NI makes an “unexpected” conclusion: in the event of a nuclear war, humanity will perish

181
Now, after the United States is once again changing its position on RSDM, military analysts of The National Interest published the article about the American nuclear arms race in the last century. The article notes that plans for civil defense in the United States were ambitious and were estimated at half the country's GDP at the time. But at the same time, they did not bring anything but the certainty that in the event of a nuclear war, all of humanity would inevitably perish.

NI makes an “unexpected” conclusion: in the event of a nuclear war, humanity will perish




Then in the USA it was supposed to build large underground bomb shelters-dwellings in all large cities. True, it was not possible to implement that civil defense program in the United States: partly because of the very high cost, partly because of the millions of civilian casualties, even with underground bunkers. It turned out (unexpectedly) that the only alternative to a nuclear war could be only peaceful coexistence on the planet.

Large-scale studies of this issue in the United States were conducted in the late fifties - early sixties of the last century. Their task was to propose the concept of survival of at least 80% of the US population in the event of a nuclear conflict. In the end, two models were proposed, but both were just cosmically expensive.

Both concepts were repelled by the idea that if cities could not avoid nuclear bombing "horizontally", then they should look for escape in flight "vertically." At the same time, the cost of these projects did not frighten Americans as much as the fact that for life underground it would be necessary to completely reformat the life of society from a social point of view.

The first model of salvation was offered by analysts of the RAND center. According to their project, under each city it was necessary to build a large bunker at a depth of about three hundred meters, which ensured survival even if the megaton hydrogen bomb hit. The entrances to the bunker had to be wide and numerous in different points of the cities, approximately like the entrances to the subway, so that a large number of citizens could descend into the air-raid shelter in a few minutes.

After that, all the rescued Americans remained in this bunker for a long time and went almost to martial law: they slept, ate and washed themselves together, forgetting forever about any individual space. At the same time, special paramilitary units had to follow order, so this collective residence in the bunker was more like a voluntary stay in prison.

The model was "well thought out", but its cost is enormous. However, following it, it was possible to save individual human lives, but to lose society as a whole, to which neither the leadership of the country, nor the Americans themselves were obviously ready then. And now they are hardly capable of it.

A second project to save the nation in a nuclear war was developed at Cornell College of Architecture. The idea of ​​the architects was to create an underground communal city with a capacity of up to 9 thousands of people. In this bomb-shelter-city, people would have to go down the aisles in schools and colleges, and after the impact they would have to go outside and maintain the work of factories and schools. True, according to this model, almost the entire population of the United States perished, with the exception of those elected to whom space was allocated under the ground. This plan was rejected with the grim conclusion that "there will not be so many bulldozers in the States to clear the streets of corpses."

After such studies, the Americans realized that nothing saves humanity in the event of a nuclear catastrophe. Therefore, all models and methods for overcoming the consequences of nuclear war were rejected. In the United States, nothing was left of the GO programs of those years besides rusty tablets with the words “bomb shelter”. The world remained in the atmosphere of nuclear deterrence, and peaceful coexistence is the only solution that allows us to survive an atomic missile strike, simply by not allowing it.
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  1. +4
    15 November 2018 12: 11
    But at the same time, they brought nothing but confidence that in the event of a nuclear war, all of humanity will inevitably die.
    And then the "big game" will end ... Game over, so to speak ... The next game will be played without us.
    1. +2
      15 November 2018 12: 11
      Part of the article is very unexpected news ...
      1. +5
        15 November 2018 12: 29
        Quote: maxim947
        Part of the article is very unexpected news ..

        for a long time they digested it. from the age of 45
        1. +1
          15 November 2018 12: 52
          at 45 no one thought about the global atomic war at all, but about its consequences and even more so
          1. +3
            15 November 2018 13: 03
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            at 45 about global atomic war no one thought at all

            because they were sure that we would never have such a weapon.
            and began to think when they saw the results of the bombing of Japan
            1. +2
              15 November 2018 13: 11
              Quote: LSA57
              and began to think when they saw the results of the bombing of Japan

              Listen, well, read at least something before you write a blizzard, and it’s not the first time, the first Soviet atomic bomb is 49 years old, what is the global atomic war? !!!!
              1. -1
                15 November 2018 13: 17
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                not the first time

                accountant, consider jambs after yourself !!!!
                quoted about Japan, and answered about 49 years. where is there about the global war ???
                so which of us doesn’t read ????
                1. -1
                  15 November 2018 14: 05
                  Quote: LSA57
                  consider jambs behind you !!!!
                  and you and I, did we drink the brudershaft? !!!
                  Quote: LSA57
                  quoted about Japan, and answered about 49 years. where is there about the global war ???

                  I understand you are not fooling around ?!
                  article on global nuclear conflict and civil defense
                  You claimed that the Americans had been preparing for such a conflict since the age of 45
                  Quote: LSA57

                  Quote: maxim947
                  Part of the article is very unexpected news ..
                  for a long time they digested it. from the age of 45
                  I didn’t confuse anything, did I quote it right?
            2. +2
              15 November 2018 14: 37
              Quote: LSA57
              were sure that we would never have such a weapon.

              not quite so: they thought that we would not have such weapons for at least 20 years, and their task is to accumulate more nuclear weapons in these 20 years, because in the 1945m they had only a few warheads! By the way, during the Caribbean crisis, they had 1500 warheads, and we have only 100, but they still did not dare to attack!
              1. +2
                15 November 2018 16: 07
                They did not risk attacking North Korea in 2018, although Kim and a hundred, most likely, will not be typed laughing
                Quote: Tutejszy
                Quote: LSA57
                were sure that we would never have such a weapon.

                not quite so: they thought that we would not have such weapons for at least 20 years, and their task is to accumulate more nuclear weapons in these 20 years, because in the 1945m they had only a few warheads! By the way, during the Caribbean crisis, they had 1500 warheads, and we have only 100, but they still did not dare to attack!
        2. +9
          15 November 2018 13: 19
          This plan was rejected with the grim conclusion that in the States "there aren’t so many bulldozers to clear the streets of corpses».

