Military Review

"Iron Felix": the man who saved the country from chaos and anarchy

365
"Iron Felix": the man who saved the country from chaos and anarchy 90 years ago, 20 July 1926, the legendary creator of the Soviet security and intelligence agencies, People's Commissar of Railways of the USSR and chairman of the Supreme Council of National Economy Felix Edmundovich Dzerzhinsky passed away. "Iron Felix" is associated mainly with the "Red Terror" and the position of the head of the Cheka, but he also made a great contribution to the fight against homelessness, to the development of sports in the USSR. As chairman of the Council of National Economy (VSNH), he was one of the founders of the program for the rapid rehabilitation and development of the national economy. The Dzerzhinsky economic program, in fact, became the basis for the industrialization of the Soviet Union.


Felix Dzerzhinsky was born on August 30 (September 11) of 1877 on the estate of Dzerzhinovo in the Oshmyany district of the Vilna province in the Polish small-family and large family of a noble family. Educated at the gymnasium (the course is not graduated). Young Felix was brought up, like many Poles, in hatred of Russia. In the year 1922, when Dzerzhinsky was already one of the leaders of Soviet Russia, he wrote about his childhood patriotic feelings: “As a boy, I dreamed of an invisible cap and the destruction of all Muscovites.” Felix was also a zealous Catholic and even wanted to join the Jesuit Order. However, when he began to prepare for the career of a Catholic clergyman in 16 years, he was dissuaded. He persuaded his mother and, oddly enough, a close priest to the family.

Dzerzhinsky then lost faith in God: “I suddenly realized that there is no God,” he noted later in his diary. However, he found another faith. Felix became a fan of the German Social Democratic Party. Later on Felix became an exemplary revolutionary with a typical biography. In 1895 he joined the Lithuanian Social Democratic Organization, in 1900 he joined the Social Democracy of the Kingdom of Poland and Lithuania (SDKPIL). Conducted party-subversive work in Vilna, cities of the Kingdom of Poland, in St. Petersburg. Since 1906, the representative of the SDKPIL in the Central Committee of the RSDLP. In 1906-1912 was a member of the Central Committee of the RSDLP (b). He was arrested several times, fled twice, was released several times under an amnesty. In recent years, before the revolution, 1917 was held in custody. So, in April, 1914 was sentenced to 3 years of hard labor; he was serving them in the Oryol Central. In addition, he was sentenced in 1916 to the year of 6 years of hard labor, he served her in Butyrka prison in Moscow, from where 1 was released in March 1917 of the year after the February revolution. “Iron Felix” spent a total of years of his life in hard labor and in exile 11.

Since August, 1917 has been a member of the Central Committee and the Secretariat of the Bolshevik Party. In October, 1917 - a member of the Petrograd Military Revolutionary Committee, a member of the famous meeting of the Central Committee of the Bolshevik Party, where a decision was made on an armed uprising. In the days of the October Revolution in Petrograd, he was responsible for guarding the Bolshevik Smolny headquarters, supervising the capture of the Main Post Office and Telegraph. He was Commissar of Defense from June 17 to August 31. Since November, 1917 has been a member of the NKVD RSFSR college.

At the suggestion of Lenin 7 (20) December 1917 was appointed chairman of the All-Russian Emergency Commission (VChK) under SNK RSFSR to combat counter-revolution and sabotage. The Cheka and its local bodies received the broadest powers, including the imposition of the death penalty. The Cheka used, like similar security agencies in other countries, various methods: from relatively soft - temporary isolation, expulsion of dissidents abroad, etc., to very tough - the execution of hostages, the "red terror" by the class principle, the creation of the first concentration camps . The phrase of Felix that “a man with a cold head, a warm heart and clean hands” can be a KGB officer later became legendary.

At the same time, in his personal life he was an asceticly modest and extremely hardworking man, fully immersed in the work entrusted to the party. As M.I. Latsis recalled, Dzerzhinsky “is not content with leadership alone. He longs to act. And we have often seen how he interrogates the accused himself and digs in incriminating materials. His case is so exciting that he sits out nights in the Cheka. He has no time to go home. He sleeps right there in the office behind the screen. He will eat right there, the courier brings him food, which is served by all the staff of the Cheka. ” Vyacheslav Menzhinsky wrote: “The organizer of the Cheka, in the first turbulent time, when there was neither experience ... nor people, he himself went on searches and arrests, personally studied all the details of the KGB case, so difficult for the old revolutionary of pre-war dressing, who grew together with the Cheka, which became his incarnation, Dzerzhinsky was the most stringent critic of his brainchild ".

In 1918, Dzerzhinsky supported Trotsky and the "Left Communists", opposing Lenin's position on the conclusion of the Brest Peace, regarding him as capitulatory. Since March, 1919 simultaneously headed the NKVD of the RSFSR, since August of the same year - the Special Department of the Cheka (military counterintelligence), and since November 1920 - and the border guard service. From October 1919 - Chairman of the Military Council of the Militarized Guard Forces (WOCR), from November 1920 - the troops of the VNUS (internal service). Thus, he concentrated in the hands of the main special services.

During the Soviet-Polish war and the offensive of the Red Army on Warsaw (1920) - Chairman of the Polish Bureau of the Central Committee of the RCP (B.) And a member of the Provisional Revolutionary Committee of Poland. In August-September, 1920 was a member of the Revolutionary Military Council of the Western Front. Repeatedly went to various fronts of the Civil War, where he led the fight against banditry, restored discipline among the troops. From 1921, simultaneously with the main Chekist work, he headed the commission to improve the lives of children; supervised the elimination of childless homelessness.

Unlike part of the Bolsheviks, Dzerzhinsky immediately supported the new economic policy, advocated the development of market relations. At the same time, he fully agreed with Lenin’s policy in the political sphere, aimed at eliminating any dissent and maintaining the Bolshevik monopoly on power. In the days of the Kronstadt uprising, he believed that its participants were acting on the instructions of foreign intelligence services and demanded its ruthless suppression. In 1922, he declared: “The war has ended, now we need to look especially vigilantly at anti-Soviet movements and groups, crush the internal counterrevolution, uncover all the plots of the overthrown landowners, capitalists and their henchmen.” In the same year, when the GPU was deprived of the right to impose death sentences and send political prisoners into exile, he succeeded in creating a special meeting under the NKVD (Dzerzhinsky became chairman) with the right to exile counterrevolutionaries. Thus, Dzerzhinsky became one of the organizers of the expulsion in 1922 abroad of figures of national science and culture, repression against the clergy. Strongly opposed the attempts of a number of liberally-minded Bolsheviks to transfer state security organs under the authority of the People's Commissariat of Justice of the RSFSR.

In February, 1922, in connection with the liquidation of the Cheka, became the chairman of a new organization, the Main Political Directorate (GPU) under the NKVD of the RSFSR. At the same time he became People's Commissar of communications. Since September 1923, the chairman of the OGPU under the SNK of the USSR. He was repeatedly elected a member of the Organizing Bureau of the Central Committee of the RKP (b).

Since 1922 was a supporter of Stalin in his struggle, Trotsky. Leon Trotsky noted on this point: “On 1921, or maybe 1922, Dzerzhinsky, extremely proud, complained to me with a note of submission to fate in a voice that Lenin did not consider him a political figure. “He does not consider me an organizer, a state man,” insisted Dzerzhinsky. Lenin was not enthusiastic about the work of Dzerzhinsky as the people's commissar of communications. Dzerzhinsky really was not an organizer in the broad sense of the word. He tied employees to himself, organized them with his personality, but not with his method ... On 1922, Ordzhonikidze and Dzerzhinsky felt dissatisfied and largely offended. Stalin immediately picked up both. "

After Lenin's death (January 1924), he was appointed head of the commission of the Central Election Commission of the USSR on the organization of funerals. Dzerzhinsky insisted, contrary to the objections of the widow of the late Krupskaya, on embalming the body of the deceased. Under his leadership, as soon as possible, a mausoleum was built, which became one of the main symbols of Soviet civilization. Since February, 1924, leaving the post of chairman of the OGPU, headed the All-Russian Council of National Economy (VSNKh) of the USSR, almost all of the country's economy was under its control. As chairman of the Supreme Economic Council, he brought to his work experienced specialists with pre-revolutionary education, continued to support market reforms, allow free prices, and put an end to pressure on the peasantry. This caused a deep conflict with opposition leaders Zinoviev and Kamenev.

The essence of the dispute was about the ways and methods of industrialization, how to turn a huge agrarian, peasant country that had just finished rebuilding the economy after the difficult years of the First World War, the Civil War and the Entente's intervention, into an industrial, highly developed country. It was obvious to sensible personalities that the conquests of October, the socialist system could be maintained only under the condition of creating a highly developed industry.

The “Left Opposition” insisted: for industrialization, it is necessary to rob the “muzhik”, to strip to the last thread, to the last penny. Like, only this will allow to find the necessary funds for the development of heavy industry. In reality, such a position meant a break between the peasantry and the working class, which in the country - for the most part still peasant - threatened with a new peasant war and the defeat of the revolution (under the conditions of an external hostile environment). Therefore, Dzerzhinsky sharply criticized this position: “If you listen to you ... then ... as if there is no union of workers and peasants here, you do not see this union as the basis of Soviet power, under the dictatorship of the proletariat, which consciously leads the country to a specific goal, to socialism ... This completely erroneous political bias can be murderous for our industry and for the whole of Soviet power. ”

20 July 1926 of the year at the plenum of the Central Committee on the state of the economy of the USSR, Dzerzhinsky delivered a two-hour report during which he looked sick. In it, he again sharply criticized representatives of the opposition, Pyatakov, whom he called "the largest industrial disorganizer", and Lev Kamenev, whom he accused of not working, but engaged in politicking. Because of a nervous breakdown, he became ill. On the same day, he died of a heart attack.

Later, the myth was created that Stalin was guilty of the death of Dzerzhinsky. However, Stalin had nothing to do with the death of Dzerzhinsky. On the contrary, he, apparently, suspected that something was wrong and demanded that the doctors he trusted conduct a thorough autopsy and study of the causes of death. There is a version that Dzerzhinsky, like Frunze, was eliminated by the so-called. "Trotskyists" as one of the figures that supported Stalin.

Dzerzhinsky was a major figure not only as a “security officer No. 1”, but also as the head of the entire national economy. Under his leadership was the entire industry, which was in the stage of recovery. Stalin personally recommended him for the post of chairman of the Council of the National Economy, with whom Dzerzhinsky had very good personal and business relations. Dzerzhinsky was convenient for Stalin not only because he supported his policies, but also because he was a supporter of the rapid recovery and development of the economy and was well versed in economic matters.

Dzerzhinsky developed a very promising "locomotive" program, the essence of which was the immediate deployment of locomotive engineering in the USSR (that is, engineering). According to the informed opinion of Iron Felix, the program made it possible to fully load locomotive plants, which in turn dramatically tightened other related industries. In particular, locomotive engineering requires the advanced development of metallurgy. And on the basis of the intensive growth of the metallurgical industry, it becomes possible to sharply intensify the metalworking industry, and accordingly saturate the market with metal products, ensure the profitability of the state industry, acquire working capital for the restoration and development of industry. Thus, Dzerzhinsky planned to make a locomotive a “locomotive” of Soviet economic growth. Stalin, who was also well-versed in economics, unreservedly supported this plan.

It is clear that the Trotskyists immediately opposed the plans for the restoration of the Russian economy. First of all, subsequently shot by people's commissar of finance G. Ya. Sokolnikov (Brilliant). He insisted not only on a drastic reduction in the financing of the industry development program, which Dzerzhinsky put forward, but also on preserving the function of distribution of all funds allocated to industry for the people's commissariat of finance. As we see, the Trotskyist Sokolnikov is almost indistinguishable in its views from the current Russian liberals, who are stifling the economy, science and education of the country with “optimization” (reduction of expenses).

In response, Dzerzhinsky proposed a program of radical transformations in the management system of the metallurgical industry, the essence of which was to concentrate and centralize management. The same program contained a paragraph with the idea of ​​a single industrial budget. The invention is very simple, but equally effective. State industry part of the profits handed over to the state. The People's Commissariat of Finance projects the state budget, in which there is a string of financing for the industry as a whole. But the distribution of industry financing is already carried out at the Presidium of the Supreme Economic Council, in accordance with the objectives of industrial development.

With the support of Stalin, the Dzerzhinsky program was approved by a decision of the Politburo of the Central Committee of the CPSU (B.). It was based on the following principles:

- the main task of industrialization is the rapid growth in the production of steel and iron;

- the main economic goal is the construction of a powerful machine-building industry that will be able to carry out an economic revolution in the country;

- the main political goal of these economic transformations is to overthrow the economic power of the peasantry by creating large-scale commodity industries based on the large-scale use of machinery and equipment produced in Soviet factories;

- the main method of industrialization - the concentration of industrial management in one headquarters and the concentration of state capital in a single industrial budget;

- the main method of industrialization: a) large-scale development planning of entire industries in their interrelation and mutual influence on each other; b) development together with the large metallurgical and machine-building industry of related and related sectors of the economy;

- the main character of industrialization - the concentration of production at the largest factories and the construction of the largest and most modern enterprises. Thus, Dzerzhinsky anticipated the foundations of future industrialization.

At the same time, his inherent energy, Dzerzhinsky, was actively involved in the titanic work on the economic transformation of the country and achieved excellent results. So, when he headed the VSNH, 1,55 million tons of pig iron, 1,623 million tons of steel were smelted in the USSR, 1,396 million tons of rolled products were produced. As of 20 in July, 1926, when Dzerzhinsky was gone, iron smelting in the country amounted to 2,2 mln. Tons, steel - 2,9 mln. Tons, rolled steel - 2,2 mln. Tons. That is, the growth was 55-70%! When Dzerzhinsky headed the Supreme Economic Council, the entire 45 domain and 115 open-hearth furnaces operated in the country. After itself "Iron Felix" left 53 working blast furnaces and 149 open-hearth furnaces. Under him, Yenakievsky, Donetsk-Yuryevsky them were put into operation and put into operation. Voroshilov and Konstantinovsky metallurgical plants in the south and five metallurgical plants in the Urals, more than 400 other enterprises of different industries were re-commissioned and put into operation. Under Dzerzhinsky, the foundation was laid for the metallurgical plant in Kerch, the plants for agricultural engineering in Rostov and Zlatoust, etc. In 1926, for the first time, the load of the USSR plants exceeded the level of 1913 of the year, making 101%. In the same year, the USSR entered the 7-place for the production of pig iron and the 6-place for the production of steel in the world.

It is clear that the success of Stalin and Dzerzhinsky in the development of the country infuriated Trotsky and other "Trotskyist internationalists" who explicitly or by default worked for the West, solving the problem of turning Russia into a backward raw periphery of the "world community." They did everything possible to sabotage the successful development of Soviet industry, which turned Russia-USSR into one of the leading world powers, guaranteeing its independence. Therefore, Dzerzhinsky and became another target of Trotsky and his supporters. They organized his persecution at all levels. As a result, Dzerzhinsky’s health did not endure (and he didn’t have good health), or according to one of the versions, he organized a “heart attack”, having poisoned “the security officer No. 1”. And then the loud death was blamed on Stalin, as in a number of other cases.

It is also worth noting that Dzerzhinsky interfered with the Trotskyists and as the head of the security organs. Dzerzhinsky retained a tremendous influence on the state security organs, since, despite all the workload at the Supreme Economic Council, Felix Edmundovich remained the chairman of the United State Political Administration (OGPU) at the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR. Inside the OGPU, a kind of parallel leadership has already taken shape, which was carried out by the deputy of “Iron Felix” G. G. Yagoda, a relative of the once powerful Central Executive Committee chairman Ya. M. Sverdlov (a famous Russophobe and agent of influence of the West). He made a group - KV Pauker, MI Guy, and others. When Dzerzhinsky died, Stalin managed to put his man at the head of the OGPU - V. R. Menzhinsky. He planned to put organs under strict party-state control. However, the effect of this personnel maneuver turned out to be small as Menzhinsky was seriously ill, so the Yagoda group managed to maintain and even strengthen their positions. Thus, before the arrival of Beria, who cleared these “Augean stables”, the security organs became a stronghold of the Trotskyists, because of this, a large number of innocent people suffered during the “cleansing”.

Thus, the point of view imposed on 1991 by the enemies of the Soviet project and civilization cannot be accepted that Dzerzhinsky is a “bloody ghoul”, which was marked only by “red terror” against “innocent” nobles, White Guards, intelligentsia, priests, etc. “Iron Felix” was the builder of the Soviet statehood (there was no other then, because the Russian Empire was destroyed, and in return the Liberal Democrats could not offer anything worthy) and did it in the most critical areas. This is one of the people who saved Russia from chaos, anarchy, gangster lawlessness and the invasion of foreign invaders. Felix Edmundovich really fought against the enemies of the people and built a new Soviet civilization, a society based on the idea of ​​social justice. Dzerzhinsky was one of the founders of the program of Soviet industrialization, on the foundation of which Russia still holds. Apparently, therefore, Dzerzhinsky and causes a feeling of hatred among modern liberals.
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  1. Mordvin 3
    Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 06: 53
    +3
    Comrade Samsonov. Have you studied the material well? And then I heard that about a warm heart, a cold head, and clean hands - he told me how to pickle cucumbers. smile Companions (drinking companions) liked. Or is it a slap of liberals? fellow No.
    1. Kos_kalinki9
      Kos_kalinki9 20 July 2016 07: 48
      +23
      Quote: mordvin xnumx
      Comrade Samsonov. Have you studied the material well? And then I heard that about a warm heart, a cold head, and clean hands - he told me how to pickle cucumbers. smile Companions (drinking companions) liked. Or is it a slap of liberals? fellow No.

      Well, well. And probably the one who sat with him at the same table and ate vodka at that ????
      An eyewitness to the events, so to speak.
      1. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 09: 43
        +2
        Quote: Kos_kalinki9
        Well, well. And probably the one who sat with him at the same table and ate vodka at that ????
        An eyewitness to the events, so to speak.

        They wrote about this in Komsomolskaya Pravda. And in the Rossiyskaya Gazeta they wrote that when Dzerzhinsky, along with Trotsky and the company (I don't remember exactly who was there), chased the Russian gold that the White Guards had dragged away, and slowed down on the island of Sviyazh (near Kazan), they argued over who to erect the monument , Judas, or Satan. Judas won, because I quote, "Judas is closer to the working class than Satan." The monument was demolished in a quiet area in the mid-20s.
        1. Nikita Gromov
          Nikita Gromov 20 July 2016 10: 34
          +3
          There is nothing meaner and more disgusting to whitewash the executioner and the murderer of hundreds of thousands of Russian people. This article, like many others, Mr. Samsonov and others like him, is aimed at idealizing and even heroizing the unprecedented Jewish Bolshevik genocide against the Russian people, organized by that cannibalistic system in a planned manner. Who has kept in mind the memory of our ruined ancestors, this article is an open mockery of their memory.
          1. Gardamir
            Gardamir 20 July 2016 13: 59
            +19
            There is nothing meaner and more disgusting to whitewash the executioner and the murderer of hundreds of thousands of Russian people
            what about the Mannerheim board? What about Kadyrov’s bridge? By the way, over the Kadyrov bridge http://www.fontanka.ru/2016/07/18/112/
            1. Paranoid50
              Paranoid50 20 July 2016 21: 52
              +7
              Quote: Gardamir
              what about the Mannerheim board?

              Well, we'll figure it out about the board, no jokes. For now, I repeat, for now, the local authorities are given a chance to recognize this harsh jamb and correct it. Although, judging by how abruptly the "responsible" mor ... persons have evaporated, we are waiting in vain. It turned out that this "dazibao" has no owner, from the word "absolutely". Well, okay ... No one will "sew" extremism and vandalism, but hooliganism ... so serve a day, if anything - across the road, in the same place on Zakharyevskaya. Believe me, Leningrad has not forgotten, and it has not forgiven.
          2. Petr petrov
            Petr petrov 21 July 2016 08: 55
            +6
            Better immediately billions .... !!!!!
            "The more lies, the better they believe in it" ........ they were not true !!!!!!!
          3. Monarchist
            Monarchist 21 July 2016 10: 48
            -6
            Ober-lieutenant, I agree with you in rejection of liquid-bolvism: they destroyed the Russian Empire! F.E. has a sea of ​​sins in his soul, but what I agree with Samsonov-F.E. was a good organizer
          4. kalibr
            kalibr 22 December 2016 13: 41
            0
            "Samsonovshchina" - one word!
        2. faiver
          faiver 20 July 2016 10: 40
          +18
          Thank you, he laughed, but the people are naive in our country, which they don’t write in the newspaper believes everything ...
          1. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 11: 01
            +2
            Quote: faiver
            Thank you, he laughed, but the people are naive in our country, which they don’t write in the newspaper believes everything ...

