Military Review

Increasing loss ratios. Ukrainian Cyclone flies to court

68
The ongoing conflict in the space industry of Ukraine is unlikely to contribute to the return of funds spent on the project "Cyclone-4" or save the project itself with the involvement of other partners.


Increasing loss ratios. Ukrainian Cyclone flies to court


Despite the summer heat, the new week began for the Ukrainian space industry is extremely cheerful. Initially, the “Appeal of the Labor Collective” appeared on the website of Yuzhnoye Design Bureau, addressed to the Presidential Administration of Ukraine, the Cabinet of Ministers, the National Security and Defense Council and the Security Service of Ukraine, which “expressed deep concern about the systematic destructive actions of the space industry leadership that did not lead to significant financial losses only across the enterprise, but across the entire state. " In particular, the current leadership of the State Space Agency of Ukraine was blamed for “incompetence and professional inconsistency, inactivity and official negligence”. As a result, in the opinion of KB workers, “the situation around the Cyclone-4 project significantly deteriorated, Brazil ... in every way delayed the process and did not pay enough attention to the stages and schedule of implementation of the ground part creation,” and the HCA of Ukraine, as responsible for implementing the project with knowing the state of affairs in Brazil, “did not take any steps to correct the situation and solve the problem of delays from the Brazilian side”.

According to a preliminary assessment of the Yuzhnoye Commercial Bank, losses caused to Ukraine as a result of the unilateral termination of the Treaty by Brazil may reach 805,86 million dollars. In order to protect the interests of the state, Yuzhnoye Commercial Bank turned to the State Tax Institution of Ukraine with a request before July 16 2016 g . initiate sending a note to the Brazilian Foreign Office with a direct objection to the unilateral termination of the Treaty by the Brazilian side without compensation for the damage caused to the Ukrainian side, as well as without Lenia order to resolve the situation, which was not done. According to the provisions of the Vienna Convention on the Law of International Treaties, the absence of a direct objection until the termination of the Treaty between Ukraine and Brazil greatly complicates further protection of the rights and interests of Ukraine and may make it impossible to repay the damage incurred by the Ukrainian side in connection with its termination.

As a result, the staff of the Yuzhnoye design bureau directly accused the leadership of the SCCU "of inaction to protect the interests of the state in connection with the unilateral denunciation by Brazil in 2015 of the long-term cooperation agreement on the use of the Cyclone-4 launch vehicle at the Alcantara launch center."

The answer came immediately. On the same day, in his interview on the radio, the chairman of the State Communications Committee of Ukraine, Lyubomir Sabadosh, said that "more than half a billion dollars were spent on the implementation of the Cyclone-4 project. This is the creation of the Cyclone-4 launch vehicle, which should give Ukraine independent access to outer space True, it was from Brazil and provided the output of both Ukrainian and international satellites. The Yuzhnoye design bureau was responsible for the execution of this contract. Unfortunately, today we have no launch vehicle, and officials B "Southern" suffered only administrative responsibility. " He also informed that the General Prosecutor’s Office of Ukraine conducted four criminal cases on charges of “seizing public funds by abusing the official duties of state-owned enterprises”, and expressed the hope that the investigative actions would be brought to an end so that the perpetrators “would bear responsibility, and not by exemption for non-fulfillment, but by real compensation for losses incurred by the state. " The name of Alexander Degtyarev, General Designer and General Director of the Yuzhnoye Design Bureau named after MK Yangel, was not named, but it was he who was dismissed by 2016 in February following the results of a financial inspection and accused of "misuse of credit funds received by the KB in the framework of the project "Cyclone-4".

As follows from the events of July 18, the positions of both parties to the conflict coincide only in terms of the need to "return funds to the budget, which are so necessary today to ensure the country's defense and to support industrial enterprises." For the rest, and above all in assessing guilt, views are diametrically opposed.

The agreement concluded at the intergovernmental level in 2003 does not provide for financial liability of the parties for its non-fulfillment, therefore the Brazilian Space Agency refuses to negotiate a legal mechanism to compensate Ukraine for costs due to termination of cooperation and denunciation.

According to the representatives of the SSAU, in coordination with the authorized state bodies, the search and development of an optimal action plan in connection with Brazil’s withdrawal from the Cyclone-4 CRC project is ongoing and the possibility of initiating ad hoc arbitration according to the UNISTRAL rules is being considered. Translated into the language of the inhabitant, there are no prospects for Brazil to return the money spent by the Ukrainian budget and state enterprises.

