Military Review

The myth of the "bloody genocide of Stalin" in Ukraine

244
One of the most terrible and destructive myths about the Soviet Union is a lie about the “bloody regime” of Stalin, who allegedly destroyed tens of millions of innocent people. Few people know that this myth was created in Hitler's Germany, and only later it was used by the USA in the information war against Soviet civilization.


Despite a series of basic research based on factual material from the archives, which showed incompatibility of Joseph Stalin’s accusations of mass repressions and terror, the false myth, supported by slanderers like Solzhenitsyn, Radzinsky, Suvorov-Rezun, continues to dominate the information field of Russia and the world community. Dirty job of slandering Russian and Soviet stories continues in the framework of the global historical and informational confrontation between Russian civilization (Russia) and the West. Citizens of Russia (especially young people), not to mention Ukraine and other post-Soviet republics, continue to be stuffed with horrible stories about the death and murder in the labor camps of the Gulag (General Directorate of Camps and Prisons), stories about millions who died of starvation and deliberately destroyed in the USSR, about the alleged intent of the famine in Ukraine, about the inhuman cruelty of the Soviet punitive system, "the bloodiest in the world." Repressions against the kulaks and the “fifth column” acquire an absolutely fantastic character in these stories, and Stalin becomes a villain of a literally galactic scale. All of this is superimposed on the image of the USSR-Russia in the world - as the “empire of evil” and “Russian Mordor”, where the “ferocious” Muscovites live, quilted nests, ready to drown in the blood of all dissidents in Russia themselves, as well as to drive in his "concentration camp" and the surrounding nations.

The myth of the “bloody Stalinist regime” was created in Hitler's Germany. After the Nazis came to power in Germany, they applied informational and psychotechnologies to the appropriate treatment of the population. The minister of propaganda was Joseph Goebbels, who implanted dreams of a racially pure people living in Great Germany, an empire with a vast living space. This living space included the territory to the east of Germany, the Russian lands, including Little Russia-Ukraine. The conquest of living space meant a big war, a war with the USSR. Therefore, the Nazi propaganda ministry led by Goebbels launched an information campaign around the alleged genocide organized by the Communists in Ukraine, the terrible famine (famine), organized personally by Stalin. The goal of Nazi propaganda was to prepare the world community for the "liberation" of Ukraine by German troops from the "bloody Bolshevik yoke". Later, the Ukrainian Nazis (Bandera) used the same lie about the artificial famine to sit on the neck of the people of Little Russia, Ukraine.

In the United States, the same media campaign against socialism, the USSR and Stalin personally was led by the largest media tycoon, founder of the Hearst Corporation holding, and leading newspaper publisher William Randolph Hurst. He created an industry News and invented to make money on gossip and scandals (the so-called "yellow press"). Hurst has become one of the richest people on the planet and one of the most influential personalities. So, in the 1940s, Hurst owned 25 daily newspapers, 24 weekly newspapers, 12 radio stations, 2 world news agencies, one enterprise producing new themes for films, Cosmopolitan film studios, etc. His newspapers were sold in millions of copies daily . He formed the minds of tens of millions of Americans. In addition, millions of people around the world received information from the Hurst Press through news agencies, films and newspapers, which were translated and printed in large quantities around the world.

In 1934, Hearst traveled to Germany, where he was received by Hitler as a guest and friend. After this visit, American newspapers were filled with horror stories taking place in the Soviet Union — murder, torture, genocide, slavery, and famine among the people. One of the first campaigns of the information industry of Hirst against the Soviet Union was the continuously raised question of the millions who died of starvation in Ukraine. The American press has declared 6 to the millions who died of starvation in the USSR.

The myth of the "bloody genocide of Stalin" in Ukraine

Josef Goebbels

William Randolph Hearst

In fact, in the USSR at the beginning of the 1930-ies there was a terrible tragedy associated with the peasant issue in the Russian Empire, the events of the Revolution and the Civil War, the peasant war during the turmoil 1917 - 1920. and the class battle in Soviet Russia. This led to instability of agricultural production (plus mistakes and, possibly, sabotage of some Trotskyist managers, hidden enemies of Stalin and his project), and a reduction in food production in a number of areas of the USSR, including Ukraine. The lack of food has weakened people, which in turn has caused epidemics. It is worth remembering that mass diseases were then widespread. So, in 1918 - 1920. the Spanish flu epidemic, which was imposed on the depletion of people during World War I, unsanitary conditions, overcrowding in military camps and refugee camps, resulted in more than half a billion people being infected and 50 - 100 million people (2,7 — 5,3% of the world's population) died.

As a result, at the suggestion of the Nazi regime in Germany, a huge myth was created in the world that the Bolsheviks deliberately killed millions of people, starved them, and, on a national basis, allegedly mostly “Ukrainians”. In the wake of the campaign launched by the press against the “famine organized by the communists,” no one was particularly interested in the counterarguments of Moscow and the exposure of lies.

Nothing has changed in this method of information wars and the modern world. For example, the “Scripal case”. It is obvious that in the West they are lying. The version of the British authorities collapsed almost immediately. However, the reasoning from Moscow is not interesting to anyone. The owners of London and Washington control the world's main media, and they can create an information picture among the majority of Westerners and the entire world community. And all the excuses in Moscow are in vain - the victim has already been appointed. Another pebble in a common mosaic - “Russia - the evil empire”, “Russian Mordor”.

Thus, the USA provided not only material, financial, economic, technological support to the Nazi regime in Germany, but also informational. With the full support of Washington and London, the "Hitler" project gained strength in Germany, subdued most of Europe, then to go "crusade" on the USSR. In the West, they created the myth of the "red plague", allegedly preparing a blow to Europe and destroying people in the subordinate territories by millions, tens of millions. So, the masters of the West tried to maintain domination over most of the planet, and their own cannibalistic, predatory-parasitic essence. The Nazi regime at that time received colossal information support, Hitler himself was a popular person. And all in order to blacken the Soviet development project to create a "solar civilization", the society of the future and incite the then "world community" to it.

It is worth remembering that, in spite of the false propaganda of the world, blaming Germany and Japan for the losers of the world war, the USA and Britain sponsored the Nazis in Germany, helped them come to power, financially helped create a powerful military-industrial complex, Hitler made it clear to the Munich agreement that Europe at his disposal, and that the road to the East is open. Hitler was allowed to create a strong coalition directed against communism and the USSR. It was the United States and Britain that allowed Hitler to start a world massacre. And the real masters of France, knowing perfectly well the alignment and tasks of the new world war, capitulated to Germany almost without a fight, after the so-called. "Strange war", providing the Third Reich with steel backs for aggression against Russia-USSR. England secretly promised not to open a "second front" (R. Hess's mission) while Hitler was fighting in the East.

Thus, we must always remember that it was England and the United States that unleashed the Second World War (as before and the First World War, and dozens of other small and large wars, uprisings, coups and revolutions throughout the world), a deadly war for the complete destruction of the Russian civilization and the Russian superethnos. What exactly London and Washington were and still are our main enemies. Germany, as well as Japan, were only “rams' clubs” in their hands. Russia, Germany and Japan do not have fundamental contradictions, their strategic alliance would be able to stop the aggression and the predatory aspirations of the Anglo-American octopus. Therefore, London and Washington are trying with all their might to embroil Russians, Germans and Japanese, to pit them against each other, receiving from this a lot of benefits and the main prize - domination of the planet.

The lie about the “famine organized by the Bolsheviks” lasted until the 1980-s, when it received a new breath. Several generations of people in the West grew up on this lie, having a negative view of socialism and the Soviet Union. In the 1980-e years decided the fate of the West and the United States. The western project, the system of capitalism, based on the constant expansion of living space for plunder and the exhaustion of resources, was on the verge of destruction. The West was dying, because the socialist camp did not allow the Westerners to drain resources and energy from it. The USSR was at the peak of military space power, it was impossible to win by military means. The population of the USSR was morally stable, the economy as a whole was self-sufficient. The only way to victory was in the decomposition, "recoding" of the Soviet elite, so that she herself destroyed the Soviet project and civilization. Therefore, in the West, they launched a new large-scale information campaign against the Russian “evil empire”. This new “crusade” was led by American President Ronald Reagan.

Begins a new period to incite Russophobia. One of the most popular American authors who described mass terror in the USSR was Robert Conquest. Reagan even instructed him in 1984 to write material for his presidential campaign in order to "prepare the American people for the Soviet invasion." The text was called “What to do when the Russians come? Survival Guide. A former intelligence officer and diplomat, Conquest was a professional propagandist. He worked in the Information Research Department of the Foreign Office, created to combat Soviet propaganda, then became a “free” writer and historian, but continued to work in the old anti-Soviet direction. He gained fame after the publication of the book “The Great Terror: Stalin's 1968 Purges” in 30. The work was based mainly on information made public during the “Khrushchev thaw” (when they began de-Stalinization under Khrushchev in the USSR), it also contained information received from Soviet emigrants and exiles, including runaway Ukrainian Nazis and war criminals. According to Conquest, Stalin's hunger and cleansing led to the death of 15 - 20 million people. In 1986, Conquest published the book Harvest of Grief: Soviet Collectivization and Terror by Hunger, dedicated to famine in Ukraine and other parts of the USSR. The work stated that millions of peasants died from starvation, deportations to labor camps and executions.

Later, Conquest's deception was discovered. Thus, the Canadian journalist Douglas Tottl revealed the falsifications of a retired English intelligence officer and professional propagandist in the book Fraud, Hunger and Fascism. The myth of the genocide in Ukraine from Hitler to Harvard. " This book was published in Toronto in 1987 year. In it, Tottl pointed out that the frightening photos of hungry children were made during the famine of the Civil War. Another example exposing Conquest’s lies was the fact that Thomas Walker, a journalist who had long supplied the American historian with photographs and reports from the hungry regions of Ukraine, had never been to Ukraine himself.

Thus, the lie about the many millions who died from the “specially organized by Stalin” famine was revealed in the West. But the deed was already done, the true story could not break into a sea of ​​lies. In the West, they fought an information war against the USSR and used fakes that were invented back in the Third Reich.


Robert Conquest


To be continued ...
Author:
244 comments
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  1. Comrade Beria
    Comrade Beria 22 August 2018 06: 35
    -27
    They will recruit everyone on the ad "Teror", damn it.

    The article is another attempt to justify the Communists for the most terrible crime, the collapse of the great state of the USSR. With all the ensuing consequences.

    As regards terror, I myself am a descendant of the repressed at that time, and still live away from my small homeland.
    1. Boris55
      Boris55 22 August 2018 07: 35
      +19
      Quote: Comrade Beria
      As for terror,

      See the birth chart and draw conclusions who actually staged the genocide of the Russian people:


      Quote: Comrade Beria
      so living still far from his small homeland.

      And so, they are still not amnestied, did the Soviet authorities like it? laughing
      1. Comrade Beria
        Comrade Beria 22 August 2018 08: 08
        +3
        As if the term "amnestied" is used out of place. Amnesty for a crime committed, and rehabilitate for an imperfect one.

        What crime could a peasant commit? Is that an extra cow in the farm to get.

        Quote: Boris55
        See the birth chart and draw conclusions

        "1917-1922 is the reign of the Trotskyists."
        Is Lenin a Trotskyist?

        And a very significant decrease in fertility in 1936-37 years. You can’t name the reason?
        1. Boris55
          Boris55 22 August 2018 08: 15
          +2
          Quote: Comrade Beria
          Is Lenin a Trotskyist?

          In the beginning he walked along the lines of Trotskyism. The vast majority in the party were Trotskyists. (This is, as now, in the Duma there is the United Russia and the Communist Party. After a while, all the bzigs of the United Russia can be attributed to the Communist Party ...) Then - no, for which they killed.
          1. Sweetheart
            Sweetheart 22 August 2018 14: 58
            +5
            Quote: Boris55
            In the beginning he walked along the lines of Trotskyism.

            Boris .. I understand that Kobovskaya nonsense is all yours ... but think of that. Lenin is a "Trotskyist" ... one must have talent, turn everything upside down ... this is Trotsky who got into a demonic head. the USSR
            1. Boris55
              Boris55 22 August 2018 16: 53
              +7
              Quote: The Swordsman
              ... but come up with that. Lenin the "Trotskyist"

              Who told you that? Lenin, the creator of the Bolshevik party and he cannot be a Trotskyist, but surrounded by the Trotskyists, he could not ignore their influence. Stop perceiving the ruler as the Almighty. Maybe then something will become more clear to you.

              It was not for nothing that I gave an example with the composition of the current Duma. Are the communists doing a lot of things today? No, from the word at all. Exactly the same situation was then - the number of Trotskyists in the party significantly exceeded the number of Bolsheviks. Only after the death of Lenin, Stalin managed to carry out the "Lenin Call" and in the 27th year to remove Trotsky from the party, but his followers remained and did not abandon their attempts at revenge. Only in 1953 did they finally manage to seize power again ...

              Look at the graph of how the number of Communists in the party has changed and compare them with the political situation in the country (46t. Before the revolution and 350. T. After, where and who are they from?):

            2. andrew42
              andrew42 22 August 2018 18: 47
              +2
              The RSDLP and BUND grew out of the same root, the first two congresses were joint. The history of the CPSU does not hide this. Further, it does not matter, a Trotskyist is not a Trotskyist, since Leiba Davidovich was the face and "soul" of the 2 RSDLPb. We can say that the entire party was 1917% "Trotskyists" in 80. , plus those who have joined them. Practical theorist Ulyanov-Blank is just a superstructure.
        2. Boris55
          Boris55 22 August 2018 08: 31
          +3
          Quote: Comrade Beria
          And a very significant decrease in fertility in 1936-37 years. You can’t name the reason?

          Although Trotsky himself was exiled to Central Asia only in the 27 year, and fled to Turkey only in the middle of the 30 year, his followers still remained at key posts and it was they who tried to seize control of the country and continued to genocide the people. With the advent of Beria, repression sharply declined.
        3. Stirbjorn
          Stirbjorn 22 August 2018 08: 43
          +15
          Quote: Comrade Beria
          And a very significant decrease in fertility in 1936-37 years. You can’t name the reason?
          Where did you see this? On the graph, I see only a decline in 1941-45, I can name the reason. In 1936-37, the graph shows growth, because repression affected a small percentage of the population
          1. Nick_R
            Nick_R 22 August 2018 16: 49
            0
            The failure of the population was observed in 1933-1935. These are the consequences of starvation and dispossession.
          2. Imobile
            Imobile 23 August 2018 00: 45
            0
            In those days, statistics were very carefully filtered. Child mortality was not considered. They gave birth to 12-15 children, and 3-5 survived. If not for hunger and repression, we would have been larger than China without the republics.
            1. Beringovsky
              Beringovsky 24 August 2018 12: 17
              0
              Dear, you apparently mixed up with the times of RI - and there it really was, 12 was born, 5 survived
        4. zenion
          zenion 22 August 2018 14: 34
          +1
          My mother was very surprised by this hunger strike. She always said - where did the grain come from in the villages to drive moonshine, which was the sea. That the villagers sold it even at the bazaars in the district center. Where did they get the grain from? Or drove from stools - a stool?
          1. Nick_R
            Nick_R 22 August 2018 16: 53
            0
            Apparently your mother was from the city. ... ... The peasants hid grain so as not to starve to death, often simply burying it in the ground. After several months of such "storage" the grain was not suitable for food. Is it possible to drive out moonshine, at least some calories, as you know there are a lot of them in alcohol.
            1. Beringovsky
              Beringovsky 24 August 2018 13: 22
              +1
              Excuse me, do you keep peasants for idiots?
              Or do you think the peasant and his family will starve, knowing that buried grain is rotting in the garden?
              Or stood at every corner of the house along the NKVDeshnik with a gun, guarded day and night?
              Where only such tales come from.
            2. MrK
              MrK 4 September 2018 18: 31
              +2
              Quote: Nick_R
              After several months of such "storage" the grain was not suitable for food.

