Military Review

New NATO tank gun: desired and realities

214
New NATO tank gun: desired and realities



German developers claim that tank the L / 51 cannon will be able to stop the Russian T-14 Armata tank. Is it so?

The eternal problem of “projectile against armor” reiterated itself at the end of last week. At the exhibition of weapons "Eurosatory-2016" (13-17 June), the German concern Rheinmetall Defense showed a prototype of the new NATO tank gun. The manufacturer claims that the power of the gun has been increased by 10% compared to that of the German Leopard-2 tank and will be able to withstand the latest Russian T-14 tank Armata.

The demonstration of such a cannon and the excitement raised around it is more evidence of the concern of the Western military about our new tank. However, the reasons are not only this. But first about what is known about the gun, the tank and the possible result - who wins.

Little is known about the new gun, and that is from the article in the exhibition issue of Jane's Defense Weekly. An L / 51 cannon with a 130-mm caliber and a total (barrel) weight of at least 3 (1,4) is designed to fight with our T-14 tank and can be installed on the Leopard-2А5, Leopard-2А6 tank and for the promising Franco -German tank MGCS. To increase armor penetration at 10%, new, longer and heavier projectiles have been developed for the cannon - sub-caliber armor-piercing with a feathered core and a separating pallet, as well as high-explosive fragmentation with remote blasting. Practical test shooting guns have not yet been. It is reported that the designers decided to leave the download in L / 51 manual. That's all for now.

And what about the "Armata"?

As Oleg Bochkarev, deputy chairman of the board of the Military Industrial Commission (MIC), noted, the Armata surpasses the main battle tanks of other countries in a number of indicators.

The first is the high security of the crew. It is provided by the placement of people in an armored capsule, as well as systems of active, dynamic and passive protection. At the teachings of T-14 was never amazed. Complicates the defeat of the tank and its truncated silhouette, which in the heat of battle must still get. Well, if hit, then the projectile, in addition to the protection systems, has to overcome highly effective combined multi-layer armor (44С-св-Ш, SRI "Steel"). By the way, the “cake” of metal, ceramics and composite materials on 15% reduces the total weight of the tank's armor protection while maintaining the required armor penetration.

The smooth-bore 125-mm gun 2А82 “Armata” also has high destructive capabilities. It can shoot both conventional and guided projectiles of the Krasnopol type. To make it clear what was going on, “Krasnopol” at demonstration firing in Abu Dhabi hit a moving tank at a distance of 12 000 m. In addition, a projectile was created that pierces steel homogeneous armor 4700-850 mm at a distance of 1000 m. According to Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin, "we have a projectile burning a steel meter, we will bet on Armata." Projectiles for “Almaty” are made from 2013 year and enter the army.

Another feature is the ability to quickly replace the factory 120-mm on the 152-mm 2-83 gun with automatic loader, which was already tested at the end of 90-x and the beginning of 2000-s. According to well-known experts in the field of armored vehicles, Viktor Murakhovsky, Sergey Suvorov, Victor Baranets and others, according to general indicators, this gun has no equal today, and its opponents are unlikely to appear in the near future. Against its armor penetration 1024 mm at a distance of at least 5100 m will not stand any of the currently existing foreign tanks. The lack of such a gun in service today is explained by the fact that the standard gun "Armata" today solves all the necessary tasks. But “when the time comes, and there will be a real need for such an instrument to be installed, 2А83 will be returned,” says Suvorov.

And one more property of "Armata" is its mobility. According to this most important indicator for combat conditions, the Russian tank surpasses Western competitors or is not inferior to them. Diesel engine power 1400-1600 hp with an automatic transmission, it provides tank movement at speeds up to 80 (70) km / h on a highway (rough terrain).



The reason for the loud announcement

The reason for the emergence of a new German cannon and loud statements about its so far not really confirmed data is trivial - the competition and the desire to grab a piece from the gun "pie", but more. In the current conditions of total anti-Russian hysteria and intimidation of western people with a threat from the “East”, Western industrialists have a good time to score points with such statements.

Judging the effectiveness of the new German cannon in the fight against "Armata" on the booklet is an absurdity. According to political analyst and military expert Vladimir Karyakin, the characteristics weaponsspecified in the brochures should never be taken for granted.

On the other hand, does the same Germany, France and other NATO countries need such a gun? In the context of reducing the work on the creation of new tanks and the modernization of existing ones, the answer is rather negative than positive. So it turns out that all this demonstration hype is designed for those who already have Leopards, Leclercs and Abrams. Sly German manufacturers are counting on the sly to push their gun through to those who are very afraid of the Russian threat.

The reason is also that the 120-mm smoothbore guns of the Rheinmetall company use the majority, except for the Russian and Chinese, manufacturers of tanks. So it turns out that the Germans will do with their gun if they don't buy it?

The fact that the Germans were clearly in a hurry to declare the possibility of their gun fighting Armata is nothing more than a marketing ploy. This is obvious, especially for professionals. Without specific data of practical shooting of the gun installed on the tank, it is hardly worth taking these and similar statements seriously. So far there is no convincing evidence of the ability of the new cannon to resist the Armata, but there are clear flaws. For example, the same lack of an automatic loader, which will undoubtedly reduce the rate of fire of the gun. There is no data on the compatibility of the new gun with the existing firing control systems, in particular, the gun stabilizer. And without it, there will be no high accuracy of shooting.

But even if they pass the tests, there will be no special faith in them. It is no secret that Western manufacturers often test their products in benign conditions to obtain the “desired” result. A very recent example is the Italian Iveco armored car called the Lynx. On comparative trials with our "Tiger" in Nizhny Tagil machine hopelessly stuck. Of course, the drivers of the “Lynx” refused help from the “Tiger”. The “Lynx” anti-mine capabilities did not fully respond as voiced in the booklets. The result is known: our military rejected the Italian in favor of their Russian car.

However, such facts do not seem to bother German and other European marketers. Even the fact that "Armata", like T-90, is equipped with effective means of protection. Do not take into account the capabilities of the enemy, in this case to protect, a great self-confidence on the part of the German specialists, who have always been distinguished by their pragmatism and thoroughness.

As a result

In general, it turns out that the German engineers gave not so much a serious answer to the Russian technology as they decided to “warm their hands” on the artificial fear of the Russian T-90 and T-14. It is quite possible that at the next such event Russia could show “Armata” with a 152 caliber millimeter cannon. And then what? Do they have the courage to come together in comparative competitions and prove their case? It is doubtful.
Author:
Originator:
http://rusplt.ru/sdelano-russkimi/tankovaya-pushka-nato-armata-26747.html
214 comments
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  1. st25310
    st25310 29 June 2016 18: 25
    +31
    Even before the collapse of the Union, the tank caliber 140mm was adopted in NATO countries. Those who wish can easily find the information on the samples of tank guns made and tested. Further development of the direction was frozen due to excessive redundancy and inexpediency of the transition to a new caliber (the Union fell apart, there was no one to fight, it was full of 120mm ammunition and guns for this caliber).
    The development of 130 mm looks like a compromise between the already obsolete 120mm and the redundant 140mm.
    In caliber 120 mm.
    The German feathered AP-projectile with a detachable pallet DM-53 (LKE II) (adopted by the 1997 year), its modification DM-53A1 and the further development of DM 63 in terms of armor penetration (when firing from L55) - 810 mm / 2km. American BPS M-829A2 - 720mm / 2km, M-829A3 - over 930mm / 2km.
    At this level, Russia has "Slate-1", "Slate-2", "Vacuum-1" and "Vacuum-2" (2005). But the troops do not even have "Lead" (1991), "Lekalo (1997)", "Lead-1 (2002)" and "Lead-2 (2002)".
    The ammunition manufacturers of the NATO countries have the opportunity to shove funding for the development (in principle, they already have) and the production of new ammunition in the caliber 120mm with a larger armor penetration (at the 1100 level - 1300mm / 2 km).
    By 2A82. The increase in power is simply not given. As before (before the adoption of phlegmatized cartridges 12,7) for the "Cliff" there were three barrels in the kit, and now, for a guaranteed total shot of 750 shots, the 2A82 also requires three barrels. One under-chromed barrel barely pulls out 250 shots to the peak.
    1. Maksus
      Maksus 29 June 2016 18: 28
      +21
      To create a cannon and to create a cannon with shells of all stripes is a bit different in time and cost. Our 125 mm was made for a long time. And, either the Germans also showed a long backlog (which is strange, given the lack of rumors), or simply in a hurry to announce that. But their engineers are intelligent, competent and tank-experienced, not without reason the Leopard-2 is the best NATO tank. Will watch.
      1. Sharapov
        Sharapov 29 June 2016 19: 22
        +29
        If the FRG armor-piercing projectile now weighs 28 kg, the new caliber will be under 35, the high-explosive fragmentation shell - generally 45 - if unitary loading.

        I wonder how they will charge? Automatically, or in the states of the Negro will be discharged?
        In a cramped tank, turning such a heavy elongated projectile is a nightmare.
        1. Dart2027
          Dart2027 29 June 2016 20: 59
          +3
          Quote: Sharapov
          Automatically, or in the states of the Negro will be discharged?

          The article says that manually:
          It is reported that the designers decided to leave the load in L / 51 manually.
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. Sharapov
            Sharapov 30 June 2016 07: 14
            +1
            Yes, by the way, I agree.

            If they are going to just change the cannon on old tanks (because we are not talking about creating a new tank), I’m sure it’s impossible to attach an automatic loader to the old tank.
        2. Foxmara
          Foxmara 1 July 2016 16: 53
          0
          Quote: Sharapov
          I wonder how they will charge? Automatically, or in the states of the Negro will be discharged?

