Combat work "Night Hunters" in Syria (new video)

Newspaper Look published videos that captured the combat work of the Mi-28H helicopters.

The video was posted on YouTube by user Konstantin Rokossovsky (Rokossovskiy Konstantin). The footage shows how a rocket fired from a helicopter hits a terrorist car.




And the user named this video “The third one will not go far too”

Comments

[soroKING]

and the guys are gambling

[seti]

Thank you for efficiency. It seems there is no such type of aviation or helicopter technology that has not been tested in Syria. The experience will be useful and will help to identify defects if any.

[cniza]

The breathtaking and bursting pride, men return home healthy, God bless you.

[PAM]

three goals - two misses on standing two trucks, the third SUV was the fastest and the deadest (exact hit)

[PAM]

the quieter you go, the further you'll get.

[Eugene-Eugene]

three goals - two slip on standing two trucks

This topic, along with the recording of the work of Ka-52, has already been laid out on bmpd (http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1834321.html). Do not embarrass yourself.

[aktanir]

it is necessary to implement the target automatically, shot and forgot, manually is no good, the helicopter freezes and becomes an excellent target

[_Vladislav_]

Beauties - one word!)

[Manul]

Quote: aktanir

the helicopter freezes and becomes an excellent target

There, the numbers of the range to the target change, pay attention. The first two targets were fired upon when approaching (the distance is too far for a "perfect target"). The third (The professor in vain says that it was necessary to finish off the second - there all the drivers escaped, the target will not go anywhere, the pilots are great !) moves away and the helicopter rushes in pursuit - the range has increased again, and we hit perfectly on this target. The car worked all the time on the approach trajectory, and did not hang anywhere in particular. I forgot about automatic tracking, and I forgot about the shot (advantages and disadvantages) in the branch they have already told everything. But I am absolutely FOR, so that we have analogs of Halfire. It's just that our rocket should be able to do everything - fly itself as it wants, and be manually controlled.

[adept666]

And for this purpose they hit perfectly.

Moreover, it is noteworthy that in the manual mode we were struck by a target moving at a decent speed, but the automatic tracking machine was a little fake alas ...

[Professor]

Quote: Manul

(The professor says in vain that it was necessary to finish off the second - there all the drivers ran away, the goal is not going anywhere, the pilots are great!

Well done, only they didn’t hit the target. They and the children escaped with a slight startle.

[adept666]

Well done, only they didn’t hit the target. They and the children escaped with a slight startle. request

No, just when the pilots themselves launched a missile in a semi-automatic mode, and they hit a moving target But when there were flaws with a hit, the helicopter tracking machine was taxiing: I missed the first target due to the error in determining the spatial coordinates of the target (for> 5 km range up to 5 m error), and missed the second because the tracking machine failed after catching a plume of smoke from its own ATGM, which blocked the target, but at the same time additional software support was included (if the attack is disrupted, then using the last telemetry readings of the target gives the ATGM guidance to the intended target site) and the missile reached the target in this mode (and almost got to tell )

[Professor]

Quote: adept666

No, just when the pilots themselves launched a missile in a semi-automatic mode, and they hit a moving target

No, they didn’t hit. Show us a damaged car.

Quote: adept666

almost hit it must be said

[adept666]

No, they didn’t hit. Show us a damaged car.

In the third hit, it is clearly visible as at 0:46 a piece flies from the car and the explosion is strong just because of the detonated gas tank.

[jPilot]

What nonsense! Helicopter never freezes to fire everything is done with summer. And the tracking of the target that you see in the video is performed by an operator who works with the sighting and navigation system of the UR (guided missiles), as well as with bomb sights. The crew commander, through his TSA, controls weapons that do not require target tracking: gun, machine gun, NAR, GUV, etc. Therefore, the Ka-52 was developed to replace the Ka-50 for the simple reason that one pilot does not have time to cope with everything, and especially with guided missiles.
A hanging helicopter can certainly work, but it is very rarely done using natural shelters, for example, from an ambush, in PMV, under cover of a forest, enter the BP zone, popped up a shot while hanging, and again flew off under the cover of a forest. Syria is not the place for this kind of use.
By the way, on the sighting system, information is displayed that the speed is 174 km / h, watch carefully, then comment.
Sorry, but the opinions of "SPECIALISTS" are very annoying

[Red_Hamer]

Syria is not the place for this kind of use.
By the way, on the sighting system, information is displayed that the speed is 174 km / h, watch carefully, then comment.
Sorry, but the opinions of "SPECIALISTS" are very annoying

When necessary, quickly sprinkle, I'm afraid some comrades, and do not read, and do not look closely, guided by the speed of writing comments from "SPECIALISTS". And the fact that work is going on there, and the training of specialists in a real combat situation, do they generally (do not care), or simply do not understand?

[adept666]

it is necessary to implement the target automatically, shot and forgot, manually is no good, the helicopter freezes and becomes an excellent target

1.Automatic tracking is available, there is no "let-and-forget" mode (no missiles with an active guidance head), when automatic tracking is turned on, the helicopter must be kept on course on the line of sight, the operator can relax as in the second video. 2: In both cases, the helicopter did not hang, but flew at a decent speed.

[ver_]

... interesting - the helmet for helicopter pilots is equipped with tracking eye movement when choosing a target or not?

[AllXVahhaB]

What does the Ka-52 have to do with it? In the hat Mi-28N.

[jPilot]

The Ka-52 has nothing to do with the article, just an example, an explanation of why it became necessary to create this machine. Because, judging by the comments, the majority do not understand what the work of the crew is and who controls what weapons.
And of course, the Mi-28N works

[ASK505]

Quote: PAM

three goals - two misses on standing two trucks, the third SUV was the fastest and the deadest (exact hit)

Yes, two misses. Why the operator did not hold the frame? That is the question. Nobody interfered. And the third on the video escaped ... Maybe they can get it from the gun ...

[kamski]

because it’s all yesterday, the United States has long shot and forgot

[vovanpain]

Quote: kamski

because it’s all yesterday, the United States has long shot and forgot

Well, yes, yes, and how we are still alive, Comrade Kamsky, I don’t understand, there’s no industry, no money, no mind, can’t create anything that we don’t have there yet, according to your comments?

[EvgNik]

Quote: kamski

the United States has long shot and forgot the target

And he hit the excavator, the hospital. And then (because I forgot) to blame the videoconferencing system, it's normal.

[Vostok35]

Well, where are we to the mattresses))))

[adept666]

Yes, two misses. Why the operator did not hold the frame?

Because the operator did not hold her from the very beginning, for they fired with an automatic escort, he faked a little.

[INVESTOR]

Good shots, I would like the Syrian sky teeming with our helicopters, like mosquitoes in the forest after the rain, then the spirits startled at an adult.

[apostoll]

I would like our and all the turntables to stand at the airfields, and the pilots were at home! And on earth, they would not fight for petrodollars and gas pipes! I would really like that.
But ... "The Party said, it is NECESSARY, the Army replied, THERE IS !!!
Sorry, but there is no one else to give a crack to a frenzied pack of jackals ... !!!
Come back home alive and healthy men !!! Honor to you and Praise !!!

[Witness 45]

It is not harmful to want, but only then the size of the economy must be comparable to that of the United States or China, and while the "Kudrintsy" are running the show in the government, it seems that one cannot count on this.

[Sling]

Quote: Svidetel 45

It is not harmful to want, but only then the size of the economy must be comparable to that of the United States or China, and while the "Kudrintsy" are running the show in the government, it seems that one cannot count on this.

how to say

[hartlend]

Yesterday these videos were in the comments, today they have grown to a separate news item. Promptly.

[abrakadabre]

The first thing to do is auto-hold guidance. And then there you can see the manual guidance mode. Well, multichannel at the same time. because the second video shows that until the first rocket reached the goal, the second wasn’t fired. And with multi-channel missile control and auto tracking of targets, missiles could be launched with a minimum pause of 1-3 seconds. Then the barmalei would not have time to leave the second car and scatter. As seen in the video. And the third car would have managed to hit a little less than synchronously.

[evgenii67]

Beauties !!! Most of all, negotiations delight me!
- "... oh, let's run ..la"
- "..for one more time"

[firefighter]

I agree !!!

[Witness 45]

Normally, the army style of communication, especially in a combat situation.

[79807420129]

We look forward to the next series in this wonderful series. Well done, our falcons.

[sgazeev]

[quote = 79807420129] We look forward to the next series in this wonderful series. Our falcons are good. [/ qu


By the way, the video was posted by the grandson of the legendary Rokossovsky, a modest and honest man, all in his grandfather.

[DMM2006]

Colleagues when you watch such shots, as it becomes good at heart. And again the pride of a citizen of the once great empire rises in it. And the awareness of the fact that the Empire is alive and that it is rising from its knees to declare itself is being strengthened.
Somehow, the lines of Yevgeny Lukin came to mind:

At the end of the century he took and overthrew
Angry man. Good man.
From a grenade launcher slap him, a goat, -
So good is stronger than evil ...

