In Novosibirsk, developed a new high-explosive fragmentation shell caliber 122 mm

Russian artillerymen can get into service a new high-explosive fragmentation shell. The new ammunition was developed by specialists of the Novosibirsk State Technical University (NSTU). This was reported by the university press service.

The new 122-mm high-explosive fragmentation shell is reportedly intended for the D-30 howitzer and the 2X1 Gvozdika self-propelled artillery. The development of ammunition was carried out for three years, the tests were carried out at the test site of the Novosibirsk Scientific Research Institute of Measuring Instruments.

This is a high-explosive fragmentation shell of increased accuracy and power. Its flight range is 15 km and mass is 21,76 kg

- said in a statement.

The developers of the new ammunition do not give details, but declare that, due to the new design, the balance of the projectile has significantly improved, which has led to an increase in the accuracy of hitting at 30% compared to the standard ammunition 122-mm for the D-30 and self-propelled guns "Carnation". One of the innovations in the design is called the modified lead belt, which is now made uniform with the shell of the projectile, as in previous versions of the ammunition it was a separate part.

According to a press release, the new high-precision high-explosive fragmentation projectile is designed to suppress and destroy enemy weapons and equipment at concentration sites and strongholds, and to destroy field-type defenses and observation posts.

Comments

[Theodore]

Well! For the shell!

[figwam]

They write that he ...

[Starper-xnumx]

Quote: Theodore

Well! For the shell!

I join Fedya And damn us not a brother.
It would be necessary to test it he he he Real, and then something like chatter)))

[Doctor]

Do you really need 122 caliber?

[Mountain shooter]

And what, and the small goals of the 152nd to suppress? Good caliber, right. The fact that NATO does not have such a caliber does not mean that we do not need it.

[bouncyhunter]

Quote: Mountain Shooter

And what, and the small goals of the 152nd to suppress?

What for ? They don't shoot at flies from a bazooka.

[Vadim237]

To do this, there are kamikaze drones - launch from a portable tube, flight, detection and accurate defeat.

[krot]

Do you want to say that it’s time to scrape artillery? In my opinion prematurely.

[Lopatov]

And MANPADS, which dozens of such pieces shoot down ...

[Vadim237]

The probability of hitting a mini UAV and even with an electric motor at a minimum height is extremely low from MANPADS, and MANPADS are not enough.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Vadim237

The probability of hitting a mini UAV and even with an electric motor at a minimum height is extremely low from MANPADS, and MANPADS are not enough.

You do not follow the news from Syria? Journalists are already tired of writing about the repulsed attacks of the Kamikaze UAVs.

[svp67]

Quote: Mountain Shooter

And what, and the small goals of the 152nd to suppress?

Yes, as it was previously announced the rejection of the 122 mm, maybe once again revised ... now it’s fast

[Vadim237]

For export deliveries, that’s it.

[Nikolaevich I]

Yes ... there was a case ... they decided to abandon the D-30 and the "carnations", at the same time ... But these "persecuted and unfortunate" D-30s, and "carnations, too ... proved to be quite good in Syria ! It’s so good that the “ranks” in the Ministry of Defense decided to hold back the remaining guns in the troops ... After such perturbations, he begins to want to call the “ranks” in the Ministry of Defense “idiots” ...

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

Quote: Arzt

Do you really need 122 caliber?

Today, we are armed with several thousand 122mm barrels! You can’t hide them in the fridge in one fell swoop. So both trunks are needed and new shells for them! In a word, the shows are not so rich in order to make revolutions in the artillery business !!!

[Ryaruav]

as well as how many shells of this caliber in warehouses Oh, this is our historical caliber very good explosive action fairly light towed systems and I agree with you - new shells are needed for everyone

[Lopatov]

Quote: Arzt

Do you really need 122 caliber?

That's a great question.
A course has been taken for complete removal from service. So far, the problem is only with the Airborne D-30. Replacements are not observed.
And in ground artillery it is easily replaced by 152.

D-30s go to Roshydromet (it seems that they have D-30s already more than those of Moscow Region)
2C1 should be sawn into "Hosts".

There is also a niche of the Russian Guard, but it seems like they want to replace it with "Phlox"

[chenia]

Quote: Spade

D-30s are going to Roshydromet (it seems that they have D-30s already more than MOs

This is in vain. There is no better system in mob.variant (and suddenly what).
So that the shell does not hurt.

[Lopatov]

Quote: chenia

This is in vain. There is no better system in mob.variant (and suddenly what).
So that the shell does not hurt.

