"General's case"

70 years ago, 4 June 1946, the “Trophy case” or “general's business” began in the USSR. It was a campaign of state security agencies of the USSR in 1946-1948, launched on the personal instructions of Joseph Stalin and with the active participation of State Security Minister Viktor Abakumov, the former head of SMERSH. Its purpose was to identify abuses among the generals. But, according to some researchers, it was a reason to remove the popular commander, Marshal G.K. Zhukov, from the “Olympus”. It is believed that his authority among the people and the army was indisputable, especially after the victory in the Great Patriotic War. And all this didn’t like Stalin’s entourage and, of course, himself.

However, apparently, this idea appeared after de-Stalinization, when Stalin was accused of all possible and impossible sins. In reality, the generals were not without sin. Highlighting the ugly side of some representatives of the Soviet generals and other representatives of the Soviet elite after the Victory of the Red Army over Nazi Germany, no one wanted, it was much easier and more convenient (taking into account the internal and external order) to blame Stalin for the bloody tyrant.

prehistory

As you know, during the war, the USSR began to collect trophies, which was a necessary condition for the destroyed economy. 5 in January 1943. The Chairman of the State Defense Committee I. Stalin signs the Decree of the State Defense Committee “On the Collection and Removal of Trophy Property and Storage”. In accordance with this decree, in February 1943 began its work the Central Commission for the collection of captured property. Marshal Budyonny was appointed chairman of the commission. Lieutenant-General Vakhitov was appointed head of the trophy board. It is clear that even before 1943, the Red Army was collecting trophy property, but during the 1941-1942 period. the collection of trophies was not centrally organized, and individual trophy teams subordinate to the front commanders of the fronts were guided in their work on the basis of the relevant orders of NGOs.

During the second half of 1942 and 1943, the city of GKO will issue 15 orders regarding the organization of the collection, accounting, storage and export of captured property and scrap metal. In addition, in the 1943, the GKO will approve a plan for the delivery of non-ferrous scrap and waste. Trophy management will be transferred to the base of the Office of Material Funds of the NPO of the USSR, and representatives of the trophy management who were sent to all fronts received clear instructions specifying the tasks of registration, collection, temporary storage and export of captured and damaged domestic weapons, as well as scrap metal and valuable property from army rears and liberated territories. I must say that in addition to the military, to the collection of trophy weapons and property was attracted and the civilian population living in the liberated territory. The locals had a great help in collecting trophies, as they watched the Nazis retreating and knew where the Germans threw or hid weapons and equipment they could not or did not manage to take out.

In April, the Central Commission 1943 was reorganized into a permanent Trophy Committee under the State Defense Committee. When the front departments formed trophy teams. Marshal of the Soviet Union Voroshilov was appointed head of the Trophy Committee. Trophy brigades, battalions and companies were formed in the army units, the personnel of which were mainly represented by fighters of the older age group. By the summer, a clear structure of the trophy bodies of the Red Army was formed: the Trophy Committee at the State Defense Committee; Trophy weapon control; Front-line controls of captured weapons (from 1945. Separate captured controls subordinate to the commanders of the fronts); army divisions captured weapons. Control over the work of the captured parts was entrusted to the Main Directorate of Counterintelligence SMERSH.

According to the reports of the Trophy Committee for the period from 1943 to 1945. captured parts collected 24615 broken German tanks and self-propelled guns; more than 68 thousand artillery pieces, 30 thousand mortars, 257 thousand machine guns, 3 million rifles; more than 114 million shells, 16 million minutes, more than 2 billion various rounds, etc. The total weight of the “recyclable” ferrous metal was 10 million tons, including 165 tons of non-ferrous. Part of the equipment was repaired and returned to the troops. So, for example, in the period 605-1943. the Red Army’s car fleet was replenished with more than 1945 thousand vehicles due to various captured vehicles, which amounted to 60% of the total number of the Red Army’s fleet.

The war ended with the defeat of Germany, and the USSR’s right to reparation was fair and recognized by other victorious powers. Established under the State Defense Committee, the State Commission determined the amount of material losses of the USSR from the war with Hitler Germany in 674 billion rubles. The issue of reparation was discussed during the work of the great powers at the Yalta Conference. The Soviet side proposed to fix the total amount of German reparations in 20 billion US dollars. At the same time, the USSR was supposed to - 10 billions, Great Britain and the USA, taking into account their victims and an important contribution to the victory - 8 billions, to all other countries - 2 billion. However, as is known, Churchill began to object to fixing the exact number of reparation obligations. London was interested in the de-industrialization of Germany.

According to the reports of the Trophy Committee for the period from March 1945 to March 1946. for reparations imposed from Germany in favor of the Soviet Union in Germany were dismantled and exported to the USSR: 1) Equipment 29 ferrous metallurgy plants worth 10 billion rubles. at state prices; 2) equipment of machine-building plants (214300 of various machines and 136381 of different power of electric motors); 3) ferrous, non-ferrous and other metals in industrial form 447 741 tons worth 1 billion. 38 million rubles; 4) equipment 96 power plants, etc.

However, the USSR not only exported, but also contained Germany and the countries of Eastern Europe. Starting in the fall of 1945, the Soviet Union began to “feed” the countries of Eastern Europe: as early as June 1945, Hungary and Poland requested food assistance; in September - Romania, Bulgaria, then Yugoslavia. In the 1945 year, only Czechoslovak authorities tried to cope with food difficulties on their own, but a year later they turned to the USSR for help. In the same year, 1946 required grain for Finland. The USSR also provided food aid to the Chinese Communist People’s Liberation Army. And this is due to the extremely difficult food situation in many areas of the Union itself. In addition, since May 1945, the Soviet Union was forced to take on the decision of the food supply of the population of large cities in Germany.

It is clear that even before entering the territory of Germany, soldiers and officers of the rear parts of the spacecraft often resorted to searching and “preserving” various trophies in their favor. After the Victory over the Reich, a formal decision was made by the TK, which Stalin allegedly approved verbally allowing the fighters to send home the received trophies no more than one 5 kg package, and middle-level officers no more than one 10 kg package per month. Senior officers (in the rank of major and above) were allowed to send two parcels of 16 kg per month. For this, in each of the military units, commandant's offices, hospitals, etc. commissions were created whose task was to check the contents of the parcels sent home. Weapons, items made of precious stones and metals, antiques and various other things related to the Nazi regime were not allowed to be sent to the home in the packages. However, these commissions are usually purely formal. And the parcels of senior officers were practically not checked.

Later measures were tightened. By order of G. K. Zhukov, the personnel of the commandant's offices were obliged to stop transport and military personnel to inspect the property and select items from them that were forbidden to be removed according to the list approved by the June order of the Commander-in-Chief of the Soviet Military Administration in Germany (SVAG). The list included cars, motorcycles, furs, etc. However, despite all the steps taken to tighten, many things from the forbidden list still very quickly appeared on the territory of the USSR. "Trophy peak" fell on the period 1946-1947. It is clear that the military counterintelligence simply did not have the ability to track down and prevent all that was in the handbags, trunks, and the suitcases of soldiers and officers returning from Germany to the Union to be exported.

It should be noted that in relation to the marauders in the Red Army acted tough. The soldier or officer who was caught after the looting immediately surrendered to the military tribunal, and his sentence in the war and post-war period was unequivocal - execution. Therefore, in the Red Army, the relevant agencies and the command very quickly extinguished the usual “war of lawlessness” in the defeated country (aimless executions, looting, violence against women, etc.). For comparison, in the armies of the allies there was no such austerity.

Novikov case

15 March 1946. By decision of the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR, the people's commissariats were transformed into Ministries. NKGB changed its name to the MGB. 4 May 1946 was appointed Colonel-General V.S. Abakumov as Minister of State Security. It was Abakumov who, at the beginning of his work in the ministerial chair, had to face a “wave” of various post-war crimes. The war ended, but there were still a lot of problems, it was necessary to eliminate the “forest brothers” in the Baltic States and suppress ukronatsistov in Ukraine, bring down the wave of ordinary banditry (the crime took advantage of the war to increase its influence on society), etc.

In the spring of 1946, personnel changes took place at the Ministry of Armed Forces of the USSR (USSR Ministry of Internal Affairs). People's Commissar aviation Industry A. I. Shakhurin, Air Force Commander, Chief Marshal of Aviation A. Novikov, Deputy Commander - Air Force Chief Engineer A. K. Repin were arrested during the investigation of the so-called "Aviation business." Colonel General K. Vershinin was appointed to the post of commander of the USSR Air Force. Marshal of the Soviet Union G.K. Zhukov was appointed Commander-in-Chief of the Ground Forces of the USSR MVS.

30 on April 1946. Minister of the Ministry of State Security Abakumov sends Novikov’s statement to Stalin. In it, the former commander of the Air Force declared “sabotage”, in concealing “anti-state practice in the work of the Air Force and the NKAP.” Novikov admitted that “he himself cultivated servility and subservience in the Air Force apparatus. All this happened because I myself got into the morass of crimes related to the adoption by the Air Force of defective aircraft. I am ashamed to say, but I was also too much involved in the acquisition of various property from the front and in the arrangement of my personal well-being. My head was spinning, I imagined myself a big man ... ”.

Novikov also accused Zhukov of "politically harmful conversations with him that we had during the war and until recently." Allegedly, Zhukov, as "an exceptionally powerful man and a narcissist," "knocks together people around him, brings them closer to him." According to Novikov: “Zhukov is very cunning, subtle and cautious in his conversation with me, as well as among other people, trying to diminish the leading role in the war of the Supreme High Command and at the same time Zhukov does not hesitate to exaggerate his role in the war as a commander and even states that all the basic plans of military operations are developed by him. Thus, in many conversations that took place over the past year and a half, Zhukov told me that the operations to defeat the Germans near Leningrad, Stalingrad and the Kursk Bulge were developed according to his idea and he, Zhukov, prepared and conducted them. Zhukov told me the same thing to defeat the Germans near Moscow. Thus, “Bonapartism” of Zhukov manifested itself, a line of military conspiracy for the purpose of a coup d'état emerged.

After Stalin’s death, Novikov will become almost the main witness at the trial of Abakumov and the main prosecutor Rudenko will put all his efforts to prove that the arrest of the chief air marshal was groundless, and his testimony was beaten out by torture and torture. This version, voiced during the start of the “Khrushchev thaw”, that is, de-Stalinization, will be further replicated and will become the main one during the “perestroika” and “democratization” of Russia in the 1980-1990's.

