Military Review

The history of the creation of one little-known product

114

Epigraph to this stories could serve as an ironic comment found on the net: "In what year did you begin to make such happiness?" The review referred to the product, which is known in narrow circles under the name "Solar portable battery BSP-1". Product specifications can be found on this forum, however, the author erroneously indicated there that "the charge current is about 95 mA when the voltage changes from 10 to 13,8 V". This is the current for charging sealed storage batteries 10NKGTs-1d. The maximum charging current was 2 A for the product 10NKP-6c Belt, although in certain situations the current could be 10-15% more.


We'll have to start from afar to understand why this product was created and what it was intended for, why its general customer was the GRU General Staff, and why strict requirements were set for the product according to the highest group 1.14 of Soviet GOSTs.

In the 60s and 70s of the last century, various revolutionary uprisings constantly took place around the world, as well as a series of coups d'etat, which greatly complicated the work of Soviet diplomatic missions abroad, especially in Africa, Asia and Latin America. An example of such events is the military coup in Chile or the capture of the US embassy in Iran in 1979. This makes it clear how unstable the situation was in some regions.

Usually, such coups began with a disconnection from the electricity and communication systems of our foreign missions, after which the embassy short-wave radio station with a capacity of up to 0,4 kW stopped its work and communication with the Center was lost. If there was an emergency gasoline electric generator, then the fuel reserves were usually not enough for several days, because there were strict restrictions on the storage of fuel and lubricants in the embassy building. For example, in Iran, at the American embassy, ​​all fuel supplies were destroyed almost immediately, although they were stored in a buried tank, but the attackers knew where it was located and quickly spoiled the fuel with the help of "chemicals" (rumored to be almost washing powder). In such situations, our embassy's radio operator-encryptor did not have any opportunity to contact the Center at the main HF radio station, which is why a low-power correspondent radio station of the R-353 type ("Lun", "Proton" or others) was used as a reserve, which made it possible to organize communication on routes up to 4 thousand km or more under favorable conditions.


Photo source: military.trcvr.ru

But for their power supply, a battery and a generator or a manual charger, which was used in special forces units (such as PZU-5m), were needed. For ambassadorial conditions, this was very difficult, especially given the fact that, as a rule, there is only one radio operator, and information about what was happening was immediately demanded by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the KGB and the GRU General Staff at the same time, which is why the load increased sharply, the radio operator physically did not have time to charge the battery. Due to the fact that at that time the ambassadorial radio operator-cipher officer was an officer of the special radio communications service of the GRU General Staff or the special radio communications service of the KGB of the USSR, each department solved this problem in its own way, at the level of its capabilities. I will focus on the BSP-1 product, the general customer of which was the Ministry of Defense.

Based on the current situation, the leadership of the GRU General Staff set the task for the operational and technical management to conduct R&D on the creation of portable power sources for such situations. Specifically, this issue began to be dealt with by the department under the leadership of Ph.D. Colonel PT Evseenkov. Two low-budget R&D projects began almost simultaneously, in one case they used the principle of converting solar energy into electrical energy, and in the other they used semiconductor thermoelectric converters to obtain the required charging current. The development of a solar battery began to be carried out by the Krasnodar branch of the All-Union Research Institute of Current Sources, which specialized in this topic and for many years produced solar panels for our satellites for various purposes, had its own scientific base and factory production, which made it possible to organize serial production of products. This association was headed by Yu. V. Skokov, a major specialist in this field, who later headed not only the All-Russian Research Institute of Current Sources in Moscow (NPO Kvant), but also became the head of the Ministry of Electrotechnical Industry.

R&D work was completed on time, and after state tests, it was decided to accept this product for supplying reconnaissance units, for which to organize serial production of BSP-1 at the Saturn plant in Krasnodar in 1986.

Even at the stage of factory tests, specialists from the 1th TsNII MO showed interest in BSP-16, who also needed such batteries, but with a large charging current, and for this, the power supply was modernized, which allows connecting batteries in parallel and receiving a total current of about 4 amperes. This made it possible to recharge even car batteries, not to mention the power supply of some signal troops.

The operational use of the BSP-1 was originally intended only as a charger for Soviet missions abroad in critical situations, but due to the war in Afghanistan, the first serial deliveries began to the 40th Army, since the problem of energy supply there was very acutely. The need for a solar battery was not only in the special forces brigade, but also in the 254th radio and radio-technical reconnaissance regiment, where individual posts were thrown out to the mountain tops, and they sorely lacked power sources for round-the-clock radio reconnaissance. It was often necessary to use helicopters to deliver replaceable batteries to them, which not only unmasked the radio reconnaissance officers, but was also costly and unsafe. The regiment, which received BSP-1 batteries, managed to partially solve the problem of supplying power to remote posts, and this was a great help for those who provided them with everything necessary for continuous operation. Already in the GSVG, where the 254th ortp OSNAZ was brought out, I saw in this regiment damaged BSP-1 with through holes from bullets, but working properly, with a slight decrease in the charging current.

If we evaluate the BSP-1 product from the point of view of technical solutions, then we must admit that for those who developed and provided our space with solar panels, solving the problem of creating a small-sized power source seemed, I think, not such an insoluble problem. True, stringent requirements for weight, size, temperature range and specific characteristics led to the fact that the BSP-1 battery turned out to be foldable and, perhaps, not quite small-sized when deployed, but the development team coped with the task completely.


If we compare the BSP-1 product with foreign analogues of that time, then everything that was produced in the USA, Japan, France and Israel for military purposes was inferior in terms of tactical, technical and specific characteristics of our development, and their reliability lagged far behind reliability of our product. This is not surprising, because at that time we were not only the leaders in space research, but everything related to space was the most advanced in our country, which is why the silicon elements in BSP-1 were of the same quality as on ours. satellites. This, of course, affected the price of the entire product, but the general customer considered it acceptable, because in crisis situations, not only the fate of the embassy staff could depend on the BSP-1 battery, but also future relations with those leaders who came to power in this or that country after the coups.

As for the operational use of the BSP-1 product, several structures of the USSR Armed Forces have shown interest in the solar battery. In addition to the signal troops, they were used in the Strategic Missile Forces and in other structures. Ordering structures of the KGB of the USSR also paid for the delivery of BSP-1 products, and those who served in the border troops encountered them at remote points, as some border guards write about on the network. I don't know how things are now in this segment of small-scale power generation of the armed forces, but I think that such equipment should always be kept in stock. The events in Syria and the deaths of some of our servicemen from the MTR shows that the issue of providing autonomous power supply and means of charging batteries for our reconnaissance groups and agents will remain relevant for a long time, which means that this issue must be dealt with seriously.

And in conclusion, I would like to note that when our leaders mention the USSR and "galoshes", which supposedly could only be produced there, it makes me laugh from their "enlightenment", because they have no idea what the country's industry could produce in that time. This is evidenced by the history of the creation of a little-known product BSP-1, which was the best in the world not only at the time of creation, but also for many years after the serial production began.
Author:
Photos used:
forum.guns.ru
114 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. Ragnar Lodbrok
    Ragnar Lodbrok 9 September 2020 12: 20 New
    33
    when our leaders mention the USSR and "galoshes", which supposedly could only be produced there, it makes me laugh from their "enlightenment", because they have no idea what the country's industry could produce at that time.

    And the mobile phone? The first mobile phone was invented by L.I. Kupriyanovich in 1957 and was tested in 1958. Thus, the mobile phone was officially invented and tested in the USSR 15 years earlier than in the USA.
    And the microwave? On June 13, 1941, four years before the discovery of the American, the newspaper Trud informed its readers about a useful invention by Soviet scientists ... a microwave oven for defrosting and heating food.
    And the Internet? The idea of ​​creating a prototype of the Internet was first proposed to the Soviet government in 1959 by Colonel Anatoly Kitov. Following Anatoly Kitov, Academician Viktor Glushkov became interested in the idea of ​​creating a prototype of the Internet. Taking into account the centralized system of governing the country, the scientist in 1961 proposed to create a nationwide automated system for recording and processing information, but despite all the advantages of introducing a computer network that controls the state, the government of the USSR did not dare to take this step. In vain.
    Almost a decade later, in 1969, the United States launched the ARPANET system, which unites the computers of the US Department of Defense into a single network, repeating the work of Anatoly Kitov and the ideas of Viktor Glushkov.
    And the computer? In 1968, Arseny Anatolyevich Gorokhov patented a personal computer in the USSR, by a whole eight years ahead of Steve Jobs, the founder of Apple.
    Хороши "галоши"..!
    1. An64
      An64 9 September 2020 12: 29 New
      +2
      Quote: Ragnar Lothbrok
      And the computer? In 1968, Arseny Anatolyevich Gorokhov patented a personal computer in the USSR, by a whole eight years ahead of Steve Jobs, the founder of Apple.
      Хороши "галоши"..!

      Ясное дело - сейчас же народ стремиться купить себе персональную "горошину", а не ящик с надкусанным яблоком на крышке...
      А вообще, следуя старому анекдоту - и рентген изобрели у нас. Ведь ещё Иван Грозный грозил боярам: "я вас, бл...й, насквозь вижу"!
      1. Timeout
        Timeout 9 September 2020 14: 33 New
        0
        Quote: An64
        Ясное дело - сейчас же народ стремиться купить себе персональную "горошину", а не ящик с надкусанным яблоком на крышке...

        If you follow your thought, then already Russian women should not give birth from Russian men, not a camilfo, there is no label ...
        1. An64
          An64 9 September 2020 14: 54 New
          +8
          If you follow your thoughts ...