            You can laugh further, only the base from the monument with the inscription "Judas Iscariot" is still preserved. Or do you think "Rossiyskaya Gazeta" is not a serious source? The photos were printed there. About 10 years ago. He was stunned when he saw.
            1. faiver
              faiver 20 July 2016 11: 14
              +16
              photo in the studio, what's the problem? Google did not find, but it gave out a bunch of links with a refutation of this myth ...
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 12: 53
                +3
                I could not find it myself. It seems that Iron Felix woke up and cleaned up the whole tyrnet. sad Yes, and everywhere denials pushed.
                1. Stas57
                  Stas57 20 July 2016 13: 07
                  +18
                  Quote: Mordvin 3
                  I could not find it myself. It seems that Iron Felix woke up and cleaned up the whole tyrnet. Yes, and everywhere denials pushed

                  of course, it’s hard to find something that is not there, because there was serious research, and it turned out that alas, there is no monument to Judas or Lucifer.
                  there are no facts other than the work of the newspaper.

                  for example
                  http://rdp4v.livejournal.com/2040596.html
                  http://wiki.istmat.info/миф:памятник_иуде
                  http://alexey1789.livejournal.com/3477.html

                  believe less in apocrypha, especially newspaper and Snychev
                  1. Mordvin 3
                    Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 13: 24
                    +2
                    Stas, because you saw with your own eyes a photo of the foundation of the monument. With an inscription . If I knew, I would save it. Or did I dream about that photo? I don’t seem to have glitches yet.
                    1. Stas57
                      Stas57 20 July 2016 13: 59
                      +9
                      Quote: Mordvin 3
                      Stas, because you saw with your own eyes a photo of the foundation of the monument. With an inscription . If I knew, I would save it. Or did I dream about that photo? I don’t seem to have glitches yet.

                      now we will see this, does this mean its real existence ?.
                      1. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 14: 31
                        +2
                        Quote: Stas57
                        now we will see this, does this mean its real existence ?.

                        And who knows. One British scientist (please do not laugh) believes that people need to sit quietly, like mice on planet Earth, because it is not known what space is preparing for us. A strange signal was recorded from some kind of star system. But people have been sending radio signals for a hundred years, and therefore sitting quietly will not work. Or maybe the enemy fleet with such freaks, like you have in the picture, is already racing at full speed to capture our planet, observing the radio silence mode. Then we will definitely not be up to revolutions. laughing
                      2. Kos_kalinki9
                        Kos_kalinki9 20 July 2016 17: 51
                        +9
                        Efremov, Lem, Bradbury, Asimov and the Strugatsky brothers are resting and nervously smoking aside after your post. drinks
                      3. Svidetel 45
                        Svidetel 45 21 July 2016 00: 49
                        +2
                        Well, why, on the topic of this post, how many films have Hollywood already put, such as "Star Wars"?
                    2. Alex
                      Alex 20 July 2016 18: 47
                      +5
                      Quote: Mordvin 3
                      And who knows. One British scientist ...

                      Vladimir, it's good to be kidding, you know: asgards are good guys, they will protect us from the goaulds.
                  2. Alex
                    Alex 20 July 2016 18: 44
                    +3
                    Quote: Stas57
                    now we will see this, does this mean its real existence ?.

                    A good photo of Asgard Thor in the sarcophagus of Apophis. Well, ЗВ-1 is not in vain spending money. wink
        3. Kos_kalinki9
          Kos_kalinki9 20 July 2016 17: 48
          +1
          only the base of the monument with the inscription "Judas Iscariot" is still preserved

          Here recently, according to Ren.TV, they talked about aliens, and to what cunning journalists came to, they presented photos. request Like this fellow
        4. Svidetel 45
          Svidetel 45 21 July 2016 00: 46
          +6
          Well, of course, a "serious" newspaper, won't a serious newspaper receive grants from overseas? Of course not, but the fact that Rossiyskaya Gazeta receives grants is confirmed by Roskomnadzor in Izvestia dated April 22, 16. And we should not forget that in the Government, whose official media body is Rossiyskaya Gazeta, we have more than enough de-Stalinization and de-Sovietization figures, so rely on strictly objective information in this newspaper and swallow it like semolina without chewing. in my opinion not worth it.
          1. Monarchist
            Monarchist 21 July 2016 11: 01
            0
            In "RG" there are bends, this is true.
      2. Roy
        Roy 20 July 2016 11: 42
        +11
        The fact that the closest comrades-in-arms of Lenin of Jewish nationality were in the highest state and party positions now is no longer in doubt. Trotsky, Kamenev, Zinoviev, Sverdlov Y., Sverdlov V., Sokolnikov, Volodarsky, Sklyansky, Ganetskiy, Radek, Steklov, Berry, Lomov, Streinberg, Yakovlev, Saks, Ryazanov, Schlichter, Theodorovich, Litvinov, Troyanovskaya, Adoratsky, Vladimir Gukovsky, Danishevsky, Lozovsky, Kozlovsky, Krestinsky, Olminsky, Manuilsky, Uritsky, Dzerzhinsky, Yaroslavsky ... Such a selection of personnel can not be called random.
        1. Kaiten
          Kaiten 20 July 2016 12: 31
          +12
          Quote: Roy
          in the highest state and party positions were the closest associates of Lenin of Jewish nationality,

          So now this nationality is in power. When, finally, the indigenous nationality will rule itself.
          1. Roy
            Roy 20 July 2016 13: 39
            +4
            Then, when the power of this nationality ruling since 1917 will be overthrown. There is no other way.
            1. Gardamir
              Gardamir 20 July 2016 14: 13
              +6
              1917, nationality
              Can the Germans think better before 1917?
            2. Kaiten
              Kaiten 20 July 2016 18: 28
              0
              Quote: Roy
              Then, when the power of this nationality ruling since 1917 will be overthrown. There is no other way.

              Jews in Russia 0.07%, do you think this is a serious obstacle for Russians to finally take their fate into their own hands?
              1. bastard
                bastard 20 July 2016 19: 27
                +7
                Quote: Kaiten
                Jews in Russia 0.07%, do you think this is a serious obstacle for Russians to finally take their fate into their own hands?

                And then again squeals about the Holocaust? No, we will go the other way!
                And the percentage will be more, only lawyers and their children more than 0.07% will be typed. And also artists, economists, traders, liberalists. . .
                The darkness is dark, although you often met among your brother people of the highest degree decent and not Zionists. I will not divulge the names, otherwise you yourself will decide them.
                1. Kaiten
                  Kaiten 21 July 2016 06: 59
                  -2
                  Quote: villain
                  And then again squeals about the Holocaust? No, we will go the other way!

                  and what is he like? voice ...
                  Quote: villain
                  And the percentage will be more, only lawyers and their children more than 0.07%

                  fear has big eyes. the numbers of Jews in Russia are not secret. and they can easily be seen on many statistical sites in Russia.

                  Quote: villain
                  And also artists, economists, traders, liberalists. .

                  and ascribe to a bunch of doctors and teachers. and everything will be like Pol Pot in Kampuchea.
            3. Svidetel 45
              Svidetel 45 21 July 2016 00: 56
              +4
              Are you sure that until 1917, power in Russia belonged to an indigenous nationality, beginning from the emperor himself and ending with many state and military ranks who came from abroad, maybe Russified, but still, but many Jews became in their spirit maybe more Russian than some Russians, for example, I am more respected by the Jew General Rokhlin than the Russian former Prime Minister Kasyanov.
            4. Petr petrov
              Petr petrov 21 July 2016 09: 04
              +1
              I wonder .... and who until 17 ruled us ...... really clean (Aryans) sorry ..... clean "Muscovites" .... !!! -
        2. tatra
          tatra 20 July 2016 12: 52
          +9
          Yes, all the enemies of the communists are the same in the false mentality.
          You always tear out from the general and the whole only that which is beneficial to you, and expose it as the general and the whole.
          Lists such as the lists of A. Dikogo, where the Jews are in the SNK, the All-Russian Central Executive Committee, etc. almost 90% are obtained in a very prosaic way. Firstly, this is a record in the Jews of those who are not. Secondly, this is a reduction in one list of people who were part of the SNK, the All-Russian Central Executive Committee, etc. at different times.
          And thirdly, it is the removal of Russians from the lists. It is impossible not to note a couple more details that from the book of A. Dikiy migrate into her like. These are absolutely fantastic people's commissariats, such as the evacuation commissariat, state land or denominations. ... At the head of these fictitious Commissariats are fictitious people who, and how could it be otherwise, "are" Jews.
          1. PHANTOM-AS
            PHANTOM-AS 21 July 2016 00: 58
            +2
            Quote: tatra
            Yes, all the enemies of the communists are the same in the false mentality.
            You always tear out from the general and the whole only that which is beneficial to you, and expose it as the general and the whole.

            Tatra, I applaud you! Bravo!
            +100500 good
        3. Gardamir
          Gardamir 20 July 2016 14: 12
          +4
          This selection of frames can not be called random.
          That's right. Here is another selection for you, so-called guess yours what is common between them, Smirnov Vladimir Alekseevich, Yakunin, Kovalchuk Yuri Valentinovich, Shamalov Nikolay Terentyevich, Myachin Victor Evgenievich, Fursenko SA, Fursenko A. A. Zubkov Victor.
        4. PHANTOM-AS
          PHANTOM-AS 21 July 2016 00: 54
          +4
          Quote: Roy
          The fact that the closest comrades-in-arms of Lenin of Jewish nationality were in the highest state and party positions now is no longer in doubt.

          Stop dragging Lenin into Jewish conspiracies.
          It's a bullshit.
      3. NordUral
        NordUral 20 July 2016 13: 05
        -2
        So it was in the 80s.
    2. NordUral
      NordUral 20 July 2016 13: 04
      0
      You also read the wrong ones ...
    3. pin313
      pin313 20 July 2016 16: 35
      +2
      You never know what and where they wrote. A bad word is written on the barn, and there is firewood.
    4. Kos_kalinki9
      Kos_kalinki9 20 July 2016 17: 44
      +6
      Mordvin 3 (1) RU Today, 09:43 ↑
      This was written in the Komsomol. And in the Russian newspaper they wrote

      I won’t even argue. I will answer you with the words of the Bulgakov hero of Professor Preobrazhensky.
      1. captain
        captain 20 July 2016 18: 30
        +1
        Lenin wrote in 1914 that we would turn the imperialist war into a civil war. And we must pay tribute to his achieved. True, it was necessary to destroy first the tsarist army, and then Russia. When they destroyed the "old world to its foundations," it turned out that slogans would not be enough and they began to build a "new world." They built a new one, which collapsed after seventy years. The conclusion can be made classic; break not build.
        1. tatra
          tatra 20 July 2016 18: 33
          +3
          Quote: captain
          Lenin wrote in 1914 that we would turn the imperialist war into a civil war. And we must pay tribute to his achieved. The truth had to destroy at first the tsarist army, and then Russia.

          How much stupidity and lies.
          This is some kind of surrealism, among the enemies of the Communists in the USSR there is not a single honest and adequate person.
        2. Svidetel 45
          Svidetel 45 21 July 2016 01: 15
          +4
          Just do not need to ascribe to the Bolsheviks what they could not do, destroy the imperial army, according to the recollections of the former generals of this army, all this Bolshevik propaganda inflicted damage no more than mosquito bites on an elephant, but whoever really began to destroy the army is temporary the government, only its decree No. 1 of which stood, which abolished what any army of the world rests on - subordination and one-man management.
        3. NordUral
          NordUral 21 July 2016 09: 28
          +2
          The Russian army was not destroyed by Lenin; history needs to be known.
          And Lenin built a new world with Stalin. And to destroy is to Comrade Trotsky and K.
        4. The comment was deleted.
      2. NordUral
        NordUral 21 July 2016 09: 26
        +1
        As was right, professor, we read and heard enough, heard enough in the second half of the 80s. Still hiccups the majority and the country (now countries, unfortunately).
    5. Petr petrov
      Petr petrov 21 July 2016 08: 52
      +1
      Hmm .......
      What kind of nonsense you have not heard enough in the last 30 years ..... !!!!!!
  2. The comment was deleted.
  3. PKK
    PKK 20 July 2016 16: 47
    +7
    He worked to improve the lives of children and really did the right thing. The modern major, except how to ride Gelika on anything that is not capable of.
  • NordUral
    NordUral 20 July 2016 13: 03
    -1
    Not the ones you listen to ...
  • siberalt
    siberalt 20 July 2016 13: 16
    +14
    What? Samsonov can write quite objectively! I read it with steel with pleasure. Although, for our generation, there is nothing new in it. We read ZhZL, not the current yellow "Komsomol members".
    Respect to the author!
  • THE_SEAL
    THE_SEAL 20 July 2016 18: 00
    +5
    I am confused in the article by the following moment: "Dzerzhinsky was brought up from childhood in hatred of everything Russian." I don’t think he changed a lot when he reached maturity. As well as Zinoviev, Kamenev and others. After reading the comments, I come to the conclusion that the Civil War is not over yet. She is in the minds. And once again, the Western countries will benefit from this in a certain scenario. Ukraine is a prime example.
    1. tatra
      tatra 20 July 2016 18: 05
      +1
      Quote: THE_SEAL
      “The civil war is not over yet.”

      The civil war ended in the USSR, and the enemies of the Communists, starting with Gorbachev, who launched monstrous slander against the Communists in the late 80s to justify the capture of Soviet Communists by the enemies, unleashed it again.
      1. cdrt
        cdrt 21 July 2016 00: 13
        +2
        Quote: tatra
        Quote: THE_SEAL
        “The civil war is not over yet.”

        The civil war ended in the USSR, and the enemies of the Communists, starting with Gorbachev, who launched monstrous slander against the Communists in the late 80s to justify the capture of Soviet Communists by the enemies, unleashed it again.


        True communist resourcefulness.
        One movement Secretary General of the Communist Party, posed by the heir Andropov and approved by the communist elite, became the enemy of the Communists :-))))
        As soon as the Communists dodge, to wash their white dog
        1. tatra
          tatra 21 July 2016 00: 32
          +4
          Quote: cdrt
          One movement Secretary General of the Communist Party, appointed by the heir

          This is for you, the enemies of the Communists, resourcefulness and a MENTAL propensity for betrayal.
          You always betray both normal people who believed you, and each other, and even your "Liberators" and benefactors - Gorbachev and Yeltsin, betrayed them, threw them to us, supporters of real communists who never betrayed their party and its beliefs, as unnecessary garbage.
          Where did you come from?
          You are all Russophobes, you have proved that you don’t care about the Russian Empire, the Romanovs, you slandered the Soviet period to justify your capture of the USSR, by the post-Soviet period you’re all “innocent”.
          You proved by what you did, said and wrote that you do not need not only socialism, but also the System, as in your adored West, and capitalism in general.
          You want only as occupiers, without taking any responsibility for the country, to pump resources and money from the country and people.
    2. Svidetel 45
      Svidetel 45 21 July 2016 01: 21
      +2
      It will never end, as long as there is injustice and untruth in society, it, a civil war, will only flare up, then, if it is possible to suppress the "disaffected", smolder for the time being.
  • bazalt16
    bazalt16 20 July 2016 21: 28
    0
    Svanidze and Tsypkova overheard
  • avvg
    avvg 20 July 2016 06: 56
    +27
    In my opinion, it is necessary to return the "Iron Felix" to the Lubyanka.
    1. Beefeater
      Beefeater 20 July 2016 23: 52
      0
      In general, then the triples must be returned.
      They grabbed a sentence on the street, immediately sentence, in the evening they smeared his forehead with green paint and spanked. The beauty.
      1. Svidetel 45
        Svidetel 45 21 July 2016 01: 25
        +2
        So, after all, there was a civil war, and in a war as in a war, everything according to the laws of wartime, without a jury and lawyers, it was like this at all times and in all countries, not good, but such is the reality.
        1. Simpsonian
          Simpsonian 21 July 2016 01: 38
          +1
          There was an ethnic cleansing of the Russians, the unarmed population was destroyed mainly the intelligentsia and the Cossacks, as its advanced parts.
          Stalin, who destroyed most of those who did this, was in fact a "counter-revolutionary".
          1. Alexey T. (Oper)
            Alexey T. (Oper) 21 July 2016 08: 27
            -1
            Quote: Simpsonian
            There was an ethnic cleansing of the Russians, the unarmed population was destroyed mainly the intelligentsia and the Cossacks, as its advanced parts.
            Stalin, who destroyed most of those who did this, was in fact a "counter-revolutionary".

            Cossacks = unarmed population? Yes, you're straight captain Obviousness ....
            1. Simpsonian
              Simpsonian 22 July 2016 02: 32
              -1
              About the destruction of the Cossacks, about "decossackization", read something ...
              1. Alexey T. (Oper)
                Alexey T. (Oper) 22 July 2016 08: 19
                +1
                I'm not interested in reading anything. I am interested in reading documents. And even in the decree on raskazachivaniya said that the fight should not be fought with the Cossacks as such, but only with a rich stratum opposed to the new government.
                I hope the right of the authorities to reconcile legitimate violence for self-defense against enemies is not in doubt?
                1. Simpsonian
                  Simpsonian 22 July 2016 18: 18
                  -2
                  You are simply not interested, you are the "same" opera ...
                  1. Alexey T. (Oper)
                    Alexey T. (Oper) 22 July 2016 18: 32
                    +1
                    Quote: Simpsonian
                    You are simply not interested, you are the "same" opera ...

                    Firstly, I don’t remember having a drink with you on brotherhood and switching to “you”.
                    Secondly, there is essentially nothing to object, so you decided to try to transfer the conversation to a discussion of my personality? Well, this trick is familiar to me. negative
                    1. Simpsonian
                      Simpsonian 22 July 2016 18: 42
                      -1
                      Well, if only I was drinking, I remembered it for sure. Nobody objected to you, they essentially wrote.

                      the one who is now trying to deny the genocide of the Cossacks cannot be a good person - with such "on you" is not necessary.
      2. V.ic
        V.ic 30 September 2016 06: 36
        +1
        Beefeater "In general, the three must be returned. They grabbed it on the street, immediately the verdict,"

        The Yeltsinoids in October 1993, during the blockade of the "White House", did without triples, and for some reason high-ranking officials "from the USSR" for some reason hung from folders and jumped through the windows ... Have you already forgotten about leaving military equipment and weapons in Chechnya? It was enough for two companies ... If you read your magpie chirping, the hand itself reaches for the shotgun!
  • Shiva83483
    Shiva83483 20 July 2016 07: 03
    +32
    I don’t want to justify, let alone blame the iron Felix, the man was in his place, and he solved the problems by the methods that were appropriate at that time ... the cherubs did not serve tea in the White Guard and counterintelligence either ...
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 07: 45
      +1
      Quote: Shiva83483
      .In the White Guard and counterintelligence, too, the cherubs did not serve tea ...

      Not angels, I agree. But in the Cheka at that moment demons served! Most of the liberal nationality, and not only. And they destroyed the Russian people in batches, first of all the part that is called the elite in all countries (the fact that the elite played too much is another question).
      The question is - do people of non-titular nationality decide the fate of the country by such methods? hi
      P.S. The complex and controversial figure of Dzerzhinsky. For the first time I did not give Sasha a rating for the article.
      1. Alexey T. (Oper)
        Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 08: 17
        +4
        Can you confirm your allegations with links to real documents?
        1. tasha
          tasha 20 July 2016 08: 42
          +2
          What charges do you require evidence for?

          If you are talking about the "red terror", what documents do you need? Search and read Soviet newspapers of 1918. Lists of those who were shot were published in regional publications. To deny the "Red Terror" is simply stupid and criminal.
          One can argue only about its causes and necessity.
          1. PHANTOM-AS
            PHANTOM-AS 20 July 2016 09: 21
            +11
            Quote: tasha
            To deny the "Red Terror" is simply stupid and criminal.

