Military Review

Office Nabiullina at the end of the year raised the key rate

200
Today, the country's main financial regulator announced an increase in the key rate. From Monday (December 17) it will be 7,75% per annum. The increase thus amounted to a quarter percentage point. At the moment, the rate of the Central Bank - 7,5%.




By the way, this is already the second increase in the key rate this year. Experts believe that the Bank of Russia has made such a decision due to the fact that it fears possible sharp jumps in the ruble exchange rate in the last weeks of the current year and in the first weeks of the next year. At the same time, many believe that if no negative consequences for the Russian national currency show up during this time, the office of Elvira Nabiullina may return the key rate to its current level in February already.

All these forecasts of economic "gurus" actually look like fortune telling on the tea leaves. About two months ago, forecasters from the economy asserted that by the end of the year oil could exceed the price mark in 90 dollars per barrel (Brent mark). Today, oil is traded in the 60 area of ​​US dollars per barrel, sometimes sagging lower. In this case, the barrel jumps are quite impressive. In the past weeks, subsidence has sometimes reached 6%.

Now financiers are watching how the Russian ruble will react to the decision of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation. It was on the “stability of the course,” as noted at the Bank of Russia at these moments, that today's decision was primarily directed.
Photos used:
https://ru.depositphotos.com
200 comments
Ad

Subscribe to our Telegram channel, regularly additional information about the special operation in Ukraine, a large amount of information, videos, something that does not fall on the site: https://t.me/topwar_official

Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. Blackmokona
    Blackmokona 14 December 2018 14: 12
    +10
    Two steps forward, three steps back ......
    1. ancestors from Don
      ancestors from Don 14 December 2018 14: 23
      +8
      The Central Bank of Russia is an IMF branch (((, it acts under their dictation and in their interests ((((Russia needs to apply the experience of restoring the national economy after the Second World War, but for this, the main condition is to return the remnants of property stolen from the people to state administration and nationalize banks and mineral deposits, just don’t say that this is a new civil war ((((which one of you will defend the modern nouveau riche? ... so where does this civil war come from, modern thieves capitalists will quietly drive over the hill.
      1. solzh
        solzh 14 December 2018 14: 29
        +16
        Quote: ancestors from the Don
        Russia needs to apply the experience of restoring the national economy after the Second World War

        To do this, the government must switch to the Soviet type of economy, and this means giving up capitalism. And who of the government and the oligarchy will go on the rejection of their profits? None.
        1. Serge Gorely
          Serge Gorely 14 December 2018 14: 35
          +17
          Like it or not, but Elvira still - all of Nabiu ...
          1. SSR
            SSR 14 December 2018 15: 25
            +4
            Quote: Serge Gorely
            Like it or not, but Elvira still - all of Nabiu ...

            Elvira is just a gear))) The Central Bank, in its person, is trying to keep the ruble in NG amid rising VAT, services and utilities tariffs, and fuel prices.
            Sew with white thread on black. Guardians of figs.
          2. mojohed2012
            mojohed2012 14 December 2018 17: 31
            +6
            Too shy to ask! And raising the key rate will help citizens against the backdrop of an illogical and surrealistic increase in VAT, a hidden increase in fuel prices, conspiracy of retailers about a pre-New Year price increase for products, and after NG they will increase even more, explaining VAT and fuel ...
            But they don't care. They have children abroad, their money is not in Russia, and at home, by the way, in London or the USA, on dummies. They have nothing to worry about, but for now, they are sitting and living well.
        2. Hammerlock
          Hammerlock 14 December 2018 15: 16
          +4
          when will Devil call them, ghouls
        3. RL
          RL 14 December 2018 15: 34
          -2
          Do you go to the polls, or do you choose? Is your hut on the edge?
          1. For example
            For example 14 December 2018 19: 06
            +2
            Another stubborn one. wassat
            Elections laughing

            Homosapiens, you campaign in France. Now is the time.
            And do not forget to say that Russians and Putin personally are to blame. laughing
            1. DymOk_v_dYmke
              DymOk_v_dYmke 14 December 2018 23: 43
              0
              Another stubborn one. wassat
              Election laughing

              Homosapiens, you campaign in France. Now is the time.
              And do not forget to say that Russians and Putin personally are to blame. laughing

              Emptiness.
              Either vote for the minimum of evils, or, excuse me, keep quiet.
        4. Comrade Beria
          Comrade Beria 14 December 2018 16: 14
          -6
          Quote: solzh
          To do this, the government should switch to the Soviet type of economy,

          About the deceased or good, or the truth, right?

          If the Soviet economy was efficient and balanced in groups A and B, did not work for itself, and would be more focused on meeting the needs of people, then the USSR would not only not fall apart, but would flourish to this day.

          It was the stupor of the Soviet economy that was the root cause of the collapse of the USSR.
          1. aybolyt678
            aybolyt678 14 December 2018 18: 52
            +2
            Quote: Comrade Beria
            It was the stupor of the Soviet economy that was the root cause of the collapse of the USSR.

            Stupor, Latin brake. The top braked through was made up of agents from the CIA and the NSA. This elite did not see the whole picture of the world, the whole world for them was a continuous class struggle, where in any conflict one of the parties dreamed of becoming Soviet.
            In addition, the complete lack of work to improve planning, identify trends, trends in the global economy, and psychological work with people. Communism was turned into a dogmatic religion .... It was the lack of truthful information about world problems that became the root cause of the collapse of the USSR. This is precisely what is becoming the root cause of today's problems in Russia. The main problem is the lack of enough cheap oil and other resources for global prosperity.
            1. Comrade Beria
              Comrade Beria 14 December 2018 19: 11
              0
              Quote: aybolyt678
              The top braked through was made up of agents from the CIA and the NSA.

              Starting with Khrushchev?
              1. Wolf
                Wolf 14 December 2018 22: 32
                +1
                Namely from Khrushchev! ;)
              2. aybolyt678
                aybolyt678 15 December 2018 22: 36
                0
                Quote: Comrade Beria
                Starting with Khrushchev?

                Khrushchev’s inner circle no doubt acted not in the interests of the country. And in the dark used the explosive and unbalanced character of Nikita Sergeevich. So, for example, before meetings with scientists or cultural workers, he was not enlightened in the essence of the issues discussed, but was provided with incriminating evidence - who calls him what, what anecdotes are told, ... etc. that is, instead of government issues, issues of personal affection or hostility were resolved.
            2. Claymore
              Claymore 14 December 2018 21: 34
              +1
              Quote: aybolyt678
              The top braked through was made up of agents from the CIA and the NSA. This elite did not see the whole picture of the world, the whole world for them was a continuous class struggle
              So what was that?

              Was the top braked (and therefore did not understand what it was doing)?

              The top ranks consisted of agents from the CIA and the NSA (and therefore perfectly understood what they were doing)?

              Or was the elite adequate and sharing a communist ideology, but the perception of reality from a class perspective prevented it from seeing the whole picture of the world (and therefore Marxist-Leninist theory and Stalin were wrong)?

              Maybe you’ve already decided what really happened? lol
              After all, in one sentence you manage to give out 3 options, each of which contradicts the other 2.
              1. Wolf
                Wolf 14 December 2018 22: 38
                -1
                Marx beat ............ He could create an ideology on the foundation of a man without a soul, only a demon could. Marx ileologist was beaten by the fact that the bi confused the man from the right of the put. Socialism eats better than humanity, but socialism where man with his soul is the foundation.
                1. Claymore
                  Claymore 14 December 2018 22: 59
                  0
                  1 Ideology, which is the aggregate of a system of values ​​and worldview, always appears as a natural response to environmental stimuli — it cannot be created, it can only be formulated and systematized.

                  2 To claim as a fact the existence of an unproven (for example, soul) can only be either liars pursuing selfish goals, or infantile individuals who are stuck in their emotional development at the fifth-grader level.
                  1. Wolf
                    Wolf 14 December 2018 23: 16
                    -1
                    Marx formulated demonic ideology! I am a petoklasnik but my soul eats. Ideology where most of his work is against a simple peasant (agricultural) and where he did not think about the banking interest and the parasites of the demon's world banking. The foundation of your ideology WILL DESTROY A FREE MAN AND HIS FAMILY. Disgusting bastard he beat and not cholovek. There are no cholovek, just corvus and meat, it is much more than clothes. Ask Marx how the percentage of capital goes and why. This was not a problem for him! I probably infatilni but Marx beat an idiot. God besides the Soul also eats, but Marx "did not see" it!
                    1. Claymore
                      Claymore 14 December 2018 23: 23
                      +1
                      And what is demonic about it - the position "who does not work, he does not eat"? laughing

                      And what is freedom expressed in your understanding - the ability to write unsubstantiated nonsense about demons and call fantasies about the soul facts?
                      1. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 02: 15
                        +2
                        Claymore can argue lehko.
                      2. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 02: 33
                        0
                        For 200 years, fantasy has been beating the earth that the earth has been circling around the Sun, but today you probably know that Shchemlya circling near the Sun. Soul and God are not proof? You know, every word among the people has a real reason. He didn’t get anything, he noticed or saw. Itd ........ If eating the WORD OF GOD AND SOUL then they EAT. Can you bring it like a dogma, or can you think of it if you want it? And as they say from the beginning beat WORD?
                      3. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 15 December 2018 02: 48
                        +1
                        Quote: Wolf
                        00 years of fortune was beaten by the imagination that the earth grows around the Sun,

                        Lies. repeat Here, fly on a plane, look at one point, and fly away ... over the horizon ...
                      4. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 02: 51
                        0
                        And what's the problem ? Does the earth rotate around its axis?
                        Or is it a lie?
                      5. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 02: 53
                        0
                        Sve moves no that stillness.
                      6. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 15 December 2018 02: 54
                        +3
                        Quote: Wolf
                        Or is it a lie?

                        But what about! The congress of supporters of the theory of flat land has all been scientifically proven. repeat But you don’t believe ...
                      7. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 03: 00
                        0
                        laughing wink tongue
                      8. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 15 December 2018 03: 03
                        +1
                        Quote: Wolf
                        laughing wink tongue

                        What are we doing? Here in California, a congress of the theory of flat land gathered. repeat They scientifically substantiated everything there. fellow
                      9. Wolf
                        Wolf 16 December 2018 17: 40
                        +1
                        Yes, and that, you can sell Americanos, they are dumb as a hammer. With SLAVEN on another not stupid, ali gullible and naive. This is the difference between him and us. So Marx managed to sell us his invalid ideology.
                        Live beat
                      10. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 03: 20
                        +1
                        Today I know that the Earth moves in space after the Sun, making revolutions around the trajectory of its movement.

                        What has been attributed to the action of divine powers for thousands of years is now explained in an experimental way by science, and for the divine there is less and less space.
                        And this, in turn, makes it possible to extrapolate to the future and declare that the existence of the force that is called God in religions is extremely unlikely.