          Negroes, Young Europeans, it makes no difference, you just tell them that they are against the Russians ... and they will lift 50 kg, even if they dug up the Black Sea?
      2. Victor N.
        Victor N. 29 June 2016 19: 22
        .
        Most importantly, the NATO OBPS easily overcome the Russian DZ. That is why in NATO countries prefer composite armor.
        1. Victor N.
          Victor N. 29 June 2016 19: 27
          +3
          Text for comment. The site does not miss photos without comments.
          1. just exp
            just exp 30 June 2016 03: 12
            +16
            only the latest versions of shells can get around the relic, everything older than the relic does not work on them.
            here is an interview with an American tanker working at a proving ground in the states and experiencing new BOPs and the like
            According to the standard, it is claimed that M829A2 pierces Contact-5 "

            Well, easier said than done. Pin-5 may reflect the M829A1 and DM-53. And the difference between A1 and A2 is more on paper than in real life. In fact, the DM-53 is even better than the M829A2.
            M829A3 is generally a different fish. This is APFSDS.
            But he very much wears the gun barrel.
            And what do the Russians do to combat the new threats - they are making a new generation of remote sensing systems, better than Contact-5.
            Unfortunately, М829А2 can be completely destroyed by DZ contact-5, as well as DM-53, especially uranium shells.

            I generally trust Russian DZ, because saw the test results. All I want to say if the Iraqis had DZ contact (not 5) on the T-72s in the Gulf War, then the battles would be fought at much closer distances and the losses of the T-72 would be minimal.
            If the Iraqis had T-80UM1 with contact-5 (but the ammunition is as shitty as 3BM12, 3BM15), then the United States would have won, but with losses. Well, and if they were given 3BM42, the T-80 would have won easily.
            In general, M829A1 can break contact-5 in 1 out of 5. This is alarming.
            M829A2 is also not good enough, he is not able to defeat contact-5 every time. This is the reason why the US is developing A3.
            I want to remind once again that contact-5 not only deflects the projectile, but also destroys it, and the deviation can reach 30 degrees. I tell you, DZ works.
            1. voyaka uh
              voyaka uh 30 June 2016 08: 47
              +7
              The theoretical dispute will apparently be resolved in the near future.
              time. In Syria, 2 pieces of T-90 were captured by militants.
              They will certainly try to be transported to the United States.
              They’ll shoot at them at the firing range and check their OBPS,
              and DZ.
              1. just exp
                just exp 30 June 2016 11: 20
                +3
                and what new things will they learn about DZ which is 30 years old and which they tested 20 years ago in practice?
              2. Zaurbek
                Zaurbek 30 June 2016 13: 34
                +4
                Why is it so difficult, the T-90 has been exported for a long time. "On the sly" and India can sell, there is such a quantity that no one will control. And you can shoot Leo, if it gets punched, then the T-90 will beat him. It makes sense to capture only the new DZ and KAZ, which are not on the T-90.
              3. Lex.
                Lex. 1 July 2016 09: 39
                +7
                . In Syria, 2 pieces of T-90 were captured by militants.
                They will certainly try to be transported to the United States.
                They’ll shoot at them at the firing range and check their OBPS,
                and DZ.
                I don’t think that they captured the T-90 in Syria, the Americans have long known the T-90, they are in service with India, Algeria, Azerbaijan, they probably shared a secret how Morocco passed the Tunguska to the Americans for testing
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. voyaka uh
              voyaka uh 30 June 2016 09: 05
              +1
              “M829A2 is not good enough either, it is not capable of defeating Contact-5 every time.
              This is the reason why the USA is developing the A3. "////

              No connection. The Americans are developing an A3 (KAZ) against ATGMs.
              KAZ OBPS can’t intercept - they fly too fast.

              And in what, interestingly, way Contact-5 was tested against American
              Uranium OBPS, if Russia doesn’t have them? And Russian tungsten is shorter
              American almost 30 cm.
              What shot at Contact?
              1. just exp
                just exp 30 June 2016 11: 23
                +5
                1 AZ is not two letters (letter A and letter Z), but a modification of BOPS consisting of the letter A and the number 3 (three), and it has nothing to do with KAZ.
                2 Afghanit works on BOPS.
                3 Better ask the Americans where they got the American shells from. otherwise the Americans tested them in America, not the Russians in Russia.
                I wrote there for a reason
                here is an interview with American a tanker working at a proving ground in the states and experiencing new BOPS and the like
            4. The comment was deleted.
        2. Victor N.
          Victor N. 29 June 2016 19: 28
          .
          Text for comment. The site does not miss photos without comments.
          1. Bramb
            Bramb 29 June 2016 19: 32
            +51
            Victor. if you knew how far we have come in creating composites, and that the armor in the T-14 is not at all homogeneous ... However, consider that everything is bad with us.)))
            what is your saying there? Is the economy in shreds? ))))
            1. Vadim237
              Vadim237 29 June 2016 22: 11
              .
              Unfortunately, this new 44C-Sv-Sh armor with a tensile strength of 2048 MPa, even with a thickness of 1000 millimeters, will be guaranteed to be pierced by a core weighing 10 kilograms of tungsten flying at a speed of 2000 meters per second - the new German 130 mm gun will most likely have the latest performance .
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 29 June 2016 22: 43
                -2
                Modeling and calculation show everything.
                1. just exp
                  just exp 30 June 2016 03: 17
                  0
                  Not everyone .
                  1. Vadim237
                    Vadim237 30 June 2016 10: 28
                    -4
                    In technical terms, that's all.
                    1. just exp
                      just exp 30 June 2016 11: 54
                      +2
                      why then the test? all everything has already been calculated and they will not learn anything new.
                      1. Vadim237
                        Vadim237 30 June 2016 19: 36
                        0
                        Practice consolidates the calculations and models, the time will come and they will devote less time to the tests in reality, since the manufactured product will fully comply with the task of reliability and wear resistance - the improvement of CAD and modeling programs continues.
                      2. just exp
                        just exp 1 July 2016 03: 09
                        +4
                        for some reason, every year the tests last longer and longer, probably computers age over time and become slower.
            2. just exp
              just exp 30 June 2016 03: 16
              0
              1 this newest 44C-sv-sh armor with a tensile strength of 2048 MPa can be made in the form of several layers.
              how to explain to you, this is a traditional tradition starting with the T-64.
              In addition, according to BPSs, not only VDZ, but also KAZ works for Almaty.
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 30 June 2016 10: 00
                0
                The Amat tank has no means to intercept OBPS.
                1. just exp
                  just exp 30 June 2016 11: 25
                  +3
                  if I listen to you, then I will believe that Almaty and have no tracks.
                  Afghanite works on targets at speeds up to 1800 m / s.
                  1. Cat man null
                    Cat man null 30 June 2016 11: 28
                    +5
                    Quote: just EXPL
                    if I listen to you, then I will believe that Almaty and have no tracks.
                    Afghanite works on targets at speeds up to 1800 m / s.

                    Do not argue with Vadim. He is not afraid of nuclear war, but you are talking about some kind of KAZ ... belay
                    1. just exp
                      just exp 30 June 2016 11: 51
                      +2
                      this one is still relatively sane, there are worse passengers.
                    2. Come on
                      Come on 1 July 2016 14: 30
                      -1
                      Distributing shortcuts, who is relatively sane, who is not, and here you tell stories about KAZ Afghanit, about the interception of OBPS flying up to 1800m / s. Probably silly to ask about sources. It would be generally interesting for me to see at least the interception of an RPG7 grenade. After all, if they had shown, then what, did they discover some secret? No one asks how the system is made. There is a video of the same Drozd, Arena, Trophy, ADS. After all, they claim some supercharacteristics, the video would show how Armata goes, bang ATGM, or RPG, and she is plim-plim, Agfanit, bang, smoke, Armata goes on without damage .. that's all. This would not only strengthen the faith in defense in the country, but the adversary would also say wow! Or is it such a psychological trick so that the enemy goes crazy thinking whether Afghanistan is working, or not working? Everyone believed Chemezov about serial production .., holy simplicity.
                2. Vadim237
                  Vadim237 30 June 2016 19: 22
                  +2
                  "Afghanit works on targets at speeds up to 1800 m / s" - The designers did not say this, but they talked about four elements of protection: armor, dynamic protection, aerosol shots - an active protection complex and an electronic warfare system - not a word about any intercept missiles it was - my belief that there are no such missiles on the tank is explained by the fact that it is impossible to shoot down the BOPS with shrapnel and even get into the body of the core, if it were real, a similar principle would be applied in Drozda, and those guides that are in the lower part of the Armata tower -if this KAZ for interception will have low efficiency, since the striking elements will scatter 360 degrees from the axis of the projectile and only in the interval of 20 degrees will the striking elements hit the intercepted projectile, in this regard, the Arena principle will be much more effective where all the striking elements are directed on the incoming projectile.
                  1. just exp
                    just exp 1 July 2016 03: 10
                    0
                    my belief

                    gold words.
                    and for those who are interested for a long time infa slipped that Afghanistan is based on shock cores.
              2. NEXUS
                NEXUS 30 June 2016 14: 25
                +3
                Quote: Vadim237
                The Amat tank has no means to intercept OBPS.

                Excuse me, but where do the "fireballs" come from? Not from World of Tanks by the case? laughing
          2. goose
            goose 1 July 2016 10: 13
            +5
            Quote: Vadim237
            at a speed of 2000 meters per second

            How much how much? 2000?
            Yes, he doesn’t fly so much at the edge of the trunk, but at a distance of 2 km, give him Allah to have more than 1300 m / s.
            I don’t like comparisons with sub-caliber people who shoot at a distance of 2 km, because they have a ballistic deviation of a direct shot of the order of 1 m vertically. Where will he go? One Buddha knows. And no SLA will help. Real shooting in the desert in Iraq showed an accuracy of less than 50% at ranges of 2-2,5 km, despite the fact that they took place almost in firing conditions due to the fact that the enemy’s night devices had a maximum range of about 800m.
            1. Come on
              Come on 1 July 2016 14: 37
              -2
              C'mon, 2,5km)) LMS Leo2 up to 4km in auto mode takes targets and the probability of hitting the first shot is higher than 99%, the second will be for sure. With 4km manually, goals are set. But this is Leo2A6, now with models A7 and PSO, the FCS has even better characteristics.
              1. just exp
                just exp 1 July 2016 18: 05
                +1
                tales of the Viennese forest.
                1. Come on
                  Come on 1 July 2016 20: 22
                  0
                  Well, of course, fairy tales. Even on the internet I accidentally stumbled upon a video from the training ground, where the commander's order to fire is clearly visible, in that case at 3300m. In Israel, they train even further. But this is exactly what is kept secret. Although there is a lot of open data, and there are a lot of leaks from the "closed" ones.
      3. ICT
        ICT 29 June 2016 20: 25
        +3
        Quote: Victor N.
        The site does not miss photos without comments.


        if the photo is not on your computer, then after the first comment you want to change and add the photo as much as you need
      4. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 10: 06
        -5
        Pearls from sofa experts:

        Quote: just explo
        this newest armor 44S-sv-Sh with tensile strength 2048 MPa can be made in the form of several layers.


        laughing Is it like a double or triple armored corps from this armor or what? And how much will he weigh? Can a tank even move around?