            Red terror was the answer to white terror! Anti-Bolshevik and anti-Soviet forces tried to destroy the leaders of the Bolshevik movement with their sympathizers. And here are quotes:
            "Now I've seen enough of what the whites are doing in the Vyatka province, they left one horse in 30 houses, otherwise they took everything away. The workers were shot, and the corpses were burned at the stake. The peasants there pay high taxes, they take 1000 rubles from the poor. The whites stabbed more than 300 people. , regardless of the women and children who have a son, the whole family is massacred. Where the Reds were buried, they were torn out, poured over with kerosene and burned "(Vyatka province, July 14, 1919).
            “In Siberia, there is now the tsarist old regime. All the bourgeois, capitalists, landowners, generals and admirals sat down again on the necks of the peasants and workers. The peasants are strangled with taxes, such taxes have been imposed on the peasants that it is impossible to pay in any way. rub." (Vyatka province, July 60, 26).
            "Denikin is committing terrible atrocities. A terrible panic began in the Denikin army, because partisan troops are beginning to organize in the villages" (Kursk province, July 28, 1919).
            1. PHANTOM-AS
              PHANTOM-AS 20 July 2016 09: 29
              +11
              Quote: PHANTOM-AS
              One can argue only about its causes and necessity.

              The Bolsheviks first tried to avoid terror. The II All-Russian Congress of Soviets abolished the death penalty The arrested enemies of the Soviets were released on parole - not to fight the new government (for example, Generals Krasnov, Marushevsky and others who did not keep their word were released). The Soviet government began to use the death penalty for political opponents in June 1918, when the Civil War broke out. The anarchist element manifested itself. Anarchists were temporary fellow travelers of the Bolsheviks in overthrowing the power of the bourgeoisie. But they acted uncontrollably. Thus, under the leadership of anarchists, sailors of the Black Sea Fleet destroyed about 500 officers in Crimea in January 1918. At the same time, spontaneous and anti-Soviet forces rose. In Cossack regions, Cossacks, for example, began to destroy nonresident - peasants requiring the redistribution of all lands, including Cossacks. In May, the rebellious Orenburg Cossacks captured the village of Alexandrov Gai of the Samara province. Immediately shot captured by the Red Army - 97 people. On the advice of local kulaks, they began reprisals against supporters of Soviet power. In total, about 800 people were killed.
              When the Socialist-Revolutionary governments appeared, state white terror began. In Samara, about 300 people were killed during the coup. During the capture of Syzran by Czechoslovakians and the army of Samara Komuch - 500, during the capture of Volsk - 800. The Samara government created a punitive body - the State Guard, in addition, counterintelligence of the People's Army of Komuch, Czechoslovakia and Serbs acted. All of them arbitrarily arrested not only supporters of the Soviets, but for the slightest suspicion of disloyalty, they shot anyone without any trial who they considered necessary. The prisons of the Samara government were crowded, so the first concentration camps in the history of Russia, in the Totsk military camps, appeared on the territory of Komuch. Used to keep arrested barges.

              The Socialist-Revolutionary West Siberian government launched terror even more brutally, on the territory of which the officers of the old army and the White Cossacks actively showed themselves. In September 1918, peasants of the Slavgorod district in Altai revolted. They refused to give conscripts to the Siberian army, captured Slavgorod. On September 11, ataman Annenkov's punitive detachment arrived in Slavgorod. On this day, punitive captured, tortured, shot, hanged 500 people. They burned down the village of Cherny Dol, where the rebel headquarters were burnt.
              -----
              Kolchak, the favorite of the current rulers, was especially fierce! Planted by the Entente as the supreme ruler, Gauleiter!
              On November 8, 1918, the Directory was overthrown in Omsk — the Socialist-Revolutionary Government. The power passed to the British creature - Admiral Kolchak. At the insistence of the Entente, he was declared the Supreme Ruler of Russia. December 3, 1919 Kolchak signed a decree on the widespread use of the death penalty for attempted assassination of the health and life of the Supreme Ruler, for the fight against the white regime.

              After the coup, the Kolchakites began to arrest and destroy the Social Revolutionaries overthrown by them. On December 22, a group of Bolsheviks and soldiers attacked a prison in Omsk and released those arrested. Some of the Social Revolutionaries, about 60 people, decided to return to prison, hoping that the "legitimate authority" would justify them. But at night the convoy brought them to the ice of Irtysh and shot them. In total, in connection with the events of December 22, Kolchakites in Omsk destroyed one and a half thousand people, the corpses of the dead were taken out in bulk in sleighs, like cattle carcasses.

              and in the Urals and Siberia there were mass arrests. At the end of 1918, there were 914 thousand prisoners in Siberian concentration camps, 75 thousand in prisons. There were still prisons and concentration camps of other White governments. For comparison: in Soviet Russia at that time there were a little more than 42 thousand prisoners, of which 2 thousand were in concentration camps.
              1. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 10: 00
                +1
                Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                The Bolsheviks first tried to avoid terror.

                Impressions of eyewitnesses on all railways November-December 1917 are about the same. “What a journey! Everywhere executions, everywhere the corpses of officers and ordinary inhabitants, even women, children. Revolutionary committees were rampant at the train stations, their members were drunk and fired at the bourgeois on cars. A little stop, a drunken brutal crowd rushed onto the train, looking for officers (Penza-Orenburg) ... The corpses of officers were lying all the way (on the way to Voronezh) ... I was pretty scared, especially when I saw corpses out the window, right in front of the house in the snow officers, - I examined them in horror, - obviously cut with sabers (Millerovo) ... The train started off. On this terrible way back, what a chilling horror! - in front of our eyes, on the platforms, eight officers were shot. We then saw fifteen officers being led, along with the general and his wife, somewhere along the railway track. In less than a quarter of an hour, gunshots were heard (Chertkovo). The same at art. Volnovakha and others ... He was taken out of the carriage to the station building, swollen and, leaving only in underpants, was taken to a room where there were already about 20 people in the same form. It turned out almost all the officers. They learned their fate - the execution, as it was last day with fifty arrested (Kantemirovka). ”
                1. Alexey T. (Oper)
                  Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 10: 16
                  +6
                  Dear, what relation to the events of November-early December of the 1917 of the year does the Cheka have, whose head was Dzerzhinsky? It was formed only December 20 1917 year. Moreover, the first commission appeared only in Petrograd.

                  Were the Chekists really so omnipotent that already in November they managed to chop down officers in Millerovo, Voronezh, Orenburg?
                  1. Ingvar 72
                    Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 10: 23
                    +2
                    Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
                    Dear, what relation to the events of November-early December of the 1917 of the year does the Cheka have, whose head was Dzerzhinsky?

                    If you are more attentive, you will see that we are a Phantom Ace talking about the origins of the "Red Terror". The topic is "passing".hi
                    1. Turkestan
                      Turkestan 20 July 2016 10: 56
                      +5
                      I AM ABOUT WHITE

                      . General Greves, commander of the American expeditionary forces in Siberia, did not share these enthusiasms. Further, I quote the book of the Americans M. Sayers and A. Kahn "The Secret War against Soviet Russia."
                      “Every day, his (Graves) intelligence officers supplied him with new information about the kingdom of terror, which Kolchak established. There were 100 thousand soldiers in the admiral’s army, and new thousands of people were recruited into it under the threat of execution. Prisons and concentration camps were packed to capacity.
                      1. Aleksander
                        Aleksander 20 July 2016 11: 17
                        +2
                        Quote: Turkestan
                        . General Greves, commander of the American expeditionary forces in Siberia, did not share these enthusiasms. I quote the book further Americans M. Sayers and A. Kahn "Secret war against Soviet Russia." “Every day, his (Graves) intelligence officers supplied him with new information about the kingdom of terror, which Kolchak established.

                        WERE DARKER could not find?

                        Michael Sayers (1911-2010) and Albert Kahn (1912-1979) - YEAR OF BIRTH is visible? In Siberia NEVER BEEN.

                        Two Jews from Ireland and England, first anarchists, then Communist Party of the United States Kang-generally Soviet intelligence officer. yes Good "witnesses"! lol

                        Graves is a Bolshevik litter that impeded arms supplies to Kolchak.
                        He LOSED the courts in the USA about the "atrocities" he had described in Siberia.
                      2. MrK
                        MrK 20 July 2016 13: 54
                        +8
                        Quote: Aleksander
                        Graves is a Bolshevik litter that impeded arms supplies to Kolchak.


                        Well, Graves doesn't like it - take another general like Knox
                        The English general Knox, military adviser to Admiral Kolchak, wrote to his government in July 1919: "You can defeat the million-strong army of the Bolsheviks, but when 150 of millions of Russians do not want white, but want red, then aimlessly help the white».

                        But this is not the problem. The trouble is that they didn’t finish your game with you in 37. Nothing is yet to come.
                      3. Aleksander
                        Aleksander 20 July 2016 21: 09
                        -11%
                        Quote: mrark
                        But this is not the problem. The trouble is that they didn’t finish your game with you in 37. Nothing still ahead.


                        Alas dull communal losers-suckers, everything is already behind. laughing Communism is like a shabby tiger: with torn fangs and claws clipped: it seems to growl, but it’s funny to everyone, and everyone sticks him on a silly head with a stick.

                        your power Myself ate itself and quietly died and just for 70 years. lol
                        What to do - the natural end of a stillborn genetic commodorets request

                        By Knox-Bring This quote from any english library
                        Or your knox (unlike historical) didn't speak english? laughing

                        PS Usefulness of primary sources, rather than the usual Dumb kommagitki, so as not to look really stupid. hi
                      4. PHANTOM-AS
                        PHANTOM-AS 21 July 2016 00: 15
                        +2
                        Quote: Aleksander
                        Alas, the dull communal losers-suckers, everything is already behind. Communism is like a shabby tiger: with torn fangs and claws clipped: it seems to growl, but it’s funny to everyone, and everyone sticks him on a silly head with a stick.

                        The more I read something like this mmmmm .... (no public words), the more I gain a foothold in communist views.
                        Thank you and write more in the same vein, and the red terror and the dictatorship of the proletariat are just around the corner.
                        She's like a bone in your throat. Really? wink
                      5. Aleksander
                        Aleksander 21 July 2016 09: 18
                        -1
                        Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                        The more I read something like this mmmmm .... (no public words), the more I gain a foothold in communist views.


                        How long can you “strengthen yourself? belay How many years have been "strengthened", but all the same it is necessary to "strengthen! lol Maybe it's time laxative accept in the form of the truth about crime of crime? wink
                        Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                        and the Red Terror and the dictatorship of the proletariat are just around the corner. It’s like a bone in your throat.


                        I repeat once again:

                        Communism is a shabby tiger with torn fangs and clawed claws: it seems to growl, but it’s funny to everyone and everyone sticks it on a silly head with a stick.


                        Today you are no longer afraid of anyone, moreover, you are ridiculous and absurd with your "dictatorship" of the non-existent proletarian. laughing -
                        "Costumed" in one word lol
                    2. MrK
                      MrK 21 July 2016 11: 13
                      -1
                      Quote: Aleksander
                      Alas, the dull communal losers-suckers, everything is already behind.


                      So far yours have won, but not because the communist idea is bad. And because the destruction of this idea was launched from above and was carried out by the top of the traitors from the Communist Party.

                      «The transition from capitalism to socialism, warns V. I. Lenin, is a whole historical era. Until it ends, the exploiters will inevitably have hope for restoration, and this hope will turn into attempts at restoration.».
                      So you restored it. While restored.
                      But you cannot kill the idea of ​​social justice. For this idea is in the genes of the peoples of Russia.
                      And that means that time will pass and again crowds of people will seek and shoot thieves-bourgeois, as well as “good people” eating scraps from their tables
                      And the eternal train will go down the earth again.
                      Because the people for you are dandruff, which according to Griboedov "... you can tear at the stable, rape in the kitchen and" sell one by one».
                      And the people will not forgive you. How not forgiven in 1917.
                2. The comment was deleted.
                3. Zulu_S
                  Zulu_S 21 July 2016 09: 53
                  +1
                  My comment yesterday was deleted. Probably for using the name of the body part of the body that is, but not a word. (::: pa there, but no words), as in a famous song. Therefore, in other words:
                  Quote: Aleksander
                  Michael Sayers (1911-2010) and Albert Kahn (1912-1979) - YEAR OF BIRTH is visible? In Siberia, there have never been.

                  You, dear, were not in this part of the body, but do you know that it is dark there?
                  With best wishes.
              2. The comment was deleted.
            2. Alexey T. (Oper)
              Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 11: 02
              0
              Quote: Ingvar 72
              Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
              Dear, what relation to the events of November-early December of the 1917 of the year does the Cheka have, whose head was Dzerzhinsky?

              If you are more attentive, you will see that we are a Phantom Ace talking about the origins of the "Red Terror". The topic is "passing".hi

              The origins of red terror must be sought in white terror.
        2. Turkestan
          Turkestan 20 July 2016 10: 53
          +12
          A few quotes.
          White General Kornilov: "We went to power to hang, but we had to hang to come to power."
          American General Graves: “In Eastern Siberia, for every person killed by the Bolsheviks, there were a hundred people killed by anti-Bolshevik elements.”
          US officers Sayers and Kahn: "Hundreds of Russians who dared not submit to the new dictator (Kolchak) hung on trees and telegraph poles along the Siberian Railway."
          Russian writer William, who fought in the Denikin army: “In the middle of the village they dug a pole, tied it (the Red Army) higher; They wrapped a rope around the skull, stuck a stake through the rope and - a circular motion! At the end, the soldiers refused to turn, gentlemen, the officers took up. And suddenly we hear: crack! - the skull box shook ... An instructive sight. "
          Yeah, the sight is really instructive. Especially for those who listen with tenderness to songs about the noble lieutenants of the Golitsins and the Cornets of Obolensk. Please note: the soldiers could not stand it, refused, and these, "their nobility", gladly brought the torture to a spectacular ending. An instructive spectacle for Denikin’s current admirers, under whose leadership atrocities were committed in Novorossiysk, both in the dungeons of Denikin’s counterintelligence and right on the streets.
          1. Wayna qhapaq
            Wayna qhapaq 20 July 2016 13: 45
            +4
            Yes, the admiral was a rare villain.
            1. Zulu_S
              Zulu_S 20 July 2016 18: 20
              +2
              The admiral was, according to some reports, a good sailor. But as the Supreme Ruler of Russia, it turned out to be a terrible evil for her. From the series "Deliver me from such friends, and I can handle the enemies myself."
        3. Felix99
          Felix99 20 July 2016 12: 50
          +3
          This is precisely the beginning of the civil war - complete anarchy. What political forces did the shooters represent at the time you indicated? The Bolsheviks came to power in October (according to the old style) in November-December 1917 - complete anarchy and anarchy, almost no one has yet decided who for whom.
        4. The comment was deleted.
          1. The comment was deleted.
        5. Zulu_S
          Zulu_S 20 July 2016 17: 53
          +6
          Are you surprised by the abundance of memoirs about red terror? Most of the peasants did not leave their memoirs. Most were illiterate. The Russian elite needed illiteracy. The present, however, too. That ran. What they fought for.
    2. tasha
      tasha 20 July 2016 09: 34
      +1
      Do not be so categorical
      Red terror was the answer to white terror!


      Here is an excerpt from the speech of V.I. Lenin at the V Congress of Soviets
      We are told that when they shoot at the Dzerzhinsky’s commission, it’s good, but if the court openly says in the face of the whole people: he is a counter-revolutionary and worthy of execution, then this is bad. People who have come to such hypocrisy are politically dead. (Applause.) No, a revolutionary who does not want to be a hypocrite cannot refuse the death penalty. There was not a single revolution and era of civil war in which there would be no executions.


      Those. V.I. Lenin, unlike you, does not see the need to justify the elimination of entire classes by revenge for the cruelty of certain representatives of these classes. For him, terror is a mandatory feature of every revolution, severe and necessary.
      1. PHANTOM-AS
        PHANTOM-AS 20 July 2016 09: 48
        +7
        Quote: tasha
        Those. V.I. Lenin, unlike you, does not see the need to justify the elimination of entire classes by revenge for the cruelty of certain representatives of these classes. For him, terror is a mandatory feature of every revolution, severe and necessary.

        You distort and take the phrase out of context!
        And here is what Comrade Stalin said:
        When the Bolsheviks came to power, they first showed in relation to
        softness to your enemies.
        The Mensheviks continued to exist legally and
        released their newspaper. The Socialist Revolutionaries also continued to exist legally and had
        your newspaper. Even the cadets continued to publish their newspaper. When the general
        Krasnov organized a counter-revolutionary campaign against Leningrad and fell into our
        hands, then under wartime conditions we could at least hold him in
        captive, moreover, we; should have shot him. And we released him
        "on my word of honor." And what? It soon became clear that such softness
        only undermines the fortress of Soviet power. We made a mistake by showing
        similar softness towards the enemies of the working class. If we
        repeated this mistake further, we would have committed a crime in relation to
        to the worker: the class, we would betray his interests. And it soon became;
        absolutely clear. It soon became clear that with what; softer we relate to our
        enemies, the more resistance these enemies have. Soon the right Socialist-Revolutionaries -
        Gotz and other right-wing Mensheviks organized in Leningrad
        counter-revolutionary action of the junkers, as a result of which many
        our revolutionary sailors. The same Krasnov, whom we released "on
        word of honor, "organized the White Guard Cossacks. He teamed up with
        Mamontov and for two years led an armed struggle against the Soviet
        authorities. It soon turned out that agents were standing behind these white generals.
        Western capitalist states - France, England, America, as well as
        Japan. We were convinced of how we were mistaken, showing gentleness. We got it
        from experience that these enemies can be dealt with only if
        apply the most ruthless suppression policy to them.
        ("Conversation with the German writer Emil Ludwig" v.13 p.108.)
        1. bober1982
          bober1982 20 July 2016 10: 04
          +1
          Comrade Lenin, of course, hung noodles on the ears of a German comrade.

          Krasnov never was the organizer of the campaign to Petrograd, the instigator was Kerensky, Krasnov only obeyed, he reacted negatively to this campaign itself, and it was impossible to call it a campaign — there was something operetta.
          The counter-revolutionary action of the junkers was the beating and killing of children, in fact, there was no mass death of sailors, they were engaged in looting at that time.
          No White Guard Cossacks existed, they were on their own, and their gene organized them.
          Agents of all countries could not stand behind Krasnov, it was the Germans who stood behind him, the Japanese behind Semenov, etc., and you put everything in one heap (or Comrade Lenin brings down)
          1. Turkestan
            Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 07
            +6
            The coming to power of supporters of the Constituent Assembly in the Volga cities in the summer of 1918 was accompanied by reprisals against many Party and Soviet workers, a prohibition on the Bolsheviks and left Socialist-Revolutionaries from serving in power structures. In the territory controlled by Komuch, state security structures, military courts were created, and death barges were used
            On September 3, 1918, the workers ’performance in Kazan was severely suppressed, and on October 1 in Ivashchenkovo. As an employee of KOMUCHA S. Nikolayev reports, “the regime of terror took especially cruel forms in the Middle Volga region through which the movement of Czechoslovak legionnaires took place”
            In 1918, under the “white” government in the northern territory with a population of about 400 thousand people, 38 thousand were arrested, of which about 8 thousand were shot, more than a thousand died from beatings and illnesses.
          2. Alexey T. (Oper)
            Alexey T. (Oper) 21 July 2016 08: 35
            -2
            Quote: bober1982

            The counter-revolutionary performance of the junkers - this was the beating and killing of children)

            What kind of children? By 1917, cadet schools at 3 / 4 were staffed with soldiers and non-commissioned officers - front-line soldiers nominated to receive an officer rank. So they can be considered children only by misunderstanding.
        2. tasha
          tasha 20 July 2016 10: 05
          +4
          Do not Cry. What am I distorting?

          We are showered with a hail of accusations that we are acting in terror and violence, but we are calm about these attacks. We say: we are not anarchists, we are supporters of the state ...

          We say: we need firm power, we need violence and coercion, but we will direct it against a handful of capitalists, against the class of the bourgeoisie. For our part, coercive measures will always follow in response to attempts - insane, hopeless attempts - to resist the Soviet regime. And in all these cases, the responsibility for this will fall on the resistance.


          For in the era of the revolution, the class struggle inevitably and inevitably took the form of civil war in all countries, and civil war is unthinkable without the destruction of the gravest form, nor without terror, nor without the constraint of formal democracy in the interests of war.


          Those working classes that for centuries have been oppressed, clogged, forcibly clamped in the grip of poverty, ignorance, and savagery cannot make a revolution without error. And the corpse of bourgeois society, as I had already pointed out once, cannot be pounded in a coffin and buried in the ground


          Her servants accuse us of terror ... The English bourgeois forgot their 1649, the French their 1793 year.


          And you have somehow finely ...

