Iran admitted that accidentally shot down a Ukrainian passenger Boeing

Iran admitted that accidentally shot down a Ukrainian passenger Boeing

Passenger Boeing 737 of Ukraine International Airlines, crashed near Tehran, was shot down accidentally as a result of a “human error”. This is stated in a statement by the General Staff of the Armed Forces of Iran.


As a result of human error and by accident this plane was shot down

- said in a statement distributed by the state television and radio company IRIB.

The Iranian general staff added that they shot down the plane, because it flew near the IRGC military facility. As noted in the statement, this happened in a "high alert", associated with a possible US response to missile attacks on US bases in Iraq.

This information was confirmed by Iranian Foreign Minister Javad Zarif, who made a corresponding post on Twitter.

Sad day. Preliminary findings of the internal investigation of the Armed Forces (Iran): a human error made during the crisis due to US adventurism led to disaster

- he said.

Zarif offered condolences and apologies to the Iranian people, as well as to the families of the victims of the tragedy.

Earlier, a number of Western media reported that the Ukrainian airliner could be shot down by anti-aircraft missiles. This conclusion was made by American intelligence, having studied satellite images and the circumstances of the crash of the aircraft.

On January 8, the Ukrainian Boeing 737 airliner crashed in Tehran, with 176 people on board, 9 of them crew members (citizens of Ukraine). All flying on board Tehran-Kiev died. Initially, information appeared in the press about the crash due to the “technical malfunction” of the aircraft.
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  1. Nikitich 11 January 2020 07: 51 New
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    Good memory to the victims!
    I am for justice!
    You have to be really strong to admit your mistakes!
    Iran well done ..
    1. viking1703 11 January 2020 07: 54 New
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      all right. let all yesterday’s commentators who insulted the Dutch, laugh at the Ukrainian versions, etc. they will apologize to them and admit that they were mistaken with their cheers of patriotism.
      1. The Sparkle 11 January 2020 08: 00 New
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        Should the outskirts also recognize the downed Boeing and apologize to Russia?
        1. viking1703 11 January 2020 08: 03 New
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          and now the grandmother said in two! Western versions of downed planes are more truthful. maybe Ukraine shot down, and maybe the DNI. Now the West will poke in the face that their versions always hit the nail on the head.
          1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 19 New
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            Quote: viking1703
            . Now the West will poke in the face that their versions always hit the nail on the head.

            Oh really?
            Earlier, a number of Western media reported that the Ukrainian airliner could be shot down by anti-aircraft missiles. This conclusion was made by American intelligence, having studied satellite images and the circumstances of the crash of the aircraft.

            Well, where are these conclusions about the Boeing?
            "They are, but we will not show them to you"?
            Something they don’t remember about it
            1. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 29 New
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              Quote: Lipchanin
              Well, where are these conclusions about the Boeing?
              "They are, but we will not show them to you"?
              Something they don’t remember about it

              The US still leaves room for compromise.
              It comes to trial - they will voice it.
              1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 32 New
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                Quote: atalef
                The US still leaves room for compromise.

                belay To whom ??? Us???? belay
                Yes, they are even for unproven the violinists imposed sanctions and sent diplomats.
                And here, why, then, do not "leave room for compromise."?
                1. littoral 11 January 2020 08: 39 New
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                  Quote: Lipchanin
                  Yes, they even imposed sanctions for unproven violinists

                  For the proven.
                  1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 43 New
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                    Quote: littoral
                    For the proven.

                    In a court?
                    Remind me Where, when such a court was and his sentence?
                    1. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 47 New
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                      Quote: Lipchanin
                      In a court?
                      Remind me Where, when such a court was and his sentence?

                      well, enough already post a horseradish.
                      What Petrov and .. Vasechkin laughing it was not just Salisbury who walked clearly even to the very stubborn dolwormaster.
                      But for everyone - nothing has been proven.
                      We found where they served, where they serve, what kind of cars they drive, addresses, phone numbers and, most importantly .. photos.
                      but this is certainly not proof for you - 2 honest businessmen went to admire the cathedral. lol
                      1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 54 New
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                        Quote: atalef
                        it was not just Salisbury who walked clearly even to the very stubborn dolwormaster.

                        Only the stubborn “hollow lizard” does not need any evidence. It’s enough for him to say that they came to poison and specially walked under the cameras, and oh that’s enough
                        Once again I ask, In what court is it recognized by the EVIDENCE of the involvement of the Russian Federation and, in particular, the data of citizens in the poisoning.
                        Your place where you eat is not considered
                      2. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 58 New
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                        Quote: Lipchanin
                        Only the stubborn “hollow lizard” does not need any evidence.

                        Well, of course, an interview with Simonyan is evidence.
                        Everything else is not.
                        If the case is not considered in the Basmanny court, it means a priori not fair.
                        If the Russians are not allowed to be investigated, it means 100% biased.
                        So what do you think?
                        Then there’s nothing to talk to you at all.
                        Quote: Lipchanin
                        Once again I ask, In what court is it recognized by the EVIDENCE of the involvement of the Russian Federation and, in particular, the data of citizens in the poisoning.

                        baby talk.
                        To conduct the trial, the second party must at least be represented, did Petrov and Vasechkin agree to go to London and prove their innocence in court?
                        As I recall, they even refused to testify to investigators from the Scotland Yard, who were ready to come to the territory of the Russian Federation.
                        It’s strange how you think why * innocent accusers * in no way tried to prove the opposite and whitewash their name.
                        At least a testimony?
                        Is it strange? request
                        Still want to talk about the court?
                      3. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 09: 15 New
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                        Quote: atalef
                        If the case is not considered in the Basmanny court, it means a priori not fair.

                        In which then ??????
                        YOU already got your speculation.
                        There was NO trial, NO evidence was recognized, but everything is clear to you.
                        You will inappropriately be joyful when YOU, without any trial, without PROVEN evidence, will be sent to life
                        It’s strange how you think why * innocent accusers * in no way tried to prove the opposite and whitewash their name.

                        Are they obliged to prove something?
                        Did the court prove their guilt? Or should they answer every nonsense?
                        Have you heard anything about the presumption of innocence? The Court has already recognized them as won?
                        Well, the last question.
                        Why has so much time passed, a lot of “evidence” has been collected, “suspects” are known, but the case has not yet been referred to the COURT?
                        The blame was blamed the next day, but in court
                      4. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 42 New
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                        Quote: Lipchanin
                        In which then ??????
                        YOU already got your speculation.
                        There was no court

                        But it cannot be, the second side refuses to participate in it.
                        Quote: Lipchanin
                        You will inappropriately be joyful when YOU, without any trial, without PROVEN evidence, will be sent to life

                        You probably did not understand, for those who are especially stubborn, I repeat.
                        Petrov and Vasechkin agreed to testify?
                        Maybe they agreed to defend their name in court?
                        How can they be taken away somewhere if they just disappeared?
                        Quote: Lipchanin
                        Why has so much time passed, a lot of “evidence” has been collected, “suspects” are known, but the case has not yet been referred to the COURT?

                        This is English law (legal) - there are no correspondence courts by definition.
                        We have the same English law in Israel, and so without the official reaction of the other side to the prosecution, no lawsuit is opened.
                        Alas - absentee courts in English law do not exist.
                        request
                        This is not a basmanny court for you
                        Quote: Lipchanin
                        The blame was blamed the next day, but in court

                        strange you.
                        But how is it otherwise?
                        First, the investigating authorities collect the evidence base, then it is transferred to the prosecutor's office, then the prosecutor's office makes an indictment, then the court.
                        You do not know the code of procedure?
                        Teach the materiel
                      5. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 09: 53 New
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                        Quote: atalef
                        But it cannot be, the second side refuses to participate in it.

                        What is ???????? The court has already been appointed ????? Agendas sent ????
                        So, if the criminal refuses to speak in court, there will be no trial? laughing
                        Iron logic laughing
                        About absentee sentences are not the ear is not a face? laughing
                        Petrov and Vasechkin agreed to testify?

                        Where????? In which COURT ???? Where does he go ????
                        Maybe they agreed to defend their name in court?

                        What court and where does it blame them for something ???
                        WHERE do they defend him ????? ADDRESS name ???
                        First, the investigating authorities collect evidence, then it is transferred to the prosecutor’s office, then the prosecutor’s office issues an indictment, then the court.

                        Where is he this court ???
                        Why didn’t they transfer so much time ????
                        You got it already by the fact that our guys have to prove what NOBODY has officially accused them of yet !!!
                        There is no presumption of innocence in your court.
                        And such a concept as guilty or innocent can only be recognized by the court, isn’t it?
                        But judging by the fact that, without any trial, the citizens of the Russian Federation were found guilty without any trial, then NO
                      6. Sergey1987 11 January 2020 10: 34 New
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                        Quote: Lipchanin
                        What is ???????? The court has already been appointed ????? Agendas sent ????
                        So, if the criminal refuses to speak in court, there will be no trial?
                        Iron logic
                        About absentee sentences are not the ear is not a face?

                        But what kind of logic does this clown have there?))))) This atalef is an ordinary balabol criticizing everything that the Russian Federation would not have done. What can I say if in one of the comments he calls the best foreign minister in history.
                      7. Pete mitchell 11 January 2020 10: 56 New
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                        Quote: Sergey1987
                        What can I say if in one of the comments he calls the best foreign minister in history.

                        Then let usveterans.com read, where veterans of state intelligence in black and white about 777: if the president said that there is evidence, and then does not show it, then they do not confirm the position of the United States. Obama never showed space intelligence images, but promised on the very first day ...
                    2. borberd 11 January 2020 10: 51 New
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                      Ha ha So I can imagine how seasoned MI-5,6 scouts and counterintelligence agents beat the thresholds of the Basmanny court, make complaints, humbly listen to the refusals and again and again try to call Bashirov and Petrov to justice. I have not heard more stupidity.
                    3. atalef 11 January 2020 11: 14 New
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                      Quote: Lipchanin
                      judging by the fact that, without any trial, the citizens of the Russian Federation were found guilty without any trial, then NO

                      they are not convicted, they are in the status of the accused. refusing to cooperate with the investigation.
                    4. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 12: 35 New
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                      Quote: atalef
                      they are accused.

                      Yeah....
                      Maybe they are still SUSPECTED?
                      Did someone file a charge against them in the COURT?
                    5. atalef 11 January 2020 14: 06 New
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                      Quote: Lipchanin
                      Did someone file a charge against them in the COURT?

                      prepared by the UK prosecutor.
                    6. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 14: 29 New
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                      Quote: atalef
                      prepared by the UK prosecutor.

                      That's it, it’s prepared.
                      To promise, this does not mean to marry laughing
                      Interestingly, all the preparation came down to husky like? laughing
                    7. atalef 11 January 2020 14: 33 New
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                      Quote: Lipchanin
                      That's it, it’s prepared.

                      would you rather like it - not prepared? belay
                      Quote: Lipchanin
                      To promise, this does not mean to marry
                      Interestingly, all the preparation came down to husky like?

                      All preparation came down to that. then Petrov that Bashirov disappeared and refuse to cooperate with the investigation, to testify and generally try to whitewash his * unjustly tainted name * request
            2. Bukhalov 11 January 2020 11: 15 New
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              Quote: Lipchanin
              Quote: atalef
              But it cannot be, the second side refuses to participate in it.

              What is ???????? The court has already been appointed ????? Agendas sent ????
              So, if the criminal refuses to speak in court, there will be no trial? laughing
              Iron logic laughing
              About absentee sentences are not the ear is not a face? laughing
              Petrov and Vasechkin agreed to testify?

              Where????? In which COURT ???? Where does he go ????
              Maybe they agreed to defend their name in court?

              What court and where does it blame them for something ???
              WHERE do they defend him ????? ADDRESS name ???
              First, the investigating authorities collect evidence, then it is transferred to the prosecutor’s office, then the prosecutor’s office issues an indictment, then the court.

              Where is he this court ???
              Why didn’t they transfer so much time ????
              You got it already by the fact that our guys have to prove what NOBODY has officially accused them of yet !!!
              There is no presumption of innocence in your court.
              And such a concept as guilty or innocent can only be recognized by the court, isn’t it?
              But judging by the fact that, without any trial, the citizens of the Russian Federation were found guilty without any trial, then NO

              Sorry generously that I am wedging myself into a discussion about Petrov and Vasechkin. I was interested in two points. Iran pleaded guilty in the form of negligence. But the comments went in a completely different direction. 1. Lipchanin, not in the manner of any edification. You undertake to judge things in which, well, to put it mildly, are not quite competent. In order to reason on these topics, you need to have a legal education. And if you do not know anything about the various forms of the criminal process, including the main ones - the Inquisition and the indictment, the difference between the continental and island criminal process, then all your other arguments about the preliminary investigation, the indictment and the court - neither to the village nor to to the city. I do not dare to distract you from further research.
            3. borberd 11 January 2020 11: 25 New
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              This is the usual troll technique - to translate the discussion on a topic that is closer to them, where they feel more confident. You just have to not be fooled by this. Yesterday, they all blamed the Americans for everything and otmazyvat Iranians. But then the Iranians confessed what brought their guardians here in a state close to shock.
            4. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 12: 37 New
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              I’m wrong that there was NO court, but the Russian Federation and the citizens of the Russian Federation have already been found guilty ??? belay belay belay
            5. Bukhalov 11 January 2020 13: 33 New
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              Quote: Lipchanin
              I’m wrong that there was NO court, but the Russian Federation and the citizens of the Russian Federation have already been found guilty ??? belay belay belay

              I answer the last time. Because it hurts your ears your conviction and argumentation are not based on professionalism. The situation around Petrov and Bashirov is very easily resolved legally. The Constitution of the Russian Federation, as well as other countries, prohibits the extradition of citizens of the Russian Federation to other states. The norm of the general part of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation governs the criminal law of the Russian Federation in time and space. According to this norm, citizens of the Russian Federation who have committed a crime outside the territory of the Russian Federation are subject to criminal liability under the laws of Russia, if they provide for liability for such an act. There are reasons and grounds for instituting criminal proceedings against Petrov and Bashirov on the fact of the attempted murder of Skripals. This is reported in the Russian press (as a pretext) and the fact that Skripals was involved in the incident (as a basis). The Russian Federation must conduct a pre-investigation check (the so-called filtration stage of legal proceedings) and take one of two procedural decisions: initiate a criminal case and proceed with an investigation, or refuse to institute proceedings. Neither one nor the other has been done. On the presumption of innocence. Wrong you understand her. Long before the trial, even at the stage of pre-trial investigation, the accused is treated exactly as the guilty. He is deprived of almost all constitutional rights: freedom of movement, correspondence, the right to dispose of property, even the right to see his family, call them on the phone, what he wants, even wear a belt (in case of detention). The legislator has a completely different meaning in defining the presumption of innocence. A person is innocent outside the process. And the last one. There is no preliminary (pre-trial) investigation in England, as in most countries of Europe. They immediately begin a trial, where, unlike the Russian Federation and Ukraine, defense is the same subject of proof as the court and the prosecutor's office. Yes, yet. The court does not prove anything at all, neither guilt nor innocence. And he is not a party to the process. Its task is to ensure equal conditions for the parties to prove their position. It’s on your fingers. But everything in space orders is more regulated and more complicated. Therefore, I propose to return to the earth, to the topic of the branch.
            6. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 13: 45 New
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              Quote: Bukhalov
              Long before the trial, even at the stage of pre-trial investigation, the accused is treated exactly as the guilty.

              Everything is clear with such nonsense.
              Even being in a pre-trial detention center is called CONSIDERATIVE and in no other way !!!
              It seems that he picked up the tops ....
            7. atalef 11 January 2020 14: 15 New
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              Quote: Lipchanin
              Even being in a pre-trial detention center is called CONSIDERATIVE and in no other way !!!

              For a simple understanding, I will tell you the essence of the code of procedure so that you do not write nonsense.
              When an unlawful act is committed, the investigation begins during the investigation, it is determined whether there are SUSPECTED, for a start he is suspected, then transferred to the rank of a SUBSIDENT or WITNESS for this illegal action.
              Depending on the danger measure, the SECONDARY measure of restraint can be chosen, it can be carried out only with the permission of the COURT, with the submission of both the prosecutor's office and the investigating authorities.
              At that moment when the investigating authorities completed the investigation (the case is transferred to the Prosecutor's Office where the prosecutor's office checks both the progress of the investigation and the evidence base.
              If everything is in order, the PROSECUTOR'S OFFICE brings an indictment, the suspect goes into the status of the DEFENDANT, the case (the prosecutor submits to the court.
              Court during the hearing and dismantled both the arguments of the prosecution and the arguments of the defense accepts resente (if a guilty verdict is passed), then only then the accused will transfer to the status of GUILTY
              I clearly explained?
            8. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 14: 34 New
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              Quote: atalef
              I clearly explained?

              Aha. Only I still have not understood why, without any court, to which the matter does not seem to reach, the citizens of the Russian Federation were appointed Guilty in the use of OS?
              Are these your words?
              The court during the meeting and having examined both the arguments of the prosecution and the arguments of the defense accepts the decision (if the verdict is guilty), then only then the accused will transfer to the status of GUILTY

              ONCE I ASK, COURT WAS ?????
            9. atalef 11 January 2020 14: 38 New
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              Quote: Lipchanin
              Are these your words?
              The court during the meeting and having examined both the arguments of the prosecution and the arguments of the defense accepts the decision (if the verdict is guilty), then only then the accused will transfer to the status of GUILTY

              ONCE I ASK, COURT WAS ?????

              for especially stubborn dolboers, I’ll ask for the last time - where are they officially found guilty?
              They are at the stage of the accused.
              Russian is written in white, and above I explained the difference.
              Adyos, the conversation ceases to be languid.
              Take a read comprehension test
              Here is a reference
              https://nsportal.ru/nachalnaya-shkola/chtenie/2018/06/07/testy-na-ponimanie-prochitannogo-teksta
              then we'll talk.
            10. KrokodilGena 11 January 2020 16: 38 New
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              This Lipchanin is a troll, which, together with his ilk, is here to flood.
      2. Bukhalov 11 January 2020 14: 17 New
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        Quote: Lipchanin
        Quote: Bukhalov
        Long before the trial, even at the stage of pre-trial investigation, the accused is treated exactly as the guilty.

