Military Review

“Shoot down the squadron in three minutes”: Serbia impressed with S-400 air defense system

123
Recently held in Serbia, joint military exercises with the Russian Federation demonstrated the high efficiency of the S-400 air defense system. Belgrade, impressed by this anti-aircraft missile system, is exploring the possibility of acquiring it. About this writes the Serbian publication "Vespers news».



During these maneuvers, which received the designation "Slavic shield - 2019", 14 aircraft of the local air force (that is, more squadrons) imitated the enemy. All of them were conditionally destroyed by C-400 fire, specially delivered from the Russian Federation. This required 26 missiles that “shot down” Serbian fighters in less than three minutes.

Serbia's military and state leadership was impressed by the effectiveness of the C-400 system

- writes the designated edition, citing an anonymous interlocutor.

According to him, in this regard, Belgrade intends to raise the question of the purchase of this air defense system. It is likely that negotiations will be held with the Kremlin over the coming months. In this case, the condition for the acquisition of C-400 is the allocation of a long-term loan by Moscow.

Against this background, a “shout” from Washington already followed. US Special Representative for the Western Balkans Matthew Palmer expressed concern about the possibility of Serbia purchasing military equipment from the Russian Federation. According to him, this could entail the imposition of sanctions against Belgrade.

We hope that our Serbian partners are aware of this and will be careful with such operations.

- said Palmer.

123 comments
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  1. Jerk
    Jerk 2 November 2019 12: 46
    +39
    Interfere! Interfere, scum, sell Patriots - there was a strangled cry from a pentagonal toilet ...
    1. St Petrov
      St Petrov 2 November 2019 14: 21
      +11
      we must now leave after the exercises there s-400. carry it back and forth later. we’ll learn to count money and logistics, and NATO will be calmer, although normal air defense appeared right in the center of the bloc
    2. Kuroneko
      Kuroneko 2 November 2019 16: 24
      +10
      Quote: Jerk
      Interfere, scum, sell Patriots - there was a strangled cry from a pentagonal toilet ...

      The Patriot Serbs would never have thought of buying anyway. Why take the western system with "bookmarks"? So that - when NATO again decides to "bomb out humanitarianly" - would these Patriots simply be turned off? I intentionally don’t even mention "efficiency" and the price of "Patriots" - these things are common knowledge.
    3. Oquzyurd
      Oquzyurd 2 November 2019 16: 37
      +4
      In order to see the full picture of the case concerning C-400 and what is happening in Serbia in general, in the relations in the Russia-Turkey-Serbia-Russia triangle, one would have to cover Erdogan’s recent trip to Serbia. Why didn’t they cover the media, they passed by But there were very interesting things that could be considered in the context of Turkey’s purchase of C-400 and Serbia’s interest in these systems. I note that Turkey and Serbia now have the best relations in history. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frfu-zmGRt8
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPajLQ7fERw
    4. smart ass
      smart ass 3 November 2019 14: 24
      +4
      As the "Serbian partners" turn their tongues in general, the wolves of the Tambov states are partners
  2. GKS 2111
    GKS 2111 2 November 2019 12: 46
    +22
    Serbs are experienced and skilled warriors.
    1. mvg
      mvg 2 November 2019 13: 47
      -27
      experienced and skilled warriors

      Can you tell me where the information came from? Yugoslavia, before the collapse of the ATS, was perhaps the strongest army in the bloc. However, the Croats with a sudden blow cut out the Serbian Krajina, and Serbia’s air defense clearly could not cope with the NATO Air Force. The entire economy of the country was destroyed. Of more than 1000 aircraft, about 19 pieces were shot down.
      PS: Yes, and F-117 shot down by accident, flew, as he went to the store, on a schedule and one route. And modernized with the help of France C-125. Soon the Serbs will be crushed and accepted into NATO.
      1. Nycomed
        Nycomed 2 November 2019 13: 53
        +8
        Was Yugoslavia in the police department?
        1. mvg
          mvg 2 November 2019 14: 00
          -6
          Formally, no, the contract was signed in 1955, then there were strained relations with her. But I sincerely believed that I was. At least a union state. In childhood, traveled to Poland and Yugoslavia. The world was bipolar, there were few neutrals. Sweden, Finland. So either in that camp or this. negative
          1. Nycomed
            Nycomed 2 November 2019 14: 04
            +5
            Yugoslavia belonged to the "non-aligned" countries.
          2. Kenxnumx
            Kenxnumx 2 November 2019 14: 05
            -7
            Yugoslavia always had in mind our socialist camp in general and the USSR in particular. They were on their mind and why now suddenly such love is not very clear.
      2. sivuch
        sivuch 2 November 2019 14: 02
        +3
        With regard to air defense - this, excuse me, is nonsense. (Despite the fact that Yugoslavia really was not in the police department).
        About the goblin and 125-ku too. Just tired of repeating the same thing
        1. mvg
          mvg 2 November 2019 14: 12
          -1
          About the goblin and 125-ku too

          Tell the truth. And for air defense too.
          Itself has modernized the C-75 and C-125. Settled ambushes. She had the MiG-29 in the Air Force. She did a lot of her weapons, M-84, for example. From other countries, only Poland and Czechoslovakia made tanks. The best electronics in the block. (Really not, I wrote)
          A downed planes can be viewed on the Internet, as many as the 3 version, the south, the USA and ours.
          1. Sky strike fighter
            Sky strike fighter 2 November 2019 15: 19
            +4
            Quote: mvg
            About the goblin and 125-ku too

            Tell the truth. And for air defense too.
            Itself has modernized the C-75 and C-125. Settled ambushes. She had the MiG-29 in the Air Force. She did a lot of her weapons, M-84, for example. From other countries, only Poland and Czechoslovakia made tanks. The best electronics in the block. (Really not, I wrote)
            A downed planes can be viewed on the Internet, as many as the 3 version, the south, the USA and ours.

            In general, about the war in Yugoslavia 1999 year.
            The aggression of NATO against Yugoslavia in the 1999 year did not require much tension from the Alliance, which is quite natural, given the balance of forces and means of the warring parties.