                        Thus, the reality of the existence of such substances as "soul" and "God" is not only not proven, but the very hypothesis of their existence is increasingly refuted every day.

                        If eating the WORD GOD AND SOUL then they EAT
                        These are not just words - these are words with a specific semantic content that mark supposedly existing objects with specific properties.

                        And all the experience of human civilization at the moment tells us that the probability of the existence of these objects tends to zero.
                      11. Wolf
                        Wolf 16 December 2018 17: 32
                        +1
                        Claymore wit smart man, think it over !!! THREADS DO NOT BEAT ONE WORD IN PEOPLE AND OLD EZIKS WITHOUT A REAL BASIS !!! According to this, one made English, German, etc. ezik. EZIK VERY IMPORTANT FOR THE RIGHT WORLDWIDE. For this reason, you regularly receive the names of the reform of the Pisma and the Hesik. The people never beat dumb. Aziti still use the famous letter and there are no problems. Thrllo please pity.
                      12. Wolf
                        Wolf 16 December 2018 17: 44
                        +2
                        I ASK YOU PLEASURE MAKE ONE NEW WORD !!! Katoro will be used by Ludmies.
                      13. Claymore
                        Claymore 16 December 2018 19: 20
                        0
                        I can give an example of such a word - synchrophasotron.
                      14. Claymore
                        Claymore 16 December 2018 19: 18
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        THREADS DO NOT BEAT ONE WORD IN PEOPLE AND OLD EZIKS WITHOUT A REAL BASIS !!!
                        And can you prove it?


                        Once again - when some Greek Greek saw lightning 3000 years ago, he explained this by the fact that one of the gods throws fire arrows.

                        Do you now also believe that lightning is a fiery arrow?



                        The ancient Jews believed that the sky is a firmament (solid substance), and this so-called "knowledge" migrated to Christianity.

                        Do you continue to believe that the sky is solid?
                      15. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 02: 41
                        0
                        Claymore vi disturb worldview and words. Lightning and eats fire arrow. Old Elin told the truth and rule the WORDS. Sasvim the second question, where do you get the lightning from the arrow is already a worldview or understanding of the world. The WORD itself is not MISTAKING!
                      16. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 02: 44
                        0
                        As for the synchrophasotron :) :) :) did you come up with this word? and on the basis of what?
                        :)
                      17. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 02: 48
                        0
                        What the old Yudeyi believed was a worldview, THE WORD IS SKY UNMISTABLE, SKY IS!
                      18. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 02: 59
                        0
                        So she ARROWS, and FIRE he EATES!
                      19. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 03: 06
                        0
                        So for an example for the WORDS OF SKY, ARROW, FIRE EATES REALLY BASIS!
                      20. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 03: 28
                        0
                        So, from the beginning, it really beats something, and then the floods give names to the children or the WORD.
                      21. Claymore
                        Claymore 17 December 2018 08: 36
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        As for the synchrophasotron :) :) :) did you come up with this word?
                        Not me.

                        and on the basis of what?
                        This is the original name of what is called the hadron collider in our time.

                        Quote: Wolf
                        What the old Yudeyi believed was a worldview, THE WORD IS SKY UNMISTABLE, SKY IS!
                        The Jews believed that the sky is, that it is solid, and that the stars are "bolted" to it.

                        In fact, there is no sky, but there is a space above the surface of the Earth, filled with a multi-kilometer layer of various gases.

                        Quote: Wolf
                        So she ARROWS, and FIRE he EATES!
                        And there is an arrow, and there is fire.

                        But lightning is neither an arrow nor fire, but the reason for its occurrence is not a bearded man with supernormal abilities.

                        Quote: Wolf
                        So for an example for the WORDS OF SKY, ARROW, FIRE EATES REALLY BASIS!
                        Yes.

                        But these words themselves (their meaning) are a completely incorrect interpretation of reality.

                        Quote: Wolf
                        So, from the beginning, it really beats something, and then the floods give names to the children or the WORD.
                        The question is precisely what exactly is in reality and to what extent the meaning contained in the "name" reflects reality.

                        The words "arrow" and "fire", pronounced in relation to lightning, do not reflect reality at all.
                      22. Claymore
                        Claymore 17 December 2018 08: 18
                        0
                        1.
                        I clearly distinguish the figurative expression from the essence of the described subject.

                        2.
                        The Greek, who literally spoke, was mistaken, because he did not know what lightning was, and as a consequence he perceived it as ordinary arrow, only fiery.


                        Lightning is neither fire nor arrow, and its source is not a thunder god, who seemed to the Greeks as a bearded, lascivious uncle.

                        The same is with the words "god" and "soul".

                        These words describe categories with specific properties, characteristics and signs (God is the omnipotent and all-knowing creator of the world; the soul is a substance that contains a human personality), which you perceive literally, but not figuratively - you perceive literally despite the fact that these categories and their properties of characteristics and signs not only is not confirmed by anything, but also directly contradicts the entire body of knowledge that mankind currently possesses.
                      23. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 12: 29
                        0
                        Claymore is arguing with you.

                        [quoteBut these words themselves (their meaning) are completely incorrect interpretations of reality.] [/ quote]

                        You know, if bi-vie Nicoli Tesley said about the lightning, that’s what they wrote here, he probably told your quotes. Every lightning in him had its own name.
                        Interpretation of the phenomenon depends on one level of knowledge, but the phenomenon of which the old Elin called the fire arrow, and the lightning of Tesla probably exists in a different way. Old Elin did not think literally, but he could not reach the word lightning. He gave a description of the phenomenon.
                      24. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 12: 36
                        0
                        [quote] The same is with the words "god" and "soul".

                        These words describe categories with specific properties, characteristics and signs (God is the omnipotent and all-knowing creator of the world; the soul is a substance that contains a human personality), which you perceive literally, but not figuratively - you perceive literally despite the fact that these categories and their properties of characteristics and signs not only is not confirmed by anything, but also directly contradicts the entire body of knowledge that mankind currently possesses. / quote]


                        In tribute to the moment, mankind has already reached up to 21 grams of stranog yaavleniya about weight loss in case of death of a man.
                      25. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 12: 56
                        +1
                        The words God and Soul are not described. My people at a given level of knowledge describe their meaning. EZIK ochim is a strong thing, he licks a thread lagging. He is NPR. unmistakably speaks of the history of narola and so on ....
                      26. Claymore
                        Claymore 17 December 2018 18: 41
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        Interpretation of the phenomenon depends on one level of knowledge
                        So.

                        Old Elin did not think literally, but to the word lightning, he could not finish. He gave a description of the phenomenon.
                        Not true

                        The important thing is not what word is used to denote a phenomenon, but what meaning is put into this word.

                        The Greek put a literal meaning - he represented lightning in the form of an arrow consisting of fire, which a bearded uncle named Zeus throws from the mountain.

                        In tribute to the moment, humanity has already reached up to 21 grams of stranog yaavleniya about how much weight at death of a man.
                        Not true

                        1.
                        There are no witnesses of experiments with weighing the bodies of the dead, no one saw a bed for weighing the dead, and the doctor who allegedly conducted this experiment did not have any reports, except for articles sent to the publication.

                        This experiment, which was allegedly carried out at the beginning of the 20th century, was recognized as falsification - http://fakt777.ru/2013/09/blog-post_30.html

                        And 2nd.
                        Even if you conduct an experiment that shows weight loss at the time of death, this weight loss will not be a confirmation of the presence of a soul.

                        Such weight loss can be associated with involuntary deformation, or with the termination of the electrical activity of body cells, which, like any other body with mass, can produce gravity, the strength of which can decrease at the time of death and be fixed in the form of a decrease in weight loss. lol

                        Quote: Wolf
                        Words God and Soul not described
                        Not true - these are words with a strictly defined meaning that describe supposedly existing phenomena with specific characteristics, the existence of which is not confirmed by anything.
                      27. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 20: 34
                        0
                        [quoteWord God and Soul not described

                        Not true - these are words with a strictly defined meaning that describe supposedly existing phenomena with specific characteristics, the existence of which is not supported by anything .quote]


                        In addition to the words and the hezik, they eat Claymore.
                      28. Wolf
                        Wolf 17 December 2018 20: 56
                        0
                        The old people of Slaven had a worldview with the pantheon of gods; they were beaten by many, but they also called them Gods.
                        They divided the world into RIGHTS, JAV AND LIKE. It beat their worldview. These rights beat part of the world of the Gods. Therefore, we are called ORTHODOX. RIGHTS OF GLORIA. At the hezik and his words, arbitrariness and randomness do not break the truth. These RIGHTS and SLAVNY are still free to say they understand the Slavi except Prussians Katori hammered their hezik. Do you think that is by chance? And not proven? Pojam God always beat and he beat on a real basis to Darwin and Marx. Darwin's theory is, of course, a theory that has not been proved. Maybe a bit, he came here, a monkey, who knows, but there is no sign of a man. It is much more likely that the monkeys came to the man of deevoluciomas. Eulucia eats but not in the Darwinian form, it seems like Marx's theory of the truth and part of the box.
                      29. Claymore
                        Claymore 18 December 2018 01: 41
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        In addition to the words and the hezik, they eat Claymore
                        Again not true.

                        Words are a way of conveying information.
                        Words denote certain objects and phenomena - both real and imagined.

                        At the same time, the words themselves do not mean anything and do not prove anything - the same word "god" in different languages ​​is pronounced and spelled differently (god, Θεός, אלוהים., Divinité, gott ...)
                        Thus, in order to understand exactly which phenomenon a particular word denotes, we need to know not so much the word as the meaning put into this word.

                        The meaning of a word denoting a phenomenon is a set of attributes attributed to the phenomenon - that is, the meaning is an interpretation of the phenomenon.
                        And the interpretation can be both true and false.

                        Accordingly, if we are talking about phenomena denoted by the words "god" and "soul", then we are talking about specific interpretations in which God is a real omnipotent and omniscient being who created the universe, and the soul is a kind of indefinite substance-carrier of the human personality.

                        But modern science knows neither omnipotent omniscient beings, nor substances that are carriers of personality.
                        And this means that either earlier the words "god" and "soul" meant something different than now (that is, the modern interpretation of these phenomena is not correct), or these words from the very beginning meant non-existent (mythical) phenomena.
                      30. Wolf
                        Wolf 18 December 2018 03: 18
                        0
                        But modern science knows neither omnipotent omniscient beings, nor substances that are carriers of personality.
                        And this means that either earlier the words "god" and "soul" meant something different than now (that is, the modern interpretation of these phenomena is not correct), or these words from the very beginning meant non-existent (mythical) phenomena.