True, for the situation shown in the videos, you need to change the third line to "... directly from the helicopter, slap him, goat, ...".
And it’s said right at the dot.

[samoletil18]

Thanks for Eugene Lukin.

[iConst]

Quote: DMM2006

Colleagues when you watch such shots, as it becomes good at heart.

- It is a pity that I did not "shoot - I forgot". You need to accompany.

[11 black]

Quote: iConst

Quote: DMM2006
Colleagues when you watch such shots, as it becomes good at heart.

- It is a pity that I did not "shoot - I forgot". You need to accompany.

Well, it depends which side to look at - if against ISIS then yes, it’s really a pity.
But if a war with a technologically advanced enemy, the laser countermeasures system puts an end to such missiles, for example, "President-S" makes our turntables invulnerable to SELF-HAVING
(Shot - forgot) missiles

[Ratmir_Ryazan]

Well done, they would have done something like that from tanks and other armored vehicles from the Javelins and Spikes ...

[Revolver]

Quote: DMM2006

From a grenade launcher slap him, a goat, -

Quote: DMM2006

True, for the situation shown in the videos, you need to change the third line to "... directly from the helicopter, slap him, goat, ...".

No matter what, no matter where. The main thing is the result. Personally, I would be nicer if they were soaked, in accordance with the instructions of the GDP, in the toilet. But any other way is also not bad.

[vodolaz]

They work beautifully, well done, what else can I say?

[Tusv]

and the guys are gambling

Russians definitely. Who else can give the extra 5 seconds of life to Barmaley for a choice? Ashes or according to Korney Ivanovich

[kodxnumx]

Quote: soroKING

and the guys are gambling

Just like a dash!

[Tersky]

Amazing movie ! I think it is multi-part, and each series with a similar ending.

[Rostov Papa]

Play children computer games, play sports and study at five - you will shoot such videos ...

[tomcat117]

No, not right!
Play children computer games, go in for sports and study at five - you will be VKS pilots. Be proud of the country, and RUSSIA is you!

[PKK]

Recklessly, guys are fighting.Industry! When will "fire and forget" ?!

[dvina71]

Quote: PKK

! When will "fire and forget"?

I forgot, I didn’t get it and got an answer .. As far as I know, there are automatic target retention systems, the operator only needs to be assigned a target. On vidio it is manual work .. and rightly so.

[Kurou]

I let it go - I forgot ... it's about the Yankees

Which shit immediately molt until they grabbed the lyuley
Even without checking whether they hit or not ...

Actually, this seems to be the reason why weddings, hospitals and excavators are bombing ...
they will not have time to escape

[Shadow_161]

and they don’t have photo control.

[Muvka]

Quote: PKK

Recklessly, guys are fighting.Industry! When will "fire and forget" ?!

But on the Ka-52 is not it?

[PKK]

They work on the "Shot and forget" complex, otherwise they would have boasted. Weapons with target tracking are outdated for a long time and lead to their large losses. Imagine, the crew accompanies the targets and at this time they shoot at him, what to do? Drop the target and leave or maybe If you have a shot and forget, you can shoot several maneuvering targets in seconds. Productivity increases dramatically.

[Cat man null]

Quote: PKK

Having shot and forgot, you can shoot several maneuvering targets in seconds

- outplayed in the tanks? Here, at least once read a smart person ..

Quote: hrych

The systems fired and forgot have one big drawback - the instability to the enemy’s electronic warfare. Again, there were two targets, and they were destroyed, as it were, in turn, and two homing ones could hit one because the cars stood close and for the GOS they looked like one target, the GOS could also go over to the damaged car due to more intensive heat energy release

Quote: PKK

Weapons with target tracking ... result in large losses

- this is why? The helicopter is out of the affected area of ​​all the "barrel" that the Basmachi might have

Quote: PKK

Imagine, the crew accompanies the target and at that time they shoot at him

- from what, from a slingshot? The ultimate dream of "babakhs" - something like a ZSU-23-2 in a jeep .. will not get it

Quote: PKK

Performance rises sharply

[hrych]

Moreover, due to the development of electronic warfare, it will soon be more relevant to be controlled by wires, not like the GOS, because the beam control is already able to block the "birdhouses", and even clog the radio channel without any problems ...

[Professor]

Quote: hrych

because the beam control is already able to block with "birdhouses", and even clog the radio channel without any problems ...

Do not read Soviet newspapers before eating. The MFC has not yet been drowned out, and the effectiveness of birdhouses against the beam is generally zero.

[hrych]

Quote: professor

HRMF has not been drowned yet

We, Colleague, know what the damaging factor of EMP is. , and the smoke screen will block the beam, but we will not pamper the Arabs, otherwise there must be surprises in the battle for Sinai

[Professor]

Quote: hrych

We then, Colleague, know what the damaging factor of EMP is, and the smoke screen will block the beam, but we will not pamper the Arabs, otherwise there must be surprises in the battle for Sinai

Ohhhh !!! This is a shockwave EMP. I’m giving up ....

Sinai from whom will you conquer?

[hrych]

Quote: professor

Sinai from whom will you conquer?

I’m about a new Arab-Israeli, anyway it will be someday.

[Professor]

Quote: hrych

I’m about a new Arab-Israeli, anyway it will be someday.

Not ever, but very soon not with Egypt, but with Lebanon and tanks there will be used exclusively by Israeli peacekeepers.

[Stiletto_711]

I remember during the extreme (second?) Lebanese war, not all Israeli "peacekeepers" and their tanks were able to return.

[Professor]

Quote: Stilett_71

I remember during the extreme (second?) Lebanese war, not all Israeli "peacekeepers" and their tanks were able to return.

In war, not without loss. There were losses among peacekeepers (without quotes).

[Muvka]

Quote: PKK

They work on the "Shot and forget" complex, otherwise they would have boasted. Weapons with target tracking are outdated for a long time and lead to their large losses. Imagine, the crew accompanies the targets and at this time they shoot at him, what to do? Drop the target and leave or maybe If you have a shot and forget, you can shoot several maneuvering targets in seconds. Productivity increases dramatically.

So please answer me, "Whirlwind", which is on the Ka-52 - refers to "fire and forget"?

[SSeT]

No. Illumination of the target by a laser matrix, in which the rocket is actually oriented. Illumination before hitting the target. A sort of 2+ level ATGM. "+" - this was supposed on the SU-25T and SU-39 - salvo launch and even with target switching. They tried to cram the workings on the Sh-90 into the SU-25 glider, which on that elementary base (as with the KA-50) caused a fierce smut among the designers

[not main]

Quote: PKK

They work on the "Shot and forget" complex, otherwise they would have boasted. Weapons with target tracking are outdated for a long time and lead to their large losses. Imagine, the crew accompanies the targets and at this time they shoot at him, what to do? Drop the target and leave or maybe If you have a shot and forget, you can shoot several maneuvering targets in seconds. Productivity increases dramatically.

Firstly, even the "Phalanx" allowed maneuvering, especially the "Storm B" and "Attack". I just didn't notice a big difference in the work of "Attack" and "Sturm", except that we still hit "Storm" more often! And there were no unnecessary numbers in the scope!

[gas113]

Good job!! Although I honestly expected to see aggregates of auto data flying in different directions after being hit.

[Homo]

Quote: gas113

Good job!! Although I honestly expected to see aggregates of auto data flying in different directions after being hit.

Like in the movies?

[gas113]

Yes, 9 kg in the TNT equivalent, if they got to the right place, they would have arranged the Hollywood effect with flying wheels, bridges with cabins and contents. I am for such a movie, it strongly promotes / advertises the weapons used.

[Professor]

Quote: gas113

Yes, 9 kg in the TNT equivalent, if they got to the right place, they would have arranged the Hollywood effect with flying wheels, bridges with cabins and contents. I am for such a movie, it strongly promotes / advertises the weapons used.

Gold words. Had such a warhead in a fuel truck, only horns and legs would have remained of it. By the way, where did the videos in the article go? Are they secret?

[SSeT]

What good? 1 hit out of 3, with pens! Sinai, "little ones", in the 21st century, go! ...

[AVA77]

I have something to be proud of. My compatriots.

[firefighter]

not only to you! proud of our VKS (Air Force)!

[Mister22408]

They performed the "attack". The second was taken away by something in the "automatic target tracking" mode. The third was already only in the "program" direction. The targets were hit.

[tol100v]

Quote: Mister22408

. The goals are amazed.

As required!

[firefighter]

Sir, you are wrong! It should be said differently - "what was known yesterday, but today" it happened "- these are spirits with an incomprehensible moderation. And we flew by ...

[SSeT]

1 out of 3, and in manual mode. Cool. for 1967 is pretty cool. Be proud further

[Alarm clock]

You can watch endlessly how water flows, fire and water burn, and ... how our helicopter pilots destroy ISIS.

[firefighter]

I agree. And also at the museum in Monino. Who knows about the transfer decision?

