Where and how can one see hazing?
I agree with the opinion of those who say that often we very often criticize our army and its leadership. However, this case is from a completely different opera. Now criticism, if it begins, is somewhat different.
Alexei Roshchin, director of the Center for Sociology and Social Psychology at the Moscow Institute of Economics and Management in Industry, and a participant in a number of television programs, published an article in which I personally learned a lot of new and interesting things. And what I seek to share with you.
Officers look at the toilet: where in the Russian army hazing.
The following are quotes.
Next is a series of photographs clearly from the nineties, judging by the uniform, and the reasoning of a man who has obviously slanted from the army, or does not understand at all what the essence of the problem is.
Most of the article is tears that are more suitable for the activist from the "committee of soldiers' mothers."
What a charm, isn't it? In the Soviet Union they fought with hazing and fraternity, in Russia there was also a problem, but here's the thing: they didn’t call anyone. He would explain, and he would find a solution to the problem instantly!
Because the author, who clearly did not serve a single day, did not know that serving in a dress was another thing. That is, they go to the outfit in turn. Or as a disciplinary sanction, the outfit is out of turn, if someone messed up. But so - I agree, there is a reason for contacting The Hague. So to violate human rights ...
Well, right, you can’t do that ... Well, if you take up the discussion of the problem, at least find out what it looks like, wash the toilets in the army.
The truth is that the toilet is not an automaton, you need to be able to understand. There is no need to clean and lubricate the toilet, a slightly different principle of operation, especially in the army type "point". It looks like a Kalashnikov assault rifle with its simplicity and reliability. So - no need to clean, just wash.
And if an accident such as "clogged" occurs - well, yes, it does. But such delays are also eliminated by an experienced outfit in ten minutes.
Yes, the topic, of course, is the same, but for some reason the toilet and the cadet did not consider the toilet to be such dirty and shameful work. On the contrary, he left and did not shine. It seems like he is busy with business, and ... Yes, what am I, you yourself all know everything. Who (unlike Roshchin) served.
Apparently, times are changing, so are priorities with values. Alas.
But the soldier is not alone in the toilet. We look at the opus Roshchina further.
Lord Are we talking about the army, Alexey Valentinovich? About the army, not about the boarding house of noble maidens?
That's all, thanks, enough. Standing on one leg for several hours a day - everything is clear. "I did not serve, but I condemn it in advance." Personally, in the most terrible times of the bloody Soviet past, in preparation for the most massive action - the Parade on Red Square, I did not stand on one leg for hours. Like all the participants, I guess. What I hasten to notify Mr. Roshchin, but he is unlikely to believe me.
But Roshchin really did not serve! But condemns!
Information:
I understand everything, to be honest. Especially in terms of Kasparov.ru.
And such people are trying to broadcast something. Absolutely not understanding, not understanding.
But it is quite possible that we have problems in the state due to the fact that such Roshchins climb into power and try to steal / direct something there.
But continue.
It reminds me of “The adventures of the brave soldier Schweik,” there was in one of the episodes a general who believed that the main thing for the army was an evening visit to the toilet. The rest will follow.
Roshchin, of course, was not in the army, neither in the one in which he was supposed to serve in theory, nor in the Russian. Therefore, how should he know what the head of an officer is full of? According to Roshchin, it’s clear - clean toilets.
The reality is very different from what Mr. Roshchin intended. And for sure: the officer’s toilet bowls are in last place. For them, in general, there is a foreman of a company, which is obliged to monitor how the outfit serves.
And then Roshchin said a few very warm and peculiar words about ... Serdyukov. It turns out that the former Minister of Defense very effectively fought hazing through ... outsourcing!
Bows! Bows forgot! For noble maidens! Yes, Mr. Serdyukov has benefited hundreds and thousands of outsourcing firms. I just don’t know what about the exact statistics on murders and suicides, but don’t understand the money for what they’ve shaken from the army’s budget - mom, don’t worry.
