Pacific Fleet expects to receive frigate "Marshal Shaposhnikov" before the end of the year

Pacific Fleet expects to receive frigate "Marshal Shaposhnikov" before the end of the year

The Pacific Fleet plans before the end of this year to return to its membership the frigate “Marshal Shaposhnikov” that has undergone modernization. This was reported by the press service of the Pacific Fleet.


According to the press service, the modernization of the frigate is on schedule, without disruption, despite the situation with the coronavirus. The ship repair center "Dalzavod", where the ship is being modernized and repaired, was visited by the commander of the Pacific fleet Admiral Sergey Avakyants, who got acquainted with the progress of work. Following the visit, the admiral expressed confidence that the ship would return to the Pacific Fleet by the end of the year.

As previously reported, the former BOD of project 1155 "Marshal Shaposhnikov" in the summer of 2019 was retrained as frigate. This decision was made by the Ministry of Defense.

During the modernization, the Marshal Shaposhnikov has already installed the Uran anti-ship complex with X-35 missiles, the universal caliber, Onyx or Zircon cruise missile launcher, the Bagira fire control system for naval artillery, the ship electronic suppression complex TK-25; bow artillery mount replaced. More than 20% of the ship’s superstructure were dismantled and newly manufactured, the hull was repaired, and other work was carried out.

The BOD was laid down on May 25, 1983, launched on December 27, 1984, and commissioned on December 30, 1985. In the Pacific Fleet since 1986.

Total displacement - 7480 tons, standard - 6840 tons. Length 163 meters, width 19 meters, draft 7,8 meters. Speed ​​30 knots, economical 14 knots. The crew of 220 people, including 29 officers.
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  1. Mavrikiy April 24 2020 10: 12 New
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    Pacific Fleet expects to receive frigate "Marshal Shaposhnikov" before the end of the year
    Once needed, will receive. request
    1. Teberii April 24 2020 10: 20 New
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      New armament and equipment is what the fleet needs. There are still ships that can be re-equipped.
    2. knn54 April 24 2020 11: 39 New
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      It would be nice by September 3.
    3. TermNachTer April 25 2020 15: 04 New
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      I didn’t understand from the article that UVP was put on him?
  2. Dart2027 April 24 2020 10: 13 New
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    We wait. It will be interesting to see what happens.
  3. Total displacement - 7480 tons. And is this a frigate? But this is a destroyer and he will be more than Burke.
    1. Grandfather April 24 2020 10: 51 New
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      Quote: Salavatsky Ministry of Emergency Situations
      Total displacement - 7480 tons. And is this a frigate? But this is a destroyer and he will be more than Burke.

      and rockets are fewer at times.
      1. Well, Burke has 74 missiles and 8 missile launchers "Harpoon", Shaposhnikov has 64 missiles, but I still don’t understand how many missiles he has, but certainly not less than 8. So the difference is not that big. And according to the performance characteristics of the Harpoons near the Caliber did not even roll around.
        1. kjhg April 24 2020 11: 41 New
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          Quote: Salavatsky Ministry of Emergency Situations
          Well, Burke has 74 missiles and 8 anti-ship missiles "Harpoon", Shaposhnikov has 64 missiles

          Do you even understand what you are writing about and what you are comparing with what? On Arly Berks are universal launchers MK-41. One SM-3 or Tomahawk rocket can be loaded into each cell, depending on the task. Also, this PU installation allows you to load 4 short-range anti-missiles in each cell. On Shaposhnikov there is only a short-range air defense system dagger. I'm not talking about the powerful Aegis radar, which makes it possible to shoot down even intercontinental ballistic missiles on the marching part of the flight. So, our frigate and the American destroyer are comparable only in displacement.
          1. Do you even understand what you are writing about and what you are comparing with?


            Sorry, not a specialist, that's why I am writing something about which I learned some facts in the public domain. You know, in the Ministry of Emergencies, where I work, it’s a little taut with the Harpoons and Aegis. Although, as I understand it, Aegis allows only to detect, but to shoot down ... Will they knock me down?
            1. alexmach April 24 2020 16: 33 New
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              Although, as I understand it, Aegis allows only to detect, but to shoot down ... Will they knock me down?

              One SM-3 rocket can be loaded into each cell
          2. Romario_Argo April 24 2020 12: 09 New
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            I'm not talking about the powerful radar Aegis

            sewage radar Aegis on 4 TsU on 4 radar = 16 TsU with a lower border of not less than 60 meters
            1. 16 central control units with a lower border of at least 60 meters

              What does that mean? That he can’t launch a rocket below 60 meters? Sorry, not a specialist, and in terms such as "channel" - a complete ignoramus, I would like to know people who commented on how this Aegis is so good
              1. bayard April 25 2020 01: 57 New
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                Boris, type the word “Aegis” on Wikipedia and enjoy the knowledge. Do not bother people to discuss the news.
            2. kjhg April 24 2020 15: 24 New
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              Quote: Romario_Argo
              I'm not talking about the powerful radar Aegis

              sewage radar Aegis on 4 TsU on 4 radar = 16 TsU with a lower border of not less than 60 meters

              You have outdated information. This issue has been resolved.
    2. Mavrikiy April 24 2020 10: 53 New
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      Quote: Salavatsky Ministry of Emergency Situations
      Total displacement - 7480 tons. And is this a frigate? But this is a destroyer and he will be more than Burke.

      Also drew attention.
      the former BOD of project 1155 "Marshal Shaposhnikov" in the summer of 2019 was retrained as frigate. This decision was made by the Ministry of Defense. Total displacement - 7480 tons, standard - 6840 tons. Length 163 meters, width 19 meters
      Destroyers of the Sarych project
      6 500 t (standard),
      7 t (full) Length 904 m (largest) Width 156,5 m (on design waterline)
      As the saying goes: Find the difference.
    3. donavi49 April 24 2020 11: 14 New
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      Badden Wurtenberg 7200t - frigate.