The same feverish, but unsuccessful attempts of the leadership of the SSAU to find a replacement for Brazil in the project testify to this. So, in May 2016, the chairman of the State Space Agency of Ukraine Lyubomir Sabadosh, commenting on the opportunity to attach a denounced project to partners from the United States, said: “As for the RSC Cyclone-4, this project is not on the agenda of Ukrainian-American cooperation: The market is a highly competitive market; the option of moving the Cyclone launch pad to the United States did not find adequate support from foreign government agencies and investors.
Today we are working to get Brazil back to the project. We hope that the new political situation in Brazil will contribute to this. "

15 January The 2016 Kiev hosted the meeting of the First Deputy Chairman of the SCA, Alexander Golub, with a delegation of representatives of the state of Queretaro (Mexico). The Mexican delegation, which visited Ukraine under the auspices of the Ministry of Economic Development and Trade of Ukraine, included the Deputy Minister of Economy of the State of José Antonio Perez-Cabrera and the Director of the Department of Industrial Economic Development of the State of Guillermo Lozano-Lozano. The parties also discussed the possibility of creating and implementing joint projects in the space industry, including "a project to create a cosmodrome with the participation of Mexican and Ukrainian enterprises in Mexico and prospects for using Cyclone launch vehicles to provide launch services for the benefit of project participants and commercial customers" .


Failing Mexican partners in the project "Cyclone-4"

Six months after the delegation left, no information was received on the preparation of the construction of the space center in Mexico.

Despondency reigns in the field of information support of the project. The state of the project is described on the HCAU website as follows: "Currently, workplaces have been upgraded to work on the launch vehicle assemblies, manufacturing of individual prototypes, launch vehicle assemblies have begun, their experimental testing and adjustment of the working design documentation based on test results, work continued preparation of the production base for its creation. Design and design documentation has been developed, a prototype of test equipment has been manufactured to ensure management rocket control. " At the same time, additional information was offered on the official site of the Cyclone-4 project, which is no longer functioning.

In general, as Sabadosh himself said in February 2016, speaking on the activities of the chair of the GKA of Ukraine on his activities: "The results are moving in the direction of increasing indicators" ...
Author:
Originator:
http://rian.com.ua/columnist/20160720/1013425954.html
68 comments
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  1. Vend
    Vend 27 July 2016 15: 31
    +4
    Ukraine has been repeating the path of Russia since the 90's. The question is why? Probably hopes that they will have a leader like Putin.
    1. Alekseev
      Alekseev 27 July 2016 15: 40
      +38
      Quote: Wend
      Ukraine repeats the path of Russia from the 90's

      And what, in Ukraine there were other 90? laughing
      She has been repeating her path since the ruins.
      Quote: Teberii
      Ruined such an industry

      And it pleases - hamadril (banderlogs) cannot be played with grenades, rockets, etc.
      1. Vend
        Vend 27 July 2016 16: 16
        +30
        Quote: Alekseev
        Quote: Wend
        Ukraine repeats the path of Russia from the 90's

        And what, in Ukraine there were other 90? laughing

        In Ukraine in the 90's there was no war, but in Russia it was. In the 90's they tried to completely tear Russia into small states, no one tore Ukraine to pieces. So in Ukraine there were other 90s.
        1. Temples
          Temples 27 July 2016 17: 43
          +4
          Quote: Wend
          Ukraine has been repeating the path of Russia since the 90's. The question is why? Probably hopes that they will have a leader like Putin.

          Leaders have already appeared there.
          And already there were several of them.

          But what path can this leader offer him?

          Or again become a part of the Russian world.
          So, as a result, a single country.
          No illusions.

          Or Europe.
          With all that it implies:
          - a fictional story;
          - nationalization (change of names and surnames, new language, etc., etc.);
          - destruction of the army;
          - the destruction of industry;
          Well and further.
          We have been observing the movement in this direction for 25 years.
        2. Orionvit
          Orionvit 27 July 2016 18: 46
          +3
          The same 90s. there was no war as in Russia, but now there is, what is the difference? The difference is that Ukraine remained in the 90s. It just rolls even lower in the 90s. to be honest, it was easier.
      2. svp67
        svp67 27 July 2016 16: 38
        +6
        hi
        Quote: Alekseev
        And what, in Ukraine there were other 90?
        Well, somewhat different from us, they had no war.
        Quote: Alekseev
        And it pleases - hamadril (banderlogs) cannot be played with grenades, rockets, etc.

