Military Review

Putsch as a test of the Turkish army. Expert opinion

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Putsch as a test of the Turkish army. Expert opinion



Necessary foreword

The “expert opinion” that we offer to your opinion concerns exclusively the actions of the Turkish army. What was presented as a coup attempt, on closer examination, is more like a farce or a very unfortunate production. We did not specifically address the political and other components, but focused on those issues that, in our opinion, this putsch, more precisely, his attempt, set us. Moreover, one of the writers took part in such events.

One could even draw some analogies dated 1991 the year we have in Russia. But we will not do this, because we have associations with an earlier period in our stories. 1937 came to mind year. But - in order.

So, who mostly took part in the coup. These were the commanders of the level of the battalion brigade, which implies a higher military education. It is known that Turkish officers received education not only at home, but also abroad. As in Europe, by the way, and with us. Yes, there were such times.

And in each, we emphasize, in each army (if it is really an army, and not a militia or gang) there is such a thing as a combat statute, guided by every commander, from branch to division.

When receiving a combat mission, any commander must do the following things:

1. Understand the task.
2. Rate the situation.
3. Decide on how he will act.
4. Conduct a reconnaissance.
5. Based on all of the above, to give a military order to his subordinates.

Next comes the practical implementation on the basis of the done. Verification of personnel, equipment, support, interaction with neighbors and further in the text of the charter. And at the appointed time, after reporting to the higher command about readiness, the combat mission begins.

We look at what happened in Turkey

The first thing that caught my eye was the absence of a putsch commander. It is the one who gives the order to start the operation. Highlighted at least two leaders. It is the leader, but not the commander. The chief military prosecutor and the former commander-in-chief of the Air Force. Doubtful duet, anyway. About the prosecutor simply keep silent, to the address of the former commander-in-chief of the Air Force, we note only that not all heavenly matters are applicable to earthly affairs. But in its place, the commander-in-chief of the ground forces, or at least a combined-armsman or tankman, would have looked more appropriately.

When the coup began, everything seemed to be right, if according to Lenin. Bridges, telegraph and so on. But a sequel ... Even if we consider that, as in the Greek scenario, there was a junta of "black colonels," even in this case, the attempted coup looked more than strange.

Even those of the officers of the level of major-colonel who supported the idea of ​​the coup, in fact, simply did not know their task. From here absolutely fuzzy action of all divisions. We don’t even speak about the soldiers who participated in the putsch; the soldier executes the order given to him by the commanders.

What distinguishes the military from civilians in this regard? One, but an important factor: the military, operating in the area of ​​their deployment (that is what we saw), have knowledge of the area and the environment and are able to block everything and everyone in the area of ​​its location, if not in minutes, then in hours. Proved by the Crimea, if that.

All the talk about the possibilities of the police and special services is about nothing, because, no matter how prepared the specialists, the army team has two important advantages: a quantitative factor and the presence of heavy equipment.

Here we clearly have that, having both personnel and tanks, commanders simply did not use this advantage. Either because they did not know what to do, or ... But more on that later.

You can say a lot about the fact that a tank in a city is not a cake, and surely many will cite Grozny as an example in First Chechen. But the tank in the city is not the best weaponwhen they are waiting for him there. When anti-tank positions are equipped, when these anti-tank players have a place to be. In reality, however, that Ankara, that Istanbul, everything that the police could oppose at the first moment, are MP-5 submachine guns. That is, the police would simply be swept away. What happened in some episodes.

Judging by the way the units acted in Ankara and Istanbul, even the time of readiness was not appointed, we don’t even speak about the time of a clear start. Obviously, it was not. Moreover, the very time of the beginning of the coup was chosen more than strange. This should be said in more detail, I guess.

Why were all significant offensive operations of past wars assigned to the “dog watch”, that is, to the interval from 2 to 6 in the morning? Everything is simple: it is this time that is biologically and genetically “stitched” in the human body as a time of rest. And to “get involved” in what is happening is most difficult, especially if you are not ready for this. Proved and 22.06.1941, and many other historical dates.

Here we have the fact that the coup started at a time when the streets are still full of people. That would definitely lead to a large number of civilian casualties. And led in the end. Strange choice.

The actions of the coup forces themselves also cause mixed feelings. The fact that the Air Force acted on its own, and the ground units themselves, is obvious. But in the actions of the first and second there was no single goal.

Moreover, the use of combat aircraft in urban environments is more than doubtful. An attack aircraft would have been somehow understandable, but a fighter ... Suppose even a fighter-bomber. The attack of the parliament (and the bridge by Erdogan’s supporters) with the help of F-15 took more lives of civilians than caused damage to opponents. Recall the episode in Donetsk, about the same.

For what the aircraft flew, for which the helicopter opened fire on absolutely recognizable civilians, it is not clear.

Unless we take for dogma the fact that we actually have a bunch of organisms (that is) with tanks, airplanes, helicopters, but who absolutely do not understand how to handle all this good. From here and a syndrome of "monkey with a grenade", from here and victims, from here and zero result.

But at the disposal of the putschists was precisely the force that is able to neutralize any special service. And this is not about army intelligence or military special forces. Normal blunt-infantry in sufficient quantities, but with tanks. And support helicopters. We're not an American action movie, are we? All the rembs with leybakom "Made in Turkey" would have remained if something happens there, at the scene, who smeared on the asphalt, who was buried in the rubble after a shot of a tank gun. Turkey is not Russia, who the hell would be with a grenade under the tank rushed in the case of a serious batch.

But "not soared"

Moreover, there was information in the reports that the specialists and the police were collected at home in emergency mode, and it took at least three hours.

Decision-making. The most important item that has not been met. More precisely, some decision was made, but now find out which one is already too late. Yes, and not necessary.

Began the coup. Stupidly, but started. And they started hard. The shelling of parliament, civilians, captured the media, seized the bridge. AND?

And that is all

No one spoke to the media and announced the goal of the putsch and the next steps. That is, to bring to the population and the rest of the goals and objectives. And to proceed further under the same Charter. It was not announced who becomes the leader. The control system has not been implemented.

Accordingly, the BZ was not organized in the field. In the rest of the places, for Ankara and Istanbul are not yet Turkey. Accordingly, most of the army was not aware of what is happening. And to attract this part of the announcement of the overthrow of Erdogan would not be so difficult, given that the military did not personally swear allegiance to Erdogan ...

Such oddities, which are hammered into the head of an officer as early as the first year of any decent military high school, cause the feeling that the coup was organized and planned by civilians. Turkey in its history has already experienced several coups, which were organized by the military, and organized quite successfully. But what we saw here is not similar to the work of the military.

What did tragicomedy, called a putsch, tell us?

First of all, the power and capabilities of the Turkish army must be revised. Yes, in terms of numbers and technology on paper, this is still the second NATO army, but ...

That link of the officer corps of the Turkish army, which should conduct military operations, is not capable of planning, organizing and conducting a military operation. And if the colonel majors are not capable of these actions, then the lowest level of officers will at least be under their pressure. An illiterate person will never teach another to read and write.

Army morale. Those officers who supported the coup, most likely, supported him quite sincerely. Either they really disagreed with Erdogan’s policy, or hoped for further preferences and growth if successful. Naturally, by the way.

However, as soon as the coup stalled, what happened happened. Army units, well-armed, with armored vehicles and tanks, surrendered to the police. Where to laugh, where to cry?

And in order to land on the air force, it took to shoot down one helicopter. Let even with someone from the leaders of the coup. Well, and declare that "we will shoot down all."

In the comments, readers will say that Erdogan is to blame for this situation, who in 2007-2008 persistently destroyed and repressed the officer corps. We will agree.

That is why, at the beginning of our analysis, we took over the comparison line not 1991 year, but 1937. It was in 1937 that the changes occurred in the Red Army, the fruits of which were reaped in 1941.

The situation is similar. In Turkey, there was just such a change of commanders. And that is why we often observe a repetition of the events of New Russia. When yesterday's miners, drivers and grain-growers thrashed the cadre army of Ukraine in the tail and in the mane. And in Turkey, its counterpart - the Kurds. Which quite successfully oppose the second army of NATO. And now it becomes clear why.

About the technique two words. Techniques involved a little, moreover, all of it was used for other purposes. That is also an indicator of the effectiveness of the Turkish military.

We do not know for sure whether Erdogan took off, or whether it was a fake, but this has nothing to do with the topic of our conversation. But what is to capture an airfield or, alternatively, Ataturk Airport?

For this, a smart officer needs a platoon of soldiers. And a little crazy. At a minimum, the tank is able to break through without noticing the cargo gate of the airport and decompose on the runway. In the middle. And that's all. Nobody will sit down, no one will fly. Two lanes? Well, two tanks. And do not think about what or how to shoot down the plane with Erdogan, if you can just not let him fly. For particularly stubborn, there is a tank gun capable of dissuading any Boeing from take-off.

And the most probably interesting question. Was it all necessary for the Turkish army? If you look closely, then, apparently, is not necessary. It is precisely this that can explain so illiterate and unorganized actions. As some excuse, nothing more.

But the most recent and most interesting question: what next?

And then, as we see, there will be arrests and further purging of the army. What has already been arrested around 3 thousands of military, says a lot. And the fact that realizing that the European Union does not shine for him, Erdogan can easily deal with the part of the officer corps that does not suit him. Someone will be executed, someone will be put. There is no doubt about it.

But who will serve will remain? Who, sorry, will fight the Kurds? Yes, there is no official war, but there is fighting. Plus terrorism, with which Erdogan seems to be going to fight. Although terrorism can be fought on paper, as NATO partners.