          These words need to be burned with hot iron on the foreheads of those hawks and fools who think that nuclear armageddon is not so scary.
          1. -3
            16 November 2018 15: 11
            Quote: NEXUS
            These words need to be burned with hot iron on the foreheads of those hawks and fools who think that nuclear armageddon is not so scary.

            It is a paradox that we speak more often about the use of nuclear weapons than they do. Either Zhirik, then the Commander-in-Chief ... And everyone is getting ready to answer. What are they, what are we.
    2. +5
      15 November 2018 12: 17
      Everyone understands everything correctly in the USA, but humanity will still survive, it will simply return to the Stone Age .. For this reason, there is no nuclear war and there will not be .. as long as there are countries capable of destroying the USA.
      1. +4
        15 November 2018 12: 23
        The same thing is with us .. One rusty plate .. But after all, before every enterprise there was a shelter.
        1. +3
          15 November 2018 12: 30
          Quote: 210ox
          The same thing is with us .. One rusty plate .. But after all, before every enterprise there was a shelter.

          and almost under every house. Well, what's the point of them?
          1. +5
            15 November 2018 12: 35
            Quote: LSA57
            Well, what's the point of them?

            the first is moral comfort
            second - in the event of a non-nuclear strike, they could still come in handy
            1. 0
              15 November 2018 12: 38
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              the first is moral comfort

              but I’m somehow calmer when I know that there will never be a war
              second - in the event of a non-nuclear strike, they could still come in handy

              Well, and who will climb on us from non-nuclear countries?
              1. +4
                15 November 2018 12: 51
                Quote: LSA57
                Well, and who will climb on us from non-nuclear countries?

                how old are you?
                1. -3
                  15 November 2018 13: 04
                  Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                  how old are you?

                  and who are your parents?
                  1. +4
                    15 November 2018 13: 12
                    engineers, there are still questions, comrade from Odessa ?!
                    1. +1
                      15 November 2018 13: 49
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      engineers, there are still questions,

                      just two. don't you from the hatchet.
                      the first. You were not told that it is impolite to answer a question with a question?
                      second. what does my age have to do with the topic of conversation?
                      1. +1
                        15 November 2018 14: 08
                        Quote: LSA57
                        you are not a fellow of the hatchet.

                        and you’re also a snob, I’ve never been to Khatsepetovka, I was born in Alma-Ata. Now I live in the Kaliningrad region
                        By the way, why are you bothered by communication with a person from the countryside?
                        Quote: LSA57
                        what does my age have to do with the topic of conversation?

                        Well, how would you explain? !!!!
                        when a person affirms not quite correct things and is also offended by the fact that they point him to it, he speaks either of stupidity or of a small age
            2. +3
              15 November 2018 13: 16
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              the first is moral comfort

              I agree with that
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              second - in the event of a non-nuclear strike, they could still come in handy

              With this, in fact, we had a shelter in our house, a littered cellar, at the entrance to which there was a SHELTER and an arrow written on the screen. And so near each entrance in the city. Drawn in the middle of 80x. And then and now all the more I don’t understand. How can a warrior stay there.
              1. +3
                15 November 2018 14: 10
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                With this, in fact, we had a shelter in our house, a littered cellar, at the entrance to which there was a SHELTER and an arrow

                Well, don’t tell me, during the period 60-70 this was followed, another question is that sooner they realized that there would be 0.000 (0) sense from this
                1. +2
                  15 November 2018 16: 19
                  Why is zero? If during a nuclear strike you sit out in a bomb shelter remote from the epicenter on the outskirts of the city, after three days you may well leave the built-up area and after a while find yourself in a safe place.
                  1. +2
                    15 November 2018 16: 25
                    Quote: Krasnodar
                    after three days you can easily leave the built-up area and after a while find yourself in a safe place.

                    where is it safe?
                    what to do with the residual radiation, but something else to eat
                    that is, I’ll go out and then ....
                    1. +2
                      15 November 2018 16: 32
                      Radiation very quickly (within two weeks) reaches normal, after three days - a safe level. Eat - shops in small towns, cattle in the countryside and all kinds of shopping centers outside the city will remain. And then look at the situation ...
                      1. +2
                        15 November 2018 16: 59
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Radiation very quickly (within two weeks) reaches normal, after three days - a safe level.

                        Strontium-90: half-life of about 30 years
                        Cesium-137 for about 30 years
                        everyone will have fun
                      2. +1
                        15 November 2018 17: 12
                        Only they will accumulate at the bottom of swamps and small lakes
                      3. +2
                        15 November 2018 18: 24
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Only they will accumulate at the bottom of swamps and small lakes

                        and then through the drive you will consume them
                        but this is not the worst, here ak meet a dinosaur 50x50
                        then there will be epidemics and famine
                      4. 0
                        15 November 2018 18: 43
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Only they will accumulate at the bottom of swamps and small lakes

                        and then through the drive you will consume them
                        but this is not the worst, here ak meet a dinosaur 50x50
                        then there will be epidemics and famine

                        Anarchy, etc. My dream is to build a large bunker in the foothills of the Caucasus ... But it’s worth the dough - don’t mourn laughing Potanin and Abramovich will pull, of course, but it's too early for me to think about it ((
                      5. +1
                        15 November 2018 19: 03
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        . My dream is to build a large bunker in the foothills of the Caucasus ...

                        and what are you going to do there ?! belay
                      6. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 34
                        Lead a commune, breed telapia, plant vegetables for special purposes. lighting, replenish stocks of medicines from nearby rural pharmacies, read, raise children, etc. )) To live.
                      7. +1
                        15 November 2018 22: 38
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        to grow vegetables for special. lighting

                        it’s already funny, but there will be no light - LUCHINA
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        replenish the supply of medicines from the local village pharmacies

                        you’ve been in the village for a long time, I’m talking about medicines, at best it’s enough for a month, and if you take into account that there will be a lot of intestinal and other infections, it’s even less, keep in mind that the immunity of today's people is several times less than even 40-50 years ago
                      8. +1
                        15 November 2018 22: 41
                        There are already technologies for growing vegetables under artificial lighting, in Switzerland, in a former army bunker, where tourists have access to, I saw a tiny hydropower station, and generators can be instructed and fuel is a matter of money. Yes, and you can buy medicines, and much more to do. Again - it all comes down to money.
                      9. +1
                        15 November 2018 22: 45
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        There are already Technologies for growing vegetables under artificial lighting

                        for this you need ELECTRICITY, but it simply will not be
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        I saw a tiny hydropower plant

                        Well, I have a river 40 meters away, God forbid, tomorrow it’s sinking and how will I make a hydroelectric station ?!
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        fueling is a matter of money.