Mom did not grieve while her child seemed to serve. How successful the program should be taken apart, but Roshchin is right in one thing: why pay the taxpayers crazy money for what you can get for free?
I understand that Roshchin did not read the charter, but everything is spelled out there about "the hardships and deprivations of military service." Do not crap past the toilet - is it a deprivation? Is it a burden to clean up after yourself / a comrade?
Possible.
In any case, it was not possible to lay the whole thing on the shoulders of the numerous nannies of their commercial structures. This is not even pulled our budget. Although some of this program has taken root (like salad bars). Useful, tasty, necessary.
Actually, I completely agree. That is how Serdyukov stole the army. It was precisely because some civilian cleaners began to tear up a lot of money for their services. What there Tankswhen the garbage collection is not paid? And the toilet cleaners ...
Yes, outsourcing took off not just a pretty penny, it cost huge piles of rubles. And the piles were spent precisely so that someone would make a pretty good money under the guise of removing a huge load from girls in camouflage.
Quiet hour is also a good thing.
Apparently, the thesis of Roshchin sat well in the brain bios. Stitched to death, do not erase, nor fix.
I will not say anything about my personal acquaintances who served the urgent for the next five years, but refer to the three Smirnovs: Anatoly, Valentin and Leo. One has already served his own, two are still serving in the ranks. At present, who does not believe, write to Vadim Smirnov.
If there were a lot of places in places of service, and there were a lot of places, along with training, and even not the most "convenient", we would definitely focus on this. However, our leader systematically communicates with his guys, and ... nothing, everyone is happy!
Rocketeer, artillery scout, signalman - not a word about bullying.
But what, to the devil, can there be hazing, when only a year to serve? Six months for training / development, and six months to train a successor? Well, everything is just like a blank shot!
No, there will always be such a Roshchin who does not understand anything in the service, but does not agree with everything in advance and condemns it.
It is clear, of course, that an unwashed toilet became a cause for hazing. Sure. But where is hazing if the conflict was between an officer and a private?
Generally survived. Okay, between the soldiers. Between a sergeant and a soldier. Although what kind of sergeant is this if his soldiers behave like that?
The officer demanded that the soldier fulfill his duties ... The soldier, apparently, was already so impudent that he sent the officer on a short but humiliating journey. Therefore, it was slightly choked with the help of the toilet. It’s familiar.
Yes, the hero’s dad declared his son “a real man” who “rebuffed the jackals.” I very much hope that the court will send this "hero" to life imprisonment. It would be nice to attract Shamsutdinov Sr. on the topic of how long since the jackets of the Russian army killed by his son became jackals.
Crazy, who, according to the subtleties of his soul, shot eight people, should be in prison. Although it is precisely for such crimes that it is necessary to unfreeze the death penalty and execute such "real men", since in reality they are all just cowards and murderers.
And the toilet has nothing to do with it. This Shamsutdinov would have arranged a massacre anyway, no matter the toilet, the floors, the outfit in the dining room. During my service I had seen enough of such warriors, it was the case.
Violations in part were. It is possible that there was a personal conflict. But the conflict between the officer and the private. And this is not an excuse for the killer of eight people. This is just an indicator that not everything in our army is smooth and perfect, since people with mental disabilities somehow get there.
But this is a topic of a completely different conversation.
Our conversation is that the fewer in the army and around it there will be such frank amateurs who talk about what needs to be changed so that everything becomes perfect, the better it will be for the army as a whole.
In our army there is no hazing, there are no grandfathers there long ago, as they switched to the annual system. It’s worth learning at least that.
But the fact that there is still a place in the army for Roshchin, who are fighting with the army itself under the guise of fighting against nonexistent bullying, - this is exactly the fact that there is a place to be.
Alexei Roshchin, director of the Center for Sociology and Social Psychology at the Moscow Institute of Economics and Management in Industry, and a participant in a number of television programs, published an article in which I personally learned a lot of new and interesting things. And what I seek to share with you.
Officers look at the toilet: where in the Russian army hazing.
The following are quotes.
