Military Review

Taras and fakie

67
Of course, when writing this or that work, be it a large article or a “multi-letter” comment, I would like to enlist some kind of support from the great ones. Insert instead of your own witty quote, or even a couple of poetic stanzas of the classic - well, as if to confirm your own words and thoughts. And the matter is quite good, I can even say developing, if you do not overdo it with quoting and do not turn your own record into an excerpt from the Soviet textbook, where even in the mathematical paragraph the authors (for obvious reasons) managed to insert quotes any of the representatives of the famous trinity - Marx, Engels and Lenin.


Recently, however, with the quoting of the classics, problems, to put it mildly, have begun to be observed. In pursuit of the red word or a kind of base for confirming their own right, certain ladies and gentlemen do not disdain to use either absolutely frank or heavily veiled fakes, or in other words, lies issued as classics. They say that he himself did not check whether this phrase belongs to the person to whom it is attributed, and others will not check it - but hot support or, as the modern youth says, “respect and respect” are provided.

One of the examples of such fakes, which even became “bearded” and for some time has been very popular in the blogosphere in connection with known events, is a poem, as it were, by Taras Shevchenko. It should be noted that recently almost every second article about events in Ukraine and around Ukraine this “Shevchenko poem” pops up in the comments and every time earns its own comments in the style: “Shevchenko is a youngster ... gives the country coal!” or "Ay, yes, Taras, ah, yes, son ... showed the present hoch ... m, who they really are."

Taras and fakie


So, the subject itself:

The original page has been deleted based on the ILV requirement:
Notification of the entry of information in the “Unified Register of Domain Names, Indexes of Pages on Internet Sites and Network Addresses to Identify Internet Sites Containing Information the Distribution of which is Prohibited in the Russian Federation”
In accordance with part 7 of article 15.1 of the Federal Law of 27.07.2006 No 149-ФЗ “On Information, Information Technologies and Information Protection”, we inform you that on the basis of a decision of the court / authorized federal executive body (Central District Court of Sochi - Krasnodar Territory) from 24.03.2016 No 2-1926 / 2016 index (indexes) of the page (s) of a site on the network
"Internet" https://topwar.ru/94398-taras-i-feyki.html is included (s) in the "Unified Register of domain names, page indexes of sites on the Internet and network addresses to identify sites on the Internet "Containing information the distribution of which is prohibited in the Russian Federation", the number of the registry entry 808784-RI due to the fact that this information contains information the distribution of which in the Russian Federation is prohibited by a court decision.

The poem itself can be found on the Internet, as well as information can be viewed on the site FEDERAL LIST OF EXTREMIST MATERIALS


And then any signatures may follow, but invariably one thing - Taras, you know, Grigorievich Shevchenko. They can add: a complete works, such and such a section such and such, the poem “Ukrainians”, 1851 year, or even “TG Shevchenko, from the forbidden tsarist, and then Soviet, censorship.”

There is only one argument - to check, one, excuse me, hell, no one will, but simply lift up the thumb and, according to the habit, they will also add “T.G. Shevchenko” to the one who decided to “quote Shevchenko” here and now.

It is noteworthy that the original of this text from the published in the literature has never been demonstrated - not a single photographic image of the printed page on which the text would ever appear. The solution to the absence of such photographs is simple: there are no such pages, and therefore, there are no such photographic images. But no, because there is no such poem in Taras Shevchenko!

And if some bloggers worked to produce a poem, Shevchenko does not belong, for the work of Taras Grigorievich, then there were other bloggers who exposed fake. In particular, in LJ appeared informative materialwhere the point is put on literary falsification. Never Shevchenko (perhaps someone (those who often exploited this "Shevchenko" work, it will even offend, but is it worth it to be offended by the truth?)) Wrote nothing like this. The author of the poem “Ukrainians” is Alexander Noshchenko, who published his work on the portal in 2009 "Poems.ru", about what he himself and reports (spelling, punctuation and style are preserved):

On the issue of authorship; written by me as a cartoon - an evil joke, the time of writing - before 2009, published in 2009 here on the site, I am a Ukrainian with a thoroughbred, but during the information war any material can be used as weapon.

I was asked to publish this verse again in denial of the fake of a strolling now more, as 2, under the authorship of T.G. Shevchenko. I am not at all ashamed of this evil cartoon, because it was an answer to the ardent svidomitam - the nationalists, who through 6 years with the support of the United States came to power in our country and destroyed my beloved homeland as a state.


Of course, we can say that Alexander Noshchenko is a provocateur who introduced, you know, all honest people astray, and now he is engaged in self-disclosure. But this is hardly a provocation. This is a great example of how commonplace ignorance turns into a base for action. This is an example of how a person is ready to believe in anything, and even that if a word of three letters is written on the fence, then beyond the fence there is no doubt that it (he). And if under this word there is “inscribed a personal signature of a classic,” then in general there is complete success ... And not only to believe, but also to convince everyone else of this. Referring to some (may Alexander forgive) an unknown poet of the present day - as if moveton for a certain category of people, but where the reference to the classics looks more significant, even if this classic has nothing to do with the writing.

