Military Review

Report of a Polish midwife from Osventz

95
This must be known and passed on to generations so that this will never happen again.


Report of a Polish midwife from Osventz
Monument to Stanislav Leszchinsky in the Church of St. Anne near Warsaw


Stanislaus Leszczyńska, a midwife from Poland, stayed at the Auschwitz camp for two years before January 26 and wrote this report only in 1945 year.

“Out of thirty-five years as a midwife, I spent two years as a prisoner of the Auschwitz-Brzezink female concentration camp, continuing to fulfill my professional duty. Among the huge number of women who arrived there were many pregnant women.

I performed the functions of a midwife there alternately in three barracks, which were built from planks with many cracks, gnawed by rats. Inside the barracks, on both sides, was a three-story cot. On each of them were to fit three or four women - on dirty straw mattresses. It was tough, because the straw had long since been worn away in dust, and the sick women lay almost on bare boards, besides not smooth, but with knots that had rubbed their bodies and bones.

In the middle, along the barrack, was a brick-built kiln with fireboxes at the edges. It was the only place for childbirth, as there was no other structure for this purpose. Stoked the stove only a few times a year. Therefore, the cold, painful, penetrating, pestered, especially in winter, when long icicles hung from the roof.

I had to take care of the water I needed for the mother and the child, but in order to bring one bucket of water, I had to spend at least twenty minutes.

Under these conditions, the fate of women in labor was deplorable, and the role of the midwife was unusually difficult: no aseptic means, no dressings. At first I was left on my own: in cases of complications requiring the intervention of a specialist doctor, for example, when manually separating the placenta, I had to act on my own. German camp doctors - Rode, Koenig and Mengele - could not “tarnish” their calling as a physician, assisting representatives of other nationalities, so I had no right to call for their help.

Later, several times I used the help of a Polish female doctor, Irena Ultimate, who worked in a neighboring department. And when I myself became ill with typhus, the doctor Irena Byalouvna provided me with a lot of help, caring for me and my patients.

I will not mention the work of doctors in Auschwitz, since what I have observed exceeds my ability to express in words the greatness of the doctor’s vocation and the heroic duty performed. The feat of the doctors and their dedication were imprinted in the hearts of those who will never be able to tell about it, because they accepted a martyr's death in captivity. The doctor at Auschwitz fought for the life of those sentenced to death, giving up his own life. He had at his disposal only a few packs of aspirin and a huge heart. There the doctor did not work for the sake of fame, honor or the satisfaction of professional ambitions. For him, there was only the duty of a doctor - to save life in any situation.

The number of births I took exceeded 3000. Despite the unbearable dirt, worms, rats, infectious diseases, lack of water and other horrors that are impossible to convey, something extraordinary happened there.

One day, an SS doctor ordered me to report on infections during childbirth and death among mothers and newborns. I replied that I did not have a single death among mothers or among children. The doctor looked at me in disbelief. He said that even the improved clinics of German universities can not boast of such success. In his eyes, I read anger and envy. Perhaps, to the limit, depleted organisms were too useless food for bacteria.

A woman preparing for childbirth was forced for a long time to deny herself rations of bread, for which she could get herself a sheet. She tore this sheet into patches that could serve as diapers for the baby.

Laundry diapers caused a lot of difficulties, especially because of the strict prohibition to leave the hut, as well as the inability to freely do something inside it. Washed diapers mothers dried on his own body.

Until May 1943, all children born in the Auschwitz camp were killed by the brutal method: they were drowned in a barrel. Nurses Clara and Pfani did this. The first was a midwife by profession and went to the camp for infanticide. Therefore, she was deprived of the right to work in the specialty. She was commissioned to do something for which she was more suitable. She was also entrusted with the leadership position of the head of the barrack. To help her, the German street girl Pfani was assigned. After each birth from the room of these women to women in labor came a loud gurgling and splashing of water. Soon after, the woman in labor could see the body of her child, thrown out of the barracks and torn by rats.

In May 1943, the situation of some children changed. Blue-eyed and fair-haired children were taken away from their mothers and sent to Germany for the purpose of denationalization. The piercing weeping of mothers carried away the carried away babies. As long as the child remained with the mother, motherhood itself was a ray of hope. Separation was terrible.

Jewish children continued to sink with merciless cruelty. There was no question of hiding a Jewish child or hiding it among non-Jewish children. Clara and Pfani alternately followed closely Jewish women during childbirth. The child’s birth was tattooed with his mother’s number, drowned in a barrel and thrown out of the barracks.

The fate of the other children was even worse: they died a slow death of starvation. Their skin became thin as if it were parchment, and tendons, blood vessels, and bones shone through it. Soviet children held on for the longest time - from the Soviet Union there were about 50% prisoners.
Among the many tragedies experienced there, I remember most vividly история women from Vilna, sent to Auschwitz for helping the partisans. Immediately after she gave birth to a child, one of the guards cried out her number (the prisoners in the camp were called by numbers). I went to explain her situation, but it did not help, but only caused anger. I realized that she was called to the crematorium. She wrapped the child in dirty paper and pressed it to her chest ... Her lips moved silently - apparently she wanted to sing a baby song, as mothers sometimes did, singing lullabies to her babies to comfort them in a painful cold and hunger and soften their bitter share.

But this woman did not have the strength ... she could not make a sound - only large tears flowed from under the eyelids, flowed down her unusually pale cheeks, falling on the head of the little condemned man. What was more tragic, it is difficult to say, the experience of the death of an infant dying in front of the mother, or the death of a mother in whose mind her living child remains, abandoned to the mercy of fate.

Among these nightmarish memories in my mind flashes one thought, one leitmotif. All children were born alive. Their goal was life! Survived camp nearly thirty of them. Several hundred children were taken to Germany for denationalization, more than 1500 were drowned by Klara and Pfani, more than 1000 children died from hunger and cold (these approximate figures do not include the period until the end of April 1943 of the year).

I still have not had the opportunity to send my obstetric report from Auschwitz to the Health Service. I am transmitting it now in the name of those who cannot say anything to the world about the evil caused by it, in the name of the mother and child.

If in my Fatherland, despite the sad experience of war, tendencies against life can arise, then I hope the voice of all midwives, all real mothers and fathers, all decent citizens in defense of life and the rights of the child.

In the concentration camp, all children - contrary to expectations - were born alive, beautiful, plump. Nature, opposed to hatred, fought hard for her rights, finding unknown life reserves. Nature is an obstetrician teacher. Together with nature, he fights for life and together with her proclaims the most beautiful thing in the world - the smile of a child. ”
Originator:
http://www.adme.ru/zhizn-semya/raport-polskoj-akusherki-iz-osvencima-775460/
95 comments
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  1. Fitter65
    Fitter65 14 May 2016 06: 13
    +12
    It's just awful...
    1. Lyton
      Lyton 14 May 2016 07: 39
      +20
      Quote: Fitter65
      It's just awful...

      I hope these creatures who drowned the children were torn apart vividly after the liberation of the camp, so that they would always burn paskuda in hell.
      1. Tatyana
        Tatyana 14 May 2016 09: 05
        +22
        It’s good that the Polish midwife from Auschwitz, Stanislav Leszczynska, found the courage to talk about it! But it seems that the Poles this story did not teach anything good. They demolish folk monuments in Poland to their Soviet liberators from fascism.
        Correctly about the Poles said V.V. Zhirinovsky, that the Polish leadership has a short political memory because of the complex of national Polish inferiority, which has always historically viciously let down, will lead and lead the Poles to the edge of their existence in the struggle with other nations for their supposedly superior superiority.

        Zhirinovsky puts in place a brazen Pole! New! Posted: 20 Apr 2016
        1. Vend
          16 May 2016 10: 24
          +2
          Quote: Tatiana
          It’s good that the Polish midwife from Auschwitz, Stanislav Leszczynska, found the courage to talk about it! But it seems that the Poles this story did not teach anything good. They demolish folk monuments in Poland to their Soviet liberators from fascism.
          Correctly about the Poles said V.V. Zhirinovsky, that the Polish leadership has a short political memory because of the complex of national Polish inferiority, which has always historically viciously let down, will lead and lead the Poles to the edge of their existence in the struggle with other nations for their supposedly superior superiority.

          Zhirinovsky puts in place a brazen Pole! New! Posted: 20 Apr 2016

          Vladimir Volfovich, as always on top. However, I really liked the finale. The Pole came up for fraternization. This Pole is not lost to the truth.
      2. Zoldat_A
        Zoldat_A 14 May 2016 10: 31
        +5
        Quote: Lyton
        I hope these creatures who drowned the children were torn apart vividly after the liberation of the camp, so that they would always burn paskuda in hell.

        For 30 years I can’t find a book that I accidentally read in the early 80s.

        Mikolos Nisli. "Prosecution Witness".

        That’s where it’s scary ... The author is a doctor, a Hungarian Jew, who was an assistant to J. Mengele and who accidentally survived ... Let him read his grandson ...
        1. altel
          altel 15 May 2016 01: 01
          +2
          Yes, there are many of them, "miraculously survived". Here is the French presidential candidate: “I admire the longevity of former Holocaust prisoners who died after 90 years. Did they really survive all the horrors they talked about? ”- the far-right politician and head of the French radio station Radio Courtoisie questioned on his Twitter.