        Everything is clear with such nonsense.
        Even being in a pre-trial detention center is called CONSIDERATIVE and in no other way !!!

        The term "remand" in the Code of Criminal Procedure does not exist, from the word at all. There is only a “suspect”, “accused”, “defendant” and “convict” depending on the stage of the legal proceedings. I picked up Verkhushek in stationary studies at the law faculty, over forty years ago, during which I worked on the earth for almost a quarter of a century , but in the legal profession and in scientific work for a couple of decades. With all the academic degrees and titles that flowed out. Here's an uncle. "Investigated .." Well, you should know what words. Probably on the bench, which of the grandmothers taught.
    2. atalef 11 January 2020 13: 48 New
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      Quote: Bukhalov
      Long before the trial, even at the stage of pre-trial investigation, the accused is treated exactly as the guilty.

      accused, guilty, or rather, the degree of guilt determined by the court.
    3. Bukhalov 11 January 2020 14: 06 New
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      Quote: atalef
      Quote: Bukhalov
      Long before the trial, even at the stage of pre-trial investigation, the accused is treated exactly as the guilty.

      accused, guilty, or rather, the degree of guilt determined by the court.

      This does not mean that at the stage of pre-trial investigation in the Russian Federation, or the court stage in countries of island law, the accused (defendant) is treated as innocent. Even the trial of the defendant in handcuffs, and in some places in shackles, is also given. There is a difference in the procedural status of the accused / defendant and the guilt in the court that you identify.
    4. atalef 11 January 2020 14: 20 New
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      Quote: Bukhalov
      This does not mean that at the stage of pre-trial investigation in the Russian Federation, or the court stage in countries of island law, the accused (defendant) is treated as innocent.

      Of course not, at the stage of the suspect a decision can be made on arrest, house arrest and generally restriction of rights.
      Of course.
      Yes, in general, even the police in the Russian Federation can at least anywhere detain you without charge for a period of usually 24 hours, in some countries and more.
    5. Bukhalov 11 January 2020 14: 58 New
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      Quote: atalef
      Quote: Bukhalov
      This does not mean that at the stage of pre-trial investigation in the Russian Federation, or the court stage in countries of island law, the accused (defendant) is treated as innocent.

      Of course not, at the stage of the suspect a decision can be made on arrest, house arrest and generally restriction of rights.
      Of course.
      Yes, in general, even the police in the Russian Federation can at least anywhere detain you without charge for a period of usually 24 hours, in some countries and more.

      Of course. There is a consensus, as Gorbachev used to say.
  2. Simple 11 January 2020 12: 14 New
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    Quote: Lipchanin
    And such a concept as guilty or innocent can only be recognized by the court, isn’t it?



    У atalef
    Quote: atalef
    then the prosecutor’s indictment


    those. according to his version - just in absentia.
    wassat
  3. atalef 11 January 2020 13: 52 New
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    What is in absentia?
    You probably do not understand?
    For especially stubborn, sick and miserable, I repeat.
    Absentee court in English law does not exist.
    / The prosecutor’s office can collect an infinite amount of evidence at least in person, at least in absentia
    correspondence
    - carried out without direct contact with someone

    without reaction from the accused, the case will not be accepted for consideration by the court.
  4. Simple 12 January 2020 12: 15 New
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    The prosecutor's office can approve (and not pass) an indictment
    (i.e. give him a move further, for example, send him to court)
    The initiator of the indictment is the investigation of the case.
  5. Lena Petrova 11 January 2020 12: 16 New
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    Yes, the most important thing is the logic of this action. She just isn't there. A daughter comes to daddy - a traitor, from whom everything has been "sucked out" for a long time, and intelligence agents arrive from Russia with some incomprehensible, wild and difficult mission:
    a terribly toxic substance, make noise throughout Britain. Did they wear gas masks and gloves around the city? But how to apply discreetly, if there can be cameras anywhere, and we won’t be harmed by it ourselves? Why both of them? Better about five people, or rather. And where are the heroes of the occasion? Why don't they give interviews in the freest press? Yes, and did not achieve the "set goal." A simple tie, in such cases, would be more reliable. Ugh, a circus!
  6. Flooding 11 January 2020 10: 49 New
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    Quote: atalef
    This is English law (legal) - there are no correspondence courts by definition.

    Quote: https://www.banki.ru/news/lenta/?id=1874945
    The High Court of England sentenced in absentia to two years in prison Alexander Stepanov, a former general director and major shareholder of the British Energomash (UK) Limited, a holding company of the Energomash group

    Quote: https://regnum.ru/news/society/2077640.html#!
    Former member of the Federation Council of Russia Sergey Pugachev (Tuva) was sentenced in absentia by the Supreme Court of England to two years in prison. This was announced today, February 12, by the British media.
  7. atalef 11 January 2020 11: 21 New
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    Quote: Flood
    Former member of the Federation Council of Russia Sergey Pugachev (Tuva) was sentenced in absentia by the Supreme Court of England to two years in prison. This was announced today, February 12, by the British media.

    why don’t you give the whole article?
    It is reported that a former member of the Federation Council, the founder of the bankrupt Mezhprombank, Sergei Pugachev, has been prosecuted for several violations of the court orders of the High Court of London.

    The court found Pugachev guilty of hiding under oath, failure to comply with the disclosure requirements of assets, and that he illegally left the jurisdiction of England and Wales. Pugachev’s defense has already stated that it intends to appeal the decision of the English court to the ECHR.

    He escaped from court, more precisely during the trial.
    Do you feel the difference?
    The investigation was completed, charges were brought, Pugachev's lawyers filed a defense response.
    The court accepted for consideration, the trial began in its process. Pugachev fled.
    You do not understand the difference? What does it mean to escape during the trial in the COURT?
  8. Flooding 11 January 2020 11: 26 New
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    Quote: atalef
    why don’t you give the whole article?

    The answer is obvious. In order not to clutter up the forum.
    So the sentence is in absentia - this time.
    You wrote earlier that in absentia court decisions are not made in English courts - these are two.
    The case is not the only one. The second link and the Internet to help. I can help you search - these are three.
  9. atalef 11 January 2020 11: 35 New
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    Quote: Flood
    The answer is obvious. In order not to clutter up the forum

    not obvious and don't juggle the facts.
    I said that in absentia a court in England cannot pronounce a sentence because the case cannot reach the court a priori.
    There is no reaction from the other party (the accused) - the court will not accept the case. /Dot.
    Pugachev escaped during the trial, when the court went and the case was accepted for consideration, the prosecutor’s office filed an indictment and there was a reaction from the accused.
    Quote: Flood
    You wrote earlier that in absentia court decisions are not made in English courts - these are two.

    I meant that a court cannot pass without the presence of a second party and a verdict is delivered in absentia.
    as it happens in the same Russian court.
    The article about Pugachev is not legally correct. This is not a decision in absentia, this is a judgment rendered in the absence of the accused, who escaped during the COURT.
    Do you catch the difference?
    Quote: Flood
    The case is not the only one. The second link and the Internet to help. I can help you search - these are three.

    why don’t you bring the article again?
    “In the proceedings Stepanov submitted additional agreements to the court, which, according to him, were signed at the end of 2008 between him and BTA Bank. These documents significantly changed the terms of the loan agreement to the detriment of the interests of the bank, however, as a result of a handwriting examination, these documents were found to be fake, and the version of events presented by Stepanov was refuted, ”the bank said.

    Have a problem with what you read?
    They both fled during the trial. And in the case of Stepanov in general, after the announcement of the intermediate conclusions.
  10. Flooding 11 January 2020 12: 20 New
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    Quote: atalef
    I meant that a court cannot pass without the presence of a second party and a verdict is delivered in absentia.

    The tablet freezes, so only the link
    https://zakon.ru/blog/2014/1/28/izvestit_ne_poanglijski__prezidium_vas_otkazal_v_priznanii_resheniya_britanskogo_suda
  11. Flooding 11 January 2020 11: 31 New
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    Quote: atalef
    The court accepted for consideration, the trial began in its process. Pugachev fled.
    You do not understand the difference? What does it mean to escape during the trial in the COURT?

    Nonsense. These were two different court decisions.
    And just according to the second he was convicted in absentia.
    Quote: https://24smi.org/celebrity/5245-sergei-pugachev.html
    Pugachev is put on the international wanted list, and representatives of the Russian Federation turn to London officials (at that time Sergey Pugachev lived in London) with a request for assistance in the investigation. Having studied all the nuances, a London court ruled to freeze Pugachev’s funds in the UK.

    In 2015, Sergei Pugachev, contrary to the order of the court, leaves the territory of England and flees to France, where he draws up another lawsuit against the Russian side for political persecution and expropriation of material assets. Meanwhile, Pugachev was sentenced to 2 years of imprisonment for contempt of the London court, while in Russia, the banker in court is recognized as responsible in the Mezhprombank case and brought to subsidiary liability.
  12. atalef 11 January 2020 13: 53 New
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    Quote: Flood
    Nonsense. These were two different court decisions.
    And just according to the second he was convicted in absentia.

    She did not say that this was one thing, but in both cases the accused fled during the trial.
    Do you have a reading comprehension problem?
  13. Flooding 11 January 2020 16: 01 New
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    Quote: atalef
    Do you have a reading comprehension problem?

    I will refrain from rudeness. But you seem to understand only yourself well.
    Return to my post above and re-read carefully.
    In fact, a decision was made in the Pugachev case.
    But after he violated it, a new decision was made, due to and due to his absence in absentia.
    And control yourself, express yourself more culturally.
  14. Prosha 11 January 2020 10: 51 New
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    Since the case cannot be brought to court, then there was no crime! There are no criminals and no one was poisoned! - Here are your logical conclusions! No and no trial. Or rather, since there is no trial, then there is no crime! Is it not so in your country?
    And without further development of the case, I can absolutely convincingly, with a "high degree of probability" that you poisoned Skripale and the prosecutor’s office of the Russian Federation collected a lot of all kinds of evidence, but since the case is futile, no one will bring you to justice, but if suddenly lucky enough to be in Russia, go to the nearest prosecutor’s office)
  15. victor50 11 January 2020 11: 01 New
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    Quote: Prosha
    Since the case cannot be brought to court, then there was no crime!

    Nonsense! Criminal cases, at least in our case, are being stopped while investigating the perpetrators for various reasons: amnesty, for example, reconciliation of the parties, etc.
  16. atalef 11 January 2020 11: 45 New
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    Quote: Prosha
    Since the case cannot be brought to court, then there was no crime!

    There was a crime, the prosecutor’s office insists on it and submits an indictment.
    A trial cannot begin without the reaction of the accused.
    in English law, there cannot be a priori trial when only the prosecution is in court.
    Quote: Prosha
    Here are your logical conclusions!

    You not only do not know the code of procedure, but you also cannot read.
    Sorry
    Quote: Prosha
    Or rather, since there is no trial, then there is no crime!

    There is a victim, with all the signs of violent death (as an example) - there are no suspects (the investigation did not find or did not find).
    Is there a court? -- no
    Is there a crime? - Yes .
    Turn on elementary logic.
    Quote: Prosha
    I can absolutely conclusively, with a "high degree of probability" that you poisoned Skripal and that the prosecutor’s office of the Russian Federation collected all sorts of evidence

    If the prosecutor has enough evidence, then provide an indictment.
    Quote: Prosha
    but since the case is futile, nobody will hold you accountable

    Do you contradict yourself? so enough or not? If enough, why is it futile?

    Quote: Prosha
    but if you are lucky enough to be in Russia, go to the nearest prosecutor’s office)

    You are so legally illiterate that you don’t even know Russian law.
    Who issues the detention order?
    The court, on the proposal of the prosecutor's office, if it finds sufficient reason for detention.
  17. Prosha 11 January 2020 17: 34 New
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    You yourself answered all your inferences, I just voiced everything that you yourself said, and you have refuted them with honor, thereby you objected to it.
    Well, and if, in essence, the presence of anyone in a certain place, even at the crime scene, cannot be considered criminal intent in any way, and refusing any testimony and explanation does not mean involvement in the crime.
  18. krillon 11 January 2020 11: 11 New
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    15 years ago, a TU 154 Sibir airline was shot down over Ukraine. Killed 27 citizens of Russia and 51 citizens of Israel. Remind me how the Ukrainian side rested in denying that they shot down the plane during the exercises?
  19. Pete mitchell 11 January 2020 11: 45 New
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    Quote: Krillon
    how did the Ukrainian side rest in denying that they shot down the plane during the exercises?

    Without drawing any analogies: with the Tu-154 the wildest case, the country 404 rebelled until it was pulled out of the sea. It seems the left engine is stuffed with shrapnel. When they pinned Kuchma uttered - it happens .. There something very long lasted with compensation for the Russians.
  20. Alex_You 11 January 2020 12: 21 New
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    Firstly, not over Ukraine, but over the Black Sea. Secondly, Ukraine still has not recognized that it was allegedly it shot down a plane.
  21. nikon7717 11 January 2020 15: 07 New
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    Here, the Boeing’s case over Ukraine is even more interesting, when the US lost satellite control data, and now it’s instantly found. The conclusion suggests itself when choosing the right accused, everything is.
  22. tomket 11 January 2020 11: 18 New
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    Quote: atalef
    Petrov and Vasechkin agreed to testify?

    By the way, but there wasn’t such an example for you. Two Mossad agents flunked some kind of religious obscurantist who spoiled the life of Israel, or some kind of Nazi. And then it went off, they found out that it was Moisha and Rabinovich. And why did you fail this obscurantist? And obscurantism was good, and the Nazi liked to watch films about The Lion King, and even cried when they trampled Simba's father. There is no such?
  23. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 09: 34 New
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    Quote: atalef
    To conduct the trial, the second party must at least be represented, did Petrov and Vasechkin agree to go to London and prove their innocence in court?

    Got it already.
    CASE before the COURT transferred ?????
    They were summoned to the COURT ????
    How do you know whether they will agree or not ????
    Still want to talk about the court?

    With whom??? belay belay
    With someone who makes such a BADDAY like this?
    and prove your innocence in court?

    They should NOT prove ANYTHING to ANYTHING.
    THE COURT MUST PROVE.
    With a person who does not know such ELEMENTARY things, there is simply Nothing to speak negative .
    Chao-
  24. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 55 New
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    Quote: Lipchanin
    Got it already.
    CASE before the COURT transferred ?????

    how can a case be brought to court without the official response of the accused (written by themselves) or by a trusted lawyer?
    Quote: Lipchanin
    They were summoned to the COURT ????

    How, if they are not ready to testify?
    Quote: Lipchanin
    How do you know whether they will agree or not ????

    They do not agree to testify on the territory of the Russian Federation, as the logic suggests that they certainly will not go to London.
    Quote: Lipchanin
    With whom???
    With someone who makes such a BADDAY like this?

    You are of course a connoisseur of English law laughing
    My wife is a lawyer, here is a lawyer, and we have English law.
    Want to talk about legal issues? wink
    Quote: Lipchanin
    They should NOT prove ANYTHING to ANYTHING

    They must, the presumption of innocence applies only at the stage of the investigation, after filing the indictment it is no longer there.
    The person is in status - the accused.
    Quote: Lipchanin
    THE COURT MUST PROVE.

    The court does not prove.
    The court pronounces the verdict on the basis of the findings and, so to speak, debate and evidence base presented by the prosecution and the accused.

    Quote: Lipchanin
    With a person who does not know such ELEMENTARY things, there is simply Nothing to speak

    Are you about yourself?
  25. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 10: 07 New
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    Quote: atalef
    as logic suggests that they certainly will not go to London.

    RJUNIMAGU laughing
    And therefore, the case has not yet been referred to court. laughing
    after filing the indictment, she is no longer there.

    And no in court? belay
    Is there a bill of indictment?
    Where is it? On which site can I read it?
    Or is it available only to the "chosen" in VO?
    The court does not prove.

    In the COURT prove. And since there is no trial, then there is no evidence
  26. atalef 11 January 2020 10: 31 New
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    Quote: Lipchanin
    RJUNIMAGU
    And therefore, the case has not yet been referred to court.

    laugh, but without the reaction of the other side - the matter cannot reach the court a priori - English law request
    Quote: Lipchanin
    And no in court?

    no, the person is in the position of the accused, therefore, he must prove.
    Quote: Lipchanin
    Is there a bill of indictment?

    Is.
    But without the reaction of the accused, it cannot be sued - English law request
    When crossing the border with at least Petrov at least Vasechkin, they will be delayed and the matter will spin further.
    So far - a dead end and not the fault of the prosecution.
    Quote: Lipchanin
    Or is it available only to the "chosen" in VO?

    Is this the first time you hear that Petrov and Bashirov are officially charged?
    Quote: Lipchanin
    In the COURT prove. And since there is no trial, then there is no evidence

    Evidence is provided by the prosecutor.
    Evidence to the contrary is provided by the party of the accused - that it works.
  27. Dart 11 January 2020 22: 55 New
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    damn it ... and Jews are stupid ... uzbagsy already ... or drink yadu ....
  28. victor50 11 January 2020 11: 10 New
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    Quote: Lipchanin
    RJUNIMAGU

    Sir, you are, of course, a patriot, but legally absolutely illiterate, perhaps because he is very arrogant and arrogant.
    Quote: Lipchanin
    In the COURT prove. And since there is no trial, then there is no evidence

    And if the accused, in the presence of strong evidence (for example, was caught at the time the crime was committed and +++), died before the trial. So he is not guilty and there is no evidence. You do not want to believe in the cited part of the evidence, your opponent wants to believe that is all. But your arguments about guilt-innocence, the existence of evidence only in court, etc. in the context of this dispute, complete nonsense. And, unfortunately, you are arguing as violent ignorance.
  29. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 12: 48 New
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    Quote: victor50
    And if the accused, in the presence of strong evidence (for example, was caught at the time the crime was committed and +++), died before the trial.

    No need to juggle. We are talking about the fact that the British side did not at all present any evidence or accusations. Only suspicion and speculation.
    I’m just trying to understand why the case has not yet been referred to the COURT, if everything is in order with the evidence.
  30. victor50 11 January 2020 16: 54 New
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    Quote: Lipchanin
    We are talking about the fact that the British side did not at all present any evidence or accusations.

