Military Review

Norwegian vessel with mini submarine joins the search for the submarine San Juan

63
The Norwegian ship Sophie Siem with the American mini-submarine on board will go in search of the San Juan submarine on 17: 00 GMT (20.00 Moscow time), reported RIA News Marcelo Gauto, Head of Security at the Port of Comodoro-Rivadavia in Argentina




It is planned that (ship) will be released in 17.00 GMT,
said Gauto.

According to him, initially the ship’s exit from Comodoro-Rivadavia to the search area “was scheduled for Saturday evening, but was postponed due to strong winds, the speed of which reached 50 kilometers per hour in the port area”.

It is noted that the on-board mini-submarine is able to save submariners if the San Juan is detected at a depth of up to 650 meters. At one time, a mini boat can lift an 16 person.

Recall the Argentine diesel-electric submarines stopped contacting 15 in November on the transition from the naval base of Ushuaia to Mar del Plata. On board are the 44 man. Previously, experts have recorded a single explosion, which may be associated with the disappearance of the submarine.
Photos used:
http://www.globallookpress.com
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  1. 210ox
    210ox 26 November 2017 18: 07
    +8
    I am sorry for the families and families of the deceased sailors. It is necessary to find a submarine. At least for their sake. Yes and the reason you need to know. To avoid such tragedies ..
    1. Muvka
      Muvka 26 November 2017 18: 23
      +5
      I have only one question, why it was impossible to immediately throw all the forces in search? It is unlikely that there are any secret technologies in that boat. But there would be a chance to save the crew ...
      1. Jedi
        Jedi 26 November 2017 18: 29
        +8
        I already wrote today: is there an attempt to conceal the true causes of death?
        1. pvv113
          pvv113 26 November 2017 18: 49
          +6
          Max, I, too, had once been interested in the great desire of the United States to get ahead of everyone in assisting in the search for a submarine.
          1. Jedi
            Jedi 26 November 2017 18: 54
            +7
            Here I am about the same: these merchants just do nothing. There is some interest in this topic ...
            1. pvv113
              pvv113 26 November 2017 18: 58
              +2
              Quote: Jedi
              There is some interest in this topic ...

              And obviously not for wide publicity
              1. Jedi
                Jedi 26 November 2017 19: 02
                +4
                That's right, Volodya. "Tails" want to clean up, do you think?
                1. pvv113
                  pvv113 26 November 2017 19: 07
                  +3
                  Yes, I agree with you.
                  And then I remembered the saying that a criminal is always drawn to the crime scene
                  1. Jedi
                    Jedi 26 November 2017 19: 10
                    +5
                    Quote: pvv113
                    the criminal always pulls at the crime scene

                    Yes, that is right. It is possible that because of this the USA wants to be the first to catch it ...
                    1. Svarog51
                      Svarog51 27 November 2017 04: 05
                      +5
                      Max hi Interestingly, and who are the "unidentified" faces in the crew? Isn't it all about them? Of the 7 "passengers" - one naval intelligence officer and two naval special forces. And who are the other four? Have they been transported or escorted? And here two assumptions arise: 1. Something happened on board the boat and led to the tragedy. 2. Someone very high-ranking is not very interested in the arrival of these unidentified persons at their destination, moreover, the possibilities of this high-ranking official are very wide and he "organized" a tragedy from outside. In addition, some important cargo or information could exist. It seems to me that much more strange will happen around the death of the submarine. IMHO.
                      1. Jedi
                        Jedi 27 November 2017 08: 32
                        +3
                        Both versions proposed by you are quite probable. To the second, I can add that this "someone high-ranking" could be closely related to the United States and its interests.
                        Quote: Svarog51
                        It seems to me that much more strange will happen around the death of the submarine.

                        The same opinion.
          2. jjj
            jjj 26 November 2017 18: 54
            +2
            "Haliberton" to connect there ...
      2. donavi49
        donavi49 26 November 2017 19: 21
        +5
        Not. Work teleports have not yet been created. Even if in the first hours of emergency - the ships began to prepare for the exit. In that remote area - they will reach after weeks.