Zhukov case

1 June 1946 The case of Zhukov was considered at the Supreme Military Council in the presence of all nine marshals of the Soviet Union, each of whom expressed his opinion on the personality of G. K. Zhukov. The Council, with a collegial decision, made a proposal to release Marshal Zhukov from the posts of the Commander-in-Chief of the Land Forces, the Soviet occupying forces and the Deputy Minister of the Armed Forces of the USSR. 3 Jun. The USSR Council of Ministers approved these proposals. Georgy Zhukov was appointed commander of the Odessa Military District, which for him meant disgrace.

However, Zhukov’s problems did not end there. 23 August 1946. Minister of the Armed Forces N. Bulganin sent a report to Stalin in which it was reported that 7 cars with furniture boxes in 85 were detained near Kovel. When checking the documentation, it turned out that the furniture belongs to Marshal Zhukov. According to the inventory of property arriving from the city of Chemnitz, the 7 carriages contained: 194 pieces of furniture for the bedroom, living room, office, kitchen, etc. Particularly distinguished furniture for the living room, made of mahogany. Stalin’s response to this incident is unknown, but soon events occurred that went into historyas a "trophy case."

"Trophy case"

It is obvious that the unrest created in the Red Army, despite its rapid reduction, greatly disturbed Stalin. It was necessary to restore order, especially among the higher commanders. Otherwise, the Soviet Union could easily become a victim of the United States and Britain. Traction to the material led to the rebirth of the Soviet elite, turning it into a bourgeois class with the philistine psychology. The Soviet project was based on building a society of creation and service, and here the beginnings of a consumer society appeared. After the elimination of Stalin, it is the rejection of the pursuit of the ideal of a society of creation and service and an orientation toward the material will lead to the fall of the Red Empire. Two "restructuring" - Khrushchev and Gorbachev, will destroy the essence of the red (Soviet) project, the program to create an "ideal" society. The Soviet Union will lose its goal of existence, which will cause a geopolitical catastrophe 1991.

After all, corruption struck even the KGB authorities. For example, the head of the counterintelligence department of the 1 of the Belorussian Front, A. A. Vadis, created the management of an “illegal warehouse of captured property”, from which he gave gifts to the deputy heads of the SMERSH NN Selivanovsky, I. I. Vradiyu and others high-ranking security officers. Vadis did not forget himself either - valuable property was sent to the family by an official plane from Germany to Moscow, and his wife Vadis speculated on them. The very same from Berlin brought the car furniture and other things, as well as a car. Then Vadis brought trophies acquired during his work in Manchuria (served as the commander of the SMERSH Trans-Baikal Front) —fur, silk and woolen fabrics, and so on. Subsequently, Vadis reached the Deputy Department of State Security of the Ukrainian SSR, but in January 1952 was excluded from the party for not providing measures to eliminate the OUN underground, excessive drinking and excessive love of trophies (A. Teplyakov “On corruption in the NKVD-NKGB-MGB-KGB of the USSR”).

To be continued ...

Comments

[Shadowcat]

One of the causes of death of L.P. Beria, I.V. Stalin.
"At the planning meeting, one of the generals told Stalin that he had problems exporting the trophy from Germany. Stalin smoked a pipe and ordered the major to be allowed, to which he reasonably remarked that he was a major general. Stalin, signing the document, only indicated that it contained a permit for the major."
And so from serious ones - to recall. G.K. Zhukov - he had several gold accordions in his country house, a mass of gilded books in different languages. At the same time, Zhukov did not seem to play accordions (or was he different for every day?) And did not speak foreign languages.

[ImPerts]

Zhukov knew how to play and loved. There is no subtracting or adding. But with an overabundance of various "values", the marshal went too far ...
Returning to stories about Stalin:
“Immediately after the war, Rokossovsky rebuilt a huge dacha for himself and invited the entire Politburo and the entire General Staff to wash it ... Stalin came too. We walked all night, sang songs, remembered the war. In the morning everyone said goodbye, then Stalin said:
“Thank you so much, comrade.” Rokossovsky, you built a good children's holiday home.
On the same day, the house was inhabited by orphans.
Rokossovsky himself then “had fun” about this for a long time, and several times washed a new, more modest house, but in a narrower circle. "

[Shadowcat]

Is logical. Do not hitchhike. What can not be taken away from the generalissimo is that he welcomed and besieged everyone equally. For example, he gave Zhukov the right to take Berlin, although before that the First Belorussian Front was headed by KK Rokossovsky.
Continue to poison?
"At one of the banquets, Stalin congratulated Rokossovsky on a successful operation and when the edge of his glass clinked glasses it turned out to be lower than that of the general. According to the Georgian tradition, it was a sign of respect. Naturally, Konstantin Konstantinovich immediately found a reason to clink glasses with J.V. Stalin again this time making its edge already lower. So they duck to the floor. "
:-)

[svp67]

Quote: ShadowCat

Is logical. Do not hitchhike.

Yes, order must be maintained. But do "the means always justify the ends"? This is apparently the question that everyone decides for himself.

Quote: ShadowCat

For example, he gave Zhukov the right to take Berlin, although before that the First Belorussian Front was headed by KK Rokossovsky.

"Gave the right"? You somehow imagine it strangely. It was just that in that situation Berlin had to be taken quickly in order to deprive our allies of one of the trump cards - the time during which they could capture more German territory or simply make peace with Germany. Alas, with all my deepest respect for Konstantin Konstantinovich Rokossovsky, he would have carried out this operation longer. Zhukov was akin to a "pitbull" in character, he "tore" everyone, both his own and others, feeling neither pain nor remorse, and then Konev tried to challenge his right to Berlin, trying with the forces of his front, in spite of the initial decision of the bet, to enter Berlin, while Zhukov, with his troops, crushed the Germans on the Seelow Heights and on the outskirts of Berlin, and seized the City Center.

[Idiot]

The story about the right to "first night" was launched by Konev. Briefly: 18.03.1945/2/1 Eisenhower notified the Supreme Command Headquarters of the Allies' refusal to take Berlin. Stalin understood - it was time to act, the Yankees were preparing to become the first. It was known that the US Army "battle donkey" Patton, a fierce Russophobe, was already preparing a group of troops for a throw, and the Germans were stupidly folding the western front in front of the allies, having transferred all combat-ready formations to the east. Zhukov and Konev were urgently summoned to Headquarters, as front commanders who were immediately ready to go on the offensive relatively immediately, and that is only why. At the same time, the 12nd Belorussian Front of Rokossovsky receives the task of covering Zhukov from the north, and the 1st Ukrainian Front of Konev is instructed to cut off Wenck's 1th Army from Berlin and, accordingly, cover the 10400st Belorussian Front of Zhukov from the south. Zhukov was instructed to prevent the withdrawal of formations of Army Groups Center and Vistula (1500 million men, 3300 guns, 300 tanks and self-propelled guns, 000 combat aircraft) to Berlin proper. In Berlin there are up to 3 mostly irregular troops. Therefore, Zhukov is storming the Seelow Heights head-on, while bypassing the line from the north. Konev was haunted by the laurels of the conqueror of Berlin, and when he reached the dividing line between the fronts, part of the forces (8 TA Rybalko) arbitrarily turned north, notifying Headquarters after the maneuver. The rate approved. As they say, the winners are not judged. After 24.04.1945 days of fighting, 30.04.1945. Zhukov and Konev met at the Brandenburg Gate. 02.05.1945/1/37610 Hitler is dead. 2/13070/1 the Berlin garrison capitulated. Irrecoverable losses of three fronts: 27580st Baltic Fleet: 78291 people, 4,1nd Baltic Fleet: 1 people, 906st UV: 200 people. Total: 48 people or 6% of 9 people. This is a lot, but did they fill up with corpses? Such is the bloody algebra of war - no one considered the losses of the Germans at all, in fact, the Wehrmacht lost 37 infantry, 98 tank, 200 motorized divisions, 1942 separate infantry regiments, XNUMX separate infantry battalions, XNUMX Volkssturm battalions. All were destroyed! And the choice of the conqueror of Berlin fell on Zhukov, because his front stood in front of the main line of defense of the Germans, the choice was due to the geographical factor. One should not overestimate the role of the commander in the city meat grinder, especially since the tactics of conducting street battles were developed back in XNUMX, on the streets of Voronezh and Stalingrad. Strength breaks strength. The plan of the Berlin operation was developed at the Supreme Command Headquarters, Zhukov only carried out it.

[voyaka uh]

"Briefly: 18.03.1945/XNUMX/XNUMX. Eisenhower notified the Supreme Command Headquarters about the Allies' refusal to take Berlin.
Stalin understood - it's time to act, the Yankees are preparing to become the first "////

In Yalta, it was strictly recorded that the Red Army would take Berlin.
The Americans settled on the Elbe, as agreed. Roosevelt in writing in several telegrams categorically forbade General Patton to move on.
Two weeks later, units of the Red Army approached.
No one interfered with the Red Army calmly taking Berlin, as she pleased.

[cap]

Quote: ImPerts

“Thank you so much, comrade.” Rokossovsky, you built a good children's holiday home.
On the same day, the house was inhabited by orphans.
Rokossovsky himself then “had fun” about this for a long time, and several times washed a new, more modest house, but in a narrower circle. "

For those interested in the topic, read.
http://www.oboznik.ru/?p=11576

The author bypassed the essence of the issue. Trophies were officially resolved.
And do not forget there were rules for the export of trophies.
For soldiers there is one suitcase, for generals it’s a limitation. One car. A Ph.D. thesis on finances is defended on this subject (at the WEFEF under the IFI), commissioned by the USSR Ministry of Defense in the 70s.
Stored under the heading "Sov.sek."
Of course, the author may not know about this.
That something like this.

[WKS]

The bourgeoisie and grabbing is the scourge of the Soviet high command personnel. An episode from personal practice and without specific names. The commander of the Northern Group of Forces inspects one of the army depots in Poland. Glancing lazily at the property laid out on the shelves, underpants, T-shirts, gymnasts, boots ... - suddenly his gaze freezes on the shelf, where towering stacks of blue and pink women's bike panties. "And what's that?" he asks the warehouse management. "Underwear for women military personnel" - the authorities answer. After walking a few more steps, he again returns to the shelf that interested him, says to the warehouse manager: "Wrap up a pair of size 52 and take it to the driver in the car."