                        Well, word as a child, where will I get fuel? !!!!!
                        at a gas station?
                        so it will either burn or empty in five minutes, and there will be no more supplies, wherever you take the generators, there won’t be the same shops and companies, that’s what you’ll have with you or at home and will survive
                      10. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 47
                        laughing ... such bunkers for communal living in VIP conditions with constantly updated stocks have long existed in the States))
                        The Vivos company builds the most chic, but there are other specialists. In the Russian Federation, they are mainly building about ten such people. Private companies.
                      11. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 50
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        such bunkers for communal living in VIP conditions with constantly updated stocks have long existed in the States))

                        Well, don’t tell anyone, there are robotic complexes for the production of drugs, they’ve stocked up for 100 people, they’ll last for 20 years and vegetables, but this is a dead end of the drug, the technology will break down and what’s next? !!!
                      12. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 52
                        Will be released sooner. Than after 5 years. And then the organization of production and life around such foci. Trade, self-defense, etc. The main thing is access to information and resources.
                      13. +2
                        15 November 2018 22: 57
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Trade, self-defense, etc. The main thing is access to information and resources.

                        Once again, have you even let out one tree, for firewood ?!
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Trade, self-defense, etc. The main thing is access to information and resources.

                        which side do you know approach the plow?
                        how to dry grain
                        when to plant?
                        to take birth, at least for a goat, I don’t even ask about a person what to do with diarrhea, how to treat pneumonia ?!
                        it's all beautiful when on a sofa in a warm apartment in front of a computer, studying beautiful pictures.
                      14. 0
                        15 November 2018 23: 01
                        To the plow? )) Tomorrow I will find out, family farming - thousands of hectares, drying of grain and terms - so I want it - tomorrow they will tell everyone laughing About the person - I know. Voenfeldsher of the Iraml army, was engaged in the medical business since 2001 approximately, now medical tourism. )) Among other things. Now more agricultural interests - greenhouses, tomatoes, and livestock in the future.
                      15. +1
                        15 November 2018 23: 07
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Tomorrow I will find out, family economy - thousands of hectares

                        when you find out, specify which of you will harness it
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        About the person - I know. Voenfeldsher of the Iraml army, was engaged in the medical business since 2001 approximately, now medical tourism. )) Among other things.

                        then it’s not clear why such optimism themselves should understand how it all ends
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        grain drying and timing - I want it - tomorrow they will tell everyone

                        by the way, drying giggles in vain; it uses electricity which will not be there before the new harvest; about 40% of the reserves survived; the rest was not suitable - charm, diseases, rodents
                        once again, the whole civilization will end instantly and everything will have to be done with pens, by the way the matches will end quickly
                      16. 0
                        15 November 2018 23: 15
                        I do not giggle, I just say that I have access to this information by phone call.
                        And a man is such a beast that always prepares for the worst, hoping for the best. )) Therefore, I am always peppy laughing
                      17. +1
                        15 November 2018 23: 16
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Therefore i am always peppy

                        Well, then you will die with a smile and hope for the best
                      18. 0
                        15 November 2018 23: 19
                        We will all die like that laughing
                      19. +1
                        15 November 2018 23: 09
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Autra know, family economy - thousands of hectares,

                        from thousands of hectares you will very quickly refuse more how to treat it with a hoe, not a tractor
                      20. 0
                        15 November 2018 23: 17
                        I will refuse, because it’s sinking nearby. Then I won’t get there. And if I get there, it will not be mine.
                      21. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 51
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        In the Russian Federation, they are mainly building about ten such people.

                        you yourself are not funny ?!
                        I'm talking about the death of civilization and 10 "survivors" and those who died in the bunker from old age, well, if the weather lasts, they don't play
                      22. 0
                        15 November 2018 23: 17
                        There are many such bunkers and many will survive in the outback.
                      23. 0
                        16 November 2018 06: 49
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        There are many such bins

                        per 100 people ?!
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        in the outback, many will survive.

                        well yes, outback bunkers on every corner
                      24. -1
                        16 November 2018 12: 00
                        There will be no Nuclear Strike in the outback)))
                        And most of the fallout from radioactive fallout
                      25. 0
                        16 November 2018 13: 02
                        so there after and there will be no medicine
                      26. -1
                        16 November 2018 13: 11
                        And not just medicines. Household chemicals, disinfection, etc. But at least 30 percent will survive
                      27. 0
                        16 November 2018 14: 01
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        But at least 30 percent will survive

                        what would die after hunger and infection?
                      28. -1
                        16 November 2018 14: 16
                        If we get lucky ))
                      29. 0
                        16 November 2018 15: 43
                        unfortunately no luck
                        and the living will envy the dead
                      30. -1
                        16 November 2018 16: 24
                        Yes, I do not believe in this slogan. War is scary. Nuclear war is even worse. But this is not a concentration camp. By no means do I want it to erupt, almost everything suits me in this way of life and in this country (except for state interventions to increase the dollar exchange rate) laughing), but I do not believe in such Total Tryndets in the event of a conflict on 1/6 (or 1/8) of the land!
                      31. 0
                        16 November 2018 16: 50
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        marketer in case of conflict on 1/6 (or 1/8) of the land!

                        well why tryndets, it is quite possible that savages from south america or africa will not even notice this
                        Well maybe Australia will bring
                      32. -1
                        17 November 2018 11: 58
                        Switzerland, Ireland, Chile no? Or Europe with latinos too kayuk? The same Argentina? And Siberia?
                      33. 0
                        17 November 2018 14: 41
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Switzerland

                        Switzerland definitely not
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        And Siberia

                        oh forgot super heroes in the same place, trees felled with spits with bears I drink tea in the morning
                        I will repeat once again WE A TECHNICAL CIVILIZATION, over the past 30 years EVEN EVEN IN OUR DEPTH we moved away from manual labor, respectively, as soon as we pull out a rug of civilizational amenities from under us, we fall to the ground
                        sorry in siberia plow the land with horse traction ?! !!
                        maybe they live without electricity?
                        but there will not be all this what will they do?
                      34. -1
                        17 November 2018 14: 50
                        I agree. Will Switzerland die from precipitation? What about latinos?
                      35. +1
                        17 November 2018 20: 08
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        A latinos

                        Well, purely theoretically, and they can get it all depends on the wind rose in America, although it may be lucky
                      36. 0
                        17 November 2018 20: 08
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Will Switzerland die from precipitation?