“The recent execution of a guard by a conscript soldier in the Chita Region revealed an untidy reality for a society that had taken aback: it suddenly turned out that hazing, which was considered to be successfully defeated and forever expelled from the renewed Russian army, did not actually go away. If it was “overcome” for some time, it was only for a short while, and now it “blooms and smells” again, and conscripts die again or become crippled in quite peaceful time.
This news many are perplexed. How so? Where did hazing come from again? And what is it, by the way, what is it? ”
This news many are perplexed. How so? Where did hazing come from again? And what is it, by the way, what is it? ”
Next is a series of photographs clearly from the nineties, judging by the uniform, and the reasoning of a man who has obviously slanted from the army, or does not understand at all what the essence of the problem is.
Most of the article is tears that are more suitable for the activist from the "committee of soldiers' mothers."
“To explain the nature of hazing is quite simple on an elementary question: who will wash the toilet?”
What a charm, isn't it? In the Soviet Union they fought with hazing and fraternity, in Russia there was also a problem, but here's the thing: they didn’t call anyone. He would explain, and he would find a solution to the problem instantly!
“Washing the toilets is hard, dirty, unpleasant, and even, perhaps, humiliating work for a young man. Why did all his peers, excuse me, crap - and he should clean up after them all? And not just once as an exception, but periodically, regularly, in each of his “outfits”? ”
Because the author, who clearly did not serve a single day, did not know that serving in a dress was another thing. That is, they go to the outfit in turn. Or as a disciplinary sanction, the outfit is out of turn, if someone messed up. But so - I agree, there is a reason for contacting The Hague. So to violate human rights ...
Well, right, you can’t do that ... Well, if you take up the discussion of the problem, at least find out what it looks like, wash the toilets in the army.
“The truth is that nobody wants to clean the toilets. There is no romance in this work, it has a very indirect relationship to the “defense of the homeland”, you can’t brag about it after serving either your beloved girlfriend or future grandchildren. ”
The truth is that the toilet is not an automaton, you need to be able to understand. There is no need to clean and lubricate the toilet, a slightly different principle of operation, especially in the army type "point". It looks like a Kalashnikov assault rifle with its simplicity and reliability. So - no need to clean, just wash.
And if an accident such as "clogged" occurs - well, yes, it does. But such delays are also eliminated by an experienced outfit in ten minutes.
Yes, the topic, of course, is the same, but for some reason the toilet and the cadet did not consider the toilet to be such dirty and shameful work. On the contrary, he left and did not shine. It seems like he is busy with business, and ... Yes, what am I, you yourself all know everything. Who (unlike Roshchin) served.
Apparently, times are changing, so are priorities with values. Alas.
But the soldier is not alone in the toilet. We look at the opus Roshchina further.
“And if only in the dresses for toilets was the case. In the army there is still a lot of heavy, dirty and very unpleasant work that nevertheless needs to be done - the need for constant washing of floors, kitchen outfits (where you need to wash dishes and all kitchen utensils for several hundred eaters already), all sorts of loading and unloading, construction work (after all, the barracks and utility rooms are old, they must be patched constantly), etc. ”
Lord Are we talking about the army, Alexey Valentinovich? About the army, not about the boarding house of noble maidens?
“But that is not all. After all, there are still such specific army requirements, such as combat training - physically extremely difficult, even exhausting exercises such as "pulling the toe" and "standing on one leg" for several hours a day. "
That's all, thanks, enough. Standing on one leg for several hours a day - everything is clear. "I did not serve, but I condemn it in advance." Personally, in the most terrible times of the bloody Soviet past, in preparation for the most massive action - the Parade on Red Square, I did not stand on one leg for hours. Like all the participants, I guess. What I hasten to notify Mr. Roshchin, but he is unlikely to believe me.
But Roshchin really did not serve! But condemns!
Information:
Roshchin Alexey Valentinovich, was born 21.06.1967. He graduated from Lomonosov Moscow State University with a degree in Social Psychology.
Thesis was devoted to the study of hazing in the army.