      A large series of Nigiri, where the Indians drove Zorya and bought American afterburner turbines - under 7000 tons.



      The latest variation of the Italian FREMM - the extreme block (which was handed over before the coronovirus) has grown to 6870t.
  4. novel66 April 24 2020 10: 55 New
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    armor is not enough ..
    1. bayard April 25 2020 02: 01 New
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      Quote: novel xnumx
      armor is not enough ..

      And artillery - three towers of three trunks in 12 inches.
      And SAILS - a frigate, after all. repeat
      1. Svarog51 April 25 2020 05: 23 New
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        And artillery - three towers of three trunks in 12 inches.
        And SAILS - a frigate, after all.

        The battleship will turn out with an unlimited swimming range. repeat Sails are better than scarlet and a letter of marque to the commander. good
        1. novel66 April 25 2020 10: 36 New
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          I know him!!! Interesting, still alive?
          1. Svarog51 April 25 2020 14: 43 New
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            John Silver? So he commanded the galley. request
            1. novel66 April 25 2020 14: 55 New
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              it was a disguise, do not remember chtoli?
              1. Svarog51 April 25 2020 15: 31 New
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                Riot to the end, and failed. Captain Smolett remained in office.
                1. novel66 April 25 2020 15: 37 New
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                  that's a shame crying
                  1. Svarog51 April 25 2020 15: 39 New
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                    Silver? Wow! So why do we need a loser? I suggest Blood.
                    1. novel66 April 25 2020 15: 40 New
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                      it’s impossible with that name on our fleet ...
                      1. Svarog51 April 25 2020 16: 23 New
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                        Can Silver be? wink We will register it under a different name. We use the witness protection program. drinks
                      2. novel66 April 25 2020 20: 51 New
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                        Silver - he is Silver, but imagine how Blood will call downline?
    2. novel66 April 25 2020 10: 36 New
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      nice to meet like-minded !!! lol
  • 89625588851 April 24 2020 11: 05 New
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    UKKS is certainly good, but it would be interesting to know if there were any work on modernizing the Dagger air defense system, who knows?
    1. alexmach April 24 2020 17: 48 New
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      Most likely not, since in the first there are no reports about this, and in the second, the dagger itself, as an air defense of self-defense, seems to be not so bad.
      1. Dart2027 April 24 2020 20: 34 New
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        Quote: alexmach
        Dagger as a self-defense air defense
        The problem is that it is short-range air defense, and ships of this size usually have something more long-range. I’m only afraid that I can’t shove Redoubt or Calm down on him.
        1. alexmach April 24 2020 20: 40 New
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          This is so, but this cannot be solved by modernization of the Dagger. It’s a pity that at least the very minimum of “Calm” cells were not shoved .. Apparently, it will carry out combat missions under the guise of a ship with more advanced air defense, and now walk with a pair with 22350s. On the other hand, to build a "death star" on the basis of a battered ship is probably an unpromising occupation.

          The only thing that pleases is that they reported that the remaining 3 Pacific Fleet BODs will undergo modernization under the same project.
          1. bayard April 25 2020 02: 12 New
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            Quote: alexmach
            Apparently, it will carry out combat missions under the guise of a ship with more advanced air defense, and now walk in pairs with 22350s.

            But the “Polynomial” shy away - all the hydroacoustics in the ocean are deaf ... and the whales are jumping to the shore ...
            In general, it turned out well, and quite budget. I hope in the modernization of the following boards will be able to cram 3 UKKS, as in the last 22350+, there is enough space there.
            And to try to put a new air defense system and an air defense system to it is to remodel the entire ship, and it is already old. Renovated power plants, strengthened armament, updated avionics ... what else is needed for happiness? He will serve another 15 years, and at rest.
            1. alexmach April 25 2020 09: 53 New
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              And trying to put a new air defense system and radar systems to it is the whole ship to remodel

              And to try to install the USKK with the entire nomenclature of missiles to it, is this ship not to be redone or what?
              In general, it turned out well, and quite budget

              Well .. there were opinions that it would be even more budgetary to place the same missiles in inclined launchers.

              But in general, the news about the modernization of the "remote" is very positive. Finally they waited for her.
              1. bayard April 25 2020 14: 30 New
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                Quote: alexmach
                Well .. there were opinions that it would be even more budgetary to place the same missiles in inclined launchers.

                And this is a remake of the rocket ... and its PU. Budget will not work.
                And here - they threw the tower, cleared a place in the turret with a gas cutter, inserted 2 - 3 UKKS, extended the cables to the FCS and ... high fellow .
                And the version of modernization for the 90s (made up in the late 80s)? When instead of tower No. 2 there are already 48 KR in six UKKS! And the Poliment-Redoubt with a UVP for 96 missiles, which even stuck in the place of torpedo tubes ... THE BEAST ... Yes, plus another 4 x 4 = 16 anti-ship missiles X-35 in inclined launchers in place of the PLUR.
                That's where Orly Burke was resting !!!
                Yes, ours and a hundred times more beautiful. yes bully
                But ... did not grow together, this was a task for a superpower ...
                And now - according to the age of years and opportunities ... only budget modernization.
                1. alexmach April 25 2020 15: 42 New
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                  And this is a remake of the rocket ... and its PU. Budget will not work.