            Indicative is the number of air raids by fighter aircraft of the Yugoslav Air Force - 5 hours and by fighter-bomber aircraft - 15 hours, which indicates the position of the Yugoslav Air Force. As a result, the entire air defense mission was assigned to anti-aircraft missile units and subunits covering a particular territory. It is natural that the Belgrade area, which was covered by the most combat-ready ground air defense brigade, became the most difficult area for NATO aviation. It was the forces of this brigade, which was armed with Soviet S-125 "Neva" air defense systems, that the US Air Force F-3A "invisible" aircraft was shot down by the fire of the 117rd anti-aircraft missile battalion, the fragments of which were found near the village of Budzhanovtsy. This aircraft was shot down due to a change in the nature of the flight by the pilot, as a result of which its radar reflection (about 1m²) attracted the attention of Serbian operators of the Yugoslav air defense radar.

            An important role in the successful use of laser seekers was played by the fact of the weakness of the Yugoslav air defense. Serbs not everywhere could organize a multi-level layered air defense, and in many areas (especially mountainous) it was completely absent. For this reason, NATO aircraft could carry out unimpeded illumination of targets from the air, and in those areas of Kosovo and Metohija where UAC forces operated, the illumination of targets was carried out from the ground by forces of the US Air Force and NATO MTR. Of great importance for NATO aviation was the installation of small radar beacons by local agents of Western intelligence services (including Serbs) near targets on earth.

            The operation took 78 days. During this operation, NATO aircraft flew over 20 thousand sorties, using about 37 thousand ammunition, including guided missiles (AGM-142 "Popay", AGM-130, AGM-154, AGM-84 SLAM, AGM-86C , AGM-86 ALCM), guided aerial bombs (GBU-31, GBU-37), as well as UGM-109 cruise missiles (BGM-109 version), which were fired by the British Navy from submarine torpedo tubes. For these missiles, the war in Yugoslavia has become a kind of testing ground.

            https://www.warandpeace.ru/ru/analysis/view/33856/
            1. mvg
              mvg 2 November 2019 15: 43
              0
              I read this text, like so much more. For example, the general’s memory on And last name. Now works as an expert. The aircraft almost did not rise, since the forces were too unequal. But the Serbs claim a pair of air victories.
              And the air defense was almost destroyed in the early days. Too much force was launched. More 1000 aircraft. With such forces and the Russian Federation it would be difficult. But for a European country, air defense was normal.
              And F-117 was shot down, as it came out below the clouds, it was seen optically. I do not understand how the EPR field can change. If the same height and viewing angle. At least I read this version.
          2. sivuch
            sivuch 2 November 2019 15: 30
            0
            Do you have an educational program? Okay, just a little later
            1. mvg
              mvg 2 November 2019 15: 44
              -3
              Well, if not difficult. What I read was not taken from one source.
          3. sivuch
            sivuch 2 November 2019 18: 30
            +2
            Let me start for now, and there it will be visible. First of all, there is such useful information -
            https://bmpd.livejournal.com/257111.html Поставки советских ЗРК ПВО страны за рубеж
            There is far from everything here, for example, air defense missile systems are not mentioned at all and many radars are missing. Nevertheless, it can be seen that many countries of the internal affairs department had two hundred, and brother and dederons also had 300 ki, albeit in a cropped trooper. Yes, and the number of 75's and 125's was many more. About the same with radar and ACS. True, the south also purchased western-made radars (albeit few), but it was very bad with ACS and KSA.
            With anti-aircraft defense, the picture is even more revealing. In Yugoslavia there were only MANPADS, Cubes and Arrows-10. .Os was not at all, as well as Kroogi. Moreover, the south themselves could not produce this technique.
            Mig-29 was purchased all 18, and in configuration B, since it is not the Warsaw Pact. Many countries had more ATS. But the latter also had quite modern Mig-23ML.
            That the goblin was shot down on the third day, i.e. when there could be no statistics in 9 evenings,. those. at night, I was tired of writing. As well as the fact that in the battery of Zoltan Dani there were no French thermal imagers.
    2. Kenxnumx
      Kenxnumx 2 November 2019 13: 57
      -11
      Which historically lost almost all wars
      1. SokolfromRussia
        SokolfromRussia 3 November 2019 23: 10
        -1
        After independence from the Ottoman Empire.

        Serbian-Bulgarian 1885 - Loss.
        The first Balkan 1912-1913 is a victory.
        The second Balkan 1913 is a victory.
        PMV is a victory.
        WWII - victory.
        The war in Croatia is a defeat.
        The war in Bosnia is a draw; half of the country has been retained.
        The war with NATO is a defeat.

        You can recall the military history of the Serbs of the Middle Ages. At the peak of power within Serbia were the territories of most of modern Serbia, all of Montenegro, all of Macedonia, all of Albania, half of Greece.

        You, apparently, are simply not in the know.
        1. Kenxnumx
          Kenxnumx 4 November 2019 12: 58
          -1
          Do not confuse victory and clinging to someone else's victory.
          1. SokolfromRussia
            SokolfromRussia 4 November 2019 17: 32
            +1
            I gave statistics. Confirmation of "historically lost all wars" ready to lead? With a list of wars, shares of defeats, etc. Or blurted out for the sake of a loud word?

            In WWI, Serbia was the most victorious winner. Although it was occupied by the Nazis in WWII, it created the most powerful partisan movement in Europe (after the USSR, of course). Although I looked at your profile, the questions disappeared by themselves.
            1. Kenxnumx
              Kenxnumx 4 November 2019 17: 54
              -2
              PMV - The Serbian army was crushed with a bang and knocked out of the country. WWII - the same thing but even faster. Ah partisans. Yes, about the same outcome. But the allies always helped out. 1BV - Yes, the Serbs showed themselves, but the Greeks and Bulgarians made a war. 2BV against the Bulgarians there was such an overwhelming superiority that the result was not in doubt. And what's wrong with my profile.
    3. NEXUS
      NEXUS 2 November 2019 14: 51
      +11
      Quote: GKS 2111
      Serbs are experienced and skilled warriors.