                        the Swiss will get to the heap with the EU
                      37. 0
                        17 November 2018 20: 10
                        I don’t think so. Precipitation - yes, a blow to them - definitely not. And then, there is a bomb shelter in almost every house, the first two weeks they somehow cross over.
                      38. 0
                        17 November 2018 21: 00
                        "miss" will shoot something over them
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        And then, there is a bomb shelter in almost every house, the first two weeks they somehow cross over.

                        and then down the list, hunger, illness and complete ...
                      39. 0
                        17 November 2018 21: 04
                        Hunger is unlikely to threaten them, the production of drugs without bombing will not stop, etc. And how will they “miss” them? No nuclear weapons will be spent on them; they are neutral and quite isolated.
                      40. 0
                        17 November 2018 21: 15
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Yes, and how to “miss” them

                        purely by chance feel that not only would we feel bad
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Nuclear weapons will not be spent on them

                        it is so much that one time is possible, but they don’t need more
                      41. +1
                        17 November 2018 20: 08
                        minus not I set
                      42. 0
                        17 November 2018 20: 11
                        I don’t respond to them)) This is what they retroactively put for my “Middle Eastern” comments on another thread.
                      43. +1
                        17 November 2018 21: 05
                        Well, I’m just in case, that would not have thought what
                        in general, our people have been corrupted by the last 20 years, now the closest supermarket and tragedy are closed, and I remember in the beginning of the 90s I sometimes ran 5 km from store to store to buy bread
                      44. +1
                        17 November 2018 21: 07
                        I walk now, for the sake of walking laughing
                        Well, yes, we have lost our farming skills. Maybe somewhere in quite remote villages and auls that remains))
                      45. +2
                        15 November 2018 18: 38
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Eat - shops in small towns,

                        Devour in a couple of months.
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        cattle in the countryside

                        Idem.
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        And then look at the situation ...

                        Anarchy.
                      46. 0
                        15 November 2018 19: 04
                        Quote: Mordvin 3
                        Anarchy.

                        we won’t live to anarchy - before we die
                      47. 0
                        15 November 2018 19: 05
                        I do not argue. Therefore, a shelter nearby should be ready ...
                      48. +1
                        16 November 2018 11: 32
                        Just imagine ... It began. You are in the city center. And then a signal comes, "carrots" fly ... And they fly for 30-40 minutes, no more. Until they figure out that this is really a threat, until it comes to sirens, etc., a certain number of minutes will pass. Well, you will have about 15-20 minutes. Where will you run in a general panic? Or do you remember all the shelters in the area? Run up, and there the doors are locked ...
                        Then otvetka. And on the other side of the ball everything will be the same.
                        Remote areas, northern peoples, etc., will survive, and then if they do not cover them with a train later. Something like that ... Nobody needs that ...
                      49. 0
                        16 November 2018 12: 05
                        If the war begins with the floundering bay - to all the khan. But, as a rule, escalation is gradual. International tension, then conventional fights ... and then you have to leave the city ... then use nuclear weapons in the army, and at that time you are already somewhere in your bunker in the village.
          2. +10
            15 November 2018 13: 06
            LSA57 (Sergei)
            and almost under every house. Well, what's the point of them?
            When the Ukrainian army bombed the cities of Donbass in the spring and summer of 2014, they remembered every bomb shelter that had not yet been destroyed. And many civilians who didn’t want to or could not hide from the bombing were there, just like they used cellars in residential buildings. and sometimes it’s ridiculous. And when there’s a life threatening from anywhere, you’ll climb into every gap. And you’ve done some sloppiness in Russia. They don’t even say any words. There’s no bomb shelter anyway. because they don’t build. Shopping malls are now in fashion. And gold square meters of housing without decoration ..
            1. +1
              15 November 2018 13: 22
              Quote: Observer2014
              And for that sloppiness that in Russia with GO done.

              began to create in the days of the USSR. I remember well that they began to turn them in the late 70s
              1. 0
                15 November 2018 16: 02
                Quote: LSA57
                began to create in the days of the USSR. I remember well that they began to turn them in the late 70s

                Our bomb shelter is designed for 50 kg and stay in it for no more than an hour. There were attempts to increase the residence time to 4 hours. But with overlapping BYAD. Withdrew from the fund.
          3. +3
            15 November 2018 13: 43
            Quote: LSA57
            and almost under every house. Well, what's the point of them?

            Yellow first-aid kits were stored there, and in them an interesting remedy for FOV - Taren.
            1. +2
              15 November 2018 13: 46
              Quote: serpent
              Yellow first-aid kits were stored there, and in them an interesting remedy for FOV - Taren.

              then it was removed everywhere laughing
              1. +1
                15 November 2018 13: 56
                Quote: LSA57
                then it was removed everywhere

                In those first-aid kits that I met, promedol or something like that was deleted. Taren was there.
                1. +2
                  15 November 2018 14: 02
                  Quote: serpent
                  In those first-aid kits that I met, promedol was removed

                  paramedol removed earlier. Toren was still in first-aid kits at least until 2000.
                  he died at work at our place of work. appointed revision. we were attracted to help.
                  how many OZK we have pleased the fishermen ... laughing
                  here was toren there.
                  1. +1
                    15 November 2018 15: 13
                    Eh ... The country was saving up a lot of such kindness in its bins. It’s good that I didn’t have to use all this for its intended purpose.
              2. 0
                16 November 2018 11: 25
                Quote: LSA57
                then it was removed everywhere

                According to many scientists, these pills have a very strong psychotropic effect on the body and adversely affect health in the future. Already in the late nineties, this tool began to be produced in smaller quantities. A presidential decree was issued, according to which, immediately, all organizations needed to remove a potent drug from warehouses and destroy it. - Read more on FB.ru: http://fb.ru/article/238827/tabletka-taren-ot-radiatsii
        2. 0
          15 November 2018 12: 48
          Quote: 210ox
          But before, every enterprise had a refuge.

