thing is that the onions are on the plate, and not in the jar! wink Personally, I - "we understand and approve"! drinks
        1. Bolt cutter
          Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 12: 55
          +3
          And then I gave a wave - the onion lay on the table. Even without the tablecloth! And a pile of salt lay right on the table to dip onions drinks ... Hanging shot shines belay
          1. Pane Kohanku
            Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 13: 05
            +3
            And then I gave a wave - the onion lay on the table. Even without the tablecloth! And a pile of salt lay right on the table to dip onions

            Pane kokhanku, as a potential preacher (in my room), I will say - it is not your fault, but grace from above. yes For who could resist such a yummy ?! request
            And a pile of salt lay right on the table, so that the onions could be dipped

            "Who can eat it without salt and without onions
            He will be strong, brave, kind, like Cook! "
            drinks
            1. Bolt cutter
              Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 13: 11
              +2
              In my defense, I also consider it necessary to say that it was free, that is, for free. This circumstance ideally set off the unique bouquet of the drink and significantly improved the aftertaste. drinks ... I look forward to leniency and amnesty wassat
              1. Pane Kohanku
                Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 13: 22
                +2
                In my defense, I also consider it necessary to say that it was free, that is, for free. This circumstance ideally set off the unique bouquet of the drink and significantly improved the aftertaste.

                Here you have to call the art critic Anton 3x3zsave ... And drag another liter ... As an experiment. laughing
                I look forward to leniency and amnesty

                After three penalty glasses! drinks
                1. Bolt cutter
                  Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 13: 28
                  +2
                  And drag another liter
                  Where am I him itswill I get it? Although the experiment is probably superfluous, the freebie factor has the ability to radically improve the organoleptic qualities of almost all substances known to science - even acetic acid in a 9% solution. drinks
                  After three free throws!
                  Shooting so shooting. You will collect a top three, even for decency - otherwise your wife will submit to the ECHR yes
                  1. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 14: 08
                    +5
                    You will collect a top three, even for decency - otherwise your wife will submit to the ECHR

                    We will collect another two for you. good And after the "meeting of the troika with execution for three" - will she arrange lynching over you and disperse the troika? wink drinks
                  2. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 14: 12
                    +3
                    after the "meeting of the troika with execution for three"
                    He will join as a witness for the prosecution, and then (when the cognac dematerializes) he pushes everyone into a taxi. drinks good
                  3. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 14: 59
                    +2
                    He will join as a witness for the prosecution, and then (when the cognac dematerializes) he pushes everyone into a taxi.

                    Yes, such a woman should be given flowers every day! love However, I bow to your wife, and I am very happy for you personally! drinks
                  4. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 15: 03
                    +3
                    Yes, such a woman should be given flowers every day!
                    I will definitely tell her! yes There are women in the Burgundian villages! wink
                  5. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 15: 13
                    +2
                    There are women in the Burgundian villages!

                    That is, "Hennessy" should be eaten with onions from the green fields of Burgundy? drinks
                  6. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 15: 16
                    +2
                    More likely than not, but if Burgundy is far away - Egyptian from TESCO yes will do too. Again, historical heritage - pharaohs and pyramids drinks
                  7. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 15: 27
                    +3
                    Again, historical heritage - pharaohs and pyramids

                    That is, if the Egyptian sand (from onions) accidentally crunches on the teeth - let's call it "a light touch of history." With a slight pharaoh aftertaste. yes drinks
                  8. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 15: 34
                    +2
                    It must be washed well - so that there are no illegal immigrants am
                    http://www.jasonsteelwildlifephotography.yolasite.com/uk-scorpions.php
                  9. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 15: 37
                    +4
                    It must be washed well - so that there are no illegal immigrants

                    Stunned! And what can arrive in consignments?
                    I have heard only about three such "travelers" - about rapa, Chinese crab and sleeper, which perfectly mastered the muddy ponds in St. Petersburg.
                  10. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 15: 50
                    +3
                    Britain is clearly more attractive to immigrants
                    they were even going to catch them here. There are also illegal immigrants from Australia.
                    https://getoutside.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/guides/unexpected-wild-animals-in-britain-%E2%80%93-part-1/А про лягушек в цветах и жуков во фруктах довольно часто пишут. Я как-то дохлого жука в свежей фасоли нашел. А знакомый рассказывал(он на базе работал)- из каких-то цветов вылез здоровый желто-красный паук- вероятно ядовитый и явно недружелюбный. Все его шугались пока негр-грузчик его ботнком не раздавил.
                  11. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 16: 11
                    +2
                    There are also illegal immigrants from Australia.

                    Stunned! A lady on her private island raised a kangaroo? belay
                    Sorry, translated from Google:
                    You can find red-headed wallaby living in the wild on a small island in the center of Loch Lomond. They were deliberately introduced by the previous owner Lady Arran Kolkuhun in the 1920s and have successfully lived there ever since.
                    Wallabies can be found elsewhere, with a small colony on the Isle of Man (descended from a couple who escaped from a local wildlife park) and have occasionally been seen in Ashdown Forest, Norfolk, Buckinghamshire and Peak District.