          Please, try to understand what is actually being discussed and only then object. Good?
        3. Turkestan
          Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 03
          +3
          The first battle of the army, organized and received its current name [Volunteer], was an attack on Gukov in half of January. Releasing the officer battalion from Novocherkassk, Kornilov admonished him with the words: “Do not take these villains to me! The more terror, the more victory will be with them! ”Subsequently, he added to this harsh instruction:“ We are not fighting a war with the wounded! ”
      2. Was mammoth
        Was mammoth 20 July 2016 10: 18
        +3
        Quote: tasha
        For him, terror is a mandatory feature of every revolution, severe and necessary.

        "Any revolution is worth something only if it knows how to defend itself ..."
      3. Svidetel 45
        Svidetel 45 21 July 2016 01: 45
        +1
        There is no need to lie, Lenin never called for the total physical destruction of representatives of the class of the nobility and the bourgeoisie, but for the destruction of the CLASS of the nobility and the bourgeoisie, that is, whoever does not work, he does not eat, which means he must work for the good of society, and then he will no longer belong to the class of exploiters. And mind you, Lenin says "... and if openly ... the COURT says ...", that is, according to the court, if there is a crime that deserves such a punishment. And you can recall how many of the nobility, the intelligentsia went to cooperate with the new government, for example, in the Red Army, up to 50% of the middle and top echelon of the command staff were former.
    3. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 09: 54
      +4
      Quote: PHANTOM-AS
      Red terror was the answer to white terror!

      You are confusing causes and effects. The concept of "red terror" was first introduced by the Socialist Revolutionary Zinaida Konoplyannikova, who declared at the trial in 1906
      "The party decided on the white, but bloody terror of the government, to respond with red terror ..." And they later legalized -
      Council of People's Commissars of the RSFSR

      DECISION
      from 5 September to 1918 year

      ABOUT RED TERROR

      The Council of People's Commissars, having heard the report of the Chairman of the All-Russian Extraordinary Commission for the Suppression of Counter-Revolution, Speculation and Crime on the job on the activities of this Commission, finds that in this situation, ensuring the rear through terror is a direct necessity; that in order to strengthen the activities of the All-Russian Extraordinary Commission for the fight against counter-revolution, speculation and crime in office and to make it more systematic, it is necessary to send as many responsible party comrades as possible there; that it is necessary to ensure the Soviet Republic from class enemies by isolating them in concentration camps, that all persons touching the White Guard organizations are to be shot, conspiracy and rebellion; that it is necessary to publish the names of all executed, as well as the grounds for applying this measure to them.

      People's Commissar of Justice
      D.KURSKIY

      People's Commissar
      In Internal Affairs
      G. PETROVSKIY

      Manager
      Council of People's Commissars
      V. BONCH - BRUEVICH

      Pay attention - a man a year ago who came to power as a result of a conspiracy and rebellion calls for executions! And under the king they were planted maximum.
      Let's talk about razachachivanie?
      The directive of January 24, 1919 to the Organizing Bureau of the Central Committee of the All-Union Communist Party of Bolsheviks, signed by Sverdlov, “Conduct mass terror against the wealthy Cossacks, destroying them without exception; to conduct a merciless mass terror against all Cossacks in general who took any direct or indirect part in the struggle against the Soviet power. It is necessary to apply all those measures to the average Cossacks that give a guarantee against any attempts on his part to new actions against the Soviet power. Confiscate bread and force to pour all the excess into the indicated points ... Take all measures to help the resettled immigrant poor, organizing resettlement, where possible. Equalize the newcomers from “nonresident” to the Cossacks in land and in all other respects. To carry out complete disarmament, shooting everyone who will be found weapons after the deadline ... "
      How do you like such measures?
      Rosalia Zalkind is already tired of remembering. Does the "White" have its counterpart?
      1. PHANTOM-AS
        PHANTOM-AS 20 July 2016 10: 27
        +2
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Does the "White" have its counterpart?

        Kolchak is a pure "angel", by his order, Red Army men and peasants sympathizing with the Red Army were hung on every lamp post from the Urals to the Far East.

        PS. I apologize, there is a lot of work, we will discuss later.
        with respect hi
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 10: 45
          +3
          Quote: PHANTOM-AS
          Kolchak is a pure "angel", by his order, Red Army men and peasants sympathizing with the Red Army were hung on every lamp post from the Urals to the Far East.

          Video Red terror in the Crimea. Postscript A. A. Pushkov. hi
          1. Zulu_S
            Zulu_S 20 July 2016 18: 35
            +2
            What, then already filmed on video?
          2. tatra
            tatra 20 July 2016 18: 40
            0
            And why so sharply "shifted the arrows" from Kolchak? Unprofitable?
            The phrase of the commander of the American intervention forces in Siberia, General W. Graves: “In Eastern Siberia, there were terrible killings, but they were not committed by the Bolsheviks. I will not be mistaken if I say that in Eastern Siberia for every person killed by the Bolsheviks, there were 100 people killed by anti-Bolsheviks. elements ".
            “I doubt that it would be possible to point out any country in the world over the past fifty years where murder could be committed with such ease and with the least fear of responsibility, as in Siberia during the reign of Kolchak ... The soldiers of Semenov and Kolmykov, being under protection of Japanese troops, flooded the country like wild animals, killed and plundered the people "
          3. PHANTOM-AS
            PHANTOM-AS 21 July 2016 00: 33
            0
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            Video Red terror in Crimea. Postscript A. A. Pushkov.

            With whom? with pushkov? Igor, how can you trust this colleague of the Mechino-Svanidzov camarilla?
            This gentleman, along with a certain guard, is an example of anti-journalism for me; they smell something bad from them.
            You read Pushkov’s biography at your leisure, I highly recommend it and hope that it will cease to be an authoritative source for you and a source in general.
            Here is a short excerpt for seed:
            ---
            In 1988-1991 he was a speechwriter for Mikhail Gorbachev.
            ---
            In 1993-2000, he was a member of the editorial board of the American journal Foreign Policy, published by the Carnegie Endowment in Washington [6] [7]. In 2004, he was a member of the Supervisory Board of the Carnegie Moscow Foundation [8].
            ---
            Since 1993 - Member and Permanent Expert of the World Economic Forum in Davos.
            ---
            Since 2002, he has been a member of the editorial board of the American journal National Interest, published by the Center for the National Interest in Washington [6]. Since 2005, is a member of the London International Institute for Strategic Studies [7].
            In 2009, he won the Bunin Prize for the book Putin's Swings. Postscript: ten years surrounded. ”
            ah ha ha

            In 2011, elected to the VI State Duma of the VI convocation according to the lists of the party "United Russia"without being a member of it [9] [10]. Appointed Chairman of the State Duma Committee on Foreign Affairs [11]. Member of the faction "United Russia" in the State Duma.[1] [7]
            I hope you have something to think about.
      2. Turkestan
        Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 12
        +1
        In the territories controlled by P.N.Krasnov, the total number of victims in 1918 reached more than 30 thousand people. “I forbid to arrest workers, but I order them to be shot or hanged; I order all the arrested workers to be hanged on the main street and not to be taken off for three days. ”
        1. sherp2015
          sherp2015 20 July 2016 12: 17
          -2
          Quote: Turkestan
          In the territories controlled by P.N.Krasnov, the total number of victims in 1918 reached more than 30 thousand people. “I forbid to arrest workers, but I order them to be shot or hanged; I order all the arrested workers to be hanged on the main street and not to be taken off for three days. ”

          Well this is a blatant Zionist lie! - Hutspa!
  • PHANTOM-AS
    PHANTOM-AS 20 July 2016 09: 32
    -1
    Quote: tasha
    To deny the "Red Terror" is simply stupid and criminal.
    One can argue only about its causes and necessity.

    Kolchakites began the robbery of Siberian peasants, the resistance was brutally suppressed. How did white punishers behave? “After hanging out a few hundred people at the gates of Kustanai, shooting a little, we spread to the village,” the captain of the dragoon squadron from the Kappel Frolov corps told, “... the villages of Zharovka and Kargalinsk were burnt, where all the peasants had to shoot all the peasants for sympathy with Bolshevism from 18 to 55 years, after which let the "rooster". Further, the captain reported on the execution of two or three dozen men in the village of Borovoye, in which the peasants met the punishers with bread and salt, and the burning of part of this village ... Kolchakites with their atrocities turned the Siberian peasantry against themselves so that a powerful guerrilla movement arose here. 150 thousand partisans helped the Red Army to expel Kolchakites and interventionists from Siberia. Other White Guard governments also behaved cruelly. Terror against supporters of the Reds and Soviets was used by interventionists, fists, greens, nationalists.

    That is why the Soviet government declared red terror in response to the White Terror of September 2, 1918. There are statistics about his victims, although incomplete. The Cheka and its local commissions shot 1918 people in September - December 6300, and 1919 in the first seven months of 2089. Their anti-advisers do not believe and exaggerate. Of course, other Soviet bodies also carried out executions. White governments did not keep records of people destroyed by the White Guards. Although the scale of their terror was many times greater than the size of the red terror. General Grevs, commander of the corps of American interventionists in Eastern Siberia, wrote in his memoirs in 1922: “Terrible murders were committed in Eastern Siberia, but they were not committed by the Bolsheviks, as they usually thought. I’m not mistaken if for every person killed by the Bolsheviks, there were a hundred killed by anti-Bolshevik elements. ” This is a subjective view.

    characterizes objectively the ratio of the scales of white and red

    terror. Keep in mind that White had to suppress resistance

    the majority of the people, and the red - the minority.

    Finally, the Bolsheviks also showed mercy. Beginning in May 1918, the All-Russian Central Executive Committee announced amnesties for revolutionary holidays to prisoners, especially peasants and workers involved in anti-Soviet uprisings.
    1. Turkestan
      Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 16
      +2
      In total, in 22 provinces of Central Russia, counterrevolutionaries killed 1918 Soviet workers in July 4141. According to incomplete data, in the last 7 months of 1918, on the territory of 13 provinces, the White Guards shot 22 people, and the total number of victims of "kulak" uprisings in the Soviet Republic exceeded 780 thousand people by September 1918
      1. Aleksander
        Aleksander 20 July 2016 12: 28
        0
        Quote: Turkestan
        In total, in 22 provinces of Central Russia, counterrevolutionaries killed 1918 Soviet workers in July 4141. According to incomplete data, in the last 7 months of 1918, on the territory of 13 provinces, the White Guards shot 22 people, and the total number of victims of "kulak" uprisings in the Soviet Republic exceeded 780 thousand people by September 1918


        Yes in 20 provinces of Russia occurred 245 anti-Bolshevik popular uprisings. In Central Russia in the summer months of 1918, the resistance of the peasants resulted in 130 protests against local councils, 154 self-defense against food detachments, 73 uprisings; plus mass refusals by non-commissioned officers of a number of provinces (Oryol, Kursk, Voronezh) from appearing at recruiting stations.

        And it is true folk performances against usurpers of power countrywide, and not the ub. laconic BOP 25.10.17.
        Quote: Turkestan
        in the Soviet republic


        And why did people have to recognize the power of the party that managed on elections of CSSwho did not recognize the will of this people, expressed in the elections, dispersed the DC and the FORCE established a dictatorship?
    2. potroshenko
      potroshenko 20 July 2016 12: 34
      +3
      Quote: PHANTOM-AS
      characterizes objectively the ratio of the scales of white and red

      terror. Keep in mind that White had to suppress resistance

      the majority of the people, and the red - the minority.

      where do you copy it all from?
      1. PHANTOM-AS
        PHANTOM-AS 21 July 2016 00: 38
        -2
        Quote: potroshenko
        where do you copy it all from?

        How about that? or in the case, for review, so to speak wink
        http://www.proza.ru/2010/01/12/1237
        Read Courland's book.
        rummage in archives.
        Good luck hi
  • Alexey T. (Oper)
    Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 10: 06
    +1
    For everyone: for the ethnic composition of the Cheka, for the executions of Russians in "packs" that were allegedly carried out by the Chekists, for the executions of the elite (it is not bad for a start to understand who the author of the message understands by this term). Specifically.
    1. bober1982
      bober1982 20 July 2016 10: 18
      0
      By Bolshevik standards, the elite are those who did not have dirt under their nails, and they were subject to execution, as a class element alien to the proletarians.
      1. Verdun
        Verdun 20 July 2016 11: 35
        +9
        Quote: bober1982
        By Bolshevik standards, the elite are those who did not have dirt under their nails, and they were subject to execution, as a class element alien to the proletarians.

        You, dear man, do not hang noodles on people's ears. My great-grandfather was a nobleman by class and an engineer by training. Great-grandmother - a midwife well-known throughout Saint Petersburg who took birth in the families of many wealthy merchants. From your point of view - the elite. If it were the way you think, I wouldn’t communicate with you on the site now. They would have shot both and in my place would someone else. But in reality, everything turned out quite differently. The ancestors supported the revolution, like many of the officers, nobles, and intelligentsia. During the Tambov rebellion, my grandfather was in his area - he became ill with typhus. And all the events took place before his eyes. And when I asked him why such cruel suppression measures were taken, I answered with a story about how in the village where he was, the rebels brutally murdered a family - a communist father, a mother and four children, from a year to seven years old. Just for being a communist family. There was such a time - concluded the grandfather - or we them, or they us.
        1. bober1982
          bober1982 20 July 2016 12: 04
          0
          I did not expect such a comment from you. So your glorious ancestors have switched to the side of the Bolsheviks - there is nothing strange,.... like many of the officers, nobles, intelligentsia ..Then many still finished off, but that was later.
          And subsequently finished off and such as Menzhinsky, the successor of Dzerzhinsky.
          Vyacheslav Rudolfovich himself was a noble, subtle connoisseur of poetry, close to an artistic bohemian man. That did not stop him from destroying his own kind. With special voluptuousness.
          1. Verdun
            Verdun 20 July 2016 13: 06
            +7
            Quote: bober1982
            I did not expect such a comment from you. So your glorious ancestors went over to the side of the Bolsheviks - there is nothing strange ....

            Well, firstly, my ancestors did not side with the Bolsheviks, but they themselves were communists. Moreover, ideological communists who crawled into the party not for the sake of benefits and careers. They did not make a political career, but a professional one, thanks to their skills and knowledge.
            . Then many still finished off, but that was later.
            Yes, many. But more often than not, it was not related to politics. Just someone in their purely personal interests, eliminated from their path interfering people. It has always been so, and the communist idea has nothing to do with it. It was just that civil war made these methods of elimination more stringent. At the same time, I do not justify such methods. But you need to understand that in civil wars there is no one guilty party. this is the essence of any civil war, that in Russia, that in the USA. There is one more important aspect. Decisive and energetic actions during such wars, with all their cruelty, reduce the total number of possible victims. After all, there is nothing worse than civil wars and riots lasting for decades.
    2. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 10: 20
      +7
      Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
      For all: the national composition of the Cheka

      Dzherzhinsky Pole, both of his deputies were Jews - Trilisser and Berry. Menzhinsky is the same Pole. Uritsky Jew. Most of the leading positions of the Cheka are not Russian. In general, the list of the first revolutionaries is not full of Russian surnames.
      Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
      on the executions of Russians in "packs" that were allegedly carried out by the Chekists, on the executions of the elite

      Allegedly? Have you heard of Trotsky's armored train? About Rose "Countryman"? Orders from Sverdlov, Trotsky, Uritsky in the internet are full.
      1. MrK
        MrK 20 July 2016 11: 00
        +8
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Dzherzhinsky Pole, both of his deputies were Jews - Trilisser and Berry.

        And today, the Government of Russia is entirely Russian. Only their socks matzoh smell.
        1. Kaiten
          Kaiten 20 July 2016 14: 24
          -2
          Quote: mrark

          And today, the Government of Russia is entirely Russian. Only their socks matzoh smell

          Putin receives instructions from Natanyahu. Khutspa, damn it.
      2. sherp2015
        sherp2015 20 July 2016 12: 19
        +1
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
        For all: the national composition of the Cheka
        Dzherzhinsky Pole, both of his deputies were Jews - Trilisser and Berry. Menzhinsky is the same Pole. Uritsky Jew. Most of the leading positions of the Cheka are not Russian. In general, the list of the first revolutionaries is not full of Russian surnames.
        Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
        on the executions of Russians in "packs" that were allegedly carried out by the Chekists, on the executions of the elite
        Allegedly? Have you heard of Trotsky's armored train? About Rose "Countryman"? Orders from Sverdlov, Trotsky, Uritsky in the internet are full.



        Ingvar Regards !!
        Please have more information about these scum here on VO ...
      3. Verdun
        Verdun 20 July 2016 13: 19
        +4
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        In general, the list of the first revolutionaries is not full of Russian surnames.

        In general, Russia is a multinational state. And the names are different. And Poland until 1917 was part of the Russian Empire and the Poles were the same citizens as the rest. As for Jewish surnames ... From the point of view of the Jews themselves, nationality is transmitted by mother. Therefore, the Jewish surname does not mean anything yet. Moreover, millions of Jews live with completely Russian surnames.
      4. Alexey T. (Oper)
        Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 22: 44
        +1
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
        For all: the national composition of the Cheka

        Dzherzhinsky Pole, both of his deputies were Jews - Trilisser and Berry. Menzhinsky is the same Pole. Uritsky Jew. Most of the leading positions of the Cheka are not Russian. In general, the list of the first revolutionaries is not full of Russian surnames.
        Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
        on the executions of Russians in "packs" that were allegedly carried out by the Chekists, on the executions of the elite

        Allegedly? Have you heard of Trotsky's armored train? About Rose "Countryman"? Orders from Sverdlov, Trotsky, Uritsky in the internet are full.
        Will there be documents?
  • Alexey T. (Oper)
    Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 10: 10
    -3
    Quote: tasha


    If you are talking about the "red terror", what documents do you need? Search and read Soviet newspapers of 1918. Lists of those who were shot were published in regional publications. To deny the "Red Terror" is simply stupid and criminal.
    One can argue only about its causes and necessity.

    And in what place did Ingvar write about red terror? Re-read his post carefully. He did not write about the red terror, which was a necessary measure of self-defense of the new state power of its open opponents.
    1. tasha
      tasha 20 July 2016 10: 25
      +3
      Something you later, hmm, the ignition. wink Sorry.

      Well, about the national composition, Ingvar 72 has its own cockroaches in my head.

      My own remarks concerned the role of the Cheka and its organizer and leader F.E.Dzerzhinsky in the mass executions of Russians and not only during the formation of Soviet power - the "Red Terror".
      I agree, I did not quite understand the essence of your post, which is why he clarified:
      What charges do you require evidence for?


      Sincerely.
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 11: 05
        +2
        Quote: tasha
        about the ethnic composition, Ingvar72 has its own cockroaches in his head.

        What more! good I sincerely believe that the Russian people should decide the fate of the country, and not ... well, you understand. The "Red Terror" was not invented and embodied in the main by the Russians, this is a fact and it cannot be dismissed. On the contrary, one should look for a reason in this. Most of the victims of the "White Terror" were on the conscience of the "allies" from the Entente, in Samara the Czechs "frolicked", in the Far East the Japanese and the Americans. There are a lot of examples.
        With two hands for the introduction of the law of citizenship, similar to those in force in Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Kuwait and ... the Baltic states. With regard to the preservation of national identity, the Balts are on the right track, although it is a shame that it was thanks to Russia that they got the opportunity to exist as a state. (B ... repeat walking women ungrateful)
        I consider the slogan "Russia for Russians" provocative, in reality it should sound like "Russia for indigenous nationalities!" Civil service is mandatory.
        1. tasha
          tasha 20 July 2016 11: 31
          +1
          Ehh, where are they - these same Russian people.

          I will share with you. That's when words like "pen..y", "churki", "dagi", "psheki" (there are few of them) leave the Russian language to denote other peoples - it means that something is changing for the better ...
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 12: 07
            +1
            Quote: tasha
            to denote other nations - it means that something is changing for the better ..

            Previously, the Finns were called Chukhontsi. Other peoples also have traditions to call representatives of other nationalities slang. This is not the case globally.
            1. tasha
              tasha 20 July 2016 12: 22
              +1
              I do not argue. But now similar words in Russian are used, as a rule, in a derogatory sense - globally to the issue of respect. Respect for other peoples, the laws of their country, the opinions of others and work. I would not want to emphasize such a feature as a national peculiarity ... This is purely my personal opinion.