It hurts to keep so many calibers.
Only on barrel artillery
- 203 mm
- 152 mm for 2С5 / 2А36,
- 152 mm for 2С3,
- 152 mm for 2С19 / 2А65,
- 122 mm for 2C1 / D-30,
- 122 mm with ready-made lugs for grooves for "Nona" and her descendants
And plus a promising 152-mm for the "Coalition"
Horror ....

Ideally, two should remain. 152 with modular charges and 122 with ready-made protrusions

[BARKAS]

And what for the marines, what is their replacement 2s1?

[Lopatov]

Quote: BARKAS

And what for the marines, what is their replacement 2s1?

Right I just forgot about them.
In fact, there is no replacement either.
Nona-shaped ones still have a small range for the brigade level.
Although they can replace 2S9 with "Host" or "Vienna" or "Lotus", and give 152-mm to the howitzer division.

[Paranoid50]

Quote: Spade

Right I just forgot about them.

Now it was a shame.

Quote: Spade

In fact, there is no replacement either.

At this stage - definitely not. And, after all, once "Carnations" were pushed by our land according to the principle "Take, god of the sea, that we, the green ones, are worthless." Well, while they serve. Here, in connection with the topic of 122 mm., I have a question for you, if, of course, you own the info: did the MO have any "kulak cutoffs" in storage by chance? Well, if a new projectile has been developed for this caliber ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: Paranoid50

Did the MO have no "kulak sawed-off" in storage by chance?

With high probability, all that remained was transferred to Syria.
If we’ve already gone to Roshydromet D-30 ...

[Paranoid50]

Quote: Spade

that remained, transferred to Syria.

Quite a logical move. There - the very thing, in the company of ZiS-2, ZiS-3 and D-1. In Donbass, "cut-offs" did not flicker - there D-30 and 2S1 are used in the buildings of the LPNR.

[chenia]

Quote: Spade

152 with modular charges and 122 with ready-made protrusions

For troops of constant readiness, definitely. But in the mobilization version of 122 mm, the D-30 is indispensable. Keep in storage, upgrade both shots and the system (make it self-propelled, with orientation and anchoring capabilities). Simpler and better systems for this role, because no.

[Anatole Klim]

Quote: Spade

Scary ...

It was scary when in 1990 Gorbachev signed a treaty on conventional armed forces in Europe, the so-called CFE Treaty. Then NATO and the VD assumed obligations to limit conventional weapons in Europe, restrictions were introduced on the number of tanks, armored vehicles, combat aircraft and helicopters, and, attention, artillery systems of caliber more than 100 mm. So, literally a few months after signing up for the ammunition storage base in the Belorussian Military District, where I served then, there arrived a railway transport consisting of 10 wagons with artillery shots to 76 mm ZIS-3, new straight from the factory, still hot as pies. ZIS-3 were only at the storage bases in the canned form and ammunition began to arrive. There was talk that all unnecessary artillery systems with a caliber of 122 and 152 mm falling under the quota would be replaced by a 76 mm ZIS-3. Well, then the collapse of the Union. Seichvas my former colleagues say that Lukashenko sold most of these new ammunition to Africa, they were selling like hot cakes, but there were new ones. Eh, you remember, horror.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Anatol Klim

So, literally a few months after signing up for the ammunition storage base in the Belorussian Military District, where I served then, there arrived a railway transport consisting of 10 wagons with artillery shots to 76 mm ZIS-3, new straight from the factory, still hot as pies. ZIS-3 were only at the storage bases in the canned form and ammunition began to arrive. There was talk that all unnecessary artillery systems with a caliber of 122 and 152 mm falling under the quota would be replaced by a 76 mm ZIS-3.

No 8))))
This is for substitute tools. We ourselves shot at the school for two seasons with the ZiS-3, with new ammunition. One season with D-44. With shells killed in zero. almost a quarter is "forbidden to shoot"
Well, in the troops we had "kulak sawn-off shotguns" as substitutes. Standard - 152 mm caliber, 2S3 and 2S19

It's just that all officers perform fire missions in live firing. Semiannually. And in order not to shoot the barrels under this, there are substitute weapons. And with "regular" commanders of batteries and battalions shoot

[Anatole Klim]

Quote: Spade

This is under the replacement guns. We ourselves at the school shot two seasons with ZiS-3 .... Just in combat firing, all officers carry out fire missions. Semiannually. And in order not to shoot under this trunks, there are substitute guns.

