Military Review

At the Pella plant, new generation IRAs were laid

188
In the Leningrad region at the plant "Pella" laid a small rocket ship of the new generation "Squall", reports RIA News.


At the Pella plant, new generation IRAs were laid


At the groundbreaking ceremony, Deputy Minister of Defense Yury Borisov said:
“This is purely our Russian invention. There are practically no ships in the world with such a displacement with such weapons. He has eight Caliber missile systems, which, as you know, performed well in the Syrian operation. Very soon, he will receive a new anti-aircraft missile system, and the Pantsir will be adapted from us. ”


According to him, "this is a very formidable weaponwhich will not allow any enemy over long distances. ”

In December last year, two IRCs of the 22800 project, “Hurricane” and “Typhoon”, were laid at the plant.

Help Agency: “Designed by the Almaz Central Marine Design Bureau, the 22800 project's MRCs will have a displacement of about 800 tons, speed — over 30 nodes. The ships will be equipped with a complex of high-precision rocket weapons and modern artillery complexes. Among the advantages of these ships are high maneuverability, increased seaworthiness, as well as the architecture of superstructures and hulls, made according to technologies of low reflectivity. The ships will be able to perform tasks in the offshore zone at a distance from the bases around 3000 miles. ”
Photos used:
NW "Pella"
188 comments
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  1. Alex_Rarog
    Alex_Rarog 30 July 2016 08: 53
    +42
    An interesting project! Especially 8 calibers and shell on such a small ship! The Caspian Sea and the Black Sea I think for them as a home!
    Although everyone wants exactly ships of the first and second rank!
    1. Kudrevkn
      Kudrevkn 30 July 2016 08: 57
      +30
      Skerries of the Baltic also fit!
      1. Khariton
        Khariton 30 July 2016 09: 04
        +7
        We are building on all fronts ... Futuristic boat,! Will be able to avenge, if that .. hi
        1. gg.na
          gg.na 30 July 2016 14: 20
          +7
          Quote: Chariton
          Will be able to avenge, if that ..

          And not just revenge, he will not let anyone close at all !!! Class boat good !!! For such a drink drinks not a sin !!!
        2. tilovaykrisa
          tilovaykrisa 31 July 2016 09: 04
          +2
          Fuck in the caliber warheads with Yao to embed a kiloton so 5-10 would be a real beast.
          1. silver_roman
            silver_roman 1 August 2016 15: 04
            0
            Quote: tilovaykrisa
            Fuck in the caliber warheads with Yao to embed a kiloton so 5-10 would be a real beast.

            I think this is not a problem at all. "axes" were like with YABCh. It is lighter than conventional HE, and therefore the range is higher. Nobody will advertise, but if necessary, they will deliver.
            For example, I heard that the 1164 "Moscow" is floating with a nuclear warhead. On the performance characteristics, everything is clear, but in fact? request
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. denker1945
        denker1945 30 July 2016 09: 18
        -5
        Do you know what the Baltic Miracle is famous for? -That the Baltic Fleet was locked in ports every war !!! And the ships acted there only as stationary firing points. That the first world war, that after the revolution, the second world war was also locked
        1. 33 Watcher
          33 Watcher 30 July 2016 09: 29
          +23
          Quote: denker1945
          Do you know what the Baltic Miracle is famous for? -That the Baltic Fleet was locked in ports every war !!! And the ships acted there only as stationary firing points. That the first world war, that after the revolution, the second world war was also locked

          Well, compare the range of the ship art and the "Caliber NK" cruise missile. Well, to expand your horizons.
        2. i80186
          i80186 30 July 2016 09: 37
          +22
          Quote: denker1945
          Do you know what the Baltic Miracle is famous for? -That the Baltic Fleet was locked in ports every war !!! And the ships acted there only as stationary firing points. That the first world war, that after the revolution, the second world war was also locked

          But have you heard about the treaty "On the elimination of the INF Treaty?" Well, we cannot place cruise missiles on the ground. Here are the carriers. smile
          1. Talgat
            Talgat 30 July 2016 19: 39
            +15
            Quote: i80186
            we cannot place cruise missiles on the ground. Here are the carriers.

            Yes, and I and we all probably agree - this is indeed a very likely explanation for the focus on the construction of low-cost carriers of cruise missiles. If Russia is ok on ICBMs, then with medium-range missiles there are limitations on the agreement

            But the threats from neighbors - primarily NATO, are only growing. Placement of calibers on small vessels in the waters of Cherny. The Caspian and Baltic seas (+ and on the rivers of the western part of Russia) is a good sobering factor for potential aggressors
            1. ver_
              ver_ 31 July 2016 16: 27
              +1
              ... you might think that someone after Sabantuy, if he begins, will be able to show us what to do .. for this reason ..
    2. donavi49
      donavi49 30 July 2016 09: 08
      +42
      While 2 AK-630M are installed. Given the history of the Mi-28N / NM - where it was also proposed retrofitting (the board has architecture exits), and the MO ordered the Vanguard-3 with radar, avionics, no attack and dual control, canceling the retrofit program. Here and there it will soon be similar, the first ships 6 (taking into account the pace, and another shipyard will be connected soon) - will be with the AK-630, and the shell with 7 will go Shell.

      By the way, Pella confirms the title of shipbuilder drummer. Here is the leading RTOs grown before our eyes. It was laid in December 2015.
      1. proud
        proud 30 July 2016 22: 15
        +1
        Oh, if everyone worked like that!
        1. silver_roman
          silver_roman 1 August 2016 15: 07
          0
          for half a year the building is not fully completed. And it’s much more difficult to put the stuffing.
          By the way, the Americans at the peak of the release of the eagles of the burks released them 3 a year. Yet the pace is frantic.
    3. Phantom Revolution
      Phantom Revolution 30 July 2016 10: 23
      +32
      Quote: Alex_Rarog
      An interesting project! Especially 8 calibers and shell on such a small ship! The Caspian Sea and the Black Sea I think for them as a home!
      Although everyone wants exactly ships of the first and second rank!

      Bet on a mosquito fleet with calibers, which can at some point replace the warhead with a nuclear special. the ammunition is very interesting. So to say, mini mobile missile systems, at the same time bypassing the agreement on medium-range missiles.

      And what is more profitable? Build 1 ship of the first rank? Or "50" such ships?
      And what is "easier" to sink? Even 20 MKR, I think, are capable of patting the entire AUG grouping of the enemy. And if you need to cover most of Europe.

      We cannot compete with the US Navy over water, and if we take NATO in a compartment, all the more so, our land border is long, it must first be strengthened. And all the money is not enough.
      1. You Vlad
        You Vlad 30 July 2016 10: 49
        +7
        Yes, the very possibility of installing a nuclear warhead can cool many ardent hearts!
        1. Vladimir61
          Vladimir61 30 July 2016 12: 23
          -8
          It is hard to believe that nuclear warheads can "hand over" to small ships, if they do not come up with some kind of control of the center. The story with the "Watchdog" BOD (1975) turned on the fuse for decades to come.
          1. sergeyzzz
            sergeyzzz 30 July 2016 13: 34
            +2
            In peacetime, of course they won’t give it, but in war ...
            1. Vadim237
              Vadim237 30 July 2016 22: 54
              0
              And in the military it will be too late - the enemy’s warheads will be covered.
          2. okroshka79
            okroshka79 30 July 2016 18: 17
            +1
            Control has ALWAYS been up to these times, regardless of the class and displacement of the ships. Including ships of a similar class and displacement.
          3. Vlad.by
            Vlad.by 1 August 2016 17: 52
            0
            Iskander is even smaller, and handed over without restrictions. In the event of a military danger, there will be no time for fear. And the very fact of the possibility of the presence of nuclear weapons on board a dozen of these "babies" will have a sobering effect on any hot head
      2. ava09
        ava09 30 July 2016 12: 17
        +6
        Quote: Phantom Revolution
        And what is more profitable? Build 1 ship of the first rank? Or "50" such ships?

        It depends on what kind of tasks you are building ... With a fork, no matter how much you drink, you don't borscht, then you need a spoon ...)
        1. Navigator Basov
          Navigator Basov 31 July 2016 13: 54
          +4
          So the tasks for which it is all intended are already described in the comments: control of the coastal zone, bypassing the agreement on the liquidation of the INF Treaty. RTOs correspond to these tasks. We have no such tasks for which the United States has about a dozen large aircraft carriers with security. Moreover, when the United States simply withdraws from an uncomfortable treaty, we remain in the legal field and no one will reproach. Regarding how you can effectively puff with a fork or slap a spoon, it is written here:
          https://topwar.ru/23168-shestoy-flot-ssha-ne-smog-prorvatsya-k-poberezhyu-sirii.
          html
          Sometimes, it happens that a spoon cannot replace a fork, pasta so I wouldn’t eat a spoon.
        2. AllXVahhaB
          AllXVahhaB 1 August 2016 07: 17
          0
          Quote: ava09
          With a fork, how many do not puff up, do not chowder borscht - here you need a spoon ...)

          Spoon how many do not puff up borsch on a plate you can’t pour, here you need some cooking)))
      3. spravochnik
        spravochnik 30 July 2016 13: 10
        -3
        I would like to remind you that the range of the Caliber in the anti-ship missile version is only 300 km. So do not flatter yourself. So we build not from a good life, but according to the principle "without fish and cancer is a fish".
        1. dvina71
          dvina71 30 July 2016 16: 28
          +9
          Quote: spravochnik
          I would like to remind you that the range of the Caliber in the anti-ship missile version is only 300 km.

          I want to remind you that Onyx is remarkably placed in the USK of these boats. Range suggest?
          1. spravochnik
            spravochnik 30 July 2016 23: 30
            0
            Quote: dvina71
            Quote: spravochnik
            I would like to remind you that the range of the Caliber in the anti-ship missile version is only 300 km.

            I want to remind you that Onyx is remarkably placed in the USK of these boats. Range suggest?

            Quote: dvina71
            Quote: spravochnik
            I would like to remind you that the range of the Caliber in the anti-ship missile version is only 300 km.

            I want to remind you that Onyx is remarkably placed in the USK of these boats. Range suggest?

            And what to remind, he does not have much more.
        2. oldzek
          oldzek 30 July 2016 23: 14
          +3
          we write 300, but how fast in your mind ah ... he knows
          1. spravochnik
            spravochnik 31 July 2016 00: 37
            -2
            Quote: oldzek
            we write 300, but how fast in your mind ah ... he knows

            With such dimensions as the "Caliber" for the version with a supersonic combat stage (and only this can be used against the AUG), there is no need to count for a long range.
      4. ver_
        ver_ 31 July 2016 16: 21
        0
        ..we have self-propelled barges- how much can this stuff be crammed into and let go-Caspian -Volga-Baltic-
        Caspian-Volga-Black Sea ...
    4. ava09
      ava09 30 July 2016 12: 13
      +5
      Quote: Alex_Rarog
      An interesting project! Especially 8 calibers and shell on such a small ship! The Caspian Sea and the Black Sea I think for them as a home!
      Although everyone wants exactly ships of the first and second rank!

