Military Review

Negative consequences of pension reform: what the authorities could not or did not want to take into account

262
Negative consequences of pension reform: what the authorities could not or did not want to take into account

Pension reform can be called one of the most unpopular decisions of President Vladimir Putin for almost 20 years of his stay in power. The good intentions that supposedly guided the authorities in raising their retirement age, in practice, led only to many new social problems.


The authorities tried to justify the need to increase the retirement age not only by financial, but also by demographic considerations. Like, the birth rate in the country is low, and from this there will soon be no one to work. The elderly Russians drew quite bright prospects: work hard for five years more, but there will also be more pensions, longer you can maintain an acceptable standard of living. But projects are projects, and the reality turned out to be completely different. The authorities could not or did not want to take into account several important circumstances.

The points


First, the low life expectancy of Russian citizens, especially males, calls into question the very survival to a retirement age of 65 years. To this mark, a very large part of Russian men simply do not live. And even if it survives, it is often disabled for a variety of diseases.

The second is the unreadiness of the labor market to provide jobs for a large number of people of pre-retirement age. In "good" jobs, older people will create competition for young people, and simply cannot work in hard and unskilled jobs due to physical characteristics. How a mockery sounded the proposal to replace the elderly migrant workers: 65-year-old auxiliary workers at construction sites - you can’t imagine on purpose ...

Third, a natural decrease in the standard of living of older people. Until recently, many elderly people continued to work, receiving both a salary and a pension. This allowed them to have relatively living money and somehow make ends meet: for example, wages were, for example, 15-20 thousand rubles, plus even 8-10 thousand rubles of pension. Modestly, but you can live.

Fourth - the formation of a whole layer of elderly people, completely deprived of livelihoods. We are talking about citizens of 60-70 years who do not have enough official experience to accrue a “labor” pension of 60 and 65 years, respectively, and they can only rely on a social pension.

Previously, a social pension was granted to women at 60 years old, men at 65 years old. It was still somehow possible to refine to such an age, but now men without official experience will have to work until they are 70 years old. In fact, this means that most of them will lose their pensions altogether, even social, because of their survival.

Fifth, the indirect effect of pension reform on demography is also negative. In Russia, in many families, parents of young spouses, especially grandmothers, traditionally performed many functions to care for young children. Now grandmothers, forced to work even after 55 years, cannot take care of the children of their sons and daughters. The latter, in turn, realizing the impossibility of assistance from their parents in caring for their children, will think three more times whether it is worth getting offspring now or wait another 5-7 years until the parents retire. But 5-7 years is a long time, including for health indicators.

Not surprisingly, the majority of the Russian population accepted the pension reform negatively, with rejection. No discussion about the need for pension reform can convince an elderly person of 60 years that he needs to work at a factory or construction site for another five years without receiving a pension earned over decades of work.

Raising the retirement age by the average life expectancy of a man, combined with a negligible amount of pension (only certain groups receive decent pensions, it’s not about them), also gives the opposite effect in terms of legalizing work: people are convinced that before retirement they can and do not live out. Accordingly, you can not pay mandatory contributions to the Pension Fund, and spend this money on current residence or save for old age yourself.

But in Russian society, with its inherent paternalism, the need for independent accumulation of old age is perceived as “scam” by the state. Thus, the authority of state power is undermined, the socio-political system itself is undermined.

So, again, did the wrong people go? .. Wrong? .. Unable to assess the situation and fit into the market?
Author:
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  1. Pvi1206
    Pvi1206 6 May 2020 12: 16 New
    103
    pension reform in Russia is an anti-people and anti-state diversion of the economic bloc of power, which is engaged only in this ...
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 6 May 2020 12: 28 New
      -31
      Quote: Pvi1206
      pension reform in Russia is an anti-people and anti-state diversion of the economic bloc of power

      Well, this is not only in Russia, but throughout the capitalist world as well. There are countries where the retirement age is 68 years.
      1. Snail N9
        Snail N9 6 May 2020 12: 36 New
        65
        It is also that everyone naively thinks that even after 65 years, they will receive a pension-naive, there the government plans to increase points for receiving a pension in this period-in the future it will be necessary to have officially confirmed in labor and, moreover, confirmed by deductions employers to the pension fund, work experience of 25 years. I dare to assure you, only employees of state-owned enterprises, security officials and other "goskormushniki" will be able to receive confirmation of such experience, the rest will not be able, and as a result they will go to a penny social pension from .... 70 (75 years in the plans) years. Already now, many, because of the mess of the 90s-early 2000s, cannot confirm their experience of 15 years, but what will happen when it will be necessary to confirm it for 20-25 years? sad
        1. Lexus
          Lexus 6 May 2020 12: 59 New
          50
          So it was in the Soviet State.



          So it has become now.

          Why does a pseudo-state need citizens, from whom everything has already been "squeezed out"? Pensioners are "illiquid assets" that they get rid of. That's all there is to know about modern Russian pension reforms.yes
          1. Tatyana
            Tatyana 6 May 2020 14: 01 New
            30
            Of course, pension reform in the Russian Federation is a pro-Western DIVERSION towards Russia from the side of the financial and economic bloc in the government of the Russian Federation and the Central Bank of Russia - Nabiulina with her hubby Ya.I. Kuzminov, founder and rector of the Higher School of Economics National Research University - a school of betrayal of the national interests of the Russian Federation.
            And the Federation Council and the State Duma of the Russian Federation are, in fact, pocket instruments of the financial and economic bloc in the Russian Federation.

            Together, they are the Gaidar-Chubais colonial-pro-Western administrative in the Russian Federation, existing in the country since the 1990s.

            So far, Russia has national sovereignty only military - and especially nothing more.
            1. Svarog
              Svarog 6 May 2020 14: 07 New
              50
              Quote: Tatiana
              Of course, pension reform in the Russian Federation is a pro-Western DIVERSION


              The final word was still for the president .. and he said it .. "please be understanding", what does it mean that the tail twists the dog? Or are they for one thing? I tend to the second, one gang of watering cans .. made a cooperative out of the state ..
              1. Lexus
                Lexus 6 May 2020 14: 27 New
                20
                When retiring, a European pensioner travels around the world, and a Russian - goes around the world. (C) modern saying

                I have not a single doubt that having dealt with pensioners, the "permanent" and "long-playing pensioners" will sooner or later end it.
              2. Radio_wave
                Radio_wave 8 May 2020 09: 04 New
                +2
                I agree one St. Petersburg gang is.
            2. Nikolai Grek
              Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 14: 43 New
              -10
              Quote: Tatiana
              So far, Russia has national sovereignty only military - and especially nothing more.

              what the country does not have sovereignty in parts !! fool laughing
              1. Tatyana
                Tatyana 6 May 2020 15: 10 New
                17
                Quote: Nikolai the Greek
                the country does not have sovereignty in parts !!
                Unfortunately, sovereignty can be FULL or Partial.
                Sovereignty (from the French. Souverainete - supreme power) is the supremacy and independence of state power, manifested in appropriate forms in the domestic and foreign policy activities of the state.

                There are many factors indicating the existence of the sovereignty of the country, but there are 6 main components, without which it is impossible to talk about the complete independence and independence of the state.
                Full State Sovereignty consists of the following elements:
                1. Recognition by the international community territory of the country; the presence of a flag, coat of arms and anthem.
                2. Diplomatic sovereignty - the ability to pursue an independent international policy.
                3. Military sovereignty - the ability to defend their state from an external military attack. If the state cannot protect itself, then this means that a stronger state can make any demands on it.
                4. Economic sovereignty - This is the supremacy in domestic economic affairs and the economic equality of states in the international arena. If the state cannot control its economy, then it will be controlled by someone else who can bring down the country's economy at any time, or make, for example, a country a raw materials appendage of another country, or put pressure on an economically dependent state.
                5. Legal sovereignty - consolidation of the status of a sovereign state in legislative form. The lack of legal sovereignty is a consequence of its loss as a whole.
                6. Ideological (cultural) sovereignty - the presence of their own state ideology, culture. Ideology and culture are closely intertwined with each other. Ideology is formed from culture and vice versa. Eastern wisdom says: "If you want to defeat the enemy, raise his children." If the state does not have its own ideology, then an alien culture can easily be imposed on the society of such a state, and this can play against the state itself.

                Only in the presence of all these 6 factors can we say that the state is SOVEREIGN.
                Today, only three states have Full State Sovereignty - Great Britain, the USA and China.
                1. Nikolai Grek
                  Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 19 New
                  -22
                  Quote: Tatiana
                  Today, only three states have Full State Sovereignty - Great Britain, the USA and China.

                  laughing you would not be fond of much such scribble !!! wink lol
                  1. cniza
                    cniza 6 May 2020 17: 38 New
                    +2
                    Well then, you must already include all the Anglo-Saxons ... and what about the DPRK? laughing
                  2. Tatyana
                    Tatyana 6 May 2020 20: 22 New
                    13
                    Quote: Nikolai the Greek
                    you would not be fond of much such scribble !!!
                    But why? Since you have questions about sovereignty, then others may have questions.
                    Others will read my answers - those to whom this topic is not indifferent and interesting.

                    The USSR in 1952 was a FULLY sovereign state, the course of power aimed at the development of the country.
                    The USSR in 1980 is a sovereign state, but a crisis of ideology sets in.

                    In the period from 1991 to 1999, the Russian Federation has practically no sovereigntyThere is only international recognition. Namely:
                    - 1. Recognition: there is a flag, a coat of arms, but we don’t have a hymn, there is only music.
                    - 2. There is no diplomatic sovereignty. The Warsaw block was dissolved in the 91st year. Russia is losing its allies one by one.
                    - 3. Military sovereignty is significantly lost. The Russian Federation is disarming unilaterally and can no longer compete on equal terms with the United States. Despite the presence of nuclear weapons, Russia is not able to repel not only an external military threat, but an internal one. This was evidenced by the inability of Russia to cope with terrorism in the First Chechen War. As a result, the 1 Khasavyurt agreements on the cessation of hostilities in Chechnya were signed. According to the agreement, the Chechen Republic was to be recognized as a subject of international law, having left Russia over the next 1996 years. And this meant that other republics, as well as Chechnya, could demand separation from the Russian Federation. The signing of the Khasavyurt agreements was to be the final stage of the liquidation of Russia.
                    - 4. There is no economic sovereignty. A country cannot provide itself with anything. The whole industry is sold for pennies. The Central Bank of Russia is separated from the state. The ruble is a derivative of the dollar - to print rubles, you need to buy dollars. The state cannot control the credit rate. In 1993, the Central Bank of Russia refinancing rate reached a record high of 210%. This indicator is the collapse of the economic system of the Russian Federation. In 1995, Yeltsin, at the request of the IMF, signed the "Production Sharing Agreement". Under this law, Russian deposits of natural resources were in international jurisdiction - i.e. money for the extraction of Russian oil did not go to the budget, but went to the accounts of Western banks and oil companies — primarily the British company Shell, for its personal expenses, and if something remained, they gave it to Russia.
                    - 5. There is no legal sovereignty. Article 15, paragraph 4 of the Constitution of the Russian Federation reads: “Generally recognized principles and norms of international law and international treaties of the Russian Federation are an integral part of its legal system. If other rules are established by an international treaty of the Russian Federation than those provided by law, then the rules of the international treaty shall apply. ” This means direct supranational governance. And this is just one example.
                    - 6. There is no ideological (cultural) sovereignty. Article 13, paragraph 2 establishes a ban on state ideology. We are actively adopting other people's values.