The reorganization of Turkey as a whole is coming, from democracy to authoritarianism. Coming, of course, and the restructuring of the army from professionalism to loyalty to the regime. Familiar in Ukraine, is not it? "Who does not jump, that in lustration".

But, unfortunately, the Turkish army is not expecting anything good. Yes, she will be obedient to Erdogan, and he will not have to wait for the next coup or another backstab.

However, there is another nuance. Yes, 1937 year performed by Erdogan in 2016 will lead to the fact that many officers of all levels will fall either into the next world or into prison. But much or will remain to serve, under the flag of the fact that the case for him at any time can be taken out of the box, or will be dismissed. Just in case, as not quite loyal.

There is already another rake. Iraqi. Remember where many of Hussein’s officers were after his execution? That's right, in ISIS. And this, we note, were not the worst officers. Many studied and in our institutions. Who will say what is not an option for a Turkish officer, over whom hung the threat of deprivation of life or liberty? And what is not an option for relatives of those executed and repressed in terms of revenge? It is a possible option.

So, in conclusion, we want to summarize our conclusions.

1. The Turkish army turned out to be far from such a steep formation, as we thought before.

2. Turkish officers, who remained after the first wave of purges, do not correspond to the rank of officers of the second NATO army.

3. The army of Turkey is waiting for at least one more wave of repression, which will not have a positive effect on its condition.

And in conclusion we will make one strange conclusion: Russia is not particularly profitable. Yes, we do not consider Turkey an ally. Especially after certain events. However, it is worthwhile to consider what is more profitable: a stable Turkey or a Turkish mess, which Erdogan might not cope with?
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  1. dmi.pris
    dmi.pris 18 July 2016 05: 48
    +23
    Yeah .. This mutiny is like Dunno at the parade ..
    1. Monos
      Monos 18 July 2016 06: 56
      +9
      Putsch as a test of the Turkish army. Expert opinion


      The title of the article itself indicates the level of analysis. Well, what can these clown pokatushki with shooting say about the state of the whole army and its combat readiness? Nothing! Crazy, possibly stoned (judging by the frames) amateurs fell for kukan. That's all.
      1. Ami du peuple
        Ami du peuple 18 July 2016 07: 26
        +23
        Quote: Monos
        Crazy, possibly stoned (judging by the frames) amateurs fell for kukan. That's all.
        The truth is yours. When your subordinates with such persons, it is foolish to hope for success. This soldier, it seems, does not understand at all where he is and what is happening around.
        1. cniza
          cniza 18 July 2016 07: 43
          +18
          My opinion was a real putsch, but a cowardly Erdogan, just lucky in this case. They did not give him political asylum and thereby helped, further the actions of the police and specials. services completed the suppression of the putsch and Erdogan got all the trump cards in his hands, but then nothing good awaits him.
          1. SSR
            SSR 18 July 2016 08: 11
            +4
            Quote: cniza
            My opinion was a real putsch, but a cowardly Erdogan, just lucky in this case. They did not give him political asylum and thereby helped, further the actions of the police and specials. services completed the suppression of the putsch and Erdogan got all the trump cards in his hands, but then nothing good awaits him.

            Yes, along the way, they thought to bang it in Marmaris, but did not have time for a minute and then the whole "quartet" was confused.
            1. gladcu2
              gladcu2 18 July 2016 19: 24
              +6
              I do not agree with the conclusions of the authors. The arguments are as follows.

              The first one. Any coup is prepared in secret. Security requirements limit the ability to transmit, format, and discuss information.

              Second: since the army was used 80% blindly. There is no possibility of creating initiative actions. That is, the potential was used only in the movement of troops. In reality, the tasks and methods for their implementation were not known. Therefore, the soldiers and faces of sleepy idiots. They would know what to do, they would do.

              Third. Leadership. At the very beginning of the coup, the leader had to prove himself. A leader is one who takes responsibility for the actions of his soldiers. If you are going to take power, then take it and know how you will dispose of it. There will be no way back. That is why it is loud and loud: I am Sultan Ibrahim Ibn Sena, I take power into my own hands and guarantee the people law, peace and justice. All who are not with us are against us. Our enemies are the police forces committed to government corruption. Civilians are requested to fulfill their current duties and not interfere in current events. The enemy will be defeated, victory will be ours. "

              Well, like this.

              Therefore, I consider the author’s conclusions to be incorrect, because the coup was not carried out correctly. The army is beyond criticism.
              1. Shark Lover
                Shark Lover 19 July 2016 04: 04
                +5
                The main principle is not fulfilled, took out a gun-shoot! Not sure, don’t get it, they’ll take it away. You need to be psychologically prepared for this. The army, in this case, a pistol, but they did not shoot, if the platoon commander is in place, the platoon will shoot, but for this the platoon commander must be given a command. And so on, through the ranks. The army cannot be judged by this putsch, what they were told they did.
                1. Chiropractor
                  Chiropractor 19 July 2016 14: 56
                  +1
                  The premise was different - there was infa that Erdogan committed a successful assassination attempt.
                  The Commander-in-Chief of the Air Force decided to take matters into his own hands - to seize the chance to steer the country, or simply to send troops so that there would be no disturbances. He probably already does not know the exact answer.

                  But he gave the order. And the helicopter most likely attacked the "disguised killers of the glorious Erdogan" or "marauders".

                  And then the "lucky" man, alive and well, appeared on the stage. A dumb scene. And the failure went through the system ...
          2. Corsair
            Corsair 18 July 2016 10: 04
            +17
            Quote: cniza
            further actions of the police and special. services completed the suppression of the putsch

            what And what could the police and special services do - real military units with heavy weapons, which contrast - pistols, machine guns shields? It’s not a political asylum, but the mediocrity of the organizers, if this was not originally a setup framed by supporters of Erdogan.
            Remember how the Americans blew up a pressure cooker when people started talking for freedom, now they swallow silently, and the FBI and the police are listening to who they want and watching who they want.
          3. Azitral
            Azitral 18 July 2016 15: 42
            +14
            Well, yes, he defeated his army. For three months I was left without an army at all, and for a year or two without an army I was somehow combat-ready. He won, but only WHO DOES HE NEED WITHOUT AN ARMY? Only he is not sorry, because he is a villain, and, as it turned out, also a coward. Someone will kill him right in the coming months. And about:
            "Yes, we do not consider Turkey an ally. Especially after certain events. However, it is worth considering which is more profitable: a stable Turkey or a Turkish mess, which Erdogan may not be able to cope with?"
            The mess is not just in Turkey. A mess in a key member of NATO on the southeast flank. A hole that strategists will have to consider. And if you take into account the grudge expressed by him on the United States, then maybe the enemy in general. And, in any case, UNCERTAINTY.
            1. The stranger
              The stranger 19 July 2016 07: 07
              +1
              Three months? Give! :)
              At one time, I collected a platoon for a year. Rota - for two. The battalion is almost for life. When it disappears due to rubbing - it’s understandable, with spare mess, but disassembly for a week, no more.
              He did not collect regiments and armies, but he was clearly convinced that Erdogan would not be able to during his life either.

              And in the south of NATO there is no mess. And nobody heard the word. They would rather understand "Russian tanks!" Climb to kiss, slobber, and all forever. By stupidity.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. Ivan65
          Ivan65 18 July 2016 08: 19
          +17
          Good photo. He also noted that the rank and file looked too uninitiated - so coups do not. There is a stratification of the interests of various ranks of the army. There is no unity, the result is on the face (the face in the photo is very suitable).
        4. Mikhail Krapivin
          Mikhail Krapivin 18 July 2016 08: 25
          +7
          Quote: Ami du peuple
          This soldier, it seems, does not understand at all where he is and what is happening around.


          Yes, a soulful face. When compared with the faces of "green men" during the Crimean events, the difference is huge and undoubtedly in our favor.
          1. HERMES
            HERMES 18 July 2016 15: 30
            +2
            Quote: Mikhail Krapivin

            Yes, a soulful face. When compared with the faces of "green men" during the Crimean events, the difference is huge and undoubtedly in our favor.


            You compared the guys in helmets with prof. the military.
        5. RoTTor
          RoTTor 18 July 2016 11: 16
          +2
          The soldier is not supposed to understand.
          His job is to carry out the order.
          And if he’s not there, or if he’s bad -
      2. Asadullah
        Asadullah 18 July 2016 17: 13
        +1
        The title of the article itself indicates the level of analysis. Well, what can these clown pokatushki with shooting say about the state of the whole army and its combat readiness? Nothing! Crazy, possibly stoned (judging by the frames) amateurs fell for kukan. That's all.


        Special analysis is not visible in the article. This is called - I have an opinion and pull the arguments out of context for him. Speculation is good at finding rhymes for love verses, and political analytics has a negative value without facts. But the facts are that the people of Turkey support Erdogan by a majority, all the forces that took part in the coup are operatively subordinate to the NATO command, the Turkish armed forces are no longer an independent political figure and are split at the level of senior officers and generals, soldiers are not inclined to recklessly carry out orders, as in former military coups in the country. The game of soldiers did not work out, as the West had hoped for, whose reaction to the coup was like that of a boy who unfolded a wrapper, and there ....
        1. avt
          avt 19 July 2016 06: 48
          +1
          Quote: Asadullah
          Special analysis is not visible in the article. This is called - I have an opinion and I pull the arguments out of context for him.

          good In fact, the operation was carried out brilliantly.
          Quote: Iskander Sh
          Yes, analysis is about nothing at all.