              I will try to explain these processes. Long. But read on.
              The swelling of the starving 1932-33 of the year is recorded everywhere, while dystrophy is very, very rare. Meanwhile, the majority do not die of hunger right away, but they are skinny, turning into living skeletons. This shows the famine of 1921-22, the famine of 1946-47, the Leningrad blockade, prisoners of Nazi concentration camps - total dystrophy. But the hunger 1932-33 for some reason is not accompanied by dystrophy - continuous swelling and death.
              The reasons. 1. Climate.
              Winter crops were frozen in winter, and spring crops were not sown enough, despite all the demands and persuasions of Moscow. What threatened was committed by an insufficient crop in the autumn of the 1932 of the year, which will also be removed after the sleeves with a large shortfall and losses.
              2. Theft. The peasants did not harvest the grain or harvested at night (stolen). This grain, naturally, was not inspected. It was stored in bulk pits.
              Already in winter, part of the peasantry began to starve. As a result of the fact that honestly earned bread ran out. But almost everyone "had holes.
              Being not screened, grain during storage in raw pits not only preserved, but even increased its toxic properties and caused chronic allergic toxic hepatitis in the peasants who consumed it, which ends in cirrhosis. High mortality is due to the fact that the grain hidden by the peasants turned out to be complexly infected with grain pests - mainly rust, ergot and smut.
              Winter hunger led to negligible mortality during the winter. But people were weakening. But the real mortality in the countryside began when the masses of the unsatisfied reached the well-hidden reserves. The stolen bread, hidden without a normal re-mowing, turned out to be a deadly poison. As a result, in March began a rapid increase in mortality.
              Nevertheless, if the number of ergot and other fungus poisons is not too large, then acute poisoning does not occur, but chronic poisoning occurs with a vegetative period of manifestation of visible dangerous consequences from two weeks to one and a half months. Here it is just the June surge in mortality. In the period when there are already early vegetables with fruits, and in the southern regions - young potatoes.
              But they did not know the causes of the onset of the disease. When early cultures grew up in homestead farms, the narrow-minded and greedy peasants decided that "not to be lost to the hidden" - and they began to eat spoiled grain.
              This immediately explains all the oddities of the famine of 1933 of the year. Nutrition in the body of chronically poisoned victims has already been received, but it is already poorly absorbed. They often died of exhaustion, in spite of the fact that there was enough food to survive. This explains the shift in the peak mortality rate in 1933 to mid-summer. This explains the general swelling, which illiterate people mistook for "hungry." It is characteristic only of the famine of 1933 and which has never been seen in the world during famine.
              The same exact story happened in the North Caucasus, abundantly populated by the Ukrainian rural element with the psychology of Seluk Kurkul, who actively and passively sabotaged agricultural work in 1932 against the backdrop of collectivization.
              For this reason, despite a significantly reduced grain procurement plan (42% of the previous year), there was a famine in Ukraine in the 1933 year, which claimed about 1,3 million lives.
              A source. 1933 g. - Pestilence without hunger http://www.warandpeace.ru/ru/analysis/view/45517/
        5. Claymore
          Claymore 22 August 2018 14: 47
          0
          Quote: Comrade Beria
          What crime could a peasant commit?

          Any
        6. naidas
          naidas 22 August 2018 23: 00
          +2
          Quote: Comrade Beria
          And a very significant decrease in fertility in 1936-37 years. You can’t name the reason?

          But what is not clear, the creation of commodity agriculture. About the same time in the USA the same thing happened, how much state secret died, for mentioning they gave an article for anti-American activity. (American labor camps to help you)
        7. sleeve
          sleeve 23 August 2018 04: 53
          0
          I understand not 36-37, but 33-34? Well, hunger raged all over the world ...
      2. hhhhhhh
        hhhhhhh 22 August 2018 08: 56
        +9
        See the birth chart and draw conclusions who actually staged the genocide of the Russian people:

        The graph is not the birth rate, but the number. There is no surge in 1939 + the Baltic states and much more. There is no recession of the 90s.
        Russia in 2002 is that? Given the CIS?
        Schedule BALED LIES.
        1. Boris55
          Boris55 22 August 2018 09: 29
          -1
          Quote: hhhhhhh
          The graph is not the birth rate, but the number.

          My cant. I admit it.

          Quote: hhhhhhh
          Schedule BALED LIES.

          Bring yours. Compare.
          1. hhhhhhh
            hhhhhhh 28 August 2018 13: 43
            0
            Compare my schedule
      3. Vladimir 5
        Vladimir 5 22 August 2018 19: 42
        -8
        Boris, - So, according to the schedule, the most favorable time falls on the Russian Empire and sworn tsarism. Stalin needs to be condemned from many crimes, only one of them - dispossession with the destruction of the most productive and working layer of peasants - well-to-do in their work, called fists and literally destroyed, robbed and sent to the north, where they died most of ... The introduction of a collective farm system in the village by force, in fact, created indefinite serfdom with all the expiring consequences ... Therefore, in the Stalin era, villages began to empty and the villages were abandoned, from which the main strength of Po was always drawn these things, and many have gone into the city or have been exiled to extinction. And earlier, the village, with the need of manual workers, gave large families, but with the introduction of collective farms, the need for the families of many workers and numerous offspring disappeared ...
        1. hhhhhhh
          hhhhhhh 28 August 2018 13: 44
          +3
          So needed hands for the industry were. In Europe, peasants were simply expelled from the peasants.
    2. Krasnoyarsk
      Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 08: 39
      +12
      Quote: Comrade Beria
      They will recruit everyone on the ad "Teror", damn it.

      ??
      Quote: Comrade Beria
      The article is another attempt to justify the Communists for the most terrible crime, the collapse of the great state of the USSR. With all the ensuing consequences.

      Party carrier is not yet a communist. Like pop razstriga - not pop.
      Quote: Comrade Beria
      As regards terror, I myself am a descendant of the repressed at that time, and still live away from my small homeland.

      There are two options. Or your ancestors really were not white and fluffy in relation to Owls. authorities, or .., read the protocols of interrogation of Yezhov. Something in my head may become clear.
    3. hhhhhhh
      hhhhhhh 22 August 2018 08: 50
      +9
      Quote: Comrade Beria
      Communists for the most terrible crime, the collapse of the great state of the USSR.

      USSR built by the tsar-priest and founding.
      Quote: Comrade Beria
      I myself am a descendant of the repressed at that time

      You read the case for that planted? Maybe your ancestor stole.
      Or are you "the daughter of a Crimean officer.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Comrade Beria
        Comrade Beria 22 August 2018 13: 24
        -10
        The standard wording is Anti-Soviet activity.
        Quote: hhhhhhh
        Or are you "the daughter of a Crimean officer.

        Sorry, but I didn’t drink, I don’t drink, and I won’t drink at the Brudershaft. And even on one field I’ll go to relieve a great need, for that matter.
    4. Sweetheart
      Sweetheart 22 August 2018 14: 53
      +15
      Quote: Comrade Beria
      They will recruit everyone on the ad "Teror", damn it.

      Mr. Goebbels, are you tired of lying?
      That's how it is not a descendant of an allegedly illegally repressed, so the ancestor is white and fluffy, but how do you accumulate ... a minimum embezzler, a maximum killer, and even that tinier, Trotskyite, Vlasovite, policeman, Krasnovets ...
      And the collapse of the USSR is your fault, gentlemen deprived, no one like you all the time kept a gun in your pocket and wished the country grief.
      1. Alex1117
        Alex1117 27 August 2018 00: 46
        0
        Too primitive. Moreover, if the deprived worked well and carried out the plan, then what difference does it make in their pockets. Those who praised the leaders and the party, but did not fulfill the plan, which contributed much more to the collapse of the USSR than the quality-working deprived people.
        And further. No matter how many deprived people, each of them accounted for 100, or even more, real Communists. So, how did it turn out that the real Communists could not cope with a handful of deprived people? Or, nevertheless, it may not be a matter of the deprived?
        In general, the version is actually even harmful.
    5. Nick_R
      Nick_R 22 August 2018 16: 57
      -2
      Another article from the category of many letters and few facts, seasoned with a sauce of truth in the last resort.
    6. antivirus
      antivirus 22 August 2018 19: 30
      +3
      Have you confused the Communists and members of the CPSU?
    7. sleeve
      sleeve 23 August 2018 04: 37
      0
      That's why the communists cannot be justified because of the USSR. And what kind of "communists" are they? What were they building in the 80s? Put two Bolsheviks side by side from 33rd and 83rd. To put it mildly, with the second, it will not be clear where it fell from. So the communists have nothing to do with it. And why were they repressed, if of course not a secret?
    8. rum
      rum 28 August 2018 13: 40
      +2
      and your repressed descendant was engaged in undermining the USSR? You live in the distance, so live * in the distance * ....
    9. tezey
      tezey 30 August 2018 11: 39
      +1
      Your logic is not clear. You probably think that the great state of the USSR was created not by the Communists, but by someone else. A terrible crime, it’s hard to disagree, it was not the Communists who committed it. Gorbachev, Yeltsin and the company were no longer communists. These are typical renegades, traitors to the cause of communism. Everything is clear with them. But why, for the most part, we blame only them, and where we were, that's the question. Why did they give this bastard to finish his dirty business. Why didn’t millions take to the streets and squares and dare this scum from the body of the country. We are all to blame for what happened. The army, the KGB, the Ministry of Internal Affairs forgot about the oath, the people watched the tricks of Sobchak and Sakhorov on TV and waited for a miracle, not understanding what was really happening. So that all the Communists and the army and the people are to blame. At the expense of terror. You might think one such deprived and offended. My family was repressed and this did not interfere with life and attitude towards the country. Everyone learned, everyone got a good job, everyone lived with dignity. And to begin with, find out for what your repressed. It may be interesting.
    10. yehat
      yehat 31 August 2018 14: 19
      +1
      the myth of bloody Stalin needs to be dispelled, but the author somehow forgot about the second part of the myth - of course, there were repressions in the USSR, but who carried them out? Stalin?
      And if we recall the well-known exploits of Yezhov, Khrushchev, a couple of Romanian "patriots" in Ukraine (Bela Kun with a girlfriend) - what was Stalin doing too? On account of only 4 listed more than 120 thousand killed during the repressions, and there were other ugly people.

      The first thing the myth of the bloody Stalin began to be built with was that he was blamed for the actions of completely different people, with many of whom Stalin actively fought.
      Stalin was not an innocent kind grandfather, but most of his decisions, including tough ones, were dictated by the need to make the only possible decision. And there were not a million or a billion such "solutions", as pseudo-historians try to prove, but several hundred. And for most of them, no one personally can object to anything when they look at the reasons.


      By the way, it is worth mentioning when Stalin had the moral right to punish and probably was obliged, but he did not. Tymoshenko merged the elite division with inept management, where he served as the son of Stalin and then was captured. Stalin did not punish him. Golovin for monstrous violations and sabotage in the supply of aviation in 42 did not suffer any punishment. Stalin's son was not exchanged. A lot of painful decisions for him personally were made for one reason - in the interests of the state, which he built and tried to defend. And how many fair and difficult decisions he made that helped a huge number of people with their fates?
      1. MrK
        MrK 4 September 2018 18: 49
        0
        Quote: yehat
        the myth of bloody Stalin needs to be dispelled

        Well, that’s how they debunk him. Example article by Alexander Kurlandchik
        STALIN REPRESSIONS OF THE 30-X. ARE YOU SURE THAT THEY ARE STALIN? http://www.proza.ru/2017/06/13/60
      2. alatanas
        alatanas 19 October 2018 12: 52
        0
        a pair of Romanian "patriots" in Ukraine (Bela Kun with a girlfriend)

        As I know, Bela Kun is Hungarian.
        1. yehat
          yehat 19 October 2018 12: 53
          0
          one fig austria hungary
          1. alatanas
            alatanas 23 October 2018 09: 31
            0
            Romania to Austria-Hungary - from the side of the pripe. Clemenceau after the end of the WWII to them (Romanians) generously distributed part of Hungary.
  2. Theodore
    Theodore 22 August 2018 07: 01
    0
    A bunch of words! With a little information! It is enough just to know that all the leaders of the then Ukraine, Kosior and Co., Stalin shot!
    1. Boris55
      Boris55 22 August 2018 07: 36
      +5
      Quote: Theodore
      It is enough just to know that all the leaders of the then Ukraine, Kosior and Co., Stalin shot!

      And Khrushchev is the same? belay
      1. Curious
        Curious 22 August 2018 08: 12
        +4
        Khrushchev at that time was the second secretary of the Moscow City Party Committee and has nothing to do with Ukraine.
        1. Boris55
          Boris55 22 August 2018 08: 22
          +9
          Quote: Curious
          Khrushchev at this time - the second secretary of the Moscow City Party Committee

          The bastard managed to slip away in time ...
          Mdyaaa .. I have not finalized Comrade. Stalin, now we are suffering with EP ...
          1. ver_
            ver_ 22 August 2018 10: 21
            -11
            ... not Stalin - Beria didn’t work, when Beria * removed * Stalin - already completely useless, the greatest Ukrainian remained * rumbled and vindictive - Khrushchev, who saw his demise in Beria ... and who sorted out Sudoplatov’s and the special services * cleaned * .. and Zhukov removed ...
            1. Boris55
              Boris55 22 August 2018 11: 01
              +9
              Quote: ver_
              When Beria * removed * Stalin

              Beria and Stalin are one team. Beria did not kill Stalin. The materials that Beria prepared on the instructions of Stalin about the "failures" at the beginning of the war have not yet been found. The Trotskyists are still shaking. If they are made public, many great ones will be overthrown from their pedestals.
              1. Krasnoyarsk
                Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 13: 23
                +8
                Quote: Boris55
                Quote: ver_
                When Beria * removed * Stalin

                Beria and Stalin are one team. Beria did not kill Stalin. The materials that Beria prepared on the instructions of Stalin about the "failures" at the beginning of the war have not yet been found. The Trotskyists are still shaking. If they are made public, many great ones will be overthrown from their pedestals.

                Boris, one plus is not enough for you, so I’ll also support it.
                As I understand it, the majority of those present here don’t understand what you mean.
                They also don’t know that Beria, at Stalin’s tomb, vowed to continue his work - the decision to transfer power from the party to the Soviets, for which Stalin was killed.
            2. Krasnoyarsk
              Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 13: 18
              +9
              Quote: ver_
              ... not Stalin - Beria didn’t work, when Beria * removed * Stalin - already completely useless, the greatest Ukrainian remained * rumbled and vindictive - Khrushchev, who saw his demise in Beria ... and who sorted out Sudoplatov’s and the special services * cleaned * .. and Zhukov removed ...