              And even the enemy must be respected.
        2. Kaiten
          Kaiten 20 July 2016 12: 38
          -8
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Russia for indigenous nationalities! "

          100%
          PS
          Tatarstan for Tatars
          Yakutia for Yakuts
          Kalmykia for Kalmyks
          1. regsSSSR
            regsSSSR 20 July 2016 20: 03
            +3
            Kaiten

            100%
            PS
            Tatarstan for Tatars
            Yakutia for Yakuts
            Kalmykia for Kalmyks


            you forgot to add laughing
            101%
            America for the Indians!
            Israel for the Palestinians winked Well, etc., etc. the list is very large))
            1. regsSSSR
              regsSSSR 20 July 2016 20: 21
              +1
              so to speak!laughing
            2. Kaiten
              Kaiten 21 July 2016 07: 07
              +1
              Quote: regressSSSR
              you forgot to add
              101%
              America for the Indians!
              Israel for the Palestinians, etc., etc., the list is very large))

              it is you who should not answer me, but Ingvar72. My banter was just a continuation of his slogan "Russia for indigenous nationalities!" Think for yourself where you will come with such slogans. The Russians in the national borderlands will be the first to suffer.
        3. Verdun
          Verdun 20 July 2016 14: 16
          +7
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          I sincerely believe that Russian people should decide the fate of the country, and not ... well, you understand

          Von Bryullov, Levitan, Shostakovich, Akhmatova, Mandelstamm, Mikoyan, Baghramyan, Rokossovsky, Kruzenshtern, Litke, Schmidt, Perelman, Bagration, Martinson, Ranevskaya, Ots ... You can continue to infinity. All these are people who somehow influenced the fate of our country. Affected, from the point of view of many, positively. And what, however, are non-Russian surnames ... request
        4. plebs
          plebs 20 July 2016 14: 57
          +4
          I sincerely believe that the fate of the country should be decided by the Russian people, and not ... well, you understand.
          Yes, as they decided, bringing the country to the February Revolution. I especially like the Jewish names of those who came to accept the resignation of the king. And the commanders of the armies who did not support the tsar, were entirely Bolshevik muzzles! You are a fabulous sir ...!
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 16: 47
            +1
            Quote: plebs
            And the commanders of the armies who did not support the tsar, were entirely Bolshevik muzzles!

            And you dearest, have you heard anything about Freemasonry? wink
            1. plebs
              plebs 20 July 2016 17: 19
              0
              And you dearest, have you heard anything about Freemasonry?
              As I understand it, if the Russians have done it, the freemasons, Jews, reptilians are to blame, and if the Jews, they are to blame for everything! Interesting position. I'll think about it).
              1. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 20: 28
                +2
                Quote: plebs
                Masons, Jews, reptilians are to blame

                If you want to make the truth implausible - put it on a par with delirium, and it will also be perceived as delirium. Bullshit about reptilians was invented precisely for this purpose. RenTV regularly uses this technique. And Masons - their participation is visible in all revolutions and rebellions, starting with the French. And by Hebrews -
  • Turkestan
    Turkestan 20 July 2016 10: 51
    +1
    To deny the "Red Terror" is simply stupid and criminal.
    One can argue only about its causes and necessity.



    In the same way, one can argue about the WHITE TERROR only really about the beginning, reasons and necessity.

    But the beginning of the recognition of many scientists
    Russian historians consider the date of the first act of white terror on October 28, 1917, when in Moscow the junkers who were liberating from the Kremlin rebels captured the soldiers of the 56th reserve regiment. They were ordered to line up, supposedly for inspection, at the monument to Alexander II, and then machine-gun and rifle fire was suddenly opened against unarmed people. About 300 people were killed.

    That's where TERROR in RUSSIA began
    1. sherp2015
      sherp2015 20 July 2016 12: 22
      +1
      Quote: Turkestan

      But the beginning of the recognition of many scientists
      Russian historians consider the date of the first act of white terror on October 28, 1917, when in Moscow the junkers who were liberating from the Kremlin rebels captured the soldiers of the 56th reserve regiment. They were ordered to line up, supposedly for inspection, at the monument to Alexander II, and then machine-gun and rifle fire was suddenly opened against unarmed people. About 300 people were killed.

      Again Zionist lies! In Russian - Bullshit.
      1. Kaiten
        Kaiten 20 July 2016 13: 51
        0
        Quote: sherp2015
        Again Zionist lies!

        Ben Gurion personally commanded the junkers.
      2. Turkestan
        Turkestan 20 July 2016 16: 19
        +2
        Listen, but what nonsense? Any Moscow guide will tell YOU that on the red square on the right side, if you are facing the Mausoleum along the Kremlin wall, 300 soldiers who guarded the Kremlin Arsenal were killed by the cadets.
        1. Aleksander
          Aleksander 20 July 2016 21: 29
          -3
          Quote: Turkestan
          Listen, but what nonsense? Any Moscow guide will tell YOU that on the red square on the right side, if you are facing the Mausoleum along the Kremlin wall, 300 soldiers who guarded the Kremlin Arsenal were killed by the cadets.


          There is buried a lot of red and destroyed in all fights in Moscow during October. coup and later, but originally from Moscow.
          And in the Kremlin during that battle 14 people died HUNKER HALF
          1. tatra
            tatra 20 July 2016 21: 43
            +1
            Quote: Aleksander
            during oct. coup

            Well, how the enemies of the communists do not want to call the October Revolution a revolution, and how the enemies of the communists like to call them "color" coups and Maidans on the territory of the former USSR revolutions.
            Spit the enemies of the Communists, not only the truth, but also on logic and common sense, if only they were so FAVORABLE.
    2. Verdun
      Verdun 20 July 2016 15: 13
      +3
      Quote: Turkestan
      That's where TERROR in RUSSIA began

      Many do not understand that even the conflict between the Bolsheviks and the church began not because of religion, but because of completely mercantile reasons. It was impossible to implement the slogan "land-to-peasants" without taking this land away from the country's largest landowner, which at that time was the Orthodox Church. And she was not eager to give this land voluntarily.
      1. Paranoid50
        Paranoid50 20 July 2016 23: 36
        +3
        Quote: Verdun

        Many do not understand that even the conflict between the Bolsheviks and the church began not because of religion, but because of completely mercantile reasons.

        I absolutely agree and am ready to confirm, not with copy-paste and speculation, but with the real history of my ancestors.
  • Altona
    Altona 20 July 2016 11: 20
    +6
    Quote: tasha
    Lists of those executed were published in regional publications. To deny the "Red Terror" is simply stupid and criminal.
    One can argue only about its causes and necessity.

    -------------------
    And Leib Bronstein dash Lev Trotsky was not involved in the "red terror"? It was he who headed it, he was also the first red commander-in-chief and creator of the Red Army. And he created a new army practically using stick methods, because there were few combat officers, and they no longer had authority. Iron discipline was achieved only with blood. It's just that few people mention it.
    1. Kaiten
      Kaiten 20 July 2016 12: 40
      -1
      Quote: Altona
      It was he who headed it, he was the first red commander in chief and creator of the Red Army

      And the former tsarist officers who served with him in batches, circumcised and passed the Jewish giyur.
      1. Altona
        Altona 20 July 2016 14: 35
        +1
        Quote: Kaiten
        And the former tsarist officers who served with him in batches, circumcised and passed the Jewish giyur.

        --------------------
        And the former tsarist officers were not only with him. And the former tsarist officers were not equal to Leon Trotsky. Our subordination is still from top to bottom, and not otherwise. It was Leo Trotsky who issued the directives and demanded their implementation.
        1. Kaiten
          Kaiten 20 July 2016 14: 45
          -2
          Quote: Altona
          And the former tsarist officers were not only with him. And the former tsarist officers were not equal to Leon Trotsky. Our subordination is still from top to bottom, and not otherwise. It was Leo Trotsky who issued the directives and demanded their implementation.

          And who made them serve the Zionist Trotsky? After all, everyone served voluntarily. Von Brusilov, the leading tsarist commander, personally developed operations against his own white generals.
          1. Verdun
            Verdun 20 July 2016 15: 59
            +3
            Quote: Kaiten
            Von Brusilov, the leading tsarist commander, personally developed operations against his own white generals.

            At the end of the civil war in the ranks of the Red Army was almost the entire General Staff, including General Slashchev. And how many workers of the tsarist secret police were in the ranks of the Cheka ...
            1. Kaiten
              Kaiten 20 July 2016 18: 21
              +1
              Quote: Verdun
              At the end of the civil war in the ranks of the Red Army was almost the entire General Staff, including General Slashchev. And how many workers of the tsarist secret police were in the ranks of the Cheka ...

              Judging by the opinion of some, they probably all converted to Jewishness and went to the service with pace.
              1. Verdun
                Verdun 20 July 2016 18: 31
                +3
                Quote: Kaiten
                Judging by the opinion of some, they probably all converted to Jewishness and went to the service with pace.

                "The satellite rushes in orbit,
                With perigee at its apogee.
                In him bracket hanging nailed -
                The first Jew in space ... " smile
              2. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 20: 48
                +2
                Quote: Verdun
                The first Jew in space ... "

                And the same Titanic Iceberg in Hebrew flooded ... wink
        2. Aleksander
          Aleksander 20 July 2016 21: 38
          +1
          Quote: Kaiten
          And who made them serve the Zionist Trotsky? After all voluntarily served

          About Institute hostage-do not know?
          Look stupid.
    2. PHANTOM-AS
      PHANTOM-AS 21 July 2016 00: 48
      0
      Quote: Kaiten
      And the former tsarist officers who served with him in batches, circumcised and passed the Jewish giyur.

      something and this circumstance prevents you from thinking with your stomach, therefore write nonsense laughing
      1. Kaiten
        Kaiten 21 July 2016 07: 11
        0
        Quote: PHANTOM-AS
        something and this circumstance prevents you from thinking with your stomach, therefore write nonsense

        you have problems with the cerebellum when some of you write that the Bolsheviks consisted exclusively of Jews. and who won the civil war for the Bolsheviks, they don’t want to remember.
        1. PHANTOM-AS
          PHANTOM-AS 21 July 2016 09: 15
          -2
          Quote: Kaiten
          and who won the civil war for the Bolsheviks, they don’t want to remember.

          Well, yes, the Russian land is watered with Jewish blood fellow
          And the Jews established and defended Soviet power tokmo.
          Quote: Kaiten
          when some of you write that the Bolsheviks consisted exclusively of Jews.

          I have never written this!
          Quote: Kaiten
          you have problems with the cerebellum

          Kh.z., I didn’t seem to notice, but here you are with your statements
          Quote: Kaiten
          tsarist officers who served with him in batches, circumcised and passed the Jewish giyur.
          You prove that together with the foreskin and his (cerebellum), too, they lost, apparently the moel overdid belaybecause no one is safe from mistakes.
  • Pitot
    Pitot 20 July 2016 10: 32
    +4
    And what are you around the bush. Most of the Jews worked in the punitive bodies after the revolution. And they, in your expression, destroyed the Russians in batches. Including the hands of Czechs, Chinese and other already warmed up "friends" ....
    1. Kaiten
      Kaiten 20 July 2016 12: 47
      +2
      Quote: Pitot
      For the most part, Jews worked in punitive organs after the revolution.

      I wonder what nationality Stirlitz was, he is Isaev.
      1. Zulu_S
        Zulu_S 21 July 2016 09: 33
        0
        Quote: Kaiten

        I wonder what nationality was Stirlitz, aka Isaev

        Stirlitz is undoubtedly a Jew. If the nationality of the pope to determine. After all, his father is Yu. Semenov.
  • Turkestan
    Turkestan 20 July 2016 10: 42
    0
    The question is - do people of non-titular nationality decide the fate of the country by such methods?

    Do you think that the special services of the TITLE NATION of the Russian GUARD, the Kontra reconnaissance of the WHITE ARMY worked better and cleaner?
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 11: 14
      +2
      Quote: Turkestan
      Do you think that the special services of the TITLE NATION of the Russian GUARD, the Kontra reconnaissance of the WHITE ARMY worked better and cleaner?

      Quantitatively cleaner. And morality is more or less respected - the Russian people themselves solve their internal problems.
      And I want to ask you Isaac, as a representative of a liberal nationality - what is the morality of eating "Aman's ears" cookies, celebrating the murder of more than 70000 thousand Persians in Persia? wink
      1. sherp2015
        sherp2015 20 July 2016 12: 23
        +1
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        The Russian people themselves solve their internal problems.
        And I want to ask you Isaac, as a representative of a liberal nationality - what moral is there in eating "Haman's ears" cookies, celebrating the murder of more than 70000 Persians in Persia?

        !!! +++
        Silent Zionofascist bloody ...
      2. Kaiten
        Kaiten 20 July 2016 14: 04
        +3
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        what is the moral of eating Haman's Ears, celebrating the murder of over 70000 Persians in Persia?

        And what morality is present in the Orthodox Church, which glorified Queen Esther in the face of the Saints?
        P.S. Not the Persians, but the Amalekites. however, apparently, to you, as a major specialist in religion, in the drum.
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 16: 52
          +3
          Quote: Kaiten
          .Not Persians, but Amaleketians.

          Not all were Amaleketians, but only Haman himself and his children.
          1. Kaiten
            Kaiten 20 July 2016 18: 03
            0
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            Not all were Amaleketians, but only Haman himself and his children.

            And where is it said that the Persians were 70 thousand?
            "And the king's scribes were called at that time, in the third month, that is, in the month of Sivan, on the twenty-third day of it, and everything was written as Mordohai ordered, - to the Jews, satraps and rulers, and the rulers of the provinces that are from Odu and to Kush - one hundred and twenty-seven regions, each region in its writings and each nation in its language, and to the Jews - in their writings and in their language "

            127 regions and peoples.

            P.S. How is it with the holy Queen Esther in Orthodoxy? Will we comment?
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 19: 48
              +3
              Quote: Kaiten
              . How is it with the holy Queen Esther in Orthodoxy? Will we comment?

              No problem. Only I distinguish Orthodoxy from the so-called Orthodox Christianity. Before Nikon's reforms, it was called orthodox. Christian preachers in an effort to recruit more flock, and simplify the spread of Christianity, very often borrowed terms from pagan culture, roots closer to people. It was the same with the substitution of holidays. And this was not only in Russia. Christmas "accidentally" coincides with the holiday of Mithras, Russian Shrovetide with the beginning of Lent, Kupala became Ivan, the day of the veneration of Svarog by Kozma-Demyan.
              Are you still about the Abramic monotheistic religions? wink
              1. Kaiten
                Kaiten 20 July 2016 22: 58
                -1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Are you still about the Abramic monotheistic religions?

                That is, you are not a parishioner of the church of the Moscow Patriarchate?
      3. plebs
        plebs 20 July 2016 14: 42
        0
        Quantitatively cleaner. And morality is more or less respected
        It is a shame to talk about the purity and morality of the tsarist secret police, after the Azef case.
      4. Felix99
        Felix99 20 July 2016 14: 47
        +1
        Who was at Contra White? Germans, Caucasians, the same Czechs, Poles. Each creature in pairs.
        Wrangell
        Droplets
        All the titular nation.
      5. Turkestan
        Turkestan 20 July 2016 15: 45
        +5
        DEAR, I would be grateful if you called me the person of JEWISH NATIONALITY is closer to BODY. I am proud that my blood brothers participated in the creation of the GREAT SOVIET STATE and I, as a FORMER SOVIET OFFICER, are proud of these people

        The creators of the atomic bomb - Ioffe, Landau, Frisch, Khariton, Kurchatov (Russian), Zeldovich, Gurevich, Frank, Khalatnikov, Artsimovich, Khaikin, Ginsburg, Tamm, Kikoin, Rabinovich, Adam, Goldansky, Shapiro, Spinel, Semenovich, ... .
        The creator of the missile systems Circle, Beech, Cube, S-300, Antei-Lyulev
        The creator of air defense and missile defense is Livshits A.L., and their control systems are Livshits M.I., Zalman
        The creators of the La 5, La 7, supersonic La-160 aircraft, the Dal and Storm air defense missiles are Lavochkin (Aizikovich), Taits, Felsner, Heifets (22 thousand aircraft were produced during the war)
        The creators of the MIG-Mikoyan (Armenian) aircraft, Gurevich, and the Mi-2,4,6,8,10,12,24 ...- Miles helicopters
        The creators of TU-3, TU-4. TU-8-Tupolev (Russian), Kerber, Frenkel.
        The creators of the Yak-1, Yak-4, Yak-9 Yakovlev, Donskoy, Sachs, Sonstein.
        The creators of the PE-2 and PE-8 are Petlyakov, Isakson.
        The creators of the aircraft (general and chief designers) were Bisnovat, Khorol, Iosilovich, Felsner, Weinberg, Chernyakov, Borin, Wigdorchik, Itskovich.
        The creators of rocket science and aircraft engines are Kosberg, Shaposhnik, Bisnovat, Isaacson, Neman, Ginsburg.
        The creators of the KV and IS tanks and self-propelled guns SU and ISU-Kotin, and the engines for them - Wichmann, Gorlitsky, Ber, Werner.
        The creators of Katyusha are Schwartz, Gontmakher, Shor, Levin, Guy.
        The creator of the aircraft guns N-37, NS-45, NS-23, tank and anti-tank guns - Nudelman
        The creators of automatic anti-aircraft systems - Levin, Lyulyev, Khorol.
        The creator of the SU-152 self-propelled gun based on the T-34 is Gorlitsky.
        Creator 160 mm. mortar - Teverevsky.
        The inventor of the "hedgehogs" is General Gorikker.
        The People's Commissar of Arms - Vannikov, the tank industry - Salzman, the aviation industry - Sandler.
        The directors of the largest aviation and tank plants are Shenkman (La-5 and La-7), Honor (Barikad factory), Fradkin (Voroshilova factory), Salzman (Kr. Sormovo factory), Belyansky (Chelyabinsk factory) -d IL-2) .......
        Heroes of the USSR, even according to official, clearly underestimated figures, Jews occupy the 3rd place in absolute numbers, and in% terms they are not inferior to the Russians.
        And this is not a complete list, complete on the site of the Jews at the head of the military industry during WW2.
        A significant role in the Victory was played by songs, the authors of which:
        Dunaevsky, brothers Pokrass, Blanter, Tsfasman, Rosner, Basner, Tabachnikov, Katz, Fradkin, Kolker, king of tango-O. Strok, Utesov, Kolmanovsky, Matusovsky, Plyatsky, Dolmatovsky, Zharkovsky, Lisyansky, Frenkel, Bezmensky, Lask Kirsanov, Slutsky ....
        And, like a joke, the song "Russian Field" is usually performed by I. Kobzon, the words of I. Goff, the music of Frenkel.

        As for your question, there is a discussion of the article, if you have not forgotten Iron Felix: the man who saved the country from chaos and anarchy
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 20 July 2016 16: 45
          +3
          Quote: Turkestan
          People's Commissar of Arms - Vannikov, tank industry - Salzman

          It would be better not to mention Comrade Salzman. For even before the war he was one step away from becoming citizen Zaltsman.
          As regards the elimination of the basic structural defects of the machine, nothing substantial has been done.
          This attitude to the refinement of the machine is explained by the fact that the plant threw all its forces, means and tricks into the formal execution of the program, completely ignoring the quality of the machine and the need to eliminate serious tank defects during production. For example, failure to implement the July program led to the fact that the director of the plant comrade On August 1, Zaltsman gave a false report to the Central Committee of the All-Union Communist Party of Bolsheviks that 15 cars were handed over, while 13 cars were not accepted by military acceptance with a number of defects to be eliminated. Several cars were not even in the control military mission. In addition, the towers did not rotate on the machines during the roll. All these vehicles are currently not ready (by August 12), have not been accepted by military acceptance and are unlikely to be received in the next 10-15 days. This fact indicates that the plant is not at all worried about the quality of the machine, it wants to execute the program formally, and the director is engaged in fraud.
          © representative of military acceptance at the Kirov plant, military engineer of the 3rd rank Kalivoda
          Director of the Kirov Plant Zaltsman I.M. twice submitted to the People's Commissariat of Heavy Engineering the wrong information about the production of tanks in July-August of this year.
          In the July report, the KZ director announced the release of 15 KV in July; in fact, only 5 tanks were delivered to the ABTU KA this month. The remaining 10 were not finished production. Their completion and surrender to the military representative continued until August 22-24.
          In the August report, the plant indicated the release of 22 KV; in fact, on September 1, only 11 tanks were handed over to the military envoy.
          This incorrect information was provided by the director of the plant, Salzman I.M., with the knowledge and consent of the head of the armored command of the spacecraft V. Korobkov. and his deputy, Alymova N.N., who gave orders to the senior military representative of the ABTU KA at the Kirovsky factory, A. Sppananov. on registration by tanks unfinished by production.
          © Mehlis

          And during the war, Zaltsman did not stay long for the People's Commissar - less than a year.
        2. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 20: 57
          +1
          Quote: Turkestan
          I am proud that my blood brothers participated in the creation of the GREAT SOVIET STATE

          Trotsky also participated in the creation of the USSR.
          Question - How would you feel if the tsarist government resolved the issue of the Pale of Settlement by the methods of your compatriots of the 1917-22 sample? And later, until 1937, when did the great Russian Georgian put an end to the coven of your compatriots?
          And about your list - I also respect these people, most of them, with respect. But I will give an example - taking help from neighbors in one, you are categorically against the fact that they would crawl into your family problems. Why such selectivity? wink Hope the hint is clear?
          1. Turkestan
            Turkestan 20 July 2016 21: 45
            0
            How would you react if the tsarist government would solve the problem of the Pale of Settlement by the methods of your compatriots of the 1917-22 sample?