      Almost the only Slavic state in the far abroad, whose inhabitants love and respect the Russian Federation, without interruption for wagging his ass in the direction of the West.
      1. The comment was deleted.
  3. Scoun
    Scoun 2 November 2019 12: 47
    +11
    With the size of Serbia and the range of C-400, the question from the commercial becomes political.
    EBN believed the "partners".
    Imha it's time to make an island of security in Europe.
    PS.
    In BV, they could, in Asia they could, it’s time in Europe to create a center of stability for the level of A2 / AD air defense
  4. Lapunevsky
    Lapunevsky 2 November 2019 12: 50
    -1
    And if in Serbia, God forbid, the "democratic Maidan", the government changes as in Ukraine to a pro-American one, then these Pantsiri and S-400 will immediately be stuck around by American specialists, dismantled to a screw.
    1. parkello
      parkello 2 November 2019 12: 52
      +5
      if my grandmother had eggs. then she would be a grandfather yes
      1. Scoun
        Scoun 2 November 2019 13: 03
        0
        Quote: parkello
        if my grandmother had eggs. then she would be a grandfather yes

        +)) the only thing I don’t understand is that - why do not they mask the shadows from vertically standing PUs? Disguise is not so difficult to produce with the use of light reflectors.
        For systems, it is enough to prescribe an algorithm and they will automatically select characteristic contours in automatic mode.
        Although maybe our people do it on purpose, which would be a surprise with real databases.
        IMHA.
        1. parkello
          parkello 2 November 2019 13: 05
          +3
          there is no need if such irrelevance appears. everyone will disguise. the nose mosquito will not tarnish.
          1. Scoun
            Scoun 2 November 2019 14: 05
            +1
            Quote: parkello
            there is no need if such irrelevance appears. everyone will disguise. the nose mosquito will not tarnish.

            Yes, and I actually think so, just slightly annoying photos from bloggers showing deployed systems in Syria, Egypt, Turkey and other countries.
      2. Lapunevsky
        Lapunevsky 2 November 2019 14: 19
        -2
        And if at VO there would be no opportunity to minus any dissent, it would be fine in general. Backing track fighters - the crowd is like a herd. Keyboard Special Forces
        1. hrapon
          hrapon 4 November 2019 10: 36
          0
          There you go. + For universal balance.
    2. knn54
      knn54 2 November 2019 13: 16
      0
      -We hope that our Serbian partners are aware of this and will be careful with such operations.
      That's the whole story.
    3. Terenin
      Terenin 2 November 2019 13: 30
      +5
      Quote: Lapunevsky
      And if in Serbia, God forbid, the "democratic Maidan", the government changes as in Ukraine to a pro-American one, then these Pantsiri and S-400 will immediately be stuck around by American specialists, dismantled to a screw.

      ... The complex also has its own internal methods of protection (for example, the complex can be driven into a special hangar where communication with satellites will be blocked). The most important thing in C-400 is the system operation algorithms. The appearance can be easily copied (as was done in China with C-300), but you can’t do without a computer and an algorithm wired into it to make it work. So, when concluding a contract, Turkey asked for access passwords in order to independently enter the data on the recognition of “Friend or Foe” into the system, but Russia, of course, refused. Turkey had to transmit information about its aircraft and Russian engineers set up this system on their own, also entering data on Russian fighters into it. Therefore, the missiles of the complex will not be able to shoot down Turkish and Russian aircraft.

      If the Turks (or NATO) try to bypass the password by hacking the system, when an unauthorized access is attempted, the computer automatically clears all the data that was embedded, which turns the C-400 into a pile of metal.
      1. Lapunevsky
        Lapunevsky 2 November 2019 14: 24
        -4
        Very interesting theory. Do engineers personally tell you these secret things? Something I do not believe in such tales about algorithms. If the Syrian air defense knock down our intelligence with the most modern equipment, then what can I talk about, and what algorithms? And the very device of missiles, engines, guidance systems - all this is also important for enemy reconnaissance. And not just software.
        1. Tank hard
          Tank hard 2 November 2019 17: 54
          +3
          Quote: Lapunevsky
          Very interesting theory. Do engineers personally tell you these secret things?

          What, in "Call of Duty" there is no S-400 and even S-300? No? Then it's difficult for you ... feel
        2. Pilat2009
          Pilat2009 4 November 2019 12: 13
          0
          Quote: Lapunevsky
          If the Syrian air defense knock down our intelligence with the most modern equipment, then what can I talk about, and what algorithms?

          You do not compare with -200 30 -year ago and with -400
      2. Doliva63
        Doliva63 2 November 2019 17: 17
        +1
        Quote: Terenin
        Quote: Lapunevsky
        And if in Serbia, God forbid, the "democratic Maidan", the government changes as in Ukraine to a pro-American one, then these Pantsiri and S-400 will immediately be stuck around by American specialists, dismantled to a screw.

        ... The complex also has its own internal methods of protection (for example, the complex can be driven into a special hangar where communication with satellites will be blocked). The most important thing in C-400 is the system operation algorithms. The appearance can be easily copied (as was done in China with C-300), but you can’t do without a computer and an algorithm wired into it to make it work. So, when concluding a contract, Turkey asked for access passwords in order to independently enter the data on the recognition of “Friend or Foe” into the system, but Russia, of course, refused. Turkey had to transmit information about its aircraft and Russian engineers set up this system on their own, also entering data on Russian fighters into it. Therefore, the missiles of the complex will not be able to shoot down Turkish and Russian aircraft.

        If the Turks (or NATO) try to bypass the password by hacking the system, when an unauthorized access is attempted, the computer automatically clears all the data that was embedded, which turns the C-400 into a pile of metal.

        Previously, they put a button there - like, do not care who flies. And that is reasonable. Can it be gone now? belay And if he suddenly decides to bomb his own in the Kremlin, will we ask the NATO to bring down? laughing
        I mean, you don’t need to crack a friend or foe system, it just turns off / on when necessary, and you can shoot down anyone you want.
      3. K-36
        K-36 2 November 2019 18: 46
        +3
        H. Terenin Do not tell me in which sources you looked for a similar information blizzard published by you ???
        Turkey had to transmit information about its aircraft and Russian engineers set up this system on their own, also entering data on Russian fighters into it. Therefore, the missiles of the complex will not be able to shoot down Turkish and Russian aircraft.