        Quote: just explo
        In addition, according to BPSs, not only VDZ, but also KAZ works for Almaty.


        laughing First, study why the KDZ and KAZ are INTENDED. Lapads.

        Quote: just explo
        NATO creates BOPS that can bypass DZ


        Mega Pearl laughing I have no words. Knowledge of the materiel - too.

        BOPS - do not care if the KDZ tank is installed or not. This is a simple high-strength alloy ingot that penetrates armor (or a composite armor package) - AT THE ACCOUNT OF ITS HIGH KINETIC ENERGY! Just like a dowel pierces concrete. By the same principle.

        KDZ is designed to protect the tank - ONLY FROM CUMULATIVE AMMUNITION!

        KAZ is designed to protect the tank - ONLY FROM CONTROLLED CUMULATIVE AMMUNITION!

        From BOPS, a tank can be protected only by good multilayer (composite) armor. And that is not always the case.

        In the competition of armor and projectile at the current moment by a wide margin - the projectile wins!

        Learn mat.chast - losers. laughing
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 30 June 2016 10: 46
          -5
          There is one solution that can protect the tank from OBPS, and from multi-component and high-speed over 2000 meters per second, though this protection kit will weigh about 6 tons, it works as a multi-layer obstacle for cumulative shells, and against OBPS as a dynamic defense, at the time of passage of the core through a plate, it acts on it with its kinetic energy, this protection can protect even from new kinetic missiles, as an example, weighing 40 kilograms and a speed of 1800 meters per second.
        2. Cat man null
          Cat man null 30 June 2016 11: 39
          +9
          Quote: wanderer_032
          BOPS - do not care if the KDZ tank is installed or not. This is a simple high-strength alloy ingot that penetrates armor (or a composite armor package) - AT THE ACCOUNT OF ITS HIGH KINETIC ENERGY! Just like a dowel pierces concrete. By the same principle

          - it's true

          Quote: wanderer_032
          KDZ is designed to protect the tank - ONLY against cumulative ammunition

          - this is bullshit. Reject the "nail" you are driving into the wall by five degrees from the perpendicular. Admire the result wink
          - this is exactly (to divert towards BOPS) and it is capable of making remote sensing. And she does it yes

          Quote: wanderer_032
          KAZ is designed to protect the tank - ONLY FROM CONTROLLED CUMULATIVE AMMUNITION!

          - that's bullshit. No further comments.

          Quote: wanderer_032
          Learn the mathematical part

          - this is for you
          - materiel is usually written together. A trifle, of course, but in the horse text of your message - IMHO is very significant laughing
          1. wanderer_032
            wanderer_032 30 June 2016 14: 50
            -1
            Quote: Cat Man Null
            materiel is usually written together


            Do losers exactly. laughing

            Mat. part is a reduction. From full expression - the material part. wink
            1. Cat man null
              Cat man null 30 June 2016 15: 08
              +10
              Quote: wanderer_032
              Mat. part is a reduction. From full expression - the material part

              - diagnosis: "did not serve in the Soviet Army"
              - still playing tanks
              - "knowledge" - exclusively from Google

              Somehow yes
              1. wanderer_032
                wanderer_032 30 June 2016 15: 12
                -5
                Quote: Cat Man Null
                - diagnosis: "did not serve in the Soviet Army"
                - still playing tanks
                - "knowledge" - exclusively from Google

                Somehow


                An excellent description of your abilities and your education in the field of armored vehicles. I agree.
                1. Cat man null
                  Cat man null 30 June 2016 15: 25
                  +4
                  Quote: wanderer_032
                  An excellent description of your abilities and your education in the field of armored vehicles. I agree

                  - no, it was for you laughing
                  - I don’t play tanks - I played enough in due time. In kindergarten laughing Where big .. um .. noses, and tanks and machine guns are all real laughing

                  Tricky question:

                  - what is a hard stopper?
                  - where is his regular place in the tank?

                  And? wink
                  1. just exp
                    just exp 30 June 2016 15: 40
                    +3
                    You should be careful with him. Otherwise the smell of a burnt fart will go all over the country.
                  2. Cat man null
                    Cat man null 30 June 2016 15: 48
                    +1
                    Quote: just explo
                    Would you be careful with him

                    Yes I, in general, tenderly enough .. funny guy just, nothing personal request
                  3. wanderer_032
                    wanderer_032 30 June 2016 16: 41
                    -4
                    Quote: just EXPL
                    all over the country the smell of burnt fart will go.


                    So far, only yours is coming. laughing Minuses you probably threw? laughing
                2. wanderer_032
                  wanderer_032 30 June 2016 16: 40
                  -3
                  Quote: Cat Man Null
                  - I don’t play tanks - I played enough in due time. In kindergarten


                  Well, of course. Now it has grown - to the level of the 1 class of elementary school. laughing
                3. Cat man null
                  Cat man null 30 June 2016 17: 31
                  +3
                  Quote: wanderer_032
                  Quote: Cat Man Null
                  - I don’t play tanks - I played enough in due time. In kindergarten

                  Well, of course. Now it has grown - to the level of the 1 class of elementary school. laughing

                  But you shouldn’t be rude. I do not like negative
                4. wanderer_032
                  wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 15
                  0
                  Quote: Cat Man Null
                  But you shouldn’t be rude. I do not like


                  What is hello, so is the answer. Who first began to be rude? wink
            2. wanderer_032
              wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 30
              +1
              Quote: Cat Man Null
              - what is a hard stopper?


              In fact - a rod with two holes at the ends, which stops the gun from vertical movement. One side clings to the breech of the gun in a special eye through which a finger is inserted, and a cotter pin is inserted into the finger. The other end is behind the ceiling of the tower. Through the same eye in the ceiling of the tower. In which a finger is also inserted and splinted.


              Quote: Cat Man Null
              - where is his regular place in the tank?


              Depends on the model of the tank.


              Quote: Cat Man Null
              And?


              Is your curiosity satisfied?
    2. wanderer_032
      wanderer_032 30 June 2016 15: 06
      -3
      Quote: Cat Man Null
      - this is exactly (to divert towards BOPS) and it is capable of making remote sensing.


      When cumulative ammunition gets into the armor, the explosive plate detonates from the effects of the blast wave that it creates.

      How is an explosive in a DZ container initiated when a BOPS core enters it?

      And what happens when the BOPS core penetrates the joints between the DZ containers? Or to those places that KDZ does not close.
      1. Cat man null
        Cat man null 30 June 2016 15: 17
        +3
        Quote: wanderer_032
        When cumulative ammunition hits the armor, the explosive plate detonates from the effects of the blast wave that it creates

        - in fact, "cumulative ammunition" creates (initially) a cumulative jet. It is under its influence that the explosives detonate in the DZ box

        Quote: wanderer_032
        How is an explosive in a DZ container initiated when a BOPS core enters it?

        - from shock yes

        Quote: wanderer_032
        And what happens when the BOPS core penetrates the joints between the DZ containers?

        - both boxes will detonate. "Between which" "penetrates" laughing (rzhunimagu ... stick the "nail" между boxes DZ .. song laughing )

        Quote: wanderer_032
        Or in those places that DZ does not close

        - not a single DZ box will work request

        Still just like ...
        1. wanderer_032
          wanderer_032 30 June 2016 16: 43
          -2
          Quote: Cat Man Null
          in fact, "cumulative ammunition" creates (initially) a cumulative jet. It is under its influence that the explosives detonate in the DZ box


          How is a cumulative jet created? What initiates it?
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. Cat man null
            Cat man null 30 June 2016 17: 05
            +3
            Quote: wanderer_032
            How is a cumulative jet created? What initiates it?

            Approximately like this:
            1. wanderer_032
              wanderer_032 30 June 2016 17: 33
              -6
              Quote: Cat Man Null
              Approximately like this:


              It’s good when there are pictures from tyrnet. And in your own words, according to what is in the head?
            2. Cat man null
              Cat man null 30 June 2016 17: 48
              +3
              Quote: wanderer_032
              It’s good when there are pictures from tyrnet. And in your own words, according to what is in the head?

              - the picture is clearer
              - I have a lot in my head
              - and you, in any way, decided to check? And who are you, actually, for this?
            3. wanderer_032
              wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 33
              -2
              Quote: Cat Man Null
              And who are you, actually, for this?


              I do not ask who you are? Somehow it’s not good:



              laughing
            4. wanderer_032
              wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 40
              -1
              Quote: Cat Man Null
              - the picture is clearer


              The picture may be clearer, but I would like to hear something more specific from you personally. Preferably in your own words.

              Quote: Cat Man Null
              - I have a lot in my head


              Everyone has a lot. Yes, not everyone climbs.
        2. alex86
          alex86 30 June 2016 22: 05
          +1
          The scheme of the formation of a cumulative jet in the roller is incorrect: the jet is formed when the facing is moving against each other, while due to the high pressure, the metal turns into a fluid state (heats up by about 600 degrees, i.e. does not melt), the jet is "squeezed out" by the collapsing facing, from which the pestle remains (at a large opening angle of the funnel, the term "impact core" is applicable). Very conditionally - at an opening angle of up to 90 degrees, the main energy is in the jet, more than 90 degrees - in the pestle (impact core). The shape of the cladding can be different, however, the complication of the shape is not justified by the complication of the technology (except for the cases of creating ammunition for hitting with a shock core at long distances (anti-board, anti-helicopter mines)
          I don’t interfere in the discussion, get very personal
        3. Cat man null
          Cat man null 30 June 2016 22: 14
          +1
          Thanks for the correction .. the calculation was at the level of the opponent, and for a long time to look for a suitable illustration was .. lazy, I repent request

          The picture is not from here?