        The search is likely to take months, if not years. There it is necessary to scan the bottom on the 700x200 km section. Calculate what kind of work it is and how long it will take.
    2. Primoos
      Primoos 26 November 2017 19: 26
      +1
      Condolences to family and friends. They are no longer looking for a submarine, but the mass grave of sailors, unfortunately.
    3. Maz
      Maz 26 November 2017 20: 31
      0
      Well, Norway always find boats. These will find. And from where did our people fly there? Train or what?
      1. water
        water 26 November 2017 23: 02
        +2
        Quote: Maz
        Well, Norway always find boats. These will find. And from where did our people fly there? Train or what?

        Ours just flew in order to find and examine the sunken boat. It’s already more than late to talk about saving the crew.
        Yes, and you need to train too.
  2. san4es
    san4es 26 November 2017 18: 18
    +6
    SOPHIE SIEM is an oil platform support vessel under the flag of Norway. SOPHIE SIEM
    length 74m and width 16m. Gross tonnage 2465 tons soldier
    1. Going
      Going 26 November 2017 18: 24
      11
      Good evening, Alexander! hi that the USA as actively wants to be the first to find, raises a lot of questions.
      1. Monarchist
        Monarchist 26 November 2017 18: 39
        +3
        To the marching one, there is just nothing surprising in this: Americans are talking all over the world that they are the main support of the "poor and wretched" and that there is a reason for PR, and in our opinion ** shrink ..
        In addition, the Argentine Armed Forces were created by whom? -USA and if they get to whom they will go for a consultation?
        1. Going
          Going 26 November 2017 20: 59
          +6
          Yes, the United States does not care about Aboriginal people, the question is - why do they need this boat, why are they pulling up such forces? what interests them so much?
      2. donavi49
        donavi49 26 November 2017 19: 22
        +4
        Not. They just have forces closer to the operational area. 13 countries work there. In any case, look for a very long time (months) - if there is no happy luck (accidentally stumble).
        1. water
          water 26 November 2017 23: 15
          +2
          I’m probably becoming a cynic, but it seems that later it will be established that those four, out of seven people who were not part of the state, who left this boat at sea (in total, seven went with the crew, two of them were combat swimmers, one was an intelligence officer. Four others have not yet been announced about professional affiliation) will be members of the crew, so an action was called up to advertise American means of rescue the crews of sunken submarines. However, the production trick turned into a real tragedy. But modern American means are not able to cope with the actual assistance to the crew of the submarine.
          1. Svarog51
            Svarog51 27 November 2017 04: 25
            +5
            Vladimir hi There is one major omission in your version. If it was planned to remove the rescue of the boat, it would be "grazed" both from the surface and under water, and would not have been allowed to go into "free flight" for a real search. I voiced a slightly different version of events a little higher. I would like to hear your opinion.
            1. Veteran
              Veteran 27 November 2017 14: 03
              +5
              Sergei hi Sorry to interfere, but in the absence of torpedoes on this submarine (as announced by the Argentine Navy command), only AB could explode. In addition, there have been publications on the dark history of the repair of San Juan, a corrupt deal with German companies supplying boat batteries. Instead of new ones, they used used batteries. And the old accs have a high probability of “sticking” of the ventilation valves, which can lead to the formation and concentration of a gas-air mixture with a hydrogen content of more than 4%, i.e. explosive mixture. It will explode, then a volumetric fire, depressurization of the compartments. The boat is only 3-x-cut-off, single hull, with a small margin of buoyancy. The flooding of even one compartment will immediately fail it to a depth to the bottom, and if sea water still enters the battery, then it will etch all still alive with chlorine.
              1. Svarog51
                Svarog51 27 November 2017 14: 39
                +5
                Yuri Alekseevich, hello hi I read information about used batteries and I do not deny that a catastrophe could have happened for this very reason. But I am very confused by the presence on board of the submarine of "unidentified" persons. How can this happen that the command does not know who is present on board except for the full-time crew? Well, it was not the boat commander who decided to "toss" the familiar officers without notifying his command. Secret operation? I admit, but then it’s just the delivery of those same “passengers”, because the boat did not have torpedoes on board and was not sent to the training ground, but purposefully moved from one base to another. In any case, at least we learn something only after its discovery and inspection, and even then it is not a fact that they will tell the truth. Surely all the attracted foreign forces and means have a non-disclosure agreement, and all the information will be only from the Argentines. But whether they want to voice the true cause of death is a big question.
                1. Veteran
                  Veteran 27 November 2017 15: 02
                  +5
                  Hello, Seryozha. hi The command knows who it "hooked" on the boat, but it is unlikely that it will fully admit its "specification", at least now, perhaps, it will do it later, after raising the boat (as in the case of the North Korean boat in 1996 d. - after the completion of the incident). Perhaps it was the commandos who decided to "nibble" and familiarize themselves with the conditions of work on the submarines, plus their mentors. And the boat yes, it made the usual interbase transition after more than 6-year repair to its home base - Mar del Plata.
                  If a boat is found, then the cause of death will be established, and this will not be a secret, because foreigners will raise it, and the Argentinean public will require disclosure. The question is whether Argentina has enough finances to pay for expensive underwater work, because now they have a very difficult financial and economic situation.
                  1. Svarog51
                    Svarog51 27 November 2017 15: 31
                    +5
                    Yuri Alekseevich hi Yes, perhaps you are right. They will most likely find the boat, the whole question is how long they will search. Examine and find out the reason. That's just who will conduct this examination. But at the expense of the rise, I personally doubt very much. It will happen as with the North Korean boat - there will be nothing to pay for the rise and it will be left at the bottom, supposedly so as not to disturb the peace of the dead sailors. If I am mistaken, then I am only in favor, one sea secret will become less.
                    1. Veteran
                      Veteran 27 November 2017 15: 49
                      +5
                      Yes, Seryozha, they can search for a long time, unless chance helps. After all, approx. 140 thousand sq. km, and here it is necessary to methodically "crawl" echo sounders along the bottom and examine it with underwater vehicles.
                      1. Svarog51
                        Svarog51 28 November 2017 02: 32
                        +5
                        Yuri Alekseevich hi And you do not know, the Americans used their boat for special operations? Like "Sea Wolf" called.
            2. water
              water 27 November 2017 19: 21
              +2
              Quote: Svarog51
              Vladimir In your version there is one significant omission. If it was planned to remove the rescue of the boat, it would be "grazed" both from the surface and under water, and would not have been allowed to go into "free flight" for a real search. I voiced a slightly different version of events a little higher. I would like to hear your opinion.