[svp67]

Quote: wks

Petty bourgeoisie and grappling are the scourge of the Soviet higher command staff.

Oh what? And how did German feel in this regard?

[3agr9d0tryad]

Quote: svp67

And how did German feel in this regard?

And how do you feel, giving the fascist army as a "reference point"?

[3agr9d0tryad]

Quote: wks

Petty bourgeoisie and grappling are the scourge of the Soviet higher command staff.

Take more, grafting is the scourge of the Soviet nomenclature of both that and subsequent times.

[gladcu2]

To begin with, “grabbing” requires a clear definition.

Without a definition, it is not clear what the problem is. Because in the Soviet Union, moral standards were determined by ideology. Ideology IS A CONSCIOUS OR FORCEDLY changed morality.

In general, in the modern world, ideology and the right morality can be controlled only through the right state system of education.

Religion was previously worried about morality. No matter what. Each country had its own dominant monotheistic religion. And the purity of this religion was monitored not only by churchmen but also by the state. All or not all knew that sects were banned in the USSR. They left only a few religions but brought them out of the state. Nevertheless, the Code of the Builder of Communism was officially introduced. One hundred is essentially biblical morality.

Once again I want to remind and explain. MORAL is the guarantee of the stability of the state. The evidence of powerful morality in the state is the poverty of the "lawyer corps". The number of civil litigations in courts is not significant. It was so in the USSR. The work of lawyers was not popular.

Well, about capitalism, you see for yourself. The media are not subject to state censorship. It is called true that tomorrow will be a lie, depending on who pays the most. Religions without state support and powerful pressure from the media lose control of morality. Education is trying to minimize because education is dangerous for the existence of capitalism.

The population requires possession of personal weapons. Since only personal weapons under capitalism are the guarantor of civil rights.

And so on.

[gladcu2]

I wrote what it is for.

This is an example of how ideology crashes. Those. those who are obliged to monitor moral and ideological foundations themselves create incidents of violation. And the consequences will be even if the fact of such a violation is a usual TALK.
Therefore, the USSR without censorship in the media is not possible.

I am not saying that the USSR is bad. The USSR is still a country not surpassed in terms of organization. Confidence in life.

But, a stable state was only due to ideology.

Therefore, ideology is very serious. Once you receive such a weapon, you need careful, meticulous care.

Modern states are also not without flaws.

The problem is legislation. Legislation should adhere to morality not conflict with it. For example, these LGBT people. Who do they interfere with? Nobody, then why give them higher civil rights? The answer is this for puppet states done. To undermine the moral foundations of state stability.

Whose LGBT people are raging? In Germany, Canada, France, in Ukraine. Why? Because the governments of these countries will not pursue a policy of national interests. Even in the states, many states refuse to amend their laws in favor of LGBT people.

Summary. The state begins with MORAL.

[AllXVahhaB]

Quote: cap

Stored under the heading "Sov.sek."

And how do you know that?

[Monarchist]

Marshal Grechko personally reported to him

[svp67]

Quote: cap

Stored under the heading "Sov.sek."

What is stored? Thesis or order?

If there is an order, then here it is and it has a stamp - "Secret", otherwise it could not simply be used in their activities by a huge number of people who simply had to use it.

Order of the NPO of the USSR “On the organization of the reception and delivery of parcels from the Red Army, sergeants, officers and generals of the active fronts to the rear of the country”
No. 0409 December 26, 1944
Approved by the People's Commissar of Defense of the USSR
The State Defense Committee decrees No. 7054 of December 1, 1944 [32] and No. 7192s of December 23, 1944 [33] allowed well-performing Red Army soldiers, sergeants and officers, as well as generals of operating fronts to send personal parcels to house.
Parcels can be sent no more than once a month in the following sizes: for ordinary and sergeant personnel - 5 kg, for officers - 10 kg and for generals - 16 kg.
In pursuance of these decisions of the State Defense Committee - I order:
1. From January 1, 1945, at the military postal stations, open reception of personal parcels from the Red Army, sergeants, officers of units, formations and institutions, as well as from generals of the active fronts of the Red Army for sending to the rear of the country.
2. Parcels from subunits and units at military postal stations shall be received from senders (Red Army soldiers, sergeants, and officers) only with the permission in each case of the unit commander, unit, or head of the corresponding military institution.
3. Reception of military packages from the Red Army and the sergeant is free. From officers and generals charge 2 rubles per kilogram for sending parcels.
The military postal authorities should accept parcels with declared value: from ordinary and sergeant personnel - up to 1000 rubles, from officers up to 2000 rubles and from generals - up to 3000 rubles with the collection of insurance fees at the current rate.
4. To receive mail parcels to the head of the Main Directorate of Communications of the Red Army, organize:
a) as part of the military postal stations of the compounds - the separation of mail parcels of three people;
b) as part of the army military postal stations of the first and second echelons - the separation of parcels of two people in each;
c) as part of the army military postal bases - a parcel department of 15 people;
d) as part of the front-line military postal stations of the first and second echelons - separation of packages of two people each;
d) as part of the frontline military sorting center - a parcel department of 20 people.
To form the above divisions and departments of postal parcels, increase the number of military postal stations of the division, corps, army and front by one officer in each, and increase the number of front-line military sorting points by five officers. The rest of the composition of departments and parcels departments should be staffed to the established state due to the existing number of military postal agencies of divisions, armies and fronts.
5. Parcels shall be sent from military postal stations of formations to military postal bases of armies and from army bases to front-line military postal sorting points by transporting formations, armies and fronts. In addition to providing transport for the transportation of parcels, the commanders of formations, military councils of armies, and the chiefs of logistics of fronts should be provided with the necessary security to accompany the parcels.

[svp67]

6. The transportation of military parcels from front-line mail-sorting points for delivery to the People's Commissariat of Communications shall be carried out by special military-mail trains.
To the head of the Main Directorate of Communications and the head of the rear of the Red Army, together with the NKPS, to form and provide materially one train for the 1st and 2nd Baltic, 1, 2 and 3rd Belorussian, 1, 4, 2 and 3rd Ukrainian fronts consisting of 15 covered wagons and one human wagon for maintenance personnel and military guards, for a total of up to 25 people.
Formed military post trains subordinate to the chief of communications of the fronts.
If a large number of parcels are accumulated at the front-line military postal sorting points, submit military applications to the NKPS for additional number of wagons to the military postal trains.
7. For the export of military parcels from front-line military mail sorting points located in the area of ​​Western European gauge railroads, Commander Khrulev, the head of the rear of the Red Army, General of the Army, and the head of the Main Directorate of Communications of the Red Army, Marshal Peresypkin, according to the above type military post trains from wagons of the Western European gauge and to ensure the transshipment of parcels to the military post trains of domestic gauge.
8. Military parcels from military postal sorting points of the fronts for delivery to the bodies of the People's Commissariat of Communications should be delivered by military postal trains:
from the 1st and 2nd Baltic fronts - to the station. Riga;
from the 1st, 2nd and 3rd Belorussian fronts - to the station. Minsk;
from the 1st, 4th, 2nd and 3rd Ukrainian fronts - to the station. Kiev.
Military parcels from units and formations of the 14th separate army shall be delivered to communications agencies in the city of Murmansk, and from units and formations of the Leningrad Front to Leningrad.
9. To the Chief of the Main Organizational Directorate of the General Staff of the Red Army by January 1, 1945, make changes and additions to the staff of the military field mail in accordance with paragraphs 4, 6 and 7 of this order.
10. From January 1, 1945, to transfer to the head of the rear of the Red Army the entire officer, sergeant, and red army personnel engaged in the reception, delivery, and protection of military parcels for food according to norm No. 1 of order NCO No. 312 1941
11. From January 1, 1945, the chief of the Financial Department of the Red Army should establish that all officers and sergeants working in the reception and delivery of military parcels from the fronts will receive 25% higher salaries.
12. To accept for guidance and execution the attached Instructions for the reception, processing, forwarding and delivery of military parcels from active fronts to the rear of the country.
13. The commanders of units, formations and heads of institutions of the army should explain to all servicemen the Instructions on the procedure for sending personal parcels from the army to the rear of the country.
14. The military councils of the fronts to submit to me by February 15, 1945 reports on the progress in the implementation of this order.
Deputy People's Commissar of Defense of the USSR
Army General Bulganin

[svp67]

INSTRUCTIONS
on the receipt, processing, shipment and delivery of military parcels
from existing fronts to the rear of the country
Approved by GKO
No. 7192c dated December 23, 1944
General situation
Military parcels from the rank-and-file, sergeant, officers and generals of the Red Army for sending to the rear of the country are received at military postal stations of the formations of the active fronts of the Red Army.
Package weight set:
From ordinary and sergeant staff - up to 5 kg, otofitserskogo - up to 10 kg, from generals - up to 16 kg.
The maximum parcel size must not exceed 70 cm in each of the three changes.
Military parcels from the Red Army and non-commissioned officers are accepted free of charge, from officers and generals for a fee of 2 rubles per kilogram. Parcels, at the request of the senders, can also be delivered with declared value: from ordinary and non-commissioned officers –– 1000 rubles, from officers –– up to 2000 rubles, and from generals –– up to 3000 rubles with the collection of an insurance fee at the current rate.
It is forbidden to send in parcels: weapons, items of military equipment and uniforms of the Red Army, flammable, explosives, toxic substances, medicines, all kinds of liquids, perishable products, written investments, money in various currencies, all kinds of literature and other printed material.
Parcels packed in hard corking (wooden box, suitcase), sheathed with durable material or in soft closure sheathed with durable material are subject to acceptance.