                    Interestingly, it turns out that English grass is quite edible for them? request
                    It's funny that the English word for chipmunk is "Siberian chipmunk". Straight leavened pride takes! laughing drinks
                    There will be material on St. Kilda - let me read it. An interesting island as a phenomenon in the Outer Hebrides ...what It looks like excursions there are rare and private.
                    I think you have many common themes with Sergei-Korsar4. But he is more of an arch-specialist in botany. And with Albert-Krasnodar - he is just a connoisseur-connoisseur of a wide profile. I bow to you! drinks
                  12. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 16: 17
                    +2
                    English grass is quite edible for them
                    Sheep and cows are doing great. Even squirrels in South England - immigrants from America (gray) - by the way, about immigration - they crowd out the local European species)
                  13. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 16: 20
                    +4
                    by the way, about immigration - they are replacing the local European species

                    Apparently, like any invasive species, they turned out to be more arrogant and prolific ... request
                  14. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 16: 34
                    +3
                    they turned out to be more arrogant
                    They carry nuts straight from their hands.
                    he is more of an arch-specialist in botany.
                    Him to the Isle of Man.
                  15. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 16: 55
                    +5
                    They carry nuts straight from their hands.

                    Only in our parks does this flourish. Choosy! laughing Seeds are not taken, nuts are not all. stop But in the parks they have freedom. There are many feeders. Here, last April:

                    Him to the Isle of Man.

                    Corsair4 - note! drinks
                  16. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 16: 59
                    +3
                    Seeds are not taken
                    Do not gop-disdain smile ... English squirrels and chips are minced at once.
                  17. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 17: 04
                    +3
                    English squirrels and chips are minced at once.

                    The best fish and chips ate in an Irish pub in Kingisepp - ex. Yam, Yamburg. Although in England, this dish is probably prepared differently ... drinks
                  18. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 17: 13
                    +2
                    Originally invented by the Jews of East London (working-class districts), the dish (in the days when meat was expensive and fish that did not know supertrawlers were cheap and plentiful) is now prepared and sold almost exclusively by colored immigrants. The key to success is good fish and oil change more often than once a year yes Esto it follows where the fish are caught, in Hastings, very nothing. Watch out - air attacks will lead to a nervous shock - cormorants have learned to dive vertically on those eating this dish and pull out a piece of fish (or pick it up from the ground, where everything flies after the attack). They come from behind / from above, and dive so that they find themselves right in front of the face - the factor of surprise.
                  19. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 17: 22
                    +3
                    They come from behind / from above, and dive so that they find themselves right in front of the face - the factor of surprise.

                    I've heard similar stories about frigates, but they live in Latin America. Like, other birds take food on the fly. I saw them once in the Dominican Republic - beautiful, devils. winked They just take away from birds, not from people. laughing
                    Originally invented by the Jews of East London

                    We must call Krasnodar! He can speak for it!
                    almost exclusively colored immigrants cook and sell

                    That is, in food preferences - a kind of fast food? hi
                    My friends! It is very pleasant when in our cheerful international in the "history" section you discover new good interlocutors! good Have a nice evening everyone. Perhaps I'll come back in two or three hours, or tomorrow. With respect, Nicholai drinks
                  20. Bolt cutter
                    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 21: 28
                    +3
                    That is, in food preferences - a kind of fast food?
                    Exactly. The fish was bought on the market, deep-fried (a tank of oil and a slotted spoon - all the equipment), wrapped along with deep-fried potatoes in yesterday's newspaper (convenient and very cheap) - and sold cheaply (competitors are not asleep) sold to port workers, builders, cleaners - the working class. Meat before industrial farms and feed additives was expensive, and fish — not yet cleaned out by supertrawler fleets — were abundant and cheap. Even now there is an English saying about french fries (chips) - cheap as chips.
                    They say that food is taken away from other birds on the fly.
                    I do not interfere in their feathered affairs. Don't touch my ration! I had a large portion of the cormorant (also with mayonnaise and pickled cucumber, feathered chicken) on the boardwalk in Hastings sad
                    It is very pleasant when in our cheerful international in the "history" section you discover new good interlocutors!
                    I am grateful to you for the opportunity to communicate normally in Russian without stories that soon the Balts and Anglo-Saxons sucking Russian blood will come to a complete end, and before that they will all die of blacks and cold. drinks
                  21. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 17 February 2021 15: 20
                    +3
                    I am grateful to you for the opportunity to communicate normally in Russian without stories that soon the Balts and Anglo-Saxons sucking Russian blood will come to a complete end, and before that they will all die of blacks and cold.