Does one "Taras Shevchenko's poem" today have such problems? Not. Internet resources managed to produce “quotes of famous people” for all occasions, and these “quotes” become almost life guides for a certain category of citizens. The whole essence of this kind of "quotes" is perfectly demonstrated in the sort of demotivator by an unknown author:



Here are examples of "quotes" that have become an integral part of a number of publications.

"Stalin's quote":
There would be a man, but there will be an article.


In fact, in none of the documents is there any confirmation of the “Stalinist” authorship of these words. V.Chkalov says that this phrase to her father (V.P. Chkalov) was told by prosecutor Andrei Vyshinsky. But the prosecutor Vyshinsky and Stalin are, as it were, not the same person at all ... But a borzopist, having reversed the facts, decided to attribute the phrase to Stalin.

"Stalin's quote":
There is a person - there is a problem, there is no person - there is no problem.


This is a frank juggling of facts - Stalin never uttered such phrases. Her first documentary appearance relates to the publication of Anatoly Rybakov’s book Children of the Arbat. Subsequently, Rybakov himself admitted that this was his “transposition of the Stalinist principle”, and that it was “the artist’s right” to deal with the transcriptions.

"Quote Bismarck":
Officials are drones writing laws that a person cannot live through. Why do ministers have a salary constantly and irrespective of whether the population of Prussia lives well or badly? Now, if the quota of bureaucrats' salaries fluctuated up and down depending on the standard of living of the people, then these fools would write less laws, and more would think ...


Formally, but essentially ... Well, Otto von Bismarck didn’t say anything like that. This quotation appeared in Valentin Pikul's 1977 in his Battle of the Iron Chancellors.

"Quote Bismarck":
It is necessary to create an independent Ukraine to maintain balance and peace in Europe. The rejection of Ukraine would be a difficult amputation for Russia.


And this is fake. None of the sources cited even by very prominent historians reveal anything like that expressed by Bismarck. It does not detect, but the authorship of Bismarck is attributed to the words even more “ironier” than what the iron chancellor himself was.

What is all this written for today? No, this is not a call to sit down at the archives and "shovel" the works of the same Bismarck. This is a common statement of fact connected with how sometimes we are trusting, and how corrosively a false word capable of creating a whole system of false values ​​and attitudes.

And the conclusion is: to continue to produce such fakes (even if they look very nice) - to give a chance to those in whose interests the existence of a thinking society in Russia does not mean ...
Author:
67 comments
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  1. parusnik
    parusnik April 25 2016 07: 22
    +22
    This is a great example of how commonplace ignorance turns into a base for action...Ignorance..and moreover .. People stopped reading books .. And if they read, do not think, do not analyze, do not compare .. But it’s a pity ..
    1. vkl.47
      vkl.47 April 25 2016 07: 54
      -26%
      Bismarck only shook the air.
      1. Nicholas C.
        Nicholas C. April 25 2016 08: 07
        +19
        The idea of ​​the article is not very clear.
        Are fakes characteristic of Russian national consciousness, for the politics of our state? Is our society engaged in the production of fakes?

        The vast majority of fakes on the Russian-speaking Internet is of Ukrainian origin. Including MinStec’s army of trolls is working on them.
        In Ukraine, lying is an acceptable and perhaps the main means of the Jesuits to achieve their goals. There are completely fakes. The Jesuit lies in Ukraine did not appear yesterday. Raised into the pantheon of gods-creators of Ukraine, N. Kostomarov (as the predecessor of M. Hrushevsky - the author of the Ukrainian nation) himself exposed the forgers (Velichko's chronicles, "History of the Rus" under Konissky, etc.) The paradox is that Kostomarov, as one of leaders of the secret society, they themselves are trying to attribute the authorship of the "Book of the life of the Ukrainian people."