          Or rather not about that. A false start was actually made under the name "Putsch". Well, the most active twitched and .... turned out to be "headless horsemen" and many of them will literally become such in the short term. In a short, Erdogan will skim the cream off the Islamization of the country on the way to the Sultan's turban. But this is short. And there ... wait and see how the chip will fall. It seems to me that there will be an option "Sick Man of Europe No. 2." Someone who seriously claims that the Germans will still protect their investments in Turkey with a firm hand - I strongly doubt that the Yankes, who supervise and keep the German specialist on a short leash, will go to such a strengthening of the Hans They need it? They don’t. They will do the dirty work with their hands, like the hands of Sarkozy and other Italoangles in Libya, and continue to plant true democracy on every kilometer in Turkey.
      3. Iskander Sh
        Iskander Sh 18 July 2016 17: 45
        +9
        Yes, analysis is about nothing at all.
        1. The plot was realized by a small group of officers and gendarmerie who did not like the purge of Erdogan and Turkey’s departure from the republic of Atatürk to an autocratic Islamic to the state.
        2. The success of the coup was subject to the rapid capture of pro-Erodagni generals. Selected the wedding of the daughter of the head of the Air Force (seem). Therefore, at 23-00, the guests have not yet gone home, as close as possible to 2-00 at night. Author analysis in courses about this?
        3. The idea of ​​a change of leadership in the country was not supported by all the military, although they remained decapitated due to the seizure of the generals. But they did not help the putschists either; as a result, there were not enough hands on the ground and disunity of actions.
        4. So now there are 3000 detainees, so Erdogan has many opponents among the military and now, under the pretext of an attempted coup d'etat, they will all be cleaned up. And on the ground there is now a great chance to sit up the bosses or remove the unwanted will be used to its fullest, hence the numbers.
        5. The putsch is not a war; consider the degree of preparation of the army on the basis of the putsch. Seriously? request
        6.
        Quote: Monos
        Technicians used little, moreover, all of it was used for other purposes
        Tanks are needed during the coup for moral suppression. The point of rolling them into a strip? If Erdogan already whistled on a plane and asked to Germany, if you believe the rumors, but if you do not believe then one figs standing on the strip of Erdogan in the sky you can’t shoot from a tank. The putschists had almost no aircraft, or to be more precise, there were no pilots. Erodagan, by the way, was guarded by fighters. As far as I understand, the pilots of the putschists flew quickly, only the turntables were flying and that wasn’t much. So what kind of technique are you talking about? Transport quickly delivered the infantry to key positions, the operation began at about 23-00 and by 00-00 most of the key points and positions in large cities were under the control of the putschists. What they could use.
        7.
        Quote: Monos
        Army units, well-armed, with armored vehicles and tanks, surrendered to the police.
        To fight with their people is to Ukraine. Surrendered and done right. If you want, you don’t want, but Erdogan is the elected president, the first by direct election.
        8.
        Quote: Monos
        No one spoke to the media and announced the purpose of the coup and further steps.
        A statement on the seizure of power was made after the seizure of the Telecentre. Somewhere at 2 a.m., the loyalists turned the television center around with a strike. But the author of the analysis does not seem to be aware of this either.
        9.
        Quote: Monos
        Turkey is not Russia, hell whoever there with a grenade under the tank rushed in the event of a serious kneading.
        But this is just urapatriotism. The internet is full of pictures of how the Turks went under the tanks and threw them under their cars and this is without any grant. In one of the videos, one tank was crushed by one Turk.

        I apologize for many beech.
        1. Monos
          Monos 18 July 2016 18: 16
          +6
          Quote: Iskander Sh
          I apologize for many beech.


          Yes figs with them, with letters! Everything about the case.

          I have another question: "What do I have to do with it?" These are not my words! These are quotes from the article! And I did not quote them. winked
          1. Iskander Sh
            Iskander Sh 19 July 2016 02: 15
            +2
            Sorry, I wanted to write a post in support of you, show off analysis so to speak winked And the quotation turned out like that, my hands are crooked, do not blame me. repeat
            1. Monos
              Monos 19 July 2016 23: 04
              +5
              laughing Yes, I'm not offended. I just can’t understand how to stir up this. what drinks
      4. laogun
        laogun 19 July 2016 13: 06
        +1
        The author of the article, apparently the civil pestapol, does not know the Turkish special forces. Little boy soldiers were introduced into the city, who were disarmed, flogged with straps, stripped and forced to crawl. A correct soldier, in an attempt to disarm, at least 10-15 people will kill, according to at least the store and drill regulations.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. siberalt
      siberalt 18 July 2016 06: 58
      +23
      Thanks to the authors for trying the analysis! It would be so simple. Then in the same row it is necessary to write down a planned "provocation" to deteriorate relations between Turkey and NATO and the United States. And here the question arises, was it not cool everything was mixed up and for what? Here you can build different hypotheses, inside and out - like who killed J. Kennedy.
      The algorithm "what should the commander do when he receives an order" is no longer quite working. If only because the general military schools and academies do not teach coups d'etat in general and, in particular, within their own state. And now let's turn the pages of history a few days ago and read the forecasts of our leading military political scientists I. Korotchenko and S. Bagdasarov. They were convinced that the coup was real. Has Erdogan really outplayed everyone? belay We will never know everything. But it seems that in the end, two main points worked. Inexperienced coup preparation accompanied with betrayal within the conspirators and indecision in part to go to the end (as rightly noted by the authors), the use of part of the military "in the dark" (the authors did not emphasize this), and, second, with the decisiveness of the actions of the security services and police.
      1. Tatar 174
        Tatar 174 18 July 2016 07: 10
        0
        Quote: siberalt
        Then in the same row it is necessary to write down a planned "provocation" to deteriorate relations between Turkey and NATO and the United States.

        The analysis did not say anything about how this should be perceived in NATO? Why was the US framed? Who needs this?

        However, you should consider what is more profitable: stable Turkey or a Turkish mess

        Is the mess in Turkey a continuation of the mess in the EU? Isn't this one storyline? What does this attempted coup come across for Russia, if it really was an attempted coup?
        1. nadezhiva
          nadezhiva 18 July 2016 08: 17
          +4
          Quote: Tartar 174
          The analysis did not say anything about how this should be perceived in NATO? Why was the US framed? Who needs this? ...... However, it is worth considering what is more profitable: a stable Turkey or a Turkish mess
          US framed? Not even funny. These do not need to be substituted; they are always there. I most likely will believe that they tried to substitute GDP. Under the presence of Kerry in Moscow and the protracted negotiations, if you wish, you can bring a good base. Does anyone doubt that the United States benefits from a Turkish mess?

          One could even draw some analogies dating back to 1991 in Russia. But we will not do it
          But this is in vain. Strongly in vain. This immediately lowers the analysis by an order of magnitude. If we compare precisely these 2 situations, then they will have a lot in common. To the disgrace.
          1. Monarchist
            Monarchist 18 July 2016 13: 14
            +2
            I put a plus to the article, but I also think that they have not seen in vain the analogies since 1991. They were shy: 1937 was a long time ago and everything was smooth there, and 1991 the participants of those events are still alive and it’s better to keep silent. Apparently, this consideration stopped the authors. If they had not circumvented the events of 1991, and would have mentioned other coups: the same Pinochet, or how many rebellions in Argentina after 1945? And the Gaddafi revolution? Portugal - carnations revolution? The article turned out to be 85%
            1. Orionvit
              Orionvit 18 July 2016 22: 17
              +2
              The analytics in the article floats, everything in the area "we do not know for sure, but maybe". For 1937. the authors clearly pronounced a liberal anti-Russian version. If Stalin had not cleared out the traitors from the highest command staff, the German blitzkrieg would have been one hundred percent successful. Cleaned out, but badly. All the difficult events of 1942, other than the betrayal of the generals, cannot be explained. Regarding the massive scale of repressions against the military in 1937, this is zvizdezh, there are open documents in the archives, just go to look through and study, even the "historians" have no desire. Everyone prefers the version of Solzhenitsyn and the magazine "Ogonyok". Why think, it's easier to repeat after someone.
        2. guzik007
          guzik007 18 July 2016 12: 29
          +6
          The analysis did not say anything about how this should be perceived in NATO? Why was the US framed? Who needs this?
          -----------------------------------
          And who is the USA for Turkey by and large? This is the internal affairs of the Turks first of all. And then, do not forget that their army is still Ataturk officially is the guarantor of a secular state. In essence, the military has free hands in this regard. There is a general sees that the leadership is sliding into a terry Islamization- Please shave, gentlemen. In the 20th century, 4 military coups took place. And everything is successful and, as we see, nothing is wrong.
          Erdogan simply begs for a thrashing. Another thing is that the military behaved simply mediocre and clumsy. And if they would have succeeded, they would all be heroes. And there is a temporary government and the election of an adequate leader, plus, it is possible a change in foreign policy with regard to neighbors.
          Here, in Egypt, they turned a macaque, an Islamist — no one in the world sneezed — they took it for granted.
        3. Simple
          Simple 18 July 2016 17: 58
          0
          Quote: Tatar 174
          Why was the US framed?



          Maybe in this way they wanted to "find" a scapegoat about Syria.
      2. samuil60
        samuil60 18 July 2016 10: 16
        +2
        Hmmm, the people are shrinking, they are shrinking ... One person was not able to "crash" normally, but there - to arrange a coup, to come to power ... Already in Turkey there are no normal literate men in uniform left. Or does this communication with asexual EU have such an impact?
        1. Winnie76
          Winnie76 18 July 2016 10: 48
          +2
          But it seems to me that the putsch commanders simply wanted to stay in the shadows. The Negotians were fighting to the end. For they understood that in case of failure to them a tower. Therefore, now they are reaping the fruits of their indecision. Apparently the calculation was precisely for the murder or arrest of a mustachioed.
      3. novel66
        novel66 18 July 2016 11: 19
        +3
        “If only because the general military schools and academies do not teach coups d'état at all” - why? something useful
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. siberalt
          siberalt 18 July 2016 13: 31
          +2
          Plusanul, of course. The coup is taught either in their special institutions, or in strangers against ours. The army has completely different tasks.
      4. Simple
        Simple 18 July 2016 17: 54
        +2
        Quote: siberalt
        the second is the decisiveness of the security services and the police.