            So the tsarist government decided with these methods
            Pale of Settlement

            But I will give an example - taking help from neighbors in one, you are categorically against the fact that they would crawl into your family problems. Why such selectivity? wink I hope the hint is clear?

            Honestly, I didn’t understand the phrase. I will be deeply grateful if you:
            You will participate in discussions on the topic of the article and WITHOUT ANY HINT
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 21 July 2016 06: 18
              +2
              Quote: Turkestan
              So the tsarist government decided with these methods
              Pale of Settlement

              Which ones? The shootings in the basements? fool
              1. Kaiten
                Kaiten 21 July 2016 07: 12
                -1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Which ones? The shootings in the basements?

                Forced relocations and pogroms.
                1. Ingvar 72
                  Ingvar 72 21 July 2016 08: 25
                  +2
                  Quote: Kaiten
                  Forced relocations and pogroms.

                  Horseradish (plant wink ) with a finger compare. The Pale of Settlement did not imply resettlement, but a restriction of resettlement. If some particularly cunning Jews quietly settled below the Pale of Settlement, then they were naturally resettled. But then why blame the mirror if the mug is crooked?
                  But the pogroms were not a state program, but a response of the people to some features of the Jewish mentality. hi
                  1. Alexey T. (Oper)
                    Alexey T. (Oper) 22 July 2016 08: 26
                    0
                    Quote: Ingvar 72

                    But the pogroms were not a state program, but a response of the people to some features of the Jewish mentality. hi

                    So the destruction of certain classes, estates and social groups (nobles, officers, Cossacks, kulaks, bourgeoisie) was not a state program of the Bolsheviks until these classes, estates and groups unleashed the Civil War and bloody terror against the government and the state.
          2. Zulu_S
            Zulu_S 22 July 2016 15: 34
            0
            The stubborn anti-Semitism of the government is one of the (not the last) reasons for the death of the Russian Empire. The Jews driven behind the Pale of Settlement had no reason to feel love either for the tsar-father or for the state. National policy led to the flight of the outskirts of the empire from its composition at the first opportunity. It is foolish to accuse Lenin of recognizing the independence of the Baltic states and Finland. What, did Soviet Russia have the strength to keep them? Likewise, Transcaucasia, Turkestan. Even in the Far East until 1922 there was a Far Eastern Republic. The forces of the Soviet government appeared, the reverse "gathering of Russian lands" began. Unfortunately, because of the wrong national policy in the USSR, the situation repeated itself.
            But back to our sheep, sorry, the Jews. If they are such a malicious nation, then why didn’t they destroy the USA, England, etc.?
            Maybe "something had to be changed at the conservatory"?
            I do not put you a minus. Just urge you to think. In the end, every nation has its own heroes and villains.
  • Felix99
    Felix99 20 July 2016 12: 27
    +3
    Not a titular nationality? And who is the title? Ingvar? Swedish or Baltic? I agree with everything said except this. The methods are not humane. So the most humane and civilized to each other gases - mustard gas civilized. The Japanese - samurai skin alive and in the furnace of a steam locomotive. War is a dirty business, civil double dirty.
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 16: 58
      +1
      Quote: Felix99
      Ingvar? Swedish or Baltic?

      Byelorussian. wink
  • NordUral
    NordUral 20 July 2016 13: 07
    +8
    That liberals are demons, then I completely agree with you. Until now, they have not been extinct, and they are doing the same abominations.
  • Zulu_S
    Zulu_S 20 July 2016 17: 07
    0
    Why, explain, the British elite “didn't play too much”, didn't bring the country to revolution, Germany “played too,” but corrected the situation, and the Russian “elite” fucking fucked up the country?
    Nehru on the Jews blame reluctance to put the interests of the country above their own.
    And there were many demons in the country on both sides, and not only in the Cheka - counterintelligence.
    1. Paranoid50
      Paranoid50 20 July 2016 23: 52
      +2
      Quote: Zulu_S
      Why, explain, the British elite "didn't play too much", didn't bring the country to revolution

      And they, you know, together with the Dutch, "bombed" before others in Europe - 1640. the first bourgeois revolution in the Netherlands; -1649, Bourgeois revolution in England, execution of Charles I, coming to power of "Cromwell and Co." And this was when there were no other "cradles of revolution" at all. This is the basics of history, EMNIP, sixth grade. The most famous work of art on this topic is "XX Years Later" by A. Dumas hi
  • Beefeater
    Beefeater 20 July 2016 08: 54
    +1
    Quote: Shiva83483
    I don’t want to justify, let alone blame the iron Felix, the man was in his place, and he solved the problems by the methods that were appropriate at that time ... the cherubs did not serve tea in the White Guard and counterintelligence either ...

    The difference in the scale of terror.
    Yes, and very interesting characters met in the Cheka at random. Prince Andronikov, the same one, von Pilchau, a relative of Felix, Frauchi, he is Artuzov, the mediocre failure of the Trust, mired in Boky mysticism, so it was not Felix who saved the country, but Yezhov, who multiplied this whole audience by zero. Stalin could not build a new world with such features.
    1. alexej123
      alexej123 20 July 2016 09: 37
      +8
      For Artuzov "who failed the operation" Trust "in more detail is possible? Reilly lured," Syndicate 2 "lured Savinkov. And it's FREE? Well, show an example and lure out at least Yarosh? I am silent about Obama. Before you write anything on VO read books.
    2. Turkestan
      Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 22
      0
      WHERE ARE THEM? BEFORE THIS CHARACTER IN WHITE MOVEMENT

      In the investigation against Ataman Annenkov, which began in May 1926, several thousand testimonies of peasants who were robbed, relatives of those killed by his detachment under the motto: “We have no prohibitions! God and Ataman Annenkov are with us, chop right and left! ” On September 11, 1918, while suppressing a peasant uprising in the Slavgorod district, “hussars” Annenkov tortured and killed up to 500 people. Among them were 87 delegates to the peasant congress, who, by order of Annenkov, were chopped down in the Slavgorod square against the people's house and buried in a pit there. The village of Cherny Dol, where the headquarters of the rebels was located, was burned to the ground, even wives and children of peasants were shot, fought and hung on poles. Girls from Slavgorod and its environs were brought to the train of Annenkov, who was at the city station, raped, and then shot. According to eyewitness Blokhin, the executions of the Annenkovites were particularly cruel: the victims had their eyes and tongues torn out, stripes on their backs were cut out, they were buried alive, and tied to horse tails. In Semipalatinsk, Annenkov threatened to shoot every fifth resident of the city in case of refusal to pay indemnities.
    3. tatra
      tatra 20 July 2016 17: 19
      0
      Quote: Beefeater
      Difference in the scale of terror

      Not on the scale of terror, but on the mentality of the Communists with their supporters, and their enemies.
      If in the USSR it was always known that there was both the White Terror and the atrocities of the interventionists, and the Red Terror, then the pathologically deceitful enemies of the Communists threw out the White Terror and the atrocities of the interventionists from their "most truthful historical truth", and the Red Terror was inflated to fantastic proportions.
      There is NO honest man among the enemies of the Communists.
  • Valery Valery
    Valery Valery 20 July 2016 07: 03
    +4
    A tough, at times cruel man who gave his life in the interests of the state !!
    1. Kim Klimov
      Kim Klimov 20 July 2016 11: 01
      +1
      This "man", if he can be called a man, destroyed the Russian people not in the interests of the state, but in the interests of the Jewish Bolshevik clique that had seized power in Russia. The difference is diametrical.
  • Scud
    Scud 20 July 2016 07: 20
    +5
    Unfortunately, I do not have the ability to post a photo of the majestic monumental monument of F.E. Dzerzhinsky which back in February of this year. decorated the square in Zaporozhye. The new head of the city who went to the polls with the slogans of the former PR immediately after the victory switched to mov and Bender’s methods — demolished not only the monuments to Ordzhenikidze, Kirov, Dzerzhinsky memorial plaque to L.I. Brezhnev but also the largest monument to Lenin. Since the Soviet era, on May 29, the border guards gathered and celebrated their holiday, and it was very cool. In 2013, the ill-intentioned Vlad organized a large-scale exhibition of arms and equipment of the border troops. It was truly a national-state holiday. And now, after the ugly revolution in Zaporizhzhya, it was not a holiday, but a miserable and wretched sight with disgusting SUGSs. And the veterans of the border troops, gray-haired, hide their eyes, being afraid to quickly sip their helplessness as soon as possible.
  • Million
    Million 20 July 2016 07: 23
    +11
    And they buried him in the old tunic ... There were people, not even a couple of the current rulers of Russia!
  • tasha
    tasha 20 July 2016 07: 25
    +2
    Thus, one cannot accept the point of view imposed on the enemies of the Soviet project and civilization by 1991 that Dzerzhinsky is a “bloody ghoul”, which was noted only by “red terror” against “innocent” nobles, White Guards, intelligentsia, priests, etc.


    25 years have passed since the collapse of the USSR. Since the end of the activity of F.E. Dzerzhinsky as one of the leaders of the Soviet state - 90 years. For most people in Russia, Dzerzhinsky is a forgotten history. For fun, go outside and do a survey. What do you think you will get? Half of the militant destroyers of the USSR are long gone. But with what ecstasy people who consider themselves to be supporters of the socialist path (and in my opinion are the most real enemies) remember the "bloody ghouls". The time has come for calmer assessments. You can't make everyone white and fluffy, and you can't stomp into the mud either.

    And separately about the "innocent". Why did the author put this word in quotation marks? To emphasize the guilt of those listed? With any change in the state system, there will always be people who are not ready to accept the new order. This is the tragedy of any revolution.

    Here's another question for the author. You list: "nobles, white guards, intelligentsia, priests, etc." White Guards is a common name for a movement formed with the aim of overthrowing Soviet power, i.e. conscious and ideological opponents. And no matter who is included in it, there may be nobles, and priests, and the intelligentsia. Yes, Soviet power fought with the White Guards for a long time and stubbornly. Why did "etc. suffer?"
    1. alexej123
      alexej123 20 July 2016 11: 53
      +4
      In the Civil War, the main point was that Russians were killing Russians. When passing the introductory history to the MVD tower, I remember there was a question, the main reason for the loss of the White movement. I couldn't answer right away, excitement. And now I think that this movement was too different. Some were "For the United and Indivisible", the second for the Republic, the third for the fact that they would enter Moscow with foreign bayonets on a white horse. But the Reds had a monolithic backbone. And they knew the goal clearly. And the Whites were different. I read somewhere, I don’t remember now that in the days of the Battle of Stalingrad, A.I. Denikin put candles for the Red Army. And other examples Krasnov, and what a shame fellow countryman Shkuro, put on SS uniforms.
  • parusnik
    parusnik 20 July 2016 07: 42
    -1
    Felix became a fan of the German Social Democratic Party. ..This is where the German Social Democratic Party came from in the Russian Empire? ...He was Commissar of Defense from June 17 to August 31...There were three people's commissars of defense- Voroshilov, Tymoshenko, Stalin..and what kind of people's commissar of defense in June-August 1917? Was Dzerzhinsky a member of the Provisional Government?
    1. bober1982
      bober1982 20 July 2016 08: 21
      +3
      Dzerzhinsky began his revolutionary activities in the Lithuanian Social Democratic Party, participated in a conference in Berlin, was a fan of Rosa Luxemburg, so the article correctly indicates this stage of Dzerzhinsky’s activity
      1. parusnik
        parusnik 20 July 2016 08: 51
        -1
        R. Luxemburg is not the whole German Social-Democratic Party .. Or do we say party-mean R. Luxemburg, we say R. Luxemburg-mean party?
        1. bober1982
          bober1982 20 July 2016 08: 59
          +2
          Talk about nothing - well, he was a fan of the German party members, as stated in the article, so what of this? at that time he was not a member of the RSDLP, but he hardly liked anyone.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 07: 43
    0
    First, the country was brought into chaos .. and then brought out of chaos. It is still unknown what methods were used to get out of this chaos.
    1. V.ic
      V.ic 20 July 2016 08: 16
      -3
      Quote: Mengad
      It is still unknown what methods were used to exit it chaos.

      So it is not known? Completely, completely unknown? By the way, what do you think "this"is chaos different from simple chaos or following your logic THAT chaos?
  • bober1982
    bober1982 20 July 2016 07: 53
    +2
    Dzerzhinsky was a real fanatic, from the point of view of an Orthodox person — obsessed with something demonic. As N. Berdyaev put it, there was something terrible in him.
    1. Alexey T. (Oper)
      Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 08: 23
      +2
      Zealots will not develop documents in the likeness of the Cheka’s Draft Instructions for the 1918 Searches of the Year, the provisions of which are fully consistent with Iron Felix’s words about a warm heart, clean hands and a cold head.
      1. bober1982
        bober1982 20 July 2016 08: 43
        +1
        The Cheka of the Dzerzhinsky period was a bunch of criminal elements, and all sorts of ghouls, and you talk about some kind of instructions. Stalin then shot them all (old Chekists).
        1. sherp2015
          sherp2015 20 July 2016 12: 27
          +5
          Quote: bober1982
          The Cheka of the Dzerzhinsky period was a bunch of criminal elements, and all sorts of ghouls, and you talk about some kind of instructions. Stalin then shot them all (old Chekists).

          Stalin did the right thing!
        2. Felix99
          Felix99 20 July 2016 12: 35
          +6
          Documents of that time are still used as instructive. And according to investigative techniques and searches and undercover work.
          And the fact that you are not a ghoul is not your dignity, but our shortcoming.
        3. alexej123
          alexej123 20 July 2016 14: 07
          0
          bober1982, if all the old ones were shot, there would be no continuity of generations, experience, there would be no further success of the threat and counterintelligence, including during the Second World War. Operational work, successful involves, among other things, the presence of experience in the past. Cadres decide everything. So your statement is not true. And I completely agree with my colleague and namesake Alexei (also opera), even then Dzerzhinsky was thinking ahead, how counterintelligence agencies would work in the future, how to protect people from arbitrariness.
    2. Alexey T. (Oper)
      Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 08: 26
      +8
      Quote: bober1982
      As N. Berdyaev put it, there was something terrible in him.

      "It is not for nothing that he avoids the police post
      And the police are afraid of the one whose conscience is not clear "(c)
      1. bober1982
        bober1982 20 July 2016 08: 29
        -3
        From a police newspaper, did they quote verses?
        1. Alexey T. (Oper)
          Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 10: 21
          +4
          Quote: bober1982
          From a police newspaper, did they quote verses?

          Those. Did your mother read "Uncle Stepa" S. Mikhalkov as a child? I recommend. Clears the brain of liberal propaganda. bully
          1. bober1982
            bober1982 20 July 2016 10: 42
            -1
            I didn’t read, and I didn’t read it myself - which of this. I read Marshak’s hey don't stand too close I'm a tiger cub not a pussy
          2. plebs
            plebs 20 July 2016 15: 12
            0
            Those. Did your mother read "Uncle Stepa" S. Mikhalkov as a child? I recommend. Clears the brain of liberal propaganda. bully
            I applaud while standing !!!
        2. Felix99
          Felix99 20 July 2016 12: 37
          +1
          Are you a fan of creativity in the style of chanson?
          For you, any person in police uniform is a criminal?
    3. Turkestan
      Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 27
      0
      BUT THESE ARE NOT EXCESSED BY BESS?
      On May 9, 1918, after the Cossacks captured Ataman Dutov, the village of Alexandrov-Gaya, 96 captured Red Army soldiers were buried alive. In total, 675 people were executed in various ways in the village. After the capture by the Cossack detachment of the chieftain Dutov on May 27, 1918 Chelyabinsk and Troitsk, on July 3, Orenburg was established in these cities a terror regime. More than 6 thousand prisoners were kept in one Orenburg prison, of which about 500 were killed during interrogations. In Chelyabinsk, Dutovites shot or transported 9 people to Siberian prisons. According to Soviet periodicals, about 700 people were executed by the Dutovites in Troitsk in the first weeks after the capture of the city. In Ilek, they destroyed 400 people. Such mass executions were characteristic of the Cossack troops of Dutov. By an order of August 4, 1918, Dutov imposed the death penalty in the territories under his control for the slightest resistance to the authorities, as well as for evading military service. In the Ural Region alone, in January 1919, 1050 people were killed by Dutov's Cossacks. On April 3, 1919, a Cossack chieftain ordered them to be shot and taken hostage at the slightest unreliability. In the same year, in the village of Sakharnoye, the Dutovtsy burned down a hospital along with 700 typhoid-infected Red Army soldiers there, destroyed the village of Meglius, together with 65 of its inhabitants.
  • rkkasa xnumx
    rkkasa xnumx 20 July 2016 08: 24
    +17
    A few quotes from Felix Edmundovich (in my opinion are still relevant):

    Recently, politics very often smells of oil, and oil - of politics.

    We must go and explain to every worker and peasant that we [Russia] need funds in order to move our plants, to have enough of our raw materials, so that we do not be so dependent on foreign countries as we can get in if we to build the development of our economy solely through import from abroad ...

    We [in Russia] each trust and syndicate - on its own. In almost all matters: salary, rehabilitation, concentration, market mastery. And everyone strove to use all their “happiness” for themselves, and to transfer the “misfortune” to the state, demanding subsidies, subsidies, loans, high prices ...

    It is necessary to conduct economic construction from such an angle so that the USSR can be turned from a country importing machinery and equipment into a country producing machinery and equipment ... to widely introduce scientific and technological progress into production. If this work is not carried out, we are threatened with the closure of our factories and slavery to foreign capital. If we are now wooden, bastard Russia, then we must become metal Russia.


    The fact that you have no criminal record yet is not your merit, but our flaw.
  • erased
    erased 20 July 2016 08: 25
    +7
    From the perspective of today, knowing what happened in the USSR and what happened to Russia, we can definitely say that Dzerzhinsky was a real statesman. He did everything to create a powerful state on the ruins of an empire. Power was tough, sometimes brutal then, but it worked for the people. And the people believed her.
    Now, when power and control are seized mostly by enemies, people like Dzerzhinsky, Stalin, Beria are simply necessary. People who put the interests of the people above all, and even more so, above themselves.
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 10: 39
      +4
      Quote: erased
      Dzerzhinsky was a real statesman. He did everything to create a powerful state on the ruins of an empire.

      But first, he participated in the collapse of the country. And with Parvus’s money, etc. Foreign money.
      And methods - not all means justify the ends. hi
      1. erased
        erased 20 July 2016 11: 21
        0
        The country was not destroyed by the Bolsheviks, but by representatives of the ruling elite, the nobles and the monopolists. They overthrew the emperor and took power. But they could not do anything but finish off the rest of the country. The Bolsheviks seized control in time and did not allow Russia to fall apart completely.
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 20 July 2016 11: 28
          +1
          Quote: erased
          The country was not destroyed by the Bolsheviks, but by representatives of the ruling elite, the nobles and the monopolists

          But the Bolsheviks were among the destroyers! It is foolish to deny their participation, blaming all the blame on types like Kerensky. Like they are so soft and fluffy, they just took power after the collapse. request
  • NikolaiN
    NikolaiN 20 July 2016 08: 31
    -6
    Young Felix was brought up, like many Poles, in hatred of Russia. In 1922, when Dzerzhinsky was already one of the leaders of Soviet Russia, he wrote about his childhood patriotic feelings: "As a boy, I dreamed of an invisible hat and the destruction of all Muscovites."