[svp67]

Receiving parcels
Parcels from subunits and units to the military postal station are delivered personally by senders (Red Army soldiers, sergeants, officers) and are accepted for dispatch with the permission of the unit commander, unit or head of the corresponding military institution.
Parcels for shipment are presented in open form to verify the attachment. After checking the attachment, the parcel is tightly clogged and sewn up, tied up crosswise with twine with a pass under the shell at the corners of the parcel and sealed with the seal of the military postal station.
In the upper right corner of the parcel and on the accompanying form the inscription “Military” is made.
At the reception of each parcel by the military post station, the sender is issued a separate receipt of the established form.
Delivery of parcels to the enterprises of the People's Commissariat of Communications
Military parcels by military postal institutions are delivered to the Narkomsvyaz enterprises at specified points, with name-by-word verification of parcels, in groups developed in accordance with the established procedure for sorting and sending correspondence, with the obligatory delivery of a form of an accompanying address.
On invoices, the mark "Military" is made.
Parcels with damaged shells, unsealed, with severely damaged or unclear seals, parcels that leak or are clearly missing in weight, are delivered to the People's Commissariat of Communications enterprises only after they have been repacked and the listed defects have been eliminated by acts.
If mixed packages of parcels are found upon delivery, then in this case they are unloaded from the wagons, put in order in accordance with the documents, and only after that they are delivered to the military postal distribution base of the People's Commissariat of Communications.
Delivery of parcels in the enterprises of the People's Commissariat of Communications
Notifications of addressees of the arrival of parcels to their address are processed in a dedicated manner and delivered to the Narkomsvyaz enterprises in a timely manner.
Undelivered parcels to the addressees, due to their absence, are not returned to the senders, and after a 2-month storage period at the points of delivery they are handed over for sale to the state trading network for sale at state prices to invalids of the Patriotic War and families of war veterans.
The hosting organizations donate the amount received from the sale to the People's Commissariat of Communications for sending by postal orders to the senders of these parcels.
Material liability
For parcels lost due to wartime circumstances in the areas of the front rear, the military field post and the People's Commissariat of Communications do not bear material liability to the recipients and senders. For parcels lost due to other circumstances, to pay compensation for the cost of parcels to senders within the declared value, at the expense of the Narkomsvyaz insurance fund in accordance with the established procedure.
Applications for the search for parcels from senders are accepted and considered by the communications departments of the fronts and, in the center, by the military post office of the Main communications department of the Red Army.
Applications for the search for parcels filed by recipients with the People's Commissariat of Communications are the last to be sent to the Military Bureau of Postage Accounting in Moscow.
The procedure for receiving, processing, processing, forwarding and issuing military parcels to the extent not provided for in this Instruction is carried out in accordance with the current rules and instructions for postal use.
People's Commissar of Communications of the USSR Sergeychuk
Head of the Main Directorate of Communications of the Red Army
Marshal of the Communications Troops Peresypkin

RGVA. F. 4. Op. 11. D. 78. L. 491-498.

[Idiot]

There is, in my opinion, some refined sarcasm in these 16 general pounds. Great Boss! Why not 15kg. or not 20kg. or not 30kg. Why exactly 16kg.? So I see: the arrow on the scales of the capter is trembling between 15 and 16. The general shouts: your scales are not calibrated, the weight was filled with lead, the son of a bitch! ..

[Alexander Greene]

I suggest ImPertz (1) their post was successful, so as not to dirty the name of K.K. Rokossovsky. This incident occurred with Papanin.

[svp67]

Quote: ImPerts

But with an overabundance of various "values", the marshal went too far ...

What did you want from the peasant son? Do not forget that Zhukov was a peasant and he had it at the "genetic level". And here, no offense, a person is very difficult to remake.

[Idiot]

Being the chief of the General Staff of the Red Army from January to July 1941, Zhukov, along with Timoshenko, was guilty of the catastrophic defeat of the formations of the North-Western, Western Special and Kiev military districts. Zhukov was never a commander, always - only an effective executor of someone else's strategic plan. For him, blood is the same liquid as the rest. Being a nonentity, as they say "from rags to riches", having believed in the myth of his military leader's genius by the end of the war, "lost the coast." He was robbing in trains. He had so many paintings in his house that they did not fit on the walls of the living quarters and even hung in the kitchen and hallway (the house was not small, a kind of mini-palace). He was justly grounded by Stalin, who also had a limit of patience and was demoted. This story is now being presented by modern cinema myth-makers (Baluyev as Zhukov) as the persecution of the cannibalistic Master on the bogey of the Great Victory! To understand the difference in scale between Stalin and Zhukov, who personified almost the entire Soviet post-war generals, ask what property was left after Stalin's death and what was seized from the military elite during searches, why did Shulzhenko settle down? ..

[Sergej1972]

Shulzhenko never sat.

[svp67]

Quote: Sergej1972

Shulzhenko never sat.

Our vis-a-vie, hot as Vesuvius, in his "righteous" anger confused the names, apparently wanted to name Ruslanov, but forgot ...

[svp67]

Quote: pft, fkb

Being the head of the General Staff of the Red Army from January to July 1941, Zhukov, along with Tymoshenko, is guilty of the catastrophic defeat of the North-Western, Western Special and Kiev military districts

Well, the list of perpetrators is MUCH longer. Although it usually begins with the surname Stalin and continues with the surnames Pavlov, Klimovsky, Grigoryev, Klich, Tayursky Oborin and Korobkov.

Quote: pft, fkb

Zhukov was never a commander,

Well here you can argue.

Quote: pft, fkb

What did Shulzhenko sit for? ..

And you can details, but somehow the people do not know. And I myself think Claudia Ivanovna too.

[Colonel]

Quote: ImPerts

Immediately after the war, Rokossovsky built himself a huge summer cottage and invited the whole Politburo and the whole General Staff to wash ...

Unique stupidity!

[AK64]

Unique stupidity!

This is not stupidity, this is the slander of these "comrades" against Rokkosovsky.

This story was told about Papanin's cottage even BEFORE the war.

(True, Papanin didn’t invite EVERYTHING at once; he just invited Stalin at some point too)

[Sergej1972]

Most likely, Papanin is also a bike.

[SergeBS]

Quote: ImPerts

Immediately after the war, Rokossovsky built himself a huge cottage

This is not about Rokossovsky. Correct the name on the CORRECT.
About Rokossovsky was different:
- Comrade Stalin, Rokossovsky has a lover - a beauty, and his wife does not mind. What we are going to do?
- That we will ... We will envy!

[AK64]

Zhukov knew how to play and loved. There is no subtracting or adding. But with an overabundance of various "values", the marshal went too far ...
Returning to stories about Stalin:
“Immediately after the war, Rokossovsky rebuilt a huge dacha for himself and invited the entire Politburo and the entire General Staff to wash it ... Stalin came too. We walked all night, sang songs, remembered the war. In the morning everyone said goodbye, then Stalin said:
“Thank you so much, comrade.” Rokossovsky, you built a good children's holiday home.
On the same day, the house was inhabited by orphans.
Rokossovsky himself then “had fun” about this for a long time, and several times washed a new, more modest house, but in a narrower circle. "

One small, tiny nuance: this could not be. Rokkosovsky actually lived in Poland.

But this is not the point: they told this bike about the summer cottage ... Papanin, moreover, the pre-war one. Papanin was the head of the North Sea Route, that is, the organization is huge. Well, I built myself a summer house. Moreover (the dude!) Greek marble brought for her, and boasted of it.

Here they gave his summer house to a kindergarten or orphanage.

So ... you slander Rokkosovsky, retelling gossip of women.

About the summer cottages: under the house of Trotskyist Ostrovsky, the one in Sochi gave away ... the buildings of a specially constructed children's samatorium.
But this was already a trick of Gamarnik, Gamarnik got into his own sweetheart.

[siberalt]

Again this Samsonov, a lover of scouring the "rubbish heaps" of Russian history, throws dirt at the fan. Be sure to throw anything nasty about the USSR on the forum. What kind of corruption could there be if there was no private property as the environment that generates it? And careerists, grabbers and bribe-takers were always and everywhere. But we fought hard with them.

[avt]

Quote: siberalt

What kind of corruption could there be if private property did not exist, as the environment generating it?

Well, why go into insanity? Can you refresh the criminal case of those years about the underground building part?

Quote: siberalt

no nasty thing about the USSR will throw on the forum.

Nothing here "nasty"? Yes, by and large, for what the Germans did in the USSR during the war ... but simply for creating the Ost plan, they had every right to disassemble all of Germany, without referring to the customs of war! It's another matter, how did it all fit into the “moral image of the builders of communism?” It is clear that this is not trade in the besieged Leningrad with products in a warehouse for briolki and antiques. BUT! I think so - Stalin saw how new bars began to form, the descendants of which in 1991 year, they still managed to live according to the principle - that we would have everything and we would have nothing for it, and now the descendant of the teacher of Marxism-Leninism, Igor Chtsbais, is all such a monarchist, and with Gavrilka Popov, a booklet about how Vlasov made his way into Leningrad, in order to lead the resistance against Stalin. Again, he knew good history about the Decembrists who passed that Patriotic War too. So along the way he solved the problem of keeping the generals in check, well, of course the methods were old, checked He worked ahead of the curve; as a politician with a bestial instinct, he needed a half-hint in the form of Zhukov's close contacts with Eisenhower. Do you think Stalin did not know and did not give the intelligence task to calculate promising politicians for the presidency of the USA? The GPU / OGPU / NKGB / KGB in general is a POLITICAL structure - the vanguard of the CPSU.

[siberalt]

Do not confuse God's gift with fried eggs. Corruption is an integral part of the system of organization of government and administration. Its distinctive part is the sale of posts in order to extract bureaucratic rents, as ifs for profit and the emergence of private property protected by the state. In the USSR there was no private property, there was personal, state, cooperative and property of public organizations. Private was illegal. And the fact that we are being tricked into corruption in the form of bribes by traffic cops or doctors with school teachers is complete insanity. And how can corruption be defeated in a state if it cannot function without it by definition? Learn the match, dear.

[unsinkable]

Quote: siberalt

What kind of corruption could there be if private property did not exist, as the environment generating it?

My friend, knowing your comments on VO, I’ll just tell you that you are mistaken. Yes, you yourself will understand this, remembering about the Soviet guilds. About the article. I will not dispute that trophies were being taken excessively. I think that Zhukov is not sinless. But what he did to win, but he really did, does not deprive him of the title MARSHAL VICTORY. With all sins inherent in man.

[SergeBS]

Quote: unsinkable

does not rob him of the title MARSHAL VICTORY.

Feldfebel Victory, its complete insignificance in military affairs, blood-smeared, wherever this happens.

[siberalt]

"Soviet tsekhoviki" is a completely different topic. They were not built into the state system of the USSR, and corruption was originally built into it.

[alstr]

Note. Gilded books - how is it? If the pages are gilded around the perimeter (i.e., the edge), then in fact this is the standard design of books for libraries, because this prevents books from being damaged by dampness and other factors. So this is not an indicator. Now, if the covers were gold, then this is another matter.