              Stalin was "removed" not by Beria, but by Khrushchev.
              1. ver_
                ver_ 26 August 2018 01: 47
                -1
                ... poisoned Koganovichi - brother and sister ..
        2. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 22 August 2018 19: 52
          +5
          Quote: Curious
          Khrushchev at that time was the second secretary of the Moscow City Party Committee and has nothing to do with Ukraine.

          What time is it?
          Nikita Svet-Sergeevich was sent to Ukraine during the period of "Yezhov's purges" of 36-37 years of the last century as a representative of the CEC. It was he who sent requests for "increasing the limit".
        3. Alex1117
          Alex1117 26 August 2018 20: 40
          -2
          From January 1938, Khrushchov was the first secretary of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Ukraine. And therefore, it has the most direct relation to Ukraine during the period of the anniversary. Let me remind you that Stalin set Beria as the first deputy to Yezhov only in August 1938.
          1. Curious
            Curious 26 August 2018 21: 46
            -1
            Have you read the comment? The article deals with the famine of 1932-1933. and, accordingly, where Khrushchev was at that time. And here is the Yezhovism and what is Yezhov to the famine of 1932-1933?
            1. Alex1117
              Alex1117 27 August 2018 07: 33
              0
              I apologize. Precisely because I delved into the comments, I digress from the essence of the article. He reacted to the comment that by the beginning of the executions of the guilty Khrushchov SUCCESSFUL WASHED FROM Ukraine.
        4. yehat
          yehat 31 August 2018 14: 24
          0
          a lie - Khrushchev was transferred from Ukraine, but his influence remained there and the people from his team remained there.
  3. samarin1969
    samarin1969 22 August 2018 07: 07
    +11
    The author goes to other extremes. There was hunger. And not a "consequence of epidemics". My ancestors told me in childhood that the "scrolls" of people who died of hunger from Ukraine gleamed in the fields. My relatives are simple people, they just said what they saw, and I simply did not believe them in the days of the USSR.
    Another thing is that the scale of the famine, of course, was "not millions."
    1. Moskovit
      Moskovit 22 August 2018 07: 20
      +9
      The famine was. Terrible hunger. It was artificial, but not out of a desire to kill Ukrainians, Russians or Kazakhs (for some reason it is not customary to talk about the rest of the nations), but because of the policies of the local authorities, who at all costs tried to fulfill the plan for the delivery of grain. And be that as it may, Stalin is to blame for this, as the country's leader. And the Soviet government too.
      1. naidas
        naidas 22 August 2018 23: 25
        +6
        Quote: Moskovit
        He was artificial

        Well then, Stalin decided not to be a raw materials appendage of the West, but to develop his industry:
        The period of the history of Soviet Russia from 1925 to 1932 is called the Golden Blockade by historians: starting in 1925, Western countries sold the USSR the latest equipment and technologies of that time only, at the beginning, for timber, oil and grain, and from 1930 ONLY for grain.
        Hope Stalin for a new crop. It turns out to be small - in a country of drought.
        Attempts are being made to immediately import grain from Persia, where they agree to accept gold. Do not have time - a disaster happens. That Ukraine is now called the Holodomor. In 1932-1933, a lot of people die, and only after that, right after that (!) The West is again ready to accept oil, timber and precious metals from the Bolsheviks. In 1934, grain exports from the USSR generally ceased.
        1. Snakebyte
          Snakebyte 23 August 2018 09: 01
          0
          Quote: naidas
          Since 1925, Western countries sold the USSR the latest equipment and technologies of that time only, in the beginning, for timber, oil and grain, and since 1930 ONLY for grain

          At that time the Great Depression happened, production arose, who in these conditions needs timber and oil?
      2. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 23 August 2018 19: 23
        +2
        Quote: Moskovit
        hungry. It was artificial, but not out of a desire to kill Ukrainians, Russians or Kazakhs (for some reason, it’s not customary to talk about the rest of the nations), but because of the policies of the local authorities.
        Here with this part of the comment, I can agree. In the 90s there were coupons. My relatives, who lived in a residential area far from the center and ended at 18 p.m. did not have time to secure coupons. All ---- stores are empty. But if you go at least in the afternoon or evening to the center, to Petrogradka ---- then it was possible with coupons and without coupons. But the truth is, the norm. I remember.
      3. yehat
        yehat 31 August 2018 14: 32
        0
        Sorry, but Stalin was not the leader of the country when this company was in Ukraine, toughened hunger (just like that, hunger in any case would have been due to crop failure and the difference in the social status of the villagers). But the measures of party careerists, primarily Ukrainian ones, brought the problems to the point of absurdity.

        Learn the real power that Stalin had and in what period is useful for breaking down myths.
    2. Sweetheart
      Sweetheart 22 August 2018 15: 07
      +8
      Quote: samarin1969
      that the "scrolls" of people who died of hunger from Ukraine were white in the fields.

      Gentlemen are lying about the Holodomor. How can they not explain how 5 million men from Ukraine ended up in the RSFSR, and they were counted as those who died from hunger?
      Secondly, they will not explain in any way, since the HUNGER IS SWELLED ... they are not exhausted, but the SWELLY-this happens only from the lack of protein in food-livestock then .. cut under the root.
      Third, the bread stored without proper conditions. Struck by the ergot poison, then the gentlemen lied in no way to explain, and why they rotted the bread. They didn’t clean it, they left it under the snow. Who was to blame?
      Well, and the fourth ... the followers of the Trotskyists. Somehow yelling joyfully about hunger ... and who was at the head of the Communist Party of that time?
      Well, the fifth ... Goebbels propaganda bodies tried to use the Holodomor theme. Nothing came of it, why not?
      And finally ... if everything was so bad ... then why didn't the people go on a hunger strike or later. Did nothing to demolish, as otherwise desired, the power of the USSR?
      1. Nick_R
        Nick_R 22 August 2018 17: 04
        -11
        It's a pity that your grandmothers-grandfathers did not end up in the starving regions, they would explain to you why people are swollen with hunger and what a "wonderful" leader, Comrade Stalin. But then there would be a great chance that I would not read your posts here at all, because you would be just a point on the graph of the population decline in 1933-1935
        1. Sweetheart
          Sweetheart 23 August 2018 19: 52
          +5
          Quote: Nick_R
          It’s a pity that your grandparents did not end up in starving regions

          You take pity on yourself, from your inherent stupidity.
          My ancestors lived there and told who and what, why and who is to blame, so keep quiet.
          1. yehat
            yehat 31 August 2018 14: 36
            0
            my mother said that the famine also affected Belarus and it was not easy there either, but because of the more sane local leadership the problem was greatly alleviated - the population escaped mainly with scurvy and other ailments, and died a little.
    3. rum
      rum 28 August 2018 13: 47
      0
      And my grandmother said birth in 1910 ... I was hungry, but I was lucky, she says, I lived in a village where the owner had cows, pigs and hens .. And I worked from morning until evening, and in the evening they gave me what was left from food .... And in another village they say they eat the dead .... So, her life is terrible and diverse and bizarre .... Liberals and the rest of the Shushare-grandmother died with a clear mind and in full consciousness of her actions ...
  4. Moskovit
    Moskovit 22 August 2018 07: 16
    +7
    Naturally, Churchill came up with everything in the eighteenth year. Mediocre agitation.
    1. Borisovich
      Borisovich 22 August 2018 07: 42
      +20
      Quote: Moskovit
      Mediocre agitation.

      Of course worthless.
      Here is the agitation so agitation And what is most interesting, "truthful" to the outrageous!

      1 500 x 1 000 000 = ????????????? !!!!!!!!!!!!!
      1. Boris55
        Boris55 22 August 2018 08: 11
        +3
        Quote: Borisovich
        1 500 x 1 000 000 = ????????????? !!!!!!!!!!!!!

        Do they even know how many people on Earth? wassat
        1. Borisovich
          Borisovich 22 August 2018 08: 41
          +14
          Quote: Boris55
          how many people on earth do they know?

          So read the entire population of present-day China imprisoned. what And ishsho manenko places left .........

          China Population
          1 (430)
          1. yehat
            yehat 31 August 2018 14: 39
            0
            Do not blindly believe Chinese statistics.
            According to estimates based on food consumption, in China the population is about 0.9-1.1 billion. (exact statistics do not exist at all, because some regions had dummy data or none at all)
            1. Borisovich
              Borisovich 31 August 2018 14: 47
              +6
              UN data provided. If your data is more accurate, Toda ......... oh !!!!!!!!!
              1. yehat
                yehat 31 August 2018 14: 52
                +1
                the truth is that no one has any real data - neither the UN nor the Chinese leadership. All data is drawn. But I trust analytical, not political, assessments based on real reliable facts.
                Finally, do you realize that the Chinese live along a narrow strip of coast and riverbeds of two rivers?
                Try to settle there one and a half billion!
      2. Moskovit
        Moskovit 22 August 2018 08: 58
        +3
        Did I say that those who are right say that Stalin personally shot 150 million from the Nagan?
        But this "writer" is no better than various liberal historians.
        1. yehat
          yehat 31 August 2018 14: 40
          0
          any one-sided story coverage is false. It is important to show the essence of the process, and the author showed only propaganda materials and even partially, without opening the process, so that people can judge even on the basis of incomplete data.
      3. Sweetheart
        Sweetheart 22 August 2018 15: 10
        +7
        Quote: Borisovich
        1 500 x 1 000 000 = ????????????? !!!!!!!!!!!!!

        E .. so this is not Mikhalkov .. this is a certain Petrov. On Echo of Moscow blurted out .. yes so that the host choked .. although she herself from the same flock of deceivers ..
        Back in 2010, the following article was published on the well-known resource of Ekho Moskvy radio:

        Source: http://echo.msk.ru/programs/staliname/677212-echo/

        The article is a transcript of one of the broadcasts, where the historian Nikita Petrov was present at the host Natella Boltyanskaya. At first glance, nothing is alarming, but we read further, and we see the following:

        Quote: “You just have to take into account the fact that under Yezhov during the years of great terror and the very mass operations of the NKVD, over one and a half thousand million people were arrested.” Http://worldwebwar.ru/falsifikacii/poltory-tysyachi-millionov-arestovannyh-vo -vremya-stalinskih-repressij.html
        So here in the discussion, some lie and do not worry from lies ..
  5. Curious
    Curious 22 August 2018 07: 53
    +14
    It turns out I have a father, grandfather, two grandmothers, other relatives and neighbors who talked about hunger - without exception, victims of propaganda and that they were starving, learned from Goebbels. By the way, none of them ever said that hunger was arranged in order to kill Ukrainians.
    The author has completely lost the coast. Instead of trying to somehow sort out objectively the reasons, he slipped into an obvious lie, in principle, no different from those people whose portraits he placed at the beginning of the article.
    1. gridasov
      gridasov 22 August 2018 08: 43
      +5
      It’s not worth adding that the author of the article is an outright liar. The story of my kind is proof of this. Let this author tell, for example, to me that my father, who had already returned from the war, only miraculously managed to return to the Bukovinsky village and saved his relatives, already swollen from hunger, from death. And let this author tell me that there was no confiscation of pets and seed stocks cleaned up, but at the same time the announcement of these people with fists. I believe my father more than a lying propagandist who does not understand what is distorting the story. The question is only another. Communist ideology is quite logical and reasonable, but in the hands of underdeveloped creatures it is a powerful tool for destroying people
      1. Sasha333
        Sasha333 22 August 2018 10: 22
        +7
        That was all, but not Stalin's fault, but the scum on the ground. He wanted to take the surplus, again for himself or something, for cities where there was nothing at all. And these bastards sabotaged and cleaned everything. This is such as Khrushchev demanded (I do not remember his position) 20000 executions, and then opened the cult of personality when he became the first secretary.
        1. RUSS
          RUSS 22 August 2018 15: 52
          -1
          Please answer, what kind of leader is this country that is not to blame for the fact that there is famine in the country? Or maybe he was not in the know? Or just not guilty and not up to date on the repression? Stalin then who? Puppet?
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 22 August 2018 20: 03
            +3
            Quote: RUSS
            Please answer, what kind of leader is this country that is not to blame for the fact that there is famine in the country?

            Quote: Nick_R
            Well, yes, now Putin is not to blame either,

            A typical (systematic) mistake of "experts" in the history of the USSR is to try on the current system of governing the country from the 30s of the last century.
            I. Stalin, the sole and sovereign leader of the USSR in May 1941. And from 1917 to 1941, the country's leadership was carried out collectively. All decrees were signed by members of the Politburo.
            And today to blame V. Putin for all sins means to admit that one is narrow-minded in understanding the processes taking place in the highest echelons of power. "Power vertical" exists on paper, but few people suspect about "ravines" in reality and "undercover games".
            And if, suddenly, the GDP takes illegal, non-compliant with the CPC actions, it will be demolished in no time by his team and associates.
          2. naidas
            naidas 22 August 2018 23: 34
            0
            Quote: RUSS
            Answer please

            To answer, put yourself in the place of the country's leader, either a weak and obedient raw materials appendage of developed countries (where the poor were found frozen to the floor as we have in the 90s), or a superpower paid for by deaths.
        2. Nick_R
          Nick_R 22 August 2018 17: 07
          +4
          Well, yes, now Putin is also not to blame, but only local sabotage officials
      2. Krasnoyarsk
        Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 10: 36
        +11
        Quote: gridasov
        It’s not worth adding that the author of the article is an outright liar. The story of my kind is proof of this. Let this author tell, for example, to me that my father, who had already returned from the war, only miraculously managed to return to the Bukovinsky village and saved his relatives, already swollen from hunger, from death. And let this author tell me that there was no confiscation of pets and seed stocks cleaned up, but at the same time the announcement of these people with fists. I believe my father more than a lying propagandist who does not understand what is distorting the story. The question is only another. Communist ideology is quite logical and reasonable, but in the hands of underdeveloped creatures it is a powerful tool for destroying people

        Sorry, but I put you a minus (you had one plus), and +2
        You see what’s the matter ....
        Once, in the RONO archive, I came across an interesting document for the 39th year. It spoke of the need to open an additional first grade at the school of the village of Vyazovoye. That is, in Vyazovoy in 31 years of age were born (and survived despite the famine!) So many children that they could not fit in one class.
        Being interested in this issue, I talked with old people who survived the famine of 32-33 years, everyone said that "it was very hungry", but that "I don't know that" to die of hunger.
        Why am I doing this? Moreover, the state is one thing, but the situations in the regions are different.
        90s, I was driving somehow in an electric train, in front of me were two little boys who looked from 12 to 14 years old. Thin, pale. I was cut by the phrase of one of them - "And my mother and I have been frying potatoes in the water for a long time." The boy, you see, loves fried potatoes, but there is nothing to buy fat from his mother, from her, poor, and trying to somehow diversify the menu.
        This is how to evaluate? Hunger?
        Studying the famine of 32-33 is very difficult due to the death of most of the archival documents in Ukraine. Therefore, it is precisely in Ukraine that the greatest speculations arise in this regard.
        And to trust the stories of relatives ... I do not know. A person, almost everyone, has the property of exaggerating the situation in order to increase his significance, or to make it more tragic in order to arouse pity or compassion.
        So, I would trust the archives more than the "witnesses"
        1. Curious
          Curious 22 August 2018 12: 05
          +2
          Sorry, but I also put a minus to you. For the sake of a red word, no one will describe how he lay, swollen from hunger, how he ate a crow, as he saw the same dream - food. Father was 10 years old. Childhood memories. And then, always, no matter where I called from home, the first question is whether I am hungry.
          As for the older generation, nobody ever spoke of cannibalism or universal extinction. But what they died, especially the children, was told. People who survived two world wars, revolution, civil, collectivization, industrialization, post-war devastation, never exaggerated their life’s trials. Too much more. Well this is not a reason to argue from the couch.
          1. Krasnoyarsk
            Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 13: 32
            +6
            Quote: Curious
            Sorry, but I also put a minus to you. For the sake of a red word, no one will describe how he lay, swollen from hunger, how he ate a crow, as he saw the same dream - food. Father was 10 years old. Childhood memories. And then, always, no matter where I called from home, the first question is whether I am hungry.
            As for the older generation, nobody ever spoke of cannibalism or universal extinction. But what they died, especially the children, was told. People who survived two world wars, revolution, civil, collectivization, industrialization, post-war devastation, never exaggerated their life’s trials. Too much more. Well this is not a reason to argue from the couch.

