Military Review

Fighter 6-th generation: tomorrow for Russia and the United States

137
Advisor to the First Deputy General Director of the Radioelectronic Technologies Concern (KRET), Vladimir Mikheyev, in an interview with TASS, said that the sixth generation fighter is in full swing. And even called approximate dates.




Vladimir Mikheev: 6 generation fighter will be armed with electromagnetic guns.

UAC (United Aircraft Building Corporation) believes that the prototype of the 6 fighter generation can make its first flight in 2023-2025. And you can talk about full readiness after 2030. Research work in this direction is already underway.

On the one hand, it’s weird to talk about the generation 6 fighter, when the 5 fighter is not yet up to mind. On the other hand, prepare a sleigh in the summer, and a cart in the winter. And there is a certain logic.

Some aspects of the project are interesting. Fighter plan to create a "two faces." The first option - manned, the second - unmanned. And the first modification will be able to fly in the drone mode. But it will be two different aircraft.

Unmanned version will have greater combat capabilities than its manned fellow. Since the human body still has certain limits on physical exertion, the unmanned fighter will be able to develop greater speed, perform more complex maneuvers in terms of congestion, and even go into space. It's about hypersonic speed.

The piloted version will have several other features. In general, the most effective aircraft will operate in a flock. That is, one or two pilots on the aircraft of the first modification will serve as the command center for the unmanned fighter 2-4. Something like this today can act MiG-31BM for other machines.

Unmanned airplanes are supposed to be equipped with a certain artificial intelligence, so that in battle they can effectively distribute goals among themselves and coordinate their actions, both with commander machines and among themselves. This or approximately such a scheme is used today in the ICBM Liner.

It was noted that the aircraft will be able to work in conjunction with ground forces and warships.

When creating a new concept, designers plan to stick to the strength of Russian aircraft, namely, high maneuverability. The speed qualities are expected at the lower threshold of the hypersound, the estimated maximum speed is about 5M. A cruising, without afterburner, not lower than 2M.

And here we can expect the problems that Soviet and American designers faced in the last century. It is worth remembering that the American HV-70 "Valkyrie" when flying at a speed of about 2,5-3М heated to 3 000 degrees. At the same time, it was completely made of titanium and stainless steel and weighed about 230 tons. Domestic hypersonic aircraft T-4 and M-50 also did not differ ease. M-50 in take-off weight was not inferior to the "Valkyrie", T-4 was lighter (about 150 tons), and the construction also used titanium and steel.

Obviously, the construction of a fighter, the tasks of which are somewhat different from the tasks of the reduced aircraft, should be much easier. Therefore, we are talking about the development of new materials that can provide both strength and resistance to high temperatures. After all, it will be necessary to protect not only the airframe from heating by friction against the air, but also the engines from overheated air coming from the air intakes.

And for the proper safety of pilots, thermal insulation probably should be no worse than that of reusable spacecraft.

Stealth technology will also be given special attention. Aircraft must confront not only the existing air defense systems, but also the radar of the aircraft, including the fifth generation. That is, there are many requirements for materials - heat resistance, mechanical strength, absorption of radiation by enemy radars, low values ​​of thermal radiation. It is not yet known whether we possess such materials in principle, but if the development of a new generation of aircraft is already underway, then the issue with the materials for their construction also does not stand still.

Armament. Here you can quote Mikheev.

"These will be ultra-long hypersonic rockets capable of working on air, land and sea targets. They will undoubtedly use the principles of" free hunting and collective responsibility "- when a group of missiles, having reached remote enemy forces that need to be suppressed, independently choose the main and secondary targets and distributes them among themselves. "

Mikheev also mentioned absolutely exotic types of weapons, electromagnetic guns of the microwave range. According to the designers, these guns will be able to completely disable the electronic systems of the enemy aircraft. But this is already a matter of a very distant future, at least until the issue of the source of energy for these guns is resolved. To date, a fast and maneuverable fighter and a similar system are combined poorly.

Who specifically is working on the 6 generation fighter is, of course, not disclosed for many reasons. It can be assumed that this is the Sukhoi Design Bureau. In the KLA they say that Russian aircraft designers came to grips with the new theme immediately after the fifth generation T-50 fighter was practically made and the designers (that is, the Sukhoi Design Bureau) had time for new developments.

In the US, the sixth generation fighter makes the company "Boeing". Her project is called F / A-XX. It is assumed that this new 30-s will replace the deck fighters F / A-18E / F "Super Hornet".

For the first time, a prototype model was presented for review in 2009 year. It was then significantly reworked and shown in the 2013 year.

The glider is a "flying wing" without vertical tail. This option was adopted on the basis of the fact that the keel creates additional aerodynamic drag. Turn is carried out by small-sized rudders located on the wing. Apparently, during a straight flight, the rudders are removed and are released only when maneuvering.

About the type of engine is not reported. Most likely, turbojet. It, as well as on the fifth generation fighter jets, can provide supersonic cruising flight in non-landing mode. Maximum speed not specified. But probably hypersonic it will not.

Fighter double, with two engines. The version of the unmanned vehicle is also being worked out. The maximum take-off weight is declared at the level of 45 tons, range - 3000 km.

Last year, information began to come in about how the US military saw the car. Naval Operations Chief Jonathan Grinet said that the speed and secrecy of the aircraft were not a priority. Emphasis is placed on the target detection range and striking from long distances. Perhaps the fighter will be equipped with laser or electromagnetic weapons. But here is the same problem as the Russian developers: the power plant.

In general, the latest developments of Americans (in F-22 and F-35) have become quite a compromise. Having abandoned super-maneuverability and speed in favor of stealth, the Americans thereby received far from the best aircraft. But dear. And now also stealth will be sacrificed. Perhaps just the maneuverability and speed will come to the fore.

It should be recognized that no one has defined or announced a clear criteria for belonging to the sixth generation. But today, on the basis of those bits of information that come from designers and customers, it can be concluded that our and American aircraft of the new generation will vary greatly.
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  1. Teberii
    Teberii 19 July 2016 05: 09
    +11
    We'll wait and see the blasters from Kalashnikov, and the leading tanks.
    1. Nitarius
      Nitarius 19 July 2016 05: 54
      +10
      Here you have a flying stupa ..
      something like that?
      And she stuck a turbine! The Williams X-Jet
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 19 July 2016 06: 22
        +8
        Quote: Nitarius
        Here you have a flying stupa ..

