Military Review

Payment "Ruslana"

200
The US agency Bloomberg announced that the Russian air carrier AirBridgeCargo Airlines, a member of the Volga-Dnepr group of companies, and the US aerospace concern Boeing are close to concluding a firm contract to supply at least ten new Boeing 747- 8 Freighter. According to the agency, the document will be signed in July at the International Aerospace Salon in the British Farnborough.

Strictly speaking, the interest of AirBridgeCargo and the mother Volga-Dnepr to these American cars is not news. In June, 2015, during the aerospace show in Paris, signed a memorandum of understanding between Boeing and the Volga-Dnepr group on the delivery of two dozen 747-8. In the framework of these agreements, the Russian carrier purchased two cars in November last year. Last March, Boeing received a firm order for two more aircraft. But until the last moment, few people believed that Volga-Dnepr would decide on a difficult time both for itself and for the air transportation market for the full-scale implementation of such a risky deal and convert intentions into firm orders. The title of the Bloomberg article speaks for itself: “The Russian company saves the“ seven hundred and forty-seven ”.

The fact is that the program Boeing 747-8 is experiencing its decline - in the airline market, including freight, "Jumbo" or "Queen of Heaven", as the name of this car, is rapidly replacing the twin-engine aircraft of the new generation. The reasons are simple. First, twin-engine airplanes are more economical, and secondly, a modern air traffic management system allows efficient use of baggage and cargo compartments of passenger liners for cargo transportation. Modern passenger twin-engine Boeing 777 or Airbus A350, even with one hundred percent filling of passenger seats, take on board 25 – 30 tons. Logistics companies are happy to charter these facilities, because of which specialized cargo aircraft lose market. Therefore, the order of ten to twenty new 747-8 Freighter is a matter of saving this program for the aircraft manufacturers of Boeing and a big risk for the carrier who decided to buy such machines.

On the hong kong account

Let’s leave aside the question why the Russian company is being rescued by an American aircraft, and for example, not a domestic IL-96-400T. Although the group of companies is called Volga-Dnepr, not Missouri-Potomac. And the American brands that supported the production of some Russian aircraft do not even come to mind. We'd better think about why the Boeing 747-8 is not being saved by American shipping companies, or at least some Asian ones. The last major order for 747-8F from foreigners - Hong Kong carrier Cathay Pacific Cargo - is dated far 2007-m. Maybe they better calculated the risks than the Russians?

If AirBridgeCargo purchases all the 20 new "seven hundred and forty-seven" in accordance with the memorandum of intent, it will mean a doubling of the fleet of these vehicles from a particular carrier and a threefold increase in the number of aircraft modified 747-8F. Explaining such an expansion by some kind of boom in the freight market does not work. The global air cargo market in 2015 increased by 2,2 percent. This is a good indicator, but the growth rate declined compared with the previous year (in 2014, it was 5%). In addition, the increase was mainly due to the Middle Eastern market, where there are strong players, and for AirBridgeCargo, the main markets are stagnant American and European and slow-growing East Asian. Plus, one should not forget that a considerable part of this modest increase in traffic volumes was absorbed by the already mentioned cargo compartments of passenger wide-bodied aircraft. In the market of bulky goods - the birthplace of "Volga-Dnepr" - no growth is observed. Moreover, in recent years, Volga-Dnepr, partly due to the winding up of the American military campaign in the Middle East, and partly because of the sanctions, has lost a significant part of its orders — earlier, many NATO military cargoes and equipment carried its planes. Already in the 2014 year, according to the company's own report, its cargo turnover for the year decreased by 17,7 percent, and the revenue from the charters decreased by 19,4 percent relative to the 2013 index. The fall in this segment was so significant that the group could not compensate for it due to a slight increase in the volume of regular traffic. There is no certainty that this trend will be broken soon. So, in a difficult market situation, the company resorts to the extremely risky expansion of its fleet.

Volga-Dnepr is a private company with the right to carry out any business strategy. However, most recently, we have already seen how the same air carrier crashed, including as a result of an adventurous development policy, and the consequences of this disaster not only affected the Russian aviation industry, but also had a pronounced negative macroeconomic effect. This, of course, is about Transaero. They have a lot in common. Both companies are private. Both were created in hard times - at the turn of the eighties and nineties. The companies were united by an extremely aggressive and risky policy to expand their own fleet in times of crisis. Shortly before her death, Transaero signed contracts for the supply of expensive Airbus A380 and Boeing 787 Dreamliner airliners. The finale of powerful expansion is now known even to people far from aviation: a bankrupt company with a quarter trillion debts and liabilities ceased operations. However, when the leadership of Transaero, already flying downhill, ordered “dreamliners” with “superjumbo”, it was at least clear what it was counting on. Relatives in the Interstate Aviation Committee and among the patriarchs of the Russian foreign policy establishment, tens of thousands of Russian passengers with tickets already bought, an army of ten thousand of its own personnel. We are so big! We are socially significant! State, help us with budgetary funds and money from state banks, otherwise you will get some protests! However, this simple plan did not take off: in the difficult crisis of sanctions, the state did not want and could not save the company, whose management got a long-term business development plan with poker bluffs. It is unlikely that the financial, lobbying opportunities and social significance of Transaero were less than those of Volga-Dnepr and AirBridgeCargo. At the same time, the purchasing adventures of the collapsed Transaero and the upcoming Volga-Dnepr deal are at least comparable in scale.

Security pledged

The 20 procured value of the Boeing aircraft purchased is close to eight billion dollars. It is clear that with such a large order, the buyer will necessarily sell himself a discount, but its scale will in any case be measured by percentages, not times. If we are talking about a firm order for ten cars, the size of the deal decreases to the 3,5 – 4 line of billion dollars, but no matter how you count, the cost of the new “seven hundred and forty-seven” will be equal to the total turnover of the Volga-Dnepr group of companies over several years. Turnover, mind you, not profit. It is clear that the Russian company itself does not have such funds and we are talking about leasing and a long-term loan secured by new and existing airlines, including the American Boeing 747 subsidiary AirBridgeCargo and An-124 Volga-Dnepr itself. The payback period for new aircraft will be measured in decades, and even then with the most favorable development of the market situation. In the meantime, the most likely scenario is the following. Shortly after signing the contracts and receiving the planes, it turns out that AirBridgeCargo and Volga-Dnepr are unable to pay for them, the companies are declared bankrupt, and their cars, like the new “seven hundred and forty-sevenths,” and the old “Ruslans”, go to the property of the lenders. As a result, not only private Volga-Dnepr, but also Russia, as a state, loses part of the fleet of unique An-124 vehicles.

What does this mean in turn?

Payment "Ruslana"


In November last year, the anti-aircraft missile system C-400 was delivered and deployed to the Russian Hmeimim airbase in Syria. The only type of vehicles that can carry out such a transfer - military transport An-124 "Ruslan". These were airplanes of the Russian Ministry of Defense. Thanks to the continuing fleet of "Ruslans", the Armed Forces of our country have the ability to deploy heavy military equipment over long distances. Such, as Western military analysts say, capability is not needed every day, but under certain scenarios for the development of crisis situations it acquires exceptional importance. Therefore, the scheme was invented in its time: initially, the An-124 military was transferred to civilian operators, including the Volga-Dnepr, so that the machines would not stand idle and earn money, but in the event of that they would help their own Ministry of Defense. The number of Ruslans in the military department is about a dozen, Volga-Dnepr has eleven plus one more, which previously belonged to the deceased airline Polet, this year should be restored to airworthiness. Together, "Ruslans", "Volga-Dnepr" and the Ministry of Defense can provide for the transfer of a division of anti-aircraft C-400, operational-tactical "Iskander" or coastal "Bastions", significantly changing the balance in the theater of conflict. Without the "Ruslans" "Volga-Dnepr" our Ministry of Defense will be able to count at best on a one-time transfer of a battery or two of these systems. Considering that plans to resume production of An-124 due to disagreements with Ukraine are laid down and the new heavy military transport aircraft cannot be seen for decades for another, there is no alternative to the old Ruslans as a means of ensuring operational and strategic mobility. It turns out that the purchase of AirBridgeCargo civilian "Boeing" turns into a matter of national security.

The competence of the management of Volga-Dnepr, one of the oldest and most successful Russian private companies in the field of air cargo, is undoubtedly very high. People in difficult times for the industry and the country have created an airline that not only survived, but also discouraged a fair share of the market from foreign competitors. It is worth noting the efforts of the leadership of the Volga-Dnepr Group to preserve the unique fleet of An-124 Ruslan aircraft for Russia, even if these vehicles were the source of income for the leadership itself. But after all, Transaero was not led by stupid people - everyone is mistaken. Therefore, the expert community and the public need to pay attention to the extremely risky deal, the possible consequences of which can be not only the bankruptcy of a large Russian company, but also the loss of the operational mobility of our Armed Forces. Once again weigh all the risks.
Author:
Originator:
http://vpk-news.ru/articles/31212
200 comments
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  1. maxim1987
    maxim1987 3 July 2016 10: 01
    +35
    good article. the kid can be beautiful, but not for us angry
    1. bulvas
      bulvas 3 July 2016 10: 07
      .

      There may be a version that, on the contrary,

      Is Russia increasing its fleet of transport aircraft in this way?


      1. Ami du peuple
        Ami du peuple 3 July 2016 10: 15
        +95
        Quote: bulvas
        Is Russia increasing its fleet of transport aircraft in this way?
        And why at the expense of foreign-made aircraft? Indeed, why not our IL-96-400T?
        1. bulvas
          bulvas 3 July 2016 10: 18
          +7
          Quote: Ami du peuple
          Quote: bulvas
          Is Russia increasing its fleet of transport aircraft in this way?
          And why at the expense of foreign-made aircraft? Indeed, why not our IL-96-400T?


          I don’t know this, only suggested a version

          Maybe the timing, maybe other arguments.
          You may need a cargo plane such as a Boeing (140 tons per 8000 km)

          They planned to build the AN-124 with Ukraine, it didn’t work, you have to buy

          If necessary, transfer the Iskanders and S-300/400 from East to West and vice versa ...
          1. combat192
            combat192 3 July 2016 18: 31
            +7
            But is there a ramp for large vehicles in Boeing 747 trucks? Something did not hear and did not see.
            1. Inok10
              Inok10 3 July 2016 20: 53
              +53
              Quote: Ami du peuple
              And why at the expense of foreign-made aircraft? Indeed, why not our IL-96-400T?