    You? To your opponent? request There is no provision in any criminal procedure legislation to present evidence to you or anyone else who is not a participant in this process. You and your opponent are guided by information that has leaked (or intentionally merged) into the media. No one knows what is in the case file, except for those who investigated it. And they merge information based on the specific interests of the investigation, political, etc. But only do .. not very smart and sneaky investigator will merge outright lies. And why it is not transferred to the court - one of the possibilities your opponent informed you. In general, the Anglo-Saxon justice system is very different from ours, so much so that it is impossible to approach it with our concepts. And to ask such a question, you need to know it very well (some subtleties are difficult even for our lawyers). Especially - to answer this question. In general, the reasoning of NOT PARTICIPANTS of the process about the presence or absence of evidence of guilt-innocence is stupid. To consider whether they exist or not, and if so, whether they are sufficient, you need to study the details of the criminal case in detail, and not be guided by media publications. But now - all the same, investigators, prosecutors, judges and lawyers. Everyone knows what they have investigated, after reading the publications in the media. lol There are very few real ones left. no
  31. Dart 11 January 2020 23: 00 New
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    reasoning of NOT PARTICIPANTS of the process about the presence or absence of evidence of guilt-innocence is stupid

    I agree ... say it again to the one who is above with foam at the mouth already accused of all sins that he is stupid.
  32. KrokodilGena 11 January 2020 16: 59 New
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    Quote: Lipchanin
    We are talking about the fact that the British side did not at all present any evidence or accusations.

    It's a lie! Evidence collected abundantly, the entire chronology of action. We found everything, the real names of these grief agents, where they served, ranks. And this is far from an isolated case of GRU failures in recent years.
  33. Prosha 11 January 2020 17: 41 New
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    Another English prosecutor !!! They tried to besiege only one of Israel, and the second immediately drew. Above, the comrade adequately tried to ask: where is this evidence and to whom are they known to the two of you, and why did the angel court share its knowledge with you?
  34. Sergey1987 11 January 2020 10: 42 New
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    Quote: atalef
    You are of course a connoisseur of English law
    My wife is a lawyer, here is a lawyer, and we have English law.
    Want to talk about legal issues?

    Bad, it means you have a lawyer and you seem to understand jurisprudence like I am in ballet, if you simply do not understand the concepts of “absentee sentence” and “presumption of innocence”. For this, there is no need for the other party to be in court. Read at least what it is.
    One of the fundamental principles of criminal proceedings is that a person is presumed innocent until proven guilty of a crime in the manner prescribed by law and established by a court decision that has entered into legal force.
    Everything else is about who is to blame and who poisoned the skripal with empty talk. If the prosecutor had already submitted the evidence to the court, he would have already been convicted in absentia long ago.
    But this, of course, does not bother you, if only to open your mouth towards the Russian Federation.
  35. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 17: 09 New
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    You forget that we are talking about the English system of law, and there the concept of "presumption of innocence" in this form appeared only after joining the EU. You will be surprised, but in the United States a court can convict even without proving the guilt of the defendant. What is the presumption of innocence, what are you talking about?
  36. Sergey1987 13 January 2020 09: 53 New
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    Quote: dmmyak40
    You forget that we are talking about the English system of law, and there the concept of "presumption of innocence" in this form appeared only after joining the EU.

    Yes, Britain is only entering the EU so far, which means that the "presumption of innocence" should work.
    Quote: dmmyak40
    You will be surprised, but in the United States a court can convict even without proving the guilt of the defendant. What is the presumption of innocence, what are you talking about?

    In principle, I am not surprised, but can you give examples anyway?
  37. dmmyak40 13 January 2020 16: 01 New
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    Yes, Britain is only entering the EU so far, which means that the "presumption of innocence" should work.
    This is not the point here: from the very beginning in the English system of law there is no direct reference to the presumption of innocence: neither in the Habeas Corps Act, nor in the Magna Carta. There is, in my opinion, a mention of the mandatory process of the trial and something else. But the rule is about the "presumption of innocence." as understood in continental law, was introduced only after accession to the EU. But this does not mean at all that this principle applies to the same extent as ours.
    In principle, I am not surprised, but can you give examples anyway?
    With examples, I think it will help you Atalef, nevertheless, it is his spouse who has a lawyer wassat , and I just read a little about it in due time. If you do not go into the specifics, then this is the so-called judicial transaction: when the defendant pleads guilty in exchange for the sentence proposed by the judge (usually less than it would have been in the subsequent investigation). And no one should prove anything to anyone !!!
    Here, even after confession, the defendant can refuse them and, if the state prosecutor does not have a reliable evidence base, the judge will send him to hell. (in theory, of course).
  38. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 12: 52 New
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    Alexander, I do not quite understand, is the lawyer your spouse or you yourself?
    It’s just that you refer to the system of English law with competence ... In the context of the concept of the presumption of innocence.
    They must, the presumption of innocence applies only at the stage of the investigation, after filing the indictment it is no longer there. The person is in status - the accused.
    From this place, please, in more detail. First of all, give the concept of the accused of your right (for us - Article 47 of the Code of Criminal Procedure).
    And then about the presumption. Tell us a little about you, her status ... About the judicial "deal" and the full process ... About the burden of proof ...
  39. dmmyak40 14 January 2020 22: 08 New
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    My wife is a lawyer, here is a lawyer, and we have English law.
    Mr. Atalef, why did you shut up, and I was so eagerly awaiting an answer to my question regarding the status of the defendant and the presumption of innocence in Anglo-Saxon law! Not good, darling, not good! You are the husband of a lawyer! THERE A LAWYER!
    Do not be shy, my yacht, write! Tea is not Saturday, and you probably are not Shabbat-goy ...
  40. Ramzaj99 11 January 2020 09: 38 New
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    Quote: atalef
    at least the other party must be represented in court,

    And to keep the citizens of Russia, those very lively and HEALTHY, citizens of the Skripals and not allow the ambassador to them, is this normal ?? In European? In fair trial? By the way, they did not refuse citizenship! And where is the other side ???
    So do not rub here about honest European courts.
  41. atalef 11 January 2020 10: 03 New
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    Quote: Ramzaj99
    And to keep the citizens of Russia, the very living and HEALTHY, citizens of the Skripals and not allow the ambassador to them, is this normal?

    Skripal has English citizenship (although this does not play a role in this case 0
    Not the ambassador, but the representative of the embassy (the ambassador does not have to meet at all 0 - they must admit if
    1. A citizen is in the status of a detainee.
    2 He (a citizen) requires a meeting with a representative of the embassy.
    Everything else is propaganda.
    The violinists are not in the status of detainees and the refusal to meet with the embassy's representatives, Skripal's daughter, was voiced.
    Skripal himself, who is an English citizen, is not obligated by the Russian Federation to voice anything at all.
    Quote: Ramzaj99
    In European?

    All according to the law, read above.
    They do not want to meet with representatives of the Russian Federation and she sounded it.
    It's her right
    Quote: Ramzaj99
    In fair trial?

    Which court 7 was the court?
    Quote: Ramzaj99
    By the way, they did not refuse citizenship! And where is the other side ???

    In the case of Skripal - a citizen of England in general, nothing, local citizenship prevails, in the case of a daughter - read above what I said
    Quote: Ramzaj99
    So do not rub here about honest European courts

    Why European and why courts? belay
  42. Ramzaj99 11 January 2020 10: 17 New
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    Quote: atalef
    In the case of Skripal - a citizen of England in general, nothing, local citizenship prevails, in the case of a daughter - read above what I said

    And who said that they do not want to meet with the Russian ambassador ?? Jewish radio?
    Was there a statement from Skripal's daughter that she did not want to return to her homeland?
    Maybe she’s dead for a long time, maybe she’s in shackles.
    The country is obliged to check whether everything is in order with its citizens. And London is obliged to confirm that they do not want to communicate voluntarily!
  43. atalef 11 January 2020 10: 34 New
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    Quote: Ramzaj99
    And who said that they do not want to meet with the Russian ambassador?

    Skripal's daughter officially stated this
    The British police issued a statement on behalf of the daughter of the GRU ex-Colonel Sergei Skripal Julia, poisoned in Salisbury. It says that the girl is “starting a new life” and so far does not want to see either the employees of the Russian embassy or her cousin Victoria.


    Read more: https://news.tut.by/world/588610.html

    Quote: Ramzaj99
    Was there a statement from Skripal's daughter that she did not want to return to her homeland?

    YES
    And she said this, including in a telephone conversation with her cousin.
    Quote: Ramzaj99
    The country MUST check whether everything is OK with its citizens

    She voiced this in an official statement.
    Quote: Ramzaj99
    London MUST confirm that they do not wish to communicate voluntarily!

    Does the statement of the violin itself not suit you?
  44. Ramzaj99 11 January 2020 11: 03 New
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    Quote: atalef
    Does the statement of the violin itself not suit you?

    No, it doesn’t!
    She didn’t say anything PERSONALLY!
    According to the father, sister, special services, journalists: - this is bullshit.
    This is inter-state relations and not a village club.
    There must be either a certified document, and certified by the Russian side. Or a personal meeting with the ambassador.
    Everything else is ...: - read above ....
  45. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 12: 51 New
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    Quote: atalef
    Which court 7 was the court?

    In the morning I’m trying to prove that they accused the Russian Federation without any trial.
    Really got it? laughing
  46. KrokodilGena 11 January 2020 17: 12 New
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    Quote: Ramzaj99
    And to keep the citizens of Russia, those very lively and HEALTHY, citizens of the Skripals and not allow the ambassador to them, is this normal ??

    I doubt that the Squeakers after the attempted murder were eager to meet with the ambassador of that country, which sent its security forces to kill them. No one holds the violins, but protects. Somewhere there was information that the Skripals want to meet with the ambassador of the Russian Federation, but they are not allowed to do this ??

    Quote: Ramzaj99
    By the way, they did not refuse citizenship!

    And what the hell they refuse citizenship ?? Or does it oblige meetings with ambassadors and other officials of the Russian Federation?
  47. Alex Nevs 11 January 2020 11: 12 New
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    If you went under the cameras, GUILTY? Or have something to say?
  48. aleks26 11 January 2020 11: 23 New
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    Well, of course, an interview with Simonyan is evidence

    No, of course, evidence is the ravings of various bloggers on the Internet.
  49. Krasnoyarsk 11 January 2020 12: 38 New
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    Quote: atalef

    It’s strange how you think why * innocent accusers * in no way tried to prove the opposite and whitewash their name.
    At least a testimony?

    And why should the innocent prove something?
  50. The comment was deleted.
  51. Alexander Seklitsky 11 January 2020 10: 06 New
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    Quote: Yuri Yaroshevsky
    Iranian air defense as well as Russian is famous for getting into passenger planes

    Remind about that 154 shot down over the Black Sea, the valiant Ukrainian air defense?
  52. victor50 11 January 2020 11: 14 New
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    Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
    Remind about that 154 shot down over the Black Sea, the valiant Ukrainian air defense?

    And the Iranian plane shot down over the Persian Gulf of the US ship’s air defense ?!
  53. The comment was deleted.
  54. The comment was deleted.
  55. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 09: 00 New
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    Alexander, you tell the same thing to American "diplomats" who "accidentally" went to admire the nature and beauties of the Russian North in a closed zone a couple of months ago. Tell me by looking into their naive eyes.
    As for the Skripal case, but any adequate judge who is not under pressure will send the prosecutor to hell with such evidence.
    PS In any case, our traitor? Our. Have the right to liquidate? The answer was Mossad many years ago.
  56. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 10 New
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    Quote: dmmyak40
    Alexander, you tell the same thing to the American "diplomats" who "accidentally" went to admire the nature and beauties of the Russian North in a closed zone a couple of months ago

    but what does it have to do with it?
    Some worked for special services and others did the same.
    What is the general question?
    only that the Americans were not there by chance - everyone believes (and I, too)
    But Petrov and Basharov are certainly tourists. wink
  57. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 09: 18 New
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    But with that. It turns out that American diplomats accidentally lost their way when inspecting nature in the ban, and did not get any kind of info. It is truth. One cannot but believe the statements of the State Department.
    But our tourists accidentally in Salisberry can not be. It was they who poisoned the Skripals. And the cat. Evidence of their involvement and many strange events related to the incident? Gentlemen take the word.
  58. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 23 New
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    Quote: dmmyak40
    But with that. It turns out that American diplomats accidentally lost their way when inspecting nature in the ban, and did not get any kind of info. It is truth

    for whom ? For you ? It’s absolutely clear to me that they were spying.
    By the way, what happened to them afterwards?
    Quote: dmmyak40
    One can’t but believe the statements of the State Department.

    And the statements of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation-is possible?
    Quote: dmmyak40
    But our tourists accidentally in Salisberry can not be.

    Did they at least testify? Maybe the IC of the Russian Federation or the Scotland Yard investigators who wanted to come to the Russian Federation?
    Quote: dmmyak40
    Gentlemen take the word.

    Indeed, a sea of ​​photos of who Petrov and Bashirov are.
    From where, the names of the Parents. where they studied, where they served. PHOTOS - but for you, this is certainly not evidence - gentlemen are taken for granted. good
  59. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 10: 04 New
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    By the way, what happened to them afterwards?
    They were sent, if not mistaken. The usual procedure.
    And the statements of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation-is possible?
    Did I say that you can? Think with your head. True, our foreign minister did not shake test tubes in Sobes ... ... really, right?
    Alexander, do you, as I see, consider yourself to be in the Western world? Unlike us, Scythians with slanting and greedy eyes ... So, I will open for you the "truth": you need to believe only facts, not words.
    Here explain to me how we, Russian people, can take the word for those who came up with the proverb: “A gentleman is the master of his word: he wanted to give, he wanted to take” (here: “Without giving a word - be strong, let’s hold on”). Those who repeatedly committed treason against Russia? Forgot the explosion of the cruiser Maine? Dardanelles operation? Intervention? Gleivice? Test tube Powell? Hiley Likely?
    Where after all this may faith in your words come from? As one wise man said: words are empty, and actions speak for themselves.
  60. atalef 11 January 2020 10: 39 New
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    Quote: dmmyak40
    They were sent, if not mistaken. The usual procedure.

    Ie they did not believe the word. and we believe Petrov and Bashirov request
    Quote: dmmyak40
    True, our foreign minister did not shake test tubes in Sobes ... ... really, right?

    I don’t know why this is 7; you can somehow invade the Tatar-Mongol invasion.
    Let's talk more specifically without leaving the topic.
    Quote: dmmyak40
    Alexander, do you, as I see, consider yourself to be in the Western world? Unlike us, Scythians with slanting and greedy eyes ...

    I personally have not seen you, maybe they are really slanted at you, but what does it have to do with it?
    Quote: dmmyak40
    Here explain to me how we, Russian people, can take the word for those who came up with the proverb: “A gentleman is the master of his word: he wanted to give, he wanted to take” (here: “Without giving a word - be strong, let’s hold on”).

    Well, yes - baby talk again.
    Quote: dmmyak40
    Forgot the explosion of the cruiser Maine? Dardanelles operation? Intervention? Gleivice? Test tube Powell? Hiley Likely?

    and Obama pisses in elevators.
    Quote: dmmyak40
    As one wise man said: words are empty, and actions speak for themselves.

    Here I am about that.
    Petrov and Bashirov where are they gone?
    Why do not want to whitewash their honest name?
  61. Prosha 11 January 2020 17: 51 New
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    Here are interesting people in Israel live!))
    ... I don’t know why this is 7, you can somehow invade the Tatar-Mongol invasion.
    Let's talk more specifically without leaving the topic ...

    ... But the conversation was about Iranian air defense and the Ukrainian plane, but here the theme of the Skripals came up by chance and ...
  62. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 22: 36 New
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    Ie they did not believe the word. and we believe Petrov and Bashirov
    The Americans were in a zone closed to foreigners, i.e. they deliberately violated the ban. What did Petrov and Co. violate? Just specifically answer.
    I don’t know why this is 7; you can somehow invade the Tatar-Mongol invasion. Let's talk more specifically without leaving the topic.
    If necessary, I will remember him. What is the Powell test tube for? This is a word of trust in the Anglo-Saxons. The parable of the boy and the wolves remember? The Anglo-Saxons so often shouted "wolf" that they can no longer be trusted.
    I personally have not seen you, maybe they are really slanted at you, but what does it have to do with it?
    And this is to the fact that we are different: you, Westerners, have the same values, but ours (alas for you) are different. And about the slanting ..., this is a quote from one of the Russian classics of the Silver Age. Google it. And my eyes are ordinary, South Russian, although I was born precisely among the Kalmyk Mongols.
    Well, yes - baby talk again.
    My dear adult friend! I don’t know exactly how old you are, but I know for sure that you are younger than me. Therefore, behave according to your own age and do not fall into childhood. The verb is like a husband, not a small child.
    and Obama pisses in elevators.
    Oops! I didn’t know, didn’t know her by God !!! This is an unexpected! Where does such an insider come from? Personally wiped after him, or what?
    About the style and semantics of the answer I will not repeat, see the previous koment.
    Here I am about that. Petrov and Bashirov where are they gone? Why do not want to whitewash their honest name?
    Oh, these tales! Oh, these storytellers! We see one of the favorite Anglo-Saxon tricks: to label unreasonably, and then offer the opponent to prove that he is not a camel. No, gentlemen, the Anglo-Jews, the burden of proof for the allegations rests with you and only you! The standard message "responsibility for the consequences that may arise may be laid only by a gentleman and only on others" will not work with us! You have to answer for the bazaar!
  63. The comment was deleted.
  64. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 20: 30 New
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    Not tired. If the Secretary of State impudently lied at a meeting of the UN Security Council, then we will always poke the USA at these excrement. What Paeull said I know perfectly well, as well as the fact that this test tube was a placebo.
    I can only say one thing to you: you are a giant of thought and well done! But not the father of Russian democracy! Keep it up! A flag in hand and a fair wind without stones in the back!
  65. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 10: 04 New
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    By the way, what happened to them afterwards?
    They were sent, if not mistaken. The usual procedure.
    And the statements of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation-is possible?
    Did I say that you can? Think with your head. True, our foreign minister did not shake test tubes in Sobes ... ... really, right?
    Alexander, do you, as I see, consider yourself to be in the Western world? Unlike us, Scythians with slanting and greedy eyes ... So, I will open for you the "truth": you need to believe only facts, not words.
    Here explain to me how we, Russian people, can take the word for those who came up with the proverb: “A gentleman is the master of his word: he wanted to give, he wanted to take” (here: “Without giving a word - be strong, let’s hold on”). Those who repeatedly committed treason against Russia? Forgot the explosion of the cruiser Maine? Dardanelles operation? Intervention? Gleivice? Test tube Powell? Hiley Likely?
    Where after all this may faith in your words come from? As one wise man said: words are empty, and actions speak for themselves.
    Did they at least testify? Maybe the IC of the Russian Federation or the Scotland Yard investigators who wanted to come to the Russian Federation?
    Or maybe it was not necessary to destroy evidence? Or not hide Russian citizens from consular workers? Why did you suddenly decide that Russia should do everything that the Britons requested, and to us on our requests - a cookie with butter?
    Indeed, a sea of ​​photos of who Petrov and Bashirov are. From where, the names of the Parents. where they studied, where they served. PHOTOS - but for you, this is certainly not evidence - gentlemen are taken for granted. good

    I read your comments and think: are you a mentally normal person or have you been so crippled by the Western paradigm? What side of the photograph, “where”, the names of parents, place of study and place of service became evidence of the crime? Or in the West, what is the evidence determined by the judge? At your leisure, read something from the criminal process, you will learn a lot.
  66. Doctor 11 January 2020 12: 23 New
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    It’s absolutely clear to me that they were spying.