        So Baba Yage’s stupa was not easy, but with a cool Rolse engine lol
        1. Red_Hamer
          Red_Hamer 19 July 2016 15: 19
          +8
          So Baba Yage’s stupa was not easy, but with a cool Rolse engine
          And apparently also a smartphone from Apple laughing"Roll, bull's-eye, on a plate, Show me the distant lands, Alien shores, underground, Where there is a lonely life among people Beloved sister lives ..."
      2. Nitarius
        Nitarius 20 July 2016 08: 55
        +1
        Here is another from the same topic!
    2. siberalt
      siberalt 19 July 2016 07: 17
      +4
      Yeah. "Call me a pot, but don't put me in the oven!" Well, they called it, put it in the oven in spite of it, and then what happened? Read Russian fairy tales, there is all the wisdom of our people. Let them call our PAK FA 4 ++ and what? Ditto for the arms business. The mind cannot understand Russia. But these are no longer our problems.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Bayonet
        Bayonet 19 July 2016 08: 09
        +11
        Quote: siberalt
        Read Russian fairy tales, there is all the wisdom of our people.

        Undoubtedly! Our stupa first rose to the sky !!! Well, of course, the first pilot of the stupa is a woman, also ours !!! fellow
        1. Tibidokh
          Tibidokh 19 July 2016 13: 55
          +4
          Quote: Bayonet
          Our stupa first rose to the sky !!!

          It's a pity I didn't go to the "series" ...
          1. Red_Hamer
            Red_Hamer 19 July 2016 15: 25
            +7
            It's a pity I didn't go to the "series" ...
            Why didn't you go? After the next global nuclear cataclysm in a single copy left, laughing plus as a memory of not a soft landing, also a "bone" prosthetic leg (the aunt clearly served in the prehistoric VKS Russia) laughing
            1. Tibidokh
              Tibidokh 19 July 2016 18: 33
              +2
              Quote: Red_Hamer
              plus as a memory of not a soft fit, also a "bone" prosthetic leg

              I do not believe. A reference, please. tongue
        2. Andrey Yuryevich
          Andrey Yuryevich 19 July 2016 20: 26
          +4
          Quote: Bayonet
          Undoubtedly! Our stupa first rose to the sky !!!
          1. Simpsonian
            Simpsonian 20 July 2016 08: 12
            +5
            Quote: Andrey Yurievich
            Undoubtedly! Our stupa first rose to the sky !!!


            Undoubtedly! And the only one ... Theirs shmars still fly on broomsticks - "English school, a complete insignificance" (C). wink
        3. Oleg Karlash
          Oleg Karlash 29 September 2016 19: 56
          0
          All stupas and women will be ours =)
    3. Pavel1
      Pavel1 19 July 2016 08: 03
      +15
      The engine type is not reported. Most likely turbojet

      what kind of aircraft is 6pok. if the engine is old? Some kind of nonsense.
      what's the point of discussing what is not? This 6th generation is already inclined in every way. It turns into an insistent collection of fairy-tale situations, instead of talking about the present.
      It is worth remembering that the American XB-70 "Valkyrie" when flying at a speed of about 2,5-3M heated up to 3 degrees.

      to 3000? Does titanium melt a bit at 1720С. From tungsten, was this Valkyrie made?
      1. Baikal
        Baikal 19 July 2016 10: 14
        +12
        Quote: Paul1
        to 3000? Does titanium melt a bit at 1720С. From tungsten, was this Valkyrie made?

        By the way, an interesting remark. Something the author gave to the bar laughing
        From another article:
        At M = 3, the skin temperature could reach 330 ° C...

        http://testpilot.ru/usa/northam/b/70/b70_1.htm
        1. Normal ok
          Normal ok 19 July 2016 11: 56
          +9
          Quote: Baikal
          Quote: Paul1
          to 3000? Does titanium melt a bit at 1720С. From tungsten, was this Valkyrie made?

          By the way, an interesting remark. Something the author gave to the bar laughing
          From another article:
          At M = 3, the skin temperature could reach 330 ° C...

          http://testpilot.ru/usa/northam/b/70/b70_1.htm

          This author regularly hits the bar. Consistency is a sign of "professionalism" laughing
          1. Tibidokh
            Tibidokh 19 July 2016 13: 57
            +3
            Quote: Normal ok
            the author regularly hits the post

            Og. The T-10 and M-50 are hypersonic, you see.
            1. Come on
              Come on 20 July 2016 01: 17
              +6
              The article has a bunch of blunders and strange conclusions, here about 3000s.



              "The aircraft XB-70 "Valkyrie" was designed according to the "duck" with a thin triangular wing and two-keeled vertical tail. With the number M = 3, the sheathing temperature, according to the calculations, could reach 330 ° C, therefore, stainless steel, high-strength tool steel NI and titanium alloys were widely used in the design. Found a rather exotic alloy based on Rene-41 nickel. These materials retained high strength in the calculated operating temperature range for B-70, equal to 230-330С.
              For the XB-70 Valkyrie, conventional sheet metal sheathing, reinforced panels of various designs and sandwich panels were originally developed. Studies have shown that laminated panels have the best performance for most of the airframe. This was largely due to the requirement for good thermal insulation. Otherwise, due to the kinetic heating of the skin, the fuel temperature in the tanks-compartments could exceed 150'C, the maximum permissible level of fuel temperature at the engine inlet. Laminated structures were also favored by their high rigidity (and, consequently, maintaining a smooth surface and high aerodynamic quality at high speeds), resistance to acoustic fatigue (from fluctuations in air pressure in high-speed flight and engine noise) and a relatively low mass.
              ."

              Then you see F-22 and F-35 sacrificed maneuverability for the sake of stealth. But this is nonsense, enough to look at the performance characteristics of these machines.
          2. papik09
            papik09 19 July 2016 23: 21
            +2
            Quote: Normal ok
            Quote: Baikal
            Quote: Paul1
            to 3000? Does titanium melt a bit at 1720С. From tungsten, was this Valkyrie made?

            By the way, an interesting remark. Something the author gave to the bar laughing
            From another article:
            At M = 3, the skin temperature could reach 330 ° C...

            http://testpilot.ru/usa/northam/b/70/b70_1.htm

            This author regularly hits the bar. Consistency is a sign of "professionalism" laughing

            "DO NOT CHECK THE PIANIST - HE PLAYS AS WELL KNOWS" (C) love
        2. Normal ok
          Normal ok 19 July 2016 11: 56
          +2
          Quote: Baikal
          Quote: Paul1
          to 3000? Does titanium melt a bit at 1720С. From tungsten, was this Valkyrie made?

          By the way, an interesting remark. Something the author gave to the bar laughing
          From another article:
          At M = 3, the skin temperature could reach 330 ° C...

          http://testpilot.ru/usa/northam/b/70/b70_1.htm

          This author regularly hits the bar. Consistency is a sign of "professionalism" laughing
      2. Vadim237
        Vadim237 19 July 2016 10: 59
        +1
        For this, Russia is already experiencing a combined - ramjet plus scramjet engine for sixth generation aircraft.
        1. Lt. Air Force stock
          Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 11: 05
          +3
          In the US, the sixth generation fighter makes the company "Boeing". Her project is called F / A-XX. It is assumed that this new 30-s will replace the deck fighters F / A-18E / F "Super Hornet".

