Toxicologists of the Bundeswehr: We cannot provide data on the situation with Navalny due to their secrecy

The statement of German military toxicologists on the situation with Alexei Navalny managed to cause a wide public response.

We will remind that earlier in the government of the Federal Republic of Germany, with reference to the toxicologists of the Bundeswehr, it was stated that “traces of a substance from the Novichok group were allegedly found in the body of the Russian oppositionist. Russia demanded that the German side provide specific data. German Foreign Minister Heiko Maas said that Germany "is ready to share information with Russia and provide legal assistance."

And today, following the statements of Maas, the Bundeswehr Institute of Toxicology is receiving statements that “the laboratory representatives cannot provide any data on the situation with Alexei Navalny, since this is unacceptable from the point of view of security and for reasons of secrecy”. It is reported in its material "New Newspaper".

In a statement from representatives of the toxicology laboratory of the German army, it is said that "this is a sensitive area", and therefore "information cannot be provided."

Such words caused a resonance due to the fact that they actually exactly repeat the statements previously made in the United States and Britain after accusing Russia or Syria of allegedly using chemical weapons, including BOV. The statements were as follows:

We have proofs, but we cannot provide them to you, since they are secret.

In this regard, experts in Russia believe that another "spectacle" is being played out in Germany, which, as, for example, in the case of the Skripals in Britain, aims at another round of the sanctions confrontation against Russia. In this case, the goal has already been announced - sanctions against the unfinished Nord Stream-2 gas pipeline.

Comments

[Servisinzhener]

It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found.

[FenH]

Quote: Servisinzhener

It is very interesting what could be secret about what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in which samples were found.

Substance-Dichlorvos, Concentration-3 zilch, per glass of beer. Only shhh, it's a mystery

[KAV]

We have proofs, but we cannot provide them to you, since they are secret.

We decided to mow under the striped ones, or what? So they didn't come out like a stigma! The State Department is already doing it badly, and then some colony decided to speak in the words of the owners. Already really, except for laughter it does not cause anything else!
Theater of absurdity!
It looks like the chancellor decided to play a dark game. Wow, how strongly the draconite of the striped ones is our SP2! Any methods are used, just to overwhelm this project! They do not disdain anything ... Inhumans.
By the way, such a clumsy carrying out of this operation only means that the customer is in a very hurry and nervous. They sculpt everything, literally, in haste.

[Simargl]

Quote: KAV

We decided to mow under the striped ones, or what?

What training manual is issued, and mow.

[Tatyana]

Toxicologists of the Bundeswehr: We cannot provide data on the situation with Navalny because of their secrecy

Well, that means that Navalny is his own foreign "patrons" of foreign - English or German, etc. - "Newbie" and poisoned!
For it is known that "Novichok" is called "Russian" only from the homeland of his invention, while it is successfully produced in Great Britain, the USA, Germany, etc. - in general, in 5 Western countries. In this case, the country of origin of the "Novice" can be determined by the degree of its purification on the national equipment of this country.
It is precisely this information that Germany, a NATO country, is hiding under the seal of secrecy.

It is necessary for Russia to boldly and directly accuse Germany or Great Britain / USA of poisoning Navalny by them with a "Novichok" foreign - German, British, American, etc. - production. Whose "Novice" turns out to be - that country and the poisoner of Novalny.
The Russian Federation has all the grounds for this.

[prior]

That, no ... Components of Nord Stream-2, interference in the American elections, the annexation of the Crimea and the Malaysian Boeing were found in Lyosha's urine. But this is a secret.

[FenH]

Quote: prior

That, no ... Components of Nord Stream-2, interference in the American elections, the annexation of the Crimea and the Malaysian Boeing were found in Lyosha's urine. But this is a secret.

And before the landing of the "un-poisoned" one, some two men let the cat out of the cage. It was established by video cameras that the cat was rubbing at the feet of the "grass-haired" one, and it looks like a Skripals cat by the composite.

[hydrox]

Here is a hunt for you all to joke about the unfortunate warriors of the Wehrmacht, who have no idea that there are such devices in the world as chromatographs and mass spectrometers, on which even schoolchildren can work in the Novosibirsk Academgorodok, and these stoeros contrived not someone, but to expose your Madame Chancellor in front of the whole world in one leaky shirt LIE and all because of some unwashed sisyan !! Seems like the wrong age old woman?

[Captain45]

Quote: FenH

Substance-Dichlorvos, Concentration-3 zilch, per glass of beer. Only shhh, it's a mystery

It is because of this that Xisyan suffered. I would have known about the secret of three zips, the fourth would not have pissed off and would not have gone out.

[FenH]

Quote: Captain45

Quote: FenH

Substance-Dichlorvos, Concentration-3 zilch, per glass of beer. Only shhh, it's a mystery

It is because of this that Xisyan suffered. I would have known about the secret of three zips, the fourth would not have pissed off and would not have gone out.

[Captain45]

Quote: FenH

The little people grew smaller. I remember in the years of "dry law" 86-88, I was still working in the teaching staff, that only the people did not drink. Wherever there is "Novichok", such mixtures interfered and nothing, no one died. Wait ... weaklings ...

[user1212]

Quote: Servisinzhener

It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found.

And it can be secret for exactly one reason, because the voiced official version does not fight with toxicology :)))

[SRC P-15]

Quote: user1212

And it can be secret for exactly one reason, because the voiced official version does not fight with toxicology :)))

And I think that it is secret due to the fact that Navalny is no longer there and even ashes are gone! If the toxicology laboratory of the Bundeswehr provides "secret" data on the poisoning, then in the end they will face a dilemma: provide Navalny, alive or dead. But most likely he is no longer on this mortal earth.

[Doctor]

Very interesting what could be secret

The resolution of their mass spectrometers.

[Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich]

Quote: Arzt

The resolution of their mass spectrometers.