        He is so simple: 7899 policemen were fired in less than a day. (This is only a meager official version).

        http://www.augsburger-allgemeine.de/panorama/Saeuberungen-Tuerkische-Regierung-w
        ird-immer-schaerfer-kritisiert-id38522332.html
    4. Rus2012
      Rus2012 18 July 2016 11: 02
      +1
      Quote: dmi.pris
      Yeah.

      Quote: Author Alexander Staver, Roman Skomorokhov
      The reorganization of Turkey as a whole is coming, from democracy to authoritarianism. Coming, of course, is the reorganization of the army from professionalism to loyalty to the regime.

      ... ay-ay-ay, authors ...
      as if Turkey was the beacon of democracy. As if the dermocratic armies are omnipotent!
      On the contrary, the armies of an authoritarian system are super-strong in terms of morale, for example, the North Korean, Japanese-imperial ...

      The authors left around the corner an analysis of where Turkey and Erdogan began to drift ... And what consequences it led to: the destruction of Su-24, an attempt to repent, terrorist attacks, coup mutiny ...

      this -
      It is known that Turkish officers received education not only at home, but also abroad. Like in Europe So, by the way, and here.

      I would like to clarify for myself - when could NATO troops be trained with us?
      During the war, when the VVZh was in Turkish Zindan - hardly ...
      Then when?
      In the days of Ataturk, yes they could ...

      I would be grateful if anyone covers this issue ...
      1. Monarchist
        Monarchist 18 July 2016 13: 19
        +5
        I also don’t remember when Turkish officers studied in the Soviet Union?
    5. twviewer
      twviewer 18 July 2016 11: 18
      0
      Improvisation failed (I heard the version: it turned out, army shifts were expected), in addition to organizational issues, the question arises: what did they want? what were you up to? here you need to look for the reasons for the failure
      There is no need to talk about the strength of the army in this situation - the seizure of power is not part of the army’s tasks.
      1. Rus2012
        Rus2012 18 July 2016 11: 30
        +1
        Quote: twviewer
        There is no need to talk about the strength of the army in this situation - the seizure of power is not part of the army’s tasks.

        ... this is not about Turkey!
        It was believed that the Turkish military is the guarantor of the "secular state", for this reason, 4 coups before the last coup-rebellion ...
  2. Shiva83483
    Shiva83483 18 July 2016 05: 49
    +4
    The rebellion cannot end in success, otherwise it’s called him differently .... the events at Erdoganchik remind me of the performance of the uninterrupted Youth Theater, and not even with the first composition, but somewhere in the third ... with grandfather Lenin and comrades it was necessary to learn mediocrity and not with natyuki, to love these iodine-deficient oligophrenics in a knee-elbow position ....
    1. nadezhiva
      nadezhiva 18 July 2016 08: 57
      +8
      The performance of the freelance youth theater looked when our president lifted the ban on flights with tourists to Turkey after a terrorist attack at a Turkish airport. That was a feint with ears. Inexplicable by nothing.
      And now everything fell into place.
      1. Ka-52
        Ka-52 18 July 2016 11: 10
        +6
        Our Tourists "kill" me more sad
        Their motto is "See Turkey and Die!"
        1. RoTTor
          RoTTor 18 July 2016 11: 21
          +1
          It’s necessary to go to Crimea, to develop and tame Abkhazia, and they will fly to Turkey, and they will bring currency there.
          Fools to crave?
  3. Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 18 July 2016 05: 49
    +22
    Was there a boy? Was there a putsch? 5 helicopters, 5 tanks, 350 hours participated in the putsch. To date, 3000 military have been arrested. AND REMOVED THE PLACES OF 3000 JUDGES, How is it? Erdogan plays toys, USA, EU, NATO smoke aside.
    1. razmik72
      razmik72 18 July 2016 07: 45
      +2
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      Was there a boy? Was there a putsch? 5 helicopters, 5 tanks, 350 hours participated in the putsch. To date, 3000 military have been arrested. AND REMOVED THE PLACES OF 3000 JUDGES, How is it? Erdogan plays toys, USA, EU, NATO smoke aside.

      Erdogan took advantage of this attempt of a coup d'etat and dismisses people who are objectionable to him, that’s all, that’s the whole trick fellow .
      1. Mavrikiy
        Mavrikiy 18 July 2016 10: 34
        +3
        Quote: razmik72
        Quote: Mavrikiy
        Was there a boy? Was there a putsch? 5 helicopters, 5 tanks, 350 hours participated in the putsch. To date, 3000 military have been arrested. AND REMOVED THE PLACES OF 3000 JUDGES, How is it? Erdogan plays toys, USA, EU, NATO smoke aside.

        Erdogan took advantage of this attempt of a coup d'etat and dismisses people who are objectionable to him, that’s all, that’s the whole trick fellow .

        You probably don’t know, Erdogan doesn’t need a coup to dismiss thousands, another man.
        1. Among the judges dismissed - 5 members of the Supreme Judicial Council.
        2. Erdogat suggests, citing the people, the introduction of the death penalty for the coup.
        3. Erdogan dreams of reviving the Sultanate. Oh well....
        4. Right. Erdogan conducted the play with a putsch, against this background he will replace the judges, at the request of the people he will impose the death penalty, and no one else will stand in his way, otherwise it will be defined as an attempted coup.
        5. What is the performance not visible?
    2. donavi49
      donavi49 18 July 2016 08: 46
      +8
      There was little participation in Istanbul, but there were more in Ankara (several tank units on the Leo2 and M60 Israeli, as well as quite a few infantry on the BMP) - there they contributed all night to success. Moreover, they even had MLRS 300 mm on the way.

      But by morning, it became clear that in Istanbul everyone - and in Ankara began to give up.
    3. Rus2012
      Rus2012 18 July 2016 11: 26
      +2
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      Was there a boy? Was there a putsch? 5 helicopters, 5 tanks, 350 hours participated in the putsch. To date, 3000 military have been arrested. AND REMOVED THE PLACES OF 3000 JUDGES, How is it? Erdogan plays toys, USA, EU, NATO smoke aside.


      ///... THE "BLANKS" of the local regional committee float, and immediately sang along on the stage: "dramatization, youth theater", in more detail -
      Not only that, the American media immediately launched a “version” launched by Gulen about “staging”. An active promotion of this, with the permission to say "version", was organized in the network on the mass of Russian resources. At the same time, it is characteristic that our patriots, weak on the head, actively began to procrastinate the topic. This included some of our “analysts."

      completely - http://oko-planet.su/first/329481-aleks-zes-armagedon-v-turcii-igry-soznaniya.ht



      ml

      and meanwhile the Turks, the common people, supported the President -

      16.07.2016. The people of Turkey defended their President ... Photo: REUTERS



      Residents of Ankara, protesting against the coup, seized the tank from the military. Photo: REUTERS


      And further -
      Ischenko: I could only call a coup in Turkey a staging
      http://oko-planet.su/politik/politiklist/329519-ischenko-tolko-idiot-mog-nazvat-

      perevorot-v-turcii-inscenirovkoy.html
      The well-known Ukrainian and Russian political scientist, observer of the Rossiya Segodnya news agency Rostislav Vladimirovich Ishchenko answered several questions from iReactor correspondents in connection with the events that occurred on the night of Friday to Saturday in Turkey.
      On the night of 16 on 17 July, an attempted coup d'etat took place in Turkey. How can you comment on these events?
      An attempted coup d'etat took place. Unsuccessful.

      There were rumors that the coup could be staged to conduct political purges in the country. What do you think about this?
      This is absolute nonsense. Just imagine that, for example, in Russia, fights between the armed forces of the Russian Federation take place during the night in Moscow and St. Petersburg. Say, between the Air Force, the National Guard and the army. By morning the rebellion was crushed - hundreds of dead, thousands of wounded. Captured by a naval ship with the commander in chief of the Navy, captured by the commander in chief of the Air Force. And smart people walk around the city and say that Putin invented it all himself in order to carry out a purge. Do you think it will increase from this? No. The same applies to Erdogan. If in his country the army is fighting against itself, and for several hours it does not control the situation, but could, by the way, turn out to be overthrown, then what is this dramatization?
      In general, you need to be a rare idiot to suggest that skirmishes with your own police can be staged in order to intensify. From this, power always only weakens. Especially if the army opposes it.
      1. your1970
        your1970 18 July 2016 12: 30
        +4
        civilians who seized a tank from the military speak only of one thing - that the military does not have a commander - whom they TRUST and who gave the order “Shoot !!” With such commanders, military coups are successful all over the world quite successfully and quite regularly.
        And no civilians will climb tanks - if they shoot at least at them with machine guns.
        No leaders - no coups - just riots ......