        Also now. Remember how Gogol was "translated" into MOV? They explained simply: Gogol WANTED to write that, but the tsarist censorship and money prevented. Such is the state policy there. Why are books, films, TV, newspapers and other sources of information from Russia banned? To lie unhindered.
        "We all remember well USSR invasion of Germany and Ukraine. We must not let this happen. No one has the right to rewrite the results of World War II. However, this is exactly what Russian President Putin is trying to do. " - said Yatsenyuk (the second person in the "state" at that time).
        And this is no longer a fake.
        1. cniza
          cniza April 25 2016 08: 25
          +13
          The information war is very tough, on the one side Russia, Truth and those who support us, on the other the USA, the West, the cynical lies and those who support them, which are inside our country and this war will go on until the Victory.
          1. Tatyana
            Tatyana April 27 2016 09: 18
            +5
            Do you want, I’ll tell you one secret, how does one method of information warfare among the atlantists that they introduced in Russia to replace the worldview of Soviet people and Russians work? I personally came across this. Moreover, this technique works against Russia (and other countries) not only in political circles, but also in the scientific community of Russian patriots.
            Somehow the theoretical justification of the political program of one Russian political party A. was written. The party members of another political party B asked me to look at this program and tell them what was wrong in it.
            Fakes, of course, are literary, and they are also just in the form of a scientifically untenable foolishness, when you are plunged with a lot of methodological errors by false political principles to support the ideas and programs of some adventurers who seek to enter power.
            So that’s the most interesting. It turns out that by criticizing a work full of methodological errors, you can only influence people at the local local level — that is, at best, they will print your review with a detailed correction of the author’s errors for internal use only. But, to publish for wide open access, you will not find support. And you know why? And because in the West, the atlantists formed a system of rating value of copyright works, which depends solely on the amount of citation by other authors - and this is independent of the scientific viability of the work itself. And at the same time, not your refutation of the literary and pseudoscientific fakes of the erroneous second work will be appreciated, but how many times in your opposition to the author's “delirium” you quoted scientifically untenable quotes of the unfortunate author that you had to mention, parse and correct. And the result is the more scientifically insolvent the author’s work, the more methodological mistakes made by the demagogues consciously in her, the more often you are forced to stop and correct each such mistake, proving its sophistry (logical fallacy as an author’s trick to achieve his demagogic goals) the higher the rating of such a job for promoting it in a publication, the more it will have a circulation - especially if it ultimately works for the atlantists and against Russia.
            As a result, in order to prevent the bad work from going on, in the scientific community it is customary to oppose such works simply to hush up - i.e. the opposition does not print or convey to the general public.
            How do you like the reception of the Atlantists in their information war against the countries to which their aggression is directed?
            Can you imagine what free space for provocative lies, fakes during the information war opens up for demagogues, provocateurs and Westernists-Atlantists in our country ?! And so all the last 25-30 years!
          2. The comment was deleted.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. Pinkie F.
          Pinkie F. April 25 2016 08: 55
          +4
          Quote: Nikolai S.
          Are fakes characteristic of Russian national consciousness?

          killed phrase laughing laughing
          Quote: Nikolai S.
          The vast majority of fakes on the Russian-speaking Internet is of Ukrainian origin.

          in how. Authorship immediately identified. Consequently, these hohls are misinterpreting old Bismarck. Now I know everything.
        4. dogens
          dogens April 25 2016 16: 35
          -1
          Quote: Nikolay S.
          The idea of ​​the article is not very clear.
          Are fakes characteristic of Russian national consciousness, for the politics of our state? Is our society engaged in the production of fakes?

          The vast majority of fakes on the Russian-speaking Internet is of Ukrainian origin. Including MinStec’s army of trolls is working on them.
          In Ukraine, lying is an acceptable and perhaps the main means of the Jesuits to achieve their goals. There are completely fakes. The Jesuit lies in Ukraine did not appear yesterday. Raised into the pantheon of gods-creators of Ukraine, N. Kostomarov (as the predecessor of M. Hrushevsky - the author of the Ukrainian nation) himself exposed the forgers (Velichko's chronicles, "History of the Rus" under Konissky, etc.) The paradox is that Kostomarov, as one of leaders of the secret society, they themselves are trying to attribute the authorship of the "Book of the life of the Ukrainian people."

          Also now. Remember how Gogol was "translated" into MOV? They explained simply: Gogol WANTED to write that, but the tsarist censorship and money prevented. Such is the state policy there. Why are books, films, TV, newspapers and other sources of information from Russia banned? To lie unhindered.
          "We all remember well USSR invasion of Germany and Ukraine. We must not let this happen. No one has the right to rewrite the results of World War II. However, this is exactly what Russian President Putin is trying to do. " - said Yatsenyuk (the second person in the "state" at that time).
          And this is no longer a fake.


          I do not agree, and we love to deceive ourselves. Trusting you understand.
          If you look through such motivators, then you will feel sorry for Vysotsky, Raikin, F. Raneuvskaya .... because they did not live as long as written about their sayings. And here, sorry, Ukraine has nothing to do with it. It's just someone who creates content, and someone else, this content, sorry, "hawala".
        5. EvgNik
          EvgNik April 26 2016 05: 09
          +1
          Quote: Nikolai S.
          "We all remember well the Soviet invasion of Germany and on Ukraine.

          Yatsenyuk could not say on Ukraine, only в Ukraine.
      2. Shuttle
        Shuttle April 25 2016 18: 14
        +12
        Quote: vkl.47
        Bismarck only shook the air.