The announcement of the result of the examination will require the announcement:
1. Methods of analysis and sample preparation;
2. What was taken as a standard poisonous substance and where did this standard come from from the German toxicologists;

[strelokmira]

2. What was taken as a standard poisonous substance and where did this standard come from from the German toxicologists;

Station shawarma, was purchased from Ashot)

[Doctor]

The announcement of the result of the examination will require the announcement:
1. Methods of analysis and sample preparation;
2. What was taken as a standard poisonous substance and where did this standard come from from the German toxicologists;

And what's the secret?
Methods are about the same everywhere, and any self-respecting medical service should have samples of BOV of a potential enemy.

But how many ions from a cubic centimeter the Bruker of the Bundeswehr can get, and not the one they sell to everyone, it's interesting.

[Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich]

Quote: Arzt

The methods are about the same everywhere, and any self-respecting medical service should have samples of CWA of a potential adversary, but how many ions from a cubic centimeter the Bruker of the Bundeswehr can get, and not the one they sell to everyone, is interesting.

About the fact that the accuracy of the mass spectrograph or chromatograph in service with the Bundeswehr is secret information - this is understandable, there can be no dispute here.
But what about the standard substance is more interesting.
The OM can be of Russian origin, or it can be brewed in a laboratory somewhere in Germany itself. Thus, having a Russian OM and a German OM, one can conduct an additional analysis and draw a conclusion about whose OM in Navalny's analyzes (if, of course, the poisonous substance is actually there).
I think the secrecy is connected with this.

[Evdokim]

Quote: Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich

Thus, having Russian OV and German OV, one can carry out additional analysis and draw a conclusion about whose OV in Navalny's analyzes

This is the very essence. It is possible to pull the Germans themselves with these analyzes so much by the scrotum that even Merkel herself will have her eyes on her forehead !!!

[Doctor]

Thus, having Russian OV and German OV, it is possible to conduct additional analysis and draw a conclusion about whose OV in the analyzes

It may be possible, but it is almost impossible to prove. This is not the question.

In principle, the Germans could not find any "newbie" in the body, firstly because no one used it, and secondly, even if they did use it, you will find hell in 2 hours.

Most likely it was like this.
Navalny developed hypoglycemia on the plane (as the Omsk doctors say), and while the plane was landing, he was already in a coma. Moreover, in a deep coma, 5 points according to Glasgow, as the ambulance claims again, naturally with a decrease in heart rate, so they began to inject atropine.
Upon arrival at the hospital, he was intubated and transferred to mechanical ventilation, and by itself muscle relaxants were injected.

Further, not feeling sins behind themselves, they calmly gave it to the Germans.
They took skeletal muscle punctate and found synapses clogged with acetylcholine left over from muscle relaxants.
It is now argued that it was a super dose of ChE inhibitors.
It will not be easy to excuse yourself.

[mikh-korsakov]

Dwarf! Do you mean identification of the origin of OM by impurities? I doubt that if Navalny survived, and thus the dose of OM, which he supposedly received is much less than the LD50, it will be possible to determine the impurities. The LD50 value for compounds of the "novice" type is not available in open sources, but it is believed that their toxicity is ten times higher than that of Vx. Absolutely lethal dose Vx 0,8 mg by inhalation and 3,2 mg when applied to the skin for a person weighing 80 kg. Decreasing the values ​​10 times, we get 0,08 and 0,32 mg for an absolutely lethal dose. The half-life values ​​are unknown to me. Considering the elimination of the poison and its binding to the target biostructures, I think it is reasonable that the concentration from the moment of poisoning to the sampling decreased 10 times. The sensitivity of modern mass spectrometers is 10 ^ 10 μg / μL. Let us even assume that the efficiency of extracting poison from a sample is 100%, which is not achieved even in the best practices. The volume of blood is 5 liters. Suppose that 50 ml of blood was taken from the patient for analysis at the same time, that is, it turns out that 1/1000 of the dose of poison will go for analysis. Let it be possible to concentrate the sample by 100%, which does not happen, and let us assume that we managed to concentrate the sample to 1 μL, which also does not happen. Then, for the lethal dose, taking into account all the assumptions, we obtain 0,08 μg and 0,32 μg, respectively. Assuming that a person received 1/100 of a lethal dose, it turns out that the definition of a poison is on the verge of sensitivity, even assuming that the system is ideal. that is, there is no noise.

[Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich]

In other words, the presence of OF is confirmed “within the limits of the device error”. Well, it is not possible to identify the country of origin of this OM ...
In other words, Russia's involvement in this incident is an exuberant fantasy of German politicians on a given topic.

[Polymer]

Quote: mikh-korsakov

Decreasing the values ​​10 times, we get 0,08 and 0,32 mg for an absolutely lethal dose. The half-life values ​​are unknown to me. Considering the elimination of the poison and its binding to the target biostructures, I think it is reasonable that the concentration from the moment of poisoning to taking a sample decreased by 10 times

Interesting arithmetic. I think it should be added that the dose was NOT lethal. Those. the initial concentration is even lower.

[The eye of the crying]

Quote: Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich

What was taken as a standard poisonous substance and where did this standard come from from the German toxicologists;

The formula for "substance A-234" is generally known.

[Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich]

Quote: Eye of the Crying

The formula for "substance A-234" is generally known.

Yes, the formula is known, but the substance is never completely pure. Accordingly, depending on the technologies for its production, even from the specific enterprise where the substance is manufactured, it will contain impurities / contaminants.
Accordingly, by the nature of impurities / contaminants, one can make a conclusion - our (Russian) substance is or not.
If not - a question for the Germans: where did you get THIS?

[The eye of the crying]

Quote: Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich

Yes, the formula is known, but the substance is never completely pure.

So what? They are looking for a substance, not an impurity.