          I thought the F-35C was a replacement for the Super Hornets.
        2. Makarov
          Makarov 19 July 2016 20: 56
          +1
          luxury booth)
      3. Verdun
        Verdun 19 July 2016 12: 18
        +6
        Quote: Paul1
        Some kind of nonsense.
        what's the point of discussing what is not?

        And here you just need to ask what kind of adviser Mr. Mikheev is. Judging by his statements, it seems that in general. Such advisers can easily make any statements - the main thing is to be in the spotlight.
        Quote: Paul1
        to 3000? Does titanium melt a bit at 1720С. From tungsten, was this Valkyrie made?
        T-4 - weaving - created almost simultaneously with the Valkyrie, was made of milled titanium panels. He reached speeds of 3M. The creators argued that the power-to-weight ratio and aerodynamics could have made it possible to develop more, but it was the strength of the materials that was lacking. If you look at the T-4 in Monino, it is easy to see that its unpainted hull is all in "tarnish" colors. That is, the temperatures there are really very serious, quite close to the melting points. And this is one of the still unresolved difficulties on the way of creating hypersonic aircraft of any generation.
        1. Gray brother
          Gray brother 19 July 2016 16: 19
          +3
          Quote: Verdun
          . That is, the temperatures there are really very serious, quite close to the melting points. And this is one of the difficulties that have not yet been overcome on the way to create hypersonic aircraft of any generation.

          The higher the height, the lower the density of air and, accordingly, the less heat.
      4. Grenader
        Grenader 19 July 2016 13: 00
        +2
        Quote: Paul1
        what kind of aircraft is 6pok. if the engine is old? Some kind of nonsense.

        Recently there was information about the 6th generation engine (I don’t know how true) http://warfiles.ru/show-123456-serdce-istrebitelya-shestogo-pokoleniya-gotovo-k-

        seriynomu-proizvodstvu.html They write that a promising engine is ready, although so far there is little information about the engine for the T-50, which is very strange.
        The Ministry of Defense intends to present the engine for the sixth generation fighter to the world. It is planned to demonstrate the pilot project at the Army 2016 forum, which will take place in September in Kubinka near Moscow.

        And now, information for those who prefer specifics. Before us in all its glory will appear the engine for a promising aerospace aircraft, which has a combined power plant with two operating modes: air - for flying in the atmosphere, and rocket - for near space.

        One of the main features of the future fighter is the ability to fly in near space at hypersonic speeds. Of course, this is not only the merit of the engine, but also of the specific structure of the fuselage of the fighter, but the movement of the device is carried out using the power plant of the aircraft, and, therefore, the main feature in the form of hypersonic speed can be written to the engine’s account.

        At the moment, it is reported that the model passed all the fire tests, and fully confirmed its performance. This was personally stated by the commander-in-chief of the Strategic Missile Forces, Sergei Karakaev.

        It is quite likely (and I would very much like to hope) that soon civil aircraft with similar engines will appear on Earth - this will significantly reduce fuel consumption for flight due to lower air resistance and the need to keep a high "spill" in the power plant. The era of free space flights and excursions is just around the corner, and thanks for this to Russian military engineers and developers. Thanks to their efforts, we are able to compete with the world powers in the space industry, maintain the country's air security at the highest level, and move one step closer to the possibility of free space travel.
        1. DimerVladimer
          DimerVladimer 19 July 2016 13: 49
          +8
          Quote: Grenader
          Recently there was information about the 6th generation engine (I don’t know how true) //warfiles.ru/show-123456-serdce-istrebitelya-shestogo-pokoleniya-gotovo-k-

          seriynomu-proizvodstvu.html They write that a promising engine is ready, although so far there is little information about the engine for the T-50, which is very strange.


          The engine is a very complex design and its development and testing takes twice as much time as an airplane.
          It’s not for nothing that engine operators say that an airplane is a primitive device designed for engine flight :)
      5. K-50
        K-50 19 July 2016 13: 14
        +4
        Quote: Paul1
        up to 3000С? Does titanium melt a little at 1720С

        Maybe they still considered Fahrenheit? In a mattress, the temperature in Fahrenheit is measured.
  2. azer
    azer 19 July 2016 05: 13
    +5
    I'm sorry I'm not a military man, but I have a question. The point is to create a PAKF that has not yet been adopted and already create the 6th generation. Then what to do with the entire fleet of fighters?
    1. domokl
      domokl 19 July 2016 05: 29
      +5
      Each donkey wears his ears ... Any aircraft performs certain tasks ...
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. siberalt
        siberalt 19 July 2016 07: 24
        0
        Bravo! Well said.
    2. Bayonet
      Bayonet 19 July 2016 08: 13
      0
      Quote: azer
      Then what to do with the entire fleet of fighters?

      It still needs to be built smile And everything else is just talking.
    3. Pavel1
      Pavel1 19 July 2016 09: 00
      -3
      Quote: azer
      Then what to do with the entire fleet of fighters?


      the consumption of equipment during hostilities will be huge, Russia is opposed to almost the whole world ...
    4. dumkopff
      dumkopff 19 July 2016 10: 07
      +9
      This is a military joke. As soon as a new fighter (generation n) enters the series, immediately issue an order to create an even newer one (generation n + 1). In 1959, the MiG-21 went into series, and work on the MiG-23 started immediately, in 1969 went into the MiG-23 series, and in the same year a competition was announced for the creation of PFI (LPPI and TPFI - MiG-29 and su- 27). So the beginning of work on the topic of the 6th generation fighter when another 5 in the series did not go is normal.
    5. bk316
      bk316 19 July 2016 12: 04
      +7
      Quote: azer
      The point is to create a PAKF that has not yet been adopted and is already

      Do you know how many generations of processors simultaneously under development at Intel?
      Three, one more is made as the main and one as leaving - this is a minimum. Sometimes it happens that 4 generations are produced at the same time. And still, promising developments are underway with an aim of about 10 years. And the costs of all this R&D are quite comparable with the development of a new aircraft. Otherwise it’s impossible - you’ll fall behind.
    6. weksha50
      weksha50 19 July 2016 16: 07
      0
      Quote: azer
      The meaning of creating PAKFa which has not yet been adopted and already create the 6th generation. Then what to do with the entire fleet of fighters?


      Literally about 15 minutes ago, there was information that India had broken off the Rafale contract with France in favor of the contract with Russia precisely under the PAK FA ... Part of it would be acquired from us, and then, on the basis of it, they would create with us then his own ... belay

      The ways of trade are inscrutable ...
    7. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 19 July 2016 20: 30
      0
      Quote: azer
      The point is to create a PAKF that has not yet been adopted and already create the 6th generation.

      but how do you think? try to do today when you needed yesterday? the backlog should be.
    8. vv3
      vv3 19 July 2016 20: 38
      0
      The PAK FA is not a 5th generation aircraft; it is not integrated into any information system, and does not exchange information with it. Moreover, the attempt to create such systems has failed. Until such systems are created instead of the ESU TZ "Constellation" and "Andromeda-D", there is no need to talk about the 5th generation. The 5th generation aircraft is a key link in the information system with certain properties. There are properties, but there is no link and system. We almost have a good platform for a 5th generation aircraft. Almost, because a sample with a full avionics is only being tested. What 6th generation are we talking about? Maybe, instead of a new platform, in 10-15 years we can create an information system and its link? ... By the way, most of the problems for Americans are connected with this ...
      1. Lt. Air Force stock
        Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 21: 40
        +3
        Quote: vv3
        It is not integrated into any information system,

        How do you know whether it is integrated or not?
        Quote: vv3
        What 6 generation are we talking about?