      This is not such a small SHIP, considering that the "caliber" launcher is placed in a 32-foot container, and the "shell" is on a KAMAZ. I agree with the second part of the commentary, we are sorely lacking offensive weapons. In the current situation, we may be able to fight back, but the one who attacks wins. One of the main aggressors overseas, the "caliber" will not reach there, while the other (internal) still lacks collective intelligence ...
    5. Juborg
      Juborg 30 July 2016 12: 35
      -5
      The ship is good, one thing is embarrassing, "Pella", a private enterprise, as at the expense of disruptions and failures, the same "Raptors" delivered something like a huge gap, although the funding went like clockwork.
    6. ver_
      ver_ 31 July 2016 16: 09
      0
      you might think they take up a lot of space ..
  2. denker1945
    denker1945 30 July 2016 08: 54
    -36%
    Soon all the coastal zones will be filled up with small missile boats ... By the way, how many rowers does such a boat take on board? We must go to Africa for rowers, they say, and in ancient times they rowed well. Plus for half a year if you have done 47 caliber then give !! ! -one missile per ship — not half the missile!
    1. Dam
      Dam 30 July 2016 08: 58
      +15
      Aren't you tired? The scheme is the same, you come under a new name, you spit feces, at the end of the day you are drained. Or is this work?
      1. denker1945
        denker1945 30 July 2016 09: 03
        -15%
        Not DAMM-I’m not tired. I’ve already come to read that from each such event, ordinary people do almost a PR action))) and this is just in the realities of the world's oceans, it's just an inflatable boat that essentially can’t do anything sensible as a combat unit - only as part of a group, which we do not have as such
        1. svp67
          svp67 30 July 2016 09: 12
          +19
          Quote: denker1945
          as part of a group, which we do not have as such

          What are you talking about, how did you open your eyes to everyone. What about Crimea? Or Kaliningrad? There is already a strong group in Crimea, which such "gnats" would significantly strengthen, as well as the Kaliningrad group and the Kuril, and indeed the Far East. Moreover, over the past time, "calibers" have been produced significantly more than the figure 47 you indicated. There people work in three shifts.
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 30 July 2016 09: 30
            +33
            Quote: svp67
            Quote: denker1945
            as part of a group, which we do not have as such

            What are you talking about how I opened my eyes to everyone. What about the Crimea? Or Kaliningrad?

            In fact, the "mosquito" fleet is ideal for coastal defense. Including it is much more economical. Well, the vastness of the ocean for a country that has 1/7 of the world's land and located from Norway to Japan can be worried in the second place. Here the railway and autobahns are more important (IMHO)
            1. Tusv
              Tusv 30 July 2016 10: 12
              +3
              Quote: Aaron Zawi
              Generally the "mosquito" fleet is ideal for coastal defense

              Well, that's how to say. Quite recently, a lone boat of almost the same kind was noticed in Mediterranean, obviously "for fishing" came in. Nix in the media raised the ecumenical.
              And so in the Celestial Empire, already a couple of such shores go out in the sea on board twenty of the same type, but noticeable without Caliber
              1. Alex_Tug
                Alex_Tug 30 July 2016 11: 01
                0
                in China there are already twenty of the same type


                What information is not:
                - cruising speed (30 wrong number)
                - range (autonomy duration)
                1. Tusv
                  Tusv 30 July 2016 12: 21
                  0
                  Quote: Alex_Tug
                  What information is not:

                  It is necessary to read authors from and to, but not to squander. There was such info here. A year or two ago hi
            2. Albert1988
              Albert1988 30 July 2016 10: 49
              +12
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              In fact, the "mosquito" fleet is ideal for coastal defense. Including it is much more economical.

              And you can safely transfer these kids from the Black Sea Fleet, let’s say to the Baltic or northern ones - they will pass our rivers and canals with a bang))))
          2. Alex777
            Alex777 30 July 2016 12: 40
            +2
            Moreover, over the past time, there have been produced much more "calibers" than the number 47 you indicated. There people work in three shifts.

            I don't know who you answered, but the data on purchases in the first half of 2016. "... about 50 Gauges" in total.
            To my great regret, this is only a refund spent last year.
            1. Albert1988
              Albert1988 30 July 2016 13: 32
              +8
              Quote: Alex777
              "... about 50 Gauges" in total.
              To my great regret, this is only a refund spent last year.

              What do you think. What is such a top-down info, like the number of purchased KRs that’s just taken and voiced like that? naturally. that it is either speculation or just deliberate misinformation.
              1. Alex777
                Alex777 31 July 2016 01: 09
                +1
                What do you think. What is such a top-down info, like the number of purchased KRs that’s just taken and voiced like that? naturally. that it is either speculation or just deliberate misinformation.

                Why should I think of something here?
                Read for yourself:
                http://vpk.name/news/159526_vmf_rf_poluchil_v_pervom_polugodii_47_raket_kalibr_i
                _72_zenitnyie_upravlyaemyie_raketyi.html

                Who said what he said and where - everything is readily stated.
                1. Albert1988
                  Albert1988 31 July 2016 12: 08
                  +2
                  Quote: Alex777
                  Read for yourself:
                  //vpk.name/news/159526_vmf_rf_poluchil_v_pervom_polugodii_47_raket_kalibr_i
                  _72_zenitnyie_upravlyaemyie_raketyi.html

                  So you think that this is reliable information? What is such a secret Old. how will the amount of ammunition be picked up and announced?
                  So - my father was engaged in the development of military optical systems, in his words - everything, absolutely ALL the figures of any purchases, supplies, etc., which are announced openly - are either taken from the ceiling. or deliberately changed for what? Correctly for the misinformation of the "partners", because the real tsifiri are top-secret information and a long time has been laid for its disclosure, until now.

                  Py.Sy. But to think is always useful, regular engagement in this useful business allows you not to believe in any mischief.
                  1. Alex777
                    Alex777 1 August 2016 12: 59
                    0
                    88 - year of birth? Oh well...
                    This year I was engaged in tank sights at KMP. My friends in Heat Engineering worked and were engaged in a volume explosion in TsAGI. hi
                    I appreciate your pioneer enthusiasm, but it’s too early to give you advice.
        2. dauria
          dauria 30 July 2016 09: 27
          +4
          To me already comes read what of each such event


          grunt -
          to oppose, to turn away from oneself, to cause disgust,

          You know, but your scribble disgusts me .. Not a grammar, no ... If only it made sense. Just a grunt.
          1. todessichel01
            todessichel01 30 July 2016 09: 36
            -2
            Essentially, ensign, essentially.
            Pret, do not read.
            Here are intellectual people in the 10th generation, you cannot understand our sublime logic.
            Parasitize on us, yes, you can, but no more.
            I’m here a candidate for prof. Professor of All Associate Professors and Doctors of Sciences, fighting off greasy hands and swollen brains with fat.
            Learn grammar, orcas, everything is there according to the rules and schemes.
            Left, right, left right, the drum is already full of holes ...
        3. 33 Watcher
          33 Watcher 30 July 2016 09: 36
          +7
          Quote: denker1945
          in essence nothing really can be done as a combat unit sensible

          Tell the crew of the Israeli destroyer Eilat. yes
        4. Dart2027
          Dart2027 30 July 2016 10: 13
          +4
          Quote: denker1945
          in the realities of the oceans

          Hmm, "The trouble is, if the shoemaker starts to bake the pies, And the cake-maker will wear boots ..."
          Dear, do you know the difference between ships designed to protect the coast and the ocean fleet? Not to mention the fact that the Caliber rocket does not care about the displacement of the ship from which it will be launched.
    2. Tusv
      Tusv 30 July 2016 09: 21
      +2
      Quote: denker1945
      All coastal zones will soon be overwhelmed with small missile boats.

      Do you know how many stealth katerks you need to destroy a couple of AUGs? Right, not a single one. AUGs don't even churn out
    3. i80186
      i80186 30 July 2016 09: 40
      +3
      Quote: denker1945
      about one rocket per ship — not half the rocket!

      Yeah, with 100 kilotons on board, one rocket, one AUG. laughing
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 30 July 2016 22: 59
        0
        One missile has a zero chance.
  3. prior
    prior 30 July 2016 08: 55
    +7
    This "midge" will zadolbet any aircraft carrier!
    1. todessichel01
      todessichel01 30 July 2016 08: 57
      -20%
      This midge will be crushed like a bug, of which it is.
      And an aircraft carrier with 8 strap-ons can only be plugged in the bathroom while playing
      1. Sirocco
        Sirocco 30 July 2016 09: 14
        +23
        Quote: todessichel01
        This midge will be crushed like a bug, of which it is.

        Dear, you this Fable, tell the bees, which, in a single copy, sting painfully but not fatally, but when five or ten of them are planted for you, it will be no laughing matter, by God, I'm silent about the swarm. And if the aggressor whom they attack has an allergy to "bee venom", then one bee that will bite in the right place is enough, for a person it is the neck. laughing
        So you and your colleague do not need to set the fox avatar, but jackals or hyenas))))
        Now about the midge, have you been to the taiga? Do you know what a midge is? and how does the place of a bite even of one midge itch and itch?
        So it is with you, itchy and itchy, from the positive information in the article. Is not it, the symptoms are very similar)))))
        1. prior
          prior 30 July 2016 09: 20
          0
          The word midge emphasizes the second syllable.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. denker1945
          denker1945 30 July 2016 09: 24
          -6
          From midges there is a miracle remedy-ointment-anointed and flies and midges and mosquitoes trying to fly die or run away. What will you do with these inflatable boats with 4 rowers on each side against the AUG? notice! These fragile sloops are only good for fighting the Papuans without the appropriate countermeasures — like ISIS baboons in Syria
          1. PKK
            PKK 30 July 2016 09: 53
            +2
            Dear, there is a tactic for combating various goals. Disarming strikes with blinding radars, all kinds of obstacles are used. If mosquitoes are built, then there is already a tactic for them.
            1. Denker76
              Denker76 30 July 2016 10: 07
              -5

              In the morning I got up and I can’t understand who I am, where I am.
              1. Dart2027
                Dart2027 30 July 2016 10: 19
                +4
                Quote: Denker76
                By the way, I’m studying all the photos of such boats, I examined all the sides, I don’t find holes for oars

                Well, look further. Who's stopping something?
              2. DMB_95
                DMB_95 30 July 2016 10: 33
                +7
                Quote: Denker76
                There is no tactic there, we are building this because we can’t do another yet. By the way, I’m studying all the photos of such boats, I’ve looked around all the boards, I don’t find any holes for oars .. there are no keys either. How do they navigate the water? Can Negro rowers push boat behind?