          Look at yourself and around you - clothes, watches, telephone, TV, car, household appliances, Internet - ours? An Indian hut ... There is nothing of ours ... Well, at least the weapon is ours, although the electronics inside I doubt that it is assembled from our microcircuits ...
          1. Timeout
            Timeout 9 September 2020 15: 02 New
            +1
            Quote: An64
            Indian hut ... Nothing of ours ...
            Why not? Because some leaders said that nothing should be done in Russia, because foreign ones are better. And they all lost it, to the screams of the enthusiastic audience. And now, in general, they began to say that the Russians cannot invent, everything is tyryat in the west.
          2. Lopatov
            Lopatov 9 September 2020 15: 12 New
            +3
            Quote: An64
            Look at yourself and around you - clothes, watches, telephone, TV, car, household appliances, Internet - ours?

            You don't have to do everything yourself ...
            In fact, the problem is old.
            Как там в "Чебурашке", "Овощи, фрукты, прочие продукты, Тыква и брюква, импортная клюква."
            У "командной экономики" есть свои недостатки. И потому любой советский гражданин предпочитал импортное.

            Ну а действительно конкурентоспособными товарами СССР были нефть и хлопок. Не требовавшие продажи в кредит, продажи по заниженным ценам и прочего "родовспоможения"

            Thanks to Khrushchev
    2. Undecim
      Undecim 9 September 2020 13: 45 New
      +7
      And the computer? In 1968, Arseny Anatolyevich Gorokhov patented a personal computer in the USSR, by a whole eight years ahead of Steve Jobs, the founder of Apple.
      Yes Yes! The USSR is the homeland of elephants.
      Arseny Anatolyevich Gorokhov did not patent any personal computer. He patented
      "Устройство для задания программы воспроизведения контура детали", то есть графопостроитель. С патентом можно ознакомиться по ссылке https://www1.fips.ru/fips_servl/fips_servlet?DB=RUPAT&rn=9056&DocNumber=383005&TypeFile=html.
      By the way, the application was filed in 1970. Read on and if you have any idea of ​​what a personal computer is, you will understand that no peas have overtaken anyone.
      1. Undecim
        Undecim 9 September 2020 14: 14 New
        +6
        You can minus as much as you like. Minus clearly something can argue? Or does clinical turbopatriotism not allow?
        1. Timeout
          Timeout 9 September 2020 14: 42 New
          0
          Quote: Undecim
          Minus clearly something can argue?

          Mr.-comrade-master .... Those who have a computer will see there only drawings in the form of dots that do not carry any information. But the paper originals in the OmSU museum show everything. And remember, patent and copyright are two different things.
          1. Undecim
            Undecim 9 September 2020 15: 37 New
            +8
            You would, for a start, have a look, sir. Then write where you see the PC there.
            1. Timeout
              Timeout 9 September 2020 15: 40 New
              0
              So you tried to read? Doesn't that sound like a description of a PC? First, read the material you are trying to refute.
              1. Brylevsky
                Brylevsky 9 September 2020 17: 48 New
                10
                So you tried to read? Doesn't that sound like a description of a PC?

                hi
                To be honest, not really. Rather, on a highly specialized computer ... Because the PC decides wide range of tasks. From engineering calculations to children's games. And this device, strictly limited by its purpose, does not pull on a personal feed computer, sorry.
                1. Timeout
                  Timeout 9 September 2020 18: 04 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Brylevsky
                  Because the PC solves a wide range of tasks.

                  Dear, Doom has been launched on an e-pregnancy test, is this also a PC? After all, it solves many problems, calculates ovulation, measures temperature, determines pregnancy and you can play Doom.
                  1. Brylevsky
                    Brylevsky 9 September 2020 18: 28 New
                    +9
                    Dear, Doom has been launched on an e-pregnancy test, is this also a PC?

                    Read carefully the article: https://w4bsit2020-dns.com/09/07/375266/XNUMX/
                    The screen of this device was used to display the graphics of the game, the program itself was executed on another device. What are you trying to pull by the ears? The plotter is not a PC, do not engage in casuistry.
                    1. Timeout
                      Timeout 9 September 2020 18: 40 New
                      -2
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      The screen of this device was used to display the graphics of the game, the program itself was executed on another device

                      Not really? Here's a proof, except for the external USB controller there is nothing!
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      What are you trying to pull by the ears?

                      Another connoisseur? Study the material.
                      1. Brylevsky
                        Brylevsky 9 September 2020 18: 48 New
                        12
                        Внешний микроконтроллер! А не тот, который используется в самом электронном тесте! Очевидно потому, что микроконтроллер, используемый в самом тесте, игру не потянет! С "макетки" провода идут на дисплей...
                        I tell you again:
                        The plotter is not a PC, do not engage in casuistry.
                      2. Timeout
                        Timeout 9 September 2020 18: 55 New
                        -2
                        Quote: Brylevsky
                        С "макетки" провода идут на дисплей...

                        Study the materiel)). Five wires for connecting the Oled display ... You are my friend, the original.
                        Quote: Brylevsky
                        I tell you again:

                        Don't repeat yourself! Learn the basics of electronics. To at least distinguish a USB controller from a regular arduino or PI
                      3. Brylevsky
                        Brylevsky 9 September 2020 19: 03 New
                        +8
                        Don't stray from the topic of the conversation. The discussion is not about a pregnancy test, but about this:
                        So you tried to read? Doesn't that sound like a description of a PC? First, read the material you are trying to refute.

                        It not a PC.
                      4. Timeout
                        Timeout 9 September 2020 19: 07 New
                        -2
                        Quote: Brylevsky
                        This is not a PC.
                        Personal computer, PC - a computer intended for operation by one user, that is, for personal use.
                    2. Brylevsky
                      Brylevsky 9 September 2020 19: 42 New
                      +9
                      Study the materiel)). Five wires for connecting the Oled display ... You are my friend, the original.

                      Actually there are four of them ... but it's close to five lol Here is a four-wire circuit:

                      6-wire circuit:

                      I am not strong in microelectronics - alas, not my profile. But these circuits tell me that an OLED display can be connected with either four or six wires. Presumably, depending on the version of the display and the control controller ...
                      Don't repeat yourself!

                      Sorry, but you are forcing me to do this. A plotter is not a personal computer. Вся остальная полемика вокруг этого тезиса, не более чем ваша попытка вытянуть меня играть на вашем "поле" по вашим "правилам".
                    3. Timeout
                      Timeout 9 September 2020 20: 12 New
                      -1
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      that the OLED display can be connected with either four or six wires.

                      Dear, don't make me brains! In a technique similar to this test, the display controller is built into the microcontroller chip, which means that it will simply not work to connect it physically via the i2p bus, because the control data goes directly to the display. Secondly, find the arduino or uno inscription on the board.
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      A plotter is not a personal computer.
                      Это манечка или уровень интеллекта? Не, я понял. У вас все "потому что - гладиолус". Запомните, не ПК решает широкий круг задач, а на ПК с помощью программного обеспечения. Ибо ПК 40 лет назад и сейчас вещи абсолютно разные, хотя только связанные архитектурой. Уймитесь, "академик". В простеньком мобильном телефоне (не смартфоне) сейчас стоит процессор в 3-4 раза мощнее чем Intel 386 на котором 25 лет назад гоняли в Doom.
                    4. Brylevsky
                      Brylevsky 9 September 2020 20: 33 New
                      +6
                      For the PC 40 years ago and now things are completely different, although only related by architecture.

                      40 лет назад "ПК" ещё не было. Были ЭВМ. В НИИ и прочих, подобных им, организациях. Разницу понимаете, "академик"? А если понимаете, то какого чёрта вы тут смуту вводите своим:
                      So you tried to read? Doesn't that sound like a description of a PC? First, read the material you are trying to refute.
                      ?!
                      Yes, I may not know something in microelectronics! It's forgivable to me, I'm not a radio engineer! But that's when they start to me:
                      After all, it solves many problems, calculates ovulation, measures temperature, determines pregnancy and you can play Doom.
                      , I cannot but react to it. No need to joke! And to engage in casuistry. I hope you understand the meaning of this word!
                    5. Timeout
                      Timeout 9 September 2020 20: 55 New
                      -4
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      40 лет назад "ПК" ещё не было.

                      Stunned .... Dear, the first serial PC began to be produced in 1984, that is, from a historical point of view, 40 years ago. Next, you are our stubborn friend, we are talking about 1968. In those years, there really was no concept of a PC, and computers had a completely different circuitry. And Gorokhov proposed the circuitry of a modern PC.
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      It's forgivable to me, I'm not a radio engineer!

                      So what the hell, you climb there that you don't understand! A common truth, ignorance of the laws, does not absolve from responsibility.
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      I can't help but react to it

                      So before you react, learn the PC concept! And then bother with your reasons.
                      Quote: Brylevsky
                      No need to joke! And to engage in casuistry. I hope you understand the meaning of this word!

                      Dear, if I start joking at someone on VO, it ends sadly for them. And you are engaged in casuistry, trying to prove something that does not exist. And while not having the appropriate knowledge.
                    6. Brylevsky
                      Brylevsky 9 September 2020 21: 01 New
                      +8
                      Dear, if I start joking at someone on VO, it ends sadly for them.

                      Ну...это просто потому, что вы ещё не нарывались на того, кто перестебает вас. Чем больше "шкаф", тем громче он падает...
    3. Brylevsky
      Brylevsky 9 September 2020 18: 32 New
      +6
      After all, it solves many problems, calculates ovulation, measures temperature, determines pregnancy and you can play Doom.