                    2013 - much has been restored in the sovereignty of the Russian Federation, but far from everything.
                    1. l7yzo
                      l7yzo 7 May 2020 18: 47 New
                      +1
                      YOU next time about the constitution, tell the law enforcement authorities - that you have rights))
                      By the way, they noticed - who in the world is all in balance - while the government did not ramp up the people strongly - our government did not ram in the world. It allowed itself to take advantage of the power over the weak - it received this in its address.
                  3. user
                    user 12 May 2020 09: 20 New
                    -2
                    you would not be fond of much such scribble !!!


                    What has become scary?
              2. Going
                Going 6 May 2020 17: 47 New
                -35
                It’s hard to live in retirement, only to those who have not thought about it since youth and those who want to live at the expense of the state.
                1. Virus-free crown
                  Virus-free crown 6 May 2020 22: 51 New
                  20
                  Do you EXACTLY live in Russia ?! fool
                  Tell me as a cleaner, all my official work activities working in white, Could save myself for a comfortable old age?

                  Or do we have a "white bone" in Russia and there is ... uh ... all the rest, of which 3/4 of the population is at least ???
                  1. AU Ivanov.
                    AU Ivanov. 7 May 2020 12: 59 New
                    -15
                    What religion prevented the cleaning lady from obtaining education and qualifications? As my dad rightly said: "If you are a loader at 20, it's okay. But if you work as a loader for 20 years, you have lived your life in vain."
                    1. Virus-free crown
                      Virus-free crown 7 May 2020 14: 16 New
                      +8
                      Do you EXACTLY live in Russia ?! repeat Do we have robots instead of cleaners ?! And in general, during the Soviet era there was a slogan - all works are good, choose to taste !!!
                      1. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 09: 45 New
                        -3
                        Uzbeks work for us as "cleaning managers". And if you are talking about the USSR, then Lenin also said: "study, study and study again."
                      2. Virus-free crown
                        Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 11: 58 New
                        +4
                        Quote: AU Ivanov.
                        Uzbeks work for us as "cleaning managers". And if you are talking about the USSR, then Lenin also said: "study, study and study again."

                        So I say that we live in two different Russia laughing
                        In MY Russia, the "cleaning manager" at our company is "Aunt Klava" - a single mother - who has raised and raised 2 children - great children, moreover !!! fellow
                      3. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 12: 00 New
                        +1
                        In my village, in Pyaterochka, the sellers are Russian, but the cleaning lady is a Central Asian. I’m silent about Peter.
                      4. Virus-free crown
                        Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 12: 08 New
                        +2
                        Quote: AU Ivanov.
                        In my village, in Pyaterochka, the sellers are Russian, but the cleaning lady is a Central Asian. I’m silent about Peter.

                        But in my village - 59 km from Moscow time - in pyaterochka - both Russians and Uzbeks - they are also sellers and cleaners hi and OTHER work in our village for 1000+ inhabitants is NOT from the word at all !!!! just understand - NO !!! there’s nothing more where you can get a job, the nearest city is 15 km from us near Moscow
                      5. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 12: 17 New
                        +1
                        I'm at my job for over 300 km. I’m traveling, though not every day. From the city to the countryside. And you need to learn, you must. We leave the rag and broom to the Uzbeks.
                      6. The comment was deleted.
                      7. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 12: 42 New
                        +1
                        And what about Nazism? Skilled jobs should be occupied, first of all, by citizens of Russia, do you disagree with this? Do you want to be treated, taught, repaired by your foreigners? Since when is the owner of a small woodworking elite? Tell the oligarch again! With a gold toilet on a business jet, yeah.
                      8. Virus-free crown
                        Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 12: 51 New
                        0
                        Quote: AU Ivanov.
                        And what about Nazism? Skilled jobs should be occupied, first of all, by citizens of Russia, do you disagree with this? Do you want to be treated, taught, repaired by your foreigners? Since when is the owner of a small woodworking elite? Tell the oligarch again! With a gold toilet on a business jet, yeah.


                        Nazism - in your words that "Qualified jobs should be occupied, first of all, by citizens of Russia" am

                        and let the non-qualified citizens of Russia die of hunger - in their place, recruit "Uzbeks"
                      9. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 12: 58 New
                        -3
                        And unskilled must qualify. No incapable - there are unwanted.
                      10. Virus-free crown
                        Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 13: 02 New
                        +2
                        Quote: AU Ivanov.
                        And unskilled must qualify. No incapable - there are unwanted.

                        Well, that's what I’m saying - we live in DIFFERENT Russia laughing
                        In my Russia, 59 km from Moscow, my neighbor, a single mother, has two children and she has a seriously ill mother who does not get out of bed, there is NO near 15 km from us !!! jobs from the word at all !!! and this is NOT a dead taiga - this is the NEAREST suburbs !!!

                        It is a pity that you cannot "be in the shoes" of my neighbor for at least a month ...
                      11. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 13: 13 New
                        -3
                        In the 90s I was in this skin, and for more than one year When they sat on the ground, without flights and the salary was delayed for 4 months, scanty, then the pilots were not paid much. With three children and a wife in her arms. Nothing: I learned how to drive a road train, and I managed to lay the stoves and "buy and sell" mastered. This is in my Russia. There are no hopeless cases, with rare exceptions like your neighbor's. And then, if she has certain skills, then you can find a remote job. I needed an employee to take orders in the online store.
                      12. Virus-free crown
                        Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 13: 28 New
                        0
                        I read before, until the opinions of you on the forum did not overlap that you - let's put it mildly - "sent Cossack" wink
                        now I'm just sure about it bully
                        I told the same thing about just one of my neighbors, and on the apartment site there are two more families, and in the entrance way how many people live, but in the house ... and in the village ... what
                        here you can compose a poem, why life is bad in Russia ... and almost everything will be "carbon copy" ...

                        so I accuse you of Nazism - if out of the 1000+ inhabitants of my village you accuse everyone of the fact that they are Inadequate to live in Russia - then who are you really ???
                      13. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 13: 49 New
                        0
                        But it’s not worth cutting everyone under one comb. If the conversation has already entered the landings, then I have only one out of 5 apartments living poorly. Alcoholic. And so long-range on his wagon, IT specialist, store owner and I, your humble servant. And how many more lives in my front door? Judging by the cost of parked cars, they live well. For some reason, migrant workers find work for themselves, and, often, earn more than the indigenous ones. Something we have to turn the steering wheel on a minibus for 60 of the few local people. Like sitting at the leverage of a bulldozer. Who am i? The pilot, a former, was bailed out into fifty dollars for retirement due to health reasons. I had to spin - spin. I tried one thing - it didn’t work, the other one didn’t. Engaged in third - voila - profit!
                      14. Virus-free crown
                        Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 13: 57 New
                        0
                        But you are aware of how many points from the Constitution of Russia you managed to question only in the past XNUMX hours ?! bully

                        I will now file a complaint with you Dear Site Administration - at the same time and check how they know the laws of the country in which we live drinks
                      15. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 14: 11 New
                        +1
                        List violated clauses of the Constitution, be so kind. At the same time, check your legal literacy.
                      16. The comment was deleted.
                      17. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 14: 21 New
                        0
                        That is, you yourself are not able to formulate your thoughts? Apparently, this is where your standard of living is - not able to, I apologize for the tautology. My Russia is a Russia of opportunity. Yours is not able to. Get out of the couch.
                      18. Virus-free crown
                        Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 14: 25 New
                        0
                        Quote: AU Ivanov.
                        That is, you yourself are not able to formulate your thoughts? Apparently, this is where your standard of living is - not able to, I apologize for the tautology. My Russia is a Russia of opportunity. Yours is not able to. Get out of the couch.

                        I'm used to "discussing the taste of shrimp only with those who have tasted it" - this was once hi
                        And two - I’m still a law-abiding citizen of my country, and it jars me when publicly violating its laws and bragging about it am
                      19. AMB
                        AMB 8 May 2020 18: 51 New
                        +1
                        excuse me AU, by old age I retired and writhed Count Monte Cristo, fear God, pride is the most terrible sin, but as it seems to me - I’ll cross you too much, you’re not Ivanov at all.
                      20. AU Ivanov.
                        AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 18: 54 New
                        +1
                        And I'm an ordinary man, not seven spans in my forehead and the seal of genius is not marked. I managed. Why are you worse than me?
                      21. AMB
                        AMB 8 May 2020 18: 58 New
                        +1
                        Thank you of course for you, you are not Ivanov, that's for sure.
  2. magirus401
    magirus401 22 May 2020 12: 19 New
    0
    What categorical right you are, I think you are 14-15 years old, judging by youthful maximalism, but nothing will pass, with age
  • Pvi1206
    Pvi1206 7 May 2020 20: 39 New
    +6
    someone needs to work as a loader if there is a need for society ... neither profession, position, nor wealth makes a person better or worse ...
  • magirus401
    magirus401 8 May 2020 09: 18 New
    +6
    [What religion prevented the cleaning lady from getting an education and qualification? / quote] And if there is no elementary ability to learn, what qualifications are we talking about, and not all the bosses and oh, what kind of specialists to be, someone should work to support them, and that the loader is shameful in the work, so your dad is not fair , in the article we are talking about retirement, and therefore about decent pay for any work
    1. AU Ivanov.
      AU Ivanov. 8 May 2020 12: 10 New
      -1
      Yes, there is no inability - there is reluctance. I would like to see our women not with a dirty rag in their hands, but at a computer in a warm office, at an operating table, with a pointer in their hands by the school board. Working skilled workers. They deserve it. A rag, weights and other black work - for migrant workers.
  • l7yzo
    l7yzo 7 May 2020 18: 43 New
    +7
    Yes, this is because you got the advice section. The current ones will no longer have this - neither apartments in their youth, nor trips from the party or collective farm. Yes, many of the small towns do not go further than the dachas - there is no money. From there, the army is torn - to see the country.
    Printed like that.
  • user
    user 12 May 2020 09: 25 New
    -1
    It’s hard to live in retirement, only to those who have not thought about it since youth and those who want to live at the expense of the state.

    You are probably from the political forces, in dusty helmets. Because of this approach, you will never have a strong state.
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 6 May 2020 14: 52 New
    +8
    Quote: Tatiana
    Together, they are the Gaidar-Chubais colonial-pro-Western administrative in the Russian Federation, existing in the country since the 1990s.