        An advance project so far.
        1. Simpsonian
          Simpsonian 20 July 2016 08: 46
          0
          From there, that in such a generation of fighters is equal to the version number of the installed "Windows" tool.
        2. vv3
          vv3 21 July 2016 19: 20
          0
          If there are no such systems, or rather there are, but they do not work. Read, on the Internet, about ESU TK "Constellation" and "Andromeda-D". You just need to read and think. Can you handle it?
  3. max2215
    max2215 19 July 2016 05: 16
    +5
    then an unmanned fighter will be able to develop greater speed, perform more complex maneuvers in terms of overloads and even go into space.
    most likely, space will become the main theater of operations, tauka and equipment do not walk but just rush. Remember, in the 80s, I remember reading an article about laser disks in the TM magazine, so they considered it a duck. 35 years have passed, a moment in history, so the amount of information from a good library already clings to a small flash drive. But what will such a speed of progress lead to? After all, if "the gun goes off! At best we will find ourselves in the Stone Age again ...
    1. domokl
      domokl 19 July 2016 05: 30
      +7
      Quote: max2215
      After all, if “the gun goes off!” At best, we will find ourselves in the Stone Age again.

      laughing And you are an optimist ...
  4. stas52
    stas52 19 July 2016 05: 43
    +2
    about half a year ago, I already read it.
  5. Nitarius
    Nitarius 19 July 2016 05: 46
    +2
    The idea is very interesting))
    And if you still include a little fantasy! and "vpendyurit" there the engines on "without support thrust" .. the one that stands on man-made earthly UFOs ... then such a "Beast" can work! Although I don't think to show it officially then!
    or are these
    1. Bayonet
      Bayonet 19 July 2016 08: 27
      +6
      Quote: Nitarius
      And if you still include a little fantasy!

      From my window you can still not see! smile
      (click)
      1. Nitarius
        Nitarius 20 July 2016 08: 46
        0
        But in Novosibirsk, one clever and competent did a much more interesting thing on the Natural Effect .... Grebennikov’s platform!
        http://bronzovka.ru/glava05_1.html - советую для Чтения))
    2. Bayonet
      Bayonet 19 July 2016 08: 36
      +3
      Meanwhile,
      18.07.2016/9/XNUMX The first stage of the Falcon XNUMX rocket made a successful vertical landing at the spaceport. This was reported by SpaceX.
      Earlier, SpaceX's Falcon 9 rocket launched from a Florida spaceport with a Dragon ship with cargo for the ISS. The launch of the rocket took place at the estimated 7:45 Moscow time. The docking of the spacecraft with the ISS is scheduled for July 20.
      The kid learns to stand on his feet and is not unsuccessful! What will happen tomorrow? wink
      1. Corsair
        Corsair 19 July 2016 09: 52
        +8
        Quote: Bayonet
        The kid learns to stand on his feet and is not unsuccessful! What will happen tomorrow?

        what The question is - is it worth it, except perhaps as the development of a landing module on other planets with lower gravity. Because how to run it again after such overloads without a meticulous examination is impossible and dangerous.
        1. Bayonet
          Bayonet 19 July 2016 11: 26
          0
          Quote: Corsair
          The question is - is it worth it, except perhaps as the development of a landing module on other planets

          Exactly! Mars is just around the corner!
        2. DimerVladimer
          DimerVladimer 19 July 2016 13: 58
          +2
          Quote: Corsair
          the question is whether it’s worth it, except as the development of a landing module on other planets with lower gravity. Because how to run it again after such overloads without a meticulous examination is impossible and dangerous.


          This is worth the development cost, even if the cost of a reusable motor is twice that of a disposable one, plus the replacement of some "disposable parts" in a reusable engine (for example, nozzles or their critical sections made of refractory materials, power and pressure sources, TPA bearings, disposable valves for TB and tn), in general, if the cost of the "bulkhead" of the engine does not exceed 10-20% (or so) of its initial cost, then the topic is very interesting and profitable.
      2. Urfin
        Urfin 19 July 2016 16: 07
        +2
        We can say that the baby gets on its feet only after a rocket with an already used stage successfully launches.
        In the meantime, this is only an embryo ... unfortunately, with all the signs of stillbirth.
  6. Aaron Zawi
    Aaron Zawi 19 July 2016 05: 46
    +6
    In my opinion, so far we can only talk about the formation of the concept of the sixth generation. Due to the fact that many scientists believe that mankind has made it to the Fourth Industrial Revolution, it is too early to even issue technical specifications.
    1. gridasov
      gridasov 8 October 2016 20: 53
      0
      You can talk about any generation and the essence will not change from the name. If we are talking about 5-7-10 M, then there are not even prerequisites for success. The physics of the process on turbine blades is such that already modern engines fly to the limit of their potential capabilities. And I note that promising engines are structurally and conceptually the same. Further. no processor is capable of analyzing the aggregate environment during flight. Modern processors are built on a primitive basis that has nothing to do with mathematics. Therefore, such complex processes can only be processed by processors associated with numerical analogs of a pulse. In general, dreaming is not harmful!
  7. Magic archer
    Magic archer 19 July 2016 06: 14
    +4
    Talk about this has been going on for a long time. But no one has yet put forward the basic requirements for the 6 generation aircraft. It is clear that it will most likely be unmanned, which will allow it to make maneuvers unbearable by the human body. Plus, everything is not clear how to equip it. Real weapon systems for There is no 6 generation aircraft. No guns, no lasers, no rockets. In general, there are some questions that are not answered yet.
    1. Art
      Art 19 July 2016 07: 52
      0
      Because now they started to do this, there are a lot of questions, it will take a lot of time to solve all the issues, I think from 10 years for a light version of the 6th generation (5 ++), to 20 years for a hypersonic version with AI
  8. Dimon19661
    Dimon19661 19 July 2016 06: 27
    +4
    When creating a new concept, designers plan to adhere to the strengths of Russian aircraft, namely high maneuverability.

    High maneuverability and hypersonic pilot will be easier to paint over than to assemble. Although sometimes think what to write. The article reminds me of 70s school posters with projects of lunar bases.
    1. Lt. Air Force stock
      Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 21: 48
      +2
      Quote: Dimon19661
      High maneuverability and hypersonic pilot will be easier to paint than assemble.