        If the Turks (or NATO) try to bypass the password by hacking the system, when an unauthorized access is attempted, the computer automatically clears all the data that was embedded, which turns the C-400 into a pile of metal.

        I apologize, but your fantasies (about the prohibition of shooting at targets with the correct respondent) will lead you to admit that now any hijacker of a Russian combat aircraft can do this with absolutely impunity !!! After all, their air defense systems will not be able to shoot at their aircraft, because some "friend or foe" subsystem is endowed (in your words) with extraordinary powers to "prohibit firing at friendly". That is, the tail (in your opinion) received legal rights to control the dog itself ... what
        So yes, I have to ask two more questions to your level of educational program:
        1. What do you (personally) know about the Air Defense Password Change Grid?
        2. Do you (personally) have any relation to service in the air defense?
        In answer to these two questions, I’m interested (I will not hide), because I want to understand when, by whom and how You have been "recruited" to control a dog's own tail.
        hi
        1. Terenin
          Terenin 3 November 2019 22: 17
          +6
          Quote: K-36
          So yes, I have to ask two more questions to your level of educational program:
          1. What do you (personally) know about the Air Defense Password Change Grid?
          2. Do you (personally) have any relation to service in the air defense?
          I am interested in answering these two questions (I will not hide), because I want to understand when, by whom and how you were "recruited" under the theory of controlling a dog's own tail.

          Yes, I’m not good at it. Sorry if you hit nonsense hi . I took the information from open sources http://rusonline.org/opinions/kak-s-400-zashchishcheny-ot-kopirovaniya-v-turcii-i-kitae
          1. K-36
            K-36 3 November 2019 23: 59
            0
            You know, Terenin, I even breathed a sigh of relief. For still NEVER ANYTHING on this forum I didn’t try to call so deliberately (excuse me) empty-bones. I am sincerely glad that you took me away from such a radical (for me) act!
            I have a personal request for you: do not rush to upload information that is not verified... Moreover, the forum allows you to clarify the information from the specialists, of whom there are enough here. After all, specialists, in the event of an obvious blizzard, will certainly bring you to the rank ... (well, "chatterbox" is still divine, but they can also assign the rank of "fakecomet", which is much worse for further communication what ).
            Well, in fact, your delusion about the "omnipotence" of the "Password" subsystem. She is always on any air defense system is in the observation radar station (referred to as the SRTs, SOC, etc.). Its purpose is to monitor the air around the complex itself (SAM). Moreover, in a radio range that differs from the range of operation of the firing complex itself, which (SOC, SRC) records all civil aircraft within its reach. It also includes the interrogator "friend or foe" for each aircraft. The operator of this station enters the results of inquiries into a special log with the date and time. But in the event that an aircraft appears in the field of view without the correct answer, it immediately notifies the commander of the air defense missile system (and the higher chiefs of airspace tracking stations). And then the higher headquarters decides which of the regiment / brigade / division air defense systems to assign this target. Then they will urgently figure out (who, why and why) and make a decision (shoot down or not). Something like this.
            In the case of hijacking an aircraft from our airspace abroad (even with the correct "answer"), the command "Destroy the target!" Will unambiguously follow the combat aircraft, but on the civilian board the decision will be made already in high political offices. Actually, why am I saying all this? Any aircraft captured by the air defense missile system for "auto tracking" will be shot down, regardless of the signal from the responder of this aircraft according to the "Password" system, if the command "Target No. ... destroy!" Is sent to the air defense missile system that captured it "in the crosshairs"
            hi
            1. Terenin
              Terenin 4 November 2019 00: 32
              +7
              ... After all, experts, in the event of an obvious blizzard, will certainly bring you to the rank ... (well, "chatterbox" is still divine, but they can also assign the rank of "fakecomet", which is much worse for further communication what)

              They’ll do it right, I myself would do that.

              Thanks for the clarification on the SAM. Feels like "inside" were hi
              1. K-36
                K-36 4 November 2019 01: 31
                +1
                Feels like "inside" were
                Yes, I was. And in the summer of 1980, like all my friends at that time, lieutenants, for the first time faced a situation when the commander of my 1st battery of the S-125 air defense missile system had only to receive the command "from above", which would sound like this: "Slave", target No. xxx destroy. "" Slave "is the call sign of my 12th air defense missile launcher, which was guarding the port of Ilyichevsk near Odessa. And the plane designated for our division as" target #xxx "is the Soviet An-24 (in the" salon "version), on which our diplomats flew outside the corridor to Turkey. muddler the co-pilot at the designated time did not change the quartz of the responder "friend or foe" (and, therefore, correct answer at a specific time our observation station P-12 did not receive from him). So he got into the "gentle hands" of the air defense. And it so happened that it was at this time that my division, on the orders of the Odessa brigade, was on duty. Therefore, we had to put our missiles on "pairing", which for the uninitiated means: the missiles are powered, the gyroscopes are untwisted, the missile beams are directed strictly in the direction of the beam pattern of the guidance antenna. The only thing left is to press the "START" button.
                Fortunately, the "top" sorted it out in time (and there was less than a minute before the violator crossed the sea border 12 miles, and these seconds pulled us into a string), and the command "End of combat work" sounded. After the state of "nervous tic" (shoot, chi no ???) everyone embraced in joy. And by one o'clock in the morning they violated discipline in the most insidious way and took on the chest (in agreement with the commander of their battery) 75 grams of medical alcohol. They took care of the snack before that, of course. For no one took off duty from the battalion, And if something happened again, we must again be the first to report that we are ready to "repel anyone." Something like this.
                I am very glad Terenin that you yourself have returned to sanity. Sincerely.
                hi
    4. Tank hard
      Tank hard 2 November 2019 17: 49
      +1
      Quote: Lapunevsky
      And if in Serbia God forbid the "democratic Maidan", the government will change as in Ukraine to a pro-American one, then these Shells and C-400 will immediately stick to American specialists, they will take it apart to a screw.