                Well, if you "build these things" with "oars and black oarsmen", then this is a problem of either your state or your madhouse.
              3. midivan
                midivan 30 July 2016 11: 19
                +4
                Quote: Denker76
                In the morning I got up and I can’t understand who I am, where I am.

                you should drink less wink if there are people in white coats around, then most likely the location of your LTP is at best laughing
            2. Alex777
              Alex777 1 August 2016 21: 21
              0
              Quote: PKK
              Dear, there is a tactic for combating various goals. Disarming strikes with blinding radars, all kinds of obstacles are used. If mosquitoes are built, then there is already a tactic for them.

              The tactics are quite transparent - a threat to the missile defense system, runways of aerodromes, nuclear weapons storage facilities, etc.
              As a means of combating AUG - they do not look at all. At least because of the complete lack of air defense.
              That's when they put the Carapace - a chance may appear.
        4. todessichel01
          todessichel01 30 July 2016 09: 28
          -4
          And what is positive about it?
          Pledged, laid, pride for the country appeased.
          No one in the world?
          And maybe because not, their value is doubtful.
          Let them first at least build this miracle, supply them with rockets, and then we'll see.
          And drooling joy over the midge ....
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 30 July 2016 10: 02
            +10
            Quote: todessichel01
            And drooling joy over the midge

            And you didn’t get away with two accounts in one topic.
          2. Tusv
            Tusv 30 July 2016 10: 22
            +4
            Quote: todessichel01
            And what is positive about it?
            Pledged, laid, pride for the country appeased.
            No one in the world?

            Well, we can insist that on the tank of the yacht Abramoyvch there should be a container with the Club.
            And so really no one has such a "mosquito fleet".
            Katerok katerok, but armament - NATO corvette envy
        5. spravochnik
          spravochnik 30 July 2016 13: 34
          +1
          Apology doesn't work exactly like that. When you work with bees, you put on the appropriate bone, and even fumigate them with smoke. So here too, who will allow you to reach the launch range (I repeat, the launch range of the Caliber anti-ship missile system is only 300 km).
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 30 July 2016 13: 39
            +10
            Quote: spravochnik
            Apology doesn't work exactly like that. When you work with bees, you put on the appropriate bone, and even fumigate them with smoke. So here too, who will allow you to reach the launch range (I repeat, the launch range of the Caliber anti-ship missile system is only 300 km).

            Show at least one idiot admiral mattress who will give the order of the AUG to enter the coastal defense coverage area with a ground air group, AWACS, coastal fleet, air defense systems and anti-ship systems, as well as electronic warfare systems.
            1. spravochnik
              spravochnik 30 July 2016 15: 04
              +1
              Quote: NEXUS
              Quote: spravochnik
              Apology doesn't work exactly like that. When you work with bees, you put on the appropriate bone, and even fumigate them with smoke. So here too, who will allow you to reach the launch range (I repeat, the launch range of the Caliber anti-ship missile system is only 300 km).

              Show at least one idiot mattress of Mattress who will give the order of the AUG to enter the coastal defense coverage area with a land-based air group, AWACS, coastal fleet, air defense systems and anti-ship systems, as well as electronic warfare systems.

              So I am about the same. There are no such idiots. Therefore, they will not enter the zone, but they will not allow the "mosquito flock" to come to them either. So, those who dream of breaking the AUG with such boats can calm down.
            2. Vadim237
              Vadim237 30 July 2016 23: 00
              0
              The effectiveness of electronic warfare can be considered conditional, since these complexes have not shown themselves against foreign technology.
              1. NEXUS
                NEXUS 31 July 2016 11: 08
                +4
                Quote: Vadim237
                The effectiveness of electronic warfare can be considered conditional, since these complexes have not shown themselves against foreign technology.

                What do you mean .... that is, the story with the destroyer Cook was also conditional, when it was "extinguished" by coastal EW systems?
      2. 33 Watcher
        33 Watcher 30 July 2016 09: 39
        +3
        An aircraft carrier (anyone) will have one RCC, a maximum of two. There are 8. Four will reach the goal (in the worst case scenario). Consider ...
        1. Trick shot
          Trick shot 30 July 2016 09: 50
          +15
          The aircraft carrier will be just right, and one that reached his rocket deck. You can’t take off from a disassembled take-off, and 4 thousand crews begin to fight merrily for the survivability of this barge, and another 2 thousand crew from the wing are waiting for their fate and follow the news ...
          1. You Vlad
            You Vlad 30 July 2016 10: 56
            +6
            And those who are already in the air quietly pray!
            1. Alex_Tug
              Alex_Tug 30 July 2016 11: 13
              0
              And those who are already in the air quietly pray!


              They have a catapult.
              1. You Vlad
                You Vlad 30 July 2016 11: 21
                0
                If the deck is damaged, landing is not possible! And take off too.
                1. Alex_Tug
                  Alex_Tug 30 July 2016 11: 23
                  +1
                  If the deck is damaged, landing is not possible!


                  Do you need a catapult in the cockpit for landing?
                  1. You Vlad
                    You Vlad 30 July 2016 11: 27
                    0
                    Sorry did not understand you from the beginning) But the planes in the air will be lost.
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 30 July 2016 23: 02
          0
          The probability that they - all 8 will fly is minimal.
      3. dauria
        dauria 30 July 2016 09: 42
        +2
        This midge will be crushed like a bug, of which it is.


        Well, in addition to blind anger, you have no thoughts.

        Okay. In 1905, the Russian second squadron climbed into the Tsushima Strait. The proximity of Japan's bases allowed her to use not only destroyers, but also "small ships", not adapted either in seaworthiness or in range. Russian losses from night torpedo attacks (direct and indirect) were not much less than from the artillery of battleships.

        The British type of corvettes, the British revered, as we are the T-34.
        This little ship of only 1000 tons, with a steam engine and a speed of 16 knots and one frivolous cannon, did more for them than the battleships of the Royal Navy.
        1. spravochnik
          spravochnik 30 July 2016 15: 31
          0
          Quote: dauria
          This midge will be crushed like a bug, of which it is.


          Well, in addition to blind anger, you have no thoughts.

          Okay. In 1905, the Russian second squadron climbed into the Tsushima Strait. The proximity of Japan's bases allowed her to use not only destroyers, but also "small ships", not adapted either in seaworthiness or in range. Russian losses from night torpedo attacks (direct and indirect) were not much less than from the artillery of battleships.

          The British type of corvettes, the British revered, as we are the T-34.
          This little ship of only 1000 tons, with a steam engine and a speed of 16 knots and one frivolous cannon, did more for them than the battleships of the Royal Navy.


          Well, dear man, examples should be chosen more correctly.
        2. Verdun
          Verdun 31 July 2016 14: 33
          0
          Quote: dauria
          Russian losses from night torpedo attacks (direct and indirect) were not much less than from the battleship artillery.

          That's just these attacks were made at the final stage of the battle. when the destroyers finished off Russian ships that had already suffered damage in an artillery battle.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. denker1945
      denker1945 30 July 2016 09: 00
      -16%
      And where are you going to give birth to swarms of bugs? -Or a miracle caliber will solve the problem? When the Americans started to launch these missiles in '92 nobody screamed, OOOO this miracle rocket a miracle how it flies -And in 2016 we launched and oh-ohh miracle rocket flew !! !
      1. SPACE
        SPACE 30 July 2016 09: 34
        +9
        Quote: denker1945
        When the Americans began to launch these missiles in 92, nobody shouted, OOOO this miracle rocket a miracle how it flies -And we launched in 2016 and oh-ohh miracle a rocket flew !!!

        You are historically completely underdeveloped, the P-15 was the first real combat use of anti-ship missiles in the 60 years, and then there were cruise missiles for every taste and color, Basalt, Granite, Volcano, Grenade, X-55, Mosquito, Yakhont, Caliber is just an ordinary glorious tradition. The Americans are no one in this business and there is no way to call them !!!
        Z. ancestors minus
      2. Trick shot
        Trick shot 30 July 2016 09: 54
        +5
        Quote: denker1945
        where do you make swarms of these bugs?

        Absolute incompetence, but a great desire to be noticed. At least for some reason.

        Similar in class to this "bug" - MRK project 21631 ("Buyan"). Dozens of people gather in Zelenodolsk a year. Little is received by the Russian Navy, because foreigners are fighting in line after them.
        It was they who scared the bearded straight from the Caspian ...
        1. Verdun
          Verdun 30 July 2016 15: 05
          +1
          Quote: Trick Shot
          It was they who scared the bearded straight from the Caspian ...

          That is why these bearded men got scared and fled at once ... With all due respect, the shooting of "Caliber" from the Caspian Sea on the territory of Syria is more a demonstration of capabilities than inflicting real combat damage. At the same time, the use of the fleet in the fight against ISIS is, of course, great. But how suddenly the presence of our ships is required somewhere in Cuba or at Cape Horn? And at
          RTO project 21631 ("Buyan"). In Zelenodolsk they gather dozens a year.
          cruising range of the economic course - 2500 miles and autonomy - 10 days. What shall we do?
          1. Trick shot
            Trick shot 30 July 2016 17: 43
            +3
            Quote: Verdun
            It was they who scared the bearded straight from the Caspian ...
            That is why these bearded men got scared and fled at once ... With all due respect, the shooting of "Caliber" from the Caspian Sea on the territory of Syria is more a demonstration of capabilities than inflicting real combat damage.

            Somewhere it is written that the bearded were DESTROYED with one series of volleys? The goal was to scare, including "our ZAOKEAN partners". It was achieved.
            Quote: Verdun
            cruising range of the economic course - 2500 miles and autonomy - 10 days. What shall we do?

            Use RTOs for their intended purpose and within the capabilities of the class, as they would have been called "STOROZHEVIKS" earlier - for actions in the near sea zone, for fighting enemy surface ships and submarines, patrolling the zone of responsibility for the purpose of blockade within autonomy.
            1. Verdun
              Verdun 30 July 2016 18: 02
              +1
              Quote: Trick Shot
              To use RTOs for their intended purpose and within the capabilities of the class, as they would have been called "STOROZHEVIKS" earlier - for operations in the near sea zone, fighting enemy surface ships and submarines,

              So when you find on the RTOs the means to combat the enemy submarines, we will certainly continue this debate. hi At the same time, I hasten to note. that no one talks about the uselessness of RTOs. The point is that it is high time to move on to the construction of larger ships, which the fleet is clearly not enough.
        2. spravochnik
          spravochnik 30 July 2016 15: 41
          +1
          Quote: Trick Shot
          Quote: denker1945
          where do you make swarms of these bugs?

          Absolute incompetence, but a great desire to be noticed. At least for some reason.

          Similar in class to this "bug" - MRK project 21631 ("Buyan"). Dozens of people gather in Zelenodolsk a year. Little is received by the Russian Navy, because foreigners are fighting in line after them.
          It was they who scared the bearded straight from the Caspian ...