Quote: Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich

Accordingly, by the nature of impurities / contaminants, one can make a conclusion - our (Russian) substance is or not.

Who will draw this conclusion and how? As far as I understand, the Germans did not do it.

[voyaka uh]

After the poisoning of the Skripals, the British sent samples to several leading European laboratories.

[Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich]

Quote: voyaka uh

After the poisoning of the Skripals, the British sent samples to several leading European laboratories.

Wonderful, but where did the British take those standard samples ??? did you cook it yourself? Then the same questions apply to the Skripals case and to the incident with Navalny: who exactly is the OV in their carcasses, is it Russian or not? or not at all?

[voyaka uh]

I do not know. Maybe these guys walking from the railway station to the Skripals' house are Russians, or maybe not at all?
But in an interview with Simonyan, they did not deny their tourist walks.

[Cyril G ...]

Quote: voyaka uh

they did not deny their tourist walks.

It is forbidden? The cameras in the area of ​​the former colonel's house did not record them ...

[culinary]

Quote: voyaka uh

I do not know. Maybe these guys walking from the railway station to the Skripals' house are Russians, or maybe not at all?
But in an interview with Simonyan, they did not deny their tourist walks.

I was in this Salisbury. There are a lot of tourists there. Because Stonehenge is nearby !!!! By the way, there is something else ...
And the cathedral is truly magnificent!

[user1212]

Quote: voyaka uh

I do not know. Maybe these guys walking from the railway station to the Skripals' house are Russians, or maybe not at all?

If there is no water in the tap, then you drank ... Russians

[Liam]

Quote: Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich

Wonderful, but where did the British take those standard samples ???

In the OPCW

[Liam]

Quote: voyaka uh

After the poisoning of the Skripals, the British sent samples to several leading European laboratories.

The OPCW has Newcomer reference samples.

April 12 2018

The Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) concluded that the British authorities correctly identified the substance with which they poisoned ex-GRU Colonel Sergei Skripal and his daughter Julia in Salisbury.

"The samples collected by the OPCW team confirm Britain's findings about the nature of the toxin used in Salisbury," the organization said in a statement.

The OPCW said that the samples collected by the organization's experts were extremely pure and almost free of impurities, according to the BBC's security correspondent Frank Gardner.


The name "Novice" is not mentioned in the text of the OPCW's statement, Gardner said. Also, the organization did not indicate the possible origin of the substance, since this was not the task of the experts.

The OPCW has released another, classified report on the attack on the Skripals, which it handed over to all member countries of the organization. Russia is a member of the OPCW.

"The name and chemical structure of the substance are described in the full - classified - version of the report," added the organization. The open part of the report can be found on the OPCW website .

[Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich]

[quote = Liam] The OPCW has Newbie reference samples. 12 April 2018 The Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) has concluded that the British authorities have correctly identified the substance that poisoned ex-GRU Colonel Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia in Salisbury. " collected by the OPCW team confirm Britain's findings about the nature of the toxin used in Salisbury, "the organization said in a statement. The OPCW said the samples collected by the organization's experts were exceptionally pure and almost free of impurities, according to the BBC's correspondent on security issues Frank Gardner. The name "Newbie" is not mentioned in the text of the OPCW statement, says Gardner. Also, the organization did not indicate the possible origin of the substance, since this was not the task of the experts. The OPCW released another, classified report on the attack on the Skripals, which it handed over to all member countries of the organization. Russia is a member of the OPCW. "The name and chemical structure of the substance are described in the full - classified - version of the report," the organization added. The open part of the report can be found on the OPCW website. [/ Quot

Well, then the situation is absolutely absurd: kill a person (poison) and leave your business card and written confessions of guilt at the crime scene ...

[sharp-lad]

Samples from Port Down's reserves?

[Lipchanin]

Quote: Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich

... What was taken as a standard poisonous substance and where did this standard come from from German toxicologists

They didn't try our self-dance

[Servisinzhener]

As an option. But the same is doubtful because for a chemical warfare agent, the time and rate of elimination from the body must be known. And based on these figures, we can assume what sensitivity should have a device that can determine this substance after so many days ..

[Captain Pushkin]

Quote: Arzt

Very interesting what could be secret

The resolution of their mass spectrometers.

Most likely, both we and the Germans use the same mass spectrometers, made in the USA.

[Motorist]

Quote: Arzt

The resolution of their mass spectrometers.

Doctor, put a smiley face - the people here are serious (judging by the minuses).

[iouris]

Quote: Servisinzhener

Very interesting what could be secret

I answer. Navalny has been poisoned by Nord Stream 2.

[Svetlana]

In theory, detection methods, techniques and equipment can be veiled in mystery. And most importantly, the minimum detection threshold.
And if you say that the object has "Three-pah-acid", then the opponent will scratch his head and say: I do not believe. A lot of time has passed, Show me how .. And how, it is secret and new debates and curses will begin. Therefore, it is easier to say right away: Nope, secret.
...
Something like this.

[Servisinzhener]

Quote: Svetlana

"Three-pah-acid"

excreted from the body at such a rate. In skin / blood / urine / hair, the concentration decreases at a rate of X. Hence, after Y days, the concentration should be Z. Taking into account the correction factors.
But statements about secrecy may be due to the fact that if you voice the method, then their deception will become clear. Since such a concentration cannot be detected by this method.

[Svetlana]

That's it. The one who determines everything to the thousandth will tell the one who can determine to the millionth that this is a deception.
Therefore, in order to stop all these secondary conversations, they talk about the secret at once.
...

[Arthur73]

That is, it is proposed to take these non-gentlemen at their word? And how is it known that they are not lying? They immediately gave up, because in the Tomsk samples of Alyoshka, it turns out, they cannot find anything. And trusting them is the last thing. It was not for nothing that they immediately accused Moscow and began to put pressure on SP2. Who shouts the loudest "derzhivora" I think it is not necessary to remind. And Europe has been hysterical for several days already.