          Quote: alex86
          I don’t interfere in the discussion, get very personal

          - yes there would be something to move on to laughing
        4. alex86
          alex86 30 June 2016 22: 38
          +1
          Yes, hell knows where the picture came from - I saw the most similar to what the Polytechnical Dictionary had in the 77th year (I can be mistaken, many years have passed, maybe not there - I just trust online sources more, on paper everything it was more reliable). And this picture was one to one.
  • wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 30 June 2016 16: 45
    -5
    Quote: Cat Man Null
    - both boxes will detonate. "Between which" "penetrates" (rzhunimagu ... push the "nail" between the boxes DZ .. song)


    What do they detonate from? laughing From getting a steel disc? laughing This nonsense, do not tell anyone else. Do not. laughing Do not make people laugh.
    1. Cat man null
      Cat man null 30 June 2016 16: 55
      +1
      Quote: wanderer_032
      What do they detonate from? From getting a steel disc?

      - exactly. You just never saw what such a "blank" does with a target (steel plate, 50-70 mm ... I don't remember exactly)
      - so, she just doesn’t notice her. Flies through and flies on

      DZ on BOPS works something like this (in the picture - Knife):
      1. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 17: 30
        -3
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        DZ on BOPS works something like this, in the picture - Knife:


        This picture is pure profanity. The angle of contact of the projectile with the surface of the armor, such as in this picture, is very rare.

        Because the projectile always flies in an arc. And upon contact with the armor, it normalizes, i.e. its tip becomes relatively perpendicular to the surface it encounters. Further, the tip begins to penetrate into the obstacle, and the leading belt resting on the obstacle gives the core an additional kinetic impulse. That provides in many similar situations - breaking through the armor. Even multi-layered with composite components, such as "Chobham".

        By the way, neither the KDZ "Contact-1", nor the KDZ "Contact-5", nor the KDZ "Relikt" have such a ribbed surface. This is for your overall development.

        KDZ "Knife" is a Ukrainian development. The effectiveness of this KDZ has already been repeatedly reviewed. Incl. and specialists from the Research Institute of Steel, who gave a very low assessment of its real combat effectiveness.

        http://www.litmir.co/br/?b=313824&p=11
      2. Cat man null
        Cat man null 30 June 2016 17: 45
        +5
        Quote: wanderer_032
        By the way, neither the KDZ "Contact-1", nor the KDZ "Kontakt-5", nor the KDZ "Relikt" have such a ribbed surface. This is for your overall development.

        is not a "ribbed surface"
        - these are cumulative elements, in one box there are 7, EMNIP
        - in fact, in the figure "Knife" in section
        - this is to make it clearer for you wink

        Quote: wanderer_032
        Because the shell always flies in an arc

        - BOPS belay Well, if only so ... low, low yes
        - And if you put the gun to one side, can you shoot from it around the corner? (with) what

        Quote: wanderer_032
        And when in contact with the armor, it normalizes, i.e. its tip becomes relatively perpendicular to the surface with which it collides. Farther...

        - and then, according to your scheme, the projectile begins to tumble, a la city bat ..

        Young man, I'm tired of laughing, really laughing
      3. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 17: 50
        -4
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        Well, if only so ... low, low


        Is ballistics a familiar expression? laughing Or vaguely recall? laughing
      4. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 17: 55
        -1
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        these are cumulative elements, in one box of such 7, EMNIP


        Hmm ?! lol But at first glance - you will not say.

        I advise you to choose pictures better if you want others to understand you. And even better in your own words. According to what is in the mind.
      5. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 17: 57
        -2
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        Young man, I'm tired of laughing, really


        Above oneself? Understand.
      6. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 10
        0
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        in fact, in the figure "Knife" in section


        You didn’t give any explanations to the picture you posted. Neither the device is described, nor the principle of operation of these elements of the remote sensing.
        Post and even the grass does not grow. Type - understand how you want. So I showed an example of how this can be understood.

        Quote: Cat Man Null
        this, so that you understand


        So it was necessary to immediately write an explanation. This is this. And this is that.
        It works like that. If you want to be understood correctly the first time.
      7. Cat man null
        Cat man null 30 June 2016 18: 29
        +2
        Quote: wanderer_032
        I had to immediately write an explanation

        Quote: wanderer_032
        If you want to be understood correctly the first time

        Quote: wanderer_032
        I showed an example of how this can be understood

        - wow, how many of you have become fellow

        You see:

        - In fact, no one here owes you anything
        - You asked a question - they answered you. I find it quite exhaustive. In any case, I would have had enough wink
        - if you don’t have enough .. well, I don’t even know ...

        Learn materiel (s) request
      8. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 34
        -3
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        - In fact, no one here owes you anything


        You too.
      9. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 43
        -3
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        I find it quite exhaustive.


        Well then, everything is clear with you, this time. Your level of knowledge in armored vehicles is limited only by tyrnet. For more - do not pull.

        Your slip is counted.
  • Vadim237
    Vadim237 30 June 2016 19: 54
    0
    Vryatli KNIFE will protect from a two-component core - the first will destroy, and the second will continue to move where there was protection.
  • just exp
    just exp 1 July 2016 01: 46
    +2
    Now DZ is made of two BB explosive tiles, so the relic, for example, works on all types of BOPS.
  • wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 1 July 2016 18: 20
    -3
    Quote: just EXPL
    Now DZ is made of two BB explosive tiles, so the relic, for example, works on all types of BOPS.


    Losers. Learn mat. part. There are no two plates with explosives in "Relikt".
  • goose
    goose 1 July 2016 10: 40
    +1
    With a certain probability, compound tips work, yes, but not always.
  • goose
    goose 1 July 2016 10: 35
    +2
    Quote: wanderer_032
    and the leading belt abutting against an obstacle gives the core an additional kinetic impulse.

    And where does the crowbar near the target lead belt?

    On what physical principles can an additional impulse be obtained? Are you seriously?

    Normalization: how do you imagine a full normalization for shells of this elongation? If they normalized, no DZ was needed - they themselves would have collapsed from the transverse load. Normalization is for traditional AP shells.
  • wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 1 July 2016 18: 21
    -4
    Quote: goose
    And where does the crowbar near the target lead belt?


    Do not interfere with "fulyuganit". lol In a good way.

    And antires to the study of the mathematical part.
  • wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 37
    -2
    Quote: Cat Man Null
    - from shock


    More specifically.
  • Come on
    Come on 1 July 2016 14: 53
    0
    Quote: Cat Man Null
    - in fact, "cumulative ammunition" creates (initially) a cumulative jet. It is under its influence that the explosives detonate in the DZ box


    Come on, but I thought DZ initiates from the impact of a grenade, or a cumulative projectile on the surface of the DZ block. Then comes the simultaneous initiation of the explosive towards the tank’s armor, that is, the godfather, and in the DZ block at this time, the explosive force pushes the steel plate to meet the resulting tumulus to destroy it. If a grenade magically exploded 2cm above the armor, then a godfather, whose speed is higher than that of an OBPS, would probably have pierced the DZ without initiating it. But the cumulative grenade must first hit the armor in order to touch the point and concentrate the cumulative stream.
    1. Cat man null
      Cat man null 1 July 2016 19: 59
      +1
      Quote: Yeah, well.
      C'mon, I thought

      - you were wrong

      Quote: Yeah, well.
      But the cumulative grenade must first hit the armor in order to touch the point and concentrate the cumulative jet

      - I brought the picture above, dynamical. Everything is very similarly depicted there. It is for the cumulative shell

      Quote: wanderer_032
      Quote: Cat Man Null
      - from shock
      More specific

      - for bores specially, quote:

      Quote: http://btvt.narod.ru/1/zudt/zudt.htm
      The initial speed when firing modern BOPS can be from 1550 to 1800 m / s., Which is significantly lower than that of the head sections of the cumulative stream (8-10 km / s), but at the same time strict requirements are put forward on protective devices of this type for shelling means not posing a threat to the armor of the tank (bullets, AP shells, fragments of artillery shells), so the developers were forced to look for a solution not related to a simple increase in the sensitivity of explosives. Therefore, the cover of the container DZ was made of thick high-strength steel, when the BPS hit it, a stream of high-speed fragments is generated, which lead to the initiation of protective devices. Then, in principle, a similar effect is performed on the BOPS (or cumulative jet), which leads to partial destruction and destabilization of the BOPS and the destruction of the cumulative jet

      - You specifically could not live without it? Take, give, use love
      1. Come on
        Come on 2 July 2016 01: 56
        0
        In order to confidently say whether the DZ Contact 5 of the BOPS DM53 / 63, or A3 / 4, destroys, it is necessary to have both the shells themselves and the guns to them. On the other hand, this Contact 5th at the adversary in bulk to find a line of shells to neutralize it. Which happened a long time ago. Well, maybe it acted on Mango, since Mango loses significantly faster than Western and more modern counterparts. It is also interesting that the developers of modern shells themselves claim that it is the ability to flash without initiating Contact5 DZ. Liars? I think by maintaining a high speed and a thickness-to-length ratio of BOPS.
      2. Cat man null
        Cat man null 3 July 2016 00: 41
        0
        Quote: Yeah, well.
        Developed by modern shells themselves declare the ability to flash without initiation of DZ Contact 5. Liars?

        - definitely laughing
  • just exp
    just exp 30 June 2016 11: 46
    +4
    Mr. gentleman is stupid, go learn the materiel and do not dishonor the Russian speakers.
    Is it like a double or triple armored corps from this armor or what? And how much will he weigh? Can a tank even move around?