    You wrote it right, but it’s amazing that there are so many people who don’t like it. Do they really support the pension system, the HSE and the aunt with the Central Bank?
  • l7yzo
    l7yzo 7 May 2020 18: 41 New
    +1
    The suite makes the king. And so you can tryndet as much as you like.
  • user
    user 12 May 2020 09: 18 New
    -2
    Of course, pension reform in the Russian Federation is a pro-Western DIVERSION in relation to Russia


    In this question, the main saboteur of the CTO?
    Guess from three times.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • ism_ek
    ism_ek 6 May 2020 16: 35 New
    -20
    I am 43 years old. According to the PF information, 20 years of experience. Not a security official or a civil servant. Just honestly paying taxes. We have low pensions because a third of the population considers it normal to not pay taxes.
    1. edasko
      edasko 6 May 2020 18: 44 New
      11
      And why are gas prices high? Do you pay taxes or your employer? Here's what the employer pays for you (if you're not self-employed):
      Personal income tax (13%)
      Contribution to the FIU (22%)
      Contribution to the FSS (3%)
      Contribution to the MHIF (5%)
      For example, personal income tax - can you tell where it is spent? And from pension funds where money periodically disappears and why are their managers periodically caught abroad?
      1. ism_ek
        ism_ek 6 May 2020 20: 40 New
        -17
        Quote: edasko
        Here's what the employer pays for you (if you're not self-employed):
        Personal income tax (13%)
        Contribution to the FIU (22%)
        Contribution to the FSS (3%)
        Contribution to the MHIF (5%)

        Two thirds of the country's population pay all these taxes.
        Quote: edasko
        For example, personal income tax - can you tell where it is spent?

        85% - the regional budget and 15% the local budget, i.e. PIT is the construction of schools and kindergartens, the salaries of doctors and teachers.
        Quote: edasko
        And from pension funds where money periodically disappears and why are their managers periodically caught abroad?

        How much did you steal from pensioners?
        1. edasko
          edasko 6 May 2020 21: 41 New
          -12
          Well, in general. The car is expensive, 4 apartments, girls are cute .. Envy? Come to me to work, you will not regret it!
    2. Virus-free crown
      Virus-free crown 6 May 2020 22: 57 New
      +9
      I have more than your experience wink All my life I have been taxed by taxes am Why will my FUTURE pension be such that I cannot even go abroad on a trip around the world in my old age ??? crying
      1. AU Ivanov.
        AU Ivanov. 7 May 2020 13: 04 New
        -4
        Because a good third of the able-bodied population does not consider it necessary to pay taxes in the established manner. And you will retire later for the same reason.
        1. Virus-free crown
          Virus-free crown 7 May 2020 14: 34 New
          +6
          And what do I care about this third ?! am
          Did i pay ??? - paid !!!
          "Be so kind as to wrap up my purchase." wassat
        2. l7yzo
          l7yzo 7 May 2020 18: 51 New
          +5
          Well, I had experience, but I think that all citizens have))) Where are all the savings from the funded pension? And remember how cool it was - For each ruble you invested, the state will add another ruble. )
  • Doccor18
    Doccor18 6 May 2020 13: 01 New
    49
    In our team for
    retired for the last 5 years
    4 men. Three of them are already gone
    alive. Another 2 died before they reached 60. As a result, out of 6 potential pensioners, only 65 would survive to 1.
    Yes, and there are a huge number of professions and positions,
    where just physically at 64
    not really working fine.
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  • Lannan Shi
    Lannan Shi 6 May 2020 13: 20 New
    40
    Quote: tihonmarine
    Well, this is not only in Russia, but throughout the capitalist world as well. There are countries where the retirement age is 68 years.

    Compare life expectancy. In the same USA, the life expectancy for retirement will be 13 years, we have 9. In Germany 15, the same number as France, Italy 16. Greece and the Netherlands 13. We do not need to raise the retirement age, but lower it, for that matter. Well, if if the state exploiting its citizens longer than its neighbors, the state cannot provide them with pensions ... Then the state leadership should be changed, not prolonged the term of operation.
    1. Kuroneko
      Kuroneko 6 May 2020 13: 36 New
      -10
      Quote: Lannan Shi
      In the same usa, retirement life will be 13 years

      For the sake of fairness, I will note that in the same States, the population for the most part is so indebted that loans are inherited from father to son, then to his son, and so on. Yes, there (in most cases) collectors do not come with an iron and a soldering iron, but half of America has long been living in inherited debt (and, hearing and reading many of the revelations of our "sausage emigrants", this is even considered NORMAL - moreover, it comes and to such an extent that if you do not take loans, neighbors begin to look askance at you: "they say, what shisha does he eat like that?"). So the more understandable is the tradition of Americans to hand over their old people to nursing homes - there they are kakbe for the state. boarding house, but their own pension helps their sons / daughters a little to keep their "family debt" within more or less tolerable limits. Those. at least enough to service the debt.
    2. New Year day
      New Year day 6 May 2020 13: 46 New
      29
      Quote: Lannan Shi
      Compare life expectancy.

      and not only the duration! QUALITY of life must be compared
    3. 210ox
      210ox 6 May 2020 13: 55 New
      19
      Where did you get this figure-9 years ... Of the men, one in a thousand will survive. This I still modestly call.
      1. Lannan Shi
        Lannan Shi 6 May 2020 14: 00 New
        +9
        Quote: 210ox
        Where did you get this figure-9 years ..

        Average life expectancy - average retirement. In fact, yes, in fact, everything is many times worse. But I use only official data. And with them then .... Everything is more than sad.
        1. 210ox
          210ox 6 May 2020 14: 05 New
          12
          Yes I understand. Official data they are. I know only one person who lived to be 75 years old, my father-in-law. But he worked as a leader almost all his life. Hard workers do not reach 65.
          1. Lannan Shi
            Lannan Shi 6 May 2020 14: 14 New
            23
            Quote: 210ox
            I know only one person who lived to be 75 years old, my father-in-law.

            She worked for 10 years in construction, road construction, without kopecks. Handymen, those who are "in the snow and in the heat", to 40 complete ruins. Maximum up to 45. Machine operators up to 50-55. Even in the ITR position .... Let's just say, not sugar, and not even honey. Although for 8-10 hours, on average, outdoors, in the fresh air, my health somehow did not increase. Contrary to the claims of medicine, about the benefits of fresh air for the body yes
      2. Kuroneko
        Kuroneko 6 May 2020 17: 34 New
        +7
        Quote: 210ox
        Of the men, one in a thousand will survive. This I still modestly call.

        Here you, too, exaggerated in a sy-and-silly way, but here is that the middle of the 50s of life is the most dangerous time for men (almost half die at this age) - this is a fact. Essentially, cardiovascular.
        And even earlier. Mironov will not let lie. Although, of course, he spent himself as rarely. The great actors of the old school quickly wore themselves out.
  • Sling cutter
    Sling cutter 6 May 2020 13: 33 New
    24
    Quote: tihonmarine
    Well, this is not only in Russia, but throughout the capitalist world as well. There are countries where the retirement age is 68 years.

    Comrade, do not forget that in the developed cap. countries, life expectancy is higher, and the size of the pension itself is simply not comparable with ours.
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 6 May 2020 15: 05 New
      +1
      Quote: Stroporez
      Do not forget that in the developed cap. countries, life expectancy is higher, and the size of the pension itself is simply not comparable with ours.

      Where I live, the end of the term is 67 years, life expectancy, as in Russia, retirement is a bit more. Although I delayed my term, and left at a discount of 46 years. True, he worked for a long time in the main specialty, and now I work.
  • Svarog
    Svarog 6 May 2020 14: 04 New
    10
    Quote: tihonmarine
    Well, this is not only in Russia, but throughout the capitalist world as well. There are countries where the retirement age is 68 years.

    Just for some reason, European pensioners have the opportunity to travel the world, and ours count every penny ..
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 6 May 2020 15: 06 New
      -4
      Quote: Svarog
      Just why European pensioners have the opportunity to travel the world

      There developed capitalism, and pensions are much greater.
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 6 May 2020 15: 08 New
        +5
        Quote: tihonmarine
        There developed capitalism, and pensions are much greater.

        That’s what we’re talking about ... there is a higher life expectancy and pensions .. only the officials there are not so greedy ..
    2. AU Ivanov.
      AU Ivanov. 6 May 2020 16: 15 New
      -9
      Not every European pensioner can afford travel. Either own savings, or annuity, or corporate pension. Our pensioners abroad are also not uncommon.
      1. AK1972
        AK1972 7 May 2020 09: 43 New
        +4
        Quote: AS Ivanov.
        Our pensioners abroad are also not uncommon.

        I agree, it’s not uncommon, but it’s mainly Muscovite grandmothers who live by renting their apartments.
        1. AU Ivanov.
          AU Ivanov. 7 May 2020 10: 04 New
          -2
          My mother is not a Muscovite and does not rent an apartment, but we, her children, and five of us, constantly send our mother to travel or to improve health at the resorts. Abroad.
          1. AK1972
            AK1972 7 May 2020 12: 50 New
            +6
            The fact that you and your brothers and sisters (for the benefit of five of you) ensure your mother’s vacation abroad does honor to you, and not to the state, so please do not distort. It’s about the state’s care for its retirees, or you want to say that your mother’s pension will be enough for secured living and will remain on vacation abroad.
            1. AU Ivanov.
              AU Ivanov. 7 May 2020 12: 55 New
              -1
              A decent pension - a blockade worker, a home front worker (from 11 years old a nurse in a hospital) Karlovy Vary may not be enough, but just go to
              the same Czech Republic - quite. Often I see our retirees and a lot of shopping in Finland.
  • Graduate student
    Graduate student 7 May 2020 20: 28 New
    16
    Quote: tihonmarine
    There are countries where the retirement age is 68 years.

    But we don’t live somewhere in the world, we live in Russia and we have nothing to follow.
    Mind does not understand Russia,
    No yardstick to measure:
    She has a special feature -
    You can only believe in Russia.