          Union of Jewish Students of France. These words of the 67-year-old Henri de Lesquin have also raised protest from the Union of Jewish Students of France (UEJF), which also sued the politician. He encroached on the holiest scoundrel!
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Seren
      Seren 14 May 2016 08: 24
      +2
      That would make the Holocaust deniers read it ...
      1. Chisayna
        Chisayna 14 May 2016 09: 28
        +11
        And what did the Jews do in Poland, Spain, Russia. Why did the Russians defend their land. And they did not scatter across countries and continents. What is the loan% who invented it. By the way, talking to the Evenks, I told them, I took one sable skin, and you will give two. And they cannot understand it. Here.
        1. aiw
          aiw 14 May 2016 09: 39
          0
          But did the Jews have their own land in Europe? Jews, like other citizens of Poland, the USSR and other countries, fought in WW2 (only in the Wehrmacht, for obvious reasons, they were not there), tried to survive the occupation or leave along with the retreating troops.

          And by the way, they fought quite well - the percentage of Heroes of the Soviet Union from among Jews was no less than among Russians, Ukrainians or Georgians. I'm not talking about the contribution of Jews to defense development ;-)
          1. Chisayna
            Chisayna 14 May 2016 09: 53
            +1
            And where is their land in general? Why only after WWII did they remember this.
            1. aiw
              aiw 14 May 2016 10: 02
              0
              Actually, they always remembered about it - they simply ignored their opinion, learn history.
              1. altel
                altel 15 May 2016 20: 34
                +1
                They remembered from the filing of the Zionists at the end of the 19th century at the 1st Zionist Congress in Vienna. They just did not decide where it would be. Palestine was part of the Ottoman Empire and at that time it was not possible to gather so many "smart people" there. We even considered Uganda.
          2. Seren
            Seren 14 May 2016 09: 57
            -6
            Higher. In the ratio of Heroes of the Soviet Union to the population, Jews come first. 500 thousand Jews fought on the Soviet-German front, 200 thousand of them died
            1. Chisayna
              Chisayna 14 May 2016 10: 11
              +8
              Nda, my paternal grandfather was drafted in August 41, a participant in the defense of Moscow. He was a scout in a ski battalion. And he said that "them" were not among the scouts.
              1. aiw
                aiw 14 May 2016 10: 39
                +6
                Your grandfather (with all due respect to him) was unlikely to communicate with ALL the war breakers. And it was unlikely that he would ask everyone for nationality when communicating.

                There are statistics, including official.

                And there are well-known historical facts - if it weren’t for the Jews Zeldovich, Khariton, Landau, etc. — you would not have personally written here (well, either written in German or in English). I’m not saying that the Jews are such great fellows - then all were well done. My point is that your message about un-warring / useless Jews is deeply false.

                My cousin's paternal grandfather (Jew) was a doctor. After he found out that in 1942 the Germans shot his wife, he volunteered for the Marine Corps, where he fought the whole war.
                1. Chisayna
                  Chisayna 14 May 2016 12: 00
                  +4
                  And what prevented him from going to 41? Only when he found out, only then did he go. And if he didn’t find out, he wouldn’t go.
                  1. aiw
                    aiw 14 May 2016 12: 08
                    +2
                    And at 41m he worked in a field hospital, saving the wounded. I hope your grandfather didn’t pass through his hands - probably your grandfather would then be very tormented by the fact that he owes his life to a Jew ...

                    Interestingly, what prevented your grandfather from raising you as a normal person?
                    1. Pomeranian
                      Pomeranian 16 May 2016 09: 49
                      +3
                      Quote: aiw
                      Interestingly, what prevented your grandfather from raising you as a normal person?

                      Nothing personal, one question: why did the dead Jews during the siege of Leningrad leaders from Yad-va Shem be recorded as victims of the Holocaust? How did they differ from other Leningraders?
            2. parusnik
              parusnik 14 May 2016 10: 42
              +26
              Tell me why the overall Victory of the entire Soviet people - Russians, Jews, Tatars, Georgians, Ossetians, etc ... is being pulled apart in pieces ... Why, these measures ... we had more heroes ... but you have less ... why only the genocide of the Jewish people is recognized ... Why is it not said about the genocide of the Slavic peoples, the Gypsies ... they were no less killed and not only Jews but also other nationalities were destroyed in the Nazi camps ... Why is this protrusion ... In our family only on the maternal side , only 8 people died, 6 on the fronts, one during the bombing ... the other, for joy, on May 9 ... the heart could not stand it, and during the occupation the Germans crippled it, smashed fingers and toes ... could hardly walk and could hardly I worked with my hands, my bones had grown together .. And why, for the fact that I got into the trash heap behind the potato peel .. Yes, according to my father’s three relatives .. also died at the front ... But this type does not count .. It is not recognized. .released Europe demolishes monuments and is banished over the memory of the victims .. including my relatives, but Hol oss ... then yes ... This is sacred, the scum will spoil the monuments to the victims of the Holocaust, then the whole world community is protesting ... and the same scum will spoil the monument to Soviet soldiers or the graves ... silence or you can do it, "democratic" peoples are engaged in decommunization .. . Restore justice.
              1. aiw
                aiw 14 May 2016 10: 59
                -5
                Sorry, but who is measured then? Some citizens claim that the Jews did not fight at all - they have to poke their nose into facts.

                About the reaction of the world community - questions to the world community. Do these reactions disturb you? I am also outraged, but does this somehow cancel the fact that the Holocaust was? Or that the Jews quite successfully fought themselves?

                Are you outraged that the Jews focus on the Holocaust? And why should they not focus on it if 6 million of them died there? Before the war, 4 million Jews lived in the occupied territories of the USSR, of which 2.5 million did not have time to evacuate, most died - this is about 50%, every second! Moreover, mind you, the concept of the Holocaust includes the destruction by the Nazis, including Soviet prisoners of war, Poles, gypsies, etc. At the same time, does one of the Jews deny the fact of the loss of the USSR during the Second World War? But some citizens deny the fact of the Holocaust ...
              2. Aleksander
                Aleksander 15 May 2016 12: 48
                +11
                Quote: parusnik
                .. Why it is not said about the genocide of Slavic peoples, gypsies ... they were no less killed and not only Jews but also other nationalities were destroyed in Nazi camps

                Question unexplored by ANYONE and this is absolutely terrible! Type in a search engine a question:
                "How many died Russian in the Great Patriotic War?
                NOT ONE article, notes, remarks, NOT ONE will you find!
                There is only the army figure of the dead Russian soldiers 5,75 million people (66%).
                In peaceful Russian, not a word at all. One can only estimate: if the occupation was about 80 million people, then with the exception of the fully occupied republics, half of the 80 million-Russians. So, roughly, half of the 17 million civilians who died were Russians (although they did not touch western Ukraine and the apates at all, not like Russia and Belarus)
                The figure is terrifying -14 million Russians died in that war, most of them are civilians! Twice and a half times more than Jews!
                But in Israel there is a memorial "Yad Vashem Holocaust Museum. Since 2005, there has been an INTERNATIONAL Day of Remembrance for the Victims of the Holocaust.
                WHERE is such a Memorial in Russia? WHERE repentance and compensation of Germany to Russian people? There is nothing!
                And there is nothing because so far none of the leaders of Russia have ever said this anywhere, the descendants of the killers are afraid to offend everyone.
                And who himself confesses and repents? It is necessary to declare and demand, but to begin with, conduct research and publish scientific monographs on this topic, and put a modest monument on Red Square "Eight million peaceful Russians destroyed by the Nazis in WWII " .
                It was the Russian people who suffered the most terrible sacrifices in the Second World War, made a decisive contribution to the Victory and is worthy of the Monument.
            3. pv1005
              pv1005 14 May 2016 22: 04
              +4
              Quote: seren
              Higher. In the ratio of Heroes of the Soviet Union to the population, Jews come first. 500 thousand Jews fought on the Soviet-German front, 200 thousand of them died

              If Chingachguk, the last of the Moggikans fought in World War II and was awarded the title Hero of the Soviet Union, then Jews would be in second place. Pichalka isn't it? crying And therefore do not smack nonsense, the heroes were of the SOVIET UNION, and not the promised land. And to divide them into ours and not really ours is not necessary. hi
            4. altel
              altel 15 May 2016 00: 53
              +2
              Don’t lie, the Kazakhs come first. 96 people born in Kazakhstan and about 10 people in Russia and Uzbekistan. total 106 people It's just that they will be more modest than you and not so cunning. 600 thousand out of 6 million Kazakhs fought. After the war, the Kazakh veterans did not talk, "that this is not their war," and they did not know about Stalin's crimes, " the cult of personality, and they didn’t shout about their sufferings at every corner. I’m talking about veterans.
          3. Zoldat_A
            Zoldat_A 14 May 2016 10: 20
            +14
            Quote: aiw
            Jews, like other citizens of Poland, the USSR and other countries, fought in WWII (only in the Wehrmacht, for obvious reasons, they were not)