[qQQQ]

Quote: Svetlana

Therefore, it is easier to say right away: Nope, secret.

Following this logic, any accusation of poisoning, and indeed anything, does not need any proof at all. Gentlemen should take their word for it.

[figwam]

The circus of the absurd continues now the Bundescircus

[cost]

The circus of the absurd continues

all that remains is to nominate Shisyan for the Nobel Peace Prize

[Arthur73]

Most likely, posthumously. The second Yushchenko will not be molded from him. And the dead do not tell anything. So he will never tell how and who persecuted him. It is unlikely that he knew what fate his patrons were preparing for him from the west.

[Vend]

Quote: Servisinzhener

It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found.

Like what? The fact that there is not any chemical weapons and poisoning because of it, and this is already a state secret

[Lipchanin]

Quote: Servisinzhener

It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found.

No data, but the stench recognizes

[Maz]

Quote: Servisinzhener

It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found.

It turns out that they themselves either produce this substance or work on it. And the data is classified because there is

[eklmn]

Andrey, you said:
"It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found."
A question for you and your supposed answer - while in the Omsk hospital, did they take blood for analysis from Navalny? Yes. Did they take a lot of blood? Yes. Could modern diagnostic tools in Russia detect blood abnormalities in a patient with such severe pain that he fell into a coma? And here interesting answers and their versions begin.
The diagnosis of Omsk doctors after the analysis of Navalny's blood is “improper metabolism, which led to coma”. I, as a former citizen of the USSR, know that doctors in the USSR made such a diagnosis when they did not know the cause of the disease.
Do you agree with the diagnosis of Omsk doctors? No, we do not agree, because taking 50-70 mg of blood from the patient, modern diagnostics will detect anomalies in the blood.
And if not found, then two reasons - either they were forbidden to tell the truth or diagnostics at the level of the early USSR. And the Omsk doctors do not confess to either one or the other. Asking the Germans for the result of the analysis is incorrect - the Russian doctors had a chance to make a diagnosis and they failed. Out of ignorance or by order - but failed. Asking the Germans to explain how they got such an analysis and on what equipment is their know-how, they will not tell.
But if you politely ask doctors from Omsk to tell the truth, you will learn a lot of interesting things. True, there will be no one to tell about this alone ...

[Captain Pushkin]

Quote: eklmn

Diagnosis of Omsk doctors after Navalny's blood test is “improper metabolism leading to coma”

Navalny was found to have high blood sugar. This is in addition to alcohol, caffeine and a bunch of medicines.
They could not establish the cause, but they did not have time for this, no information about their lifestyle, no medical history.
Presumably drank like a horse and took something else that is incompatible with either alcohol or health
There is no information at all from German doctors, except for some nonsense about a "newbie". What they found there is a great mystery.

[eklmn]

"What they found there is a great mystery."
A great mystery for those who do not rummage, because 1) I do not_ want_ to know_ the truth and 2) I believe_ in my own.
“German doctors in the first days of treatment announced that the politician had been poisoned with substances from the group of cholinesterase inhibitors, but the exact agent could not be identified.
After analyzes in a German military laboratory, it was announced that it was a substance from the Novichok family. This combat poison became widely known after the poisoning of ex-GRU officer Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia in Salisbury in the spring of 2018. According to Der Spiegel, traces of the poison were found in Navalny's blood, urine and skin. They remained on the bottle, from which the oppositionist drank, presumably after he was poisoned. ”
https://www.bbc.com/russian/features-54061808
In the blood and on the skin! And on the clothes that remained in the Omsk hospital! And you are interested in his lifestyle in the week before the poisoning? And what did he drink for a week? And the blood test did not suggest that he was drinking? Actually, Russia is no longer funny to pretend to be a fool, and it's hard. North Korea will believe you, of course. And China. And the opinion of the other fools of Russia is not interesting ...

[Captain Pushkin]

Quote: eklmn

According to Der Spiegel, traces of the poison were found in Navalny's blood, urine and skin. They remained on the bottle, from which the oppositionist drank, presumably after he was poisoned. "
https://www.bbc.com/russian/features-54061808
In the blood and on the skin! And on the clothes that remained in the Omsk hospital!

Do you believe in this nonsense? The chemical warfare agent flew from Navalny in all directions and none of those around him was hurt, and he himself got off with a slight fright?
Come on ... I don't believe it!

[eklmn]

"Come on ... I don't believe it!"
An article from the BBC in Russian, by the way, could be read - there are answers to your questions.
“After the German doctors published their conclusions about Navalny's poisoning with poison from the Novichok class, the media raised many questions about this version. For example, could the poison be developed by chemists who did not have access to military laboratories, and why the war agent could not kill Navalny. The BBC decided to ask leading Western experts in the field of toxicology and chemical weapons about this. The questions about what happened were answered (hereinafter I will omit the list of who answered, their titles).
... The conclusions of all the specialists interviewed by the BBC are similar: Navalny, who, apparently, this time turned out to be the only one who came into significant contact with the military substance, was saved by timely medical assistance. At the same time, it was really difficult for the Omsk doctors to find out what exactly he was poisoned with.
“Why is Navalny the only victim of the poisoning? In the case of the Skripals, a police officer was also injured, and another woman was killed. ”
“The fact that Navalny is the only victim indicates that, most likely, he was the only one who was in prolonged contact with the poisonous substance and received a high dose. In this case, the attack against him was localized and targeted, says Professor Gary Sfefens.
The version according to which the politician drank poisoned tea fits into this theory, because in such a scenario only the victim of the assassination is exposed to negative effects, experts interviewed by the BBC agree. It should also be remembered that nerve agents are often unstable. The poison from which Navalny suffered could evaporate before he could harm someone else - but this depends on the characteristics of the particular substance, suggests Dr. Natasha Badjema. If Navalny really was poisoned with tea, it can be assumed that he drank the entire liquid and threw out the plastic cup - in this case, there really might not have been other victims. "

[Arthur73]

Why then the one who gave him this tea was not poisoned? He seemed to have no means of protection. And now he is alive and well. Alesha's colleague, by the way, Ilya Pakhomov. The video is in the tyrnet. Naturally, they could not know who the glass was intended for. with a drink, but they prefer not to remember him, this pakhomov.