                        Logically nothing will add here. Vi rightly said modern science knows neither omnipotent omniscient beings, nor substances that are carriers of personality. In the name of the modern Nuke, the same thing as the old Elini did not reach the lightning. Mankind probably needs even times that the bi reached God and the Soul. This does not mean that they are not present, it only shows at what level modern science.
                      31. Wolf
                        Wolf 18 December 2018 03: 24
                        0
                        But God is not dryness.
                      32. Claymore
                        Claymore 18 December 2018 08: 47
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        This does not mean that they are not present, it only shows at what level modern science.
                        But this does not mean that they are.

                        And since modern science knows much more than our distant ancestors (including the Greek, who, as we found out, was greatly mistaken in his interpretations), we can say with confidence that the probability of the real existence of such phenomena as "soul" and " God "is negligible and tends to zero.

                        But God is not dryness
                        How do you know that? lol
                      33. Wolf
                        Wolf 18 December 2018 11: 37
                        0
                        This is my theory, taught by Darwin and Marx.
                      34. Wolf
                        Wolf 18 December 2018 11: 42
                        0
                        The very existence of space is inexplicably modern science. The big question itself: Doesn’t God eat, but where does matter come from?
                      35. Wolf
                        Wolf 18 December 2018 11: 44
                        +1
                        And that one begins, maybe the beat of the old nations, therefore, the word God came?
                      36. Claymore
                        Claymore 18 December 2018 20: 58
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        This is my theory
                        Which one?

                        Quote: Wolf
                        The existence of space itself is inexplicably modern science
                        Yes, so far inexplicable.

                        But science is trying to understand, explain and prove the correctness of this explanation, while religion is engaged in the statement of the unprovable.

                        The big question itself: Doesn’t God eat, but where does matter come from?
                        There is another big question - where does the self-conscious god come from if matter does not exist?

                        Quote: Wolf
                        And that one begins, maybe the beat of the old nations, therefore, the word God came?
                        This could be so if the word "god" meant the unknown (in this sense, the universe could be called a god).

                        But the word "god" always means not the unknown, but a specific person who has certain characteristics, emotions, will, goals, and has superpowers.
                      37. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 02: 58
                        0
                        In order to argue, you first need to answer the 2 questions I asked. )))
                      38. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 03: 00
                        0
                        Reply wait
                      39. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 15 December 2018 03: 05
                        +1
                        Quote: Claymore
                        In order to argue, you first need to answer the 2 questions I asked. )))

                        What is the question? I will answer, no problem.
                      40. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 03: 26
                        0
                        What is demonic in Marxist ideology, and in what freedom is expressed in understanding the subject. )))
                      41. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 15 December 2018 03: 39
                        +1
                        Quote: Claymore
                        What is demonic in Marxist ideology

                        Three hundred percent profit. And Eve bit the apple, and Adam seduced.
                      42. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 03: 58
                        0
                        So neither to Marx, nor to ideology, nor by sleep or spirit. laughing
                      43. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 15 December 2018 04: 20
                        +1
                        Quote: Claymore
                        So neither to Marx, nor to ideology, nor by sleep or spirit.

                        We had one ideology: Lenin, K. Marx, and Engels. And, still Makarenko a portrait hung. wink
                      44. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 03: 06
                        +2
                        On the question of ideology. I see them as something else. The ideologies of katore, incomplete, represent lies and deception. Means if you goaorite the "truth" or not entirely those. do not say something, then the lie is cunning. Easy to find a lie.
                      45. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 15 December 2018 03: 43
                        +2
                        Quote: Wolf
                        It’s easy to discover simple lies.

                        A spoon is good for dinner ..
                      46. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 03: 11
                        +1
                        So someone doesn’t work, he doesn’t eat. There are no problems with this, they just beat the work differently and the children and old people cannot work, and the family should.
                      47. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 03: 35
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        According to the question of ideology. I see them differently
                        No problem, let's get right from the start - what is ideology?

                        Means if you goaorite the "truth" or not entirely those. do not say something, then lie ali cunning
                        Statements that distort reality are a lie (cunning and incompleteness are a kind of lie).

                        Now give an example of a lie in Marxist ideology.

                        Quote: Wolf
                        So someone doesn’t work, he doesn’t eat. There are no problems with this, they just beat the work differently and the children and old people cannot work, and the family should.
                        Therefore, the formula "who does not work, he does not eat" refers only to those who are able to work.
                      48. Wolf
                        Wolf 15 December 2018 03: 35
                        +2
                        Freedom than bend? We differentiate in ways, and one of them when in FIG you are more interested in the interest rate of banks. So I answered the second question about the ideology and Marx. He said plainly often to the truth and most importantly he did not say often. Peasants (agrarian farm) problems are only for bankers and the authorities are not for society. Bankarsky system of interest is a parasite in society. And this system as a parasite destroys its carrier, the bankrupt system with interest does not live in symbiosis with the carrier, it destroys it. Theory of working value is also part of the truth, if ali eats, and the theory of corinism is simply included in the set of truth. So Marx didn’t either know or intentionally deceived, but I think he lied with the intention!
                      49. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 03: 54
                        0
                        Quote: Wolf
                        Freedom than bend? Different ways, and one of them when in FIG you are more than the interest rate of banks
                        And this does not happen - you can’t be in society and not be free from society.

                        The same is with banks - if banks exist, it means there is a need for them, and therefore their actions (including setting a specific level of the interest rate) affect the existence of individuals, and therefore there can’t be any interest in the rate.

                        He said plainly often to the truth and most importantly he did not say often
                        So what exactly did he say, and what exactly did he not say?

                        Bankarsky system of interest is a parasite in society. And this system as a parasite destroys its carrier, the bankrupt system with interest does not live in symbiosis with the carrier, it destroys it
                        This + is true, and Marx in Capital not only talks about it, but also analyzes the mechanisms of parasitism.

                        Theory of working value is also part of the truth, if ali eats, and the theory of corinism is simply included in the set of truth. So Marx didn’t either know or intentionally deceived, but I think he lied with the intention!
                        The whole joke is that the labor theory of value was not created by Marx, but by Smith, Ricardo and a number of economists.

                        The merit of Marx lies in the fact that he checked it for consistency with reality and filled the gap in it, showing where the profit comes from.
                  2. aybolyt678
                    aybolyt678 15 December 2018 22: 42
                    0
                    Quote: Claymore
                    Ideology, which is a combination of a system of values ​​and worldview, always appears in the form of a natural response to environmental stimuli

                    A natural response to environmental stimuli is behavioral reactions - food, sexual, protective. But not ideology smile
                    i caught you! lol
                    1. Claymore
                      Claymore 15 December 2018 23: 40
                      +1
                      A person suffers from cold and hunger and enjoys warmth and satiety.

                      In response to suffering and pleasure, a person, being aware of his own self, concludes that he needs prosperity.
                      So wealth becomes a value that appears as a natural response to environmental stimuli.

                      A person does not stop at this and, being a thinking creature, comprehends his position (often theoretically) both in a situation of affluence and in a situation of lack of affluence, as a result of which the idea is formed that affluence is good, and lack of affluence is bad .
                      So, on the basis of value (which is prosperity), a value judgment appears regarding the presence and absence of value - i.e. worldview.

                      A set of values ​​(appearing as a natural response to environmental stimuli) and a worldview based on these values ​​(value judgments) are called ideology.

                      So who did you catch? laughing


                      ZY
                      "Social being determines social consciousness" - this is just about ideology.
                      1. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 16 December 2018 10: 38
                        +1
                        Quote: Claymore
                        So who did you catch? laughing

                        still caught. Ideology combines palaces with squares. Its social function is such a unifying one. It is inseparable from the concept of Idea. The idea, in turn, is inseparable from the concept of Happiness. And happiness is just a feeling of perspective. And perspective is inseparable from the concept of Goal.
                        Quote: Claymore
                        So wealth becomes a value that appears as a natural response to environmental stimuli.

                        that is, a house, a bank account, a delicious breakfast and a full refrigerator - an ideology? why then do we all so dislike each other?
                        caught, caught, you talking! laughing
                      2. Claymore
                        Claymore 16 December 2018 17: 19
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Ideology combines palaces with squares. Its social function is such a unifying
                        Ideology cannot unite, because at palaces and squares it is different (although individual elements may coincide).

                        Combining palaces with squares is a function of propaganda that interprets ideology, not ideology itself.

                        It is inseparable from the concept of Idea. The idea, in turn, is inseparable from the concept of Happiness.
                        Why do you think so?

                        An idea (from the Greek. Ἰδέα - image, representation) is a mental image, a formulated idea of ​​something.

                        And here is happiness, which is a subjective positive emotional sensation of a high degree of intensity?

                        that is, a house, a bank account, a delicious breakfast and a full refrigerator - an ideology?
                        Those. what you have listed in modern conditions are elements of the concept of "prosperity", which designates one of the values ​​included in the value system, on the basis of which the worldview is formed.

                        And the totality of the value system and the worldview based on it is called ideology: from "idea" - an image, notion (about positive and negative) and "logos" - a word, doctrine (about what is good and what is bad).

                        So you didn’t catch me, but you drove yourself into a corner, while at the same time showing that your teachers of Marxism and diamat deserve to be hewn with a belt. lol

                        why then do we all so dislike each other?
                        Because ideology cannot combine palaces with squares - palaces and squares are different.

                      3. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 17 December 2018 09: 09
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        And here is happiness, which is a subjective positive emotional sensation of a high degree of intensity?

                        what you are talking about is probably ecstasy or violent joy. And happiness is to have a goal and go to it. The most offensive is that if the goal is achieved, then what was considered happiness turns into luck
                        An idea, or ideology, is an image, an idea of ​​how happiness should be. Hence the connection with the prospect (per - through, through, through, spectio-look) look into the distance. That is why happiness is just a sense of perspective. In everything. For example, live life with your loved one, have a child, have a full refrigerator for the rest of your life .... or for example, know that you live in the best country with free fishing and a very high pension laughing
                        and I repeat do not confuse luck, joy and momentary prosperity. Happiness may be the realization that in the future no one will take this wealth
                      4. Claymore
                        Claymore 17 December 2018 10: 41
                        0
                        HAPPINESS is an axiological concept denoting the optimal combination of various benefits for a particular individual, expressed in a sense of inner satisfaction with how his life as a whole develops ...
                        HAPPINESS is a person’s state corresponding to inner satisfaction with his being, completeness and meaningfulness of life.
                        HAPPINESS - a feeling and a state of complete, higher satisfaction.


                        In which dictionary do not look, we are always talking about a subjective positive emotional sensation of a high degree of intensity, and not about the presence of a goal (although its presence may be a subjective condition for the emergence of a positive sensation).