      To tears! laughing
    5. Son of sorts
      Son of sorts 2 November 2019 23: 10
      +1
      At least let them take apart molecules. In such systems, the highest mathematics rules. Iron cannot surprise them. Then such systems are made in blocks, opened the block, and there is porridge from the boards, and the porridge "boils" right before our eyes. The main thing is mathematics, and this is open, do not open, do not pull out in any way.
      1. Pilat2009
        Pilat2009 4 November 2019 12: 24
        0
        Quote: Son of Rod
        Then such systems are made in blocks, opened the block, and there is porridge from the boards, and the porridge "boils" right before our eyes. The main thing is mathematics, and this is open, do not open, do not pull out in any way.

        Which did not stop the Chinese from cloning the S-300. You know, it reminded me of Japanese tape recorders of the 80s, where also "when opening a porridge from the boards"
  5. parkello
    parkello 2 November 2019 12: 50
    +3
    but how much does it cost even request ? maybe they can pick up some money, for him recourse
  6. AB
    AB 2 November 2019 12: 51
    -15
    Turkey, Serbia. Who is next? Arming NATO with our weapons and renaming the Warsaw Pact? It seems from the smell of money, in the defense industry of Russia, the roof goes ...
    1. Lapunevsky
      Lapunevsky 2 November 2019 13: 00
      -7
      Where is the smell of money? We give everything on credit. Moreover, the bank creditor is also Russia itself. And the debts must still be returned from the buyer. And how the Kremlin can write off billions of dollars in debt to other countries - I think everything is in the know.
      1. Jerk
        Jerk 2 November 2019 13: 16
        +4
        For example, after the "write-off" (in fact, restructuring) of debts (most of them are hopeless times in the USSR), immediately on the forum we signed contracts with the same ones from whom they wrote off - for 13 billion, and not only we take money, but and resources. This is to those that were before. We were able to exchange practically irrevocable nothing for a completely tangible and useful something.
        And one more thing: this is a worldwide practice. The same China, Pakistan and the Philippines, not to mention the same Africa, wrote off tens of times a large amount, and so, now it is called in the USA the Chinese occupation of these regions.
        Do not write this in manuals?
        1. Kenxnumx
          Kenxnumx 2 November 2019 13: 53
          -7
          But in the training manual they don’t write what to conclude debts on 13 mld and make a profit on 13 mld not the same thing? What profit will be there and whether it will be is a question. They invested in oil production in Venezuela, and now where is it and what they have extracted do not know where to put it. And they will receive lured offices in Africa - you will benefit from this. Not to mention the fact that the same Africa gave new loans. Maybe it's better to invest in Russia and forgive debts to the Russian regions? And what China wrote off a big secret - they do not publish information in principle. But the fact that they bring their workers to countries that owe them and develop resources themselves is a fact. Do we have a lot of extra workers? Maybe extra warriors for different PMCs
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      2. hrapon
        hrapon 4 November 2019 10: 46
        0
        I see my plus for you is not good. Maybe you have a pebble in your boot?
  7. SERGEY SERGEEVICS
    SERGEY SERGEEVICS 2 November 2019 12: 55
    +2
    How professionally ours worked, well done, excellent. At the same time, now the Slavic Serbs brothers are taught to work professionally.
    1. parkello
      parkello 2 November 2019 13: 06
      +1
      they are diligent students, learn fast, and study well. wink
  8. Alien From
    Alien From 2 November 2019 12: 55
    -8
    Well, why do we always sell to the detriment of ourselves, and mattresses to our advantage ????
    1. Andrey Chistyakov
      Andrey Chistyakov 2 November 2019 13: 04
      0
      Quote: Alien From
      Well, why do we always sell to the detriment of ourselves, and mattresses to our advantage ????

      Well yes. Why China and Turkey bought themselves to their detriment. And the Indians are on the way ...
      1. Alien From
        Alien From 2 November 2019 13: 06
        -3
        They don’t buy much for real money, that’s the essence of the matter .....
        1. hrapon
          hrapon 4 November 2019 10: 51
          0
          Do you know what the EBRD is? This is such an office created to give loans to those who do not have enough of their own to buy other people's expensive toys. The overwhelming majority of transactions for the purchase of expensive weapons or equipment in the Western world are carried out through "tied" loans. Don't be upset over trifles.
          1. Alien From
            Alien From 4 November 2019 11: 54
            -1
            Thank you of course) tired of the Holodrans frankly!
  9. Berkut24
    Berkut24 2 November 2019 12: 57
    +3
    Taking into account the distance of detection and destruction, I think that all the neighbors around were "impressed" during the exercise.
    In a good way, it would be necessary to set up a good all-round radar and a wiretapping station with data transmission to Russia. A very favorable position for intelligence in the middle of Europe.
    1. Good_Anonymous
      Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 13: 45
      -5
      Quote: Berkut24
      In a good way, it would be necessary to set up a good all-round radar and a wiretapping station with data transmission to Russia. A very favorable position for intelligence in the middle of Europe.


      But what about the Radar Container? She sees everything at 3000km.
      1. Berkut24
        Berkut24 2 November 2019 14: 18
        -1
        1) Not a circular view
        2) Low data accuracy
        3) Over range
        4) Absolutely not for mountainous terrain.
        5) Consumes energy as a third of all Serbia.
  10. Good_Anonymous
    Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 12: 59
    -5
    Serbian fighters


    I wonder what kind of fighter.
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 2 November 2019 13: 08
      -8
      Even more interesting are the 26 missiles spent on 14 targets.
      1. Andrey Chistyakov
        Andrey Chistyakov 2 November 2019 13: 11
        +11
        Quote: voyaka uh
        Even more interesting are the 26 missiles spent on 14 targets.