          I visited one such bunker in 1988, if the memory serves me right. Then I was impressed, and now remembering the size of this bunker I understand that a maximum would fit in it, only the plant’s bosses
          1. +2
            15 November 2018 13: 07
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            and now remembering the size of this bunker I understand that a maximum would fit in it, only the plant’s bosses

            even the fenders realized that you can’t hide everyone.
            Then in the United States it was planned to build large underground bomb shelters-dwellings in all major cities. However, it was not possible to implement that civil defense program in the USA: partly due to the very high cost, partly due to multi-million civilian casualties even with underground bunkers
            1. 0
              15 November 2018 15: 07
              For that, in games they fully realized their dream. Fallout example.
              And now, the idea is actively circulating in the media that these nuclear explosions are not so harmful. That the ammunition is modern, much cleaner than the first, that all theories about nuclear winter and others are untenable.
              In short, they are still pushing for this option.
      2. +3
        15 November 2018 12: 29
        Their task was to propose the concept of survival of at least 80% of the US population in the event of a nuclear conflict.

        I am not familiar with the history as closely as I would like, but I do not recall cases of attacks on the United States over the past 70 years. Their claims and overtly aggressive attacks can be listed for a long time. I can only guess the reason for this behavior - the lack of response steps. The only reason for the possible start of a nuclear war can be considered either a mistake in the artificial intelligence of the Pentagon computers or the final loss of the natural.
        1. +1
          15 November 2018 14: 09
          In 2001, they attacked themselves with the help of the Saudis. They still can’t win.
      3. 0
        15 November 2018 12: 31
        Quote: Svarog
        just back in the stone age ..

        in the Stone Age savages from the jungle will remain, and we will go to fertilizer. just at different speeds, who immediately, and who after half a year
        1. 0
          15 November 2018 12: 39
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          and we will go to fertilizer. just at different speeds, who immediately, and who after half a year

          and you kind of hoped for a bomb shelter. morally so
          1. +1
            15 November 2018 12: 50
            you would read everything, otherwise you will look as always with rams and deep space
            1. -1
              15 November 2018 13: 10
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              otherwise you look like always with rams and deep space

              Now I understand what is in your head. except for cockroaches in your outer space there is nothing there.

              you would read everything

              but what is there to read? about savages? Well, of course, this topic is closer to you. I'm not an expert in it
              1. 0
                15 November 2018 14: 11
                Quote: LSA57
                I'm not an expert in it

                Yes, apparently not only in them
        2. 0
          15 November 2018 18: 24
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          we will go to fertilizer. just at different speeds

          Even the urban population will not go completely: those who manage to take cover or leave the city ahead of time risk being in the ranks of the builders of a new civilization on the ruins of the present.

          Of course, the option of continuing the development of an existing civilization is much more preferable.
          1. +3
            15 November 2018 19: 17
            Quote: Nychego
            those who manage to take refuge or leave the city ahead of time risk being among the builders of a new civilization on the ruins of the present.

            the first man today, especially the post-Soviet generation, is no longer adapted to survive, the second even if one third dies enough to die in the near future at least 4/5 of those left from the epidemics, the rest will be finished by hunger and cold, the natives will survive in the jungle how they ran with bare booty and spear
      4. 0
        15 November 2018 16: 11
        Quote: Svarog
        Everyone understands everything correctly in the USA, but humanity will still survive, it will simply return to the Stone Age .. For this reason, there is no nuclear war and there will not be .. as long as there are countries capable of destroying the USA.

        Not all countries will return to the Stone Age, and in the States themselves, about 30 percent of the population will survive (if not more), because no nuclear weapons will be spent on any mini-cities of Carolina and Idaho. But they will live at the level of Central Africa - clan wars, etc.
        1. +1
          15 November 2018 18: 33
          Quote: Krasnodar
          in the States themselves, about 30 percent of the population will survive (if not more), because no nuclear weapons will be spent on any mini-cities of Carolina and Idaho.

          They will only have to solve the problem of how to survive the "nuclear winter" or "nuclear autumn" if, after all, the calculations of mathematicians like the disappeared VV Aleksandrov are incorrect. For post-agrarian societies, the problem is quite solvable, although it requires a high degree of social consolidation.
          1. 0
            15 November 2018 18: 40
            I don’t know about nuclear winter, summer or autumn - it seems to me what will happen like in the Persian Gulf 1990-1991 - a temporary drop in temperature by 3-4 degrees. Regarding the consolidation of society - I doubt that the Americans will achieve this. The federal government (its remnants) will maneuver between the interests of more or less surviving states until it disappears as meaningless. And then - the central African scenario.
            1. +2
              15 November 2018 18: 47
              Quote: Krasnodar
              I don’t know about nuclear winter, summer or autumn

              The article, even in the Russian version of Wikipedia, is quite informative.

              In the 80s, the calculations were quite serious, with the involvement of reliable scientific information. He himself witnessed the collection of information on the dry weight of biomass in the forest regions of the Urals. Employees at that time carried out work at the Ural Forestry Institute, the Ural Forest Institute and the Institute of Ecology of the Ural Branch of the USSR Academy of Sciences. The fact that the program was supervised by the USSR Ministry of Defense through the USSR Academy of Sciences was no secret to managers and research participants.
              1. 0
                15 November 2018 18: 51
                I do not argue - not special, but the only situation close to the consequences of a nuclear war has refuted these calculations.
                1. +2
                  15 November 2018 19: 03
                  Quote: Krasnodar
                  the only situation close to the consequences of a nuclear war has refuted these calculations.