[eklmn]

"Why then the one who served him this tea was not poisoned?"
Are you there, in Russia, all pretending, or through one? This Novice is either through the skin or through the stomach, but not through the air! Already so many have been poisoned and still do not know !!!

[Arthur73]

We in Russia perceive reality adequately, unlike you, who believe in all sorts of test tubes with washing powder! In addition to the notorious "highlikli", your propaganda, as usual, has nothing. You start getting angry. This proves once again that your propaganda is just a blatant lie!

[eklmn]

“We in Russia perceive reality adequately”
You can't see it. You confused Newbie with the gases from the First World War, they spread through the air. Novice - by skin or food contact. And this is not propaganda, it is a fact.
And this is a list that they tried to poison or were poisoned (not only by a beginner)
Alexander Litvinenko
Anna Politkovskaya - in 2004, after a cup of tea, she was pumped out in the hospital.
She was killed 2 years later.
Vladimir Kara-Murza - twice, in 2015 and in 2017
Sergey / Julia Skripali
Pyotr Verzilov - in 2018
Navalny ....
Of course, it was only Western propaganda who came up with this, because all were treated in the West, and this propaganda was very beneficial to him, the West. To accuse Russia, which treats critics of its regime with patience, gentleness and almost lovingly, is nonsense, lies, slander ...

[Arthur73]

In general, apart from speculation, you have no facts. Litvinenko, political, karamurza, creaked, bulk, the shadow of the Kremlin is everywhere ... Delirium of consciousness, struck by Western propaganda!

[Dude]

Quote: eklmn

"Why then the one who served him this tea was not poisoned?"
Are you there, in Russia, all pretending, or through one? This Novice is either through the skin or through the stomach, but not through the air! Already so many have been poisoned and still do not know !!!

How is it not transmitted through the air? !! Are you out of your mind ?! Have you heard anything about the inhalation method of transmission ?!
Before scribbling comments, at least in general terms, we sorted out the issue under discussion.
Your amateurism, just at the kindergarten level ...
R. S. Come on, come on, tell us: do how many already poisoned by this damned Rookie, do you think?

[eklmn]

And why figure it out! He got to all the poisoned through the skin or food. They, a beginner, were NOT BREATHING !!!
They creaked through contact with the door handle, the policeman through the same handle, the woman found a spray can and sprinkled on her wrist.
Can it be transmitted through the air? Sure! Where are those who poisoned themselves near Navalny? They are in the hospital with “improper metabolism,” “high blood sugar,” “flat feet,” etc. If nothing was found with the poisoned one, how will it be found with the weakly poisoned!
Check it out for yourself ... only without "enthusiasm", otherwise the landing is guaranteed ...
"Your dilettantism, just at the level of a kindergarten ..."

[Dude]

And why figure it out!

Right! Why investigate ?! Better, without thinking anything about the issue under discussion, with an important look to give out the cosmic scale of stupidity (as you do), bravo!

They are in the hospital with “improper metabolism,” “high blood sugar,” “flat feet,” etc.

Name, sister! ©
Who are they, these "slightly poisoned", as you write? No, I'm waiting, name it! ©
At least one name!
It's funny to listen to you, honestly ...

[Arthur73]

They don't need to figure it out; it's easier to say that this is all Russia.

[Captain Pushkin]

Quote: Servisinzhener

It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found.

The main secret is that those analyzes do not smell of any "beginner".
The second secret is that these are not "samples", but an ordinary "cranberry" in German, which in appearance, smell and taste is completely indistinguishable from the "cranberry" in English.

[rocket757]

Toxicologists of the Bundeswehr: We cannot provide data on the situation with Navalny due to their secrecy

Shoy, it seems to me that in vain he hoped for the sanity of German officials / politicians !!!
Everything and everything will be said as they seem! It cannot be otherwise!
It looks like we will have to continue a series of ofigisms such as "British scientists", "striped scouts" and further down the list!

[cniza]

It looks like the end of sanity, as well as the belligerence of the Germans ...

[rocket757]

Disappointment is very close ... I'll wait a day, another, and then ...

[cniza]

I really want to believe, but a very disgusting feeling, I did not expect this from the Germans ...

[rocket757]

So yourself, yourself. There was a strong country, but there will be a poor litter, into which its own politicians, the green and minke whales, will turn it.

[cniza]

It's a pity that they don't want to get rid of the minke whales, but such a time will come ...

[prior]

After such statements, I'm afraid we will never see Lesha who is not poisoned again.

[Lipchanin]

Quote: prior

After such statements, I'm afraid we will never see Lesha who is not poisoned again.

Likely
Yes, our chemists are such that they cannot poison anyone. Yes, dichlorvos was poured into him and buried long ago

[Grandfather]

Toxicologists of the Bundeswehr: We cannot provide data on the situation with Navalny due to their secrecy

the test tube again ... it will get bored in the end. maybe enough "partners" to call them names? speak as is and act as is.

[The leader of the Redskins]

All knurled.
Well, we are expecting new packages of sanctions, which will make us even better.

[Arthur73]

So the sanctions are imposed on far-fetched reasons. Otherwise, the Russians are not satisfied with everything. For this, Russia and its people are being sanctioned.