        Have "Patriot" tried to count in Saudi Arabia?
      2. Good_Anonymous
        Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 13: 12
        -1
        Apparently, not every missile launched 2 missiles.
      3. Kenxnumx
        Kenxnumx 2 November 2019 13: 55
        -3
        As far as I remember, Osa-M worked on two rockets as standard
        1. voyaka uh
          voyaka uh 2 November 2019 13: 57
          -2
          And Patriot on 2 works. There is simply no change in C-400 in this
          plan compared to C-300. The same rockets. What these teachings have confirmed.
          1. sivuch
            sivuch 2 November 2019 14: 06
            +1
            40Н6 and 9М96 already release
      4. Romario_Argo
        Romario_Argo 3 November 2019 14: 17
        0
        The most interesting. what are electronic launches
        and since it was not delivered a full division but only 4 PU = 16 missiles
        and the fact that the Serbs simply fighter ran out, so only 14 goals are struck
        and 26 consumption, it’s like with virtual controllers
    2. parkello
      parkello 2 November 2019 13: 11
      +1
      29 MiGs recourse ... you might think they have some more ?! request
      1. Good_Anonymous
        Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 13: 13
        -2
        They definitely had their own production fighters. I don’t know how now.
        1. Nycomed
          Nycomed 2 November 2019 14: 02
          0
          They did not have fighters of their own production. There were TCB / UBS: "Yastreb", "Galeb", "Super Galeb". Even exported. Together with the Romanians, they made the J-22 "Orao" fighter-bomber with old English engines. Outwardly it resembles "Jaguar", but only outwardly and only reminds.
          1. Good_Anonymous
            Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 14: 09
            -2
            Below on the branch is the composition of the Serbian Air Force. There are simply no 24 fighters in your understanding of the word.

            Quote: Nycomed
            Together with the Romanians made the J-22 "Orao" fighter-bomber


            Wow, a fighter. Standing in service.
            1. Nycomed
              Nycomed 2 November 2019 14: 18
              0
              First: you spoke about "own-made fighters". A fighter-bomber is not really a fighter, let's just say: not a fighter at all. And in the link you have given, he is generally designated as an attack aircraft, although he is not an attack aircraft either. Something like this. hi
              1. Good_Anonymous
                Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 14: 35
                -3
                Quote: Nycomed
                You talked about "self-made fighters"


                Yes, here I was mistaken - I mixed Yugoslavia with Czechoslovakia (there they made the MiG-21).

                Quote: Nycomed
                a fighter-bomber, it’s not quite a fighter, let's say this: not a fighter at all


                Yes, Captain, of course. But they are still called that. And they are called "bombers" too.
                1. Nycomed
                  Nycomed 2 November 2019 14: 46
                  0
                  And here is the question of terminology, so it is accepted, for some reason, although what kind of "fighters" are from the F-111 or F-117? And they even pass the index as a "fighter". There is a lot of confusion there, as well as ours.
        2. sivuch
          sivuch 2 November 2019 14: 07
          0
          Galeb are not fighters
          1. Nycomed
            Nycomed 2 November 2019 14: 23
            0
            So I said that this is a line of UTS / UBS. And they have nothing to do with fighters. Fighters to Yugoslavia were supplied by the USSR (MiG-21, MiG-29) and also the States (F-86 "Saber").
    3. Stalllker
      Stalllker 2 November 2019 13: 12
      0
      Who cares?! You can launch any barrel with wings in the form of a target! And just do not need to attach F 35, they only fight well against Barmalev
      1. Dmitry Gundorov
        Dmitry Gundorov 2 November 2019 15: 32
        -1
        According to yours and su-35, it works with the Bormalei, but no, and not that
        1. Stalllker
          Stalllker 2 November 2019 15: 37
          0
          And what does su35 have to do with it? It would be correct to compare su34 and ф35, as su35 and ф22. According to the purpose of the technique
    4. Town Hall
      Town Hall 2 November 2019 13: 19
      0
      The structure of the Serbian Air Force is represented by 2-I air brigades - in Nis and in Batajnica. The 98 Air Brigade in Niš has at its disposal 22 Ј-22 Orao attack aircraft, An-2TD transport aircraft, 2 Mi-8T helicopters, and 15 Aerospatiale Gazelle helicopters of the XT 40M, 42N, 45N, 47, XN, 42, XN versions.

      The 204 airborne brigade in Batainitsa is equipped with three MiG-21 airplanes, the 14 airplanes MiG-29 airplanes, the Yak-40 airplanes, the 20 air assault aircraft SOKO G-4 Super Galeb and light-transport aircraft Dornier Do-28XN. There are also 2 helicopters Mi-2В-17 and 5 helicopters Aerospatiale Gazelle modifications ХТ 15, ХН 40М, 42М and 45, ХО 47 and 42, ХИ 45.
  11. Terenin
    Terenin 2 November 2019 13: 11
    +4
    . Palmer: We hope that our Serbian partners are aware of this and will be careful with such operations.

    Well, we are sure that you are also aware and will be careful when deciding on irresponsible flights, in your interests, in the area of ​​our air defense systems.
    1. Good_Anonymous
      Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 13: 16
      -3
      Quote: Terenin
      in the range of our air defense systems.


      Ahem. Actually, the air defense systems will be Serbian.
      1. Terenin
        Terenin 2 November 2019 13: 40
        +5
        Quote: Good_Anonymous
        Quote: Terenin
        in the range of our air defense systems.


        Ahem. Actually, the air defense systems will be Serbian.

        Quite right, they will explain, de jure, about the reasons for the use of air defense systems ... yes
        1. Good_Anonymous
          Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 13: 43
          -3

          Quote: Terenin
          they will explain, de jure, about the reasons for the use of air defense systems ...


          And who will actually apply? Give out military secrets.

          PS in "de jure" there is no letter "o".
          1. Terenin
            Terenin 2 November 2019 14: 06
            +4
            Quote: Good_Anonymous
            Quote: Terenin
            they will explain, de jure, about the reasons for the use of air defense systems ...


            And who will actually apply? Give out military secrets.

            PS in "de jure" there is no letter "o".

            Thanks for the comment about de jure hi
            Those with access codes will apply.
            1. Good_Anonymous
              Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 14: 11
              -4
              Quote: Terenin
              Those with access codes will apply.


              And what - the Serbs will not have access codes?
              1. Terenin
                Terenin 2 November 2019 14: 38
                +3
                Quote: Good_Anonymous
                Quote: Terenin
                Those with access codes will apply.


                And what - the Serbs will not have access codes?