                        An idea or ideology is an image, an idea of ​​how happiness should be
                        No, this is an experimentally formed idea of ​​the factors of being that ensure the onset of a state of happiness, and the factors associated with the onset of a state of suffering.
                      5. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 17 December 2018 18: 27
                        0
                        This is all very old, and does not correspond to the need for today's knowledge.
                        Happiness is a sense of perspective in any aspect, respectively Goals. For example: Happiness of Victory over a hated enemy. Hatred is when you want to kill but are afraid, not to be confused with contempt. But the struggle was inevitably difficult, and with varying success, and in the end, Victory! the enemy is defeated, he is no more - the prospect is that there is no enemy!
                        Happiness in love: This is when a person who is a symbol of the opposite sex suddenly chooses you from a bunch of competitors, at the moment when you think that everything! the prospect of a long and happy relationship with a person replacing you with half the population of the planet earth.
                        Happiness in personal life is when the goal is to arrange life in such a way that in the morning with joy run to work and in the evening with impatience to rush home to your beloved wife and children.
                        As can be seen from the above examples, happiness is impossible without a goal.
                        Quote: Claymore
                        HAPPINESS - a feeling and a state of complete, higher satisfaction.

                        it's an orgasm!
                        Quote: Claymore
                        HAPPINESS is a person’s state corresponding to inner satisfaction with his being, completeness and meaningfulness of life.

                        it is a confession before the death of a good hardworking person
                        Quote: Claymore
                        HAPPINESS is an axiological concept denoting the optimal combination of various benefits for a particular individual, expressed in a sense of inner satisfaction with how his life as a whole develops ...

                        the definition is very tense - vague, scientific ... there is no future
                        but the feeling of perspective is very understandable and widely applicable.
                      6. Claymore
                        Claymore 17 December 2018 19: 53
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Happiness is a sense of perspective
                        The prospects are different, so happiness cannot be a sense of perspective.

                        Happiness is subjective.
                        Only 1 moment remains unchanged for everyone - a feeling (in the sense of emotional experience / state) of satisfaction (of a high degree of intensity - otherwise it will not differ from the usual feeling of satiety)

                        As can be seen from the above examples, happiness is impossible without a goal
                        Without a goal, little is possible at all, because we are talking about a man, and a man is a thinking being, and that means acting consciously and in accordance with the goal.

                        But happiness without a goal is possible, since no one canceled the fortunate occasion (the unexpected receipt of something positive that was not claimed), therefore the presence of a goal in this system is superfluous.

                        And from the above examples, two things can be seen.

                        1 Even for you, happiness is associated not with the presence of a goal (a goal is always a meaningful task that has a certain decision algorithm), but with the moment you get what you want — victory, reciprocity, emotional closeness (+ a happy coincidence that is not connected with goals).

                        2 Even for you, happiness is an experience of high intensity, because the victory, reciprocity and emotional closeness with the family cited as an example contrast with the usual comfortable routine, when everything is fine, everything is there, everyone is happy, but something is still missing.

                        it's an orgasm!
                        Orgasm is a physiological sensation, and emotional happiness.

                        it is a confession before the death of a good hardworking person
                        Before death, a person experiences a feeling of fatigue, rather than satisfaction or meaningfulness of life. )))

                        the definition is very tense - blurry, science-like
                        And at the same time the most comprehensive and accurate.

                        Moreover, in the definition of happiness there should not be a future, because the feeling of happiness is always connected not with expectation, but with the moment of achievement - it is a feeling of the present, not the future.
                      7. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 20 December 2018 07: 47
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        the definition is very tense - blurry, science-like
                        And at the same time the most comprehensive and accurate.

                        motion blur - call it all-encompassing? and science - accuracy? The definition should be precisely SCIENTIFIC, and applied accordingly hi
                      8. Claymore
                        Claymore 20 December 2018 09: 14
                        0
                        An axiological (value) concept denoting the combination of various benefits that is optimal for a specific (since emotional feelings are subjective) individual, expressed in a sense of inner satisfaction with how his life as a whole develops.

                        Where is the blurriness and science?

                        And the definition cannot be applied - the definition is intended not for "applying", but for revealing the essence of the phenomenon denoted by a specific word.
              2. aybolyt678
                aybolyt678 16 December 2018 15: 02
                0
                Quote: Claymore
                Was the top braked (and therefore did not understand what it was doing)?

                The top ranks consisted of agents from the CIA and the NSA (and therefore perfectly understood what they were doing)?

                in my opinion we have already discussed something like that? But now I’m clarifying that our dear Nikita Sergeyevich was in a hostile, Soviet environment. And this environment was agents of the West and used the top in the dark.
                1. Claymore
                  Claymore 16 December 2018 17: 35
                  0
                  Not really about that, but now I'm not at all about that.

                  I mean that you made 3 statements in one sentence, each of which directly contradicts the other two.

                  Decide.
                  1. aybolyt678
                    aybolyt678 20 December 2018 14: 29
                    0
                    Quote: Claymore
                    I mean that you made 3 statements in one sentence, each of which directly contradicts the other two.

                    Well, then let us call it a new term - trialelectics!
                    Scott Fitzgerald once said: a sign of first-class brains is the ability to keep two mutually exclusive thoughts in mind without losing the ability to think.
                    you flatter me! I keep in mind 3 thoughts directly opposite thoughts at the same time! go nuts! How can 3 items be placed directly opposite each other? - So their geometry allows it?
                    1. Claymore
                      Claymore 20 December 2018 20: 21
                      0
                      In your "trialectic" there is no unity of opposites, nor their struggle - these are just 3 mutually exclusive statements.

                      ZY
                      Statements have no geometry - their opposite is semantic, not spatial.
              3. aybolyt678
                aybolyt678 17 December 2018 09: 17
                0
                Quote: Claymore
                Maybe you’ve already decided what really happened?
                After all, in one sentence you manage to give out 3 options, each of which contradicts the other 2.

                Ingenious! Or maybe this is where the unity and struggle of contradictions in the world is manifested ?? laughing
                1. Claymore
                  Claymore 17 December 2018 11: 51
                  +1
                  Not - this manifests only the pluralism of opinions that exists in one particular head. laughing
                  1. aybolyt678
                    aybolyt678 19 December 2018 21: 14
                    0
                    Quote: Claymore
                    Not - this manifests only the pluralism of opinions that exists in one particular head. laughing

                    I wrote a great answer about happiness and physiology, with jokes, the computer hung up, everything disappeared, but an idea appeared - maybe because of the lack of a clear concept of happiness, the Marxists lost their Leninists? By and large?
                    can we modern people not be able to connect Marxist theory with physiology and sociology using the Internet?
                    1. Claymore
                      Claymore 20 December 2018 00: 12
                      +1
                      Quote: aybolyt678
                      I wrote a great answer about happiness and physiology, with jokes, the computer froze, everything was gone
                      This is a sign from above. lol

                      but a thought appeared - perhaps because of the lack of a clear concept of happiness, did the Leninists lose the Marxists? By and large?
                      Happiness is a subjective emotional state, and therefore the creation of a concept of happiness is impossible (this is not allowed by subjectivity).

                      It is only possible to create a list of factors associated with this condition.
                      But these factors, in fact, are already known to everyone, and in general terms have already been formulated in the "Maslow pyramid".

                      can we modern people not be able to connect Marxist theory with physiology and sociology using the Internet?
                      Like what for? laughing

                      Why bother trying to connect something with something if Marxist theory already represents a conclusion from a detailed sociological study of class society, already contains a philosophy based on physiology and social psychology, and does not have obstacles to mastering via the Internet?
                      1. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 20 December 2018 07: 53
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Happiness is a subjective emotional state,
                        And in Hollywood they think differently laughing
                        Quote: Claymore
                        and that means the creation of the concept of happiness is impossible (this is not allowed by subjectivity).
                        With this approach, Communism cannot be built ... of course, unless you consider happiness as avoiding death from someone else’s hands. But this implies the presence of an enemy. So mortal enemy is necessary to create a communist society?
                      2. Claymore
                        Claymore 20 December 2018 09: 21
                        0
                        Communism with the category of happiness has nothing to do.

                        And I didn’t enter - what side is a mortal enemy here?
                      3. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 20 December 2018 16: 21
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Communism with the category of happiness has nothing to do.

                        If communism has nothing to do with the category of happiness, then what are its prospects? Unfortunately, no.
                        Quote: Claymore
                        And I didn’t enter - what side is a mortal enemy here?

                        Imagine a war, you are surrounded, sitting in a fortress and once again thanks to inhuman efforts, avoid death, what do you feel when you survive? something like happiness, I guess. Happiness in this case is the prospect of living. Moreover, you have, to put it mildly, uncomfortable living conditions, you are very rarely full, but nevertheless even a small victory, or even the fact of life gives you hope for some kind of perspective!
                        From here, you can be happy and in poor conditions, provided that there is the possibility of losing what you have. To do this, you need an enemy or a space cataclysm ....
                      4. Claymore
                        Claymore 20 December 2018 20: 14
                        +1
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        If communism has nothing to do with the category of happiness, then what are its prospects? unfortunately no
                        Indicate the causal relationship of this conclusion.

                        Otherwise, I do not understand at all how the subjective-emotional category of "happiness" can become an obstacle to the objective historical-natural development of productive forces and production relations.

                        What do you feel when you are alive? something like happiness, probably
                        No

                        Relief, hysterical joy, etc. emotions that have nothing to do with the category of "happiness".

                        Happiness in this case is the prospect of living.
                        Once again, sastier is an emotion of the present only.

                        From here, you can be happy and in poor conditions.
                        Because happiness is a subjective value category.

                        Communism is a political-economic category, a category of objective group interests, and not subjective emotions.
                      5. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 21 December 2018 05: 37
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Indicate the causal relationship of this conclusion.

                        do you want to catch? smile Communism, if I am not mistaken, has an ideological component, and if there is an ideology, then there must be a Goal, tasks to achieve this goal and bonuses for its achievement, the entire visible path is a perspective. If any doctrine does not promise happiness, any- personal, social, universal, etc. then who needs it? something like that I understand it ..
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Once again, sastier is an emotion of the present only.

                        that’s exactly what emotion - this is the physiology of the present - which can be decomposed into endorphins, adrenaline, serotonins, that is, into a specific chemistry of the process. By your definition, addicts who have taken a dose can be considered happy people. And happiness is a time-stretched concept. This is the prospect of, for example, regularly producing endorphins if you buy a summer cottage on the seashore!
                        If I am not mistaken for happiness under Communism, is social security of a person considered, if a person works for society, creates conditions for him to work creatively? I don’t remember, I'm sorry.
                      6. Claymore
                        Claymore 21 December 2018 09: 09
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        If any doctrine does not promise happiness, any- personal, social, universal, etc. then who needs it?
                        It depends on the teaching.

                        Specifically, Marxism is needed by any sane person who wants to at least learn to understand the reality surrounding him.

                        But the doctrine, which promises public or universal happiness (which by definition cannot exist), may be needed only by the infantile who seeks self-deception.

                        And again, communism is a production relationship of a specific nature that appears as a result of the natural development of productive forces and changes in the value-worldview attitudes that accompany this development.

                        Those. there is no place for the category "happiness" in this system, because happiness is about the emotional feelings of an individual (warm), and communism is about the economic state and interests of society (soft).