In the 90, he worked on projects for the development of Russian entrepreneurship and privatization, funded by USAID and the World Bank.
Since 1999, he has been working in the field of political consulting, industrial sociology. He was involved in elections at the level from municipal deputies to governors and deputies of the State Duma of the Russian Federation, and also participated in the organization of election campaigns in Ukraine, the Baltic states and Central Asia.
Also known as a journalist and blogger with the nickname sapojnik.
It was published on the websites of Kasparov.ru and Gazeta.ru, in the magazines Expert, Money and Power.
Thesis was devoted to the study of hazing in the army.
In the 90, he worked on projects for the development of Russian entrepreneurship and privatization, funded by USAID and the World Bank.
Since 1999, he has been working in the field of political consulting, industrial sociology. He was involved in elections at the level from municipal deputies to governors and deputies of the State Duma of the Russian Federation, and also participated in the organization of election campaigns in Ukraine, the Baltic states and Central Asia.
Also known as a journalist and blogger with the nickname sapojnik.
It was published on the websites of Kasparov.ru and Gazeta.ru, in the magazines Expert, Money and Power.
I understand everything, to be honest. Especially in terms of Kasparov.ru.
And such people are trying to broadcast something. Absolutely not understanding, not understanding.
But it is quite possible that we have problems in the state due to the fact that such Roshchins climb into power and try to steal / direct something there.
But continue.
“You ask: where do the officers look? The answer is simple: officers look at the toilet. After all, their task is to ensure that the toilets are clean. But nobody wants to clean them, and the officer cannot offer soldiers any positive motivation. ”
It reminds me of “The adventures of the brave soldier Schweik,” there was in one of the episodes a general who believed that the main thing for the army was an evening visit to the toilet. The rest will follow.
Roshchin, of course, was not in the army, neither in the one in which he was supposed to serve in theory, nor in the Russian. Therefore, how should he know what the head of an officer is full of? According to Roshchin, it’s clear - clean toilets.
The reality is very different from what Mr. Roshchin intended. And for sure: the officer’s toilet bowls are in last place. For them, in general, there is a foreman of a company, which is obliged to monitor how the outfit serves.
And then Roshchin said a few very warm and peculiar words about ... Serdyukov. It turns out that the former Minister of Defense very effectively fought hazing through ... outsourcing!
“What was the essence of Serdyukov’s reforms, which almost allowed him to take hazing under control? Serdyukov made a mini-revolution in the army by launching “outsourcing” into the army - that is, companies with civilian personnel that are for money! - they took over most of the army’s “dirty” work - cleaning, washing, working in the cafeteria, etc. This undermined the “economic” basis of bullying: if there are less unpleasant and heavy “unromantic” jobs, the need for coercion of some soldiers decreases by others. Less coercion - less violence, the dignity of the coercion suffers less, and there is less ground for murder and suicide. ”
Bows! Bows forgot! For noble maidens! Yes, Mr. Serdyukov has benefited hundreds and thousands of outsourcing firms. I just don’t know what about the exact statistics on murders and suicides, but don’t understand the money for what they’ve shaken from the army’s budget - mom, don’t worry.
Mom did not grieve while her child seemed to serve. How successful the program should be taken apart, but Roshchin is right in one thing: why pay the taxpayers crazy money for what you can get for free?
I understand that Roshchin did not read the charter, but everything is spelled out there about "the hardships and deprivations of military service." Do not crap past the toilet - is it a deprivation? Is it a burden to clean up after yourself / a comrade?
Possible.
In any case, it was not possible to lay the whole thing on the shoulders of the numerous nannies of their commercial structures. This is not even pulled our budget. Although some of this program has taken root (like salad bars). Useful, tasty, necessary.
“Perhaps you have already noticed that the reforms of the“ thief Serdyukov ”were partly unnatural: after all, in fact,“ plundered the army ”Serdyukov insisted that from now on the army should pay for what it always always received for free. You see, “always” the toilets in the barracks were brushed with toothbrushes by the soldiers themselves with their salaries of 2 thousands of rubles - and then suddenly the plunderer of the people's property forces some civil cleaners to pay for it, and not 2 at all, but a lot more ” .