                  Which makes perfect sense if there are Soviet ships with inclined launchers in the fleet. And the alteration is not at all great. The same "Onyx" on the coast was used with an inclined PU. This is exactly what a budget decision is.
                  stretched the cable to the MSA and ...

                  and redo the SOU. And from scratch.
                  And the version of modernization for the 90s (made up in the late 80s)? When instead of tower No. 2 there are already 48 KR in six UKKS! And "Poliment-Redoubt" with UVP for 96 missiles

                  All the same, it was not a project to modernize the existing BOD, but an entire destroyer, which at the same time cost from scratch.
                  1. bayard April 25 2020 16: 10 New
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                    Quote: alexmach
                    And the version of modernization for the 90s (made up in the late 80s)? When instead of tower No. 2 there are already 48 KR in six UKKS! And "Poliment-Redoubt" with UVP for 96 missiles

                    All the same, it was not a project to modernize the existing BOD, but an entire destroyer, which at the same time cost from scratch.

                    And they were going to build such from scratch, and to modernize the combatant units during the scheduled repair. There was a plan for modernization under the “Grenades” and “Onyxes” in the USK and destroyers such as “Sarych” - to stick instead of the stern tower of the UKSK. Many plans were ... There was a Great Country.
                    Quote: alexmach
                    stretched the cable to the MSA and ...

                    and redo the SOU. And from scratch.

                    So anyway, after all, they redid it. You cannot place new weapons without this.
                    Quote: alexmach
                    And this is a remake of the rocket ... and its PU. Budget will not work.

                    Which makes perfect sense if there are Soviet ships with inclined launchers in the fleet. And the alteration is not at all great. The same "Onyx" on the coast was used with an inclined PU. This is exactly what a budget decision is.

                    For the 90s, such an upgrade was justified, and the Onyx was really first tested on inclined launchers. But at one time there was no money for the rearmament, and later - all new ships were planned with UKKS, the coastal complex too - vertical launch. So the plan was good, but it didn’t work on time, and now they are sculpting rockets only under the existing PU.
                    Re-equipping old ships is simply unprofitable - too expensive for ships that have 15 years of life after a major overhaul. The cost of such an upgrade is almost like a new ship coming out. And no less time. So it’s better to build new ships, and thereby extend the life until the shift arrives.
                    1155 and so it turns into a decent beast after such, even shrunken, modernization. He is, after all, an anti-submarine ship. He has a Polynomial and new missile systems in UKKS, yes 8 - 16 anti-ship missiles X-35, and two helicopters. Will fight again. And for serious tasks you can take a walk with a couple from 22350. Together, they will cost more than any Burke.

                    As we understand now with ship repair, you won’t be able to pull more anyway. But such a "budget" modernization of 1155 will reduce the time of modernization itself and drive as many ships through it as possible. The main thing is that Ukrainian power plants learned to repair - it was important in itself, the rest is simpler. hi
                    1. alexmach April 25 2020 19: 34 New
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                      . So the plan was good, but it didn’t work on time, and now only under the existing PU missiles sculpt

                      To realize the possibility of launching vertically and from an inclined launcher for the same missile is a minimal change.
                      Re-equipping old ships is simply unprofitable - too expensive for ships that have 15 years of life after a major overhaul.

                      A little higher were you happy with the modernization of not just such a ship?
                      And there are 7 of them
                      + Chabanenko
                      + 2 more guard patrols at the Black Sea Fleet.
                      + MRK
                      + maybe a couple more "buzzards still on the go"
                      That would be for them the most budgetary modernization with the replacement of the Civil Code.

                      There have recently been reports of an exit from the repair of "Okay." He came out with new turbines and will obviously serve the same 10-15 years. But with what to serve it? He has no such modern weapons. Why not replace it with its irrevocably obsolete complex of PLUR with an inclined USKK?
                      1. bayard April 25 2020 20: 54 New
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                        Quote: alexmach
                        To realize the possibility of launching vertically and from an inclined launcher for the same missile is a minimal change.

                        It will have to change the start algorithms in the head. Have you seen what Onyx is doing with vertical launch? From the slant it is necessary in a completely different way. “Gauges” from the slant never started. That is, it will be necessary to remake the missiles for an inclined start (in this case they will not start from the UKKS and will not be universal), but this is expensive and unjustified.
                        With inclined launchers, only the X-35 now starts with us. Here they can be put on the old watchmen, as they are put on the RTOs now.

                        Quote: alexmach
                        A little higher were you happy with the modernization of not just such a ship?

                        He who does not rejoice at such modernization has neither mind nor heart.
                        Quote: alexmach
                        And there are 7 of them
                        + Chabanenko

                        And wonderful, here they are for modernization, and it is advisable to modernize not only at Dalzavod, but also in Severodvinsk, and in a stream, so that in as little time as possible.
                        Quote: alexmach
                        + 2 more guard patrols at the Black Sea Fleet.

                        Except for the X-35, UKKS, you can’t shove them into the watchmen.
                        Quote: alexmach
                        + MRK

                        They already put 4 x 4 = 16 X-35. This is quite enough.
                        Quote: alexmach
                        + maybe a couple more "buzzards still on the go"
                        That would be for them the most budgetary modernization with the replacement of the Civil Code.

                        These disappear - their power plants are unstable, only support. They have boiler-turbine units that are unique in their time, but there is no one to upgrade them. Alas.
                        Quote: alexmach
                        There have recently been reports of an exit from the repair of "Okay." He came out with new turbines and will obviously serve the same 10-15 years. But with what to serve it? He has no such modern weapons. Why not replace it with its irrevocably obsolete complex of PLUR with an inclined USKK?