                    Good day! How can I tell you ... Our company has been developing for almost five years, all from different regions and even countries, different nationalities; each with his own cockroaches and views. The main (not voiced by anyone) principles are benevolence, no conflicts and insults. We decide everything peacefully. and with jokes. Somehow we agree with each other ... We ourselves are not leavened patriots, but open Russophobia is not acceptable either ... hi Nice to talk to you! good drinks
                  22. Phil77
                    Phil77 17 February 2021 16: 10
                    +4
                    And we are also able to critically perceive reality, but benevolence, as Nikolai correctly wrote, comes first. hi
                  23. Pane Kohanku
                    Pane Kohanku 17 February 2021 17: 08
                    +4
                    And we are also able to critically perceive reality.

                    So yes, we are usually friends with our heads .. and if suddenly situationally we are not friends, then it’s already Friday, deep evening! laughing drinks
                    Uncle Kostya once posted this picture very justly:
                  24. Phil77
                    Phil77 17 February 2021 19: 28
                    +3
                    Well, who is without sin? You will not sin, you will not repent.
                    laughing
                  25. Korsar4
                    Korsar4 17 February 2021 21: 29
                    +4
                    "- They are fighting for you" (c).

                    Yesterday I reviewed the fragments.
            2. Fat
              Fat 18 February 2021 22: 44
              +1
              Everything is acceptable, Except the chaos. Do not let the Creator in our lands. I won't advise anyone. They will hide and they will not ask the surname. The law is taiga. This is no joke - life is on the line. Nikolai gently meant ... drinks
              And warning is not superfluous
          2. Fat
            Fat 18 February 2021 22: 29
            +1
            You're welcome, Bro! only without surplus .... We don't like poachers. As well as other "overexposure" ... drinks
      2. Fat
        Fat 18 February 2021 22: 00
        +1
        Speaking of sprats? Smoke first, then fry?
        And then already spit ... On flying pigs - seagulls ... Er-Kushen, etit ...
        Alex! I will not reveal any secret. What, like, cormorants are fishermen. Fishermen, but following the flight of a bird, the tribe found a school ... For which they were loved in our country. There are several more species - birds - fishermen ...
        Well, there is no point about a seagull, what - to voice - a Pig.
        Buzzard is important! It is possible to track zander well.
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 17 February 2021 08: 45
    +3
    While the nearest April plans - an island in the east.

    I hope everything will come true.
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 17 February 2021 14: 54
    +2
    While the nearest April plans - an island in the east.

    Bali? wink Odalisque, massage and blue curaçao taken to the sound of bachata? drinks
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 17 February 2021 19: 13
    +3
    Not. Never been. I want to go to Sakhalin again. Last time there was a men's company. Hills, Kuril bamboo, through which old-growth larches had to wade.

    True, there were hot springs too.
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 18 February 2021 09: 44
    +3
    Hills, Kuril bamboo, through which old-growth larches had to wade.

    Beautiful there? By the way, are there bears on Sakhalin?
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 18 February 2021 10: 24
    +2
    How much more.
    A she-bear with cubs ran across the road. But we were in the UAZ.

    Very beautiful.
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 18 February 2021 11: 06
    +3
    Write an article about your feelings from Sakhalin! I think few of us were there.
    A she-bear with cubs ran across the road. But we were in the UAZ.

    And in Kamchatka, people are attacked. There seems to be a large population of bears?
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 18 February 2021 16: 02
    +2
    I have not been to Kamchatka. They say yes.

    Pikul has already re-read "Katorga" with geographic references.

    Vyacheslav Olegovich advertised the museum in Yuzhno-Sakhalinsk.
    And the tunnel in Aleksandrovsk deserves attention.
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 18 February 2021 16: 21
    +3
    Pikul has already re-read "Katorga" with geographic references.

    To "Katorga" captain Tairov surrenders (after the battle) with his squad, after which the prisoners are exterminated by the Japanese.
    In fact, his name was Ilyas-Devlet Dairsky, he was a Crimean Tatar!
    From the article:
    a monument to which grateful fellow countrymen recently donated and helped to erect at the site of the death of the detachment. Born Mirza, that is, a nobleman, he adopted the Christian faith and, after graduating from the Odessa Infantry-Junker School, became a Russian officer.
    .....
    At the end of July, retreating from the village of Petropavlovskoye, the partisans reached the western coast in order to reach the Aleksandrovsky post and join up with the main forces. Having passed a little to the north, the detachment came under fire from the Japanese cruisers, which had landed troops to pursue the partisans. Dairsky led his warriors across the ridge to the valley of the Naiba River. Here, on August 17, part of the detachment fell in battle, and the rest, led by Staff Captain Dairsky, were captured by the Japanese and brutally killed.
    This fact of the inhuman destruction of prisoners was not caused by the military situation. They were dictated by purely political motives. At this time, peace negotiations were already underway between Russia and Japan, and the invaders sought to prove that there were no combat-ready Russian units left on Sakhalin that did not lay down their weapons. Dairsky's detachment did not live to see the signing of the peace treaty for only five days.