          This is really an example of absolute incompetence. If only they read the statistics of the delivery of ships before writing such nonsense. And give an example of at least one country that ordered "Buyan".
        3. spravochnik
          spravochnik 30 July 2016 16: 19
          0
          Quote: Trick Shot
          Quote: denker1945
          where do you make swarms of these bugs?

          Absolute incompetence, but a great desire to be noticed. At least for some reason.

          Similar in class to this "bug" - MRK project 21631 ("Buyan"). Dozens of people gather in Zelenodolsk a year. Little is received by the Russian Navy, because foreigners are fighting in line after them.
          It was they who scared the bearded straight from the Caspian ...

          This is really an example of absolute incompetence. Before writing such nonsense, would you look at the statistics of the delivery of ships. And a list of the queue of foreign countries that ordered "Buyan" in the studio.
          В
          1. Trick shot
            Trick shot 30 July 2016 17: 34
            +1
            From the same wiki
            "By order of Vietnam, two ships were built. They were laid down by export project 11661E ("Cheetah 3.9") in 2007, launched on December 12, 2009 and March 16, 2010, respectively. The first of them was sent to the customer in the fall of 2010 and on March 5, 2011, the Vietnamese flag was hoisted on it, the ship received the name "Ding Tien Hoang" (Vietnamese. "Đinh Tiên Hoàng"). The second ship called “Li Thai To” (Vietnamese “Lý Thái Tổ”) entered service with the Vietnamese Navy in 2011.
            In December 2011, Vietnam ordered an additional batch of two units in the anti-submarine version. In early July 2013 it became known that the start of construction of the second pair of Vietnamese Cheetahs, previously planned initially in June 2013, then in July 2013, was postponed to September 2013. The laying of the second pair of Cheetah-3.9 corvettes for the Vietnamese Navy took place 24 September 2013
            At the beginning of 2016, the date of transfer of patrol ships was moved to a later date due to the fact that Ukraine ceased to supply ship engines. Most likely, the future Cheetahs will be equipped with German MTU-8000 diesel engines, instead of Ukrainian ones. Germany previously committed to supply at least two diesel engines to equip the BPS-500 missile ships (their construction in Vietnam was postponed “for subjective and objective reasons”"
            That's why the ORDER line is. I talked about OPPORTUNITIES, and not about realities independent of Zelenodoltsy.
            1. Verdun
              Verdun 30 July 2016 18: 33
              0
              Quote: Trick Shot
              By order of Vietnam, two ships were built. They were laid on the export project 11661E ("Cheetah 3.9")

              And how do the project 11661E with a displacement of 1700 tons relate to the project 22800 with a displacement of 800 tons? This is no longer just incompetence. This is a deliberate misrepresentation.
              1. Trick shot
                Trick shot 30 July 2016 18: 58
                0
                This is a dispute FOR THE DISPUTE. And I didn’t start it. Reread your question.
                Quote: Trick Shot
                Similar in class to this "bug" - MRK project 21631

                Quote: Trick Shot
                I talked about OPPORTUNITIES, not about realities

                Yes, and the very first appeal WAS NOT ADDRESSED TO YOU!
                And "correlate" so that in relation to BOTH of these projects -
                "In 2014, in connection with the imposition of sanctions against Russia, the German company MTU at the end of the year suspended the supply of engines envisaged by the project. However, according to a representative of Zelenodolsk Shipyard," replacement diesels have already been found and the construction of ships will not be suspended. " for these ships began to supply "Kolomensky Zavod" and the factory "Zvezda" from St. Petersburg. "
                1. spravochnik
                  spravochnik 31 July 2016 01: 37
                  -2
                  Your delusional post was asked a very specific question. Instead of a specific answer, you are carrying a complete nonsense. That's really a dispute for the sake of argument.
            2. spravochnik
              spravochnik 31 July 2016 01: 04
              0
              And what does the pr. 11661 have to do with "Buyan"? These are ships of a completely different class, a tributary that the Gepard Caliber did not even come close to.
    4. kepmor
      kepmor 30 July 2016 09: 05
      -13%
      First, let this "midge" try to approach the aircraft carrier at a missile launch distance
      Only who will let them in?
      Drowned like kittens!
      It’s just that our industry is now not able to build destroyers with frigates in the right amount, then there are no engines, then the air defense system is not ready, and the terms are considerable.
      So you have to build a "mosquito fleet" ... all this is not from a good life!
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. denker1945
        denker1945 30 July 2016 09: 10
        -5
        Yes, it is valuable as a combat unit in the number of warrants — but where can I get the warrant? And then, it has just been laid, as if 10 years later they hadn’t put a bolt on it like it had already happened!
        1. Trick shot
          Trick shot 30 July 2016 09: 57
          +2
          Quote: denker1945
          and where to get the warrant?

          Yes, in the same place where you got this word - "order". Now the term BUILDING is used ALL OVERALL.

          "Gathered tops, not dug roots." And -
          "Meli Emelya, while your week ..."
          / rus. Nar last /
          1. Verdun
            Verdun 30 July 2016 18: 15
            0
            Quote: Trick Shot
            Yes, in the same place where you got this word - "order". Now the term BUILDING is used ALL OVERALL.

            Building is on the parade ground, next to the outhouse, where the corresponding substance floats. And in the Navy - a warrant and latrine. hi
            1. Trick shot
              Trick shot 30 July 2016 19: 02
              0
              Leave me alone. Are you excited and stuck. Give a link to where "MODERN COMBAT ORDERS". Do not forget about the terminology. Will you find a" order "there? If it does occur, then only as an additional explanation or SINONYM the word "order"
              1. Verdun
                Verdun 30 July 2016 20: 28
                -1
                Quote: Trick Shot
                Are you horny and stuck. Give a link to where "MODERN COMBAT ORDERS ARE DESCRIBED".

                What kind of "battle formations" do YOU ​​have, I am not very aware, but here on this link
                http://militera.lib.ru/regulations/russr/2001_ku/index.html
                You can get acquainted with the current charter of the Russian Navy. There, not only about the warrant, but also many more useful things for yourself. And if you are too lazy to look, for example I quote:
                101. At sea, the commanding officer assigns the speeding ships, course, marching order to the commanding ships and is responsible for the safety of ships operating in one warrant under his flag, organizes the work of the command post connection.
                hi
      3. Monos
        Monos 30 July 2016 09: 19
        +13
        Quote: kepmor
        First, let this "midge" get to the aircraft carrier at a missile launch distance!
        Who will let her go there ... drown like kittens!


        At 2,5 t. Km? Why pick it up? Drown? You find him first! You, my dear, have problems with math. Calculate your search area with a radius of 2500 km.
        Your bunch turned out to be liquid.
        1. kepmor
          kepmor 30 July 2016 09: 34
          +2
          This is your "bunch" out of place!
          Learn mat.chast, as they say in the Navy, before writing nonsense!
          "Caliber" in the anti-ship version flies a maximum of 400 km, so it has a great speed!
          And the effective firing range with a probability of hitting a target of at least 0,6-, 0,7 is no more than 2 \ 3 of the maximum range, and then under favorable conditions - the absence of fire and electronic countermeasures and normal radar observability of the target.
          That is, it is necessary to approach the aircraft carrier 270 km no further, and this is the zone of active defense of security ships and aviation.
          It is only in Hollywood films that they show an order with a distance between ships of 5-10 kbt, but in reality AUG is a "well-protected cylinder" with a radius of 300-400 km and a height of 10-15 km - try to "climb" into it first, and then another and "get out" unscathed - the probability of this action is zero point fucking tenths!
          Well, where are your 2500 km and which of us have problems with arithmetic?
          1. Monos
            Monos 30 July 2016 10: 02
            +4
            Do not scaffold people brains. According to AUG, no one will shoot high explosive warheads. And 3М14 with UBC is thrown on 2600 easily.
            1. alex80
              alex80 30 July 2016 11: 02
              +1
              SBCH can be easily installed, but as they say, "easy on paper, but forgot about the ravines."
              Question: how will target designation be carried out for 2600 km. on a moving target ???
              The Chinese with their supposedly ballistic anti-ship missiles DF, the tests of which are not known
              and then they say no more than 1500 km., and we already have an island and RCC on 2600 appeared thanks to
              specialists on the forums lol
              1. Alex_Tug
                Alex_Tug 30 July 2016 11: 15
                0
                RCC on 2600 appeared thanks to specialists on the forums


                Maybe it’s for television, damn it ... whoever the main newsletter on Sundays flew from our heads.
            2. kote119
              kote119 30 July 2016 12: 06
              +3
              Komrad, you are deeply mistaken, the caliber (which is anti-ship) has a range of combat use of the order of 300-400 km, do not confuse it with the caliber used on ground targets, with a range of 2500 km, these are completely different missiles
              1. Albert1988
                Albert1988 30 July 2016 13: 36
                -3
                Quote: kote119
                these are completely different rockets

                Ugum - and why are they so "different"?
                What explains this difference in combat radius?
            3. kepmor
              kepmor 30 July 2016 13: 42
              +5
              Again deuce, you! Now for not knowing the mathematical part and for the lack of sound thinking!
              Let's start learning from the "basics":
              1. "Throwing at 2600" in the ocean is not so easy, because. ed.3M14 has an inertial seeker, i.e. according to a previously developed and calculated route with reference to the terrain and constant GLONASS correction. How are you going to "tie" a rocket over the sea .... to the waves, or what?
              Well, from the realm of fiction, you somehow managed to put target coordinates, bearing and distance into the brains of a rocket, so what next? Command AUG to stand still?
              How will you aim the rocket at the AUG moving at a speed of 35-45 km \ hour?
              And what is the flight time of a rocket to a target from a distance of even 2000 km?
              I answer - about 3 hours, because Marching speed of about 180-200 ms! Do not believe ... count yourself!
              For 3 hours of missile flight, the deviation from the given coordinates will be about 150 km., If you will know even the general course of the AUG.
              2. What capacity should be the nuclear weapons that you are discussing here in order to destroy the AUG or at least damage it within a radius of 150 km? What size and weight?
              Only "couch generals with marshals" have learned to shoot at aircraft carriers with 3M14 missiles, but real military men cannot do it, however!
              So which one of us "powders the brains" here, on the forum, are you my double?





              2.
              1. Albert1988
                Albert1988 30 July 2016 13: 47
                -3
                Then you have a question - what about external target designation from AWACS aircraft, radar stations capable of "seeing beyond the horizon", satellites?
          2. Albert1988
            Albert1988 30 July 2016 11: 02
            -5
            Quote: kepmor
            "Caliber" in the anti-ship version flies a maximum of 400 km, so it has a great speed!

            Do you know why? The humming-bird in the anti-ship version flies to 400 only in the absence of external target designation (for example, from an AWACS plane - after all, the coordinates of the target change), given that there will be such target designation near the shore, then ...