                If you drive trolling, you will be upset to the point of impossibility. If you really don't know, then I briefly explain that the transmitting side "clogs" the data on its aircraft and adjusts other parameters of the air defense systems. Therefore, the missiles of the complex will not be able to shoot down these aircraft. You cannot reconfigure.
                1. Good_Anonymous
                  Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 14: 41
                  -3
                  Quote: Terenin
                  And what - the Serbs will not have access codes?

                  If you drive trolling, you will be upset to the impossibility.


                  I won’t. So what about access codes?

                  Quote: Terenin
                  I briefly explain that the transmitting side “clogs” the data on its aircraft and adjusts other parameters of the air defense systems. Therefore, the missiles of the complex will not be able to shoot down these aircraft.


                  Perfectly. So the Serbs will have access codes? If somebody else will have them - will they be able to "use" the air defense system? If so, how?
                  1. Terenin
                    Terenin 2 November 2019 14: 57
                    +4
                    Quote: Good_Anonymous
                    Quote: Terenin
                    And what - the Serbs will not have access codes?

                    If you drive trolling, you will be upset to the impossibility.


                    I won’t. So what about access codes?

                    Quote: Terenin
                    I briefly explain that the transmitting side “clogs” the data on its aircraft and adjusts other parameters of the air defense systems. Therefore, the missiles of the complex will not be able to shoot down these aircraft.


                    Perfectly. So the Serbs will have access codes? If somebody else will have them - will they be able to "use" the air defense system? If so, how?

                    This is how the MO decides. Just a rocket will not fly into a particular plane.
                    And, 100% guarantee is given only by the insurance policy ... and then only in case of death.
                    1. Good_Anonymous
                      Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 14: 59
                      -2
                      Quote: Terenin
                      Just a rocket will not fly into a particular plane.


                      Those. Serbs will not be able to use C-400 against Russia, it sounds logical. But whether to apply it for all other purposes, they will decide for themselves? Or someone else?
                      1. Terenin
                        Terenin 2 November 2019 18: 16
                        +2
                        Quote: Good_Anonymous
                        Quote: Terenin
                        Just a rocket will not fly into a particular plane.


                        Those. Serbs will not be able to use C-400 against Russia, it sounds logical. But whether to apply it for all other purposes, they will decide for themselves? Or someone else?

                        Good Vasily, well, by golly, like a burdock (do not be offended), answer directly - on which plane, when and for what purpose will you fly to Serbia (or by)? Decide from the Ministry of Defense.
                      2. Good_Anonymous
                        Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 19: 32
                        0
                        Quote: Terenin
                        answer directly - on which plane, when and for what purpose will you fly to Serbia (or by)?


                        If Serbia will sell C-400 - only on Su-57. To avoid.
                      3. ul_vitalii
                        ul_vitalii 2 November 2019 19: 23
                        +2
                        Quote: Good_Anonymous
                        Quote: Terenin
                        Just a rocket will not fly into a particular plane.


                        Those. Serbs will not be able to use C-400 against Russia, it sounds logical. But whether to apply it for all other purposes, they will decide for themselves? Or someone else?

                        Man, I think you are running ahead of the engine, first, pure politics and geopolitics are paramount here, and then it will shoot or not. yes
                        Even having deployed one complex (I’m exaggerating), all of NATO will sit in the back, everything will be visible and illuminated, and all the data that is worth its weight in gold you know where it will go. hi .
                2. K-36
                  K-36 3 November 2019 21: 58
                  0
                  TereninYou post a blatant lie! ( Therefore, the missiles of the complex will not be able to bring down these aircraft. Cannot be reconfigured.)
                  And I don’t understand why you need this ?! After all, you are an outspoken layman in the air defense system. You do not even have an idea in which of the functional components of the systems any air defense system there is such a negligibly small (in fact) auxiliary sub-subsystem, like the transmitter-receiver "friend or foe". So where, in what functional link is this "miracle", which "forbids the complex to shoot at"??? If your answer is correct, then I am sincerely ready to continue to communicate with you as with a sane person. If not, then without a twinge of conscience I can publicly call you ... idle talkers (excuse me).
                  For all readers and commentators of this topic: it was not Terenin (personally) who "got" me, but that the frank lie that he professes here.
                  With respect to the rest of the forum users, hi
  12. _Ugene_
    _Ugene_ 2 November 2019 13: 42
    -3
    14 local air force planes (i.e. more squadrons) simulated the enemy. All of them were conditionally destroyed by C-400 fire, specially delivered from the Russian Federation. This required 26 missiles

    for 2 missiles for an 4 generation aircraft, how many will be needed for an inconspicuous 5 aircraft generation?
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 2 November 2019 13: 55
      0
      To shoot one missile at one target, capable of sharp
      maneuver (like a fighter), we need other missiles.
      It is necessary that her engine last stage worked until the last
      (like explosives). Need IR scanning seeker and gas steering wheels.
      1. sivuch
        sivuch 2 November 2019 14: 08
        +1
        and an active radar head, like on 9M96, will not suit you
      2. _Ugene_
        _Ugene_ 2 November 2019 14: 09
        0
        those. a fighter can escape from an 1 rocket, but isn’t it possible from an 2?
        1. voyaka uh
          voyaka uh 3 November 2019 00: 14
          0
          The second rocket is launched a little later than the first. When a fighter makes a sharp turn,
          then the first missile can lose it, and the second picks up the target already on a different trajectory.
          To shoot down from the first missile, it must be made much more complex in design -
          three-speed (including a booster) with gas rudders. And not enough
          Only active radar in GOS. Especially if the target is stealth.
          It is safer to see the target with an IR video camera. She also transmits
          telemetry interception to the ground.
          1. aszzz888
            aszzz888 3 November 2019 01: 38
            0
            voyaka uh (Alexey) Today, 00: 14 NEW
            -1
            The second rocket is launched a little later than the first. When a fighter makes a sharp turn,
            then the first rocket can lose it, and the second picks up the target

            Who would have thought!)) laughing laughing laughing It would be necessary to emboss the dissertation! wassat wassat wassat
      3. Good_Anonymous
        Good_Anonymous 2 November 2019 14: 15
        -2
        Quote: voyaka uh
        To shoot one missile at one target capable of a sharp maneuver (like a fighter), you need other missiles.