                        This is an anti-submarine ship, and will serve in this capacity. Like a watchman. With a gun and old PLUR. You can give him a pair of PU 2 x 4 anti-ship missiles X-35 for mimicry. To observe enemy ships in the Black Sea and the Eastern Mediterranean, it’s enough to give target designations for the coastal complexes BastioN and Bal, as well as aviation.
                        And build new ships - 22350, 22350M and 20380.
                        hi
                      2. alexmach April 25 2020 23: 23 New
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                        It will have to change the start algorithms in the head. Have you seen what Onyx is doing with vertical launch? From the slant it is necessary in a completely different way

                        This is a bullshit task. The rocket has already solved much more complex ones, this one is also solvable.
                        That is, it is necessary to remake rockets for an inclined start (in this case, they will not start from the UKKS and will not be universal)

                        Will be. Once again, having a good rocket starting vertically to add the ability to launch at an angle is neither impossible nor difficult. This is done, and there is nothing to fence a garden with 100-500 comments about how difficult it is. It is relatively not difficult.
                        “Gauges” from the slant never started

                        And how do they start at Varshavyanka? Can they from the USKK, can from under the water, can from the supply from the torpedo tube and from the inclined launcher can not? This is some kind of nonsense and not an argument.
                        With inclined launchers, only the X-35 now starts with us. Here they can be put on the old watchmen, as they are put on the RTOs now.

                        It is possible, but it is a rocket of a different class. For example, replacing Mosquitoes with the X-35 will completely change the concept of using the ship. Replacing them with Onyxes is just to modernize the ammunition.

                        And wonderful, here they are for modernization, and it is advisable to modernize not only at Dalzavod, but also in Severodvinsk, and in a stream, so that in as little time as possible.

                        With inclined PUs, this would be easier faster and cheaper.
                        They already put 4 x 4 = 16 X-35. This is quite enough.

                        What exactly is enough for? For shore strikes, for example, is it enough? And for a massive attack on KUG / AUG?
                        These disappear - their power plants are unstable

                        The Chinese are repairable, the Admiral Kuznetsov is repairable but not repairable here? and why? I agree that there is a question that makes sense, but it is with respect to any modernization of any ship.
                        This is an anti-submarine ship, and in this capacity will serve

                        Okay? It is already irretrievably outdated in that capacity.
                      3. bayard April 26 2020 00: 59 New
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                        Well, neither the naval commanders nor the shipbuilders of our inclined launchers want to bother. They made such a decision and do not intend to refuse. request I would also like to see the modernization of the Atlanteans under the Caliber and Onyx, but ... they were late. Ships have grown old. And the modernization of Ustinov showed how even such a version of it is expensive and lengthy. And with rearmament and even more so. Look at the torment with the modernization of Nakhimov - for such money and for such a period it was easier to build a new one.
                        Loss of competency?
                        Yes .
                        But not only that. It’s just that sometimes repairing an old ... not even a ship, but ... a car leads to such costs and time that it is cheaper to buy a new one. So in this case. Therefore, the decision was made to repair and maintain the old ships, modernization, but budget, for 1155 - as the most repairable and in demand ships - to update and re-equip.
                        And wait for the arrival of new ships, for which all hope.

                        If the budget is limited, and it is necessary to plan expenses in the long (with the fleet always so), choose priority directions and refuse ballast.
                        So the “Sarychami” happened - there is no one to repair them with us. And the Chinese ... they switched to gas turbines not so long ago, and I won’t be surprised that the equipment from the St. Petersburg plant where the power plants for Sarycha were sculpted, they transported to themselves under the guise of scrap metal ... This is my version, but the right to life has, the Chinese have often acted so ...
                        Now, old ships must somehow stretch 10-15 years before the shift arrives. Exactly - to stretch. At the lowest cost, because funds are needed for the construction of new ones.
                        1155 has an enviable fate in general - they were not written off and put on the wall in the 90s, they were driven by services all zero and tenths, and now the only candidates for modernization. Painfully successful buildings and power plants ... Yes, and they are beautiful.

                        And the X-35 is not worth sinning. It is at least small, but it is smart with its head and its flight profile is extremely low-altitude - a difficult goal. Especially if in a massive salvo. At MRK there are now 16 of them. set, and such boats rarely go one at a time. Even a pair of such RTOs in one gulp at 32 KR will not only puzzle any ship, but also the KUG. And at 1155 they are put as an auxiliary weapon - for less priority purposes.

                        It’s not time for our Fleet to be fat, but at least two decent surface ships they will receive this year - “Admiral Kasatonov” and “Marshal Shaposhnikov” ... and “Moscow” from repair. If I wait, it’s almost a celebration of the soul ... And when the Nakhimov comes into operation, the new frigates will start to be handed in two each year ...
                        To live.
                        hi
                      4. alexmach April 26 2020 09: 36 New
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                        Well, neither the naval commanders nor the shipbuilders of our inclined launchers want to bother. They made such a decision and do not intend to refuse.

                        They are something very much reluctant from what is really needed.
                        And the modernization of Ustinov showed how even such a version of it is expensive and lengthy. And with rearmament and even more so

                        It seems to me against the background of the work that was done with him and those investments, the modernization of weapons in the first place would not be super expensive ... It would be a plus to the estimate but not a space plus. And with that level of investment in its modernization, re-equipping it with modern missiles would be a very logical decision.
                        1155 has an enviable fate in general - they were not written off and put on the wall in the 90s, they were driven by services all zero and tenths, and now the only candidates for modernization. Painfully successful buildings and GEMs ... Yes, and they are beautiful

                        Yes, the ships showed themselves well and it is excellent that at least they undergo modernization from the old Soviet backlog.
                      5. bayard April 26 2020 14: 09 New
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                        Quote: alexmach
                        Well, neither the naval commanders nor the shipbuilders of our inclined launchers want to bother. They made such a decision and do not intend to refuse.

                        They are something very much reluctant from what is really needed.