            Forgive me, too, but I have never claimed that there was no famine.
            = But what they were dying, especially the children, was told. = This is what worries me.
          2. faiver
            faiver 22 August 2018 19: 10
            +1
            No one, for the sake of a red word, will describe how he lay, swollen from hunger, how he ate a crow, how he saw the same dream - food
            - but I do not agree with this, all people are different, and even in old age and even more so ... hi
        2. Sasha333
          Sasha333 22 August 2018 17: 16
          +4
          So Khrushchev destroyed the documents, especially as regards his deeds.
      3. Beringovsky
        Beringovsky 24 August 2018 13: 55
        +5
        Great! Five with a plus!
        My father told me ... I believe him ... took away livestock, seeds ... fists ... hunger ... ayyayay, blablabla
        Poor, poor Bukovinsky village!)))
        But didn’t that the famine in the USSR was in 1932-33, and Bukovina became part of the USSR only in 1940m? And before that, was part of Romania? Nothing? Hmm, nothing ...
        In fact, Ukrainians have a pronounced tendency to myth-making - they will come up with stupidity and themselves will believe in it sacredly.
      4. yehat
        yehat 31 August 2018 14: 46
        +1
        interesting, but didn’t you think, under whose direction did you live in Bukovina until 44?
        if anything, this is Germany. And the fighting does not contribute to the prosperity of the economy.
        And for some reason, blame for the ruin of the economy in the USSR?
        Well, at least turn on the brain! The fact that your relatives were starving is probably true, but why Stalin or the USSR is to blame for this is not very clear to me. Or was there the same famine in the pre-war 40th year? It seems to me that this is not so.
    2. Moskovit
      Moskovit 22 August 2018 09: 02
      0
      It was. It is terrible what happened in the developed agricultural region. The Trotskyists have done everything. Directly omnipotent.
      1. Sweetheart
        Sweetheart 22 August 2018 15: 14
        +3
        Quote: Moskovit
        about. It is terrible what happened in the developed agricultural region. The Trotskyists have done everything. Directly omnipotent.

        Yes, it was the Trotskyists who were in the struggle for power. Trotsky and his henchmen were ready for anything. Exactly the same as according to the recollections of a certain Larina - “WHAT more will we borrow in denunciations of people, the more arrested there are, the faster we will create conditions for the demolition of the hated us Stalin. "
        1. Nick_R
          Nick_R 22 August 2018 17: 13
          -7
          Why are there Trotskyists, take it higher: world imperialism, fascists and other Zionists at the instigation of aliens. But in no case is the Soviet government.
          1. Sweetheart
            Sweetheart 23 August 2018 19: 55
            +1
            Quote: Nick_R
            But in no case is the Soviet government.

            The Soviet government handed out to all sisters the earrings guilty of this, then you are yelling so heart-rending now. In the ancestors, there were no cases of those who rotted bread, but spread rumors. Kill cattle. Bury bread, otherwise they will take everything away?
            You sing familiar songs, just like an amnuel and his ntsovskaya gang.
        2. yehat
          yehat 31 August 2018 14: 49
          0
          from the civil war, a lot of all sorts of stench foam came to the local authorities.
          and not only in Ukraine, it’s just easy to survive there and no one thought when the outrage began. The same thing happened in Siberia, but survival is a holiday there every year - and therefore the infinite could not do much there.
      2. RUSS
        RUSS 22 August 2018 15: 53
        +2
        Before, the Trotskyists were to blame for everything, but now are the liberals?
        Well, the authorities are again out of business laughing
        1. Sweetheart
          Sweetheart 22 August 2018 16: 11
          +4
          Quote: RUSS
          Before, the Trotskyists were to blame for everything, but now are the liberals?
          Well, the authorities are again out of business

          Are the authorities not liberals today? They got rid of the Trotskyists. The country rushed forward, but what about yours?
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 22 August 2018 17: 40
            -2
            But mine is not in power ....
            1. Sweetheart
              Sweetheart 23 August 2018 19: 56
              0
              Yours, outspoken nationalists, and do not have the gift of nothing. Turn so much. That the whole country will become bitter.
        2. Nick_R
          Nick_R 22 August 2018 19: 21
          -4
          Well, at least Western imperialism does not disappear, at least some stability in power)
    3. Sharikov Polygraph Poligrafovich
      Sharikov Polygraph Poligrafovich 22 August 2018 22: 28
      +5
      My grandmother was born in 1923 from a village near the Dnieper} | {ideological.
      It is 18 km from the railway. dor. station, now it has long been in the city limits.
      In 1933 she was 10 years old and for the then peasant girl from a large family
      family it was already the age of far NOT a child.
      She was the youngest of 6 children in the middle peasant family, whom
      quite softly, one might even say divinely (as for the commies) dispossessed
      in 1929 - 1930
      They took only a couple of horses, a couple of cows and a third of their strength
      private land and no longer touched right up to MYKYty - Kukuruznika.
      В организованный местный колхоз никто из ихней семьи так никогда и НЕ вступил
      purely fundamentally, everyone went to work for the nearest plants and the railway
      and they all lived pretty tolerably, one might even say not bad.
      And for this type of "irresponsibility" to any of her family from the Soviet government
      there was never anything bad, my grandmother was even in a scythe.
      But still, they didn’t really have any reasons to love the Soviet regime.
      Nevertheless, 2 of her older brothers left as volunteers immediately in the summer of 1941,
      one plowed the whole war and returned, and the second died.

      There are no grandmothers for 5 years, but the whole hysteria of the times of May 1st and the rotten muzzle
      She found a puppy about a terrible type of "Holodomor" in a sound mind and strong memory.
      So, she always said that all the Canadian fables about the "Holodomor" -
      the purest nonsense and when I heard these groans in the zombie-box, then always
      wildly cursed, although until that moment I had generally abused words from her
      for many decades, almost never heard ...
      And she nursed me in the 70s almost right up to the school itself, and even later I all
      summer holidays stuck with her, and NOT in the city’s parental apartment building in the center.
      The only thing she explained was that in 1932-1933. I had to starve a bit
      times to the same communist activists - loafers and drunks, who in 1929-1930.
      most of all they torn a throat for a collective farm and participated in dispossession.
      This is how a "boomerang" came out to them :-)))
      But even from these gorlopanov nobody died.
      And from her family, more distant relatives and neighbors, no one was starving at all.
      She even added that during the post-war crop failure of 1948 with food
      and that was worse than during the mythical "Holodomor" ...

      And you suggest me NOT to believe her ???
  6. Sasha333
    Sasha333 22 August 2018 08: 03
    0
    Well done. I completely agree with the article. I am not a communist and I never had a desire to join, because I accepted everyone, for example, scum like Yeltsin and others. And yet the party should not have been a guiding ideologist. Stalin built thousands of factories, saved us from Jewish fascists, for example: Lenin, Trotsky, Sverdlov, etc. But they forgot Beria if it weren’t for us to have an atomic bomb, and then think about what the Americans would do to us. Enemies of bad will not blacken, blame bright people. Now, like a hundred years ago, murderers have revived again and we see their deeds. Their last creation is pension reform. How many billions have been taken out, taken out and taken out.
    1. Comrade Beria
      Comrade Beria 22 August 2018 08: 19
      -1
      Quote: Sasha333
      He saved us from the fascist Jews, for example: Lenin, Trotsky, Sverdlov, etc.

      Fascist Lenin is stronger than Faust Goethe. am
      Quote: Sasha333
      But they also forgot Beria, if it weren’t for us we didn’t have an atomic bomb, then think about what the Americans would do to us


      But the Jews have nothing to do with it. Such as Kapitsa, Zeldovich, Lange?
      1. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 22 August 2018 09: 53
        +1
        I agree with your thought. But a little correct. Kapitsa is not a Jew, and he did not agree to participate in the creation of nuclear weapons. Although, probably, a number of his ideas were used.
      2. Sasha333
        Sasha333 22 August 2018 10: 08
        +4
        My friend personally heard (he came to photograph children in the Jewish "pioneer camp" and waited for a while) how the counselor rubbed the children that you are God's chosen people, and other people are worse than pigs. He listened to this junta for 40 minutes, all according to the torus, by the way, and according to the Bible. The Old Testament is copied from the Torah. And about our Jewish artists, everything is not so simple, they play their role well, although there are wonderful people.
        1. Proxima
          Proxima 22 August 2018 16: 24
          +1
          Quote: Sasha333
          And about our artists, Jews are not so simple, they play their part well, although there are wonderful people.

          There are, for example, my favorites: Vladimir Vysotsky, Andrei Mironov ..
          1. Sasha333
            Sasha333 22 August 2018 17: 39
            0
            And, well, yes, Vysotsky and Mironov what kind of favorite artists follows from here, what kind of Jews are sincere people. And what they are taught by nonsense.
      3. Krasnoyarsk
        Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 10: 39
        +2
        Quote: Comrade Beria
        But the Jews have nothing to do with it. Such as Kapitsa, Zeldovich, Lange?

        With what fright do you have Kapitsa became a Jew?
        1. Comrade Beria
          Comrade Beria 22 August 2018 13: 35
          -4
          Sorry, I mixed up with Joffe.
    2. faiver
      faiver 22 August 2018 19: 15
      0
      you rave dear
    3. Prosha
      Prosha 30 August 2018 22: 19
      0
      He saved us from the fascist Jews, for example: Lenin,
      and hereinafter ...

      Sasha333 you urgently need to see a parasitologist and order sanitation of the room where you live - you got bitten by crazy fleas, don’t mess with it, you won’t buy health! It has long been known: the first sign of a parasite bite is the fear of Jews and other nations ...
  7. Forester
    Forester 22 August 2018 08: 13
    +4
    Eeeeeee .... But what about the hundred hundred and five hundred personally tortured ???
  8. Alex_59
    Alex_59 22 August 2018 08: 26
    +4
    In principle, like articles of a monarchist-imperial style, this article does not in the least bring the reader closer to the truth. There is no attempt to objectively, without tantrums, emotions and excesses, to understand the essence of what happened. There is no sense of reality, in the presence of which it will inevitably have to admit the mistakes of the Soviet authorities.
    In principle, you don't even need to go into the archives, you just need to have life experience to understand what they have done with hunger and repression from the heart. It’s just that the Ymperians use this fact in order to arrange a hysteria in the style of "union - Mordor, communists - mediocrity", and people like the author simply deny it as a myth and fiction. Horseradish radish is not sweeter - there is no smell of truth here.
    1. faiver
      faiver 22 August 2018 19: 32
      +6
      that with hunger and repression they messed up from the heart
      - Excuse me, but was the Soviet regime to blame for the famine of the beginning of the 30x in the USA, Canada, France, Spain, Germany, Poland? I am not trying to defend the Soviet regime, there were really enough mistakes, but why is the question of hunger in the USSR beginning 30x considered in isolation from the rest of the world? so maybe the question here is not only in the Soviet regime? hi
      1. Hantengri
        Hantengri 22 August 2018 20: 54
        +6
        Quote: faiver
        - Excuse me, but was the Soviet regime to blame for the famine of the early 30s in the USA, Canada, France, Spain, Germany, Poland?

        Of course! Especially the famine of 1932-33 in Poland (Western Ukraine) and Romania! Well, it is clear to every sane elf that the drought and epidemic of ergot in these blessed countries that never knew hunger (never before, and again!) Were organized by the godless bolsheviks to hide the planned genocide of the Ukrainian and Kazakh peoples! !! Eyewitnesses claim that Comrade Stalin, personally, drank all the water in the fields ... But I believe that, for this purpose, he detached specialists of a more suitable nationality !!! wassat
  9. thinker
    thinker 22 August 2018 08: 34
    +7
    “Fraud, hunger and fascism. The myth of genocide in Ukraine from Hitler to Harvard. ” This book was published in Toronto in 1987.

    It has not been translated into Russian and it seems no one is going to translate it. Here is such an interesting situation.
    1. kalibr
      kalibr 22 August 2018 16: 36
      -2
      That is, there was allowed the opportunity to write this way and that? And did we have any alternative? Not!
  10. brigadier
    brigadier 22 August 2018 08: 39
    -2
    It was. The deceased grandmother told me that in villages in the Zhytomyr region people died like flies. There were cases of cannibalism in the villages - they ate their own children.
    Real life is worse and worse than any fiction.
    Over and over again, rewriting history for the sake of today's political reality will not lead to good.
    1. Krasnoyarsk
      Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 10: 43
      +6
      Quote: brigadir
      It was. The deceased grandmother told me that in villages in the Zhytomyr region people died like flies. There were cases of cannibalism in the villages - they ate their own children. .

      Was she seeing with her own eyes, or were acquaintances telling her?
      Solzhenitsyn's too ... "I haven't seen it myself, but they told me ... 60 million ..."
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 23 August 2018 20: 43
        0
        Quote: Krasnoyarsk
        Solzhenitsyn's too ... "I haven't seen it myself, but they told me ... 60 million ..."

        The answer to this "thinker" was the Soviet "I have not read, but I condemn."
        What is the question - that is the answer .... laughing
      2. brigadier
        brigadier 28 August 2018 13: 51
        0
        Quote: Krasnoyarsk
        Quote: brigadir
        It was. The deceased grandmother told me that in villages in the Zhytomyr region people died like flies. There were cases of cannibalism in the villages - they ate their own children. .

        Was she seeing with her own eyes, or were acquaintances telling her?
        Solzhenitsyn's too ... "I haven't seen it myself, but they told me ... 60 million ..."

        I saw it myself. She was born in 1918, her kingdom is heaven.
  11. hhhhhhh
    hhhhhhh 22 August 2018 08: 58
    +3
    Quote: Curious
    It turns out I have a father, grandfather, two grandmothers, other relatives and neighbors who talked about hunger - without exception, victims of propaganda and that they were starving, learned from Goebbels.