[SergeBS]

Quote: ShadowCat

And so from serious ones - to recall. G.K. Zhukov - he had several gold accordions in his country house, a mass of gilded books in different languages.

Also remember 12 (!) Versions of his "memoirs", of which 11 - after death, and all - "on the topic of the day." My daughter tried. All dad.

[cap]

With Victory did not grow together they took up the Marshals of Victory.
I can’t even judge who needs it.
Historians? Let them study on health.
Want freedom of the press? publicity? tolerance? fame?
Nail the Kremlin’s causal place.
One free artist nailed. Even the prize was given. International!
European!

[Camel]

With Victory did not grow together they took up the Marshals of Victory.
I can’t even judge who needs it.

It is for the exaltation of Our Victory that these matters are considered! So that later there would be no fake photos where a Soviet soldier takes a bicycle and the like.

The enemy’s goal is to make us believe that a Soviet soldier came to Berlin for profit, and not to DESTROY the fascist reptile! They (the enemies) still do not understand why the Soviet soldiers did NOT destroy Germany.

Because of this, they (the enemies) do not develop propaganda, they cannot provoke the wrath of their own nation! They themselves will never wash off the nuclear bombing of PEACEFUL cities!


PS For "cap" If you are against - you are welcome to Red Square, I will bring a hammer and a nail myself

[unsinkable]

Quote: Camel

I’ll bring a hammer and a nail myself

And let me beat.

[Monarchist]

Such scum that they are trying to discredit our victory for ... hanging on poles. The truth is that some people across the ocean will not like it

[SergeBS]

Bro, you forgot about "10 million German women raped by SA". THIS was also in the Western press. As there Lavrov: "stupid people, bHya." Each SA soldier is given an order: "to rape 2, and preferably 3". No other way.

[3agr9d0tryad]

Quote: SergeBS

Each SA soldier is given an order: "to rape 2, and preferably 3"

Well, I don’t know about the number of Germans, but according to the practice of that time, there were usually up to 10 soldiers per German.

[excomandante]

Thanks, read with interest.

[ImPerts]

They brought everything from Germany (and not only Germany). But in different volumes. For small volumes, they often closed their eyes. But the cars and trains have already attracted the attention of the competent authorities. Wagons and trains spilled over into such matters.

[def89]

My grandfather came with two suitcases of trophies, and there were no problems. Three sisters need to dress at home, you won’t live on some cards, the elder sister Klava lost her leg on the Karelian front, her brother died in Ukraine in the 43rd. And I want to eat.

[excomandante]

There was such a bike (I don’t know how true) that a smart soldier brought home a box of sewing needles from a non-metchina, the family lived at the expense of these needles for 20 years)))

[Aviator_]

This is not a bike, only there was not a box, but a small suitcase. And about 20 years of a comfortable life - this is a bike.

[Dart2027]

The craving for material led to the degeneration of the Soviet elite, turned it into a bourgeois class with philistine psychology. The Soviet project was based on building a society of creation and service, and here the rudiments of a consumer society appeared.
It would be strange if this did not happen. People remain people, with all the corresponding advantages and disadvantages.

[bogdan4ik]

Everything is correct, but the trouble is that after the war, Stalin was not able to shoot all the crooks and enemies, as after the revolution and the Civil War. So the globe grew like Khrushchev, Zhukov and other Trotskyists

[apro]

A trophy thing? I think this covered up the completely pleasant word marauding, everyone sinned and dragged from Germany and not only, more grandma officers once said in a conversation that after the war she knew one carriage of good was captain served. Of course the war certainly was bad, but conscience also needs to be in place when the state has been doing this and distributing this one thing, but if everyone was dragging it, it’s decay and undermining social justice.

[avg-mgn]

according to some researchers, this was an occasion to remove from the Olympus the popular commander, Marshal G.K. Zhukov.

My father-in-law (the kingdom of heaven to him), in the 44th after the injury served as a driver in these very "trophy troops", and so he did not talk about the total plunder, but only mentioned that the authorities allowed themselves a dozen gold tsatseks to hold, but they feared Smersh as fire. He himself brought a trophy - two silver tablespoons and a silver cigarette case, it seems that Smersh did not make any claims to the sergeant in such volumes. Probably, the higher the commander's rank, the lower the control threshold was. But it was a war, and it ended long ago, but the rapids remained

[Barakuda]

My grandfather brought a bicycle from the war. Well this is necessary, from Germany to Vladikavkaz .. Father traveled, I ... until they stole

[Mordvin 3]

Рђ РјРѕР№ дед РїСЂРёРІРѕР »РѕРє РґРІРµ С € вейны Рµ РјР ° С € РёРЅРєРё Рё Р ° ккордеон.

[vanavatny]

German compass, a few coins, a mug of obscure metal (I drink beer from it), a razor, a Japanese casket and an ashtray grandfather - major, grandmother - sergeant

[kalibr]

Well, my adoptive father was a colonel and brought - two paintings from the Dresden Museum - a reward from Marshal Rokossovsky, directly from the storerooms, a silver salary of an 11 century prayer book, 18 century furniture from oak to an apartment, and much more. So it was not an apartment, but a museum. But ... everything was according to the law, there were no complaints.

[vanavatny]

what is taken from the battle is holy

[3agr9d0tryad]

Quote: vanavate

what is taken from the battle is holy

When? In the days of the Tatar-Mongol yoke? Maybe we will return the custom of blood feud?

[Silhouette]

Quote: kalibr

my adoptive father was a colonel and brought - two paintings from the Dresden Museum - an award from Marshal Rokossovsky, directly from the storerooms, a silver salary for an 11th-century prayer book, 18th-century oak furniture to an apartment, and much more. So it was not an apartment, but a museum. But ... everything was according to the law, there were no complaints.

Two paintings from the Dresden Museum, which was "in charge" of Marshal Rokossovsky - is this by law? Can you name the law? Or at least the position of adoptive father. Probably the Germans, according to this law, removed some room from Peterhof from amber. Well, the pictures were presented from our museums to their subordinates for merits.
Marauder is your stepfather. That's all. And what did not attract - so cunning and slippery.

[Alexander Greene]

kalibr, do not get dirty the name of Marshal Rokossovsky. There wasn’t that!

[Silhouette]

Of course it wasn’t. This is the tale of the old man-marauder for silly little children who do not mature with their minds.

[kalibr]

On them behind the signature were-for what, to whom and from whom!

[kalibr]

Imagine it! And it so happened that because of his knowledge of the Polish language, he was "sent" to the Polish army, to fight and "monitor the mood." At one time he graduated from the intelligence school, so it was a task in his specialty. And after the war he was left in Poland as the head of the special department of the Krakow VO. Marshals Zhimersky and Rokossovsky were the people to whom he made a report, sometimes even at night. And Rokossovsky had an award fund, where there were all sorts of interesting items and he awarded them right away without delay. An inscription was made on the back, then the award paper was drawn up at the headquarters and that's it. There were also paintings. Of the storage rooms, not very valuable, most often with an inscription, the author is unknown. On one there was a cityscape, on the other - a huge three marabou birds stood on an egg and thought. If you have read my novel "Let's Die Near Moscow," then it says how he got the first two trophies. Now I am working on its continuation, there will be about all this in detail. At one time he wanted to write about it himself, wrote two manuscripts: "This is how the steel was tempered" and "On this side of the grate." I read excerpts where it was all described in Soviet times. But he gave it up to reprint, and the typist died. And the heirs ... threw away all the papers. And when, three months later, he came for the finished work - everything ended. I could not restore it. But my memory was good. I remember a lot.

[Silhouette]

Quote: kalibr

And Rokossovsky had an award fund, where there were all sorts of interesting objects, and he awarded them right away without delay. An inscription was made on the back, then at the headquarters award paper was drawn up and that was it. The paintings were there too.

Horror. To take someone else's is theft. Even the Germans did not think of rewarding their officers with stolen goods. Pictures from museums or icons from temples.
And the award fund from the assigned material values, created in violation of even the Soviet military and civil laws - how is it?
All award signatures are fakes made by your hit father, and documents with stamps are illegal.

[kalibr]

Are you sick in the head or stupid? A person awarded the highest orders of Poland: Virtuti Military, the Grunwald Cross, the Brave Cross and the Golden Cross of Merit, apart from our Red Star and World War II, is so stupid to lie because of two paintings by unknown artists - it's ridiculous. There was a war and the laws were looked a little different than they are today. From here, by the way, all these matters arose.

[Silhouette]

Those who served know how those who are not rewarded and who are innocent are punished. Four highest Polish orders for 4 post-war years - what is this for? For what feats? Plus two paintings from the Dresden Gallery from Rokosovsky. If you take into account the position of your stepfather - the head of the Special Department of the district, then all this seems to be redeeming, not premium.

[3agr9d0tryad]

Quote: Silhouette

Those who served know how those who are not rewarded and who are innocent are punished.

Well, actually in the Soviet army it was that the heavier the shoulder straps and party card, the heavier the order and the suitcase.
But what is Vyacheslav to blame for? What honestly writes about this? It's ridiculous!

[Monarchist]

I agree, this reminds the Germans that they grabbed the museums. In my opinion, KK, if he really wanted to donate, would have done without the treasures of the Dresden gallery. Perhaps, being a rogue, his stepfather invented a story about Rokossovsky, or maybe this "story" of recent origin?

[kalibr]

There, besides treasures, there was a lot of all outright shit. And then ... probably it was worth it?
Here is one of the episodes. An order from Moscow: to eliminate a certain cardinal. Tied to the West, anti-Soviet, but ... a cardinal. Therefore "no trace". Otherwise ... So he came up with it: he found out that the cardinal loves to "pour over the collar", but his heart is bad. I found two of the most drinking soldiers, dressed them in the uniform of colonels, hung with medals. And at some kind of celebration they hooked him up with the cardinal. And they began to drink! Without measure! They made up patriotic toasts. Collectible cognacs were brought ... The next morning the colonels were somehow pumped out. But the "man of God" has passed away! Are you saying that then it was "cheaper" than a painting by an unknown artist?

[Silhouette]

Yes you are that storyteller, kalibr! No worse than my friend.

[kalibr]

You might notice from my articles that I have no habit of lying to strangers to me. For me it is humiliating! And most importantly, I do not see the point in this. Why lie when it's easier not to lie. When there are archives, documents, and almost everything can be given with links to them. However, everyone judges by himself, right?

[Silhouette]

You are not lying. You are broadcasting a lie. Either out of ignorance, or out of stupidity.