    Too obvious. Rather, they covered the main ones, diverting the attention of counterintelligence.
  67. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 11 New
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    Quote: dmmyak40
    As for the Skripal case, but any adequate judge who is not under pressure will send the prosecutor to hell with such evidence.

    do not make laugh my slippers.
  68. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 09: 14 New
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    A serious answer, reasoned! And, most importantly, backed up by a lot of things! Bravo! To you and your slippers! Plus ...
  69. Alex Nevs 11 January 2020 11: 20 New
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    and evidence base
  70. demo 11 January 2020 09: 31 New
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    Mossad showed much earlier how to deal with traitors, even if they are your own children, Emperor Peter 1.
    To withdraw from the place where he sits and the mud pours onto the country, interrogate and condemn.
  71. saturn.mmm 11 January 2020 09: 10 New
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    Quote: atalef
    well, enough already post a horseradish.

    As the Professor once wrote, “don’t tell the person what to do, but the person will not say where you need to go”
    Quote: atalef
    We found where they served, where they serve, what kind of cars they drive, addresses, phone numbers and, most importantly .. photos.
    but this is certainly not proof for you - 2 honest businessmen went to admire the cathedral

    That is: a photograph of a person, place of work, place of service, car, address, are proof of an attempt to kill a person?
  72. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 25 New
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    Quote: saturn.mmm
    That is: a photograph of a person, place of work, place of service, car, address, are proof of an attempt to kill a person?

    for starters - of course not.
    But I would say that at least raises great doubts about the veracity of the version voiced by them and what they did there.
    And with the condition that in the room where they lived there were traces of the Novice - everything looks even more strange.
    Do not find?
  73. Prosha 11 January 2020 17: 56 New
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    You seem to be not in disagreement with logic, explain to me the wretched and wretched - why everywhere where this “newcomer” is present to the British and the skripals, he is a terrible poison and cripples everyone even a policeman with a cat, but Bashirov and Ivanov walk so playfully Salisbury lives in the room with the traces of the “newcomer” and doesn’t they take away any of them?
    somehow it looks even weirder.
    Do not find?
  74. garri-lin 11 January 2020 09: 29 New
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    You my friend have seen enough films. Of particular importance and attention-grabbing operations are usually engaged in all sorts of homeless Osvoldi and not the Rameo / cabinet-shaped Petrovs and Vasechkins.
  75. The comment was deleted.
  76. politach-delivery 11 January 2020 10: 07 New
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    So far, all Bellingcat's investigations have turned out to be true.
  77. garri-lin 11 January 2020 12: 00 New
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    True, the concept is relative. If 100500 liars say something, this does not become true for people who know that there is true truth.
  78. Olgovich 11 January 2020 09: 52 New
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    Quote: atalef
    What Petrov and ... Vasechkin didn’t just walk through Salisbury clearly even to the stubborn dolbyashchera.

    Hans with yankels and so forth walked there. And?

    House SCRIPT was shot by SCIENCE SC. And so, cameras and engulfed cameras everywhere throughout England, but on English object. intelligence ...no! belay lol

    Only a stubborn hammerhead will believe in such, um, "randomness" .. lol

    Dead bodies, by the way, where?
  79. audigamma 11 January 2020 11: 15 New
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    And there was WMD in Iraq. They deceived the whole WORLD. And England played an important role in this. So to believe them after that is the last thing.
  80. Major Yurik 11 January 2020 12: 02 New
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    ... That Petrov and .. Vasechkin laughing wasn’t just walking through Salisbury clearly even to the stubborn dolphin bearer.

    Here before the terrorist attack in our city near St. Petersburg your shulman and Rabinovichi walked, and not one hundred copies! negative By your logic, is all this not easy? request Look, how does the Israeli propaganda bureau work, do they pay a lot for licking the hosts? tongue
  81. Thompson 11 January 2020 13: 47 New
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    Well, it's already warmer. Following your logic, you are a bumbler.
    But to us, normal people, this is not at all clear.
  82. minomoto 11 January 2020 18: 06 New
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    You say it’s like killing Skripal is something bad. It is a well-known fact that Skripal is a traitor for Russia, under his leadership there were several dozen people whom he passed all of. These people worked undercover in conditions with strong psychological stress and stress, of course they were forced to trust him and to some extent even depended on him, and he betrayed them all for the sake of a silver coin. Just the last rot * and as for me, I turned in my subordinates for personal gain. I'm not talking about the enormous damage that he inflicted on Russia. Naturally, Russia had a full moral right to eliminate it.
  83. g1v2 11 January 2020 20: 33 New
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    Are you serious? belay That is, do you seriously believe in this version with Skripal? Not kidding? belay
  • politach-delivery 11 January 2020 09: 23 New
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    5092 posts in half a year. Do you work chtoli here?
    1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 09: 37 New
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      I am a pensioner. There is plenty of time. Yes, and trolls like you do not give a nap laughing
    2. Alex Nevs 11 January 2020 11: 22 New
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      They come here on a kakulam site laughing . And you do not allow them to take off their pants, so they have to put them straight into their pants. drinks
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Barmaleyka 11 January 2020 08: 58 New
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    Quote: littoral
    Quote: Lipchanin
    Yes, they even imposed sanctions for unproven violinists

    For the proven.

    where when when?
    By the way, do not tell me how they poisoned them all the same with buckwheat porridge or with gas smeared on the doorknob
    1. littoral 11 January 2020 09: 00 New
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      Quote: Barmaleyka
      Quote: littoral
      Quote: Lipchanin
      Yes, they even imposed sanctions for unproven violinists

      For the proven.

      where when when?
      By the way, do not tell me how they poisoned them all the same with buckwheat porridge or with gas smeared on the doorknob

      Go home, get out with this on Reddit or even WOL, and not on this site. You learn a lot.
      1. Barmaleyka 11 January 2020 09: 22 New
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        poke you will be different and in another
        Now on the topic, since they still poisoned with porridge or gas, and how did they manage to kill only one person and a cat by using a BOV in the city ?!
      2. bycharashkO 11 January 2020 09: 43 New
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        Interestingly considered the rating of the message. At the moment, it shows 0, and when you hover over this zero, “FOR” = 4, “against” = 2 pops up. And how does 4-2 get equal to 0? And this is not only in this message. Maybe I don’t understand something.
      3. Barmaleyka 11 January 2020 10: 07 New
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        reload the page and see that everything is fine
    2. littoral 11 January 2020 10: 45 New
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      Quote: Barmaleyka
      Now on the topic, since they still poisoned with porridge or gas, and how did they manage to kill only one person and a cat by using a BOV in the city ?!

      Have you read anything besides Rasha Tudey?
    3. Barmaleyka 11 January 2020 11: 57 New
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      Quote: littoral
      Have you read anything besides Rasha Tudey?

      I didn’t read RT on the case of violins, but the BBC was cast out as best it could
      Amesbury victim's brother: Beginner was in a perfume bottle
      https://www.bbc.com/russian/news-44841416
      Police found Amesbury novice poisoning source
      https://www.bbc.com/russian/44827497
      New details of Skripal’s case: “Novice” was found on the threshold of the house of a poisoned agent
      https://www.bbc.com/russian/news-43577681

      According to BBC Safety Correspondent Gordon Korera, the highest concentration of the substance was found on the doorknob of the Skripals house. The substance could be added to the sticky mass applied to the door handle, says Gordon Korera.

      This, according to the BBC correspondent, explains the fact that the poisonous substance was found on Skripal's car, as well as in a restaurant where he had lunch with his daughter.
  • cradle 11 January 2020 11: 28 New
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    what are the evidence of evasion ?! Is the cat healthy?
  • atalef 11 January 2020 08: 42 New
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    Quote: Lipchanin
    To whom ??? Us???

    of course
    Quote: Lipchanin
    Yes, they even imposed sanctions for unproven violinists and sent diplomats.

    for Boeing - the same.
    Quote: Lipchanin
    And here, why, then, do not "leave room for compromise."?

    not the country to leave this place for her and not in that position.
    They tried to deny, you think at the first moment they didn’t know that they had failed (or like shooters with their posts?).
    They knew whether they would analyze it or not, when they realized that there is nowhere to go.
    Of course piled on the States - which were not there at all.
    laughing
    1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 48 New
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      Quote: atalef
      of course

      What of course?
      And how many years will this "chance" last? laughing
      not the country to leave this place for her and not in that position.

      Double standards again laughing
      So after all, they told the whole world that they would not show evidence to anyone laughing
      1. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 01 New
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        Don’t argue with this stubborn mentally retarded .. don’t waste time ... such as it’s a great Russian proverb for dew and eyes .... I won’t give it completely, because the strange rules of the site can make me this
        1. aszzz888 11 January 2020 10: 20 New
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          Lipchanin (Sergey) Today, 08: 48 Andrey VOV (Andrey) Today, 09:01
          +3
          Yes, do not argue with this stubborn mentally retarded .. do not waste time... such as he fits perfectly Russian proverb on dew and eyes .... I will not give completely, because the strange rules of the site can me this

          True says, Andrei VOV, it is not worth it. It rubs here for a long time, but all the time it bends ONE OWN. To prove anything is useless, and to your own detriment. Sergei, hi !
    2. saturn.mmm 11 January 2020 09: 14 New
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      Quote: atalef
      not the country to leave this place for her and not in that position.

      Quote: atalef
      Quote: Lipchanin
      Well, where are these conclusions about the Boeing?
      "They are, but we will not show them to you"?
      Something they don’t remember about it

      The US still leaves room for compromise.

      Something with memory?
    3. Alex Nevs 11 January 2020 11: 24 New
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      And I don’t see a gopher ... laughing
  • Commissar77 11 January 2020 08: 44 New
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    Yeah, the Iranians surprised me. I thought they would refuse, maybe they could find some pilot Voloshin, probably they thought that it would cost less
    1. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 52 New
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      Quote: Military Commissar77
      Yeah, the Iranians surprised me. I thought they would refuse, maybe they could find some pilot Voloshin, probably they thought that it would cost less

      then completely sour.
      Voloshin then why bring down an airplane over Tehran laughing
      Yes, and Jews are hard to drag, such as beaten on them, shot down - not that sad
      Get out the same way sad
      1. Commissar77 11 January 2020 08: 53 New
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        Well, maybe then the Spanish dispatcher?
        1. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 19 New
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          Quote: Military Commissar77
          Well, maybe then the Spanish dispatcher?

          where so many dispatchers pick up?
        2. max702 11 January 2020 10: 19 New
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          Quote: atalef
          Quote: Military Commissar77
          Well, maybe then the Spanish dispatcher?

          where so many dispatchers pick up?

          In the 404th there are wonderful invisible dispatchers .. How what questions do they immediately become invisible to them ..
    2. grandson of Perun 11 January 2020 13: 04 New
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      Quote: atalef
      Yes, and Jews are hard to drag

      And here you hit the sky with your finger.
      Wikilix published a correspondence between "ours" (owners of both Russian and Israeli passports) with the Israelis about the exchange of codes.
      "Ours" gave the Israelis the codes from the Iranian Thors-M1, the Israelis gave the "ours" codes from the drones used by the Georgian army.
      So the Jews had the opportunity to provoke the Torah of Iranian air defense.
      https://oko-planet.su/politik/newsday/554290-wikileaks-moskva-predostavila-izrailyu-kody-dlya-sistem-vozdushnoy-oborony-irana-tor-m1.html
  • lopvlad 11 January 2020 09: 08 New
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    Quote: Military Commissar77
    I thought they would refuse


    so they are not an under-state of "Sumerians" who are not used to answering for the West and hiding for their actions. Iran is a great country that if something really does, it will plead guilty.
    1. Commissar77 11 January 2020 09: 15 New
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      Maybe so. It is strange that many members of the forum denied the version that the plane was shot down despite the fact that a lot indicated this. Denied only because the Americans were the first to announce this version? They have many satellites over Iran.
      1. Olgovich 11 January 2020 10: 04 New
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        Quote: Military Commissar77
        It is strange that many members of the forum denied the version that the plane was shot down despite the fact that a lot indicated this. Denied only because the Americans were the first about this version announced? They have many satellites over Iran.


        No, because the Americans always LIE.

        Therefore, even when they sometimes tell the truth, they no longer believe
    2. Prosha 11 January 2020 18: 06 New
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      And the question still does not leave me: how did the individual who took the picture turn out to be in time on time? Who prompted him - where when and what should be removed? Probably, the chief of the Iranian general staff said: "Sit and wait, a rocket will fly on a plane right now!"
      Even with all the confessions, all of this is strange ...
  • syndicalist 11 January 2020 09: 48 New
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    I didn’t expect it either. Especially when you consider that even Zelensky constantly urged not to make hasty conclusions.
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. anykin 11 January 2020 10: 03 New
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      Quote: RUSS
      Only a stubborn cheer patriot mbired by a putivist does not believe that Skripaley travuli ours.

      All of Russia has no doubt that yours and they trawled.
    2. IGOR GORDEEV 11 January 2020 10: 38 New
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      Quote: RUSS
      Quote: Lipchanin
      Yes, they even imposed sanctions for unproven violinists and sent diplomats.

      Only a stubborn cheer patriot mbired by a putivist does not believe that Skripaley travuli ours.

      Mat prohibited on the site ... Barely restrained, reading the commentator "Russ." Tfu.
  • Nyrobsky 11 January 2020 09: 06 New
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    Quote: atalef
    Quote: Lipchanin
    Well, where are these conclusions about the Boeing?
    "They are, but we will not show them to you"?
    Something they don’t remember about it

    The US still leaves room for compromise.
    It comes to trial - they will voice it.

    In the case of a downed Boeing over the Donbass, the United States are accomplices of dill. The case will reach the court - there will be voiced.
    1. atalef 11 January 2020 10: 40 New
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      Quote: Nyrobsky
      In the case of a downed Boeing over the Donbass, the United States are accomplices of dill. The case will reach the court - there will be voiced.

      Or Russia accomplices of the militias.
      There are 2 versions so far.
      1. cradle 11 January 2020 11: 39 New
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        root word "bye"
      2. Nyrobsky 11 January 2020 12: 57 New
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        Quote: atalef
        Quote: Nyrobsky
        In the case of a downed Boeing over the Donbass, the United States are accomplices of dill. The case will reach the court - there will be voiced.

        Or Russia accomplices of the militias.

        I do not see the logic. As always, the question arises - "To whom was it profitable?". Russia did not have any goodies to bring down a passenger plane, but the interest of mattresses in finding a tool to put pressure on Russia is clearly visible.
  • Tank jacket 11 January 2020 09: 16 New
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    Which court? Honest and unbiased? And who are the judges?
    1. valeryb 11 January 2020 10: 45 New
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      Quote: Tank jacket
      Which court? Honest and unbiased? And who are the judges?
      Shaw, is it not enough? there are in London and in Stockholm.
      1. Tank jacket 11 January 2020 11: 37 New
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        Sorry, but this is a sharashkin office. Gazprom and that from Stockholm got the Naftogaz lawsuit ... "Ukraine is poor, the EU has not given money and therefore you must" ... wassat
  • Senior manager 11 January 2020 16: 38 New
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    It’s strange to read
    Quote: atalef
    It comes to trial - they will voice it.