    I think that your brains are not enough to master what I will write, so just look at the pictures by request in the search engine for the word "chobhem". this is the most easy-to-understand example, it is clearly shown there. even fools will understand (though not the fact that you can understand, fools are a couple of steps higher than you in terms of intellectual level).
    First, study why the KDZ and KAZ are INTENDED. Lapads.

    But what does the Complex Diagnostics and Measurements have to do with it? but VZZ and DZ also work on BOPs (and under the KDZ you can also shove a piece of iron in the form of a screen), above I gave an interview to an American tanker who experienced the effects of our DZ on American BOPs, if you have enough gray matter you can find this post of mine ( Searching the page will help you if you master it).
    further, if you can do the search on the page, I hope that you can do the same on the Internet and find the definitions of the abbreviation KAZ, and after that you can find out which KAZ is on Armata (I’ll tell you right away, because I’m afraid that your head will explode overvoltage, KAZ on Armata is called Afghanit).
    and when "Afghanit" is entered into the request, you can find an approximate non-secret description of it, among which it is written in Russian letters (yes, there are such letters, they are also called Cyrillic) that the complex is based on a shock core and works on PTS (anti-tank weapons) at a speed up to 1800 m / s. this is more than most of the BOPSs, and even more so the BOPSs that have flown several kilometers.
    By the way, a version of Afganit is already being developed that works on TCP with a speed of 2500 m / s. and will even intercept impact cores.

    Mega Pearl I have no words. Knowledge of the materiel - too.

    darkness. Do you happen to be a Chukchi? although I now insulted the Chukchi.
    BOPS - do not care if the KDZ tank is installed or not. This is a simple high-strength alloy ingot that penetrates armor (or a composite armor package) - AT THE ACCOUNT OF ITS HIGH KINETIC ENERGY! Just like a dowel pierces concrete. By the same principle.

    explosives working on the dowel?
    learn materiel, explosion DZ first rejects BOPS. and secondarily also destroys it. it is believed that on average DZ reduces the effect of BOPS by 30%. often destroys it altogether.
    1. wanderer_032
      wanderer_032 30 June 2016 14: 51
      -6
      Quote: just explo
      I think that your brains will not be enough to master what I will write


      Sure. Because in any nonsense from people like you sofa-"experts" - I'm not even going to delve into.
      1. just exp
        just exp 30 June 2016 14: 59
        +1
        there’s nothing to delve into, and the terms are complex, it can and burst on the forehead.
        1. wanderer_032
          wanderer_032 30 June 2016 15: 11
          -2
          Quote: just explo
          nothing to delve into


          To delve into all sorts of nonsense that are scribbled in batches such as you are "experts" - I do not consider it necessary and something useful for myself.

          That's all.
          1. just exp
            just exp 30 June 2016 15: 45
            0
            for vegetable people only, the facts seem nonsense.
            and now on the facts.
            1 DZ works on BOPS
            2 KAZ (Afganit and Barrier) works on BOPs
            3 multi-layer armor in modern tanks
            You declared it all nonsense. go to the tank officers and tell them about it, together "laugh".
            1. wanderer_032
              wanderer_032 30 June 2016 16: 48
              -3
              Quote: just explo
              You declared it all nonsense. go to the tank officers and tell them about it, together "laugh".


              To people like you with your corefan go something? laughing Well, give the address of the school, if it’s close to me, I’ll come somehow. laughing
            2. wanderer_032
              wanderer_032 30 June 2016 16: 55
              -3
              Quote: just explo
              multi-layer armor in modern tanks


              "Subtle" life observation. laughing According to the pictures from tyrneta. laughing
            3. just exp
              just exp 30 June 2016 17: 03
              +2
              Are you over 12 years old?
              just answer honestly.
          2. wanderer_032
            wanderer_032 30 June 2016 17: 42
            -3
            Quote: just explo
            DZ works on BOPs


            Quote: just explo
            KAZ (Afghanite and Barrier) works on BOPs


            How can you prove it?

            Can you tell the principle of the effect of RS elements on BPS? Not with pictures from tyrnet and quotes from other sites, but in your own words? wink
          3. just exp
            just exp 1 July 2016 01: 31
            0
            I asked a question, I am waiting for your answer first.
  • wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 30 June 2016 18: 13
    -2
    Quote: just explo
    But what does the Complex Diagnostics and Measurements have to do with it?


    KDZ - a complex of dynamic protection. Especially for sofa-sperd. laughing
    1. just exp
      just exp 1 July 2016 01: 33
      +2
      especially for a human vegetable, KDZ is a set of additional protection, which can also consist of ordinary screens.
      and DZ can work in the form of one block, without any complex.
    2. goose
      goose 1 July 2016 10: 47
      +1
      Quote: wanderer_032
      KDZ - a complex of dynamic protection. Especially for sofa-sperd.

      Sheldon, it was sarcasm. Here we wave the red flag for especially advanced intellects.
  • goose
    goose 1 July 2016 10: 43
    +1
    Quote: just explo
    on average, DZ reduces the effect of BOPS by 30%. often destroys it altogether

    Based on tungsten carbide almost always destroys, they are fragile. I don’t know how Germans generally get their results on DM53.
    Uranium is harder to destroy, but they suffer, here a reduction in penetration ability from 30%, provided that the explosive detonator has worked properly.
  • just exp
    just exp 30 June 2016 11: 46
    +1
    the whole post did not fit


    KAZ is designed to protect the tank - ONLY FROM CONTROLLED CUMULATIVE AMMUNITION!

    and from unmanaged cumulative does not protect?
    sorry the creators of Afghanistan do not know what their brainchild is capable of. they did not ask the mandala from Topwar how to do it, and they did what was impossible to do.
    From BOPS, a tank can be protected only by good multilayer (composite) armor. And that is not always the case.



    Wow . but what about

    Is it like a double or triple armored corps from this armor or what? And how much will he weigh? The tank will generally be able to move

    in general, I am even at a loss about the diagnosis to you. even the boldest diagnosis will be very weak. there’s not even mushrooms. here is something heavier.

    In the competition of armor and projectile at the current moment by a wide margin - the projectile wins!

    if you take your forehead as an example. then the shells are resting. in the world there is no such ammunition that could penetrate the thickness of your forehead.
  • goose
    goose 1 July 2016 10: 24
    +2
    Quote: wanderer_032
    Is it like a double or triple armored corps from this armor or what? And how much will he weigh? Can a tank even move around?

    Hey, threesome, actually in the USSR, spaced armor has existed for 60 years in a series, if that. Now it is at least 4's layer, not counting the fillers between them.
    Quote: wanderer_032
    BOPS - do not care if the KDZ tank is installed or not.

    No, don't give a damn. DZ has an armor plate, which is shot in the direction of the "crowbar", and the "crowbar" is destroyed due to excessive lateral load. designed for longitudinal. New types are counting on a new multi-vector load, inventing "hinges", fake fragments, etc. pieces. But the most important thing is that the crowbar will in any case undergo a change in trajectory, which will lead to a conditional "ricochet". The main thing is that the explosive has time to work in the remote control. Perhaps point-blank, when the projectile speed is still high, the remote sensing will be delayed, but at a distance of 1 km, it will probably work.
    1. wanderer_032
      wanderer_032 1 July 2016 18: 04
      -3
      Quote: goose
      Hey, threesome, actually in the USSR, spaced armor has existed for 60 years in a series, if that. Now it is at least 4's layer, not counting the fillers between them.


      Exactly what - DIFFERENT! Those. those areas of the armored corps where the hits are most likely to be protected are most strongly protected. And not in a circular, as in the losers (yksperds). laughing



      Quote: goose
      DZ has an armor plate, which is shot in the direction of the "crowbar", and the "crowbar" is destroyed due to excessive lateral load. designed for longitudinal.


      What initiates the detonation of explosives in a DZ container when an BPS core (BPS) enters it? wink
  • svp67
    svp67 29 June 2016 21: 28
    +11
    Quote: Victor N.
    That is why in NATO countries prefer composite armor.

    Which was first used on a mass scale in the USSR on T-64 series tanks ... back in the 60s of the 20th century. But it seems for someone it may become a "break in the template" about the backwardness of the USSR.
    And the fact that you are showing the research results of the Soviet Research Institute of Steel, so that is why DZ "Contact" was replaced by "Relikt" ...
    1. goose
      goose 1 July 2016 10: 51
      0
      Quote: svp67
      Which was first used on a mass scale in the USSR on T-64 series tanks ... back in the 60s of the 20th century. But it seems for someone it may become a "break in the template" about the backwardness of the USSR.

      The T-64 immediately made all NATO tanks obsolete, as they were not able to penetrate his frontal armor. The T-72, which later appeared, could withstand sub-caliber shots from a 105 mm main gun at NATO, at close range, at a distance of about 100 m. It has been repeatedly checked by Israel.
      1. just exp
        just exp 1 July 2016 11: 41
        0
        and in Syria, the T-72 armor was not layered. On the export T-72 multilayer, there was an emnip in 1986m with the T-72M1.
  • just exp
    just exp 30 June 2016 03: 00
    +1
    Most importantly, the NATO OBPS easily overcome the Russian DZ. That is why in NATO countries prefer composite armor.

