Military Review

Unacceptable percentage

138

After not tomorrow



It is hardly worth asserting now that the domestic economy is in ruins. The plants and factories among those that generally remained in the country seem to be working, pumping oil and gas, nobody is slowing down construction. Even the curbs in the capital did not stop changing. Here with tourism and small business really seams. And when cafes and restaurants open, there is no guarantee that someone will make them happy with their visit. The public is frightened as if tomorrow is a war.

All material support, direct, which should come from the same direct directions from above, in practice turns into some kind of miserable handouts. When you read peppy reports from regions, for example, from the Orenburg region that 6 entrepreneurs there received budget subsidies of 330 million rubles, you don’t know whether to cry or laugh.

You just count: for each, an average of 55 thousand rubles. These are two, just two acceptable monthly salaries of ordinary employees! It seems that they scattered everyone a little so as not to offend anyone. In March-April, someone and somewhere, as you know, really credited for the issuance of salaries. And it seems to be even at a zero rate.

Unacceptable percentage

In a rich (still!) Capital, in contrast to the Orenburg region, completely different figures appear on this part. So, almost officialdom, "Evening Moscow", brings to readers:

“The size of the subsidy for leasing payments should not exceed 100 million rubles per year. The maximum amount of the subsidy for the reimbursement of part of the cost of paying interest on loans is 200 million rubles a year. ”

This is only interest, you can imagine how much can go on loans. And to whom ... But the author, with all his wide connections in the traditional real business, did not succeed even in Moscow and the region to find at least one entrepreneur who could get such a loan. At crazy interest - as much as you want, but here is something not enough for those who wish.

Of course, the regional authorities, as usual, do not have money, but if you help like that, while also trying to rip off the entrepreneurs as sticky, they will definitely not be any more. However, in Moscow, if one of the closest associates gets his share at 2 percent, then most likely he will not be spreading about it. However, the metropolitan biased press will almost certainly do this for him.

At the same time, various kinds of loyal business associations, starting with the RF CCI and the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs and ending with Delovaya Rossiya, Opora Rossii, and even the Association of Small and Medium Enterprises (SMEs), all this does not interfere with beautiful reporting to the top. Again, on the implementation of certain programs of support, assistance and soft loans.


But how could it be otherwise, these oligarchs in miniature painted, everything that was lowered from above, in their own way and even under good commissions. And they reported. Upstairs. In fact, if something happens, then as in light industry - only after the “candle” is launched, sorry, “masked”, the factory under the well-known mayor.

However, industry cooperation is somehow working, where enterprises and banks that stay afloat help less successful partners only because they are afraid to lose them. Production and logistics chains will break, sales markets will collapse - here you will involuntarily become the last to share.

I'd like to hope that with an anti-crisis loan at 2% per annum the balance will not be so cruel. It is obviously too early to talk about whether such hopes will be justified. However, many managed to accumulate the first experience of how everything will actually be with salary presidential loans. It is well known that the tsar’s decree in Russia is almost no one’s decree.

Login and not return


The program, under which banks can lend to business and non-profit structures at 2% per annum, started on June 1. In accordance with it, the volume of loans issued should be more than 248 billion rubles. Not so much, but not enough. At the same time, for the reason, a total of 5,7 billion rubles will be allocated for the compensation of lost income.

What confuses the author so much? And the fact that the figures somehow do not beat, 5,7 billion is less than 2,5 percent of the total. We add them to the agreed 2 percent per annum and get a real rate of no more than 4,5 percent. There are big doubts that someone today, for all our anti-crisis stability, will really take on loans to drowning people under such conditions.

The fact is that, in addition to the need to make at least some profit, the same banks also need to make sure that some of the customers are bankrupt. But bankruptcies, no matter how many you forbid them, will still be there, just in time for when you have to repay soft loans.

It is already known that few prefer to call a 2 percent loan, which the Ministry of Economic Development, which implements the program, prefer to call a loan, few. These are companies from affected sectors and socially oriented NGOs, as well as companies from industries that require support to resume operations.

An extraordinary measure such as writing off the entire loan along with interest is proposed as the main lifebuoy. Provided that the recipient of the loan will be able to retain at least 90% of the staff. If 80% of employees remain in the state, the entrepreneur will have to repay only half of the loan and interest on it.

It has already been stated that the state should pay for such recipients of a soft loan. But how many such enterprises at the moment are generally left in the affected sectors, they are unlikely to be able to say in the Ministry of Economic Development itself. And how much will be left by the time when it will be necessary to report, and this in one case in three months or on December 1, 2020, in the other on April 1, 2021, it seems to make no sense to predict at all.

There is one more nuance in the program. It provides an extremely tight system of control over the level of employment. To this end, the tax service will finally launch a specialized blockchain platform, which tax officials began to develop even when the Federal Tax Service was headed by Mikhail Mishustin (current prime minister). The reporting will be based on data on insurance premiums that entrepreneurs submit to the Pension Fund every month.

Credit always, credit everywhere


In general, the widely announced 2% loan immediately reminded the author of the Soviet lending practice. Then, in the stagnant 70s and 80s, illiquid (but only because of the high price) goods like carpets and jewelry were sold on credit and at two, and even at one and a half percent. Or in installments, when the percentage was carefully hidden in the price.

Apartments in ZhSK, where it was still very difficult to get, were generally credited at 0,25% per annum. And at the same time, even at the Gaidar fracture with shock therapy in the form of a jump in prices, it never occurred to anyone to index their price.

By the way, the first installment in those years was not as heavy as it is now. Usually this was 40 percent of the total cost - at the level of 10-12 thousand Soviet rubles, and taking into account the trade union assistance and mutual assistance cash desk, the employee himself sometimes left 25-30 percent, or even less.

But the modern mortgage, almost anyone who received it, considers it not a gift of fate, but a bondage. Comparing it either with a noose around his neck, or with a financial trap abruptly "MMM". As a rule, one thing saves from the complete disappointment of victims of a mortgage: getting the long-awaited square meters. Which, in fact, can be lost at any time. Clear business, for debts.


And the first bell that for the notorious 2% will have to answer citizens, as usual, has already sounded. Sberbank, which is now in full swing reporting about the beginning of soft loans, for example, in Stavropol and in the same Orenburg region, much earlier began to withdraw its percentage, so far only one, for simple transfers from card to card.

From the office of German Gref, depositors are already threatened that they will have to pay even for transfers between their cards. Pensioners, who diligently cherish what they manage to put on a special Mir card, with slightly higher percentages, will now have to think a lot before dealing freely with their hard-earned money. Just because a couple of thousand gifts to grandchildren can not be thrown back to where it is more convenient.