              ... because it ends with "y" ... You need to learn the hardware, or at least not be lazy to use Google ... IL-96-400T ... 92 tons per 5000 km., In fact:
              The main difference between the Il-96-400T cargo plane and its passenger version is that the passenger cabin has been converted into a cargo one with reinforced cabin floor and with the installation of additional rails for mounting floor mechanics designed for loading and unloading international aviation pallets and containers. Source: http://www.ilyushin.org/aircrafts/transport/5561/
              ... and more bulvas absolutely right:
              Quote: bulvas
              You may need a cargo plane such as a Boeing (140 tons per 8000 km)

              ... the way it is ... 140 tons of international air pallets and containers ... hi
              ... but the article might not have been a vinaigrette or a fur coat turned inside out ... if the author had not compared ... An-124 and 747-8F just in terms of carrying capacity ... after all, 140 tons. It seems like both ... purely mattress trick, on a sucker ... laughing ... 747-8F is not intended for the transport of oversized cargo! ... only air pallets and containers ... that is, something that An-124 can take on board even from the ground ... for the 747-8F is not an achievable dream! ... this is an aircraft for transporting "many, many boxes" ... the Liebchnerr 120 t crane, which Ruslan delivered to Armenia after the earthquake, is not possible for the 747-8F! ... they are not competitors' aircraft ... from the word at all ... hi
              Quote: combat192
              But is there a ramp for large vehicles in Boeing 747 trucks? Something did not hear and did not see.
              ... You are absolutely right ! ... and visually the loading capabilities of the An-124 and 747-8F ... With respect to the Honest VO Community! ... soldier
              P.S. ... in the Military Transport Aviation of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, not 10 An-124 aircraft, but 26 boards, fly 10, the others cherish the resource or not ... hi
              1. Theophanes
                Theophanes 5 July 2016 14: 31
                0
                For a bonus, they will sell their mother mother !!! The rulers are doing everything to make them live better, but we are worse!
              2. derik1970
                derik1970 6 July 2016 09: 26
                0
                oh are you really that simple ... are you up to date with the Kremlin's plans or are they reporting to you every day ... did you know the same about Turkey? Did you know that we will become friends with her? it’s necessary ... enemies yesterday, today friends ... nobody killed anyone ... it’s not difficult to analyze it, but it will be better than reality ... nobody knows what concessions the Kremlin’s leadership will make to the West ... in times privatization of Western bosses bought up defense enterprises 10 at a time and did not frown ... lol
            2. magician
              magician 3 July 2016 21: 37
              +3
              there is no ramp in them for loading our military equipment, if only for delivering paratroopers with comfort to a fashigton, but I think the guys from the airborne forces would agree to fly an IL76, if only with all their weapons.
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. Orionvit
            Orionvit 4 July 2016 23: 19
            0
            You may need a cargo plane such as a Boeing (140 tons per 8000 km)
            Sorry, what 140 tons? Did you happen to make a mistake about three times?
        2. Shadowcat
          Shadowcat 3 July 2016 10: 59
          -2
          Perhaps because our capacities are loaded chichas on the lid itself and there is no opportunity to build Ilyushin?
          1. VALERIK_097
            VALERIK_097 3 July 2016 11: 44
            +2
            Alas, you are right. And this applies not only to the aviation industry.
          2. Slavin
            Slavin 3 July 2016 12: 13
            0
            The author himself answered his question in the article: It’s clear that the Russian company itself does not have such funds and it is about leasing and a long-term loan; who will provide 20 planes for a long-term leasing-Ilyushin? They don’t cost that much. I don’t see black in this room cats
          3. The comment was deleted.
          4. evge-malyshev
            evge-malyshev 3 July 2016 13: 57
            +7
            Quote: ShadowCat
            our capacities are loaded chichas on the lid itself and there is no opportunity to build Ilyushin?


            Is Voronezh so busy? What is it so loaded with now? Does VIP salons equip?
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. bulvas
              bulvas 3 July 2016 14: 48
              +2
              Actually, it’s interesting how many of the fierce critics of the Boeing’s purchase plans were involved in at least some real serious planning?

              At least a little higher and more difficult than the family budget?
              I don't think many

              Then this question:
              - Surely, many had to plan repairs at home or in the country, buying a car, going on vacation.

              What issues were brought to the forefront, support from a domestic manufacturer, or price / quality?

              1. 34 region
                34 region 3 July 2016 17: 01
                +22
                Boulevard! 14.48. I think here the question of strategic thinking. Therefore, I agree with the opinion of the author. It is rather a question of competition. Remember the 90s. The West will help us! Remember Maidan. Ukraine tse Europe! Western companies who helped? We surpassed the West in quality? Made in Russia, the most sold goods? Western companies buy the company and then go bankrupt. Thus, competitors are removed. I do not believe in fairy tales about the transfer of modern technology by the West. Is there a private business and no interest in Western countries? Well, how many private (non-state) funds were and are! And everyone works in the interests of their countries. And even our leadership is puffing in their direction. And no different from the Maidan. The same emotion of the West and creeping before him. So, home repair, car, vacation, this is not the level of thinking. And our leadership thinks at this level. And you need to think more globally. We do not have leaders with strategic thinking. There are PR specialists. And in our large companies people of the level of vacation and car are also sitting. An example of a bankrupt airline is indicative.
                1. bulvas
                  bulvas 3 July 2016 18: 26
                  +2
                  Quote: Region 34
                  Boulevard! 14.48. I think here the question of strategic thinking. Therefore, I agree with the opinion of the author



                  Not at the address, the author is not me

                  and "strategic thinking" is cool!

                  Let's all deal with strategic thinking in all areas, we will immediately lift the country out of crisis



                2. goose
                  goose 4 July 2016 10: 00
                  +2
                  Quote: Region 34
                  I think here the question of strategic thinking.

                  I think the question of kickbacks.
              2. Vovan 73
                Vovan 73 6 July 2016 06: 53
                +1
                You know, you can certainly consider me an idiot, but ... When I bought my daughter a car, I personally evaluated the following factors. Price quality. producer ... in the end, bought her a new Lada Vesta.
            3. Shadowcat
              Shadowcat 3 July 2016 15: 01
              +1
              I hope you do not think that the plane is just a hull? And electronics, hydraulics, motors in the end are not mana from heaven! Where to get them from?

              To your question - IL-96-300, An-148-100E, IL-112V, parts for Sukhoi SZh-100, parts for A320, IL-76MD-90A, preparation for MS-21.
              I took everything from his site.
            4. Forever so
              Forever so 4 July 2016 11: 18
              +1
              Voronezh Aircraft Plant was long and carefully destroyed. So the presence of buildings, this is not production. No people.
          5. K-612-O
            K-612-O 3 July 2016 15: 44
            +12
            The capacities are just not loaded, the FSB officers handed over 2 out of 4 aircraft (IL-96-400), the Voronezh plant is barely breathing, only thanks to Detachment 1 and the FSB, which order ILs, and 6 aircraft in 2 years is ridiculous.
            1. Nross
              Nross 5 July 2016 17: 00
              +2
              I don’t think that such a deal involves a kid.
              It's just business: the Russian industry cannot provide the ships of the required class, and the company's development plan, or as effective Maskov managers say now, the "road map" of Volgodnepr has been marking time for quite some time.
              Yes - a crisis, Yes - a plane for 4OO.OOO.OOO bucks / unit, but others - which ones?
              C5 Galaxy? - And who will sell them?
              Airbus freight? - Yes, and he was not lying next to 747-8.
              Do IL-400T? - Now this beauty is hardly a serial machine.

              So, comrade s, you should not cheat. Maybe fin. VolgoDnepr indicators and not so hot, but who counted those details in which the devil is hidden? Kerosene / maintenance / staff ... and much more. Some say - there are few orders - the competition is great, others yell that the market will grow by 20% in 100 years. And what will actually be - even the gods do not know ....
        3. bovig
          bovig 3 July 2016 11: 00
          +25
          Quote: Ami du peuple
          Quote: bulvas
          Is Russia increasing its fleet of transport aircraft in this way?
          And why at the expense of foreign-made aircraft? Indeed, why not our IL-96-400T?

          The most viewed motive in this situation is the justified withdrawal of capital from the country, justifying any risks ... IL-96-400T does not contribute to this goal, although it helps to eliminate risks ... IMHO!
          1. Cat man null
            Cat man null 3 July 2016 11: 18
            -5
            Quote: bovig
            The most viewed motive in this situation is a reasonable withdrawal of capital from the country.

            Would you at least look at the definition of a term or something ... before using it ...

            REMOVAL OF CAPITAL - export of capital to other countries state, enterprises, firms, individuals for the purpose of more favorable placement, use

            - keywords - placement, use
            - that is, money is invested, for example, in some kind of foreign financial, production etc .. scheme. Money works outside the Russian Federation
            - and now tell me - how sideways does the purchase of aircraft (which will be used in the Russian Federation) relate to? request
            1. bovig
              bovig 3 July 2016 14: 55
              +7
              Quote: Cat Man Null
              Quote: bovig
              The most viewed motive in this situation is a reasonable withdrawal of capital from the country.

              Would you at least look at the definition of a term or something ... before using it ...

              REMOVAL OF CAPITAL - export of capital to other countries state, enterprises, firms, individuals for the purpose of more favorable placement, use

              - keywords - placement, use
              - that is, money is invested, for example, in some kind of foreign financial, production etc .. scheme. Money works outside the Russian Federation
              - and now tell me - how sideways does the purchase of aircraft (which will be used in the Russian Federation) relate to? request

              Key words?))) Who offered them to you, if you did not choose them yourself? Who will tell you about your true intentions?)))) You are naive, like a child! Any WORD OF WORDS can be thought of as "keywords"!
              "Who wants to be right and speaks the language,
              He will always be able to be right! "(" Faust "by J.W. Goethe)
              The purchase of aircraft abroad has always had a goal - to ruin, slow down the development of domestic civil aircraft manufacturing for foreign manufacturing companies (market capture) and for airlines - to get their own gesheft + the possibility of tax evasion through offshore companies! And you can always find a reasonable explanation for this phenomenon when you know the language! Try to follow the Central Bank of the Russian Federation in the invention of terms (targeting, volatility and other nonsense ...) Until you master the meaning of the terms used, they invent new ones! What for? And the less you understand the essence of their activities, the more opportunities they have to "breed suckers"!
              1. Cat man null
                Cat man null 3 July 2016 15: 01
                -4
                ... to ruin, slow down development ... capture the market ... get your own gesheft ... offshore! ... "breed suckers"!

                Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ... belay

                Tie a plump, good advice to you fool
                1. bovig
                  bovig 3 July 2016 16: 55
                  +6
                  Quote: Cat Man Null
                  ... to ruin, slow down development ... capture the market ... get your own gesheft ... offshore! ... "breed suckers"!