    Victor, you are partly right, NATO is creating BOPSs that can bypass the DZ, but there is one BUT. they cost the old DZ, which is precisely why M-829A1 appears first, then M-829A2 appears, and after M-829A3, and now the M-829A4 emnip is being made. and they make them because for the new DZ the older BOPS is no longer so scary. in the new DZ, the work on such BOPS is already taken into account.
    that is, situevina develops like this. DZ developers look at what kind of damaging agents Nata have and do DZ on these funds. NATO, seeing that their shells and rockets are no longer so effective, are developing a new BOPS. developed DZ seeing that there are new BOPS make a new DZ which neutralizes them. and again in a circle.
    1. goose
      goose 1 July 2016 10: 53
      +1
      One thing remained on the sidelines: in order for DZ to work properly, due to the aging of explosives, it needs to be periodically serviced and checked. Otherwise, it starts to be late, or not to work on time at all.
  • oleg-gr
    oleg-gr 29 June 2016 19: 23
    +6
    The scary story about the "Russian threat" has been promoted, it's time to start cutting coupons. In vain, did some of the NATO countries decide to increase military spending? You need to be in time with advertising your product.
    1. Vladimirets
      Vladimirets 29 June 2016 19: 42
      +7
      "Victor Baranets"

      With all due respect to Viktor Nikolaevich, when did he manage to become a "famous specialist in the field of armored vehicles"? what
    2. venik
      venik 29 June 2016 20: 49
      +29
      Ladies and gentlemen!! And no one thought about the question:
      "THEY" saw that "Armata" only at the parade in Moscow, and even on the infographics! What it is made of - DO NOT KNOW (what is armor 44C-sv-Sh-also DO NOT KNOW)! What is the thickness of the armor - DO NOT KNOW !! But they made a cannon that "guaranteed" will destroy Armata !!!!
      I am Bastard !!!!
      PS PR and advertising - in action ....
      1. svp67
        svp67 29 June 2016 21: 32
        +6
        Quote: venik
        What is the thickness of the armor - DO NOT KNOW !! But then they made a cannon that "guaranteed" will destroy Armata !!!!
        I am Bastard !!!!

        And how else to "get in" a weapon, as a result of the adoption of which almost everything in the range of ammunition will have to be changed. After all, old, 120-mm caliber will not fit it.
        1. Come on
          Come on 2 July 2016 02: 32
          0
          Quote: svp67
          After all, the old ones, the caliber of 120 mm, will not fit


          Why so? If you are talking about a new 120mm gun, it has 10% more power, then Rh120 is suitable, and if you are talking about 130mm, then 50% say it. But probably such guns will be placed (if ever) on some tanks of special tank regiments, which will have to withstand units armed specifically with the Armata, or some other Chinese tanks of the next decades. Against the T-72, T-90 120mm to 130 will not change.
      2. Air defense SSH
        Air defense SSH 29 June 2016 23: 49
        0
        For each Armata with an atomic bomb - then for sure ... And then a gun, a shell - the main tail ...
  • NEXUS
    NEXUS 29 June 2016 21: 05
    +6
    Quote: Maksus
    And, either the Germans also showed a long backlog (which is strange, given the lack of rumors), or simply in a hurry to announce that.

    Almost all NATO tanks have a German 120 mm cannon. The Germans continue to monopolize this weapons sector for MBT and this is logical.
    As for whether a projectile fired from such a cannon is capable of stopping Armata, it looks like simple bravado. And there are many aspects here: starting with the armor of our tank, passive and active protection and ending with whether the enemy's tank will be able to approach the target range of a shot to Armata, because the range of our gun is greater. Yes, and the enemy's subcaliber and armor-piercing projectiles themselves may simply be "weak" in armor penetration in relation to the Armata, as no one has tested them on a real T-14 at the range.
    About my 152 mm gun, I generally keep quiet ...
  • barbiturate
    barbiturate 29 June 2016 20: 35
    +4
    You overestimate the readings of armor penetration of the American and German BPS, M-829A3 - 825mm / 2km, for the German from 700 to 750 in 63 shells
  • Nick
    Nick 29 June 2016 20: 50
    0
    Quote: st25310
    At this level, Russia has "Slate-1", "Slate-2", "Vacuum-1" and "Vacuum-2" (2005). But the troops do not even have "Lead" (1991), "Lekalo (1997)", "Lead-1 (2002)" and "Lead-2 (2002)"

    Is this the latest data? What is the source of information
    1. goose
      goose 1 July 2016 10: 59
      0
      Quote: Nick
      Is this the latest data? What is the source of information

      The data is indeed correct. The last 2 generations of sub-caliber projectiles are produced in extremely small batches, and in units there is only "Mango-2". In fact, new shells are produced only for export in significant series, excluding the newest ones.
      Due to the "redundancy" of new shells and the low likelihood of a collision with NATO, production is frozen due to the high cost. ATGM is cheaper.
  • Number 17
    Number 17 29 June 2016 20: 58
    +1
    If I understand you correctly then create a gun is half the battle. The main thing is to put it on an existing tank and adjust it so that it works correctly. Not to the detriment of the tank and crew.
    1. kind
      kind 29 June 2016 21: 36
      +3
      I wrote about the uselessness of this product when this gun was only presented at the exhibition, and sofa specialists in armaments threw me cons.
      1. kind
        kind 29 June 2016 21: 46
        +3
        Here's another pearl from a tanker from the "Word of Tank"!
        1. Come on
          Come on 2 July 2016 02: 37
          -2
          And what is the "pearl" here? Like your nonsense about the "uselessness" of the 130mm cannon, why is it useless? Well, tell me what is "non-pearl" then, describe how it really is?
  • Pavel1
    Pavel1 29 June 2016 22: 38
    +2


    we also have 130 mm guns from new ones, for example
    Shore-anti-ship firing rate

    14 / min or ship AK130 there is a higher rate of fire, but there is water cooling.
  • spech
    spech 29 June 2016 18: 26
    +6
    become at the level of
    who is stronger than a whale or an elephant?
    PS everything is built on speculation.
    1. Bramb
      Bramb 29 June 2016 19: 25
      +1
      Article of norms.
      And the answer to the riddle about animals is simple: only the language of the sperm whale weighs 3 tons - as much as the largest Indian elephant. )))
      1. Verdun
        Verdun 29 June 2016 21: 19
        +2
        Quote: Bramb
        And the answer to the riddle about animals is simple: only the language of the sperm whale weighs 3 tons - as much as the largest Indian elephant. )))

        Firstly, the largest elephants are African. and secondly, whales cannot walk on land. So, your answer to the riddle, to put it mildly, does not roll ...
        1. goose
          goose 1 July 2016 11: 01
          0
          Quote: Verdun
          Quote: Bramb
          And the answer to the riddle about animals is simple: only the language of the sperm whale weighs 3 tons - as much as the largest Indian elephant. )))

          Firstly, the largest elephants are African. and secondly, whales cannot walk on land. So, your answer to the riddle, to put it mildly, does not roll ...

          That's why they talk about the Indian. African almost 1,5 times larger.
    2. Verdun
      Verdun 29 June 2016 21: 14
      +2
      Quote: spech
      become at the level of
      who is stronger than a whale or an elephant?
      PS everything is built on speculation

      it’s just that on the one hand there are unverified and frankly populist statements about the cannon, and on the other hand, like a carbon copy from Mao’s quote-book, statements by representatives of UVZ. At the same time, there is no tank or gun in the series yet and it is completely incomprehensible how some may claim that they will break through the armor, while others - that it will withstand everything. And the realities, apparently, are such that both sides have no idea how the situation is in practice.
  • hirurg
    hirurg 29 June 2016 18: 29
    +7
    All over again, like ... Well, yes, the trunk is new, only so far separately from the unit. Accordingly, while on the shelf.
    TTX Armata no one knows.
    Question? Will it be able ..
    Too many unknowns in the task.
  • BladeRunner
    BladeRunner 29 June 2016 18: 33
    +1
    Experienced cannon versus experienced tank. winked
    1. Homo
      Homo 29 June 2016 19: 28
      +7
      Quote: BladeRunner
      Experienced cannon versus experienced tank.

      Do not smack nonsense! There is no gun yet, there is a prototype that has never fired. And Armata went into the series! soldier
      1. Vadivak
        Vadivak 29 June 2016 21: 05
        +6
        Quote: Homo
        . And Armata went into the series!


        Prototypes of new equipment were sent to the troops in the second decade of last month for testing. In total, 100 units of armored vehicles were sent.

        Deliveries of serial samples of Almaty should start no earlier than in the next two years. The cost of one Armata is 250 million rubles. Cheaper than Abram but more expensive than a cat.
    2. In100gram
      In100gram 29 June 2016 20: 12
      +3
      Quote: BladeRunner
      Experienced cannon versus experienced tank.

      Tryndet not tossing bags. The article says
      "During the exercises, the T-14 was never hit. Complicating the defeat of the tank and its truncated silhouette, which in the heat of battle still have to get into."
      That's when they test the gun, then you can discuss. And so, talking about a mythical cannon. The caliber is certainly steep 130 mm (152 is better of course), but where is the ammunition? Maybe I don’t know what? request
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 29 June 2016 22: 17
        -4
        Yes, there will be no 152 mm gun on Armata - God forbid, with 125 mm, the declared number of combat platforms would be released.
        1. In100gram
          In100gram 29 June 2016 22: 28
          +2
          Quote: Vadim237
          Yes, there will not be any 152 mm gun on Armata

          There, the main thing was to create for modernization. It will be necessary, the gun will be, no, then no hi
          There will be a tank in the troops. Definitely will be. The more, the cheaper. Lot size matters.
        2. goose
          goose 1 July 2016 11: 03
          0
          Quote: Vadim237
          Yes, there will be no 152 mm gun on Armata - God forbid, with 125 mm, the declared number of combat platforms would be released.

          Well, yes, but Krasnopol, which is only in caliber 152 mm, from which they shot?
          1. Come on
            Come on 2 July 2016 05: 10
            0
            Quote: goose
            and Krasnopol, which is only in caliber 152 mm, from what was shot?