Author:
Photos used:
picabu.ru, irsepi.ru, opora.ru
138 comments
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  1. pmkemcity
    pmkemcity 4 June 2020 04: 59 New
    23
    I’ve replenished a Sberov credit card the other day, so they took 250 rubles, and this, by the way, is a bottle of vodka! And if you don’t waste time on small things, I can say that two acquaintances recently took apartments, so a mortgage is more expensive than a consumer loan. They took a loan.
    1. Crowe
      Crowe 4 June 2020 05: 14 New
      37
      Sberbank knows how to siphon money out of the people, assets and owners with managers are by no means in our country ...
      1. Tugarin
        Tugarin 4 June 2020 05: 36 New
        25
        It's a mess about helping entrepreneurs. We cooperate with Sberbank, according to the senior manager of the credit department (an acquaintance), the conditions for obtaining this "loan" can be met by a few. Entrepreneurs are saved only by illegal activities.
        1. And Makarov
          And Makarov 4 June 2020 05: 54 New
          19
          Entrepreneurs save only illegal activity

          Survived! In Soviet times there was an article for parasitism, and now they punish for work angry
          1. samarin1969
            samarin1969 4 June 2020 06: 06 New
            14
            Quote: A Makarov
            Entrepreneurs save only illegal activity

            Survived! In Soviet times there was an article for parasitism, and now they punish for work angry

            Well, in the days of the Union, for such "activity" very "enterprising" guys from OBKhSS could be attracted.
            1. 2 Level Advisor
              2 Level Advisor 4 June 2020 06: 46 New
              +6
              During the time of the Union, it was forbidden to engage in activities prohibited by law? And if you are talking about limitations on the epidemic, then the OBHSS didn’t do it .. where is the theft of social property, for example, in the work of a dentist?
              1. Deck
                Deck 4 June 2020 06: 55 New
                11
                Well, everything is so bad, there are positive aspects:

                The real estate market in the suburbs is growing unexpectedly briskly. Houses of 40-50 million fly away literally in an instant. There is so much free money that no mortgage is required.
                They say that the whole thing is the colossal amount of free money. The reason for this was the state programs to combat coronavirus (the account goes from 500 billion) and government support packages (about 2,8 trillion rubles) of state programs and state contracts.
                Intermediaries and contributors receive their coronavirus percentage.
                So the fight against coronavirus smoothly grows into stabilization - growth in real estate purchase volumes and new capital export records.
                Money did not defeat the coronavirus, but strengthened the wealth of the fiscal class
                1. Stas157
                  Stas157 4 June 2020 09: 15 New
                  18
                  But to the author, with all his wide connections in traditional real business, failed even in Moscow and the region find at least one entrepreneur who could get this kind of loan.

                  Kremlin handouts and the notorious "help to the population" are so conditional that to fulfill all the conditions and become lucky ones who have received a bribe from the government, bookmakers (connected with the same government) can be more likely than ordinary citizens who are really in need.
              2. samarin1969
                samarin1969 4 June 2020 07: 03 New
                +6
                Quote: Level 2 Advisor
                During the time of the Union, it was forbidden to engage in activities prohibited by law?

                ??? ... Nothing "epidemic" ... laughing Mr. Makarov indicated as "salvation", "illegal activity". Greenhouses, shabashki, catering and trade machinations were illegal businesses. This "private initiative activity" was stifled by the employees of the Department of the Chemistry of Chemistry, etc. (to their own benefit). Now such classes are called the noble concept of "gray business".
                1. And Makarov
                  And Makarov 4 June 2020 08: 21 New
                  0
                  Mr. Makarov pointed out how "salvation", "illegal activity"

                  You and the commentator were not mistaken?
                2. Sergej1972
                  Sergej1972 4 June 2020 10: 31 New
                  +9
                  There were legal cobbers in construction crews. Mostly Caucasians and Western Ukrainians. But there were also many Russian engineers from factories who worked on these teams on vacation. State farm, in which the director was the father, built objects. Moreover, they earned quite officially much more in comparison with the workers of the state farm. True, they worked intensively. Yes, there were still Ukrainians from Bukovina and Transcarpathia who came to process sugar beets. Colorful characters. Most of the people are good, but often with low self-esteem and some kind of eccentric in the eyes of local people. Representatives of the older generation among them were some slightly bruised, and young people were quite normal, but with an insufficient level of general education. Although, maybe I'm wrong. I do not pretend to generalize estimates.
                  1. Igoresha
                    Igoresha 9 June 2020 18: 04 New
                    0
                    Quote: Sergej1972
                    more Ukrainians from Bukovina and Transcarpathia

                    in the Kharkiv region at my state farm, too, zapadentsy earned money, some grain trucks were sent to some places of residence at the expense of their salaries
              3. avg
                avg 4 June 2020 12: 37 New
                +1
                Quote: Level 2 Advisor
                During the time of the Union, it was forbidden to engage in activities prohibited by law?

                Do not understand. request
          2. Virus-free crown
            Virus-free crown 4 June 2020 12: 30 New
            +2
            Quote: A Makarov
            Entrepreneurs save only illegal activity

            Survived! In Soviet times there was an article for parasitism, and now they punish for work angry

            Totally agree! hi
        2. knn54
          knn54 4 June 2020 09: 23 New
          +4
          An additional tax (%) will be introduced to eliminate the consequences of the coronavirus.
          And the money will go to the money.
      2. Uncle lee
        Uncle lee 4 June 2020 05: 42 New
        32
        In general, everything is gloomy ....
      3. Svarog
        Svarog 4 June 2020 07: 20 New
        +9
        It is well known that the tsar’s decree in Russia is almost no one’s decree.

        Of course it is known why and why such a "king" whom the boyars do not listen to.
        From the office of German Gref, depositors are already threatened that they will have to pay even for transfers between their cards. Pensioners, who diligently cherish what they manage to put on a special Mir card, with slightly higher percentages, will now have to think a lot before dealing freely with their hard-earned money. Just because a couple of thousand gifts to grandchildren can not be thrown back to where it is more convenient.

        Money needs to be kept at home and preferably in dollars .. The 90s are back. That's as soon as citizens take off all their savings, so Gref and his ilk will immediately begin to lure and stop impudent. We substitute the veins for the bloodsuckers themselves.
        1. Roman123567
          Roman123567 4 June 2020 10: 27 New
          +5
          Money needs to be kept at home and preferably in dollars .. The 90s are back.

          Judging by the fact that all these years the dollar has only grown - the 90s did not go anywhere ..))
        2. New Year day
          New Year day 4 June 2020 10: 51 New
          +7
          Quote: Svarog
          Money needs to be kept at home and preferably in dollars .. The 90s are back.


          laughing request
          You must listen to the voice of the Almighty and .. your voice
          1. pmkemcity
            pmkemcity 4 June 2020 12: 33 New
            +2
            The constitution costs 41 rubles. - https://my-shop.ru/shop/product/4026927.html?partner=6408&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkfjT_Ozn6QIVDIGyCh1skwEkEAYYASABEgKWefD_BwE
            and the dollar is much more expensive - 69,11 Russian rubles
            Jun 4, 09:31

            Currency data is provided by Morningstar, cryptocurrency is presented by Coinbase.
            1. New Year day
              New Year day 4 June 2020 14: 31 New
              +6
              Quote: pmkemcity
              and the dollar is much more expensive - 69,11 Russian rubles

              guess, how much will the ruble cost after July 1, when the GDP will receive the next "vote of confidence"?
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 4 June 2020 16: 58 New
                -3
                Everyone does not care how much the ruble will cost - everyone is interested in how much a barrel of oil will rise in price.
                1. New Year day
                  New Year day 4 June 2020 17: 35 New
                  +7
                  Quote: Vadim237
                  No one cares how much the ruble will cost

                  I don’t give a damn - we use drugs from behind the hill
                  1. TuM0305
                    TuM0305 4 June 2020 22: 01 New
                    +1
                    Better how much they will raise the retirement age again!
      4. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 4 June 2020 08: 21 New
        +9
        Quote: Crowe
        Sberbank knows how to siphon money out of the people, assets and owners with managers are by no means in our country ..

        I remembered the phrase from the movie where Rolan Bykov plays the king "Everyone will be rich, except for the poor, long hello !!!"
      5. New Year day
        New Year day 4 June 2020 10: 49 New
        16
        Quote: Crowe
        Sberbank "knows how to siphon money from the people, assets and owners with managers are by no means in our country ...

        you missed the most important thing in the "rebranding"!