                  Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ... belay

                  Tie a plump, good advice to you fool

                  I don’t drink (I don’t use it at all!), Probably for eight years! So take your advice on board - a bottle of beer more often than once a month is already a lot! This is alcoholism! And if you do not know what BUSINESS is and do not know what rules it uses to conquer sales markets, oust competitors and make a profit at any cost (not to mention such tough cases - for the sake of your own survival), then you are not given to see such interconnections, let alone admit their existence ... Everything that happens in the world happens by itself ... "Funds have collapsed," "the rate has fallen," "oil has fallen in price" - you take such phrases as "face value" without realizing their semantic absurdity ... Hence your sarcasm. I don’t mind if you stick to your opinion! To each his own! laughing hi
                  1. Cat man null
                    Cat man null 3 July 2016 19: 44
                    +8
                    Quote: bovig
                    I don’t drink (I don’t drink at all!), Probably eight years! So take your advice

                    - happy for you
                    - thanks, I'll think about it laughing

                    Quote: bovig
                    And if you don’t know what BUSINESS is and don’t know what rules it uses to conquer sales markets, oust competitors and make profit at any cost (not to mention such tough cases - for your own survival), then you are not given to see such interconnections, especially to allow their existence ...

                    - given, given ... only the Soviet aviation industry was knocked down even during the EBN-e, and I somehow am not ready to consider the urgent need for a dozen cargo Boeings in connection with the "difficulty of life for the Russian aviation industry" ... Excuse me request
                    - the difference between Boeing and IL, I think you do not need to explain
                    - one more "difference" - Boeing is ready to sell, practically, "right now" ("at the rate of demand"). With IL, this will definitely not work, you will have to wait a long time yes

                    And so I see the following:

                    - urgently need a dozen trucks. Right now, right
                    - Volga-Dnepr - convenient buffer for their acquisition (she, by the way, is not under sanctions)
                    - if you think that, if you wanted, at the state level, this deal would not have been crushed before its conclusion - you are just lovely love

                    Voooot .. request

                    Quote: bovig
                    Hence your sarcasm

                    - not from here. It is from there that you use the terms (the same "capital withdrawal" ... especially amused) - without straining at all on the topic that it has nothing to do with this transaction .. has nothing to do with it, by definition.

                    "Cuts", "kickbacks", "lease overpayments" and other husks - leave it ... there would be a contract before your eyes - you could talk about something. And so - this is all fortune telling .. on a felt boot, which the girls threw outside the gate.

                    All this terminology helps to catch the pluses here, since people are guided precisely by terminology, the meaning of which he, for the most part, does not understand.

                    But this has nothing to do with the matter. Well, just never. Just for the lack of information about the real deal.

                    That's all hi
                    1. Stas157
                      Stas157 4 July 2016 11: 20
                      +3
                      Quote: Cat Man Null
                      Boeing is ready to sell, practically, "right now" ("at the speed of demand"). With IL, this will definitely not work, you will have to wait a long time

                      Stop scratching! What is Boeing ready to sell you right now? Aircraft you haven’t built yet?
                    2. Idiot
                      Idiot 5 July 2016 09: 50
                      0
                      would not work as with the "Mistrals". The Americans will not return the money so quickly. Or maybe the Boeings are being purchased in order to preserve the Ruslan's resource? Or even return them to MO?
              2. The comment was deleted.
              3. bulvas
                bulvas 3 July 2016 16: 37
                0
                Quote: bovig
                ... Until you master the meaning of the terms used - they invent new ones! What for? And the less you understand the essence of their activities, the more opportunities they have to "breed suckers"!



                It’s hard to evaluate it correctly without a medical education.

                fellow
            2. K-612-O
              K-612-O 3 July 2016 15: 48
              +9
              I can answer you too. Money and very large are sucked off for purchase and (drum roll) then for the entire life of the aircraft we pay Boeing for repairs, maintenance, spare parts. parts etc. and for 20 years we sign a stable monetary stream to an American company. Something like that. sad
              1. Cat man null
                Cat man null 3 July 2016 16: 11
                0
                Quote: K-612-O
                Money and very large are sucked off for purchase

                - a private company buys at its own expense (from the article, there it is)

                Quote: K-612-O
                and (drum roll) then for the entire life of the aircraft we pay Boeing for repairs, maintenance, app. parts etc. and for 20 years we sign a stable monetary stream to an American company

                - Well, then you need to go exclusively to Ladakh-Kalin ... You say that a person who buys Mers "takes out capital"?
                - no, but you say ... together we will laugh laughing
                1. bulvas
                  bulvas 3 July 2016 16: 26
                  +3
                  Quote: Cat Man Null
                  Would you say that the person who buys Mears "takes out capital"?



                  Do not talk about Merce here - they will trample

                  Ask about Phillips or GE bulbs, Colgate paste, Ariel washing powder, Kozel beer, Egyptian potatoes, Serbian apples ............................ .................................................. ..


                  ............................

                  Maybe it will be clearer that all of us in Russia are engaged in "capital export"

                  And according to this logic, it turns out that you don’t have to brush your teeth yet, turn on the light, eat potatoes, and wait until they start to release all the domestic

                  By the way, they forgot that the Communists brought agriculture to the point that they bought grain from the USA and Canada?

                  And even machines for boring submarine shafts were purchased (horror!) In Japan (Toshiba)


                  PS I am not going to refuse Kozel beer
                  drinks
                  1. Cat man null
                    Cat man null 3 July 2016 20: 03
                    0
                    Quote: bulvas
                    Do not talk about Merce here - they will trample

                    - me? It is unlikely laughing

                    Quote: bulvas
                    Maybe it will be clearer that all of us in Russia are engaged in "capital export"

                    - yes, damn it ... they picked up words, like "legitimate", and now they stick them everywhere .. where necessary and not necessary
                    - "capital export", "The Central Bank of the Russian Federation is controlled by the Federal Reserve System", stuff like that ... ugh, forgive me, Lord request

                    Quote: bulvas
                    I am not going to refuse Kozel beer

                    - I'm more on Tuborg drinks
                    1. bulvas
                      bulvas 3 July 2016 20: 15
                      +1
                      Quote: Cat Man Null
                      Quote: bulvas
                      I am not going to refuse Kozel beer

                      - I'm more on Tuborg drinks


                      - also normal

                      for the "export of capital"! drinks

                      then I thought, because the ideal of communists and sympathizers with red is the number of types of beer in the country no more than 2: "there is beer" and "there is no beer"

                      The same goes for toothpaste, cars and planes

                      But what is interesting is for the "working people", for themselves they will leave all the good things they have got used to

                  2. saturn.mmm
                    saturn.mmm 4 July 2016 21: 47
                    0
                    Quote: bulvas
                    And even machines for boring submarine shafts were purchased (horror!) In Japan (Toshiba)

                    Not shafts but screws.
                    Quote: bulvas
                    PS I am not going to refuse Kozel beer

                    Here you are in vain, better beer is brewed in Russia than Kozel, Zhiguli of the Moscow bottling in glass bottles is very popular with us, everyone puts Kozel above.
                2. Backfire
                  Backfire 4 July 2016 16: 23
                  0
                  Russian company then.
          2. Terner38
            Terner38 3 July 2016 11: 33
            +13
            The exchange of cut paper for 10 - 20 planes, and most likely a lot of paper and it depreciates. IMHO .. I bought a turning machine myself in the garage, although not a millionaire. Yes, and it all lies on the surface, but the fact that the entire defense industry (and not only) is re-equipped with expensive hundreds of thousands of imported machines is like seeds. I myself see all this every day — on the one hand, it’s pleasing, on the other hand, how you think about the possibility of consequences (consumables, spare parts, tools), it annoys me. On the machine I have one engine covered - they cannot bring a year (sanctions), okay, even without the machine plows it.
        4. Vadim237
          Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 06
          +1
          Apparently because Boeing’s service base is quite extensive, and the rights to release Anovs remained in Ukraine and the Volga Dnepr will not wait for several years until our aircraft manufacturers build them the IL 96 400T aircraft.
          1. starogil
            starogil 3 July 2016 11: 33
            +17
            "Ruslans" AN-124 were built in Irkutsk. If today's temporary workers remembered
            that Antonov Design Bureau, located in Novosibirsk, was only translated in the 50s
            to the outskirts of Russia, then they, if they were statesmen, and not State Deputies
            gaskets, would have long ago spit on conventions like "release rights".
            1. VIT101
              VIT101 3 July 2016 21: 27
              +7
              Quote: starogil
              "Ruslans" AN-124 were built in Irkutsk.


              The AN-124 was never built in Irkutsk. They were assembled at Aviastar in Ulyanovsk, which was built for this purpose. An installation batch of these machines was assembled at Aviant in Kiev.
        5. TsUS-Air Force
          TsUS-Air Force 3 July 2016 15: 49
          +2
          yes it’s again a politician as with MISTRALS unnecessary to anyone in the world
        6. magician
          magician 3 July 2016 21: 32
          0
          well, 96 would be a good car.
        7. magician
          magician 3 July 2016 21: 32
          0
          well, 96 would be a good car.
        8. Al1977
          Al1977 5 July 2016 11: 48
          +1
          Quote: Ami du peuple
          And why at the expense of foreign-made aircraft? Indeed, why not our IL-96-400T?

          The version that Boeing is more effective, and then it will be easier to sell them do not consider?
          Crew IL 96 - 3 people
          Boeing 747 - 2 people
          Maximum take-off weight of IL -270 t
          Boeing - 447 t
          In terms of economy, too, 100% confident in Boeing
          Therefore, I do not see the obvious advantages of IL
          Western companies also do not particularly see them, judging by the orders.
        9. Cresta999
          Cresta999 5 July 2016 13: 46
          +1
          After the collapse of the Soviet Union, there was only one positive political event in our country - the arrival of V.V. Putin to power instead of Yeltsin. However, do not forget that the ruler is just an expression of the will of the ruling class. Therefore, without bringing some new anti-aircraft defense parties to the State Duma (at least), one cannot count on a government strategy aimed at, among other things, supporting domestic industry (including aviation). This is at least naive. You can not bring anyone to the Duma and just change the social system, but this will require a revolution. And what consequences it may have, we know from our experience and from the experience of our closest neighbors.
        10. ver_
          ver_ 6 July 2016 04: 29
          0
          ... why not boost the development of a thermal plan with a carrying capacity of 2500 tons? ..
        11. SHURA_159
          SHURA_159 13 July 2016 22: 55
          0
          This is another offer and I think not without the participation of our dear liberal government. But what is Comrade Putin looking at? Ruslans are currently strategically important aircraft. All our businessmen, including the Volga-Dnepr company, are a short-sighted crook, temporary workers. Their scrotum will burst from 20 already obsolete Boeings, and will be paid either by the state treasury or all Ruslans will go to Uncle Sam, and even with a surcharge. And why not buy the beautiful IL-96, because you won’t get kickbacks from them, and giving Boeing 50-100 million is not a problem, the FRS will print some more pieces of paper.
      2. starogil
        starogil 3 July 2016 10: 31
        +26
        For service, for spare parts and much more - Russia sits down buying these Boeings,
        and also sits past a chair, backwards on the asphalt, once again throwing the development of his own
        aircraft manufacturing, that is, more and more bogged down in technological lags.
        1. Koshak
          Koshak 3 July 2016 10: 39
          +15
          Quote: starogil
          For service, for spare parts and much more - Russia sits down buying these Boeings

          The most interesting thing will be if the Yankees sell airplanes, and sanctions are imposed on the supply of spare parts.
          1. Shadowcat
            Shadowcat 3 July 2016 11: 02
            0
            And even funnier is what technology sells. Moreover, intentions are only intentions. They haven’t even put the money on the barrel yet.
          2. Vadim237
            Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 09
            .
            Spare parts can be purchased through third parties - there will be no problems with this.
            1. tomket
              tomket 3 July 2016 14: 10
              +3
              Quote: Vadim237
              Spare parts can be purchased through third parties - there will be no problems with this.