[Interlocutor]

A. This means we will not see him again. Good too.

[mark2]

Of course we won't. A worthy change is already being prepared for him. Yegorka Zhukov is young, handsome, ambitious. Major, but also going to fight corruption. A worthy replacement for Alyoshenka.

[Arthur73]

Let him remember about the gratitude of the western owners. Creaked ... Germans ... bulk ... the position is vacant :)))

[Servisinzhener]

Cynically. But this is the harsh truth of life. Youth "boy bands" do not retire. And the leader of the youth, and now adolescent protest cannot be a person under fifty dollars. I recall the dialogue from the movie Pulp fiction. -If you wanted to achieve something. This should have been done earlier. And in this battle you will lie down.

[boris epstein]

Unfortunately, it is possible that we will see. NaVralnaya came out of a coma this morning. About impurities. At one time, Russia was accused of poisoning Litvinenko with polonium. But they did not understand to classify the results of the polonium analyzes. It turned out that polonium of this purity is produced only in one country in the world. And this country is NOT Russia. And Italy.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: Boris Epstein

But they did not understand to classify the results of the polonium analyzes.

Apparently for this reason, the Bundes and secret their information on toxicological expertise. Because the component base inherent in the "product" from the UK can be found. The lady from the foggy albion was spinning around Alyoshenka all the time ... she could have splashed a little ... more Navralny is already a waste material: nothing promising would have come of it. It's time to make room for the next "opposition leader"

[APASUS]

Everything is like a blueprint, it worked once, and why doesn't it work again? Now customers will be the most pressing

[askort154]

It already happened .... We have satellite images on flight MN -17, but they are secret (Obama, a few hours after the plane crash) Russia is involved there.

[Piramidon]

Quote: askort154

It was already ....

[Motorist]

Quote: Piramidon

Quote: askort154

It was already ....

How did the writers know for so long ?!

[tralflot1832]

Yes, they got it already. Would you like to clean it up quietly. No corpse, no case. Type went to the taiga, the tundra will be reunited with the one-man command.

[alpamys]

Quote: tralflot1832

Yes, they got it already. Would you like to clean it up quietly. No corpse, no case. Type went to the taiga, the tundra will be reunited with the one-man command.

Well, then why were they released, and even to Germany, not to Kazakhstan?

[Arthur73]

Were you sure that the "partners" would not add poison?

[alpamys]

Quote: Arthur73

Were you sure that the "partners" would not add poison?

the requirement to take it to Germany was supposed to say .. now it's too late, they will turn off SP2.

[Woodman]

Could have come up with something new, otherwise the "Newbie" is already out of date ... Probably not enough imagination ...

[Boa kaa]

Quote: Lesovik

You could have come up with something new, otherwise "Newbie" is already out of date.

Well, do not tell me!
"Novichok" - after "the Skripals case" - is now the same brand as KALASHNIKOV. He said - and nothing else needs to be explained! Everything immediately becomes clear to everyone: these are HORRIBLE RUSSIANS !!!

[Reserve buildbat]

In general, well done. The anal one completely failed, but then he was relieved of the court and declared a "victim of the redhead" and JV2 was pulled by the ears. They know how to rationally use slaves in the West.

[Boa kaa]

And Putin is scheduled to speak at the UN at the end of September ...
("Well, how not to please a dear little man ..." (c).
AHA.

[tihonmarine]

We have proofs, but we cannot provide them to you, since they are secret.

Like a carbon copy of the Skripal poisoning. Was there any poisoning at all? And where will they go to Letsik, or he will also face the fate of the Skripals.

[Piramidon]

Quote: tihonmarine

Like a carbon copy of the Skripal poisoning. Was there any poisoning at all? And where will they go to Letsik, or he will also face the fate of the Skripals.

Greetings from Skripal

[Marconi41]

The newcomer was developed in Russia, while the Germans have it secret. It's strange.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Marconi41

The newcomer was developed in Russia, while the Germans have it secret. It's strange.

As the big boss said, "secret" means secret.

[kamarada]

All this is from the stupidity and toothlessness of power. Well it was necessary to throw Lyokha right into the clutches of the enemies. Well, they just made a gift. And now from there any dirt will be poured by any of the most branded help. And they do not need to prove anything. What for ?

[Karaul73]

Quote: Servisinzhener

It is very interesting what can be secret in what kind of substance, in what concentrations and in what samples it was found.

How it was discovered and by what means. How long can an OM be detected? This is the secret.

[_Ugene_]

What prevents our politicians from answering directly - The statements about the poisoning of Navalny with this substance are a lie. After all, they took blood from him for analysis, so let them provide the results. When they chew snot like now, it becomes unclear why, maybe they really poisoned?

[Polymer]

Quote: _Ugene_

maybe they really poisoned?

Maybe, but not the Russian special services. But the fact that they missed this business - on their own territory! - this makes me mumble now. As one of the versions.

[_Ugene_]

so at first he was treated with us and all the tests were taken, so let them provide the results and no need to mumble, and if they really poisoned him, let them say so, no one is obliged to guard him around the clock, and due to the fact that our talkers do not have a clear and clear positions of people all sorts of suspicions appear

[Polymer]

Quote: _Ugene_

and if he was really poisoned so let them say

= declare your own insolvency. Pat.

Quote: _Ugene_

no one is obliged to guard it around the clock

So no, of course. But here's the thing: his poisoning, whoever carried it out, and by whatever means, is now being used against the state of the Russian Federation. And to stand guard over this state is the task of the special services. Thus, they did not fulfill their task. Something like this.