        Otto Edward Leopold Ferdinandovich von Bismarck-Schönhausen knew and spoke perfectly not only in German and French, but also in Russian. Moreover, knowledge of the Russian language allowed him to conduct a very effective policy with Russia. If we consider your message, dear vkl.47, it becomes quite obvious that, strangely, I would even put it even more definitely - a mystical coincidence, only two of it were written completely without errors. These words are "only air".
        I am sure that Otto Ferdinandovich could answer you, vkl.47 properly in writing if he were alive. And I am absolutely sure that he would have made mistakes much less than yours. And syntactic, and spelling, and semantic, and semantic.
    2. Victor jnnjdfy
      Victor jnnjdfy April 25 2016 11: 44
      +8
      M. Yu. Lermontov. "Farewell to unwashed Russia ..." Few people know that the poem surfaced 30-40 years after the death of the poet. Allegedly, someone once wrote down this poem from the words of Lermontov himself, and then somewhere this paper with an "immortal creation" was found ... Lermontov did not even serve "behind the wall of the Caucasus" (i.e. in the Transcaucasia ).
      1. VALERIK_097
        VALERIK_097 April 25 2016 14: 31
        -16%
        Pyatigorsk is not Transcaucasia in your opinion? Although the Stavropol Territory.
        1. Diana Ilyina
          Diana Ilyina April 25 2016 15: 15
          +19
          Quote: VALERIK_097
          Pyatigorsk is not Transcaucasia in your opinion? Although the Stavropol Territory.


          Aw, dear, do you yourself understand where the Caucasus is, and where is the Caucasus ?! Or are you looking at the map from Turkey ?!
          1. VALERIK_097
            VALERIK_097 April 25 2016 22: 04
            -6
            Pyatigorsk is not the Stavropol Territory?
            1. Diana Ilyina
              Diana Ilyina April 26 2016 08: 41
              +14
              Quote: VALERIK_097
              Pyatigorsk is not the Stavropol Territory?


              Stavropol, Stavropol, no one argues here. Only now, with what kind of transfer is the Stavropol Territory Transcaucasia ?! Aww, help, the geographer drank the globe !!!
              1. VALERIK_097
                VALERIK_097 7 May 2016 22: 29
                0
                Yes, with Transcaucasia went too far is the North Caucasus
          2. The comment was deleted.
      2. Nicholas C.
        Nicholas C. April 25 2016 15: 30
        +14
        Everything is correct. "Goodbye, unwashed Russia" is a fake liberalist of the second half of the 19th century. The autograph of this "Lermontov's poem" is not and could not have been. The publisher was confused in the testimony and was clearly lying.
        The question is posed here: www.warandpeace.ru/ru/analysis/view/79923/
        Here is the real Lermontov M.Yu .:

        Homeland

        I love my motherland, but with strange love!
        Her reason will not win.
        No fame, bought with blood,
        Neither full of proud peace of mind,
        Neither dark antiquities cherished precepts
        Do not stir in me a pleasant dream.

        But I love - for what, I do not know myself -
        Its steppes are a cold silence,
        Its forests are boundless kolyagyan,
        The spills of its rivers, like the seas;
        In the country way I like jumping in a cart
        And, with a slow gaze of a night piercing the shadow,
        To meet on the sides, sighing about the overnight stay,
        Trembling lights of sad villages;
        I love the smoke of a bedroom stubble,
        In the steppe, the overnight convoy
        And on a hill among the yellow fields
        Even the white birches.
        With joy, a lot of unfamiliar,
        I see a full threshing floor,
        The hut covered with straw,
        With carved shutters window;
        And on a feast in the evening dewy,
        Watch until midnight ready
        On the dance with stomping and whistling
        Under the sound of drunken peasants.
    3. Vadim42
      Vadim42 April 25 2016 13: 27
      -4
      And earlier, in every peasant's hut, libraries or books were beaten. If you do not take the Soviet era, when at the state level instilled a love of the book. But for the analysis of what you read, you are right, people were lazy to disgrace. And I liked the stitches, folk art as always close to reality.
    4. siberalt
      siberalt April 25 2016 14: 57
      +7
      "Purebred crest" how is it? laughing Really all life on the Maidan galloped? And father rode, and grandfather rode, and great-grandfather ... belay Actually, the "crest" is a local omen to distinguish from neighbors (a manifestation of primitive separatism) by the hairstyle in the form of a shaved head with a tuft in the form of a long forelock tucked behind the ear, plus wide Turkish shawars. And where does the "blood"? We are all Russian by blood.
    5. KaPToC
      KaPToC April 25 2016 19: 46
      0
      It would be nice to go through supposedly popular proverbs and sayings.
    6. Spnsr
      Spnsr April 27 2016 10: 19
      +2
      Bequeathed as much by Monomakh:
      "Contact God forbid
      With three - a liquid, a crest and a lyakh! ”
      Well, as it was not yet Ukrainians, zh.id.y were, but not as a relation to the nation, but as a current in .... now it is rather white-bellied! and then they had nothing to do with Jews as a nationality !!! and with the Poles already got excited! I still don’t quite understand where it came from, but somehow it wasn’t possible under Monomakh, and in 1851 some of them were just starting to gain the meaning that is now in them! so that the authorship of this alone is doubtful !!!
  2. Barakuda
    Barakuda April 25 2016 07: 25
    +15
    Thank you for the article. Itself is a sin, you need to watch a telly less for example .. And there are really a lot of historians of all stripes, go figure it out .. it seems like the brain is present and there are enough books. what
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid April 25 2016 08: 41
      +6
      Good historical programs are broadcast on the Zvezda channel. True, at night. Probably, it is not available to everyone. In general, you cannot read everything, there is more and more information ...
      And fakes will certainly be. Nothing comes of them.
      1. Altona
        Altona April 25 2016 11: 12
        +3
        Quote: Reptiloid
        Good historical programs are broadcast on the Zvezda channel. True, at night. Probably, it is not available to everyone. In general, you cannot read everything, there is more and more information ...