                        emotion - this is the physiology of the present - which can be decomposed into endorphins, adrenaline, serotonins, that is, a specific chemistry of the process
                        Right.

                        By your definition, addicts who have taken a dose can be classified as happy people
                        So it is - in the event that at this moment they are aware of themselves.

                        And happiness is a time-stretched concept.
                        Happiness is stretched in time exactly as long as the emotional state is maintained = specific hormonal balance.
                        Happiness is an emotional sensation. It cannot last a week, a month, or a year — it either arises or disappears.

                        This is the prospect of, for example, regularly producing endorphins if you buy a summer cottage on the seashore.
                        Yes, it is not the prospect that gives a feeling of happiness, but the moment of reaching what is of value to the individual.

                        Take the same prospect of buying a summer house.

                        In this case, value is perceived as the possession of a summer residence, the existing prospect of acquiring which does not give any emotions.
                        But in the event that the possession of the cottage is a value, and the prospect of its acquisition is absent, the prospect also becomes a value.

                        And in the case of the appearance of a perspective (and the moment a previously absent perspective appears - this is the moment of achievement), the very emotional state that is called happiness occurs.
                        But the appearance of this state is connected not with the perspective as such, but with the moment of reaching the previously absent perspective, which at that moment is a value.

                        If I am not mistaken for happiness under Communism, is social security of a person considered, if a person works for society, creates conditions for him to work creatively?
                        No, with the category "communism" the category "happiness" did not come close.

                        Communist production relations really should facilitate the achievement of this state and increase the frequency of its occurrence, but only by virtue of the fact that they will save society and its constituent individuals from the mass of hemorrhoids associated with earning their daily bread.

                        But they cannot make someone happy, because happiness is an individual emotion tied to the perception of a particular person, and not to the quality of production relations.
                      7. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 21 December 2018 09: 59
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Specifically, Marxism is needed by any sane person who wants to at least learn to understand the reality surrounding him.
                        ++++ bravo. !!!! fellow drinks I'll probably write a book - "Conversations with Claymore" !!!! there is something in this!
                        but seriously, it’s very interesting, however, Where is he Communism? Marxism has remained, moreover, it is in digital form, but Communism? from Parshev, in my opinion I met that Communism is an ideal ideology of survival in the conditions of limited resources and territory. Does that mean?
                      8. Claymore
                        Claymore 21 December 2018 10: 22
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Where is he Communism?
                        In future. smile

                        from Parshev, in my opinion I met that Communism is an ideal ideology of survival in the conditions of limited resources and territory. Does that mean?
                        This means that the one who called communism the ideology of survival, or fool or scoundrel. laughing

                        Communism is a socio-economic formation that excludes the exploitation of man by man, based on public ownership of the means of production, and characterized by the absence of classes and a high (compared with previous formations) degree of development of productive forces.
                      9. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 21 December 2018 20: 06
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Communism is a socio-economic formation that excludes the exploitation of man by man, based on public ownership of the means of production, and characterized by the absence of classes and a high (compared with previous formations) degree of development of productive forces.

                        I offer an alternative point of view. Productive forces will undoubtedly achieve perfection, and as practice shows, which, as is known, the criterion of truth, a person without labor turns into a consumer .. Remember, labor was made from a monkey person? so, based on the same definition, a person will turn into a monkey! laughing no contradictions. The past was already, and communism is only a hypothesis. crying Again the jungle !!! fellow although communism is undoubtedly ... drones will collect bananas with coconuts, and feed a lazy monkey-like spoon. Happiness! and there is no competition
                      10. Claymore
                        Claymore 22 December 2018 02: 14
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        so, based on the same definition, a person will turn into a monkey!
                        Why?

                        The past was already, and communism is only a hypothesis
                        Taki theory.

                        drones will collect bananas with coconuts, and feed a lazy monkey-like spoon. Happiness!
                        Well, what happiness leaned against this phantasmagoria?
                      11. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 22 December 2018 08: 53
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        so, based on the same definition, a person will turn into a monkey!
                        Why?

                        if labor has made a man out of a monkey, then the absence of labor makes a man out of a man, humanlike, without hair on his body and fat. It is in accordance with the definition, and thanks to progress
                      12. Claymore
                        Claymore 22 December 2018 12: 24
                        +1
                        if labor is made of a man’s monkey, then the absence of labor makes a man a man-like monkey, without body hair and fat
                        1.
                        Labor led to the emergence of thinking and forced to cooperate.
                        Lack of labor does not eliminate thinking and the ability to cooperate.

                        2.
                        Labor is an expedient activity aimed at creating values ​​to satisfy needs, expressed in the transformation of nature.
                        This means that although the forms of labor may change, the very need for labor will disappear only with the disappearance of humanity.
                      13. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 22 December 2018 14: 19
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Lack of labor does not eliminate thinking and the ability to cooperate.

                        The ability to cooperate arises only when necessary. Have you seen the cartoon Valley? Remember fat people who talked only on the tablet?
                        lack of labor ...... You see, a person has a need for emotions, both positive and negative. Like a pendulum. For example, you bought a car that you had been dreaming about for a long time, and it was difficult to go to it. And suddenly on the very first day CARAPINA! just as far as the pendulum of your well-being has deviated towards pleasure, by the same amount towards annoyance. So with difficulty. Under socialism, we labored. Our propagandists everywhere hung up posters about labor. However, Hollywood showed that under capitalism one can not work, and we joyfully built this society. Without catastrophes, the result of labor is invisible because of habit.
                        The fact is that I can’t imagine this society without problems. You did not read the Sharashka fellow soldiers, Andrei Khodov and the continuation of Transduction? Here it is approximately described how to build such a society. It is a working model. Read rather entertaining fiction
                      14. Claymore
                        Claymore 24 December 2018 01: 16
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        The ability to cooperate only arises when it becomes necessary
                        And?

                        Have you seen the cartoon Valley?
                        No.

                        You see, a person has a need for emotions, both positive and negative
                        The need is not inherent - a mechanism has been laid out that allows them to be tested.

                        Under socialism, we labored. Our propagandists everywhere hung up posters about labor. However, Hollywood showed that under capitalism you can’t work
                        Hollywood showed ?! laughing

                        Marx is drawing a whole study on this subject + examples of primitive thefts and robberies from everyday reality.

                        Without catastrophes, the result of labor is invisible due to habituality
                        It is perfectly visible, as well as audible, tangible, smelling, sensing with taste buds and consuming.

                        The fact is that I can’t imagine this society without problems
                        The problems of man are ensured by his very existence, in connection with which there is no sense in the existence of a purposefully problem society.

                        You have not read Sharashka fellow villagers
                        The name is familiar, but what / about which was not left in my memory (apparently about nothing).
                      15. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 24 December 2018 21: 33
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        You see, a person has a need for emotions, both positive and negative
                        The need is not inherent - a mechanism has been laid out that allows them to be tested.

                        This mechanism has a deep meaning: why is the need for positive emotions needed? this is understandable - we want it. But pay attention, after the first 50 grams it seems joyfully, a holiday! after the third - it seems good, but the next day - it would be better if I didn’t drink .... Whatever the joyful feeling, it loses its charm with constant repetition. Otherwise, why do we go camping - mosquitoes, unsanitary conditions, overheating in the sun, freezing in a tent ... ???? So, why does this mechanism exist? And why do we use it? why do we spend money on fishing rods, tents, kerogazs for heating tents, when it would be much easier to buy fish in a store? And then enjoy the slender logical calculations of Marx? Yes, because in order to realize how good it is for us, you need to feel how bad it can be, to rejoice at it.
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Have you seen the cartoon Valley?
                        No.

                        it is in vain, one of the few where there is love, self-sacrifice, the prospect of a life without perspective, and the meaning
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Without catastrophes, the result of labor is invisible due to habituality
                        It is perfectly visible, as well as audible, tangible, smelling, sensing with taste buds and consuming.

                        but often not appreciated. Only survivors of a nuclear war will appreciate
                        Quote: Claymore
                        You have not read Sharashka fellow villagers
                        The name is familiar, but what / about which was not left in my memory (apparently about nothing).

                        Nowadays many people write about the populace. The beginning is the same for all, then each, with the help of either knowledge or technical means, changes history, but in the named tetralogy, there is more analysis of sociological knowledge. This author has a little thing - a "tired fairy" so there is generally a theory that every social order is natural. Imagine an alien object falls into the hands of a teenager girl with the help of which she can change the world according to her mind. But, no matter what she does, the world resists, In general, there is a lot of Gumilyov, but there is also a zest.
                        And Marxism will win only when the concept of Happiness and Communist Ideology is worked out. "Without a theory, we die" often said J.V. Stalin
                      16. Claymore
                        Claymore 25 December 2018 03: 17
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        Why do we need a need for positive emotions?
                        It is not needed - it is the result of evolution, a given.

                        after the first 50 grams it’s kind of joyous, a holiday! after the third - it seems good, but the next day - it would be better if I didn’t drink .... Whatever a joyful feeling, it loses its charm with constant repetition
                        The intoxication does not lose its charm - just at some point its negative factors begin to outweigh the positive ones.

                        As for the positive sensations from factors that ceased to be rare, then they do not lose their attractiveness.
                        They turn from an event into a norm and begin to be perceived less vividly (as a routine having a positive character), but the attractiveness of these factors persists and no one wants to abandon them.

                        Otherwise, why do we go camping - mosquitoes, unsanitary conditions, overheating in the sun, freezing in a tent ... ????
                        Boredom.

                        And then enjoy the slender logical calculations of Marx?
                        Enjoying it ?! belay

                        Did you read it for sure? laughing

                        Yes, because in order to realize how good it is for us, you need to feel how bad it can be, to rejoice at it
                        No, all these hikes, hunts and fishing are the result of an unconscious attempt to escape from reality, kill time and fill the void of meaningless existence, and not a consequence of the desire to feel in contrast how we actually live well.

                        but often not rated
                        What is the reason for the petty-bourgeois consciousness.

                        In general, there is a lot from Gumilyov
                        So analysis and sociology are definitely not there.

                        But Marxism will triumph only when the concept of Happiness and Communist Ideology is worked out.
                        Marxism is a theory confirmed by practice - it has already won, it is Communism's turn.

                        "without a theory, we are dead"
                        This is about the production relations of socialism.
                      17. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 25 December 2018 10: 54
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        No, all these hikes, hunting and fishing are the result of an unconscious attempt to escape from reality, kill time and fill the void of meaningless existence,

                        I do not agree, artificial reality kills time - in games, or intoxication. Campaign is a therapy.
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Did you read it for sure?