        Well, they play and honestly I want it to end already. Tired, worse than steamed turnips.
      3. sandrmur76
        sandrmur76 28 July 2016 01: 25
        0
        In Ukraine, such enterprises were concentrated by the union !!! The best and everything was promoted. There are hands there, there was still easel stock and everything for the sake of it. Redistributes to the Americans merged. How many are poured there. There are enough stocks for 50 years. Is it all enough? Frauer's greed destroyed !
    2. SRC P-15
      SRC P-15 27 July 2016 15: 46
      +2
      "Results are moving towards increasing indicators" ...

      - Dulei: Brazilian indicators blew, Spanish indicators blew ... who are the next? smile
    3. Samen
      Samen 27 July 2016 15: 47
      +6
      : "The results are moving towards increasing indicators" ...

      Interesting ... What indicators? The case is not in terms of theft and cut budget funds?
    4. Monarchist
      Monarchist 27 July 2016 15: 48
      +4
      They have "cooler" shots: Pan Pedro, Yaytsenyukh (designed the new Chinese wall) Lyashko, Gadya, and the main tie taster? And the lady with the scythe, pardon the devil of the scythe, Pan Yulia? In short, there are more people who want to steer Ukraine than necessary, and unfortunately Ukraine is one
      1. Khariton
        Khariton 27 July 2016 17: 22
        0
        in the space industry of Ukraine is unlikely

        I almost choked on reading .... crying The pig industry, I can understand ..! Well, there to grow a bulb, etc.
        1. 33 Watcher
          33 Watcher 27 July 2016 17: 55
          +7
          Quote: Chariton
          in the space industry of Ukraine is unlikely

          I almost choked on reading .... crying The pig industry, I can understand ..! Well, there to grow a bulb, etc.

          And what about the idea of ​​the Mexican spaceport? Two cosmic powers found each other.
          Circus with horses. laughing
          1. 33 Watcher
            33 Watcher 27 July 2016 18: 20
            +3
            ABOUT! Judging by the minuses, someone really considers Mexico to be a space power. laughing
            1. Khariton
              Khariton 27 July 2016 18: 58
              +1
              Quote: Observer 33
              ABOUT! Judging by the minuses, someone really considers Mexico to be a space power. laughing

              Yes, a lot of these appeared on the site ... bully I won’t be surprised if Ukraine and Colombia conclude a contract ... Coke is first-class there, but there is no suitable transport! Everything fell under the table ..))))) wassat laughing crying
          2. GSH-18
            GSH-18 27 July 2016 19: 05
            +1
            And what about the idea of ​​the Mexican spaceport? Two cosmic powers found each other.
            Circus with horses. laughing

            More truly with skakkami lol
          3. kostiknet
            kostiknet 27 July 2016 22: 23
            +4
            Quote: Observer 33
            Two cosmic powers found each other.

            what a cosmos !? Winter is coming, but gas has not been pumped ... raptors of mlyn ...
        2. Alex_Tug
          Alex_Tug 27 July 2016 17: 56
          0
          The pig industry, I can understand


          Do not roll, now the pig industry as a space. The complex is served by one person. At the entrance of the pigs - at the exit of pigs. (seven month cycle)
      2. captain
        captain 27 July 2016 19: 28
        +3
        Well, why Svidomo rocket science? They will flee to their farms, from these bad factories, which the Muscovites built and will live like pans. Fat will be, vodka will be, democracy will be and what the hell are these missiles.
    5. Homo
      Homo 27 July 2016 17: 33
      +7
      Quote: Wend
      Ukraine has been repeating the path of Russia since the 90's. The question is why? Probably hopes that they will have a leader like Putin.