              In the process of collecting and analyzing information on this boat, so much sad and sad comes up that involuntarily the 2000 year is remembered.
              The boat has an expired battery. So the gratings in the elements crumbled and it does not hold the capacity.
              The boat left the base in fine weather. At the transition I got into a storm. Submerged, went underwater. But not for long. The battery was completely discharged and an arbitrary pole change on the elements began. Tires between the elements began to warm up, smoke began to flow. I had to surface in a storm, start a diesel engine and ventilate the compartments through the engine compartment.
              What is in a storm, in the surface position for a submarine with a displacement of 3900 tons, I know - a very extreme event. And for a boat in 2000 tons, and even on the ocean wave - this is an order of magnitude more extreme.
              The screw on the wave began to emerge from the water, the automatics on the generator began to knock out, the diesel engine began to stall.
              In such conditions, it is likely that the boat was simply flooded with water through the hatches. But they could not pump out the equalization due to the lack of electricity.
              Something like this.
              1. Svarog51
                Svarog51 27 November 2017 19: 39
                +5
                Vladimir hi Thank you very much. The situation is like with boats during the First and Second War. Technical progress did not reach this boat. But I still will not exclude an extraneous factor until the receipt of plausible information. Do you think our rescuers will be allowed to work after the boat is discovered?
                1. water
                  water 27 November 2017 21: 58
                  +2
                  There is now the American "DUPA" - a complex that includes a remotely controlled rescue bell, two pressure chambers for decompression of the rescued, two sets of hard suits "HS-2000" (2000 feet, that is, 600 meters).
                  According to the representative of the Argentinean fleet - as soon as the boat is discovered, DUPA will immediately begin to rescue the submariners. This can be interpreted in two ways: either the native does not understand that there is already no one to save, or no one is looking for a boat, and she is waiting for the appointed time to lie on the ground on a convenient beach and surrender to DUPE. That is, we are talking here about advertising this very “DUPA”, with the aim of selling it to the fleets of states with submarine forces. In this case, ours will be attracted only as spectators.
                  However, all these are assumptions. What is actually time will tell. Moreover, our hydrograph has not yet arrived there.
                  1. Svarog51
                    Svarog51 28 November 2017 02: 38
                    +5
                    Vladimir, my respect hi But if all this is a staging, then what about the timing? Or will they say that the whole connection "flew"?
  3. Going
    Going 26 November 2017 18: 22
    +9
    It is noted that the on-board mini-submarine is able to save submariners if the San Juan is detected at a depth of up to 650 meters. At one time, a mini boat can lift an 16 person.