[freejack]

It seems there is no such type of aviation or helicopter technology that has not been tested in Syria

There is. "Armata". probably it is still "raw" for such tests, but it would be an irreplaceable test ... And the West would settle down at the expense of cardboard dummies!)

[senima56]

"Soaked" great, of course .... but !!!! Look how long the helicopter "hangs" and waits for the missile to hit the target! But at this moment the airplane is practically defenseless !!! And if the terrorists had a large-caliber machine gun (God forbid!) ...... You yourself understand how this threatens the helicopter and the crew. This I mean that it is necessary to develop and install weapon systems on helicopters on the "fire and forget" principle! As far as I know, it is the lack of such weapons on our helicopters that is the reason for many losses in tenders for the purchase of helicopters.

[Petr1]

Quote: senima56

And whether the terrorists have a heavy machine gun (God forbid!).

In my opinion, they don’t see them, so if they could attack several targets at once !!

[hrych]

Quote: senima56

Look how long the helicopter "hangs" and waits

Do not be sad, the helicopter hangs out of the enemy’s range, because they didn’t even hear the helicopter noise due to the operation of the car engines, the rocket flew for a very long time, and its speed was very decent. The systems fired and forgot have one big drawback - the instability to the enemy’s electronic warfare. Again, there were two targets and they were destroyed, as it were, in turn, and two homing ones could hit one because the cars stood close and for the GOS they looked like one target, the GOS could also go over to a damaged car due to more intensive heat energy release . In this case, you can hit the enemy’s car in the convoy of civilians, etc.

[Professor]

Quote: senima56

As far as I know, it is the absence of such weapons on our helicopters that is the reason for many losing tenders for the purchase of helicopters.

No. Lack of relevant GOS.
And by the way, the helicopter does not hang for long. Here is the fact that it works on goals not in parallel, but in succession, of course, minus.

[rubidium]

Quote: professor

No. Lack of relevant GOS.
And by the way, the helicopter does not hang for long. Here is the fact that it works on goals not in parallel, but in succession, of course, minus.

No GOS is a fact, but even if they were, using them against ISIS jeeps and trucks is highly economically inexpedient. But the fact that the operator holds the target manually, this is a real minus. So they do not even shoot Attack-B, but the usual attack.
Well, with the number of simultaneously held goals - this is about MI-28NM.

[hrych]

Quote: rubidiy

GOS no - fact

Yes, it’s full of you, hit the GOS from Strela, Igla, Verba, etc. certainly you will not be mistaken, and the jet stream of the gas turbine engine Abrams will not greatly yield to aviation if that. It's different ...

[Professor]

Quote: rubidiy

No GOS is a fact, but even if they were, using them against ISIS jeeps and trucks is highly economically inexpedient.

Yes? So to drive "Night Hunter" in the afternoon for distant lands is advisable, but is it impractical to use high-precision weapons from it?

Quote: rubidiy

Well, with the number of simultaneously held goals - this is about MI-28NM.

And the fact that of the three fired targets, he with an interference hit one suits you?

Quote: hrych

Yes, it’s full of you, hit the GOS from Strela, Igla, Verba, etc. certainly you will not be mistaken, and the jet stream of the gas turbine engine Abrams will not greatly yield to aviation if that. It's different ...

No need to compare a member with a finger. At MANPADS, the GOS acts on a completely different principle.

[hrych]

Quote: professor

No need to compare a member with a finger. At MANPADS, the GOS acts on a completely different principle.

Oh oh The question is rather exclusively in the price, plus any rubbish such as GOS cooling, as in Javelin, if I don’t confuse it from 30 seconds to a few minutes, it’s required that in modern combat conditions it’s unacceptable, but plus after cooling it’s necessary to let go even if the goal is already gone. And, most importantly, if the dvigun does not work for the target, then the goal for the GOS is not a goal, for obvious reasons.

[Professor]

Quote: hrych

Oh?

Yeah, match though. It’s like a half-blind old man who can see a bright spot on a dark background with a young sniper looking at the target in detail.

Quote: hrych

plus all sorts of rubbish like GOOS cooling, as in Javelin, if I don’t confuse it from 30 seconds to several minutes, it’s required that in modern combat conditions it’s unacceptable, plus after cooling it’s necessary to let go even if the target is already gone.

There is no such thing on Spike, and Javelin can be "recharged". And for whom did I write articles?

Quote: hrych

And, most importantly, if the dvigun does not work for the target, then the goal for the GOS is not a goal, for obvious reasons.

We do not tell these nonsense to anyone, they may laugh. For example, a Javelin in Afghanistan is shooting at a hut with the engine on.

[hrych]

Profff, we draw from the press (by the way, the rocket has gone, the shaitan knows where, he can’t see any hut and delved (cooled) for an awfully long time ...)
The disadvantages of the complex [edit | edit wiki text]
Relatively low mobility, weight (22.3 kg) exceeds the characteristics ordered by the US Army.
The guidance system cannot function until the GOS is cooled. The manufacturer calls the minimum time required for cooling, 30 seconds, but it depends on the ambient temperature and may be longer. After turning on the cooling, the rocket must be launched, it is impossible to refuse to launch.
A strong heat contrast of the target is needed for guidance. In other words, the rocket will not aim at the target with the engine turned off or covered with a thermal cape. Or it may hit a bonfire lit next to the target.
The operator cannot correct the missile in flight
The defeat range (2.5 km) is inferior to its predecessors and competitors MILAN 3 km, Swingfire 4 km, TOW 4.2 km and Kornet_ (ATGM) 8 km.
Cost $ 246,000 (in 2014 prices)

[Professor]

Quote: hrych

roff, we draw from the press (by the way, the rocket has gone, the shaitan knows where, he can’t see any hut and delved (cooled) for a terribly long time ...)

Where they sent there and left. The fact that the Taliban have no armored vehicles. He worked for a long time, was looking for the target and aimed.

Quote: hrych

After turning on the cooling, the rocket must be launched, it is impossible to refuse to launch.
A strong heat contrast of the target is needed for guidance. In other words, the rocket will not aim at the target with the engine turned off or covered with a thermal cape. Or it can hit a bonfire lit next to the target

Christmas trees, sticks ... For whom am I trying and writing articles if people quote wikis and even correctly? Look for an article on Javelin on VO.

[hrych]

Quote: professor

For whom I try and write articles

I have to read ...

[Fregate]

Yes, at least not even "Shot and forget", but more long-range ATGM. And then they work from a distance of 2,5-5 km, here you can get a response from MANPADS.

[Bashibuzuk]

Well, I don’t understand ... aggressors ... shot-forgot
Here Serzho .. posted a memo - on decoding the screen readings.
What we see there - p.p. 14-19 ... weapon selection, auto tracking, software support ... what else is there.
If I understand correctly - we are talking about the system - I caught the goal, Approved the goal, set it to the AU - and bye ... well, rubbish with her, with Belgium.

The thing is different - how much all this works reliably and flawlessly.
I don’t know anything here.
..
And to the pilots sitting in the wheelhouse, and even at night, it was probably VERY interesting to shoot alive .... and not at the auto tracking.
What else to take to the dreary night hours when NO HORSE is not visible around.
And here at least cartoons run around ... a joke (for the keenly sensitive).
...
I am wrong?

[dvina71]

Quote: Bashibuzuk

I am wrong?

Only in one. This is not out of boredom. Automation is good, but to train manual guidance in a real battle .. it's oh so expensive. And always come in handy.
He fired - he forgot in the conditions of a dense battle nothing. There is so much heat that the GOS will go crazy. Be it at least three times matrix and with memory for all existing types of goals.

[Dryuya2]

Quote: senima56

whether the terrorists have a heavy machine gun (God forbid!) ...... You yourself understand how this threatens the helicopter and the crew.

I understood correctly
1 - speed
2 - height
3 - range to the target or ... ????

[Fregate]

Quote: Dryuya2

I understood correctly
1 - speed
2 - height
3 - range to the target or ... ????

Correctly. A little higher, the man laid out the full layout on where what is shown on the screen.

[Bashibuzuk]

A much more interesting circle with a missile course and a target indicated by a cross.
The beauty....
If it also scales, in general ...
...
Or does the circle determine the probability of destroying the target?

[Dryuya2]

Quote: Fregate

A little higher, the man laid out the full layout

already saw ATP

[senima56]

I said and will repeat that "a hovering helicopter is a good target"!

[SOKOL777]

Quote: senima56

"a hovering helicopter is a good target"!

Your argument is correct, so I put +.
Only the helicopter does not "hang".
After the target is captured by an optical locating station (OLS), the auto tracking mode is automatically activated.
After launching the rocket, the helicopter performs a dodge maneuver, in general it does not hang.

Dvina71 is also right.
In a tight battle, when there are a lot of IR emitters (the machine also shines), the manual mode is the most reliable.
Here everything is decided by the skill of the operator, as he skillfully moves the joystick with his finger, and the rocket will fly.