            Py.Sy. They generally spoke about hummingbirds at first. that he only flies 300 km, and were very surprised when he flew away once and for 1500)))).
            So do not be afraid - it turns out. that anti-ship hummingbird for a couple of thousand gets)))).
            1. Alex_Tug
              Alex_Tug 30 July 2016 11: 17
              -1
              a couple of thousand anti-ship hummingbirds get it)


              Why should we be afraid? Can't they bring down Caliber?
              1. Albert1988
                Albert1988 30 July 2016 13: 34
                +2
                Quote: Alex_Tug
                Can't they bring down Caliber?

                They can, but it all depends on how many of these calibers fly — the more massive the salvo, the more missiles fly.
                1. spravochnik
                  spravochnik 31 July 2016 01: 49
                  0
                  Damn, whence so many profane brought, probably "Caliber" at full range.
                  1. Albert1988
                    Albert1988 31 July 2016 12: 09
                    0
                    Quote: spravochnik
                    Damn, whence so many profane brought, probably "Caliber" at full range.

                    In this case, explain what profanity consists of, clearly and reasonably ...
            2. kote119
              kote119 30 July 2016 12: 10
              0
              At the moment, the family of calibers includes three completely different missiles - cbbd, pkr, plur, respectively, each has its own tasks and different characteristics
        2. Izotovp
          Izotovp 30 July 2016 09: 37
          +7
          What is more valuable for the fleet: ten such mosquitoes or one frigate cannot be said right away. Impact capabilities, flexibility of application, survivability of a system versus survivability of a loner ... must be considered, dear ones, and not throw slogans and allegories without arguments. By the way, in some ways the aircraft carrier will be more vulnerable than an ordinary frigate or cruiser. To stop its functioning, it is enough to properly damage the runway, island, catapults, air finishers ... all together, individually ... in short: create conditions for the termination of functioning. Drowning is not necessary. The so-called necessary damage to the system.
          1. Ze Kot
            Ze Kot 30 July 2016 10: 48
            +4
            Quote: Izotovp
            What is more valuable for the fleet: ten such mosquitoes or one frigate cannot be said right away.


            In the event of hostilities, the Baltic Sea is immediately blocked by minefields. In the Baltic "pool" big ships have nothing to do. And such small maneuverable ships are the very thing.
        3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Tusv
        Tusv 30 July 2016 10: 27
        0
        Quote: kepmor
        First, let this "midge" try to approach the aircraft carrier at a missile launch distance
        Only who will let them in?

        In general, AUG won't even see them until it appears in direct line of sight am
      5. Albert1988
        Albert1988 30 July 2016 10: 56
        +5
        Quote: kepmor
        First, let this "midge" try to approach the aircraft carrier at a missile launch distance
        Only who will let them in?

        Ugum, there is a distance of 3000 kilometers! So this is not a "midge" will come up, but an AUG - "midge" will sit near the coast under the cover of coastal air defense, coastal anti-ship missile complexes and with the support of powerful ground radars and AWACS aircraft.
        Will AUG decide to approach all this good?
        If it is decided, then this AUG will not be ...
        1. Verdun
          Verdun 30 July 2016 11: 39
          0
          Quote: Albert1988
          Ugum, there is a distance of 3000 kilometers! So this is not a "midge" will come up, but AUG -

          I must note that the AUG also includes ships armed with long-range anti-ship missiles. At the same time, the air defense systems installed on the MRK are unlikely to provide him with reliable protection against air strikes.
          1. Dart2027
            Dart2027 30 July 2016 12: 30
            +1
            Quote: Verdun
            At the same time, air defense systems installed on RTOs

            They are put in an emergency. If something happens, they will be covered by coastal air defense.
          2. Albert1988
            Albert1988 30 July 2016 13: 39
            0
            Quote: Verdun
            I must note that the AUG also includes ships armed with long-range anti-ship missiles. At the same time, the air defense systems installed on the MRK are unlikely to provide him with reliable protection against air strikes.

            And why does he need his own air defense system if he can be covered by a ground-based air defense system? These ships will not depart so far from the coast that they will fall outside its radius of action.
        2. kepmor
          kepmor 30 July 2016 12: 55
          +6
          AUG is designed to gain air supremacy in the open sea, to destroy enemy ship groups - KUG, KPUG, DESO and convoys!
          And they will naturally not patrol near our shores, in the area of ​​our tactical aviation and ships of the near sea zone!
          And its air wing is "sharpened" for this task both in composition and in armament!
          And to destroy the enemy's infrastructure, even in the coastal zone, is not a prerogative of the AUG ... for these purposes there are other, more effective forces and means - strategic aviation and submarines with "axes".
          What the hell 3000 km, what kind of heresy are you writing? Learn mat.chast!
          Izd.3M14 with a firing range of 2600 km. can shoot ONLY at geostationary ones, for the gifted I explain, at stationary coastal targets, since a "terrain map" is aimed with correction of the current location from GLONASS and it is impossible to use it against a highly maneuverable sea target, which is AUG!
          The anti-ship version 3M54 flies at 380 km maximum!
          And in general, the Americans are "so stupid in life" that they only dream of a new Jutland battle with our RTOs!
      6. Koshak
        Koshak 30 July 2016 12: 44
        -7
        Quote: kepmor
        First, let this "midge" try to approach the aircraft carrier at a missile launch distance
        Only who will let them in?
        Drowned like kittens!

        Well, indicate the range of the "sinkers" from the aircraft carrier. The main deck F / A-18E has a combat radius of 760 km. And "Caliber" can be launched from a distance of 2000 km from the AUG. So there is no need to rush to the funeral of the "kittens"
        1. kote119
          kote119 30 July 2016 13: 06
          +1
          Capmore explained to you on the range, it seems normal, re-read his post again if not in the subject, do not confuse the pcr caliber and the cbd caliber
      7. NEXUS
        NEXUS 30 July 2016 13: 17
        +1
        Quote: kepmor
        First, let this "midge" try to approach the aircraft carrier at a missile launch distance

        Dear, the ships of the Karakurt project, as well as the Buyan-M, are designed to protect the coastal zone. And if the AUG comes so close to the coast, then believe me, these MRKs will be the most insignificant problem for her. In simple terms, -AUG off the coast of the country with good coastal defense and the support of the fleet and aviation, he will not live with all his air wing for half an hour.
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 30 July 2016 23: 05
          +1
          These RTOs without cover, deck aircraft will send to the bottom - quickly and efficiently.
      8. ML-334
        ML-334 30 July 2016 16: 18
        -2
        And they don’t need to approach, it’s the aircraft carrier that needs to approach so that the aircraft would work. I think that the larger the plane is in the air, the less chances it will survive. Most likely, the "mosquito fleet" will have centralized control, and they will tear anyone.
    5. Verdun
      Verdun 30 July 2016 10: 04
      0
      Quote: prior
      This "midge" will zadolbet any aircraft carrier!

      Tired of explaining to people who went out to sea only on an inflatable mattress and never even swam for buoys that RTOs, whatever their range, missiles did not stand on them, due to their size, are suitable only for operations in the coastal zone. At the same time, the entire practice of fleet development shows that it is impossible to solve the coastal protection task with a mosquito fleet alone.
      1. Trick shot
        Trick shot 30 July 2016 10: 15
        +3
        Quote: Verdun
        one mosquito fleet cannot solve the task of protecting the coast.

        If the task is precisely in this - then easily.
        In addition to the surface fleet, a "mosquito" submarine fleet in the form of diesel engines of the "Varshavyanka" type is attached.
        Behind the hill are also not woodpeckers sitting. Estimate the chances and STAY OUT OF REACH.
        And what we need.
        1. Verdun
          Verdun 30 July 2016 11: 11
          +2
          Quote: Trick Shot
          Behind the hill are also not woodpeckers sitting. Estimate the chances and STAY OUT OF REACH.

          You would, my dear man, be put on such an RTO, and send somewhere in the Barents Sea in the autumn storm to catch the adversary three hundred miles from the coast. I think you would quickly change your point of view.
          1. You Vlad
            You Vlad 30 July 2016 11: 45
            +1
            And ground-based systems will not be able to cope with such a task?
            1. Verdun
              Verdun 30 July 2016 17: 57
              0
              Quote: You Vlad
              And ground-based systems will not be able to cope with such a task?

              And how can ground-based systems destroy enemy submarines or large groupings of ships? The fact that we do not have anti-ship missiles capable of delivering strikes for 500 or more kilometers, and the long-range version of the Caliber is designed to strike at stationary objects, many have already written here. But the enemy, being outside the reach of our coastal defenses, may well strike at stationary targets on the territory of our country.
          2. Trick shot
            Trick shot 30 July 2016 11: 55
            +2
            And I was there. Only not MRK, but on the BOD. Barents, so it was a native home, but they went into Kara, but more of the Atlantic. I also had a chance to taxi to the Mediterranean ...
            1. kepmor
              kepmor 30 July 2016 13: 03
              -3
              Well, well done, I compared ... an opa with a hedgehog - a flat-bottomed "vanka-vstanku" MRK with a displacement of 850 tons and a BOD with a displacement of 7000 tons, sharpened under an ocean wave!
              Hero, however .... what else can you say!
              1. Trick shot
                Trick shot 30 July 2016 17: 51
                +1
                What are you talking about?
                Something you parted in your rampage ... You thought the range seemed to be correct, you cited the arguments, and suddenly switched to snarls FOR ANY EVENT ... wink
                The question was asked to me - "Was I there?" I replied that I was. Why should you be excited about this?
          3. Koshak
            Koshak 30 July 2016 12: 55
            +3
            Quote: Verdun
            You would, my dear man, be put on such an RTO, and send somewhere in the Barents Sea in the autumn storm to catch the adversary three hundred miles from the coast. I think you would quickly change your point of view.

            Why chase the adversary by sea? Let him try to approach the range of his wing, and we will wait in the coastal zone under the cover of coastal air defense systems.
            1. Verdun
              Verdun 30 July 2016 13: 36
              -1
              Quote: Koshak
              and we will wait in the coastal zone under the cover of coastal air defense systems.