        You can block any airfield without even placing tanks, there are enough trucks / cars, there are always a lot of service equipment. If the airfield is not a pity, you can put the control room and power sources, and at the same time controllers. After that, only helicopters will land, and then only in case of sufficient qualifications / courage of the pilots ...
  4. Wolka
    Wolka 18 July 2016 06: 03
    +4
    The British are no longer up to the game, and the CIA is yanking the Yankees again, a terrorist attack in Nice, a failed coup in Turkey, something in Armenia, in Syria, the situation is getting better, it seems that these are all links of the same chain, but it’s all the above that should be understood that the coup attempt had completely different goals and objectives, and they have been achieved, and the continuation will not take long, the patience of the gentlemen, patience, all the most interesting is just beginning ... Erdogan with enviable obstinacy climbs into the mousetrap for cheese
    1. Stas157
      Stas157 18 July 2016 07: 33
      +3
      Quote: Volka
      all the most interesting is just beginning ... Erdogan with enviable obstinacy climbs over the cheese in a mousetrap

      What is starting? What are you hinting at, what kind of cheese?
    2. nadezhiva
      nadezhiva 18 July 2016 08: 24
      +2
      Quote: Volka
      Erdogan with enviable obstinacy climbs over the cheese in a mousetrap
      Does not look like. Now he will take advantage of the situation from the heart. The arrest of 6 objectionable is the dream of any dictator. How could the drafters of the coup plan assume that Erdogan would receive such trump cards? Not to life.
      As well as the fact that no one could calculate that as a result of the Maidan, Crimea will return to Russia wink
      And Erdogan just slipped out of the mousetrap. Moreover, at the last moment. Masterfully, you can’t even argue.
  5. Masya masya
    Masya masya 18 July 2016 06: 14
    +6
    The play ... the director is one ...
    1. nadezhiva
      nadezhiva 18 July 2016 08: 28
      +3
      Definitely. It is a pity our 1991 was not taken into analysis.
  6. Vladimir61
    Vladimir61 18 July 2016 06: 15
    +4
    After numerous speeches by experts, ranging from directors and leading specialists of various institutions with sonorous names to military observers of the central media, the rest of the layering of versions and forecasts does not carry anything new! Moreover, the issue of a possible military action began to be discussed as an inevitable event since February of this year. All and sundry wrote about this! Here are the headlines of April - "Military coup in Turkey. Wait not long?" - allpravds.info, "A military coup is possible in Turkey: is the US" draining "Erdogan?" - Islam.ru and others.
    1. Stas157
      Stas157 18 July 2016 07: 40
      +3
      Quote: Vladimir61
      "A military coup is possible in Turkey: is the US" draining "Erdogan?"

      It is certainly obvious that for the United States this revolution was a surprise, and the United States has nothing to do with it. Otherwise, the picture of the coup would be completely different.
      1. donavi49
        donavi49 18 July 2016 08: 50
        +5
        But, here is a moot point.

        Most likely, they really distanced themselves. But they should have known (here, and the putschists could well have probed the soil carefully at the preparation stage, and reconnaissance was obliged to work in the most difficult and important partner in the Region), and even the commander Ijilik the putschist turned out to be. Here's an example of a map of units accused of participating in a coup.
        1. Stas157
          Stas157 18 July 2016 09: 25
          +4
          Quote: donavi49
          But, here is a moot point.

          Most likely, they really distanced themselves. But they should have known

          It is no secret that the United States is interested in removing the obstinate Erdogan and bring his six in his place. Erdogan himself has always stated that the Americans are to blame for all the unrest, performances on Taksim Square.
          The United States in the matter of color revolutions and coups dog ate. Usually this is preceded by the stage of preparation, the decline of the elite and the media to their side. The coup itself is led by trained people with a clear plan of action. As if on command, the liberal-minded masses protest at once, the media is heating up, the Kurds would not be left out!
          That all this was not. There were no smooth actions, international support, coordination. One gets the impression that they simply wanted to kill Erdogan at the Marmaris hotel, and no one was preparing a coup.
          1. donavi49
            donavi49 18 July 2016 09: 51
            +3
            It is quite difficult for Kurds to get out.

            Their cities are in ruins, the main combat units are destroyed, and the army stands there, and it does not matter to whom it is faithful. Erdogan and the military have roughly the same Kurdish solution. Partisans do not overestimate a lot. Moreover, the main rebellion came from the military unit located in the depths of Turkey, and the army units in Kurdistan were actually not involved.

            And as for media support, yes. This was clearly not centralized.
            1. Stas157
              Stas157 18 July 2016 10: 19
              +3
              Quote: donavi49
              It is quite difficult for Kurds to get out.

              Yes, probably it is. The Turkish military themselves would hardly have begun fraternizing with the Kurds. The only ones who could stir the Kurds are their new curators from the United States.
              And, all the same, my opinion is that in any upheaval from where the ears of the United States stick out, there is coherence and organization, as well as good preparation. There should be a comprehensive complaisant: elites, media, popular performances dissatisfied with the authorities and Western support. What this time was not in sight.
              1. ver_
                ver_ 19 July 2016 07: 30
                0
                ... there everyone is working on this "topic", "interested players", and each other "trips up and presents" surprises ".. There are more" players "than in the football team of the first and second squad, along with all the" service staff " ... and everyone has their own "Wishlist" - the result is a complete brothel in all "interested houses." Who "got whom" - will be found out, of course, but not now ..
  7. parusnik
    parusnik 18 July 2016 06: 22
    +3
    Another unstable country on the Russian borders: the war with the Kurds, support for the so-called moderate and not moderate Syrian opposition, the sweeping of the army, and much more .. they won’t bring good to Turkey .. The dreams of the sultanate ended ... And the sultan was blown away .. Not to fat, to be alive ..
    1. siberalt
      siberalt 18 July 2016 07: 05
      +2
      Is Turkey already on our borders? belay
      1. parusnik
        parusnik 18 July 2016 07: 14
        +2
        And what is the sea border is no longer a border? belay
        1. Stas157
          Stas157 18 July 2016 07: 48
          +3
          Quote: parusnik
          And what is the sea border is no longer a border?

          The maritime borders of Russia are in contact with Georgia and Ukraine on the Black Sea. We do not border Turkey yet.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. siberalt
          siberalt 18 July 2016 07: 59
          0
          We do not have a sea border with Turkey on the Black Sea, dear. There is an international free shipping and flying zone, according to the Montreux Treaty. The maritime border of the Russian Federation is defined by another treaty, but it does not touch the maritime border of Turkey. Now, when Georgia was part of the USSR, then there was a border. And the western one is already there through Bulgaria and Romania.
          1. parusnik
            parusnik 18 July 2016 08: 07
            +1
            Maybe ... But this is what the border guards do in Anapa, the port of the Caucasus ...
            1. Stas157
              Stas157 18 July 2016 08: 17
              +2
              Quote: parusnik
              But here is what the border guards do in Anapa, the port of the Caucasus ...

              Like what? They border Turkey! It’s clear!))
              1. Lyubopyatov
                Lyubopyatov 18 July 2016 23: 46
                0
                Sea border guards in Anapa do the same as other border guards at any international airport.
          2. sisa29
            sisa29 18 July 2016 09: 18
            +3
            It is more correct to replace the word adjacent to the word neighboring. But the meaning is still that next to us, do not say.
    2. razmik72
      razmik72 18 July 2016 08: 07
      +11
      Quote: parusnik
      Another unstable country on the Russian borders: the war with the Kurds, support for the so-called moderate and not moderate Syrian opposition, the sweeping of the army, and much more .. they won’t bring good to Turkey .. The dreams of the sultanate ended ... And the sultan was blown away .. Not to fat, to be alive ..

      In general, dear members of the forum, it is difficult to suspect me of sympathy for the main Turk, but recent events have shown that, as Napoleon writes, the sultan has quite strong support from the population, otherwise the Turks would not have poured into the streets and stood up against armed soldiers. sneers at the Turkish army and draws conclusions that should not be drawn from a concrete coup attempt, since the army was defeated not by the special services, not by the police, but by the simplest Turk who took to the streets and bridges of his country and defended his president. this fact, but if he recognized it, then all the conclusions of the authors of the article would already be completely inconsistent, since no matter how strong and powerful the army of any country is, it will psychologically break down if it fights with its own people. that there were cases in history when the army in blood suppressed the protests of its people. This happened in Armenia in 2008, when against peaceful demonstrations of Armenians, protestersAgainst the next fraud in the presidential elections in Armenia, army units were used, which from the point of view of efficiency showed miracles of efficiency, suppressing the protests of the people in the blood, and bringing serzhik to power. But this "brilliantly carried out" operation did not bring anything good from a military point of view Armenia is degrading more and more, and the recent events in Karabakh and the panic in the ranks of the Armenian leadership have clearly shown what the victory of the army over its own population can lead to. I am almost sure that my post will most likely be removed.
      1. parusnik
        parusnik 18 July 2016 12: 46
        0
        as Napoleon writes... Be sure to poke a stranger with an avatar ..Another unstable country on the Russian borders: the war with the Kurds, support for the so-called moderate and not moderate Syrian opposition, the sweeping of the army, and much more .. they won’t bring good to Turkey .. The dreams of the sultanate ended ... And the sultan was blown away .. Not to fat, to be alive ..... Specifically, in my comment ... besides the fact that Erdogan enjoys the support of the population ..
        1. razmik72
          razmik72 18 July 2016 15: 17
          0
          Well, excuse me, parusnik, and there was nothing in my thoughts to offend you, just Napoleon is my favorite historical character and I thought that calling you under this name would be nice to you. I won’t be anymore hi .
  8. Retvizan 8
    Retvizan 8 18 July 2016 06: 26
    +10
    I didn't understand "what was that" at all? !!!
    -Dramatization? But there are so many corpses, isn’t it too cool for the performance?
    Although I agree with the author, why are these stupid shootings from tanks, and the use of aviation is generally some kind of insanity ?!
    -If a real coup attempt? Then everything is really very stupid! But I can’t admit that the stupid people were at the helm of the uprising. Well, probably before the start they should have sat down to think, to plan.
    And it really struck me how quickly the participants surrendered as soon as they threatened them with a finger!
    But one result is predictable to all of us, the strengthening of Erdogan’s power, somehow it all turned out to be very profitable for him!
    1. Vladimir61
      Vladimir61 18 July 2016 06: 32
      +3
      The answer is simple - Find out who benefits from it? And since it was "beneficial" to many, it was not worth expecting success right away - there are too many centers of application of forces and little coordination.
      1. domokl
        domokl 18 July 2016 06: 49
        +3
        Quote: Vladimir61
        The answer is simple - Find out who benefits from this?