[Muvka]

Quote: senima56

"Soaked" great, of course .... but !!!! Look how long the helicopter "hangs" and waits for the missile to hit the target! But at this moment the airplane is practically defenseless !!! And if the terrorists had a large-caliber machine gun (God forbid!) ...... You yourself understand how this threatens the helicopter and the crew. This I mean that it is necessary to develop and install weapon systems on helicopters on the "fire and forget" principle! As far as I know, it is the lack of such weapons on our helicopters that is the reason for many losses in tenders for the purchase of helicopters.

Attack flight speed up to 550 m \ s. Now count how far the launch was made. And think about what you said.

[senima56]

I said and will repeat that "a hovering helicopter is a good target"!

[Muvka]

A hovering helicopter at a speed of more than 200 km \ h? Strong.

[not main]

Quote: senima56

Look how long the helicopter "hangs" and waits for the missile to hit the target!

Incredible stupidity! When the operator holds the target, the commander can maneuver with a roll of 30 and a course deviation (if I remember correctly) to 45.

[SSeT]

It’s not even the person involved who noticed this. The rest to be proud and smack

[Crown]

Rogozin producer!

[firefighter]

Let there be such producers everywhere! I think Sergey Kozhugetovich with Mr. Lavrov will not refuse his services!

[behemot]

and let go of rockets, forget we don’t? It’s a pity that they didn’t drive obscurantists from the cannon;

[donavi49]

Well, here is the Attack, and judging by the consequences they beat Kumami, because 2 of the three trucks survived and the drivers ran out. Americans hit Helami with a land mine and MAC (cloud of detonating mixture - on the principle of the same bumblebee or TOC) for such purposes.

A cannon, you can repeat the feat of the Frenchman, who in Mali in Gazelle stormed the carts with ZU-23. Plus, MANPADS cannot be ruled out.

By video:
1 - the car was hit after him, most likely incapacitated, the driver probably survived.
2 - the car was hit, but the failure was in question (it went under the wheel along the tracer and exploded on the passenger side), after the explosion the car drove 10 meters, the driver survived.
3 - the car is not affected.

[xam0]

These are our pilots who are already outdated "Attacks" from almost extreme distances are so good at sniffing, but new "Assaults" will arrive and they will fill their hand, in general there will be beauty, they will not take their eyes off! Good luck to Our falcons and further success!

[not main]

Quote: xam0

These are our pilots who are already outdated "Attacks" from almost extreme distances are so good at sniffing, but new "Assaults" will arrive and they will fill their hand, in general there will be beauty, they will not take their eyes off! Good luck to Our falcons and further success!

You at least opened Wikipedia! Although I know without it that Attack is a modified Sturm-V, and both complexes use the 9M113 missile.

[Professor]

And the user named this video “The third one will not go far too”

First you need to get on the second, and only then take a third.

[killganoff]

This is what century ??? The operator asks the pilot to "pedal gently" i.e. the helicopter should hang in the air EXACTLY, without moving, the whole cycle of salvo-escort-defeat !!! Why ELEMENTARY automatic target tracking by contrast is not realized ?! I'm not talking about the principle of fire-forget! With the same success, you can use NUR to beat the basmachi ... And it is cheaper at times! Targets are inactive. What can we do in case of active resistance? !!! Do not be ashamed to boast about it ???? !!!

[hrych]

Quote: killganoff

With the same success, you can beat NUR with basmach ...

You have to be there and know the real situation, respectively, the reason for the use of one weapon or another, and also, as the GDP said, these are exercises and tests of various combat systems ...

[OlegLex]

The task is not just to roll out the enemy but to be out of reach for him, that's why they fire guided missiles and limit distances, and even if you noticed that the tail at the missile does not give light, that is, we see an attack of night witches when the enemy is disoriented.

[firefighter]

not ashamed. I'm certainly not a great specialist, but spirits (basmachi) very much do not like such a beautiful work. I saw it myself.

[Muvka]

Quote: killganoff

This is what century ??? The operator asks the pilot to "pedal gently" i.e. the helicopter should hang in the air EXACTLY, without moving, the whole cycle of salvo-escort-defeat !!! Why ELEMENTARY automatic target tracking by contrast is not realized ?! I'm not talking about the principle of fire-forget! With the same success, you can use NUR to beat the basmachi ... And it is cheaper at times! Targets are inactive. What can we do in case of active resistance? !!! Do not be ashamed to boast about it ???? !!!

Have you tried a little to figure out the picture? Or didn’t they analyze the digits that glow there? This is about motionless hanging.

[not main]

Quote: killganoff

This is what century ??? The operator asks the pilot to "pedal gently" i.e. the helicopter should hang in the air EXACTLY, without moving, the whole cycle of salvo-escort-defeat !!! Why ELEMENTARY automatic target tracking by contrast is not realized ?! I'm not talking about the principle of fire-forget! With the same success, you can use NUR to beat the basmachi ... And it is cheaper at times! Targets are inactive. What can we do in case of active resistance? !!! Do not be ashamed to boast about it ???? !!!

Not ashamed! Question to the operator: why are you? I repeat! The helicopter does not hang, it flies and can maneuver! I myself have launched "Shturm" more than once and I will say that the complex is good! Allowed from a distance of 6 km to hit exactly the target with an error in the guidance system! (constantly underestimated the rocket). But seeing the exhaust of a rocket, there is nothing difficult to direct it to the target. By the way, the video shows it perfectly!

[SOKOL777]

Quote: killganoff

The operator asks the pilot to "pedal gently"

He asks correctly ... The work is in manual mode. And the century is XX.
Judging by the trajectory of the projectile (in the video), this is the Shturm-V ATGM, the 9M113 Gaboi projectile.
"Whirlwind" is the XXI century, its flight trajectory is different, I would say cunning ...
If they use it in Syria, then they won’t show it to us, probably five years, until something new appears ...

[kapitan281271]

Adequately without uryapatriotism!

[Earnest]

Quote: senima56

... how long the helicopter "hangs" and waits for the missile to hit the target! But at this moment the airplane is practically defenseless !!! And if the terrorists had a large-caliber machine gun (God forbid!) ....

From a distance of 5,8 km to a height of 1,5 km from a heavy machine gun? Not even funny.

[vv3]

It’s clear that men, as children, rejoice at the new toy. As a representative of the ITS VVS, I can say that all the videos are not presentable and posted on the site in vain. First, use expensive ammunition designed to destroy armored vehicles on vehicles and sheds are unintelligent, especially in these conditions it is easy to use a gun. Secondly, in 2 of the 3 videos, it is clear that the crew is poorly trained and the targets are not direct. And in the last video, in the comments, the launch is not carried out correctly. Of course, the pilots are studying and we can assume that it was The task is to use this type of ammunition. But why show it to everyone? Moreover, the video could be picked up better, how many storytellers there, even generals are ....

[igor67]

Quote: vv3

It’s clear that men, as children, rejoice at the new toy. As a representative of the ITS VVS, I can say that all the videos are not presentable and posted on the site in vain. First, use expensive ammunition designed to destroy armored vehicles on vehicles and sheds are unintelligent, especially in these conditions it is easy to use a gun. Secondly, in 2 of the 3 videos, it is clear that the crew is poorly trained and the targets are not direct. And in the last video, in the comments, the launch is not carried out correctly. Of course, the pilots are studying and we can assume that it was The task is to use this type of ammunition. But why show it to everyone? Moreover, the video could be picked up better, how many storytellers there, even generals are ....

At the rembase where I worked as the head of the LIS (now SLI), the colonel was a test pilot in Afghanistan, a bunch of orders, the meaning is different, he often made demonstration visits "to the target", found a photo, video should be searched,

[SSeT]

Shikarno! Is it possible in HD?

[avva2012]

Quote: vv3 Of course, the pilots are studying and we can assume that such a task was to use this type of ammunition. But why should everyone show this? Moreover, the video could be picked up better, how many storytellers there, even generals are ....

You, forget about our potential partners. Why do they need a video where a squirrel gets into the eye? Let them continue to think that we are slurping cabbage soup. This was probably training. But, they showed it, this video (someone, after all, allowed to post it) because they wanted to tell someone, "it's okay, you, that's the only way we can."

[SpecialSnab]

Cool pedal in the 1st video, shame probably flew to Turkey and stomped on the pedals to user

[tyler2]

Give at least one video of the gun, in general, nowhere to be found.

[kmv.km]

Impressive !!!

[Alexander 3]

Barmalei should not be relaxed day or night, they should know, they HUNT at them, they are filthy game which cannot be touched with hands.

[firefighter]

call a spade a spade - from afar IT does not smell And at night only a real hunter can see And his hands are not dirty

[rubidium]

from the same channel))))

[OlegYola]

If the jeep with MANPADS, then it is worth spending the time.
The truck with the truck is doubtful whether the skin is worth dressing. 30 mm 2A42 gun is not cheaper from 3-4 kilometers
And misses, with partial defeat, is a dubious advertising move though, of course, the pilot knows better;)

[PKK]

Quote: Kurou

I let it go - I forgot ... it's about the Yankees

This is the past, not only the Yankees, but also Israel. And for our aviation, this is in the future.