              Yeah, are you a naive Chukchi guy?
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 04
                +1
                I also order the necessary components from abroad - so at the expense of the "naive guy" this is not for me.
            2. Koshak
              Koshak 3 July 2016 23: 28
              +1
              Quote: Vadim237
              Spare parts can be purchased through third parties - there will be no problems with this.

              Yeah, especially with the engines. They are traded in the states on every corner. What is worth persuading someone, he runs away, buys and delivers to Russia. Well, aircraft repairs can be done by someone in the garage.
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 4 July 2016 09: 49
                -1
                Engines can be ordered through other foreign companies. "What is it worth to persuade someone" - No one needs to be persuaded, we have such guys who are fully engaged in these purchases both in Russia and abroad, with the availability of tools and spare parts, as well as trained specialists, and they are also in Russia, you can repair and at home - Boeings are already being repaired here.
              2. Al1977
                Al1977 5 July 2016 12: 12
                0
                Quote: Koshak
                Yeah, especially with the engines. They are traded in the states on every corner. What is worth persuading someone, he runs away, buys and delivers to Russia. Well, aircraft repairs can be done by someone in the garage.

                Have you heard recently a scandal when the IAC tried to ban the operation of the B737?
                How did it end and why did the airlines laugh together?
                All aircraft are registered in other countries. MOT pass there.
                And so many companies and countries sell spare parts for boeing.
          3. Al1977
            Al1977 5 July 2016 12: 00
            0
            Quote: Koshak
            The most interesting thing will be if the Yankees sell airplanes, and sanctions are imposed on the supply of spare parts.

            And if they impose sanctions on windows
            Maybe you need to invent your OS?
            And parts can not be bought through other countries?
            It’s also a question, but you may not know that the place of registration of almost all aircraft in Russia is other countries. You will be surprised, but even Aeroflot does not register aircraft in Russia.
            Personally, I drive a foreign car, call on Apple, and write with Windows.
            And I feel great.
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 3 July 2016 12: 16
          -3
          This is not Russia landing, but a private freight company.
        3. Idiot
          Idiot 5 July 2016 09: 56
          0
          Ten cars - Russia sits on a lot of what? What are we throwing, how will the Russian aircraft industry suffer?
      3. 2s1122
        2s1122 3 July 2016 12: 46
        0
        I wonder who put the downsides to you for the assumption of foreign technology for the MO?
      4. magician
        magician 3 July 2016 21: 29
        0
        yeah, and tomorrow sanctions and spare parts are zero, they sawed the money and rolled it into the asphalt like with roads. certainly, that in MO not all fools. Why is Russia so addicted? we have our own factories capable of fulfilling this task cheaply and angrily. sorry but minus.
    2. Pavel1
      Pavel1 3 July 2016 10: 36
      +9
      Why does our company work with non-equipment? The answer here is one - capitalism does not contribute to the development of patriotism, but only rudeness, bargaining, selfishness and selfishness. This type of company, our company does not bother with the development of its own aircraft industry, the development of its own science, but simply the existence of its people, and the main thing in all their activities is profit, and they put the rest. Capitalism brings misfortune and ruin to the people of Russia, but the leadership does not care.
      1. aba
        aba 3 July 2016 11: 10
        +15
        This type of our company does not bother

        Under capitalism, there are no our or not our companies, companies are all private and they are only interested in money. And in order to develop our own production forces, we need legislative acts at the state level. For example, the same states, so that their Japanese automakers would not eat, banned the import of Japanese women to their market. The Japanese were forced to build their full-cycle plants (not car assembly plants) in the United States, creating jobs for Americans in all sectors involved in the production of automobiles.
        But the story of the Volga-Dnepr may actually turn out to be that we lose Ruslanov or the state will be forced to pay an inflated price to the private trader. so that the planes do not leave.
        It is necessary to conduct an audit of the activities of this company, while there is still time.
        1. Come on
          Come on 5 July 2016 03: 59
          0
          Quote: aba
          The same states, so that the Japanese would not eat their carmakers, banned the import of Japanese women to their market. The Japanese were forced to build their full-cycle plants (not car assembly plants) in the USA


          You invented it for a red word? How can one arrange such bans while in the WTO? And there has never been such a thing.
          1. Idiot
            Idiot 5 July 2016 09: 58
            +1
            WTO - a fairy tale for suckers. As they say, only its owner wins in a casino.
      2. Forest
        Forest 3 July 2016 11: 37
        0
        Firstly, Boeing can launch these airplanes in the shortest possible time, while Ilov needs to wait several years for at least one to leave the factory. Secondly, the IL-76 is inferior in carrying capacity to the Boeing 747.
      3. Sharapov
        Sharapov 3 July 2016 12: 33
        -1
        And why should the carrier company bother with aircraft manufacturing issues?
        According to your logic, a patriotic taxi fleet should use only priors and viburnum, and invest revenue in a VAZ.

        Merchants make money in their industry, and if they are sprayed (especially during a crisis), they will immediately burn out. The law of the market.
        1. Pavel1
          Pavel1 3 July 2016 14: 07
          +4
          Quote: Sharapov
          And why should the carrier company bother with aircraft manufacturing issues?


          you don’t get it. You argue, as a typical selfish consumer, why should I not think of myself, not of my pocket? For people like you, the homeland is where it is warm, where you can get rich, and if there are any problems with the homeland, you can change such a homeland and protect it is not worth it, but you only need to protect your wallet in any country. But here is your and the joy that our equipment is the best and our people will have in the company and that it will be the best, such considerations were the cornerstone in making such decisions about the purchase of equipment, neither you nor the leadership of this company have such thoughts sales company.

          there are good words - "... only the Motherland would be rich and happy, and there is nothing higher than the happiness of the Motherland in the world," but this is not about you ...
          1. Suhov
            Suhov 3 July 2016 15: 55
            +1
            Quote: Paul1
            You argue, as a typical selfish consumer, why should I not think of myself, not of my pocket? For people like you, Motherland is where it’s warm

            For your information:
            A domestic manufacturer "has" a domestic consumer at any opportunity.
            So you do not worry about the pockets of our businessmen, but rather look after your own. And it’s not even an hour — the guardians of domestic interests will cleanse them. wassat
            1. Pavel1
              Pavel1 3 July 2016 17: 40
              0
              Quote: Sukhov
              A domestic manufacturer "has" a domestic consumer at any opportunity.


              in your head, as in our state, everything is turned upside down, is it funny to you that both ours and not ours are robbing us? This is capitalism around deception, lies, misrepresentation.
              For example, your picture seems to be FOR OFFICIAL POWER, it should be, but in fact it’s a lie-mask ...
        2. Suhov
          Suhov 3 July 2016 15: 47
          -1
          Quote: Sharapov
          According to your logic, a patriotic taxi fleet should use only priors and viburnum, and invest revenue in a VAZ.

          According to Their logic, a patriotic taxi fleet can drive anything, but send all the proceeds to AvtoVAZ management.
      4. Vadim237
        Vadim237 3 July 2016 18: 41
        -2
        Because our equipment, namely cargo transport aircraft, does not have the required carrying capacity.
        1. Pavel1
          Pavel1 3 July 2016 19: 29
          +1
          Quote: Vadim237
          Because our equipment, namely cargo transport aircraft, does not have the required carrying capacity.


          what are you chasing? ant124 - has all the records for lifting capacity up to 170t
          b747-147t, and loading-unloading on Ruslan is more convenient, because he lies on his belly ...
          1. Vadim237
            Vadim237 3 July 2016 21: 46
            0
            Yes, what are you - An 124 - and you probably don’t know that this plane will no longer be released and will not be released - thanks to Ukraine, the IL 96 generally barely lets out one machine a year.
            1. Pavel1
              Pavel1 3 July 2016 22: 35
              +1
              Quote: Vadim237
              will not be released - thanks to Ukraine,


              if they want, they will release, there is documentation, just like Zenith accelerating units, rd180 engines based on Voivode, produce because these products are not Ukrainian, but Soviet ...
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 4 July 2016 09: 53
                0
                All rights for the production of the An 124 remained in Ukraine, they put a fat cross on the production of this aircraft and will never produce it, we began to develop a new heavy military-technical vehicle - but it will fly only in a few years.
                1. Pavel1
                  Pavel1 4 July 2016 10: 55
                  0
                  Quote: Vadim237
                  All rights for the production of the An 124 remained in Ukraine, they put a fat cross on the production of this aircraft and will never produce it, we began to develop a new heavy military-technical vehicle - but it will fly only in a few years.


                  Ukrainians spoke about the same thing about Crimea, however, it turned out differently, especially since they are being made in Ulyanovsk ...
    3. ARS56
      ARS56 3 July 2016 10: 50
      +8
      Yes, the internal enemy is on the alert and lowers resources into the US pocket past our defense industry and to the detriment of the country's defense.
      1. kartalovkolya
        kartalovkolya 3 July 2016 11: 11
        +12
        Something I do not remember that private companies care about the welfare of the state, so "to get into" the state pocket is yes, but you never know how they pulled our money to support private banks from our budget, in fact, they stole from us! It's time to recruit " the command "for the construction of the next canal or something else, otherwise the quilted jackets in the warehouses become unusable, and the crowbars with the picks are dull on the shelves!"
    4. Sharapov
      Sharapov 3 July 2016 12: 20
      +3
      To take such funds (equipment) on lease - go along the path of Transaero, gentlemen, comrades! Given that the direction is not promising ...
      1. quote
        quote 3 July 2016 14: 20
        +6
        Quote: Sharapov
        To take such funds (equipment) on lease - go along the path of Transaero, gentlemen, comrades! Given that the direction is not promising ...

        To discharge.
        The company was founded in 2004. The first transportation under the AirBridgeCargo brand took place in May of the same year on the Boeing 747. This event was preceded by a two-year preparatory work, including the development of a development strategy for the project of regular freight transportation within the Volga-Dnepr Group of Companies, the completion of the fleet, the selection and training of the flight composition, as well as the formation of a management team. Today AirBridgeCargo provides regular flights between Europe and Asia via the Trans-Siberian route. Flights are operated on Boeing 747 family cargo aircraft. It is noteworthy that AirBridgeCargo became the first Russian cargo airline, carrying out transportation on aircraft of this type.