                        Capitalism ... and his daughter is corruption. request
                    2. Nemchinov Vl April 26 2020 15: 32 New
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                      Quote: bayard
                      Well, neither the naval commanders nor the shipbuilders of our inclined launchers want to bother
                      it's a pity recourse and I agree with the previous speaker -
                      Quote: alexmach
                      They are something very much reluctant from what is really needed.
                      winked and call them laziness - the engine of progress, I would not be in a hurry .. no because really
                      Quote: alexmach
                      With inclined PUs, this would be easier faster and cheaper.
                      . Do not be offended by my friend - Vitaliy, but here is a ball towards Alexander (alexmach (Alexander) .
                      Quote: bayard
                      Now, old ships must somehow stretch 10-15 years before the shift arrives. Exactly - to stretch. At the lowest cost, because funds are needed for the construction of new ones.
                      And here I completely agree with you !!! And already a ball in your direction ... But ...
                      "I am tormented by vague doubts"- in the sense that I don’t quite understand what they are going to change / repair March turbines of ships pr. 1155?! what belay Statistics "frozen awaiting repair" three units of 1155 (1155.1) of the Northern Fleet, as if indirectly indicating that here is the root of the problem ?! repeat don't you find ?! what hi
                    3. bayard April 26 2020 17: 06 New
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                      Quote: Nemchinov Vl
                      "I am tormented by vague doubts," in the sense that I do not quite understand what are going to change / repair the marching turbines of ships of the project 1155 ?! The statistics of three units of the Northern Fleet 1155 (1155.1) frozen in anticipation of repair seem to indirectly indicate that this is the root of the problem ?! don't you find ?!

                      I hope that the solution to the root of this problem lies in the successful (but given by great efforts and nerves) repair of the Marshal Shaposhnikov power plant. If they were able to repair and restore the power plant of this ship, then they learned how to, there appeared capacities and competencies, and therefore with the following ships it will be easier, faster and more fun. After all, it was after solving this problem that plans to modernize all the ships of this series were announced. But there were opinions that the repair of "Shaposhnikov" will be "eternal" with a smooth flow to recycling.
                      So after success with Shaposhnikov, I look at the repair of subsequent ships with some optimism. But in order to have time to upgrade at least most of these ships, you need to start work on at least two shipyards and put on stream, otherwise they will rot before the time comes.
                      And as for the other types of ships ... You look at what is going on with ship repair in general - with the repair of the same nuclear submarines and submarines. This is horror and longing. Neither capacity, nor funds, nor personnel are chronically lacking. The Sevastopol Shipyard and the Kerch Gulf, which arrived with the accession of Crimea, are now coming to life and perhaps will dilute these terrible statistics. But "Moscow" and "Okay", it is only a repair and restoration of validity. Few are capable of more so far.
                      Therefore, I have such an opinion about inclined launchers - they did not manage to carry out modernization with re-equipment (at least for Onyxes) at the time when the ships had a reserve of resources - alas, time was lost. Now these old men can be repaired, like the old car, when everything is touched, everything is being poured. And the price of repairs with modernization is sometimes more expensive than the construction of an equivalent new one. The example of Nakhimov is especially vivid here - according to rumors from Klimov, the cost of all repair and modernization work came close to 200 (!!!) billion rubles. Moreover, most of this amount has already been spent, and at the old rate. For comparison, the atomic destroyer Leader is estimated at about 100 billion rubles.
                      Feel the difference in costs and results?
                      It is for this reason (well, the experience of modernizing Ustinov) that led to grabbing their heads at headquarters - repairs are more expensive and longer than building a new ship!
                      Therefore, the rejection of the modernization of "Moscow", "Varyag" and "Peter the Great".
                      And bet on the construction of NEW ships.
                      That is, it’s not a fool of admirals here, but pure arithmetic.
                      Plus problems with marine diesels and gas turbines, gearboxes, in general with gas turbines.
                      For already a year and a half or two I heard about the purchase and the beginning of the deployment of a large number of gear cutting machines and other machine tools to solve the problem with gearboxes, they promise just about a whole line of marine diesel engines ...
                      And the more you think about it, the more clearly you understand that it would be easier and cheaper in 2014 to simply return Ukraine to Russia - at the request of its president Yanukovych, and not have problems with either a power plant for ships or engines for aircraft and helicopters, neither with the resumption of the Ruslan production, the production of the An-70 in Ulyanovsk, the An-148 for the Russian Defense Ministry in exchange for the Tu-134, nor the problems with gas transit to Europe.
                      In the worst case, they would have had the same sanctions, but would have felt MUCH better.

                      The right decisions must be taken on time.
                      hi
                    4. Nemchinov Vl April 26 2020 18: 03 New
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                      Quote: bayard
                      I hope that the solution to the root of this problem lies in the successful (but given by great efforts and nerves) repair of the Marshal Shaposhnikov power plant.
                      I hope too ... winked
                      Quote: bayard
                      If you managed to repair and restore the power plant of this ship, then - learned (1) , there were capacities and competencies,
                      it IF managed reestablish ?! instead of being used as "donors", parts of the power plant from three ships that got to repair 1155 Northern Fleet (2) ?! what but unfortunately, I’m not sure what happened as you and I dream (see option 1), and not as unfortunately happens most often in reality (see option 2) ... request and then, -
                      Quote: bayard
                      ... and so with the following ships it will be easier, faster and more fun
                      becomes questionable ?! what recourse
                      Quote: bayard
                      After all, it was after solving this problem that announced plans for the modernization of all ships of this series .
                      Well .... say loudly about "grandiose plans", it’s like in that saying about, - "promise, not yet mean to marry" . fellow and believe me, I say this with regret. God grant that it turns out that I am not too trusting to the promises of the industrialists in the plans for the revival of the fleet. belay Here I would like to be mistaken, but .. request
                      Quote: bayard
                      But there were opinions that the repair of "Shaposhnikov" will be "eternal" with a smooth flow to recycling.
                      And while, for example "Admiral Chabanenko" did not come to life ?! recourse no , so that objectively testifies to, -
                      Quote: bayard
                      restore the power plant of this ship, means - learned, power and competencies appeared ,
                      ?! belay request With your comments going further (in the text of your post), I certainly agree in their greater degree. With uv. Vladimir hi
                    5. bayard April 26 2020 20: 22 New
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                      I myself treat the statements of our industry with ... caution. We’ll see “Shaposhnikov” in the ranks - I’ll drink a pile for the initiative, and I’ll hear that one or two BODs went into repair next, which means that it really works with the repair of the power plant. There is nowhere to take new turbines to them anyway.
                      Even if it is possible to upgrade 3-4 ships, it will be great, especially since in a couple of years 22350 \ 22350+ should begin to arrive one or two a year - it will become easier.
                      This year, “Admiral Kasatonov” will come into operation, “Marshal Shaposhnikov” and the cruiser “Moscow” will return, and these are three first-rank. Not often in recent years, the fleet was replenished with surface ships. But also the submarine fleet will replenish.
                      But there are still more uncertainties than confidence. hi
                    6. alexmach April 26 2020 22: 02 New
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                      There is nowhere to take new turbines to them anyway