      So there will be no pilot, there will be either automatic control based on AI or remote control, there will be 6th generation manned fighters, but there will be significantly fewer of them. Since a man is a weak link, maneuvers at hypersonic speeds are difficult for him to withstand, in addition, they are going to install microwave guns on these fighters, and it will be difficult to protect the pilot from radiation, and the presence of a pilot is an extra burden: manual control systems, cockpit glass, LCD monitors, life support system, heavy ejection seat, etc.
  9. Rurikovich
    Rurikovich 19 July 2016 07: 01
    +7
    Oh come on lol "Another 5th generation has not been brought to mind, but they are already working on the 6th." If we compare it with the fleet, then sometimes, after laying on the slipway, the ship actually turns out to be outdated and in the design bureau whatman paper is already rustling with might and main when designing the next one. And nothing, they are finishing construction! winked
    1. Lt. Air Force stock
      Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 11: 12
      +5
      Quote: Rurikovich
      Oh, come on, "The 5th generation has not been brought to mind, but they are already doing the 6th."

      This is always done, for example, with regard to submarines, ours began to work on the concept of 4th generation submarines in the early 80s.
      Since R&D takes years, if you first bring a 5th generation fighter to your mother and then start developing a 6th fighter from scratch, then the time lag can be 10 years.
    2. Vadim237
      Vadim237 19 July 2016 11: 18
      +2
      It seems that T 50 will be purchased in limited quantities, mainly they will buy Su 35 - for four dryers one t 50 - 120 airplanes for the Russian Air Force will be released and supplies will end, and there the sixth generation will do. We were 20 years late with fifth-generation planes and the Air Force leadership understands this and is trying to narrow the gap by ordering the development of the sixth generation of fighters.
      1. Lt. Air Force stock
        Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 14: 40
        +1
        Quote: Vadim237
        generations we are 20 years late

        Where are you late? The US won only F-35 are going to produce, the Chinese are also just testing their own, the Japanese are testing.
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 19 July 2016 18: 06
          0
          "Where are you late? The US is only going to release the F-35." Well that's right - the F 35 is already in serial production, but the F 22 was already released before it - sixteen years ago, and we still do not have a single fifth-generation aircraft - the epic about the adoption of the T 50 will last until 2020, so as the engine of the second stage is only being completed, and then the aircraft itself will be tested and refined with new engines, the aircraft of the sixth generation may appear in the USA, in 10 years, new technologies, design systems will greatly speed up its creation. And our Air Force is faced with a choice - either to buy the T 50 en masse for several billion rubles apiece, or to limit itself to a batch of new aircraft and buy the Su 35 en masse, waiting for the sixth generation - which is just around the corner - three different heavy fighters in service with the Air Force. Russia will not pull it.
          1. Lt. Air Force stock
            Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 19: 32
            0
            Quote: Vadim237
            Well right - the F 35 is already mass-produced,

            Small-scale production so far. The USA in the late 80s, for example, produced 80 F-16s per year. This is a large-scale one.
            Quote: Vadim237
            F 22 - sixteen years ago, but we still don’t have it in service,

            The USA also produced the F-22 at a slow pace; in almost 10 years, only 187 were produced.
            Let me remind you that the United States has about 1000 F-16, 200 F-15C and 200 F-15E, as well as 750 Hornets and Superhornets.
            Quote: Vadim237
            And our Air Force is faced with a choice - either in large numbers to buy T 50 for several billion rubles apiece, or to limit itself to a batch of new planes and massively buy Su 35, waiting for the sixth generation - which is just around the corner - three different heavy fighters armed with the Air Force, Russia will not pull.

            When they begin to mass produce the T-50, they will most likely use the production facilities that Su-35S and Su-30SM are now producing.
            1. voyaka uh
              voyaka uh 22 July 2016 00: 12
              0
              - F 35 is already mass-produced,
              Small-scale production so far. "//////

              Large-scale - since 2019.
              By the end of 2020, 600 aircraft will be produced.
              450 for the States. 150 for allies.
      2. ver_
        ver_ 20 July 2016 10: 14
        +1
        6th generation - a platform - there is nothing for a person to do there ..
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 20 July 2016 20: 59
          0
          They promise a manned and unmanned version.
    3. Fat
      Fat 19 July 2016 12: 40
      +1
      Quote: Rurikovich
      Oh come on lol "Another 5th generation has not been brought to mind, but they are already working on the 6th." If we compare it with the fleet, then sometimes, after laying on the slipway, the ship actually turns out to be outdated and in the design bureau whatman paper is already rustling with might and main when designing the next one. And nothing, they are finishing construction! winked

      The ship becomes obsolete on the slipway, that the design bureau still "rustle whatman paper", scores knock, drawers and sliders of slide rulers creak yes
      1. Lt. Air Force stock
        Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 14: 41
        0
        Quote: Thick
        The ship becomes obsolete on the slipway, that the design bureau still "rustle whatman paper", scores knock, drawers and sliders of slide rulers creak

        Therefore, it is necessary to build warships and submarines in the sub-series.
  10. lotar
    lotar 19 July 2016 07: 06
    +6
    I watched one of the military programs, where a military expert talked about the timing of the creation of subsequent generations of weapons. According to him, it turns out that as soon as a new generation combat system appears in the troops for its refinement with subsequent adoption into service. So scientists and engineers immediately take for creating mock-ups of prototypes of future generations of military equipment. There is a whole phased work that does not stop even for a second, since when one of the stages is stopped, we give chances for success in confronting our potential enemy.
  11. Nix1986
    Nix1986 19 July 2016 07: 07
    0
    I will not once again joke about the decked version of this pepelats for the star cruiser enterprise and electric trains traveling without an ordinary Conder ... On the issue of swarms of exterminators in the article, I am afraid to present the cost of this miracle, so I think if it will be created, then it is destined for it the role as a raptor is a screensaver on the desktop, a participant in air parades and Discovery issues, but real-life old-fashioned old generation 3-4+ will work like the USA - A10, F15, F16. While there are no technologies that make hypersonic both effective and cheap, the 6th generation is a whim.
    1. Lt. Air Force stock
      Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 11: 14
      +1
      Quote: Nix1986
      On the issue of swarms of exterminators in the article, I’m afraid to imagine the cost of this miracle,

      Well, we also plan the concept of a "pack", most of them will be unmanned fighters and 1-2 with pilots. They say that unmanned vehicles will cost less than manned ones.
      1. Nix1986
        Nix1986 19 July 2016 12: 15
        0
        What is at the moment, there is a raptor, at the price of gold for its weight. Well, suppose there will be an unmanned version, minus the cost of the pilot control interfaces and life support systems, plus remote control devices, it will be cheaper, but not by much. And now the psychological moment, who will give the remote control a tool worth $ 200 million, which has a high risk of control interception ?! It will be just like the pilot just a demonstration stand of technology.
        1. Lt. Air Force stock
          Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 14: 43
          0
          Quote: Nix1986
          remote control facility worth under $ 200 million,