            Maybe we didn’t exist in the Wehrmacht ... Only in war do all sorts of miracles happen ...
            Unusual cavaliers of the Iron Cross of the 2nd class were two Finnish Jews (!), The certificates for the awards of which were signed by Adolf Hitler. Major of the medical service of the 53rd Infantry Regiment Leo Skurnikin, who in August 1941 organized the evacuation of the wounded from a German field hospital across the Kapustnaya River near Kiestinki, surrounded in August 1941 by the Red Army, not only provided medical assistance to the wounded German soldiers, but pulled them out of the battlefield, which saved more than 600 people. The commander of the infantry battalion, Captain Solomon Klass, was honored with awards after the battles in the area of ​​the Karelian village of Uhtua (Uhtua; now Kalevala). Both officers refused to accept German awards.
            http://medalww.ru/nagrady-germanii-3-reih/kresty-germanii
            / zheleznyj-krest-das-ei
            serne-kreuz-ek /
            By the way, they fought quite well - the percentage of Heroes of the Soviet Union from among Jews was no less than among Russians, Ukrainians or Georgians.
            And about how Jews fought in the Soviet Army, I would not even write separately - just like the Russians, Kazakhs, Georgians, Tatars and others. Because in that war, the key word for determining nationality was not "Jew", "Ukrainian" or "Kazakh", but "SOVIET" - that is why we won. All then were one, the correct nationality, Soviet ...
            1. aiw
              aiw 14 May 2016 10: 31
              +2
              I completely agree - I wrote separately specifically for citizen Chisain. And then his grandfather brought up so that the citizen is not in the know.
          4. Fox
            Fox 14 May 2016 21: 29
            +7
            Quote: aiw
            (only in the Wehrmacht, for obvious reasons, they were not

            og ... and more than 10000 captured Jews in the USSR where did it come from?
          5. grandson of Perun
            grandson of Perun 14 May 2016 22: 16
            +9
            Quote: aiw
            Jews, like other citizens of Poland, the USSR and other countries, fought in WW2 (only in the Wehrmacht, for obvious reasons, they were not),

            Actually, 150 Jews served in the Wehrmacht.
          6. altel
            altel 15 May 2016 01: 04
            +1
            In general, the Germans then should give the Jews land under the state or the Americans. What does the Palestinians have to do with it? Or money from them, and from others the land?
          7. altel
            altel 15 May 2016 20: 23
            +3
            And Birobidzhan? Why not land? No, give them Crimea or California! In general, why do Jews need land? They will not plow and sow. Gold and diamonds are another matter. The anti-Semite Comrade Stalin gave the command to resettle all Jews to the Kolyma. Lazar Kaganovich "saluted" and drove the trains, and L. Beria's deputies Milstein and Broverman kicked half of Moscow into them. You can't take the land with you, but gold and diamonds are easy. Madeleine Albright (Czech Jew), father Nicolas Sarkozy and For some reason, George Soros with his parents (Hungarian Jews) and Zbigniew Brzezinski (Polish Jew) also survived the war with their ancestors under the Germans, and left their countries like before the arrival of the Red Army. Sarkozy's father even later recruited into the French fighters and went to avenge " Holocaust "to anti-Semites Algerians.
            1. yastr
              yastr 17 May 2016 12: 33
              +1
              Not certainly in that way. You would be very surprised at the number of date and vegetable farms in Israel. They just came up with an irrigation system, in which they grow what is needed in the desert.
          8. max702
            max702 16 May 2016 00: 34
            +6
            Quote: aiw
            (only in the Wehrmacht, for obvious reasons, they were not

            It was! And not a little 150 000 ... Learn the mat part!
          9. The comment was deleted.
          10. Lone wolf
            Lone wolf 16 May 2016 19: 06
            +3
            But did the Jews have their own land in Europe? Jews, like other citizens of Poland, the USSR and other countries, fought in WW2 (only in the Wehrmacht, for obvious reasons, they were not),
            They were not in the Wehrmacht ?? Yes, at least you should look at Wiki for a start.
        2. Igor39
          Igor39 14 May 2016 10: 20
          +2
          About Evenks is cool smileWell, it’s written in their bible, don’t take it from your own, and take a percentage from the rest.
      2. Zoldat_A
        Zoldat_A 14 May 2016 10: 39
        +7
        Quote: seren
        That would make the Holocaust deniers read it ...

        Yes, no one denies your Holocaust - calm down ... Just think about the fact that Hitler didn’t send Jews to the furnace ... Remember Russia, Belarus, Ukraine ... Do not expose yourself to be the only and most injured ...
        1. aiw
          aiw 14 May 2016 10: 42
          +1
          Compare the percentage (of the total number of citizens) of Russians, Belarusians, Ukrainians and Jews who died in concentration camps and think about it.
          1. Zoldat_A
            Zoldat_A 14 May 2016 10: 54
            +13
            Quote: aiw
            Compare the percentage (of the total number of citizens) of Russians, Belarusians, Ukrainians and Jews who died in concentration camps and think about it.

            I have nothing to think about - I gave the best years of my life to the army, which won in that war. But the national composition of the victims is considered to be the one who does not sleep at night, thinking who else to get for the Holocaust ....

            The national composition of the destroyed let the GERMANS consider - I have nothing to blame for myself, nor for my grandfather, nor for my FAMILY Army ... MY army in the ovens did not burn anyone - it only freed ... Apart from who exactly - Jews, Ukrainians, Poles, Czechs ... EVERYONE!
            1. Seren
              Seren 14 May 2016 11: 01
              -19%
              When released, they drive out the invaders and withdraw their troops from the liberated country. But the Soviet troops liberated eastern Europe from the Germans and thank her very much for that, we will never forget that). But the problem is that Soviet troops remained in Eastern Europe, thereby replacing the German occupation with the Soviet one. For me, there are 2 Soviet armies — the heroic liberating army in 41–45. And the occupying army in the years 39-41 and 45-90. The first saved the world from the brown plague. The second occupied the Baltic states, Moldova, eastern Poland, and suppressed popular uprisings in Budapest and Prague.
              1. aiw
                aiw 14 May 2016 11: 08
                +18
                Uh ... you have no complaints about the American army?
                1. Seren
                  Seren 14 May 2016 11: 15
                  -13%
                  I have no complaints about the American army. After the war, American troops were in the territory of only those countries of Western Europe that requested this. France, for example, did not want to, and not a single American soldier was on its territory
                  1. aiw
                    aiw 14 May 2016 11: 39
                    +11
                    Actually, elections were held in Eastern Europe, and that’s all, that is people were asked. And in Japan, then in Japan - the Japanese also probably wanted the Americans to stay there?

                    About the Marshall Plan Are you of course also up to date? Well, Europeans probably wanted this kind of help ...

                    For a Jew, you are somehow very naive ... compatriots (according to popular rumor) are usually smarter ;-) Although, IMNO, the mind, etc., is not connected with nationality in any way, this is not a cut of eyes and not the color of the skin.
                    1. Seren
                      Seren 14 May 2016 12: 11
                      -16%
                      Japan, like Germany, was an aggressor country in which after the war there were occupying forces.
                      We are now talking about the countries of Eastern Europe, in which the German occupation was replaced by the Soviet one. Analogies with the Americans and Western Europe are inappropriate on the example of France.
                      1. aiw
                        aiw 14 May 2016 12: 18
                        +11
                        How interesting! And Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria were not aggressor countries?

                        About the remaining countries of Eastern Europe (for example, Poland, a large part of Belarus and Ukraine, which chopped off after WW1) - please list in which of these countries the troops of the USSR Contrary to the will of their peoples? It is advisable with links to sources and a description of the mass protests.
                  2. Tatyana
                    Tatyana 14 May 2016 11: 43
                    +12
                    Seren
                    I have no complaints about the American army. After the war, American troops were in the territory of only those countries of Western Europe that requested this. France, for example, did not want to, and not a single American soldier was on its territory

                    Ha! England, France and the United States unleashed WWII, setting Hitler on the USSR! In addition, they were among themselves allies. Why would the US troops stand in France after the war?
                    The United States was in those territories that they managed to occupy as a result of WWII.
                    1. The comment was deleted.
                    2. Seren
                      Seren 14 May 2016 12: 09
                      -15%
                      This is an amazing thing. And I thought that the beginning of World War II was laid by the Ribbentrop-Molotov pact on the division of Poland and spheres of influence in Europe ...
                      1. aiw
                        aiw 14 May 2016 12: 12
                        +15
                        Actually, it all started earlier, learn history. Munich Agreement and that’s it ...

                        And the legs of the 2MB are growing from the 1MB, which in turn we are entirely indebted to the Britons. Read the memories of Tirpitz.
                      2. Tatyana
                        Tatyana 14 May 2016 12: 29
                        +11
                        Seren
                        the problem is that Soviet troops remained in Eastern Europe, thereby replacing the German occupation with the Soviet one. For me, there are 2 Soviet armies- a heroic army-liberator in the 41-45 years. And the occupying army in the 39-41 and 45-90 years. The first saved the world from the brown plague. The second occupied the Baltic states, Moldova, eastern Poland, and suppressed popular uprisings in Budapest and Prague.