      Микроконтроллер, по-вашему, это тоже компьютер? Простенькую анимацию и скрипт, опрашивающий датчики, можно и для "Arduino" написать, но он от этого не станет компьютером.
      1. Timeout
        Timeout 9 September 2020 19: 02 New
        -4
        Quote: Brylevsky
        можно и для "Arduino" написать

        It is possible, on all AVR platforms, even the Chinese write Arduino))
        1. Brylevsky
          Brylevsky 9 September 2020 19: 05 New
          +3
          Well, still:
          Is the microcontroller a computer in your opinion?
          ?
        2. Timeout
          Timeout 9 September 2020 20: 37 New
          -1
          Do you know? The Atmega microcontroller, which is on the Uno in terms of power, is not inferior to the same i286., And the craftsmen have already emulated the work of DOS more than once. So a microcomputer. And you yourself drove into a semantic TRAP. Computers are not installed anywhere now, in cars, toasters, etc., and so on.
        3. Brylevsky
          Brylevsky 9 September 2020 20: 47 New
          +7
          So a microcomputer.

          Not. This is a microcontroller. Unlike a computer, a microcontroller does not multitask. It can only emulate multitasking ...
          And you yourself drove into a semantic TRAP.

          Not. Unlike a computer, a microcontroller does not have Operating System, даже простейшей DOS. Для него "setup" и "loop", и всё, что между ними...
          Computers are not installed anywhere now, in cars, toasters, etc., and so on.

          Not. Microcontrollers install, yes. Microcomputers are not. If the problem is solved by a microcontroller, a microcomputer will never be installed in the device, not even a cheap Rasberry Pi ...
          Я не настолько не шарю в микроэлектронике, чтобы повестись на ту "ботву", что вы мне пытаетесь тут "скормить". hi
        4. Timeout
          Timeout 9 September 2020 21: 21 New
          -1
          Quote: Brylevsky
          Not. This is a microcontroller. Unlike a computer, a microcontroller does not multitask.

          Dear, multitasking on a PC appeared with the release of Windows 95. Your next jamb ...
          Quote: Brylevsky
          Unlike a computer, a microcontroller does not have an operating system, not even the simplest DOS.

          Of course, for that, he is not badly programmed to perform certain actions. And the firmware can be considered an operating system.
          Quote: Brylevsky
          Not. Microcontrollers install, yes. Microcomputers are not. If the problem is solved by a microcontroller, a microcomputer will never be installed in the device, not even a cheap Rasberry Pi ...
          Я не настолько не шарю в микроэлектронике, чтобы повестись на ту "ботву", что вы мне пытаетесь тут "скормить".

          Again twenty-five. You see, you are tired ... What do microcontrollers have to do with it? How did the dispute begin? Is it possible to run Doom on a test. So in this test there is an ARM processor, Android 10 runs on it. You insist that this is all garbage, it is not possible to start, an external device is used. So the video clearly shows that there is a USB controller for connecting a keyboard and a flash drive with software to this test. And they tried to shove me that this is an arduino, on which they emulated a simple picture. Your words? And who are you trying to put a quilted jacket in your ears? Our scampering!
        5. region58
          region58 10 September 2020 04: 30 New
          +8
          Quote: Timeout
          firmware can be considered an operating system

          Moreover, in the end, everything is still translated into machine codes ...
        6. Rec
          Rec 13 September 2020 16: 44 New
          0
          Quote: Timeout
          multitasking on PC appeared

          Quote: Brylevsky
          microcontroller not multitasking

          Справедливости ради нужно сказать что неплохо бы разобраться с терминологией, потому как термин "многозадачность" имеет варианты. Насчет Windows95 вопрос спорный, если применительно к ПК, то были малоизвестные ОС, например AmigaOS, это восьмидесятые годы.
  • Undecim
    Undecim 9 September 2020 18: 04 New
    +9
    I read it carefully. Tell me what is used as a processor in the described device, but I don't see it in the text.
    1. Timeout
      Timeout 9 September 2020 18: 20 New
      -4
      Quote: Undecim
      then I don't see it in the text.

      At the time the author's certificate was issued, there was not even such a concept. Called whatever you like, described in the certificate as a converter.
      1. Undecim
        Undecim 9 September 2020 18: 54 New
        10
        I have to upset you. This concept has existed since at least 1955.
        1. Timeout
          Timeout 9 September 2020 19: 12 New
          -4
          Quote: Undecim
          This concept has existed since at least 1955.

          Is it? I know the calculating device, I know the block of relay groups, I know the transistors of the block assembly ... But I only found out about the processor after 71 years.
          1. Undecim
            Undecim 9 September 2020 19: 58 New
            +5
            What you learned, damn it, after 1971, suggests that you simply did not have access to information, you were sitting behind the Iron Curtain.
            After 1971, this is Intel 4004.

            Это из инструкции 1965 года к IBM System/360 Model 30. Надеюсь, что такое "central processing unit, CPU" Вы знаете.
          2. Timeout
            Timeout 9 September 2020 20: 29 New
            -3
            Уважаемый, вы в себе? Вы видите там слово микропроцессор? В 360 модели CPU был не виде одного чипа, а стойки с транзисторными блок-сборками. И советской школе разработки компьютеров этого слова просто небыло! А когда появился 4004 только тогда начало упоминать я слово "микропроцессор".
          3. Undecim
            Undecim 9 September 2020 21: 09 New
            +7
            Уважаемый, Вы себя контролируйте. Причем тут микропроцессор? Изначально речь шла о том, когда появился термин "процессор" (см. мой комментарий выше). Вы написали, что в 1970 году такого понятия не существовало. Я вам привел инструкцию 1965 года с термином "процессор" именно в том смысле, в котором он употребляется и поныне.
          4. Timeout
            Timeout 9 September 2020 23: 03 New
            -5
            Quote: Undecim
            вам привел инструкцию 1965 года с термином "процессор" именно в том смысле, в котором он употребляется и поныне.
            По ходу до вас не доходит... А то что терминология в СССР и США совсем разные думать и знать запрещено? Да, печальный случай... Или не видно разницы между словами "центральное процессорное устройство" и "процессор".
          5. Undecim
            Undecim 9 September 2020 23: 13 New
            +7
            The case is really sad. And the phrase Или не видно разницы между словами "центральное процессорное устройство" и "процессор". leads to very sad thoughts.
            Let's try to go from the other side. Tell me. What are the fundamental differences between the 360 IBM System / 30 Model 1964 computer and the 1970 Gorokhov plotter, in your opinion, allow the latter to be considered a personal computer and the former not?
          6. Timeout
            Timeout 9 September 2020 23: 28 New
            -5
            Quote: Undecim
            in your opinion, allow the latter to be considered a personal computer and the former not

            To begin with, the 360 ​​is a mainframe, but by no means a PC. There is no monitor or keyboard. Judging by your remarks you are reading from punched cards or punched tape. And the Gorokhov architecture is painted as it exists in the present time.
          7. Undecim
            Undecim 9 September 2020 23: 47 New
            +8
            Is having a monitor and keyboard an architecture? I naively believed that architecture is the principles of operation, information connections and communication of the main logical nodes of a computer.
            Judging by your replica, you read from punched cards or punched tape
            And what would fundamentally change in our dialogue if I received information from punched cards. Except for the response time, nothing.
            And what can you say about this computer.

            What prevents him from claiming the role of a PC.
            By the way, what did the monitor, keyboard and all other components of Gorokhov's computer look like?
  • Undecim
    Undecim 9 September 2020 14: 30 New
    +3
    Misprint - Gorokhov.
  • Undecim
    Undecim 9 September 2020 13: 58 New
    +5
    And the mobile phone? The first mobile phone was invented by L.I. Kupriyanovich in 1957 and was tested in 1958. Thus, the mobile phone was officially invented and tested in the USSR 15 years earlier than in the USA.
    12 years later. The first publicly available mobile telephony appeared in 1946 in St. Louis.
    1. ccsr
      20 September 2020 09: 55 New
      -4
      Quote: Undecim
      12 years later. The first publicly available mobile telephony appeared in 1946 in St. Louis.

      This is not so, because the first mobile phone in the United States appeared much later, according to the statement of the American inventor:



      And more:
      https://ok.ru/video/2021959993975
      1. Undecim
        Undecim 20 September 2020 10: 41 New
        0
        You will first decide what the discussion is about - about mobile telephony or about cellular communication in the modern sense.
  • fa2998
    fa2998 9 September 2020 17: 07 New
    +2
    And what has to do with who invented in advance. Let's see, who organized the mass production, Reduced the cost, and exports all over the world, and pays taxes.
    And from us, they took money from the budget, invented it, sold it to the military at astronomical cost (and some were not produced), and classified it. The money was written off.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • SaLaR
    SaLaR 9 September 2020 12: 36 New
    10
    It was heavy and not comfortable ... they preferred to take one more spare belt ... 5 OBSPN Maryina Gorka
    1. Timeout
      Timeout 9 September 2020 13: 57 New
      0
      Quote: SaLaR
      we preferred to take one more spare belt ..

      На сколько помню радиостанции из "птичек" у пятёрки были только у лис, а они не гнушались и панельку потаскать. Задачи больно специфические выполняли. А остальные из пятерки все больше с 159 бегали, а к ней пояс не идёт...
      1. SaLaR
        SaLaR 9 September 2020 17: 28 New
        +8
        пояса шли к КМ.. обычно брали 2 пояса на однодневные скачки..а с 159 бегали "рексы"
        1. Timeout
          Timeout 9 September 2020 17: 58 New
          -2
          Quote: SaLaR
          belts went to KM ..

          Первые опытные "Северки" для испытаний появились уже во время вывода, в конце 88. И особо себя эта станция не показала, на "штырь" и "куликовку" в горах работала неустойчиво. Так особой любви не заработала. А пояс 10НКП-6С появился ещё на Р-352 "СОКОЛ", а также на "Стриже",," Протоне", и "Шмеле".
          Quote: SaLaR
          usually took 2 belts for one-day races.