        Exactly. And it is beneficial only to one person. it is the suppression of the putsch that gives Erdogan the opportunity to once again become the leader of the nation. Yes, and the opposition will hide the tail
        1. Vladimir61
          Vladimir61 18 July 2016 06: 54
          +3
          This is what it is called - a setup!
        2. ramzes1776
          ramzes1776 18 July 2016 10: 22
          +2
          There is another version that in the coming days, Erdogan’s intelligence services planned mass arrests of the military, which is why they spontaneously acted without any preparation.
  9. Dimon19661
    Dimon19661 18 July 2016 06: 31
    +6
    Erdogan, like any dictator, has serious support from his people (in which the media controlled by him greatly help). The army consists of the same people. Health-conscious Turks, seeing the example of Syria, partly Egypt, absolutely do not want a bloody mess in their country, and this is one of The main reasons for the failure of the coup.
  10. Filxnumx
    Filxnumx 18 July 2016 06: 34
    +11
    And this passage reminded me more of July of another year, 1944, the attempted coup in Germany. There, too, a lot turned out to be tied up with an attempt on the life of the leader, Hitler. And it was also planned that the death of the Fuhrer of the nation "will inspire the hesitant and call the entire German army under the banner of the leaders of the uprising." Although if you go to the second level of logic, then the Turkish putsch may have been conceived as initially "unsuccessful" as a test for the lousy of the officer corps. And in 1944, the Germans acted much more clearly, and only the Fuehrer's happy salvation did not allow this coup attempt to result in something more serious.
    1. Vladimir61
      Vladimir61 18 July 2016 06: 41
      0
      This is closer to the "body" than the proposed "vinaigrette" of times and peoples!
    2. Stirbjorn
      Stirbjorn 18 July 2016 09: 11
      +2
      I agree, Erdogan was also essentially happily saved - the singer escaped from calving once a year before the commandos began to storm him, the second, when two F-16 putschists did not begin to shoot down his plane. They would have neutralized him at the beginning, the putsch was a success, even with such a performance. So this is a weak point in the entire analysis of the article. As the arrests of the highest level of Turkish Sun show, the conspiracy included not only the colonels, they just tried to hang everything on them.
  11. Razvedka_Boem
    Razvedka_Boem 18 July 2016 06: 45
    +1
    And to top it all, we make one strange conclusion: Russia is not particularly profitable. Yes, we do not consider Turkey an ally. Moreover, after certain events. However, it is worth considering what is more profitable: a stable Turkey or a Turkish mess, with which Erdogan may not be able to cope?

    It will be more profitable to take advantage of the situation in your favor.
    We fantasize further. If the United States considers that Erdogan and Turkey are getting out of control .. There will be an exception to NATO, and there .. all kinds of options are possible)
    But there will be no exclusion from NATO, despite the aggravation of relations. Erdogan will continue to blackmail with refugees, Figs, etc. to achieve his goal. There will be no mess. He will drown everything in blood and the West will silently look at it.
  12. Lightpower
    Lightpower 18 July 2016 06: 50
    +7
    This article is written in the same way as people with a rich imagination read fiction books. The author read something on the Internet, saw something on TV, and thought up the rest himself and laid it out as a common truth. Where did you get the idea that the coup did not have a commander? He had to openly identify himself, what would you show him on the news? How do you know who and how much was going in an emergency mode, on whom he opened fire, and on whom he did not open? Why do you blame the disorganization and weakness of the fact that the military did not dare "the enemy" in the form of the police and the military loyal to the perdogan? What other enemy? Have you forgotten by chance that these are their fellow citizens, and they could not overnight turn from their own into strangers, especially since they are overthrowing the president, not their colleagues? Here, rather, everything on the contrary was much more close to life, the soldiers rolled out the tanks in the hope that everyone would be scared and not have to shoot, and someone would join them in the process, but they were wrong. The only question is why there were so few putschists. There were not many of them initially, or were some of them simply scared, or were some of the putschists actually loyal to the president? Does the author know, or was he not informed?
    Next is this crazy assessment of the forces of the Turkish army. I repeat, there was no enemy. They overthrew the unpopular ruler, no one was going to arrange a mince there, otherwise the newly-minted power would not have lasted a couple of days, guess why.

    1. The Turkish army turned out to be far from such a steep formation, as we thought before.


    Did you consider the Turkish army a very cool mix? In vain. But why give her grades now? In the context of a failed conflict with us? So after a fight, they don’t wave their fists, much less failed. Turkey, as a member of NATO, does not have to have a cool army. Any NATO country is first and foremost a foothold.

    2. Turkish officers, who remained after the first wave of purges, do not correspond to the rank of officers of the second NATO army.


    Well, you, of course, are competent in such matters and you can say for sure who in NATE corresponds to what and who does not.

    3. At least one more wave of repressions awaits the Turkish army, which will not have a positive effect on its condition.


    Yes it is possible. But, again, what is it written for? Like, now everything will be worse with them, so if they suddenly get another plane down, then this time we certainly hang them?


    And the main question for the article. Why is all this comedy, especially with the victims, needed by the fart? He is a flamboyant tsar, disobedience in any form is not beneficial for him, absolute support by everyone is important to him. What is the point of him making his own image of the king sitting on a stool with two legs?

    Oh, these sofa warriors are experts ...
    1. domokl
      domokl 18 July 2016 20: 25
      0
      Quote: LightPower
      What makes you suddenly realize that the putsch did not have a commander? He should have been openly called, what would you show him in the news?

      Why not? This is exactly what the coup leader should have done. It is for this that they capture mail, telegraphs and other communications ... The leader must speak and explain to the people how good it will be after all this bloody meat grinder
      Quote: LightPower
      How do you know who and how many were going in emergency mode,

      So, OBS intelligence .... You understand very well that tomorrow everyone will write about it. And now the information is only in some media.
      Quote: LightPower
      Why do you blame the disorganization and weakness of the fact that the military did not dare "the enemy" in the form of the police and the military loyal to the perdogan?

      You are either stupid, or deliberately provoking ... Yes, simply because the criminal and his opponent (I will not specify who is who) are never allies. They are antagonists ...
      Quote: LightPower
      You did not accidentally forget that it was their fellow citizens, and they could not immediately turn from their own into strangers,

      Now I understand ... the disease. Try it on the contrary .. And the police could?
      Quote: LightPower
      Were there few of them at first, or some were simply frightened, or some of the coupists were actually loyal to the president?

      Idiocy ... A loyal putschist is as natural as a good villain ..
      Quote: LightPower
      Next is this crazy assessment of the forces of the Turkish army.

      Hmm ... You served in the army, dear?
      Quote: LightPower
      Any NATO country is first and foremost a foothold.

      laughing For whom? the second army in NATO is a foothold? .. And who will fight? Americans ...
      Quote: LightPower
      Well, you, of course, are competent in such matters and you can say for sure who in NATE corresponds to what and who does not.

      So ... somehow it is ... For that they are experts ... That they know the army not on the couch, but from the inside
      Quote: LightPower
      Yes it is possible. But, again, what is it written for? Like, now everything will be worse with them, so if they suddenly get another plane down, then this time we certainly hang them?

      Dear ... You really in the White Pillars ... Heal from stress
      Quote: LightPower
      And the main question for the article. Why is all this comedy, especially with the victims, needed by the fart?

      The only interesting question ... And can you say that after the breakdown of the tourist season, after the losses of the peasants of Turkey, after the collapse of the construction industry, Erdogan is popular in Turkey? Now turn on the thought. After the putsch is liquidated, who will remain in Erdogan’s opponents? And will he become a real dictator now?
  13. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 18 July 2016 06: 52
    +5
    The coup was well conceived, but the implementation was screwed up. And the officer corps, I agree with the authors, was not up to par. Erdogan was not eliminated, they "grabbed the void" in Marmaris, and then it turned out that the leaders did not have time to make OPERATIONAL decisions. This may indicate that the control center is far away (Gülen?) And the feedback is therefore too weak.
  14. Nix1986
    Nix1986 18 July 2016 06: 53
    +5
    Very strange events, no one tried to detain the country's top officials, there were no media reports from the leaders of the coup either on the situation as a whole or on the purpose of the coup. There was no support for the commanders of any of the 3 armies. Either this is really a very poorly prepared coup, or the performance of Erdogan.
    1. Skubudu
      Skubudu 18 July 2016 08: 15
      +2
      In any case, Erdogan is on horseback.
      Unfortunately...
    2. nadezhiva
      nadezhiva 18 July 2016 08: 39
      +1
      And who tried to detain, except for Yanukovych in 2014? Nobody. Just unlike the Ukrainian president, Erdogan enjoys the support of the population. But the conspirators did not raise a hand to turn their people, who took to the streets, into bloody mess.
      1. Stirbjorn
        Stirbjorn 18 July 2016 09: 14
        0
        [quote = nadezhiva] And who tried to detain, except for Yanukovych in 2014? Nobody. Just unlike the Ukrainian president, Erdogan enjoys the support of the population. And the conspirators didn’t raise their people who took to the streets to turn bloody mess. [/ Quot] Yanukovych turned out to be just a miserable rag, and Erdogan showed his will - in this regard, he didn’t say anything, he showed himself a man
      2. Simple
        Simple 18 July 2016 18: 39
        0
        Quote: nadezhiva
        Just unlike the Ukrainian president, Erdogan enjoys the support of the population.