                        And 3 / 4 of Germany after the war remained under the occupation of the USA, England and France. Why keep quiet about it. After the war, the United States destroyed 1 million Germans from the detention in inhuman conditions in the German prisoners of war prison camps. Why are you silent about this? Now the Germans can not expel US and NATO troops from their territory. Isn't that an occupation? And the migration policy for the American project - is that not the US occupation of Germany?
                        You have little information, and besides, it is perverted.

                        That's how VV Zhirinovsky puts in place the Poles. Posted: 20 Apr 2016

                        This is what Korotchenko replied to Ukram and Balts for "Occupation" Published: 13 May 2016
                    3. Fitter65
                      Fitter65 14 May 2016 13: 44
                      +5
                      And when the non-aggression pact, he is also signed by Molotov-Ribentrop? You don’t need to drive bullshit. There are also people here who do not know the history of YOUR country from the textbooks that were written to us in the Soros Foundation
                    4. Pomeranian
                      Pomeranian 16 May 2016 09: 55
                      0
                      Quote: seren
                      . And I thought that the beginning of World War II was laid by the Ribbentrop-Molotov pact on the division of Poland and spheres of influence in Europe ...

                      That is, you do not consider Chinese as people? laughing And no less terrible war in the Far East, by the time the Pact was signed, had already been going on for almost five years, and direct participants in the Second World War took part in it, sorry for the tautology ..
                    5. yastr
                      yastr 17 May 2016 12: 38
                      0
                      I'm ashamed for you. This is just a shame. You probably live in a vacuum.
                  3. The comment was deleted.
                2. Fitter65
                  Fitter65 14 May 2016 13: 40
                  +13
                  Quote: seren
                  After the war, American troops were in the territory of only those countries of Western Europe that requested this.

                  By the way, the Soviet army was also where they asked for it. For example, Romania didn’t want to and our troops were not there, as in Bulgaria, Yugoslavia and Austria. Yes, and in Denmark our troops did not remain (on Bornholm), as well as in Finland and Norway ... Although, as it is now claimed, it’s not the peace-loving USA and their licking from NATO who came to Russia, it was we who moved our borders to them.
                3. altel
                  altel 15 May 2016 00: 42
                  +6
                  Where does the “Russian of the Mosaic Law” have such love for the United States? Many Russian-speaking Jews are from the USSR by birth, and their grandfathers fought, and they are heroes of the USSR, and Russia has no better ally than Israel. So Agvidor Eskin, and Satanovsky, and Soloviev. And how will they leave Russia, so is she and the "stepmother" and "the sun rises in the west across the ocean?", And the Gulag, and Hitler and Stalin are the same?
                  1. Seren
                    Seren 15 May 2016 18: 02
                    -8
                    Eskin and Satanovsky at the salary of the Tsar of Russia, they say they will order, they are at work. And I can afford to say for free what I think. In the period 39-41, Stalin and Hitler were 2 twins. In 41-45, my sympathies are clear on the side of the Soviet Army, in 45-90 the Soviet army is the occupier. In 52-53, Stalin was preparing a new genocide, but died in time.
              2. kush62
                kush62 14 May 2016 16: 43
                +6
                aiw Today, 11:08 ↑
                Uh ... you have no complaints about the American army?

                They have no complaints about this army. If in another war the Americans are no longer killing them, then they admire the feat of such warriors. Soldiers burning napalm population of Vietnam, for them are heroes. Here is an example for you.

                Zawi
                * On February 16 1967, the unit of the 1 Cavalry (Airmobile) Division was in a night ambush in Bindin Province. Suddenly, his positions were attacked by the enemy with hand grenades. Private 1-th class James Monroe under fire made his way into the next rifle cell to help the wounded, but found that everyone was dead there. He returned to his cell and began to provide medical assistance to the wounded radio operator. At this time, an enemy grenade fell next to him. Monroe shouted a warning to his comrades, pushed the radio operator and the platoon sergeant away, and threw himself on a grenade, at the cost of his life saving several soldiers from injury or death.
                * On 11 on August 1967, a unit of the 1 Marine Division ensured the safety of the US Navy construction squad in Quang Nam. Lance Corporal Roy Wheat left his position to conduct reconnaissance. Upon returning back three meters from the unit’s positions, he accidentally activated a well-disguised enemy jumping mine. Shouting a warning, Whit covered himself with a mine, at the cost of his life saving several comrades from injury or death.
                * On November 12 on November 1967, during the battle of Dacto, a unit of the 173 Airborne Brigade fought with large enemy forces (presumably a battalion). Private 1-th class John Barnes the third noticed that the calculation of one of the machine guns of his unit was killed. He took his seat at the machine gun and with his fire destroyed 9 enemy soldiers. Pausing to pick up extra ammunition, he saw an enemy grenade land in the midst of a group of wounded American soldiers near his position. Barnes threw himself on a grenade and covered it, at the cost of his life saving several soldiers from new injuries or death.
                * On July 3, 1969, a unit of the 173 Airborne Brigade cleared a village in Bindin Province. During the operation, an unknown person jumped out of one house and rushed to run. 4 class specialist Michael Blanchfield shouted a warning after him and opened fire. Unknown threw a grenade, the explosion of which injured Blanchfield. Then the unknown threw another grenade, which fell next to a group of soldiers. Blanchfield covered this grenade with his body, saving himself at the cost of his life from the injury or death of four comrades and several peaceful Vietnamese.
                * On 19 on August 1970, a unit of the 101 Airborne Division fought in the province of Kuangchi. It was under the fire of two long-term firing points of the enemy. Corporal Frank Fratellenico managed to crush one pillbox using hand grenades and attacked another. At this moment, he was struck by enemy fire and dropped a grenade, which he was about to throw. Aware of her threat to the comrades who were nearby, Fratelleniko covered the grenade with his body and at the cost of his life saved four soldiers from injury or death.
                or do you think that a feat, but to sacrifice yourself in the name of comrades, is it always a feat (IMHO) has a nationality or citizenship?
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. Cat man null
              Cat man null 14 May 2016 11: 15
              +7
              Quote: seren
              suppressed popular uprisings in Budapest and Prague

              - well, in Prague - there the Germans mostly noted, the Oriental .. they are still remembered there .. with a shudder wink

              Quote: seren
              the problem is that the Soviet troops remained in Eastern Europe, thereby replacing the German occupation with the Soviet

              - like, incidentally, the British and the Americans - in their zone of occupation .. everything is honest and symmetrical, no?

              Quote: seren
              The second occupied the Baltic states, Moldova, eastern Poland

              - they still forgot about Ukraine laughing
              1. Seren
                Seren 14 May 2016 11: 17
                -15%
                After the war, American troops were in the territory of only those countries of Western Europe that requested this. France, for example, did not want to, and not a single American soldier was on its territory
                1. Cat man null
                  Cat man null 14 May 2016 11: 37
                  +8
                  Quote: seren
                  After the war, American troops were in the territory of only those countries of Western Europe that requested this

                  - well, not that "asked" .. let's say - actively did not object wink

                  Quote: seren
                  France, for example, did not want

                  - a mechanism with which "did not want" - do not remind?
                  - with the well-known "love" of the French and British for each other - it is not surprising that this happened, no?
                  - which of the countries of the (future) Warsaw Pact just "did not want" Soviet troops, as France did not want Anglo-American (Prague and Hungary - not to offer, it was much later and the reasons were there .. purely different)
                  1. Seren
                    Seren 14 May 2016 12: 19
                    -9
                    The same Poland or Czechoslovakia, who desperately resisted the agreement on the stay of the Soviet occupation forces, the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Czechoslovakia Jan Masaryk "unexpectedly" fell out of the window of his ministry.
                    1. aiw
                      aiw 14 May 2016 12: 28
                      +8
                      Would it not be difficult for you to name the number and location of the Soviet occupation forces in Poland and Czechoslovakia after 1945 (before the suppression of the Prague Spring)? And if they were there, why would they be brought in there?

                      And if you want to condemn the entry of Soviet troops into Czechoslovakia and Hungary, you do not want to condemn US military operations at the same time?
            4. Fitter65
              Fitter65 14 May 2016 13: 35
              +6
              And the American troops that still stand in Europe, who are they? Freedom bearers. They are just kind people who brought happiness to people by burning, cities and villages in Indochina. What did they do with Grenada? And with Yugoslavia, Iraq, Libya - or is it all the provision of gratuitous help? Yes, and the uprising in Budapest is not an uprising, but the rebellion of the former faithful ally of Nazi Germany.
            5. alleksSalut4507
              alleksSalut4507 23 May 2016 23: 56
              +1
              if the dollar after the War did not climb into its opu as an exchange currency, I.V.S. would not have stayed in Eastern Europe and had not announced the creation of the GDR (after the declaration of the FRG as "allies") Stalin was against the US-proposed fragmentation of Germany. everything happened after the implementation of such an invention as the Cold War. there are articles on VO, read.
          2. aiw
            aiw 14 May 2016 11: 07
            +4
            Your position is excellent. Saying to those who blame that there was no Holocaust / the Jews did not fight - let them blame themselves. But you cannot answer them!