                        Once, as a student, the night before the exam, I was preparing for the exam with an Istmat teacher. Cost is the labor embodied in the product, repeated about every 3-5 minutes. I passed the exam by 5! I will never forget the expression on the examiner's eyes! In graduate school, in '96, he was preparing, and he simply studied Marx with pleasure, but there were very few questions about it.
                      18. Claymore
                        Claymore 26 December 2018 02: 32
                        0
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        I do not agree, artificial reality kills time - in games, or intoxication. Campaign is therapy
                        A hike is also an escape into an artificial reality, into which you plunge for a while, and from which you expect to return to a boring, senseless routine.

                        This can of course be called therapy ("therapy of hopelessness" that temporarily relieves symptoms), but this will not change the essence of the matter.

                        I studied Marx with pleasure, but there were very few questions
                        For me, there are not many questions there, and the manner of presentation is extremely indigestible.
          2. For example
            For example 14 December 2018 19: 12
            +3
            Quote: Comrade Beria
            more focused on satisfaction of needs people

            Consumer society? laughing

            So that’s exactly what the west of the USSR dumped. Wake up seleovek, calling himself Beria.
            Stupor in the minds of many. Still not sober.
            Then to the grave everything and the car and clothes?
            Although not to the grave all this "satisfaction of needs" will end up in the toilet and in the landfill.

            After all, for every "New Year" you need to throw out everything old and buy a new one, right, kid? laughing

            Read about the stupor of the Soviet economy on Wikipedia? laughing
            1. Comrade Beria
              Comrade Beria 14 December 2018 19: 31
              +1
              Quote: For example
              boy

              This "boy" was born under Stalin, and even managed to live with him. True, all that I could in that period was to suck the mother's tit, and sign the diapers.
              So I’ve seen everything. Starting from corn in the Arkhangelsk region.
              Quote: For example
              Then to the grave everything and the car and clothes?

              What for? There are children, grandchildren, I think in the next five years, and great-grandchildren will appear.
              And the car is not a luxury, but a means of transportation. wink

              Quote: For example
              Read about the stupor of the Soviet economy on Wikipedia?

              Why was the Soviet economy unable to pull off such a "trifle" as the war in Afghanistan, if it was not in a stupor?
              1. aybolyt678
                aybolyt678 16 December 2018 14: 58
                0
                Quote: Comrade Beria
                Why was the Soviet economy unable to pull off such a "trifle" as the war in Afghanistan, if it was not in a stupor?

                YES because we didn’t kill there but built roads, school hospitals, the army carried out a peacekeeping mission
            2. aybolyt678
              aybolyt678 16 December 2018 10: 46
              0
              Quote: For example
              Although not to the grave all this "satisfaction of needs" will end up in the toilet and in the landfill.

              After all, for each "New Year" you need to throw out everything old and buy new

              trash movement algorithm - balcony shed dacha pit
          3. DymOk_v_dYmke
            DymOk_v_dYmke 15 December 2018 00: 02
            +1
            ...
            It was the stupor of the Soviet economy that was the root cause of the collapse of the USSR.

            Maybe a little wider is worth a look?
            The main causal point of the collapse of not only the USSR, but also CMEA, is
            Gorbachev ban inside the SEVO calculations in transferable rubles.
            This is not advertised, hardly noticeable, but its main trick.
            I think, conscious. Further, everything rained down as planned.
            According to our plan.
            1. aybolyt678
              aybolyt678 16 December 2018 12: 11
              0
              Quote: DymOk_v_dYmke
              Further, everything rained down as planned.
              According to our plan.

              + yes yes! that is, otherwise, how can we explain that in the period of Glasnost it was possible to say only that which destroyed the public consciousness and changed the system of values. I remember how at the Komsomol meeting we all condemned the letter of Nina Andreeva - I can’t sacrifice principles. Under the signature of each.
      2. Qwertyarion
        Qwertyarion 14 December 2018 14: 59
        0
        Quote: ancestors from the Don
        Central Bank of Russia is a branch of the IMF

        What is your evidence?
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 15: 14
          +6
          Quote: Qwertyarion
          What is your evidence?

          Here is the head of the IMF:

          Naibulina probably had better socks. wassat
          1. Hammerlock
            Hammerlock 14 December 2018 15: 17
            +2
            she has tights, but that’s not certain (maybe she is a reploid?)
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 15: 19
              +1
              Quote: Hammerlock
              she has tights, but that’s not certain (maybe she is a reploid?)

              I am not in courses, I am not familiar with Elvira. wink
          2. Qwertyarion
            Qwertyarion 14 December 2018 15: 34
            +1
            The dude also has dirty pants! wassat
          3. The Siberian barber
            The Siberian barber 14 December 2018 15: 59
            +2
            Quote: mordvin xnumx
            Quote: Qwertyarion
            What is your evidence?

            Here is the head of the IMF:

            Naibulina probably had better socks. wassat

            Come on you: uncle nails, on his feet, does not cut! laughing
            Maybe the Cossacks eats like a child))
            As for Nabiulina, and others, it’s been clear with them for a long time: smart, caring faces!
            The more caring a person, they have, the more preoccupied and perplexed, for most people living in the vast, immense ..
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 16: 20
              +1
              Quote: The Siberian Barber
              As for Nabiulina, and others, it’s been clear with them for a long time: smart, caring faces!

              But what about! No wonder she was called the best hands of the Central Bank. Like Yegorushka Gaidar. wink
              1. The Siberian barber
                The Siberian barber 14 December 2018 16: 26
                0
                Did he "steer" the Central Bank? ??
                Maybe I'm wrong, but no. Although, one field of bananas
          4. Comrade Beria
            Comrade Beria 14 December 2018 16: 17
            +2
            But isn't the head of the IMF a woman with a long nose named Lagarde?

            And this is Poroshenko’s idol.
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 16: 27
              +2
              Quote: Comrade Beria
              And this is Poroshenko’s idol.

              Yes, they are all misery. When the police arrested one billionaire, they found him a bunch of tea bags, which he dried in a cupboard.
        2. Dangerous
          Dangerous 14 December 2018 15: 14
          -2
          rumor goes on, from generation to generation
      3. Claymore
        Claymore 14 December 2018 15: 04
        -4
        Quote: ancestors from the Don
        The Central Bank of Russia is a branch of the IMF (((, it acts under their dictation and in their interests

        Do not write nonsense.
        1. Hammerlock
          Hammerlock 14 December 2018 15: 19
          +3
          sadly so
          In 2007 she graduated from Yale University. Passed US leadership training program - IVLP (International Visitor Leadership Program)
          1. Claymore
            Claymore 14 December 2018 15: 37
            0
            Quote: Hammerlock
            graduated from yale university

            And what is the relationship between Yale and the IMF? smile
            1. Hammerlock
              Hammerlock 14 December 2018 15: 39
              +4
              straight as a ruler
              1. Claymore
                Claymore 14 December 2018 15: 42
                +3
                What interests me is not the form, but the essence - so which one? lol
                1. Hammerlock
                  Hammerlock 14 December 2018 15: 44
                  +1
                  Do you work in her department? I have thrown off the sin of usury
                  1. Claymore
                    Claymore 14 December 2018 16: 00
                    +1
                    And you're funny. laughing


                    Yale, my joy is a private university in the USA.

                    The IMF is a UN unit in which the Russian Federation has a veto.

                    And the UN is a platform for negotiations, not a political subject who has interests and the ability to dictate something.


                    Therefore, statements from the series "The Central Bank of Russia is a branch of the IMF, it acts under their dictation and in their interests" - This is nothing more than a demonstration of stupidity, expressed in the rehash of conspiratorial nonsense and generated by aggressive amateurism.


                    Truncated? lol
                    1. aybolyt678
                      aybolyt678 14 December 2018 19: 00
                      +1
                      Quote: Claymore
                      The IMF is a UN unit in which the Russian Federation has a veto.

                      The USSR also had the veto power at the UN ... only the USSR maintained an independent financial system. And in Russia, the Central Bank maintains, constitutionally legal, independence from the state. I am sure that in fact, despite the UN registration, the IMF remains the same independence there!
                      Truncated? lol
                      1. Claymore
                        Claymore 14 December 2018 21: 15
                        +1
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        And in Russia, the Central Bank maintains, constitutionally legal, independence from the state
                        Igor, do you know why the majority of the population of the RSFSR / RF has been living much worse than it could for the last 60 years, and the government is led by all kinds of Gorbachevs, Yeltsins and Putin, who are quite calmly pursuing a policy that is directly contrary to the interests of the majority?

                        This is primarily because the population (including candidates of science) for the most part refuses to study, preferring to cram, rather than delve into and understand (this happened in the process of "studying" the works of Marx and Lenin, the same is now happening in the process of "reading" the constitution ).

                        Tell me - where did you manage to find the "constitutional and legal independence of the Central Bank from the state", if in the 2nd part of the 75th article the Russians write in white about one specific function that the Central Bank, for objective reasons, should perform independently (what, by the way, no - in this part the constitution is also violated)?

                        What kind of consciousness aberration should happen so that the words about the independent fulfillment by the state institution of one specific function begin to be perceived as words about the independence of the state institution from the state?


                        Truncated?
                        Not only truncated, but also laid out - and also explained and asked "leading" questions. lol
                      2. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 15 December 2018 08: 27
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        This is what kind of aberration of consciousness should happen, so that the words about the independent execution by the state institution of one specific function

                        there is a key to this function, you would have to dig deeper into the meaning of the words, and more attention to the structure of the money cycle in the world. Although I admit that you write beautifully. hi
                      3. aybolyt678
                        aybolyt678 15 December 2018 13: 03
                        0
                        Quote: Claymore
                        Not only truncated, but also laid out - and also explained and asked "leading" questions

                        Quote: Claymore
                        and not to delve into and understand (this is what happened in the process of "studying" the works of Marx and Lenin, and it is now happening in the process of "reading" the constitution).

                        If you study Marx and Lenin, Communism will inevitably happen. This is not happening. Following the well-known doctrine of Allen Dulles, corresponding services were created to counter Communism. They received a salary! Did they do something? They are classified, in theory. They developed the methods of psychological warfare! They know how to make a herd of sheep from human society! It makes sense to read open sources of information if hidden forces rule the world?
                        PS: remember in the 90s a wonderful law was passed against drunkenness and alcoholism? which was spoiled with one comma and two words: "except beer." In our information age, life is not enough to study everything.
                        Well, maybe a little messy, I hope you understand me.
                      4. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 14: 46
                        +1
                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        there is a key in this function
                        The key to what? laughing

                        The stability of the ruble is understood as two things - the relative invariability of the ruble against foreign currencies (ensured either through the legislatively established tight binding of the ruble to reserve currencies, or through interventions in the foreign exchange market due to gold reserves) and minimization of inflation (ensured by setting + - unchanged the ratio of commodity and money supply).

                        So, damn it, how can this independently carried out function make the Central Bank independent of the state? laughing

                        Quote: aybolyt678
                        If you study Marx and Lenin, Communism will inevitably happen. This is not happening
                        Communism is not "when everything is free," but rather concrete relations of production.