There were no artillery schools in Belarus, and there were also no substitutes in the artillery brigade located near the storage base, we went to combat training exercises as part of a 2C3 combat training group, and fired with a standard projectile. Maybe due to the fact that this brigade was not fully deployed, one division was deployed, the rest were of a reduced composition, so it was possible to keep the trunks.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Anatol Klim

There were no artillery schools in Belarus, and there were no substitutes in the artillery brigade located next to the storage base,

It could not be.
In the late USSR, even BM-13s, which were Katyushas, ​​were present on the basis of the 131st ZiL as substitutes.
It's just that, for example, we had three M-30s and one ZiS-2 in OPTADN per division. One "sawed-off" gun and the anti-tank gunners' cannon were shot to zero, and were not used for live firing.

Quote: Anatol Klim

went to combat training exercises

There are of course full-time.
But there are not only exercises, there is the fulfillment of test fire missions by all officers. At least once every half a year.

[Anatole Klim]

Quote: Spade

It could not be.
In the late USSR, even BM-13s, which were Katyushas, ​​were present on the basis of the 131st ZiL as substitutes.

Colleague, I will not argue, I just say what I knew and saw. This artillery brigade received all the ammunition only from us, and they took only PF 2S3 shots for training and never others. They did not even have their own ammunition depot, everything lay with us, for the war they received mob.units, their ZNSH came to us every year and looked at their stacks that they had to load, drew entrance diagrams, how many cars could be put under loading. As for the RS BM-13, I also had them, but they were received by anti-aircraft gunners on the Tunguska from the tank division, they used them as targets in their exercises, but I don’t know how they were launched, somehow I didn’t think to ask.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Anatol Klim

This artillery brigade received all the ammunition only from us, and they took only 2F3 OF shots and never others for the exercises.

So their combat training was organized disgustingly.
Apparently, test firing at the VAP

[Anatole Klim]

Quote: Spade

So their combat training was organized disgustingly.

Then the commander of the artillery brigade was Colonel Khachaturov, a military officer and an excellent commander, two orders of the Red Star after Afghanistan, he later became Colonel General Head of the General Staff of the Armenian Armed Forces, and later Secretary General of the CSTO, but Pashinyan secured his removal and prosecution against him.
But about poor combat training, not everything depended on the brigade commander, remember that time just before the collapse of the Union, the tops no longer thought about the army, although Khachaturov probably also saw himself in Armenia.

[Lopatov]

Was the brigade not cropped for an hour?

[Anatole Klim]

Quote: Spade

Was the brigade not cropped for an hour?

Probably you are right Lopatov, but I could not know whether the squad was cropped or not, they were regularly shooting with a regular 2C3, but now I sat and remembered how I somehow burst into their park in a UAZ, and a 2C5 rushed towards me, such a healthy self-propelled gun, barely dodged, and mob.arriages were for "Hyacinda", oh, how much we had to make "NZ" for them then, there the projectile and the charge went separately in different boxes, the shell box had its own trick, from the side of the head it was quite light, and from the side of the ass heavy, the ratio is 35% to 65% approximately, so the senior personnel, knowing about this, were the first to approach the box and grab the light side, the young fighters always got the hard side and they literally fell after a while. The stack also could not be folded if one side of the box was heavy and the other light, they just fell apart under the weight of the heavy side. Eh youth, and hello to you Lopatov, you really have the best comments on artillery
,

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Anatol Klim

It was scary when in 1990 Gorbachev signed a treaty on conventional armed forces in Europe,

It was scary when the Chechen Dudayev signed the pipe

[BARKAS]

It hurts to keep so many calibers.

Well, this is not so bad. There are still problems with logistics. They brought us 2-mm shells into the 3s152 division somehow, it turned out to be from some other system. One shell even got into an ammunition stack, so the crew then calmly loaded it and shot them.

[Lopatov]

Quote: BARKAS

Well, this is not so bad. There are still problems with logistics. They brought us 2-mm shells into the 3s152 division somehow, it turned out to be from some other system.

I wrote this.
The shells there are about the same. At least for howitzers. But the charges, for example, for 2C3 / D-20 and 2C19 / 2A65 are different. Because shots from one to another do not fit.

[JD1979]

Quote: Spade

- 122 mm with ready-made lugs for grooves for "Nona" and her descendants

Isn’t it 120mm? EMNIP mortar systems under 120 were?

[Lopatov]

Quote: JD1979

Isn’t it 120mm?

Plus protrusions for rifling.

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Spade

Plus protrusions for rifling

Who" ?

[Nikolaevich I]

Fir-trees ... what kind of "122 mm with ready-made protrusions"? You decided to introduce new terminology in any way?

[Lopatov]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

Fir-trees ... what kind of "122 mm with ready-made protrusions"? You decided to introduce new terminology in any way?

[svp67]

Quote: chenia

This is in vain. There is no better system in mob.variant (and suddenly what).

There is ... 152 mm PAT-B

[bouncyhunter]

Seryoga, but is MSTA-B not a 152 mm?