            Those who are indignant that Jews are so worried about the Holocaust, nevertheless suffered - in your opinion, are they right? Well, think of it, every second one was killed - this is unseen ...

            And what do you tell me about the exploits of the Soviet Army? Everyone is in the know, and so am I. Does anyone here dispute these exploits?

            You won’t want to say anything to Cisine?
      3. Seren
        Seren 14 May 2016 11: 12
        -13%
        No nation has suffered such losses as the Jews. A third of the Jews were destroyed in the Holocaust. Only 2 nations were destroyed only by nationality: Jews and Gypsies. And if you recall the significant data about every fourth Belarus annihilated by the Germans - almost all of the annihilated inhabitants of Belarus were Jews. And unlike you, the current Russian Tsar understands the tragic uniqueness of the Holocaust and the importance of the Jewish community for the development of Russia.
        1. aiw
          aiw 14 May 2016 11: 17
          +7
          Well, actually, according to Barabarossa, the Slavs, too, had an unenviable fate ... it just didn’t work out.

          More Nazis killed, disabled and homosexuals.
          1. Seren
            Seren 14 May 2016 11: 20
            -12%
            There is no subjunctive mood in history. We are talking about what happened. Talking about plans is pointless, Comrade Stalin also planned in the 53rd year of the Holocaust, but died in time)))
            1. Chisayna
              Chisayna 14 May 2016 11: 51
              +7
              Comrade Stalin died in his bed, and not like a Trotsky-bracket from a piece of iron on his head. And yet Comrade Stalin coolly reduced the number of fiery revolutionaries.
              1. Seren
                Seren 14 May 2016 12: 14
                -6
                For me, Zinoviev, Trotsky, Lenin, Bukharin, Kamenev and others like them are the same villains as Comrade Stalin.
                1. Chisayna
                  Chisayna 14 May 2016 12: 22
                  +6
                  Well you are so about your fellow tribesmen.
                  1. Seren
                    Seren 14 May 2016 14: 44
                    -2
                    So what are the tribesmen? My people have the same right to their villains and bastards as any other. By the way, Trotsky and Kaganovich especially fiercely destroyed synagogues and the Jewish religion, including the execution of rabbis and members of Jewish youth organizations
                    1. Reptiloid
                      Reptiloid 14 May 2016 22: 56
                      +2
                      Once there was a program about Jews --- Lushnikov and a Jewish teacher (?). The teacher said that at that time there was such a trend ----- to stop identifying with the persecuted nations, and to join the Russians, to Russian culture. Moreover, after the revolution, discriminatory laws were abolished: on the Pale of Settlement, on posts, education, taxes. And the rabbis warned against participating in political parties.
            2. altel
              altel 14 May 2016 21: 26
              +6
              Comrade Stalin did not plan a Holocaust. Comrade Stalin gave the order to take over 1 million. Jews from Poland, Western Belarus and Western Ukraine as refugees in 39-40 and resettle them to the south of the USSR, away from the Holocaust. Among them was Vladimir Zhirinovsky's dad, a Polish Jew, and the next "wave" was in 41-42. And now Comrade Stalin is a tyrant and oh horror-anti-Semite. They cannot forgive him for cleansing the country of the 30s from the communist internationalists, most of whom were Jews.
              1. aiw
                aiw 14 May 2016 23: 21
                -2
                That was the beginning. And in the 1950s there was a doctors ’business, and a wave of anti-Semitism, and articles in the press (dig into the binder of Truth, everything is freely available - your hair stands on end), and the trains already formed ... but he died.
                1. altel
                  altel 15 May 2016 02: 31
                  0
                  State security agencies supervised by Khrushchev since 1948. He then cleaned the archives with the help of Serov and dumped everything on Stalin.Tov. Stalin was already 70 years old. and he doesn’t have 10 goals. By the way, the case of the doctors was preceded by the JAC case, and Golda Meir’s arrival in Moscow. Of the convicted doctors, half are not Jews. Do you want to say that they were unjustly convicted? At least there was negligence on the part of doctors.
        2. kush62
          kush62 14 May 2016 16: 49
          +1
          Seran Today, 11:12 ↑
          No nation has suffered such losses as the Jews. A third of the Jews were destroyed in the Holocaust. Only 2 nations were destroyed only by nationality: Jews and Gypsies. And if you recall the significant data about every fourth Belarus annihilated by the Germans - almost all of the annihilated inhabitants of Belarus were Jews. And unlike you, the current Russian Tsar understands the tragic uniqueness of the Holocaust and the importance of the Jewish community for the development of Russia.


          How is it that you still don't have a halo over your avatar?
        3. altel
          altel 15 May 2016 00: 34
          +5
          About 30 million Chinese people have been cut out by the Japanese since the mid-30s, But they “don’t smear snot and don’t demand to be loved?” You tell me that there are so many of them, but “Jews are worth their weight in gold” a Jew is many times dearer than the soul of a Chinese? The Belarusians apparently managed to hide in the forests, and the Jews "suffered" for them. What the hell is it that all the dead Belarusians are Jews?
    4. ioann1
      ioann1 15 May 2016 17: 25
      0
      Take the gun and make
  • Razvedka_Boem
    Razvedka_Boem 14 May 2016 06: 43
    +7
    You need to know and remember. In order not to happen again.
  • Reptiloid
    Reptiloid 14 May 2016 06: 53
    +2
    Those people had a very terrible life. The whole world should know and remember.

    the Poles do not know, otherwise they would have behaved differently.
    1. aiw
      aiw 14 May 2016 08: 32
      +5
      When the ghetto burned
      When the ghetto burned
      Warsaw was amazed
      Four consecutive days.
      And there was so much cod
      And there was so much light
      And people said:
      - The bugs are on fire.

      ... And after a quarter century
      Two wise people
      Sat behind a bottle
      Good wine
      And Janusz told me
      The Thinker and Colleague:
      - The Russians in front of Poland
      I have my own fault.

      Why are you in the 45th
      Standing in front of the Vistula?
      Warsaw is dying!
      Who will let her live?
      And I told him: - First
      There were few strengths
      And it turned out, with the help of
      You can’t rush.

      - Warsaw Uprising
      Crushed and crushed
      The Warsaw Uprising
      Sunk in the blood.
      Better I die
      Than let my brother die
      With a great trembling voice
      My vis-a-vis said.

      And I told him this:
      - When the ghetto burned,
      When the ghetto burned
      Four consecutive days
      And there was so much cod
      And there was so much light
      And you all said:
      "The bugs are burning."
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 14 May 2016 08: 54
        +2
        Please tell me, Anton, who wrote these verses?
        During the holidays on the channel "Russia 24" I accidentally heard the words of the Chairman of the Jewish Communities of Russia. His name is Alexander Boroda. He said that Israel has a law prohibiting the correspondence of History.
        1. aiw
          aiw 14 May 2016 09: 16
          +6
          It is my fault that I did not refer, Gugol says that it is Alexander Aronov "When the ghetto was burning"

          I don’t know about Israel, but some EU countries have laws criminalizing Holocaust denial. IMPORTANT, this is very correct - those who deny the fact of the presence of acceleration of gravity can screech from the window, i.e. natural facts protect themselves. It is more complicated with history, historical facts (namely facts and not propaganda tales) should be protected from distortion by people. Further democracy - you want to condemn the Holocaust, you want to approve ... but the fact that it was kindly be recognized.

          Another little-known page of history - in Poland there were Jewish pogroms AFTER WWII, when Jewish refugees tried to return to their homes, and it turned out that these houses were occupied / plundered by neighbors.

          And another fact - in some German concentration camps after 2MB political prisoners were held. True, they no longer drove them into gas chambers (on the question of comparing the two modes).
          1. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 14 May 2016 09: 40
            +2
            A few years ago I happened to be at a lecture on the history of the Jews, after which I developed this poem:

            Why Jews were killed ---
            Little, proud people?
            And they drove the Jews to jail ---
            And in the cold, and in thunderstorms, and in ice.

            Years and centuries have passed
            There are no past oppressions.
            And this respected Faith
            Already more than three thousand years !!!

            They used to be a bit ---
            Tens of millions now!
            Ordinary people, directors,
            Doctors and scientists --- believe me !!!

            Now do not offend the Jews ---
            Great and proud people!
            Victory in the war created ---
            All together, Soviet people !!!
            1. aiw
              aiw 14 May 2016 09: 48
              0
              Actually, anti-Semitism is blooming again in Europe (most likely thanks to the Arab diasporas). In Israel, you don’t really take it easy - they will shoot, and in Europe, do what you want with their tolerant police ...

              Well, the history (and situation) of Israel is also very revealing. Harassment seemed to go to a different level.