          Одно пояса и так хватает на 2 часа в режиме беспрерывной передачи на "Северке"
          Quote: SaLaR
          159 бегали "рексы"

          Look at the avatar, you will understand.
          1. SaLaR
            SaLaR 9 September 2020 18: 37 New
            +7
            -Р-394КМ "Стриж-КМ" переносная КВ радиостанция для разведгрупп,,..брали 2 пояса и ПЗУ-шку. С одним поясом на скачки никогда не ходили..всегда был риск повредить или просто разрядится зимой в мороз. А 159 обычно таскали "рексы" когда ходили на стрельбище или при движении в автоколонне на прыжки..правда в том случае если им не придавали "паука" с той же самой 159, потому что обычно "рексы" были так далеки от связи как Земля от Луны))) ДМБ 90-92 5ОБСпН "паук". P.S. И с КМ на плечах не одну сотню километров намотал по белорусских лесах
            1. Timeout
              Timeout 9 September 2020 19: 50 New
              -3
              Quote: SaLaR
              to the races

              Let's figure it out. Horse racing is an exercise between divisions. The last and only races in the top five were at 91. Next.
              Quote: SaLaR
              Р-394КМ "Стриж-КМ" переносная КВ радиостанция для разведгрупп
              Copy-paste from the Internet is immediately visible.
              Swifts are taken out in at least two groups! At a distance of 100 kilometers from the base. And in the 90th in the top five he was replaced by Severok. And so no one ran beyond the bath. And most importantly, all citizens of the Russian Federation were fired before March 92, due to the transfer of the brigade to the army of Belarus. Well, the cherry on the cake, no rex and spiders. Even Banderlog and Trucks did not take root. I know not by hearsay, at 91 I was with the guys from the five in one interesting place. So darken you sir ...
              1. SaLaR
                SaLaR 9 September 2020 20: 22 New
                10
                1.Название с инета взял..у нас просто называлась "кээмка"..и как ее правильно уже давно забыл
                2.Russian citizens quit their jobs last in SEPTEMBER 92
                3."Рекс"-это разведчик.."паук"-это радист-разведчик..
                4.Km was taken by each reconnaissance group
                5.Jumps are one-day .. three-day .. and six-day .. usually battalion
                6.And went to the bathhouse with infantry ... in the neighboring guards-tank division ... since there was no one of our own
                7.I am a Belarusian
                8.And the cherry ... if you know the top five well, then tell me why the neighboring division called us dogs (I give a tip: not that we barked, but for that ... ?????)
            2. ccsr
              12 September 2020 20: 58 New
              +2
              Quote: SaLaR
              It was heavy and not comfortable ... they preferred to take another spare belt ...
              We never went to the races with only one belt .. there was always a risk of damage or simply being discharged in winter in the cold.

              Вы описываете ситуацию в Средней полосе бывшего СССР и вдобавок с краткосрочным использованием "Стрижей" в ходе соревнований разведгрупп оперативной разведки, где БСП-1 в общем-то и не планировалось использовать изначально. А вот если бы вы оказались среди наших офицеров-спецназовцев в Мозамбике, Анголе или готовили сандинистов для Никарагуа, то уверяю вас, вы бы сами потребовали чтобы вам в группу выделили хотя бы одну БСП-1, а не дополнительный "Пояс". К слову, чтобы вы были в курсе - "Стрижи" в Болгарии по лицензии стали выпускать и поставлять в разные страны, т.к. слишком много заказов было на эту радиостанцию. И как правило эти страны лежали гораздо южнее наших границ и надо было учитывать как обеспечить их бесперебойным питанием, вот почему ошибочно думать что это изделие предназначалось только для бригад СпН. Партизаны и агентура больше спецназовцев были заинтерсованы в таком устройстве, и это факт - просто имейте это ввиду при оценке изделия.
              1. SaLaR
                SaLaR 12 September 2020 22: 03 New
                0
                Полностью с Вами согласен...просто поделился своим опытом использования). Действительно БСП-1 для нас был как экзотический девайс). А "Стриж" очень хвалили офицеры которые в 89- 90г "ездили" в Ереван, говорили что "Стриж" лучше держит связь с частью, чем огромные передвижные радиостанции "центровиков" (название станции не помню, но кунг был больше чем современный полуприцеп дальнобойщика)
                1. ccsr
                  13 September 2020 10: 34 New
                  +2
                  Quote: SaLaR
                  А "Стриж" очень хвалили офицеры которые в 89- 90г "ездили" в Ереван, говорили что "Стриж" лучше держит связь с частью, чем огромные передвижные радиостанции "центровиков"

                  Если обратится к нашей военной истории, то представители ставки ВГК убывая на фронты во время Великой Отечественной брали с собой офицера спецрадиосвязи с знаменитой станцией "Север" (прародитель "Стрижа"), которая обеспечивала им постоянную связь с Генштабом. Так что наши малогабаритные средства связи были не такими уж плохими, как некоторым может показаться, особенно в руках настоящих профессионалов радиосвязи.
                  Quote: SaLaR
                  Indeed, the BSP-1 was like an exotic device for us).

                  В бригаде есть рота РТР, группы из которой могли вести разведку с позиций в течении длительного времени, но для этого им нужно было держать постоянно в рабочем состоянии пассивные средства радио- и радиотехнической разведки. Так что для них батарея БСП-1 нужна была больше, чем дополнительный "Пояс". Но я согласен что "разведчикам" из отрядов в нашей полосе эти батареи в общем были не нужны, вот почему их и не включали в комплект снаряжения радистов.
                  1. Ruslan67
                    Ruslan67 14 September 2020 17: 04 New
                    -1
                    Quote: ccsr
                    "разведчикам" из отрядов в нашей полосе эти батареи в общем были не нужны, вот почему их и не включали в комплект снаряжения радистов.

                    in the Arctic, I also had to run with a spare belt sad
                    Quote: ccsr
                    battery BSP-1

                    We didn't even get close
                    1. ccsr
                      14 September 2020 18: 27 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Ruslan67
                      We didn't even get close

                      This battery was still being developed for the more southern regions, so it could not get to you. A generator based on semiconductor thermoelectric converters with the same output characteristics was developed for the northern regions. R&D was carried out and prototypes were created, which passed State tests. But the product did not go into mass production - perhaps later I will write about the history of this project in more detail, if anyone is interested in it.
                      1. Ruslan67
                        Ruslan67 15 September 2020 16: 49 New
                        +1
                        Quote: ccsr
                        maybe later I will write about the history of this project in more detail, if it interests anyone.

                        I'm so sure But there are few of us here I know one more, but he hasn't appeared for a long time request
          2. ccsr
            10 September 2020 12: 06 New
            +1
            Quote: Timeout
            Первые опытные "Северки" для испытаний появились уже во время вывода, в конце 88. И особо себя эта станция не показала, на "штырь" и "куликовку" в горах работала неустойчиво. Так особой любви не заработала.

            Все дело в том, что радиостанцию "Северок-К" создавали разработчики Сарапульского радиозавода по собственной инициативе и ТТЗ на это изделие не утверждалось гензаказчиком, а лишь согласовывались отдельные позиции. Поэтому "Северок-К" вообще мог бы не попасть в части СпН, если бы не шла война в Афганистане и катастрофически не хватало систем связи, обеспечивающих работу в гористой местности на трассах до 200 км. Разработка шла за деньги выделяемые их министерством, а не за счет Минобороны, так что можно сказать хоть на этом в ГРУ ГШ сэкономили, хотя закупки серийной техники шли уже по военному бюджету, но под контролем военного представительства. Как интересный факт - опытный "Северок-К" побывал на Северном полюсе, когда решили провести испытания в полярных широтах, и в одну из экспедиций Д.Шпаро было передано это изделие. К удивлению, они сумели организовать сеансы связи даже в телефонном режиме, если мне память не изменяет. Так что не совсем плохая радиостанция была.
  • rocket757
    rocket757 9 September 2020 12: 39 New
    +5
    And in conclusion I would like to note that when our leaders mention the USSR and "galoshes", which supposedly could only be produced there, it makes me laugh from their "enlightenment"

    They say everything and everyone as intended !!! Because they are all united only by fear and hatred, before the great history of the Great Country. OUR STORY!
  • Lebed
    Lebed 9 September 2020 12: 51 New
    +4
    when our leaders mention the USSR and "galoshes", which supposedly could only be produced there, I get ridiculous from their "enlightenment"

    Таких "лидеров" в кавычки надо было поставить
  • Lopatov
    Lopatov 9 September 2020 13: 50 New
    +6
    And in conclusion, I would like to note that when our leaders mention the USSR and "galoshes", which supposedly could only be produced there, it makes me laugh from their "enlightenment"

    А когда некоторые начинают врать про то, что " наши лидеры упоминают СССР и «галоши», которые якобы только и могли там производить", мне становится смешно от самонадеянности таких авторов. Ведь это интернет, неужели они верят, что человек не проверит ими сказанное?
    1. ccsr
      9 September 2020 14: 21 New
      -3
      Quote: Spade
      And in conclusion, I would like to note that when our leaders mention the USSR and "galoshes", which supposedly could only be produced there, it makes me laugh from their "enlightenment"

      А когда некоторые начинают врать про то, что " наши лидеры упоминают СССР и «галоши», которые якобы только и могли там производить", мне становится смешно от самонадеянности таких авторов. Ведь это интернет, неужели они верят, что человек не проверит ими сказанное?

      And this is who said:
      https://youtu.be/yh-Wu3PPbY4
      So who's lying - you or Putin? Check it out ...
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 9 September 2020 14: 45 New
        +6
        Quote: ccsr
        So who's lying - you or Putin? Check it out ...