        The AirBridgeCargo delivery network includes, in addition to its own routes, regular flights of interline partners (NCA, Air Canada, Emirates, Cargolux and others), as well as extensive truck delivery capabilities.

        The airline was repeatedly recognized as the best freight carrier at Frankfurt Airport (2009, 2010, 2011), and was also awarded with such awards as: Schiphol Aviation Awards (2012), Wings of Russia (2009, 2010, 2011), Golden Chariot "(2011).

        The average age of the fleet is 7,0 years. Consists of 17 aircraft [1]:

        1 Boeing 737-400F
        3 Boeing 747-400F,
        5 Boeing 747-400ERF,
        8 Boeing 747-8F,

        And what does the Ruslana have to do with it?

        Put a minus? Read it again!
        In "right now" they read!
        1. weksha50
          weksha50 3 July 2016 15: 29
          +3
          Quote: devis
          And what does the Ruslana have to do with it?


          Um ... That is, AirBridgeCargo is just one of the companies included in the Volga-Dnepr corporation and operates purely on Boeing ???

          That is, "Ruslans" are operated by another structure, "Volga-Dnepr", and in the article "horses, people are mixed in a heap" ???
          1. Vadim237
            Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 42
            +1
            "That is, the Ruslans are operated by another structure, Volga-Dnepr, and in the article" horses, people are mixed in a heap "??? - You have heard the truth.
        2. 34 region
          34 region 3 July 2016 17: 20
          0
          Davis! 14.20. Do they have many competitors? Who are they competing with? Or are they monopolists?
    5. Maksus
      Maksus 3 July 2016 13: 58
      +2
      Il 96 and Boeing are different machines, look at the length of the fuselage and the dimensions of the cargo compartment. Boeing is good for transporting long vehicles. And the ability to quickly get 20 machines is much better than the ability to wait for the devil knows how much ...
    6. Sodom897
      Sodom897 4 July 2016 14: 00
      0
      But does the state have leverage to put pressure on them so that the deal does not take place ???
    7. derik1970
      derik1970 6 July 2016 09: 17
      0
      the article is good ... but who told you that you and we have not been thrown? they have forwarded with Turkey out of nothing to do, "patriots" are already tearing up their soles in travel agencies, the honor and dignity of a Russian soldier who died in Syria has been trampled by the slippers of holidaymakers ... and in any other case, no one in the Kremlin will ask anyone ...
  2. captain
    captain 3 July 2016 10: 05
    +11
    His pocket was always closer and dearer to his heart.
  3. kind
    kind 3 July 2016 10: 05
    +7
    Therefore, a scheme was invented at the time: initially, the An-124 military was handed over to civilian operators, including the Volga-Dnepr, so that the cars did not stand idle and earn money, but at the same time they would help their own Ministry of Defense.

    "Military An-124s are handed over to civilian operators." Therefore, Volga-Dnepr cannot dispose of them, they are state-owned on lease.
    1. Simple
      Simple 3 July 2016 10: 33
      +7
      Quote: Good
      "Military An-124s are handed over to civilian operators." Therefore, Volga-Dnepr cannot dispose of them, they are state-owned on lease.



      Now imagine how "if something happens" the Boeings of the Ministry of Defense will "help".
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 11
        +3
        Yes, it will help easily if something happens - the main thing is that these planes fly ..
        1. 34 region
          34 region 3 July 2016 17: 25
          0
          Vadim! 11.11. If we want to put launchers on the Mexican-Amer border, will these airplanes help us? Or suddenly abruptly refuse? How will the balance of interests of the country (USA) and business go?
          1. Vadim237
            Vadim237 3 July 2016 18: 45
            +1
            ... If we want to put launchers on the Mexican-Amer border - What's that for? We have excellent delivery systems in the form of submarines equipped with ICBMs, which in turn will deliver the "package" within 20 minutes.
    2. bovig
      bovig 3 July 2016 11: 17
      +6
      Quote: Good
      Therefore, a scheme was invented at the time: initially, the An-124 military was handed over to civilian operators, including the Volga-Dnepr, so that the cars did not stand idle and earn money, but at the same time they would help their own Ministry of Defense.

      "Military An-124s are handed over to civilian operators." Therefore, Volga-Dnepr cannot dispose of them, they are state-owned on lease.

      The lease is a thin thing, especially if it is NOT real estate .... Its conditions are unknown to us! Suppose, if the contract provides for the return of the rented equipment with reimbursement of costs (most often this common condition is hammered into the lease), it turns out so - pay the maintenance costs (which, most likely, have already exceeded the residual value!) And take this junk!
  4. atamankko
    atamankko 3 July 2016 10: 09
    +14
    When will business work for the prospect of their country,
    and not to support foreign companies, or is it not fashionable?
    1. aleksfill
      aleksfill 3 July 2016 10: 37
      +2
      Never, because business is what language does not turn to call - work.
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 15
        -2
        "Never, because business is what the language does not dare to call - work." In order to sell something - you have to do something from the beginning, and also offer - why is it not work for you?
      2. aba
        aba 3 July 2016 11: 21
        +8
        Never

        You can still recall the following saying of Napoleon: "Money has no homeland; financiers have neither patriotism, nor honesty; their only goal is profit ”
    2. bovig
      bovig 3 July 2016 11: 23
      +8
      Quote: atamankko
      When will business work for the prospect of their country,
      and not to support foreign companies, or is it not fashionable?

      Private business will work for the prospect of their country only when they have no other perspective!
  5. Grbear
    Grbear 3 July 2016 10: 10
    +4
    It is strange that the aircraft belonging to the Ministry of Defense are not legally insured against the possibility of "transfer" in the event of the operator's bankruptcy. "Illiteracy" 90s what . I doubt it. hi
    1. bovig
      bovig 3 July 2016 11: 35
      +4
      Quote: GrBear
      It is strange that the aircraft belonging to the Ministry of Defense are not legally insured against the possibility of "transfer" in the event of the operator's bankruptcy. "Illiteracy" 90s what . I doubt it. hi

      Legally, in the event of the bankruptcy of the operator, an arrest may not be imposed on funds that are not his property, but ...! The costs and expenses associated with maintenance during operation, which may exceed the residual value of these funds, are the property of the operator and its assets ...
      1. Cat man null
        Cat man null 3 July 2016 11: 41
        -1
        Quote: bovig
        Costs and expenses associated with maintenance during operation

        Sorry, you want to say that, like, I rent a car, but the landlord pays for parking, gasoline and ongoing repairs?

        Delirium request

        There is a concept of "inseparable improvements" of the rented object (the pilot's seats are covered with crocodile leather, for example).

        Duc it is still necessary to prove that this "improvement" was really necessary in order to receive reimbursement of their costs from the lessor.

        So no?
        1. bovig
          bovig 3 July 2016 17: 35
          0
          Quote: Cat Man Null
          Quote: bovig
          Costs and expenses associated with maintenance during operation

          Sorry, you want to say that, like, I rent a car, but the landlord pays for parking, gasoline and ongoing repairs?

          Delirium request

          There is a concept of "inseparable improvements" of the rented object (the pilot's seats are covered with crocodile leather, for example).

          Duc it is still necessary to prove that this "improvement" was really necessary in order to receive reimbursement of their costs from the lessor.

          So no?

          That's right! What you wrote is complete nonsense! Costs and maintenance costs, these are the costs of maintenance, repair, etc., taking into account that used B / C equipment at the residual value, taking into account the fact that in the process of operation, depreciation charges reduce its residual value, and more frequent repairs increase the cost of maintaining it (read the law on accounting), then after ten years the cost of maintenance may exceed the residual value! And to prove these costs in court is not difficult if you have the appropriate accounting and compliance with relevant technical standards and requirements! Fershteyn? lol
          1. Cat man null
            Cat man null 3 July 2016 20: 21
            +1
            Quote: bovig
            Costs and maintenance costs, these are the costs of maintenance, repair, etc.

            - and this is exactly the problem of the tenant. Volga-Dnepr companies, in this case

            Quote: bovig
            during operation, depreciation charges reduce its residual value

            - But this is already the problem of the lessor, on whose balance these planes are composed. Do not confuse warm with soft laughing

            Quote: bovig
            and more frequent repairs increase maintenance costs

            - these are again the problems of the tenant ...

            Quote: bovig
            read the law on accounting

            - this is not in nature. Are you talking about PBU? What if not a secret? wink

            Quote: bovig
            maintenance costs may exceed residual value

            - one thing does not correlate with each other. According to the same "accounting law" laughing

            Quote: bovig
            And to prove these costs in court is not difficult if you have the appropriate accounting and compliance with relevant technical standards and requirements

            - in court, dear, this is not proven. There is such a thing - "inseparable improvements"
            - this is the trick that can cause a legal dispute between the landlord (to whom these "improvements" were presented for payment), and the tenant who made these "improvements" at their own expense
            - if these improvements consist in the fact that the pilot's seat was covered, I repeat, with crocodile leather - the tenant will never prove that it was really necessary. Consequently, he will never receive compensation for this "improvement".

            Quote: bovig
            Fershteyn?

            - YYYYYY laughing laughing laughing
            - thank. I haven’t had such high quality fun for a long time love
    2. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 3 July 2016 11: 46
      +3
      Quote: GrBear
      It is strange that the aircraft belonging to the Ministry of Defense are not legally insured against the possibility of "transfer" in the event of the operator's bankruptcy.

      How do you know how the contract is drawn up? Maybe they are leased from the Moscow Region, they are not the property of a private owner. In this case, in the event of bankruptcy, they are returned to the owner. Legally they do not belong to a private owner and it will not work to lay hands on this "property"
      1. 34 region
        34 region 3 July 2016 17: 29
        +1
        Pilate2009! 11.46. All of this is certainly true. Only another question may arise. The issue of technical serviceability of aircraft. There is an airplane, but it cannot fly. How to be here?
  6. figwam
    figwam 3 July 2016 10: 13
    +2
    So the engine life of the AN-124 is not eternal, what will they fly on then?
    1. NordUral
      NordUral 3 July 2016 10: 19
      -1
      And they can be removed and put others.
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 15
        0
        What are the others?
        1. NordUral
          NordUral 3 July 2016 20: 07
          0
          The brothers Slavs created a problem with the engines for us, but we will solve it.
          Not the first time.
          http://allpravda.info/bitva-dvigateley-kuznetsov-protiv-motor-sich-19739.html
      2. figwam
        figwam 3 July 2016 12: 22
        +2
        Quote: NordUral
        And they can be removed and put others.