      The "path" is determined overseas, not Ukraine itself.
      What for? Why did they ruin Russia? Elimination of an economic competitor, creation of a sales market, land, a bridgehead, a training ground!
      But Putin did not appear thanks to and contrary to !!! hi
    6. dmi.pris
      dmi.pris 27 July 2016 20: 53
      +1
      Why repeats? There nothing has changed for the better.
      Quote: Wend
      Ukraine has been repeating the path of Russia since the 90's. The question is why? Probably hopes that they will have a leader like Putin.
  2. Teberii
    Teberii 27 July 2016 15: 31
    +5
    Ruined such an industry.
    1. Berkut24
      Berkut24 27 July 2016 18: 37
      +5
      They did not ruin the industry. They just fell out of it. For space - this is according to the results of the USSR - it was a common industry. Like aircraft, from which they also fell. Such is the volatility Svidomo ....
  3. dsm100
    dsm100 27 July 2016 15: 33
    +4
    As the saying goes: "Finita la comedy" ....
  4. Arkan
    Arkan 27 July 2016 15: 34
    +3
    And the space industry galloped. Dupuy thought when they signed the contract.
    1. Alex_Tug
      Alex_Tug 27 July 2016 15: 53
      +5
      Arkan
      Dupuy thought when they signed the contract.


      In fact, this unit was supposed to fly about 6 years ago. Then Crimea-not-ours and Yanukovych at the helm.
      1. dauria
        dauria 27 July 2016 16: 05
        +2
        and Yanukovych at the helm.


        agreement concluded at the intergovernmental level in 2003 Leonid Danilovich Kuchma .... Love your health.
  5. Altona
    Altona 27 July 2016 15: 40
    +17
    Ukrainian industry was imprisoned for cooperation with the industry of the USSR, Russia in particular. That is, it existed as part of imperial industry. Attempts to take it out of scope somehow will be very unprofitable. The West does not need this piece of industry of the USSR either; it simply has no tasks for it, and similar industries have been there for a long time. So Ukraine drags this heavy suitcase without a handle from its farm to the European station and it’s not a fact that it will drag it.
    1. Alex_Tug
      Alex_Tug 27 July 2016 15: 57
      +6
      Altona
      So Ukraine drags this heavy suitcase without a handle from its farm to the European station


      - There are carriers on the European market
      - And Brazil can buy media at least from China (cheaper) or from Russia.
  6. Flinky
    Flinky 27 July 2016 15: 42
    +14
    I do not understand, but what the hell is "Yuzhnoye" still named after Yangel? Let the name of some hetman be called, for example. They have a hundred thousand years of history, and the decommunization of the kagbe continues.
    1. Samen
      Samen 27 July 2016 15: 51
      +2
      Let the name of some hetman be called, for example

      Them. Old Man Makhno. As an option. hi
    2. Alex_Tug
      Alex_Tug 27 July 2016 18: 00
      0
      why the hell is "Yuzhnoye" still named after Yangel?


      Strategic reserve. Sell ​​for grandmas to anyone who wants to.
  7. Skubudu
    Skubudu 27 July 2016 15: 47
    +11
    The theme of the Moscow footprint in the destruction of the space industry by Nezalezhnaya is not disclosed.
  8. vit
    vit 27 July 2016 15: 51
    +6
    There is an exit! Sell ​​design bureaus for metal, build a small factory for the production of trampolines (closer to space, and your favorite national occupation can be raised to a new level!). The remaining money to share! Some solid pluses! laughing
    1. GSH-18
      GSH-18 27 July 2016 19: 13
      0
      Quote: Vit
      There is an exit! Sell ​​design bureaus for metal, build a small factory for the production of trampolines (closer to space, and your favorite national occupation can be raised to a new level!). The remaining money to share! Some solid pluses! laughing

      Aha lol And next to it is still a small pot factory in the shed to fancy!
  9. Banishing liberoids
    Banishing liberoids 27 July 2016 15: 51
    +4
    Offer your rocket to Poland -you are there with a flat, or rather, with Poland polish gums, kiss. And the Poles will pay you apples-bitten !!! wassat fool
  10. Naval
    Naval 27 July 2016 15: 52
    +7
    Why do they need rockets and a spaceport? The nation, having pulled out the Black Sea with the help of a digger stick and built the Egyptian pyramids with the help of a wooden lever, is quite capable of launching satellites synchronously jumping on the Maidan and bringing the catapult to a resonant frequency. The main thing is that it is covered with an embroidery. Sala Usraine!
  11. izya top
    izya top 27 July 2016 15: 52
    +7
    Yangel in a coffin turns over. I would live-half-dill would be shot
  12. prior
    prior 27 July 2016 15: 55
    +3
    "Results are moving towards increasing indicators" ... - a brilliant phrase to justify
    lack of result.