        --------------------
        For example, I read a couple of poems from all of Taras Shevchenko. I haven't read the Iron Chancellor at all. How can I assume that he said something there? Therefore, it is better not to get involved in quoting the "unknown". I also don’t read pseudo-historians and their books, there they immediately hang a backpack of fakes on an inexperienced reader — these are Rezun and Solzhenitsyn. Moreover, these "backpacks" are easily refuted by ordinary logic and arithmetic and the most banal statistics available. How can you torture 60 million in a 180 million country? And who then built everything? Or “for Hitler,” a million Russians fought. "Yes, with such an army, Hitler would have reached China easily. There were Ukrainian punishers, several thousand, yes. There were Khivi, they twisted their tails to the bulls, helped everyone. Even the ROA was decent in size, they write that “one hundred thousand.” But for “a million Russians to fight?” This is beyond good and evil. And there are whole garbage dumps of such a “history” on the Internet.
        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid April 25 2016 11: 51
          +1
          And I read "The Iron Chancellor" when I was petty. Accordingly, I can't compare anything to "quote". But "Word and Deed" ---- I remember a lot from the book.
          Just immediately for yourself to determine the veracity of the sources and "not a step to the side."
          1. Pinkie F.
            Pinkie F. April 25 2016 12: 05
            +5
            Quote: Reptiloid
            And I read "The Iron Chancellor" when I was small.

            nevertheless, this is historical fiction. Some liberty of the genre is allowed. Documentary accuracy from the novelists is unnecessary. Just as, for example, it is now customary to judge the time of Ivan the Terrible from notes of the adventurer Heinrich Staden. Paradox or not, but it is precisely the complete absence of morality in the notorious G.Sh. and called the argument in favor of the reliability of his writings)
        2. EvgNik
          EvgNik April 26 2016 05: 18
          0
          Quote: Altona
          Therefore, it is better not to get involved in quoting the "unknown"

          It is checked easily, there would be a desire. You type the first line in the search and go! Now I will be more careful with demotivators - first check the truth of the words.
  3. Pvi1206
    Pvi1206 April 25 2016 07: 31
    +4
    To maintain public interest, both quotes and parodies of quotes are used.
    Interest in publication is the same fee to the author, but not in material form.
    Everything new is well forgotten old.
    Everything has already been repeatedly said before us: both wisdom and stupidity.
    And according to this, the main thing is not authorship, but thought, idea ...
  4. Same lech
    Same lech April 25 2016 07: 33
    +3
    And the conclusion is: to continue to produce such fakes (even if they look very nice) - to give a chance to those in whose interests the existence of a thinking society in Russia does not mean ...


    Fakes were and will be and it is sometimes difficult to determine their authenticity ...
    for this it is necessary to shovel all the work of the author referred to ... which takes a lot of time.
    On the other hand, you get a lot of additional knowledge ... your head becomes like a watermelon ...
    bursting with different information.
    1. Eragon
      Eragon April 25 2016 08: 23
      +2
      Quote: The same LYOKHA
      Fakes were and will be and it is sometimes difficult to determine their authenticity ...
      for this it is necessary to shovel all the work of the author referred to ... which takes a lot of time.
      On the other hand, you get a lot of additional knowledge ... your head becomes like a watermelon ...
      bursting with different information.

      So after all, the head is not a watermelon, it also has to think about the information it receives and leave only the necessary. And if a watermelon, then we get such fakes, because we don't think: I saw, "liked", repost.
      1. Same lech
        Same lech April 25 2016 10: 10
        +1
        So after all, the head is not a watermelon, it should also think about the information that it receives and leaves only the right information.