    Here is the memorial itself at the site of the death of the detachment:

    2005 article:
    https://sakhalin.info/news/32523
    Vyacheslav Olegovich advertised the museum in Yuzhno-Sakhalinsk.
    And the tunnel in Aleksandrovsk deserves attention.

    There is also a railway museum, I think there will be rare exhibits - before the Sakhalin track was Japanese, and Japanese second-hand diesel locomotives worked on it. drinks
    The "opinions" published an article by Shpakovsky about historical knowledge. I think some of the site's inhabitants will now be busy with their favorite quiz - "Throw some poop at Shpakovsky!" wink
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 18 February 2021 17: 10
    +3
    Most recently, the track was changed to our standards.
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 18 February 2021 17: 23
    +3
    Most recently, the track was changed to our standards.

    Yes, just that recently! And before that there was 1067 mm.
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 18 February 2021 18: 09
    +4
    I even photographed it. There the sleepers were laid, which are capable of carrying three rails.
  • Fat
    Fat 18 February 2021 22: 51
    +2
    Bamboo? is a class!
    disciplines at times!

    Have a nice trip!
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 19 February 2021 05: 42
    +3
    Thank you!
    I'm really looking forward to it.
    I hope everything works out.
  • Bolt cutter
    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 16: 45
    +3
    A lady on her private island raised a kangaroo?
    An Irish man on Lambay Island (4km from Dublin) did the same.

    https://www.thejournal.ie/wallabies-lambay-island-2-3516673-Jul2017/
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 16: 57
    +4
    An Irish man on Lambay Island (4km from Dublin) did the same.

    So the "singing shamrock" is very tasty for a wallaby? yes
  • Bolt cutter
    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 17: 04
    +2
    The pastures in Ireland, the "Emerald Isle", are unique. Butter from grass-fed cows is softer than produced elsewhere and is perfect for spreading on breakfast toast.
    British troops in Northern Ireland called the deployment site "the emerald toilet" wassat
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 17: 05
    +4
    British troops in Northern Ireland called the deployment site "the emerald toilet"

    I mean, oil comes in easily - comes out easily? wink
  • Bolt cutter
    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 17: 15
    +3
    I mean, at the time of The Troubles' "problems" their life there was akin to a substance sent to the toilet.
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 17: 23
    +4
    I mean, at the time of The Troubles' "problems" their life there was akin to a substance sent to the toilet.

    Ahh, I'm sorry. Now I understand. request
  • Bolt cutter
    Bolt cutter 16 February 2021 17: 25
    +2
    Not one pint was drunk with a friend - he served in Belfast at the time. Then he managed to register in Yugoslavia.
  • Fat
    Fat 18 February 2021 23: 03
    +1
    There is no need to attribute poetic delicacy to the military. They called a toilet! and, in part, for the cause - right.
  • Bolt cutter
    Bolt cutter 18 February 2021 23: 43
    +1
    Emerald toilet instead of the common (semi-official) emerald island.
  • Fat
    Fat 18 February 2021 21: 40
    +1
    Unfortunately Rotan, this little black perch-like bastard is not from Egypt ...
    Asian ... in terms of survivability, the champion, maybe he eats horrible cho ...
    A little more and will multiply in the cesspool.
    Not to the point - it is quite edible. So ... we need to think about what we eat instead of pollock ... request
  • Pane Kohanku
    Pane Kohanku 19 February 2021 09: 47
    +1
    black perch-like bastard not from Egypt ...

    Last year I fished in Sergievka (the estate between Peterhof and Lomonosov). The bites are instantaneous (apparently, they had already devoured everyone in the local pond, and now they enjoyed cannibalism). Sucked the hook almost to the ass - I could not pull it out from two. And the meat - yes, normal, I even dried them when I was young.
  • Fat
    Fat 18 February 2021 21: 29
    +1
    In theory, an onion soup ...
  • Korsar4
    Korsar4 17 February 2021 08: 43
    +3
    "For every spouse
    More angrier than any spouse "(c).
  • Fat
    Fat 18 February 2021 21: 18
    +2
    But - but! A liter is already gluttony (a mortal sin). Three liters is enough without polished fines, for "society".
    Trouble, but not otherwise taste drinks
    Interestingly, Hennessy is rolled into standard three-liter bottles? recourse
  • Fat
    Fat 17 February 2021 01: 14
    +3
    This is class, Bro. Although if there is nothing, it is better without a snack at all. This is brandy, not bread wine .... although "starka" is sometimes better than others recourse
  • BAI
    BAI 16 February 2021 13: 21
    +2
    So vodka with cognac is needed not in bottles, but in a decanter. And the fact that the rules of etiquette change over time without any scientific and philosophical substantiation, and according to need (they correspond, so to speak, to the prevailing socio-economic realities), is not taken into account by the author. And bottles (and cans) are now specially made beautiful so that they can be put on the table. In expensive vodkas - a bottle of 70% of the price.
  • Bar1
    Bar1 16 February 2021 10: 29
    -4
    Quote: Dalny V
    And why hell, I beg your pardon, the authorities still need, how not to provide the needs of the population?