        And there are no others!
      3. 34 region
        34 region 3 July 2016 17: 32
        0
        NordUral! 10.19. Which others? Where to get them? Where to get funds for them? Why splurge on them?
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 3 July 2016 18: 47
          0
          Ten years later, they promise to create a line of engines with thrust from 20 to 50 tons.
        2. NordUral
          NordUral 3 July 2016 20: 07
          0
          See above.
          Or: http://allpravda.info/bitva-dvigateley-kuznetsov-protiv-motor-sich-19739.html
  7. NordUral
    NordUral 3 July 2016 10: 18
    +5
    Most likely this is a vile scam.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 4 July 2016 09: 55
      0
      Not a scam is the business of the company.
      1. NordUral
        NordUral 4 July 2016 10: 16
        0
        And almost the entire business of oligarchic corporations is a series of scams and thefts.
  8. populist
    populist 3 July 2016 10: 19
    +6
    Therefore, at one time, a scheme was invented: initially, the An-124 military was transferred to civilian operators, including the Volga-Dnepr, so that the cars did not stand idle and earn money, but at the same time they would help their own Ministry of Defense. The number of “Ruslans” in the military department is about a dozen, in “Volga-Dnepr” there are eleven plus one, previously owned by the deceased airline

    If these 11-12 cars really belong to the Moscow Region, then in this situation they should be taken away or a ban should be placed on transactions with them. Let the managers on ... transport.
    1. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 3 July 2016 20: 38
      0
      Quote: populist
      then in this situation they should be picked up or a ban on transactions with them should be imposed. Let the managers on ... transport.

      Then they will just rust. The planes are created to fly. The MO receives some money from this. Let them invest in the production of the same engines
  9. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 3 July 2016 10: 19
    +6
    The original scheme of liquidation of the enterprise. With the confiscation of property FOR DEBTS, and not needed. Not once observed phenomenon in our, and not in our business communities. There is such a mindset - adventurism. At different times, this mindset either raises to the top of the business, or drowns like a kitten in a garbage can.
  10. Basarev
    Basarev 3 July 2016 10: 20
    +12
    And this is not stupid. This is a conscious step. The Volga-Dnepr leadership has sold offal and is eager to prove its usefulness to its American friends. But they won’t find recognition - the Americans’s deflections are not in price. In general, the story is like with policemen and punishers: despite all the atrocities that the policemen and punishers themselves considered proof of their loyalty, the occupation administration did not value them penniless, simply because they were untimely, and even traitors. So it is here: in spite of the Ruslans given and the damage to national security, the Volga-Dnepr leadership will never become their own in the United States. They will remain useful idiots.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 22
      0
      Volga Dnepr is a transportation company and it strives for profit, like all other companies, and chooses faster and more efficient solutions for itself - even if they want, they buy the state and they have no right to dictate what to buy, the main thing is that then the Ruslans would transfer to the balance of the Moscow Region .
  11. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 3 July 2016 10: 25
    +13
    But behind the ear and into the sun, "effective managers", surnamed, with a "pedigree" and track record. What is it? With the advancement of the "Superjet" we cant on a cant (although the market is not packed to capacity), with the more competitive MC-21 we will still cry thanks to our sworn partners. The 204th was ditched, although it could have been brought to mind, I generally keep quiet about the short-haul. They are, you see, "private traders".
    "You can't live in society and be free from society." Lenin wrote something like that.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 57
      +3
      And what about the Superjet - more than 100 pieces have already released it and continue to release it.
      1. iliitchitch
        iliitchitch 3 July 2016 12: 25
        +4
        Quote: Vadim237
        And what about the Superjet - more than 100 pieces have already released it and continue to release it.


        We planned about 1500 pieces, as far as I remember. In the jet segment "up to 100 passengers" the profit is minimal. Well, it will pay off, in 300 years, at this rate.
    2. NordUral
      NordUral 3 July 2016 20: 10
      +1
      From all these problems and hemorrhages, the urgent need for nationalization, socialization, and a planned economy in the main sectors of the economy follows. There will be no sense in an oligarchic economy.
  12. atakan
    atakan 3 July 2016 10: 25
    -1
    I haven’t minus articles for a long time. short-sighted decision.
    1. midashko
      midashko 3 July 2016 10: 47
      +11
      And here is the minus article. The article is good and timely, it should be given a bold plus. A minus should be given to those figures who conclude such agreements. And why did the Ruslans betray this to a private company, they could simply lease it, then with the collapse of this company, the Ruslans would return to their owners.
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 25
        +1
        And if they had not been given to this company at one time, then most likely these aircraft would have turned into worthless scrap metal, this company would at least repair and maintain them in good condition.
        1. avia1991
          avia1991 3 July 2016 13: 24
          +5
          Quote: Vadim237
          if they were not given to this company at one time, then most likely these planes would have turned into worthless scrap metal, this company would even repair them

          laughing laughing laughing !!! ...
          Sorry, of course - but this could be written only by a person who has no idea about the exploitation of "Ruslan" by the aforementioned office in the 90s! You can't tell the details - you have to sing! The workers of the ARP of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation saved the situation, where the owners of "V-D" - the former commanders and deputies of the Air Force and VTA - drove the killed cars "according to old memory" and restored them at the state expense! ..
          1. Vadim237
            Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 08
            0
            The fact remains that all the transferred Ruslans remained in excellent condition and are in operation, but those that remained on the balance sheet of the Moscow Region are only half in working condition.
            1. avia1991
              avia1991 3 July 2016 19: 59
              +2
              Quote: Vadim237
              all transferred Ruslans remained in excellent condition and are in operation

              How do you know this? ..
              And in the plane of these poor fellows who worked in "V-D", dropped in? Have you ever seen in what condition the root rib is? And what does the plane itself hold on? From constant overvoltage .. And how the shafts of the compressors in the engines play in broken bearings - can you imagine ?!
              You just have to argue that USE HARASHO - JUST FOR ... BIS! And people risked their lives flying such cars ..
              PS By the way, I will not say 100%, but it seems that after the collapse of the Union, the Russian Air Force did not receive ANY new "Ruslan" - everything that was released after the 91st went into "commerce". So, the Russian Aerospace Forces has a certain number of An-124s - a great merit of the pilots, technicians and engineers of the VTA, who managed to keep these machines in working order!
      2. Idiot
        Idiot 5 July 2016 10: 16
        0
        It’s a riddle for me in general: why not create a structure at the Moscow Region that would carry out the commercial operation of airplanes, with one hundred percent state participation? Why lease state property (it is not clear under what conditions) to merchants? I believe, if it is only necessary to avoid the above involvement of the state. The son or matchmaker of some general leads, not otherwise ...
    2. Cat man null
      Cat man null 3 July 2016 10: 49
      +4
      Quote: atakan
      has not minus articles for a long time

      - an article is just information about what is happening in reality. What is there, it would seem, minus?

      Quote: atakan
      short-sighted decision

      - exactly yes
    3. NordUral
      NordUral 3 July 2016 11: 17
      +6
      On the contrary, a very far-sighted ... Only from the point of view of the enemy of our country.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    4. bovig
      bovig 3 July 2016 11: 59
      +5
      Quote: atakan
      I haven’t minus articles for a long time. short-sighted decision.

      Strange statement of the question!))) The author of the article did not take this short-sighted decision! He only informed you that there are people who make such a decision ... And you, minus the article, act like a capricious check: the messenger is to blame for the fact that he brought you bad news - to execute !?))))
  13. Banishing liberoids
    Banishing liberoids 3 July 2016 10: 45
    +3
    Another example of the fact that the country is a complete mess, and apart from money by any means, our carriers are not interested in anything.
  14. sabakina
    sabakina 3 July 2016 10: 47
    +4
    Guys, who in the subject, what is happening?
    1. iliitchitch
      iliitchitch 3 July 2016 11: 05
      +5
      Quote: sabakina
      Guys, who in the subject, what is happening?


      Nice gesheft with the following: "Mom, give sisyu", in short.
      1. Cat man null
        Cat man null 3 July 2016 12: 07
        0
        Quote: iliitch
        with the following: "Mom, give sissyu"

        - yeah ... Only with a risk this sisu not get
        - Transaero did not receive in due time fellow
    2. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 11: 51
      -3
      The conclusion from the article is that our BTA has very few heavy transport aircraft, the technical base for servicing our domestic aircraft abroad is not developed, and the construction of the domestic IL 96 aircraft itself is extremely slow 1 - 2 aircraft per year, hence the answer to why the Volga Dnepr decided Buying a Boeing 747-8, Tranaero will not take this company into account - cargo transportation has always been and will be more profitable than passenger transportation and the Volga Dnepr is much more profitable than the rest Transaero.
    3. bovig
      bovig 3 July 2016 12: 04
      +1
      Quote: sabakina
      Guys, who in the subject, what is happening?

      Quote: iliitch
      Quote: sabakina
      Guys, who in the subject, what is happening?


      Nice gesheft with the following: "Mom, give sisyu", in short.

      Absolutely right! A big-time gesheft with the simultaneous withdrawal of capital from the country and subsequent compensation at the expense of taxpayers ...
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Cat man null
        Cat man null 3 July 2016 12: 58
        0
        Quote: bovig
        A big deal with ... followed by taxpayer compensation

        - may not ride, Transaero - as an example

        Quote: bovig
        gesheft with simultaneous withdrawal of capital from the country

        - well no I have a TV! there capital withdrawal...
        1. bovig
          bovig 3 July 2016 14: 13
          +3
          Quote: Cat Man Null
          Quote: bovig
          A big deal with ... followed by taxpayer compensation

          - may not ride, Transaero - as an example

          Quote: bovig
          gesheft with simultaneous withdrawal of capital from the country

          - well no I have a TV! there capital withdrawal...

          Transaero is not an example! Or do you not know cases of intentional bankruptcy in order to obtain a cash discount?
          I don't have a TV either, but the withdrawal of capital in this situation is immediate! Or does the Boeing company provide planes for free?)))) As humanitarian aid!))))) Although the "humanitarian aid" often has its own self-interest for the future ... Even if leasing (without a down payment), it means borrowing, to be paid in the future! And the terms of leasing (as a rule!) Imply a cumulative overpayment THREE TIMES! This is the practice. Study, check! This is the withdrawal of capital (you are investing in someone else's economy), even without taking into account the possible collusion about kickbacks ... Do you think why the domestic aircraft industry was ruined? Out of good intentions?))) Or from an excess of a sense of patriotism? Or do you believe that everyone who wants to block or slow down the revival of the Russian aviation industry has died out? If you do not believe in something, then this factor is not proof of the absence of intentions, or an event ... There are no fools in business and it is not done without profit, moreover, the state in these transactions - you yourself understand who ...
          1. Cat man null
            Cat man null 3 July 2016 14: 22
            0
            Uhhhhhh ... the flow of consciousness, however ... okay, in the case:

            Quote: bovig
            the withdrawal of capital in this situation is immediate!