    Author: F. I. Tyutchev
  • Anatole Klim
    Anatole Klim 6 May 2020 12: 29 New
    31
    Quote: Pvi1206
    anti-people and anti-state diversion of the economic bloc of power

    Ah, whoever is to blame, it turns out the economic bloc of power, and I swear to the Duma and SovFed, and the Government, and Him too, and the bloc is blamed for the economic bloc, but his eyes opened am
    1. Fan-fan
      Fan-fan 6 May 2020 15: 05 New
      +6
      sabotage of the economic bloc of power

      With such expressions they want to divert responsibility for this "sabotage" from the Chief Person.
  • smart ass
    smart ass 6 May 2020 12: 39 New
    +5
    Say don’t speak, there’s no sense
  • To be or not to be
    To be or not to be 6 May 2020 12: 45 New
    20
    Listen to what the Voucher said that year
    1. Errr
      Errr 6 May 2020 17: 12 New
      -6
      Quote: To be or not to be
      Listen to what the Voucher said that year
      "In that distant" is now the 2011th year. smile
      You presented Chubais' speech at the RusNanoTech 2011 forum on October 27, 2011. With all my rather skeptical attitude towards this person, here it is difficult for me to disagree with him. If the world's population growth is not controlled, it will be, to put it mildly, not very good. Only here, specifically about the population of Russia, I did not hear anything from him here. smile And the main topic in this speech was, in general, not about limiting the population, but rather about stopping the irrational, predatory consumption of planet resources by humanity through the use of new technological solutions. If you have the desire and time, you can watch and listen to this performance in full from the link https://youtu.be/4u0n8P2k_e8.
  • paul3390
    paul3390 6 May 2020 12: 56 New
    30
    You might think - the rest of the blocks are something better! Yes, at least take a look at medicine .. And so - alas, everything is with us .. Here the system needs to be changed, and not the blocks and individual characters.
    1. Svarog
      Svarog 6 May 2020 14: 24 New
      14
      Quote: paul3390
      You might think - the rest of the blocks are something better! Yes, at least take a look at medicine .. And so - alas, everything is with us .. Here the system needs to be changed, and not the blocks and individual characters.

      Of course, it is necessary to change the whole system, from the fact that the beds will move, the sense will be zero .. The state should be a state, not a cooperative .. If the state is socially irresponsible - why is it needed? Why pay taxes? What would contain this mediocre, huge apparatus of officials?
      1. paul3390
        paul3390 6 May 2020 14: 52 New
        21
        Actually - what can be the first conclusions from the ongoing cataclysm?
        1. The authorities were not able to ensure the safety of the population, because they did not impose tough measures on the spot a la China or Vietnam. Instead - some kind of stupid and meaningless type of self-isolation. Although there is, after all, both quarantine and emergency mode. But no .. With all the consequences.
        2. Putin’s vertical of power was absolutely not working. The mess as it was - continues, and half a year as the epidemic began. On the ground - some in the woods, some for firewood. They could not provide banal masks. But - heaps of all sorts of formidable decisions are made ..
        3. Putin turned out to be frankly weak. For all his pointers - they put everything with the device .. Starting from banks, ending with the population. It turned out - that no one began to listen to him, but to force him - he could not or did not want to. Thus, violating the commander’s first commandment - never give orders that you can’t force to execute. And this is his weakness - to us soon oh how comes around ..
        4. Putin was corny greed. For he did not give a penny from the accumulated population, when many were literally put on the brink of survival .. Putting everything on our shoulders. And then it will only get worse. And our Koschey - languishes over gold. Type - a small egg on a rainy day. - if it’s not him, then which one is really black ??? In general, it became clear that our survival is purely our problems. The authorities are not going to interfere. Moreover, she openly scoffs at us, demanding that we, from nowhere, also pay taxes and salaries.

        Conclusion: And what the hell do we need such power ?? But the most disgusting thing is, apparently, only ahead .. And the capitalist leaders have already demonstrated all their "best" qualities. No, they don't care about us .. So - we want to survive, we need to change the government. Back to the Soviet. Only in this way there are chances for a better future ..
  • Sling cutter
    Sling cutter 6 May 2020 13: 18 New
    36
    Quote: Pvi1206
    it is an anti-people and anti-state diversion of the economic bloc of power, which is engaged only in this ...

    The law does not enter into force without the signature of the president. Accordingly, who is the last father, hence the father of raising the retirement age is our "wonderful" president. so that he was empty!
    1. Pavel57
      Pavel57 6 May 2020 13: 44 New
      -3
      We will not know what the president has been led to.
      1. martin-159
        martin-159 6 May 2020 15: 16 New
        +3
        Who cares?
    2. Virus-free crown
      Virus-free crown 6 May 2020 23: 39 New
      0
      He could not sign this law !!!

      His words are:

  • New Year day
    New Year day 6 May 2020 13: 53 New
    24
    Quote: Pvi1206
    it is an anti-people and anti-state diversion of the economic bloc of power

    1. Lexus
      Lexus 6 May 2020 14: 09 New
      21
      All this "getting up from your knees" just for the sake of making it easier to put in the coffin.
  • pereselenec
    pereselenec 6 May 2020 20: 13 New
    +4
    Quote: Pvi1206
    economic power bloc

    What a flamboyant effimism, not to say "Putin".
  • Boris Chernikov
    Boris Chernikov 6 May 2020 22: 29 New
    -1
    like a pension in the USSR .. but then for some reason no one ached ..
  • Graduate student
    Graduate student 7 May 2020 20: 26 New
    13
    Quote: Pvi1206
    sabotage of the economic bloc of power

    Right. The positions of Gaidar and Chubais in economic policy are very strong.
  • About 2
    About 2 8 May 2020 08: 44 New
    0
    First of all, this is a sabotage of the nullified unprincipled Putin, who is not responsible for his words.
  • AB
    AB 6 May 2020 12: 19 New
    23
    And when the powers that be were interested in the life of the common people? Never!
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 6 May 2020 13: 22 New
      22
      perceived as “scam” by the state

      "And please treat this with understanding!"
  • Crowe
    Crowe 6 May 2020 12: 26 New
    29
    So, again, did the wrong people go? .. Wrong?

    Yes, the authorities were not lucky with the people. Some people want pensions there, then they don’t understand the current situation. The ungrateful people. They promised him paradise, but he .... There’s something to be done about this ... to bring the Chinese, so it’s no longer an option, they have an average salary more .. Can it come from Africa? So they want to live in Europe, not with us ... What to do ....
  • ximkim
    ximkim 6 May 2020 12: 27 New
    10
    A pension fund is such a pleasant place in which the money of the population is stored. After retirement, you need to pay this money. And once, in one fell swoop, a pension reform was signed so that money didn’t go anywhere or was delayed. How is it: you earn money not you hands, but we hands laughing
    1. New Year day
      New Year day 6 May 2020 13: 50 New
      11
      Quote: ximkim
      And once, in one fell swoop of the pen, a pension reform was signed so that denyuzhki did not go anywhere, or were delayed.

      they were simply plundered request
  • prior
    prior 6 May 2020 12: 30 New
    21
    If pension reform is not genocide, then what?
  • rocket757
    rocket757 6 May 2020 12: 33 New
    +8
    The people have pronounced their "judgment" on the pension reform!
    And then what ???
    "Vaska" all the same strives to gobble up his sour cream, but at least stand still for the cook, at least lie down right away ... he settled down where he was told.
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 6 May 2020 15: 15 New
      +7
      Quote: rocket757
      The people have pronounced their "judgment" on the pension reform!

      Well, as Nekrasov said:
      Do not be shy for the kindly fatherland ...
      I brought enough Russian people,
      He took this railroad too -
      He will bear everything that the Lord sends!
      It will endure everything - and broad, clear
      Breast pave the way for himself.
      The only pity is to live in this beautiful time
      I don’t have to - neither to me nor to you ”
      .
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 6 May 2020 15: 39 New
        +2
        Classics of the genre! Only if we cannot bear, at all, this "load", the descendants will definitely not thank us for sure!
  • Igor Borisov_2
    Igor Borisov_2 6 May 2020 12: 34 New
    +7
    All points in the article to the point !!!
  • seacap
    seacap 6 May 2020 12: 36 New
    20
    Because for these ghouls who have seized power, but are not ready for it in their intellectual development, but in psychological and moral terms, there are not even censorship words, those who betrayed and killed their country, who gave it for plunder and reproach, and without any intervention and struggle, solely for the sake of their own ambitions and the satisfaction of philistine needs, so are people in the country, a burden and hindrance, figures on paper, despicable plebs.
  • Van 16
    Van 16 6 May 2020 12: 39 New
    27
    "Pension reform can be called one of the most unpopular decisions of President Vladimir Putin in his almost 20 years in power."
    His most shameful decision, moreover, is betrayal of the people of Russia.
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 6 May 2020 13: 08 New
      18
      That’s okay, but guess what’s about to start now? After kovidlov? A bunch of small businesses went out and inevitably will leave even more soon, several million young animals will end up on the street, and then there are still non-pensioners ... That's when all this type of reform will rotten to us! And it remains to wait - a couple of months on the strength ..
      1. Van 16
        Van 16 6 May 2020 13: 15 New
        +5
        Yes, this "reform" was originally cannibalistic, and the further, the more it will show its anti-people face.
  • paul3390
    paul3390 6 May 2020 12: 41 New
    22
    Because the bourgeoisie will not calm down until they ditch all the social gains of the USSR. Their ideal is somewhere around the middle of the 19th century, with disenfranchised and impoverished people. And they are systematically implementing their plans. There is no hope for Putin, for he represents precisely these circles. Which more than once proved the last time. So - we have only one reasonable option, to return Soviet power. Otherwise, the capitalists will definitely kill us .. For there are no limits to their greed and greed ..
  • 7,62h54
    7,62h54 6 May 2020 12: 47 New
    -22
    Citizen Polonsky, let’s go without hysteria and rocking the boat. What do you propose?
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 6 May 2020 12: 59 New
      19
      Quote: 7,62x54
      Citizen Polonsky, let’s go without hysteria and rocking the boat. What do you propose?

      It is not necessary to ask Polonsky, but to establish popular power with the abolition of the pension law. We will choose.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    2. New Year day
      New Year day 6 May 2020 13: 51 New
      +9
      Quote: 7,62x54
      Citizen Polonsky, let’s go without hysteria and rocking the boat. What do you propose?

      I'm afraid that soon people themselves will make an offer
      1. Pavel123
        Pavel123 7 May 2020 03: 26 New
        -5
        And they sincerely believe that if the power is overthrown, it will become better? Naive. It will only get worse. For most citizens. At least not one of the republics of the former USSR began to live better.
        1. Pavel57
          Pavel57 7 May 2020 16: 39 New
          -1
          Replace Putin with Sobyanin?
  • Siberian
    Siberian 6 May 2020 12: 48 New
    20
    Yes, it’s not Russian paternalism that is guilty, but rather miserable salaries. Now in the running line they are inviting to work - some small production facilities, warehouses of everything in a row with s / pl. 14 thousand rubles. Why save from such a salary? And the pension is 38% of the salary. Here it is all the reform. Eh, the EP would wait just a little bit, the virus would solve all their problems, weed out everyone they planned. They would have waited, so they would not have been so overgrown.
  • Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 6 May 2020 12: 57 New
    23
    In Russia, in many families, parents of young spouses, especially grandmothers, traditionally performed many functions to care for young children. Now grandmothers, forced to work even after 55 years, cannot take care of the children of their sons and daughters.