          Perhaps there will be automatic control, not remote control.
          1. Nix1986
            Nix1986 19 July 2016 18: 20
            0
            Technically, it is possible a certain neural network with training signatures of enemy targets. True, there is one thing, but now such a network will require either if it works autonomously by weight of ferrous iron, the aircraft will not pull it out, or it will also control from the ground through a channel, but not by a pilot, but by the same network. But this is clearly not 2030, at least 2035.
  12. inkass_98
    inkass_98 19 July 2016 07: 42
    +2
    About the mass of the aircraft: SR-71 weighed 78 tons, the speed reached about 3,3 M, so a certain reserve has been accumulated for a long time. There is also a MiG-31 with a speed of the order of 3000 km / h. Its mass is also far from the declared 150-230 tons.
    Well, you don’t have to talk about the M-50 at all - he never reached the set parameters due to the lack of suitable engines.
    Well and further: "Valkyrie", T-4, M-50 are strategic bombers for their purpose, it is incorrect to compare them with fighters.
  13. FID
    FID 19 July 2016 08: 27
    +4
    Think about how Mikheev (KRET) relates to aircraft design ??? The concern of radio-electronic technologies ... Mikheev and one more engine engineer (there was an article recently with him) carry nonsense with the following meaning - give money, and we will design it .... You think about it - a flock of planes knows what generation, to hell knows what speed, releases another flock, but already missiles, which they themselves choose targets, etc. Why then generals and marshals ??? Why a manned version of these six-generation? Mikheev, sitting in his office and looking at the laptop screen, will do everything himself. Destroy all and defeat ....
    1. silver_roman
      silver_roman 19 July 2016 09: 22
      0
      Sergey, hi
      Quote: SSI
      eat bullshit with the following meaning - give money, and we will design this

      Rather, give me the money. And we will write an essay on the subject of the 648 generation aircraft.

      I understand that the regiment of Rogozin and Bondarev replenishment.
      Now there Mikheev sits.

      The eyes just hurt from the article: 23-25 ​​year - the first flight. No, maybe they will draw a glider, it will fly with engines of 4 generations, because these years is not a fact that the 5th generation of engines will be finished.

      In short, in the furnace.
    2. bk316
      bk316 19 July 2016 11: 51
      +6
      Quote: SSI
      You think, what does Mikheev (KRET) have to do with aircraft design?

      Here you have one extra word: KRET.
      Because KRET, then of course it has a relationship, but Mikheev no.

      You yourself probably know what an adviser is - usually they give such positions when they withdraw for the staff, so that it would not be offensive.
      And here it’s not just an adviser but an adviser to Nasenkov (I think I won’t open secrets). But Nasenkov, too, has nothing to do with design, he does not have a technical education at all, he is an economist and marketer. I listened to them at MAX - cried.

      So you can write at least about the 222 generation aircraft, at least about neutron blasters.
      1. FID
        FID 19 July 2016 13: 28
        0
        Quote: bk316
        Advisor to Nasenkov (I think I won’t open secrets

        Do not open, I came across these work leaders ...
  14. guzik007
    guzik007 19 July 2016 09: 19
    +1
    For me, it's just another vyser from another "budget milker". Promise whatever you want, maybe it will go through and some money will be thrown from above due to incompetence.
    Superfluous water filters are also heard, which would enrich and heal all of Russia.
    Promoted the idea of ​​"the minister of funeral", if my memory serves me right. And he cut down a lot of dough.
  15. pavelty
    pavelty 19 July 2016 10: 07
    +5
    Colleagues, I have a higher aviation education, I will tell you honestly - this is crap. What is the sixth generation? Not we, not Americans, with our F-35s have not come close to the fifth, all the more so since these criteria are very arbitrary ... Therefore, we must listen to Comrade Mikheev carefully))
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 19 July 2016 11: 29
      +2
      And what is F fifth generation not for you - it’s in the series and has been flying for a long time.
      1. saturn.mmm
        saturn.mmm 19 July 2016 16: 01
        0
        Quote: Vadim237
        And what is F fifth generation not for you - it’s in the series and has been flying for a long time.

        It will look ridiculous if, by the 6th generation, the PTB will stick.
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 19 July 2016 18: 09
          0
          Additional fuel tanks will always be with all generations of fighters that will use hydrocarbon fuels - so the sixth generation will have them too.
    2. DimerVladimer
      DimerVladimer 19 July 2016 14: 10
      +1
      Quote: pavlentiy
      Colleagues, I have a higher aviation education, I will tell you honestly - this is crap. What is the sixth generation? Not we, not Americans, with our F-35s have not come close to the fifth, all the more so since these criteria are very arbitrary ... Therefore, we must listen to Comrade Mikheev carefully))


      Similarly.
      Each subsequent generation of engines, more and more heat-intensive than the previous one, and development takes DECADES.
      To make a glider and equipment into it is possible, only IT will not fly without an appropriate engine.
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 19 July 2016 18: 16
        0
        Now with the creation of engines it has become easier, engineering CAD systems have already appeared that allow using a computer model to work out all sorts of loads, and as close as possible to real influences - this significantly reduces the cost and simplifies the process of creating units.
        1. berezin1987
          berezin1987 19 July 2016 21: 49
          +1
          The question is not so much in the design of engines as in structural materials. You can design a wonderful engine with excellent traction and indicators of efficiency, but its production will be impossible at the current level of technology. The best engines today have thrust of 15-18 t. And allow you to reach speeds of about 3000 km / h (Mig-31), but to achieve speeds in the 5M area, you will need many times more thrust or an aircraft going to great heights.
          1. Lt. Air Force stock
            Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 21: 58
            0
            Quote: berezin1987
            The question is not so much in the design of engines as in structural materials.

            By the way, with regard to structural materials, they say that composite materials are stronger than metal and several times lighter therefore they are used in passenger aircraft, but passenger aircraft fly at subsonic speeds and do not experience heating. Fighters fly at speeds of 2-2,5 Mach and the surface is experiencing heat. How do the physical properties of composite materials change when heated?
          2. Vadim237
            Vadim237 19 July 2016 22: 04
            -1
            This problem has already been solved - they created a combined engine, take-off, acceleration to 2000 - on a jet engine, and after switching to a scramjet engine, the speed in the flesh is up to 17 mach.
            1. Lt. Air Force stock
              Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 22: 10
              0
              Quote: Vadim237
              takeoff, acceleration to 2000 - on a jet, and after the transition to the scramjet engine speed to the flesh up to 17 mach.

              I wonder what fuel consumption is 17 mach? And how much fuel is enough? An article about a 6th generation fighter said that an unmanned version would be able to patrol airspace for almost days. Is it interesting with or without refueling?
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 20 July 2016 00: 49
                0
                Fuel consumption depends on the mass of the apparatus, engine thrust, engine design and fuel composition, as well as airframe design.
            2. Come on
              Come on 20 July 2016 02: 00
              0
              Quote: Vadim237
              This problem has already been solved - they created a combined engine, take-off, acceleration to 2000 - on a jet engine, and after switching to a scramjet engine, the speed in the flesh is up to 17 mach.