                  Situations were repeatedly - eruptions of the so-called "supervolcanoes". The main difference from the "War in the Gulf" is the removal of a significant amount of ash particles outside the troposphere. In the stratosphere, horizontal transport processes have a very different character, and the structure and nature of air flows will allow ash particles (ash) not to fall to the ground for a long time. Another disadvantage of particles entering the stratosphere is that there is no equatorial transport barrier, otherwise humanity would have a whole hemisphere (southern) to preserve a civilizational base.
                  Well, if this serves as a consolation to anyone - Russian powerful nuclear weapons charges will make a decisive contribution to the civilization core - our mushrooms with their hat will drag the bulk of the ash into the stratosphere.
                  1. 0
                    15 November 2018 19: 04
                    Comforted))))
                    1. +1
                      15 November 2018 19: 04
                      Quote: Krasnodar
                      Comforted))))

                      I tried.)))
            2. +2
              15 November 2018 19: 22
              Quote: Krasnodar
              The federal government (its remnants) will maneuver between the interests of more or less surviving states,

              and there will be no more or less survivors, remember Hurricane Katrina - riots started immediately, and this is not a global blow to the whole territory
              1. 0
                15 November 2018 19: 25
                Will be. Not all small towns and even administrative centers will be hit. The goals of the Russian Federation are in Europe, military targets in the United States, BV, Japan, etc.
                1. +1
                  15 November 2018 19: 32
                  Quote: Krasnodar
                  Not all small towns and even administrative centers will be hit

                  1. 0
                    15 November 2018 19: 45
                    66 cities of strategic importance - 204 bombs. The remaining 260 are for military / other purposes. The question is - will there be a blow to many small cities and even small administrative centers?
                    1. 0
                      15 November 2018 19: 51
                      Quote: Krasnodar
                      The question is - will there be a blow to many small cities and even small administrative centers?

                      for example, they will hit industrial centers, although these are plans of the 40s and 50s, there was not enough "heads" now enough for more, but having destroyed the industry, the rest will be left to starve to death, by the way, you can MANUALLY saw and chop wood for the winter ?!
                      1. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 06
                        Many Americans do that. For the sake of the fireplace - exotic, but still ... America - except for large cities, mostly one-story (two-story). I - no, but if hunger forces - not that I can))
                      2. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 35
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        I - no, but if hunger forces - not that I can))

                        while it’s sitting on the couch, but when it’s baking ...
                        By the way, you will still need to find the saw, a chainsaw to dissolve the tree, you will be thrown off, but you don’t even want to think manually
                        and besides firewood everything else will still be needed, DYE ALL, who earlier who tormented a bit later
                      3. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 44
                        Well no! )))
                        People will get together in communes and together will cut down the forest, collect branches, etc.
                      4. +1
                        15 November 2018 22: 46
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Well no! )))
                        People will get together in communes and together they will cut down the forest

                        only honestly, have you even let out one tree ?!
                        By the way, what will they saw?
                        communes need to be fed, what will you feed?
                      5. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 54
                        Not dismissed, everyone needs to stock up in advance))
                      6. +1
                        15 November 2018 23: 02
                        Quote: Krasnodar
                        Do not dissolve, everyone needs to stock up in advance

                        everything is clear, do not be offended, but in principle you do not know what you are talking about
                        for the sake of interest, take a saw and saw a log at least 50 cm in diameter, by the way where you will store everything you saw beforehand laughing ?!
                        where will you store medicine, seeds, and most importantly HOW ?!
                      7. 0
                        15 November 2018 23: 20
                        In a large VIP bunker, for which there is no money yet fellow
                      8. 0
                        16 November 2018 06: 48
                        how many drugs?
                        drowning, two, three? !!!!
          2. 0
            15 November 2018 19: 21
            Quote: Nychego
            For post-agrarian societies the problem is completely solvable, although it requires a high degree of consolidation of society.

            it is not solvable in principle, 40 years yes, now no
            if technology is taken away from today's peasants, this will mean the end of everything, and it will be so
            all equipment will be fun because of a lack of fuel
            there will be no meat, no vegetables, no grain, in the gardens, even the gardens will not save - today not a single household completely provides itself with feed
            1. 0
              15 November 2018 19: 22
              Theoretically can provide. Potato, fodder beets.
              1. 0
                15 November 2018 19: 26
                Quote: Krasnodar
                Theoretically can provide.

                even theoretically - ALL gardens for households are plowed and covered with appliances, do not even write about fodder beets, to feed one goat for 150 days you will need about 0,5 hectares (in tight fit), but they will still need to be processed, I'm sorry but you don’t You will find no one who knows how to do this without a tractor, and you also need to grind it to give cattle, etc. etc.
                1. 0
                  15 November 2018 19: 30
                  It is unlikely that all equipment will be destroyed, but its quality will decrease over time, but all sorts of workshops will flourish and multiply. )))
                  1. +1
                    15 November 2018 19: 52
                    Quote: Krasnodar
                    It is unlikely that all equipment will be destroyed

                    and you don’t need to destroy ALL equipment, just leave it without fuel
                    1. 0
                      15 November 2018 21: 06
                      I agree. Resumption of oil production and refining is more than one day and serious
                  2. 0
                    15 November 2018 20: 59
                    Quote: Krasnodar
                    but all sorts of workshops will flourish and multiply. )))

                    and how many artisan smiths do we have ?!
                    you forget that the workshops will have even bigger problems due to the lack of skills for working with their hands, only honestly can you sharpen the saw normally ?!
                    1. 0
                      15 November 2018 21: 11
                      No I can not
                      1. +1
                        15 November 2018 22: 28
                        here I am about the same thing, we have practically lost our skills to survive, even if we do not die from radiation, then hunger and epidemics will prove
                2. +1
                  15 November 2018 19: 47
                  Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                  , to feed one goat for 150 days you will need about 0,5 hectares (in tightness), but they will still need to be processed, I'm sorry but you will not find anyone who knows how to do this without a tractor, and you also need to grind it to give cattle, etc. etc.