[kalibr]

Dear without a name: it is so stupid to be so stupid to write so much (with such competition), to be published in Germany and England, and it is stupid to lie about trifles. And my stepfather didn't need that either. In Poland, when he was invited there on Victory Day in Soviet times, the officers saluted him on the street, and in the restaurant they approached (generally surprising!): "Pan gentleman, let me be present!" Surprisingly for us, it was the norm there. Or would you say that he also hung the Polish and Soviet orders on himself, and the photo of where he was with Rokossovsky and Zhimersky was Photoshop? No, that was all.

[Aleksander]

Quote: kalibr

You might notice from my articles that I have no habit of lying to strangers to me. For me it is humiliating!

It is obvious. Do not pay attention and write: as a rule, what you wrote is always interesting!

[kalibr]

And I don’t pay. I never thought that a banal example would cause such a reaction. However, I’m not surprised, this is a banal human envy: he was out of the Avon and what he had. Our destiny is to knock on the keyboard, there is no one to call, but here "you say peacocks." No one has canceled the gaps between social groups, they existed before, but now they are only getting worse. This is clear.

[Alexander Greene]

What is the difference between Caliber and Baron Munchausen?
Baron Münhausen was a harmless liar, and the caliber was a malicious dirty trick.

[kalibr]

“Everything will be as we want. In case of various troubles, We have a Maxim machine gun, They don’t have Maxim ”Healer Bellock“ New Traveler ”.
This is to ensure that you, Sanya, can write anything you want. 0 will be of benefit to you, and as I did what I consider necessary, I will!

[Alexander Greene]

Yes, Caliber knows his business very tightly. Just like Muller: "Slander! Something will remain!"

[Silhouette]

Quote: kalibr

However, I am not surprised, this is banal human envy: Avon, he is a whore and what he had.

I never envied the special officers, but did not consider them officers. And there were reasons for that. And why they were turned off and for what I knew firsthand.

Quote: kalibr

The abyss between social groups has not been canceled, they were before, and now only worsen.

The gulf does not exist between social groups, but between carriers of certain life rules, principles and worldviews. Views on what is good and what is bad.

We have an abyss in understanding some simple truths. And this is not surprising. After all, you grew up in the distorted information field of your stepfather, the special hero of the Krakow district, who was holding Rokosovsky and Zhimersky by the balls.

[kalibr]

"who by the balls held Rokosovsky himself with Zhimersky" Fi, how it went! Such statements humiliate you more than me. I don’t know about the truth, but we only meet here, and you are anonymous, but I don’t, I know that for sure. And your opinion, as it were, is more delicate, so it costs little. The social importance index is small.

[Silhouette]

Straight on Zhvanetsky: "What can a lame man say about the art of Herbert von Karoyan lame if he is told right away that he is lame?"

Think primitively and wretchedly dear. Indices or something else, be measured elsewhere if it is interesting to you and somehow inspires.

[kalibr]

You better write how much do you let in your Partenit apartment? People will appreciate it more, you look someone and will come to you and will live on something in winter!

[MrK]

Quote: Silhouette

Yes you are that storyteller, kalibr!

Of course. And who else can be a former teacher of History of the CPSU.
As they say, I used to be in the Communist Party and shit on the SS, now in the United States and .... settles the Communist Party.
What do you take from the changeling.
And his stepfather has a looter

[Sergej1972]

That’s all mean. This is not worth boasting about. This is actually a crime.

[kalibr]

Quote: Monarchist

I agree it reminds the Germans that they robbed museums

And how did Priam's treasure come to be with us?

[Silhouette]

Our Priam’s treasure turned out to be in the same way as the paintings of the Dresden Gallery. But not with you, but with the state. Apparently you are confusing your coat with the state. (from which Comrade Saakhov himself warned us).

[kalibr]

In any case, he was taken out and not returned, right?

[Silhouette]

Quote: kalibr

my adoptive father was a colonel and brought - two paintings from the Dresden Museum - an award from Marshal Rokossovsky, directly from the storerooms, a silver salary for an 11th-century prayer book, 18th-century oak furniture to an apartment, and much more. So it was not an apartment, but a museum. But ... everything was according to the law, there were no complaints.

Two paintings from the Dresden Museum, which was "in charge" of Marshal Rokossovsky - is this by law? Can you name the law? Or at least the position of adoptive father. Probably the Germans, according to this law, removed some room from Peterhof from amber. Well, the pictures were presented from our museums to their subordinates for merits.
Marauder is your stepfather. That's all. And what did not attract - so cunning and slippery.

[Uncle Murzik]

and many families got only the funeral!

[kalibr]

Yes, our family also got two of the two warring sons of the grandfather.

[parusnik]

kalibr Your stepfather could not bring the paintings from the Dresden Gallery, because she was buried by the Germans, and a special unit was engaged in her searches, under the command of Captain Volynsky ....

[kalibr]

He was in Poland until 1949. Then everything was found. A lot was sent to Moscow for restoration. A part (the most not valuable) remained in Germany, and, apparently, something went to the awards. Because on the back were the corresponding award inscriptions and additionally sheets signed by Rokossovsky. Just think for yourself: to drag from Poland one huge picture and one small ... nafig, when you could take a lot of "useful" things. But the fact of the matter is that I was obliged to take them!

[demotivator]

Here you need to clearly understand the difference between trophies and looting. My father also brought home German trophies from the war - what could fit in his soldier's duffel bag. This is a German straight razor of the Solingen brand and ONE silver spoon. And that's it! Probably, there was something else, but I remember only this from my childhood. In general, then Germany was "vacuumed" by everyone, as best he could, who had what opportunities for this. It is clear that the generals and marshals had incomparably more of them than ordinary soldiers. By and large, it, Germany, in general, all should be smashed to rubbish, to the last Kiripichik, so that all subsequent generations of Germans would forever understand how much grief and misfortune they brought to our people. As they say, to be remembered! But, there is one but. It is one thing when all the trophy goods have settled in the stash of a narrow circle of people, and another thing when it would have been released for the benefit of all our people. This is exactly what Stalin wanted - that the German and other reparations were used in this way. Well, Zhukov and a number of other generals did not think so, they wanted benefits only for themselves. So we paid. By the way, Rokossovsky did not have such problems with trophies. And not only with him. Let us recall the generals of the new formation and how they profited from the withdrawal of Soviet troops from Germany in the 90s? Did Kobets and his Caudle behave like an officer in those years? Nothing is new, everything has already happened ...

[Spartanez300]

A man of great leadership talent, bold and original in his judgments, very firm in implementing decisions in life, not stopping at any obstacles to achieve military objectives. Feeling right in this or that controversial issue, Georgy Konstantinovich could rather sharply object to Stalin, which no one dared to do, at one time was never appreciated. The eternal memory put the commander among the best strategists of all time.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Spartanez300

at one time was never appreciated.

Excuse me, but how should it have been evaluated? To erect a golden monument?
He had all the awards and fame, and if you think that he should have become a dictator, then there were no good dictators in principle.
You can kick the West as much as you like, but their system in the political system is more progressive. They will not be allowed to rule anyone more than the constitutionally stipulated and drastically change their political course. Yes, and it will not work much to steal. Well, yes, you elect deputies, and even now they they’ll follow the party lists right now, they will rush to improve your life .... Have you recruited all sorts of athletes, dancers, retirees to the Duma and think that they will work? Yes, for 17 years you could have passed normal laws for a long time.
By the way, Churchill was not put up a golden monument, although he did a lot for the country in his life. The Prime Minister is a manager hired by the state to manage and if he doesn’t manage well, you need to change it, there’s nothing wrong with that, and if you are appointed to a position nothing good will be

[King, just king]

Right and right! A plus.

[kalibr]

In England in the 18 century there was a certain Robert Clive. He led the assault on Seringapatama - in fact, conquered India. 1 drew a million pounds. Gotcha! Was convicted! Although it was a feather of England. At the trial he said - The rich city lay at my feet, I took it by military force. I took only 1 million and still am surprised at my modesty!
They sentenced him to chop off his head and ... chopped off! But at the same time they erected a monument and it says: "For the great and worthy services rendered to the British crown"

[Dart2027]

Did they just chop off his head? In my opinion he was acquitted and died later.

[kalibr]

I will not say yes or no. The memory lingered that they had been executed. If you know for sure that there is no, please give me a link so that I should be “executed” from my memory.

[Idiot]

Quote: kalibr

I will not say yes or no. The memory lingered that they had been executed. If you know for sure that there is no, please give me a link so that I should be “executed” from my memory.

This is a wonderful historian! This I understand! At first he confidently blurted out, as they say, was seized and from .. reb, immediately turned on the return flow - maybe I'm wrong, ... give a link. The main thing is to show that the great British are an example of state wisdom and universal morality. Not that these Russian, German poor fellows were unprofessionally raped and robbed. Pozooor! .. Something: we found spoons, but the sediment remained.

[SergeBS]

Here, damn it, another "couch warrior".

Quote: Spartanez300

Feeling right in one or another controversial issue, Georgy Konstantinovich could rather sharply object to Stalin, which no one dared to

FACTS in the studio. Comrade Zhukov, when it turned out - WAR, and Pavlov failed everything he could (although six months before that, half a year, Karl, at the command-staff exercises, this Pavlov was "raped" from the west), ran away and burst into tears. Pavlov was shot, not Zhukov.
More facts about "the authority among the people and the army was indisputable."
Uh-huh. "Zhukov has arrived - to be of great blood." front sign.
Points from the biography - a prosperous furrier in the 1st World War, at the end "for prestige" - he entered the Alekseevsky school, graduated from the accelerated program and was greatly offended - "I, from the people, were not given 1 point, but given to some volunteer Skorino (former student of St. Petersburg University) ".
The next point - "the regiment commander (cavalry) Zhukov is disgusted with staff work, because he is incapable of it. He is rude and disdainful of his regiment comrades." 1936 year.
Next item: Khalkhin-Gol. "Zhukov arrived - and won a month later." Urrya, comrades. Only a month of planning for such an operation - "it will not be enough" (then there were no computers, mobile too). But the "genius" Zhukov "modestly forgot" who prepared the operation. Like Berlin, which was prepared by Rokossovsky, but when there was only an order to give: "Forward", Rokossovsky was "removed" for his Polish name. Rokossovsky was then still the Commander-in-Chief of the Polish Army. After the war.
Let us also recall the Rzhev operation, which was commanded by the "great commander" G.K. Zhukov. She failed. But the distracting Stalingrad - well, everyone knows what happened there.
This is how he is "Marshal Pobeda", who hung his portraits on the territory of the GDR at every crossroads.
Feldfebel in Marshall epaulettes. But NEVER JV Stalin did not mind. This was done by Vasilevsky, Rokossovsky, Konev, but never by Zhukov.