            Art, for which Krasnopol was created. Do you think they want to put a rifled gun from Msta on Armata and shoot under a canopy with "Krasnopoli"?))
  • PValery53
    PValery53 29 June 2016 18: 40
    +7
    It turns out that the Germans are using "military cunning" in marketing? - Oh well.
    "I'm under entot antires
    I will float them hemp and wood. "(L. Filatov)
    Amid the hype about the Russian threat, the Germans strive to "float" their tank guns to customers.
  • Dmitry Potapov
    Dmitry Potapov 29 June 2016 18: 41
    +4
    It can, can, if the entoy cannon jam the engine! lol
  • vasdel
    vasdel 29 June 2016 18: 42
    +4
    And this gun, similar to the American (miracle cannon) plant or power station is not needed nearby?
    1. Bramb
      Bramb 29 June 2016 19: 37
      +3
      Not. Need not.
      Just a team of Negro porters for shells.
  • SeregaBoss
    SeregaBoss 29 June 2016 18: 43
    +8
    Let this tube to inflate European toads there! To inflate someone is their credo.
  • noct
    noct 29 June 2016 18: 43
    +3
    Another wunderwaffe without checking and testing) and in general, recently there was a film on the star about the "armata" family. There are 4 degrees of protection. In fact, only a "dull" ammunition can penetrate, and then after the active armor is pierced in the same place, and whoever said that the tank is standing still, it must be massively fired at it, also with direct fire.
    And that is not a fact ...
  • Banishing liberoids
    Banishing liberoids 29 June 2016 18: 45
    +11
    Every night I shoot three UFOs from a slingshot !!! wassat
    1. grandson of the hero
      grandson of the hero 29 June 2016 22: 56
      +1
      I can confirm! I saw it myself.
  • sir_obs
    sir_obs 29 June 2016 18: 45
    +4
    Why not a newfangled railgun?
    A power station and several coils with wires are attached to the tank.
    And it could also be put on a trolley bus.
    And let along the border.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Monos
    Monos 29 June 2016 18: 48
    +26
    Our country is becoming an advertising brand. Putin is used in the election campaign in America, "Armata" is used in the competition by gunsmiths, NATO in general uses the whole country for its promotion. It's time to beat them for it.

    And sanctions, s.uki, do not try to shoot!
    1. ALEA IACTA EST
      ALEA IACTA EST 29 June 2016 19: 52
      +7
      Mongols for what? request
      1. Monos
        Monos 29 June 2016 21: 26
        +8
        Quote: ALEA IACTA EST
        Mongols for what? request


        That is, do you understand everything with the Chinese?
        1. In100gram
          In100gram 29 June 2016 22: 14
          +11
          Quote: Monos
          Mongols for what?

          The Mongols during the Second World War were with us, and their help was very good. By the power of them. How much could. And after the war they were allies to us. Do not disturb their people with dirt. They are worthy of respect.
          PS Minus is not mine
        2. In100gram
          In100gram 29 June 2016 22: 24
          0
          Quote: Monos
          Mongols for what?

          The Mongols during the Second World War were with us, and their help was very good. By the power of them. How much could. And after the war they were allies to us. Do not disturb their people with dirt. They are worthy of respect.
          PS Minus is not mine
      2. PSih2097
        PSih2097 29 June 2016 21: 54
        +5
        Quote: ALEA IACTA EST
        Mongols for what? request

        for the yoke ...
        1. just exp
          just exp 30 June 2016 15: 10
          0
          which was not.
  • kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 29 June 2016 18: 49
    +3
    There is nothing special about the fact that the Germans decided to somehow answer us to our "Armata"! I just remembered how in 1941 the Germans told Adolf Hitler that 152 mm guns were installed on Russian KV tanks, which he was surprised and did not believe. But by the way, and judging by the advertisement, this vaunted gun does not even have an automatic loader , what again, as they say, will charge "fart steam"? Time will tell whether the Germans really "bungled" something or is it just a "bluff" and a publicity stunt!
  • kolkulon
    kolkulon 29 June 2016 18: 49
    -4
    It seems that this gun is not so new. Dusted for the time being. And here is a present in the form of I Armata.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Banishing liberoids
    Banishing liberoids 29 June 2016 18: 52
    -1
    Actually, it’s not a cannon but its shot that stops a tank or a Betaer. It is possible to stop the m14 by interrupting the goose or creating an insurmountable obstacle. But knocking down or destroying the tank is a matter of questions. Let Hans bring their gun to mind, put them on the tank, and we will have a fair fight to find out if their brainchild is so good at how it is advertised ..
  • Simon
    Simon 29 June 2016 18: 52
    0
    It seems to me that this is a German tremor. They saw our T-14 and began to quickly stuff into their "leopards" more powerful guns, which came to hand, since they did not have similar developments that we have. request
  • sergey72
    sergey72 29 June 2016 18: 53
    +16
    Poor loaders ...... on the U5TS / 2A20 of the T-62 tank, the shot weighed 22-31kg ...... And how much will be here? Shots of a new type are longer and slightly thicker and this will require re-arrangement of the tower and the fighting compartment. Taking into account that the shots in Leo-2 are spread all over the tank (stored in three battle stations, in three different places), the process of loading the guns, especially in movement, turns into an exciting activity belay wassat laughing
    1. shurik
      shurik 29 June 2016 20: 42
      +3
      Oh, I'm sorry for the German loaders. It was not easy to throw 115mm. Oh, it's not easy. And 130mm .....
      1. NEXUS
        NEXUS 29 June 2016 21: 27
        +3
        Quote: Shurik
        Oh, I'm sorry for the German loaders. It was not easy to throw 115mm. Oh, it's not easy. And 130mm .....

        The shells are not only larger in caliber, but also in length ... so that you don’t have to take a second loader to help. The issue of the rate of fire of such a gun is interesting, especially in a protracted battle.
    2. Forever so
      Forever so 29 June 2016 21: 25
      +1
      And negros what ??)) Best automatic loader in the world - Nigger !!
      1. Come on
        Come on 3 July 2016 14: 02
        0
        Well, in the West, they do not see problems with manual loading and the role of the loader is not only to throw blanks. And the "pity" for the loaders is incomprehensible, they say it's hard, what, are dystrophics gathered? You might think that the loader needs to overcome the obstacle course in order to take the projectile and run back)).
        1. Cat man null
          Cat man null 3 July 2016 14: 10
          0
          Quote: Yeah, well.
          You might think that the loader needs to overcome the obstacle course in order to take the shell and run back

          I give you a beacon: in the tank, when it goes along the intersection, it noticeably chatters. So what about the "obstacle course" you are right somewhere wink
  • sergey2017
    sergey2017 29 June 2016 18: 53
    0
    The demonstration of the gun was carried out, but the practical test firing of the gun was not yet! But what a stir around it! Germany needs to show at least something, not even brought to mind the development, just to raise the mood of its military! Russia has a new tank, but the European fighters do not panic, how to resist it!
    1. aba
      aba 29 June 2016 20: 28
      0
      But what a stir around her!

      The advertisement is engine of the trade! (c)
    2. Come on
      Come on 3 July 2016 14: 08
      0
      Quote: sergey2017
      The demonstration of the gun was carried out, but the practical test firing of the gun was not yet! But what a stir around it! Germany needs to show at least something, not even brought to mind the development, just to raise the mood of its military! Russia has a new tank, but the European fighters do not panic, how to resist it!


      It was reported to you that "there was practically no shooting"? The gun was tested by Rheinmetall, as well as the BC to it. It is simply not accepted for service anywhere, because it is new and because, most likely, it will be considered that the old Rh120, or its modernization is still sufficient. And it is not clear Vazhe statement about the panicked Eurovoys about Armata. Maybe when they will be adopted, after the military tests have passed and confirmed their performance characteristics, when they are equipped with a couple of regiments, then it will be possible to pre-teach something.
  • Observer2014
    Observer2014 29 June 2016 18: 55
    +3
    To shove the fluff of a larger caliber into a modular tank, you need to make a new tank, so let them leave their marketing move for their Bundeswehr, and for tanks like Abrams, a charging Negro also has restrictions on weight lifting.
  • satelit24
    satelit24 29 June 2016 18: 58
    +1
    when they start to shoot at each other, then we will find out, and you can discuss them even before the carrot request
  • acetophenon
    acetophenon 29 June 2016 19: 01
    0
    Quote: kartalovkolya
    2А83

    in 1941, the Germans informed Adolf Hitler that 152 mm guns were installed on Russian KV tanks, which he was surprised and did not believe.
    And he did it right. Putting a howitzer on a tank is a perversion. Only two towers are worse.
    1. demiurg
      demiurg 29 June 2016 20: 15
      +7
      Yeah, perversion. And what for then SU ​​/ ISU 122/152 thousands riveted?
      Hint: But is it against strongly protected objects, where the ballistics of the gun is unimportant?
      Variants of answer:
      1. Yes
      2. There is
      3. That's right
    2. Sharapov
      Sharapov 30 June 2016 07: 08
      -1
      To fight German tanks at the beginning of the war, it made no difference - that 76 mm, that 152 - KV won.
      He won in different ways - 76 mm - he leaked, and 152 mm - tore off towers or smashed to pieces.
      And about the perversion ... Ask this from the soldiers whom the KV-152 saved by smashing DOTA dust and other well-fortified targets, they will tell you how 76 mm shells were useless.
  • Dr. Bormental
    Dr. Bormental 29 June 2016 19: 07
    +1
    Yes, ordinary advertising ... why did everyone get excited? The product is (or will be), so it must be sold in order to sell, it must be said that this is the best product ... the whole story lol
  • prior
    prior 29 June 2016 19: 10
    +3
    Well, now we will be measured by trunks?
    No, now we will not lay millions of Russians on the release of Geyropa. We will stagger the "calibers" and "iskanders".
    And Armata, this is so, to restore public order.
  • Arandir
    Arandir 29 June 2016 19: 10
    0
    I've already invented so many weapons, already horror. But not even a single drawing is there. Firstly, Martian-Amer spies can steal, and secondly, they are more perfect in sweet dreams. Today they are perfect, perfection itself, and tomorrow they closed their eyes, presented and went a kaleidoscope, one better than the other. No no, you need to leave a little the next day.
    Dreaming is not harmful. It’s harmful to say gop until you jump over.
  • masiya
    masiya 29 June 2016 19: 23
    0
    And that the fluffy is not bad, judging by the performance characteristics, but you can stick it anywhere, just the point? After all, there will be no direct clashes, as on the Kursk Bulge ... and in the conditions of the city there is no difference in guns ..., in speed, in maneuverability our tank is one figs better, in rough terrain 70 km per hour, you can imagine what there’s also going to be a fool around, another squeeze of the Eureka this cannon for the people of Europe ... well, allah and Akbar with them, let them have fun for their babos !!!
    1. alpamys
      alpamys 29 June 2016 19: 49
      +1
      Quote: masiya
      ., in speed, in terms of maneuverability, our tank is one FIG better, cross country 70 km per hour,

      maneuverability and speed caught up with leopard
      1. Grigory_78
        Grigory_78 1 July 2016 10: 44
        0
        With the current Leopard - maybe. In speed. In terms of maneuverability, our tanks have been better since WWII. Read at least how Leo-2 climbed the descent in the Greek tender ... This is a song.
  • gladcu2
    gladcu2 29 June 2016 19: 30
    +4
    The author has a mistake.