        In Ukraine, for decades, the efforts of the West and the United States created conditions for the events of Euromaidan.

        Where are such premises in Turkey?
        And nowhere to the West is this very Turkey in the EU, like a fifth wheel cart.

        And yes, dictators (albeit on a patriotic wave) always officially enjoy the support of the broad masses of the population of their country.
  15. Starshina wmf
    Starshina wmf 18 July 2016 06: 53
    0
    A strange coup, such a feeling as if Edik himself had invented and played everything.
  16. rf xnumx
    rf xnumx 18 July 2016 06: 55
    +3
    Someone will be executed, someone will be imprisoned. There is no doubt about it
    All dogs will now be hanged.
  17. Alexander 3
    Alexander 3 18 July 2016 07: 03
    +2
    There are many questions of terror against the Kurds with whom the mattress flirts. The war in Syria, the support of the Islamists. Ignoring the views of the army. The deterioration of the economy after the imposition of sanctions by Russia. All this could result in a collapsed coup.
  18. Lightpower
    Lightpower 18 July 2016 07: 03
    -1
    Quote: domokl
    Quote: Vladimir61
    The answer is simple - Find out who benefits from this?

    Exactly. And it is beneficial only to one person. it is the suppression of the putsch that gives Erdogan the opportunity to once again become the leader of the nation. Yes, and the opposition will hide the tail


    Are you kidding? The mere fact of the putsch no longer makes him any leader of the nation. If the president is already trying to overthrow by force, then for his authority everything is bad. Among ordinary citizens, he has long been not popular.
    1. domokl
      domokl 18 July 2016 20: 01
      +1
      Quote: LightPower
      Are you kidding? WITH

      Not. Just thinking ... Before the coup, Erdogan was a creep for the Turks. He ditched business with Russia, ditched the tourist season, didn’t enter the EU, and so on.
      And today he will remove opponents by force and will again become the leader of the nation.
      Or can you name another way for him?
  19. Miner
    Miner 18 July 2016 07: 07
    0
    Thanks to the authors of this material.
    It is stated competently and reasonably.
  20. Korsar4
    Korsar4 18 July 2016 07: 19
    +2
    Not enough information to draw conclusions. Since our 1991, and not everything has come to the surface.
  21. Mengad
    Mengad 18 July 2016 07: 19
    0
    Yes, it wasn’t professionalism that struck me right away, Are they either suicide bombers or fools? It seems to me that this was a provocation. Erdogan knew that a military coup could be, especially since it happened before. And the horse made the first strike, it was sent to this a cell of conspirators, a couple of three of their people (or maybe objectionable to him) under the pretext that you are serving the motherland. Here we see the result of not professionalism in the actions of the conspirators. In this way, Erdogan killed two birds with one stone.
  22. Alex von Dorn
    Alex von Dorn 18 July 2016 07: 24
    +6
    So far, one thing is clear - Turkey is divided into secular and religious-Muslim parts, there is a struggle between them. In my opinion, this is beneficial for Russia. Turkey has never been and will not be our ally, which means that the worse it is, the better for us. You can play on these contradictions and achieve your goals. And the Russians will find rest where and without Turkey.
    1. Ivan65
      Ivan65 18 July 2016 08: 06
      +3
      The external viewer is shown a picture of the victory of secular democracy over the authoritarian abyss (army dictatorship), in fact, the Islamist order defeats secular society. No wonder the allies of daish from Syria congratulated Erdogan ...
      The army will be repressed - this is good for us, but strengthening neo-Ottomanism is bad for us. If yesterday’s initiative lieutenants with burning eyes come to command posts, it’s good, as they will certainly break firewood, but it’s also bad .... The army will be another destabilizing factor in Turkey. Erdogan himself is a very large destabilizing factor for Turkey, and now the plus is his army. I’m afraid that there are fewer contradictions in Turkish society in order to play them effectively. And the Russians should rest at home - with benefit, in military patriotic camps :))))
  23. Alex ..
    Alex .. 18 July 2016 07: 28
    +6
    Impression of the coup ....
  24. 0895055116
    0895055116 18 July 2016 07: 36
    +3
    Putsch? I'm not sure ... Erdogan needed an excuse for large-scale purges in the Armed Forces and government bodies and HE GOT THIS REASON! Where can ALL THIS bring? - It is clear that Erdogan will STRICTLY strengthen his PERSONAL POWER to the level of a DICTATOR. But the Turkish Armed Forces, I'm afraid, will lose a lot in the sense of professionalism (and annology since 1937 in the USSR is very strong). I think that Erdogan will take steps to create SOME NEW STRUCTURE, PARALLEL ARMY, something like oprichina (Russia under Ivan the Terrible), Islamic Revolutionary Guards (IRAN) or "volunteer" battalions (Ukraine). All this will lead to a sharp drop in the authority of the Armed Forces and a drop in Turkey's defense capability. In other words, this is no longer our headache ...
  25. papont64
    papont64 18 July 2016 07: 47
    0
    Love, hope, quiet glory

    We were deceived for a short while,

    Young fun disappeared,

    Like a dream, like a morning mist;

    But we still burn with desire,

    Under the yoke of power fatal

    An impatient soul

    Homeland vneshlem calling.

    We are waiting with a longing for hope

    Minutes of holy liberty,

    How to wait for a lover young

    Minutes of a true date.

    While free burn

    While hearts for honor are alive,

    My friend, dedicate to the fatherland

    Souls are wonderful impulses!

    Comrade, believe: she will rise,

    Captivating Star of Happiness,

    And the Turks will rise from their sleep

    And on the ruins of autocracy

    Write our names!
  26. avg-mgn
    avg-mgn 18 July 2016 07: 49
    +5
    Quote: domokl
    Quote: Vladimir61
    The answer is simple - Find out who benefits from this?

    Exactly. And it is beneficial only to one person. it is the suppression of the putsch that gives Erdogan the opportunity to once again become the leader of the nation. Yes, and the opposition will hide the tail

    Without a magnifying glass it can be seen, except for Erdogan, no one won in this strange coup. I already expressed my hypothesis on the day of the coup about the organizers of the coup, I will repeat briefly:
    The Turkish special services secretly warmed up several dozen senior officers from various branches of the armed forces, appointed an hour X, and then everything went without a general plan, without a common goal, etc. Okay, Erdogan will deal with the military, but - on the surface is the question of the arrested judges. How could they participate in the rebellion? Well then, about the not arrested prosecutors, the leadership of the security and intelligence services.
    The picture does not add up. A cheap performance with human casualties, and Erdogan will have to answer for this !!!
  27. ism_ek
    ism_ek 18 July 2016 07: 56
    +3
    The article is stupid.
    A putsch is a non-standard military operation. She is preparing in secrecy from the command. Until the hour "X" it is necessary to hide your intentions from subordinates. The mistake of the putschists was that they were not ready to eliminate Erdagan. Apparently the "owners" from Washington and Berlin did not give them such permission. After the failure in Marmaris, Erdagan's plane had to be shot down. The rebels had such an opportunity. They let Erdagan turn to his supporters, and the army is powerless against the crowd.

    Well, Putin’s reaction was struck. When the putschists prevailed, he did not become silent and supported the dictator. But he could remain silent, like others. Perhaps it was thanks to the support of Russia that Erdogan found the strength to appeal to the people. Our president is afraid of the putsch. And for his sake, the Russians will not go under the tanks.
    1. Stirbjorn
      Stirbjorn 18 July 2016 09: 19
      +4
      Quote: ism_ek
      Well, Putin’s reaction was struck. When the putschists prevailed, he did not become silent and supported the dictator. But he could remain silent, like others. Perhaps it was thanks to the support of Russia that Erdogan found the strength to appeal to the people. Our president is afraid of the putsch. And for his sake, the Russians will not go under the tanks.

      At the same time, when the Mursi were overthrown in Egypt, and the same military men, I don’t remember the GDP protesting - Al-Sisi is a great friend, but he’s not like Erdogash, they don’t let tourists in anyway. It was more reasonable and this time it was silent at the beginning, but it’s really afraid to see, it’s not without reason that Rosguard creates
  28. The comment was deleted.
  29. Serge
    Serge 18 July 2016 08: 05
    0
    How many experts have divorced recently, interpreting the events in the right way. And if you change the signs in places? In the country, the putsch and the Turkish army in a short time, with skillful and decisive actions, defeated the putschists. AND? And already a completely different picture. But it is of little interest to jingoistic patriots. And as a result, we again get "if tomorrow is war" as in the old film.
  30. Butchcassidy
    Butchcassidy 18 July 2016 08: 46
    +2
    Quote: Monos
    Putsch as a test of the Turkish army. Expert opinion


    The title of the article itself indicates the level of analysis. Well, what can these clown pokatushki with shooting say about the state of the whole army and its combat readiness? Nothing! Crazy, possibly stoned (judging by the frames) amateurs fell for kukan. That's all.


    In fact, speaking of the "second NATO army", there is a certain inertia of thinking here - the Turkish army was once the second NATO army. Before Erdogan, before reductions and repressions like Ergenekon.