    There are fewer and fewer people willing to "waste money".
    Not everyone can engage in space, or rather, everyone can engage in space, but not everyone can do it ....
  13. pts-m
    pts-m 27 July 2016 15: 55
    +3
    This is tilke in cartoons of kakhlyachi Cossacks cope with any difficulty. But life is not a cartoon, although there is something from the scriptwriters.
  14. japs
    japs 27 July 2016 15: 56
    +12
    Can't find a partner? Search not for a partner, but for a cash cow. In this cyclone, you need to invest at least 3-5 lard dollars to see the result. But there is no guarantee that the money will not "dissolve in the murky Ukrainian waters".
    Therefore, there are no partners.
  15. siberalt
    siberalt 27 July 2016 16: 02
    0
    Why not start a collaboration with the space agency of Honduras? But they also strained with the dough. laughing
    1. GSH-18
      GSH-18 27 July 2016 19: 27
      -1
      Quote: siberalt
      Why not start a collaboration with the space agency of Honduras? But they also strained with the dough. laughing

      Her. For them it is still early. You need to start with Papua New Guinea, or with Eritrea, for example lol
  16. Banishing liberoids
    Banishing liberoids 27 July 2016 16: 04
    +4
    What, ended not only money, but also fools ???
    1. GSH-18
      GSH-18 27 July 2016 19: 32
      0
      Quote: Expelling Liberoids
      What, ended not only money, but also fools ???

      More precisely, in the west, fools with money ended
  17. drop
    drop 27 July 2016 16: 16
    +13
    I had 1979 enterprises under my control in Ukraine from 1989 to 12 (Ministry of Radio Industry of the USSR). None of them have been working for eight years. Thank God we had backups on the territory of the Russian Federation. Therefore, the development (of course negligible) was preserved for aviation radio electronics. OJSC "Concern East Kazakhstan region" Almaz-Antey "is tracking this. How else does the Yuzhnoye KB work. I had to go there, sorry for the specialists and their families. Here is the result of the work of Kuchma, who came from this enterprise (was the secretary of the party committee) and our Gorbachev and the drunkard of all Russia.I have the honor.
    1. sabakina
      sabakina 27 July 2016 16: 53
      +2
      Quote: Drop
      I am subordinate to Ukraine from 1979 to 1989 reptile there were 12 enterprises

      Lucky for you, you count them in boas. I'm in a parrot. Fly like a jet.
      pysy. I do not hesitate, just a joke of humor before the end of the work.
  18. Cananecat
    Cananecat 27 July 2016 16: 16
    +6
    A country where there are many wild monkeys, put up a loot country, which threw everyone for money? I applaud while standing !!! laughing
  19. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 27 July 2016 16: 17
    +2
    In general, the money has been successfully used, the RESULT is zero, the Brazilians, seeing such a thing, "jumped off", the stage of punishment of the innocent begins, since it is "not possible" to find the ends of HALF-BILLION greenery! It reminds me of something, so familiar to me! In the 90s, a memo to the racketeer: "How to buy a bank?" It turns out that you just need to sign a piece of paper - state guarantees for the loan. Further in this bank, a loan is taken under this piece of paper (on any conditions!)
    this money is used to buy up the shares of this bank (a controlling stake, and whoever does not want to sell, the killers are cheaper), and then you become the owner of this bank, and deal with the loan "in your own way." Dill is only now experiencing the "dashing 90s". Something they have delayed this process.
  20. izya top
    izya top 27 July 2016 16: 25
    +8
    and at this time ... the battle for the harvest wassat
    On Saturday night in the Nikolaev area a group of armed people came to mow wheat on a strange field near the village of Khristoforovka. The incident is reported by the police press service, where the director of the farm that processes the field complained.

    Law enforcement officers and special forces arrived at the scene. Armed persons turned out to be representatives of a security company, they stated that they act legally - on the basis of legally available documentation. However, criminal proceedings were initiated under article 186 of the Criminal Code of Ukraine (robbery).

    According to the farmer, the local edition "Crime.net" writes that two combines, two trucks, eight cars and about 40 armed guards drove into his field. Then he called the police, but upon arrival, the law enforcement officers questioned those present and left.

    In the morning, the harvesters again entered its fields, and the police were again called in. According to the publication, the deputy chief of the Main Directorate of the National Police in the Mykolayiv region Arthur Gasparov went there with special forces and operatives of the criminal investigation department.

    Towards lunchtime, the guards came into conflict with the police officers, but the conflict was suppressed by the special forces. They took away three Saiga carbines, telescopic batons and bats. Some of the offenders go to the regional department to clarify the circumstances and to carry out explanatory work.