              The Holocaust is not the only example of the extermination of people on a national basis - it is terrifying that it was already in enlightened Europe, it was so massive (as a percentage of the affected nationality) and was organized by one of the most developed (including spiritually) nations. Well, the concentration camps themselves ... to kill right away IMHO is somehow more humane ;-(
              1. altel
                altel 14 May 2016 21: 06
                +1
                In fact, the Arabs also belong to the Semites. The greatest "love" for the Jews is in Hungary and Poland, and there are few Arabs there. Apparently the Arabs have studied their Jewish cousins ​​well for several thousand years. The Arabs (Germans,) and other enemies are to blame for everything mankind. Evropa is to blame. You understand every Arabs, there would be no way to immediately "wet" them in Israel.
            2. Reptiloid
              Reptiloid 14 May 2016 10: 09
              +1
              I re-read 10 times, and all typos creep in at some stage. The last quatrain. PEOPLE.
              1. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 16 May 2016 09: 59
                0
                Many thanks to Alesndr Romanov for fixing the typos!
                If another Moderator corrected, then also my huge thanks
                Sincerely.
          2. altel
            altel 14 May 2016 21: 46
            -1
            "The Polish population, with the exception of a small group of communists in cities and an even smaller group, in the countryside. Perceived the entry of the Red Army into Poland after the invasion of the Wehrmacht as an attack (39). The Jewish population, especially the youth, massively welcomed the Red Army and the introduction of new orders, including with weapons in hand. The second issue is cooperation with repressive bodies, primarily with the NKVD. At first, all sorts of "militias" were engaged in this, later the "workers' guard" and "civilian militia". In cities they were almost entirely from Polish Jews, ... Poll Jews in civilian clothes, with red armbands, armed with rifles, also widely took part in arrests and deportations. "Professor of History Pan Tomasz Strzembosz" New Poland "newspaper. So not elite apartments of Jews and envy of he was moved by the Poles, and the opinion that the Jews betrayed them
        2. Koshak
          Koshak 14 May 2016 09: 19
          +1
          The author is Alexander Aronov. "Ghetto, 1943"
          Nightmare.. crying
        3. Seren
          Seren 14 May 2016 11: 22
          +5
          Alesand Aronov wrote this.
          And there are still wonderful autobiographical lines by Boris Slutsky:


          How was my grandmother killed?
          My grandmother was killed like this:
          In the morning to the hunchback building
          A tank came up.
          One hundred and fifty Jews of the city
          Lungs
          From a year old famine
          Pale from dying longing
          We arrived there, carrying nodules.
          Young Germans and policemen
          Cheerfully pressed old women, old people
          And they led, rattling with bowlers,
          They led us out of town, far away.

          And grandma, little one,
          like an atom
          My seventy-year-old grandmother,
          German wings scolded,
          She screamed to the Germans about where I was.

          She screamed:
          - My grandson
          at the front,
          You just dare
          Just touch!
          Hear
          our shot is audible!
          Grandma cried and screamed
          And she walked.
          Started Again Again
          Shout.
          From every window
          Shumeli Ivanovna and Andreevna,
          Cried Sidorovna and Petrovna:
          - Hold on, Polina Matveevna!
          Scream at them! Go straight!
          They were noisy:
          - Oh, sho to be.
          With our German, our vorog!

          So they decided to kill the grandmother,
          They were still passing by the city.
          A bullet tossed hair.
          A gray braid fell out.
          And the grandmother fell to the ground.
          So she disappeared.
  • Dimon19661
    Dimon19661 14 May 2016 08: 29
    +4
    But how quickly Poland changed its priorities: Russia is an enemy, Germany is a friend. How short human memory can be ....
    1. atos_kin
      atos_kin 14 May 2016 10: 27
      +2
      Churchill defines Poland as a European hyena.
  • parusnik
    parusnik 14 May 2016 10: 47
    +2
    Enlightened death in the camps of Europe, powerfully adjusted .. European ..
  • Kostya Andreev
    Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 11: 32
    +2
    Quote: seren
    That would make the Holocaust deniers read it ...


    I am not a Holocaust denier, I can simply say that it is not so simple there.
    Regarding the article: my grandmother, 69 years old, decided to write memories of the events that happened 20 years ago. This is not a report, but a literary work. When I read it, it seemed that it was already somewhere.
    You can consider me a cynic, but it is a miracle that from hungry barely alive mothers who were malnourished, children were born alive, beautiful, chubby.

    [/B]
    and my opinion on the Holocaust is similar to that of Jürgen Graf. and others. I think so because if they said nonsense, then the laws on the denial of the Holocaust were not adopted.
    1. aiw
      aiw 14 May 2016 11: 45
      -1
      You have a conspiracy of the brain, I advise you to wear a foil cap and do not forget to ground it.

      Facts and documents about the Holocaust of the Tuyeva Khucha, starting from the decision of the Nuremberg Tribunal, testimonies of witnesses and the few survivors - google to help. But you want to play conspiracy theology, which does not deny the fact of the Holocaust, but rather clearly characterizes you personally.
      1. Kostya Andreev
        Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 12: 35
        +1
        Do not say what to do to others and they will not tell you where to go.
        It’s good that you use Google and other necessary things, but besides this, you need to study another opinion, which is also presented in Google. (You will also be helped to it)
        study the facts, test witnesses.
        1. aiw
          aiw 14 May 2016 12: 39
          +4
          My wife’s grandfather passed through Majdanek.

          And when you study opinions, do not limit yourself to the opinions of citizens propagandizing Nazism and xenophobia - there are other opinions.

          Of course, I can tell you where to go, but it’s difficult to accomplish it - you and your people there have been busy for a long time.
          1. Kostya Andreev
            Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 13: 00
            +2
            My grandfather went through three wars, was captured, fled. (will we brag about grandfathers further?)

            And you, studying opinions, do not limit yourself to the opinions of citizens propagandizing Zionism, and forcing you to consider the whole world to blame yourself. (read how many Jews were captured by the Soviet army). and when studying sources, turn on brains.

            you can tell me what to do too, but considering your experience of wearing a foil cap, the result is deplorable.

            read at least critically (with a pencil) research on the opponents of the Holocaust and their opponents, and only then you can argue.
            For example Jurgen Graf book "The Collapse of the World Order" ed. LLC algorithm book. 2008 year. lies on my table. what do you have more against what is written on page 84 of F. Bruckner's words about Pressac?
            1. aiw
              aiw 14 May 2016 13: 13
              +1
              I brought my wife's grandfather to the question of the quality of witnesses. And what, of course, your grandfather told you that the Zionists were to blame for everything, and that in the concentration camps, the Jews were engaged in light physical labor in the fresh air and ate stuffed carp?

              My brains are on all the time, by profession I’m supposed to keep them on and think critically. But there’s nothing to include you ...
            2. aiw
              aiw 14 May 2016 13: 20
              0
              According to your "logic", the adoption of laws on responsibility for denying the Holocaust confirms the hypothesis that Einstein's general relativity is firstly stolen, secondly wrong, and there is a world Jewish conspiracy in physics.

              In support of this theory, a lot has been written by Levashov, read it - you'll like it! Only competent people will not discuss this nonsense, this is for you to the same stubborn conspiracy theorists. "Contact the league of sexual minorities - they will help you" (c) hi
              1. Kostya Andreev
                Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 13: 40
                +1
                I will not enter into a skirmish, I will not brag about the merits of my grandfather, everyone worked in the camps and died, and not just Jews.
                The question arises about your adequacy: what does Einstein Levashov have to do with prosecution for convictions with real terms of imprisonment. if what the rezezionists write is nonsense and stupidity.
                And whatever you leave the topic I repeat the question
                Jurgen Graf book "The Collapse of the World Order" ed. LLC "algorithm book". 2008 year. lies on my table. what do you have against what is written on page 84 of F. Bruckner's words about Pressac?
                or what can you object to page 255 second paragraph above?
                1. aiw
                  aiw 14 May 2016 15: 10
                  -1
                  You wrote above:

                  "and my opinion about the Holocaust is similar to the opinion of Jurgen Graf. and others. I think so because if they were talking nonsense, the laws on denying the Holocaust were not adopted."

                  So, these laws confirm the falsity of Einstein's general relativity and Levashov’s opinion in exactly the same way.

                  But I have no questions about your adequacy. Discussing Jurgen's "works" is about the same as discussing Levashov's "works" - one field of berries. Look for companions and like-minded people elsewhere, I think your psychiatric dispensary should have a list of the most active, if the doctors do not give the list, just hang out in queues there.
                  1. Kostya Andreev
                    Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 16: 43
                    +1
                    I did not read Levashov, and as far as I understand, now the conversation is not about him, and his theory. So I understand the revisionists, you have not studied and read, therefore, you use insults as an argument.
                    Therefore, I ask and demand to explain where I am wrong. at least in these pages
                    1. aiw
                      aiw 14 May 2016 16: 50
                      -4
                      Insults? Excuse me, I am only stating the facts hi

                      You can ask and demand anything, but I do not discuss nonsense. With the same success, you can ask and demand that I explain why supporters of the hollow earth theory are mistaken. Or why the supporters of the Earth standing on three pillars are mistaken. Or the Earth around which the Sun and firmament revolves.

                      There is a historical fact - the Holocaust was. Jews and gypsies massively and brutally destroyed by nat. featured.

                      Further, you can try to refute this fact before turning green - this is the same as arguing with the law of universal gravitation, you will not begin to levitate, but only demonstrate your obstinacy (which actually happens). hi
                      1. Kostya Andreev
                        Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 17: 41
                        +4
                        I will not describe your psychological state and perception of the world. (although I can do it)
                        I don’t argue about the structure of the world, if I don’t know what it stands for (it’s a law not to argue on topics you don’t know about).