    An objective court can remember, and should, about Adolf Aloizovich.
  • Butchcassidy 11 January 2020 16: 59 New
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    The USA and the court are things from parallel universes.
  • figwam 11 January 2020 10: 36 New
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    An interesting picture is obtained, the plane “accidentally” took off with an delay of one hour, flying for several minutes spontaneously turned around without permission from the ground and keeping radio silence went towards the military facility of Iran, just at that time the American spy “accidentally” flew in and recorded the work of the Iranian The air defense, which was brought to maximum combat readiness, was also accidentally woken up by a local resident, and it was at that time that he “accidentally” shot a rocket launch in the night sky that lasted a couple of seconds. Iran needs to thoroughly conduct an investigation, too many coincidences, very similar to a planned provocation.
    1. qQQQ 11 January 2020 13: 06 New
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      Quote: figvam
      unauthorizedly turned around without permission from the ground and keeping radio silence went towards the military facility of Iran

      Yesterday, in passing, a version slipped through that they put a remote control system on the Boeing that can be controlled from the ground, ignoring the pilots, so the version of the sacred sacrifice very much has a place to be.
  • Crystal of Truth 13 January 2020 06: 16 New
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    In March, the trial will begin .. Here they will show
  • Vyacheslav Viktorovich 11 January 2020 08: 22 New
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    In this message, I simply send greetings to everyone who has been proving to me for the past two days that I have been hiring the West, a troll, a liar, I have the wrong logic and so on. Well, whose picture of the world turned out to be adequate, and whose - not?
    1. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 02 New
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      Buy yourself a gingerbread, hang it on the wall and beat yourself in the chest every morning with happiness
    2. cradle 11 January 2020 11: 41 New
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      transmitting? So who are you after that?
  • Barmaleyka 11 January 2020 08: 57 New
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    Quote: viking1703
    western versions of downed planes are more truthful

    Are you talking about Korean Boeing in the Far East?
  • Vyacheslav Viktorovich 11 January 2020 08: 59 New
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    -9
    Quote: viking1703
    Now the West will poke in the face that their versions always hit the nail on the head.
    What is there to poke? Everyone can build a logical chain in accordance with their level of thinking:

    Tu-154 crashes over the Black Sea - everyone denies guilt - the US says its satellite detected the launch of missiles from Ukraine - Ukraine admits

    Boeing 737 crashes over Iran - everyone denies blame - USA says its satellite has detected the launch of missiles from Iran - Iran admits

    Boeing 777 crashes over Donbass - everyone denies blame - USA says that their satellite detected the launch of missiles from the territory under the control of militias - (???)
    1. Ramzaj99 11 January 2020 10: 09 New
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      +17
      Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
      Tu-154 crashes over the Black Sea - everyone denies guilt - the US says its satellite detected the launch of missiles from Ukraine - Ukraine admits

      And here it is not necessary to lie)))!
      I will update your memory .......
      Ukraine refused to the last, spit on all the evidence, and only when they called from the pope and said "time to confess" did they admit something there, while President Kuchma said that this was not a tragedy, there were tragedies and worse.
      but then suddenly: -
      The plane was shot down on October 4, 2001
      And in January 2011, despite all the evidence received, the Prosecutor General of Ukraine closed the criminal case, the Kiev Court of Appeal determined that the investigators of the Interstate Aviation Committee could not prove that the plane was shot down by a Ukrainian rocket.
      Checkmate)
    2. Olgovich 11 January 2020 10: 19 New
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      +6
      Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
      What is there to poke? Everyone can build in accordance with their level of thinking. logical chain:

      )

      There is a virgin, there’s no logic
      Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
      Tu-154 crashes over the Black Sea - everyone denies guilt - the US says its satellite detected the launch of missiles from Ukraine - Ukraine admits

      And who else could bring down over that water area? Only they shot.
      Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
      Boeing 737 crashes over Iran - everyone denies blame - USA says its satellite has detected the launch of missiles from Iran - Iran admits

      And who else could shoot in the center of the country?
      Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
      Boeing 777 crashes over Donbass - everyone denies blame - USA says their satellite has detected the launch of missiles from territory under the control of militias

      To get it: there were TWO ukroBUKOV in the same area.
    3. Alexander Seklitsky 11 January 2020 10: 27 New
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      In the first two cases, there was a launch from the installation of air defense systems of these countries. A linden drawn by the ears that the SOU from the BUK were brought to the militia to repel the assault strikes? Excuse me, but as a person who served in the division of BUKs I laugh in your face laughing
      1. Pete mitchell 12 January 2020 02: 29 New
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        Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
        as a man who served in the division of BUK

        hi Then if you allow the question: what is the probability of knocking down 777 at a speed of 0,82 and an altitude of 9k with only one JMA from the BUK? This is far from the possibilities of the whole complex
        1. Alexander Seklitsky 12 January 2020 10: 36 New
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          JMA itself can overwhelm a beech. Having either external target designation from the radar or knowing a clear route of the aircraft and its level. Since the viewing angle of the onboard SDA is small and covers only a small sector in the horizon. The self-propelled guns are only part of the complex and are not designed to operate autonomously. Therefore, the version that the self-propelled guns were fitted up to militia to repel attacks is not stand up to criticism. For these purposes, they would fit the TOP or Shell
          1. Pete mitchell 12 January 2020 12: 02 New
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            If simple: then the target must be brought out into a rather narrow area of ​​space, so that the interception is
            1. Alexander Seklitsky 12 January 2020 12: 07 New
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              Absolutely.
          2. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 12 January 2020 17: 52 New
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            Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
            JMA is only part of the complex and is not intended for autonomous operation.
            Here at 4:05 they say what is intended:
            1. Alexander Seklitsky 13 January 2020 06: 05 New
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              Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
              Here at 4:05 they say what is intended:

              They say that it can work autonomously, but is not intended for this. Even in the story, the videos talk about it. The coverage area of ​​one radar station is 120 degrees. It is not suitable for circular reflection of attacks. For work, it needs a ROM for reloading and for volley with two missiles. Well, for constant combat work, another diesel generator set
              1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 13 January 2020 06: 26 New
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                I assume that if the installation has an offline mode (outside the complex) with the function of searching for targets, it is unlikely that it was added simply for the sake of fun and with the realization that it is practically impossible to use it in combat conditions.
              2. Alexander Seklitsky 14 January 2020 05: 04 New
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                In combat conditions, no one will use the sow on its own. This is not a combat unit. A combat unit is a battery. 2 SOU 1 ROM under the command of an officer.
                Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
                with the goal search function,
                A radar on a JMA is not for searching for targets, but for highlighting a target for a missile. The algorithm of action is this: SOC detects targets and gives an indication of the desired sector for the JMA. The SOU takes the target for escort and decides on the attack. An attack can be either a single missile or a salvo using ROM as a launch pad
              3. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 14 January 2020 05: 50 New
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                Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
                The radar on the JMA is not for finding targets, but for highlighting targets for missiles.
                The 9C35 radar has a target search mode. It is a fact.

                Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
                In combat, no one will use the sow on its own. This is not a combat unit.
                "Nobody will be" - this is your opinion. The presence of an autonomous operation mode provided by the developers for the JMA is a fact.
              4. Alexander Seklitsky 14 January 2020 06: 23 New
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                Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
                The 9C35 radar has a target search mode. It is a fact.
                Search for targets in the 120 degree sector. There is no round-robin view. This is a fact.
                Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
                "Nobody will be" - this is your opinion.

                This is not my opinion. This is a practice of application. Do not write nonsense if you did not have the slightest relation to air defense and the army as a whole, and all your knowledge is based on a video from the TV channel Star. I have no desire to explain the truth to NUB. One tank can also fight autonomously, but not for long and with dubious effectiveness. For without infantry and reconnaissance it will be quickly destroyed. The situation is the same with a single self-propelled firing system. This is not the installation that is designed to cover troops on the march. Firstly, it moves without missiles. Missiles are placed on guides after deployment. Secondly, I repeat, the viewing sector is limited. This means that there is almost no sense in it when attacking the enemy. Third, after firing four missiles, reloading is needed. Have you ever seen a branch in itself? No, it is part of the battery under the command of an officer. Yes, the JMA can operate autonomously, but at the same time carry out a very narrow range of tasks for a limited time. Let’s say they instructed her to control a certain sector for an hour, she will control it.
              5. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 14 January 2020 07: 02 New
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                Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
                Yes, the JMA can operate autonomously, but at the same time carry out a very narrow range of tasks for a limited time. Let’s say that they instructed her to control a certain sector for an hour, she will control it.
                Yes, this is a reasonable conclusion, we agreed with this.

                The next step - you believe that no one will do this, because it is impractical. The problem with this reasoning is that you are trying to draw universal conclusions from your logic, like "nobody will"But in order to draw such conclusions, an implicit assumption is necessary that each and every other person has the same experience as you, with the same knowledge as you, pursues the same goals as you, argues in the same way that and you.This is an incredibly strong assumption, and, frankly, I believe that it is not true.
              6. Alexander Seklitsky 14 January 2020 10: 29 New
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                And let's do without puns. Summing up, I’ll say that the version that the self-propelled guns from the BUK M1 air defense system were brought in to repel the APU assault attacks does not stand up to criticism, and only the last layman can believe in it. The reasons why this is so I painted above. I will not repeat
              7. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 14 January 2020 10: 42 New
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                Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
                And let's do without puns.
                My previous post is quite logically correct. Can you indicate a logical error in it?
  • victor50 11 January 2020 11: 27 New
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    Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
    Boeing 777 crashes over Donbass - everyone denies blame - USA says that their satellite detected the launch of missiles from the territory under the control of militias - (???)

    And with us: either a missile launched by the APU, then a Su-25, or someone will admit to something. Who came up with the Su-25 to drag ?! If we did not shoot down, then this Su-25 will still be seriously used against us. He resets the clear conclusions of the specialists of Almaz-Antey.
  • audigamma 11 January 2020 13: 10 New
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    I’ll remind you personally. Iraq has weapons of mass destruction. AND?????????
  • anykin 11 January 2020 09: 56 New
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    Quote: viking1703
    western versions of downed planes are more truthful

    Russian television star Michael Bom has long ceased to refer to the Western media as the truth) And he had such a crown))
    1. atalef 11 January 2020 10: 42 New
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      Quote: anykin
      Russian television star Michael Bom has long ceased to refer to the Western media as the truth) And he had such a crown))

      Citizenship had to be obtained (Russian)
      wink
      You still say that there are independent experts on Russian television wink
      1. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 22: 43 New
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        You still say that there are independent experts on Russian television

        Exactly as many independent experts as in the USA, Great Britain, France, Germany and Israel. And they’ll be taken off the air if the girl says that it was not Russia who attacked ... lol
  • CYM
    CYM 11 January 2020 11: 39 New
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    In these "true" versions, there are still no testimonies of dispatchers who sent a Boeing over a war zone using air defense. In addition, Ukraine insists that the DPR has its territory, and if so, no matter who shot down and what shot down, the Boeing and its passengers were under the jurisdiction of Ukraine.
    1. Nyrobsky 11 January 2020 13: 05 New
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      Quote: CYM
      In these "true" versions, there are still no testimonies of dispatchers who sent a Boeing over a war zone using air defense.

      No one already knows where these dispatchers are missing. There is a strong understanding that they have already been strangled by the handles of the SBU under the control of the CIA.
  • freejack 11 January 2020 11: 50 New
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    maybe Ukraine shot down, and maybe the DNI

    How did your language turn? The downed Boeing in the sky of the outskirts and the downed Boeing in the sky of Iran are two completely different stories ....
    They only have the word "Boeing" and innocent victims .... blessed memory of them! Amen! sad
  • prodd 11 January 2020 08: 07 New
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    Russia also admits that it shot down mn17. It just takes time. All the evidence for this. And I will get minuses again, as in the case with the comments that Iran shot down the Ukrainian.
    1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 22 New
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      Quote: prodd
      All the evidence for this.

      Where is the main thing?
      Here it was immediately found.
      This conclusion was made by American intelligence, having studied satellite images and the circumstances of the crash of the aircraft.

      Why so far they have not published this "evidence"? After all, if the fault of the Russian Federation is what is expected?
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. YOUR 11 January 2020 08: 39 New
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          Quote: prodd
          The Dutch identified the rocket launch point, showed photos of the inversion track with reference to the terrain, showed numerous photos of the video of transporting the beech. The Americans said that infrared satellites saw a rocket launch from under the snow

          I have not read such nonsense. But when everything happens for the first time.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. Abbot 11 January 2020 10: 07 New
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              Firstly, many have read the report, and not you alone. Secondly, the report is not based on objective monitoring data, or on the testimony of dispatchers, nor on satellite reconnaissance data, nor on the identification data of rocket fragments found at the crash site. Thirdly, the allegations were made long before the publication of the report. Fourth, others have reasonable doubts about your adequate perception of the text of the report. Well, and finally, if you have analogies, then the Ukrainian state and the Armed Forces are primarily responsible for the crash of flight MH17 in the airspace of Ukraine. They also had to conduct an investigation with the involvement of interested parties, as Iran did.
              1. The comment was deleted.
                1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 13: 15 New
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                  Quote: prodd
                  What are the data of objective control? From my Russian Federation?

                  No. From APU.
                  As they still believe that the Boeing brought down Su 25, they did not make other statements.

                  Again a lie.
                  By the serial number of the rocket, published by the way by the Dutch, it was found out that this rocket was transferred to Ukraine 30 years ago.
                  Whose American space scan data? So they said where the air defense system was fired from.

                  Lying again. They said that there is evidence, it is not clear what, but they will not show it.
        2. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 40 New
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          Quote: prodd
          The Dutch identified the rocket launch point, showed a photo of the inversion trail with reference to the terrain

          But they did not show whose Buk shot. Or is it possible to determine “nationality” from the inversion trace?
          showed numerous photos of video transportation of beech.

          Taken from social networks and recognized as fakes laughing
          The Americans said that infrared satellites saw a rocket launch from under the snow.

          Apparently you forgot their famous phrase, "We have evidence, but we will not show them to you"?" laughing
          To all this, the Russians showed a copy of the magazine, which says that the rocket found was sent 30 years ago to Ukraine.

          Well, firstly, not a magazine, but magazines, and secondly, what can we talk about if such a missile was on the territory of Ukraine? request
          And why then were the shots of the rocket engine with its number gone?
          Well, then, what did the air defense of Ukraine do in the combat zone?
          Does LDNR have an air force?
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 04 New
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              AN 26 shot down from MANPADS in general .. miracle you are a man ....
              1. The comment was deleted.
                1. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 20 New
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                  +14
                  did you see him this drushlag? or just photos and statements of the general staff of the ukroarmi? so better be quiet, get off smart ... or else you’ll start drawing parallels from the time of the king of peas and posing as all this truth ..
            2. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 09: 07 New
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              Quote: prodd
              What evidence should the Americans show? Rocket launch?

              What do they have. They themselves said that they are, but they will not show.
              Nobody pulled their tongue
              What you need ?

              Nothing for me.
              But this seems to you enough
              showed a photo of the inversion trace

              The Dutch were apparently sitting in the bushes? laughing
              Ukraine’s air defense, I think exactly like Russian air defense, is always in the zone of operation of ground forces, especially given the fact that Russia has overcome the Crimea with the help of the armed forces.

              What does Crimea have to do with it? belay
              And the air defense is there, where there is a threat of air force use. I’ll ask again, does LDP have IT?
              and Russian channels rejoiced at the downing of a Boeing.

              After such a Nonsense I will not say the words TO YOU anymore !!!!
        3. The comment was deleted.
        4. Alexander Seklitsky 11 January 2020 10: 31 New
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          Tell me, did Russia bring the beech to the DNI so that the Boeing would fill up? However, with logic you don’t have any
        5. Olgovich 11 January 2020 10: 41 New
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          +2
          Quote: prodd
          showed a photo of the inversion trace with reference to the terrain,

          Diamond -Antey convincingly showed -From where they fired UK.ry
          Quote: prodd
          showed numerous photos of video transportation of beech

          Into their tube and into there, yes.
          Quote: prodd
          . The Americans said that infrared satellites saw a rocket launch from under the snow

          They showed a test tube with WMD from the UN rostrum, if they forgot.
          Quote: prodd
          To all this, the Russians showed a copy of the magazine, which says that the rocket found was sent 30 years ago to Ukraine.

          It was this missile that was presented by the Dutch themselves, as if it had shot down a Boeing.
          And she is UKR.
      2. GenNick 11 January 2020 09: 11 New
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        Good day, Lipchanin ...
        1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 09: 59 New
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          Not really...
          But FSE is equally nice hi
    2. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 03 New
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      admit that you have problems, it will be better
    3. lopvlad 11 January 2020 09: 12 New
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      Quote: prodd
      Russia also admits that it shot down mn17


      Russia Kozyrev and Yeltsin ended in the 90s and its adherents had only to remember those "golden" times for them on the echo of the matzah and in the temples of the Yeltsin centers.
    4. Barmaleyka 11 January 2020 10: 09 New
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      +5
      Quote: prodd
      All the evidence for this.

      bring at least one
    5. Olgovich 11 January 2020 10: 20 New
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      +1
      Quote: prodd
      Russia also admits that it shot down mn17. It just takes time. All the evidence for this.

      Never. For it was not.
      Like evidence-NO. No one.
    6. victor50 11 January 2020 11: 31 New
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      +1
      Quote: prodd
      Russia also admits that it shot down mn17.

      May be. But in any case, Ukraine is primarily to blame - there was no ban on flights! Although the whole world turns a blind eye to this fact. If ours - then shot down by mistake. But if Ukraine is consciously, vilely!
    7. cradle 11 January 2020 11: 42 New
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      honestly minus did not set. I think this is superfluous.
  • Evgeny Goncharov (smoogg) 11 January 2020 08: 11 New
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    Here it is - the face of a cheer patriot. Even savages from Iran found the courage to admit a mistake, and this pilot MH-17 still knocks down a pilot Voloshin. God's dew.
    1. NKT
      NKT 11 January 2020 08: 58 New
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      +16
      Voloshin was eliminated so as not to blurt out. And the wild country 404 did not admit that the Tu-154 failed and the Boeing 777, such is it, you are right.
    2. RUSS 11 January 2020 09: 31 New
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      Quote: Evgeny Goncharov (smoogg)
      Here it is - the face of a cheer patriot. Even savages from Iran found the courage to admit a mistake, and this pilot MH-17 still knocks down a pilot Voloshin. God's dew.

      How real convicts go to the full negative, therefore, we are treated abroad as gopniks, gopniks at the state level
      1. Barmaleyka 11 January 2020 10: 10 New
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        +11
        comparing your country with convicts is cool
        Isn’t living disgusting?
      2. Olgovich 11 January 2020 10: 47 New
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        Quote: RUSS
        How real convicts go to full negatives, so to us abroad attitude towards gopniks, gopniks at the state level

        this "abroad" killed a MILLION people in Iraq on the basis of a ..... false test tube.
        He bombed Libya into the Stone Age, for no reason.
        He nurtured al-Qaeda and ISIS-to the West they were not there.
        Etc.

        And ALL the West denies.

        So WHO is a gopnik?
        1. RUSS 11 January 2020 12: 48 New
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          Quote: Olgovich
          So WHO is a gopnik?

          Of course, everyone somehow violates international law, but the "gopnik" does everything quietly, and the gangster West and the USA openly
          1. Olgovich 12 January 2020 11: 07 New
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            Quote: RUSS
            Of course, everyone in one way or another violates international law, BUT "gopnik" doing everything quietly, and gangster West and US Open

            Do not gangsters talk about gopnik.
      3. cradle 11 January 2020 11: 46 New
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        do not drag us to you.
      4. Prosha 11 January 2020 18: 29 New
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        You are treated abroad as traitors who do not cost anything to turn to where it is profitable in any awesome case!
    3. CYM
      CYM 12 January 2020 01: 00 New
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      These "savages" built stone palaces when we Slavs still lived in dugouts. They admitted that they shot down a plane in their airspace. But savages from dill are guilty of blaming the downed aircraft in their airspace with all their might for the neighbor. By the way, there is a very convincing version that the MH-17 wasn’t shot down at all, but there was still an explosion inside the aircraft: the bodies of the pilots were intact and without traces of damaging elements, the air duct from the middle of the cabin was burned from the inside, and the sensors in the tail of the aircraft instantly turned off. And if the explosion was inside then this is a jamb of the Dutch, then they jump out of their pants proving the version with a rocket.
  • Karaul73 11 January 2020 08: 31 New
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    This Russia must do something! At the top they know what. True, though in decades to become known.
    1. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 05 New
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      They pulled out pan-devilish devils .... oh, pulled them out .. well, okay .. drop on the fan, maybe it will make you feel better
    2. victor50 11 January 2020 11: 34 New
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      +2
      Quote: Sentry73
      This Russia must do something! At the top they know what. True, though in decades to become known.