                  My grandfather, as far as I remember, constantly had 4 goats + 1 horned-bearded (moderators don’t miss) was. Something like hay and potato peeling. (In winter, in the sense of).
                  1. +1
                    15 November 2018 19: 55
                    goat potato peeling goes only from hunger, ONE goat needs 3 kg of hay per day - 450 kg per season, one goat needs neither milk nor meat, besides it needs grain, otherwise again there will be no milk or kids
                    p / s / I have 50 goats so that I know what I'm writing
                    1. 0
                      15 November 2018 20: 03
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      ONE goat needs 3 kg of hay per day - 450 kg per season

                      Mowed dofiga. And about the grain - I do not remember, because of my youth it was not like that before.
                      1. 0
                        15 November 2018 20: 56
                        Quote: Mordvin 3
                        Mowed dofig

                        damn it's about nothing, as well as 4 goats - pampering
                        but when the question of survival arises, it turns out that you won’t find either potatoes, grain, bread or even a scythe
                      2. 0
                        15 November 2018 21: 07
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        that no potatoes, no grain, no bread, and even a scythe you will not find

                        I will find the scythe. Only there will be no sense from her. Goats will be devoured, grain with potatoes - too, few people will think about seeds. Well, I think the most stubborn will survive. Type Sterligov.
                      3. +1
                        15 November 2018 21: 17
                        Even if they do not devour it, it will be necessary to be able to protect it.
                      4. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 32
                        Quote: Mordvin 3
                        Well, I think the most stubborn will survive.

                        it’s not a matter of obstinacy, but skill, and it’s just not there, the same sterlig, he doesn’t spread the wood for firewood with a hand saw, and he does not plow the land with a horse, but with a tractor so that the seeds need to be stored, and this is without dryers oh what problem, the hay on the tractor was mowed and raked up, and no one can do it manually, etc.
                    2. The comment was deleted.
                    3. 0
                      15 November 2018 21: 13
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      goat potato peeling goes only from hunger, ONE goat needs 3 kg of hay per day - 450 kg per season, one goat needs neither milk nor meat, besides it needs grain, otherwise again there will be no milk or kids
                      p / s / I have 50 goats so that I know what I'm writing

                      Cost-effective? Milk?
                      1. +1
                        15 November 2018 22: 33
                        cheese, butter, sour cream, cottage cheese, meat
                      2. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 37
                        Milk + meat. Already at zero or live with it? We have a family economy in the Krasnodar Territory (cereals, mainly) so I'm interested. I myself am engaged in vegetables / fruits (trade). Interested in livestock and processing.
                      3. +1
                        15 November 2018 22: 40
                        we live, plus I work part by design through no
                      4. 0
                        15 November 2018 22: 56
                        Clear. I have access to cheap loans, there is a land fund, but there are no specialists ((Yes, and to delve into this topic as it should be. Loans for that are loans that you have to give. And most importantly - sales.
    3. +2
      15 November 2018 12: 28
      Quote: Less
      The next game will be played without us.

      the question is just who.
    4. +3
      15 November 2018 12: 33
      And who are we ??) For us, specifically everything will end in a few decades ..)),
      But life in the Universe, and on the planet itself, will not disappear ..
      What difference does it look like our great-great-great-grandchildren ..)))
    5. 0
      16 November 2018 08: 53
      Humanity will perish... I can reassure ..... he won’t die ... he just will be ... really big and full .. his form is not important .. what's the difference from what to die? hi
  2. The comment was deleted.
  3. +4
    15 November 2018 12: 13
    fallout is not the same as the developers promised))
  4. +6
    15 November 2018 12: 18
    "We all slept, ate and washed together, forgetting forever about any individual space" - they didn’t smell the salabons, our communal apartments ...
    1. +2
      15 November 2018 12: 32
      Well, do not tell me, in a communal apartment, they went to the toilet in turn
    2. +2
      15 November 2018 12: 32
      Quote: Mitya2424
      our communal apartments are not sniffed ....

      Yes, it seems to me they will not understand what it is
    3. +1
      15 November 2018 12: 33
      He is more interested in what they will eat, drink, and wherever such a horde of hungry mouths can help. Huge mass grave in general
      1. 0
        15 November 2018 16: 09
        Quote: koksalek
        He is more interested in what they will eat, drink, and wherever such a horde of hungry mouths can help.

        TV series "Hundred". There is about bunkers with a full processing cycle.
  5. +2
    15 November 2018 12: 18
    NI makes an “unexpected” conclusion: in the event of a nuclear war, humanity will perish

    ... however, they saw laughing ... for a long time they needed to get to this .. bully
  6. +2
    15 November 2018 12: 21
    were they really going to survive?
    1. 0
      15 November 2018 16: 12
      Quote: taiga2018
      were they really going to survive?

      They are going to survive even now. Their classic is "Valley of Curses" mixed with "Postman". Alas, we are no better.
  7. +3
    15 November 2018 12: 25
    Americans realized that nothing saves humanity in the event of a nuclear disaster

    Thank God it came ... then not everything is so hopeless ...
    1. +1
      15 November 2018 12: 34
      Quote: Masya Masya
      Thank God it dawned ..

      I doubt very much what came to their hawks
  8. 0
    15 November 2018 12: 30
    The model was "well thought out", but the cost was colossal.
    how long would they live there ?!
    where to get energy, what to eat, what to drink, what to breathe, where to dispose of waste
    bullshit all this is a week well THREE months, and then what? !!!!
    radioactive desert and die from exposure? !!!
    it’s better right away
    1. +4
      15 November 2018 13: 04
      and the living will envy the dead ...
      1. +2
        15 November 2018 13: 16
        amers had a film on this subject for 83 years, "the next day" it was
    2. -2
      15 November 2018 13: 12
      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
      it’s better right away

      Strange, then FOR bomb shelters.
      now with two legs against request
      1. +1
        15 November 2018 14: 13
        Quote: LSA57
        Strange, then FOR bomb shelters.
        now with two legs against

        I'm sorry, but it seems that this is natural for you, once again for those who consider the solar system as deep space - learn to read
  9. 0
    15 November 2018 12: 31
    However, even now no one has given up on the idea of ​​delivering a preventive global nuclear strike ""
  10. +3
    15 November 2018 12: 32
    Sick people .. Such "projects" I could come up with in kindergarten ..
    Is it really not clear that this is the Stone Age .. Several thousand and without any bunkers will survive somewhere along the woods .. and free of charge .. But what good is such a life ?? Their options are akin to moving to Mars ..
    1. 0
      15 November 2018 16: 18
      Quote: Roman070280
      Several thousand and without any bunkers will survive somewhere thread through the woods .. and free of charge ..