              During a storm, it is in the coastal zone dangerous to ships of any displacement. Smudges on the coastal cliffs - it will not seem enough. At the same time, the fleet can in no way be regarded as a defense weapon. It is created to attack and attack active.
      2. kepmor
        kepmor 30 July 2016 13: 06
        +2
        Yes, it is useless to explain the common truths to the "sofa general staff"!
        Not worth it ... I myself, frankly, got sick of fighting "windmills"!
        I’m better off pickling a lamb for tomorrow's holiday!
        Congratulations to all "naval" people on FLEET DAY!
        Sorry that in advance, but tomorrow I will have no time ... WITH HOLIDAY!
      3. Monos
        Monos 30 July 2016 13: 28
        +5
        Quote: Verdun
        Tired of explaining to people who went to sea only on an air mattress and never even swam for buoys,


        And what do you use for yourself? On the cruiser Aurora? Judging by your reasoning during the Russo-Japanese War, yes. You probably haven't heard about aviation, "Bastions", submarines, nuclear weapons ...
    6. spravochnik
      spravochnik 30 July 2016 13: 28
      -2
      Quote: prior
      This "midge" will zadolbet any aircraft carrier

      Yeah, dream. "Dreams, dreams, oh your sweetness. Dreams are gone, the muck remains."
    7. Andy
      Andy 1 August 2016 15: 17
      0
      PCR range 300km, aviation radius of 700 km. whom you decided to peck in the absence of a short-range shell of 20 km. their PCR from the aircraft will be launched from 200-300 km. is the math clear?
  4. Barakuda
    Barakuda 30 July 2016 08: 56
    +2
    Here are those who were DOPED IN THE DOPE, along with the doctors at the shipyard - to work out people's money, there is a lot of energy. wink
    1. svp67
      svp67 30 July 2016 09: 03
      +4
      Quote: Barracuda
      Here are those who were DOPED IN THE DOPE, along with the doctors at the shipyard - to work out people's money, there is a lot of energy.

      You are cruel. In the doping scandal, our bureaucrats are more to blame, who should be strongly thinned out, you can from the "galleys", they don't row one fig, but only interfere, right at the shipyard, and some of them even on the yard ...
      1. Barakuda
        Barakuda 30 July 2016 09: 23
        +3
        In the yards, and which of us is cruel? winked And about the bureaucrats - right!
        1. svp67
          svp67 30 July 2016 09: 42
          +1
          Quote: Barracuda
          In the yards, and which of us is cruel?

          Am i cruel Yes, how did your hand rise to write this. I’m with love, with all democratic values, everything is through the courts, and then to whom it’s written in the family, to whom the shipyard, to whom rey. But that would be visible from any shipyard.
    2. Trick shot
      Trick shot 30 July 2016 10: 00
      +1
      If we again mean the notorious Mildronate, then tens of thousands of CARDIOLOGY patients can be sent to the shipyard.
      But there they will not last long ...
      1. svp67
        svp67 30 July 2016 10: 18
        +1
        Quote: Trick Shot
        If we again mean the notorious Mildronate

        And we mean it. They knew that they wanted to add him to the list of banned people, why they did not resist. Who missed such an attack? Where is his last name, first name, middle name? Who is to blame for the fact that our athletes are forced to use its Japanese counterpart, which is ALLOWED and costs us tens of times more.
        Why when they dispersed our anti-doping commission, no one thought of asking for guarantees written by WADA about the admission of our athletes, subject to the requirements put forward by WADA. Our state spent about two million dollars on their implementation, and as a result, only those athletes who trained abroad were allowed, although the number of samples surpasses all conceivable standards and they were checked abroad.
        Who is responsible for this is immediately a blunder.
        1. Trick shot
          Trick shot 30 July 2016 10: 55
          +4
          They knew - did not know ...
          All this is nonsense. Doctors laughed at this "ban" EXACTLY YEAR. From the middle of the past until this June.
          Of course DO NOT KNOW! More precisely, they did NOT BELIEVE or EXPECT.
          According to the chronology, the year before, the analogue of mildronate trimetazidine was banned, but he even said in the annotation. which has an antihypoxic effect. Let's say.
          And Mildronate DIDN'T KNOW what would be classified as "doping". It DOES NOT HAVE any stimulating, anabolic or steroidal effect. It has been said to "accelerate the body's recovery." What kind of "organism" bolt? Its action is directed to the MYOCARDIUM. Then validol should be banned this year. And brilliant green, because it also contributes to the RESTORATION of the "organism" by suppressing the development of microorganisms in the wound. Even plantain should be banned.
          The decision of WADA came as a surprise, which was taken by COLLOURAL, and only after the results were ready on the statistics of WHO and IN WHICH countries it takes it. It is clear that WITHOUT pressure on WADA. And this is pure POLICY.
          Doctors have nothing to do with this.
          Moreover, TIME was chosen sooooo well.
          The ban on participation came into effect on many positions already by the federations.
          There is both a "double punishment" and a positive test, but with such a MIND amount of residues in organisms at the beginning of the year that they did not pay attention to it before.
          Now it is only the work of lawyers, but they will not have time to do anything by the beginning of the OI.
          So you can already recognize. In Russia, they bothered accurately and successfully.
          Whom will we appoint guilty, who "overlooked" that they will be thumped exactly at this place
          1. svp67
            svp67 30 July 2016 11: 08
            +2
            Quote: Trick Shot
            Of course DO NOT KNOW! More precisely - did not believe and did not expect
            This can be attributed both to unprofessionalism and to malicious intent, possibly paid. The fact that this drug was included in the banned list was known in advance, and then it was already necessary to begin to resist, and not in fact. Someone simply must be punished for such a mistake, otherwise there will be no order in the future. Does he mean to receive money for his position, but is there no answer?
            Quote: Trick Shot
            In Russia, they bothered accurately and successfully.

            And no one is to blame for anything, it happened ... ah ah. And where is the confidence that such attacks will not continue to be missed. Why Poland perceives our slightest statement very sharply, but we have ... many millions of costs for training, for the maintenance of both athletes and officials from sports, so that they would "botch" us like that. Isn't it too expensive? This is where the FSB should certainly work.
            1. Trick shot
              Trick shot 30 July 2016 11: 23
              +1
              I don’t see unprofessionalism on the part of doctors here. It was IMPOSSIBLE to predict. How impossible it is to predict what will be BANNED tomorrow, especially since WADA DOES NOT CONSULT ANYONE when making decisions.
              Lawyers always act upon what happened. Bureaucracy of any level is NOT OBLIGED to follow the issues of medicine - this is RUSADA.
              So do when PREPARED!
              We do not expect that a knife will be planted on our side in the subway.
              And this is exactly what happened.
              To be "punished" must be (appointed /? /) Responsible. Who is he?
              Therefore, there are no names or surnames ... They simply cannot be, if these are not some psychics and other mediums looking into the future.
              Faced LOGIC and HEALTH meaning with violation of laws and of course POLICY.
              Looking for blunders in politics among doctors? Also nonsense.
              Will it happen or not in the future? A rhetorical question. Will it happen? Not here, so it’s necessarily stuck in another place ...

              By the way, just like a doctor, I’ll go now and throw a couple of ampoules of trimetazidine, I don’t have to go to the Olympic Games, and I’ll have to play volleyball on the beach today.
              1. Koshak
                Koshak 30 July 2016 13: 02
                0
                Quote: Trick Shot
                I don’t see unprofessionalism on the part of doctors here. It was IMPOSSIBLE to predict. How impossible it is to predict what will be BANNED tomorrow, especially since WADA DOES NOT CONSULT ANYONE when making decisions.

                Hello! Stop flooding! What does the mosquito fleet have to do with meldonium and doping in general? You all go to the PM.
            2. Trick shot
              Trick shot 30 July 2016 11: 41
              0
              Quote: svp67
              this drug is on the banned list was known in advance

              That is the whole nonsense. Known to whom in advance?
              RUSADA and sports doctors in Russia learned about this less than six months before the ban. This is very small, especially since medicine is used to operating BIOCHEMISTRY data on the half-life of drugs from the body. And according to Mildronate specifically, NOBODY HAVE ALWAYS TAKEN IT. Well, they did not expect that it was this (according to some authoritative opinions - placebo) that would fall into this list.
              The situation is even more absurd in that we will hypothetically imagine. They were allowed to drink while driving, and over the course of a month they announced that they were down from the 1st day. I, being safe, do not use as much as a week. The traffic cop slows me down, blows me, and the exhaust does not show anything. But they bring me to the laboratory, or even get the data for the year before last, and some 0.000 ... ppm on the blood test. Oops! Violated. Lichen.
              I yell - UNFAIR, Let's figure it out "
              Be sure to understand, but with whom exactly?
  5. Sarmat149
    Sarmat149 30 July 2016 08: 59
    +2
    Quote: denker1945
    Soon all the coastal zones will be filled up with small missile boats ... By the way, how many rowers does such a boat take on board? We must go to Africa for rowers, they say, and in ancient times they rowed well. Plus for half a year if you have done 47 caliber then give !! ! -one missile per ship — not half the missile!


    Come on blow your sick urkain or straight in july, troll.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. denker1945
      denker1945 30 July 2016 09: 06
      -5
      And why did you decide that I was from Ukraine? -Do you have a silver ball on the table and you drive there and see me in this ball? -It would be better to write as the builders of the cosmodrome have no new money for half a year, stole salaries, do not pay - they disrupt the surrender of such an object, then it would be more useful. And not just another tank for the toilet
      1. 33 Watcher
        33 Watcher 30 July 2016 09: 46
        +3
        Quote: denker1945
        And why did you decide that I was from Ukraine?

        Well, how, level, principles of thinking. Lack of education, combined with some kind of command of the Russian language, a conviction of one's own rightness when writing outright stupidities ... All this points to the origin. Style, you see. laughing
    3. tanit
      tanit 30 July 2016 09: 10
      +7
      There are enough sick people ... I got tired of listening to how financial flows should be steered. I offered one "who knows how" to make an estimate, at least one point at a time laughing It was shi-karrno. laughing I found out - he was not taught this, it is not his responsibility. Quite enough. But - how to steer the country's economy - He knows. laughing
  6. Valery Valery
    Valery Valery 30 July 2016 09: 03
    -1
    We are waiting for such a ship in the SF, a very necessary ship.
    1. denker1945
      denker1945 30 July 2016 09: 08
      -7
      A non-ship is not needed; it would be better if people returned part of the funded pension that they froze forever, taking billions of rubles from depositors
  7. Kudrevkn
    Kudrevkn 30 July 2016 09: 04
    +5
    I understand that the "double" 20630 can turn out to be "small spool but expensive"? "Dorog" is expensive both in construction and in operation! Will Project 22800 be able to become a mass one, that is, a "motorcycle" or a "workhorse" for the Navy - this is the most important question? Let's wish the St. Petersburg shipbuilders labor success, and our Fleet new warships! HAPPY NAVY HOLIDAYS to all of us, all Russians !!!! Happy Holidays, dear military men of Russia! Long live the motto of the Russian marines: "Where we are, there is victory!" Congratulations, Russia!
    1. donavi49
      donavi49 30 July 2016 09: 13
      +5
      No.

      Toothy Buyan is the brainchild of Zelenodolsk Design Bureau, it grew out of an ordinary Buyan, which is the River-Sea. A more flat-bottomed hull significantly reduces seaworthiness, and most importantly speed - it has less than 25 knots.

      This is the same ship painted in Almaz - it is based on the Almazov Scorpio (which was already stolen for metal at Vympel, because it was built on credit and without a customer - the result is clear). It initially has a marine hull and a design speed of 30+.
      1. KnightRider
        KnightRider 30 July 2016 10: 32
        +2
        Quote: donavi49
        Toothy Buyan is the brainchild of Zelenodolsk Design Bureau, it grew out of an ordinary Buyan, which is the River-Sea. A more flat-bottomed hull significantly reduces seaworthiness, and most importantly speed - it has less than 25 knots.