      Well yes? How about Korean Boeing? I missed something - the USA admitted to the provocation ?! lol
    3. cradle 11 January 2020 11: 47 New
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      +1
      Of course, claims on the country 404 will become and fly.
  • Chaldon48 11 January 2020 08: 33 New
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    It is unlikely that Ukraine will admit it, it takes an example from its best friend the United States, they also did not want to apologize when their rocket taking off from an American destroyer shot down a passenger plane.
    1. Evgeny Goncharov (smoogg) 11 January 2020 08: 36 New
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      The United States acknowledged its responsibility in less than a day.
      1. Chaldon48 13 January 2020 18: 44 New
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        However, the US President categorically refused to apologize to the injured party.
  • max702 11 January 2020 10: 07 New
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    Quote: Flame
    Should the outskirts also recognize the downed Boeing and apologize to Russia?

    Until then, they didn’t admit that they shot down the TU-154 .. And they didn’t recognize the Siberia Airlines (so as not to pay the victims) before Israel they recognized everything and paid it right .. They recognize the Boeing yeah .. Although looking at this tragedy, you need to think about karma ..
  • venik 11 January 2020 10: 18 New
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    Quote: Flame
    Should the outskirts also recognize the downed Boeing and apologize to Russia?

    =======
    Actually, first of all, in front of Malaysia, the Netherlands and other countries whose citizens died. And before Russia-for slander!
  • The popuas 11 January 2020 10: 31 New
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    Before Malaysia ... request Russia in general, not in business ...
  • Olis 11 January 2020 10: 48 New
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    Ukrainian pilot of the SU-25 attack aircraft Vladislav Voloshin who shot down a Boeing 777 of flight MH-17 committed suicide!
    Ukraine got out again, and Raziyushka will have to answer .. Already tears are pouring into my eyes
    when I watch Dmiriy Kisilev.
  • Osya Bender 11 January 2020 11: 00 New
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    +4
    Something is not heard of the cheerful banter of the pan-leggings about the death of his plane, or he, and the French freaks from the "Charlie EDPO", can you mock only the Russians who died in the crash?
    1. Olis 11 January 2020 11: 04 New
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      Zadorov died and there was no one to joke about “the plane crashed because it was heavier than air”.
  • KrokodilGena 11 January 2020 15: 23 New
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    Quote: Flame
    Should the outskirts also recognize the downed Boeing and apologize to Russia?

    And to admit, all three of the most truthful versions of MO, General Staff and the Kremlin? After all, a Boeing over Ukraine shot down the Mig-29, along with the Su-25, with the help of the dispatcher Carlos, who quietly dragged Buk there .. I advise once again to read the comments of the "patriots" who, along with the zombies, poured tons of emoticons of nonsense and bullshit, instead of to follow the investigation. I really don’t know, but the Iranian trolls also tore their ass in the open and no, did they justify those responsible for the downed Boeing over the Donbass?
  • mmaxx 11 January 2020 17: 34 New
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    After the obvious Tu-154 over the Black Sea, no one ever forced this Ukraine to recognize this incident. And Boeing will never be recognized. The essence of Bandera is this.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • 1976AG 12 January 2020 07: 51 New
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    Quote: Flame
    Should the outskirts also recognize the downed Boeing and apologize to Russia?

    They have not yet apologized for the plane shot down during the exercises during the time of Kuchma.
  • Basil50 11 January 2020 08: 02 New
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    Iranians are no less * stubborn * than Ukrainians.
    Remember how the Ukrainians shot down a RUSSIAN airplane and still lie a lot of things about that event.
    What are the Iranians once confessed to? Usually they do not recognize even the obvious.
    Apparently there are reasons. AND?
    1. Lipchanin 11 January 2020 08: 23 New
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      Quote: Vasily50
      Remember how the Ukrainians shot down a RUSSIAN airplane and still lie a lot of things about that event.

      But quiet compensation was paid to all but citizens of the Russian Federation
      1. Moon 11 January 2020 09: 05 New
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        Quote: Lipchanin
        But quiet compensation was paid to all but citizens of the Russian Federation

        to all the relatives of the victims. Without a difference of nationality
        Refused to Russian companies.
        Information is available
        Ukraine in 2003 signed intergovernmental agreements with Russia and Israel on compensation for the relatives of those killed in a plane crash without legal admission of guilt. In accordance with these agreements, Ukraine paid 200 thousand US dollars for each victim - 7,8 million dollars to Russia and 7,5 million dollars to Israel
        In accordance with the Claims Settlement Agreement signed by Russia and Ukraine on December 26, 2003, the Ukrainian government transferred $ 7 to pay relatives of the deceased Russian passengers. Compensation was paid ex gratia, that is, without recognition of legal liability. Relatives of Israeli passengers were paid $ 809 million

        similarly the US paid the Iranians
        300 dollars for each able-bodied victim and 000 for each dependent
    2. Kamikadze19 11 January 2020 08: 24 New
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      +7
      And the point is to deny? All the same, black boxes would show everything. And what will it be for the Iranians? Absolutely nothing. They have already said that this is due to US adventurism. They will pay compensation to relatives and all. And to deny stupidly they only spite worse with 100% evidence
      1. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 30 New
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        -31
        Quote: Kamikadze19
        And the point is to deny?

        A type recognized immediately and did not know that shot down?
      2. NKT
        NKT 11 January 2020 09: 05 New
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        +14
        The Americans paid $ 300 thousand, but refused to pay compensation for the sun. Reagan said there was a defensive need. Well, the "heroes" of the order were given.
      3. Ironcity 11 January 2020 09: 09 New
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        -8
        Normal people understand this, but there are more others who are bending their own version in spite of everything. For example, even after all the Dutch examinations and the Diamond-Antey experiment, the conclusion of the Union of Engineers of Russia still hangs according to which a Boeing over Donbass was shot down by fighter-cannon weapons. If only they had already taken off, the "engineers" would not be dishonored.
      4. Pedrodepackes 11 January 2020 09: 36 New
        • 1
        • 0
        +1
        Quote: Kamikadze19
        And the point is to deny? All the same, black boxes would show everything.

        there is no denying a reason, the investigation (multinational of all involved) began right away, it’s impossible to hide the traces, only I don’t agree with the black boxes, on the Malaysian Boeing there’s just a telemetry break and no evidence of a missile hit, here, I think, the same way.
    3. RussianRoulette 11 January 2020 09: 10 New
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      -7
      Undisputed proofs mattresses they probably brought.
    4. Doctor 11 January 2020 13: 04 New
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      0
      Apparently there are reasons. AND?


      Many Iranians are among the dead.
  • kjhg 11 January 2020 08: 02 New
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    +3
    Quote: viking1703
    let all yesterday’s commentators who insulted the Dutch, laugh at the Ukrainian versions, etc. they will apologize to them and admit that they were mistaken with their cheers of patriotism.

    They are victims of propaganda. It has been scientifically proven that 93% of people do not use analytical thinking. They do not think and do not analyze what is happening. They have such an opportunity, but they do not use it. Most accept information provided to them by the media and people to whom they have developed trust. He will tell them, for example, Navalny or Makarevich the truth about some event, and Soloviev or Kiselev will say that this is not so, that they are lying. Who will most believe? Of course to the propagandists. After all, they have already been laced with brains who can be trusted and who not. Now this majority is ready to believe and believes even the most obvious lies. This is used to the fullest by the authorities.
    1. Stas157 11 January 2020 08: 47 New
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      +3
      About the adequacy. The site’s floor, self-confidently, was screaming that the United States had overwhelmed the plane and completely dismissed that the Iranians did it. Today's news shows what your opinions really are.

      Already a new urya is heard, they say, which Iranians are well done that they admitted ... But they did not immediately admit it, but under pressure. At first, these "fellows" denied everything. But for some reason this is overlooked.
      1. kjhg 11 January 2020 08: 55 New
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        • 10
        +1
        Quote: Stas157
        Almost the entire site, quite confidently, screamed that the United States had overwhelmed the plane. Today's news shows what your opinions really are.

        I didn’t scream like that. Quite the contrary, I wrote, it is strange that, the first: the time of the fall falls several hours after the murder of Suleimani; second: the aircraft is almost new and reliable; third and most important: the Iranians claimed that there was no connection with the plane. And it is near the airport right after take-off! In the fall frames, it is clear that the plane did not collapse in the air, but decreased at an angle, i.e. fell smoothly enough.
        1. Stas157 11 January 2020 09: 00 New
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          +5
          Of course, I didn’t mean you. hi On the contrary, I agree with your opinion.
        2. asv363 11 January 2020 10: 52 New
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          +3
          Quote: kjhg
          Quite the contrary, I wrote, it is strange that, the first: the time of the fall falls several hours after the murder of Suleimani;

          The plane crashed on January 3, are you adequate?
    2. lopvlad 11 January 2020 09: 23 New
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      • 19
      -3
      Quote: kjhg
      It has been scientifically proven that 93% of people do not use analytical thinking. They do not think and do not analyze what is happening. They have such an opportunity, but they do not use it. Most accept information provided to them by the media and people to whom they have developed trust.


      it only seems to you. In reality, it is precisely 93% who use analytical thinking and therefore in Russia the president is not the boy Alyosha trained with money from the State Department but uncle Volodya from Leningrad.
      1. valeryb 11 January 2020 10: 58 New
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        -6
        Quote: lopvlad
        In reality, 93% use analytical thinking
        Whose? Well mikhanov, mikhanov is, and what to do?
      2. prodd 11 January 2020 13: 01 New
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        And as a result?
    3. Moskovit 11 January 2020 10: 27 New
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      +6
      It’s good that they still didn’t name the victims of abortions. I am always pleased with people, there are especially many of them in the liberal democratic camp, who, when they disagree with their point of view, immediately write down their opponents in duped zombies.
  • Edik 11 January 2020 08: 13 New
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    +8
    Quote: viking1703
    all right. let all yesterday’s commentators who insulted the Dutch, laugh at the Ukrainian versions, etc. apologize to them and admit that they were wrong

    I didn’t see anyone laughing at this yesterday! My version was that this was another provocation of the USA! Repent? Do not wait!
    1. viking1703 11 January 2020 08: 22 New
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      just enough usa to attract ears everywhere. they are not so omnipotent!
      1. Edik 11 January 2020 08: 31 New
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        +13
        Quote: viking1703
        just enough usa to attract ears everywhere. they are not so omnipotent!

        Well, yes! The sanctions have been imposed on everyone and the lawlessness in the world! How many countries have they destroyed? And the provocation is their calling card! And Trump's GDP personally brought to power!
        1. RUSS 11 January 2020 09: 35 New
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          -27
          Quote: Edik
          Well, yes, sanctions have been imposed on everyone and may be lawless in the world

          Well, enter retaliatory sanctions, and about lawlessness, so, and how are we different? PMC Wagner, Squeaked, Crimea, DNR, LC, etc.
          1. cradle 11 January 2020 11: 51 New
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            you can not understand
        2. valeryb 11 January 2020 11: 00 New
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          -8
          Quote: Edik
          Well, yes! The sanctions have been imposed on everyone and the lawlessness in the world! How many countries have they destroyed? And the provocation is their calling card! And Trump's GDP personally brought to power!
          It sounds like oh oh oh, give you a handkerchief?
      2. Olgovich 11 January 2020 10: 59 New
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        +5
        Quote: viking1703
        just enough usa to attract ears everywhere. they are not so omnipotent!

        If they had not killed Suleymani, the passengers of the plane would have been alive.

        Hope this is not in dispute?

        If they hadn’t sung to Iraq (by test tube), there would have lived 1 million more people, there would have been 2 million more Christians and there would have been no ISIS. Also obvious, I think.
    2. Kamikadze19 11 January 2020 08: 25 New
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      +20
      So in essence this is the provocation of the United States. If they hadn’t killed Suleimani, the Ukrainian letak would have been safe
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. Edik 11 January 2020 08: 46 New
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          -8
          Quote: viking1703
          It turns out Strelkov's provocation led to the downing of a Boeing.

          To the thousands of dead Russians and the crushing of Ukraine!
        2. NKT
          NKT 11 January 2020 09: 08 New
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          +20
          The coup in Ukraine is the beginning of all beginnings. Claims to the seller of cookies.
          1. RUSS 11 January 2020 09: 36 New
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            Quote: NKT
            The coup in Ukraine is the beginning of all beginnings. Claims to the seller of cookies.

            If not for cookies, you will not see Crimea
            1. Yves762 11 January 2020 10: 03 New
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              +5
              Quote: RUSS
              If not for cookies, you will not see Crimea

              If it weren’t for the cookies, Crimea wouldn’t have needed .... "to see." tongue
        3. lopvlad 11 January 2020 09: 32 New
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          • 2
          +11
          Quote: viking1703
          the shooters wouldn’t start seizing the Donbass cities and there wouldn’t be a downed Boeing in the Donbass. So by the lice of logic.


          there would be no coup in Kiev and no one would have heard of any rifle.
          A normal country during military operations closes this area for civil aviation flights, while an abnormal country does not provide dispatcher data, black box data, pilot talks, etc. for all to see.
          1. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 34 New
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            -18
            Quote: lopvlad
            there would be no coup in Kiev and no one would have heard of any rifle

            if Lenin had not given these territories to Ukraine, it would not have happened.
            Lenia with ... is to blame.
            And Stalin, by the way, is the same.
            Quote: lopvlad
            A normal country during military operations closes this area for civil aviation flights and an abnormal provides

            beeches are at the disposal of the militias.
            1. Alexander Seklitsky 11 January 2020 10: 39 New
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              +9
              Quote: atalef
              beeches are at the disposal of the militias.

              And when was Russia transferred to the DNU BUK complex? For what purpose? We would like to cover the DNI army, we would fit a couple of Tunguska or shell.
              1. The comment was deleted.
                1. Alexander Seklitsky 12 January 2020 10: 23 New
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                  +1
                  If you were even more competent than a full kettle, you would know that the JMA alone is never used and is only an integral part of the BUK complex.
            2. edmed 11 January 2020 10: 47 New
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              • 0
              +4
              Quote: atalef
              if Lenin had not given these territories to Ukraine, it would not have happened.
              Lenia with ... is to blame.
              And Stalin, by the way, is the same.

              Dinosaurs are to blame for everything, wouldn’t measure out, then
              Quote: atalef
              would not have happened.
              recourse
            3. lopvlad 11 January 2020 23: 53 New
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              +3
              Quote: atalef
              beeches are at the disposal of the militias.


              Apparently the very ones who can remotely shoot a rocket standing in the arsenal of beech trees located in the Lviv region. Even the Dutch investigators on this occasion realized that they managed the rocket to the fullest and you still twist the barrel organ.
        4. Olgovich 11 January 2020 11: 00 New
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          +4
          Quote: viking1703
          Well, that means that the shooters would not have taken the capture of the Donbass cities and there would have been no downed Boeing in the Donbass. So by the lice of logic. It turns out Strelkov's provocation led to the downing of a Boeing.

          There would be no fascist coup in Kiev in February 2014, there would be no Donbass.

          There would be no desire of local residents, no girkin would not last a day. how many DIVISIONS he brought to "capture" dozens of cities. and?

          Obviously not?
      2. lopvlad 11 January 2020 09: 26 New
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        Quote: Kamikadze19
        so the ukrainian letak would be intact


        once again, for the lawlessness of the United States paid their allies, whose citizens on the plane were more than half.
  • carstorm 11 11 January 2020 08: 14 New
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    +18
    they have a right. it’s the same as in that saying, the spoons were found and ... we have already been taught not to believe all these statements. Iran acted courageously and admitted the mistake after a few days. recall the decision of the Ukrainian court that it has not been proved that their rocket shot down that 154 over the Black Sea? already in 2011 by the way. or what kind of circus was it, then the missiles were without warheads at launches, is it still all nonsense? this is an instinct not to believe anything they say
    1. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 31 New
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      -15
      Quote: carstorm 11
      Iran acted courageously and admitted the mistake after a few days.

      When I realized that there’s nowhere to go.
      1. carstorm 11 11 January 2020 09: 12 New
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        +11
        Yes, I beg you. would include a fool and so many years understood. this is Iran and not Europe. they have nowhere to go, yeah. I’ll repeat the European 404 to you by the decision of my court, closed the criminal case for the crash of that 154 because they couldn’t prove that they were their missiles. They haven’t even paid compensation for the plane until that if) this bad world and everything is possible in it personally, as for me, the right step.
      2. lopvlad 11 January 2020 09: 37 New
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        • 2
        +12
        Quote: atalef
        When I realized that nowhere to go


        could have hidden the data of black boxes as Ukraine did, which has been lying for more than 5 years, and the West still can’t suck out evidence to accuse Russia, all the courts transfer and transfer.
        They thought they’d hit the rocket, but again the ambush, it turned out that in Russia all the documentation was in place and the rocket was then delivered to Lviv in Western Ukraine where it was in service.
  • svp67 11 January 2020 08: 15 New
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    +15
    Quote: viking1703
    they will apologize to them and admit that they were mistaken with their cheers of patriotism.

    And what to apologize for? Before unproven words. No, then the situation was one, now it is completely different.
    So, if there were no direct insults, NOT ANYTHING FOR ANYTHING.
    All demanded not words, but EVIDENCE.
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      2. Nastia makarova 11 January 2020 08: 36 New
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        +8
        again the trolls got out !!!
        1. RUSS 11 January 2020 09: 38 New
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          -15
          Quote: Nastia Makarova
          again the trolls got out !!!

          You have some manic attitude towards bots and trolls, Nastya just understand the simple thing if someone does not agree with you or with the party line, they are not trolls, but simply have their own point of view
      3. svp67 11 January 2020 08: 42 New
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        • 7
        +5
        Quote: viking1703
        they were crowding over the Dutch, they remembered that the grass was legalized and they dreamed of everything, etc., so don’t need la, la.