    If they told you, then they are not victims of hunger? I also starved in the 90s, a few days.
    Advocacy in targeted destruction, which was not.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  12. sxfRipper
    sxfRipper 22 August 2018 11: 04
    -4
    a false myth supported by slanderers like Solzhenitsyn, Radzinsky, Suvorov-Rezun
    Well, why the fuck, huh? Suvorov just debunked the myth of the ruined ingenious stick leaders (they did not pull the generals). And once a lie ...
    1. Krasnoyarsk
      Krasnoyarsk 22 August 2018 13: 36
      +4
      Quote: sxfRipper
      a false myth supported by slanderers like Solzhenitsyn, Radzinsky, Suvorov-Rezun
      Well, why the fuck, huh? Suvorov just debunked the myth of the ruined ingenious stick leaders (they did not pull the generals). And once a lie ...

      You see, what’s the matter ...
      To believe in your lies, tell the truth. So he told the truth about the "ruined brilliant commanders". And everything else ...
      1. Alex1117
        Alex1117 26 August 2018 09: 23
        +1
        Suvorov (Rezun) didn't really tell us anything new. The only thing is that he slightly rearranged the accents. Like instead of the usual expression: "pioneer red tie" he says: "red pioneer tie." Anyone who is at least a little familiar with military planning is clear that before the war, the USSR simply MUST have a Plan of Preventive Strike on Germany as one of the components of the state's defense strategy. And the Plan must be such that it can be implemented in the shortest possible period, as soon as a favorable moment is created for this. If there was such a Plan and preparations were made for it, this is NORMAL. But if there was no and we were not preparing to strike a preemptive strike at a favorable moment for us, then it was not STUPIDITY and SILENCE, but betrayal. Unfortunately, before the war, J.V. Stalin removed the staff officer K.A. Meretskov from the post of chief of the General Staff of the Red Army, and put the combat commander G.K. Zhukov. Which, according to the characteristics written by K.K. Rokossovsky in the mid-1930s: "he has an organic aversion to staff work."
        1. sxfRipper
          sxfRipper 27 August 2018 22: 08
          -1
          Suvorov (Rezun) didn’t really tell us anything new. The only thing is that he slightly shifted the emphasis
          He simply accentuated what did not officially come out, but was not subject to accentuation. And this is exactly what the zealots of "historical truth" cannot forgive him, who made big stars and pants with stripes on mantras like An evil toothy wolf attacked a peaceful sheep.
        2. Evgeny Alexeev
          Evgeny Alexeev 28 August 2018 00: 04
          -1
          And before the war, in the Stalinist purges, ALL the highest command of the army and navy perished. High Command. Interestingly, did any ruler in the world destroy all the commanders of his army before the war? Well, Alexander I would have taken and destroyed all his generals for Bonapartism just before the war with Napoleon. So what? After all, they all became French, all traitors and spies. wassat
          The top echelon of the Red Army command in 1936 consisted of 41 people, and exactly the same number - 41 people - were shot on the eve and in the first months of the great war on behalf of the party and government, on behalf of the people. S.S. managed to die a natural death. Kamenev. Only S.M. managed to survive from the old composition. Budyonny, K.E. Voroshilov, L.M. Galler, V.V. Ulrich, B.M. Shaposhnikov. But those who received in 1937-1939 were shot. "Four-punch" military ranks Ya.K. Berzin, M.D. Velikanov, G.P. Kireev, P.I. Smirnov-Svetlovsky, M.P. Frinovsky, N.S. Rozovsky - died in custody. All the top leadership of the army and navy has been completely destroyed. You can start over.
    2. Evgeny Alexeev
      Evgeny Alexeev 28 August 2018 00: 01
      +1
      Suvorov just debunked the myth of the ruined ingenious stick leaders (they did not pull the generals).

      Suvorov debunked? Suvorov -. He's talking nonsense. He doesn’t understand this.
  13. Trilobite Master
    Trilobite Master 22 August 2018 11: 40
    +8
    The article is another primitive attack on the fan, provocative, unsubstantiated and tendentious. To take any seriously the work of the author is to offend one's own mental abilities, sinking to the level of consciousness of a caveman. We are they, the light is darkness, the superethnos is the masters of the West, that is the whole world history. This is how primitive creatures-consumers are brought up and there is no difference between Samsonov's "super-ethnos" and the US's "democratic values" - both are just a fetish, the simplest attitude that suppresses any thought process in the information consumer. It is sad that VO, which positions itself as a patriotic media, continues to print the work of this intellectually underdeveloped individual who infects (at least tries to infect) others with his wretched primitivism.
    Most of all in this article I was dismissed by the phrase
    To be continued ...

    Sounds like a threat, and the threat is inevitable and merciless. The threat to continue to stupefy the audience, the threat to drag the reader to the bottom until his last breath, into the abyss of ignorance and indifference, where individuals who are even more intellectually backward than the author of this creation can only reflexively respond to slogans that have been hammered into his head in advance by shouting "hurray!", "glory!", "death!" and throw up your hands in your greeting to what or to whom they will be told.
    That's it, for today I finished reading "History".
    sad
    1. kalibr
      kalibr 22 August 2018 16: 33
      +1
      Very primitive. And about Hirst and the rest. I just finished the textbook "Public Opinion Management Technologies". Shoveled a bunch of literature. Of course, for ... you can write articles about information management that way. But people should be raised to new, higher information levels, and not lowered. Just Goebbels and Hirst were famous for this. Do we repeat their path? Nice!
      1. Sweetheart
        Sweetheart 22 August 2018 16: 40
        +2
        Quote: kalibr
        . Repeat their way? Nice!
        Reply

        Are you talking about your work, a former party worker?
        1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 23 August 2018 02: 46
        +1
        I'm embarrassed to ask ----- It seems that the teaching has ended, I apologize if I am mistaken?
        Why this textbook?
        It seems that such textbooks have already been written by professors for MGIMO and for others?
        1. kalibr
          kalibr 23 August 2018 13: 34
          -4
          So after all, Dmitry, another professor writes worse than an assistant professor, didn’t it occur to you? And then, yes, I don’t work at the university anymore, I need to live in retirement. But what does this have to do with the textbook? It is for everyone, and not just for PSU. And PR is not only taught at MGIMO.
          1. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 23 August 2018 15: 14
            +1
            I just met the author ---- Nightingale. Another book. I know that he has about PR. Then I looked at a review of textbooks by other authors, Vyacheslav Olegovich.
            1. kalibr
              kalibr 23 August 2018 19: 28
              -4
              I have three of his books and have read a number of articles. And his books are on the list of references in my book. But he has "his own PR", and I have "mine".
    2. Fat
      Fat 22 August 2018 19: 44
      +1
      This article belongs to another section called "opinions". It looks like a speech at a rally, for "history" is too emotional. Figures, graphs, links to documents and maps are clearly lacking.
  14. worms
    worms 22 August 2018 12: 34
    0
    Quote: Comrade Beria
    then I myself am a descendant of the repressed at that time

    Yeah, as they say, I’m the daughter of an officer, so it’s not all clear ... or are you the daughter of a fist ?? or maybe the daughter of a squirrel? although it seems to me that you are Trotsky’s pronounced daughter ... a kind of hereditary Tsilya Bronstein hi
    1. Comrade Beria
      Comrade Beria 22 August 2018 13: 41
      -4
      Quote: orm
      although it seems to me

      Seems to be baptized.
      But it does not seem to me that you have spoken at 282. And you are not alone.
      1. Beringovsky
        Beringovsky 24 August 2018 15: 29
        +2
        Does article 282 mention Tsili Bronstein? Very interesting!
  15. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 13: 37
    +1
    Quote: Krasnoyarsk
    Being interested in this issue, I talked with old people who survived the famine of 32-33 years, everyone said that "it was very hungry", but that "I don't know that" to die of hunger.

    And this is about nothing. Where the steppe, for example, whole villages have died out, and where the meadows and mountains with forests there have survived much more. And the norms were the same, just the landscape plays a role, the forest can feed, unlike the steppe.
  16. BAI
    BAI 22 August 2018 13: 44
    +7
    In fact, in the USSR in the early 1930s there was a terrible tragedy related to the peasant issue in the Russian Empire, the events of the Revolution and the Civil War, and the peasant war during the troubles of 1917 - 1920. and the class battle in Soviet Russia. This led to the instability of agricultural production (plus mistakes and, possibly, sabotage of part of Trotskyist managers, hidden enemies of Stalin and his project), and a reduction in food production in several regions of the USSR, including Ukraine.


    Among the list of reasons, the author did not indicate the main thing - drought. Droughts shocked RI before the revolution, and were in the USSR after the revolution. Some authors claim that in 1932 there was normal weather with rains, but let's see the document:




    August 21, 1932. Drought covered the Volga region, Bashkiria, Orenburg.
    Well, Ukraine, too, was not lucky with the weather.

    By the way, it should be noted (maybe in the next part) that at that time the USA refused to sell the USSR machines and materials necessary for industrialization for money and demanded payment in grain, putting the USSR before the choice: either starve to death, or curtail the industrialization program .
    1. BAI
      BAI 22 August 2018 13: 48
      +4

      And this is the first part of the letter. The site does not allow you to insert 2 photos.
    2. Koshnitsa
      Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 13: 49
      -2
      Neither in Ukraine nor in southern Russia there was a drought in 1932-33. And in 46-47 there was no drought either. In the Kuban, in the entire history of agriculture, such a phenomenon as drought, which led to the complete death of crops, was not noted.
      Quote: BAI
      confronting the USSR with the choice: either starve to death, or curtail the industrialization program.

      Did Georgians for some reason not starve to death? Did the Trotskyists feed?
      1. BAI
        BAI 22 August 2018 16: 09
        +5
        Neither in Ukraine nor in the south of Russia there was a drought in 1932-33.

        Of course not! I immediately wrote:
        Some authors claim that in 1932 there was normal weather with rains

        However, if we discard anti-Sovietism and turn to the facts, we will see:
        For an exact answer to this question we need weather information in those years - they are available on the Internet. This thankless, but very important work was done by KED, the forum participant S. G. Kara-Murza. He looked at the site http://eca.knmi.nl weather reports for 1932-1933. There are laid out daily meteorological observations of 5 Ukrainian stations (Kiev, Poltava, Lugansk, Nikolaev and Feodosia) for the entire XX century (more precisely, from the end of the XIX century to the present). Based on the observations given there, it turns out that in 1932 the summer was relatively arid in many parts of Ukraine affected by hunger. In Poltava, for example, only 402 mm of precipitation fell, which is 70–80 mm below the norm.

        However, this is not the whole truth. It turns out that 1931 was still drier in the Poltava region - 211 mm of precipitation. Moreover, neither in 1930 nor in 1929 there was no precipitation, not only “according to the norm”, but even at the level of 1932! In Lugansk - the same thing. For the sake of completeness, it is worth noting that the most arid period in the period under review was 1934. In Kiev and Nikolaev this year, about half the average annual rainfall fell, in Lugansk - less than a third, and in Poltava - generally about 1/4 of the norm.

        THREE YEARS CONTRACTION OF SEDIMENTS WAS LESS RATE IN UKRAINE! And so, of course, there was no drought.

        Did Georgians for some reason not starve to death?

        You will laugh - but there was no famine in the Far East either. Maybe this will be a revelation for you - the USSR was a big country with different climatic conditions. And drought physically could not cover the whole country. Incidentally, an artificial famine would have swept the whole country, but this was not. So hunger is not artificial.
      2. Sweetheart
        Sweetheart 22 August 2018 16: 32
        +2
        Quote: Koshnitsa
        Neither in Ukraine nor in the south of Russia there was a drought in 1932-33, and in 46-47 there was no drought either.

        Mr. liar ... you either don’t know anything or knowing, nevertheless you are brazenly lying. Such can be in two cases - the person is programmed, the family is there because of some offense. The organization is for a fee. But lying despite the facts .
        It's about the hunger of the 20s
        The lean year of 1920 was the first prerequisite for disaster. Only about 20 million pounds of grain were collected in the Volga region. For comparison, its amount in 1913 reached 146,4 million pounds. Unprecedented drought brought spring of 1921. Already in May, winter bread died in the Samara province, spring began to dry out. The appearance of locusts, which ate the remains of the crop, as well as the absence of rain, caused the death of almost 100% of the crops by early July. As a result, famine began in the Volga region. - Read more on FB.ru: http://fb.ru/article/211331/golod-v-povolje-----godov-prichinyi-istoricheskie-faktyi
        This is over 30 years
        Climatic causes of the famine of 1933
        Earlier, as one of the main causes of the famine of 1933, I showed such a thing as mass sabotage (resistance) of collectivization peasants. He showed statistics of mass slaughter of cattle and the mention of this phenomenon in Prishvin's diaries. Now we turn to the climatic, natural causes of the crop failure of 1932, which caused a mass famine of 1933. To start Prishvin:

        August 8 (1932). It’s worth the heat. Forests burn everywhere. There is no rest in Moscow.
        August 10. Huge forest fires. The prohibition of hunting.

        This is the Moscow region, i.e. Central Russia. Judging by this description, the summer of 1932 was like the summer of recent 2010 with its protracted drought and forest fires. Let me remind you that in the dry summer of 2010 we harvested 60 million tons, and last year 104 million tons. The difference is almost twice. It is a drought and now a drought. Exactly the same picture was in the Volga region of 1932, only droughts there are hotter and lingering. This is confirmed by documents of that time ....
        https://burckina-faso.livejournal.com/980803.html
        Here are data on the number of cattle slaughtered by year:

        1928 - 70;
        1929 - 67;
        1930 - 52;
        1931 - 47;
        1932 - 40;
        1933 - 38.
        The amount of draft power (horses), which was the main working tool, was more than halved. In 1932, the fields were overgrown with weeds. Even parts of the Red Army were sent for weeding. Due to a lack of manpower and draft power, 30% to 40% of the grain remains in the field not harvested.
        The years 1932-1933 were barren. There was widespread ergot and other grain diseases. These troubles are superimposed on the sabotage of grain harvesting, which was carried out by the opponents of the Bolsheviks, setting wide layers of peasants against the Soviet regime. Part of the grain was hidden in the pits. As you know, this method of storage led to spoilage of the grain and its transformation into poison for the body.

        When we try to find out where, for example, 4 million people died of starvation in Ukraine in 1932-1933, it turns out that this number was calculated according to empirical formulas based on population censuses that took place once every 5, or even 10 years .

        Meanwhile, there are clear mortality data for each year, based on the registry offices. So the average mortality rate in Ukraine for the five years preceding the famine of 1932-1933 is 515 thousand people per year. In 1932, the death rate was 668 thousand people. In 1933, the death rate amounted to 1 million 309 thousand people. After calculating, we conclude that the number of deaths in two hungry years increased by 945 thousand people, just as many deaths can be attributed to events related to the hunger strike. Even if you add up all the dead in Ukraine for 1932-1933, even 2 million people are not recruited, not to mention the 4 million figure that was given earlier.
        1. Accusations against the Soviet state are in droves - to make it more difficult to refute. It is unprofitable for the author-anti-adviser to focus on a separate episode, because weakness of argumentation and unreliability of sources emerge. And so, in bulk - it looks solid and convincing.