    I want to believe in a miracle, but from the 15th ...
  4. polpot
    polpot 26 November 2017 18: 23
    +8
    For that, all Russia was taught to live in 2000; now we’ll take a look at them
  5. Eurodav
    Eurodav 26 November 2017 18: 26
    +3
    Quote: polpot
    For that, all Russia was taught to live in 2000; now we’ll take a look at them

    I agree!!! They are lovers to learn, but to show an example by themselves ...
  6. Sagebrush
    Sagebrush 26 November 2017 18: 37
    +5
    and I immediately, hearing about the submarine, thought about the lost sea mine of the times of the war for the islands
    probably there were

    During the war, about a million mines of various designs and capacities were released into the North and Baltic Seas. Three hundred and fifty thousand of them were caught, the rest are still swimming. During the day we go exactly along the cleared "road", and at night mistakes are possible. Togo and look run up. Then one "Dane" was blown up - they did not save anyone. (with)
    1. VALERIK_097
      VALERIK_097 26 November 2017 19: 13
      0
      Justify those?
      1. Sagebrush
        Sagebrush 26 November 2017 19: 24
        +4
        what did I think about mine?
        so this is the first thought just an assumption
        one acquaintance told how in the 70s they nearly flew a mine in the Pacific Ocean on a fishing trawler

        recently reported on the news - in the area of ​​the loss of boats heard the explosion
        1. Usher
          Usher 27 November 2017 00: 24
          0
          Where is Argentina, where is the Baltic?
          1. Svarog51
            Svarog51 27 November 2017 19: 51
            +5
            The Baltic was mined in the first and second all who had a fleet. Argentina - she had her own war for the Falklands with England. And why can't mines stay there? And much more modern and dangerous. Can you guarantee that there were no minefields in that area? Even the events of World War II cannot be ruled out. Remember the battle of La Plata, they could then set up a mine can.
  7. The comment was deleted.
  8. APASUS
    APASUS 26 November 2017 18: 40
    +4
    I wonder why the beacon has not separated from the submarine, or do they have no such systems? But the participation of Americans raises many questions, why did the US suddenly become interested in some kind of trough from Argentina.
    Honor and respect to all seamen who died at the post
    1. Sagebrush
      Sagebrush 26 November 2017 18: 43
      +6
      Quote: APASUS
      why is it that the United States was interested in some kind of trough from Argentina.


      to show themselves as saviors, as in their films :-)
      and practice in real conditions
      1. APASUS
        APASUS 26 November 2017 18: 59
        +1
        Quote: Wormwood
        show themselves as saviors, as in their films:

        Well, you got excited with the rescuers. A country that hammering through cities with phosphorus charges cannot be a priori rescuer!
        And Hollywood products are watched by degenerates, perverts and foreigners!
        Great words of Zadornov
        Quote: Wormwood
        practice in real conditions

        The United States Navy has no funding problems for training, the bottom line is that they are interested in this particular boat.
        1. Sagebrush
          Sagebrush 26 November 2017 19: 08
          +4
          Quote: APASUS
          And Hollywood products are watched by degenerates, perverts and foreigners!


          oh well, in most countries, if not all, watch Hollywood movies
          here the main thing is to watch because the choice is great

          as Lenin said there - "Of all the arts, cinema is the most important for us"
          so they propagandize themselves

          Quote: APASUS
          Do not have funding problems for training.


          That's it, why not practice in real conditions, and not training
    2. donavi49
      donavi49 26 November 2017 19: 24
      +2
      The Argentine Navy is in poor condition due to lack of funding. Damage there is the norm. An exit with admission forms - for specific breakdowns, is also the norm. And then - the accident could unfold so that the buoy did not work.
    3. AID.S
      AID.S 26 November 2017 23: 54
      +2
      Quote: APASUS
      But the participation of Americans raises many questions, why did the US suddenly become interested in some kind of trough from Argentina.