        And they had the right. Where are those Netherlands and where is Iran. If the first person the state says something, then this should be supported not by words, but by evidence. Let him learn from Poroshenko.
        1. viking1703 11 January 2020 08: 58 New
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          -18
          video of missile hits, photo of part of the rocket, this was enough for everyone except Russian patriots.
          1. svp67 11 January 2020 09: 03 New
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            +11
            Quote: viking1703
            video of missile hits, photo of part of the rocket, this was enough for everyone except Russian patriots.

            Dear, I’ll go out on the street and take off a wrecked car, and put potatoes next to me, and on this basis I will blame you as a Belarusian in this accident. Forgive me, but there is an accepted system of evidence. And these are not just fragments of a rocket lying somewhere. These are fragments of damaging elements and their traces in the corps and bodies of the dead, etc., etc.
          2. lopvlad 12 January 2020 00: 08 New
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            • 1
            +1
            Quote: viking1703
            photo of the rocket part - this was enough for everyone


            with the number that is assigned to the air defense unit located in Western Ukraine.
        2. Bad thing 11 January 2020 09: 11 New
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          -5
          Are you hinting at a piece of the bus?
          1. svp67 11 January 2020 09: 16 New
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            +11
            Quote: Bad
            Are you hinting at a piece of the bus?

            Yes, at least for something, for a piece of the bus, for documents, he tried to present something. And here are just words.
            In this situation, they are few, we need evidence. The Iranians pleaded guilty, even though they turned out to be great fellows, if they had so blundered. But the trouble is, something like that was already there
            Iran Airbus Airbus A300B2-203 airliner operated the IR655 commercial passenger flight en route Tehran — Bandar Abbas — Dubai, but 7 minutes after departure from Bandar Abbas, flying over the Persian Gulf, it was hit by a ground-to-air missile launched from US Navy Vincennes missile cruiser. Killed all 290 people on board - 16 crew members and 274 passengers (including 65 children)
            It was July 3, 1988.
            In general, the US government sees the incident as a military incident and believes that the cruiser’s team acted in accordance with current circumstances. Later, the cruiser commander was awarded the Legion of Honor order for his successful service from 1987 to 1989.
            Let me remind you that there was no war between the USA and Iran
            1. Bad thing 11 January 2020 09: 25 New
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              +3
              Famous story, Americans then mistook watermelon for attacking F-14
              1. svp67 11 January 2020 09: 32 New
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                +12
                Quote: Bad
                Famous story, Americans then mistook watermelon for attacking F-14

                So the Iranians are now leading a similar argument ... that they say sorry, not for that this unfortunate plane took
    2. Karaul73 11 January 2020 08: 37 New
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      Another follower of IHTAMNET?
      Without clear evidence, you will never admit. Herein lies the difference between a strong power and a weak one.
      1. svp67 11 January 2020 08: 44 New
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        +19
        Quote: Sentry73
        Another follower of IHTAMNET?

        And as I understand it, are you the next follower who didn’t recognize obvious things even with evidence, such as the destruction of a Siberia Airlines plane?
        And at the expense of IHTAMNET, so we take an example from you. How many of your IHTAMNETS have run around the Caucasus mountains since the mid-90s, do not tell?
      2. borberd 11 January 2020 19: 21 New
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        +1
        Practice shows that with obvious evidence they fall into the negative. All of these - ichtamnet, etonemes, vysoverit, created the image of their country as constantly lying. And even if they someday will tell the truth, nobody will just believe them, as in that parable about the boy shepherd and wolves.
  • Rostovchanin 11 January 2020 08: 17 New
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    +9
    Where Americans appear - they knock down civilian sides ... this is not a coincidence, this is a trend ...
    1. littoral 11 January 2020 08: 47 New
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      -25
      Quote: Rostovchanin
      Where Americans appear - they knock down civilian sides ... this is not a coincidence, this is a trend ...

      I wanted the dude of “pluses” to cut down easily and then - on you!
      1. svp67 11 January 2020 08: 54 New
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        +12
        Quote: littoral
        I wanted the dude of “pluses” to cut down easily and then - on you!

        And what are the Americans so “white and fluffy” in this story? You have a strange logic
        1. Rostovchanin 11 January 2020 08: 59 New
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          +12
          Do not feed the troll, it is useless to prove the connection, it will only increase the speed of the fan.
          1. dmmyak40 11 January 2020 22: 59 New
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            +2
            And let's feed the troll, add the fan to the maximum. What if it burns down ?!
  • mig29mks 11 January 2020 08: 21 New
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    +2
    Apologize to whom? Before the Ukrainians, traitors to the blood. You need a liberal that the Russians always apologize to everyone.
    1. viking1703 11 January 2020 08: 29 New
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      -19
      what traitors? everywhere traitors and spies seem to you. It is an independent state and goes its own way. what difference does it make to you? you put things in order in Russia. You drag in liberals, what does it have to do with it. Liberals are to blame for the mess going on in Russia? What increase the retirement age, as in Belarus? Stop blaming the liberals and the State Department for everything. This is silly.
      1. Edik 11 January 2020 08: 56 New
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        +2
        Quote: viking1703
        you put things in order in Russia. You drag in liberals, what does it have to do with it. Liberals are to blame for the mess going on in Russia? What increase the retirement age, as in Belarus? Stop blaming liberals and the State Department for everything

        You’re defenders of the United States all whining that the standard of living in Russia has fallen! But it’s somehow not reaching you that it has fallen because of Western sanctions and our efforts to import substitution and the wounding of the ruble! Scream further, I don’t feel sorry for you! have, and they still protect them fool
        1. viking1703 11 January 2020 09: 16 New
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          -10
          where did I defend the usa ????? I wrote about what is enough everywhere where failed or failures in the economy and social life to blame the United States. you need to be able to admit your mistakes as courageous Iranians, so it seems now everyone has started talking?
          1. mig29mks 11 January 2020 09: 49 New
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            Now, and Russia, suggest that you do not recognize as courageous Iranians?
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 09 New
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        +2
        Hey ... come on, you better go through the bulb in the cellar for sowing, time is flying fast spring will come ...
        1. GenNick 11 January 2020 09: 55 New
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          -5
          And that’s true ... Paid pagdyazhu. An hour a little bit lazytsko-soon know tsytsu treba davats budzhe ...
    2. RUSS 11 January 2020 09: 39 New
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      -24
      Quote: mig29mks
      You need a liberal that the Russians always apologize to everyone.

      There are no liberals in this forum
  • Aliken 11 January 2020 08: 33 New
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    +19
    There is nothing to apologize for. They themselves said "highly likly". And when the Iranians finished the investigation, then they announced the truth.
  • qQQQ 11 January 2020 08: 43 New
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    -11
    Quote: viking1703
    that they were mistaken with their cheers of patriotism.

    Moreover, at the request to refute the version about the operation of air defense, only cons. It’s bad that modern education only allows shouting Hurray.
    1. Karaul73 12 January 2020 19: 17 New
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      When they stick a pin in one place, then they will scream URA. More these duped can not do anything.
  • maidan.izrailovich 11 January 2020 08: 58 New
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    +11
    ... laughed at Ukrainian versions, etc. apologize to them ...

    Having shot down a Russian civilian plane over the Black Sea, by the way, by accident, Ukraine not only did not apologize, but even refused to admit its guilt.
    ... who insulted the Dutch .....

    Official Netherlands conducting an investigation into a Boeing that was shot down over Ukraine, where many of their own citizens died, contrary to all the facts, they brazenly lie, blaming Russia for this. And we hardly expect an apology from them.
    We certainly condole the families of all the victims. But an apology to demand from the Russians amid such an attitude towards Russia is the height of arrogance.
  • politach-delivery 11 January 2020 09: 21 New
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    -14
    And only silent minuses. Even the head of Iran acted like a man, but not supposedly officers. Hrr-pah.
  • Dur_mod 11 January 2020 09: 39 New
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    -11
    That's for sure, patriots are popular, they just hear the word Ukraine, Ukrainian - the brains are turned off, yesterday they also set minuses for comments
    We got information that one stewardess called my mother with the words - Mom goodbye shelling us ...
  • knn54 11 January 2020 09: 53 New
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    +4
    Something I recalled the case of the Russian IL-20, shot down from behind the fraud by the Israelis.
    Was there a similar situation, only because of the Yankees drone. - after all, TWO rockets were fired.
    GUILTY in the tragedy are those who allowed the departure of the Ukrainian airliner. ALL other carriers carried flights.
    1. valeryb 11 January 2020 11: 18 New
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      -3
      Quote: knn54
      Something I recalled the case of the Russian IL-20, shot down from behind the fraud by the Israelis.
      Overwhelmed by the Syrian calculation, trained by Russian "teachers" from weapons made in Russia under the command of the Russian command and shooting into the white light, like a penny.
    2. Leytenant mahouny 12 January 2020 07: 09 New
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      0
      This is when the Israeli fighter dodged?
  • Piramidon 11 January 2020 11: 03 New
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    +3
    Quote: viking1703
    who insulted the Dutch

    And what, the Dutch, have already completed their "honest" investigation and proved someone's guilt? The sixth year is being "investigated" and no shifts. So far, only falsification and unsubstantiated accusations are coming from them. They should not be offended; they themselves must be judged. negative
  • Vadivak 11 January 2020 11: 09 New
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    0
    Quote: viking1703
    let all yesterday’s commentators who insulted the Dutch, laugh at the Ukrainian versions, etc. apologize to them

    It is unlikely. Worldview will not allow
    Zyablitsev (Eugene) 5 January 8, 2020 08:07

    American plane ... American electronics, American service staff, Ukraine near America - there is access to all bases ... But they will not tell us the truth, but it is very difficult to believe in such coincidences! But Tehran can be blamed for filling up the plane of the American ally, that Russia was involved in this too ... Mass options for American propaganda!
  • Jarserge 11 January 2020 12: 12 New
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    +1
    Apologize to people who have no information expressed politically biased versions? Which highlighted the main thing in their opinion "shot down by a Russian rocket"? And just by chance and unprofessional Iranian air defense guessed? Yes, the question remained where the rocket shot down the Ukrainian Boeing was produced, there is such diversity and foreignness ..... Right now, I apologized.
  • KrokodilGena 11 January 2020 16: 08 New
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    -2
    Quote: viking1703
    let all yesterday’s commentators who insulted the Dutch, laugh at the Ukrainian versions, etc. they will apologize to them and admit that they were mistaken with their cheers of patriotism.

    Look at the minuses to you and the vomit answers, as well as an attempt to plant branches by discussing all kinds of nonsense, hundreds of flood commenters are off topic, just from those who ridiculed the investigation and the most serious versions. Who are you calling to apologize to, a herd of trolls? The Kremlin could take an example from the Iranian leadership and admit a mistake, the destruction of a Boeing over the Donbass, this will have to be done sooner or later, and further denial and dissemination of all lies will only damage the reputation of the country and people, which will have negative consequences. But to propagandists and trolls on such things as reputation, adequacy, decency are alien.
  • Paranoid50 11 January 2020 17: 46 New
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    Quote: viking1703
    that's right

    What horror ... Potato ... Talking ... wassat
  • Leeds 11 January 2020 22: 37 New
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    Quote: viking1703
    all right. let all yesterday’s commentators who insulted the Dutch, laugh at the Ukrainian versions, etc. they will apologize to them and admit that they were mistaken with their cheers of patriotism.

    So VO also did not look comme il faut. In this situation, out of habit, putting a thought that was chewed up with the correct conclusions into our information receivers, yesterday the author used the word “supposedly” about 10 times, chuckling openly at their versions, like overright bullshit. Shamefully interesting? The Canadian journalist after the Super Series from the USSR gobbled up his newspaper in a similar situation. Maybe it’s worth changing the approach to presenting information, stimulating the audience ... sorry for the insolence ... THINK yourself?

    Yes, I turn to the gentlemen:
    Invoice
    Black Padded Jacket
    Edik (saw him, man)
    well, a dozen more affirming
    where is your language today? Can a man admit wrong? Like that journalist.
    Any information requires confirmation, not cliches from those who refuse to think.

    It is sad that Iran so lazhanul, it was very wrong time. Although he could rest against the latter, having cleared everything.

    And yet, now they rejoice over the ocean, but where is the reason for the launch of rockets? Not there in Iraq not so long ago? I hope the little people in the west, wrinkling their foreheads, reach the obvious answer.
    Too bad people, one way or another, and vegetables.
  • kjhg 11 January 2020 07: 57 New
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    What is recognized is a plus to Iran. Now they still have to pay multimillion compensation for the plane and the relatives of the victims.
    All the same, Ukrainians, Americans, and even the Dutch were right, and not most of our commentators.
    1. Nikolay87 11 January 2020 08: 02 New
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      Guessed, but did not know. Call a spade a spade.
      1. bessmertniy 11 January 2020 08: 11 New
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        Sometimes it turns out to be worse than overdoing. recourse
      2. kjhg 11 January 2020 08: 12 New
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        Quote: Nikolay87
        Guessed, but did not know.

        Where did I write that I knew? I wrote that I was right.
        Quote: Nikolay87
        Call a spade a spade.
        That's it!
        1. Nikolay87 11 January 2020 08: 19 New
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          Our "majority" did not work out because we are all sure that Ukrainians, Americans, Dutch are wrong, but that they without evidence argue AGAIN (!). And to deny someone’s conclusion does not mean to agree with the alternative version. How do you know that there are such "majority", statistics you conduct, a survey was conducted? Slyly.
      3. Snail N9 11 January 2020 08: 29 New
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        I can imagine how many millions of dollars will now have to pay Iran to the relatives of the dead foreigners. Just yesterday I wrote about this, recalling that Iran, in a similar situation, demanded and received from the United States millions of compensations to the relatives of the victims who died in the plane crash of flight IR655 ...
        1. NKT
          NKT 11 January 2020 09: 12 New
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          Iran received $ 300 thousand for each plus $ 150 thousand for a dependent. The United States refused to pay for the plane.
          1. Snail N9 11 January 2020 09: 21 New
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            The USA then paid in general millions of dollars of compensation, I think that "universal people" will come to Iran through the UN in full (for Canadians-Ukrainians and other foreigners):
            "On May 17, 1989, Iran filed a lawsuit against the United States with the United Nations International Court of Justice demanding compensation for damages and conviction of the United States for violating international air transport conventions. In February 1996, a settlement agreement was signed between the United States and Iran, after which the case was closed in court Under the terms of the agreement, the United States was supposed to pay compensation in the amount of $ 131,8 million (including $ 61,8 million to the heirs of 248 dead, based on $ 300 for each able-bodied victim and 000 for each dependent), and Iran refused further claims to the United States in connection with this disaster. "
      4. qQQQ 11 January 2020 08: 45 New
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        Quote: Nikolay87
        Guessed, but did not know. Call a spade a spade.

        They put forward a version and cited arguments that no one had denied.
        1. Nikolay87 11 January 2020 09: 03 New
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          Quote: qqqq
          Quote: Nikolay87
          Guessed, but did not know. Call a spade a spade.

          They put forward a version and cited arguments that no one had denied.

          Fortunately, arguments, unlike facts, are not evidence-based. In the civilized world there is a presumption of innocence, i.e. "you are not to blame - until proven otherwise." So, we don’t need them "Highly Like" yes
          1. qQQQ 11 January 2020 12: 34 New
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            Quote: Nikolay87
            Fortunately, arguments, unlike facts, are not evidence-based.

            This is the difference between the version and the charges. I just asked to bring at least one fact of engine fire when the crew could not send a distress signal. Fanaticism is bad, I'm waiting for the cons and not one fact.
    2. Kamikadze19 11 January 2020 08: 27 New
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      I don’t think that some kind of court will make them pay any big money. The volume itself will be determined and paid for letak and the dead
      1. Blackmokona 11 January 2020 08: 40 New
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        Iran, USA managed to oblige to pay a huge pile of money for a downed plane, and even Iran will be much easier to force
  • Alex Justice 11 January 2020 08: 10 New
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    You have to be really strong to admit your mistakes!

    At first they refused, they thought how to hush up the matter.
    1. Kamikadze19 11 January 2020 08: 28 New
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      In the beginning, they understood then admitted. Hush with black boxes will not work
  • smart ass 11 January 2020 08: 14 New
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    I told you that Iran shot down, and you yelled at me and sent to the State Department for salary
    1. qQQQ 11 January 2020 08: 48 New
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      Quote: Clever man
      I told you that Iran shot down, and you yelled at me and sent to the State Department for salary

      And I get hangover., Better for a salary, appreciated higher - it's a shame.
    2. Snail N9 11 January 2020 10: 07 New
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      And what was said yesterday on the Russian media by all sorts of "iksperty" who were ironic in every way about the possibility of defeating the missile launcher! I wonder with what eyes they will say the opposite today?
      1. The comment was deleted.
  • atalef 11 January 2020 08: 27 New
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    Quote: Nikitich
    Iran well done

    Well, yes, a good dancer is always interrupted by a stinger.
    Syrians are great. Iranians are great.
    But everyone is to blame.
  • donMigel 11 January 2020 08: 28 New
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    Quote: Nikitich
    You have to be really strong to admit your mistakes!
    Iran well done ..

    Everything is fine with you about Iran, anyway, you admitted it means you are strong, and you fell into complete ignorance, too. How not to say praise the sacred. Monkeys at the console are a dangerous thing, dear ..
    1. Pytnik 11 January 2020 09: 44 New
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      liberal monkeys look here a bit too much to pop up "not respected"
      1. donMigel 11 January 2020 09: 51 New
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        Quote: Pytnik
        liberal monkeys look here a bit too much to pop up "not respected"

        Switch to personal insults?
        1. Pytnik 11 January 2020 09: 53 New
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          can you arrange a meeting right away? I am for bully angry
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. Mordvin 3 11 January 2020 08: 51 New
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        Quote: atalef
        For example, I do not.

        And who shot down over the Black Sea, are also not sure?
        1. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 54 New
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          Quote: mordvin xnumx
          And who shot down over the Black Sea, are also not sure?