    In Russia, more than 205 places were lacking in kindergartens, but more than 000 grandparents coped with this. Now I do not know... request
    Briefly ... Only for this pension reform of the creators of the law and those who have accepted this "genocide" of the population should be judged, depriving forever of benefits and privileges. There should be no forgiveness for such cynicism. And it’s time to expel people over 65/60 from the civil service at the legislative level ...
    1. Altona
      Altona 6 May 2020 13: 12 New
      15
      Quote: ROSS 42
      And it’s time to expel people over 65/60 from the civil service at the legislative level ...

      --------------------
      In general, ELECTION OFFICERS should not be SUBSIDIARY Nobles; a normal rotation of power is needed so that there are no revolutions and civil wars. And in conditions of social blockage of power, corruption, arbitrariness and unjustified tyranny with the police force are generated.
    2. Van 16
      Van 16 6 May 2020 13: 20 New
      13
      "And it's time to expel people over 65/60 from the civil service at the legislative level .."
      And with an average pension in the country. For nefig.
      1. Pavel123
        Pavel123 7 May 2020 03: 22 New
        0
        And that is right now. 65 years is the deadline for the bulk of civil servants.
  • Andrey Krasnoyarsky
    Andrey Krasnoyarsky 6 May 2020 13: 06 New
    24
    Pension reform is actually no reform, for the essence of any reform is changing something to improve the situation. And this, in the diplomatic language, is a confiscation measure. And if not diplomatic - state robbery of the population.
    1. Altona
      Altona 6 May 2020 15: 08 New
      +5
      Quote: Andrey Krasnoyarsky
      for the essence of any reform is changing something to improve the situation.

      -------------------------
      By the way, the "constitutional reform" that has been started is completing what was begun by the "pension reform", namely, it destroys the remnants of the legitimacy of the current government.
    2. Pavel57
      Pavel57 7 May 2020 17: 02 New
      0
      The cancellation of St. George's Day was also a reform.
  • Altona
    Altona 6 May 2020 13: 10 New
    18
    When they just voiced their Wishlist and began to run propaganda programs about how cool it is to be old and work hard, I and probably many other people (including middle-level officials) immediately thought that the government was breaking its legitimacy with its own hands, breaking its social base and in general makes a frankly stupid step, knocking out a stool or throne from under him. In 2016, I said in the elections do not vote for the United Russia it will be worse, to which the grandmothers replied, "but they are fuming." Well, we have lived up to the moment of truth, as they say. Without the pension reform, this government had a good share of loyalty and it was possible to stop whistling until 2024, but they wanted the best, they got it as always. Yes, and the effect of the "pension reform" turned out to be a penny, only 23 billion rubles. Such money can be obtained by a small jump in the daily rate of the ruble of kopecks by 50-70.
  • Sancho_SP
    Sancho_SP 6 May 2020 13: 13 New
    -11
    It is necessary to reform the pension towards its abolition.

    Everyone who receives a white salary gives 22% (!) To a pension fund. And of this money, a pension is paid to all those who did not pay taxes. I do not like such leveling, because with an average salary of a qualified specialist, I feed 2-3 pensioners at a minimum wage and a quarter of an official from the PFR.

    I am more than happy not to pay 22% and not to receive any pension for experience. Yes, and most of those who pay taxes.
    1. Kronos
      Kronos 6 May 2020 23: 49 New
      0
      This is a pubic eater
    2. Oleg Skvortsov
      Oleg Skvortsov 7 May 2020 11: 42 New
      +3
      Sancho, you are not feeding anyone. Each pensioner earned his own pension, having developed experience. Your reasoning - reasoning of an immature mind
  • Whirlwind
    Whirlwind 6 May 2020 13: 22 New
    -6
    In general, a socialist state with its social funds and social expenditures inevitably loses to capitalism in a competitive struggle for profit, if the people do not consciously support it or if they do not rob other countries and peoples, like the USA ...
    Was the defeat of the USSR in the ХV 1945-1991 with the USA and the West? It was !
    Everyone can feel the consequences in their own skin.
    1. Oleg Skvortsov
      Oleg Skvortsov 7 May 2020 11: 41 New
      +2
      You’re our whirlwind, anti-Soviet - for 30 years in Russia you have grinned rotting capitalism, and you’re all about socialism, which you saw only in the womb of your mother
      1. Whirlwind
        Whirlwind 7 May 2020 18: 38 New
        +2
        Dear, delve into what you were told. If capable ...
  • alone
    alone 6 May 2020 13: 24 New
    +5
    I am surprised by one interesting detail: In the "Decaying West", most retirees travel all over the world .. They have a rest for their pleasure ... Only pensioners of the post-Soviet space after
    retire, sit and think: "How to live further"
    1. AU Ivanov.
      AU Ivanov. 6 May 2020 14: 10 New
      -7
      I will upset you. In the decaying, not all pensioners can afford voyages. Either these are people who have savings, or have rents. And so there are many of our pensioners abroad.
      1. alone
        alone 6 May 2020 14: 27 New
        +9
        Quote: AS Ivanov.
        I will upset you. In the decaying, not all pensioners can afford voyages. Either these are people who have savings, or have rents. And so there are many of our pensioners abroad.

        Well, upsetting me is not very easy ... At least they don’t think about nutrition, how to live on this money .. I am very ashamed to watch old people fight for expired products .. I wish everyone who supported these reforms to be in their place
        1. AU Ivanov.
          AU Ivanov. 6 May 2020 14: 45 New
          -4
          It's not just pensioners who fight for delays. I personally saw how, during the liquidation of the SPAR hypermarket, quite respectable people fought for discounted goods, who arrived by car for several million. Yes, and it is worth looking at "Black Friday" in other countries, there is exactly the same as ours. X is a freebie.
          1. alone
            alone 6 May 2020 15: 06 New
            +3
            Quote: AS Ivanov.
            as with the liquidation of the SPAR hypermarket, for discounted goods

            As you noticed "for discounted goods" .. And these fought for food from the dustbin .. This is not the same hi
            1. AU Ivanov.
              AU Ivanov. 6 May 2020 15: 14 New
              -7
              But I didn’t see this, so that a sane person who does not suffer from dementia and is not an alcoholic rummaged in search of food. Is that homeless.
              1. sabakina
                sabakina 6 May 2020 19: 56 New
                +3
                Quote: AU Ivanov.
                But I didn’t see this, so that a sane person who does not suffer from dementia and is not an alcoholic rummaged in search of food. Is that homeless.

                Do not renounce prison and from the sum. Who said?...
          2. Pavel57
            Pavel57 7 May 2020 17: 05 New
            0
            Human nature, it manifests itself unexpectedly.
        2. Nikolai Grek
          Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 14: 52 New
          -8
          Quote: lonely
          At least they don’t think about nutrition, about how they live on this money ..

          read ratings again ???? wassat and you were not surprised by the info that in prosperous Britain, pence doesn’t have money for heating ??? !!! wink
          1. alone
            alone 6 May 2020 15: 04 New
            +7
            Quote: Nikolai the Greek
            read ratings again ????

            Why read the ratings? I've been to several countries that have very scarce natural resources than Russia .. But the standard of living of their pensioners is many times better than Russian pensioners ...
            1. Nikolai Grek
              Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 15 New
              -5
              Quote: lonely
              Quote: Nikolai the Greek
              read ratings again ????

              Why read the ratings? I've been to several countries that have very scarce natural resources than Russia .. But the standard of living of their pensioners is many times better than Russian pensioners ...

              I traveled all over the world ... not everything is so simple !!! wink lol
              1. alone
                alone 6 May 2020 16: 27 New
                +1
                Quote: Nikolai the Greek
                I traveled all over the world ... not everything is so simple !!!
                In fact, have something to say? Not the whole world - I'm not Putin V.V. Been in some countries of "Decaying".
                1. Nikolai Grek
                  Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 34 New
                  -6
                  Quote: lonely
                  Essentially have something to say?

                  in fact, you were told right away !! wink
            2. Pavel57
              Pavel57 7 May 2020 17: 07 New
              +1
              lonely (Omar Khayyam),
              "Theirs" retirees live on the money underpaid to our retirees.
    2. Nikolai Grek
      Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 14: 49 New
      -12
      Quote: lonely
      I am surprised by one interesting detail: In the "Decaying West", most retirees travel all over the world ...

      what who surprised you with such noodles on your ears ??? !!! wassat laughing ratings read again ?? !!! lol
      1. alone
        alone 6 May 2020 15: 01 New
        11
        Well, why immediately noodles and immediately to the ears? Have you seen the life of foreign pensioners? I saw .. They live for themselves, at least they don’t think about food .. And I see the life of our senior citizens ... If it can be called life ..
        1. Nikolai Grek
          Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 14 New
          -11
          Quote: lonely
          I have seen.

          daughter of an officer - our fffffsёёёёёёё !!!! wassat laughing
          1. alone
            alone 6 May 2020 16: 17 New
            +8
            Quote: Nikolai the Greek
            daughter of an officer - our fffffsёёёёёёё !!!!

            You can have it all .. I'm used to talking about what I see .. But not about what they say on TV. I would not be surprised if you confirm that 17000r. it's middle class hi
            1. Nikolai Grek
              Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 23 New
              -8
              Quote: lonely
              I'm used to talking about what I see ..

              It is doubtful that you are talking about everything you see !!! wink Really around you always some Cossacks go, but the poor ask for a piece of bread ?? !! wassat
              1. Mambius
                Mambius 6 May 2020 16: 26 New
                -10
                Quote: Nikolai Grek
                Quote: lonely
                I'm used to talking about what I see ..

                It is doubtful that you are talking about everything you see !!! wink Really around you always some Cossacks go, but the poor ask for a piece of bread ?? !! wassat

                "An artist sees this way" .. And you can't argue here .. laughing
                How many such "free artists" we have got divorced, read them and even shoot yourself ..
                1. Nikolai Grek
                  Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 32 New
                  -7
                  Quote: Mambius
                  Quote: Nikolai Grek
                  Quote: lonely
                  I'm used to talking about what I see ..

                  It is doubtful that you are talking about everything you see !!! wink Really around you always some Cossacks go, but the poor ask for a piece of bread ?? !! wassat

                  "An artist sees this way" .. And you can't argue here .. laughing
                  How many such "free artists" we have got divorced, read them and even shoot yourself ..

                  Well, so many of them finally have an opinion about what is happening in the country according to the comments of local "artists" HERE !!! belay laughing
              2. alone
                alone 6 May 2020 16: 29 New
                +8
                Quote: Nikolai the Greek
                It is doubtful that you are talking about everything you see !!! Really around you always some Cossacks go, but the poor ask for a piece of bread ?? !!