[avg-mgn]

Quote: CERHJ

See, I’ll explain. Here’s the decryption with Valor of the numbers on the sight, and the decoding of these numbers. The picture is clickable ..

Thanks for such a detailed explanation of the situation, it was possible not only to admire the work of the guys, but to really appreciate the jewelry work.

[firefighter]

Quote: AVA77

I have something to be proud of. My compatriots.

And not only. The compatriots will not let you down - this is a fact, and the Syrians are also not made a finger

[Buffet]

Ehh only when there will be already modernized missiles "fire - forget"? And so looking at the work of men is very interesting =)))

[Orang]

The cars hit, and the Basmachis fled. Probably cumulatively fired. It doesn’t. The main thing is to fill up more barmaleys. Technicians will still push them. Full video with Apache, there manpower beat masterfully. Our still learn

[not main]

Quote: Orang

Our still learn

There would be no "friendship" with the United States in the 90s and that's it. Don't start over!

[dsm100]

Well done guys give Papuans crap ...

[Gippo]

"Study, study and study!" V.I. Lenin

[Velizariy]

For all time, no researcher found this expression in the records and transcripts. His Ulyanov attributed.

[senima56]

Quote: Petr1

Quote: senima56

And whether the terrorists have a heavy machine gun (God forbid!).

In my opinion, they don’t see them, so if they could attack several targets at once !!

I also spoke about it! They fired at the first target and "forgot", the second "on the fly", the third, etc. And then they let in and "lead" until they hit! As a result, one of the three targets hit two, and the third went away!

[not main]

Quote: senima56

Quote: Petr1

Quote: senima56

And whether the terrorists have a heavy machine gun (God forbid!).

In my opinion, they don’t see them, so if they could attack several targets at once !!

I also spoke about it! They fired at the first target and "forgot", the second "on the fly", the third, etc. And then they let in and "lead" until they hit! As a result, one of the three targets hit two, and the third went away!

You see the video from the sight of the 9M114 complex, but where the commander (and the helicopter) is aiming is the question!

[sontinianin]

Gently pedal ... Perhaps this phrase may be suitable for many !!!

[Der schwarze]

The missiles are called I am a suicide-2nd generation — keep your sight until you hit — woe to this helicopter if they had MANPADS — at Apache well — gave everything at once and flew away — shot and forgot

[kamski]

I agree in this regard, they have gone far, and the very filling of US helicopters is abruptly

[Orang]

Fight what is. The main thing is the correct conclusions. God forbid they decide that it will come down

[AllXVahhaB]

Well, yes - half of them are in their own way, the second half are in peaceful hospitals ...

[Tamod]

Pedaled!

[Papapg]

Anyone who can, he puts the stranger for his own. In this video posted earlier and completely.

[Westet2]

I do not understand such joyful comments about the shooting of our guys !! The first video is even less, but again, in manual mode, accompanying the target is something !! The second movie is just a failure !! To get into the car and people ran out of it, and this is an ordinary dump truck and not a tank. Someone wrote above, like that it should fly like a movie? Not like in the movies, but in real life. There are a lot of Apache videos, so everything scatters like in Hollywood. If it hangs on a target, few people managed to escape at any speed at all. About how we missed the standing car, I generally keep quiet.

[vv3]

You know, it's nice anyway. And the helicopter guidance system works well. Given the low altitude and the range to the target — the aiming angles are small, but the earth does not have any shielding effect. Considering that this is by no means the last type of missile — it's great.

[Alexdark]

Well, anyone can make a cut from success. Are there really no blunders and failures? There is! Everywhere is and always will be.

[AllXVahhaB]

Quote: Westet2

Not like in the movies, but in real life. There are a bunch of Apache videos, so everything scatters like in Hollywood.

So these videos in Hollywood and shoot

[Witness 45]

Well, yes, Apaches shoot well and efficiently, but for some reason, while ours didn’t intervene, the barmales just advanced and somehow didn’t notice the Apaches shooting well.

[Westet2]

Well, maybe because they didn’t need it. This is already a matter of politics. They talk about the fight against ISIS, but they themselves help. But when it comes to real work, then there are problems with boradorach. And I would like to have such cannons on our vert = olet as the American Apaches with a warhead of 1000 rounds, and not 250 like ours now. Even our combat pilots spoke about this!

[Koronik]

"Well, everyone can make cuts of success. Are there really no mistakes and failures? Yes! Everywhere is and always will be."
There is no doubt, dear, there are misses and no luck, for this the guys work in combat conditions to identify and eliminate everything. And would you like to see a cut from the failures?

[Alexdark]

This is what I wrote to a comrade "Westet2" about his admiration for the work of the Apaches. I have seen enough election videos, he is driving our pilots. Not good!

[Westet2]

I’m not chasing pilots, but the equipment that needs to be developed and modified. But keeping a fast-moving target in sight in manual mode is truly the skill of our pilots !!! What an honor and praise to them !!

[Bramb]

They knocked out the third, but missed the first two. A man ran out of the first after the shot, the second sight jerked to the left and the rocket went there.
I read the explanations, but in reality this is a drawback: after the missile hit the truck, nothing should remain but a heap of debris, and not "slid into a ditch." Either the missiles are not the same, or the warhead is small, but something needs to be done.

[Rom14]

Quote: kamski

because it’s all yesterday, the United States has long shot and forgot

Ours back in Afghanistan experienced "bummed" forgot ... Amers Russia is the enemy number 1, because our "karamultuk" enrages them ... So cut Shura, she is golden.

[Alex von Dorn]

It's strange for me that the operator has to keep the target in sight. Didn't "let it go and forget it"?

[kapitan281271]

Here that you want to say, but two motionless goals, and so unconvincing. and where is the simultaneous tracking and destruction of 12585 targets at once

[kapitan281271]

Mattresses with Apache don't say something more convincing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Os5CmHRCuE

[Muvka]

Quote: kapitan281271

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Os5CmHRCuE

from 1 kilometer? Well handsome. And ours work from 5 km. And the question is, how will your beautiful Apaches work so beautifully from 1 km if our Mi-28 manages to take it 4 times while it flies to such a distance? And yet, apparently our work with cumulative missiles, for some reason, because from the OF there would have been more destruction.

[kapitan281271]

Yes, it’s not my fucking Apache, and the quality of the picture is different, apparently there is some kind of stabilization system for the sight, I generally need our 100 km chisel nov not special, I can be mistaken, I just say that I see two motionless targets destroyed quite unconvincingly in one didn’t hit the second, retained the ability to move; the third left, well, let's say that it’s not so that everything is fine, Remember Simonov, Sukhoi if they thought so we wouldn’t have the machines that we are so proud of and which ** to live.
PS I recall already from the finished machine but with very mediocre Features found the courage to refuse and created a new one which is still an unsurpassed masterpiece

[Muvka]

And you do not mind the difference in shooting for 1 kilometer or 5? Will there be no difference in picture quality? Then why can't your beloved Americans film other planets in good quality? After all, nothing depends on the distance.

[Come on]

Here, look at the bottom left of the figure against TADS. He launched a rocket at about 7,8 km, and at the end of the video he approached 1 km. At 8km Apache can confidently work. Since 2012, more than 500 Ah 64D units have been upgraded to Ah 64E Block 3. These are more powerful turbines, a cruising speed of more than 300 km / h, the ability to control a drone and use its data and backlight to destroy targets:

[Muvka]

Quote: Yeah, well.

Here, look at the bottom left of the figure against TADS. He launched a rocket at about 7,8 km, and at the end of the video he approached 1 km. At 8km Apache can confidently work. Since 2012, more than 500 Ah 64D units have been upgraded to Ah 64E Block 3. These are more powerful turbines, a cruising speed of more than 300 km / h, the ability to control a drone and use its data and backlight to destroy targets:

And the picture quality is much worse than on our helicopters. I meant it. And then a man shoves a video from a kilometer and says that they have such good picture quality.

[Come on]

The video quality is excellent and the sharpness is excellent. It's just that very rarely original videos come across on the net.

P.S. And minus to see for the fact that his comments hurt someone's feelings?

[Muvka]

I do not see excellent quality. From a kilometer - yes, a good picture. With 8 - squalor. And this is normal. An attack of up to 8 km also flies, a whirlwind of up to 10. This is normal. What does not suit you?

[Come on]

Once again, this is not an original picture, original in excellent quality and video surveillance can be conducted at 16km, at least clearly identified armored vehicles and large concentrations of troops. But in general, it doesn’t matter what suits me or not, I look at things soberly. Below and above, I and others have answered your questions in full detail, but your business remains with your opinion.

By the way, look through the history of the site, not so long ago there was an article comparing Russian and NATO combat turntables, and it was precisely the issues of the absence of some technologies that were raised.

[adept666]

Here, look at the bottom left of the figure against TADS. He launched a rocket at about 7,8 km.

Judging by your video, it’s not the helicopter from which the picture is being transmitted that is shooting, but another from the group.