        2. Information is announced without indicating the sources of information. Because the quality of those sources is very doubtful.

        3. Dramatization. An attempt to shock the reader, cause him an emotional reaction.

        To shock the reader with numbers - millions and millions of victims are certainly needed.

        To shock the reader with the inhumanity of the Communists.

        For example, in the article all the victims of the famine of 1921-1922 (famine in the Volga region), the famine of 1932-1933, and the famine of 1946-1947 are counted as victims of the communist regime.

        The total number of victims of hunger: 5 million + 6-7 million + 2 million = 13-14 million. Sources of information that confirm these figures are not given. In order to emphasize the inhumanity of the Communists, all three famines are called “artificial” (ie, man-made).
        https://cont.ws/@burevestn1k/110791
        From the book: Ustin Chashikhin, Exposing slander against the USSR.

        With the myth of the “famine” - the same thing as with the myth of “repression” and the myth of God. No one will ever show you either God or millions of skeletons of victims of the Holodomor - all this is exaggerated many times. Churches and anti-advisers of Ukraine invented a bunch of myths, consisting of logical errors and blatant slander, and called them “the Holodomor.” Http://wiki.istmat.info/ myth: hunger
    3. faiver
      faiver 22 August 2018 19: 37
      0
      demanded payment in grain,
      - because they also had problems with food ....
      1. Sweetheart
        Sweetheart 23 August 2018 20: 00
        +1
        Quote: faiver
        because they also had problems with food ....

        The official statistics of the United States lost almost 8 million people somewhere, already wikipedia erased all the articles on this subject, to the United States to go on that famine was. Yes no one gasps, gasps .. democracy ..... everything on the Union of barrels and tubs of mud pour ..
      2. Alex1117
        Alex1117 26 August 2018 12: 12
        0
        There were no food problems in the United States, with the exception of its overproduction, but even if the United States did not behave towards us in the best way, even at a loss, it would be foolish to blame them. After all, the USA was not connected with the USSR by any treaties on the participation of the USA in the industrialization of the USSR. There were not even diplomatic relations between our countries.
  17. The comment was deleted.
  18. Alexander Greene
    Alexander Greene 22 August 2018 14: 38
    +3
    The famine that took place in 1933 in some regions of the USSR, including Ukraine, is called by the Ukrainian authorities “famine” and requires the world community to recognize it as genocide of the Ukrainian people.

    The fact that the famine was not genocide against the people by the Soviet government is evident from the testimonies of Mikhail Sholokhov. Here is how he describes Stalin’s reaction to the news of the famine that began in the Don: “Local activists wrote a letter to Stalin that the population of the region was starving, Stalin sent a telegram: “Count how much you need. We will help ” The local comrades carefully calculated and sent the request by letter. Stalin, sent bread, but scolded for his slowness: “It was necessary by telegram, we lost a lot of time”.

    Soviet power is the people's power, it could not arrange genocide against this people. Even if we argue from the mercantile point of view of the layman: why starve people at a time when working hands are so needed at the grandiose construction sites of socialism - Dneproges, Magnitka, Komsomolsk-on-Amur, Stalingrad Tractor Plant, hundreds of thousands of other construction projects.

    There is only one reason for constantly exaggerating the topic of the Holodomor - as soon as the bourgeois authorities or the degenerates have something wrong, be it Khrushchev, Gorbachev, Yeltsin, Kravchuk or the current leaders of the countries, they immediately begin to wake up questions of repression or famine.

    Therefore, one of the main tasks of the people of our generation is to protect Soviet history from bourgeois slander.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 22 August 2018 15: 45
      +2
      The topic is very large and somehow it was difficult for me to approach the topic of hunger in the country. Since childhood, I have heard my grandmother's stories about her childhood. Tula region. Aleksinsky district. The working village is rural and has its own plots. After all, there was a collective farm. But now do not link this with work at the factory ---- "cardboard", and do not ask already. Grandmother born in 1928. Some lean years .... According to her, she was always hungry, she was very thin, she was often sick, like other children in the family. Of the 7 children, four died between the ages of one and 14 years. There was this famine before the war and during the war, but after the war everything is fine, although my father is gone. The three remaining children started working early, at the age of 14, and somehow got better. The younger grandmother's brother, older sister. There is a 5-year difference between each of them. All of them later learned, they became people. Became communists ...
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 22 August 2018 16: 11
        +2
        The children did not know then that there are children's holidays - a birthday or a name day. Or New Year. Such was life in the village. We were pioneers. Helping adults. Like working collectives. Such a childhood. At the same time, residents of the cities ---- Moscow and Leningrad lived better ----- how would it be? I have the Murzilka magazine since 1924. An amazing kind world arises from this magazine
      2. Sweetheart
        Sweetheart 22 August 2018 16: 35
        +2
        Quote: Reptiloid
        The topic is very large and somehow it was difficult for me to approach the topic of hunger in the country.

        The hunger myth of 1946-1947 is built on a bunch:

        - An unscrupulous scientist, doctor of historical sciences V. Zima writes a work, voices dubious conclusions.

        - Wikipedia calls V. Zima's statements authoritative, but Shalak is silent about the counter-arguments of the doctor of historical sciences.

        - An anti-Soviet author who uses Wikipedia and the conclusions from it to create and promote the myth of artificial hunger and 2 million dead.

        Source: http: //burevestn1k.livejournal ...
        1. Koshnitsa
          Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 18: 13
          -4
          Vadim Kozhinov estimates the number of victims of the famine of 1946-47 at one and a half million people.
          Calling post-war hunger a myth is strange, don’t you?
          1. Hantengri
            Hantengri 22 August 2018 21: 39
            +2
            Quote: Koshnitsa
            Vadim Kozhinov estimates the number of victims of the famine of 1946-47 at one and a half million people.

            Vadim Valerianovich Kozhinov (July 5, 1930, Moscow - January 25, 2001) - Soviet, then Russian literary critic [2], critic and publicist. Candidate of Philological Sciences (1958).

            Interestingly, with the help of what mathematical method, this philologist "estimated" "the number of victims of the famine of 1946-47"? laughing How did you assess the error of your "estimate"? laughing Although ... why "a man with a good face" (c) all this mathematics! He, like Solzhenitsyn, needs a simple, all-pervading elven instinct. lol
            1. Alex1117
              Alex1117 26 August 2018 12: 56
              0
              in general, liberals call Vadim Kozhinov the most reactionary Stalinist, anti-Semite, and even Black Hundreds.
              So, the mathematical method is archival reports from the NKVD and the NGB
              1. Krasnoyarsk
                Krasnoyarsk 27 August 2018 14: 51
                0
                Quote: Alex1117
                So, the mathematical method is archival reports from the NKVD and the NGB

                And what did they bring about?
                Do you seriously think that the NKVD and the NGB were engaged in statistics?
                1. Alex1117
                  Alex1117 27 August 2018 18: 43
                  0
                  What does it have to do with it, what do I think? There are reports from places to Moscow. With a description of the real situation. Some of them are posted on the Internet. Search.
  19. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 14: 54
    -4
    Quote: Alexander Green
    "It was necessary by telegram, we lost a lot of time."

    The Georgians gave a telegram and there was no hunger, and the rest did not give and died. Interesting version. request
  20. Apollo
    Apollo 22 August 2018 15: 07
    -6
    There is a political struggle in Russia, and Stalin became a bargaining chip among its participants.
    A quarter of a century after the collapse of the USSR, it became obvious that living in our days based on Stalinist methods of government is unacceptable, and based on those used by the current government and believing in a "great future" is impossible.
  21. Alexander Greene
    Alexander Greene 22 August 2018 15: 45
    +3
    Quote: Koshnitsa
    The Georgians gave a telegram and there was no hunger, and the rest did not give and died. Interesting version.

    No need to jerk.

    About the causes of the famine in 1933
    When collectivization began, the class struggle of the poor against the kulaks immediately intensified in the countryside. Of course, the Soviet state supported the poorest peasantry in this struggle. Fists supported by the opposition launched a powerful anti-collective farm campaign. Soon they turned from words to action - Soviet officials, party workers, Selkors, activists, ordinary collective farmers were killed, burned, and slaughtered by entire families.

    In addition, the opposition, in order to harm collective farm construction, called on the peasants to slaughter cattle, to mow grass, to rotting grain, just not to turn them over to the collective farm. And this agitation had an effect. If in 1930 grain harvested 835,4 million centnersthen in 1932 only 698,7 million If horses in 1930 were 30,2 million heads, tabout in 1932 there was only 16,6 million Cattle also declined from 52,5 million goals in 1930 to 38,6 million in 1932 city

    Thus, in the year preceding the famine, cereal harvest was sharply reduced, and livestock numbers decreased. Who is to blame? - The Bolsheviks? No, the peasants who succumbed to anti-collective farm propaganda were to blame; they sowed less, cut cattle and draft power — horses and bulls, so as not to turn them over to the collective farm. At night they ate meat so as not to catch, and then ran to the yard. Remember how Sholokhov described Grandfather Shchukar in the novel "Virgin Soil Upturned", a malachai who was sticking out of sunflowers, who, too, succumbing to kulak propaganda, slaughtered his heifer and vilified further than he saw. And so it was everywhere.

    In addition, there were many hidden enemies on the ground, former White Guards, representatives of the NEP bourgeoisie made their way to the boards of collective farms and to local authorities. The party, too, then had many enemies, even in the highest echelons of power. Together with the kulaks, they also harmed the Soviet regime and collective farm construction, and allowed excesses. They did not give true information to the center, the communists who tried to resist this were arrested.

    This is all well-known, but in Ukraine, all the anti-Soviet people all agree that the Soviet government is to blame, however, no one can answer the question that if the Soviet government was specially arranged for the famine of the Ukrainian people, then why in 1933 the Soviet government 1,1 million tons of grain was bought abroad for gold, of which 50 thousand tons were immediately sent to Ukraine to save the starving?
    1. Nick_R
      Nick_R 22 August 2018 19: 28
      -6
      What are the purchases of grain abroad. Raise your statistics. It was continued to be exported both in 1932 and in 1934. Ukraine was helped, but with grain from other cities, when cannibalism had already begun in full. And in the hungry years 46-47, grain was exported to "brotherly" Germany
    2. Imobile
      Imobile 23 August 2018 00: 23
      -3
      Peasants meekly gave cattle to the communes. At least in the Smolensk region. This is a concrete example, I think it was the same in others. To control the communes were hired, support of the system, drunks and criminals. They did not milk cattle. In fact, they ate it. As soon as the last cow was slaughtered, the communes quietly disappeared.
      1. Alexander Greene
        Alexander Greene 23 August 2018 11: 22
        +5
        Quote: Imobile
        To control the communes were hired, support of the system, drunks and criminals. They did not milk cattle. In fact, they ate it. As soon as the last cow was slaughtered, the communes quietly disappeared.

        Oh, "great connoisseur" of the history of collective farm development, you do not even distinguish a commune from a collective farm, and all the same ...
  22. avia12005
    avia12005 22 August 2018 16: 11
    +1
    How many do not ask, no one can answer. Why in the besieged Leningrad people were not swollen from hunger, but lost weight? And in Ukraine from hunger did not lose weight, but puffed up?
    1. The comment was deleted.
  23. kalibr
    kalibr 22 August 2018 16: 19
    -2
    Quote: Boris55
    Boris55 (Boris) Today, 08: 15
    0
    Quote: Comrade Beria
    Is Lenin a Trotskyist?
    In the beginning he walked along the lines of Trotskyism.

    N-yes, with what, but God didn’t offend you with imagination!
  24. kalibr
    kalibr 22 August 2018 16: 21
    -6
    Quote: Alexander Green
    When collectivization began, the class struggle of the poor against the kulaks immediately intensified in the countryside

    So all the fists were plagued back in Civil ...
    1. BAI
      BAI 22 August 2018 16: 45
      +5
      They could not shoot kulaks in Grazhdanskaya for a simple reason - the legal definition of "kulak" appeared only in 1928 in the Decree of the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR of May 21, 1929 "On the signs of kulak farms in which the Code of Labor Laws should be applied." Before that - sheer verbiage and a fist could be called any peasant who did not want to hand over grain to the state. Therefore, if they did shoot, then anyone, but not kulaks from a legal point of view. Legally, they did not exist.
      1. BAI
        BAI 22 August 2018 17: 51
        +1
        only in 1928 year
        - a typo in 1929.
    2. Alexander Greene
      Alexander Greene 22 August 2018 21: 59
      +3
      Quote: kalibr
      So all the fists were plagued back in Civil ...

      You surprise me, if you taught the history of the CPSU in this way, then it becomes clear why you managed to destroy the USSR.
  25. kalibr
    kalibr 22 August 2018 16: 22
    -6
    Quote: Alexander Green
    a malachai who was sticking out of sunflowers, who, too, succumbing to kulak propaganda, slaughtered his heifer and vilified further than he saw.

    Poor, did not even know what a toilet is!
  26. kalibr
    kalibr 22 August 2018 16: 25
    -4
    Quote: Alexander Green
    Therefore, one of the main tasks of the people of our generation is to protect Soviet history from bourgeois slander.

    It is impossible to protect what has fallen apart. Good worth it. The bad is falling apart! Even small children understand this!
    1. Sweetheart
      Sweetheart 22 August 2018 16: 42
      +4
      Quote: kalibr
      It is impossible to protect what has fallen apart.

      You then immediately collapsed. You are in demand. You are in the regional committee for ideology, as they say. They answered.
      Quote: kalibr
      . The bad is falling apart! Even small children understand this!

      Well, Soros, who translated your pennies for you, is no longer the same system that you "build". Having betrayed what you swore more and more often fails, for 30 years they could not build anything really worthwhile, except for a horde of world eaters ..
      1. kalibr
        kalibr 22 August 2018 19: 50
        -7
        Soros and quite a few (!) Groshikov translated for me for a book about the knights of the East, and after 91, and for the system we worked in good faith - it was very beneficial to protect it. Who cuts the branch on which he sits? Foam brain include ...
    2. Alexander Greene
      Alexander Greene 22 August 2018 22: 10
      +4
      Quote: kalibr
      It is impossible to protect what has fallen apart. Good worth it. The bad is falling apart! Even small children understand this!

      The USSR did not collapse, it was destroyed. In an open struggle, I mean the Great Patriotic War, it did not work out, so the enemies did it by cunning, deception and betrayal, almost like Troy, launching a "Trojan horse" ...
      1. kalibr
        kalibr 23 August 2018 15: 58
        -7
        That is, scoops are suckers, right?
        1. Alexander Greene
          Alexander Greene 23 August 2018 18: 19
          +3
          Quote: kalibr
          That is, scoops are suckers, right?

          No, not bad. But here, how could you be discerned when you so mimicked?
          1. kalibr
            kalibr 23 August 2018 19: 38
            -7
            Fuckers, fuckers! They cheated, robbed, and they, the poor, could only rivet rockets and Kalash, and what would be clever to destroy them - they were not smart enough. There was not enough money to buy! And ... what do you mean by mimicking? I honestly worked out the program of the Ministry of Education, 320 rubles. + money for lectures to the people and all that. What they said in the OK and the Central Committee conveyed to the people with "fire in their eyes." Vegetable garden, I would have been kept in this job, had it not been otherwise. An, all my and my colleagues' efforts were in vain. Everything fell apart without us ... And I don't bet on the losers. Do you know the 11th commandment? "The falling one - push!"
            1. Alexander Greene
              Alexander Greene 23 August 2018 23: 58
              +2
              Quote: kalibr
              What they said in the OK and the Central Committee conveyed to the people with "fire in their eyes."