                        And if we study the works of Marx / Lenin not as a spherical horse in a vacuum, but in contrast with the processes of changing production relations, it becomes very clear that the first stage of communism in the USSR did happen (then the counter-revolution took place), and in the rest of the world capitalism was forced to incorporate many socialist elements (and this process will continue)

                        It makes sense to read open sources of information if hidden forces rule the world?
                        Direct - to get acquainted with the most accurate sociological study of capitalism (of which Marxism is) + learn to think.

                        The world cannot be ruled by hidden forces, tk. in order to rule (that is, to exercise power), the power must openly manifest itself (the subordinate executes the orders of the authorities just as much as the authorities are able to openly show their power and make the subordinate "bo-bo" - otherwise, if the subordinate not aware that the boss is in front of him, he will simply send him to hell).

                        Thus, the "psychological war" you mentioned is about convincing the masses that some hidden forces rule the world.
                        Simply put - in your head an image of an enemy that does not exist in reality is created, which your aggression is directed at - fight with windmills, and the capital at that time will stretch coupons.

                        There isn’t enough life to study everything in our information age
                        But instead of studying the basic laws of social life and dialectics, which allows you to draw the right conclusions, you study the never-existing plans of the Dulles and read diagonally separate articles of the constitution. laughing
          2. DymOk_v_dYmke
            DymOk_v_dYmke 15 December 2018 00: 15
            +1
            https://topwar.ru/151252-vedomstvo-nabiullinoj-pod-konec-goda-podnjalo-kljuchevuju-stavku.html

            Attach a complete list of students on this
            the program and many things will fall into place.
      4. Svarog
        Svarog 14 December 2018 16: 36
        -2
        I came from fishing, turned on news 24 .. and there SHE .. She looked to put it mildly not convincing .. to questions, and staged answers with hesitation .. but what I realized that we were in for big problems .. Then Mikhalkov began to broadcast. he is a master of speculation and seems to be saying everything correctly .. BUT .. I watched Dud & Mikhalkov yesterday .. I recommend it to everyone, Dud just turned its essence out ..
        1. sdc_alex
          sdc_alex 14 December 2018 20: 43
          -1
          Dud is power, a beacon of justice and democracy .... wassat wassat wassat

          Go fishing and see 2 House fool
          1. Svarog
            Svarog 14 December 2018 21: 07
            -1
            Quote: sdc_alex
            Dud is power, a beacon of justice and democracy .... wassat wassat wassat

            Go fishing and see 2 House fool

            At least, everything is nicer than watching Kisilevshchina and Solovyov’s brilovshchina. And Dud, a young but charismatic guy, is pleased to watch how he communicates with zealous figures ..
            1. sdc_alex
              sdc_alex 14 December 2018 21: 16
              0
              Quote: Svarog
              At least everything is nicer than Kisilevschina and Brilevshchina


              Well, yes ... then whoever ... some men seem to be "nicer" than women ....
    2. persei
      persei 14 December 2018 14: 54
      +8
      Nabiulina is afraid of economic growth, so he raises a key rate. What if entrepreneurs will invest in real production.
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 14 December 2018 15: 04
        +5
        This is not the Bank of Russia, but a branch of the Fed. The key rate depends on the dollar. The dollar is determined by momentary demand and depends on the price of oil. Why are we brained with these bets? People ceased to carry money - rates are raised, rushed to open deposits - rates are reduced. And what is the point of the Central Bank granting licenses to so many banks? Correctly Serge said: twists and nabiulivlya ...
        1. Henderson
          Henderson 14 December 2018 15: 09
          0
          it does not depend on the dollar.
          1. Ross xnumx
            Ross xnumx 14 December 2018 15: 18
            +2
            Quote: Henderson
            it does not depend on the dollar.

            I am not special in banking and take from specialists who explain:
            December 15, in a financial crisis, when the ruble rate plummeted, The Central Bank decided to raise the key rate to 17%. This decision was nice for banks to stop taking cheap ruble loans to buy foreign currency: banks earned that, and the ruble kept falling ...
            The central bank has always argued that raising the key rate is only a temporary emergency measure. After oil prices stabilized, the ruble stopped falling, and the Central Bank decided to gradually reduce the key rate.

            The country should have the State Treasury and the State Bank of Russia. And their submission should be directly tied to the President. To have someone to ask. And then we select a representative of the government of one, and in the state unknown unknown people pulled out of nowhere.
            1. Claymore
              Claymore 14 December 2018 15: 29
              0
              Quote: ROSS 42
              The country should have the State Treasury and the State Bank of Russia. And their submission should be directly tied to the President.
              In the Russian Federation, all this takes place, with the exception of direct subordination to the president.

              This is not the Bank of Russia, but a branch of the Fed
              This is the Central Bank of the Russian Federation, and the Fed cannot have branches, because the Fed is not an organization, not an authority, and not an enterprise, but a system (a system of relations - like a healthcare system or an education system).

              The key rate depends on the dollar.
              From projected inflation.

            2. Henderson
              Henderson 14 December 2018 15: 41
              -2
              Again. The key rate does not depend on the exchange rate. The course depends on the price of oil, yes. Because there is no industry. The key bet is about something else.
            3. DymOk_v_dYmke
              DymOk_v_dYmke 15 December 2018 00: 23
              +1
              The country should have the State Treasury and the State Bank of Russia. And their submission should be directly tied to the President. To have someone to ask.

              Is there any demand from the president?
      2. mavrus
        mavrus 14 December 2018 15: 12
        +2
        Somehow in the article modestly ...
        "The Bank of Russia ... fears sharp leaps", instead of "persistently seeking a sharp drop in the ruble exchange rate."
        And you might think that oil itself, without the help of our leaders, financiers and oligarchs, instead of $ 90, today costs 60. It seems that the Russian Government, "in spite of all forecasts and OPEC", instead of temporarily reducing production (as OPEC suggests ), deliberately storms more and more records in oil production, and trumpets about it all over the world
        1. Ross xnumx
          Ross xnumx 14 December 2018 15: 42
          +4
          Quote: mavrus

          Somehow in the article modestly ...
          "The Bank of Russia ... fears sharp leaps", instead of "persistently seeking a sharp drop in the ruble exchange rate."

          The Bank of Russia has ensured that not a single Russian industrial production can deal with high interest rates on loans. Hence, Medvedev’s innovations, Putin’s breakthroughs, and 25 million high-tech jobs ...for effective managers
          Today I accidentally got into Gordon's program "Male / Female. Non-childish business". I don’t know why they tell about how young Russian kids become aces in business, but it’s clear that these are not the guys who experience any feelings other than the passion for profit. Faceless, emotionless millionaires are social media idols. Russian weapon designers will not work out of them. And they will not become famous surgeons like S. Fedorov ...
      3. Qwertyarion
        Qwertyarion 14 December 2018 15: 37
        0
        Quote: persei
        Nabiulina is afraid of economic growth

        She’s not afraid of anything, she’s a hired manager and nothing more. Someone makes decisions above her.
      4. The Siberian barber
        The Siberian barber 14 December 2018 16: 02
        0
        Quote: persei
        Nabiulina is afraid of economic growth, so he raises a key rate. What if entrepreneurs will invest in real production.

        I will add: with the increase in taxes and energy tariffs ..
        "stimulus" for development in Russian
        1. aybolyt678
          aybolyt678 14 December 2018 19: 05
          0
          Quote: The Siberian Barber
          I will add: with the increase in taxes and energy tariffs ..
          "stimulus" for development in Russian

          stimul - in Latin means a stick with a tip for fitting mules and slaves.
          1. The Siberian barber
            The Siberian barber 14 December 2018 20: 18
            0
            ))) in your post, there are some analogies)
      5. Comrade Beria
        Comrade Beria 14 December 2018 16: 21
        0
        Quote: persei
        What if entrepreneurs will invest in real production.

        Yeah, we ran straight and stood in line.
        Why rest on when you can weld on the difference in courses.
      6. aybolyt678
        aybolyt678 14 December 2018 19: 03
        +1
        Quote: persei
        What if entrepreneurs will invest in real production.

        they will begin to invest in real production only after the revolution
    3. private person
      private person 14 December 2018 15: 32
      +3
      But what about the assurances of our government that Russia got off the oil and gas needle? Where is the growth of the economy?
      1. Metallurg_2
        Metallurg_2 14 December 2018 19: 30
        +1
        In the reports of Rosstat.
        1. private person
          private person 14 December 2018 19: 58
          0
          It’s necessary to shoot these extras so that they don’t hang pasta on the hearing organs, but they probably get a good salary for * b.
    4. atalef
      atalef 22 December 2018 14: 23
      0
      Quote: BlackMokona
      Two steps forward, three steps back ......

      no, it only says that the issuance of cheap loans did not give any impetus to the economy and there were fears of inflation
  2. siberalt
    siberalt 14 December 2018 14: 17
    +6
    We stably swim and dive like a fishing float. Yes, just get the right thing for the people does not work.
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 14: 29
      +4
      Quote: siberalt
      Yes, just get the right thing for the people does not work.

      Dragging-dragging, we can’t stretch ... laughing
  3. rocket757
    rocket757 14 December 2018 14: 22
    +3
    Those. what awaits us? Do they seem to be waiting for something when they cover us?
    And this is when oil and gas are stable in demand and in price? Ali they do not say what, are encrypted!
    1. Claymore
      Claymore 14 December 2018 15: 07
      +1
      Quote: rocket757
      Those. what awaits us?

      The increase in inflation associated with New Year's tariff increases and the entry into force of new tax rates.
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 14 December 2018 15: 12
        +3
        Quote: Claymore
        Quote: rocket757
        Those. what awaits us?

        The increase in inflation associated with New Year's tariff increases and the entry into force of new tax rates.

        This is a known fact! What else can be what we were not warned about.
        1. Claymore
          Claymore 14 December 2018 15: 25
          +1
          Can not.

          In this case, the Central Bank only adjusts the rate in accordance with the forecast inflation, and nothing more.
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 14 December 2018 18: 04
            +1
            Is it really sho? And why is inflation rising?
            But in general, at least somewhere it was possible to stabilize such measures and even more so to stimulate the growth of production and everything else?
            I don’t even want to explain further .... One thing is known, the bullying of a very high rate is to extinguish the fire, and at the same time to strangle industrial production, we can still be afraid, no matter what happens! We will not have economic growth at the right level and everything else.
            1. Claymore
              Claymore 14 December 2018 20: 32
              0
              Quote: rocket757
              Is it really sho? And why is inflation rising?
              With the appetites of natural monopolies.

              But in general, at least somewhere it was possible to stabilize such measures and even more so to stimulate the growth of production and everything else?
              And where did you get the idea that these measures (as well as the activities of the Central Bank) are aimed at stabilizing or stimulating production growth?

              The Central Bank has been given the law completely different tasks — unrelated to production.

              bullying and so very high stakes it is to extinguish a fire, at the same time to strangle industrial production, we can still be afraid, no matter what happens
              Bullying rates, in the existing set of conditions, is a logical refusal to subsidize "effective owners" at the state expense.