[chenia]

Quote: svp67

There is ... 152 mm PAT-B

You would have to work with 152 mm, you would understand a lot. The expense is 1/3 less for tasks, but the execution time will be longer. Pat stillborn, for the mobilization option, and for the troops of constant readiness of the MSTA and the Coalition.

[Lopatov]

Quote: chenia

Stillborn Pat, for mobilization option

That's not the point.
It was facilitated by the firing range. As far as I understand. for all paratroopers, both Airborne and SV.

[chenia]

Quote: Spade

It was facilitated by the firing range. As far as I understand. for all paratroopers, both Airborne and SV.

Why 152 mm troops? Well, you know how "convenient" the system (and shells) in such a caliber is., Here the D-30 is too heavy (well, you are a paratrooper). And the tasks for the Airborne Forces are not to tear the echelon, but to crush the guard, and then keep basic approach. They rushed along the example of the Americans (777), and then look who we will sell to.

[Lopatov]

Quote: chenia

Why 152 mm landing?

Unification

Quote: chenia

well you are a paratrooper

No, I'm a landlord.

[chenia]

Quote: Spade

Unification

Then NONA -K,

[Lopatov]

Quote: chenia

Then NONA -K,

Range.
By the way, Nona-M1 is better in terms of weight. You can even disassemble and carry it and have now begun to use it in airborne assault. And not only with us.

[chenia]

Quote: Spade

By the way, Nona-M1 is better in terms of weight.

That is to develop 120 mm, for the battalion unit, landing and mob.variant (but this is when the troops are saturated). But while the 122mm warehouses are clogged.

[Lopatov]

Quote: chenia

But while the 122mm warehouses are clogged.

I’m not at all sure of this.
Therefore, in fact, we were talking about new shells.

[svp67]

Quote: Spade

And not only with us.

Judging by MAZ and Zvyazda - Syabry?

[Lopatov]

Yes.
This is from the site of the Belarusian Ministry of Defense

[svp67]

Quote: chenia

Pat stillborn, for the mobilization option, and for the troops of constant readiness of the MSTA and the Coalition.

Here I just disagree. The trunk is single, but it is easier to produce than other systems and it became "stillborn" only because it was "born" at the wrong time, in the 90s. The state did not need it, and the foreign customer was not interested in 152-mm caliber, he was interested in 155-mm.

[chenia]

Quote: svp67

Here I just do not agree.

152 mm for troops of constant readiness (regiment and higher) - definitely self-propelled guns.
Towed, this is already in the mobile version. This system is heavy; most 122 mm problems are solved faster (even though the flow rate is 1/3 more). Even to make PAT-B self-propelled, with a device for facilitating loading, it still makes no sense to have it below the division link.

[orionvitt]

As shown by the experience of the Great Patriotic War, 122mm, it was the main caliber of howitzer artillery. And while the barrel artillery was not abolished, the caliber is very necessary, and by many estimates, optimal.

[Pashhenko Nikolay]

Certainly needed. But it is highly desirable not the D-30, but self-propelled guns that quickly change positions, for the counter-battery struggle today has taken a leap forward.

[gorenina91]

-I am not an expert, but the site had a topic about artillery, which said that these guns (as shown in the photo) were already removed from service in Russia ...

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

D-30 is in stock! Carnations are still in order !!! The coalition is certainly beautiful, but it rarely happens when all at once !!!

[KCA]

They may have been shot in Russia, but there are so many D-30s in the world that a simultaneous salvo will either accelerate the Earth’s rotation or slow down, they launched an IS-2 in the Donbass, and there’s also 122mm

[113262a]

By the way, shots from the d-30 did not fit!

[Hermann]

In the Airborne Forces D-30 there is also a motorized rifle "ultralight" brigade where the battalion is on the UAZ Patriot, and so in the ground forces there are practically none.

[Lopatov]

Quote: gorenina91

I am not an expert, but the site had a topic about artillery, which said that these guns (as shown in the photo) were already removed from service in Russia ...

It is not possible yet.

[Svarog51]

Why is your nickname highlighted in yellow? It seems that the authors have it green. Or what innovation? What does it mean?

[asv363]

The namesake, the respected comrade Lopatov in the profile says: Best commentator.

[Svarog51]

That's it. So he is the winner of the competition. Thank you, I did not know before that.

[bouncyhunter]

Seryoga, hello! Lopatov fully deserved this title.

[Svarog51]

pasha I have no objection, I'm just surprised by the color of the nickname. Now in the know. "The owner of the trelobit" is also "yellow". The results of the 30th will be announced, everyone will be listed there. It will be clear what's what.
P.S. I don't like the color, association with the "yellow press". Raspberry would be at least. Well, not for us to decide.