[Leto]

While working in the police, several interesting captured German hunting rifles passed through me, most of them in very good condition, although the issues were pre-war. Mostly Zimson and Sauer. I remember there was one three-barrel fitting, under horizontally located smooth trunks of 12 klb. rifled barrel of unknown caliber. Rather, it was rifled, the owner drilled it in the 70s so as not to mess with the registration of rifles and there were no cartridges for it. The same number of trunks was exported from Germany, even if they are still encountered in Siberia.

[Andrey NM]

My grandfather had a German hunting rifle. I am extremely far from hunting, we can say that zero is complete. The gun was called the Sauer Three Rings, like a 12 gauge. And there was also a Viennese accordion, so small, it gave one sound to the release of the buttons, and another to the compression. My grandfather played it great, and even I learned a little (I was then studying the button accordion in the music school). And two Solingen razors. I have these razors, I even shaved with them at one time in autonomous machines. Interestingly, each razor was accompanied by a special certificate with numbers, such as a passport.
True, my grandfather said that he bought all this in some markets for brands, because the money was still not really needed, and you couldn’t put it on the plane anymore. He has been in military aviation since 1940, from February 1942 he flew on the IL-2, he survived, the war ended with a castle mask.

[Million]

Well, I understand that when Zhukov, Rokossovsky, they’re at least war heroes. But when the CLOWN! Galkin is building a castle for himself, which means that something wrong is happening in this country

[Igor39]

Everything is respected according to the laws of capitalism, everything is legal, jesters, sluts and homosexuals are held in high esteem now, such a time.

[King, just king]

So, and who pays Galkin, 5 each (approximately, I definitely don’t know) for the concert, so that he would build a castle?
When the miscarriages of the "star factory" are snotty, scratching the country - who pays them? Who pays all phonogram stars for full halls, who?

[demotivator]

By the way, about Rokossovsky's dacha, which Stalin allegedly took from him. In fact, in our history it was not the Rokossovsky summer residence, but the famous polar explorer Papanin. It was he who, having lost shame and having lost a sense of proportion, shook off a huge summer cottage, even by today's standards, trimmed it with expensive Italian and Greek marble and other gadgets. This question was then even specifically considered at the Politburo of the Central Committee, where Stalin said:
- Nobody wants to belittle the merits of Papanin. And the country appreciated his feat, having awarded the Hero Star. He got a state cottage. But this didn’t seem to him enough, and he decided to build a summer house for himself, where a kindergarten, which we lack, could freely be accommodated. He was not even satisfied with Soviet marble, give him Greek, Italian. Unfortunately, there are members of the Politburo ready to support him. But what will the working class and the working peasantry think about us, comrades? Can we close our eyes to this? But for the sake of what did we make a revolution if we have such untouchables, with whom everything is permitted?
“Of course not,” the opinion of the Politburo was unanimous.
- I, too, have such an opinion. You can’t cut ten skins from one ice floe ...
As for Rokossovsky, he had other hobbies, about which the same Stalin remarked: "We will envy Comrade Rokossovsky."

[Cartalon]

Or comrade Chernyakhovsky, who else knows any jokes about his beloved leader?

[Idiot]

During a discussion of grain supplies in the early 30s, the secretary of one of the regions quipped, saying that his region could not supply more grain: "The French say that even the most beautiful woman cannot give more than she has!" The chief replied: "But she can give twice" ...

[Idiot]

During a discussion of grain supplies in the early 30s, the secretary of one of the regions quipped, saying that his region could not supply more grain: "The French say that even the most beautiful woman cannot give more than she has!" The chief replied: "But she can give twice" ...

[Timyr]

The bike is about to envy. Once political organs reported to Comrade Stalin about Marshal Rokossovsky. A pier with a living wife has a mistress-actress Serova. Does not correspond to the appearance of morality. What will we do with comrade Rokossovsky. Stalin answered how we would do, we would envy.

[gunter_laux]

The article is interesting and informative. Thank.

[Riv]

My grandfathers were not lucky in that sense. The one on the father’s side was wounded in the Baltic states and lay in the hospital until victory. And on the mother’s side was a tanker. He said that he had something, but in East Prussia the tank burned down and the nest egg with him. Well, at least everyone managed to jump out. Of the trophies, he only brought one cupronickel spoon and brought back from the war, which was then in his pocket, and a German officer’s belt and a lighter. Grandmother before her death said that he still had a hidden trophy gun somewhere, but when he died, he didn’t say where and if I could find it by accident, so that he would immediately surrender it. But they didn’t find it.

[moskowit]

"... Trophy Germany, trophy Japan,
The country of Limonia has come,
Solid suitcase ... "(Vladimir Vysotsky)

You see, dear friends, even the Great Poet testifies. Knew the subject well. During the post-war demobilization he was 7-10 years old. The most memorable impressions, and my father was "in rank", major or lieutenant colonel ...
And ordinary soldiers could send packages of a certain weight. There was a ruling ...
General Telegin, a member of the Military Council from G.K. Zhukov, stole 25 wagons (echelon) of trophies and received a year for each wagon. This is very clearly, with the attachment of documents in the case and petitions for clemency, is narrated in an article in the "Military Historical Journal" No. 6 for 1989, entitled "Echelon Quarter Century Long."
A very entertaining story. The magazine is easy to find on the website "Military Literature" under the heading "periodicals", it is posted in PDF format

[Silhouette]

"... And my neighbor Vovchik's father came with trophies ..."
Next to our three-story buildings in Simferopol there are private houses, in one of which lived my childhood friend Vovchik Dubovik, 5 years older than me. His father was a pilot during the war and brought an Opel from Germany, which he drove until the end of the 70s ...
Several houses formed Officer Street. In the first house with a huge garden, which has survived to this day, lived the commander of the air regiment, "Colonel". Behind him was the house of Vovchik's father, who was in the rear of the regiment. Then there was the tiny house of the Colonel's adjutant, a retired sergeant, on a strip of land. Adjacent to it was the house of a special officer named Red. Vovchik had two older brothers - Kolya and Krendel. Kolya, at the age of 26, fell to his death from a tree, and Krendel was planted two years before that and I never heard anything about him. Vovchik got married on vacation when he served in the army, and when he returned, his wife ran away from home, leaving him with twins, which his mother raised until she drank herself.
And in our three-story buildings lived front-line soldiers who didn’t bring anything home in a coma of lead in their bodies and trophies in backpacks. Between themselves, they and the officers did not communicate, they did not like to talk about the war, but sometimes very interesting information could be pulled out of them. Including the flea marketers who came from the front not empty-handed.

[3agr9d0tryad]

Quote: Silhouette

His father during the war was a pilot and brought from Germany "Opel"

I am still amazed at the ease with which Soviet citizens write that until the 70s and 80s they used "captured" German equipment, which on the other side of the German border the Germans had long ago thrown into the trash.
After all, it has been a car for more than 30 years, because it’s already firewood! Even with the most careful storage, they are already morally obsolete.

[Silhouette]

He traveled a little, sometimes on Sundays, drank a lot. Opel was in the garage. These non-current cars are designed for 10 years, and that German Opel is still sometimes seen in the summer on the roads of Crimea.

[3agr9d0tryad]

Quote: Silhouette

These non-current cars are designed for 10 years.

This is, for the most part, a myth.

Quote: Silhouette

and that German Opel and still sometimes meet in the summer on the roads of Crimea.

It is a restored weekend car.

Quote: Silhouette

He traveled a little, sometimes on Sundays, drank a lot.

Not important. The service life of rubber products is not unlimited, and metal fatigue takes its toll, and this Opel was clearly not a truck.
PS And the main thing was in the commentary, if you didn’t understand that the Soviet people for 30-40 years couldn’t acquire their own similar goods in the USSR.

[King, just king]

Yes, for the war, it was necessary to remove ALL Germany, leave the Germans, drive them into the Stone Age.

[ovod84]

Russia is a generous soul, who did not understand, he will understand.

[Vadim2013]

Good and true article. Very interesting comments on her.

[moskowit]

Unfortunately, some readers did not quite understand my comment. It is clear that the Army of Victors had the legal right to export trophies. This practice is old and ubiquitous. No one will condemn a fighter for a pair of boots or a piece of manufacture, all the more so since all this was regulated by a government decree.
But the essence of my comment is as follows. You can, of course, find how many sentences have been passed by military tribunals for looting. This action (looting) has already been very widely interpreted .... But people invested with considerable power, especially political workers who should have been able to observe morality and the rule of law allowed, not all, of course, to put it mildly, to abuse their official position. The former Lieutenant General Telegin, who was rightfully convicted, belonged to these.

[Mikado]

A wonderful phrase: "The craving for the material led to the degeneration of the Soviet elite, turning it into a bourgeois class with a philistine psychology."
And instead of idealistic workers we get bourgeois, and leadership becomes sybarites. The law of any society. Further more. When a society is satiated, vices begin to creep out and bulge out in it. The highest peak of this development is ancient Rome and Europe now. In principle, everything is according to Gumilyov.

[Andrey VOV]

I’ve got one grandfather from the war (I FINISHED IT IN KENIGSBERG, WAS HEARED WRITTEN) a German thermos, two dangerous razors, a sugar bowl, two spoonfuls of nickel silver or silver and her grandmother told me that it’s a cool dress ... it turned out to be a normal silk German nightie))) ) the second one is also a pair of razors, some kind of watch, a harmonica and now I don’t know how, but the dirk is German .... either the Navy or the SS ... it's hard to say not a specialist

[antiexpert]

Sparta, if anyone forgot, self-destructed when her top commanders began to own luxurious things ...

[ALABAY45]

Now, I myself do not know how to relate to this, even when I was in my old years! In my boyish time, I went with my deceased grandmother to Lyubertsy, to her brother, a communications major who had gone through the whole war since 1941 ... At his home (and my childhood memory, like a "camera", I, for the first time, saw German porcelain ( services and figurines) and heavy velvet curtains, and a huge German radio and a trophy dagger (I think the Luftwaffe), which I was given to HOLD IN HAND !!! ... When Zhukov died in 1974, he was at the funeral and cried. In 1976, my grandmother's brother died, leaving behind, in addition to "trophies", 4 stripes for wounds and 11 military awards. I do not even allow myself to suspect him of looting! Something like this...