    you are a funny person.
    Vlati DOES NOT deal with meeting the needs of the population, but they are always engaged in one-exploitation of the population i.e. legalized robbery. So it was under any government and under the Bolshevik too.
  • Fat
    Fat 19 February 2021 01: 02
    +1
    "The Ministry of Love instilled fear. There were no windows in the building. Winston never crossed its threshold, never came closer than half a kilometer to him. It was possible to get there only on official business, and even then overcoming a whole maze of barbed wire, steel doors and camouflaged machine-gun nests.Even the streets leading to the outer ring of fences were patrolled by black-uniformed guards with gorilla faces and articulated clubs.
    "The Ministry of Love was the really frightening one. There were no windows in it at all. Winston had never been inside the Ministry of Love, nor within half a kilometer of it. It was a place impossible to enter except on official business, and then only by penetrating through a maze of barbed-wire entanglements, steel doors, and hidden machine-gun nests. Even the streets leading up to its outer barriers were roamed by gorilla-faced guards in black uniforms, armed with jointed truncheons. "

    - If you are in the minority - and even in the singular - it does not mean that you are insane. There is truth and there is untruth, and if you stick to the truth, even in spite of the whole world, you are not insane.
    - War is peace, freedom is slavery, ignorance is power.
    - Power is not a means; she is the goal. A dictatorship is not instituted to guard the revolution; a revolution is made in order to establish a dictatorship. The purpose of repression is repression. The purpose of torture is torture. The goal of power is power..
  • bubalik
    bubalik 16 February 2021 06: 28
    +10
    acquired land ownership
    ,,, yes we have no property. When buying a land plot, it is probably a temporary or perpetual lease from the state. Hence the annual taxes.
  • tasha
    tasha 16 February 2021 06: 54
    +9
    Good material. I keep thinking, where does this desire come from to find myself an object for national love or the same hatred. It turns out that everything has a scientific explanation.
    But I cannot support the idea that the source of paternalism is an exclusively rural lifestyle.
  • sergo1914
    sergo1914 16 February 2021 07: 38
    +9
    ... That is, the generations of the 50-60s and beyond should give up their place in leadership positions to representatives of the generations of 2000 and so.


    We recently discussed this constellation of managers with colleagues. It seems to be a good education (red diplomas from leading universities, budget). They speak well, competently at interviews. Smart phrases know by mouth. But now you set a specific task. And that's all. Basta, Teletubbies. The train does not go further. The rail is over. They cannot categorically make managerial decisions on their own. They can talk. Handsomely. There is no way to achieve results.
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 16 February 2021 07: 58
      +8
      But I see - who is achieving the result.
      For example, in one of the districts of Moscow, my graduate student copes with snow. Successfully.

      Yes. He does not work in his specialty.
      But they taught him to work and achieve results.
      Origin - the countryside of the Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug.
      1. sergo1914
        sergo1914 16 February 2021 08: 08
        +4
        Quote: Korsar4
        But I see - who is achieving the result.
        For example, in one of the districts of Moscow, my graduate student copes with snow. Successfully.

        Yes. He does not work in his specialty.
        But they taught him to work and achieve results.
        Origin - the countryside of the Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug.


        I'll tell you a little secret. Nobody copes with snow in Moscow and the region. Trust me. It is impossible to walk down the street. With public transport - collapse. Only in the subway everything is fine. There is no snow there.

        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 08: 14
          +7
          A pedestrian. I feel good.
          I was in Moscow on Sunday. From morning to evening. Enjoyed life.
          I did without the metro.

          Believe me, if the work had not been organized, you would have felt much stronger.
        2. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 08: 15
          +6
          I did not face any problems with electric trains on the Yaroslavl direction.
          And there are many people - the paths are well trodden.

          Or maybe I just love to walk.
          1. depressant
            depressant 16 February 2021 08: 59
            +10
            And there are many people - the paths are well trodden.

            And it is not so with us)))
            All day yesterday the tractors were puffing, the roads and popular paths were being cleaned, and in the evening I went to throw out the garbage and almost broke my legs: no one had cleared the way to the trash bin! I walked, fell through, holes - almost waist-deep, those that were created before me, and those that I created)))
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 16 February 2021 10: 14
              +4
              There is no snow today. I was a little more upset by the ice of the previous days.