    With all due respect, as the creator of the security and intelligence agencies, it is worth noting that he was nevertheless an ardent Russophobe ... and not only in childhood.
    1. Felix99
      Felix99 20 July 2016 12: 41
      +1
      What manifested Russophobia? Statistics of charges? by nationality.
  • Aleksander
    Aleksander 20 July 2016 08: 52
    +1
    This is one of the people who saved Russia from chaos, anarchy, bandit lawlessness and the invasion of foreign invaders.

    This is one people who VVERG Russia into chaos, anarchy, bandit lawlessness and surrendered a third of the country to the German occupiers.
    can not be taken imposed on 1991 by the enemies of the Soviet project and civilization, the point of view that Dzerzhinsky is a "bloody ghoul", which was marked only by "red terror" against the "innocent" nobles, White Guards, intelligentsia, priests, etc.


    Probably, after all, there is no need to teach - what is impossible and what is possible: the author has the same equal point of view as the others and nothing more.
    Secondly, Dzerzhinsky is really bloody ghoul, sadist, Russophobemarked by “red terror” versus really the innocent Russian citizens - nobles, White Guards, intelligentsia, priests, workers, peasants: innocent because the court did not admit their guilt, people were destroyed on a social basis, as hostages or simply on suspicion.
    And this is after the trial by jury of RI!
    "Iron Felix" was the builder of Soviet statehood (there was no other then, because the Russian empire was destroyed, and in return the liberal democrats could not offer anything worthy)
    Yeah right "galley slave"," Russian statesman "! lol NO ONE neither he nor his party to build "co-statehood" -did not charge, and they didn’t ask anyone that the author himself admitted:
    At the same time, he fully agreed with the course of Lenin in the political sphere, aimed to destroy any dissent and preserve the Bolshevik monopoly on power

    For author's information, Lenind himself April 1917 g acknowledged: "Russia today is the freest country in the world!" -Just he did not need a free country, he needed a dumb dictatorship.
    1. Turkestan
      Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 30
      +3
      From the documentary evidence - an excerpt from the order of the governor of the Yenisei and part of the Irkutsk province, General S. N. Rozanov, the Special Commissioner of Kolchak in the city of Krasnoyarsk) from 27 March 1919 year:
      The chiefs of military units operating in the area of ​​the uprising:
      1. When occupying villages captured earlier by robbers, demand the extradition of their leaders and leaders; if this does not happen, but reliable information about the availability of such information is available, shoot the tenth.
      2. The villages, the population of which will meet government troops with weapons, burn; adult male population to shoot without exception; property, horses, carts, bread, and so on, selected in favor of the treasury.
      Note. Everything selected must be carried out by order of the detachment ...
      6. Among the population, take hostages, in case of action of fellow villagers directed against government troops, shoot hostages mercilessly.
      1. Aleksander
        Aleksander 20 July 2016 13: 13
        +1
        Quote: Turkestan
        From the documentary evidence - an excerpt from the order of the governor of the Yenisei and part of the Irkutsk province, General S. N. Rozanov, the Special Commissioner of Kolchak in the city of Krasnoyarsk) from 27 March 1919 year:


        There was no such order. Although, of course, during the war everything could be.
        But the Reds had exactly STATE policy of terror and hostage, Denikin and Kolchak have such a state policy DID NOT HAVE.
    2. Gardamir
      Gardamir 20 July 2016 14: 34
      +1
      This is one of the people who overthrew Russia into chaos, anarchy, bandit lawlessness and surrendered a third of the country to the American invaders.
      nothing now him the Yeltsin Center from grateful descendants.
      1. Was mammoth
        Was mammoth 20 July 2016 15: 21
        -1
        Quote: Gardamir
        nothing now him the Yeltsin Center from grateful descendants.

        We read the law: "Federal Law of May 13, 2008 N 68-FZ" On the centers of the historical heritage of the presidents of the Russian Federation who have ceased to exercise their powers "Adopted by the State Duma on April 25, 2008
        Approved by the Federation Council on May 6, 2008 "
        "ER" hurried in advance. Construction of two more centers is ahead. For whom - guess? wink Here, I think, who will have a center larger than the Cheops pyramid.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 15: 33
          +4
          Quote: There was a mammoth
          For whom - guess?

          We will guess. And for the president of the USSR will also be built?
          1. Was mammoth
            Was mammoth 20 July 2016 15: 41
            +1
            Quote: Mordvin 3
            We will guess. And for the president of the USSR will also be built?

            God forbid. Something "ER" did not work out here.
  • Pushkar
    Pushkar 20 July 2016 09: 03
    0
    Dzerzhinsky is a complex person, but the time was difficult, requiring quick and uncompromising decisions and actions. His merits to the state and people are undeniable, and the arrests and executions of the freemen remaining after the Civil War are the salvation of hundreds of thousands of lives that would have burned down in new uprisings.
  • uskrabut
    uskrabut 20 July 2016 09: 12
    +6
    No words - a very hardworking person, a statesman. Not like the current ones, only to drive around on gelenvagens and throw show-offs. Now I would have the Cheka to clean the scum in the country.
  • Basil50
    Basil50 20 July 2016 09: 29
    +8
    What is interesting is that * blame * FE E DZERZHINSKY put protection, restoration and development of SOVIET RUSSIA. Today's * tiligents * together with * democrats * are discussing the legitimacy of protecting the SOVIET STATE a priori justifying everything that * former * and their foreign owners did. Among the whites there were people with brains and already in exile described that * whites * * * fought * with the Bolsheviks. After all, the nobles did not hesitate to flog all those whom they caught or hung up or something else to come up with, education was enough to recall the wildest executions, and * subtle soul * and * sensitivity * did not interfere with mass executions and the manifestation of sadism. And how RUSSIA was plundered by the interventionists with the help of * knights of white * movements * knights * themselves described, and did not hesitate at all.
    Today, it seems that Trotsky’s followers are in power from here and such * plans * in the economy and in the harassment of the true builders of the SOVIET UNION. As an obligatory program, the infringement of the RUSSIANS in RUSSIA, the beneficence of * small nations *, who understand to whom they owe their well-being, and therefore fully support all * undertakings *.
  • Old Horseradish
    Old Horseradish 20 July 2016 09: 50
    -5
    I'd love to know, old man, who in Russia in the civil war created the end of the camp? I would very much like that Felix himself went through everything that he has done for millions of citizens of our Russia. Probably in hell now it’s passing ...
    1. Was mammoth
      Was mammoth 20 July 2016 09: 56
      +3
      Quote: Old Fuck
      I'd love to know, old man, who in Russia in the civil war created the end of the camp?

      Please.
      "The first concentration camp in Russia was founded by the British - in August 1918"
      http://sell-off.livejournal.com/3728614.html
      Internet to help you. At the same time, read about the "white" terror.
      1. alexej123
        alexej123 20 July 2016 14: 15
        -1
        In the North, in my opinion, the Angles built. Pikul's "From the Dead End" tells about this.
    2. Turkestan
      Turkestan 20 July 2016 11: 32
      +1
      In Yekaterinburg province, one of the 12 provinces controlled by Kolchak, at least 25 thousand people were exterminated under Kolchak, and about 10% of the two million people were outraged. Flogged both men and women and children.
      The merciless attitude of Kolchak's punishers towards the workers and peasants provoked mass uprisings. As A.Lytvyn notes about Kolchak’s regime, “it’s difficult to talk about supporting his policy in Siberia and the Urals, if out of about 400 thousand red partisans of that time 150 thousand acted against him, and among them 4-5% were prosperous peasants, or, as they were then called, kulaks. ”
  • Vovan 73
    Vovan 73 20 July 2016 10: 11
    -2
    So maybe again, how in the 20s to shoot the liberals? AND?
  • Old Horseradish
    Old Horseradish 20 July 2016 10: 18
    0
    As Orthodox elders and priests say, “You can't even pray for Dzerzhinsky, for peace,” the blood of millions of his victims cries out to heaven and his soul cannot count on God's farewell. In addition, he was the enemy of God on Earth, destroyed hundreds of thousands of priests, monks, nuns, tried to destroy the Orthodox faith in Russia. One simple question: what, for example, would Peter I, Suvorov, Kutuzov do with Dzerzhinsky? What would Alexander Nevsky and Catherine II do with Dzerzhinsky?
    1. Antiprogressor
      Antiprogressor 20 July 2016 13: 47
      0
      Laughing! Peter the First? Ekaterina? Alexander Mongolian?
    2. Gardamir
      Gardamir 20 July 2016 14: 38
      -2
      Peter I
      a liberal with kicks and blood pushing the Russian people to Europe,
      Catherine II?
      and who is this, German Frederick Zerbstka?
      1. Old Horseradish
        Old Horseradish 20 July 2016 19: 29
        0
        Dear Gardamir, I usually like your comments. I will personally try to continue the list for you:
        One simple question: for example, what would Dmitry Donskoy, Pozharsky, Minin, Ivan the Terrible, Prince Mikhail Vasilyevich Skopin-Shuisky, Prince Bagration, Denis Davydov and thousands of our commanders and heroes do with Dzerzhinsky? I think the answer is obvious - the same as what they did with the enemies of the Fatherland. Regards, Old ...
    3. The comment was deleted.
  • sancho16
    sancho16 20 July 2016 10: 27
    +2
    For the past 30 years, the term RED TERROR has been hammered into our consciousness, they are only stubbornly silent about when
    The Bolsheviks took power, immediately abolished the death penalty and introduced a democracy that was not before them
    and never will be. Namely, they introduced the election of all posts, including commanders in the army, and decisions were made
    collegially, by councils and executive committees. Only after losing the political struggle for power did the anti-Soviet move on to
    terror and they simply began to kill the Bolsheviks and their leaders everywhere. As a result, Lenin pronounced his
    famous words, “IN RESPONSE TO THE WHITE TERROR, WE WILL RESPOND TO THE RED TERROR-,” and away we go.
    And at the expense of repression, the NKVDists didn’t run with the gun and didn’t look for someone to shoot and torture it,
    as shown in modern kin for, everything needed a formal occasion, an official statement,
    testimony or interrogation, and statistics is a stubborn thing, by the number of crimes, Stalin
    just a boy in short pants, against all the regimes of Poland, Germany, France, Italy, England and America,
    recall at least the famous HUNTING WITCH, when people were massively repressed for no reason.
    And the fact that these regimes are still doing it, except for vomiting and contempt, does not cause a normal person.
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 10: 51
      +3
      Quote: sancho16
      Lenin said his
      famous words, “IN RESPONSE TO THE WHITE TERROR, WE WILL RESPOND TO THE RED TERROR-,” and away we go.

      And you do not find that this is just an excuse for Lenin? What Comrade Devil did in Crimea, even the Bolsheviks became insane. They asked Lenin to calm her down, so no, he awarded her with an order.
      1. faiver
        faiver 20 July 2016 11: 07
        0
        Also in some sort of newspaper read?
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 11: 21
          +2
          Quote: faiver
          Also in some sort of newspaper read?

          In "Arguments and Facts". laughing Any more questions? bully wassat
      2. Gardamir
        Gardamir 20 July 2016 14: 42
        +2
        And you do not find that this is just an excuse for Lenin?
        Right! Lenin had already foreseen then that 2016 would come on the TOPVAR website and he would discuss his affairs, it was necessary to pay off in advance.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 15: 10
          +2
          Quote: Gardamir
          full time! Lenin had already foreseen that 2016 would come on the TOPVAR website for a year and they would discuss his affairs;

          Excuse before the people for their actions. And his associates.
  • Pitot
    Pitot 20 July 2016 10: 38
    +7
    Maybe I'm wrong (I don’t remember exactly), but in my opinion it was him, Dzerzhinsky, the Cheka and struggled with homelessness. And this issue was resolved. I agree, maybe sometimes the methods were not pedagogical from the perspective of today, but they solved the problem. And at the end of the 20th century, again to get homeless and do nothing - this is a pancake in the face of the Yeltsin government and ideology - to spit on the People. .... spitting today fly. But Dzerzhinsky must return the old monument or install a new one - for fear of liberoids and similar evil spirits. And most importantly - the normal Pole turned out ..... from the priest family ..... Vivat Dzerzhinsky ....
  • Antiprogressor
    Antiprogressor 20 July 2016 10: 59
    -3
    Do not touch Felix! He is ours!
  • Tiger4
    Tiger4 20 July 2016 11: 47
    -3
    dangerous article !!!! insulting the feelings of believers .... Dzerzhinsky realized that there is no god!
    1. Tiger4
      Tiger4 20 July 2016 16: 06
      0
      ABOUT! unbelievers (or believers) minus what for? if Felix realized that there is no God?
      1. bober1982
        bober1982 20 July 2016 16: 28
        +3
        “If I heard it right, did you deign to say that Jesus was not in the world?” The foreigner asked, turning his green left eye to Berlioz.
        “No, you heard right,” answered Berlioz politely.

        “Are you atheists?”
        “Yes, we are atheists,” Berlioz answered smilingly ...

        “Oh, what a delight!” Cried the amazing foreigner ...
        “In our country, atheism does not surprise anyone,” said Berlioz diplomatically politely,
        most of our people have consciously and long ago stopped believing in fairy tales about God
  • Andrey VOV
    Andrey VOV 20 July 2016 11: 50
    +1
    Any revolution is blood and civil war, on one scale or another .. Robespierre, oh, the torch of the Great French Revolution .... and how much blood was shed then? And what eventually happened to him? Revolution in England, europe-blood , tyranny, thousands of victims from the common population ... Dzerzhinsky was a man of that era in which he lived, was part of the system that was at that time and did everything that it considered to be true and necessary then ... for any person, any historical person there is everything in his deeds, both good and bad, and it couldn’t be otherwise ... the century of breakthroughs, the century of revolution and fermentation cannot be pure white or pure black .. and at that time without the state of terror the USSR would not have taken place and what would be the result .. there is already an unplowed field for discussion ..
  • Andrey VOV
    Andrey VOV 20 July 2016 11: 57
    0
    And yet, perhaps a rhetorical question, it is probably intended more for, say, members of the forum with the so-called liberal views, which are here on the forum regarding this article as well:
    1. In your opinion, name the ideal ruler of Russia in its history.
    2. How do you see the current state structure of Russia acceptable in your opinion.
    3. What should be the relations with Europe and America.
    4. And what is your personality in history, not only in Russia, which you would definitely appreciate very positively?
    Thank you
    1. Kenneth
      Kenneth 20 July 2016 13: 05
      -1
      1. False Dmitry 1
      2. Presidential and Parliamentary Republic
      3. The good ones.
      4. I. Christos
      1. alexej123
        alexej123 20 July 2016 14: 47
        -1
        For point 1 - According to your logic, Good relations with America are needed so that they lead to the power of the modern "False Dmitry 1". He brought the invaders to the country and "Good ruler".
        1. Kenneth
          Kenneth 20 July 2016 19: 21
          -1
          You have extremely bad history. Take the trouble to learn a little. Normal relations with America and Europe are needed so that you have the opportunity to surf the Internet to study the same story. Well, in general, I do not see any reason to lift up the strongest enemy without extreme need.
    2. NikolaiN
      NikolaiN 20 July 2016 21: 13
      -1
      1. Catherine 2
      2. Presidential Republic
      3. Pragmatic (with the left hand we sign an agreement on mutually beneficial cooperation, with the right hand we check the fuse on the "Kalash")
      4. Sergius of Radonezh, Seraphim of Sarov, John of Kronstadt and others from the same host ...
  • 1536
    1536 20 July 2016 12: 18
    0
    In my opinion, the monument to F.E. Dzerzhinsky to Lubyanka Square in Moscow, and finally stop discussing the events of 100 years ago and the actions of the people participating in them, let alone give them amateurish assessments!
  • Andrey VOV
    Andrey VOV 20 July 2016 12: 32
    0
    Fighting with monuments is the last thing, and many terrible things started with demolishing monuments, burning books, torchlight processions .... it’s easiest to fight with monuments, he won’t answer ...
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 12: 56
    0
    Quote: faiver
    Thank you, he laughed, but the people are naive in our country, which they don’t write in the newspaper believes everything ...

    He is not naive, he is stupid because he is not looking for the truth himself, but is looking for himself an authority that will tell him this truth.
  • Evgenijus
    Evgenijus 20 July 2016 13: 02
    +3
    Felix Edmundovich really fought against the enemies of the people and built a new Soviet civilization, a society based on the idea of ​​social justice


    Then the question to the author - why were the priests killed in batches? Nothing and they are sworn enemies? My wife's grandfather-priest was killed in 1937. Why? The protocol of the "troika" says - for disrupting the elections to the Supreme Council. My grandfather made a mistake - he opened the church on Sunday before the elections. Here's a "foe" ... Felix's students worked efficiently.
    1. faiver
      faiver 20 July 2016 14: 22
      0
      why did the priests do good for the people?
      1. Evgenijus
        Evgenijus 21 July 2016 13: 50
        +1
        Good question. Like, if you do not do good, so to the wall? Have you personally done anything good for the people? Think, maybe for you there is a place near the wall? Felix ask, he will find a must. We have a church in the city. Before the revolution, Priest Konstantin Bankkovsky served in it. The Russian-Turkish war began, he went to the front. He returned with awards on his chest, but not with one (I have his photo). Do you have any medals or orders for feats? To the question I answered you?
        1. faiver
          faiver 21 July 2016 15: 40
          +1
          I have nothing against your grandfather, but the church actively opposed the Soviet regime and church ministers often supported anti-government underground associations, I doubt very much that you or your spouse have complete information about what her grandfather did ...
          1. Evgenijus
            Evgenijus 21 July 2016 17: 12
            +1
            My spouse has a copy of documents from the NKVD archive (good people in the archive are working now!). About the grandfather-pop, everything is written there, who informed on him, when that he was confiscated during the arrest (only the cross was available). There is a solution of the three. Scary documents ...
            1. faiver
              faiver 21 July 2016 17: 51
              0
              and what was the reason for the denunciation?
              1. Evgenijus
                Evgenijus 21 July 2016 17: 56
                +1
                Yes, the reason for the denunciation - the ordinary human fear for their lives. Pop opened the church for the service, but the NKVD -ists did not like it. They caught the people who witnessed the opening of the church on Sunday. During interrogations, the investigators signed everything they needed. An interesting fact - the texts of denunciations are almost identical.
  • Kenneth
    Kenneth 20 July 2016 13: 03
    -1
    And most importantly, he was a great visionary when he wrote "then the country will find its dictator - the burial of the revolution - no matter what red feathers were on his suit ..." - although he did not seem to write about that.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 13: 06
    0
    Quote: sancho16
    For the past 30 years, the term RED TERROR has been hammered into our consciousness, they are only stubbornly silent about when
    The Bolsheviks took power, immediately abolished the death penalty and introduced a democracy that was not before them
    and never will be. Namely, they introduced the election of all posts, including commanders in the army, and decisions were made
    collegially, by councils and executive committees. Only after losing the political struggle for power did the anti-Soviet move on to
    terror and they simply began to kill the Bolsheviks and their leaders everywhere. As a result, Lenin pronounced his
    famous words, “IN RESPONSE TO THE WHITE TERROR, WE WILL RESPOND TO THE RED TERROR-,” and away we go.
    And at the expense of repression, the NKVDists didn’t run with the gun and didn’t look for someone to shoot and torture it,
    as shown in modern kin for, everything needed a formal occasion, an official statement,
    testimony or interrogation, and statistics is a stubborn thing, by the number of crimes, Stalin
    just a boy in short pants, against all the regimes of Poland, Germany, France, Italy, England and America,
    recall at least the famous HUNTING WITCH, when people were massively repressed for no reason.
    And the fact that these regimes are still doing it, except for vomiting and contempt, does not cause a normal person.

    Judging by the post .. you understand the essence of the current government .. they are scoundrels and all that, yes of course you live at that time and you yourself feel to some extent the charms of this power, believe me, I agree with you .. only understand what it is ..you so zealously defend the communist system that .. as if you were in the thick of those events ... you knew all the events and people what they are honest and impartial ... children bread .... women flowers! How can you know who and how? yes, you don’t know what a neighbor is capable of, but at the same time you know and say that all the communists from the top beat the most honest people .. and didn’t offend anyone? I understand that there were a lot of good and honest people with a party card but .... who goes to power .. in order to achieve their goal and stay in power, they will stop at nothing and this is a FACT!
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 13: 14
    0
    [quote = Alexey T. (Oper)] Can you confirm your allegations with links to real documents? [[quote = Antiprogressor] Do not touch Felix! He is ours! [/ Quote]
    Are you a Pole al from Israel?
  • Civilian62
    Civilian62 20 July 2016 13: 15
    +1
    Dzerzhinsky is a symbol of order. The order that my country is lacking so much.
    1. Evgenijus
      Evgenijus 21 July 2016 18: 25
      +1
      In Auschwitz-Birkenau (Auschwitz) there was also an ideal order. The convicts themselves sent the arrivals to the gas bunker, then pulled the corpses and dragged them to the crematorium.
      The order is different. You could learn order from Dzerzhinsky. All those who disagreed with his order found themselves in the ground. In Turkey, now take an example from Felix ...
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 13: 31
    +3
    Quote: Kaiten
    Quote: Pitot
    For the most part, Jews worked in punitive organs after the revolution.