    Combines and trucks were delivered to the penalty area.
  21. avg-mgn
    avg-mgn 27 July 2016 16: 28
    +2
    Companions, you know, I am sincerely sorry for them (Ukraine), both the people and the authorities. The people are more by an order of magnitude, two - they are unhappy due to the fact that they live in this territory (of the Fascist state) .... But they don’t want another fate, and those who want are waiting for a good uncle.
  22. Smog
    Smog 27 July 2016 16: 49
    +11
    I remember in 2014, Mamchur, "great and terrible" was walking, you bastard, on ours with a red banner in his hands and shouting, "America is with us" and something
    So, back in May 2016, the chairman of the State Space Agency of Ukraine Lubomir Sabadosh, commenting on the possibility of attaching the denounced project to partners from the United States, said: “As for RSC Cyclone-4, then this project is not on the agenda of Ukrainian-American cooperation: the market is a highly competitive market; the option of transferring the Cyclone launch site to the United States did not find adequate support from foreign government agencies and investors.
    As they say, we ate sweet berry together, bitter berry, you eat alone on the outskirts.
    Wait for new servings of buns from Aunt Nuland. Download above the Cyclone and longer.
  23. isker
    isker 27 July 2016 16: 51
    +3
    Tell me to drive five years ago that a Ukrainian - a man of the future - would never have believed! ..
    However, this is true!
    As D. Rodari wrote "She had already learned to turn on the TV and was ready for marriage ...", so the Ukrainians - for a couple of years and, except for pressing the buttons - will not be able to do anything else!
    what missiles to Honduras? what are they for the villagers? on theft and robbery - you can't build rockets, and they can't do anything else! Yuzhmash - only one laugh ... in the design bureau they pay for drawings, not for "hardware", therefore, the appearance of "active work" of a long-dead production is created!
    a living example - now the law on special confiscation is being pushed hard, stressing that it is possible to squeeze 7 billion of Yanukovych through it ... There will be a breakthrough in the economy and, in general, the sky is in diamonds! and meanwhile, only at the Odessa citadel (customs) 1 billion hryvnias (!) are stolen per month. We need money for the ATO - squeeze it from Yanukovych, we need money for the salaries to the miners - from the same Yanukovych, and so on forever ... They introduce an electronic income statement for senior officials - again, to know - what to squeeze again ...
    To steal and rob - the state way of development of the country - it was, is and wakes up!
    so - buttons, buttons and only buttons - for more, neither desire nor brains are gone!
  24. Krsk
    Krsk 27 July 2016 16: 55
    0
    it’s not sad, but bulk recycling started in / in Ukraine, in a year the federalization now offered will seem like a great chance
  25. then
    then 27 July 2016 16: 56
    +5
    It seems not to be idlers and could live.
    1. Khariton
      Khariton 27 July 2016 17: 31
      0
      Quote: sedan
      It seems not to be idlers and could live.

      They could, but the freebie corrupts ... After the collapse of the USSR, Ukraine got a rich "inheritance", unlike other former ones ... How many years have passed, and they have not yet been able to plunder and destroy everything! They are trying with the help of the USA .. . Soon at the rallies in Kiev greeting "Glory to the Farmers", "Glory to Obama"!))))) Maybe it's for the best ..! hi
      1. Alex_Tug
        Alex_Tug 27 July 2016 18: 03
        0
        , "Glory to Obama"


        Obama is already a lame duck.
  26. Executer
    Executer 27 July 2016 17: 31
    0
    Quote: Wend
    There was no war in Ukraine in the 90s

    Interesting ... And you did not hear who shot down our sides over Georgia? This, of course, is not the 90s, but in the 90s there are many examples of the participation of kaklov in the actions of militants on the territory of our anti-terrorist operation.
    There was no war on the territory of the Outskirts, and participation in conflicts is obvious.
    1. Alex_Tug
      Alex_Tug 27 July 2016 18: 06
      0
      Have you heard who shot down our sides over Georgia?


      Chain mail coupled with Buk-ami. This is not a war for Ukraine. Only blood business.
  27. mr.redpartizan
    mr.redpartizan 27 July 2016 17: 35
    +1
    Fierce surrender at the ruin. Let the satellites launch in a jump, they can do it better than anyone else in the world.
  28. Foresterer
    Foresterer 27 July 2016 17: 52
    +2
    Ukrainians themselves throw everyone in a row and are wildly offended when they themselves are thrown. You need to get used to it.
  29. fa2998
    fa2998 27 July 2016 18: 05
    +5
    Quote: Wend
    So in Ukraine there were other 90s.