Actually, I completely agree. That is how Serdyukov stole the army. It was precisely because some civilian cleaners began to tear up a lot of money for their services. What there Tankswhen the garbage collection is not paid? And the toilet cleaners ...
Yes, outsourcing took off not just a pretty penny, it cost huge piles of rubles. And the piles were spent precisely so that someone would make a pretty good money under the guise of removing a huge load from girls in camouflage.
Quiet hour is also a good thing.
“That is, everything is simple: if you leave the draft army alone and leave it to yourself, it immediately enters its natural state. With hazing. "
Apparently, the thesis of Roshchin sat well in the brain bios. Stitched to death, do not erase, nor fix.
I will not say anything about my personal acquaintances who served the urgent for the next five years, but refer to the three Smirnovs: Anatoly, Valentin and Leo. One has already served his own, two are still serving in the ranks. At present, who does not believe, write to Vadim Smirnov.
If there were a lot of places in places of service, and there were a lot of places, along with training, and even not the most "convenient", we would definitely focus on this. However, our leader systematically communicates with his guys, and ... nothing, everyone is happy!
Rocketeer, artillery scout, signalman - not a word about bullying.
But what, to the devil, can there be hazing, when only a year to serve? Six months for training / development, and six months to train a successor? Well, everything is just like a blank shot!
No, there will always be such a Roshchin who does not understand anything in the service, but does not agree with everything in advance and condemns it.
“The decisive conflict of Private Shamsutdinov in the closed Gorny Mountain Zabaykalsky Territory flared up with an officer precisely about the toilet. The officer demanded that the ordinary wash him again, Shamsutdinov did not want to. Then, according to one version, the officer grabbed a private soldier and several times dunked his head right there, "accustomed to cleanliness."
Shamsutdinov “did not remain in debt” and, starting his slaughter, killed this officer first. ”
Shamsutdinov “did not remain in debt” and, starting his slaughter, killed this officer first. ”
It is clear, of course, that an unwashed toilet became a cause for hazing. Sure. But where is hazing if the conflict was between an officer and a private?
Generally survived. Okay, between the soldiers. Between a sergeant and a soldier. Although what kind of sergeant is this if his soldiers behave like that?
The officer demanded that the soldier fulfill his duties ... The soldier, apparently, was already so impudent that he sent the officer on a short but humiliating journey. Therefore, it was slightly choked with the help of the toilet. It’s familiar.
Yes, the hero’s dad declared his son “a real man” who “rebuffed the jackals.” I very much hope that the court will send this "hero" to life imprisonment. It would be nice to attract Shamsutdinov Sr. on the topic of how long since the jackets of the Russian army killed by his son became jackals.
Crazy, who, according to the subtleties of his soul, shot eight people, should be in prison. Although it is precisely for such crimes that it is necessary to unfreeze the death penalty and execute such "real men", since in reality they are all just cowards and murderers.
And the toilet has nothing to do with it. This Shamsutdinov would have arranged a massacre anyway, no matter the toilet, the floors, the outfit in the dining room. During my service I had seen enough of such warriors, it was the case.
Violations in part were. It is possible that there was a personal conflict. But the conflict between the officer and the private. And this is not an excuse for the killer of eight people. This is just an indicator that not everything in our army is smooth and perfect, since people with mental disabilities somehow get there.
But this is a topic of a completely different conversation.
Our conversation is that the fewer in the army and around it there will be such frank amateurs who talk about what needs to be changed so that everything becomes perfect, the better it will be for the army as a whole.
In our army there is no hazing, there are no grandfathers there long ago, as they switched to the annual system. It’s worth learning at least that.
But the fact that there is still a place in the army for Roshchin, who are fighting with the army itself under the guise of fighting against nonexistent bullying, - this is exactly the fact that there is a place to be.
Information