    This gun is not for marketing moves and the conquest of the arms market. This gun is more likely to raise morale.

    The mere presence of a trunk does not mean that this trunk will fall into the right place. There can be a very long way from words to deeds.
  • akims
    akims 29 June 2016 19: 44
    +6
    A tank gun without installation on a tank and testing is not a cannon, but a blank.
    Install, shoot, shove ammunition, remove gases, reduce recoil, develop a new gyrocompass, PC, software, etc.
    In short, 7-8 years minimum.
  • Woland
    Woland 29 June 2016 19: 53
    +4
    Let them put their cannon and come to us for a tank biathlon. That's where all its advantages will be revealed.
    1. Arctic
      Arctic 29 June 2016 23: 27
      +1
      What are they really bad at all, so they’re not like a cannon, they won’t be able to sell a tank :)
  • Castor oil
    Castor oil 29 June 2016 20: 04
    +1
    Not really about the cannon, but Armata is also in the subject: I don’t know about your colleagues, but I think it would be very interesting right now, out of competition, but to include Armata in the “tank biathlon” participants. It would be a PR bomb and interest in competitions would simply skyrocket. And all armophobes have a skiff then. Yes yes
  • Aleksander
    Aleksander 29 June 2016 20: 06
    +1
    I will come from "the other side": according to the Potsdam agreements of 1945 (which no one canceled and which, allegedly, are still in effect) Germany B PRINCIPLE cannot create and to have weapons more difficult than small arms. The vicious policy of appeasing and "taming" the "former" aggressor IMMEDIATELY after the war, and especially when marked, led to the fact that Germany is again a trendsetter in armaments and threatens Russia.
    Question: what were you fighting for? Is it not for FOREVER to destroy the very possibility of Germany creating-threatening ?!
  • ALEA IACTA EST
    ALEA IACTA EST 29 June 2016 20: 18
    0
    If the gun is really effective, then hi .
  • demiurg
    demiurg 29 June 2016 20: 18
    +5
    Quote: Monos
    Our country is becoming an advertising brand. Putin is used in the election campaign in America, "Armata" is used in the competition by gunsmiths, NATO in general uses the whole country for its promotion. It's time to beat them for it.

    And sanctions, s.uki, do not try to shoot!

    Cattle picture. In the spirit of Tagill !!! and other bestiality. Not even Petrosianism.
  • BOB044
    BOB044 29 June 2016 20: 27
    0
    The Germans forgot how their menagerie touted. Under Prokhorovka, our St. John's wort knocked out their menagerie cleanly.
    1. Just me
      Just me 30 June 2016 01: 37
      0
      What do you mean by the name ANNIVERS It was under Prokhorovka which cars were
  • Berkut24
    Berkut24 29 June 2016 20: 40
    0
    It’s not at all clear what the gun has to do with it. the T-14 made a bet on the remote destruction of flying ammunition, including sub-caliber. And in this case, neither the caliber of the gun nor the properties of the ammunition are important. The radar monitors the flight path of the projectile threatening the machine and the on-board computer fulfills the shooting of the oncoming element of the defeat. What does the least new gun have to do with it?
  • Siberia 9444
    Siberia 9444 29 June 2016 20: 50
    +1
    The Germans always knew how to make good steel and good weapons. You need to keep your ear sharp, because it’s not a secret to anyone that their guns are on the abrams! Maybe the Germans are far away to create a new tank, but you can see them just on American tanks.
  • Taygerus
    Taygerus 29 June 2016 21: 13
    0
    let them reassure themselves, put men in our designers and production workers, we haven’t done them with our bast shoes, and we believe we have the answer to all their wisdom
  • The comment was deleted.
  • denisey
    denisey 29 June 2016 21: 43
    0
    I have one question: how much does the absence of an ejector increase the power of the generating element with the same amount of charge?
  • Arkan
    Arkan 29 June 2016 22: 05
    0
    Russian Prussians always beat. I agree with the conclusions of the author of the article that nothing but a burning desire for profit was announced at the exhibition, the presented sample looks like a Du 130 mm pipe.
  • Anchonsha
    Anchonsha 29 June 2016 22: 05
    +1
    I think that the Germans understand that there will be no war with us, we have never started wars first, which is evident from our entire history. Well, they need to cut down denyuzhku and even at least as a torus to reassure their NATA in front of the formidable Russian "Armata". And the West is so dumbfounded that Russia has shown how it can technically create a new army and navy so quickly in a short time. The McCains from this began to lose their memory, because sometimes they are not heard for so long.
    1. alpamys
      alpamys 30 June 2016 00: 15
      +1
      Quote: Anchonsha
      I think that the Germans understand that there will be no war with us, we never started the first wars,

      there will be no war with the Germans, I agree here, but history needs to be taught, the Soviet-Finnish War of 39-40.
  • Cananecat
    Cananecat 29 June 2016 22: 24
    0
    We read by syllable: "the new tank gun is capable of OS TA NO VIT T14", not to destroy but to stop ... Nuka lovers HERE, tell me how to stop the tank? That's right ... knock down the harp. Can you figure out what to do next? ))) So the Germans did not lie ... if this is an exact translation. )))
    1. kartalovkolya
      kartalovkolya 30 June 2016 07: 10
      0
      If we proceed from your conclusions, then, in principle, after all, the T-14 can be stopped from the usual "degtyarevskaya armor piercing", knocking down a caterpillar, well, why "fence a garden" ?! Not everything is as simple as you would like, but the point is that NATO felt the lag and began to grab every opportunity to prove that they are not exactly "suckers"!
  • kolkulon
    kolkulon 29 June 2016 23: 30
    +2
    They threw minuses. I read that they developed this gun for a long time. Although whoever denied it, threw the link. Or so by the way, is there a minus the second will not hurt?
    1. eleronn
      eleronn 29 June 2016 23: 56
      0
      Do your minuses prevent you from expressing your opinion? Calm down, breathe deeper! I was bombarded here because I dared to say that a fighter with full refueling and maximum combat load is turning into an iron.
      1. kolkulon
        kolkulon 30 June 2016 03: 50
        0
        I’m only for, if not right. But I would like to justifiably. And my horizons would expand.
  • Just me
    Just me 30 June 2016 01: 18
    +1
    She can shoot both conventional and guided missiles like Krasnopol. How? How can I push Krasnopl into a 125mm cannon There with caliber slime Or not? Next, I just didn’t read the article
  • Zomanus
    Zomanus 30 June 2016 04: 27
    +1
    Well made a gun, so what?
    As an example, they bought the most-most powerful processor, so what?
    To him the motherboard acc. level, RAM, cooling, power, ...
    And to the gun, respectively. turret, chassis, tracking / guidance system, and tydy and typy.
    So it’s too early to judge the whole machine by one spare part.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Runx135
      Runx135 30 June 2016 05: 33
      0
      Why a tower? Our eastern partners from igilas do not particularly bother, weld the trunk to a pickup truck and go into battle. Cheap and cheerful. And from buyers there will be no end.
  • Wolka
    Wolka 30 June 2016 05: 37
    0
    the cannon may be good, but its cost is a big question, and in order to equip it with at least a tank battle, all the EU will have to throw it off and still borrow from China ...
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 30 June 2016 08: 58
      +1
      The price of the tank is about 4-6 million. The price of one OBPS is 10-25 thousand dollars.
      Compared to shells, the gun itself is not too expensive.
      1. goose
        goose 1 July 2016 11: 37
        0
        Quote: voyaka uh
        The price of one OBPS is 10-25 thousand dollars

        And they need to train, hammer in the ammunition, at least 20 pieces. And at least once change the barrel on the gun. 40 DM53 sub-calibers are already very much felt for the price.
  • wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 30 June 2016 09: 45
    0
    The fact that the Germans were clearly in a hurry to declare the possibility of their guns fighting the “Armata” was nothing more than a marketing ploy.

    I doubt it. They also have experience with tank guns since the end of the Cold War. Just pulled out of the storerooms, the old backlog.

    As for the chassis, the Germans had such a development by order of the Swedes. The design of the machine Strv 2000.

    Link to the article:

    https://topwar.ru/12402-shvedskiy-perspektivnyy-tank-strv-2000.html

    And an interesting photo:



    In general, with regard to the development of new tank guns from Rheinmetall, you can read here:

    https://topwar.ru/11729-perspektivnye-140-mm-tankovye-pushki.html

    https://topwar.ru/24225-tankovye-pushki-kalibra-140-millimetrov.html
  • Red_Hamer
    Red_Hamer 30 June 2016 10: 05
    0
    smoothbore 125-mm gun 2A82 "Almaty". She can shoot both conventional and guided missiles like Krasnopol.
    "Cranopol" is a thing, 12000 m by the way, is far from the limit, (just in the article they gave a specific example from DEMONSTRATION firing). And not only the T-14 is equipped with such "guided missiles". There will be many surprises.
  • Shuttle
    Shuttle 30 June 2016 13: 24
    0
    The fact that the Germans were clearly in a hurry to declare the possibility of their guns fighting the “Armata” was nothing more than a marketing ploy. This is obvious, especially for professionals. Without specific data on the practical firing of a gun mounted on a tank, it is hardly worth taking these statements and similar statements seriously.

    Respectfully and gently explained the state of things.
    And you can say so about marketers from Rheinmetall.

    © I.A. Krylov