            REMOVAL OF CAPITAL - export of capital to other countries state, enterprises, firms, individuals for the purpose of more favorable placement, use

            The term "capital outflow" implies that:

            - money goes outside the country (this is in this case)
            - money "works" outside the country, and is not returned to the country
            - but this - no ... Boeings are returning (instead of money), which begin to work inside the Russian Federation (since the company is registered in the Russian Federation)

            And where is the "capital withdrawal", (censorship) ?!
  15. vladim.gorbunow
    vladim.gorbunow 3 July 2016 10: 58
    +6
    Well, here is the Great. Medium and Small businesses. Consistent infringement of national interests from mass food poisoning, drowning of children to trade in national security.
  16. PValery53
    PValery53 3 July 2016 11: 11
    +7
    In the event of the purchase of Boeings and the onset of a critical military situation, the interception of control of the Boeings and their "unforeseen fall" with all our military contents is quite possible. It will be "offensive". The hacker has already reported about the interception of Boeing control.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 12: 00
      +2
      Than they gathered to intercept it - in a military situation, the Internet will not.
      1. figwam
        figwam 3 July 2016 12: 25
        +3
        Quote: Vadim237
        Than they gathered to intercept it - in a military situation, the Internet will not.

        They will bring down a companion.
      2. avia1991
        avia1991 3 July 2016 13: 12
        +3
        Quote: Vadim237
        in a military setting, there will be no Internet.

        Yeah ?! But how will all modern SMSs work - really on VHF? !!
        The Internet, just, will be - and all the warring parties will try to support it! For, if he "lays down", only Russians and ... papuasy will be able to continue the database! laughing Which we, like, are not enemies wink
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 12
          0
          And in addition to Internet connection and VHF, do we have others?
          1. Cat man null
            Cat man null 3 July 2016 15: 24
            -1
            Quote: Vadim237
            And in addition to Internet connection and VHF, do we have others?

            Telepathic fit? fellow

            In general, radio communication is not only VHF, as I was taught at school wink
            1. Vadim237
              Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 56
              0
              Fiber-optic communication is also available, VHF - 62-108 MHz, and the military frequency range is 29.50-31.75 MHz, there are laser communication channels - so there will be communication without the Internet.
          2. PValery53
            PValery53 3 July 2016 16: 15
            0
            My only invention (in the 90s) was on broadband.
      3. bovig
        bovig 3 July 2016 13: 31
        +2
        Quote: Vadim237
        Than they gathered to intercept it - in a military situation, the Internet will not.

        And what does the Internet have to do with it?))) Through communication systems (work via satellites), for example, a program is introduced that blocks the transition to a manual control system (for 1-2 minutes) and false parameters of state control systems and flight modes with blocking the rechecking algorithm (central computer hangs) ... The executive automatics brings the matter to the end - it starts to "rage" and puts the plane into uncontrollable mode ... And the analytics of information from the "black box" will lead you to the conclusion about the human factor ...
        1. Cat man null
          Cat man null 3 July 2016 13: 50
          0
          Quote: bovig
          Through communication systems (work via satellites), let's say a program is introduced that blocks the transition to a manual control system ...

          - wondrous fantasy
          - But communication system is in no way connected with the control system...
          - that's bad luck, right? wink

          And, yes - what kind of "often falling for strange circumstances" Boeings?

          That's honest - I was looking, but could not find ... request
          1. bovig
            bovig 3 July 2016 15: 53
            +2
            Quote: Cat Man Null
            Quote: bovig
            Through communication systems (work via satellites), let's say a program is introduced that blocks the transition to a manual control system ...

            - wondrous fantasy
            - But communication system is in no way connected with the control system...
            - that's bad luck, right? wink

            And, yes - what kind of "often falling for strange circumstances" Boeings?

            That's honest - I was looking, but could not find ... request

            So not only you did not find them!)))) Nobody found them! One example: a Malaysian Boeing with passengers fell somewhere in the ocean - to this day no information!)))) Nobody was found!))
            And the communication system that has no connection with the control system (if you mean the negotiations between the crew and the dispatcher) is not the only one! There are automatic communication systems, to which, in particular, the transponder belongs ... And then, why are you sure that it is on Boeing that there are no communication systems associated with the control system? Who can prevent a company from integrating into the control system the RECEIVER of the corresponding commands !? (just in case!))))) Such a tiny 110 nanometer chip with non-volatile memory! Your computer (specifically, Windows OS) has such a protection system - a “firewall”, but it does not guarantee 100% protection against the possibility of external control of your computer! And eavesdropping devices are built into batteries for cell phones (under a paper sticker) ... There are emulator programs that allow you to wiretap when the phone is off - you will not notice their work ... And there is also a lot that we, as ordinary people, do not know relies!
            1. Cat man null
              Cat man null 3 July 2016 16: 00
              -3
              Quote: bovig
              One example: a Malaysian Boeing with passengers fell somewhere in the ocean - to this day no information!

              - well, that’s not surprising ... The ocean, you know, it’s large and in some places very deep belay

              Quote: bovig
              There are automatic communication systems, which, in particular, include a transponder ...

              - the transponder also has no connection with the aircraft control system ...

              Quote: bovig
              why are you sure that there are no communication systems associated with the control system on the Boeing? Who can hinder companies to integrate corresponding commands into the RECEIVER control system !?

              - company reputation... Because if this "tiny 110 nanometer chip with non-volatile memory" (suddenly, by accident) is found on at least one of the Boeing, the manufacturing company will fly out of the market. Instantly and forever. Can you imagine the price of the question, at least approximately? wink

              Quote: bovig
              there is much more that we, as average people, are not supposed to know!

              - I repeat - get excited already and stop thumping ... yes
              1. bovig
                bovig 3 July 2016 18: 17
                +1
                Quote: Cat Man Null
                - the reputation of the company. Because if this "tiny 110 nanometer chip with non-volatile memory" (suddenly, by accident) is found on at least one of the Boeing, the manufacturing company will fly out of the market. Instantly and forever. Can you imagine the price of the question, at least approximately?

                Given the number of aircraft manufacturers in the world market that takes place, we can say that Boeing is almost a monopolist! And first you try to find, as an experiment, at least an extra current track on your computer’s motherboard (I assure you there are a lot of them!), And then swipe at 110 nanometers with a CHIP!)))) So, really, wondrous fantasies !!! laughing
                Then, the following - I did not state anything initially, but only voiced "rumors" based on a hypothetically possible technical performance ... The same fact with the Malaysian Boeing does not prove anything, but does not refute anything either! But the fact is that even supposedly the causes of the disaster that could occur with a technically sound aircraft are not known! And EVERYTHING can be attributed to the human factor! Even the crashed Boeing in Europe, which crashed into the mountain, allegedly under the control of a suicide pilot! It is true - he could not find other methods of suicide! How did this fact affect the manufacturer's "reputation" and what losses did he incur?
                I repeat, I am not proving anything, but for some reason you are trying to refute what is hypothetically possible and has the right to exist, as a version! Is it your obsessive goal in itself to assert your "truth"? lol
                1. Cat man null
                  Cat man null 3 July 2016 19: 55
                  -2
                  Quote: bovig
                  I did not state anything initially, but only voiced "rumors" based on a hypothetically possible

                  Quote: bovig
                  The same fact with the Malaysian Boeing does not prove anything, but it does not refute anything either!

                  Quote: bovig
                  I repeat, I do not prove anything, but for some reason you are trying to refute what is hypothetically possible and has the right to exist, as a version!

                  Brrrrr ...

                  I initially try to explain to you that you are juggling with terms whose meaning you do not understand.

                  That's all.

                  Keep your entire Spyrology horse. Has, damn it, the right to exist ... In your inflamed brain ... no further.

                  And wear a foil hat more often - they say it helps.

                  Dixi hi
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 10
          0
          The name of such a system do not tell me?
    2. Cat man null
      Cat man null 3 July 2016 14: 57
      +1
      Quote: PValery53
      The hacker has already reported about seizing control of a Boeing

      Quote: http://www.interfax.ru/world/442253
      US hacker Chris Roberts managed to hack into an airplane control system by connecting his laptop to an entertainment center on board the ship. He claims that he was able to command the aircraft engines to rise

      - people who allegedly "took over control" of Boeing, was inside this Boeing
  17. Tamerlan I
    Tamerlan I 3 July 2016 11: 11
    +8
    "Import substitution" is in full swing ...
  18. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 3 July 2016 11: 26
    +3
    All of us here were indignant (including myself) on the topic "what's going on?" , but the thought came: Shoigu, for an hour, wasn’t going to move large equipment quickly and far at a time in large quantities, as part of increasing mobility? Such a need may arise. Then all the inconsistencies are removed. The MO will not buy directly from Boeing.
    1. bovig
      bovig 3 July 2016 12: 14
      +3
      Quote: iliitch
      All of us here were indignant (including myself) on the topic "what's going on?" , but the thought came: Shoigu, for an hour, wasn’t going to move large equipment quickly and far at a time in large quantities, as part of increasing mobility? Such a need may arise. Then all the inconsistencies are removed. The MO will not buy directly from Boeing.

      Possible variant! This is the only thing that can justify such a deal! However, lately, the Boeing has often started to fall ... Sometimes under very strange circumstances ... Perhaps this is gossip, but there are rumors that their electronic control system suggests the possibility of interception ...
      1. Cat man null
        Cat man null 3 July 2016 12: 18
        +1
        Quote: bovig
        Recently, Boeing often began to fall ...

        - What, and give examples? belay
        - what is "often", by the way?

        Quote: bovig
        Sometimes in very strange circumstances

        - list of "circumstances" - to the studio wink

        Quote: bovig
        Maybe it's gossip but there are rumors...

        - aaaaaa ... slu-u-oooh ...
        - the phrase is valid!
        1. iliitchitch
          iliitchitch 3 July 2016 12: 32
          0
          As for the possible interception - the Frenchmen with mistrals were bent on the KA-52 and our "stuffing", why not continue here?
          The 747th in any performance is a thing, whatever you say, proven over the years.
        2. avia1991
          avia1991 3 July 2016 13: 08
          +1
          Quote: Cat Man Null
          list of "circumstances" - in the studio

          That is - we do not watch the news, and do not listen? .. In this case, it turns out that you are using rumors, Roman! Then why such a disregard for your favorite source:
          Quote: Cat Man Null
          aa-aah ... SLU u uuuh ...
          ... lol hi Greetings! ..
          My opinion is somewhat lower. Everything is said there, so don’t rush into the battle - I don’t give a reason! wink
          1. Cat man null
            Cat man null 3 July 2016 13: 32
            +1
            Quote: avia1991
            ... do not rush into battle - I do not give a reason!