      I believe that it is unworthy to doubt the sincerity of the help of all the countries that have offered it, regardless of our attitude to them. In addition, penguins probably have more opportunities and means than ours.
  9. Fedorov
    Fedorov 26 November 2017 18: 43
    +2
    Yes, how much can you grind this topic? “The Moreman died.” sad
    My grandfather’s ate was saved, the boat in the nets got confused. Which ship came to the rescue - I will write later. Not in vain, I think I earned 2 orders of the Red Star and the Red Banner.
    Here it would be necessary to write an article, but here all the talents are not enough.
  10. Herculesic
    Herculesic 26 November 2017 18: 51
    +2
    This is no longer a salvation, but a purely search operation, alas! soldier
  11. ivanovbg
    ivanovbg 26 November 2017 22: 41
    0
    And here is the real cause of the accident:

    the investigation revealed that representatives of the Argentine Navy could not follow regulatory standards when repairing a submarine and replacing batteries, and that buying batteries could be in the interests of certain suppliers. The information gathered at least allows us to say that the contracts concluded not only do not comply with the administrative procedure, but also that the military personnel responsible for the contracts probably committed illegal actions that were in the interests of the Hawker Gmbh and Ferrostaal AG companies that received the order. " cites the publication of an excerpt from the ministry documents. The results of this investigation coincide with the data of the Office of the General Controller of Argentina, which confirms the violations. Nia found that due to the delay in the purchase process, batteries with an expired warranty period were purchased.
    1. water
      water 26 November 2017 23: 21
      +2
      So drown the boat and the "ends" in the water !? - How is it in bourgeois!
      1. Svarog51
        Svarog51 29 November 2017 02: 14
        +5
        Vladimir, I welcome you hi A sharp need arose in your expert assessment.
        That's why the Argentines allocated such small ships to our specialists, divers and under the Panther - I’m at a loss. Well, 1800 t corvette, but the second carrier is the stotonik patrol boat, how will they work with it in a storm? It would be necessary to ask Vladimir - “Vodyaniy” his opinion on this matter. But I do not watch it on the site.

        If you have some free time, we will be glad to listen. soldier
        1. water
          water 29 November 2017 18: 45
          +2
          Quote: Svarog51
          Vladimir, I welcome you hi A sharp need arose in your expert assessment.
          That's why the Argentines allocated such small ships to our specialists, divers and under the Panther - I’m at a loss. Well, 1800 t corvette, but the second carrier is the stotonik patrol boat, how will they work with it in a storm? It would be necessary to ask Vladimir - “Vodyaniy” his opinion on this matter. But I do not watch it on the site.