    As for the putsch, all terrorist attacks have always occurred in Turkey when it was beneficial to Erdogan. And from this putsch, the main beneficiary will again be Erdogan. Well done, he is talented. He does not have long to live (he has cancer), but he wants to be a full-fledged sultan, and for that, you can go to not such a "concert".
  31. kenig1
    kenig1 18 July 2016 09: 04
    +1
    Perhaps Erdogan knew about the upcoming coup and began to act according to the principle "if you cannot prevent drunkenness, then you must lead it."
  32. vladimirvn
    vladimirvn 18 July 2016 09: 16
    +3
    There are many questions, but few answers. Because as a task with many unknowns. One can only draw some obvious conclusions.
    1. The power of Erdogan is strengthened and ours in every possible way demonstrate support to him in this.
    2.Russia now benefits from this situation in Turkey.
    3. There is a big game and ours in this game look more than worthy.
  33. Prince of Pensions
    Prince of Pensions 18 July 2016 09: 36
    0
    Accordingly, the statement of the KB was not organized.
    Guys, how do you like contractions. But not only military specialists read you. Decipher these abbreviations somehow.
    If this coup was a farce, then the topic of the Turkish army is not disclosed?
  34. Mestny
    Mestny 18 July 2016 09: 44
    -1
    Quote: nadezhiva
    The performance of the freelance youth theater looked when our president lifted the ban on flights with tourists to Turkey after a terrorist attack at a Turkish airport. That was a feint with ears. Inexplicable by nothing.
    And now everything fell into place.

    Do not bother in more detail - what has fallen into place there?
    Or is this comment from the "Putin's guilty" series?
  35. aleks700
    aleks700 18 July 2016 10: 06
    +2
    However, it is worth considering what is more profitable: a stable Turkey or a Turkish mess, with which Erdogan may not be able to cope?
    A mess is beneficial. In this case, Turkey as a military force and a member of NATO can be written off. And no one climbs into Syria, no one climbs into the Crimea. No common border? Well, to hell with no, with Turkey. A Rest in the Crimea. Or the south of western Siberia.
  36. DimerVladimer
    DimerVladimer 18 July 2016 10: 14
    +2
    “Experts” - how many successful coups have you made to criticize?
    Is it very convenient to criticize while sitting on the couch?

    Over in Almaat now (the morning of July 18, 2016) there are shootings in different parts of the city - also the coup of the eternal president Nazarbayev?
    1. aleks700
      aleks700 18 July 2016 14: 43
      0
      Experts "- how many successful coups have you made to criticize?
      Is it very convenient to criticize while sitting on the couch?
      Who in our country has made successful coups? A lot of those? And what, you can not speak out? You know a lot about the events in Alma-Ata. Well, then why talk about it.
  37. Lekxnumx
    Lekxnumx 18 July 2016 10: 14
    +2
    I don’t put the minus article but deserves it. The putsch was arranged at 22:00 because the rebels were laid down and had to start ahead of time. And on TRT (State Channel) there was a speech of the rebel military, and the speaker of the channel explained everything to the people. The author would have known all the info for you to begin with, then you would have already analyzed and acted on TRT more than once. The Army silently supported the coup, almost all except the air forces deployed in Eskisehir, except for one of the commanders of the Navy, and the commander of some district. The putsch command was carried out through the vatsap and the soldiers were given the command atesh serbest (shoot if necessary). But not every officer and soldier decide to take such a step against his people. Namely supporters of Erdogan the people stopped the army, and among the policemen without a chance, all the more so, some high-ranking officers in the Gendarmerie helped the coup.
  38. DimerVladimer
    DimerVladimer 18 July 2016 10: 31
    +1
    In the morning in Almaat there were shootings in different areas, another attack on the police.
    Send photos - not happy.
  39. Victor-M
    Victor-M 18 July 2016 10: 52
    +1
    The Turkish coup is the usual provocation of the Turkish authorities to identify dissatisfied with it among the security forces, to further strengthen their positions. Is that why the West reacted so calmly to this that they knew about the upcoming operation of this performance.
  40. Turkir
    Turkir 18 July 2016 10: 54
    +4
    The terrified Erdogan refutes the complex concepts of experts.
  41. Mengad
    Mengad 18 July 2016 11: 22
    0
    Quote: treble 72019
    Someone will be executed, someone will be imprisoned. There is no doubt about it
    All dogs will now be hanged.

    Ask a question? People are military, preparing to overthrow, the honor of the uniform and all that .... but in civilian life? request
  42. Seraphimamur
    Seraphimamur 18 July 2016 11: 30
    +4
    Let Erdogan figure it out in his own country and not bother us in Syria. Turkey is a potential enemy and the worse they have, the better for us.
  43. ksv36
    ksv36 18 July 2016 11: 32
    0
    "1. The Turkish army, in fact, turned out to be far from such a cool formation as we thought before."

    2. If they allow the verification of all of NATO, it will be the same. smile
  44. Petrik66
    Petrik66 18 July 2016 11: 49
    +3
    There are several similarities with 1991 and 1993 in Moscow. The same stupidity, lack of understandable goals. If everything was based on the destruction of Erdogan, then drive three turntables with a group of 28 people to capture the Hotel? And something bigger could not be applied? A bomb for example? We would learn from Assad - we take a barrel bomb and drop it from the same helicopter to the hotel, and then, we express our condolences to the families of the victims. Fast, cheap and cheerful. Extrajudicial executions and toughening policies against the Kurds and Syria await Turkey. Erdogan will go to the end, he no longer has options. Or he, or him. Reliance on local Hongweibins is a new brand in Turkish domestic politics. And our tourists? well everywhere is enough. after all, so - about 4000 idiots who came through the Batkostan and Khokhlyandy are already sitting in hotels ...... But others do not pass tickets, but wait for the development of events. They have few faces.
  45. Leonid Har
    Leonid Har 18 July 2016 12: 19
    +1
    I agree with the author. The Turkish army will be subject to purging and the combat effectiveness of this will decrease by half or three.
  46. thorns
    thorns 18 July 2016 12: 25
    +1
    [quote] [Such oddities that drive into the head of an officer in the first year of any decent military university make me feel that the coup was organized and planned by civilians / quote]
    Not special services. They muddied the heads of the military. They warned Erdogan. Erdogan knew what was going on in the army. He doesn't need such an army. Not only did he tackle the US opposition leader. Immediately. He didn't just ask the people to go out into the street. And the military - the GKChP "Turkish spill". Erdogan will now begin the purge. His rating soared after this ideotism.
  47. alexey water
    alexey water 18 July 2016 13: 09
    +5
    Question: Why did Ingerlik cut off electricity? After all, they did it yesterday, when the coup was largely suppressed. But at this airbase all the same, not only Turkish, but also American military aircraft stand. And not only. There, after all, NATO is based. The head of the air base, who is suspected of rebellion, was arrested by that time.
    Some kind of performance is going on. It seems that the military on this putsch was simply framed. They provoked, taking advantage of their fair indignation by Erdogan's policy, and then simply framed. Although this does not explain Erdogan's throwing at night on his plane. It feels like he was scared.
  48. Des10
    Des10 18 July 2016 14: 25
    +3
    "Normal XNUMXst infantry in sufficient numbers, but with tanks."
    Excellent level of "military experts" (VO).
    Apparently they are both from the Air Force or Navy. laughing .
    But not from the videoconferencing for sure.
    And so - a normal article. For the district will pull.
    For cheap show-offs - minus the authors (not the article).
    Here, the authors can write --- "Regular TUO winged infantry in sufficient numbers, but with tanks. , but the censor pointed out to me --- insultingly laughing .
    Viva authors.
  49. Starik72
    Starik72 18 July 2016 15: 09
    0
    I am not a politician and analyst, I am a simple mortal philistine, and my opinion is that a BLOODY PERFORMANCE has been played! Who organized it? The one to whom is most profitable, and he is most profitable to Erdogan and his clan, which allows Erdogan to completely untie his hands, which is what the actions of Erdogan, begun after the BLOOD PERFORMANCE, speak of. And how many more deaths will be after this performance, it is hard to imagine when more than 3000 so-called putschists were arrested, or maybe just extras who did not know what they were involved for.
  50. Lyubopyatov
    Lyubopyatov 18 July 2016 15: 14
    +2
    The authors of the article have their own logic. Events have their own dark. The main question, if you stay in line with the title of the article: WHO checked the Turkish army? The United States, that is, the CIA and the Pentagon with the State Department? Erdogan himself? Or the States, though not without the knowledge of Erdogan?
    You shouldn't write off the Turkish warriors, although now their strength has weakened. But the fundamental mistake of the authors in their misunderstanding of 1937 (though this does not affect the logic of their "Turkish" investigation). Nevertheless, one must object to their cute phrase from the liberal encyclopedia: "It was in 1937 that those changes took place in the Red Army, the fruits of which were reaped in 1941." In 1937/38. the conspiracy of the Trotskyists, the Tukhachev anthropoids, who distinguished themselves only by punitive operations in their own country and recruited by "friends" in Germany, was defeated. And the situation in 1941 was aggravated by the stubbornness of other ambitious people who ignored the orders of Stalin, whom they disliked very much: the Zhukovs and Tymoshenko (with a small letter) and hoped to depose against the background of the unsuccessful start of the war (overestimating themselves and underestimating Hitler's offensive - or the scale of their bungling).
    Assessment of the article itself: smart people wrote.
    1. siberalt
      siberalt 18 July 2016 16: 16
      +2
      Roman has a clear mind, a hot heart and a rebellious soul. Respect! But the article is not a tote for "+", "-", but for reflection. Forum and authors one interacting system for "vhlop" and "exhaust". Here, for someone, our perception of what is happening is being formed, and for someone else. You need to beat enemies, not like-minded people, at least it is not entirely clear who conveyed their thoughts. Instead of judicious polemics, there are cons without opposition. There is either no mind, or too smart. For the latter, try to object without a button. laughing Good luck to everyone and good health!