        The Security Council directly indicated that it has nothing to do with Russia. And this is not an accident. This is a reflection of the country's policies.
    2. carstorm 11
      carstorm 11 4 June 2020 05: 38 New
      -19
      and what for you use the services with a commission? transfer from debit without these payments and that's it. you create difficulties for yourself with such decisions.
      1. Mitroha
        Mitroha 4 June 2020 07: 22 New
        -2
        Yes, there is some kind of heresy written there. Person replenished a credit card with a commission of 250 rubles. To manage to do this, it must be replenished from a card where the cash withdrawal service is paid (for example, another credit card). Or by interbank transfer from another bank. Himself "evil Buratino" That's just where the bank is, it's not clear.
        And the story is about a consumer loan, which is cheaper than mortgages, if you do not take extremes from advertising, in general from kolotampovye.
        1. Andrey Shch
          Andrey Shch 4 June 2020 08: 01 New
          10
          Well, I don’t know about the "credit card", but recently I transferred money to my wife from card to card. Both debit, both Sberbank, the commission was removed - 1%. They do not withdraw only if you transfer yourself within the limits of Sberbank.
          1. Mitroha
            Mitroha 4 June 2020 08: 52 New
            -4
            I always throw mom, no commission. In one city. She has a retirement momentum. In any case, you need to know the tariffs of your cards
            1. Andrey Shch
              Andrey Shch 4 June 2020 09: 23 New
              +7
              Can you talk about Online Sberbank? Then yes, up to 50 thousand without commission. I'm talking about a "transfer" through an ATM. They are filming. In one city. Recently introduced. Tariffs have nothing to do with it. I specially approached the bank employees and asked them.
              1. Mitroha
                Mitroha 4 June 2020 10: 04 New
                +2
                Sorry, you also implicitly about ATMs, of course, about a mobile application. I only go to ATMs to deposit cash, the rest is online. Sberbank too, in my opinion, uses the "memory of the people" about his ancestor Sberkassa and the number of branches. But another generation has grown up, and they will choose banks for convenience and least greed. But it won't reach Sberbank
              2. Vadim237
                Vadim237 4 June 2020 17: 00 New
                0
                Why don't you use online in these operations?
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 4 June 2020 17: 07 New
                  +5
                  Quote: Vadim237
                  Why don't you use online in these operations?

                  But I don’t have any money for cards at all.
          2. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 4 June 2020 10: 33 New
            +1
            Transferring money through a quick payment system from a card of one bank to cards of others, no commissions.
          3. Lbbe
            Lbbe 7 June 2020 09: 48 New
            0
            For you, they came up with SBP (quick payment system) up to 100k per month without commission. Sber still connected from the 4th day (and not a year has passed)
        2. Doccor18
          Doccor18 4 June 2020 08: 32 New
          +8
          Yes, there is some kind of heresy written there ...

          And our "ardently loved" bank manages to charge a percentage of wages in cash at the branch. From a card without a commission, in a branch with a commission. A person, in order to take his hard earned money, must unfasten the bribe to the bankers. Capitalism in all its glory ...
          1. Mitroha
            Mitroha 4 June 2020 08: 53 New
            +1
            At the branch, at the cash desk in almost all banks it is paid, probably they don’t really want to see us at the branches))
          2. AU Ivanov.
            AU Ivanov. 4 June 2020 09: 27 New
            -9
            Transfer salary to another bank, where no commission is charged, is it fate?
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 4 June 2020 17: 09 New
              +5
              Quote: AU Ivanov.
              Transfer salary to another bank, where no commission is charged, is it fate?

              It's not meant to be. Personally, I get cash.
              1. AU Ivanov.
                AU Ivanov. 4 June 2020 18: 27 New
                -6
                Gray salary? Perhaps in the cash shop you pay? I'm so sorry.
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 4 June 2020 20: 34 New
                  +5
                  Quote: AS Ivanov.
                  Perhaps in the cash shop you pay?

                  I pay in cash.
                  Quote: AS Ivanov.
                  I'm so sorry.

                  Set a flower for yourself
        3. mark021105
          mark021105 10 June 2020 21: 03 New
          0
          I often transfer money from card to card. A limit of 50.000 is now set for transfers and withdrawals. This limit is quickly consumed. And further - even between your cards it is transferred with a withdrawal of 1%.
    3. 72jora72
      72jora72 4 June 2020 09: 55 New
      +5
      And if you don’t waste time on small things, I can say that two acquaintances recently took apartments, so a mortgage is more expensive than a consumer loan. They took a loan.
      Even if the loan is a little more expensive, then it’s already their an apartment and not a bank .......
    4. Civil
      Civil 4 June 2020 11: 52 New
      -3
      I don’t understand what you want from a poor state that has no money, there are also problems with the mind. At the helm are pensioners like you. There are no prospects. Maybe it's time to relax?
  2. Far B
    Far B 4 June 2020 05: 24 New
    20
    Why is it hardly worth saying that the economy is in ruins? For one self-insulated April, tax collections dipped by either 20 or 30 percent (testimonies vary). By May, the numbers had not yet been announced. If these are not ruins, then what are the ruins? Like, there is no limit to perfection?
  3. carstorm 11
    carstorm 11 4 June 2020 05: 30 New
    -38
    Who considers a mortgage bondage? this is a mortgage. A conscious choice that we personally have accepted. this is some kind of nonsense - you consider your capabilities. collect money for a down payment. build life and calculate risks. don't like it, well don't take it. live in rented apartments all your life and, for God's sake, pay some aunt every month into the void. up to 35 years a bunch of buns in general that reduce payments and costs. young family programs there or federal and regional.
    1. Crowe
      Crowe 4 June 2020 05: 35 New
      43
      I, Dim, consider the mortgage a bondage. Well, put away the blinders from your eyes, and look not biased ...
      In Europe, a mortgage is available at 1-5% per annum, in the USA - 3-4%, and in Russia - between 9 and 10%.
      At the level of salaries in the above countries, we have this robbery, to put it mildly .. We must call a spade a spade, agree ...
      1. carstorm 11
        carstorm 11 4 June 2020 05: 39 New
        -33
        I’m actually already crying for the second time. I don’t have to tell. if I can’t pay, I won’t take it either. I am not a masochist.
        1. Essex62
          Essex62 4 June 2020 06: 11 New
          29
          But should a young family live on the street? Or not eat up, walk in rags, go to work on foot for ten miles? And these are millions, tens of millions of citizens of the Russian Federation. And at the same time, a certain director of a state-owned enterprise, who successfully sat down on a national treasure, receives a few lyamas a day. The question is, what is he shitting with his pants and handing over to the treasury? What kind of benefit should society bring in order to get such money?
          Programs do not work. The task of the burrowing banker is to extract the maximum gesheft and he will squeeze it, one way or another. And in case of loss of work, by someone from the family, generally seams.
          1. carstorm 11
            carstorm 11 4 June 2020 06: 29 New
            -29
            I am not going to participate in the rally. I don’t need all this. can’t pay much let them take cheaper. I taxed to pay the first faster. nothing fell off. everything is better than how my parents with two children without an apartment in the Union were sitting and without real prospects to get it. I am already working as an older child to earn an apartment. My first apartment in my family appeared when I was 13 years old and my brother was 11.
            1. 2 Level Advisor
              2 Level Advisor 4 June 2020 06: 48 New
              20
              If people do this, this does not mean that this is normal, it means that they have no choice, Dmitry ..
              1. carstorm 11
                carstorm 11 4 June 2020 07: 50 New
                -19
                it means there is an opportunity. and whether you want to use it or not, it is up to the person to decide. I repeat, you can not pay a mortgage but just rent an apartment for the same money and be glad that you are not in the bondage of the bank. that's better?
            2. Slavs
              Slavs 4 June 2020 09: 23 New
              10
              Quote: carstorm 11
              my parents with two children without an apartment in the Union were sitting and without real prospects to get it

              Where and by whom did your parents work? In what years?
              1. carstorm 11
                carstorm 11 4 June 2020 10: 24 New
                -8
                Ordinary family of a CA officer. official housing is small and all. kennel-sized kitchen. service housing is fun in itself.
                1. Slavs
                  Slavs 4 June 2020 12: 13 New
                  +3
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  service housing is fun in itself.