          If you have some free time, we will be glad to listen. soldier

          I apologize for having involuntarily made me wait.
          Essentially: Now, and before the Yantar military approach, ours are busy identifying the “contacts” of the search vessels discovered (in our opinion, the search team for sunken objects). The group was divided into two parts: one with the Panther + on the corvette, the second with the Falcon on the patrol boat. Work is being carried out taking into account security measures, with a wave of not more than 3 points. Sleeping places and hot meals are provided.
          At the same time, the personnel of the 328 EASO SN Navy has enough naval practice to, if necessary, secure the ship on which it is located from navigational and other incidents. - This is what is known.
          Further assumptions: The area was surveyed by various ships and vessels. The arsenals of PLO and OVR ships in Argentina are equipped with g / a stations for the search for bottom and anchor mines in their parameters inferior even to our ancient MG-89. Armed with fishermen ordinary fishing stations. Because of this kind of "motley" search technique, the contact "field" obtained as a result of combing the search area is not susceptible to probabilistic analysis. That is, there is no way to isolate from the mass of contacts those that, by their characteristics, are most similar to contact with a submarine. For this, the guys have to examine - get a visual picture from each contact. And this is a very long time. When g / s comes, work will accelerate.
          About this way.
          1. Veteran
            Veteran 29 November 2017 20: 05
            +5
            Thank you, Vladimir. That's just the situation when a storm is unclear. On the eve of this corvette for several hours could not enter the port due to the storm, which, as I understand it, arises there quite quickly. In addition, in the Bay of San Jorge, as they say, the largest tide in the world, with a difference of levels up to 12 m. How will the boat spin under such circumstances ...
          2. Svarog51
            Svarog51 30 November 2017 00: 19
            +6
            Vladimir, hi I join in the words of gratitude for the explanatory explanation. good
          3. Veteran
            Veteran 1 December 2017 14: 16
            +5
            Hello Vladimir! hi Well, finally, it was clarified with the second Panther carrier. The journalists mixed up, they gave out "Islas Malvinas" as a patrol boat, which really was in Argentina, but was captured by the British during the war, and eventually decommissioned. Then the same name in the Navy received the polar multipurpose tug purchased from us in 2015, b. Neftegaz-57, with a displacement of 2730 tons, now it has been identified in the carrier. This is already clear.
  12. Veteran
    Veteran 28 November 2017 20: 37
    +5
    Svarog51Hello Sergey! hi Tasks for the implementation of special operations can be performed by full-time US submarines of the Virginia type, they are now in the ranks of 15 units, they are equipped accordingly for this. "Sivulf" - not adapted, this boat is a "hunter" and shock. It does not make sense to send some “Virginia” to the search area to the US, why do they need a “dead” Argentine DEPL? And they can also interfere with the search, substitute for detection.
    That's why the Argentines allocated such small ships to our specialists, divers and under the Panther - I’m at a loss. Well, 1800 t corvette, but the second carrier is the stotonik patrol boat, how will they work with it in a storm? It would be necessary to ask Vladimir - “Vodyaniy” his opinion on this matter. what But I do not watch it on the site.
    1. Svarog51
      Svarog51 29 November 2017 02: 28
      +5
      Yuri Alekseevich hi Well, apparently, they didn’t find anything else. Our rescuers - the people are not picky what they gave - on that we will carry out the task. Maybe the storm has subsided, how much time has passed? I posted your question to Vladimir a little higher under his comment, he should receive a notification about this. You can write in a personal, then he will also receive a notification by e-mail, but I think - we will wait. I'm interested too. And about the staff boat, I probably did not name it correctly. Some kind of boat they have been equipped for special operations with a hump minisubmarine and the ability to work for divers and marine special forces without surfacing. Or am I confusing something again?
      1. water
        water 29 November 2017 19: 19
        +1
        Argentines have identified roughly what is needed in this case. For "Panther +" - a corvette, for "Folkon" - a boat. Work is carried out only with a wave of up to 3 points. Presumably, places of shelter in case of bad weather are assigned. In fact, the search area, though stretched, is all within an hour in full swing from the coast.
        1. Svarog51
          Svarog51 30 November 2017 00: 24
          +5
          Vladimir, hi And why do not you change the color of the epaulettes on the site? After all, everything is quite simple - click on your nickname, in the pop-up window at the bottom left, the "View Profile" key. Go to your profile, left click on the major epaulet and select a captain of rank 3. With marine epaulets and an avatar it looks clearer. good
          1. water
            water 1 December 2017 18: 16
            +1
            Thanks for the advice!
            To go nuts! I am already a whole captain of 3 rank! I’ll go, I’ll pour 100 grams!
            1. Svarog51
              Svarog51 1 December 2017 19: 06
              +5
              Vladimir hi Write more comments, you have to slam and 300. good drinks
      2. Veteran
        Veteran 29 November 2017 21: 23
        +5
        Seryozha wrote off the specialized boats for special operations and went by equipping serial boats (Los Angeles, Virginia and 4 types converted for Ohio - mod. Ohio) for installation and technological docking of removable containers - modules of two types: 1) DDS (dock camera) with VI approx. 30 t, with three airtight compartments designed for operation up to 40 m, with the ability to hold one vehicle or 20 combat swimmers with 4 rubber boats, and 2) DSRV - a deep-sea rescue vehicle. The operation of installing the module itself takes 12 hours, with preparatory work - from one to three days. Then, on the boat, such a notorious “hump” appears, however, it does not reduce the properties of the nuclear submarines (except for maximum speed). On mod. "Ohio" can be installed two modules, all the rest - one. In addition, on Virginia and these Ohio, the gateway devices provided for the installation of ASDS mini-submarines (60 t, to a depth of approx. 50 m). Such a mini-submarine (on top of the deck behind the wheelhouse) was first installed in test mode for the latest Sivulf - Jimmy Carter, so you probably remember it. But the ASDS was built in a single copy, it burned down in 2008, and even earlier the Americans abandoned the further construction of these mini-submarines. hi