        All is correct smile however, the process of digesting knowledge is not fast.
    2. Eragon
      Eragon April 25 2016 08: 23
      0
      Quote: The same LYOKHA
      Fakes were and will be and it is sometimes difficult to determine their authenticity ...
      for this it is necessary to shovel all the work of the author referred to ... which takes a lot of time.
      On the other hand, you get a lot of additional knowledge ... your head becomes like a watermelon ...
      bursting with different information.

      So after all, the head is not a watermelon, it also has to think about the information it receives and leave only the necessary. And if a watermelon, then we get such fakes, because we don't think: I saw, "liked", repost.
  5. Riv
    Riv April 25 2016 07: 38
    +4
    There is an old, still Soviet joke. Question to the Armenian radio:
    - How is a crest different from a Ukrainian?
    Frosts:
    - The Ukrainian lives in Ukraine, and Khokhol - anywhere.

    Nothing really changed. The current Svidomo themselves also do not associate with any such Ukraine. They do not need independence, they want to go to Europe, under the cozy gentlemen's boots.
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee April 25 2016 09: 26
      +6
      Quote: Riv
      wherever.

      Do not go anywhere - it will hit again!
    2. Weyland
      Weyland April 25 2016 10: 34
      +2
      Quote: Riv
      hohol - anywhere.



      not "anywhere", but "where profitably"!
    3. Weyland
      Weyland April 25 2016 10: 34
      -1
      Quote: Riv
      hohol - anywhere.



      not "anywhere", but "where profitably"!
  6. Yuri Y.
    Yuri Y. April 25 2016 07: 38
    +4
    On the other hand, a thinking society always operates with the thoughts of some individuals, for example, with knowledge. There is no other way. You won't really shovel the whole Bismarck. On this occasion, someone said "we stand on the shoulders of titans." This is how we live, someone says something, someone refutes or agrees (with knowledge or emotions). Sometimes the truth appears.
  7. zoknyay82
    zoknyay82 April 25 2016 07: 40
    +2
    I will paraphrase: ... "If all fakes are removed from the story, maybe the story itself will not disappear" ... :-)
  8. Scud
    Scud April 25 2016 07: 41
    +6
    All around, untruth and bondage,
    to torment the people tormented,
    and on the apostolic throne
    gangster yearning snydy.
    T.G. Shevchenko 1850
    1. 2s1122
      2s1122 April 25 2016 10: 16
      +3
      And here are the other lines,

      Slip on the crib
      and lead your child.

      unfortunately I don’t remember further, I taught for a long time somewhere in the year 75, but in Ukraine nothing has changed. That is not to say, but Shevchenko is a genius who sings without any flying reason.
  9. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch April 25 2016 07: 46
    +8
    So what? What are we talking about? Personally, to me, in parallel, what Shevchenko wrote and thought there, I read the textbooks of literature for the high school of the Soviet era carefully, this is enough to understand who is able to write something and who is not. The average level of education of the Internet population is already clear, savages, they are savages, Wikipedia as truth is by no means impressive. The brain for what? He is either there or not. If not, then go:
  10. Gardamir
    Gardamir April 25 2016 07: 57
    +2
    Alas, the author is right. many live by and for similar quotes.
  11. Avis24
    Avis24 April 25 2016 08: 13
    +1
    I like Shevchenko's "Poles". From this poem it is clear who the enemy is for him. Although the Russian tsar got it.
  12. rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 April 25 2016 08: 14
    +2
    If someone is pleased to realize that this was written by T. Shevchenko, then why deprive a person of pleasure. Another thing is that the thrown once is picked up and multiplies exponentially. So this is probably the cost of the same Internet.
    1. ImPerts
      ImPerts April 25 2016 08: 51
      +8
      I somehow tried to follow the links on Wikipedia. An article about pre-war repression. The link was numbered, it was referred to as an argument about the scale. I found an article in the magazine where this was mentioned. The article also referred to a certain source. I found this source, also an article, but in the newspaper. And in the article, or rather the interview, the interviewee says that in his opinion it was in such quantity ...
      Although up to a point, everything looked pretty. Fact, link to the source ...
  13. thinker
    thinker April 25 2016 08: 26
    +4
    When reading the Internet, you should always remember - On the fence is also written ... (Russian folk wisdom).
    And a quote about Ukraine -
    In the certificate of the SS centurion of the SS "Galicia" division, the most interesting inscription is Hitler's quote in German and Ukrainian: "We will then defeat Russia when the Ukrainians and Belarusians believe that they are not Russians."

    http://www.vesti7.ru/news?id=49435
  14. baudolino
    baudolino April 25 2016 08: 40
    +3
    This problem has been two hundred years old. As the information wars began during the time of Bonaparte, they continue. As the saying goes, he who has ears hang.
    1. avt
      avt April 25 2016 09: 53
      0
      Quote: baudolino
      This problem has been two hundred years old.