              Let me not believe you, because a person who has a petty-bourgeois consciousness, who himself does not believe in the class struggle and the dictatorship of the proletariat, cannot speak about this with fire in his eyes.
              1. kalibr
                kalibr 24 August 2018 12: 36
                -5
                And then I didn’t have a petty-bourgeois consciousness-ha ha! It was the most ... from Proletarskaya Street! And then - otherwise they would have driven them out of the feeder. In the grassroots organization, who needed bad workers?
                1. Alexander Greene
                  Alexander Greene 24 August 2018 21: 33
                  +2
                  Quote: kalibr
                  And then I didn’t have a petty-bourgeois consciousness-ha ha! It was the most ... from Proletarskaya Street! And then - otherwise they would have driven them out of the feeder.

                  Where did you get the class proletarian consciousness? For this it was necessary to be born in a proletarian family, and to cook in a factory boiler for ten years. And you have a family of intellectuals, after school - a university, the street also teaches only hooliganism and theft, and when you clung, as you say, to the "feeding trough", then it was already in charge of degenerates who accepted only their own kind.
                  1. Reptiloid
                    Reptiloid 26 August 2018 10: 18
                    +1
                    Quote: Alexander Green
                    Quote: kalibr
                    And then I didn’t have a petty-bourgeois consciousness-ha ha! It was the most ... from Proletarskaya Street! And then - otherwise they would have driven them out of the feeder.

                    Where does class proletarian consciousness come from?
                    Just to the topic of your conversation ----- on the Day TV channel ----- video of Fursov and Fefelov, recently. Well, just super !!!! About the party workers who changed to the new realities ..... how they fought for all the good, I don’t know about whom specifically, others understand ....
                    But all to talk. Even about the gentry surname mentioned .... Just like a mirror.
    3. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 23 August 2018 02: 31
      +2
      Quote: kalibr
      It is impossible to protect what has fallen apart. Good worth it. The bad is falling apart!

      He began to remember what fell apart ...
      Tsarist RI
      French monarchy
      Slavery in the USA, unlike Russian serfdom
      Gupta State, Delhi Sultanate,
      Empire of Charles 5
      Holy Roman Empire
      Arab caliphate
      Empire of Germanaric
      Empire of Attila
      The Roman Empire .... However, this is not all.
      1. kalibr
        kalibr 23 August 2018 15: 59
        -4
        Think correctly, Dmitry! A lot of good things that became bad over time fell apart!
  27. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 18: 01
    -2
    Quote: Alexander Green
    No need to jerk.

    So why was there no famine in Georgia? The peasantry has not launched a struggle against collective farms, and why?
  28. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 18: 19
    -3
    Quote: BAI
    You will laugh - but there was no famine in the Far East either. Maybe this will be a revelation for you - the USSR was a big country with different climatic conditions. And drought physically could not cover the whole country

    There was no drought in the Kuban in 1932-33, and the harvest was not bad, and the famine was terrible, in many villages the majority of the population died out. Monuments stand over those mounds where these people are buried.
  29. Doliva63
    Doliva63 22 August 2018 19: 20
    +6
    Quote: kalibr
    Quote: Alexander Green
    When collectivization began, the class struggle of the poor against the kulaks immediately intensified in the countryside

    So all the fists were plagued back in Civil ...

    Rave?
    I can’t believe that you worked in the Communist Party — you didn’t take such people there until the end of the 80s.
    1. kalibr
      kalibr 22 August 2018 19: 46
      -7
      Find my Ph.D. dissertation online ...
  30. The comment was deleted.
  31. kalibr
    kalibr 22 August 2018 20: 13
    -5
    Quote: BAI
    Legally, they did not exist.

    And practically they shot and how!
  32. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 20: 30
    -2
    Quote: BAI
    it turns out that in 1932 the summer was relatively arid in many areas of Ukraine affected by hunger. In Poltava, for example, only 402 mm of precipitation fell, which is 70–80 mm below the norm.

    This is a good rainfall for the area.
    Quote: BAI
    It turns out that 1931 was still drier in the Poltava region - 211 mm of precipitation. Moreover, neither in 1930 nor in 1929 there was no precipitation, not only “according to the norm”, but even at the level of 1932!

    And note, no one died of hunger.
  33. The comment was deleted.
  34. Altona
    Altona 22 August 2018 21: 32
    +5
    Quote: Comrade Beria
    The standard wording is Anti-Soviet activity.

    -----------------------------
    Under the anti-Soviet activity, criminal offenses such as sabotage, registration, terror, banditry, and speculation took place. I do not justify large-scale persecutions on the basis of property, but they were caused by the zeal of local cadres, and not personally by Stalin, who himself had to fight the bronzed party groups. As for the kulaks, the kulak was not a "strong business executive" as it is commonly thought, but a kind of microfinanceist who lent grain at interest, thereby enslaving the mass of the poor peasantry. That is, the fight against the kulak had a class character. In addition, the kulaks opposed the introduction of machine cultivation and the unification of peasants into collective farms, as this undermined their financial base, so to speak. If the kulak could really feed the population, then no one would begin to destroy it. But in the form of a grain speculator who, moreover, challenged state prices for grain, the kulak was a direct pest.
    1. Evgeny Alexeev
      Evgeny Alexeev 27 August 2018 23: 49
      -1
      Under anti-Soviet activity, quite criminal crimes took place such as sabotage, home registry, terror, banditry, and speculation.

      Only nowhere in the world were they shot for postscripts and speculation. Only in the country that built the world's best system.

      I do not condone the large-scale persecution on property grounds, but they were caused by the zeal of local cadres, and not personally by Stalin,

      What are you saying? Seriously? That is, at the side of the head of the country they exterminated innocent people, and he was neither sleep nor spirit. Well, a wonderful leader. And Stalin did not sign the shooting lists? Yeah.

      As for the kulaks, the kulak was not a "strong business executive" as it is commonly thought, but a kind of microfinanceist who lent grain at interest, thereby enslaving the mass of the poor peasantry.

      He used to be like that. Under the king. In Soviet times, it was simply a strong business executive.

      If the fist could really feed the population, then no one would destroy it.

      Excuse me, you don’t know history at all, or are you just pretending to be a felt boot?

      But in the form of a grain speculator, who also disputed state prices for grain, the fist was a direct pest.

      What are the prices for grain? There was a surplus appraisal, almost all grain was taken from the peasants. Read the letter of Sholokhov to Stalin. This grain was sold over a hill and machines were bought on it to carry out industrialization due to the complete robbery of the peasantry.
  35. Altona
    Altona 22 August 2018 21: 37
    +4
    Quote: Rakatansky
    When the Reds came to power, they took all the grain from the peasants to feed the army. After a couple of years, all the grain was taken again to buy specialists from Western countries for the construction of plants, hydroelectric power plants, etc.

    ----------------------------
    You do not see the other side of this phenomenon. Stalin offered the West in payment gold, oil, coal. metals, but the west demanded the payment of grain unnecessary to him. These were the first kind of sanctions when payment was charged with a food product. to cause domestic hunger in the USSR. So the true organizer of the famine is not Stalin or the Soviet leadership. Do not forget that hunger at that time was unleashed throughout the world, including in the United States itself. See the story in its entirety, not in propaganda squeezes.
  36. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 21: 51
    -3
    You so
    Quote: Altona
    Stalin offered the West in payment gold, oil, coal. metals, but the west demanded the payment of grain unnecessary to him.
    Documents? More specifically, to whom and how. They exported everything else and furs and antiques. John Steinbeck read about the famine in the United States, eat up meat, buy cars and leave for California.
  37. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 21: 54
    -3
    Quote: Altona
    If the fist could really feed the population, then no one would destroy it.

    In the country, people took power who did not understand anything about real, concrete life. In agriculture, Dzhugashvili was a layman, however, like his guard, dropouts, all kinds of lousy, tumbleweed. Hence the consequences of collectivization.
  38. Altona
    Altona 22 August 2018 22: 16
    +3
    Quote: Koshnitsa
    In the country, people took power who did not understand anything about real, concrete life. In agriculture, Dzhugashvili was a layman, however, like his guard, dropouts, all kinds of lousy, tumbleweed. Hence the consequences of collectivization.

    ------------------------
    That is, you offer retrospectively the further development of the notorious peasant community and small-scale commodity production. The further development of the peasant community led to the fragmentation of already small land allotments for consumers and their critical reduction, that in reality they would not be able to feed anyone. In addition, the absence of any agronomy would not guarantee productivity, which was already nonexistent, at the level of the 17-18th century.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 23 August 2018 02: 08
      +3
      Quote: Altona
      The further development of the peasant community led to the fragmentation of already small land allotments for consumers and their critical reduction, that in reality they would not be able to feed anyone. In addition, the absence of any agronomy.
      The fragmentation of small areas made it impossible to use the technique, the areas turned out to be narrow "across the strip". As soon as the horses pass. Lack of agronomy --- no one thought to help the peasant. Stolypin wanted to solve all these problems with his reform, as a result of which small allotments would be sold to large landowners who would dictate their terms
  39. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 22 August 2018 22: 23
    -3
    Quote: Altona
    That is, you offer in retrospect the further development of the notorious peasant community and small-scale commodity production

    Namely, as in Europe, well, the preservation of large land tenure, landlord, specific, large owners.
    Quote: Altona
    Further development of the peasant community led to the fragmentation of already small land allotments for eaters and their critical reduction

    This problem has already been solved by Stolypin. Our country was not settled by the 20th century. Take the same territory of Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan, after Kuropatkin’s events in 1916, the territory was completely empty there, resettle surpluses of the agricultural population and provide the infrastructure for food export.
    Quote: Altona
    In addition, the absence of any agronomy would not guarantee productivity, which was already nonexistent, at the level of the 17-18th century.

    During the reign of Nicholas II, the average yield from tithing doubled. This is the data of Oldenburg.
  40. Imobile
    Imobile 23 August 2018 00: 13
    -5
    The famine was all over the country. In the steppe regions, he was stronger because of the features. Mom told how they birch branches ground and ate. In Ukraine there was no forest, hence the consequences. The first that led to the famine, the export of grain for the purchase of decommissioned equipment, the second, the destruction of agricultural equipment and transfer to collective. The history of the creation of communes is noteworthy. Cattle was taken from the peasants, they were looking for drunkards who did not milk or feed the cattle. Just cut and eat. As soon as they slaughtered the last, the communes fled. Stalin was a very strong Russophobe. This is especially evident when Hitler tried to capture Stalingrad for an attack on Baku and there was a famine in the country, the peoples of the Caucasus quietly absorbed kebabs. Just do not gang up on them, they just did not know. They are normal people and if they were informed, they would definitely share it. It’s just that in the Kremlin one mustachioed Georgian figured that the Slavs of the second grade should let them fight, and let the peoples of the Caucasus chew the kebab.
    1. Alex1117
      Alex1117 26 August 2018 12: 38
      +1
      The French are often perplexed about the famine in Ukraine and the Don. Where could hunger come from if hundreds of millions of delicacies live in those places: frogs, snails, slugs.
      On the Don, however, the so-called "river oysters" - shells called "turtle" were mined. But many were ashamed to catch them.
  41. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 03: 53
    -1
    Quote: Reptiloid
    As a result, small plots would be sold to large landowners, who would dictate their terms

    You say so, as if there was something bad about it. And plots of lazy people and drunks too. Sold. For money. And on the collective farm, how did they take everything, to remind?
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 23 August 2018 12: 22
      +2
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      Quote: Reptiloid
      As a result, small plots would be sold to large landowners, who would dictate their terms

      You say so, as if there was something bad about it. And plots of lazy people and drunks too. Sold. For money. And on the collective farm, how did they take everything, to remind?

      And where would all these owners of small plots go? Families? In the village, as without land. Listen to Fursov’s network. A.I., Elena Prudnikova ... You mean for large latifundists.
      1. The comment was deleted.
  42. wooja
    wooja 23 August 2018 11: 01
    +1
    History and politics are very dirty and interdependent things ..., Ukrainian affairs in the USSR ...-- historically, Ukrainian comrades had a huge influence in the center ... throughout the existence of the USSR and sufficient independence from the center ...., Stalin was practically no one at that time, although it is customary to call him a dictator, the mess in the country was terrible, including power structures, and now it has not really decreased ... but what the local authorities did on the ground ... .., so we remember the 90s well ... compared to the late 20s and early 30s, they look like children's games in the dog oznache .... party initiatives and their implementation on the ground - Hollywood horrors compared to this ..., children's horror stories. Local Ukrainian comrades with a traditional thirst for power and power, as well as with the same incompetence and traditional greed (Ukrainians) ... and this is the result ... .., and then everyone stupidly dumped in Moscow, Moscow also did not stand out with any intelligence or quick wits .. .. and then on Chernomyrdin ....
  43. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 13: 07
    -3
    Quote: Reptiloid
    And where would all these owners of small plots go?

    Relocation to the outskirts or cities.
    Quote: Reptiloid
    Listen to Fursov’s network. A.I., Elena Prudnikova ..

    Petrosyan or Stepanenko do not offer?
    1. Hantengri
      Hantengri 23 August 2018 19: 00
      +4
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      Quote: Reptiloid
      Listen to Fursov’s network. A.I., Elena Prudnikova ..
      Petrosyan or Stepanenko do not offer?

      Prudnikova than you did not please?
      1. Koshnitsa
        Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 19: 11
        -4
        Petrosyan is funnier. And Prudnikova is sad.
        1. Hantengri
          Hantengri 23 August 2018 20: 17
          +3
          Quote: Koshnitsa
          Petrosyan is funnier.

          Ah, well, if for you Petrosyan is ridiculous ... Then the question is removed. laughing Intelligence is a whimsical quantity and, in your case, unobservable! lol
          Illustration for the term "unobservable quantity".
          1. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 23 August 2018 20: 46
            +1
            Koshnitsa and Intelligence are incompatible things. In all his comments, he diligently pursues the theme of general guilt, both of leadership and everyone else. Everyone is to blame, except for the White Guards and traitors. It is clear where such non-religious repentance can lead. Neither England nor the United States will ever repent. The monument to Danton is in the center of Paris.
      2. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 23 August 2018 19: 38
        +2
        Quote: HanTengri
        Quote: Koshnitsa
        Quote: Reptiloid
        Listen to Fursov’s network. A.I., Elena Prudnikova ..
        Petrosyan or Stepanenko do not offer?

        Prudnikova than you did not please?

        Hello Han.!
        Yes, of course, only NTS brochures are suitable for Kosnice. Unfortunately, they are easily accessible, and so is the White Guard.
        1. Koshnitsa
          Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 20: 23
          +1
          Prudnikova is a crazy graphomaniac, referring to her, to Goblin with his abusive translations, to other trash is simply ugly. There are facts, there are figures, expound, and discuss some freaks why is this?
          The famine of 1932-33 is a direct result of collectivization, a failure in its design and execution.
          Prudnikova claims that Siberia is a very small territory in which even Stolypin could not resettle a million people. Well, who after that will discuss it seriously?
          1. Hantengri
            Hantengri 23 August 2018 20: 50
            +3
            Quote: Koshnitsa
            The famine of 1932-33 is a direct result of collectivization, a failure in its design and execution.