                      Well, actually it was about the development of Saturn production and the marching turbines they needed, too. But this was the next priority task after the development of the 22350 GEM. Well, these same turbines, as I understand it, will also be needed for the 22350M.
                    7. bayard April 26 2020 22: 33 New
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                      The power and characteristics of a power plant, which is being prepared for the 22350M, are quite suitable - a turbocouple on the M70FRU (10 - 000 l / s) and the M14FR (000 l / s). But whether it will be possible to integrate it into 90 building ... is a very controversial issue. In addition, this GEM is not there yet, and it is being prepared for the new 27M, the laying of which is delayed due to the unavailability of the GEM.
                      So for now, the hope is only for repairs. Although ... maybe Saturn will surprise ...
                    8. alexmach April 26 2020 23: 01 New
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                      and prepare it for the new 22350M, the tab of which is delayed due to the unavailability of the power plant

                      This is not true, we have already discussed this in a previous article. His bookmark is not delayed. Its laying is not possible due to the unavailability of the project, on which, as reported, they do not work after the completion of outline design half a year ago.
                      According to the power and characteristics of the power plant, which is prepared for 22350M

                      Yes indeed, I looked carefully at the 1155 "native" other installation. But as far as I remember, it was said that the M70FRU was planned to be used in the repair of old ships.
                    9. bayard April 26 2020 23: 39 New
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                      Quote: alexmach
                      Yes indeed, I looked carefully at the 1155 "native" other installation. But as far as I remember, it was said that the M70FRU was planned to be used in the repair of old ships.

                      The question is whether it will fit the gearbox in terms of speed. However, the M70FRU in this case is used as a march, i.e. maximally loaded during operation. If she succeeds in replacing the mid-flight turbine with 1155, this will solve a lot. It would be possible to integrate. That’s why I said
                      Quote: bayard
                      maybe Saturn will surprise ...


                      And as for the 22350M ... most likely they decided to continue the 22350 series and finalize the Super-Gorshkov project properly.
                    10. Nemchinov Vl April 27 2020 00: 37 New
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                      Quote: alexmach
                      looked carefully at 1155 "native" other installation.
                      absolutely.
                      Quote: alexmach
                      But as far as I remember, it was said that the M70FRU was planned to be used in the repair of old ships.
                      No, for lack of their marching engines similar to DO90 (9000 hp), they supposedly wanted to trick the M75FR (7500 hp). Even in places of fastenings customized (I came across an article on LiveJournal, unfortunately I can not find the link) but ... about her (M75FR) after 2006, nothing was heard ...?! request apparently did not go (didn't come out) she is sensible ....
                      The trouble is that the Saturn GTGs have neither an analogue of DO90 (9000 hp), nor DT-59 (22500 hp) nor DT59.N1 (18500 hp) / to continue Series "Petrels 11356 R / M ...?!
                    11. alexmach April 27 2020 08: 53 New
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                      The trouble is that the Saturn GTGs have neither an analogue of DO90 (9000 hp), nor DT-59 (22500 hp) nor DT59.N1 (18500 hp) / to continue Series "Petrels 11356 R / M ...?!