      Or maybe more. But here I have a question for the author on
      It is noteworthy that the original of this text from the published in the literature has never been demonstrated - not a single photographic image of the printed page on which the text would ever appear. The solution to the absence of such photographs is simple: there are no such pages, and therefore, there are no such photographic images. But no, because there is no such poem in Taras Shevchenko!
      The author is so well acquainted with the work of the kobzar and sat up in the archive, leafing through with his own hands in white gloves, for careful handling of documents, handwritten sheets? Have you studied Shevchenko's creations right by the years? Well, maybe you really talked with the Shevchenko scholars who worked in the archives? If not, then what is he actually doing with "debunking the myths of the Internet"? Ah! YES! Well, there are definitely no publications from Soviet times! And many knew in the same Soviet times that in Khatyn people were burned alive by Natsik Galitsai?
      Quote: sanya.vorodis
      If the author touches on such areas, then he himself must be infallible!

      And runs ahead of the dill.
      Quote: sanya.vorodis
      The article itself seems to be an attempt to "show off"!
      Or maybe shevchenkolyub and specifically offended by a kobzar?
  15. Zomanus
    Zomanus April 25 2016 08: 49
    +2
    Well, yes, we have no time to read classics and thinkers.
    Therefore, we accept such quotes on faith.
    Thanks to the author for exposing.
  16. Was mammoth
    Was mammoth April 25 2016 08: 53
    +2
    But this is really a problem - how to protect yourself from lies? With the development of means of communication, what Volodin politely called fake is growing like a snowball. Something can be "filtered" by experience, by knowledge, but not everything. And criminals use lies with might and main (remember their contemptuous attitude towards an honest person - "sucker") and unscrupulous politicians to manipulate consciousness. "Trust but verify" does not always work.
    PS Thank you! At heart, I could not believe that these were the poems of T. Shevchenko.
  17. Aleksander
    Aleksander April 25 2016 08: 57
    0
    This is a common statement of the fact that we are sometimes trusting and how corrosive a false word can create a whole system of false values ​​and views.


    Does the thought and utterance that provokes sympathy become a lie from what is written by other people? belay
    The criterion of a lie, it seems, is somewhat different — this is a statement that obviously does not correspond to the truth and is expressed in this form consciously.
  18. Cananecat
    Cananecat April 25 2016 09: 03
    +1
    I won’t say anything about Stalin’s phrases, not only would I believe, but I couldn’t scream. But as for Bismarck, some phrases cause a misunderstanding with his image. And somehow it’s quite successful to lay down on the harsh truth of our days, which immediately raises the question, and who benefits from it ...
  19. Ros 56
    Ros 56 April 25 2016 09: 10
    +5
    So this is the European style, telling lies from three boxes, and then you figure it out true or not. Read reviews about Russia in the 16-17 century, of course, for this you need to visit reputable libraries. Therefore, people believe. But in addition to studying the primary sources, there is still an internal conviction of his innocence, soaked with mother’s milk. Of course this is illogical, but nonetheless. Many at a subconscious level have a desire for justice. And someone has a betrayal, and here no school and no upbringing can do anything.
  20. adma
    adma April 25 2016 09: 23
    +13
    Fakes, Shevchenko, Bismarck ... What are you talking about ??? Yesterday I clashed with one ukr on another resource on the fact of an air strike in Lugansk on June 2, 2014. They are Until now, we are confident that in Lugansk MANPADS WORKED ON THE AIR CONDITIONER. At the same time, the whole conclusions of military experts, video investigations and evidence of this version are laid out. I read it myself yesterday and quietly oh ... al. And you are Gogol, Stalin ...
  21. a.hamster55
    a.hamster55 April 25 2016 10: 30
    +2
    "I don't care what you do at night, as long as you don't indulge in Trotskyism."
  22. nivander
    nivander April 25 2016 11: 03
    +5
    It is time for Ukraine to start publishing V. Klyachko's quotation book --- "Only one person can beat me - my coach and my wife"
    1. Pinkie F.
      Pinkie F. April 25 2016 11: 10
      +3
      Quote: nivasander
      V. Klyachko's quotation book --- "Only one person can beat me - my coach and my wife"