              The meeting was yesterday. Spring is coming.
              1. depressant
                depressant 16 February 2021 11: 20
                +3
                Here I do not observe church holidays, for the soul does not lie in the church. I am too a man of the era of atheism, although I am baptized and believe in Gd as the creator of everything. I guess I'm wrong. If there is a church with its schedule, how, when and what, then He has provided for this too)))
                1. Fat
                  Fat 17 February 2021 01: 30
                  +3
                  It was the custom of a Russian person of the Soviet era to be an unchurched Christian. He does not need intermediaries. He prefers to communicate with the creator personally. The church is not priests that are white or black, but a parish (egregor)
                  Do you need sales consultants? Do you like officials?
                  The Creator has foreseen everything, except for a lot of money for "treba" (rituals) No. stop
              2. Pane Kohanku
                Pane Kohanku 16 February 2021 11: 47
                +5
                There is no snow today. I was a little more upset by the ice of the previous days.

                We have a collapse today. Snow fell at night. In the morning I was driving - there are few accidents, but everyone is driving slowly. I spent twice as much time.
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 16 February 2021 18: 17
                  +3
                  But it was snowing a little. I'll get out on the street now and see what and how.
    2. 41st region
      41st region 16 February 2021 11: 19
      +11
      - Hello, I'm talking about work ...
      - well! There's a broom at the entrance, sweep the yard.
      - Sorry, but I graduated from the law faculty of Moscow State University!
      - @ l ... Okay, I'll show you how.
  • ee2100
    ee2100 16 February 2021 07: 53
    +4
    The topic in the article is interesting, but reflected one-sidedly. For the author, it all comes down to why we are such "lapotniks" and put cans on the table. And if you are a worker, a peasant, then children will live with the appropriate mentality.
    But if you are an intellectual in the third generation, then your children will not put cans on the table!
    The theory of paternalism was not invented in Russia, and it was invented to explain some of the processes in society.
    And if you look at the history of the development of society from a primitive system, this phenomenon has always been and was not a brake in the development of society, but rather the opposite. Children learn from their elders, and who else? and adopt the experience of previous generations, but in the modern world it was considered a brake on the development of society. I wonder why? The main thesis of paternalism is that a person should not have authority. Those. parents are not authorities, the authorities are not satisfied - the same thing. Somehow everything is super revolutionary. Only in the West was this theory invented, and it is being promoted in third countries. Ukraine is an example of this. That in the West there are no problems raised in this theory? Yes, but the author stubbornly reduces everything to the Russian Federation.
    Why did the author provide links to works on this topic and a lot? It's just that the people are not the one who got this government. It is necessary to somehow justify the failures in economics and politics.
    The topic is interesting for specialists and, which the author did not mention, intersects, or rather complements the concept of bioethics in its broadest sense.
    One of the postulates of bioethics is justice, and justice is a universal, biblical concept.
    1. Korsar4
      Korsar4 16 February 2021 08: 04
      +7
      And if the hostess loves to cook and knows how, purchased canned food on the festive table simply will not appear. Not in any form.

      Maybe some olives or capers that we don't grow.

      You can talk about justice endlessly. And Confucius will not be the first.
      1. Catfish
        Catfish 16 February 2021 09: 45
        +6
        "Now add something about space,
        Then about the joyful dawn,
        Then put your own signature,
        And take it to the Committee "(c) laughing
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 10: 20
          +5
          And I remembered a quote:

          “It turned out in this jar - not meat.
          It turned out to be in this can of herring "(c).
          1. Catfish
            Catfish 16 February 2021 10: 23
            +8
            "I bring to the light
            The last biscuit
            And I divide it into six persons.
            But there is no Belomor,
            And there are no matches either.
            But twenty tons of herring. "(C)
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 16 February 2021 18: 14
              +2
              “There are only three wonderful things: Dutch soot, Dutch cheese and Dutch herrings” (c).
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 16 February 2021 18: 33
                +5
                How?! And the Flying Dutchman "? !!!
                1. Korsar4
                  Korsar4 16 February 2021 19: 16
                  +3
                  You can't argue with Captain Vrungel.
                  1. Catfish
                    Catfish 16 February 2021 20: 02
                    +4
                    As well as with the writer Platov with his novel "The Secret Fairway".
                    1. Pane Kohanku
                      Pane Kohanku 17 February 2021 14: 56
                      +3
                      As well as with the writer Platov with his novel "The Secret Fairway".

                      By the way, why shouldn't our dashing Sergei-Bubalik consider the topic of Hitler's submarines that surrendered after the Victory? drinks
      2. ee2100
        ee2100 16 February 2021 10: 24
        +5
        It is a pity that you remembered about canned food, although the article is not about that at all.
        1. Korsar4
          Korsar4 16 February 2021 18: 15
          +3
          Of course. There are many aspects. You can't react to everything.
          1. ee2100
            ee2100 16 February 2021 18: 20
            +2
            The topic, in my opinion, is important, but as always, they discuss cooking and verses.
            am somewhere the author got lost, otherwise he usually sits on the site and distributes to everyone by earrings. I hope I am not sick.
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 16 February 2021 19: 14
              +2
              Still living their own lives. And she is a priority.
              1. ee2100
                ee2100 16 February 2021 19: 18
                +3
                This is yes. But he rarely skips his articles.
    2. depressant
      depressant 16 February 2021 09: 37
      +10
      why we are such "lapotniks" and put cans on the table. And if you are a worker, a peasant, then children will live with the appropriate mentality.
      But if you are an intellectual in the third generation, then your children will not put cans on the table!