[_Ugene_]

declare your own insolvency.
Thus, they did not fulfill their task. Something like this.

what kind of insolvency? do not write nonsense, it is impossible to protect all opposition leaders from everything in the world 24 hours a day, especially against their will, if they want to poison it anyway sooner or later, someone from their own will poison

[Polymer]

Quote: _Ugene_

what kind of insolvency? do not write nonsense, it is impossible to protect all opposition leaders from everything in the world 24 hours a day, especially against their will, if they want to poison it anyway sooner or later, someone from their own will poison

With this logic, there is no need to prevent terrorist attacks, anyway, sooner or later they will blow up something if they want to.
The point is not that you need to attach security to each specific "bulk". But the activities of foreign special services on the territory of the country should be suppressed by the Russian special services, or not?
And then, oppositionist to oppositionist strife. The fact that Navalny's activities are directly related to foreign organizations has long been beyond doubt even among ordinary citizens.

[_Ugene_]

The point is not that you need to attach security to each specific "bulk".

if it’s not about how do you technically imagine the prevention of its poisoning? the special services must do their job, but such a task was unlikely to be, because it is impossible to protect his life around the clock year-round against his will and is too expensive

[Polymer]

Quote: _Ugene_

how do you technically imagine the prevention of its poisoning?

Counterintelligence has methods of counteraction that have been developed over the years. Tracking the connections of the "object", observing the activity of other foreign agents and services, introducing one's agent into the environment, etc.
Yes, I understand that it is not in my competence to evaluate the work of the special services. And I don't blame anyone - everyone has mistakes. If you go back to my first comment, then I just offered an explanation why now, as you put it, "they chew snot" - because they are pierced. Moreover, he emphasized that this is only one of the versions.

[_Ugene_]

Can you imagine how many people, forces and means should be used to really effectively protect it? Do the special services have few more important tasks? it's too much honor to protect all opposition members like that

[Polymer]

Quote: _Ugene_

Can you imagine how many people, forces and means should be used to really effectively protect it?

First, not to protect him, as I said, but to protect the state. That being said, there are two big differences. Don't give a damn about Navalny. It should not be allowed to act, or someone used it for anti-state purposes.
Secondly ... well, this is their job.

[_Ugene_]

protection of the opposition is not protection of the state, this is a stupid waste of valuable personnel and resources, it is obvious that Navalny is just an excuse, they would not have poisoned him, they would have found another pretext for new sanctions, etc.

[Polymer]

Quote: _Ugene_

Navalny is just an excuse, they would not have been poisoned, they would have found another pretext for new sanctions, etc.

From! True, not a pretext, but a means. But the idea itself is correct - they will always look for weak points and hit precisely on them. The Navalny incident is just one episode, it could have been played out in a different scenario. But isn't this the job of the special services to analyze, foresee, and warn?

[2112vda]

Read "a helluva lot of scientific article", it seems that the same experts made their opinion on Navalny.
https://ftimes.ru/346359-opasnye-mineraly-dobycha-kotoryx-pogubila-tysyachi-lyudej.html?utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com

[Naval]

We have proofs, but we cannot provide them to you, since they are secret.

Almost like it was sung with the old song of the "DUNA" group. It seems that senile dementia is beginning to dominate the world.

The road is hard and deception is everywhere
But in order not to go astray I have a plan
But I won't give it to you
And don't you dare blame me.

[thinker]

An official representative of the Bundeswehr Medical and Sanitary Service told about this to the Novaya Gazeta correspondent.

The names of the correspondent and the representative are also secret! The level of "exclusive" information NG near the baseboard.

[tralmaster]

You can then forget not Navalny. They will give his name a little, they will see sanctions and a monument to him will be erected.

[Alexander Chirukhin]

The implementation was successful

[Svetlana]

Quote: Arthur73

That is, it is proposed to take these non-gentlemen at their word? And how is it known that they are not lying? They immediately gave up, because in the Tomsk samples of Alyoshka, it turns out, they cannot find anything. And trusting them is the last thing. It was not for nothing that they immediately accused Moscow and began to put pressure on SP2. Who shouts the loudest "derzhivora" I think it is not necessary to remind. And Europe has been hysterical for several days already.

You can't trust anyone).

[Alien From]

That is, as usual, blah blah blah and protruding overseas ears ...

[cniza]

So they are no longer hiding their ears, now there is a tug-of-war along JV 2 ...

[ZVS]

The Germans didn't find a damn thing, that's why they "secret". They did it up to their ears, as the British did with the Skripals.

[gvozdan]

We in the Bundeswehr very reliably know where we got the newcomer from, how they drove, how they infected Navalny, but we won't tell you, because the secret

[yfast]

The United States said to Germany, thank you for taking the patient out, then do what they say, then we dance him. If he had not been taken over the hill, his poisoning by a novice would still have been detected by a secret satellite.
Can you switch to rat poison, its lethality is higher?

[Pavel57]

How to say Hailey likely in German?

[Boa kaa]

Quote: Pavel57

How to say Hailey likely in German?

I am writing in Russians: "zer möglikh"!

[Cyril G ...]

We cannot provide data on the situation with Navalny due to their secrecy

We know that your troops are in Donbass, our companions can see them. But we will not show anyone !!!
Oh, it's not about that ?! From the same stupid clowns !!!!

[gvozdan]

The Russian Foreign Ministry must declare:
"The high command of the Bundeswehr are incompetent, stupid people, we know this very reliably from very secret sources."

[tatra]

This is what the enemies of the communists have "svrrda words" - unsubstantiated accusations of crimes, the requirement for others to disclose all the facts, archives, and the unwillingness to provide others with evidence of their words.

[Alexy]

Kindergarten. I have a cool car, but I won't show it to you. How can you discuss something with these people? It may be better not to finish building this sp-2. I can imagine how the Fritzes will start to perform when all the gas goes through them. In my opinion, it's better to focus on LNG, it's time to tie up with pipelines. This is not promising in modern realities: short-term contracts are not profitable, and long-term contracts, as Stockholm shows, are not worth the paper on which they are written.
Putin thought that if he was hanging around with Schroeder, then the Germans were friends. But no. The same "Western partners" as everyone else.