                      Then everything with the engines is even sadder than I thought.
                    12. Nemchinov Vl April 27 2020 13: 42 New
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                      Quote: alexmach
                      Then everything with the engines is even sadder than I thought.
                      Unfortunately yes. Alas, this is an objective reality. crying recourse
                      Moreover, DO90 was offered as the main type of marching engines for the BOD 1155 and SKR11540 ... and DT59, as the main afterburner type. But the most important thing is that Nikolaev "Zarya-Mashproekt", did gearboxes to them without straining in convulsive convulsions, as is now the Star-Reducer, and the shipbuilding programs of the USSR, went like clockwork. smile Today, not only is NPO Saturn capable of producing only two types of gas turbine engines (M90FR and M70FRU), and the third M75FR "somehow did not enter", and also the assembly speed of gearboxes "Star" ...?! - https://shoehanger.livejournal.com/547182.html (And here I found the link you promised, about the gearbox and the gas turbine engine ...) hi
                      Therefore, in Russia, for full-fledged and rhythmic shipbuilding programs, you need it very urgently - create your NEW center for the construction of marine ship gas turbine engines and gearboxes for them (like the Soviet "Dawn-Mashproekt") !!! Otherwise, all shipbuilding programs will slip !! The only thing that can save, at first (let's say for the period of his creation / formation, and access to certain capacities), this is now to drive a series of FR. 22350 for DMZ, to maximally stimulate (and control) Zvezda-Reduktor, to produce reducers it has already mastered, and to invest on Kolomensky 16SD-500 (in 10000 hp), as the most promising of diesel engines, for "quad" (as on 20380) GEM, by analogy with DDA-12000 .... (under the same project 11664 increased towards "Thunder" avenue 12441...) !!!
                      For example, the Chinese did not clap their ears, and the license for the forced version of the DT-59 from Zarya-Mashproekt was bought and adjusted for serial production under the index QC280... !! She is on pr 055 !!! and like afterburner on 052D / seven out of thirteen plans, already in operation / ... !!! They learned how to release their / license GTD DT59 / TURBINES AND REDUCER, and no longer stall !!!
                      Russia, however, missed the point and did not buy timely licenses for the main ones for its Navy DO90 and DT59 (like DK59 in 18000 HP. and DS-71 in 8450 hp)?! But the main thing that they missed, questions and technology for manufacturing gearboxes for them !!!
  • APASUS April 24 2020 11: 31 New
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    A major upgrade took place at the BOD of project 1155 Marshal Shaposhnikov, until that moment the BODs were not equipped with universal launchers for cruise missiles Caliber, Onyx, or Zircon,
  • Nemchinov Vl April 24 2020 14: 19 New
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    Actually, it seems to me that if Admiral Sergey Avakyants were "still big fan his fleet ", then he probably would have found like-minded people in the General Staff (and other high military command of the Navy and the Russian government), and with them together would throw a global tantrum to the leadership (it was very asking to write, - the masturbation of the country !!), which finds 127,6 billion rubles for laying the nuclear icebreaker "Leader" (!!) (on the "Star" in Big Stone ?!), and at the same time does not find such means that there would be to lay either four frigates 22350.1; either 2 such frigates, and one BOD / EM digitized project 11560 (for modern weapons systems; 64 cells of the Poliment-Redut air defense system / under which, by the way, one of the options 11560 was planned, at the design stage /, and 32-48 cell UKKS (!!)), so as not to be wiser with the new 22350M ?!
    1. bayard April 25 2020 02: 54 New
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      Greetings, Vladimir!
      Are you all about the patient?
      Quote: Nemchinov Vl
      BOD / EM digitized pr.11560 (for modern weapons systems; 64 cells of the Poliment-Redut air defense missile systems / under which, by the way, one of the options 11560 was planned, at the design stage /, and 32-48 UCCC (!!)), so that not to be smart with the new 22350M ?!

      For the sake of this just have to be wise.
      22350M, this is the same 22350, but with a more powerful gas turbine power plant and increased ammunition, the construction of which the industry has already mastered. Delay with bookmarks ONLY due to the unavailability of the power plant, and so as not to be distracted from bringing and testing the power plant for 22350.
      These two ships are continuation of each other, with the unification resulting from this and simplification in the process of training crews.

      And as for the icebreakers, the Leader agrees completely - prematurely, “The star is not ready for this yet. Not a single vessel has been built there from scratch, but the only thing launched into the water is mostly built in Korea ... And right away complex order ...
      It seems that Medvedev on the last day of his prime minister made a farewell sabotage - he signed a decree to begin construction of the Leader.
      But warships will not be able to build there all the more. Firstly, it is much more complicated, despite the displacement. Secondly, there are civilian orders for a decade / decades ahead of the queue - for this purpose a shipyard was built. Under these orders, the government is already asking for the construction of ONE or two of the same super-shipyards in other places - it will not cope with all orders.
      And what's the point of laying the hulls of new ships if the power plant is not ready for them? God forbid “Yantar” and “Severnaya Verf” to provide the engines ... Then the Amur Plant (I hope it’s rocking and will be able to build destroyers and frigates again) and ... maybe Kerchinsky - after all, they also built the 1135 series, and not only that.
      But this is if there will be enough power plants.
      In the meantime, be patient and wait for the first tests of the domestic power plant on a real ship. If everything goes smoothly, it will be.
      1. Nemchinov Vl April 25 2020 14: 49 New
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        Quote: bayard
        Greetings, Vladimir!
        Are you all about the patient?
        Quote: Nemchinov Vl
        BOD / EM digitized pr.11560 (for modern weapons systems; 64 cells of the Poliment-Redut air defense missile systems / under which, by the way, one of the options 11560 was planned, at the design stage /, and 32-48 UCCC (!!)), so that not to be smart with the new 22350M ?!

        Greetings Vitaliy hi Peace at home !!! hi
        Quote: bayard
        For the sake of this just have to be wise.
        not really .
        Quote: bayard
        ... it's still the same 22350,
        Scaling 22350 to 22350M (in the VI 8000 tons, in the 3-D project) is about the same task as re-digitizing 11560 to 3-D, under new weapons systems. yes The power plant under them would be the same (!). And the number (ammunition) of missiles (RCC / SAM) is the same (!), but it would be easier to fit it into the previously planned VI of the project 11560 (which is 9-10 thousand tons). And seaworthiness 1155 is time-tested ... Well, you know my position, is it worth repeating? ... smile
        Quote: bayard
        But about the icebreakers "Leader" I agree completely - prematurely
        Soon we will have more icebreakers than combat NKs of the first rank !! This is outrageous. As well as the fact that the shipyard, built on budgetary funds, in the first place does not work to solve the problem of the Navy (and first of all the Pacific Fleet !!), but looks like the executor of Rosneft’s commercial orders (?!), despite the fact that it’s “the king is naked” ...
        Quote: bayard
        And what's the point of laying the hulls of new ships if the power plant is not ready for them? God forbid "Amber" and "Northern Shipyard" to provide the industry with engines
        Well, about this we have already spoken. This problem will only be resolved when your - center for offshore gas turbine engine building and gear assemblysimilar to the Soviet Zarya-Mashproekt !!! Rybinsk has yet to play the role of such an enterprise (and I’m afraid it is unlikely to be in the future ...) wink drinks
  • antivirus April 24 2020 15: 07 New
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    again on a teaspoon per year. when is 100 thousand tons of VI?
    everything was lost and Papanov died, and Mironov with Gaidai (?)
    what is the average GDP - only modernization of 7 thousand tons of VI, when 100 will be built?
  • bars1 April 24 2020 20: 37 New
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    Laid on May 25, 1983 In the Pacific Fleet since 1986. Total water displacement of 7480 tons.
    You can get fucked now what is the level of degradation of the shipbuilding industry!
  • lvov_aleksey April 24 2020 21: 17 New
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    Quote: Dead Day
    Quote: Salavatsky Ministry of Emergency Situations
    Total displacement - 7480 tons. And is this a frigate? But this is a destroyer and he will be more than Burke.