[bouncyhunter]

Think of the color as "golden".

[Golovan Jack]

Quote: Svarog51

also "yellow"

Once upon a time there was such a feature - "subscription". A little money to not watch ads.

Subscribers stood out in this color.

Then the subscription disappeared, as it did not live up to expectations, but the feature remained. So she was involved.

Everything is simple. There is no drumstick.

[Svarog51]

Clear. Thank.

[Thrifty]

Actually, the difference between "can" and "get" is simply incommensurable, because we simply MAY not put this shell into production!

[Alexey G]

Or maybe the guys from the Polytechnic University will be entrusted with some kind of projectile! They have already shown themselves! They have golden hands. 30 percent efficiency is great!

[The leader of the Redskins]

I would like more information, well, and the photo, of course!))) And so, the thing is always necessary.

[Gray brother]

15 km and weight 21,76 kg

So what? There is no profit in such information. Maybe it's whole like a cast-iron core.

One of the innovations in the design is called the modified lead belt, which is now made uniform with the shell of the projectile, as in previous versions of the ammunition it was a separate part.

I’ve wang that they made it wider, and it was embedded in the shell of the projectile because the area of ​​contact with the rifling increased and a separate, nothing planted, part could collapse. It remains only to understand what will happen to the trunk.

[Gray brother]

Quote: gorenina91

already withdrawn from service in Russia ..

But not shells.
And not in Russia, and such howitzers in service are full.

[Lord of the Sith]

Good old D-30, a classic of the genre))
Still lives))

[Zaurbek]

So, like, they were going to remove 122mm from armament.

[Uncle Izya]

In Wiki, 4500 howitzers in Russia, I wonder what will replace

[Zaurbek]

120mm long-barreled mortar .... like in Vienna and Lotus.

[Uncle Izya]

In the USA, 105 mm howitzers were not abandoned, in the D-30 would they change the design would make it easier?

[Zaurbek]

We have no light howitzers yet

[Uncle Izya]

Probably because of the collapse of the country was not up to guns

[maxim.]

The clove system has very good accuracy, therefore, for direct support of the troops, it is much preferable to more powerful counterparts. New shells with a smaller spread - undoubtedly a buzz!

[Proton]

I’m not special in artillery, if there are specialists, tell me, with current technologies (supercomputers, simulators, etc.) for three years on a new munition under an old studied cannon, is this normal?
I’m just stupidly interested, under the ZiS-3 “In the battles of 1941, the ZiS-3 showed its advantage over the heavy and uncomfortable for the gunner F-22USV. As a result, this allowed V.G. Grabin to personally introduce the ZiS-3 to I.V. Stalin and obtain official permission for the production of guns, which by that time had already been produced by the plant and was actively used in the army. In early February 1942, official tests were carried out, which were rather a formality and lasted only five days. According to their results, the ZiS-3 was put into service on February 12, 1942 with the official name "76-mm divisional gun mod. 1942. "
What were the resources of these people? Head, Whatman and Karadash. Everything.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Proton

Here I’m just stupidly interested, under ZiS-3

In those days there was, to put it mildly, a disregard for ammunition.

Quote: Proton

three years on a new ammunition under the old studied cannon fl ok?

This is even fast.

[Zaurbek]

Progress cannot be stopped ... the accuracy of machine tools that stick out shells is growing. The smaller and more uniform the gaps between the outfit and the trunk, the higher the accuracy and speed. Somewhere because of the new alloys, you can make the wall of the projectile thinner and put more cc, cc itself may be new. Etc.

[artifact]

as I understand it, 21 kg is the total mass of the shell, but what is the weight of the iv in the TNT ?!

[Klingon]

Quote: Mountain Shooter

And what, and the small goals of the 152nd to suppress? Good caliber, right. The fact that NATO does not have such a caliber does not mean that we do not need it.

this is not the matter, but in the scatter of resources and capacities, or whether it is riveting a single 152 mm shell and riveting a bunch of different ammunition of different caliber and power. but we have, as always, the same rake in the aircraft, in the tanks and in the artillery. a lot of different things and no unification

[Kot_Kuzya]

Another cut of money. 122 is as "relevant" as 76. They would have started modernizing 76-mm shells. The whole world has already switched to 152 and 155.

[DDZ57]

News for at least 30 years, as well as the photo of the shell. I have not read such nonsense.
- NSTU does not have a license for the development of artillery ammunition.
- NSTU has never experienced anything on NOSIP.
- At present, in Novosibirsk and the okrug there is no factory where such a building can be made.