[Knell wardenheart]

Insanity of the highest standard .. for many years Germany has remained one of the main European interests of Nord Stream 2, in fact, by its activities, blocking the development of the US sanctions in this area. And now some "smart minds" are trying to prove that the Germans are themselves interested in the project not to take place, and at the highest level.

Guys, it is only in our country that the right paw can thresh on the left, in Europe they count every penny - and if they invested in efforts in this direction, then they will definitely not run to destroy it in the forefront. I would rather admit that the Germans, on the contrary, in this situation would be happy to hush up this case or stretch it, but not that they would gladly run to torpedo billions in benefits for their economy.

[viktor.]

Nord Stream can be directed to Transbaikalia, we sell some kind of gas, but this is clearly not gas and you can buy it by calling in advance or by Blat

[Hog]

Well, at least a test tube with white powder was shown)))

[Vasilenko Vladimir]

Q.E.D.
and the bulk can be presented?

[Kushka]

What a Russian habit of tearing a shirt
on the chest! "I'm not guilty, he came himself"
Did you have a sneaky neighbor?
You will not build - he will write -
suspicious land transaction.
You will build - he will write -
stolen building materials.
You won't plant a garden - he will write -
breed ambrosia.
You will plant a garden - it will write -
it shades the plot.
In will you live - he will write -
make noise, interfere with the patient's rest.
You will not live - he will call the Ministry of Emergencies -
suspiciously quiet, maybe they are crazy?
Spit and forget. The enemy is the enemy.

[TermNachTer]

It reminds me of the situation with the Malaysian "Boeing")))) we have evidence, but we will not show it to anyone, because they are terribly secret))))

[Shkworen]

in fact ... there is no evidence, only statements :)
but the culprit has already been appointed, so how to negotiate with such? :)

[Pavel57]

Quote: Knell Wardenheart

Guys, it's only in our country that the right paw can thresh on the left,

You forget that there are levels of interest. The interests of shopkeepers are not interesting to car manufacturers, and financiers are not interested in the problems of automakers. Approximate diagram.
Therefore, some are interested in doing business with Russia, others are not, and whose weight is greater, that interest will win.

[cniza]

Quote: Pavel57

Therefore, some are interested in doing business with Russia, others are not, and whose weight is greater, that interest will win.

Or who has a thicker wallet and has a lobby ...

[cniza]

In a statement from representatives of the toxicology laboratory of the German army, it is said that "this is a sensitive area", and therefore "information cannot be provided."

And I naively thought that the Germans were more decent than the English ...

[Pavel57]

Quote: cniza

the wallet is thicker and there is a lobby ...

Interest and works through wallet, lobby and other subtle tools.

[memory]

The persecution of Russia continues ..! So comrades are going the right way .. The West showed us all its bloody grin. Russia prevents them from robbing the peoples of the world!
Who is next after Navalny? It seems that the West just wanted to replace Navalny, unpopular in Russia, he exhausted himself and with such a cunning method they removed him
He will obviously not return to Russia, the criminal case hangs on him and is serious!

[Dkuznecov]

Let's say it's not at all like that.

Spitting on each other's collars in politics is common
for hundreds (and maybe thousands of years).

Simple now the information flow has increased significantly
thanks to new technologies. It became easier to generate it (copy / paste)
and broadcast (transition from physical (paper, speech, paintings)
on electronic media.

Earlier, the cat lambed in the village - for a week of talking.
The blacksmith got drunk - we will remember the year.

Information flow now an order of magnitude exceeds the "standards"
past tense.
Our poor children, they somehow cope with it.
I personally - no longer. I have to use software and hardware,
up to the filter "white" list.
Blacklists no longer work because of inefficiency.

By the way, please note that generating "shit"
several times exceeds the generation of genuine values.
This is what scares me.

In the days of physical media, inscriptions on the fence
somehow they themselves erased over time,
and everything worthy remained in history.
Now all the abomination floats on the Internet, is stored
on servers, duplicated and backed up forever.

I will repeat myself. It scares me. Information noise has become such
that the voice of reason is not heard behind it. Tits, seals, and so on.

Thank you all for your attention.

[Captain Pushkin]

Quote: prior

After such statements, I'm afraid we will never see Lesha who is not poisoned again.

The squad will not notice the loss of a soldier ... They will raise a new one ...

[Dkuznecov]

As the Americans said there - evidence
we cannot provide interference in elections,
they were stolen by Russian hackers.
And it's the end.

[Zaurbek]

The trend of the last 10 years ... there is evidence, but it is secret ... but you are to blame.

[Tuesday]

And what is the conclusion? Schizophrenia has become a contagious disease!

[Tuesday]

I roared when I read it! On a camping trip, schizophrenia has become a contagious disease!
It is understandable that they cannot provide anything! For the British have already fallen for falsifying the analyzes of the Skripals. They stupidly, according to the collective farm, poured a newcomer into a test tube with someone's blood, who was never born in Russia. And the fact that OM in the body of a living person undergoes certain physical changes was not taken into account + the blood on DNA must correspond to the character. As a result, there was a conclusion of independent experts and a scandal, which was quickly extinguished. Perhaps all this can be falsified in the future, but apparently not now.

[NF68]

They spank according to the worked out scenario.

[iouris]

The state is a suppression machine. Why was the USSR never accused of poisoning bulk "newcomers"? In executions, yes. Well, they were accused, so what? Who and for what embraced the state in the process of finishing off some secret data of the Bundeswehr? The family and intelligence of the FRG took Navalny to the "Sharite". Now Navalny is the property of the Bundeswehr. What is it: stupidity or betrayal? The answer is unequivocal. The prognosis is very bad.

[Metallurg_2]

So it was immediately clear: they themselves fed Lesha Analny as a “newbie”.