        Mediterranean Sea. Buyan-M "Serpukhov" second from the right soldier
        1. donavi49
          donavi49 30 July 2016 11: 36
          +1
          So, they regularly go to Middle-earth. This does not negate the problems with seaworthiness and speed.

          The Swedes drove their corvette of 700 tons right up to Aden. However, this is not an indication that now these Swedish snorkel boats can plow the sea-ocean.

          By the way, 2 projects were presented:
          21635 - from Zelenodolsk Design Bureau with other contours and mover.
          And this Almazovsky.

          They chose Almazovsky. Plus now AK Bars (the owner of the Zelendolsky Industrial Design Bureau and the plant) began to press.
          1. Kudrevkn
            Kudrevkn 30 July 2016 21: 46
            0
            Is it bad news about "pressing" the Tatars? What kind of people are we such that, without bickering for a bone from the master's table, we are ready to gnaw each other's throats? "To spite my grandmother's ears, I'll frostbite"?
    2. _NortoN_
      _NortoN_ 30 July 2016 09: 15
      +2
      in addition to pellets, the same MRK was laid in the Crimea on the "sea" so that it is quite possible to become massive, but in general 18 pieces are in the plans
      1. donavi49
        donavi49 30 July 2016 09: 22
        +3
        The sea is Pella. They push money there, put their people in, and how the Sea is legalized this year (Joint-Stock Company) - they will receive a controlling stake.

        Sea - Pella.
        Bay - Green Dol. But Ak Bars now wants to survive. Therefore, this is not 100%.
        1. KnightRider
          KnightRider 30 July 2016 10: 22
          +1
          Quote: donavi49
          The sea is Pella. They push money there, put their people in, and how the Sea is legalized this year (Joint-Stock Company) - they will receive a controlling stake.

          I hope that soon, for the construction of such RTOs, one of the Far Eastern plants will be connected. Pacific Fleet also needs RTOs
  8. Wildfox
    Wildfox 30 July 2016 09: 10
    +4
    Yes, you attacked the admiral of the inflatable fleet of Ukraine and his life is already broken. The Americans thought they would give a couple of Aviks, and they drove inflatable boats to villains.
    In general, I think RTOs are evil against any enemy to track down and destroy a bunch of costs, and if you don't track down a business, it can do it. Mom, don't worry. Considering also the fact that the locusts of the modern theater of operations can hide in the estuaries of some rivers. drinks
    1. Koshak
      Koshak 30 July 2016 13: 10
      +1
      Quote: WildFox
      Yes, you attacked the admiral of the inflatable fleet of Ukraine with him, and so life is broken

      I couldn’t understand why he was so interested in the number of rowers on the RTOs. Now it is clear. UkroVMF will create copies of them from garbage containers and rowing traction. Like that famous tank pedal drive.
  9. donavi49
    donavi49 30 July 2016 09: 16
    +9
    Pella, as always, shows how to work. They still Ladoga (sistership Selinger) gave some water to drink.

    September 2014 bookmark.
  10. Masya masya
    Masya masya 30 July 2016 09: 22
    +4
    "This is purely our Russian invention", now we are proud ... but before it was in the order of things ...
  11. user3970
    user3970 30 July 2016 09: 25
    +12
    I'm not talking about a boat, if that ... Relatively recently, I personally had to visit this plant near St. Petersburg. The goal - the purchase of a rowing boat for personal needs ... Boats, by the way, make cool. My old served 20 years without any problems. So about the plant ... Such a seasoned, Soviet, kondovy factory. Working day from 8:00. The people are mostly adults, 30-40 years old. The office is small. The bureaucratic moments associated with the purchase decided in 1 hour. A guided tour of the workshops (self-guided), where they were allowed to go there, full of enthusiasm. Lifeboats, inflatable boats with outboard motors, life-saving completely sealed rafts are what I managed to see. I have been familiar with the civil nomenclature of the plant for about 30 years. I myself was engaged in extreme water tourism, if that. I am glad that such enterprises survived, have not lost people and are developing. .
  12. PKK
    PKK 30 July 2016 10: 01
    0
    The boat is good, the tactics for it are interesting, but my joy is not complete. Here he would be able to dive when fired by the enemy and hide with snorkel in the meadows, then he would have admired completely.
  13. atamankko
    atamankko 30 July 2016 10: 08
    0
    How many opponents, but it is from envy and mental filth.
  14. Zomanus
    Zomanus 30 July 2016 10: 14
    +1
    In essence, such ships are a response to the ban on the deployment of cruise missiles on land.
    The Americans converted their submarines under the carriers of the Kyrgyz Republic,
    Well, we made such floating platforms.
    That is, it’s like our floating analogue of the Iskander or something ...
    And to such ships in a set of the same "kids"
    with sharpening for air defense, anti-aircraft defense, electronic warfare.
    1. donavi49
      donavi49 30 July 2016 11: 49
      +2
      Air defense does not fit the same. Well, or there will be MD / SD 12 Shtil-1 with Frigate-M (but this frigate, this ship can overturn).

      Here it rests more on detection. A radar is needed either an extensive superstructure (052С / 052D / Berki) or a mast (22350) or a large all-in / under rotary radar. In theory, Thales (the world trendsetter in the field) is now sawing small radars with canvases and rotary ones (the same SMART-S). But he can’t buy it.
  15. rudolff
    rudolff 30 July 2016 10: 25
    +3
    The discussion of a new ship, by tradition, boils down to only two questions: can it sink a carrier (of course!) And does it have a Caliber (Europe in horror!). Corvette is a normal warship of the near sea zone, combining the missions of MRK, MAK, MPK and small patrol ships. Aircraft carrier in the AUG, this is not his goal, and not too tough for him. Caliber ... 3M14 on board, the very one which was pulled from the Caspian Sea in Syria, should not be the rule. Only as a very rare exception for solving specific problems. Normal ammunition: 6 anti-ship missiles 3M54 and two anti-submarine.
    1. Wiruz
      Wiruz 30 July 2016 12: 27
      +1
      Firstly: in my amateurish opinion, it is for the sake of 3M14 that these ships are being built. The situation is such that the whole of Europe needs to be kept at gunpoint, and Iskander will not be enough here. Ground-based deployment of medium-range missiles is prohibited by a well-known agreement, and strategic aviation cannot be constantly in the air, and more expensive.

      Secondly: as far as it was clear from official sources, pr.22800 is a pure RTO, in the classical sense, that is, not burdened with anti-submarine functions. They didn’t even put the Package-NK, at least for the purpose of anti-torpedo defense.
      1. rudolff
        rudolff 30 July 2016 14: 21
        +4
        No, Alexey, this is a categorical delusion. We simply have nowhere to install them, except on these nanoships, and on the "Indians". There are no new destroyers, no cruisers, no submarines (except Ash) with vertical launchers. A strike by a CD (with conventional, non-special warheads) against ground targets makes sense only when it comes to the possibility of tens, hundreds of launches in a short period. Destruction of air defense systems, missile launchers, radars, electronic warfare systems, communication centers and repeaters, airfields, warehouses, headquarters, and individual infrastructure elements. Eight missiles for a local conflict is almost nothing. Combat load of one Su-24. Yes, we ensured a more or less massive launch from the southern part of the Caspian Sea, but ... This required all the forces and means of the flotilla, and the flotilla itself was out of action for quite a long time. We must return to the base, carry out routine maintenance, repairs, load ammunition, and re-take positions in the southern part of the Caspian. Provided the weather permits. The seaworthiness of MRK in the use of weapons is not more than 5 points.
        With this 3M14 in general, a paradoxical situation has developed. The Union had a huge fleet, but did not have a single missile capable of working on land. Toothless against the shore. The grenade does not count, there was only special warheads. The Americans pulled their axes, and we silently envied. And now now we have the same toy, we can’t get enough of it! But ... The missile appeared, but the fleet is gone. For ships of the 1st rank, the prospect is generally far away. So we shove them wherever possible, since universal PUs allow it. But this is not normal. RTOs, a Corvette or a Frigate with a PU number of up to eight, should not carry such missiles at all. Normally, there are six 3M54 anti-ship missiles and two anti-submarine ones. 3M14 only as an exception and in special cases. Destroyers, cruisers, submarines (including NPLs) should become full-fledged carriers of these missiles.
        1. Wiruz
          Wiruz 30 July 2016 15: 14
          +1
          Well, in the plans of the Navy MRK pr.22800 will be built in sufficient quantities. I don’t know about the Baltic Fleet, at least eight ships of such a project will be built for the Black Sea, plus six more pr.21631. These are fourteen ships, and in total 112 missiles. Quite enough, it seems to me. And this is only RTOs, and only at the Black Sea Fleet. There was no information that any HAC would be installed on them, so this ship could not cope with the PLO functions.

          And about the fatal mistakes of the Navy of the USSR, then I completely agree with you. The Soviet leadership was so stubbornly preparing for a war with the United States, which would have been nuclear, that before the creation of a non-nuclear cruise missile, there wasn’t enough intelligence, or opportunity, or something else. They were relatively ready for the Third World War, and only at the cost of tens of thousands of soldiers for a local non-nuclear conflict.

          And this not only concerns long-range cruise missiles, the situation is similar with anti-ship missiles. All anti-ship missiles, often equipped with SBS, were sharpened for the destruction of large enemy ships, including the AUG. There was no "light" and cheap missile to destroy the enemy's missile boats. Work on the X-35 began too late.

          Alas, those were the times
          1. rudolff
            rudolff 30 July 2016 15: 45
            +2
            RTOs are old rakes that have already been attacked. It seems that the Americans have a saying: we are not so rich people that we would buy cheap things. And if it is necessary to provide PLO? To these RTOs to put on the stream also the IPC? Tamara and I are a couple? And if there is still a threat from the air, we’ll come up with an IEDC? Such a mischief even during the times of the Union was not reasonable, but then at least there was extra money for it. Could afford experiments. Not now. We need a unified corvette project for operations in the near sea zone, which would replace MRK, IAC (generally an anachronism), IPC and patrol. It seems so at first and decided. And then ... Everything returned to normal.
            1. Wiruz
              Wiruz 30 July 2016 15: 52
              +1
              It was such a ship that the corvette of project 20380 should have been, in the future - project 20385. But, you understand, something went wrong.