                  I am in the know. The usual family of warrant officer PV. They lived in barracks at the outpost, and in dos. Yes, not mansions, but there was a roof over their heads. We did not complain, because there is such a profession ...
                  I asked about the years of service .. For in the 90s to remain without housing, the prospect was much more real than under the Union.
                2. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 4 June 2020 20: 37 New
                  +3
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  Ordinary family of a CA officer.

                  Well, you are calling. We received prarapora, I’m not writing about the colonels.
                  1. carstorm 11
                    carstorm 11 4 June 2020 22: 51 New
                    -2
                    but we did not receive. Why do I need your examples when I have my own before my eyes? and not to be rude. each has its own life story and experience.
            3. Essex62
              Essex62 4 June 2020 09: 51 New
              22
              You're lying, because about parents, Dima. There were no homeless people in the Union.
              But perhaps by the tendency to vagrancy. All of the barracks were resettled. And not only in Moscow. On the servers at home like mushrooms grew. And the prospect of getting housing was in any case. Get in line at your factory and wait. Most received. In our state farm near Moscow, even the cottages were built on the floor of the house, for two families. Cottages, Karl.
              We’re trying to rub it in, we are still alive. Here the last riddlers will kill us, they will take control of the Internet, I don’t doubt that the post-Putin will do it, then you’ll hang up the ears of young animals. Singers of capitalism. Muck, it’s your capitalism, the person is bad in it
              1. carstorm 11
                carstorm 11 4 June 2020 10: 21 New
                -10
                I said somewhere about the homeless? official apartment familiar with this expression? here it was. 4 people in a small coat. Only in the nineties did father manage to squeeze out an apartment in the Moscow region through the courts.
                1. New Year day
                  New Year day 4 June 2020 10: 57 New
                  +8
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  official apartment familiar with this expression?

                  familiar
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  only in the nineties father was able to squeeze out an apartment in the municipality through the courts.

                  I, too, through court with KECH MO fought. If you honestly earned, you will win. The truth of the nerves and tears of the wife can not be counted. But the enemy was overwhelmed! The victory was ours.
                  By the way, the lawyers in the KECh of the Moscow District are stupid ... then they were.
                  1. Sklendarka
                    Sklendarka 4 June 2020 12: 08 New
                    +4
                    Moscow Order of Lenin
                    1. New Year day
                      New Year day 4 June 2020 14: 31 New
                      +7
                      Quote: Skalendarka
                      Moscow Order of Lenin

                      yeah, the truth about the Order of Lenin in 2000 was already forgotten
                2. Sergej1972
                  Sergej1972 4 June 2020 11: 47 New
                  +1
                  When we were at school, we were taken to an excursion to a separate radio engineering company located in the village in the late 80s. Some gradually removed them from this area from the beginning of the 70s. First there was a regiment, then there was a division, and then a separate company. By the way, a special regime colony was transferred to a neighboring district center in parallel.) This is so, by the way.) The equipment there was normal. But the wretchedness of the barracks and the houses in which the families of officers and warrant officers lived was amazing.
                3. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 4 June 2020 20: 40 New
                  0
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  4 people in a small coat. only in the nineties did father manage to squeeze out an apartment in the municipality through the courts.

                  Over 80 squares in four.
                4. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 5 June 2020 04: 27 New
                  0
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  4 people in a small coat. only in the nineties did father manage to squeeze out an apartment in the municipality through the courts.

                  And your dad didn’t become insolent? Personally, I got a hut with over 80 squares. Without any ships. Our blacksmith generally refused a two-odd piece of 50-odd squares, said I did not need her.
            4. New Year day
              New Year day 4 June 2020 11: 02 New
              11
              Quote: carstorm 11
              I taxed to pay the first faster

              I also taxed in my free time. Dachshund 10 rubles to the nearest metro station. BUT this money does not pay a loan! Have you heard of competitors with hammers and screwdrivers?
              Quote: carstorm 11
              I am already working as an older child to earn an apartment. My first apartment in my family appeared when I was 13 years old and my brother was 11.

              worthy of praise! Do not customize your case for the system
        2. New Year day
          New Year day 4 June 2020 11: 00 New
          10
          Quote: carstorm 11
          I’m actually already crying for the second time.

          well done, but not everyone has such a multiplication of banknotes in a single suitcase request
          Quote: carstorm 11
          I am not a masochist.

          not a masochist, but a free attitude towards money. To give something, you need to get something.
          It's like a puzzle in a school about a 2-pipe pool
          1. carstorm 11
            carstorm 11 4 June 2020 11: 09 New
            -8
            It's not about bills and suitcases. i am a father. my third child will be born very soon. I have to do it. must. so there will be another one for sure. well, or other options if something turns up. I'm not doing it for fun.)
            1. New Year day
              New Year day 4 June 2020 11: 14 New
              13
              Quote: carstorm 11
              i am a father. my third child will be born very soon. I have to do it. must.

              I am also a father and grandfather. But even with my income, I DON'T RISK to contact a mortgage! "I stretch my legs over my clothes" - as my grandmother used to say. Well, it's not realistic to pay and live. Yes, my friend, who is under 45, took a mortgage in New Moscow! A Muscovite could not take out a mortgage for a simple apartment in Moscow! Operates at 1.5 rates + commercial medical center. And financially I could not! Only outside the Moscow Ring Road and will pay for his retirement. And this is not bondage? Sorry, but this is bondage
              1. carstorm 11
                carstorm 11 4 June 2020 14: 41 New
                -10
                so they don’t force you. do not want do not take. that’s the point. only last year in the first 6 months of the country they were given almost half a million .. and therefore not everyone thinks like you. almost half a million families take money from a bank to improve their living conditions. almost a million logically in a year. and this is just the past. but there are still years before him and will be after.
                1. Overlock
                  Overlock 4 June 2020 18: 52 New
                  +4
                  Quote: carstorm 11
                  only last year in the first 6 months of the country they were issued almost half a million ..

                  Given that about 10 million Russians (9% of the country's population) rent housing, almost half of them (49%) plan to rent an apartment for at least the next two years, then tears. The bulk of the needy cannot afford a mortgage
                  1. carstorm 11
                    carstorm 11 4 June 2020 22: 49 New
                    -1
                    math is a strange thing. half a million issued mortgages, it may be permissible in reality several million people since the family is not one person right? and this is the data for 6 months in total. and people take mortgages for many years.
      2. Svarog
        Svarog 4 June 2020 07: 24 New
        12
        Quote: Crowe
        In Europe, a mortgage is available at 1-5% per annum, in the USA - 3-4%, and in Russia - between 9 and 10%.
        At the level of salaries in the above countries, we have this robbery, to put it mildly .. We must call a spade a spade, agree ...

        To this we can add housing and communal services, which in total are close to paying mortgages, yesterday the receipt came 6 and this summer .. tin ..
        1. Crowe
          Crowe 4 June 2020 07: 52 New
          18
          Volodya, I live in a private house and I felt it on my own skin, and what can we say about the "happy owners" of apartments in five-story buildings. That's where the tin is, people give up to a third of their salaries on receipts ...
      3. New Year day
        New Year day 4 June 2020 09: 46 New
        11
        Quote: Crowe
        In Europe, a mortgage is available at 1-5% per annum, in the USA - 3-4%, and in Russia - between 9 and 10%.