      after falling from the great asphalt was added.
      1. 2s1122
        2s1122 April 25 2016 12: 22
        0
        In this quote, as in the question: "Execution cannot be pardoned" -where you need to put a comma. Put a comma and everything will fall into place.
  23. Denis Skiff
    Denis Skiff April 25 2016 11: 14
    0
    Lenin Stalin Bismarck nasmark and all!
  24. 37 year
    37 year April 25 2016 11: 17
    +1
    Not enough quotes, I will supplement.
    The death of one person is a tragedy, the death of millions - statistics
    Stalin did not say this, this is a slightly modified phrase from the novel by E. M. Remarque "The Black Obelisk."
    We have no irreplaceable.
    Also not a Stalinist phrase, this is the slogan of the election campaign of US Presidents Wilson and Roosevelt.
    If the enemy does not surrender, they destroy him
    Stalin is attributed, but this is the name of Gorky's article published in Pravda and Izvestia on November 15, 1930.
    I’m not changing a soldier for a field marshal!
    And Stalin didn’t say that either, this is a quote from Yu. N. Ozerov’s film “Liberation”.
  25. Nicola Bari
    Nicola Bari April 25 2016 11: 21
    0
    The farther into the development of networks, the less will be the opportunity to trust everything that is in it, although, it would seem, the possibilities for an ordinary person to check are much more.
  26. Arkan
    Arkan April 25 2016 12: 00
    0
    “Recently, I noticed,” said Mitya, “that from frequent use some quotes shine like a railing.
    Victor Pelevin "Life of insects."

    And nothing to add.
  27. pts-m
    pts-m April 25 2016 12: 27
    0
    But it doesn’t matter who wrote these sayings, they’re certainly suitable in the current situation. About the Kakhlov, to the very point.
  28. am808s
    am808s April 25 2016 15: 09
    0
    Quote: The same Lech
    And the conclusion is: to continue to produce such fakes (even if they look very nice) - to give a chance to those in whose interests the existence of a thinking society in Russia does not mean ...


    Fakes were and will be and it is sometimes difficult to determine their authenticity ...
    for this it is necessary to shovel all the work of the author referred to ... which takes a lot of time.
    On the other hand, you get a lot of additional knowledge ... your head becomes like a watermelon ...
    bursting with different information.

    Therefore, they won’t stop lying for a red word. I don’t want to break my head during inspections. But the lodges most often come out with the help of the Volodins and thank them for their work from us lazy people.
  29. avg-mgn
    avg-mgn April 25 2016 15: 55
    +1
    I do not know the Russian word fake, but ...
    The teacher asks a question to the class on the topic:
    "Great and rich Russian language"
    Children adequately respond, the teacher praises them ...
    Here Vovochka! Pulls a hand.
    "Mary Ivanna, make it clear to me: when they tell me - go to x .., they send me, or invite" ???
  30. Nightrain
    Nightrain April 25 2016 17: 44
    +1
    I realized that this poem is modern, even when I first saw it. It is written in too modern a language. But this does not negate his masterpiece, however.
  31. Koshak
    Koshak April 25 2016 18: 21
    +1
    Can't help but insert a quote.
  32. Bayun
    Bayun April 25 2016 20: 29
    0
    "And who does not honor quotes, he is a renegade and ..." (C)

    Propaganda - a lie with a purpose - has been replaced by everyday LIE for the sake of lies. Fake is one of the varieties. Brothers, do not waste your energy fighting the mirages of "windmills".

    By the way, what if the authors of fakes really whisper the spirits of those Authorities to whom they attribute? As far as I imagine, information from the next world is not prohibited;)
  33. Angler
    Angler April 25 2016 22: 51
    +3
    There are so many such fakes that cannot be counted. A striking example of this is Budyonny's dictum about equipment and horses. He is quoted correctly, but they "forget" to add that he said this at the congress of collective farmers. Yes, and Vyshinsky was credited with the phrase "the confession of the defendant is the mother of all evidence," but he said the exact opposite. And I think everyone knows what the statement has turned into: "We must raise the level of education to such a level that any cook can understand the issues of government."
  34. VIT101
    VIT101 April 26 2016 22: 15
    +3
    Today's liberal scholars ascribe to Lenin the expression "Every cook must run the state."

    Here is what Lenin wrote about this cook in fact:
    “We are not utopians. We know that any unskilled worker and any cook is not capable of taking over the government at once. On this we agree with the cadets, Breshkovskaya, and Tsereteli. But we differ from these citizens in that we demand immediate a break with the prejudice that only the rich or officials taken from wealthy families are able to manage the state, to carry out the everyday, daily work of government.We demand that training in public administration be carried out by class-conscious workers and soldiers and that it begin immediately, that is, to training this immediately began to attract all the working people, all the poor. "
  35. NACC
    NACC April 27 2016 08: 55
    0
    Shevchenko wrote or not, but accurately and fairly.
  36. SevaNikolaev
    SevaNikolaev April 27 2016 16: 30
    +1
    Addition to the school textbook about Shevchenko
    http://modernlib.ru/books/buzina_oles/vurdalak_taras_shevchenko/read