      I remember very well the recommendation I read back in Soviet times: the can is opened completely, put on a plate and served as it is. The recommendation came from some Her Majesty, either a chef, or a master of ceremonies-specialist. The guest takes a jar and, using a special separate device (fork, spoon, ...), puts on his plate as much as it should. And you only need to put the contents out of the jar when preparing salads.

      The main thing that Vyacheslav Olegovich, it seems to me, did not mention - we live not only in an era of political changes, but a change in technological order.
      1. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 09: 59
        +3
        Quote: depressant
        I remember very well the recommendation I read back in Soviet times: the can is opened completely, put on a plate and served as it is. The recommendation came from some Her Majesty, either a chef, or a master of ceremonies-specialist.

        I totally believe. Canned food used to be terribly expensive, and under the king it meant the status of a rich man.
        1. depressant
          depressant 16 February 2021 10: 45
          +7
          And, imagine, my colleague, just now I saw in the photo that it was precisely on the recommendation of a bank specialist with canned food that it was put on the festive table in this way. And now we are returning to a time when for many one-time "disposal" of the contents of a can into their stomach is an unaffordable luxury. And now there are a lot of blogs on the Internet where skilled housewives tell how to cook borscht from a can of meat carcass for the whole family and not for one day, but at least two. And from a can of canned pink salmon or even from sprat or anchovy - quite an acceptable ear.
          In fact, I gained such experience in the 80s and 90s, now it would be useful, but the prices for such cans are biting)))
          1. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 11: 46
            +2
            Quote: depressant
            Imagine, colleague, just now I saw in the photo that it was precisely on the recommendation of a bank specialist with canned food that it was put on the festive table in this way.

            Yeah, I noticed too. Although now I specially took out two books on home economics, both of the 50s, there is nothing written about canned food. Probably this Nadya had an old book, like Elena Molokhovets, which she conscientiously studied.
            Quote: depressant
            And now there are a lot of blogs on the Internet where skilled housewives tell how to cook borscht from a can of meat carcass for the whole family and not for one day, but at least two.

            Exactly. Summer will come, I will probably also take off a film, like opening canned food on asphalt. Let the intilligination learn, the proletariat can still do something! laughing
            1. Korsar4
              Korsar4 16 February 2021 20: 19
              +3
              "Sportloto-82" instead of instructions.
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 17 February 2021 04: 06
                +2
                Quote: Korsar4
                "Sportloto-82" instead of instructions.

                I've always laughed at them. Mountains, full of abrasive, and they could not print canned food.
          2. BAI
            BAI 16 February 2021 13: 38
            +3
            Here are other recommendations. The photo above is shown.

          3. Fat
            Fat 17 February 2021 02: 00
            +2
            Oh, Lyudmila Yakovlevna. Having called canned soup quite acceptable fish soup, you hurried. This is very conditionally edible stuff. UHA is the poetry of a fisherman. In Kostroma, on the market, a kilo of damn small change - about 100 rubles, and it will be gutted and cleaned by the buyer. From this can, with skill, turn out "quite an acceptable ear". In a normal fishing ear, the spoon will not sink, even if nothing is added except salt.
            From canned food and frostbitten fish - there will never be any fish soup! A vulgar fish soup.
            Sorry.
      2. ee2100
        ee2100 16 February 2021 10: 52
        +4
        Lyudmila Yakovlevna, nothing to do with canned food.
        According to the theory of paternalism, how? Raised a child, learned it, but he does not want to work and only dreams, as TV shows, to immediately become successful and rich and tell his parents "You taught me the wrong thing" by the "bastards" themselves and brought me up like that, but had to ride me on limousines in the resorts and teach not in the secondary school and the university, in a cool abroad in elite institutions. Etc. and on this go all of you to hell.
        So in society, a bunch of losers have gathered and blames everyone except themselves for everything, and according to the theory of paternalism, she rejects all "authorities", including the existing government, and decides to change the government so that her life becomes better.
        Example Ukraine. The youth were explained, according to the theory of paternalism, that all the problems are from the "losers" of the parents, who went in the wrong direction. Why jumped on the Maidan? Everyone wanted to get to Europe and thought that having got there all their problems would be solved automatically.
        The main thing in this theory is the denial of authority.
        1. depressant
          depressant 16 February 2021 11: 29
          +6
          Lyudmila Yakovlevna, nothing to do with canned food.