                And you probably saw Russian pensioners in Lexuses who drink champagne
                1. Nikolai Grek
                  Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 40 New
                  -6
                  Quote: lonely
                  And you probably saw Russian pensioners in Lexuses who drink champagne

                  I heard (I think, not the current me, but really the whole world) that the "civilized" pensioners died from the coronavirus, without waiting for a little help !!! negative why are you, sincerely believes that there all pensioners cut into Lexus and drink champagne ??? !!! belay or do you sincerely believe that we do not have a single pensioner on a Lexus who can afford champagne ?? !!! fool wassat
                  1. alone
                    alone 6 May 2020 16: 48 New
                    +8
                    Quote: Nikolai the Greek
                    I heard (I think, not the current me, but really the whole world) that the "civilized" pensioners died from the coronavirus, without waiting for a little help !!!

                    And where is the coronavirus? We are kind of discussing pension reform in Russia here ..
                    Quote: Nikolai the Greek
                    why are you, sincerely believes that there all pensioners cut into Lexus and drink champagne ??? !!!

                    No, I don’t think .. There is a small car in fashion .. Actually, many live there economically ... But I didn’t see one normal old man or old woman pensioner who was looking for food in a trash can. BOMS are an exception ..
                    Quote: Nikolai the Greek
                    or do you sincerely believe that we do not have a single pensioner on a Lexus who can afford champagne ?? !!!

                    There is why, if a pensioner worked for many years as an official, he can ride on a Lexus, drink cool wine, enjoy the glory .. Apparently you are one of those .. I have never met ordinary pensioners with Lexus
                    1. Nikolai Grek
                      Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 17: 00 New
                      -7
                      Quote: lonely
                      And where is the coronavirus?

                      despite the fact that he showed everyone the "wonderful" life of foreign pensioners !!! request
                      Quote: lonely
                      We are kind of discussing pension reform in Russia here ..

                      most importantly, they themselves began to crucify here about their retirees, but for some reason the reproach addressed to me !!! fool
                      Quote: lonely
                      In general, many live there economically ...

                      and why are they so ... why are they not supporting your theses about chic life ?? !! what
                      Quote: lonely
                      But I did not see one normal old man or old woman pensioner who was looking for food in the trash can.

                      you haven’t seen a lot of things in life ... this does not mean that it is so !!! wassat
                      Quote: lonely
                      I have not met ordinary pensioners with Lexus

                      the words above will revel in this for you !!! wink
                      PS ... like adults here in the comments, and such babble that you already wonder !!! recourse
  • Alexander Zaitov
    Alexander Zaitov 6 May 2020 13: 27 New
    +1
    The predatory grin of capitalism in action ... justice does not seem to wait ...
  • ugrums1961
    ugrums1961 6 May 2020 13: 48 New
    +9
    I read the article and immediately rolled. I didn’t get to the comments. Do you think this economic bloc itself started all this, and Putin supposedly did not know at first and then persuaded him. I doubt that it was so. He raped the Russian people in all holes. He will provide himself with a life-long government and the use of benefits, his friends will not be in poverty either, and he is the people. In the summer, a lot of people came out to protest with the Communist Party, rightly so few. That's what He counted on. And the siloviki are fed to protect his power. They will trample against their mothers and fathers for a handout.
  • The Word of the Word
    The Word of the Word 6 May 2020 13: 54 New
    -18
    You criticize, offer better. No critic has proposed a solution to the progressive budget deficit of the pension system. Does anyone have sound, meaningful suggestions?
    1. Million
      Million 6 May 2020 14: 06 New
      16
      Cancel pension reform. Find alternative sources of replenishment of the budget. For example, a progressive taxation scale.
      1. The Word of the Word
        The Word of the Word 9 May 2020 10: 56 New
        0
        For a while, it will plug the hole, and then what? Raise taxes again? This will not eliminate the cause of the growing budget deficit of the pension system.
    2. lot
      lot 6 May 2020 14: 12 New
      0
      The meaning of sentences without a fair choice.
      http://www.ochevidets.ru/rolik/43367/
      Masai take prey from the lions.
      with all due respect ...
    3. Overlock
      Overlock 6 May 2020 15: 07 New
      20
      Quote: Word Rule
      Does anyone have sound, meaningful suggestions?

      Do not steal officials, live modestly pension funds. Why such palaces?

      it is possible further - it makes no sense
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 6 May 2020 16: 20 New
        +7
        Quote: Overlock
        Quote: Word Rule
        Does anyone have sound, meaningful suggestions?

        Do not steal officials, live modestly pension funds. Why such palaces?

        it is possible further - it makes no sense

        That would be nice to go to "work" .. they are aesthetes .. so that there is beauty around when they rob ..
      2. The Word of the Word
        The Word of the Word 9 May 2020 10: 59 New
        0
        And why only officials should not steal? Can businessmen and citizens?
    4. ALARI
      ALARI 7 May 2020 10: 22 New
      +3
      You need to steal less.
    5. AMB
      AMB 9 May 2020 19: 52 New
      -1
      Compare the percentages of all civilian countries and answer where the money from the PFR supposedly went.
  • lot
    lot 6 May 2020 13: 57 New
    +8
    I.S. 1952 (!):
    "It would be wrong to think that it is possible to achieve such a serious cultural growth of members of society without major changes in the current situation of labor. For this, first of all, the working day must be reduced to at least 6 hours, and then to 5 hours. This is necessary in order to members of the society received enough free time to get a comprehensive education, which requires, further, the introduction of compulsory polytechnic education, which is necessary so that members of the society have the opportunity to freely choose their profession and not be chained to one profession for life. For this, it is necessary, further, to radically improve housing conditions and raise the real wages of workers and employees at least twice, if not more, both by directly raising money wages, and, especially, by further systematic reduction in prices for consumer goods. "
  • ximkim
    ximkim 6 May 2020 14: 03 New
    +5
    Quote: Silvestr
    Quote: ximkim
    And once, in one fell swoop of the pen, a pension reform was signed so that denyuzhki did not go anywhere, or were delayed.

    they were simply plundered request

    Or they took it at no cost. laughing (joke).

    Not just plundered, but spent most of the money from the fund for their own needs sad
    1. Altona
      Altona 6 May 2020 14: 38 New
      10
      Quote: ximkim
      Not just plundered, but spent most of the money from the fund for their own needs

      --------------------------
      NPFs were simply taken abroad, and the PFR is used for whatever they want, up to "lending" to all kinds of "northern streams." In general, the state began to behave like a financial pyramid.
  • Virus-free crown
    Virus-free crown 6 May 2020 14: 20 New
    +3
    "Raising the retirement age to the level of the average life expectancy of a man, combined with a negligible pension (only certain groups of the population receive decent pensions, we are not talking about them), gives a directly opposite effect in terms of legalizing labor activity: people are convinced that before retirement may not survive. "

    Here with this TOTALLY !!! I agree!!!
    I was planning to live, at best, to 65 years old, according to my plans was to save some money and at 60 years old go "to see the world, to show myself" am and now ... and now the state in itself = and I myself bully
  • U-58
    U-58 6 May 2020 14: 40 New
    +4
    Only the lazy will not write about this reform.
    So what are its consequences?
    It seems to me that the whole circle of the consequences that have arisen is a state secret, and I assume this in all seriousness.
    For having divulged them, the authorities will show their greed on the one hand, deceit on the other. As well as complete indiscretion, indiscretion, socio-economic incompetence.
    But lose face in no way.
    Therefore, making smart "litas", it is important to inflate the cheeks, the powerful representatives will, like a mentor, repeat the legend about the necessity and timeliness of this very rehvorma.
    And a rollback is impossible, because the people, sensing their strength, will sit on the head of power and the CAM will begin to refuel in the country.
    Question: Does the people need such power?
    Will the upcoming elections turn out to be an indicator of the mood of the people or will everyone once again falsify 76% in the limit ???
    1. Nikolai Grek
      Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 14: 54 New
      -15
      Quote: U-58
      It seems to me that the whole range of consequences is a state secret.

      you do not have pensioners friends ???? ask is not an option ??? Let's say my mother’s added almost 1 thousand every year !!! request
      1. U-58
        U-58 6 May 2020 14: 59 New
        18
        I have "acquaintances" pensioners.
        This is my wife and myself))))
        The retired wife finished up to 60 years.
        I would work further, but care for the granddaughter is necessary.
        I’ve come out with a ponytail for a year. I work.
        Worked until April 30. Right now in neurology with a micro stroke.
        Something like this.
        1. Nikolai Grek
          Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 13 New
          -8
          Quote: U-58
          I have "acquaintances" pensioners.
          This is my wife and myself))))
          The retired wife finished up to 60 years.
          I would work further, but care for the granddaughter is necessary.
          I’ve come out with a ponytail for a year. I work.
          Worked until April 30. Right now in neurology with a micro stroke.
          Something like this.

          Well then, each with his own ... I described to you my "situation" ... believe it or not - it's up to you !! request wassat
      2. Mambius
        Mambius 6 May 2020 16: 29 New
        -12
        Quote: Nikolai the Greek
        you do not have pensioners friends ???? ask is not an option ??? Let's say my mother’s added almost 1 thousand every year !!!

        My mother also doesn’t go hungry and eats quite .. What kind of howl is on the net .. Just to poke?
        1. Nikolai Grek
          Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 34 New
          -9
          Quote: Mambius
          Quote: Nikolai the Greek
          you do not have pensioners friends ???? ask is not an option ??? Let's say my mother’s added almost 1 thousand every year !!!

          My mother also doesn’t go hungry and eats quite .. What kind of howl is on the net .. Just to poke?

          Is this the first time you are on this resource ?? !!! what wassat
      3. sabakina
        sabakina 6 May 2020 20: 03 New
        +3
        Quote: Nikolai Grek
        you do not have pensioners friends ???? ask is not an option ??? Let's say my mother’s added almost 1 thousand every year !!! request
        My mom is 76 years old. What is the increase in tysh? On the contrary, it complains that it receives less each month. Should I believe you or my mother?
        1. Nikolai Grek
          Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 20: 39 New
          -5
          Quote: sabakina
          Quote: Nikolai Grek
          you do not have pensioners friends ???? ask is not an option ??? Let's say my mother’s added almost 1 thousand every year !!! request
          My mom is 76 years old. What is the increase in tysh? On the contrary, it complains that it receives less each month. Should I believe you or my mother?

          whoever you want, believe that ??? !!!
      4. Oleg Skvortsov
        Oleg Skvortsov 7 May 2020 11: 37 New
        -1
        Greek. do you add a thousand to her from your pocket? shine how you breathe
        1. Nikolai Grek
          Nikolai Grek 8 May 2020 04: 06 New
          +1
          Quote: Oleg Skvortsov
          Greek. do you add a thousand to her from your pocket? shine how you breathe

          go past .... it’s rude to ban unwanted people here !!! negative
      5. AMB
        AMB 9 May 2020 19: 58 New
        -1
        why so shamelessly mislead.
        1. Nikolai Grek
          Nikolai Grek 9 May 2020 21: 15 New
          +4
          Quote: AMB
          why so shamelessly mislead.