        At what percentage does Sberbank give a mortgage in Europe? And under what we have!
        1. AU Ivanov.
          AU Ivanov. 4 June 2020 10: 22 New
          -9
          In what currency does Sberka give loans in Europe and in which one? At one time, a currency mortgage and we had much cheaper ruble.
      4. New Year day
        New Year day 4 June 2020 10: 53 New
        +9
        Quote: Crowe
        I, Dim, consider the mortgage a bondage.

        My employee took a mortgage from homelessness, I need to live somewhere. They sat down, calculated with her, an overpayment of almost 100%.
        Quote: carstorm 11
        ... who considers a mortgage a bondage?

        Don't you think it’s shameful to overpay 100%? Maybe you Koreiko-a million here, a million-here?
        1. carstorm 11
          carstorm 11 4 June 2020 14: 45 New
          -7
          no. but for me it is in any case more profitable. The first apartment I paid increased in price and very decently. selling it, I could almost beat off everything. you can save money and wait. prices will rise, you will simply be counting your savings and regret it.
        2. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 10 June 2020 09: 11 New
          0
          Overpayment is known in advance, no one hides it. My monthly payment was a little more than the amount that I paid for renting an apartment. By the way, with the help of a mortgage, I bought the apartment that I rented for five years. Therefore, nothing has changed much in terms of payments, but the apartment has become my own. Mortgage closed ahead of schedule. The contract was for 15 years, I'm all
          paid for incomplete 7 years. Periodically added once every two to three months, and later and more often, additional amounts, once every month reducing the mortgage term by a month or two, then decreasing the monthly payment. There are small tricks, you need to calculate when it is more profitable to reduce the amount of the monthly payment, and when the term of the mortgage. And all without visiting the VTB branch, through your personal account. Only at the very end did he come to pick up the mortgage. By and large, in the last year and a half, the payment was not at all a burden, in addition, the salary became larger, and it could still be stretched for several years. But I just wanted to quickly become a full-fledged homeowner.
      5. Motorist
        Motorist 4 June 2020 20: 27 New
        0
        In Europe, a mortgage is available at 1-5% per annum

        With such%, many can afford to take a loan, therefore, the demand for real estate is growing, and - finally - the price is rising. So this is another question, where you overpay more ... what
  4. The comment was deleted.
  5. The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 4 June 2020 06: 22 New
    12
    Three months ago, when they thought about quarantine "to introduce or not to introduce" (after all, everything is fine with us and we are prepared), I wrote that it would not get better. Not Vanga, but felt it ... As with the sanctions, from which only "good".
    So the patriots wrote me full sofas, they say, you are a pissemist, and in general, all of them are "on" ... And now they began to write articles. "Po", it turns out, hurts ...
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 4 June 2020 06: 49 New
      +6
      We, the country, BETTER BETTER, thirty years ago ... now we are only getting the consequences.
    2. 2 Level Advisor
      2 Level Advisor 4 June 2020 06: 50 New
      +4
      And they wrote a lot about "don't tell my Iskanders" when they talked about sanctions .. for many, forecasting the future is an impossible task for the brain ..
    3. New Year day
      New Year day 4 June 2020 09: 50 New
      11
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      better not.

      It’s like with the price of gas, it grows at a low oil price, and at a high. The state takes off its margin in any weather laughing
      It only happens once that such a state loses confidence, or rather it’s almost lost
  6. Ryaruav
    Ryaruav 4 June 2020 06: 35 New
    +9
    it’s time to drive the gref back to his historical homeland, and not just him
    1. Sergej1972
      Sergej1972 10 June 2020 09: 13 New
      0
      You, obviously, are not thinking about that historical homeland. Gref is German.
  7. nikvic46
    nikvic46 4 June 2020 06: 44 New
    +9
    Here, the author mentioned Soviet loans. I asked the bank whether it was possible to repay the loan ahead of schedule. I was rather harshly told that it wasn’t possible. I began to explain to them the benefits of quick money, but ... And in 70 years it could be done quite calmly .
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 4 June 2020 06: 48 New
      13
      The Soviet Bank did not very well profit from the citizens ... he had no such goals and objectives.
    2. AU Ivanov.
      AU Ivanov. 4 June 2020 09: 31 New
      -9
      Did you familiarize yourself with the loan conditions before applying for or did you sign the contract without looking? There are loans with the possibility of early repayment.
      1. nikvic46
        nikvic46 4 June 2020 15: 54 New
        +1
        Andrei. Thank you for the advice. I took household items on credit. That's why I like the Bushmen, Masai, Gypsies, the people of the Far North. They never give advice. These tips flow vertically, horizontally. And in magazines they tell how to do children. One of us was indignant. I have been living with my wife for 30 years. It turns out that all this time I did children wrong.
    3. Sergej1972
      Sergej1972 4 June 2020 11: 59 New
      -1
      Now in normal banks, no one interferes with the early repayment of a loan.
  8. rocket757
    rocket757 4 June 2020 06: 47 New
    +4
    The topic is complex, difficult .... everything and everywhere is different, BUT, it's just CAPITALISM !!!
    1. depressant
      depressant 4 June 2020 14: 14 New
      +6
      But what a two-year plan for the restoration of the Russian economy, therefore, to increase the creditworthiness of the population and enterprises offers the capitalist Mishustin.
      The plan is divided into three stages.
      Stage 1. Prevent further decline in incomes and deepening recession.
      Stage 2. Recovery of the economy and incomes of citizens.
      Stage 3. Sustainable growth of real incomes of the population, stimulation of an active economic breakthrough up to 2,5% of GDP growth, that is, gross domestic product, by the end of 2020 (some word is a breakthrough! From the bottom up to the bottom, where in 2019? With its 1,3% painfully strained GDP growth statistics - "negative growth", as Nabiullina ordered to call the phenomenon).
      And for the "breakthrough" to take place, 500 events worth 5 trillion of budget money have been invented. I will dwell on a couple of them for now, which do not contribute in any way to Mishustin's desire to increase the creditworthiness of the population as an indicator of the success of the program in his name, even if you do zero percent at the rate.
      For example, direct payments for sick leave and benefits for citizens with children. This "event" has already been subjected to devastating criticism both at this forum and from leading economists due to the excessive bureaucratization of the process and cunning corruption hooks in the laws, which firmly excluded the majority of citizens from accessing the payments mentioned. In addition, 52 billion rubles, as correctly noted by colleagues, is a drop in the bucket. On the other hand, within the framework of an event out of these five hundred, called "Subsidies and guarantees from the state", the now unprofitable Russian Railways, Gazprom and Rosneft have already received 100 billion budget rubles of "perpetual interest-free loan" (they will give it back when they want, but they may not want to) ... Hence follows the second example, the opposite - compensated "assistance" to small and medium-sized businesses, in which a significant part of the population is employed, and I did not miss the prefix "without", it simply does not exist! Reimbursable assistance will only worsen the situation of entrepreneurs, because the loan will have to be paid, along the way, paying taxes, taking into account the fact that even before the coronavirus, entrepreneurs were already working not to make a profit, but to reduce losses (economist Ivan Nevolin). And the chairman of the Party of Small Business of Russia, Yuri Sidorov, bluntly stated: "Business will be even more credited with all the ensuing consequences. The only real support for both business and the entire people is gratuitous financial assistance and the creation of conditions for SMEs (small and medium-sized enterprises)."
      And here I presented a fantastic picture, smoothly turning into reality: the capitalist Mishustin sends you help on the card, and the capitalist Gref, licking greedy drooling, takes off the percentage, and both are smiling at each other knowingly.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 4 June 2020 14: 23 New
        +1
        Such a SYSTEM, just capitalism.
        Again and again the same question - And what should we do? or do nothing, by itself, will it go?
      2. New Year day
        New Year day 4 June 2020 14: 42 New
        +6
        Quote: depressant
        Stage 1. Prevent further decline in incomes and deepening recession.

        therefore, they did not pay money to the self-insinuators and introduced a new tax on deposits
        Quote: depressant
        Stage 2. Recovery of the economy and incomes of citizens.