        You.
        На видео по ссылке нет ничего про "«галоши», которые якобы только и могли там производить" (с)
        Lie, until the end?
        Даже когда тыкают носом в чёрный уголь, продолжать орать "да вы сами посмотрите, он же белый, разуйте глаза...."
  • A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 9 September 2020 14: 01 New
    +8
    At the very beginning of the 50s, solar panels had already left the laboratories, and in 1954 industrial production began. During the Vietnam War, they were already in full use. The battery slowly charged the battery, and then it was used for its intended purpose. There the guys from the GRU saw them and ordered them from the military industry too. Waited 15 years ...
    1. ccsr
      9 September 2020 14: 31 New
      +1
      Quote: A. Privalov
      There the guys from the GRU saw them and ordered them from the military industry too. Waited 15 years ...

      Do not fantasize if you are not in the subject, because the Vietnam War began in 65, and the first solar panels in the GRU appeared already in the late fifties. They were low power and used expandable mirrored metal plates to increase the flow of solar energy to silicon converters.
      Quote: A. Privalov
      At the very beginning of the 50s, solar panels had already left the laboratories, and in 1954 industrial production began.

      You apparently have a bad idea of ​​how military equipment differs from civilian equipment, especially since American solar panels were ineffective for the military, if only because the panel fill factor with converters was extremely low. And the efficiency of their converters was lower than ours. The Israelis did the same - they just sucked compared to our batteries.
      1. Timeout
        Timeout 9 September 2020 15: 10 New
        +3
        Коллега, спасибо за статью! Помню как нашы РТСовцы были рады этим панелям... Дырчик на КШМке ломался через раз, а пояски к "Соколам" были всегда на готове.
        1. ccsr
          9 September 2020 19: 14 New
          +4
          Quote: Timeout
          Colleague, thanks for the article! I remember how our RTS members were happy with these panels ...

          I will only note that in addition to the strict requirements for this product from the special radio communications service of the GRU General Staff for reliability, there were also restrictions on the dimensions of the solar battery - this led to excessive weight. They had to match the dimensions of the R-394K, (KM) and match the cover of the radio station so that it could be dropped into the GK-30. But the product turned out to be quite versatile for many situations, which is why it was used not only by reconnaissance units, but also, for example, on the training grounds of some types of armed forces.
          1. Timeout
            Timeout 9 September 2020 19: 17 New
            0
            Quote: ccsr
            I will only note that in addition to the strict requirements for this product from the special radio communications service of the GRU General Staff for reliability, there were also restrictions on the dimensions of the solar battery - this led to excessive weight.

            Thank you, I am aware of this)) But for the readers, that's it!
      2. A. Privalov
        A. Privalov 9 September 2020 16: 01 New
        +5
        Quote: ccsr
        the Vietnam War began in 65,

        It started 10 (ten!) Years earlier. Learn history, sir. Then, you will talk about the coefficients and efficiency. hi
        1. Timeout
          Timeout 9 September 2020 17: 28 New
          0
          Quote: A. Privalov
          It started 10 (ten!) Years earlier.

          Dear, yes, the Vietnam War began in 1955, but the US got involved in 1965. If you read Wikipedia, do it carefully. So listen to the ratios and efficiency for general development.
        2. ccsr
          9 September 2020 18: 33 New
          -3
          Quote: A. Privalov
          It started 10 (ten!) Years earlier. Learn history, sir. Then, you will talk about the coefficients and efficiency.

          Generally, one should not confuse the civil war in Vietnam and the full-scale war of the United States against North Vietnam:
          The war began as a civil war in South Vietnam. Later, North Vietnam was drawn into the war, which later received the support of the PRC and the USSR, as well as the United States and its allies (the SEATO military bloc), who were fulfilling their obligations to protect their friendly South Vietnam. As events developed, the war became intertwined with the parallel civil wars in Laos and Cambodia. All of the fighting in Southeast Asia from the late 1950s to 1975 is known as the Second Indochina War.
          The war can be divided into several periods: guerrilla warfare in South Vietnam (1955 [1] [2] - 1965), full-scale US military intervention (March 1965 - 1973) and the final stage of the war (1973-1975).

          As for the coefficients, I think that you are a complete dilettante in this matter, and do not understand at all what we are talking about. But keep in mind that I was then aware of everything that was happening in the world in the field of solar energy converters, which is why I know what you have a perverse idea of.
          1. A. Privalov
            A. Privalov 9 September 2020 19: 04 New
            +8
            Quote: ccsr
            As for the coefficients, I think that you are a complete dilettante in this matter, and do not understand at all what we are talking about. But keep in mind that I was then aware of everything that was happening in the world in the field of solar energy converters, which is why I know what you have a perverse idea of.

            Well, if you are aware of everything that was happening in the world, you should know that even in everyday life, solar-powered receivers were used already in the late 50s. What about military use? Everything there was much better and of higher quality.

            An advertisement for the same device in The New York Daily News, November 24, 1957.
            1. A. Privalov
              A. Privalov 9 September 2020 19: 24 New
              +7
              1954 year. The solar panel charges the battery. The army did not miss the opportunity to use such a device for its own purposes. This is what I was talking about in my first comment.
              1. ccsr
                9 September 2020 19: 40 New
                -3
                Quote: A. Privalov
                1954 year. The solar panel charges the battery.

                They only repeated what was done in the USSR in the thirties:
                About the first household solar panels installed in the USSR in Tashkent, "in the first House of the Sun in the Union", reported the newspaper "Evening Moscow" on January 19, 1933:

                “The house of the sun is a house of miracles. This house stands in Tashkent, on the outskirts of the city, in the green of fruit trees. In the first in the Union House of the Sun - the first two residents, comrades Trofimov and Fazdev, young Soviet scientists.
                In 1928, the Tashkent Geophysical Laboratory began testing solar energy. <...>
                Тов. Фаздев говорит, что для семьи в 5 – 6 человек достаточно установить раму в 1 квадратный метр. Это будет стоить 20 – 30 рублей. 18-ведерная рама три года назад составляла всю актинометрическую (от слова актис – луч) лабораторию молодых ученых и была единственной в Союзе. Сейчас по городам Союза уже 8 таких рам. <…>
                The achievements of solar technicians can become the property of the masses. We must become, if I may say so, sun lovers, ”writes Vechernyaya Moscow 85 years ago.
                1. A. Privalov
                  A. Privalov 9 September 2020 19: 57 New
                  +7
                  Dear ccsr, that's right, back in 1928, the Tashkent Geophysical Laboratory started testing solar energy.
                  I have highlighted the keywords in the text you quoted:
                  ... for a family of 5 - 6 people, it is enough to install a frame of 1 square meter. It will cost 20-30 rubles. 18 bucket frame три года назад составляла всю актинометрическую (от слова актис – луч) лабораторию молодых ученых и была единственной в Союзе. Сейчас по городам Союза уже 8 таких рам. <…>

                  Here we are not talking about a solar battery that converts light into electrical current, but only about a solar-powered water heater.
                  You got a little excited, it happens. lol hi
                  1. ccsr
                    9 September 2020 20: 19 New
                    -3
                    Quote: A. Privalov
                    You got a little excited, it happens.

                    I didn’t get excited, but you’re not in the subject that our work on creating solar converters began in the 30s of the last century:
                    In the 30s of the last century, domestic scientists under the leadership of Academician A.F. Ioffe created the first solar thallium sulphide cells. Their efficiency was also low. However, work on solar panels continued.

                    https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/14467/
                    1. A. Privalov
                      A. Privalov 9 September 2020 20: 43 New
                      +9
                      Quote: ccsr
                      In the 30s of the last century, Russian scientists under the leadership of Academician A.F. Ioffe created the first solar thallium sulfur cells. Their efficiency was also low. However, work on solar panels continued.

                      Quite right. Abram Faivishevich Ioffe dealt with this problem as well. It is true that the idea of ​​using the sulfur-thallium complex did not belong to him, but to Wilhelm Konrad Roentgen, with whom Ioffe studied and then worked at the University of Munich and received his doctorate. But Ioffe, of course, brought this idea to a practical, albeit laboratory application.
                      1. ccsr
                        9 September 2020 20: 54 New
                        -5
                        Quote: A. Privalov
                        Quite right. Abram Faivishevich Ioffe dealt with this problem as well.

                        Well, no need to be clever - I worked for several years with the Leningrad branch of VNNIIIT, which bears his name and knew the people who were his students very well. What did you want to surprise me with? Or should I tell you that in addition to this, he also dealt with thermocouples during the Great Patriotic War? Don't try to surprise me with Internet knowledge - I got it when the Internet didn't exist yet.
                      2. A. Privalov
                        A. Privalov 9 September 2020 21: 41 New
                        +8
                        Quote: ccsr
                        Well, no need to be clever - I worked for several years with the Leningrad branch of VNNIIIT, which bears his name and knew the people who were his students very well. What did you want to surprise me with? Or should I tell you that in addition to this, he also dealt with thermocouples during the Great Patriotic War? Don't try to surprise me with Internet knowledge - I got it when the Internet didn't exist yet.

                        Oh, in 1988-89 I had the pleasure to write my part of several dissertations for good, but very busy people who studied at the graduate school of the Ioffe Physicotechnical Institute. There was in those days this kind of extra work. laughing
                        There was no Internet then, right, but praise be to the Almighty, there were already computers from IBM. One of these - with a 20 MB hard disk (I don't think I remember exactly anymore) helped me a lot, since he had a simple DOS text editor. I had to carry 5,25 inch floppy disks somewhere for printing. hi
          2. ccsr
            9 September 2020 19: 32 New
            -6
            Quote: A. Privalov
            Well, if you are aware of everything that was happening in the world, you should know that even in everyday life, solar-powered receivers were used already in the late 50s. What about military use? Everything there was much better and of higher quality.