        Formally, it is not necessary to always shoot with two missiles, it is possible and one - just the probability of defeat will be less. Obviously, in the maneuvers mentioned, one missile was fired only for some purposes - which is why it is interesting what types of aircraft participated. If different - this could explain the different consumption of missiles. Or the control computer determined that in some conditions a sufficient probability of defeat is achieved by one missile.
  13. Kenxnumx
    Kenxnumx 2 November 2019 13: 58
    -3
    This is called advertising.
  14. internal enemy
    internal enemy 2 November 2019 14: 05
    -7
    Yes, more likely with 400 they will destroy it until it hits the first plane
  15. evgen1221
    evgen1221 2 November 2019 14: 29
    +1
    More such visual presentations.
  16. Free Island
    Free Island 2 November 2019 14: 31
    0
    Belgrade talking about the purchase
  17. 1970mk
    1970mk 2 November 2019 14: 57
    0
    I am very surprised by the fact of praise ...... for one reason .... The C-300 for decades has been in service - not a single really knocked down target ..... C-400 is the same thing ..... The tricky question arises of how this system will behave under real conditions ... VERY BIG QUESTION!
    1. huntsman650
      huntsman650 2 November 2019 15: 49
      0
      It all depends on interference immunity, the main task of c-400 is the fight against avax. They hung with impunity over Yugoslavia and aimed aviation at targets.
    2. meandr51
      meandr51 3 November 2019 23: 05
      0
      And which systems generally shot down something? Tell us about the Patriots or SM-2 ...
      1. 1970mk
        1970mk 3 November 2019 23: 10
        0
        Don't drive the fool! Patriots badly and well for "a hundred years" really worked like ... And they modernize them based on combat experience ..... No? Then you are a GENIUS! good
        1. meandr51
          meandr51 4 November 2019 13: 30
          0
          And what have they accumulated over 100 years, apart from waste? What is their real effectiveness against the Scuds in Israel?
          1. 1970mk
            1970mk 4 November 2019 16: 07
            0
            Stop talking nonsense! For what would be the real effectiveness in Israel ..... small or large ..... neither C-400 nor C-400 this real efficiency is simply ZERO! Never in decades have they shot at real targets ... Not a single real target has been shot down in decades. Fershteyn? Or still not getting it?
            1. meandr51
              meandr51 4 November 2019 21: 13
              0
              It comes to the fact that you have no idea about the probability of defeat and effectiveness. C-300, 400 therefore do not shoot at real targets, because there are no goals, the goals are afraid of them. That's when, for example, Israel will be massively bombed by the Syrian C-300, then you can judge something.
              And if you proceed from your logic, then Trident and Governor have zero efficiency. And in general it is not known if they have YABCh ...
              1. 1970mk
                1970mk 5 November 2019 01: 01
                0
                My dear My .... you still start telling me about airplanes ..... starting with the Mig-23 generation and on ... Su ... Mig .... lay out the real numbers how many died and where .... . compared with Ф-16, 18, etc. In fights ...
                Enough about rackets fairy tales then poison. Ours with racquets, for example, anti-ship missiles, were getting laid off already in the Middle East conflicts .... There are no goals))) There can be no impenetrable air defense ... and what couldn’t be fired can never be the best.
  18. Aleksandar Strichevich
    Aleksandar Strichevich 2 November 2019 16: 54
    +1
    How nice it is when an older brother protects a younger ... Thank you Russia!
  19. Armata T-14
    Armata T-14 2 November 2019 17: 23
    -1
    Better give the Serbs thermonuclear warheads and hypersonic missiles
  20. Doliva63
    Doliva63 2 November 2019 17: 24
    -1
    "The military exercises recently held in Serbia with the Russian Federation demonstrated the high efficiency of the S-400 air defense system. Belgrade, impressed by this anti-aircraft missile system, is studying the possibility of acquiring it."
    In fact, an outlet, not an exercise. laughing Oh well. Advertising.
  21. K-36
    K-36 2 November 2019 18: 10
    0
    Quote: Lapunevsky
    Very interesting theory. Do engineers personally tell you these secret things? Something I do not believe in such tales about algorithms. If the Syrian air defense knock down our intelligence with the most modern equipment, then what can I talk about, and what algorithms? And the very device of missiles, engines, guidance systems - all this is also important for enemy reconnaissance. And not just software.


    Frankly, I am very surprised by the five (at this point in time) minuses to this very robust post of yours. I would very much like to discuss with those of the minusers who are not afraid to openly appear.
    On the occasion of the IL-20 you mentioned, shot down by the Syrian C-200 complex, I can only assume 2 are reasonable versions.
    1. how most likely version... The Il-20 aircraft is uniquely equipped with modern RF equipment of the "friend or foe" responder. And the Syrian S-200 was equipped with the Syrian responder, the codes (and the Password Change Grid !!!) which do not coincide with the Russian ones. Which was the reason for the opening of fire on a target that did not respond to the request "friend or foe"
    2. There is no (unambiguously !!!) prohibition on firing at a target that even answered correctly to the request "friend or foe" on the S-200. This "response" has only an informational / consulting meaning for the guidance officer of this complex (the so-called "double" target mark on the VICO). In a situation of suddenness of an event and its transience, adrenaline splashes out in every person. So he can interfere with concentration and concentration of attention (in this case, the Syrian C-200 guidance officer). The result is erroneous fire.
    PS I think your post is very reasonable and I am happy to put "+" yes
    hi
  22. Gennady Fomkin
    Gennady Fomkin 2 November 2019 18: 22
    0
    laughing
    Quote: inner enemy
    Yes, more likely with 400 they will destroy it until it hits the first plane

    Prior to this, Manhattan will be a pile of smoking radioactive firebrands.
  23. Nikolay87
    Nikolay87 2 November 2019 19: 23
    0
    C-400 in the center of Europe ... a scan in a radius of 500 km))) all the invisibility will be at gunpoint.
  24. Pavel57
    Pavel57 3 November 2019 16: 50
    0
    C-300 did not have time to put before the war.