              We will not have economic growth at the right level and everything else
              With such rates of return - naturally will not.
              1. rocket757
                rocket757 14 December 2018 22: 23
                +1
                The question is, the problem is multi-layered, our business reformers have done a lot! The main thing is no one makes the answers, the same multi-layer decisions, actions, besides they cannot, they have not grown their brains, and even elementary greed prevents it.
                1. Claymore
                  Claymore 14 December 2018 22: 39
                  0
                  Do not be mistaken about brains.

                  It is better to take a closer look at the results of the "failed" policy - whether it is beneficial for any class or class stratum.
                  1. rocket757
                    rocket757 15 December 2018 00: 09
                    +1
                    For whose selfish interests I have not been arguing for a long time. They are explicit and large.
                    But sales, if someone decides to engage in patronage of arts, towards the state, this still needs to be managed, in the current situation. And then you need brains, not very weak ....
                    I'm afraid we will not wait for the results, no positive ones.
                    1. Claymore
                      Claymore 15 December 2018 01: 09
                      +1
                      Economic interest is the basis of any political action.

                      Accordingly, if there is a desire to understand objective reality, it is worth discussing exclusively about the selfish interests of specific social groups, co-classified by the method of generating income, and not about brains and philanthropy.
                      1. rocket757
                        rocket757 15 December 2018 08: 45
                        +1
                        Come on, I didn't put the definition of patronage in quotes. The impression is that any movement, action for the good of our country, people, on the part of servicemen and "servants of the people", looks like patronage, and not the fulfillment of their direct DUTIES!
                        We just started getting used to it! But failure to fulfill your direct duties is an official misconduct, if not a crime! For this it is necessary to drive with a "wolf ticket", and even judge.
                        About the business, which is "responsible", which is nationally oriented, everything is complicated and simple, those servants must control, Schaub their DUTIES to the state and the people, they strictly followed in the same spirit!
                        The husband has a certain merger of selfish interests
                        Business and bureaucracy are definitely not for the good of the country and citizens.
                        So we have it, the people owe everything, everything is obliged to fulfill, and the upper ones and those next to them anointed have all other rights! We can get to the handle like that, and we will be forced to wear yellow vests!
                        After all, everything is logical, it is repeated, the people, the working people must conquer, dig their rights .... with blood, from those who monopolized all rights only for the benefit of themselves.
                        This is the main thing, the very essence, of our present life!
                      2. Claymore
                        Claymore 15 December 2018 22: 08
                        +2
                        Quote: rocket757
                        The impression is that any movement, action for the good of our country, people, on the part of servicemen and "servants of the people", looks like patronage, and not the fulfillment of their direct DUTIES!
                        This impression is imposed by propaganda, serving the ordinary performance of duties as a kind of achievement.

                        The husband has a certain merger of selfish interests
                        Business and bureaucracy are definitely not for the good of the country and citizens.
                        It cannot be otherwise.

                        Persons replacing key government posts directly or indirectly belong to the ruling class - to the big bourgeoisie, which means that the class interests of business and bureaucracy not only coincide, but are identical.

                        So we have, the people owe everything, everything is obliged to fulfill, and the upper and next to them anointed have all other rights
                        This is also not surprising - this is a logical insurmountable contradiction between labor and capital.

                        We can get to the handle like that, and we will be forced to wear yellow vests!
                        After all, everything is logical, it is repeated, the people, the working people must conquer, dig their rights .... with blood, from those who monopolized all rights only for the benefit of themselves.
                        This is the main thing, the very essence, of our present life!
                        +
                      3. rocket757
                        rocket757 16 December 2018 07: 56
                        +1
                        So in fact a classic of the genre!
                        Those who don’t know the classics, haven’t read good books, often remember the rake, which they have already stepped on more than once and take a closer look around !!!
                        Maybe even then sho in the brain will become clear.
                        Eh, our people are glorious, but much does not come from where we need to, but from the rear, when it is absolutely hot!
    2. Henderson
      Henderson 14 December 2018 15: 10
      -2
      but we make rockets and planes
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 14 December 2018 15: 13
        +2
        Quote: Henderson
        but we make rockets and planes

        We do, and then what? Disposal by ???
        Give me a peaceful one, more joy from him!
        1. Henderson
          Henderson 14 December 2018 16: 37
          0
          So do me too. War is bad
        2. K-612-O
          K-612-O 14 December 2018 16: 49
          +1
          Not for me. How will I earn? what laughing
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 14 December 2018 18: 00
            0
            Everything needs harmony, a reasonable balance. I am very worried that the production of machine tools and radio components has not been restored! Schaub for every little thing and krupnyak we all over the world !!! And everything is complicated there, they didn’t give, and they give, but we wouldn’t need that at all, and there’s nowhere to take it.
            A military man, yes it will be done for a very long time, but then again, preferably on its elemental base and on its equipment!
            That's why I advocate .... hosiery-candy interests me weakly, although for this I also need my own equipment, production!
            1. sdc_alex
              sdc_alex 14 December 2018 20: 48
              -1
              That's right, everything in the country should be its own, and a resistor and a transistor, and an iron and a telephone ........

              I suggest reinventing your wheel, phone, etc. etc.

              The most interesting thing is that we all have our own, that's just the price .... because the scale of production is not international, not on a planetary scale, hence the price ....
              anyway.
              1. rocket757
                rocket757 14 December 2018 22: 19
                +1
                With the purchase of the fact that the planetary scale, we broke off! And with the state scale, we have a complete bummer because economic development is not ah.
  4. solzh
    solzh 14 December 2018 14: 25
    +2
    These steps once again show the incompetence of our macroeconomists and financiers in the government. Our followers of the Gaidar region cannot and cannot analyze and forecast not only for the year ahead, but even for the quarter.
    Forecasters from the economy insisted that by the end of the year, oil could exceed the price mark of $ 90 per barrel (Brent brand). Today, oil is trading around 60 US dollars
  5. Roman070280
    Roman070280 14 December 2018 14: 31
    +6
    Oil goes up - gas goes up ..
    Oil is getting cheaper - gas is getting more expensive ..
    Oil is getting cheaper - the ruble is getting cheaper ..
    Oil will rise in price .. the ruble will fall in price anyway ..
    1. sdc_alex
      sdc_alex 14 December 2018 20: 50
      0
      forgot about retirement tell us. repeat
  6. vladimirvn
    vladimirvn 14 December 2018 15: 46
    -1
    ... Now financiers are watching how the Russian ruble will respond to the decision of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation ..
    You are funny. How can he still react ?! Down of course. laughing
  7. Device
    Device 14 December 2018 16: 12
    0
    I wonder which country’s coat of arms stamps the Central Bank on Russian money? Why is American coat of arms on American money, Turkey on Turkey, even the Kazakh coat of arms on the Kazakh tugriks. And so-called Sberbank emblem is printed on Russian money. Why so?
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar 14 December 2018 16: 48
      0
      A conspiracy of Sberbank Sages against the Ruble.
      1. Spine
        Spine 14 December 2018 17: 31
        +1
        Quote: Krasnodar
        A conspiracy of Sberbank Sages against the Ruble.

        You shouldn’t maliciously mock Krasnodar, we know where the ears are from ..
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 17: 37
          +1
          Quote: Spine
          Quote: Krasnodar
          A conspiracy of Sberbank Sages against the Ruble.

          You shouldn’t maliciously mock Krasnodar, we know where the ears are from ..

          Duc and stick out from there, Vital
        2. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar 14 December 2018 17: 41
          -1
          Right, from Tel Aviv. And Nabiullina is a descendant of the Khazar Khaganate. Gorbachev is an agent of the Rothschilds, Yeltsin is an agent of the Berezovsky, and Getman Mazepa is an Abramovich negative
          1. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 17: 43
            +1
            Quote: Krasnodar
            Yeltsin - Berezovsky, and Getman Mazepa - Abramovich

            So how is it that Abramochich get the status of an apprentice seamstress?
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar 14 December 2018 17: 45
              -1
              Thanks to a conspiracy with Waltzman against Khmelnitsky. All according to the Zionist Talmud, which promotes the superiority of the BUND over the Communist Party of Sierra Leone.
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 14 December 2018 17: 48
                +1
                Quote: Krasnodar
                Thanks to a conspiracy with Waltzman against Khmelnitsky.

                Oooh! And I remember how Putin leafed through his notebook, and sent Meadow to such a mother ... Together with Chubais ...
                1. Krasnodar
                  Krasnodar 14 December 2018 17: 51
                  0
                  With Chubais, I would have changed my job today, to be honest laughing
  8. Spine
    Spine 14 December 2018 17: 29
    +1
    The Central Bank of the Russian Federation in general has become a strange structure .. Type of state in the state and to whom it is not known ..
    Previously, there was the USSR State Bank regulating cash flows, both domestically and around the world!
    Who is lowering these bets now? According to the instagram ..))) As the RCC of the Russian Federation was destroyed, so immediately the oddities began. Everywhere a commercial secret ..!
    1. Claymore
      Claymore 14 December 2018 20: 38
      0
      Quote: Spine
      The Central Bank of the Russian Federation in general has become a strange structure .. Type of state in the state and to whom it is not known ..
      Who doesn’t know? laughing
  9. Snail N9
    Snail N9 14 December 2018 17: 30
    +3
    I look - New Year's "gifts" from the authorities are pouring on the Russian people - here you have the obligatory paid registration of smartphones, tablets, laptops, and control of all "card" transfers, a ban on transfers to credit cards, a ban on electronic wallets, "a ban for the purchase of currency, only after providing a certificate of payment of taxes, etc. ", permission to seize the only housing for debts to housing and communal services and banks, permission to transfer debts to housing and communal services to collectors, the law on" the inadmissibility of any criticism of the authorities "and so on and so on. the feeling that after the increase in the retirement age rolled out, the legislative and controlling authorities "broke off the chain" and rushed to invent and accept all the most "unpopular", all the most restrictive for the Russian common people - a feeling that legal and economic genocide began in Russia common people by power structures, the ruling party and their hangers-on.
    1. sdc_alex
      sdc_alex 14 December 2018 20: 53
      -1
      Read the "news" headlines on social networks less.
  10. APASUS
    APASUS 14 December 2018 18: 40
    +2
    Office Nabiullina at the end of the year raised the key rate

    Everything for the people, at the request of the working people!
  11. Turist1996
    Turist1996 14 December 2018 19: 28
    0
    Nefig was to "fit" into the "world" economy - ardent greetings from Vissarionovich to "geniuses" from the Higher Economic School like Gaidar and Chubais with Kudrin !!
  12. stasimar
    stasimar 14 December 2018 21: 22
    0
    yes she is mocking! such actions only provokes the fall of the ruble, which in her opinion had not been