[user3970]

I want to answer Unsinkable about Zhukov (I deliberately write this last name with a small letter as a sign of disrespect) ... As Minister Kaganovich said: "Every crime has a last name, first name and patronymic." And what position, dear, did Zhukov hold at the beginning of the Second World War? Did you know that Stalin's order to bring the troops to full combat readiness of June 18, 1941 was carried out by the troops under the command of L. Beria (border guards and military forces) and Kuznetsov (the fleet) and sabotaged the ground forces (Pavlov - Central Military District), who was directly subordinate to Zhukov ... How did it all end? The Germans near Moscow? Do you know that Zhukov was the only one of the 9 marshals who had his own firing squad, he put forward the idea of ​​shooting not only those who were captured, but also their family members. With regards to Marshal Rokossovsky ... The only marshal in honor of the victory of whose troops Moscow saluted 61 (sixty-one!) Times! He should have stood a monument on Red Square, and not this uneducated one.

[Uncle Murzik]

about Zhukov's firing squad, the source can be found out!

[Chisayna]

Yes, my paternal grandfather fought against Rokossovsky. And under Maskva and Kursk. The reconnaissance commander came as captain. I never said a bad word about Rokossovsky.

[dvina71]

Quote: user3970

And you are aware that Stalin’s order to bring troops into full combat readiness of June 18, 1941 was executed by troops under the command of L. Beria (border guards and BB) and Kuznetsov (fleet) and sabotaged the land (Pavlov - Central Military District), which was directly subordinate to Zhukov . How did it all end? The Germans near Moscow?

Do you know that the troops received this order? And that the Southern District, which Zhukov commanded before the war, did not crumble. In some places they even crossed the border. If not for the rapid movement of the Wehrmacht in the direction of Moscow, then perhaps the southern front would not have rolled.
The reason why the northern flank fell down I was already tired of posting here. And this is definitely not the officers’s bike.

The division met the war on a march from the permanent deployment area in Vitebsk to the Voronovo - Benyakone area. At noon on June 22, 1941, the division headquarters was in Bogdanuv, two regiments that left Lepel moved on foot march, the ammunition was in the last echelon, which was possibly still in Vitebsk. [3]. The anti-tank division did not have time to begin the transfer. The rear of the division remaining in Vitebsk and part of the 20th Rifle Regiment were further consolidated into the 20th Combined Regiment, which was included in the 153rd Rifle Division [4]

During June 22-23, 1941, the division was unloaded in the vicinity of Lida and, by order of the corps commander, was deployed northward. On June 24, 1941, south-west of Voronovo, the avant-garde 247th rifle and 170th artillery regiments were attacked by German tank units, and, having lost control, retreated behind the Zhitna River in disarray. On June 25, 1941, in the opersvodka of the headquarters of the corps, it was stated that the division headquarters had completely lost control of the units. Obviously, command and control of the units was restored, since the division took part in the counterattack of the 21st Rifle Corps on June 26, 1941 and reached the Dailidki-Zhizha-Bastuny-Bastuny line. However, in the following days, the division was forced to move southeast to Ivye. The remainder of the division left the encirclement as part of the troops of the 21st Rifle Corps in the area of ​​Uzda - Rubezhevichi and later made their way to the east scattered

Now guess three times .. when did the division start loading on the trains, if it was already unloaded on the 22nd? And why did it get into the trains so early when viewed from your bell tower?

[voyaka uh]

"And that the Southern District, which was commanded by Zhukov before the war, did not fall down" ///

He would have sprinkled! The southern district was the strongest in the Red Army.
Almost all T-34 tanks were there, subordinate to Zhukov.
In this case, on the contrary, the army group South Germans was the weakest of all three.
Zhukov had a tremendous advantage in the south. But he failed to achieve anything.
In addition to the insignificant tactical successes that he could not develop.
Then Zhukov was transferred to the center, where he ordered a decisive counterattack by all means.
All counterattack units fell into the prepared boiler, were defeated and captured.
Zhukov with headquarters was taken by plane to Moscow. Such was the Chief of Staff at the beginning of the war ...
The turning point in the war came when Zhukov, finally at the end of the 42nd, was expelled from the General Staff and removed from planning operations.

[Parsec]

Quote: voyaka uh

He would have sprinkled! The southern district was the strongest in the Red Army.

There was no Southern Military District in 1941.

Quote: voyaka uh

The turning point in the war came when Zhukov, finally at the end of the 42nd, was expelled from the General Staff and removed from planning operations.

Zhukov was the chief of the General Staff from February to July 29, 1941.

Where are you going to discuss with such ideas, huh?

Think in your world from fragments of urban legends, but aplomb, and most importantly, the desire to give out the liquid product of the liquid brain, based on a leaky memory, is higher than the roof.

[ALABAY45]

"On June 25, on the basis of the administration of the Moscow Military District, the administration of the Southern Front was created"

[Silhouette]

Quote: cap

The author bypassed the essence of the issue. Trophies were officially resolved.

The essence of the matter is different. By trophies it is customary to understand the weapons seized from the enemy, military property, food, military-industrial equipment, stocks of raw materials and finished products designed to meet the needs of the armed forces of a belligerent state. Everything else is looting. Especially when it comes to household items, art and jewelry.

[EvilLion]

There is no such war that during it it is not robbed, starting from something put by a soldier in a duffel bag, to an organized removal of everything and everything. Somewhere they fought it, somewhere there is no, and generally there is no reason to believe that this is wrong, and even more so there is nothing to spare the Germans. But only in the USSR execution was relied upon for fraud.

[Silhouette]

Demagogy.

[Dart2027]

Quote: Silhouette

Demagogy.

Can you give an example of a war in which the winners did not rob at all?

[Silhouette]

Robbers rob, not winners. Please do not confuse. Among the winners there are robbers. But they are called marauders. They were sometimes shot by their own.

[demotivator]

Quote: moskowit

But people in great power, especially political workers,

Political workers were given to you, by God. Zhukov is far from being a political worker, but rather even a gangster, but hey, you too could not resist the temptation. it is not a matter of who it is - the commander or commissar, but the fact that a person has elementary ideas about officer honor and simply decency, or they do not exist at all. Marshal Zhukov had such a good friend of his, one can say a favorite - the commander of the 2nd Guards Cavalry Corps Hero of the Soviet Union, Lieutenant General Kryukov, who was really convicted subsequently. For what? And for the same thing, for looting and the maintenance of the brothel. And his wife, the famous singer Lidia Ruslanova, received a sentence for buying up stolen and stolen miscellaneous goods. Under Stalin, everything illegally acquired from them was confiscated, and they themselves were imprisoned. True, Khrushchev later released both of them and even rehabilitated them. But, the confiscated property was not returned to them, rightly believing that it was acquired by dishonest means. A strange, however, rehabilitation is obtained.

[Sergej1972]

Ruslanova soon after her release was by no means poor and was financially very well provided.

[Kolaaps]

... US Army finca ... The elder uncle (fond memory) waved in Vienna at the officer's "Walter" ... Steel rubbish ... The blade broke off from being thrown into the bathhouse ... Sharpened anew ... Beautiful, damn , special brand
Officers, gentlemen! I'm talking about this .... "Shadow of Victory" "I take my words back" ... Well, yes ... Viktor Suvorov ... Can we figure it out without squeals and hysterics ?!

[ALABAY45]

"... Steel rubbish ... The blade broke off from being thrown into the bath ..."
Of course, "rubbish"! With skillful "throwing", the Russian NR-40 sews three rails laid along, three Finnish baths and one Hitler's bunker ... in one "throwing" True, then, you have to slightly correct .... The head ...

[cedar]

Marauding
Abduction on the battlefield of things those who are killed and wounded (marauding).

The Criminal Code of the RSFSR of 27.10.60, Article 266 [Ut. force]

[Silhouette]

And in the new Criminal Code of the Russian Federation there is no article for looting at all. So what? .... Looting is over? Or has it become unpunished?
Marauding
- a special type of property encroachment committed by military ranks during hostilities or in an area declared under martial law. Looting constitutes a military criminal act and is provided for by military criminal laws. Acting military mouth. On the mandate, under M. (Art. 267) means "the seizure of supplies, clothing and other things from the inhabitants of the regions occupied by the army, as well as any extortion from the inhabitants, which is not specified by law," that is, violent and fraudulent seizure of property, but not theft ... For M., without especially increasing the guilt of circumstances, exile to Siberia for settlement or correctional punishment is assigned: expulsion from service, with deprivation of ranks - for officers, return to disciplinary battalions from 2 to 3 years - for lower ranks. When M. is committed by a whole team or several people who have conspired to do so, or even one, but with the use of weapons or violent actions, the instigators and all the main criminals are subject to the death penalty with deprivation of all rights of the state, and others - to punishments determined by the general criminal laws for robbery. German law defines the concept itself as the oppression of local residents by military ranks lagging behind their unit (§ 135 of the German military code). The unlawful seizure of property of local residents, as well as unauthorized requisitions and levies made from selfish species, it refers to robbery (§ 129).
Enz. Brockgas and Efron

[3agr9d0tryad]

Yes, yes, it was all so, bad boyars and a good king. The good tsar noblely shot smart at the time that those remaining were still not able to think critically.
And it was so.
Dzhugashvili perfectly remembered how his best general Vlasov was once at the border taken away from Chiang Kai-shek's gold medal, his wife's silver and watch, and "all kinds of junk".
And how this Vlasov later became his most terrible enemy on the ideological front.
And Dzhugashvili knew perfectly well that his impoverished army, seeing the European standard of living, would begin to drag him.
And he knew very well what political damage this would cause the USSR.
But what could he do about it? Never mind! He could only pretend that he did not see, because he understood that in the best case they would just send him, in the worst, tomorrow he would not be alive.
Therefore, Dzhugashvili silently endured when his generals took out "all kinds of junk" in wagons.
And as for the subsequent cases, Dzhugashvili understood that now people will enjoy the victory a little, and then they will start wanting to "eat", but they will not eat again.
Therefore, from the first days of peace, he planned the next repression, and "all kinds of junk" was an excellent reason to remove those less loyal to the Dictator.
And nothing more.