            When you bring something from military equipment with silicon converters, capable of giving 2 amperes at a voltage of 12,6 V with 4,5 kg of weight at a temperature of -50 to +50 C and with solar energy of 800 watts per square meter. meter, then we'll talk where you can be sent with your household receiver. By the way, do you have any idea that your battery with a receiver will not pass tests in group 1.14 from the word at all? However, I think you do not understand at all what this is about.
            1. A. Privalov
              A. Privalov 9 September 2020 19: 45 New
              +7
              Quote: ccsr
              When you bring something from military equipment with silicon converters, capable of giving 2 amperes at a voltage of 12,6 V with 4,5 kg of weight at a temperature of -50 to +50 C and with solar energy of 800 watts per square meter. meter, then we'll talk where you can be sent with your household receiver. By the way, do you have any idea that your battery with a receiver will not pass tests in group 1.14 from the word at all? However, I think you do not understand at all what this is about.

              "Батарея солнечная портативная" БСП-1.
              An army folding solar battery containing a set of articulated, stacked in the transport position one on top of the other six panels, consisting of frames with fixed bearing surfaces with solar cells, and a mechanism for opening and folding the panels, with increased battery resistance to shock and vibration loads, along the perimeter - a sealant, while the bearing surfaces are made of duralumin, material and are hermetically attached to the frames.
              Features:
              BSP-1 (weight 5,32 kg),
              works in the temperature range from - 50 to + 55 degrees, with air humidity up to 98%.
              В режиме 'питания РЭА' эта батарея обеспечивает выходное напpяжение 15 В пpи токе до 1,74 А, в режиме 'заpядки' - ток заpяда около 95 мА пpи изменении напpяжения от 10 до 13,8 В.
              They were used in the army in 1980-2000.

              Это же всё 80-е годы прошлого века. Я же вам рассказал о событиях происходивших за 25-30 лет до этого. Однако, зная, что по базовым элементам электроники в 80 годы прошлого века Запад был гораздо более продвинут относительно СССР, могу предположить с большой долей уверенности, что и в области солнечных панелей СССР не была "впереди планеты всей". hi
              1. ccsr
                9 September 2020 19: 53 New
                -6
                Quote: A. Privalov
                Однако, зная, что по базовым элементам электроники в 80 годы прошлого века Запад был гораздо более продвинут относительно СССР, могу предположить с большой долей уверенности, что и в области солнечных панелей СССР не была "впереди планеты всей".

                Your illiteracy does not surprise me - the efficiency of solar panels depends on the purity of obtaining silicon converters, and in this area we were ahead of the whole world, because we were the first to go into space. As for military electronics, for example in the West there were no analogues to our correspondent shortwave radio stations, comparable in performance even to those produced for the operational link of the armed forces. However, you can continue to fill in what was the advanced west in consumer goods - I will not deny that. But this site has a military direction, which is why your attempts to compare consumer goods with military equipment are ridiculous for me, at least on this forum.
                By the way, the Israeli army had solar panels even before 1985, although I don't remember now who produced them, but at least the Americans did something on their orders.
                1. A. Privalov
                  A. Privalov 9 September 2020 20: 23 New
                  10
                  Consumer goods are moving for military development. The military had everything earlier.
                  Выражение "Не было аналогов" -- лишь вигура речи применяемая в российском агитпропе для успокоения душ безграмотных, но очень доверчивых урякалок.
                  I don’t know what the staff did for Israel.
                  Что касается солнечных элементов, то они, действительно, применялись в космической технике, где солнечная энергия использовалась для питания спутников. В 1958 году спутник "Авангард I" использовал крошечную одноваттную панель для питания своих радиоприемников. В том же году были запущены советский "Спутник-3", американские "Авангард II" и "Explorer III" с солнечными панелями на борту. В 1964 году НАСА отвечало за запуск первого спутника NIMBUS, способного полностью работать на солнечной батарее мощностью 470 Вт. В 1966 году НАСА запустило первую в мире орбитальную астрономическую обсерваторию, работающую от солнечных батарей суммарной мощностью 1 кВт.
                  1. ccsr
                    9 September 2020 20: 36 New
                    -6
                    Quote: A. Privalov
                    Выражение "Не было аналогов" -- лишь вигура речи применяемая в российском агитпропе для успокоения душ безграмотных, но очень доверчивых урякалок.

                    You are even more illiterate than I expected, because I specifically mentioned in the text that R&D was carried out, and R&D analyzed not only what was produced in the world for the military, but also promising work in this area, including space. And only then it was determined whether our developers would be able to create something that would satisfy the customer and would be no lower than world achievements in terms of specific characteristics. So our developers were aware of everything that was happening in the world, including the use of gallium arsenide to increase the efficiency of solar cells.
                    Quote: A. Privalov
                    I don’t know what the staff did for Israel.

                    And you could not know this - it is unlikely that you served in the IDF at that time.
            2. sp77ark
              sp77ark 14 September 2020 20: 56 New
              0
              I do not want to disappoint you, but, judging by the x-kams, this is a chemical 15-volt battery, discharging up to 1.74A and charging from a solar panel with a current of up to 95 mA. Those. no 800W per square meter is out of the question, maximum 0.095A x 13.8V = 1.3W.
              There are no miracles. Today, Chinese panels give many times more.
              1. ccsr
                15 September 2020 11: 46 New
                +1
                Quote: sp77ark
                I do not want to disappoint you, but, judging by the x-kams, this is a chemical 15-volt battery, discharging up to 1.74A and charging from a solar panel with a current of up to 95 mA.

                No need to disappoint me - in BSP-1 there were no chemical sources of current from the word at all, so your speculations do not correspond to reality.
                Quote: sp77ark
                Those. no 800W per square meter is out of the question,

                Actually 800 watts per sq. meters is the average power of the Sun's radiation, falling on a summer day at noon in the Central USSR on one square meter of any surface. Here's your reference
                The radiation power of the Sun at its zenith near the Earth's surface is estimated at about 1350 W / m2. ...

                In fact, this is a calculated value for spacecraft, and the real one near the Earth is much less for various reasons.
                Therefore, when developing the samples, we took the real value of the radiation power, and not the theoretically possible one.
                Quote: sp77ark
                Today, Chinese panels give many times more.

                And they did not come close to what the BSP-1 gave out. By the way, if you are really interested in the topic, then they test their products at a radiation power of 1000 watts per square meter for a few seconds, so you will never get what they say in a real situation.
                Поэтому слово "разы" оставьте для дилетантов, и действительно чудес не бывает, т.к.только недавно удалось подойти к повышения КПД кремниевых панелей:
                Researchers at MIT forced one photon to knock out two electrons at once, which increased the theoretical maximum efficiency from 29,1 to 35%. The authors of the discovery hope that further experiments will further increase these numbers.
                Traditionally, it is believed that the efficiency of standard silicon solar cells cannot exceed 29,1%. This is partly due to the fact that each photon can only knock out one electron, even if its energy is enough to interact with two. Scientists have been trying to overcome this limitation for several decades.

                https://zen.yandex.ru/media/htech_plus/preodolen-teoreticheskii-predel-kpd-kremnievyh-solnechnyh-panelei-5d1e1cf47b832900ad7f65b3
                I will only note that in Soviet times they came very close to the theoretical value when creating silicon wafers by sputtering in special vacuum installations, where high purity of materials was achieved.
                1. sp77ark
                  sp77ark 16 September 2020 20: 26 New
                  0
                  1. Ок. Тогда зачем режим "Заряд"? Что и где он заряжает?
                  2. Куда подевалась эта чудо-технология? Почему МО от нее отказалось в 2000 году? Это же "золотая жила"!
                  3. Consider: 1.75A x 13.8V = 24.3W. In aliexpress, a meter panel gives 100W. They lie, but not at times.
                  MP, NASA has panels of Soltek and Frauhofer with an efficiency of 47%. And so, the average figures are from 21% (Chinese) to 37%.
                  1. ccsr
                    16 September 2020 20: 59 New
                    0
                    Quote: sp77ark
                    1. Ок. Тогда зачем режим "Заряд"? Что и где он заряжает?

                    Аккумуляторы 10НКГЦ-1д и 10НКП-6c, а также любой другой аккумулятор напряжением 12,6 В и для этого предусматривались специальные разъёмы типа "крокодил".
                    Quote: sp77ark
                    2. Куда подевалась эта чудо-технология? Почему МО от нее отказалось в 2000 году? Это же "золотая жила"!

                    You probably do not know that then they cut the army so that there was no time for these products - combat units and new weapons went under the knife. If the intelligence center in Lourdes was closed, then no one remembered about such batteries then.
                    Quote: sp77ark
                    3. Consider: 1.75A x 13.8V = 24.3W. In aliexpress, a meter panel gives 100W. They lie, but not at times.

                    Have you seen this panel when folded? By the way, where did you get the idea that this power can be obtained at least within 5-10 minutes if the batteries heat up to 70-75 C? Will this panel withstand landing or mechanical damage from the shock wave?
                    Quote: sp77ark
                    NASA has panels of Soltek and Frauhofer with an efficiency of 47%.

                    Silicon? There are no such indicators for silicon converters.
                    Quote: sp77ark
                    And so, the average rates are from 21% (Chinese) to 37%.

                    Can't reach 37% efficiency of silicon panels yet - don't fantasize. Experimental work is still underway and no one knows what the cost of such panels will be:
                    Researchers at MIT made one photon knock out two electrons at once, which increased the theoretical maximum efficiency from 29,1 to 35%.