          Eh, no, colleague! Canned food has something to do with it. If the question is posed bluntly: what to cook borscht from - from an inaccessible beef brisket or edge, or from an equally inaccessible carcass, and this despite the fact that in Zen there is the luxury of cooking grub from everything expensive and, as you rightly noted, The networks, and the propaganda of a luxurious lifestyle on TV, then the question clearly and unequivocally develops into a political one, namely: who rules us and what all these people want.
          1. ee2100
            ee2100 16 February 2021 11: 38
            +4
            Do your children help you financially?
    3. Bar1
      Bar1 16 February 2021 10: 43
      -1
      Quote: ee2100
      The main thesis of paternalism is that a person should not have authority.


      in this process of denial of denials, it is necessary to stop somewhere. If, as we now see, any power is evil and violence against the people, then the authority of the family, i.e. father is a boon to the family.
      The authority of the authorities must be opposed to the authority of society, but this we no longer have, the Russian society was destroyed by the Bolsheviks and therefore now the authority of the authorities is undivided, they do whatever they want. For example, Putin's recent reforms to increase the retirement age. Society, the people do not even have the opportunity than to object.
      1. ee2100
        ee2100 16 February 2021 11: 01
        +4
        From this theory, ideologists in the Russian Federation have chosen a different component. That the children of the "lapotniks" and the children will be "lapotniks" .Tk. Parents cannot teach their children anything progressive.
        And if so, then how do not lead this rabble, nothing good will come of it.
        Those. all failures in the economy and domestic politics can be attributed, based on the theory of paternalism, not to one's own ability, but to the "wrong" people.
        1. Bar1
          Bar1 16 February 2021 11: 05
          -1
          Quote: ee2100
          That children of "bast shoes" and children will be "bast shoes"


          is it so? Is this paternalism?
          1. ee2100
            ee2100 16 February 2021 11: 35
            +3
            Paternalism, to put it simply, is when you raised a child in your own likeness, and the child believes that this is a brake on his self-realization and he has the right to abandon his earlier obligations, let's say continue the family business. And he will go to the USA to study paternalism.
            Globally, this is an excuse for color revolutions (Ukraine).
            The Russian Federation took one part of the theory about the wrong people.
            1. Bar1
              Bar1 16 February 2021 11: 48
              +1
              in the net you can find the definition of paternalism - it is the authority of the father or the authority of power.
              And in your opinion it turns out that since children do not obey their father, then pationalism is the absence of authority or power. Your definition fits better with the definition of anarchism. No?
              1. ee2100
                ee2100 16 February 2021 11: 57
                +3
                I have expressed to you my understanding of this concept.
                "You can not find a definition of paternalism, it is the authority of the father or the authority of power" is the reason for this phenomenon.
                But in the development of this theory, they figured out how to deal with this phenomenon, this overthrow of authorities.
                In the USSR, this theory was considered bourgeois.
        2. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 11: 52
          +1
          Quote: ee2100
          From this theory, ideologists in the Russian Federation have chosen a different component. That the children of the "bast boots" and the children will be "bast boots".

          This is the opinion of the author. Moreover, quite controversial. Like, like we came to a Spanish restaurant, and here you are, the granddaughter holds the knife and fork correctly, although she was not taught this! And the fact that the author was deceived in this restaurant, to put it mildly, he did not notice.
          1. ee2100
            ee2100 16 February 2021 12: 05
            +4
            The author promotes one side of this theory adopted in the Russian Federation.
            Of the people that the current government has inherited "village", "Sovietness", etc. for 20 years not to knock out and therefore all the failures in the economy and domestic policy on the conscience of the people. That's the kind of people got.
            And the author opposes his family to all the other "bast shoes". A child eats with a knife and a fork - consider the elite!
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 16 February 2021 12: 09
              0
              Quote: ee2100
              A child eats with a knife and a fork - consider the elite!

              Moreover, it is European. But what about other cultures, where they eat with chopsticks, or, in general, horror with their hands, like eating pilaf, rolling balls with your hands? Savages! yes
              1. ee2100
                ee2100 16 February 2021 12: 33
                +5
                Here is the proverb about the monastery and the charter!
    4. vladcub
      vladcub 16 February 2021 16: 13
      +1
      "if you are an intellectual in the third generation, then your children will not put canned food on the table" my mother is an intellectual in the first generation, but she will not put canned fish on the festive table. Although he prefers a minimum of dishes.
    5. Aviator_
      Aviator_ 16 February 2021 19: 21
      0
      The topic in the article is interesting, but reflected one-sidedly. For the author, it all comes down to why we are such "lapotniki"

      The author has an unrequited complex - he wants to be in "their nobility", but it does not work out among those who are around, there are a lot of them, and who do not want to wash their dishes and therefore put a jar of sprats on the table.
      On the topic of paternalism in the Russian and Soviet periods, S.G. Ka