    and rockets are fewer at times.

    it's not about quantity but quality
  • lvov_aleksey April 24 2020 21: 19 New
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    Quote: antivirus
    again on a teaspoon per year. when is 100 thousand tons of VI?
    everything was lost and Papanov died, and Mironov with Gaidai (?)
    what is the average GDP - only modernization of 7 thousand tons of VI, when 100 will be built?

    this trash is not needed, any large vessel is a good target, there is in mine tonnage how much cover is needed
  • lvov_aleksey April 24 2020 21: 27 New
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    Quote: Nemchinov Vl
    Actually, it seems to me that if Admiral Sergey Avakyants were "still big fan his fleet ", then he probably would have found like-minded people in the General Staff (and other high military command of the Navy and the Russian government), and with them together would throw a global tantrum to the leadership (it was very asking to write, - the masturbation of the country !!), which finds 127,6 billion rubles for laying the nuclear icebreaker "Leader" (!!) (on the "Star" in Big Stone ?!), and at the same time does not find such means that there would be to lay either four frigates 22350.1; either 2 such frigates, and one BOD / EM digitized project 11560 (for modern weapons systems; 64 cells of the Poliment-Redut air defense system / under which, by the way, one of the options 11560 was planned, at the design stage /, and 32-48 cell UKKS (!!)), so as not to be wiser with the new 22350M ?!

    you forgot one little thing, 2 oceans wash us and a bunch of seas, you can say 3 oceans. And we must not spray resources. Khrushchev was right that he did not start a race of aircraft carriers, etc., but developed air defense. Since then, no one has been climbing to us! both cheap and cheerful
    1. Nemchinov Vl April 25 2020 15: 05 New
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      Quote: lvov_aleksey
      ... you forgot one small thing, 2 oceans wash us and a bunch of seas, you can say 3 oceans.
      Did you forget ?! It seems not !! Therefore, the eastern borders (PF !!), must provide new BNKs of the first rank "Star" (in Big Stone) !! While the Northern Shipyard will replenish frigates 22350 - SF и BSF.
      Quote: lvov_aleksey
      And we must not spray resources.
      And I'm talking about it !! Read carefully !! -
      Quote: Nemchinov Vl
      ... which finds 127,6 billion rubles on the tab of the atomic icebreaker "Leader" (!!) (on the "Star" in Big Stone ?!!), and at the same time he doesn’t find such means to lay four frigates 22350.1 there
      !!! This amount should be spent on BNK for "naked Pacific Fleet"and not on a super icebreaker !! They have already been planned and are being built more than a dozen !!!
  • lvov_aleksey April 29 2020 01: 29 New
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    Quote: Nemchinov Vl
    Quote: lvov_aleksey
    ... you forgot one small thing, 2 oceans wash us and a bunch of seas, you can say 3 oceans.
    Did you forget ?! It seems not !! Therefore, the eastern borders (PF !!), must provide new BNKs of the first rank "Star" (in Big Stone) !! While the Northern Shipyard will replenish frigates 22350 - SF и BSF.
    Quote: lvov_aleksey
    And we must not spray resources.
    And I'm talking about it !! Read carefully !! -
    Quote: Nemchinov Vl
    ... which finds 127,6 billion rubles on the tab of the atomic icebreaker "Leader" (!!) (on the "Star" in Big Stone ?!!), and at the same time he doesn’t find such means to lay four frigates 22350.1 there
    !!! This amount should be spent on BNK for "naked Pacific Fleet"and not on a super icebreaker !! They have already been planned and are being built more than a dozen !!!

    a lot of the fleet goes to the Pacific Fleet from the west, I'm not in state structures, but it can be more profitable for everyone. Nobody should cancel the loading of the plants, they may not trust the big financing in the Far East after the cosmodrome and Sakhalin.
  • lvov_aleksey April 29 2020 01: 53 New
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    Quote: lvov_aleksey
    Quote: Nemchinov Vl
    Quote: lvov_aleksey
    ... you forgot one small thing, 2 oceans wash us and a bunch of seas, you can say 3 oceans.
    Did you forget ?! It seems not !! Therefore, the eastern borders (PF !!), must provide new BNKs of the first rank "Star" (in Big Stone) !! While the Northern Shipyard will replenish frigates 22350 - SF и BSF.
    Quote: lvov_aleksey
    And we must not spray resources.
    And I'm talking about it !! Read carefully !! -
    Quote: Nemchinov Vl
    ... which finds 127,6 billion rubles on the tab of the atomic icebreaker "Leader" (!!) (on the "Star" in Big Stone ?!!), and at the same time he doesn’t find such means to lay four frigates 22350.1 there
    !!! This amount should be spent on BNK for "naked Pacific Fleet"and not on a super icebreaker !! They have already been planned and are being built more than a dozen !!!

    a lot of the fleet goes to the Pacific Fleet from the west, I'm not in state structures, but it can be more profitable for everyone. Nobody should cancel the loading of the plants, they may not trust the big financing in the Far East after the cosmodrome and Sakhalin.

    I want to add, my grandfather was mobilized only in September 45 with the Far East
    and do not forget about China, with which they have never fought, a good cover with a union of states on joint defense.