          I don’t know why they do this !!!! request
  • tochila
    tochila 6 May 2020 14: 47 New
    13
    I don’t vote for Putin anymore !!! And for EdRo I never signed up at all !!! No matter how they were called before !!! The old people are stolen money !!!! Ugh for them !!!!
    1. U-58
      U-58 6 May 2020 14: 56 New
      11
      Better late, but to see clearly ...
  • WayKheThuo
    WayKheThuo 6 May 2020 14: 51 New
    15
    What kind of correct, humane, high-quality and fair pension system can be developed if its authors are completely divorced from the people?
    Not one, I emphasize, not a single person participating in the development of this reform, and even more so, having signed it, will not live on a pension of 15 rubles (https://rns.online/economy/Glava-PFR-nazval -razmer-srednei-pensii-v-Rossii-495-2019-11 /).
    Their pension will be many, if not an order of magnitude higher.
    Therefore, the only way to at least somehow improve the quality and fairness of the measures taken is to lower the authorities to sinful land.
    Let their children go to an ordinary school, and they themselves - to a typical district clinic. Let them go to work in public transport, and around the country with ordinary trains and airplanes. And so to the level of at least the first deputy ministers.
    Then the laws will become more or less useful, fair and vital.
    I think so.
    1. U-58
      U-58 6 May 2020 15: 03 New
      11
      You are not the only one to think so.
      But .... you write: let them .., let their children ...
      But at the same time, the life of pensioners will not change.
      Therefore, let us wish: Let them not be in power!
      1. WayKheThuo
        WayKheThuo 6 May 2020 15: 34 New
        +7
        Therefore, let us wish: Let them not be in power!

        It's not about personalities; it's about the system. Not even so in the System.
        If they do not, then others will pass away, the same ones, and maybe worse.
        It is necessary to change the system of state administration, the system of selection and placement of personnel, the system of remuneration for government officials, especially senior managers, so that they will be rewarded according to the result of their labors.
        Who will do this and how? This is a question. Obviously, today's opposition is not capable of this because of its ideological impotence and low level of socio-political responsibility.
        Personally, I bet on the young. Not on a hefty talented and lucky - they "knock down" from the country over the cordon. Not for the children of the leaders of the country - they do not need anything because they were born with a golden spoon in their mouth. No. I bet on ordinary guys and girls who, having no special talents, just want to live in their country.
        And I really hope that their time will pass and another time will come - the Time of the Creators.
    2. AUL
      AUL 6 May 2020 19: 38 New
      +6
      Quote: WayKhe Thuo
      Let their children go to an ordinary school, and they themselves - to a typical district clinic. Let them go to work in public transport, and around the country with ordinary trains and airplanes. And so to the level of at least the first deputy ministers.
      Then the laws will become more or less useful, fair and vital.

      So not then they burst into power!
  • Galleon
    Galleon 6 May 2020 15: 10 New
    +8
    The negative consequence of this reform is the following: the money stolen from me and the years bursting with the wealth of my friends and I will not forget or forgive.
  • rotkiv04
    rotkiv04 6 May 2020 15: 54 New
    -4
    Everything is done on the recommendation of Western curators and the IMF, Putin submits to them
  • Red Alert
    Red Alert 6 May 2020 16: 16 New
    +1
    Quote: Freedom of the Word
    You criticize, offer better. No critic has proposed a solution to the progressive budget deficit of the pension system. Does anyone have sound, meaningful suggestions?

    Yes, but you won’t like it.
    1. The Word of the Word
      The Word of the Word 9 May 2020 11: 07 New
      0
      What difference will I like or not. Suggest!
  • Lekz
    Lekz 6 May 2020 16: 17 New
    -8
    Far from indisputable considerations. In my opinion, there should be a reasonable "middle ground" between I want to work, I want - no, but let the state support me, and the state owes nothing to anyone. You can pay your pension after 30 years, but the state does not have such opportunities. What was proposed corresponds to the capabilities of the state. The story that “I paid to the Pension Fund of the Russian Federation” was not saved for themselves, but for their descendants. And the savings intended for us ended (to put it mildly) in the 90s. They are now somewhere in London and Miami.
    There is a consideration that in order to live in Germany, you need to work in Germany. And retire as in Germany. And that not everyone manages to use a well-deserved pension for a long time, you need to monitor your health. Not from under the stick, but like that for a loved one.
    1. Nikolai Grek
      Nikolai Grek 6 May 2020 16: 28 New
      -3
      Quote: Lekz
      There is a consideration that in order to live in Germany, you need to work in Germany. And retire as in Germany.

      there are considerations that their entire allegedly curly pension is a simple buildup of the country's debt !! request
    2. ALARI
      ALARI 7 May 2020 10: 29 New
      +6
      Change the record, don’t say that in our country all the idlers who start the day with a glass and finish it. If so, then you are one of them too.
      1. Lekz
        Lekz 7 May 2020 11: 42 New
        0
        I did not claim to be different. The same lazy. This despite the fact that I am twice a veteran. But I know that I did not do much in life in full force, and this knowledge makes my life easier. But there are people who believe that others are to blame for their troubles - neighbors, Putin, Sechin, the State Duma, the State Department ... and, in general, the world is not fair to them. It’s hard for them. They are experiencing, striving to change the world, instead of changing themselves, just go and do something useful. For yourself. You would not look so hard.
        1. ALARI
          ALARI 7 May 2020 11: 54 New
          +2
          I'm not saying that Putin, Sechin, the State Duma, the State Department ... and, in general, are to blame for the lives of people. But all these people and organizations are, and we must be very naive, considering that they do not have any effect on our lives. Changing yourself is good advice, but it just happens, the rules of life change faster than you can change. As for the useful things to do for themselves, altruists became extinct in the 90s, cynical pragmatists remained, and if they do something, then only for themselves.
  • Brigadier
    Brigadier 6 May 2020 18: 58 New
    +4
    Those who voted for Putin in 2018 already understand today what they did then, and today, with fierce hatred ... oh ... they love Putin very much for his retirement lawlessness and the opportunity to die of old age, just before receiving their very first Putin pension , thereby showing the "state" his devotion to the great ideas of Putinism!

    In the end, the state needs money.
    He needs to master "nano-technologies" and "create" Chinese notebooks for years ... laughing

    PS I myself voted for Grudinin!
  • faterdom
    faterdom 6 May 2020 19: 01 New
    10
    Quote: Whirlwind
    Was the defeat of the USSR in the ХV 1945-1991 with the USA and the West? It was !

    The defeat of the USSR was not caused by the USA and the West.
    And Gorbachev, Sobchak, Yeltsin and the "elite". Because of their stupidity and greed.
    And what's the conclusion?
    That's right: the defeat of Russia can not be inflicted by the US-NATO, China or someone else there. Only full name and the "elite".
    And this full name. it is necessary to decide - he wants to be part of the destroyers of Russia, but "with the elites", or all this to stop decisively, and the "elites" in the stall!
    Or at a meat factory, who bacon and jamon walked up.
  • Pavel57
    Pavel57 6 May 2020 19: 29 New
    0
    Quote: martin-159
    Who cares?

    The difference where and how we can come is not yet clear. If the barricades, then this does not suit me.
  • Pavel57
    Pavel57 6 May 2020 19: 31 New
    -2
    Quote: rotkiv04
    Everything is done on the recommendation of Western curators and the IMF, Putin submits to them

    Putin is forced to reckon with the vassal state of finance. But he did not create this system.
  • Yuri Yatsenko
    Yuri Yatsenko 6 May 2020 19: 56 New
    13
    I DO NOT BELIEVE either the government or the president!
    I would understand the position of this well-fed bureaucrat-government-deputy fraternity if the pension and salary of a working pensioner would in total exceed the average salary level. At least for this category, the ban on indexation was lifted. No! This policy of the state is supported by all power structures! Just the other day, Petersburg deputy Oksana Dmitrieva has developed a bill to index pensions for working retirees! Notice, neither in the State Duma, nor in the Government did this! Although it was they who passed the law, according to which they do not pay indexation to working pensioners.
    In our province, for 49 years of work experience, I get 12202 rubles of pension, from my wife 9300. Count how many for two! I have to work. At the same time, I have two higher educations. This is because the salary in Soviet times was good, but the law adopted by the so-called “servants of the people” does not take into account the Soviet work experience and salaries, then my salary was several times higher than the national average, and the so-called servants of the people robbed this people, having leveled the current pensions to the level of poverty. With a coefficient of 2,96, which I was calculated by the FIU, I assigned a pension at a coefficient of 1,2. This is the law the president signed. Therefore, when the government and officials rant about the care of retirees, this is only “talk” in favor of the poor.
  • Aleksandr Suvorov
    Aleksandr Suvorov 6 May 2020 19: 58 New
    +5
    Pension reform is a management failure!
  • pereselenec
    pereselenec 6 May 2020 20: 16 New
    +5
    Senior citizen, help Putin!
  • the Saint
    the Saint 6 May 2020 20: 26 New
    -9
    If I’m not mistaken, the pensioners who wore epaulettes did not change their retirement dates and the size of their pensions did not change, along with the procedure for providing free apartments, for a number of well-known reasons.
    Therefore, the discussion of civil pensions at this forum is non-core and annoyingly immoral.
    1. Altona
      Altona 6 May 2020 20: 47 New
      14
      Quote: el Santo
      Therefore, the discussion of civil pensions at this forum is non-core and annoyingly immoral.

      -------------------------
      At what plan? My second cousin has been retired for 12 years (he left the Ministry of Justice), being only a year older than me. And I’m still retired for 14 years, being in civil work. Is it fair to have such a bias in the requirements for seniority?
      1. the Saint
        the Saint 7 May 2020 14: 04 New
        0
        It would be fair to add five years to all, and not just civilians. And even that would be relative justice.
        1. Hypatius
          Hypatius 7 May 2020 21: 21 New
          +2
          It would be fair to separate from the FIU, PF for civil servants. As well as any disabled children. Pension should be called the amount paid from the budget. And the Fund must pay those who filled it (here it would be a different term to use, instead of a pension). And now, some take off there for 20 years, others 40-50, and others nothing at all. But they get as much as the official would have thought. And then, without any budget transfers, employee pensions will grow 2-3 times, IMHO. I’ve been working for 25-30 years and you can get it, well, I got carried away. This is the next step.
          PS Matkapital is still unclear from which side. I think that only because of him there is a so-called PF deficit. It is clear that the budget pays, but the propaganda yells that money is going from the "holy" budget to the "useless" PF.
    2. Vladimirsky
      Vladimirsky 6 May 2020 21: 24 New
      -5
      and you probably do not know about the second pension? study the topic - how much has changed the requirements for its receipt.
      1. the Saint
        the Saint 7 May 2020 14: 05 New
        -1
        third and fourth pensions do not want? I am sure that I would like, like not one free apartment, but three or four.
        1. Vladimirsky
          Vladimirsky 9 May 2020 16: 44 New
          0
          shut up, you will marry a smart one. Bandera unfinished.
    3. Nehist
      Nehist 6 May 2020 21: 36 New
      +3
      I can please you, since I am 25 years old I am going to experiment with the Ministry of Internal Affairs. Extend the length of service for retirement. Eliminate departmental clinics and much more. I just don’t know what the authorities decide to do after KOVID, it’s not known. There are such plans
      1. the Saint
        the Saint 7 May 2020 14: 07 New
        0
        Gathering does not mean getting married. And why only from the 25th, and not from the 19th, as the rest of the citizens of Russia did the second grade?
        1. The popuas
          The popuas 8 May 2020 00: 04 New
          +2
          This type of vote for zero and he will show them lol
      2. The popuas
        The popuas 8 May 2020 00: 03 New
        +1
        And why not since 23 years, do not tell wink
  • Doliva63
    Doliva63 6 May 2020 21: 01 New
    +9
    I hope a revolution awaits us. Otherwise, they themselves will die out and the country will be completely destroyed.
  • O. Bender
    O. Bender 6 May 2020 21: 15 New
    +4
    Quote: AU Ivanov.
    But I didn’t see this, so that a sane person who does not suffer from dementia and is not an alcoholic rummaged in search of food. Is that homeless.