    Yes, in our understanding of the 90s, Ukraine did not exist. The successful geography of Ukraine (a window to Europe) played a role in this. The country regularly received its transit income from Russian exports (gas, oil, ammonia, freight transit, etc.) She regularly received her discounts on Russian hydrocarbons, and developed her industry. At times, she also stolen and bought free gas on the market. Well, the public services were subsidized.
    In 2014, refugees from Ukraine appeared at our construction site, well, they started talking. Heating a private house (pr. 100 sq. M.) Costs them 100-150 gr. - at that time 500-750 rubles. And I paid (apartment pr. 70 m. \ Sq.) 1000-1200 rubles WHO USES YOUR OWN GAS OR IMPORTED GAS? Now the "90s" are beginning in Ukraine - and the war, and the rise in the cost of life, and foreign loans, and the lack of funds in the budget, inflation and the closure of many programs and businesses.
    Only Russia got out at the expense of its natural resources, and paid the debts, and put them in a stash. But how Ukraine will go through its "nineties" is a question !! what hi
  30. APASUS
    APASUS 27 July 2016 18: 43
    0
    Money loves silence - the main rule for Western business! Not a partocracy, autocracy, religious fanaticism did not prevent the West from making money, everyone can see the example of Saudi Arabia!
    Ukraine was destroyed by the revolution, no self-respecting company will invest in a country where there is a war, this is the lot of exchange swindlers. Talking about long money is generally ridiculous
    1. Khariton
      Khariton 27 July 2016 19: 39
      0
      Quote: APASUS
      Money loves silence - the main rule for Western business! Not a partocracy, autocracy, religious fanaticism did not prevent the West from making money, everyone can see the example of Saudi Arabia!
      Ukraine was destroyed by the revolution, no self-respecting company will invest in a country where there is a war, this is the lot of exchange swindlers. Talking about long money is generally ridiculous

      Hike business, they will soon again ask to go to Russia (Bandera will shoot for show.))))) ... Gaza nema, eat nema, so sho we had a fight with Russia? Ukraine tse Russia has known for a long time .. "Brothers, we will shave off our forelocks for you (for your ..))) ...
      Take it easy ..))))) hi
  31. v.yegorov
    v.yegorov 27 July 2016 18: 44
    0
    In short, the northern fox came to Cyclone.
  32. midivan
    midivan 27 July 2016 19: 12
    +1
    [quote = Alex_Tug] [quote] The pig industry, I can understand [/ quo now the pig industry as space. The complex is served by one person. At the entrance of the pigs - at the exit of pigs. (seven-month cycle) [/ quote]
    laughing belay damn, just like the elections to the Duma (happy) laughing
  33. AdekvatNICK
    AdekvatNICK 27 July 2016 19: 52
    +1
    they cannot use rockets by nature.
  34. Ferdinant
    Ferdinant 27 July 2016 21: 05
    +1
    It is a pity, one of the city-forming factories was.
  35. iouris
    iouris 27 July 2016 21: 27
    0
    Enough of illusions. Everyone knows in the world: Ukraine is part of a large country (large system). Need an operation to merge the country with a TV. Such a process will take two to three years.
  36. KRIG55
    KRIG55 27 July 2016 21: 33
    0
    It is a pity that the good carrier (Cyclone) was almost 100% reliable. 20 years were given to the operation of this product, so I answer for my words.
    1. Skifotavr
      Skifotavr 27 July 2016 23: 37
      0
      Quote: KRIG55
      It is a pity that the good carrier (Cyclone) was almost 100% reliable. 20 years were given to the operation of this product, so I answer for my words.

      Cyclone-4 is a new development of the Yuzhnoye design bureau, which dies before being born.
  37. AID.S
    AID.S 28 July 2016 00: 21
    -1
    Cyclone ... cyclone ..., well, well .., well, I remember! Well these were vacuum cleaners! And there were also "Rockets"! But they didn't fly either. Maybe they thought they were building a rocket, but they built a vacuum cleaner? Mixed up the drawings.
    1. Alex_Tug
      Alex_Tug 28 July 2016 00: 29
      +1
      Here's a vacuum cleaner.