          I do not understand the meaning of the translation of arrows?
          Over the Black Sea, a RUSSIAN passenger plane, flying from Tel Aviv, was shot down.
          Ukraine paid compensation to all affected families.
          Ka5k do you think recognized or not?
          1. Mordvin 3 11 January 2020 09: 00 New
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            Quote: atalef
            Ka5k do you think recognized or not?

            Legally, no, in my opinion.
            1. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 07 New
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              Quote: mordvin xnumx
              Quote: atalef
              Ka5k do you think recognized or not?

              Legally, no, in my opinion.

              I don’t know what you are investing in this thought.
              Compensation paid, recognized the downing of air defense - not recognized legally belay
              What is it like ?
              1. Mordvin 3 11 January 2020 09: 11 New
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                Quote: atalef
                Compensation paid, recognized the downing of air defense - not recognized legally
                What is it like ?

                Reluctance to dig deep, I call the nearest Vika:
                Ukraine in 2003 signed intergovernmental agreements with Russia and Israel on compensation for the relatives of those killed in a plane crash without legal admission of guilt.

                That is, hold the dibs and leave us alone.
          2. Andrey VOV 11 January 2020 09: 12 New
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            Ukraine paid compensations voluntarily only to the citizens of Israel who were on that board, and Kuchma’s statements with a smirk say that this is not a tragedy ... remember, it’s better to be silent, you’ll get off smart
      2. Pytnik 11 January 2020 09: 45 New
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        bulk or dog? I do not recognize you in makeup negative
  • Obi-Wan Kenobi 11 January 2020 08: 28 New
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    The Iranian general staff added that they shot down the plane, because it flew near the IRGC military facility.

    This is what there should be a lack of coordination between civil aviation and air defense !?
    They foolishly missed a rocket and 176 people into the next world ...
    All. I have no words. A curtain.
  • Deniska999 11 January 2020 08: 33 New
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    Iran recognized - well done. I would not recognize - well done too. Our commentators are simply amazing.
    1. Tsoy 11 January 2020 12: 29 New
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      Quote: Deniska999
      Iran recognized - well done. I would not recognize - well done too. Our commentators are simply amazing.


      It’s good that the Russians were not on this plane. Otherwise, it would be impossible to simply bend under the party line ...
  • Catfish 11 January 2020 08: 37 New
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    You have to be really strong to admit your mistakes! Iran well done ..

    And where did they go ?! A plane in Kroshevo, with no internal explosion like that is impossible.
  • RUSS 11 January 2020 09: 18 New
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    Quote: Nikitich
    Iran well done ..

    Well done? 179 people were sent to the other world and are they well done? Well, and the fact that they recognized the fact of the shelling, since otherwise it is.
  • RUSS 11 January 2020 09: 41 New
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    Quote: Nikitich
    Iran well done ..

    And Syria fellows when shot down our IL-20 ????
  • den3080 11 January 2020 09: 59 New
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    Image losses for Iran are huge, even difficult to assess.
    Now they are inflating so that the Ayatollahs may come to an end.
  • Ramzay121 11 January 2020 10: 30 New
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    Quote: Nikitich
    Iran well done ..

    And in what fellows? That they killed innocent people? The Iranians tried to hide, but could not, too much evidence. It was necessary to confuse a civilian plane with a hostile one, and besides, flying out of Tehran airport. The poor were so scared
    1. Vadivak 11 January 2020 10: 48 New
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      Quote: Ramzay121
      The poor were so scared

      Rather, there is a monkey with a grenade, shoot down a plane on takeoff .....
      .
  • Vadivak 11 January 2020 10: 31 New
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    The branch must be closed, everyone discusses the violinists
    1. MrFox 11 January 2020 11: 35 New
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      The work of the trolls, got a team to clog the topic with garbage. Hot topic - fanatics flunk a civilian plane with our complex
  • Shelest2000 11 January 2020 11: 03 New
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    Unlike the 404, which shot down in 2001 our TU-154 (78 dead) over the Black Sea. Until now, 404 has not been officially recognized. Still have not apologized. So far, no compensation has been paid to the relatives of the victims.
    As their then prez spoke out on this occasion, with the face of a heavily drinking tractor driver:
    - Well, shot down. Well, do not make of this tragedy.
  • Ratmir_Ryazan 11 January 2020 11: 04 New
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    Good memory to the victims!
    I am for justice!
    You have to be really strong to admit your mistakes!
    Iran well done ..



    Where is Iran well done ?! For me, all these recent statements are more like a forced admission of guilt, and not their own.

    If it was their air defense that brought down a Boeing, then why didn’t these fellows say so right away ?!

    You can shoot down a civilian aircraft with the transponder turned on only as a result of deliberate actions, since no matter how it deviates from the course, data on the type of aircraft and its course are known, they are constantly transmitted by the automatic transponder. Air defense calculations defending Tehran are well aware that the sky is full of civilian liners. No matter how scared everyone on the basis of the IRGC of a possible US attack, they could not help but see that it was a civilian airliner.

    But those Iranian officials whom the United States trivially recruited and intentionally staged this provocation on the day of Iran’s response to the assassination of Suleimani could order it to be shot down.

    Or the attack on the Boeing was carried out with the help of MANPADS also by militants recruited by the United States. US terrorists in Syria are armed with MANPADS and MANPADS and they could easily arm terrorists in Iran itself.

    Hence the video where someone intentionally shoots the night sky, where supposedly a rocket hits a plane -



    The one who filmed this clearly knew that this would happen and he showed what was needed, without emotions, since there was no surprise for him here.

    And they simply forced us to admit their guilt, they were led to this by massive information pressure.

    Say Iran as it is - that the United States was involved in the downing of a Boeing, it would still look like an excuse, no one would believe it, since there is no evidence of this, even if some Iranian colonel admitted that he ordered the destruction of the Boeing to be how they paid him, in the West, all the same, they would have considered it a lie and all this would have set the world community even more against Iran and would not have saved them from paying compensation.

    Iran chose what would do them the least harm - pleaded guilty that Iran’s air defense shot down a Boeing.
    1. atalef 11 January 2020 11: 12 New
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      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      But those Iranian officials whom the United States trivially recruited and intentionally staged this provocation on the day of Iran’s response to the assassination of Suleimani could order it to be shot down.

      from how it is. laughing

      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      Or the attack on the Boeing was carried out with the help of MANPADS also recruited militants

      of course, they threw the debris of the TOP and yes
      A general comes out on the porch of his house during the day and sees that there the diary is cleaning his tattered general's uniform. “Uncomfortable somehow,” the general thinks. "And the rumor around the city can go on, what our general drinks in vain, but I don’t need it."
      He comes up to the batman and says: "Imagine, my friend, we had an officer meeting yesterday, so there was one second lieutenant, a dog, got drunk, a hundred and a whole uniform parasites me and puke."

      The diary, while continuing to clean his uniform, replies: “I will dare to report to Voystinnu the scoundrel, I dare to report to you, he also did not give a shit to your pants” ...

      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      And they simply forced to admit their guilt

      what your loch.
      They made me, but after all, not at all laughing
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      Say Iran as it is - that the United States was involved in the downing of a Boeing, it would still look like an excuse, no one would believe it, since there is no evidence of this, even if some colonel of Iran admitted that he gave the order to destroy the Boeing as he was paid, in the West, all the same, they would have considered it a lie and all this would have set the world community even more against Iran and would not have saved them from paying compensation.

      Iran chose what would do them the least harm - pleaded guilty that Iran’s air defense shot down a Boeing.

      verily - to you even ... in the eyes - God's dew.
      Level of fool rolls over.
      1. Ratmir_Ryazan 11 January 2020 11: 20 New
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        verily - to you even ... in the eyes - God's dew.
        Level fool rolls over.


        What do you think is unrealistic in this version? Explain to me how a video could appear where a rocket hits a plane?

        This happens all the time in ordinary life and in the politics of countries.

        So the United States organized on September 11, 2001, killed more than 3000 of its citizens in order to get a reason to invade Afghanistan, create a springboard there to attack oil-rich countries - Iraq, Iran and Syria, Libya.

        Say that this cannot be and it is unreal ?! Well then, answer me why the WTC tower No. 7 crashed into which no plane crashed, and one of the hijacked planes hijacked by terrorists crashed into a field?
        1. borberd 11 January 2020 20: 26 New
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          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan


          So the United States organized on September 11, 2001, killed more than 3000 of its citizens


          Somewhere I already heard it ... and, at the classic - "Unterofitserskaya widow shewn herself" (c).
          1. Ratmir_Ryazan 12 January 2020 10: 19 New
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            Somewhere I already heard it ... and, at the classic - "Unterofitserskaya widow shewn herself"


            Why did September 11, 2001, the WTC tower # 7 still crash into which no plane crashed?
  • 4ekist 11 January 2020 11: 34 New
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    It is not clear yet how a passenger plane ended up near a military facility? Was the use of airspace near this object restricted, on what basis (whose supply) did Iran take for the passenger air vessel?
  • Bukhalov 11 January 2020 12: 27 New
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    Quote: Nikitich


    You have to be really strong to admit your mistakes!
    Iran well done ..

    Ah, it’s easy to deceive me, I’m glad to be deceived myself!
    Since the murder of passengers and the crew of the civilian Ukrainian side, Iran, in the person of senior management, has only done what it lied to the whole world, which has nothing to do with the crash of the airliner. And lied brazenly and shamelessly. At the level of rudeness. Starting from the crap, such as “This is impossible from a scientific point of view” and ending with the allegations about Iran’s guilt as “Big lies and fraud.” But they did not stop there. They began to actively destroy the traces of the crime. At first they refused to provide "black boxes" to Boeing. On the second day, they said that they had destroyed memory blocks, and now Iran is ready to provide these boxes for decryption, at least to France, at least in scrap metal. They said that the liner was returning to the port to fix the problem. “Found” “eyewitnesses” who “saw” the engine catch fire on the liner and it fell. Only after they took by the hand (apparently through secret diplomatic channels the Persians demonstrated the fixation of missile launches) they turned sour. "IRAN OF THE GOOD!"
  • iouris 11 January 2020 15: 44 New
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    We are also for everything good, against everything bad. However, Iran was preparing to defend itself against the massive US retaliatory strike that could have followed the strike on the US base in Iraq, which was inflicted after the assassination of an important senior military leader .... etc. In short, I do not agree that the plane was shot down "by accident." He was shot down because he was in the wrong place at a bad time. But the plane was shot down unintentionally.
    1. atalef 11 January 2020 15: 49 New
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      Quote: iouris
      In short, I do not agree that the plane was shot down "by accident." He's shot down because he was in the wrong place at a bad time

      and surrounded by hollowers.
      laughing
  • Nikolay87 11 January 2020 07: 54 New
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    Well, that's the specifics. And then in such coincidences as a crashed plane on the eve of rocket fire somehow it is very little trusted.
    1. Alex Justice 11 January 2020 08: 07 New
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      Everything is exactly like in Ukraine МН17 or in Syria a Russian plane.
      The atmosphere is escalating. Missile bombers awaiting attack. As a result, they shoot everything down, which in their opinion is the enemy.
      Why has Iran not closed its skies? Why shot at a leaving target?
      1. kepmor 11 January 2020 08: 14 New
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        why ??? ... yes because the barrack on the KP air defense and ignorance of the situation ...
        almost the same as with our IL ...
        yeah ... sent the Almighty allies ....
        1. Vadivak 11 January 2020 10: 49 New
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          Quote: kepmor
          yeah ... sent the Almighty allies ...

          Sent it exactly, and specifically sent
        2. valeryb 11 January 2020 11: 32 New
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          Quote: kepmor
          sent the Almighty allies.
          Eh, not, in this case they chose themselves, but they could choose others.
        3. Tsoy 11 January 2020 12: 32 New
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          Quote: kepmor
          yes because the barrack on the KP air defense


          Obama is again to blame laughing
        4. 4ekist 11 January 2020 13: 03 New
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          What a mess? or were you there? Carry a complete nonsense, dear!
      2. bessmertniy 11 January 2020 08: 15 New
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        Ukraine also did not cover the sky. As a result, also a downed Boeing.
      3. kjhg 11 January 2020 08: 21 New
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        Quote: Alex Justice
        Why has Iran not closed its skies? Why shot at a leaving target?

        Lack of coordination between civilian and military. In a combat situation and time, it’s stupidly not to check if information about the civilian sides does not arrive in real time. Remember how in South Ossetia most of our aircraft were shot down by friendly fire. Although it was not even civilian aircraft, but military. But the air defense of the Ground Forces did not have sufficient coordination with the Air Force. It was after these events that the military leadership paid due attention to this.
      4. bar
        bar 11 January 2020 08: 24 New
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        Everything is exactly like in Ukraine МН17 or in Syria a Russian plane.

        Or like in 2001 over the Black Sea ...
        By the way, then Ukraine immediately admitted and paid everyone?
        1. Victoria-V 11 January 2020 10: 38 New
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          The plane was shot down by the Ukrainian 5V28 from a Russian training ground during the Russian-Ukrainian exercises. I won’t write further, you want to find out who turned on the backlight, look in the internet. You just don’t need to write anything about that catastrophe if you don’t know.
          1. Vadivak 11 January 2020 10: 54 New
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            Quote: Victoria-In
            I won’t write further, you want to find out who turned on the backlight, look in the internet. You just don’t need to write anything about that catastrophe if you don’t know.

            At the command post of the exercises they accept the report: “There are three goals on the screen!” The order of Lieutenant General V. Dyakov sounded immediately: “Send them to shit! Fire!"
            Vladimir Valentinovich Dyakov - a military figure in Ukraine. As of 2001, he was Deputy Commander-in-Chief of the Ukrainian Air Defense Forces for combat training, had the rank of lieutenant general
    2. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 32 New
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      Quote: Nikolay87
      And then in such coincidences as a crashed plane on the eve of rocket fire somehow it is very little trusted.

      4 hours after.
    3. The comment was deleted.
  • antivirus 11 January 2020 07: 54 New
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    started .... all over the earth.
    all aviation must be banned - only horses, wagons, as during the time of Pushkin
    1. Mordvin 3 11 January 2020 07: 59 New
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      Quote: antivirus
      horses, wagons, as during the time of Pushkin

      The same is dangerous, according to Pushkin:
      The plague will overpower me
      That frost will ossify
      If only a barrier slams into my forehead,
      Unstoppable disabled person ...
  • Pessimist22 11 January 2020 07: 54 New
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    It turns out Canadian intelligence was right, now Iran will be overwhelmed with suits.
    1. Vita vko 11 January 2020 08: 09 New
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      Quote: Pessimist22
      Iran will be overwhelmed with claims

      Why all of a sudden? They will pay standard insurance. Moreover, in 1988 The US itself set a precedent when, in a similar situation, they shot down an Iranian passenger Airbus. Then 290 people died and the injured relatives did not receive any compensation or insurance. Moreover, the commander of the American cruiser who issued the order was awarded the Order of the Legion of Honor.
      It is bad that the "human factor" still plays a significant role in the Iranian air defense system. This indicates a low level of automation of the air defense system, which may be a "red rag" for Israel and the United States.
      1. Blackmokona 11 January 2020 08: 42 New
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        In February 1996, a settlement agreement was signed between the United States and Iran, after which the case in court was dismissed. Under the terms of the agreement, the United States was supposed to pay compensation in the amount of $ 131,8 million (including $ 61,8 million to the heirs of 248 dead, based on $ 300 for each able-bodied victim and 000 for each dependent), and Iran refused further claims to USA in connection with this disaster
      2. Avior 11 January 2020 09: 13 New
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        The Americans paid compensation to the relatives of the victims in the downed liner and they never refused the fact of the downing of the liner, the only question was whose fault it was.
        In total, the Americans paid $ 132 million in compensation, up to $ 300 TVS to the relatives of the victims.
        There is no question of any standard insurance in such cases, the payments are much larger.
      3. bar
        bar 11 January 2020 11: 50 New
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        Why all of a sudden? They will pay standard insurance. Moreover, in 1988 The US itself set a precedent when, in a similar situation, they shot down an Iranian passenger Airbus.

        Similarly, in 2001, Ukraine paid both for the plane and for each passenger.
        1. bar
          bar 11 January 2020 15: 01 New
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          I admit a mistake. Ukraine did not pay for the plane and still has not admitted its guilt sad
    2. Jack O'Neill 11 January 2020 08: 14 New
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      It turns out Canadian intelligence was right, now Iran will be overwhelmed with suits.
      The wreckage speaks for itself. Moreover - there is a video of how a missile launcher flew into a Boeing.
  • Eragon 11 January 2020 07: 55 New
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    Once again, curvature, ... Whose is not important. I feel sorry for people.
    Only Russian equipment worked as it should. Although this time it would be better not to work.
    1. donMigel 11 January 2020 08: 08 New
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      Quote: Eragon
      I feel sorry for people.
      Only Russian equipment worked as it should.

      Do you understand that there is nothing to trigger? Civilian board against air defense.
      1. hydrox 11 January 2020 08: 23 New
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        In fact, any board should have a transponder turned on, which just serves as an answering machine for a civilian ship.
        1. Avior 11 January 2020 09: 15 New
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          It was turned on, until the missile hit the board was on the flytradar
          1. hydrox 11 January 2020 09: 28 New
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            Well, if so, then this is a jamb of Iran and I am sure that they will not be likened to Ukraine in "protecting supposedly honor and as if guidnosti"
    2. atalef 11 January 2020 08: 36 New
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      Quote: Eragon
      Once again, curvature, ... Whose is not important. I feel sorry for people.
      Only Russian equipment worked as it should

      the civilian side is not to be wrecked.
      It worked as it should.
      laughing
      I'm not special. in air defense, but the question arises
      On the locator, a slow-moving huge Boeing is not detected and the military aircraft has the same performance?
      Next question.
      Who taught, who gave a certificate of readiness to carry out independent duty, etc. etc.
      1. GenNick 11 January 2020 08: 54 New
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        Certificate? , but from this place in more detail ...
      2. Dude 11 January 2020 08: 58 New
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        Next question.
        Who taught, who gave a certificate of readiness to carry out independent duty, etc. etc.
        I was waiting for this comment !!! good wassat

        Hint that the Russians taught, then there will be talk about delivering such a serious weapon as an air defense system to unreliable customers - Russia's irresponsible behavior, => Russia is to blame again! Profit!
        A classic of the information war, right now, on VO ...
        1. atalef 11 January 2020 09: 16 New
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          Quote: Dude
          Hint that the Russians taught

          what&#