        Fantastic! how can one restore what is not? Unless with Salman to agree on a new oil price. About income, see paragraph one
        Quote: depressant
        Stage 3. Sustainable growth in real incomes of the population, stimulation of an active economic breakthrough up to 2,5% of GDP growth

        complete nonsense. Under normal conditions, outside the crisis, growth was within 1%, and here as much as 2.5! In America, growth is 2.5. Catch up with and overtake America again? Who will believe it?
        Quote: depressant
        a fantastic picture smoothly turning into reality: capitalist Mishustin sends you help on the card, and capitalist Gref, licking greedy drooling, takes off the percentage,

        will look like this somewhere!
        1. depressant
          depressant 4 June 2020 16: 19 New
          +5
          Dr. Sylvester, thanks! I laughed heartily!))))
          And here is another example of Mishustin's insufficient understanding of the mode of existence of a diversified economy, which allowed economist Oleg Cherednichenko to consider Mishustin's plan for overcoming the crisis "a set of good wishes."
          Airlines are given a state guarantee (agree, we will immediately transfer the money!) For the purchase of 59 Superjet-100 aircraft in the amount of 139,6 million rubles. It is clear that the aircraft industry needs to be supported. But listen, this is a supply chain! Well, the companies will buy these planes, budget money will go to their manufacturer, and then? The airlines have a different problem, it is in the loading of existing aircraft - there are no passengers! This means that the tourism business has no clients. To whom they promise to reduce VAT to 7% according to the plan, and tour operators are neither cold nor hot because of this - they have no money! Because the "strategist" Mishustin did not take into account that there is a line between the air carrier and the tour operator on the diagram of their connection between each other, meaning the flow of people from the tour operator to the plane - a flow that is now gone, because people are also penniless! This means that in order for planes to fly in and tour operators gratefully accept the reduction in VAT, people on the communication line must be given money. Government logistics is unable to take this line into account. Rather, she sees the line, but does not understand that in many cases the lines of intersectoral ties consist of people, which is why it is doubtful whether our economy can be self-produced according to the Mishustin plan.
  9. Gardamir
    Gardamir 4 June 2020 06: 49 New
    13
    Sberbank, which is now in full swing reporting on the start of soft loans
    I have a Sberbank card (not credit). Yesterday Sber offered me to take a 60K loan for 50 days without interest. But if I do not pay for 50 days, then the percentage will be 23,9 not sickly yes! Instead of investing in the development of the country, they row with interest.
    1. sergo1914
      sergo1914 4 June 2020 07: 08 New
      -2
      Quote: Gardamir
      Sberbank, which is now in full swing reporting on the start of soft loans
      I have a Sberbank card (not credit). Yesterday Sber offered me to take a 60K loan for 50 days without interest. But if I do not pay for 50 days, then the percentage will be 23,9 not sickly yes! Instead of investing in the development of the country, they row with interest.


      I have already had Alpha 100 days. Convenient thing. It began with a limit of 140. Now - under 500. The house was built. I bought a Finnish stove for 600. If you competently spend - you fit into the days. Interest 0. If you did not think and did not fit the deadline - (IMHO) is to blame. You need to think. And be able to count to more than ten.
      1. Gardamir
        Gardamir 4 June 2020 07: 37 New
        +7
        If you competently spend - you fit in the days
        One must be able to fit in the days.
        1. sergo1914
          sergo1914 4 June 2020 08: 42 New
          +3
          Quote: Gardamir
          If you competently spend - you fit in the days
          One must be able to fit in the days.


          That's right. Debit Credit. Costs should not exceed revenues. Evidence, understandable for some reason, is not for everyone.
          1. Gardamir
            Gardamir 4 June 2020 08: 53 New
            +1
            Evidence is different. If the source of income is not stable, then how to count.
            1. sergo1914
              sergo1914 4 June 2020 09: 03 New
              +3
              Quote: Gardamir
              Evidence is different. If the source of income is not stable, then how to count.


              So the term is not a month. You can spin.
              1. Essex62
                Essex62 4 June 2020 10: 04 New
                +4
                In a normal society, there is no need to spin. Quietly work, raise children, engage in your favorite hobby, join the beauty and nature and not constantly think that tomorrow the family will eat, how to pay for the huge housing and communal services, and if the bourgeois kicks out into the street ...
                And which cards are not needed. Prices are such that s / n is enough for everything, including a trip to the sea with the whole family, with grandmothers and grandfathers.
                1. sergo1914
                  sergo1914 4 June 2020 11: 03 New
                  0
                  Quote: Essex62
                  In a normal society, there is no need to spin. Quietly work, raise children, engage in your favorite hobby, join the beauty and nature and not constantly think that tomorrow the family will eat, how to pay for the huge housing and communal services, and if the bourgeois kicks out into the street ...
                  And which cards are not needed. Prices are such that s / n is enough for everything, including a trip to the sea with the whole family, with grandmothers and grandfathers.



                  Normal, in your opinion, society, where is all the dollar millionaires? Or are you talking about communism? Do you think everyone in the States is sitting on bags of money? I can’t slam simultaneously 500 tyr. But with this product I can banking. And then I replenish the egg. Such a scheme suits me.
                  1. Essex62
                    Essex62 4 June 2020 12: 51 New
                    +4
                    I'm talking about the society where we lived not so long ago. Everything, without exception, LIVED There were no dollar ones, and the rubles were periodically leaned against the wall "for especially large sizes." And my salary was only three times less than that of the minister. For a kopeck piece, a communal apartment, we paid a little more than three, along with gas and a telephone. And from the age of 6, my mother and grandmother took me and my grandmother to the Crimea. Every year !!!. And the Soviet government paid me a pension for my deceased father, right up to the age of 20 until the techie finished. 10 years!!! Every month!!! Here is a normally organized society.
                    And communism is the height of perfection, but not yet possible, alas.
            2. sergo1914
              sergo1914 4 June 2020 09: 10 New
              +4
              Quote: Gardamir
              Evidence is different. If the source of income is not stable, then how to count.


              Only read the contract carefully. There are nuances with interest on the transfer and the limit on cash. But everything is solved. Shopping without interest and cashback can return something.
  10. rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 4 June 2020 07: 25 New
    +5
    Sometimes one gets the impression that Sberbank is a state within a state - it lives exclusively by its own laws, which often contradict normal logic. Only refusal to work in Crimea is worth noting about interest rates and other "pranks". The state seems to have bought a controlling stake, but the result is not yet visible. Does it mean that there is complete agreement with the corporate policy of this bank?
    1. depressant
      depressant 4 June 2020 08: 50 New
      +9
      And this is because, colleague rotmistr60, that Sberbank, after its sale to the state, only half came under the control of the Ministry of Finance. Non-residents, that is, non-citizens of the Russian Federation, have 45, 41% of the shares in Sberbank. If this foreign mass of shares is counted as 100%, then 69,5% of them belong to the US-British syndicate, the rest of the shares are still held by some foreigners, which can be clarified if necessary. In the next three years, $ 17,5 billion will be allocated for dividends to these gentlemen - think about this amount! The money that could go to the treasury of the Russian Federation will go to support the welfare of not just strangers - enemies. Herman Gref is a member of the mentioned syndicate ...
      It was hoped that after the sale of Sberbank to the state, the syndicate was pushed back, Gref would be kicked out, but no. So, bringing your money to Sberbank or taking a loan from him, you work for foreign, enemy states.
    2. New Year day
      New Year day 4 June 2020 11: 07 New
      +9
      Quote: rotmistr60
      Sometimes one gets the impression that Sberbank is a state within a state - it lives exclusively by its own laws

      absolutely true and not according to Russian
      Quote: rotmistr60
      Only refusal to work in Crimea

      true, there is none in the Crimea. But in Ukraine, there is!