    I personally saw how carts with delays, mainly confectionery and milk, were taken out at the cargo entrance. Ten elderly women and men (there were two of them) were sorted into packages because the driver had not taken it from the garbage truck and two loaders from the same garbage truck. Gulliver works in the Volga region. In addition, a large shopping and entertainment center in the city center, five hundred meters from the administration, has the same picture every three to four days. Mostly elderly women, with containers, are collecting delays. Men are few, apparently still not There are three homeless people, they are constant and relatively young, there are no strangers. Here it is.
    1. tunes
      tunes 7 May 2020 06: 14 New
      +1
      Yesterday, literally at Magnit, he saw a similar picture in his homeland in Siberia.
    2. the Saint
      the Saint 7 May 2020 14: 10 New
      -1
      But retirees - neither young nor old - you will not find among that contingent.
  • Vladimirsky
    Vladimirsky 6 May 2020 21: 22 New
    +6
    The powerful loot was cut down, taking 1-1,5 million rubles from future pensioners. Now there is something to cut. My colleague in the service managed to apply for a pension - he will receive an extra 1391 rubles (unlike me). It’s not that I envy him - it dawned on me for whom to vote (or rather, not).
  • adler87
    adler87 6 May 2020 23: 47 New
    +4
    So the retirement age was not raised so that there were more pensions. This is a fairy tale for fools. Raised to pay less pensions. And this was done not in the interests of the people, pensioners, but in the interests of the state. And these are completely different, in terms of goals and objectives, organizational arrangements.
  • Pavel123
    Pavel123 7 May 2020 03: 17 New
    0
    https://youtu.be/n4W8vRGjt3o?list=RDCMUC_WeZqr3qr0PS_Gn3jFhyKA

    https://youtu.be/V3iaaeTkots?list=RDCMUC_WeZqr3qr0PS_Gn3jFhyKA

    About the USA. Emigrant.
  • tunes
    tunes 7 May 2020 06: 12 New
    +3
    The problems of the Sheriff Indians are not e ... t, in the sense they do not care. The sheriff is America, who did not understand. And we have a colonial administration, recruited from the locals who were allowed to buy apartments with villas in Manhattan and in Italy
  • tunes
    tunes 7 May 2020 06: 17 New
    +5
    It recalls 1917, when even the army did not rise to protect the tsarist police. brought ....
  • hhhhhhh
    hhhhhhh 7 May 2020 07: 58 New
    -4
    Pension accomplices of the collapse of the USSR, i.e. we are not supposed to. You can already come to terms.
    Those who served give out over the years of service. Who fought as expected. For the birth of children, too, take out a pension and put it down.
    The rest for what? For a salary in envelopes? For "I did not know, I did not know" what is happening around? Everyone got their share of the collapse of the USSR, enough.
    To demand a pension is a continuation of the collapse of Russia.
    1. Oleg Skvortsov
      Oleg Skvortsov 7 May 2020 11: 31 New
      +1
      Kozma. Can you recognize your assets from the sack of the USSR and Russia?
      1. hhhhhhh
        hhhhhhh 7 May 2020 12: 44 New
        0
        Apartment, cars, real estate, foreign trips.
        The main thing we gave to the delay of the end of capitalism, the end of capitalism we are now witnessing.
    2. Hypatius
      Hypatius 7 May 2020 21: 36 New
      +1
      Everyone got their share from the collapse of the USSR, enough.
      You are wrong. There should have been personal accounts, this time. Not everything was divided, but a small part. Subsoil, forest, land divided ?. Those. We were not fully denationalized, but they brazenly lie that our state is now a raider with false documents and constitutions. And we, no longer citizens (shareholders of the state), but plebeians, migrants and individuals. But, this is a lie.
      1. hhhhhhh
        hhhhhhh 7 May 2020 21: 41 New
        0
        If we are not citizens, we are not entitled to a pension.))))
        1. Hypatius
          Hypatius 10 May 2020 08: 59 New
          0
          If we are not citizens, we are not entitled to a pension.))))
          Well, isn’t it actually so? We have old age insurance, which is extremely unprofitable for us. The pension from the budget should be for disabled people, veterans, order bearers, marginal people, gypsies ... And not from my (our) insurance fund "old age".
          1. hhhhhhh
            hhhhhhh 10 May 2020 09: 37 New
            0
            How do you prove that you are not a gypsy, a Jew or a commissar?
            (For the moderators, sarcasm about "Pensions from the budget should be for disabled people, veterans, order bearers, marginalized, gypsies ... And not from my (our) insurance fund" old age "")
            1. Hypatius
              Hypatius 10 May 2020 09: 51 New
              0
              Duc deductions from the salary, zhezh. They introduced the Snuls, but the labor did not cancel good . Why sarcasm? recourse Well, I'm talking about the fact that a pension, and what the majority receives, calling it a "pension", are two different things. So, I called it "senile insurance". Is there a better term? Share.
              1. hhhhhhh
                hhhhhhh 10 May 2020 10: 22 New
                0
                This is not sarcasm, but an accusation of racism and an attempt to review the results of the Second World War.
                Veterans earned a pension. Our generation is not. It’s a criminal offense for our generation to even open their mouths about retirement. He did not serve in the army, there are no children - there is no pension. Military industry is equated with service.
                Pension only for the birth of children and military service.
                1. Hypatius
                  Hypatius 10 May 2020 10: 45 New
                  0
                  This is not sarcasm, but an accusation of racism and an attempt to review the results of the Second World War.
                  Why such deep fantasies ?! Nah yes. Well, I'll try again. Pensions should be paid to veterans (invalids ...) by the state, is it social (or not already, after the amendments?). The FIU is essentially an insurance company (not a state, not a budget), existing at the expense of insurance fees from salaries of workers. Here they are, the insured and must receive payments in proportion to the contribution, upon reaching a certain age, and preferably length of service. As an example, a veteran with experience receives both from the state and from the PF. Z. S. Do you personally agree to share your hard-earned money for old age with a gypsy or two who have not contributed a ruble to the insurance. Here let him, the state gives a social wiser, but to us - ours. Or what? - down with justice, you give demagogy with accusations. Z. Z. Y. If, again, it is not clear, then I wash my hands.
                  1. hhhhhhh
                    hhhhhhh 10 May 2020 12: 18 New
                    0
                    Z. Z. Y. If, again, it is not clear, then I wash my hands
                    You are talking nonsense scoop. "Receive like under capitalism (as you understand capitalism), and work like a scoop (drink tea from morning to evening." "Everyone around you owes you - you don't owe anyone anything."
                    "but for us - ours." - how much of your money left in the Pension Fund after 1998, after 2008, 2013 and after 2020
                    How much is your money in PF?
                    1. Hypatius
                      Hypatius 10 May 2020 17: 43 New
                      0
                      You are talking nonsense scoop. "Receive like under capitalism (as you understand capitalism), and work like a scoop (drink tea from morning to evening." "Everyone around you owes you - you don't owe anyone anything."
                      "but for us - ours." - how much of your money left in the Pension Fund after 1998, after 2008, 2013 and after 2020
                      How much is your money in PF?
                      Absolutely the Kremlin has a tight staff, they don't even know how to read, and this understanding is generally beyond the bounds. Maybe you will understand: Hey, an alternatively gifted liberal (an accomplice of thieves?), How I work and how much I earned is not at all in the subject. But, I pay my ₽ to the "PF" insurance company, and if Putin's friends steal my money, they must be leaned against the wall. The bunker mode is barely left, and the money will be found, as soon as your thieves show the bloody ice ax in the cell.
                      1. hhhhhhh
                        hhhhhhh 10 May 2020 18: 09 New
                        -3
                        Old scoops do not know how to think, they have in their head a scoop picture of the world.
                        The money that you paid from your salary to the Pension Fund has long since turned to zero. "Everything is stolen before you ..." ("Operation Y ...").
                        Tight at the old scoops with an understanding of the structure of the World.
                        The world is not built as you and I were told when the Soviet Union collapsed with our tacit consent.
                        NO YOUR MONEY IN PF. They ate inflation for a long time.
                2. Hypatius
                  Hypatius 10 May 2020 10: 47 New
                  0
                  Pension only for the birth of children and military service.
                  22% of the salary, whom do you propose to present? Or you need to die behind the machine.
                  1. hhhhhhh
                    hhhhhhh 10 May 2020 12: 13 New
                    0
                    22% of the salary, whom do you propose to present? Or you need to die behind the machine.
                    Didn’t Chubais say that he would die.
  • In a d and m
    In a d and m 7 May 2020 08: 10 New
    +1
    Not in the eyebrow, but in the eye!
    Thank you, dear author!
    Here
    only the question of what kind of entity in power with superalloy rigidity is pushing the root breaking of all supporting structures of the reproduction of the people: the education system, health care, science, the pension system ?!
    Why did they start reforming Moscow State University?
    Why didn’t the best university of the country please?
    Or was it Mikhalkov, quoting the famous politician "Google should break the spire of Moscow State University" ?!
    So who breaks ???!
  • EvilLion
    EvilLion 7 May 2020 08: 46 New
    -5
    And let's make a retirement age from 50 years, and preferably from 40, and we’ll all go happy. Mat. benefits arise by themselves.
    1. the Saint
      the Saint 7 May 2020 14: 14 New
      +2
      Better from the age of 37. 20 years of experience or length of service since 17 years and a pension, as it is now with millions who are more equal than others.
      1. EvilLion
        EvilLion 7 May 2020 15: 08 New
        -4
        Can you say something other than "take away and divide"?
  • EvilLion
    EvilLion 7 May 2020 08: 47 New
    -8
    There are no children who want to give birth, but someone should be supported on retirement. 40-year-old children, damn it.