                        You have such an approach to the topic: "The teaching of Marx is correct because it is correct"
                        I doubt that you read the memories of those who were in the concentration camps. Most likely there was a superficial acquaintance with the topic. like an article on the net. Because there is a reference to Google and not to the library. in nete you can read a brief reference about the topic, many do so. they will read one paragraph of the content and everything is familiar with the topic, and when you start to ask a person, for example, this or that, he cannot answer.

                        There is a historical fact - the Holocaust was. Jews and gypsies massively and brutally destroyed by nat. featured. destroyed all the Russians and Belarus owls, and the Yakuts, there is no need to focus on suffering on one god-chosen nation, otherwise you read and think that there were no one in the camps other than Jews. read how destroyed and in what ways.
                        By the way, in the territories of the former USSR this was distinguished by the local population, even the Germans were forced to limit their enthusiasm.
                        You do not confuse the law of gravity and historical moments, which have some dark sides. for example, there was a historical moment when everyone was sure that Stalin had shot the beast all over the army, and then, that is, now, even in VO one can read articles that say that to put it mildly, is not so.

                        Before arguing, you need to have information at the opponent’s level (they taught me that way) so that a book is lying on the table and the opponents could prove their point of view to each other line by line and where they are wrong. This is called a scientific debate, and when, as an argument to the requirements to indicate errors, they begin to make assumptions about the mental state and draw parallels with a person and a topic that is not related to the content of the dispute, doubts about the adequacy of the person and the degree of knowledge of the subject of the dispute creep in.
                        Do not consider me a bore, but I ask you to read the book (it is not thick, only 477 pages), it is easy to read, the topic is very interesting, even if you find its content stupid, it’s even good because the number of people with a different point of view is increasing. and in a dispute you will be able to indicate moments that are not true.
                      2. aiw
                        aiw 14 May 2016 17: 58
                        -2
                        > destroyed everyone, both Russians and Belarusians, and Yakuts,

                        But here is the nuance - extremely few Russians, Belarusians and Yakuts fell into Nazi camps on a national basis! They got there as Soviet prisoners of war, or as individuals trying to resist the Nazi regime. But the Jews (gypsies, blacks, pederasts and people with disabilities) got there just like that, because they are. Therefore, do not try to monopolize / prohibit someone from focusing on losses from Nazi atrocities.

                        In absolute terms, the two groups of people most affected in the camps were Soviet prisoners of war and Jews. AND both these groups, just like their relatives / compatriots, have every right to focus on this (as well as the rest of the victims). And those who claim that some of these groups do not have such a right - either they are not friends with logic, or just scum, choose for yourself who is closer to you.

                        Once again, I am not going to conduct scientific discussions with you about reliably established historical facts. Your conclusions about what I know and what are not quite tense, and frankly, I'm not interested at all.
                      3. Kostya Andreev
                        Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 19: 25
                        +3
                        You rightly said that about the monopoly, only for some reason everyone remembers the murdered Jews and rarely remembers the more tortured civilians of the USSR. For the world, the tragedy is that 6 million Jews died, and somehow the world calmly speaks of the deaths of millions of civilians in the USSR. why no one remembers, they were not Jews.
                        And I want to debate with you, because it is very interesting what facts you will operate on.
                        I suggest for a start it will be determined that we will discuss only the Holocaust excluding buggers. gypsies and so forth! I will separately mention that we exclude prisoners of war.
                        What do you think is the difference in the Holocaust in Europe and on the territory of the USSR?
                        Could you explain why a large number of Jews served in the army in German?
                        Could you tell me where Auschwitz is located?
                        How there turned out to be so many old people and children if they could simply be destroyed.
                        Can you answer how the corpses were destroyed? and where are the burial places.
                        By the way, could you name the death toll.
                        Do you really believe that the Jews went dutifully to slaughter.

                        Maybe I and people like me, scum and are not friends with logic, but unlike you, I'm interested in the question! And by the way, the dispute will not work with us, because you do not own the issue. A dispute implies equal knowledge, and you, my friend, grabbed tops and didn’t get to the roots. You just have to note his comment and get a plus sign.
                        I warn you right away that, for example, victims of Nazism (for example, the diaries of Anne Frank, and her critics and defenders) I also read. so I know the topic from different angles.
                        I may be mistaken in my views, but I did not read the real critics who could destroy the revisionists, maybe you can advise. if not scum and a man with logic.
                        As for the reliable facts, I am embarrassed to recall that some time ago, Stalin was an executioner and a murderer, and before that, it was also historically established that he was the father of the peoples.
                      4. Seren
                        Seren 14 May 2016 20: 47
                        -2
                        Read Aaron Schneier for brain enlightenment, although this is unlikely to help you.
                        You probably think that Einstein stole the theory of relativity from a little-known but brilliant Russian scientist, and the Americans themselves blew the twins in 2001)))
                      5. Kostya Andreev
                        Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 21: 05
                        +1
                        Thanks for the advice, be sure to read it. Otherwise, you certainly went too far. and about Einstein and the towers. And not just read, but read with a pencil. and check it out. (bad habit of checking sources).
                      6. Reptiloid
                        Reptiloid 14 May 2016 22: 27
                        +1
                        Knowing one thing and not knowing the other is no longer a shame, because the amount of information is increasing catastrophically. It turned out that only this year I learned about how the Germans treated the inhabitants of the Leningrad region. The same concentration camp. Many of my friends have books. about the Blockade of Leningrad. But about the Leningrad region there is some kind of vacuum. It is known that monuments have been destroyed, but people are not like that. Besides "I believe", "I do not believe". There is also a moral side when it comes to suffering , torture, death of people.
                    2. Pomeranian
                      Pomeranian 16 May 2016 10: 02
                      0
                      Quote: seren
                      and the twins in 2001 were blown up by the Americans themselves

                      Yes? And who, if not them? bully
                  2. aiw
                    aiw 14 May 2016 23: 18
                    -1
                    > About the monopoly you rightly said, but for some reason everyone remembers the murdered Jews and rarely remember the tortured civilians of the USSR who were more.

                    Who's everyone"? As a rule, the statement "everyone remembers / everyone knows" indicates that the applicant does not own the issue. And there were much more tortured civilians of the USSR, in percentage terms? Considering that many of them were, oddly enough, Jews and were exterminated precisely because they were Jews?

                    Regarding the dispute, are you dyslexic? I do not argue with fools, and I do not pass exams for fools. You are talking nonsense, what to discuss with you, if you have black is white? Against this background, all your claims to "ownership of the issue" look especially ridiculous.

                    > Regarding the reliably established facts, I am ashamed to recall that some time ago, Stalin was an executioner and a murderer, and before that, it was also historically established that he was the father of nations.

                    Are these mutually inclusive things? In addition, you again demonstrate that you are not friends with logic - the things you are talking about are nothing more than value judgments. Reliably established historical facts look a little different: during the Stalinist repressions, only 600 thousand Soviet citizens were shot, not counting the losses due to collectivization (starving to death), simply planted and resettled. Under Stalin, the USSR won the Second World War, created an excellent industry and an atomic bomb. Despite the superiority in all types of weapons, the losses of the USSR in the Second World War were colossal (especially at the initial stage), which is mainly due to the poor organization of the Army and the incompetence of the command. The incompetence of command was compensated as usual by mass heroism. At the same time, the Soviet command was far from the most incompetent - in Europe, the allies at first simply purged the war, Singapore surrendered the fortress city to the Japanese, etc. etc.

                    These are the facts. But the assessment of who Stalin was there, the Father of Nations or the Villain, is everyone let everyone decide for himself, and this in any case will not be a fact - a too controversial figure.
          2. The comment was deleted.
  • Andrey VOV
    Andrey VOV 14 May 2016 15: 46
    +4
    Enough to divide the victory into ours and not ours, enough to find fault and denigrate ... enough to prove who suffered harder, Jews, Russians, Ukrainians ... You are comrades from the promised land, enough already ... You are yours with these quacks, your actions and the desire to constantly be elected and forever the most offended is enough already !!!
    Enough to put an equal sign between Stalin and Hitler and everything has been clear for a long time, it is clear how and why and who unleashed and unleashed the Second World War, it is only painfully beneficial to turn a blind eye to this ... And yet, comrades from the promised land, if not a firm and not tough stance of I.V. Stalin and the USSR so hated by you ... was there at all, where is your state ...
    At your side are the nonhumans from ISIS, at your side the masterpieces of mankind are being destroyed..and you elect all are silent .... well, go on, keep silent and pour mud all around, mother Russia, our victory ... God forbid .. . God forbid they rush to you and just wipe you off the ground .... all the best
    1. aiw
      aiw 14 May 2016 16: 43
      +1
      Mdya ... and someone shares something? Where?

      In the concentration camps, two large groups of people suffered - Soviet prisoners of war (understandable on what grounds) and Jews (on ethnic grounds). Even in absolute numbers (I don’t talk about percentage), the Jews were much more actively destroyed (because they were Jews) than Belarusians (because Belarusians. And not because they resisted Germany).