      Why Security Council of Crimea, when there is a whole Ukraine? laughing
  11. parusnik
    parusnik 4 June 2020 08: 04 New
    +6
    "..... we live this way, We will live like this until we die, And if we live like this - So, it must be so!" (c) Song of a common man, gr. Zoo
  12. Sergst
    Sergst 4 June 2020 08: 25 New
    +1
    And what is a "retired professor"? This is in the signature of the author.
  13. Million
    Million 4 June 2020 08: 46 New
    +6
    If the current government says that it will help someone, then it will wrap it like a linden.
  14. ZaharoFF
    ZaharoFF 4 June 2020 09: 06 New
    +6
    much earlier he began to withdraw his percentage, so far only one, for simple transfers from card to card.

    Downshifter just lost the edge. Refusal to work in Crimea, a call to popular fooling and stupidity. For all these unfortunate 2%, we all (who have a card) will pay out of our pocket, and even with a gesheft for the bank? What's next? Will you need to swear Kabbalah for a loan? And those who refuse the stamp on their forehead will burn out? Who do they really consider us?
  15. Pvi1206
    Pvi1206 4 June 2020 09: 24 New
    +7
    Russia's current economy is focused on enriching individuals ... take for example the Pension Fund (Pension Fund) - an absolutely parasitic formation ...
  16. Samara
    Samara 4 June 2020 09: 45 New
    -10
    Retired professor of REU Ivanov, author of the article? I won’t even write anything, and so it is clear .. laughing crying negative
  17. AK1972
    AK1972 4 June 2020 10: 08 New
    +8
    Children at school wrote an essay on the topic "If I were the Minister of Finance." They started in different ways, wrote about everything, but all the compositions ended in the same way: .... and hell you would find me.
  18. begemot20091
    begemot20091 4 June 2020 10: 13 New
    +8
    Quote: carstorm 11
    I am not going to participate in the rally. I don’t need all this. can’t pay much let them take cheaper. I taxed to pay the first faster. nothing fell off. everything is better than how my parents with two children without an apartment in the Union were sitting and without real prospects to get it. I am already working as an older child to earn an apartment. My first apartment in my family appeared when I was 13 years old and my brother was 11.

    Stop whistling. Either my friend was drinking or was lazy. I'm under 70. Only my older sister, 4-5 years old, lived in a hostel in Old Peterhof, while her husband was writing his Ph.D. My parents had a house in a village near Novosibirsk, then they got an apartment in a "two-story building", my wife - in Altai, my parents lived in the village - had a good apartment - they got it from the mine a year after birth (the wife is their daughter). I lived in a hostel only as a student and for the first 2-3 months of service (a jacket in army terminology). Children also have apartments and grandchildren. Yes, it worked. After dismissal in factories and smoky factories. Total experience - 52 years. It's a pity they don't take it now - they say the old one (he quit his job due to the move). Yesterday on TV, the farmer invited him to work - to milk cows, stir up manure, plow the land. If there is no salary, let them go, work in the village, build a house for themselves. He (the farmer) provides housing. I'm not even talking about doctors - "snatchers" - the program "zemstvo doctor" - after all, they are going, but only a few. The rest are "fighting" out of town - they climb into private "shops" to consult - just not "off the beaten path, to Saratov." I am glad for you that they have provided for themselves and their grandchildren, just do not find fault with my country - the USSR. Otherwise, the unhealthy associations I mentioned above arise.
  19. tochila
    tochila 4 June 2020 10: 34 New
    +1
    Gref - he is so! Such! Nasty!
  20. pmkemcity
    pmkemcity 4 June 2020 10: 37 New
    +1
    Quote: Mitroha
    And the story is about a consumer loan, which is cheaper than mortgages, if you do not take extremes from advertising, in general from kolotampovye.

    Unfortunately it's true. If you don’t know, don’t write!
  21. Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 4 June 2020 10: 55 New
    +4
    The program, under which banks can lend to business and non-profit structures at 2% per annum, started on June 1.

    Just yesterday I deleted a message from Sberbank - a loan offer at some 23,9% per annum ... wassat
    Looping some.
    To develop the economy you need a mortgage at 1,5-2%. Production will follow her. All is well. Most importantly, people will begin to live in human conditions.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 4 June 2020 17: 11 New
      -2
      People will only reach if Sberbank has enough loans for all who wish to give housing - loans are primarily the money of depositors for which the bank is entrusted. There is no vacuum money, they are all in motion, and even when they are under their pillows they work the same in the economy - in their mass.
  22. faterdom
    faterdom 4 June 2020 12: 24 New
    +3
    Q.E.D. Banking capital from its usurious business does not come down voluntarily. Therefore, this will must be formulated and demonstrated by someone. Guess who?
    This is by no means the Constitution with its "amendments", but a very specific person who is required not to boil in five years, breaking pencils in trained fingers, but to show and indicate clearly and strictly: do banks for people, or do people exist for banks? Moreover, the slowing and doubting bankers should be encouraged. And not necessarily just gingerbread.
    1. Samara
      Samara 4 June 2020 13: 04 New
      -1
      Quote: faterdom
      Therefore, this will must be formulated and demonstrated by someone. Guess who?
      This is by no means the Constitution with its "amendments", but a very specific person who is required not to boil in five years, breaking pencils in trained fingers, but to show and indicate clearly and strictly: do banks for people, or do people exist for banks? Moreover, the slowing and doubting bankers should be encouraged. And not necessarily just gingerbread.

      What are you calling for?
      Quote: Corona without virus
      I will say simply - ANYONE !!! from my friends I didn’t manage to get a single soft loan for business ... so ... draw your own conclusions about how they relate to the Government ..

      And you too .. Little to you 90s Want to repeat?
  23. Virus-free crown
    Virus-free crown 4 June 2020 12: 45 New
    +3
    I will say simply - ANYONE !!! from my friends I didn’t manage to get a single soft loan for business ... so ... draw your own conclusions about how they relate to the Government ... repeat
  24. Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 4 June 2020 13: 21 New
    +2
    in practice turns into some miserable handouts
    Well, actually, she turns a shisha under her nose, with a cheerful laugh. You can get help in the amount of the minimum wage for one worker ... if the tax debt at the time of treatment is not more than 3 thousand rubles. Cool, right? Help to enterprises and their employees is needed because their situation is difficult! With a really working company, all taxes at such a wonderful time simply cannot be paid. No money, can you imagine ?!
    Well, if there isn’t, then you don’t see any help. Only those who do not need money can get it. Do you know who does not have a shortage of money and cannot have it in spite of any crises? Exactly...
    And plus another funny habit of banks, "forget" a little debt in your account.
    There is such a funny trick. You owe a little tax. Really a little, ten thousand for example. And this money in the account is marked as "tax debt". But they are not transferred by the bank. They just count. You don't care, it doesn't seem to bother you, but as long as this money is considered a debt, you are a debtor! I don’t know what this story is about ...
  25. Junior Private
    Junior Private 4 June 2020 15: 35 New
    +3
    Quote: rocket757
    The Soviet Bank did not very well profit from the citizens ... he had no such goals and objectives.