[Come on]

Maybe, but this target is highlighted, it can be seen from the target tracking marker. And it doesn't even matter in this case. About 8 km range of defeat, as well as "fire and forget" technology, has long been the standard on all NATO combat turntables, be it the Tiger with its Pars, Spikes, or the Apache with its Hellfire.

[adept666]

May be,

I watched the video - it’s not 100%.

but this target is highlighted, this can be seen by the target tracking marker

Not necessarily, maybe just by visual inspection.

And it doesn't even matter in this case. About 8 km, the range of destruction, as well as the "fire-and-forget" technology, has long been the standard on all NATO combat turntables

Well, how can I tell you ... there are many nuances: what time of day the action takes place, the terrain, the intensity of the battle, the type of target (stationary, dynamic). The same hell flies for 8 km for about 25-28 seconds, if the target goes at a speed of 60-80 km per hour, then it simply will not capture it. All of these ranges (your standard) are numbers from advertising booklets obtained in tests in greenhouse conditions, the actual combat use of which has nothing to do and so for all types of weapons of yours, yours, Chinese and even alien What about "shoot-forget" ... Yes, this thing has its undeniable advantages, but there are also quite a few disadvantages.

[Come on]

Initially, the military's requirement for Hell was high maneuverability, precisely for the versatility of hitting various targets, from stationary ones up to a maneuvering type of helicopter. You just lied about 60-80. And judging by the pearl about "advertising booklets" and "the disadvantages and advantages of" fire-and-forget "systems (you might think this is the reason why there are still no such systems in the Russian army), you are one of those who would very much like it to be so , and not as in fact and in this plane somehow do not want to translate the discussion.

[adept666]

Initially, the military's demand for Hell was high maneuverability, precisely for the versatility of hitting various targets, from stationary ones, to maneuvering like a helicopter.

So what? That is why, out of almost 15 Hella modifications for the US Armed Forces, only one AGM-114L complies with the "fire-and-forget" principle? Besides Whirlwind the same requirements

About 60-80 you lied simply.

Lied in what? Hell GOS capture range (AGM-114L) based on the diameter of the antenna mirror (not more than 15 cm) and the frequency of 94 GHz cannot be more than 2 km (and this is still under ideal conditions), for this it also has an additional ANN, part of the flight before capturing the target, it simply flies in the direction of the target, and then captures. If it shoots at a distance of 8 km, then the target generally just can leave the affected area and the rocket doesn’t have enough energy, or if the target’s speed is enough, the rocket will come to the search and activation point of the ARLGSN (fly to this point for more than 20-22 seconds, while a car traveling at a speed of 80 km / h will go to the side by almost 500 meters ), and the target in the scan strip is no longer

And judging by the pearl about "advertising booklets" and "the disadvantages and advantages of" fire-and-forget "systems (you might think this is the reason why there are still no such systems in the Russian army), you are one of those who would very much like it to be so , and not as in fact and in this plane somehow do not want to translate the discussion.

Well, what to say to a person who is trying to debate on a topic that he does not understand at all? Booklets and that says it all. If the enemy has electronic warfare, such a small ARLGSN has very little chance of capturing - monstrous interference. If it is raining / snowing / dense fog, practically a breakdown of the capture for such a "let-and-forget" is also ensured, such unfavorable meteorological conditions affect already starting from frequencies of 40 GHz and above, and here the wave is two times shorter. Catching the sun at the end also risks dropping the capture because the sun in our solar system is nothing more than a black body. I'm not even talking about dipole reflectors on modern armored vehicles. Therefore, when using such a peculiar rocket, you need to take into account a lot of BUTs. The only advantages: it is the ability to shoot in one volley (at several targets at once), after starting, quickly get up on skis and run run run. But the Mi-28 assault helicopter of the battlefield, it is designed to enter the enemy air defense zone, and therefore it is armored. And to create such a "let it go" we can only costly it, and the advantages are dubious.

[Come on]

There is no desire to comment on your theoretical wishes, no time, no sense. I am just sure that the pilots of the Mi-28N, Krokodilov, etc., who are rightfully proud of their machines, but are perfectly aware of both the capabilities of their machines and their Western counterparts, and are looking forward to both the overhead radars and the "fire-forget ", maybe an increase in BC for 30mm to the level of the Apache, maybe finally a specially designed gun itself, such as you would simply strangle. Because you can write a lot of blah blah theoretical sofa-expert everywhere, of course, with such aplomb, as if he himself flew on all helicopters and tried all the weapons, this is your right. But everyone can see the reality from those filming of real databases, which are already freely available, as well as the results.

P.S. But I’ll comment on your pearl:
"The only advantages: it is the ability to fire in one volley (at several targets at once), after launching, quickly get up on skis and run and run. But the Mi-28 attack helicopter of the battlefield is designed to enter the enemy's air defense zone, and therefore is armored. to create such a "let it go" we can only costly it, and the advantages are dubious. "

This type should show that the Mi-28 is such a fearless knight in armor, and the Ah-64 is a cowardly, cardboard helicopter :) And nothing that both the Apache and the Tiger are no less armored than the Mi-28N and are designed taking into account the sudden shelling of Zushka , or Shilka, that is, their armor must withstand several such designs. Which, by the way, has been proven in practice, not to mention the tests, etc. It is especially funny about the "assault helicopter", which enters the air defense zone, as if it is a technological lag behind helicopters with an overhead radar, which can conduct combat operations from under cover and the absence of the "fire-forget" mode, because of which the helicopter will have to hover, or maneuver back and forth until the rocket reaches, this turns out to be a different tactic! :)) I am sure that you personally do not create anything in order to argue here, what we can and what we cannot, especially about the dubious advantages. Well, how do you like you bother about the budget of the Ministry of Defense, this is something, direct economists-business executives :))

[adept666]

Your theoretical Wishlist

Why do you continue to do this in this case? If you were a little versed in the topic, you would have discussed in detail, rather than pouring water.

looking forward

They are on the Mi-28, what can they expect?

as well as "fire-forget"

Systems "let it go" in fact cause serious criticism, so the same Hells are most often used with semi-active guidance on the laser seeker. Why is there a second PGSN on Brimstone?

maybe finally

Plasmogan blaster Why do we need a gun with reduced power? So that how our overseas friends invent 30 mm cumulative? No thanks.

like you just overdo it

They are not so seductive. Believe me.

Because you can blah blah theoretical

For whom it is theoretical, but for whom it is practical. What exactly is blah blah blah possible on points? And if there is not enough knowledge, it is not necessary to shine here with literary delights.

But everyone sees reality

Show me a video of Apache shooting from a distance of at least 6-7 km with missiles with ARLGSN AGM-114L (at least for a stationary target and in the daytime (I’m not talking about night )), then you will say something about reality.

This type should show

No, this should show that the ideology of designing machines is initially different. Apache is much worse booked and therefore, even under the PKK, it is better not to climb.

and are designed taking into account the sudden shelling

Only in a small range of fire (near the skirt), its very large glasses cannot withstand even the B-32 7,62mm.

who can ... from under cover

As you have already hesitated with this nonsense of the Discovery Channel

will have to hang, or maneuver back and forth until the rocket reaches

A helicopter lands on a target at high speed. Which hovering and maneuvering back and forth? Exit to the target-fixation-shot-U-turn / passage at speed.

I'm sure

Well, I'll decide for myself to reason or not to reason. For example, I am also personally sure that you are not even a techie by education, you have read a lot of advertising booklets and now you are trying to "worry" about our pilots.

[Come on]

Well, yes, the favorite phrase of the sofa engineers-pilots-economists, if something concerns Western, especially American technology, it is about "advertising brochures" and the "Discovery" channel. Killing argument finally :) The Indians have probably seen enough of Discovery too, they should have listened to adept666 :)

[adept666]

Well, yes, the favorite phrase of the sofa engineers-pilots-economists, if something concerns Western, especially American technology, it is about "advertising brochures" and the "Discovery" channel.

Firstly, if you read me carefully, then in the first posts I wrote to you:

All these ranges (your standard) are numbers from advertising booklets obtained in tests in greenhouse conditions, the actual combat use of which has nothing to do and so FOR ALL KINDS OF WEAPONS our, your, Chinese yes alien laughing

And they and we have in our brochures there are theoretically achievable parameters, just almost never nobody adds the conditions of use, and this is the key.

Deadly argument finally :)

I wrote you technical arguments, but since you are not a techie, and even more so, you didn’t seem to have heard of radio physics at all, but you didn’t understand me, and in general, your goal is to veiledly show the worthlessness of our weapons and the total superiority of the Western ones, covered by some concern for pilots, just because they have everything. Want to earn a moment of fame here? It will not work ... there are people on this resource who can argue with reasoned swami. Our technique is also made by non-deliters and the developments are based on examples of real application, for example, the same Brimstone after Afgan received a second semi-active head precisely because the accuracy of the ARLGSN was lame and the reliability of the grip was not satisfactory (it strongly depended on the conditions of use). ARLGNS of this type of EHF range on traveling wave tubes were created and tested at the Istok Research and Production Enterprise at the beginning of the XNUMXs, I already wrote above about the identified shortcomings.