                    However, I have no doubt that now they can achieve much higher efficiency of solar converters than it was almost forty years ago - this is a promising direction for the future, and I am a supporter of such developments. Moreover, space needs solar converters - this is obvious.
                    1. sp77ark
                      sp77ark 17 September 2020 00: 48 New
                      0
                      Понятно. Батареи заряжались током 95мА от панели. В режиме "питания" ток реверсировался - подключенные батареи питали аппаратуру через стабилизатор напяжения 15В током до 1.75А, чтобы не переключать батарею.
                      I took information about the panels here: https://solarlove.org/which-solar-panels-most-efficient/
                      Info updated in 2015, maybe now max. the efficiency is even higher.
                      And panels in ali polysilicon, of different sizes, can be packed and connected as you like and assemble a source with the required voltage and current. There are also folding ones for tourists. We are talking about consumer goods, in the military version, the design and materials will be appropriate, as well as the operating temperature.
                    2. ccsr
                      17 September 2020 12: 52 New
                      0
                      Quote: sp77ark
                      Clear. The batteries were charged with a current of 95mA from the panel.

                      Only 10NKGTs-1d, because these are HERMETIC batteries, and a higher current would lead to an explosion when charged. That is why the charge current was limited to 100 mA. For all other batteries, the maximum charging current was 2 A.
                      Quote: sp77ark
                      В режиме "питания" ток реверсировался - подключенные батареи питали аппаратуру через стабилизатор напяжения 15В током до 1.75А, чтобы не переключать батарею.

                      This is not entirely true, because at that time most of the equipment was designed for 12,6 V plus 10 and minus 20% of the nominal. So when powering the equipment, the maximum output voltage is 13,8 V, and when charging, the voltage could reach large values ​​up to 14,5 - 15 V.
                      Quote: sp77ark
                      And panels in ali polysilicon, of different sizes, can be packed and connected as you like and assemble a source with the required voltage and current. There are also folding ones for tourists.

                      For the military, this is not suitable due to the fact that it is an unreliable design, and it is dangerous to do it under bullets.
                      Quote: sp77ark
                      We are talking about consumer goods, in the military version, the design and materials will be appropriate, as well as the operating temperature.

                      I immediately said that this is a MILITARY development and there are completely different requirements for such products. Not one consumer goods are suitable for this, which is why they can make their own batteries without strict restrictions. When the BSP-1 product was being developed, everything that was produced in the world, including for the military, was studied. Unambiguously I affirm that no one in the world then produced anything like this in terms of reliability, range of application and dimensions when folded.
                    3. sp77ark
                      sp77ark 17 September 2020 22: 49 New
                      0
                      Наберите в гугле "military solar panel" или "tactical solar panel" smile
                      There will be many pictures.
                      For example: https: //powertraveller.com/products/tactical-solargorilla-multi-voltage-solar-charger
                      Then I take my leave.
                    4. ccsr
                      18 September 2020 11: 22 New
                      -1
                      Quote: sp77ark
                      For example: https: //powertraveller.com/products/tactical-solargorilla-multi-voltage-solar-charger
                      Then I take my leave.

                      An example is clearly unfortunate, if only because you bring today's batteries and compare them with those that were produced in our country 35 years ago. By the way, you seem to have not even studied their characteristics, because
                      TACTICAL SOLARILLA
                      MULTI-VOLTAGE SOLAR CHARGER BEDROOM
                      * Multi-voltage 10W, clamshell solar charger
                      * 1x USB output: 5V / 2A
                      * 1X DC output: 20V / 0.5A
                      * Weight: 848g
                      • Size: 264mm x 200mm x 19mm (folded)

                      If you are familiar with calculating the power of solar panels, you will understand that this battery is 2,5 times weaker in power than BSP-1. So the comparison is incorrect, and I do not even compare the extended range of characteristics, because the advertising brochure is modestly silent about this. For example, the temperature range of application, mechanical strength or the ability to overload, which is important in a combat zone.
  • A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 9 September 2020 19: 33 New
    +9
    Quote: ccsr
    The Israelis did the same - they just sucked compared to our batteries.

    Don't bother yourself or people. Israel did not manufacture solar panels until 1985.
  • Timeout
    Timeout 9 September 2020 14: 11 New
    0
    Quote: Undecim
    The first publicly available mobile telephony appeared in 1946 in St. Louis.

    Уважаемый, не передергивайте. Это была опытная сеть, которая никак себя не оправдала. И потом почти 40 лет не могли нормально реализовать. А в Союзе мобильная сеть "Алтай" на основе сот работала с 1965 года в 114 городах.
    1. Undecim
      Undecim 9 September 2020 21: 30 New
      +7
      Dear, do not blame your sore head on a healthy one. You twist. It was about the fact that mobile communication was invented in the USSR in 1958, and not about where it is normally implemented. Read the comments carefully.
  • Doctor
    Doctor 9 September 2020 15: 02 New
    +4
    Article class!
    All on the topic, little known, competent.
    I wish I had more of this, I’m tired of politics ...
  • Alexey RA
    Alexey RA 9 September 2020 15: 22 New
    +8
    And in conclusion I would like to note that when our leaders mention the USSR and "galoshes", which supposedly could only produce there, it makes me laugh from their "enlightenment", because they have no idea what the country's industry could produce in that time.

    Rather, it becomes ridiculous from the authors of such maxims, who did not even bother to fully watch the president's speech, content with rehash of Caruso performed by Rabinovich cropped rollers from pseudo patriots.
    Вот что на самом деле было сказано по поводу "галош":
    Yes, my dear, yes. No need to discuss. The fact is that what we produced (and we don’t have to wave our hands), nobody needed, because nobody bought our galoshes, except for the Africans, who had to walk on the hot sand. That is the whole point.
    We had a defense industry - cool, strong, and we are still proud of it. We are grateful to our grandfathers and our fathers for creating such a defense after the Great Patriotic War.
    From the audience: ... And the first satellite.
    Vladimir Putin: Both the first satellite and the first man in space are our common pride, these are the achievements of the Soviet government, of which we are all proud. These are nationwide achievements.
    But consumer goods ... Zhirinovsky has already said this. Where were they? There were none. Let's not lie to each other and the people. The people know what was and what was not.

    И БСП-1 явно не относится к товарам народного потребления, к которым и только к которым относился термин "галоши".
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 9 September 2020 15: 28 New
      +1
      Quote: Alexey RA
      к которым и только к которым относился термин "галоши".

      Есть мнение, что в этом троллизьме Путин не был оригинален. Первым был ещё Чуковский в стихотворении "Телефон"
      And the root cause was a very strange advertisement of Rezinotrest
    2. ccsr
      9 September 2020 18: 49 New
      -5
      Quote: Alexey RA
      Вот что на самом деле было сказано по поводу "галош":

      Вы, видимо, как профессиональный агитатор, может и не видите уничижительного отношения Путина в словах о галошах в оценке СССР, стране, которой был подвластен не только космос но и ядерная энергия. А вот мне, как практику, стыдно за нашего президента, который показал себя просто невеждой по отношению к тем, кто тогда творил и работал. Кстати, с чего вы взяли что наши галоши кому-то нужны были, если наши автомобили "Лады" даже в ФРГ и Англии покупали, а фотоаппараты "Зенит" я видел в продаже в Германии. Так что оперативный сотрудник КГБ Путин этого не мог не видеть даже в Дрездене - мы с ним в одно время там были.
      Quote: Alexey RA
      And BSP-1 clearly does not belong to consumer goods,

      А вот здесь вы опять не в теме - на это изделие было много заказчиков из гражданской сферы, но производственные мощности завода не позволяли удовлетворить их запросы, да и режим секретности не позволял сразу же начать поставки в народное хозяйство помимо Минобороны. К слову, Краснодарский завод "Сатурн" начал выпускать дешевые солнечные панели на пластиковой основе в размерах одной пластины БСП-1, но с меньшими требованиями по надежности и меньшим зарядным током - вы просто не в курсе как все обстояло в то время.
      1. Aag
        Aag 10 September 2020 11: 32 New
        +1
        Автору огромное спасибо за интересную статью и не менее интересные "выступления в прениях "!
        hi
      2. Alexey RA
        Alexey RA 14 September 2020 09: 54 New
        -1
        Quote: ccsr
        You, apparently, as a professional agitator, may not even see Putin's derogatory attitude in the words about galoshes in the assessment of the USSR, a country that controlled not only space but also nuclear energy.

        So the GDP does not deny the achievements in this area, moreover, it calls to be proud of them.
        We had a defense industry - cool, strong, and we are still proud of it. We are grateful to our grandfathers and our fathers for creating such a defense after the Great Patriotic War.
        From the audience: ... And the first satellite.
        Vladimir Putin: Both the first satellite and the first man in space are our common pride, these are the achievements of the Soviet government, of which we are all proud. These are nationwide achievements.
        But consumer goods ... Zhirinovsky has already said this. Where were they? They weren't there.

        You stubbornly mix the defense industry and consumer goods into a bunch, seeing in the criticism of Soviet consumer goods the indiscriminate blaming of the whole country.
        Quote: ccsr
        Кстати, с чего вы взяли что наши галоши кому-то нужны были, если наши автомобили "Лады" даже в ФРГ и Англии покупали, а фотоаппараты "Зенит" я видел в продаже в Германии.

        Надо только уточнить: "Лады" экспортной версии, которые в СССР ценились гораздо выше того, что АвтоВАЗ производил для внутреннего потребления.
        As for the quality of domestic vehicles ... you know, I remember the times when a car mechanic was one of the ten most prestigious professions, along with a meat chopper and a dentist. smile И при наличии в семье машины нужно было либо иметь знакомого на СТО, либо проводить выходные в гараже, доводя до ума свою "ласточку".
        Насчёт же "Зенита"... ну Вы же в курсе - что было основной продукцией Красногорска.
        The quality of domestic consumer goods was such that everyone who could get imports. Walls from the GDR, Czech chandeliers, Yugoslavian boots, etc. Or they even sewed and knitted themselves, since there were no problems with the patterns (we had a whole section of the wall filled with magazines with them).
        Quote: ccsr
        But here you are again not in the subject - there were many customers from the civilian sphere for this product, but the production capacity of the plant did not allow satisfying their requests, and the secrecy regime did not allow immediately starting supplies to the national economy in addition to the Ministry of Defense.