    Under the USSR, it was possible to take a loan at work, that is, without any interest. Repayment by time periods did not bother at all.
  26. Radikal
    Radikal 4 June 2020 15: 52 New
    +5
    Quote: depressant
    But what a two-year plan for the restoration of the Russian economy, therefore, to increase the creditworthiness of the population and enterprises offers the capitalist Mishustin.
    The plan is divided into three stages.
    Stage 1. Prevent further decline in incomes and deepening recession.
    Stage 2. Recovery of the economy and incomes of citizens.
    Stage 3. Sustainable growth of real incomes of the population, stimulation of an active economic breakthrough up to 2,5% of GDP growth, that is, gross domestic product, by the end of 2020 (some word is a breakthrough! From the bottom up to the bottom, where in 2019? With its 1,3% painfully strained GDP growth statistics - "negative growth", as Nabiullina ordered to call the phenomenon).
    And for the "breakthrough" to take place, 500 events worth 5 trillion of budget money have been invented. I will dwell on a couple of them for now, which do not contribute in any way to Mishustin's desire to increase the creditworthiness of the population as an indicator of the success of the program in his name, even if you do zero percent at the rate.
    For example, direct payments for sick leave and benefits for citizens with children. This "event" has already been subjected to devastating criticism both at this forum and from leading economists due to the excessive bureaucratization of the process and cunning corruption hooks in the laws, which firmly excluded the majority of citizens from accessing the payments mentioned. In addition, 52 billion rubles, as correctly noted by colleagues, is a drop in the bucket. On the other hand, within the framework of an event out of these five hundred, called "Subsidies and guarantees from the state", the now unprofitable Russian Railways, Gazprom and Rosneft have already received 100 billion budget rubles of "perpetual interest-free loan" (they will give it back when they want, but they may not want to) ... Hence follows the second example, the opposite - compensated "assistance" to small and medium-sized businesses, in which a significant part of the population is employed, and I did not miss the prefix "without", it simply does not exist! Reimbursable assistance will only worsen the situation of entrepreneurs, because the loan will have to be paid, along the way, paying taxes, taking into account the fact that even before the coronavirus, entrepreneurs were already working not to make a profit, but to reduce losses (economist Ivan Nevolin). And the chairman of the Party of Small Business of Russia, Yuri Sidorov, bluntly stated: "Business will be even more credited with all the ensuing consequences. The only real support for both business and the entire people is gratuitous financial assistance and the creation of conditions for SMEs (small and medium-sized enterprises)."
    And here I presented a fantastic picture, smoothly turning into reality: the capitalist Mishustin sends you help on the card, and the capitalist Gref, licking greedy drooling, takes off the percentage, and both are smiling at each other knowingly.

    If hockey player Mishustin wrote how many industrial enterprises would be built during this period, and, accordingly, jobs would be created, it would be possible somehow, though with a stretch, but to believe in the reality of his "plan", but he did not say that ... what does it mean? If it's soft, then - blah blah, and if not ...? sad
    1. AU Ivanov.
      AU Ivanov. 4 June 2020 18: 26 New
      -2
      Build an enterprise is not a thing. Where we will sell products and who will buy it - that is the question. Otherwise, these plants by-and-bye and money cried.
      1. depressant
        depressant 5 June 2020 00: 12 New
        +2
        Pilot Ivanov, welcome! ))))
        I will say that. Why do I need such a government for which to build an enterprise is not a joke? I have already cited information that in the midst of an epidemic and a global economic crisis equal to a perfect storm, South Koreans, without any excruciating stress, without wrinkling their foreheads, not shaking arguments as to why this cannot be done, planned the construction of 17 new industrial zones on several square kilometers, which will complement the existing zones to 102. They planned and, as their practice shows, they will quickly build - who would doubt it! This is the kind of government I need. And not one who, with a frowning, important look, or even threateningly staring at me with an abusive voice, tells me that building a plant is not a joke to you! And I do not need a government that does not know what, except for oil, gas, grain and weapons, can be sold on the world market. But in the domestic market, it sells dreams well, and you, a colleague, are their regular customer. It would be nice if the government finally learned to trade in the sale of dreams.
  27. Poru4ik
    Poru4ik 4 June 2020 16: 56 New
    -1
    Mitroha Today,
    "Yes, there is generally some kind of heresy written. A person replenished a credit card with a commission of 250 rubles. To manage to do this, it must be replenished from a card where the cash withdrawal service is paid (for example, another credit card). Or by interbank transfer from another bank. To myself." evil Buratino "That's just where the bank is, it's not clear."
    And the story about consumer credit, which is cheaper than a mortgage, if you do not take the extremes from advertising, generally from kolampovye. "
    Sometimes you have to use a Sberbank credit card. I transfer for repayment from a card (debit) to a credit card, that is, within the limits of my current account, and every time I see in the report a column on interest withdrawal for, attention, - cash withdrawal / deposit. I call, I ask, how do I transfer virtual money from card to card inside my account? They answer - read the contract carefully! Okay, I think I'll look on the net for information. I find that there really is such a fad in the contract, but as one would expect "well, just in very small print." I began to dig further that the people were judging about it. I found a review of one Don Quixote (in a good way), who decided to wrestle with Sberbank. I will not describe all his rehearsals, for a very long time. The point is that he filed a lawsuit and the court confirmed the illegality of Sberbank's actions and ordered the money back to the client. But the man was not happy for a long time, the next month he again charged interest for withdrawing / depositing cash. He went to court again, but in court they say "the decision is valid only for a month." As it is very cleverly in the contract, this point is spelled out. If you do not agree, then come every month and write a statement. I scratched my turnip, but I spat on this Greek word, every month you are not in the courts, but they are considering these cases due to the heavy load on the judges for a very, very long time. Somehow such a story about the "People's Bank"
  28. Radikal
    Radikal 4 June 2020 18: 57 New
    +2
    Quote: AU Ivanov.
    Build an enterprise is not a thing. Where we will sell products and who will buy it - that is the question. Otherwise, these plants by-and-bye and money cried.

    Therefore, we buy products abroad instead of releasing our own? winked
  29. major147
    major147 4 June 2020 23: 38 New
    0
    It is hardly worth asserting now that the domestic economy is in ruins.

    Barak Huseynovich, are you !?
  30. Indifferent
    Indifferent 5 June 2020 13: 05 New
    +2
    Read this - just get upset. Before dinner, it is very harmful!
  31. Stalnov I.P.
    Stalnov I.P. 6 June 2020 12: 15 New
    +1
    What can I say to internal politics, in particular the economy and personnel, the current high inmates failed miserably and all these "antics and jumps" only emphasize the failure. New PEOPLE are needed, honest, decent, professionals, devoted to the PEOPLE and FATHERLAND. And the promises of development will be lost as the promises of 2008, 2012. You will see.
  32. aviator6768
    aviator6768 7 June 2020 01: 32 New
    0
    There is only one question - will there be a daredevil who will argumentatively put everything to himself for the tsar’s face .... or ours is so about nothing .... Let, in the end, Uncle X consult ...
  33. Plastmaster
    Plastmaster 11 June 2020 06: 46 New
    0
    Everything that is done is done for the better. The best pockets of Russia. By the way, yesterday Gref Putin called ..... And what is there? Who knows?
  34. Serpet
    Serpet 13 June 2020 12: 48 New
    -1
    The main thing is to shout about support louder. And there - even though the grass does not grow.