The Indians probably also saw enough of Discovery, they should have listened to adept666

Hindus love effects too (like you apparently) and bonuses . In a real combat situation, they practically did not happen against an enemy who has air defense and electronic warfare. The United States offered more favorable conditions (especially after-sales service), their helicopters were already in service, run-in in conflicts of low intensity, more aggressive advertising, completed and tested avionics at that time (which the Mi-28 had just brought to the declared performance characteristics). And this does not mean that the Mi-28 is worse, just the Indians had a choice to buy an unfinished helicopter without well-established after-sales logistics and spare parts or to take a serial that had been in battles with good after-sales technical support. The United States knows how to sell and establish supplies better than us.

[Come on]

Is an electrical engineer a techie for you, or not? And it doesn't matter, it is important and indicative here: "and in general your goal is to veiledly show the worthlessness of our weapons and the total superiority of the Western". That is, as they say, who has what hurts. This says a lot about your outlook and worldview, as well as adequateness. As in the previous posts, you pass off your wishlist and sofa fantasies as something clever., You think, here I have written how many smart words, oh, shake hiring the State Department! :))

[adept666]

Is an electrician a techie for you or not?

For me, a techie, just what does this have to do with you?

And it doesn't matter, it is important and indicative here: "and in general, your goal is to covertly show the worthlessness of our weapons and the total superiority of the Western

Well, it’s not me who jumps from post to post in this topic and jumps out of my pants telling everyone what advanced Western weapons are and what poor Russian pilots, because the Russian designers completely suck and don’t understand what they are designing. There is no type of OCD, as if we are sitting deaf and we don’t see beyond the nose (Hell has been flying with the ARLGSN since 1998) and we don’t have any information from our intelligence about the actual use of the enemy’s ATGM (with subsequent analysis) and we don’t know how to do ARLGSN for UR and NPP Istok in this business a complete zero. I quite calmly explained to you that you are mistaken and why, quite objectively and easily. Each system, which is based on the same Mi-28, was subjected to a hard discussion storm, all the pros and cons were weighed and it was all assessed not by 5-10 parameters, but by several hundred for each electronic component.

This says a lot about your horizons and worldview, as well as adequacy.

Yes, yes I am adequate to the bone marrow with this guessed.

As in the previous posts, your Wishlist and fantasy couch give out for something clever

These are not my Wishlist, this is my friend’s radio physics, I understand that this is an unexpected discovery for you, but yes it is - RADIOPHYSICS exists! By the way, what happened to your even syllable somewhere burns from my words or what?

[Come on]

You can even throw kilometer-long footcloths of any pseudoscientific nonsense here, discuss my personality, my education and my "malicious intentions to slander everything sacred and glorify everything American", but this will not change reality, except in your head. Starting a discussion with a hurray-patriot is like playing chess with a pigeon, so don't waste your time, they are waiting for you at the discussion about the high cost, uselessness and dampness of the F-35, there is a whole field for your theoretical sheets.

[adept666]

You can even roll kilometer-sized footcloths of any pseudoscientific nonsense here

Well, you at least point to one pseudoscientific nonsense where you saw it, cite something, or else while you distribute unfounded pearls and nothing more.

but this does not change reality, except in your head.

Yes you? And what is this delicious sweet reality of yours? You at least explain to me why in this your reality, advanced British after Afghanistan added archaic in the form of semi-active GOS to their Brimstones. Something you even ignores such simple questions as an electro-mechanic. Ai - I - yy uncomfortable questions are easier to not notice.

Starting a discussion with a jingoistic patriot is like playing a dove with chess

You have the criteria for jingoistic patriotism of the obviously wrong system; on this site I’m more objective sometimes

so let's don’t waste time in vain, they are waiting for you at a discussion about the high cost, uselessness and dampness of the F-35, there is a whole expanse of space for your theoretical sheets.

Yes, with F-35 straight trouble polymers disappeared in vain

[Der schwarze]

they will take it away, see, launch the rocket and leave immediately, since the rockets they have are 4 generations and we have the second. That's all the tale. A night hunter with such missiles in a real battle is not a tenant at all. His life so far on him 2-3stingers of the latest models will work

[Der schwarze]

they will take it away, see, launch the rocket and leave immediately, since the rockets they have are 4 generations and we have the second. That's all the tale. A night hunter with such missiles in a real battle is not a tenant at all. His life so far on him 2-3stingers of the latest models will work

[Haway_Nordik]

Apache, emnip, also needs target tracking in the guided missile attack process.

After viewing a couple of questions arose:
1. Why weren't 2-3 missiles launched at once? This is when the launches occur with an interval of a couple of seconds: the first hit the target, the second is still flying and the operator just needs to turn the control center on the second target. This technique was also used on the Su-25 and Shkval.
2. Usually fly a pair. Where is the second helicopter?
3. The power of anti-tank missiles at any gate ... it seems that the portable Cornet is craving more convincingly.

In general, not bad, not bad. I still thought that army aviation works the old fashioned way, like the Second World War: according to the collimator sight, my head and the order of my heart)

[CRASH]

Apache shot and forgot, AGM-114L Longbow Hellfire at 10km shoots, on the principle of 1 rocket 1 target.

In the early versions of this missile, semi-active radar guidance was used, but then, for various reasons, experiments began with other types of homing. As a result, in 1998, the AGM-114L Longbow Hellfire missile, designed specifically for the AH-64D Apache Longbow helicopter, was adopted. From the previous modifications, it is primarily distinguished by homing equipment. For the first time in the Hellfire family, an original combination of inertial and radar guidance was used. Immediately before launch, the helicopter’s onboard equipment transmits to the missile data regarding the target: the direction and distance to it, as well as the motion parameters of the helicopter and the enemy machine. For this, the helicopter is forced to “jump out” for several seconds due to natural shelter. At the end of the “jump”, a rocket is launched. Hellfire Longbow independently enters the approximate target area using an inertial guidance system, after which it includes an active radar system that captures the target and ultimately points at it. This guidance method actually allows you to limit the launch range only to the characteristics of the rocket engine. Currently, Hellfire fly at a range of about 8-10 km. A characteristic feature of the updated Hellfire missile is the absence of the need for constant illumination of the target by helicopter or ground units. At the same time, the AGM-114L is much more expensive than previous versions of this missile, however, the difference in the cost of ammunition is more than compensated by the destruction of the enemy armored car.

[Muvka]

http://ria.ru/radio_brief/20151023/1307140237.html
Hope this calms you down? Shooting expensive rockets at the jeeps of militants is probably cool, but not about us. We have stocks of old missiles that need to be spent. But as you can see, there are new ones, but if they shoot at them in Syria, then they will definitely not show it to us. That's all. In our military commissar, the main thing is efficiency. Not wow effects.

[CRASH]

There is no more reliable source than Ria Novoti? Then peace and quiet. AK12 is also the "best" machine gun in the world.
You have everything, but if we have cheap stuff, why should you plow Caliber with Capia when you can use cannon balls.

[Muvka]

Quote: CRASH.

There is no more reliable source than Ria Novoti? Then peace and quiet. AK12 is also the "best" machine gun in the world.

https://cont.ws/post/145189
Will go?

[CRASH]

God forbid, of course, if this is all true, and these vortices need to be put into operation as soon as possible, otherwise, by God, it's dumb, a powerful helicopter, and a "hello from the 80s" rocket.
Will the Crossbow be able to direct new missiles?

[Muvka]

Recently there was news on the site that an order for the supply of Whirlwinds was completed.

[Westet2]

It's all on paper for now. For now, like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oyjIEwdHeA&nohtml5=False to this day the same missiles that were 20-30 years ago. There are 3 militants I think and you won’t be in doubt how Apache would quickly figure out with the help of even an air gun alone, not to mention the explosive action of Helvair!

[SSeT]

1. Exactly what does not allow volley launch. Attack, squalor

[CRASH]

Sorry, maybe I will ruin raspberries, but in the video, which is terrible, to hit the target, you need to keep the mark on the target, if they had air defense or radar, mi28 would have been shot down. Where is our industry, where did I forget the rockets fired? It’s not there, there’s a halffire lying in Cuba, give Cuba an island in the north, let the rocket be transported to us, but it’s tin, to hang, to work for 2-4 goals. Like a helicopter, a great car, but the weapons are very behind.

[Muvka]

Quote: CRASH.

Sorry, maybe I will ruin raspberries, but in the video, which is terrible, to hit the target, you need to keep the mark on the target, if they had air defense or radar, mi28 would have been shot down. Where is our industry, where did I forget the rockets fired? It’s not there, there’s a halffire lying in Cuba, give Cuba an island in the north, let the rocket be transported to us, but it’s tin, to hang, to work for 2-4 goals. Like a helicopter, a great car, but the weapons are very behind.

Those. Do you naively think that the helicopter, while pointing, stands still?

[CRASH]

That is, you think that at 200 km per hour, it becomes invisible to radar? Or invulnerable to MANPADS?