        The product was originally designed for the military. Therefore, this is not a consumer goods.
        1. ccsr
          14 September 2020 12: 31 New
          +2
          Quote: Alexey RA
          So the GDP does not deny the achievements in this area, moreover, it calls to be proud of them.

          Well, since he is so proud of the achievements of the past, then why did he drag galoshes? Diligence not in the mind, or what?
          Quote: Alexey RA
          You stubbornly mix the defense industry and consumer goods into a bunch, seeing in the criticism of Soviet consumer goods the indiscriminate blaming of the whole country.

          It is in the example of galoshes that I see an indiscriminate criticism of the past of our country - Putin did not accept it after the revolution or the Great Patriotic War, so there is no need to give humiliating examples for us.
          And in Africa then we did not trade in galoshes, but built dams, power plants and factories, unfortunately this was a wrong decision.
          Quote: Alexey RA
          And about the quality of domestic vehicles ...

          Just don’t tell me this - I had four cars from the VAZ family, and if a person’s hands grow from where they need to be, then this car could be repaired at home, even without a garage.
          Quote: Alexey RA
          Насчёт же "Зенита"... ну Вы же в курсе - что было основной продукцией Красногорска.
          The quality of domestic consumer goods was such that everyone who could get imports. Walls from the GDR, Czech chandeliers, Yugoslavian boots, etc.

          А сейчас вы на каких автомобилях ездите, какими фотоаппаратами пользуетесь или на каких самолетах летаете? Где же достижения "прогрессивного капитализма" в России, если мы утратили лидерство в большинстве передовых технологий, в том числе и в гражданском авиастроении. К слову, уже в шестидесятых мы "Ракеты" и "Кометы" на подводных крыльях продавали в Грецию и некоторые страны Средиземноморья - это тоже из класса "галош"? Может прикинете, сколько самолетов и вертолетов советского производства летает до сих пор в разных странах, чтобы хотя бы не поплевывать в наше прошлое, вспоминая про галоши.
          Quote: Alexey RA
          The product was originally designed for the military.

          This does not mean anything, and moreover, it explains to many critics of the Soviet past that some military developments were very quickly implemented. For example, almost immediately after the start of serial production of BSP-1 in Krasnodar, they began to produce single civilian panels in the dimensions of this battery and which used the developments that were obtained in the course of R&D - I myself held them. The same has been observed in many other industries and it is a fact.
          1. Alexey RA
            Alexey RA 14 September 2020 13: 18 New
            -1
            Quote: ccsr
            Well, since he is so proud of the achievements of the past, then why did he drag galoshes? Diligence not in the mind, or what?

            Да потому что нельзя изображать СССР одной краской: либо тоталитарный ГУЛАГ, либо молочные реки в кисельных берегах. А то у нас любители СССР стараются быть святее Папы Римского, пытаясь опровергнуть даже официально разрешённую в советские времена критику "отдельных недостатков". smile
            Quote: ccsr
            Just don’t tell me this - I had four cars from the VAZ family, and if a person’s hands grow from where they need to be, then this car could be repaired at home, even without a garage.

            You see what's the matter ... the car is needed in order to transport people. And not so that the driver regularly repairs it.
            I also remember replacing piston rings with 21063 in a garage. And regular replacement of valve stem seals, adjusting clearances, bleeding brakes, etc.
            Quote: ccsr
            Now what kind of cars do you drive, what cameras do you use, or what airplanes do you fly?

            Я сейчас езжу на машине, которая от меня требует только регулярной смены масла и два раза в год - "переобувания". А классику и зубило я вспоминаю как страшный сон.
            1. ccsr
              14 September 2020 13: 50 New
              +1
              Quote: Alexey RA
              You see what's the matter ... the car is needed in order to transport people. And not so that the driver regularly repairs it.

              Кто вам сказал что наши "жигули" постоянно ламались? У меня на последней "восьмерке" в нулевых вообще не было серьезных поломок и на сервис я ни разу не ездил - все ТО делал сам. Поломки конечно же бывали, но у меня на первом моем гарантийном "Форд-Фокусе" полетело корзина сцепления и гидравлический усилитель, и оба случая были признаны заводскими дефектами. Так что не надо про качество автомобилей говорить, тем более что у меня водительский стаж 48 лет, и сейчас я покупаю только продукцию Тойоты.
              Quote: Alexey RA
              I also remember replacing piston rings with 21063 in a garage. And regular replacement of valve stem seals, adjusting clearances, bleeding brakes, etc.

              If I tell you the last cost for MOT of my car at an official dealership (the car is under warranty) is far from the most expensive, then your caps costs will look like the cost of a bottle of cognac. So everything is relative - at least take this into account. ...
              Quote: Alexey RA
              Я сейчас езжу на машине, которая от меня требует только регулярной смены масла и два раза в год - "переобувания".

              Я тоже на такой езжу, потому что сам я уже не полезу никогда в нутро моей машины - там слишком все наворочено даже для специалистов. Но это следствие научно-технического прогресса, а не отсталости СССР в той же подвижной технике. К слову, уж раз вы заговорили про автомобиль, напомню, что наш танк в восьмидесятых оценивался в 2 млн. долларов при продаже, а "Мерседесы" для Грачёва были закуплены по цене 180 тыс. зап. марок каждый. Т.е как ни крути, а за один танк мы могли закупить в рознице больше десяти Мерседесов премиум-класса, и еще бы осталось на мелочь исходя из курса доллара и марки 1:1,8. Поэтому не надо удивляться что в стране денег не хватало на Мерседесы для всех - слишком дорого нам война обошлось, вот и вкладывались в безопасность. Надеюсь хоть это вы будете учитывать.
              Quote: Alexey RA
              And I remember the classics and the chisel as a bad dream.

              У меня было две пятерки, одна тринадцатая и одна восьмерка, на которых я ездил по несколько лет с восьмидесятых, и я их вспоминаю с большой любовью, и не помню чтобы я с ними мучился или страдал. Может проблема в "прокладке" , а не в качестве машин?
  • Dimka75
    Dimka75 9 September 2020 15: 28 New
    +1
    If we compare the BSP-1 product with foreign analogues of that time, then everything that was produced in the USA, Japan, France and Israel for military purposes was inferior in tactical, technical and specific characteristics our design, and their reliability lagged far behind the reliability of our product. This is not surprising, because at that time we were not only the leaders in space development, but everything that was connected with space was the most advanced in our country.

    I readily believe and agree that it is better.
    Can you give any figures for these characteristics?
    I would like to compare for myself, even if not with those foreign ones that were then, but with modern portable panels.
    1. ccsr
      10 September 2020 12: 50 New
      +1
      Quote: Dimka75
      Can you give any figures for these characteristics?

      The main characteristics are given in the article itself, but if you are interested in exact numbers, then I will just remind you that the BSP-1 actually weighed less than 4,5 kg, and the whole set with a bag and a set of different devices was already pulling for more than five. The maximum charging current, like the power supply current of the CEA, was 2 amperes at a voltage of 12,6 to 13,8 V, as described on the forum, and the minimum was 100 mA, for a sealed 10NKGTs-1d battery, so that its explosion did not occur during charging ... https://forum.guns.ru/forummessage/114/1904743.html
      As for the strength characteristics and temperature range, then no one in the world could produce anything like that, and usually no one asked such requirements, which is why their products for civilian needs were lighter than our BSP-1. The battery could be under water at a depth of 1 - 1,5 m and after deploying it, it was enough just to check and wipe the connectors before connecting so that moisture does not remain in them if it suddenly gets there. The permissible humidity of 98% indicates that during tropical showers it did not need to be rolled up and could be left to work until the sun appeared. I don't know what is being produced for military purposes now, but I think that the need for solar panels remains, at least for certain regions and hard-to-reach places. Whoever turned ROM-5m will confirm that it is better to carry a battery than a manual charger weighing about 3 kg.
      1. Dimka75
        Dimka75 10 September 2020 13: 18 New
        +1
        Thanks for the answer
  • Operator
    Operator 9 September 2020 18: 53 New
    +7
    Вопрос - а почему генератор с педальным приводом не подошел? Ночью солнечная батарея не работает, а штатная "жертва" по кручению педалей в любом коллективе найдется всегда.
    1. SaLaR
      SaLaR 10 September 2020 18: 56 New
      +6
      even a needle has weight in the field ...))
    2. ccsr
      11 September 2020 13: 07 New
      +3
      Quote: Operator
      The question is - why didn't the pedal-driven generator fit?

      Because of the size and weight. These were in the American army during World War II, but they are not suitable for special forces units, which is why they use a manual ROM-5m there

      Quote: Operator
      а штатная "жертва" по кручению педалей в любом коллективе найдется всегда.

      А если "коллектив" 2-3 человека всего? Вы просто не представляете сколько времени нужно крутить ручку, чтобы зарядить полностью "Пояс" - несколько часов зачастую, в зависимости от разряженности аккумуляторной батареи. И если вы в тропиках находитесь, то радости от этого мало, и при -30С тоже. Вот поэтому солнечные батареи имели ограничения по применению, и не являлись обязательной техникой для комплектации разведгрупп. Все решал здравый смысл и условия в том же Афганистане. Да и по большому счёту по первоначальному замыслу их не для спецназовцев планировали использовать. Проблема была не только в наших посольских радистах, но и в том что мы помогали разным странам, типа Ангола, Мозамбик, Куба, сандинисты в Никарагуа, и еще кучу разных стран, находящихся южнее наших границ, и где были агентурные сети, использующие радиостанции Р-394К.