              And the current MRK, unlike the Soviet ones, as I already wrote, in my opinion, are built exclusively as carriers of long-range cruise missiles. According to the idea, they should not go far from the coast, so as not to be sunk by an enemy submarine. And the fact that today the Black Sea "Buyans" make regular trips to the Syrian shores is simply "not from a good life."
  16. Forcecom
    Forcecom 30 July 2016 10: 38
    +5
    The mosquito fleet is good, especially at the current stage when we cannot afford to keep large ships in sufficient numbers, especially the Baltic is contraindicated for something large in the face of the capabilities of modern ground and air-based attack weapons. BUT even these heirs of the "mosquito" are also ships and require appropriate coastal support. The basing system needs to be developed, otherwise it will be like in the USSR, the ships will be tuned and they will rot on the outer, not equipped roadstead. There were 1991 submarine submarines in the Baltic in 56, when I came after school in 2001 to the only 25 submarine brigade that remained at that time, there were 4 boats in it, with me 2 more were written off, and the brigade was reorganized into a separate division, you need to start with otherwise in 15 years we will return to where we started.
  17. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 30 July 2016 10: 49
    +2
    Each type of ship has its own tasks. These are carriers of "Caliber". Accurate, long-range, deadly - but forbidden to be deployed in the land version. And such small ships can use such weapons FROM ANY water area. "The Buyans, I suspect, are from both the Volga and Ladoga - and not only from the Caspian Sea. Well, these are more seaworthy, but small. They will hide somewhere in the skerries - and they can reach from there - to Lisbon. These ships and AUG will "peck" to death if it foolishly pokes into the coastal zone. But that is not their task. Such "Putin's boats" will go into the ocean - you cannot distinguish much from trawlers. They will approach Newfoundland, "fish" - they will reach Florida if This, IMHO, is the asymmetric answer of VVP. There is no need for us to compare with Matrasia, whose fleet is “cooler.” It is clear that theirs. The question is different - can this fleet PROTECT Matrasia from retaliation? The answer is obvious.
  18. Ze Kot
    Ze Kot 30 July 2016 10: 49
    0
    It is unlikely that RIA Novosti would have written "Leningrad region" with a small letter.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  19. Evil 55
    Evil 55 30 July 2016 11: 14
    -1
    The modern "Bad Weather Division" .. The Mosquito Fleet has proved its necessity on the example of both Iran and Vietnam .. There would be more such ships and on patrols in the Mediterranean Sea ..
    1. Wiruz
      Wiruz 30 July 2016 12: 14
      +2
      They will drown them in the Mediterranean, without even blinking an eye. Think what you say request
  20. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 30 July 2016 11: 30
    0
    "Shell" in my opinion will already be superfluous and significantly increases the cost of the boat. As in the Buyan, the AK-630M-2 and the Igla or Verba are enough. But of course, customers know better.
  21. Wiruz
    Wiruz 30 July 2016 11: 43
    0
    I wonder why Zelenodoltsy didn’t plan anything yesterday They promised in fact this year, in July and August, to lay down two ships of "an absolutely new project."
    1. Trick shot
      Trick shot 30 July 2016 17: 57
      0
      "At the beginning of 2016, the date for the transfer of patrol ships was moved to a later date due to the fact that Ukraine has ceased to supply ship engines. Most likely, future Cheetahs will be equipped with German MTU-8000 diesel engines, instead of Ukrainian ones. Earlier, Germany undertook to supply at least two diesels to equip BPS-500 missile ships (their construction in Vietnam was postponed "for subjective and objective reasons"
      This is in relation to the export option. Regarding orders for my Navy, I think the problems are similar. Solutions are being sought.
  22. Phosgene
    Phosgene 30 July 2016 13: 17
    +1
    These ships can qualitatively replace missile boats, but they are not universal, have poor air defense and have absolutely no PLO. They cannot replace universal corvettes and frigates.
  23. Old26
    Old26 30 July 2016 17: 09
    +2
    Quote: Alex_Rarog
    An interesting project! Especially 8 calibers and shell on such a small ship! The Caspian Sea and the Black Sea I think for them as a home!
    Although everyone wants exactly ships of the first and second rank!

    In essence, this is the development of a missile boat. Now the borders between the RCA and the corvettes have been erased. And about the Black Sea Fleet and the Caspian. If you believe infe in the network, 3 out of four mortgages will go to the Northern Fleet, one to the Black Sea Fleet

    Quote: Chariton
    We are building on all fronts ... Futuristic boat,! Will be able to avenge, if that .. hi

    To avenge whom? Without PLO and with almost zero air defense?

    Quote: Phantom Revolution
    Bet on a mosquito fleet with calibers, which can at some point replace the warhead with a nuclear special. the ammunition is very interesting. So to say, mini mobile missile systems, at the same time bypassing the agreement on medium-range missiles.

    And what is more profitable? Build 1 ship of the first rank? Or "50" such ships?
    And what is "easier" to sink? Even 20 MKR, I think, are capable of patting the entire AUG grouping of the enemy. And if you need to cover most of Europe.

    We cannot compete with the US Navy over water, and if we take NATO in a compartment, all the more so, our land border is long, it must first be strengthened. And all the money is not enough.

    The Mosquito Fleet bet is a dead end. Dreams that at the right time the "Calibers" will be equipped with SBCHs may remain dreams, since hardly anyone will be able to place nuclear weapons on a ship without air defense. What is easier to build? Of course there are 50 such ships. What is easier to sink - these same ships, not a rank 1 ship.

    In order for 20 MKR to be able to pat AUG, it is necessary that the AUG commander be a donkey, or specially substitute AUG in conditions unfavorable for him. For example, to bring AUG to the Black Sea (or to the Baltic Sea, to the Gulf of Riga for example)

    Quote: Observer 33
    An aircraft carrier (anyone) will have one RCC, a maximum of two. There are 8. Four will reach the goal (in the worst case scenario). Consider ...

    There is a book by Admiral Kapitanets "War at Sea" (EMNIP). In it, he very well examines the issues of the defeat of an aircraft carrier. And it indicates the number of anti-ship missiles required to defeat and sink an aircraft carrier. Moreover, these are X-22 class missiles. Do you want to do this with 1-2 "calibers" with a warhead of 200 kg? Subsonic? With a launch range of 4 hundred kilometers?

    Quote: Mountain Shooter
    Each type of ship has its own tasks. These are carriers of "Caliber". Accurate, long-range, deadly - but forbidden to be deployed in the land version.

    That's just for firing at the enemy on the shore, these "Calibers" are adapted, provided that there are no other states between the ship and the target. Rocket DOUBLE. It takes almost 1500 hours to fly to a maximum range of 2 km. Are you sure you won't get shot down in these 2 hours?
  24. tanit
    tanit 30 July 2016 19: 17
    +1
    We should not know too much. laughing And so, at a level accessible to transmission, than bad
    news?
  25. Berkut24
    Berkut24 30 July 2016 21: 26
    +1
    Pass this news to McCain. I want to see Congress splattered with saliva and snot.
  26. linen
    linen 31 July 2016 02: 42
    0
    It is necessary to equip these ships with EXCELLENT EW !!!
  27. tinibar
    tinibar 31 July 2016 09: 35
    0
    Quote: Talgat
    Quote: i80186
    we cannot place cruise missiles on the ground. Here are the carriers.

    Yes, and I and we all probably agree - this is indeed a very likely explanation for the focus on the construction of low-cost carriers of cruise missiles. If Russia is ok on ICBMs, then with medium-range missiles there are limitations on the agreement

    But the threats from neighbors - primarily NATO, are only growing. Placement of calibers on small vessels in the waters of Cherny. The Caspian and Baltic seas (+ and on the rivers of the western part of Russia) is a good sobering factor for potential aggressors

    Especially if you remember the possibility of placing the caliber in a standard container on almost any ship ...
  28. Santor
    Santor 31 July 2016 17: 59
    +1
    I ask you to remember that before the launch of the Caliber, the whole world, including its own population and officers of its own army, was categorically convinced that they only fly 330 km and stunt at a speed of 850 km per hour. The reality turned out to be far from the declared, as well as those samples that were exported.

    Moreover, we can really rely only on two facts - the commander of the Caspian Flotilla called the launch range to 2600 km http://www.rosbalt.ru/russia/2012/06/07/990257.html,

    and the commander of the Black Sea Fleet - 1500 km. http://tass.ru/politika/1461108

    Therefore, if we compare it with the American analogue "Tomogavk", then the 2600 is with the SBCh and 1500 in the high-explosive version. 2600 is a combat range, not a launch range, taking into account vertical and horizontal maneuvering.

    Everything that is written in the open press as the person involved told me is a little true.
  29. magician
    magician 31 July 2016 19: 37
    0
    small yes delete. subsequently, such ships can be driven along the path of automation, up to the refusal of human participation in the control of the ship while directly on it, but alas, this is the future. not far.)))
  30. ver_
    ver_ 1 August 2016 02: 06
    0
    Quote: Dart2027
    Quote: denker1945
    in the realities of the oceans

    Hmm, "The trouble is, if the shoemaker starts to bake the pies, And the cake-maker will wear boots ..."
    Dear, do you know the difference between ships designed to protect the coast and the ocean fleet? Not to mention the fact that the Caliber rocket does not care about the displacement of the ship from which it will be launched.

    ..these calibers can be thrown from any heavy transport aircraft and aero khe stats .., and stored on the ground is not prohibited ...
  31. dvaposto
    dvaposto 1 August 2016 02: 50
    0
    It is high time. MOSKITO's strategy, to a reasonable extent, is a good idea. it’s harder to attack them, it’s easier for them to stealth. a dense system may not be recognized as a multitude of goals, but with dispersal it is necessary to visit everyone, to get into each. yes, defining a priority goal will be harder. 30 mosquitoes with solid weapons are harder to fight off than 5 horseflies, with the same mass. a loss of 3 out of 30 is 10%, 3 out of 5 is 60%.
  32. Alex von Dorn
    Alex von Dorn 1 August 2016 06: 45
    0
    Beautiful boat, as they say, cheap and very angry ... Sworn friends will be happy.
  33. realist
    realist 1 August 2016 07: 35
    0
    laid already good! given our defensive and largely land military doctrine, these mosquitoes are enough for us to patrol the near zone in the Far East and the North Sea. and to threaten the adversary needs submarine missile carriers off the coast of North America ....
    Happy holiday sailors!
  34. ver_
    ver_ 3 August 2016 07: 34
    0
    Quote: Dart2027
    Quote: denker1945
    in the realities of the oceans

    Hmm, "The trouble is, if the shoemaker starts to bake the pies, And the cake-maker will wear boots ..."
    Dear, do you know the difference between ships designed to protect the coast and the ocean fleet? Not to mention the fact that the Caliber rocket does not care about the displacement of the ship from which it will be launched.

    ..these calibers can be thrown from any heavy transport aircraft and aero khe stats .., and stored on the ground is not prohibited ...
    Quote: KudrevKN
    Skerries of the Baltic also fit!

    Not quite to the occasion, but "On the Sea Hunter" by G. Chernyshev. The first holder of the Order of Alexander Nevsky in the Baltic. The commander of the "midges" .. "Moshki" successfully sunk enemy submarines, and opposed the German aircraft and boats, escorted convoys ..