      The USSR received a large contribution including for the destroyed prisoners of war, the Jews also received some sort of compensation payments.

      Now you come with your comrades and say that there is nothing for the Jews to claim, all the Soviet peoples suffered, i.e. You are trying to monopolize this right. On what basis? For example, Dutch Holland Jews, what about the fact that we remember this day our dead? They have their own dead, and they are grateful to the USSR for their salvation - but they also want to remember their victims. Moreover, they began to be destroyed even before the Soviet Union even entered the war.

      Fu to be like that.
      1. Kostya Andreev
        Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 18: 37
        0
        Quote: aiw
        Jews also received some kind of compensation payments.


        Hihihi, before you write the words "some", study the question, google for help. You will be surprised at what amount will be obtained and not only some compensation payments, but also military and civilian equipment and so on. and not only after the war, but also for several decades. By the way, ask about the Jews captured by the USSR army.
      2. Pomeranian
        Pomeranian 16 May 2016 10: 27
        0
        And his name was Izya (Israel) And more to the "Jewish question": https: //ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/List of_Jews_—_Heroes_Soviet_So

        yuz [/ quote]

        On May 9, I was driving a minibus, the Tajik driver, judging by the conversation, noticed that portraits of front-line soldiers were hanging everywhere. Immediately struck by the inscription: "Heroes of the Muslims of the Soviet Union." The discussion resembles this illiterate stupid inscription. Especially with regard to Soviet citizens.
  • altel
    altel 14 May 2016 20: 57
    +1
    Where does the figure of 6 million come from? taken of the murdered Jews? In the first world indicated, too, these 6 million tortured Jews
    1. Kostya Andreev
      Kostya Andreev 14 May 2016 21: 39
      0
      Right now, your cons will fly!
    2. aiw
      aiw 14 May 2016 22: 52
      0
      Actually, this figure appears in the conclusion of the Nuremberg Tribunal. Do you want to challenge him and rewrite history?
      1. altel
        altel 15 May 2016 00: 19
        +5
        For some reason, in Auschwitz, the Poles corrected the figure of 4 million on the plate at the gate at the entrance to 1.5 million. and "did the sky not fall to earth?" I'll tell you where the Nuremberg Tribunal got 6 million ... "a few days before leaving for London, namely on June 11, 1945, Jackson (Robert G. Jackson, born in 1892 and the Minister of Justice since July 1941, the United States, the head of the US commission at the Nuremberg trials) happened to visit the FBI office in New York, where he had the first meeting with representatives of several very powerful Jewish organizations, who made him understand that they would like to have some influence on the course of the trial in Germany. leading Jewish lawyers - Judge Nathan Perlman, Dr. Jacob Robinson, and Dr. Alexander Kohansky - attended the meeting with Jackson on behalf of all Jews of Free America. "Jackson's already published report to the President of the United States" - they began: "for Jews it is like rain who descended on their desert "-flattering further to begin with Jackson." If others are looking for precedents for the upcoming process in the 17th or 18th centuries, then his report sounds straight from the 22nd century, "they continued, and" it is advisable to consider the persecution of Jews by the Nazis and as a separate crime unparalleled in history. "Dr. Robinson handed him a copy of the Sevres treaty, according to which the Allies more than two decades ago imposed a penalty on the Turks for the deportation of Armenians after their uprising during the First World War. “We are not seeking revenge,” assured Dr. Robinson, “apart from, of course, just compensation for Jewish losses by the perished.” “How great are these losses?” Jackson asked. What number should he operate on in court? Robinson readily answered him, "This includes all the Jews who experienced the Holocaust from the Canal (English Channel) to Stalingrad," concluded Dr. Robinson. Jackson made the following note in his diary that day: "I was very interested the source of this assessment and the degree of its reliability, since I myself did not have any reliable data on this issue. "Dr. Robinson stated that he obtained such a figure as a result of EXTRAPOLATION from the known statistics on the number of world Jewish about the population for 2. data on the total number of Jews who are now considered alive. "The difference between the first and second figures was taken for the number of dead, missing or hiding," he concluded his obscure explanation. (In 1929, New York Governor Martin Glynn also declared "1919 million Jews killed.") Jackson was required to conduct a separate trial for persecuting Jews, and the three lawyers sought the right to have their "friendly representative" in the Jackson-led court "on behalf of 6 million innocent victims." As a result, Jackson objected national minorities persecuted by the Nazis will also want retribution and there will not be enough defendants for everyone.
  • Real stalinist
    Real stalinist 14 May 2016 21: 13
    +4
    May the fascist creatures be cursed, nonhumans ...
  • tolancop
    tolancop 15 May 2016 08: 17
    -1
    I read the heading "The report of a Polish midwife from Auschwitz" ...
    Further, I did not read ...
    1. blind
      blind 15 May 2016 10: 28
      +2
      Well, I didn’t read it in vain
  • Angor
    Angor 15 May 2016 12: 01
    +1
    Just reading, and in my heart everything turns upside down. Imagination is not enough to understand how they survived!?
    They say that a person will not survive another war - I do not believe it!
  • REZMovec
    REZMovec 15 May 2016 13: 09
    +1
    Quote: seren
    I have no complaints about the American army. After the war, American troops were in the territory of only those countries of Western Europe that requested this. France, for example, did not want to, and not a single American soldier was on its territory


    Not respected! And how do you like the US medal "For the occupation of Germany" ??? Compare with Soviet ...
  • semen777
    semen777 15 May 2016 14: 48
    +2
    Quote: Chisain
    Nda, my paternal grandfather was drafted in August 41, a participant in the defense of Moscow. He was a scout in a ski battalion. And he said that "them" were not among the scouts.

    I personally knew the veteran sniper (died in 2009) Since 1942 at the front, 2 wounds, the Order of the Red Star and many medals ... And his name was Izya (Israel) And also to the "Jewish question": https: // ru .wikipedia.org / wiki / List of_Jews _ — _ Heroes of_Soviet_So
    yuz
  • Paven
    Paven 15 May 2016 15: 32
    +2
    Vague doubts torment me ... and why she was silent for 20 years ... Where is her confession at the Nuremberg Tribunal. I do not defend the Nazis, most likely it was for the most part, but ... I don’t believe everything and that’s it. Because we talked with the prisoners of this camp live, we asked the schoolchildren many questions. And by the way, they found out about thinness, especially they were very hungry for 44 and 45, there were very few food supplies to the camps, many food supplies were simply bombed by the Allies. And fuel for there was little heating of the barracks, they saved on everything. By the way, the Slavs in the camps got the most, but there were very few Jews, according to eyewitnesses.
    By the way, the Jews were calculated in a very original way, and they were never mistaken. A crowd of prisoners was simply stupidly running around the huts until they sweat, and then they walked past an SS officer, who instantly determined the Jew by the smell of sweat ... I did not believe it before, but 2 a classmate of a Jew sweated and smelled very good at physical education classes, and being very different from others. This is not a bike, you can check it yourself.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Kaiten
      Kaiten 15 May 2016 20: 04
      -1
      Quote: Paven
      By the way, Jews were calculated in a camp in a very original way, and moreover, they were never mistaken.

      Nazis are you Paven, the most such natural Nazi. To calculate the Jews enough in the camp pants ordered to take off. However, in the camp, there were enough nits like you, who gave out their Jewish colleagues.
  • Reptiloid
    Reptiloid 15 May 2016 17: 37
    0
    I read about the medical "research" of the Germans in the camps (different). Everyone knows about hunger. Everything is written down, incl. blood tests. Some people had high cholesterol. There have been deaths from heart attacks and strokes. I myself read this about 5 years ago, I forgot where. Therefore, I believe when a midwife talks about nature. Still not everything is clear.
  • Mentat
    Mentat 16 May 2016 23: 50
    +1
    Quote: seren
    I have no complaints about the American army. After the war, American troops were in the territory of only those countries of Western Europe that requested this. France, for example, did not want to, and not a single American soldier was on its territory

    Did the Germans, with tears in their eyes, begged the Americans to stay? Probably, in memory of Dresden, they really liked anglo-saxon stylelet's call it that.
  • Mentat
    Mentat 16 May 2016 23: 53
    +1
    Quote: Chisain
    Imagine the country that feeds all of Russia is very small.

    What are you writing about? The semantic content in your text is difficult to detect.
  • alleksSalut4507
    alleksSalut4507 23 May 2016 23: 26
    0
    Quote: Chisain
    . Why only after WWII, they remembered about it.

    They had been thinking about the Promised Land for a long time. The British proposed in Palestine. The British wanted to have support for their dominance. Even transported almost for free. But the young did not really want to settle in these lands. And the Arabs did not share the imperial interests of Union Jack .... after the formation of Soviet Russia, the American rich and officials, in exchange for the steps of the owls. governments to create a Jewish state in Crimea, offered gold and technical assistance, and even organized a fundraising company .... I.V. Stalin really helped the field for 46 years ... look for V.Overview there were articles. in the archive .
  • den-protector
    den-protector 21 November 2016 17: 12
    0
    These are the "civilized" Caucasians who dare us Russians to teach democracy and culture. All of them understand and respect only strength. History, unfortunately, does not teach them anything, but it has proved it more than once.