            - no "fights", I am peaceful and pacific belay

            Quote: bovig
            lately Boeings often began to fall

            - the picture shows a list of disasters and incidents with the Boeing 747 over the past 5 years
            - I did not see there either "often fall" or "strange circumstances"
            - maybe I'm not looking there? request
  19. APASUS
    APASUS 3 July 2016 11: 31
    0
    There are also hundreds of options, only one is considered.
    The option with bankruptcy is also possible, but then Russia may well buy Ruslans, and if there are no options at all for the planes owned by our Moscow Region, the bankrupt is obliged to return all the leased equipment.
    Perhaps someone on the 747-8 Freighter took a chance on the government structures, they didn’t buy directly because of the sanctions or the specific nature of the possible cargo.
    with a total take-off weight of 447 tons, its total carrying capacity will be 140 tons, and the flight range is 8130 km.

    Just for use on the flight Moscow - Siberia.
    So the material is quite simplified.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 12: 14
      -1
      AirBridgeCargo Airlines has been operating Boeings in its fleet of 17 such aircraft for a long time and the fact that it acquires another 20 of these aircraft only indicates that the company intends to expand its services.
  20. black1boby
    black1boby 3 July 2016 11: 41
    -1
    Again everything has been done with the filing of the pro-American part of the Russian government at the head of D.A.
    I wish the speedy victory of the patriots at the head of V.V.P.
    1. populist
      populist 3 July 2016 12: 32
      +3
      black1boby

      Again everything has been done with the filing of the pro-American part of the Russian government at the head of D.A.
      I wish the speedy victory of the patriots at the head of V.V.P.

      Fighting Nanai Boys.
  21. avia1991
    avia1991 3 July 2016 13: 02
    +2
    why the Boeing 747-8 is not saved by American shipping companies, or at least some Asian ones. The last major order for the 747-8F (...) dates back to the distant 2007. Maybe they better calculated the risks than the Russians?
    Or the management took a good pullback, wanting to bankrupt the company, and themselves - to disappear. And push all the problems either to the state or to hired managers.
    By the way, regarding
    a scheme was invented at the time: initially, the An-124 military was transferred to civilian operators, including the Volga-Dnepr, so that the cars did not stand idle and earn money,
    : the transferred machines did not just earn money - they were ruthlessly operated, with extremely poor quality maintenance - for the owners who arrived there from the command of the BTA and the Air Force, soon after the collapse of the Union, were sorry to spend an extra penny on safety! So by air they
    in which case to its own Ministry of Defense.
    would not have helped then! Here is to hire military aircraft for "your" orders, and for a penny - that's fine ..
    I don’t know what the owners of Volga-Dnepr are breathing with today .. But I still hope that this is not the case when the goal is bankruptcy. Perhaps the state, using a private company, is expanding its fleet of heavy cargo planes, to enable rapid response on a larger scale to possible military threats. And with the Boeing, given the current situation, agreeing is easier and cheaper.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 18
      0
      What is the point of bankrupting a company that has large orders for transportation, a large stable customer base and earns great?
  22. tomket
    tomket 3 July 2016 14: 08
    +1
    In general, everything is conveyed in the article. and the degree of influence (or rather the ability to send GDP far and away. with its projects to support the aviation industry) and the commitment of airlines to our technology (they are even ready to take an outdated 747, just not ours) and the impossibility of the current aviation industry, to master something larger than a "superjet" and MS-21. In short, our government is on the right course.
  23. Ros 56
    Ros 56 3 July 2016 14: 58
    -2
    To live with wolves, howl like a wolf. For various proven reasons, deprive these wise men of the right to carry out transportation, bring them to bankruptcy and redeem a controlling stake in favor of the state. Other options are possible. But the company, or rather its leadership, must be very rigidly put or put in place. The desire and brains would be shorter, and it is quite possible to turn the situation in the direction necessary for the state. But the nagging liberals do not care and grind. State security is most important, otherwise why the whole garden is expensive.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 15: 31
      0
      "For various proven reasons, to deprive these clever people of the right to carry out transportation, bring to bankruptcy and buy out a controlling stake in favor of the state" - This is a raider seizure, for this there is an article in the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation - the state cannot interfere in the affairs of private companies, only law enforcement agencies can and then by court decision, if only the guilt of illegal actions is proven, and the purchase of foreign aircraft or equipment, for their own grandmother, is not illegal, that buying this right of the company.
      1. Ros 56
        Ros 56 4 July 2016 05: 31
        0
        Read the first four words of your comment once again, this implies a court decision and everything else. It seems to read, but not read. And once again I say, state security comes first, under any circumstances. hi
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 4 July 2016 09: 59
          0
          "And I say again, state security comes first, under any circumstances." - And where does a private transport company buy planes for their own money?
    2. Al1977
      Al1977 5 July 2016 12: 19
      0
      Quote: Ros 56
      For various proven reasons, deprive these wise men of the right to carry out transportation, bring them to bankruptcy and redeem a controlling stake in favor of the state

      And what to do with Aeroflot? What kind of planes are there?))))
      You are funny, so do not minus)))
  24. samoletil18
    samoletil18 3 July 2016 15: 14
    +1
    Our "partners" are very concerned about the checks for combat readiness. And they will provide us no matter how many boards with a carrying capacity of up to 140 tons? "Dobrolet" with Boeing-737 has already landed in 2014.
  25. borys
    borys 3 July 2016 16: 23
    +1
    This site passed information - a total of 54 (or 55) "Rus-
    lans. "From the article it follows that today there are about 20. There is a simple
    the question is - where are three dozen more? Following him, if they have not yet been surrendered to
    scrap metal, why not restore them to flight condition? Clear,
    that it will be very difficult, but it will give Russian work and income
    enterprises and Russian workers and engineers.
  26. 16112014nk
    16112014nk 3 July 2016 17: 20
    -2
    In addition to airplanes, you can also buy cello for music schools with money transferred to offshore. This is the goal, and the planes are a cover for eyes aversion!
  27. Phosgene
    Phosgene 3 July 2016 18: 07
    +1
    This is fraud, the company's management is on trial, Ruslans confiscate and transfer to the Russian Air Force
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 18: 55
      -1
      "This is a fraud" -Do you have solid evidence of fraud not in articles on the Internet, but on papers with seals?
  28. Vikmay16
    Vikmay16 3 July 2016 19: 27
    0
    Some kind of wrong sanctions or anti-sanctions. It is necessary to support domestic manufacturers!
  29. Skifotavr
    Skifotavr 3 July 2016 21: 23
    +1
    Western aircraft building giants have a so-called generous financial reward for those who have decided to purchase their products, in other words, rollback. Therefore, it is very likely that the owners of this company decided, for some reason, to make the planned bankruptcy of their company, simultaneously putting the same remuneration in their pocket, and traditionally throw their ordinary workers, passengers and the state.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 3 July 2016 22: 00
      0
      This company has no relation to passengers and the state - all of its funds are company revenues.
  30. antivirus
    antivirus 3 July 2016 21: 48
    0
    In "Assess" Solovyov: We must give as much as they ask.
    For the lifting of sanctions, For world peace. "They will pay an unacceptable price for the annexation of Crimea."
    We pay.
  31. pm.sv.3691
    pm.sv.3691 3 July 2016 23: 28
    0
    Whoever needs to pay! What will happen next is known to the customer. but it’s not possible to calculate the risks, you can only plan and implement, and the organizer will roll back.
  32. 13elf
    13elf 4 July 2016 06: 30
    +1
    Well, everything lies on the surface: Take 747 to carry the sausage, and since you are almost bankrupt, you will give it to strategic Ruslans. And Russia will not be able to carry what it needs and where it is needed. For this, during the time of Stalin, half of the company would have been cut out. AND CORRECTLY WOULD DO !! And where is the FSB looking ??? We wait while am merge the remains of the motherland ?????? am
  33. drunkram
    drunkram 4 July 2016 06: 39
    +1
    The article is utter nonsense. Starting from the comparison of the An-124 and the 747 citizen - is it just ridiculous, the number of An-124 is 10 pieces? headquarters? their 26
  34. Evil 55
    Evil 55 4 July 2016 07: 34
    -1
    The fact that the next "advanced" management is laying a mine under the VTA is unambiguous .. And while the soil is being probed, the possibility is being checked and mechanisms are being prepared to cause maximum damage to Russia ..
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 4 July 2016 10: 01
      -1
      "The fact that the next" advanced "management is laying a mine under the BTA is unambiguous." This is how?
  35. Bulrumeb
    Bulrumeb 4 July 2016 09: 43
    -1
    attention must be paid to an extremely risky deal, the possible consequences of which may be not only the bankruptcy of a large Russian company, but also the loss of operational mobility of our Armed Forces.

    it looks like the management of Volga-Dnepr decided to sell their homeland for good
  36. maks1803
    maks1803 4 July 2016 10: 56
    +1
    Bastards and traitors - that's what it's called. For this you need to shoot.
    1. Al1977
      Al1977 5 July 2016 12: 14
      0
      Quote: maks1803
      Bastards and traitors - that's what it's called. For this you need to shoot.

      Deputies of the State Duma, Federation Council and other officials who chose a Mercedes, and not the Volga - are also against the wall ... By the way .. what kind of car does the president have?
      And not a modest question at all .. what brand of car do you have? Probably the friendly country of China ??
  37. Backfire
    Backfire 4 July 2016 16: 26
    0
    I don’t understand why you can’t buy our Ruslans, at the same time people will have work and taxes to the treasury!
    1. Al1977
      Al1977 5 July 2016 12: 16
      0
      Quote: Beckfire
      I don’t understand why you can’t buy our Ruslans, at the same time people will have work and taxes to the treasury!

      Who are you talking to? Create a company and buy. Why not, everything is possible.
      You can even build a completely new plane, even more people will be involved.
  38. Are
    Are 4 July 2016 16: 42
    0
    Quote: bulvas
    There may be a version that, on the contrary,

    Is Russia increasing its fleet of transport aircraft in this way?

    Increases its fleet and becomes dependent (spare parts, repairs, etc.) for decades from a manufacturer from an "unfriendly" country ??? How should you hate your country? Something is wrong at the conservatory ... fool
  39. polkovnik manuch
    polkovnik manuch 4 July 2016 21: 43
    0
    Since we have to wait a long time for our cars, we need to buy Boeings, "Ruslans" just in case (and there are different cases!) From the property of "Volga -..." must be taken, now we cannot take risks, the "partners" are not childish.
  40. antivirus
    antivirus 5 July 2016 10: 43
    0
    Quote: antivirus
    In "Assess" Solovyov: We must give as much as they ask.
    For the lifting of sanctions, For world peace. "They will pay an unacceptable price for the annexation of Crimea."
    We pay.

    Buy and resell in 10 years.
    refuse leasing and now finance in small volumes and slowly its production.