      The Americans started with this. Rather, they hope to maintain the "American spirit." They also have zones of high radiation (natural background) and people who prefer to live in such places.
  11. +4
    15 November 2018 12: 41
    It's just that the Pendos have never fought, so they have excessive aggressiveness rushing. For them, war is somewhere out there kh-kh, poo-poo, and when half a percent of the population generally heard somewhere that they are dying in war, they call it "the whole nation proudly defeated Hitler." In fact, they have a whole country of sofa nerds who sit at the keyboard, and precisely because they have never fought, they are sure that they will beat anyone, in a computer toy it turned out ...
  12. BAI
    +1
    15 November 2018 12: 52
    peaceful coexistence is the only solution that allows you to survive an atomic missile strike, simply not allowing it

    The problem is that among civilian politicians in the West (especially the United States), confidence is beginning to grow and strengthen that in a nuclear war one can not only survive, but also win.
  13. +2
    15 November 2018 13: 04
    The article describes the situation after the exchange of the USA and the USSR by massive nuclear missile strikes.

    A local nuclear war, limited by the territory of Europe (without the USSR) and the Middle East was very acceptable in its consequences for the United States and the USSR.

    Another thing is that the United States lost a local nuclear war, if only because of logistics. I had to hit the target from Gorbachev and Co.
  14. +1
    15 November 2018 13: 10
    Well, if these "experts" have guessed this, now how not to believe in everything that they will broadcast there.
  15. +1
    15 November 2018 13: 32
    Nuclear war is possible only if one of the countries is guaranteed to hit all enemy warheads in the sky. And this will apparently be impossible in the foreseeable future. When the missiles were ready for launch on the cube, the generals asked Kennedy to give the order to strike, which Kennedy refused, since the generals assured that a significant part of the warheads would reach the United States.
    1. +2
      15 November 2018 13: 51
      A local nuclear war right now is very possible - primarily between Israel and Iran. The ground forces of these countries have already made direct contact in Syria, it remains for Israel to fulfill its promise and strike at Iran’s nuclear facilities (and at the same time check its missile defense radars for resistance to high-altitude nuclear explosions - in order to understand the difference between the CTO in Gaza and the war with an equal opponent).

      So the situation with civil defense is not our problem with the Americans bully
    2. -2
      15 November 2018 14: 41
      Quote: Dmitry_red
      Kennedy refused, as the generals assured that a significant part of the warheads would reach the United States.

      But in Cuba there were only 15 of them (and our entire supply of that time was 100 pieces)!
  16. +1
    15 November 2018 13: 46
    Well, exactly the scenario of the game Fallout with their underground bunkers and military bases))
  17. -1
    15 November 2018 13: 56
    Come on, we’ll manage with one Gameryka.
  18. 046
    +1
    15 November 2018 15: 25
    now, little by little it became
  19. +2
    15 November 2018 15: 33
    After such studies, the Americans realized that nothing could save humanity in the event of a nuclear disaster.

    However, in recent years, considering the consequences of nuclear attacks on Japan and the contamination of territories in Chernobyl, many biologists note that in general populations (having lost in numbers for one, two generations) have seriously strengthened.
    https://scienceforum.ru/2017/article/2017033925
    https://www.gazeta.ru/science/2016/08/12_a_10122149.shtml
    Those. Some properties appeared, such as vegetation and small rodents, allowing them to better survive in adverse conditions. The problem is that this can lead to the possibility of using nuclear weapons at least locally. No wonder the Americans again raise the topic of the possibility of local use of nuclear weapons. Especially when it comes to low-power nuclear weapons 1-20 kT. So such statements may soon change the tone.
  20. +2
    15 November 2018 16: 01
    Quote: Tutejszy
    By the way, during the Caribbean crisis, they had 1500 warheads, and we have only 100, but they still did not dare to attack!

    In 1962, the United States had - 7211 charges on strategic carriers (213 on the ICBMs 151 on SLBMs, 6817 on strategic bombers). A plus 20085 charges on non-strategic carriers. 27297.

    In 1962, the USSR had - 522 charge on strategic media (38 on the ICBMs 72 on SLBMs, 416 on strategic bombers). A plus 2800 charges on non-strategic carriers. Total 3322

    But the US had a "knife" at the throat - our R-12 missiles with 36 warheads. And their flight time was estimated at 2-4 minutes to the capital, New York, Chicago and other major targets on the East Coast. Even if only half had time to take off, the losses of the Americans would have been enormous. Therefore, they did not dare ...
    1. +1
      15 November 2018 17: 54
      American losses would be huge
      For some reason, it seems to me that those who are allowed to answer for such things do not even ask themselves such questions. This is not a card game. Here, in general, there are not many options ... Enough even literally a dozen successful defeats, so that the country is mired in chaos! And it will happen, starting with the political and beyond. Not to mention everything else. At least it’s stupid to talk about this.
  21. +1
    15 November 2018 16: 02
    Quote: Tutejszy
    But in Cuba there were only 15 of them (and our entire supply of that time was 100 pieces)!

    Konstantin. If you are already operating with numbers, then try to give real numbers as an example, rather than taken from the ceiling
  22. +2
    15 November 2018 17: 50
    The level and number of NI articles will soon begin to exceed the comments on VO))
    1. 0
      15 November 2018 19: 15
      Quote: GibSoN
      The level and number of NI articles will soon begin to exceed the comments on VO))

      Alas, the topwar found an excellent source that matches the request of a part of the audience of the forum itself.
      Well, the fact that it is very yellow is not scary, because the people are hawking.
  23. 0
    16 November 2018 08: 40
    the liberal press, the American one, is particularly prone to banalities and infantilism - to wag the reader with a dusty bag of moronism so that he knows his place .... farting in a puddle is a form of PR
  24. -3
    16 November 2018 15: 14
    But is someone seriously ready to start a war to destroy humanity. Question one- WHAT should this purpose be? If the United States, then they already have everything. They don’t want to change something on the contrary. We ... there’s no sense. China? And to whom to sell then ..
  25. -1
    16 November 2018 18: 17
    Again, the paid-for RF newspaper ghastly catches up. And in the bunkers you have to sit just a week, the world of fallout. smile
  26. -1
    17 November 2018 10: 22
    Exceptional loonies, well, they don’t live peacefully.