              Have you decided? Who and where? Where can I see the flight at Mach 17? :)
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 20 July 2016 09: 30
                0
                The engine was created with a speed limit of 17 mach, and at the moment, the real planning flight at that speed was made by the HTV 2 experimental planning combat unit - a speed of 28 mach.
  16. demotivator
    demotivator 19 July 2016 10: 13
    +2
    Quote: pavlentiy
    Colleagues, I have a higher aviation education, I will tell you honestly - this is crap. What is the sixth generation?

    I agree, although I'm not an aviator. Frankly, the author of the article is a rare romantic, yes. A dreamer who has come off Russian realities.
  17. The comment was deleted.
  18. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 19 July 2016 10: 53
    -1
    It is not very clear why to make a manned version. Drones are easier and more efficient to control from AWACS ground-ship-plane.
    1. DimerVladimer
      DimerVladimer 19 July 2016 14: 14
      +2
      There are long-range missiles and all EW ground forces against AWACS.
      The EW battalion crushed them back in the GSVG - a priority goal!
      1. Come on
        Come on 20 July 2016 02: 04
        0
        Quote: DimerVladimer
        There are long-range missiles and all EW ground troops against AWACS


        AWACS flies at a distance of 600 km, what missiles did you intend to attack it and how do you approach the missile launch range in general when it will be teeming with interceptors between AWACS and you? And what does ground defense have to do with it?
  19. Lt. Air Force stock
    Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 11: 08
    0
    Last year, information began to come about what the US military saw the car .. The chief of naval operations, Jonathan Greenet, said that the speed and stealth of the aircraft were not priority. The emphasis is on the range of target detection and striking from long distances. Perhaps the fighter will be equipped with laser or electromagnetic weapons. But here is the same problem as the Russian developers: the power plant.

    It turns out interestingly, we are developing a 6th generation fighter with an emphasis on speed and stealth, not long ago there was an article on the concept of the 6th generation, it reported that they would continue to develop stealth and increase speed.
    1. arkadiyssk
      arkadiyssk 19 July 2016 11: 32
      +2
      It’s just that a lot of outsiders are mixed in the article. Specifically, the statement by the Americans that they would lean on stealth and stealth to the detriment of speed - this was said not about fighters at all, but about a promising bomber, but the author of the article doesn’t give a damn - the paper suffers.
  20. Mytholog
    Mytholog 19 July 2016 11: 12
    0
    we can conclude that our and the new generation American planes will be very different.

    By all indications, the Yankees will rest on the new principles of weapons.
    By the range of the missiles - they are lagging behind and do not hurt to try to catch up.
    Something conceived evil :)
  21. Vadim237
    Vadim237 19 July 2016 11: 41
    0
    Rather, it will look like a sixth generation fighter, as Boeing designers present it
  22. K-50
    K-50 19 July 2016 11: 45
    +1
    Engines !!!!
    if there is no necessary motor, then you can not talk about the rest, because there will be nothing to push. And so far nothing has been heard about the engines, only "Wishlist" request
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 19 July 2016 11: 49
      0
      The engine is already done.
      1. K-50
        K-50 19 July 2016 13: 18
        +1
        Quote: Vadim237
        The engine is already done.

        Where? What parameters under what modes does it show? Power? Fuel consumption? Weight? Dimensions
        If all this is not voiced, then this is just WANTES !!!!
        There is no engine yet !!!! hi
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 19 July 2016 13: 30
          0
          See the photo of the engine on the test bench above.
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 19 July 2016 13: 34
          -1
          And KRET began to create a photon radar for a new fighter.
  23. ghby
    ghby 19 July 2016 12: 26
    0
    Quote: SSI
    a flock of planes hell knows what generation, with hell knows what speed, it launches another pack, but it’s missiles, which they themselves choose targets, etc.
    In my opinion this is still the "Granites" were able to do.
  24. cucun
    cucun 19 July 2016 12: 58
    0
    The information is quite accurate, the Sukhoi Design Bureau has been designing the 6th generation for more than two years.
    The engine has already passed fire tests ...
    1. FID
      FID 19 July 2016 13: 29
      0
      Quote: cucun
      The information is quite accurate, the Sukhoi Design Bureau has been designing the 6th generation for more than two years.
      The engine has already passed fire tests ...

      Excuse me, what does Dry have to do with motors ???
    2. berezin1987
      berezin1987 19 July 2016 21: 54
      0
      The serial engine of the second stage for PAK FA is not ready yet, but they tell us about the sixth generation. In the best case, the sample shown uses the individual elements of a promising engine. But the work is going on, which is very pleasing.
      1. Lt. Air Force stock
        Lt. Air Force stock 19 July 2016 22: 01
        +1
        Quote: berezin1987
        The serial engine of the second stage for PAK FA is not ready yet, but they tell us about the sixth generation.

        And what's wrong with the existing engine? Yes, he has less thrust than the Type-30 being developed, but he is able to develop supersonic non-cruising cruising speed, has an electronic engine control system and a plasma ignition system.
  25. Skubudu
    Skubudu 19 July 2016 13: 32
    0
    Currently, there are no polymers that can withstand heating at a speed in the atmosphere of more than 2.5Max. And then the T-50 and F-22 would fly 3000km / h +
    Therefore, there will be no full 6th generation. Perhaps some sort of orbital plane will appear faster.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 19 July 2016 18: 29
      0
      And when did plastic fighters do it? And materials for speeds of 3000+ are full, starting from titanium - the melting point is 1668 degrees, ending with tantalum carbide - the melting point is 3880 degrees and carbon fiber.
      1. Come on
        Come on 20 July 2016 02: 07
        -1
        Quote: Vadim237
        And when did plastic fighters do it?


        And you look at the skin of the same F-22, or B2 and so on.
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 20 July 2016 09: 33
          0
          "And you look at the cladding of the same F-22, or B2, etc." - There the body is made of composite materials.
  26. DimerVladimer
    DimerVladimer 19 July 2016 14: 05
    +3
    ... "Having abandoned super-maneuverability and speed in favor of stealth, the Americans thereby received far from the best aircraft. But expensive. And now stealth will also be sacrificed. Perhaps maneuverability and speed will come to the fore." ..

    And what is the author such a well-known analytical scientist that he predicted the collapse of 5th generation aircraft development programs?
    Developed by hundreds of scientists and thousands of engineers?
    You take a lot on yourself, not having data on operation and combat use?

    Your argumentation is like that of your grandfather - plowing on a mare, looking at a tractor in a neighboring field and grumbling that "shaitan-arba" only spoils the earth and there will be no harvest ...