            In Poland and Romania too?
            Quote: Koshnitsa
            0
            Prudnikova is a crazy graphomaniac, referring to her, to Goblin with his abusive translations, to other trash is simply ugly. There are facts, there are figures, expound, and discuss some freaks why is this?

            Have you already had experience with the Goblin? Has he already called you a minor de'Bill? Did this cause you severe mental trauma? Want to talk about it? laughing
            Quote: Koshnitsa
            Prudnikova claims that Siberia is a very small territory in which even Stolypin could not resettle a million people.

            Quote from Prudnikova, pliz, that would not be unfounded!
            Quote: Koshnitsa
            Well, who after that will discuss it seriously?

            Not you, for sure! Apparently, you also have enough NTS agitators for your eyes.
          2. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 23 August 2018 20: 50
            +4
            Quote: Koshnitsa
            Prudnikova claims that Siberia is a very small territory in which even Stolypin could not resettle a million people

            A link to the studio, pli-and-out. In what work this was printed.
            Quote: Koshnitsa
            Prudnikova is a crazy graphomaniac, referring to her, to Goblin with his abusive translations, to other trash is simply ugly

            It seems to me that you have your own work and research on this topic. Do not make public?
            Or is the main source for you - the notorious report of the "corn aphid" at the XX Congress of the CPSU? Or a biography dictated to a tape recorder and sent to the publishers of the "cultural and civilized West"?
          3. Alex1117
            Alex1117 26 August 2018 12: 45
            0
            You did not understand. Siberia is a huge territory. But in the beginning of the 20th century there was really little free POWDER land. Taiga, tundra, swamps, mountains. Plus huge river spills.
            1. Koshnitsa
              Koshnitsa 26 August 2018 13: 37
              0
              The word virgin is familiar to you. And before the Russian arable land in Siberia was not at all.
              I repeat for everyone, at the beginning of the 20th century, even in the Volga region, we had huge uninhabited and undeveloped lands. And in Siberia, then-Siberia, this was before the Aral Sea, in the Far East, in Turkestan.
              Do you think that Khrushchev mastered, and even under Stalin there were state farms there.
              1. Alex1117
                Alex1117 27 August 2018 18: 59
                +2
                Each vegetable has its own time. Let me remind you that not horses and oxen worked on the virgin lands. A tractor DT-54 and Stalinets-80. The numbers are the number of horse powers. But it was not easy for them, and the plows often broke. Plus, in many places, water had to be transported by tankers for 1 00 kilometers.
                1. Koshnitsa
                  Koshnitsa 27 August 2018 19: 12
                  -1
                  Do you think that virgin lands should not be opened by horse or cow plow?
                  But how did Russian settlers in Siberia plow them, starting from the 16th century?
                  Where Khrushchev thoughtlessly ordered to plow up virgin soil, of course, they didn’t settle under the tsar, what a fool to carry water for 100 kilometers! laughing
                  But the land beyond the Urals, and we still had not colonized a mass of territories, and in the European part was enough for an absolute solution to the peasant problem
        2. Hantengri
          Hantengri 23 August 2018 20: 58
          +2
          Quote: Reptiloid
          Hello Han.!
          Yes, of course, only NTS brochures are suitable for Kosnice. Unfortunately, they are easily accessible, and so is the White Guard.

          Greetings, O resident of Nibiru!
          This is all clear. But there was a crazy thought: Suddenly, the four-thread articulate vyaknet. But no ...
          1. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 23 August 2018 21: 10
            +1
            And, mind you, dear Khan, he first started about Goblin. Looks like my countryman severely injured him through the Internet! Here it is the great power of art !!!. Impressed in earnest.
            1. Koshnitsa
              Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 21: 35
              -2
              Goblin for loshki creates a product, feeds them the most delicious ice cream in the world, khe-khe ...
              What is there to be impressed with?
              1. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 23 August 2018 21: 55
                +2
                Quote: Koshnitsa
                Goblin for loshki creates a product, feeds them the most delicious ice cream in the world, khe-khe ..
                What is there to be impressed with?
                And for whom do you create your own um, um, products?
                1. Koshnitsa
                  Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 22: 24
                  -2
                  For smart, educated people who themselves can understand the realities. In principle, even with such little animals on two socks, you can solder the brain, put it on the track and let it go. laughing
            2. Hantengri
              Hantengri 23 August 2018 21: 45
              +2
              Quote: Reptiloid
              And, mind you, dear Khan, he first started about Goblin. Looks like my countryman severely injured him through the Internet! Here it is the great power of art !!!. Impressed in earnest.

              Percipient, however, denies ... But it seems to me that he was, once, "skillfully admitted"! lol
              1. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 26 August 2018 10: 30
                +2
                Quote: HanTengri
                ...... But, it seems to me,! lol
                There is no way to guess ..... But there is undoubtedly an injury! And what ..... Reads ----. Fursov. Thinks ------ about the Goblin. Burst from
                it accumulated !!!!! AHA-HA !!!!!! Through emotionless constant.
  44. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 13: 08
    -3
    Quote: wooja
    but what the local authorities did on the ground ... ..,

    These are excuses, the same article "Dizziness with Success" and so on.
    The decision about cannibalistic collectivization was made in the Kremlin by the narrowest circle.
  45. ser56
    ser56 23 August 2018 15: 06
    -2
    "In fact, a terrible tragedy occurred in the USSR in the early 1930s, connected with the peasant question in the Russian Empire, the events of the Revolution and the Civil War, the peasant war during the Troubles of 1917-1920 and the class battle in Soviet Russia."
    a question to the author - who put forward the slogan "liquidation of the kulaks as a class"? Who dispossessed 4,5 million people and exiled 2 million? Who robbed the rest of the peasants and drove them into collective farms? Who was unable to organize work on these collective farms?
  46. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 20: 56
    -1
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    A link to the studio, pli-and-out. In what work was this printed

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R1amYve-Po
    From 7: 29 please listen, this is the greatest geographical discovery.
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    Or is the main source for you - the notorious report of the "corn aphid" at the XX Congress of the CPSU?

    Corn aphid was the most faithful Stalinist, and probably he had a better understanding of what was happening than the crazy journalist
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker 23 August 2018 21: 12
      +3
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R1amYve-Po
      From 7: 29 please listen, this is the greatest geographical discovery.

      I, you know, prefer the genre of fiction. Give a link to the books she wrote. Or didn’t you read them?
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      Corn aphid was the most faithful Stalinist and probably he understood something better in what was happening

      "Stalinists" can be called Beria, Molotov with Malenkov, and others who were removed from their posts after June 53, demoted. And Malenkov was exiled in general.
      Khrushchev was from the "blood washed" breed. He enjoyed the trust of the IVS, like Yezhov in his time. But the cunning crest managed, through intrigue, having the influence of both the CPSU (b) and the CPSU, subsequently, to avoid a harsh fate. The "Leningrad affair" was "quickly" "blurred", and its main persons involved were shot. The threads leading to the Ukraine, where the "entot Stalinist" was the first secretary, were not untangled. Meshik, the head of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Ukraine, was one of the first to be liquidated during a coup d'etat in June 53rd. clearly had materials for "Nikitka". But, materials of this level could be claimed and used only from the very top.
      1. Koshnitsa
        Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 21: 25
        -3
        Quote: stalkerwalker
        I, you know, prefer the genre of fiction. Give a link to the books she wrote.

        I quote her speech in 5.06 Intelligence. 2017. On 7.35.
        "In fact, Siberia is not such a large territory at all." Or, like in books, she writes "the truth about the sluggish SRCC" in paper form, but on TV she carries any incoherent nonsense, the little one is a hundred-a-arenka, she messed up the mustache.
        Quote: stalkerwalker
        Khrushchev was from the "blood washed" breed.

        So he was all like that, they all had blood to the ears, I don’t see any options to distinguish one party functionary of that era from the rest. As a pop, this is the parish.
        Faithful Stalinists Molotov and Malenkov are active participants in the massacre of faithful Stalinist Beria, and so on.
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 23 August 2018 21: 31
          +5
          Quote: Koshnitsa
          I quote her speech in 5.06 Intelligence. 2017. On 7.35.
          "In fact, Siberia is not such a large territory at all"

          This is in what context to consider, especially if from the point of view of a populated territory. I do not defend in this case, but I do not quibble. And I do not question her conclusions.
          Quote: Koshnitsa
          Or like in the books she writes "the truth about the sluggish SRCC" in paper form

          And you read ...
          Quote: Koshnitsa
          So he was all like that

          If "they were all like that", the country would have turned into a continuous "Afghanistan today", and ceased to exist even before the German attack in 41st. And even earlier.
      2. Evgeny Alexeev
        Evgeny Alexeev 27 August 2018 23: 56
        0
        Vali kul, then we’ll take it apart. Let's dump everything on Khrushchev, maybe no one will guess who destroyed everyone else. Khrushchev is to blame no more and no less than the rest of the middle managers. From the 32nd year, everything in the country was led by Stalin. And the robbery of the peasantry and the destruction of innocent people.
  47. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 21: 00
    -2
    Quote: HanTengri
    In Poland and Romania too?

    In Poland and Romania, millions of people died, as in the USSR? Sources, plz. About real mass mortality in 1932-33 in these countries.
    Quote: HanTengri
    Have you had any experience with Goblin?

    I look like crazy to communicate with this? That's it ...
  48. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 21: 43
    -3
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    And I do not question her conclusions.

    The fact that the tsarist authorities could not resettle a million people in Siberia? There alone Cossacks lived in the Asian part more than a million by 1917. The old grandmother, mustache beguiled ....
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    And I do not question her conclusions.
    The fact that Siberia is a small territory along the Transib? And the rest of the permafrost and taiga? There is a geography textbook, his grandmother smoked it visible.
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    And you read ...
    I am not a hunter of nonsense (C). Decent people do not read this themselves and do not recommend to others. You better yourself read the provincial and regional reviews for 1913 on the Trans-Ural provinces. It will be much more informative than the “discoveries of great geographical and historical” writers from the large circulation.
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    If "they were all like that", the country would have turned into a continuous "Afghanistan today", and ceased to exist even before the German attack in 41st. And even earlier.

    As before Dzhugashvili did not turn for more than a thousand years and did not cease to exist. And here the star shines on you! hi
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker 23 August 2018 22: 00
      +4
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      As before Dzhugashvili did not turn for more than a thousand years and did not cease to exist. And here the star shines on you!

      Oppa-on !!!
      And in February 1917, it means that the country was fragrant and prosperous? Or lie about the February Revolution? Dzhugashvili came with a team, and plunged the country into the abyss of trials? Interestingly, and the turmoil of the beginning of the XVIIth century is also the business of the Stalinists?
      fool
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      I'm not a nonsense hunter

      I ASK AGAIN
      Quote: stalkerwalker
      It seems to me that you have your own work and research on this topic. Do not make public?


      Quote: Koshnitsa
      The fact that Siberia is a small territory along the Transib? And the rest of the permafrost and taiga? There is a geography textbook, his grandmother smoked it visible.

      The right thing ..... No love E. Prudnikova - give sources of authority. Do not be shy....
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 24 August 2018 04: 51
        +2
        Another thing is interesting ----- a young man by age, re-read so much, reviewed, wake up at night, cite intelligence, instantly, with a blockade, allegedly talked ...... inconsistency and strange portraiture. Such a difference, between those who a year ago and now.
  49. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 22: 18
    -2
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    And in February 1917, it means that the country was fragrant and prosperous?

    The army held the front with minimal losses, preparing for the Great Offensive in May-June. And then the coup and the seizure of power by criminal structures.
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    Dzhugashvili came with a team, and plunged the country into the abyss of trials?
    It has become even worse than it was before his sole reign. These are the same realities.
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    I ASK AGAIN

    For the period 1906-1914. 3040333 people moved to Siberia, and the grandmother says that even a million did not move.
    P. A. Stolypin: agrarian reform and Siberia
    M. A. ROGACHEVSKAYA,
    Candidate of Economic Sciences, Associate Professor.
    A scientist with a serious name, not a grandmother with a swollen face.
    Quote: stalkerwalker
    No love E. Prudnikova - give sources of authority. Do not be shy....
    Umanets F. M. “Colonization of the free lands of Russia”, St. Petersburg 1884, read Dedlov-King, it cleans the brain very much.
    1. Koshnitsa
      Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 22: 20
      -1
      Thanks to this, the masses of the most active layer of the peasantry stretched to the eastern territories. Under the peasant resettlement were given and cabinet (own royal) lands of Altai - five times Belgium. Also, the soldiers who crossed Siberia back from the Japanese war moved this peasant interest. Already in 1906, 130 thousand moved, and then a year for half a million or more. (By the war of 1914 - more than 4 million, - as much as in 300 years from Yermak). Migrants received land for free and for ownership, rather than for use — 50 acres per family, so millions of acres were distributed further, and 60 pounds of bread were removed from each, not 40, as in Central Russia before Stolypin’s land reform. For the settlers they irrigated the Hungry Steppe, dug public channels.

      If you summarize the migration for 20 years - from the beginning of the reign of Nicholas II (1893) to the outbreak of the First World War - and include the natural human increase in newly developed lands, it turns out that the number of inhabitants of Asian Russia has increased from 12 to 21,5 million. Nothing of the kind was achieved in the communist era - neither under Stalin, nor under Khrushchev with his fanfare “development of virgin lands”.
      1. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 24 August 2018 22: 03
        +4
        Quote: Koshnitsa
        Migrants received land for free and in ownership, and not in use

        Do not star. Received by right of use, not ownership. Study your own Talmud.
        Quote: Koshnitsa
        P. A. Stolypin: agrarian reform and Siberia
        M. A. ROGACHEVSKAYA,
    2. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker 23 August 2018 22: 26
      +3
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      The army held the front with minimal losses, preparing for the Great Offensive in May-June. And then the coup and the seizure of power by criminal structures.

      I'm already pretty clear your vision situation in Russia in 1917 ... laughing
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      Quote: stalkerwalker
      Dzhugashvili came with a team, and plunged the country into the abyss of trials? It has become even worse than it was before his sole reign. These are the same realities.

      That's bullshit..... lol
      Quote: Koshnitsa
      Umanets F. M. “Colonization of the free lands of Russia”, St. Petersburg 1884, read Dedlov-King, it cleans the brain very much.

      So these are your primary sources about the situation in Russia from 1917 to 1953?
      Doctors, in such cases, are simply powerless .....
      love
      1. Imobile
        Imobile 24 August 2018 20: 22
        -2
        Cleverly vaz smeared Koshnitsa (Sergey). That's because he reads smart books, and you throw rumors on a fan.
  50. Koshnitsa
    Koshnitsa 23 August 2018 22: 25
    -3
    Quote: Koshnitsa
    (own royal) lands of Altai - five times Belgium.

    For information, those who smoke geographic textbooks, Altai, which is five times Belgium is not near Transib.