    I wonder what nationality Stirlitz was, he is Isaev.

    Vsevolod Vladimirovich Vladimirov, Father - Russian, Vladimir Alexandrovich Vladimirov, “Professor of Law at St. Petersburg University, Fired for Freethinking and Closeness in the Circle of Social Democracy.” Involved in the revolutionary movement by George Plekhanov.
    Mother is Ukrainian, Olesya Ostapovna Prokopchuk, died of consumption when her son was five years old.
    I think you mean it, right? Or did you have a word on your mind ... Khutspa?
    1. Kaiten
      Kaiten 20 July 2016 14: 20
      0
      Quote: Mengad
      Vsevolod Vladimirovich Vladimirov, Father - Russian, Vladimir Alexandrovich Vladimirov, “Professor of Law at St. Petersburg University, Fired for Freethinking and Closeness in the Circle of Social Democracy.” Involved in the revolutionary movement by George Plekhanov.
      Mother is Ukrainian, Olesya Ostapovna Prokopchuk, died of consumption when her son was five years old.
      I think you mean it, right? Or did you have a word on your mind ... Khutspa?

      and how is this Russian being asked, a gentleman entered the Cheka, where, according to Pitot, did some Jews work? You understand Bush’s herp (did you decide to open online Hebrew courses in parallel here?)
  • silberwolf88
    silberwolf88 20 July 2016 13: 34
    -2
    A figure as contradictory as the time in which he lived and worked ... to consider Dzerzhinsky in isolation from the context of time ... to approach assessment from the point of view of the modern development of society would be a catastrophic mistake.
    Certainly a large-scale personality ... a man of work ... demanded by the revolution and the post-revolutionary construction of the State
    1. Beefeater
      Beefeater 20 July 2016 14: 52
      +4
      That is, each time has its own morality? Crime will always remain a crime.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 13: 56
    +1
    Quote: Old Horseradish
    As Orthodox elders and priests say, “You can't even pray for Dzerzhinsky, for peace,” the blood of millions of his victims cries out to heaven and his soul cannot count on God's farewell. In addition, he was the enemy of God on Earth, destroyed hundreds of thousands of priests, monks, nuns, tried to destroy the Orthodox faith in Russia. One simple question: what, for example, would Peter I, Suvorov, Kutuzov do with Dzerzhinsky? What would Alexander Nevsky and Catherine II do with Dzerzhinsky?

    In order to compare Dzherzhinsky (I do not condone him and am not a fan) with such people, Alexander Nevsky, (are you sure that such existed?) Catherine II? ?) Do not tell! They are all bloodsuckers of the Russian land on which many Tatars, Buryats, Slavs, Kalmyks and Chukchi, and many other nationalities live.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 14: 17
    0
    Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
    Can you confirm your allegations with links to real documents?

    I’ll even give a link to you, maybe make it clear, read on health and ANALYZE the information; link -http: //elib.shpl.ru/ru/indexes/values/38115
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 14: 22
    0
    Quote: Shiva83483
    I don’t want to justify, let alone blame the iron Felix, the man was in his place, and he solved the problems by the methods that were appropriate at that time ... the cherubs did not serve tea in the White Guard and counterintelligence either ...

    Yeah ... everything is like some nationalities .. create a problem, then solve it at the expense of others .. and you are held in high esteem!
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 14: 28
    0
    Quote: Kaiten
    Quote: mrark

    And today, the Government of Russia is entirely Russian. Only their socks matzoh smell

    Putin receives instructions from Natanyahu. Khutspa, damn it.

    Dual Hutspa wink
    1. Kaiten
      Kaiten 20 July 2016 14: 53
      0
      Quote: Mengad
      Dual Hutspa

      hutsapaym (like shivataim- "in seven")
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 14: 49
    0
    Quote: Kaiten
    Quote: Mengad
    Vsevolod Vladimirovich Vladimirov, Father - Russian, Vladimir Alexandrovich Vladimirov, “Professor of Law at St. Petersburg University, Fired for Freethinking and Closeness in the Circle of Social Democracy.” Involved in the revolutionary movement by George Plekhanov.
    Mother is Ukrainian, Olesya Ostapovna Prokopchuk, died of consumption when her son was five years old.
    I think you mean it, right? Or did you have a word on your mind ... Khutspa?

    and how is this Russian being asked, a gentleman entered the Cheka, where, according to Pitot, did some Jews work? You understand Bush’s herp (did you decide to open online Hebrew courses in parallel here?)

    He didn’t penetrate .. he just had his own worldview and understanding ... of course, not only some Jews were ..but the fact that a Jew was at the top of power is true ... some give orders .. and others carry out.
    1. Kaiten
      Kaiten 20 July 2016 14: 56
      0
      Quote: Mengad
      He didn’t penetrate .. he just had his own worldview and understanding ... of course, not only some Jews were ..but the fact that a Jew was at the top of power is true ... some give orders .. and others carry out.
      Reply

      This is what kind of worldview you need to have, so that a Russian aristocrat, an intellectual, brought up in Orthodoxy, goes into the service of Christ sellers?
    2. tatra
      tatra 20 July 2016 15: 20
      -4
      Quote: Mengad
      but the fact that a Jew occupied the top of power is true.

      Another anti-Soviet LIE.
  • Sarmat149
    Sarmat149 20 July 2016 14: 54
    0
    I believe that the Dzerzhinsky enemy.
    1. Kaiten
      Kaiten 20 July 2016 14: 57
      0
      Quote: Sarmat149
      I believe that the Dzerzhinsky enemy

      What about Lenin?
      1. Sarmat149
        Sarmat149 20 July 2016 16: 21
        +1
        For Kaiten:

        Lenin is the same, only smarter, more dangerous.
        1. Kaiten
          Kaiten 20 July 2016 18: 09
          -1
          Quote: Sarmat149
          Lenin is the same, only smarter, more dangerous.

          And why did you have it then in the central square and people have worshiped him like Pharaoh for 70 years?
          1. tatra
            tatra 20 July 2016 18: 18
            +1
            And why did you have it then in the central square and for 70 years people worshiped him like a pharaoh? [/ Quote]
            Not to the pharaoh, but to the one who opened "social elevators" for the people, who threw off the people's necks the same useless parasites as those who hated Lenin on the territory of the USSR, who, before 1917 and after 1991, appropriated and appropriated most of their income countries and most of the incomes of the people, have hammered "social elevators", and do not allow and did not allow the country to develop.
    2. tatra
      tatra 20 July 2016 15: 05
      -4
      Quote: Sarmat149
      I believe that the Dzerzhinsky enemy.

      Yes, for all enemies of the Soviet people, the Bolsheviks are communist enemies.
      Among the enemies of the Bolshevik Communists, there is not a single honest man.
      The enemies of the Bolshevik Communists never admit guilt for their crimes, they must be forced, as in the Nuremberg trial of the enemies of the Communists,
      1. Sarmat149
        Sarmat149 20 July 2016 16: 46
        +4
        You are engaged in demagogy. If you are so interested in my opinion about the Communists, write to me in your personal account, we’ll talk. And write nonsense. So far, only briefly:

        I was the same communist. In the Soviet Army, if you do not know, to become a company commander you must be either a communist or a candidate member of the CPSU. These are the events of my life 1989 year. The platoon commander called me the battalion commander and explained everything popularly, since I was a member of the Komsomol. Then I wrote an application for admission to the party. Formality has been overcome. I became a company commander. Why did the battalion commander speak with me because I was the best platoon commander, but a Komsomol member. To command a company, it is necessary to lead the primary party organization. Therefore, the company should be either a communist or a candidate.

        Yes, while I honestly pulled my shoulder strap COMMUNIST GORBACHEV and others from the UK, surrendered the country and destroyed it. All such right-wing communists suddenly became for independence, perestroika, and so on. A flash mob appeared - I burned my party card, at the same time a human bloodstream poured. Further, the country's complete dependence on the West. Thus ended the construction of communism in our country. THE COMMUNISTS WERE AT AUTHORITY AND EVERYTHING ARE R I. R Now I. Some kind of tatra will teach me life.

        Communism is a big problem, but you are engaged in demagogy.
        1. Alexey T. (Oper)
          Alexey T. (Oper) 20 July 2016 23: 09
          -2
          Quote: Sarmat149
          You are engaged in demagogy. If you are so interested in my opinion about the Communists, write to me in your personal account, we’ll talk. And write nonsense. So far, only briefly:

          I was the same communist. In the Soviet Army, if you do not know, to become a company commander you must be either a communist or a candidate member of the CPSU. These are the events of my life 1989 year. The platoon commander called me the battalion commander and explained everything popularly, since I was a member of the Komsomol. Then I wrote an application for admission to the party. Formality has been overcome. I became a company commander. Why did the battalion commander speak with me because I was the best platoon commander, but a Komsomol member. To command a company, it is necessary to lead the primary party organization. Therefore, the company should be either a communist or a candidate.

          Yes, while I honestly pulled my shoulder strap COMMUNIST GORBACHEV and others from the UK, surrendered the country and destroyed it. All such right-wing communists suddenly became for independence, perestroika, and so on. A flash mob appeared - I burned my party card, at the same time a human bloodstream poured. Further, the country's complete dependence on the West. Thus ended the construction of communism in our country. THE COMMUNISTS WERE AT AUTHORITY AND EVERYTHING ARE R I. R Now I. Some kind of tatra will teach me life.

          Communism is a big problem, but you are engaged in demagogy.
          So you joined the party for career reasons? And really think you were a communist?

          But General Govorov, for some reason, did not prevent the absence of a party card from becoming a front commander.
          1. tatra
            tatra 20 July 2016 23: 25
            -2
            Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
            So you joined the party for career reasons?

            And all those who climbed into the CPSU for the sake of PROFIT, for the sake of a career, together with the rest of the enemies of the communists, amicably blame the Soviet communists for everything that they, starting with their "Liberator" Gorbachev, did first with the USSR, and then with the republics of the USSR that they seized with their highly paid work, which they had many times over, dozens and more times higher incomes and salaries than the majority of the people received.
            And how can such people be given freedom of speech and action?
            This is an anomaly of humanity, a mistake of nature.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 15: 10
    -1
    Quote: plebs
    I sincerely believe that the fate of the country should be decided by the Russian people, and not ... well, you understand.
    Yes, as they decided, bringing the country to the February Revolution. I especially like the Jewish names of those who came to accept the resignation of the king. And the commanders of the armies who did not support the tsar, were entirely Bolshevik muzzles! You are a fabulous sir ...!

    The Russians lost power during the time of troubles, as soon as the Romanovs seized power ..
    1. plebs
      plebs 20 July 2016 15: 39
      +3
      The Russians lost power during the time of troubles, as soon as the Romanovs seized power ..
      And for 300 years they did not know this, swearing, and dying for the King. Sorry, it offends me when the Russian people, the people of Dezhnev, Ermak, Laptev, Ryazanov, Suvorov and many many other representatives speak so derogatoryly.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 15: 16
    -1
    Quote: Kaiten
    Quote: Mengad
    He didn’t penetrate .. he just had his own worldview and understanding ... of course, not only some Jews were ..but the fact that a Jew was at the top of power is true ... some give orders .. and others carry out.
    Reply

    This is what kind of worldview you need to have, so that a Russian aristocrat, an intellectual, brought up in Orthodoxy, goes into the service of Christ sellers?

    Let me remind you if you don’t understand .. that not all communists or members of the AUCPB wanted terror in Russia .. they believed in a bright future for their people .. and how they could go to this. "This man saved more than one hundred .. and maybe tens thousands of human lives ... what do you think? was it worth it?
    1. Kaiten
      Kaiten 20 July 2016 15: 30
      0
      Quote: Mengad
      Let me remind you if you didn’t understand .. that not all communists or members of the AUCPB wanted terror in Russia ..

      The conversation was that VOSR is the Jewish coup that led to the genocide of the Russian, indigenous population. And then for a moment it turns out that thousands of noblemen like Isaev served in the service of the Jews? And participated in their own genocide.
      1. tatra
        tatra 20 July 2016 15: 51
        -1
        Quote: Kaiten
        WOSR is the Jewish revolution that led to the genocide of the Russian, indigenous population.

        Where is the proof ?
        That's what genocide is. If in 1991 1,7 million people died in the RSFSR, then immediately after the capture of Russia by the "great philanthropists" - enemies of the communists, in 1993 2,1 million people died in 1994 - 2,3 million people.
        Mortality in just 2 years, a million people.
        1. Kaiten
          Kaiten 20 July 2016 16: 16
          0
          Quote: tatra
          Where is the proof ?
          That's what genocide is. If in 1991 1,7 million people died in the RSFSR, then immediately after the capture of Russia by the "great philanthropists" - enemies of the communists, in 1993 2,1 million people died in 1994 - 2,3 million people.
          Mortality in just 2 years, a million people.

          You do not need to talk with me on this issue, but with those who are trying to transform VOSR from a social conflict into an inter-ethnic Russian-Jewish conflict.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 15: 33
    0
    Quote: Pushkar
    Dzerzhinsky is a complex person, but the time was difficult, requiring quick and uncompromising decisions and actions. His merits to the state and people are undeniable, which would have burned down in new uprisings.

    hmm ... well ... okay, in parentheses I will be trying out ... and in parentheses my questions:Dzerzhinsky - a difficult person, but the time was difficult (which he or they created) .Next: requiring quick and uncompromising decisions and actions(otherwise they will lose power and their lid) .... His merits to the state and people are undeniable (the shooting and genocide of the Russian people?) went further: ... and the arrests and executions of the freemen left after the Civil War are the salvation of hundreds of thousands of lives ( salvation? from whom? from that mess which they did?) .... His merits to the state and the people are undeniable, burnt down in new uprisings. (By the state? How interesting? The state is the people who live in this territory and what merit they have?) Do you really have such a mess in your head? fool
    1. tatra
      tatra 20 July 2016 15: 40
      -2
      Quote: Mengad
      genocide of the Russian people?

      You, the enemies of the Bolshevik Communist Communists, are always accustomed to unprovenly accuse some of the crimes, and justify the crimes of others.
      The genocide that YOU arranged after you seized Russia and the other republics of the USSR, it is all in the statistics of mortality, which immediately, since 1993, increased by 20-40%, and only in Russia over a quarter century the supermortality amounted to more than 13 million people.
      And ALL Russian enemies of the Communists prove that they do not care.
      And what real evidence do you have of the genocide of the Russian people by the Bolsheviks?
      Or pretend, or you are a brazen liar and slanderer.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 15: 37
    0
    Quote: tatra
    Quote: Mengad
    but the fact that a Jew occupied the top of power is true.

    Another anti-Soviet LIE.

    If you mean by the word, Soviet, is the seizure of power of one ethnic group by another? then this is a fact and not a lie! I understand that the point is not in the nickname and in the flag presented on the forum .. but you know it smacks of arrogance ... which is called .. even though? maybe you just ... Fool? And this is even worse.
    1. tatra
      tatra 20 July 2016 15: 48
      +1
      Firstly, I am Russian, and secondly, unlike the pathologically lying enemies of the Communists, I am an honest person, and that is why I expose your enemies of the Communists of all nationalities, including Russians and Jews, the anti-Soviet lies and slander that you concocted for justification of your capture of the USSR and blaming the Bolshevik Communists for all YOUR crimes.
      In the Bolshevik party in 1917 and later, there were 4-5% Jews, and Russians - more than 70%, and in the leadership of Soviet Russia / USSR, there were always a small number of Jews compared to Russians.
      And those lists with a bunch of Jewish surnames that enemies of communists with intelligence below the plinth are dragged around the Internet without even being interested in the sources of their origin are concocted in the West, without the slightest official sources.
      1. Kaiten
        Kaiten 20 July 2016 16: 17
        0
        Quote: tatra
        In the Bolshevik party in 1917 and later, there were 4-5% Jews, and Russians - more than 70%, and in the leadership of Soviet Russia / USSR, there were always a small number of Jews compared to Russians.

        Bravo
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 15: 48
    -2
    Quote: plebs
    The Russians lost power during the time of troubles, as soon as the Romanovs seized power ..
    And for 300 years they did not know this, swearing, and dying for the King. Sorry, it offends me when the Russian people, the people of Dezhnev, Ermak, Laptev, Ryazanov, Suvorov and many many other representatives speak so derogatoryly.

    And before you wave your hands and set minuses, you would turn your head on and look for the truth .. and your jagged history at school that is beneficial to those in power is not interesting to me. Well, if you have a desire to look not at textbooks, but try to find yourself or have your point of view, then look at the bunch of Suvorov-Pugachev. Oh yes and more ... type a word in Google Tartaria compare maps .. history .. of the people can then ask yourself the right question .. but not me? Good luck in your search hi
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 16: 06
    0
    Quote: tatra
    Quote: Mengad
    genocide of the Russian people?

    You, the enemies of the Bolshevik Communist Communists, are always accustomed to unprovenly accuse some of the crimes, and justify the crimes of others.
    The genocide that YOU arranged after you seized Russia and the other republics of the USSR, it is all in the statistics of mortality, which immediately, since 1993, increased by 20-40%, and only in Russia over a quarter century the supermortality amounted to more than 13 million people.
    And ALL Russian enemies of the Communists prove that they do not care.
    And what real evidence do you have of the genocide of the Russian people by the Bolsheviks?
    Or pretend, or you are a brazen liar and slanderer.

    A good move ... for idiots but not for people thinking. There is no need to hide behind the Communists. The communists were different honest people, there were also enough of them really communists .. and there were those who covered themselves with this word and concept ... and so you scream that after the communists in 90 = x was the genocide of the Russian people? right .. why don’t you say that the authorities took control of their hands again .. are the Communists not pure in hand and rotten by the soul? eh? Or didn't you know that? maybe forgot to say? or sheltered with intent? but he blamed. So the liar and the slanderer is you!
    And do not hide and speak on behalf of ALL RUSSIANS!, This is called hiding behind someone else's backs ... you speak for yourself and not for everyone.
    1. tatra
      tatra 20 July 2016 17: 04
      -4
      Quote: Mengad
      why don’t you say that the authorities took control of their hands again .. the same communists are not clean on hand and rotten by the soul

      HERE, this is your essence, the enemies of the Communists.
      You, with the help of the Communist Communists Gorbachev and Yeltsin, who seized the USSR, and then immediately TRIED them, threw them to us, supporters of the real Communists who defended the USSR and the Soviet people from you, their external and internal enemies.
      For a quarter of a century, the Russian enemies of the communists have been stomping to vote for the "recovered" members of the CPSU Yeltsin, Putin, Medvedev, Yavlinsky, Prokhorov, and then all together blame the Soviet communists for everything that they have done with Russia and the Russian people.
      The Ukrainian enemies of the communists voted for the "recovered" member of the CPSU Yushchenko, for his sake the Maidan -2004 was jailed, and, like the Russian enemies of the communists, they blame the Soviet communists and the "damned Muscovites", because anti-Sovietism is ALWAYS equal to Russophobia.
      And you, and your slander of the Soviet Communists, and blaming them for the results of your well-paid work, prove that you captured the USSR with criminal purposes, and you need excuses for your crimes.
  • plebs
    plebs 20 July 2016 16: 16
    +1
    Quote: Mengad
    Oh, and more ... type a word in Google Tartaria compare
    And what about Cape Dezhnev, the Laptev Sea, the Bering Strait, the Nevelskoy Bay in your alternative history was called differently? Evil Romanovs renamed? I read Morozov and Uwe Toper, if you know these authors.
  • Mengad
    Mengad 20 July 2016 16: 17
    -1
    Quote: plebs
    The Russians lost power during the time of troubles, as soon as the Romanovs seized power ..
    And for 300 years they did not know this, swearing, and dying for the King. Sorry, it offends me when the Russian people, the people of Dezhnev, Ermak, Laptev, Ryazanov, Suvorov and many many other representatives speak so derogatoryly.

    Well, you don’t know what they lost 300 years ago? here is the answer hi And if you are not sure? then look for information, do an analysis of those events .. The word Tartaria is a reference point and there your mind will help you hi