[Muvka]

Quote: CRASH.

That is, you think that at 200 km per hour, it becomes invisible to radar? Or invulnerable to MANPADS?

Then the question. And what is Apache doing after the shot? Does it disappear right away? Or if the missile does not need to be aimed manually, the helicopter does not see the radars and the MANPADS cannot aim? In other words, what does the Apache do after launching a rocket such that our helicopter cannot do it and therefore it will be shot down? I hope I clearly asked the question.

[CRASH]

Counter question, why does APACH have a radar over the screws? What would rising from behind the hill, he already knew where the target is, and it remains only to shoot, and dive back. While our MI, having emerged from behind a hillock, begins to search for a target, let’s say an ambush, and it started firing, but it will withstand 12-14mm into the side, and the screws, and if in the form of a ZSU is a cheetah, you do not forget to plow for jeeps over 5km, it’s not the same as if we come across Turks, the USA, and govNATO. EW is certainly good, but no one saw it in real action, the natives have modern MANPADS, and do they even have any.

[Muvka]

Quote: CRASH.

Counter question, why does APACH have a radar over the screws? What would rising from behind the hill, he already knew where the target is, and it remains only to shoot, and dive back. While our MI, having emerged from behind a hillock, begins to search for a target, let’s say an ambush, and it started firing, but it will withstand 12-14mm into the side, and the screws, and if in the form of a ZSU is a cheetah, you do not forget to plow for jeeps over 5km, it’s not the same as if we come across Turks, the USA, and govNATO. EW is certainly good, but no one saw it in real action, the natives have modern MANPADS, and do they even have any.

Those. You want to say that this is for certain conditions rarely found in real combat? Hills are needed. Is it an ala spherical horse in a vacuum? Have you seen many hills in the desert? or in our European part of the country?

[CRASH]

That is, you now, turned on the "fool", and we start "in the desert where the hills", you understood me perfectly that where the APACH shot, and left to look for other targets, and work on them, ours will lead the target until it hits.

But as the comrade wrote above, there is already a "vortex1" which, judging by what was written, flies 10 km, the "fire-forget" system has been implemented and is already entering the troops.

AGM-114L Longbow Hellfire read, and do not find fault with the essence of "hills in the desert"

In the early versions of this missile, semi-active radar guidance was used, but then, for various reasons, experiments began with other types of homing. As a result, in 1998, the AGM-114L Longbow Hellfire missile, designed specifically for the AH-64D Apache Longbow helicopter, was adopted. From the previous modifications, it is primarily distinguished by homing equipment. For the first time in the Hellfire family, an original combination of inertial and radar guidance was used. Immediately before launch, the helicopter’s onboard equipment transmits to the missile data regarding the target: the direction and distance to it, as well as the motion parameters of the helicopter and the enemy machine. For this, the helicopter is forced to “jump out” for several seconds due to natural shelter. At the end of the “jump”, a rocket is launched. Hellfire Longbow independently enters the approximate target area using an inertial guidance system, after which it includes an active radar system that captures the target and ultimately points at it. This guidance method actually allows you to limit the launch range only to the characteristics of the rocket engine. Currently, Hellfire fly at a range of about 8-10 km. A characteristic feature of the updated Hellfire missile is the absence of the need for constant illumination of the target by helicopter or ground units. At the same time, the AGM-114L is much more expensive than previous versions of this missile, however, the difference in the cost of ammunition is more than compensated by the destruction of the enemy armored car.

[Come on]

Unlike the Mi-28, he can immediately go into cover, firing as many missiles as necessary at all targets, and they will do their job. This is the tactics of using Apache Longbow, thanks to its overhead radar (which, together with the missile seeker and provides the fired-forget mode), it first emerges from under the hill, building, etc., takes a few seconds to identify 128 targets, classifies them by priorities, air defense, radars, tanks, etc. Dives back and launches his up to 16 and Hellfires and dumps, if there are no other tasks and goals for his 30mm cannon, or NURS, for example, infantry support. He no longer needs to highlight anything, since the radar has already transmitted the coordinates of the selected targets to the missile seeker, and they, in turn, are already looking for the target themselves. This is his whole danger, and not only for the "popuas", because no short-range air defense system can react so quickly. The Mi-28 will have to maneuver, as in the video, until the target is hit. At the moment, the fire control system and armament of the Ah 64 are more advanced than that of the Mi 28N, and the BC is larger, especially the big difference in ammunition to the 30mm cannon, 250 for the Mi-28 and 1200 for the Ah-64, but time will tell, I think that the Russian Aerospace Forces now puts pressure on manufacturers of MSA and weapons. Then, judging by the video, the Mi-28N has the same problem as the Mi-17, for example, at one time in Chechnya, it is the presence of ATGMs with a shaped charge that are good against tanks, bunkers, but not against the accumulation of manpower and lightly armored targets. There is a video from Chechnya showing an attempt to destroy the militants running along a mountain path. ATGM, in principle, was well planted between them, the detonation was no more than 2 meters from them, but they both fled and fled, at least from that ATGM :) Maybe they were later finished off than others. A warhead similar to that of Bumblebee would have a greater effect in cases such as in the video.

[Leonid Har]

And what about the Apache’s armor and survivability, against Mi28? And why shoot at infantry from ATGMs?

[Come on]

And you ask pilots why, in the absence of other means, probably? The armor of Apache and the Tiger must withstand several hits of Zushka, which was confirmed in practice. Some episodes speak for themselves. Apache is a very tenacious device. In principle, all combat helicopters of this class have approximately the same armor. But Apache was constantly refined based on its abundant application practice and therefore probably has the most elaborate armor. After all, one thing is to stir up an armored capsule, or a nose with sides and to fire at a test bench, and it’s quite another when you have a huge statistics of shelling, probably in every cm of the fuselage, from all angles and all the caliber, which helps to optimize other things, such as the ability to fly, although all the oil has leaked out of the car, or the blades are well nibbled, or the control computer is broken up, etc. Interestingly, the level of protection with the Tiger is about the same, but the Tiger is made of carbon fiber, Kevlar and other similar materials, this is almost 2 times easier. Although a little less armament is, but again less noticeable on the radar. So far, little is known about the Mi-28N, like the Ka-52, in this sense, there is simply no experience in combat use.

[Leonid Har]

And I heard there were cases when Apache was shot down by a queue from AK or SVD

[Come on]

I also heard a lot. But to believe everything is not very smart.

[CRASH]

If you troll so dimly, then you answer, "August 2, 2015 mi28 crashed", not on alert, azazaza, the helicopter is bullshit, it didn't even fight, but crashed.

[vic58]

No, there is EW!

[vic58]

Baez comments!

[Redfox3k]

Quote: Yeah, well.

Unlike the Mi-28, it can immediately go into cover, firing at all targets as many missiles as necessary, and they will do their job. This is the tactics of using Apache Longbow, thanks to its overhead radar (which, together with the missile seeker and provides the fired-forget mode), first emerges from under a hill, a building, etc., it takes a few seconds to identify 128 targets, classifies them by priorities, air defense, radars, tanks, etc. Dives back and lets his up to 16 and Hellfires and dumps, if there are no other tasks and goals for his 30mm cannon, or NURS, for example, infantry support. He no longer needs to highlight anything, since the radar has already transmitted the coordinates of the selected targets to the missile seeker, and they, in turn, are already looking for the target themselves. This is his whole danger and not only for the "popuass", because no short-range air defense system can react so quickly. The Mi-28 will have to maneuver, as in the video, until the target is hit ...

Yes, Apache, I see some kind of child prodigy ... and who will highlight the goals? all the more so for 16 missiles launched in one gulp from behind a neighboring hill ... them .. you imagine smart kamikaze missiles with human intelligence directly, each is aimed at its target ... did not know! I didn’t play such a thing even in games about longbow in the lead roles. Respect!

[Come on]

This has long been a reality for Apache, the Tiger and other combat helicopters of a similar level with a super-radar and missiles with GPS. You don’t need to highlight anything, the radar tells the rocket where the target is, and the rocket with the help of the GOS finds the target itself. You can also highlight, not necessarily the crew of the helicopter, but the third, who have a common information system BIUS, at least a separate platoon, UAV, or armored personnel carrier and so on. But you don’t take it so close to your heart, because they say: Live a century, learn a century :)

[Gippo]

In short, screwed up.
The videos hurriedly give everything out, now some in the department of KUZHUTGETOVICH
receive (receives, already received) thrushes.

[Come on]

So Rogozin seems to have laid out :) In my opinion, what is critical is warhead missiles, for such purposes it is necessary to use something thermobaric-fragmentation, in this case, judging by the surviving Igilovites, the radius of destruction was small. Well, manual rocket control was also not impressive, except that such a mode of operation was specially trained.

[CRASH]

Here a friend is the site of "beaten patriots", an alternative opinion is not welcome, to explain something to them, it is more expensive for them, you say that "this is outdated, and we need a new one already" they think that you are throwing shit at the "deity", objectivity 0, each other please only.

[cedar]

RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR HELICOPTER