    Wait for the "harvest".
  27. bandabas
    bandabas 19 July 2016 15: 12
    +1
    "On the one hand, talking about the 6th generation fighter, when the 5th fighter has not yet been brought to mind, is strange." I didn't understand the meaning of the article. About nothing.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 19 July 2016 18: 34
      -2
      And the fact that most likely the fifth generation will be promoted and transferred to the sixth generation.
  28. sa-ag
    sa-ag 19 July 2016 19: 18
    0
    Is the project "Ajax" from the 90s pulled into the light of day?
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 19 July 2016 20: 59
      +1
      No, probably pulled M 19 and Tu 2000.
  29. Forever so
    Forever so 19 July 2016 20: 03
    0
    Last year, information began to come about how the US military saw the car .. Naval Operations Chief Jonathan Greenet said speed and stealth were not a priority. The emphasis is on the range of target detection and striking from long distances.

    Well, who would doubt that the main priority of the Americans would be to save diapers. after all, everyone knows that there are no fearless warriors than sitting on the couch in front of the keyboard.
  30. Andrey77
    Andrey77 19 July 2016 20: 19
    0
    Why did the Americans abandon the idea of ​​the F-14A / D? A magnificent glider capable of carrying heavy rockets ...
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 19 July 2016 21: 01
      0
      Because with six missiles weighed more than 33 tons.
      1. Andrey77
        Andrey77 20 July 2016 10: 55
        0
        You can take 4. Weak argument. It seems to me that someone stomped F-18 stupidly. Business.
  31. fa2998
    fa2998 19 July 2016 22: 44
    +2
    Quote: Paul1
    to 3000? Does titanium melt a bit at 1720С. From tungsten, was this Valkyrie made?

    I think so, the third "0" after "3" means DEGREES. There is no small circle in the keyboard, you have to write "degrees Celsius." The squadron is not in service. Only testing and waiting for a promising engine on the T-50. Now we will put it into service, master it with flight personnel and in 10 years will think about how to change it. soldier hi
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 20 July 2016 00: 53
      -1
      Rather, in ten years we will change the Su 30 and Su 27CM to the sixth generation. And the T 50 will be released in a small series.
  32. Navigator Basov
    Navigator Basov 20 July 2016 02: 42
    0
    Quote: Paul1
    what kind of aircraft is 6pok. if the engine is old? Some kind of nonsense.
    But in general, how is that: new planes - and with wings? Some kind of nonsense, everything is old.
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 02: 50
      +3
      Quote: Bass Navigator
      Quote: Paul1
      what kind of aircraft is 6pok. if the engine is old? Some kind of nonsense.
      But in general, how is that: new planes - and with wings? Some kind of nonsense, everything is old.

      Is there a new one? Well, you have a mug, navigator Basov. laughing
  33. Navigator Basov
    Navigator Basov 20 July 2016 03: 06
    0
    Quote: Nix1986
    who will give the remote control a tool worth 200mln $, which has a high risk of interception?
    Dadadad, the military will send an email with the attachment of the photo zip.zip.exe, and that's it, control is intercepted! You can also hack into the contact page of the Air Force command or air base for free without SMS. Seriously, can you give me at least one example of a seizure of control (not a REP) by a military facility?
    1. Andrey77
      Andrey77 20 July 2016 11: 03
      0
      The site of the Pentagon was broken more than once. Just a website? Yes. The story of Snowden (who is not even military) shows that this is already decent.
  34. Navigator Basov
    Navigator Basov 20 July 2016 03: 09
    0
    Quote: mordvin xnumx
    Well, you have a mug, navigator Basov.
    And you don’t have one tongue
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 20 July 2016 03: 12
      +3
      Quote: Navigator Basov
      And you don’t have one

      But I don’t need that. I'm happy with my own, hehe. laughing drinks
  35. certero
    certero 20 July 2016 14: 18
    0
    Quote: Nix1986
    . On the issue of swarms of exterminators in the article, I’m afraid to imagine the cost of this miracle,

    Most likely, the fighters will not appear at all :) But the shock drones will certainly be. In a flock they interact or a squadron - no difference. It is important that a person is definitely not needed there, and it is precisely due to the absence of a living pilot that the cost of these machines will be significantly lower.
    1. Andrey77
      Andrey77 21 July 2016 11: 16
      0
      1 live pilot will knock down a hundred UAVs. An experienced pilot, not a chick from the school. Plus, he can conduct not only battle, but also reconnaissance in battle.
      1. voyaka uh
        voyaka uh 22 July 2016 00: 23
        0
        "1 live pilot will shoot down a hundred UAVs." ////

        No one. Already carried out such a simulation.
        An experienced military pilot could not win a single victory,
        in no type of combat against a drone fighter. With those
        the same ones. characteristics, like a managed one.
      2. avia1991
        avia1991 29 September 2016 23: 24
        0
        Quote: Andrey77
        1 live pilot will knock down a hundred UAVs.

        laughing ! ..
        Sorry, you are not a pilot, definitely.
        UAV controlled by the operator from the ground - yes, maybe, provided that it will fly "slowly" wink But here we are talking about a robotic complex, "taught" all possible methods of air combat, with overloads during maneuvering, unattainable for humans.
        Want to compete in reaction speed with a combat robot? wassat
  36. Dekabrev
    Dekabrev 20 July 2016 23: 09
    0
    These are all preliminary studies. I remember in some issue of the Aviastroyeniye magazine of the 80s there were sketches of promising aircraft. What can I tell you? It is completely different from what is flying now. So all this talk about the 6th generation from the same opera.
    Maybe this, maybe this, maybe a cow, maybe a hippo, maybe this was a janitor, he walked through the countryside for a new broom ...
    But the fact that as a result of all these vacillations the new fighters from the Americans and the Russians will turn out very similar is for sure. Because the devices for the same tasks, with similar capabilities.
  37. Dekabrev
    Dekabrev 20 July 2016 23: 15
    0
    Both the author’s T-4 and M-50 are hypersonic ...
  38. Former battalion commander
    Former battalion commander 29 September 2016 19: 42
    0
    A typical technique of balabol (windbag) - without really doing one thing, he starts telling tales about "even better" ... And at the end of neither one nor the other ... A striking example of balabolism is the Bulava project. They have already adopted it, but it has not flown and still does not fly ... And Solomonov has already taken up the development of a "global system for providing strategic missile launches." One can only congratulate Russia on its future "successes" in this area. And what disarmament is so disarmament ...
  39. avia1991
    avia1991 29 September 2016 23: 18
    0
    The engine type is not reported. Most likely turbojet.
    Alexander, let's just not make such statements, since we are talking about hypersonic speeds! A turbojet engine is not able to provide hypersonic flight because it does not have the necessary bandwidth: at 4-5 M it will be continuous surging! .. provided that by some miracle a turbojet aircraft will reach such a speed wassat
    For the same reason - a limitation in technical capabilities - it is incorrect to write about the T-4 and M-50 as "hypersonic machines".
    But in general - interesting! wink Thank. I would like to see this technique in real embodiment ..